Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. Sign in or register to get started.

How Britain voted – politicalbetting.com

2456789

Comments

  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,223
    eek said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Garbage. Those NI cuts were the beginning of the right thing to do.

    NI should be abolished altogether.

    If you want to put Income Tax up by the same amount NI comes down then that is no change for those working for a living but to exempt some from tax is not the solution.
    Those tax cuts were unaffordable - that was the only point I was making here.

    I do however agree that in this day and age Employee NI is not a great tax, some of it should be retained for to cover the pension and out of work benefits but the vast majority of it should be applied to both workers and pensioners either in a different tax for health / social care or as part of income tax.
    Context is all.

    4p off NI, coupled with 3p (? Maybe four, given the overall fiscal situation right now) on Income tax, fair enough.

    4p off NI with no compensation elsewhere is irresponsible lonnyness.

    It's like saying sausages are great. They are, but eating them raw isn't.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,020
    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    ydoethur said:

    eek said:

    This is a bit awkward.

    Skwakbox are claiming that Rachel Reeves got £1,200 parliamentary expenses for energy bills for her London KPs home in 2023/24 citing IPSA

    https://skwawkbox.org/2024/07/30/rachel-freeze-reeves-has-claimed-1000s-in-energy-bills-on-second-home/

    2 things to add

    1) the choice of website to link to is "interesting"
    2) it's day old news that the main stream press don't seem to care about, I wonder why that is..
    I'm amazed Skwawkbox is still going.
    All the Maomentum lot have got to get their news from somewhere...no idea about Skwawkbox or The Canary, but I think it can be rather profitable endeavour to be in these left / right wing niches. Owen Jones makes more money than ever and I presume LoutsEaters (the Carl Benjamin thing) is extremely profitable given a fancy studio.
    There’s an international, especially in the US, market for these fringe views.

    Russell Brand now has nearly 7m Youtube subscribers, and the Lotus Eaters guys did a tour of the US conservative podcasts around the RNC.
    Has gone all very quiet on the investigations into Brand and also those who enabled his behaviour.
    He’s not someone I personally pay much attention to except when he’s in trouble, just can’t stand his style. It does appear to be much more difficult now to ‘cancel’ someone with an online presence, absent actual criminal charges or convictions.

    I think that Youtube and Facebook are now worried about people they cancel taking an audience to Twitter and Rumble, which in most cases should be seen as a good thing.
    Looks like between YouTube and Rumble he still does big numbers on his videos. Word salad global conspiracy theory videos are obviously quite popular.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,904
    eek said:

    This is a bit awkward.

    Skwakbox are claiming that Rachel Reeves got £1,200 parliamentary expenses for energy bills for her London KPs home in 2023/24 citing IPSA

    https://skwawkbox.org/2024/07/30/rachel-freeze-reeves-has-claimed-1000s-in-energy-bills-on-second-home/

    2 things to add

    1) the choice of website to link to is "interesting"
    2) it's day old news that the main stream press don't seem to care about, I wonder why that is..
    There is too much going on, what with child murders, riots, machete fights, dodgy newsreaders, Kamala, Labour's plan to starve all pensioners, and the Olympics. It has been a good few days to bury bad news.
  • eek said:

    This is a bit awkward.

    Skwakbox are claiming that Rachel Reeves got £1,200 parliamentary expenses for energy bills for her London KPs home in 2023/24 citing IPSA

    https://skwawkbox.org/2024/07/30/rachel-freeze-reeves-has-claimed-1000s-in-energy-bills-on-second-home/

    2 things to add

    1) the choice of website to link to is "interesting"
    2) it's day old news that the main stream press don't seem to care about, I wonder why that is..
    There is too much going on, what with child murders, riots, machete fights, dodgy newsreaders, Kamala, Labour's plan to starve all pensioners, and the Olympics. It has been a good few days to bury bad news.
    You don't have to be a hardline lefty to think it is a bit rum for chancellor getting a six figure income and claiming £1,200 energy bills on expenses, to kybosh payment of a quarter of that sum in energy expenses to pensioners with total income of less than £12k a year.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,223
    eek said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Noe she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE s should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the defict, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To answer that I will refer back to my point / question from yesterday.

    Why from the middle of nowhere did Rishi call an election just as the independent pay panels handed to the Government their recommendations?
    It might not have been the pay review recommendations. It could have been the crime figures published today. Or that the fiscal nasties weren't going to remain hidden indefinitely. Or goodness knows what.

    But yes, the TLDR is that the necessary blag- that government was basically going fine- was going to fall apart before the autumn.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,405
    eek said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Noe she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE s should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the defict, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To answer that I will refer back to my point / question from yesterday.

    Why from the middle of nowhere did Rishi call an election just as the independent pay panels handed to the Government their recommendations?
    Rishi called an election because he was an idiot. The news going forward was mixed better growth and inflation tight control needed on public debt.

    But what the fk has Sunak got to do with Reeves ? These are her decisions and she's afraid to stand by them. She has no problem funding things she likes and to an eye watering amount.
    So far £11+ billion of public sector pay , dame bountiful sent another £11billion to Miliband to spend on fairies and unicorns.

    Why for example didnt she send him £9,5 bn and leve the pensioners alone ? because she has chosen to spend lots and any shortfall she need to tax the arse of voters.

    So where's the gowth coming from ? Where's the productivity ?

  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,841
    Selebian said:

    viewcode said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Don't know if this has been flagged up yet on here.

    "Stats for Lefties 🍉🏳️‍⚧️
    @LeftieStats
    🚨 NEW: David Lammy confirms Labour has DITCHED its plans to recognise a Palestinian state.

    Labour will instead delay recognition indefinitely, making it conditional on Israel feeling "safe and secure" as part of a "credible" and "viable" peace process."

    https://x.com/LeftieStats/status/1818241569691963547

    Yes but it's David Lammy

    He probably thinks he's dealing with Emperor Palestine and the wookies run Israel
    It's also not what he said if you take the trouble to watch the clip. AndyJS is a little bit naughty posting a fake news far left tweet.
    StatsForLefties is the dodgy doctor librarian from Northern Ireland righr?
    If memory serves, that would be the Northern Irish cisgender Dr Eoin Clarke, who as a PhD is perfectly entitled to use the honorific "Dr", as is our illustrious God Of All Trains Dr Sunil Prasannan. Dr Clarke used to run the blog http://www.greenbenchesuk.com/, formerly http://eoin-clarke.blogspot.com/, which was linked to from PB in the old days

    StatsForLefties is the English non-binary statistician Ell Folan, who runs https://statsforlefties.wordpress.com/

    They are probably not the same person.

    :):):):):):)
    I'm also a non-binary statistician. I work mostly in base 10.
    Brilliant!
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,727
    stodge said:

    Pulpstar said:

    stodge said:

    Afternoon all :)

    Some interesting comparisons with 2019 - from IPSOS-MORI's own figures:

    18-24: Labour 41% (-21), Greens 19%, Liberal Democrats 16% (+7), Reform 8%, Conservative 5% (-14)
    25-34: Labour 47%, (-4), Reform 13%, Greens 12%, Liberal Democrats 11% (-), Conservatives 10% (-17)
    65+ Conservative 43% (-21), Labour 23% (+6), Reform 14%, Liberal Democrat 12% (+1), Greens 2%

    It rather gives lie to this notion all the young are embracing "right wing" politics. It was a clear rejection of the old duopoly to perhaps a new one (Greens and Liberal Democrats).

    What about 35 - 64 ?
    Ask and ye shall probably receive in the fullness of time.

    35-44: Labour 41% (+2), Conservative 17% (-19), Reform 14%, Liberal Democrat 13% (-), Greens 7%
    45-54: Labour 36% (+8), Conservative 22% (-24), Reform 17%, Liberal Democrats 14% (-), Greens 8%
    55-64: Labour 32% (+5), Conservative 27% (-22), Reform 19%, Liberal Democrat 12% (+1), Greens 4%

    One or two obvious trends but among 18-24 year olds there was a swing TO the Conservatives from Labour of 3.5%, among 25-34 year olds it was a swing from Labour to the Conservatives of 6.5%, at 35-44 it was 9.5%, at 45-54 16%, at 55-64 13.5% and among 65+ also 13.5%

    Duopoly (Con-Lab combined vote) 46%, 57%, 58%, 58%, 59% and 64% among the age groups.

    A lot to chew over in the numbers provided and one or two myths can be dispelled.

    Turnout helped the Conservatives salvage something from the wreckage as 73% voted in the strongest Conservative group and only 37% in the weakest. Labour's vote share impacted by abstentions and weaknes sin the 18-34 age group.
    Two-party swing is a bit meaningless when there are so many parties substantially involved. Given Labour lost 21pp and Con only had19% available to lose, a 'swing' from Lab -> Con was inevitable even if no one had voted Con at all!
  • eekeek Posts: 28,371
    edited July 31

    eek said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Noe she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE s should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the defict, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To answer that I will refer back to my point / question from yesterday.

    Why from the middle of nowhere did Rishi call an election just as the independent pay panels handed to the Government their recommendations?
    It might not have been the pay review recommendations. It could have been the crime figures published today. Or that the fiscal nasties weren't going to remain hidden indefinitely. Or goodness knows what.

    But yes, the TLDR is that the necessary blag- that government was basically going fine- was going to fall apart before the autumn.
    Oh it may not have been the pay reviews but it is beyond clear that the recommended pay increases had not been factored in when Hunt started cutting Employee NI...

    As I said point I am aware of 2 councils where the last senior planning officers finished work today and even though 3 months notice was given zero applicants applied for the (multiple) roles.

    The only fix to avoid fines for late delivery will be to find contractors who will cost an awful lot more and probably will have contracts for as long as they want them...
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,223

    eek said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Noe she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE s should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the defict, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To answer that I will refer back to my point / question from yesterday.

    Why from the middle of nowhere did Rishi call an election just as the independent pay panels handed to the Government their recommendations?
    Rishi called an election because he was an idiot. The news going forward was mixed better growth and inflation tight control needed on public debt.

    But what the fk has Sunak got to do with Reeves ? These are her decisions and she's afraid to stand by them. She has no problem funding things she likes and to an eye watering amount.
    So far £11+ billion of public sector pay , dame bountiful sent another £11billion to Miliband to spend on fairies and unicorns.

    Why for example didnt she send him £9,5 bn and leve the pensioners alone ? because she has chosen to spend lots and any shortfall she need to tax the arse of voters.

    So where's the gowth coming from ? Where's the productivity ?

    Some polling on the subjects:

    Do you support or oppose junior doctors being offered a pay offer equivalent to an average increase of 22% over two years?

    All Britons
    Support: 59%
    Oppose: 28%

    2024 Labour voters
    Support: 80%
    Oppose: 12%


    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1818308493478183124

    Rachel Reeves has announced that winter fuel payments to pensioners in England and Wales will become means-tested, a move which the public supports by 47% to 38%

    The over-65s, however, are twice as likely to oppose the policy (66%) as support it (33%)


    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1818311146274767022

    As for productivity, what happens to productivity when your junior doctors and others decide to go and work for other employers instead?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,841

    eek said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Noe she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE s should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the defict, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To answer that I will refer back to my point / question from yesterday.

    Why from the middle of nowhere did Rishi call an election just as the independent pay panels handed to the Government their recommendations?
    Rishi called an election because he was an idiot. The news going forward was mixed better growth and inflation tight control needed on public debt.

    But what the fk has Sunak got to do with Reeves ? These are her decisions and she's afraid to stand by them. She has no problem funding things she likes and to an eye watering amount.
    So far £11+ billion of public sector pay , dame bountiful sent another £11billion to Miliband to spend on fairies and unicorns.

    Why for example didnt she send him £9,5 bn and leve the pensioners alone ? because she has chosen to spend lots and any shortfall she need to tax the arse of voters.

    So where's the gowth coming from ? Where's the productivity ?

    The commitment she made in the run up to the election is that every spending decision they made would be focused on growth and its impact on growth. And then they cancelled all the infrastructure projects so they could pay more wages. It's not a great start.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,079

    viewcode said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "@YouGovAmerica
    NEW: Economist/YouGov Poll, July 27-30

    % of registered voters who plan to vote for...
    Harris: 46%
    Trump: 44%

    July 21-23 poll:
    Trump: 44%
    Harris: 41%

    https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/econTabReport_5LIBPv8.pdf#page=8"

    https://x.com/YouGovAmerica/status/1818636275345150185

    Provided she doesn't mess up the VP pick, she's going to win I think.
    Kamala Harris: Basil II

    Donald Trump: Samuel of Bulgaria

    2024 election = The Battle of Kleidion

    (I fucking hope, I am still scarred by 2016.)
    Harris: Admiral Nelson

    Trump: François-Paul Brueys d'Aigalliers

    Election = Battle of the Nile

    (Joe Biden: Earl St Vincent)
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,642
    Nigelb said:

    viewcode said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "@YouGovAmerica
    NEW: Economist/YouGov Poll, July 27-30

    % of registered voters who plan to vote for...
    Harris: 46%
    Trump: 44%

    July 21-23 poll:
    Trump: 44%
    Harris: 41%

    https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/econTabReport_5LIBPv8.pdf#page=8"

    https://x.com/YouGovAmerica/status/1818636275345150185

    Provided she doesn't mess up the VP pick, she's going to win I think.
    Kamala Harris: Basil II

    Donald Trump: Samuel of Bulgaria

    2024 election = The Battle of Kleidion

    (I fucking hope, I am still scarred by 2016.)
    Harris: Admiral Nelson

    Trump: François-Paul Brueys d'Aigalliers

    Election = Battle of the Nile

    (Joe Biden: Earl St Vincent)
    Oh that’s beautiful.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,439

    eek said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Noe she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE s should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the defict, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To answer that I will refer back to my point / question from yesterday.

    Why from the middle of nowhere did Rishi call an election just as the independent pay panels handed to the Government their recommendations?
    Rishi called an election because he was an idiot. The news going forward was mixed better growth and inflation tight control needed on public debt.

    But what the fk has Sunak got to do with Reeves ? These are her decisions and she's afraid to stand by them. She has no problem funding things she likes and to an eye watering amount.
    So far £11+ billion of public sector pay , dame bountiful sent another £11billion to Miliband to spend on fairies and unicorns.

    Why for example didnt she send him £9,5 bn and leve the pensioners alone ? because she has chosen to spend lots and any shortfall she need to tax the arse of voters.

    So where's the gowth coming from ? Where's the productivity ?

    Some polling on the subjects:

    Do you support or oppose junior doctors being offered a pay offer equivalent to an average increase of 22% over two years?

    All Britons
    Support: 59%
    Oppose: 28%

    2024 Labour voters
    Support: 80%
    Oppose: 12%


    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1818308493478183124

    Rachel Reeves has announced that winter fuel payments to pensioners in England and Wales will become means-tested, a move which the public supports by 47% to 38%

    The over-65s, however, are twice as likely to oppose the policy (66%) as support it (33%)


    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1818311146274767022

    As for productivity, what happens to productivity when your junior doctors and others decide to go and work for other employers instead?
    Hidden in the thicket of comments over the winter fuel payments was a strong suggestion from Reeves that the Government was going to conduct a campaign to encourage the take up of qualifying benefits.
    The decision might well be less unpopular among over-65's if more realist the could easily get a qualifying benefit.
    It might also lead to a better financial situation of OAP's currently on the 'financial fringe'.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,371
    DavidL said:

    eek said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Noe she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE s should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the defict, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To answer that I will refer back to my point / question from yesterday.

    Why from the middle of nowhere did Rishi call an election just as the independent pay panels handed to the Government their recommendations?
    Rishi called an election because he was an idiot. The news going forward was mixed better growth and inflation tight control needed on public debt.

    But what the fk has Sunak got to do with Reeves ? These are her decisions and she's afraid to stand by them. She has no problem funding things she likes and to an eye watering amount.
    So far £11+ billion of public sector pay , dame bountiful sent another £11billion to Miliband to spend on fairies and unicorns.

    Why for example didnt she send him £9,5 bn and leve the pensioners alone ? because she has chosen to spend lots and any shortfall she need to tax the arse of voters.

    So where's the gowth coming from ? Where's the productivity ?

    The commitment she made in the run up to the election is that every spending decision they made would be focused on growth and its impact on growth. And then they cancelled all the infrastructure projects so they could pay more wages. It's not a great start.
    Excluding the A303 at Stonehenge which funded infrastructure projects have been cancelled?
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,883

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Now she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the deficit, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To be as fair as I want to be, you're right and wrong.

    I've no issue with the implementation of a pay review from an independent body. - Sunak did the same in July 2023 when implementing 5-7% pay increases for Police, NHS staff, the armed forces, teachers and others. While that was closer to the ambient inflation at the time, the 2024/25 award recognises a degree of "catch up" from the 2010s and the truth some elements of inflation remain "sticky". I hope local Government staff also receive a fair deal this year - they almost certainly won't.

    That said, the £22 billion "black hole" stunt has been poor and clumsy politics by Reeves - it's Opposition tactics, not Government strategy and has left her weakened. I assume the line is to get the pain in early and simply saying no to certain tax rises wasn't good politics in the campaign either. For what little it's worth Hunt was equally disingenuous on tax and spending. He may think he's left the economy in good shape but too many important cans were kicked down the road in the final 18 months.

    Where I disagree is the pensioners' fuel allowance which, AIUI, is being cut only for those pensioners not receiving any other benefit such as pension credit. There was an inherent absurdity about wealthy pensioners (they do exist) getting this £250 (which they didn't need). In truth, I'd prefer to have seen higher payments go to those in genuine need (£250 doesn't go that far in heating costs). The problem about any means tested system is a) the bureaucracy which is costly to set up and administer and b) the bureaucracy which deters people from claiming. Giving it to everyone is cheaper and simpler but you could say it of almost every other benefit.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,405

    eek said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Noe she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE s should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the defict, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To answer that I will refer back to my point / question from yesterday.

    Why from the middle of nowhere did Rishi call an election just as the independent pay panels handed to the Government their recommendations?
    Rishi called an election because he was an idiot. The news going forward was mixed better growth and inflation tight control needed on public debt.

    But what the fk has Sunak got to do with Reeves ? These are her decisions and she's afraid to stand by them. She has no problem funding things she likes and to an eye watering amount.
    So far £11+ billion of public sector pay , dame bountiful sent another £11billion to Miliband to spend on fairies and unicorns.

    Why for example didnt she send him £9,5 bn and leve the pensioners alone ? because she has chosen to spend lots and any shortfall she need to tax the arse of voters.

    So where's the gowth coming from ? Where's the productivity ?

    Some polling on the subjects:

    Do you support or oppose junior doctors being offered a pay offer equivalent to an average increase of 22% over two years?

    All Britons
    Support: 59%
    Oppose: 28%

    2024 Labour voters
    Support: 80%
    Oppose: 12%


    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1818308493478183124

    Rachel Reeves has announced that winter fuel payments to pensioners in England and Wales will become means-tested, a move which the public supports by 47% to 38%

    The over-65s, however, are twice as likely to oppose the policy (66%) as support it (33%)


    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1818311146274767022

    As for productivity, what happens to productivity when your junior doctors and others decide to go and work for other employers instead?
    Oh that old chestnut. Voters always support extra spending if they dont have to pay for it themselves.

    You cant run a country on opinion polls, Ask a different question such as "should we keep pensioners warm and send less money overseas ?" and I think you'll get a different answer.

    As for junior doctors if your going to increase the pay bill by 22% then spend it on recruiting more doctors. That adds capacity to the system and allows people to have a work life balance. Just caving in to blackmail is mindless, as ever they'll be back for more. The BMA now own Wes Streeting, his chances of progressing major reform just moved down a notch.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,403
    edited July 31
    Nigelb said:

    viewcode said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "@YouGovAmerica
    NEW: Economist/YouGov Poll, July 27-30

    % of registered voters who plan to vote for...
    Harris: 46%
    Trump: 44%

    July 21-23 poll:
    Trump: 44%
    Harris: 41%

    https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/econTabReport_5LIBPv8.pdf#page=8"

    https://x.com/YouGovAmerica/status/1818636275345150185

    Provided she doesn't mess up the VP pick, she's going to win I think.
    Kamala Harris: Basil II

    Donald Trump: Samuel of Bulgaria

    2024 election = The Battle of Kleidion

    (I fucking hope, I am still scarred by 2016.)
    Harris: Admiral Nelson

    Trump: François-Paul Brueys d'Aigalliers

    Election = Battle of the Nile

    (Joe Biden: Earl St Vincent)
    Harris - Henry, Earl of Richmond
    Trump - Richard III
    Joe Biden - Margaret Beaufort
    Scenario - Bosworth Field.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,092

    Sandpit said:

    ydoethur said:

    eek said:

    This is a bit awkward.

    Skwakbox are claiming that Rachel Reeves got £1,200 parliamentary expenses for energy bills for her London KPs home in 2023/24 citing IPSA

    https://skwawkbox.org/2024/07/30/rachel-freeze-reeves-has-claimed-1000s-in-energy-bills-on-second-home/

    2 things to add

    1) the choice of website to link to is "interesting"
    2) it's day old news that the main stream press don't seem to care about, I wonder why that is..
    I'm amazed Skwawkbox is still going.
    All the Maomentum lot have got to get their news from somewhere...no idea about Skwawkbox or The Canary, but I think it can be rather profitable endeavour to be in these left / right wing niches. Owen Jones makes more money than ever and I presume LoutsEaters (the Carl Benjamin thing) is extremely profitable given a fancy studio.
    There’s an international, especially in the US, market for these fringe views.

    Russell Brand now has nearly 7m Youtube subscribers, and the Lotus Eaters guys did a tour of the US conservative podcasts around the RNC.
    Has gone all very quiet on the investigations into Brand and also those who enabled his behaviour.
    Morality scales to popularity. The ethics of the gladiatorial arena. Look at the world we have made... :(
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,194

    eek said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Noe she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE s should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the defict, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To answer that I will refer back to my point / question from yesterday.

    Why from the middle of nowhere did Rishi call an election just as the independent pay panels handed to the Government their recommendations?
    Rishi called an election because he was an idiot. The news going forward was mixed better growth and inflation tight control needed on public debt.

    But what the fk has Sunak got to do with Reeves ? These are her decisions and she's afraid to stand by them. She has no problem funding things she likes and to an eye watering amount.
    So far £11+ billion of public sector pay , dame bountiful sent another £11billion to Miliband to spend on fairies and unicorns.

    Why for example didnt she send him £9,5 bn and leve the pensioners alone ? because she has chosen to spend lots and any shortfall she need to tax the arse of voters.

    So where's the gowth coming from ? Where's the productivity ?

    Some polling on the subjects:

    Do you support or oppose junior doctors being offered a pay offer equivalent to an average increase of 22% over two years?

    All Britons
    Support: 59%
    Oppose: 28%

    2024 Labour voters
    Support: 80%
    Oppose: 12%


    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1818308493478183124

    Rachel Reeves has announced that winter fuel payments to pensioners in England and Wales will become means-tested, a move which the public supports by 47% to 38%

    The over-65s, however, are twice as likely to oppose the policy (66%) as support it (33%)


    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1818311146274767022

    As for productivity, what happens to productivity when your junior doctors and others decide to go and work for other employers instead?
    Wouldn't it likely increase given the relationship between NHS use, age and retirement ?
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 22,025

    eek said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Garbage. Those NI cuts were the beginning of the right thing to do.

    NI should be abolished altogether.

    If you want to put Income Tax up by the same amount NI comes down then that is no change for those working for a living but to exempt some from tax is not the solution.
    Those tax cuts were unaffordable - that was the only point I was making here.

    I do however agree that in this day and age Employee NI is not a great tax, some of it should be retained for to cover the pension and out of work benefits but the vast majority of it should be applied to both workers and pensioners either in a different tax for health / social care or as part of income tax.
    Context is all.

    4p off NI, coupled with 3p (? Maybe four, given the overall fiscal situation right now) on Income tax, fair enough.

    4p off NI with no compensation elsewhere is irresponsible lonnyness.

    It's like saying sausages are great. They are, but eating them raw isn't.
    Except there was compensation elsewhere, the freeze on tax thresholds.

    Actually it was overall a net tax rise, but a tax rise primarily on unearned incomes, while part of the tax rise cut taxes on earned incomes.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,405
    stodge said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Now she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the deficit, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To be as fair as I want to be, you're right and wrong.

    I've no issue with the implementation of a pay review from an independent body. - Sunak did the same in July 2023 when implementing 5-7% pay increases for Police, NHS staff, the armed forces, teachers and others. While that was closer to the ambient inflation at the time, the 2024/25 award recognises a degree of "catch up" from the 2010s and the truth some elements of inflation remain "sticky". I hope local Government staff also receive a fair deal this year - they almost certainly won't.

    That said, the £22 billion "black hole" stunt has been poor and clumsy politics by Reeves - it's Opposition tactics, not Government strategy and has left her weakened. I assume the line is to get the pain in early and simply saying no to certain tax rises wasn't good politics in the campaign either. For what little it's worth Hunt was equally disingenuous on tax and spending. He may think he's left the economy in good shape but too many important cans were kicked down the road in the final 18 months.

    Where I disagree is the pensioners' fuel allowance which, AIUI, is being cut only for those pensioners not receiving any other benefit such as pension credit. There was an inherent absurdity about wealthy pensioners (they do exist) getting this £250 (which they didn't need). In truth, I'd prefer to have seen higher payments go to those in genuine need (£250 doesn't go that far in heating costs). The problem about any means tested system is a) the bureaucracy which is costly to set up and administer and b) the bureaucracy which deters people from claiming. Giving it to everyone is cheaper and simpler but you could say it of almost every other benefit.
    wealthy pensioners dont need the money, it was a Gordon Brown bribe to win votes. There are lots more things like it - free prescriptions ? But pre-election my usual PB lefties were all saying it was impossible to make savings and spend less. Apparently savings can be made.

    It's just a shame that having made the uncomfortable choice it will get wasted in 1970s inflation re-run.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,642
    ydoethur said:

    Nigelb said:

    viewcode said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "@YouGovAmerica
    NEW: Economist/YouGov Poll, July 27-30

    % of registered voters who plan to vote for...
    Harris: 46%
    Trump: 44%

    July 21-23 poll:
    Trump: 44%
    Harris: 41%

    https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/econTabReport_5LIBPv8.pdf#page=8"

    https://x.com/YouGovAmerica/status/1818636275345150185

    Provided she doesn't mess up the VP pick, she's going to win I think.
    Kamala Harris: Basil II

    Donald Trump: Samuel of Bulgaria

    2024 election = The Battle of Kleidion

    (I fucking hope, I am still scarred by 2016.)
    Harris: Admiral Nelson

    Trump: François-Paul Brueys d'Aigalliers

    Election = Battle of the Nile

    (Joe Biden: Earl St Vincent)
    Harris - Henry, Earl of Richmond
    Trump - Richard III
    Joe Biden - Margaret Beaufort
    Scenario - Bosworth Field.
    Harris - James T. Kirk

    Biden - Spock

    Trump - Khan Noonien Singh

    Scenario - Battle of the Mutara Nebula
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,439

    stodge said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Now she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the deficit, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To be as fair as I want to be, you're right and wrong.

    I've no issue with the implementation of a pay review from an independent body. - Sunak did the same in July 2023 when implementing 5-7% pay increases for Police, NHS staff, the armed forces, teachers and others. While that was closer to the ambient inflation at the time, the 2024/25 award recognises a degree of "catch up" from the 2010s and the truth some elements of inflation remain "sticky". I hope local Government staff also receive a fair deal this year - they almost certainly won't.

    That said, the £22 billion "black hole" stunt has been poor and clumsy politics by Reeves - it's Opposition tactics, not Government strategy and has left her weakened. I assume the line is to get the pain in early and simply saying no to certain tax rises wasn't good politics in the campaign either. For what little it's worth Hunt was equally disingenuous on tax and spending. He may think he's left the economy in good shape but too many important cans were kicked down the road in the final 18 months.

    Where I disagree is the pensioners' fuel allowance which, AIUI, is being cut only for those pensioners not receiving any other benefit such as pension credit. There was an inherent absurdity about wealthy pensioners (they do exist) getting this £250 (which they didn't need). In truth, I'd prefer to have seen higher payments go to those in genuine need (£250 doesn't go that far in heating costs). The problem about any means tested system is a) the bureaucracy which is costly to set up and administer and b) the bureaucracy which deters people from claiming. Giving it to everyone is cheaper and simpler but you could say it of almost every other benefit.
    wealthy pensioners dont need the money, it was a Gordon Brown bribe to win votes. There are lots more things like it - free prescriptions ? But pre-election my usual PB lefties were all saying it was impossible to make savings and spend less. Apparently savings can be made.

    It's just a shame that having made the uncomfortable choice it will get wasted in 1970s inflation re-run.
    As a reasonably comfortably-off OAP I was disappointed when the winter fuel payment was abolished but it won't have the effect on my vote that, for example, tuition fees had.
  • mickydroymickydroy Posts: 316
    Does it say anything, re the age group most likely to vote Farage, the next election scares the hell out of me, I really wish the Torys would elect someone more moderate, in the mould of a David Cameron, I really do not want Farage overtaking them
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,586

    stodge said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Now she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the deficit, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To be as fair as I want to be, you're right and wrong.

    I've no issue with the implementation of a pay review from an independent body. - Sunak did the same in July 2023 when implementing 5-7% pay increases for Police, NHS staff, the armed forces, teachers and others. While that was closer to the ambient inflation at the time, the 2024/25 award recognises a degree of "catch up" from the 2010s and the truth some elements of inflation remain "sticky". I hope local Government staff also receive a fair deal this year - they almost certainly won't.

    That said, the £22 billion "black hole" stunt has been poor and clumsy politics by Reeves - it's Opposition tactics, not Government strategy and has left her weakened. I assume the line is to get the pain in early and simply saying no to certain tax rises wasn't good politics in the campaign either. For what little it's worth Hunt was equally disingenuous on tax and spending. He may think he's left the economy in good shape but too many important cans were kicked down the road in the final 18 months.

    Where I disagree is the pensioners' fuel allowance which, AIUI, is being cut only for those pensioners not receiving any other benefit such as pension credit. There was an inherent absurdity about wealthy pensioners (they do exist) getting this £250 (which they didn't need). In truth, I'd prefer to have seen higher payments go to those in genuine need (£250 doesn't go that far in heating costs). The problem about any means tested system is a) the bureaucracy which is costly to set up and administer and b) the bureaucracy which deters people from claiming. Giving it to everyone is cheaper and simpler but you could say it of almost every other benefit.
    wealthy pensioners dont need the money, it was a Gordon Brown bribe to win votes. There are lots more things like it - free prescriptions ? But pre-election my usual PB lefties were all saying it was impossible to make savings and spend less. Apparently savings can be made.

    It's just a shame that having made the uncomfortable choice it will get wasted in 1970s inflation re-run.
    The problem is that the ‘wealthy’ pensioners are a much smaller proportion of the population than this forum, and media in general, might think. They’re mostly retired workers from the public sector, and those public companies privatised from the 1980s, who are on final-salary index-linked pensions. It’s perhaps 10% of pensioners.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,006
    Public Policy Polling

    Arizona

    Trump 49% Harris 47%

    Georgia

    Harris 48% Trump 47%

    Pennsylvania

    Harris 47% Trump 48%

    'The Arizona poll also found that 59 percent said that if Sen. Mark Kelly (D-Ariz.) were chosen as Harris’s running mate, it wouldn’t make a difference whether they were more or less likely to vote for Harris.

    Twenty-two percent of Arizonans said it made them more likely, while 17 percent said it made them less likely. A separate 2 percent said they were not sure.

    The Pennsylvania polling found 64 percent of respondents saying it wouldn’t make a difference in whether they picked Harris if Gov. Josh Shapiro (D) were her running mate. A separate 19 percent said it would make them more likely to back Harris, 14 percent said it would make them less likely and 3 percent said they were not sure. '
    https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/4801296-trump-harris-polls-arizona-pennsylvania-georgia/
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,883

    stodge said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Now she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the deficit, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To be as fair as I want to be, you're right and wrong.

    I've no issue with the implementation of a pay review from an independent body. - Sunak did the same in July 2023 when implementing 5-7% pay increases for Police, NHS staff, the armed forces, teachers and others. While that was closer to the ambient inflation at the time, the 2024/25 award recognises a degree of "catch up" from the 2010s and the truth some elements of inflation remain "sticky". I hope local Government staff also receive a fair deal this year - they almost certainly won't.

    That said, the £22 billion "black hole" stunt has been poor and clumsy politics by Reeves - it's Opposition tactics, not Government strategy and has left her weakened. I assume the line is to get the pain in early and simply saying no to certain tax rises wasn't good politics in the campaign either. For what little it's worth Hunt was equally disingenuous on tax and spending. He may think he's left the economy in good shape but too many important cans were kicked down the road in the final 18 months.

    Where I disagree is the pensioners' fuel allowance which, AIUI, is being cut only for those pensioners not receiving any other benefit such as pension credit. There was an inherent absurdity about wealthy pensioners (they do exist) getting this £250 (which they didn't need). In truth, I'd prefer to have seen higher payments go to those in genuine need (£250 doesn't go that far in heating costs). The problem about any means tested system is a) the bureaucracy which is costly to set up and administer and b) the bureaucracy which deters people from claiming. Giving it to everyone is cheaper and simpler but you could say it of almost every other benefit.
    wealthy pensioners dont need the money, it was a Gordon Brown bribe to win votes. There are lots more things like it - free prescriptions ? But pre-election my usual PB lefties were all saying it was impossible to make savings and spend less. Apparently savings can be made.

    It's just a shame that having made the uncomfortable choice it will get wasted in 1970s inflation re-run.
    The 1970s - the clothes, the hair, the music, the strikes.....and at the end of it the Blessed Margaret.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,371

    stodge said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Now she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the deficit, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To be as fair as I want to be, you're right and wrong.

    I've no issue with the implementation of a pay review from an independent body. - Sunak did the same in July 2023 when implementing 5-7% pay increases for Police, NHS staff, the armed forces, teachers and others. While that was closer to the ambient inflation at the time, the 2024/25 award recognises a degree of "catch up" from the 2010s and the truth some elements of inflation remain "sticky". I hope local Government staff also receive a fair deal this year - they almost certainly won't.

    That said, the £22 billion "black hole" stunt has been poor and clumsy politics by Reeves - it's Opposition tactics, not Government strategy and has left her weakened. I assume the line is to get the pain in early and simply saying no to certain tax rises wasn't good politics in the campaign either. For what little it's worth Hunt was equally disingenuous on tax and spending. He may think he's left the economy in good shape but too many important cans were kicked down the road in the final 18 months.

    Where I disagree is the pensioners' fuel allowance which, AIUI, is being cut only for those pensioners not receiving any other benefit such as pension credit. There was an inherent absurdity about wealthy pensioners (they do exist) getting this £250 (which they didn't need). In truth, I'd prefer to have seen higher payments go to those in genuine need (£250 doesn't go that far in heating costs). The problem about any means tested system is a) the bureaucracy which is costly to set up and administer and b) the bureaucracy which deters people from claiming. Giving it to everyone is cheaper and simpler but you could say it of almost every other benefit.
    wealthy pensioners dont need the money, it was a Gordon Brown bribe to win votes. There are lots more things like it - free prescriptions ? But pre-election my usual PB lefties were all saying it was impossible to make savings and spend less. Apparently savings can be made.

    It's just a shame that having made the uncomfortable choice it will get wasted in 1970s inflation re-run.
    I think a lot of those "bribes" are there for convenience. The only 2 accessible pieces of information DWP have about pensioners are:

    1) They receive a pension
    2) They receive pension credits.

    As you should have seen with Covid HMRC have the bigger dataset and have never let DWP near it (for valid reasons most of the time)..

    Hence it's always been easier just to give ALL pensioners things such as free prescriptions, as also makes the external checks at the pharmacy equally straightforward.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,765

    stodge said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Now she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the deficit, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To be as fair as I want to be, you're right and wrong.

    I've no issue with the implementation of a pay review from an independent body. - Sunak did the same in July 2023 when implementing 5-7% pay increases for Police, NHS staff, the armed forces, teachers and others. While that was closer to the ambient inflation at the time, the 2024/25 award recognises a degree of "catch up" from the 2010s and the truth some elements of inflation remain "sticky". I hope local Government staff also receive a fair deal this year - they almost certainly won't.

    That said, the £22 billion "black hole" stunt has been poor and clumsy politics by Reeves - it's Opposition tactics, not Government strategy and has left her weakened. I assume the line is to get the pain in early and simply saying no to certain tax rises wasn't good politics in the campaign either. For what little it's worth Hunt was equally disingenuous on tax and spending. He may think he's left the economy in good shape but too many important cans were kicked down the road in the final 18 months.

    Where I disagree is the pensioners' fuel allowance which, AIUI, is being cut only for those pensioners not receiving any other benefit such as pension credit. There was an inherent absurdity about wealthy pensioners (they do exist) getting this £250 (which they didn't need). In truth, I'd prefer to have seen higher payments go to those in genuine need (£250 doesn't go that far in heating costs). The problem about any means tested system is a) the bureaucracy which is costly to set up and administer and b) the bureaucracy which deters people from claiming. Giving it to everyone is cheaper and simpler but you could say it of almost every other benefit.
    wealthy pensioners dont need the money, it was a Gordon Brown bribe to win votes. There are lots more things like it - free prescriptions ? But pre-election my usual PB lefties were all saying it was impossible to make savings and spend less. Apparently savings can be made.

    It's just a shame that having made the uncomfortable choice it will get wasted in 1970s inflation re-run.
    I think Reeves may face a somewhat hellish period ahead - Labour's instinct has always been to spend, and the unfortunate headline number for the doctors means that every public sector union boss will have big numbers in their sights. If she doesn't stamp down the fires very quickly it will lead to a 1970s style catastrophe. I'm not usually one to wish Labour politicians every success, but in this instance I certainly do.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,371
    Sandpit said:

    stodge said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Now she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the deficit, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To be as fair as I want to be, you're right and wrong.

    I've no issue with the implementation of a pay review from an independent body. - Sunak did the same in July 2023 when implementing 5-7% pay increases for Police, NHS staff, the armed forces, teachers and others. While that was closer to the ambient inflation at the time, the 2024/25 award recognises a degree of "catch up" from the 2010s and the truth some elements of inflation remain "sticky". I hope local Government staff also receive a fair deal this year - they almost certainly won't.

    That said, the £22 billion "black hole" stunt has been poor and clumsy politics by Reeves - it's Opposition tactics, not Government strategy and has left her weakened. I assume the line is to get the pain in early and simply saying no to certain tax rises wasn't good politics in the campaign either. For what little it's worth Hunt was equally disingenuous on tax and spending. He may think he's left the economy in good shape but too many important cans were kicked down the road in the final 18 months.

    Where I disagree is the pensioners' fuel allowance which, AIUI, is being cut only for those pensioners not receiving any other benefit such as pension credit. There was an inherent absurdity about wealthy pensioners (they do exist) getting this £250 (which they didn't need). In truth, I'd prefer to have seen higher payments go to those in genuine need (£250 doesn't go that far in heating costs). The problem about any means tested system is a) the bureaucracy which is costly to set up and administer and b) the bureaucracy which deters people from claiming. Giving it to everyone is cheaper and simpler but you could say it of almost every other benefit.
    wealthy pensioners dont need the money, it was a Gordon Brown bribe to win votes. There are lots more things like it - free prescriptions ? But pre-election my usual PB lefties were all saying it was impossible to make savings and spend less. Apparently savings can be made.

    It's just a shame that having made the uncomfortable choice it will get wasted in 1970s inflation re-run.
    The problem is that the ‘wealthy’ pensioners are a much smaller proportion of the population than this forum, and media in general, might think. They’re mostly retired workers from the public sector, and those public companies privatised from the 1980s, who are on final-salary index-linked pensions. It’s perhaps 10% of pensioners.
    If you look at people aged 72+ there will be a fair number who are on the last private sector defined benefit pension schemes. Younger than that and they are probably receiving defined contribution pensions and so need to watch the pennies.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,439
    eek said:

    stodge said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Now she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the deficit, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To be as fair as I want to be, you're right and wrong.

    I've no issue with the implementation of a pay review from an independent body. - Sunak did the same in July 2023 when implementing 5-7% pay increases for Police, NHS staff, the armed forces, teachers and others. While that was closer to the ambient inflation at the time, the 2024/25 award recognises a degree of "catch up" from the 2010s and the truth some elements of inflation remain "sticky". I hope local Government staff also receive a fair deal this year - they almost certainly won't.

    That said, the £22 billion "black hole" stunt has been poor and clumsy politics by Reeves - it's Opposition tactics, not Government strategy and has left her weakened. I assume the line is to get the pain in early and simply saying no to certain tax rises wasn't good politics in the campaign either. For what little it's worth Hunt was equally disingenuous on tax and spending. He may think he's left the economy in good shape but too many important cans were kicked down the road in the final 18 months.

    Where I disagree is the pensioners' fuel allowance which, AIUI, is being cut only for those pensioners not receiving any other benefit such as pension credit. There was an inherent absurdity about wealthy pensioners (they do exist) getting this £250 (which they didn't need). In truth, I'd prefer to have seen higher payments go to those in genuine need (£250 doesn't go that far in heating costs). The problem about any means tested system is a) the bureaucracy which is costly to set up and administer and b) the bureaucracy which deters people from claiming. Giving it to everyone is cheaper and simpler but you could say it of almost every other benefit.
    wealthy pensioners dont need the money, it was a Gordon Brown bribe to win votes. There are lots more things like it - free prescriptions ? But pre-election my usual PB lefties were all saying it was impossible to make savings and spend less. Apparently savings can be made.

    It's just a shame that having made the uncomfortable choice it will get wasted in 1970s inflation re-run.
    I think a lot of those "bribes" are there for convenience. The only 2 accessible pieces of information DWP have about pensioners are:

    1) They receive a pension
    2) They receive pension credits.

    As you should have seen with Covid HMRC have the bigger dataset and have never let DWP near it (for valid reasons most of the time)..

    Hence it's always been easier just to give ALL pensioners things such as free prescriptions, as also makes the external checks at the pharmacy equally straightforward.
    Community pharmacists and their staff really hate having to police the scheme.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,405
    Omnium said:

    stodge said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Now she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the deficit, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To be as fair as I want to be, you're right and wrong.

    I've no issue with the implementation of a pay review from an independent body. - Sunak did the same in July 2023 when implementing 5-7% pay increases for Police, NHS staff, the armed forces, teachers and others. While that was closer to the ambient inflation at the time, the 2024/25 award recognises a degree of "catch up" from the 2010s and the truth some elements of inflation remain "sticky". I hope local Government staff also receive a fair deal this year - they almost certainly won't.

    That said, the £22 billion "black hole" stunt has been poor and clumsy politics by Reeves - it's Opposition tactics, not Government strategy and has left her weakened. I assume the line is to get the pain in early and simply saying no to certain tax rises wasn't good politics in the campaign either. For what little it's worth Hunt was equally disingenuous on tax and spending. He may think he's left the economy in good shape but too many important cans were kicked down the road in the final 18 months.

    Where I disagree is the pensioners' fuel allowance which, AIUI, is being cut only for those pensioners not receiving any other benefit such as pension credit. There was an inherent absurdity about wealthy pensioners (they do exist) getting this £250 (which they didn't need). In truth, I'd prefer to have seen higher payments go to those in genuine need (£250 doesn't go that far in heating costs). The problem about any means tested system is a) the bureaucracy which is costly to set up and administer and b) the bureaucracy which deters people from claiming. Giving it to everyone is cheaper and simpler but you could say it of almost every other benefit.
    wealthy pensioners dont need the money, it was a Gordon Brown bribe to win votes. There are lots more things like it - free prescriptions ? But pre-election my usual PB lefties were all saying it was impossible to make savings and spend less. Apparently savings can be made.

    It's just a shame that having made the uncomfortable choice it will get wasted in 1970s inflation re-run.
    I think Reeves may face a somewhat hellish period ahead - Labour's instinct has always been to spend, and the unfortunate headline number for the doctors means that every public sector union boss will have big numbers in their sights. If she doesn't stamp down the fires very quickly it will lead to a 1970s style catastrophe. I'm not usually one to wish Labour politicians every success, but in this instance I certainly do.
    Reeves big challenge will be when we have a bitter winter. The media will hammer her.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,403

    ydoethur said:

    Nigelb said:

    viewcode said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "@YouGovAmerica
    NEW: Economist/YouGov Poll, July 27-30

    % of registered voters who plan to vote for...
    Harris: 46%
    Trump: 44%

    July 21-23 poll:
    Trump: 44%
    Harris: 41%

    https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/econTabReport_5LIBPv8.pdf#page=8"

    https://x.com/YouGovAmerica/status/1818636275345150185

    Provided she doesn't mess up the VP pick, she's going to win I think.
    Kamala Harris: Basil II

    Donald Trump: Samuel of Bulgaria

    2024 election = The Battle of Kleidion

    (I fucking hope, I am still scarred by 2016.)
    Harris: Admiral Nelson

    Trump: François-Paul Brueys d'Aigalliers

    Election = Battle of the Nile

    (Joe Biden: Earl St Vincent)
    Harris - Henry, Earl of Richmond
    Trump - Richard III
    Joe Biden - Margaret Beaufort
    Scenario - Bosworth Field.
    Harris - James T. Kirk

    Biden - Spock

    Trump - Khan Noonien Singh

    Scenario - Battle of the Mutara Nebula
    Shapiro as Spock and Biden as Christopher Pike, shurely?
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,415

    eek said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Noe she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE s should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the defict, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To answer that I will refer back to my point / question from yesterday.

    Why from the middle of nowhere did Rishi call an election just as the independent pay panels handed to the Government their recommendations?
    Rishi called an election because he was an idiot. The news going forward was mixed better growth and inflation tight control needed on public debt.

    But what the fk has Sunak got to do with Reeves ? These are her decisions and she's afraid to stand by them. She has no problem funding things she likes and to an eye watering amount.
    So far £11+ billion of public sector pay , dame bountiful sent another £11billion to Miliband to spend on fairies and unicorns.

    Why for example didnt she send him £9,5 bn and leve the pensioners alone ? because she has chosen to spend lots and any shortfall she need to tax the arse of voters.

    So where's the gowth coming from ? Where's the productivity ?

    Some polling on the subjects:

    Do you support or oppose junior doctors being offered a pay offer equivalent to an average increase of 22% over two years?

    All Britons
    Support: 59%
    Oppose: 28%

    2024 Labour voters
    Support: 80%
    Oppose: 12%


    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1818308493478183124

    Rachel Reeves has announced that winter fuel payments to pensioners in England and Wales will become means-tested, a move which the public supports by 47% to 38%

    The over-65s, however, are twice as likely to oppose the policy (66%) as support it (33%)


    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1818311146274767022

    As for productivity, what happens to productivity when your junior doctors and others decide to go and work for other employers instead?
    Oh that old chestnut. Voters always support extra spending if they dont have to pay for it themselves.

    You cant run a country on opinion polls, Ask a different question such as "should we keep pensioners warm and send less money overseas ?" and I think you'll get a different answer.

    As for junior doctors if your going to increase the pay bill by 22% then spend it on recruiting more doctors. That adds capacity to the system and allows people to have a work life balance. Just caving in to blackmail is mindless, as ever they'll be back for more. The BMA now own Wes Streeting, his chances of progressing major reform just moved down a notch.
    Don’t forget the additional costs on top such as the extra employers pension contributions. For rNHS it is an eye watering percent.

    Presumably if we have governance by opinion poll the so-called 2 child benefit cap must stay as well?

    People are always happy to cite polls that support their worldview and ignore them when it doesn’t.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,405
    eek said:

    stodge said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Now she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the deficit, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To be as fair as I want to be, you're right and wrong.

    I've no issue with the implementation of a pay review from an independent body. - Sunak did the same in July 2023 when implementing 5-7% pay increases for Police, NHS staff, the armed forces, teachers and others. While that was closer to the ambient inflation at the time, the 2024/25 award recognises a degree of "catch up" from the 2010s and the truth some elements of inflation remain "sticky". I hope local Government staff also receive a fair deal this year - they almost certainly won't.

    That said, the £22 billion "black hole" stunt has been poor and clumsy politics by Reeves - it's Opposition tactics, not Government strategy and has left her weakened. I assume the line is to get the pain in early and simply saying no to certain tax rises wasn't good politics in the campaign either. For what little it's worth Hunt was equally disingenuous on tax and spending. He may think he's left the economy in good shape but too many important cans were kicked down the road in the final 18 months.

    Where I disagree is the pensioners' fuel allowance which, AIUI, is being cut only for those pensioners not receiving any other benefit such as pension credit. There was an inherent absurdity about wealthy pensioners (they do exist) getting this £250 (which they didn't need). In truth, I'd prefer to have seen higher payments go to those in genuine need (£250 doesn't go that far in heating costs). The problem about any means tested system is a) the bureaucracy which is costly to set up and administer and b) the bureaucracy which deters people from claiming. Giving it to everyone is cheaper and simpler but you could say it of almost every other benefit.
    wealthy pensioners dont need the money, it was a Gordon Brown bribe to win votes. There are lots more things like it - free prescriptions ? But pre-election my usual PB lefties were all saying it was impossible to make savings and spend less. Apparently savings can be made.

    It's just a shame that having made the uncomfortable choice it will get wasted in 1970s inflation re-run.
    I think a lot of those "bribes" are there for convenience. The only 2 accessible pieces of information DWP have about pensioners are:

    1) They receive a pension
    2) They receive pension credits.

    As you should have seen with Covid HMRC have the bigger dataset and have never let DWP near it (for valid reasons most of the time)..

    Hence it's always been easier just to give ALL pensioners things such as free prescriptions, as also makes the external checks at the pharmacy equally straightforward.
    Maybe, but I still make the point this government will have to cut spending,And despite earlier protests that nothing can be cut it appears it can. On one level I welcome this, but on another where the saving gets pissed up the wall its madness.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,642
    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Nigelb said:

    viewcode said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "@YouGovAmerica
    NEW: Economist/YouGov Poll, July 27-30

    % of registered voters who plan to vote for...
    Harris: 46%
    Trump: 44%

    July 21-23 poll:
    Trump: 44%
    Harris: 41%

    https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/econTabReport_5LIBPv8.pdf#page=8"

    https://x.com/YouGovAmerica/status/1818636275345150185

    Provided she doesn't mess up the VP pick, she's going to win I think.
    Kamala Harris: Basil II

    Donald Trump: Samuel of Bulgaria

    2024 election = The Battle of Kleidion

    (I fucking hope, I am still scarred by 2016.)
    Harris: Admiral Nelson

    Trump: François-Paul Brueys d'Aigalliers

    Election = Battle of the Nile

    (Joe Biden: Earl St Vincent)
    Harris - Henry, Earl of Richmond
    Trump - Richard III
    Joe Biden - Margaret Beaufort
    Scenario - Bosworth Field.
    Harris - James T. Kirk

    Biden - Spock

    Trump - Khan Noonien Singh

    Scenario - Battle of the Mutara Nebula
    Shapiro as Spock and Biden as Christopher Pike, shurely?
    Biden sacrificed himself because the needs of the many outweighed the needs of the few.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,180
    edited July 31

    ydoethur said:

    Nigelb said:

    viewcode said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "@YouGovAmerica
    NEW: Economist/YouGov Poll, July 27-30

    % of registered voters who plan to vote for...
    Harris: 46%
    Trump: 44%

    July 21-23 poll:
    Trump: 44%
    Harris: 41%

    https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/econTabReport_5LIBPv8.pdf#page=8"

    https://x.com/YouGovAmerica/status/1818636275345150185

    Provided she doesn't mess up the VP pick, she's going to win I think.
    Kamala Harris: Basil II

    Donald Trump: Samuel of Bulgaria

    2024 election = The Battle of Kleidion

    (I fucking hope, I am still scarred by 2016.)
    Harris: Admiral Nelson

    Trump: François-Paul Brueys d'Aigalliers

    Election = Battle of the Nile

    (Joe Biden: Earl St Vincent)
    Harris - Henry, Earl of Richmond
    Trump - Richard III
    Joe Biden - Margaret Beaufort
    Scenario - Bosworth Field.
    Harris - James T. Kirk

    Biden - Spock

    Trump - Khan Noonien Singh

    Scenario - Battle of the Mutara Nebula
    Thrilla in Manilla: After 7 rounds of rope-a-dope with Joe Biden, the Dems pull the switch and Harris/Ali comes out swinging for the 8th. Trump/Foreman is caught on the hop and ends up flat on the canvas. Cue bedlam.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,439
    Taz said:

    eek said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Noe she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE s should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the defict, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To answer that I will refer back to my point / question from yesterday.

    Why from the middle of nowhere did Rishi call an election just as the independent pay panels handed to the Government their recommendations?
    Rishi called an election because he was an idiot. The news going forward was mixed better growth and inflation tight control needed on public debt.

    But what the fk has Sunak got to do with Reeves ? These are her decisions and she's afraid to stand by them. She has no problem funding things she likes and to an eye watering amount.
    So far £11+ billion of public sector pay , dame bountiful sent another £11billion to Miliband to spend on fairies and unicorns.

    Why for example didnt she send him £9,5 bn and leve the pensioners alone ? because she has chosen to spend lots and any shortfall she need to tax the arse of voters.

    So where's the gowth coming from ? Where's the productivity ?

    Some polling on the subjects:

    Do you support or oppose junior doctors being offered a pay offer equivalent to an average increase of 22% over two years?

    All Britons
    Support: 59%
    Oppose: 28%

    2024 Labour voters
    Support: 80%
    Oppose: 12%


    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1818308493478183124

    Rachel Reeves has announced that winter fuel payments to pensioners in England and Wales will become means-tested, a move which the public supports by 47% to 38%

    The over-65s, however, are twice as likely to oppose the policy (66%) as support it (33%)


    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1818311146274767022

    As for productivity, what happens to productivity when your junior doctors and others decide to go and work for other employers instead?
    Oh that old chestnut. Voters always support extra spending if they dont have to pay for it themselves.

    You cant run a country on opinion polls, Ask a different question such as "should we keep pensioners warm and send less money overseas ?" and I think you'll get a different answer.

    As for junior doctors if your going to increase the pay bill by 22% then spend it on recruiting more doctors. That adds capacity to the system and allows people to have a work life balance. Just caving in to blackmail is mindless, as ever they'll be back for more. The BMA now own Wes Streeting, his chances of progressing major reform just moved down a notch.
    Don’t forget the additional costs on top such as the extra employers pension contributions. For rNHS it is an eye watering percent.

    Presumably if we have governance by opinion poll the so-called 2 child benefit cap must stay as well?

    People are always happy to cite polls that support their worldview and ignore them when it doesn’t.
    As we saw here during June!
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,006
    edited July 31
    So age wise Starmer Labour now does best with 25-44s not 18-24s. The LDs and Greens now do best with under 25s. The Tories still do best with pensioners, Reform do best with 55-64s.

    Class wise Starmer Labour did best with ABs and C1s, the Sunak Tories did best with ABs and DEs, the latter perhaps surprisingly. Reform unsurprisingly did best with C2s and the LDs unsurprisingly did best with ABs. The Greens did best with C1s
    https://www.ipsos.com/en-uk/how-britain-voted-in-the-2024-election
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,765

    Omnium said:

    stodge said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Now she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the deficit, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To be as fair as I want to be, you're right and wrong.

    I've no issue with the implementation of a pay review from an independent body. - Sunak did the same in July 2023 when implementing 5-7% pay increases for Police, NHS staff, the armed forces, teachers and others. While that was closer to the ambient inflation at the time, the 2024/25 award recognises a degree of "catch up" from the 2010s and the truth some elements of inflation remain "sticky". I hope local Government staff also receive a fair deal this year - they almost certainly won't.

    That said, the £22 billion "black hole" stunt has been poor and clumsy politics by Reeves - it's Opposition tactics, not Government strategy and has left her weakened. I assume the line is to get the pain in early and simply saying no to certain tax rises wasn't good politics in the campaign either. For what little it's worth Hunt was equally disingenuous on tax and spending. He may think he's left the economy in good shape but too many important cans were kicked down the road in the final 18 months.

    Where I disagree is the pensioners' fuel allowance which, AIUI, is being cut only for those pensioners not receiving any other benefit such as pension credit. There was an inherent absurdity about wealthy pensioners (they do exist) getting this £250 (which they didn't need). In truth, I'd prefer to have seen higher payments go to those in genuine need (£250 doesn't go that far in heating costs). The problem about any means tested system is a) the bureaucracy which is costly to set up and administer and b) the bureaucracy which deters people from claiming. Giving it to everyone is cheaper and simpler but you could say it of almost every other benefit.
    wealthy pensioners dont need the money, it was a Gordon Brown bribe to win votes. There are lots more things like it - free prescriptions ? But pre-election my usual PB lefties were all saying it was impossible to make savings and spend less. Apparently savings can be made.

    It's just a shame that having made the uncomfortable choice it will get wasted in 1970s inflation re-run.
    I think Reeves may face a somewhat hellish period ahead - Labour's instinct has always been to spend, and the unfortunate headline number for the doctors means that every public sector union boss will have big numbers in their sights. If she doesn't stamp down the fires very quickly it will lead to a 1970s style catastrophe. I'm not usually one to wish Labour politicians every success, but in this instance I certainly do.
    Reeves big challenge will be when we have a bitter winter. The media will hammer her.
    Yes. I agree. (Still, I guess the bright side is that it could have been Corbyn and co in charge, and then we'd all have our ferry tickets booked)
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,642
    HSBC have lost another customer.

    Very Unconfirmed Reports right now, but some Sources in Syria are claiming that Brigadier General Amir Ali Hajizadeh, the Commander of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC) Aerospace Forces, has been Assassination in an Attack near the Syrian Capital of Damascus. Hajizadeh is believed to have been the Senior Commander who planned and ordered the Iranian Ballistic and Cruise Missile Attack in April against Israel.

    https://x.com/sentdefender/status/1818670645468672450
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,439
    kinabalu said:

    ydoethur said:

    Nigelb said:

    viewcode said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "@YouGovAmerica
    NEW: Economist/YouGov Poll, July 27-30

    % of registered voters who plan to vote for...
    Harris: 46%
    Trump: 44%

    July 21-23 poll:
    Trump: 44%
    Harris: 41%

    https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/econTabReport_5LIBPv8.pdf#page=8"

    https://x.com/YouGovAmerica/status/1818636275345150185

    Provided she doesn't mess up the VP pick, she's going to win I think.
    Kamala Harris: Basil II

    Donald Trump: Samuel of Bulgaria

    2024 election = The Battle of Kleidion

    (I fucking hope, I am still scarred by 2016.)
    Harris: Admiral Nelson

    Trump: François-Paul Brueys d'Aigalliers

    Election = Battle of the Nile

    (Joe Biden: Earl St Vincent)
    Harris - Henry, Earl of Richmond
    Trump - Richard III
    Joe Biden - Margaret Beaufort
    Scenario - Bosworth Field.
    Harris - James T. Kirk

    Biden - Spock

    Trump - Khan Noonien Singh

    Scenario - Battle of the Mutara Nebula
    Thriller in Manilla: After 7 rounds of rope-a-dope with Joe Biden, the Dems pull the switch and Harris/Ali comes out swinging for the 8th. Trump/Foreman is caught on the hop and ends up flat on the canvas. Cue bedlam.
    I have sometimes idly wondered what Trump will do if he loses in November. Especially if, as usual, he loses the popular vote AND the Electoral College.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,006
    52% support government set mandatory housebuilding targets but 67% oppose allowing new homes on greenbelt land
    https://x.com/YouGov/status/1818610943955292374
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,405
    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    stodge said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Now she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the deficit, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To be as fair as I want to be, you're right and wrong.

    I've no issue with the implementation of a pay review from an independent body. - Sunak did the same in July 2023 when implementing 5-7% pay increases for Police, NHS staff, the armed forces, teachers and others. While that was closer to the ambient inflation at the time, the 2024/25 award recognises a degree of "catch up" from the 2010s and the truth some elements of inflation remain "sticky". I hope local Government staff also receive a fair deal this year - they almost certainly won't.

    That said, the £22 billion "black hole" stunt has been poor and clumsy politics by Reeves - it's Opposition tactics, not Government strategy and has left her weakened. I assume the line is to get the pain in early and simply saying no to certain tax rises wasn't good politics in the campaign either. For what little it's worth Hunt was equally disingenuous on tax and spending. He may think he's left the economy in good shape but too many important cans were kicked down the road in the final 18 months.

    Where I disagree is the pensioners' fuel allowance which, AIUI, is being cut only for those pensioners not receiving any other benefit such as pension credit. There was an inherent absurdity about wealthy pensioners (they do exist) getting this £250 (which they didn't need). In truth, I'd prefer to have seen higher payments go to those in genuine need (£250 doesn't go that far in heating costs). The problem about any means tested system is a) the bureaucracy which is costly to set up and administer and b) the bureaucracy which deters people from claiming. Giving it to everyone is cheaper and simpler but you could say it of almost every other benefit.
    wealthy pensioners dont need the money, it was a Gordon Brown bribe to win votes. There are lots more things like it - free prescriptions ? But pre-election my usual PB lefties were all saying it was impossible to make savings and spend less. Apparently savings can be made.

    It's just a shame that having made the uncomfortable choice it will get wasted in 1970s inflation re-run.
    I think Reeves may face a somewhat hellish period ahead - Labour's instinct has always been to spend, and the unfortunate headline number for the doctors means that every public sector union boss will have big numbers in their sights. If she doesn't stamp down the fires very quickly it will lead to a 1970s style catastrophe. I'm not usually one to wish Labour politicians every success, but in this instance I certainly do.
    Reeves big challenge will be when we have a bitter winter. The media will hammer her.
    Yes. I agree. (Still, I guess the bright side is that it could have been Corbyn and co in charge, and then we'd all have our ferry tickets booked)
    Oddly I would prefer John Mcdonnell as chancellor, A mad bastard with few qualms but at least he would be upfront and honest about what he is doing and he would be more likely to build houses and infrastruture than Reeves.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,006
    edited July 31
    Sandpit said:

    stodge said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Now she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the deficit, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To be as fair as I want to be, you're right and wrong.

    I've no issue with the implementation of a pay review from an independent body. - Sunak did the same in July 2023 when implementing 5-7% pay increases for Police, NHS staff, the armed forces, teachers and others. While that was closer to the ambient inflation at the time, the 2024/25 award recognises a degree of "catch up" from the 2010s and the truth some elements of inflation remain "sticky". I hope local Government staff also receive a fair deal this year - they almost certainly won't.

    That said, the £22 billion "black hole" stunt has been poor and clumsy politics by Reeves - it's Opposition tactics, not Government strategy and has left her weakened. I assume the line is to get the pain in early and simply saying no to certain tax rises wasn't good politics in the campaign either. For what little it's worth Hunt was equally disingenuous on tax and spending. He may think he's left the economy in good shape but too many important cans were kicked down the road in the final 18 months.

    Where I disagree is the pensioners' fuel allowance which, AIUI, is being cut only for those pensioners not receiving any other benefit such as pension credit. There was an inherent absurdity about wealthy pensioners (they do exist) getting this £250 (which they didn't need). In truth, I'd prefer to have seen higher payments go to those in genuine need (£250 doesn't go that far in heating costs). The problem about any means tested system is a) the bureaucracy which is costly to set up and administer and b) the bureaucracy which deters people from claiming. Giving it to everyone is cheaper and simpler but you could say it of almost every other benefit.
    wealthy pensioners dont need the money, it was a Gordon Brown bribe to win votes. There are lots more things like it - free prescriptions ? But pre-election my usual PB lefties were all saying it was impossible to make savings and spend less. Apparently savings can be made.

    It's just a shame that having made the uncomfortable choice it will get wasted in 1970s inflation re-run.
    The problem is that the ‘wealthy’ pensioners are a much smaller proportion of the population than this forum, and media in general, might think. They’re mostly retired workers from the public sector, and those public companies privatised from the 1980s, who are on final-salary index-linked pensions. It’s perhaps 10% of pensioners.
    Plus a few retired directors and City of London workers living in £1 million+ homes they own outright with substantial shares and private pensions
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,439

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    stodge said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Now she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the deficit, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To be as fair as I want to be, you're right and wrong.

    I've no issue with the implementation of a pay review from an independent body. - Sunak did the same in July 2023 when implementing 5-7% pay increases for Police, NHS staff, the armed forces, teachers and others. While that was closer to the ambient inflation at the time, the 2024/25 award recognises a degree of "catch up" from the 2010s and the truth some elements of inflation remain "sticky". I hope local Government staff also receive a fair deal this year - they almost certainly won't.

    That said, the £22 billion "black hole" stunt has been poor and clumsy politics by Reeves - it's Opposition tactics, not Government strategy and has left her weakened. I assume the line is to get the pain in early and simply saying no to certain tax rises wasn't good politics in the campaign either. For what little it's worth Hunt was equally disingenuous on tax and spending. He may think he's left the economy in good shape but too many important cans were kicked down the road in the final 18 months.

    Where I disagree is the pensioners' fuel allowance which, AIUI, is being cut only for those pensioners not receiving any other benefit such as pension credit. There was an inherent absurdity about wealthy pensioners (they do exist) getting this £250 (which they didn't need). In truth, I'd prefer to have seen higher payments go to those in genuine need (£250 doesn't go that far in heating costs). The problem about any means tested system is a) the bureaucracy which is costly to set up and administer and b) the bureaucracy which deters people from claiming. Giving it to everyone is cheaper and simpler but you could say it of almost every other benefit.
    wealthy pensioners dont need the money, it was a Gordon Brown bribe to win votes. There are lots more things like it - free prescriptions ? But pre-election my usual PB lefties were all saying it was impossible to make savings and spend less. Apparently savings can be made.

    It's just a shame that having made the uncomfortable choice it will get wasted in 1970s inflation re-run.
    I think Reeves may face a somewhat hellish period ahead - Labour's instinct has always been to spend, and the unfortunate headline number for the doctors means that every public sector union boss will have big numbers in their sights. If she doesn't stamp down the fires very quickly it will lead to a 1970s style catastrophe. I'm not usually one to wish Labour politicians every success, but in this instance I certainly do.
    Reeves big challenge will be when we have a bitter winter. The media will hammer her.
    Yes. I agree. (Still, I guess the bright side is that it could have been Corbyn and co in charge, and then we'd all have our ferry tickets booked)
    Oddly I would prefer John Mcdonnell as chancellor, A mad bastard with few qualms but at least he would be upfront and honest about what he is doing and he would be more likely to build houses and infrastruture than Reeves.
    He's always sounded reasonable to me. Perhaps that's because I'm a leftie.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,765

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    stodge said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Now she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the deficit, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To be as fair as I want to be, you're right and wrong.

    I've no issue with the implementation of a pay review from an independent body. - Sunak did the same in July 2023 when implementing 5-7% pay increases for Police, NHS staff, the armed forces, teachers and others. While that was closer to the ambient inflation at the time, the 2024/25 award recognises a degree of "catch up" from the 2010s and the truth some elements of inflation remain "sticky". I hope local Government staff also receive a fair deal this year - they almost certainly won't.

    That said, the £22 billion "black hole" stunt has been poor and clumsy politics by Reeves - it's Opposition tactics, not Government strategy and has left her weakened. I assume the line is to get the pain in early and simply saying no to certain tax rises wasn't good politics in the campaign either. For what little it's worth Hunt was equally disingenuous on tax and spending. He may think he's left the economy in good shape but too many important cans were kicked down the road in the final 18 months.

    Where I disagree is the pensioners' fuel allowance which, AIUI, is being cut only for those pensioners not receiving any other benefit such as pension credit. There was an inherent absurdity about wealthy pensioners (they do exist) getting this £250 (which they didn't need). In truth, I'd prefer to have seen higher payments go to those in genuine need (£250 doesn't go that far in heating costs). The problem about any means tested system is a) the bureaucracy which is costly to set up and administer and b) the bureaucracy which deters people from claiming. Giving it to everyone is cheaper and simpler but you could say it of almost every other benefit.
    wealthy pensioners dont need the money, it was a Gordon Brown bribe to win votes. There are lots more things like it - free prescriptions ? But pre-election my usual PB lefties were all saying it was impossible to make savings and spend less. Apparently savings can be made.

    It's just a shame that having made the uncomfortable choice it will get wasted in 1970s inflation re-run.
    I think Reeves may face a somewhat hellish period ahead - Labour's instinct has always been to spend, and the unfortunate headline number for the doctors means that every public sector union boss will have big numbers in their sights. If she doesn't stamp down the fires very quickly it will lead to a 1970s style catastrophe. I'm not usually one to wish Labour politicians every success, but in this instance I certainly do.
    Reeves big challenge will be when we have a bitter winter. The media will hammer her.
    Yes. I agree. (Still, I guess the bright side is that it could have been Corbyn and co in charge, and then we'd all have our ferry tickets booked)
    Oddly I would prefer John Mcdonnell as chancellor, A mad bastard with few qualms but at least he would be upfront and honest about what he is doing and he would be more likely to build houses and infrastruture than Reeves.
    Well that is very deeply odd! I'll give you that :)
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,006
    @BorisJohnson
    I’m delighted to share the cover for UNLEASHED and I’m looking forward to sharing the book with you when it is published this October.
    Pre-order here: https://lnkfi.re/lAxuCn
    https://x.com/BorisJohnson/status/1818610843140907318
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,805

    Good to see Britain doing so well in the medal count at the Olympics. (In general democratic nations seem to be doing quite well there, so far.)

    Thanks Jim! Very kind of you to be supportive of us. I will cheer on an American this evening in return.
  • kenObikenObi Posts: 181
    Sandpit said:

    stodge said:

    eek said:

    Labour hit the sleaze path early

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnd064lx50lo

    TBF, I think that is the most minor of minor ruling breaking. She has other houses rented out between her and her husband that are registered.
    Cut the Field Marshal some slack. It is only three weeks in and he is still grieving.
    Since I didnt vote for the last govt there;s nothing to grieve about only the depressing certainty that Reeves is going to fk things up.
    Given what she has inherited - not completely fk things up will take a miracle worker...


    Note the differences in opinion here - I know it's Hunt's fked up NI cuts that have created a lot of the problems, you are pretending that those tax cuts were not a desperate attempt to win some votes.
    Oh you added a bit

    Reeves is simply spinless. I could respect her is she wantd to increase public pay and came clean about it. Instead she us hiding behind others to avoid the heat. Coward.

    And it's not as if people cant see through it. Now she's fked up even more by dragging the OBR in to things. If the OBR is meant to be non political , it now ii is now firmly in the political arena, And she has jusr painted herself in to a corner. as it owns her. That's not what a CoE should be doing.

    And then of course there's the general loss of credibility as she backtracks on previous promises, changes policy and bribes her mates. Pre election you had a go at me for say she should cut spending and you told me there was no room for cuts. What would you say about the £1.5bn cut to pensioners heating ?

    Clearly there is room and there will be more cuts to come. But instead of building infrastructure of or cutting the deficit, she'll simply spend on rubbish and we'll be no better off.
    To be as fair as I want to be, you're right and wrong.

    I've no issue with the implementation of a pay review from an independent body. - Sunak did the same in July 2023 when implementing 5-7% pay increases for Police, NHS staff, the armed forces, teachers and others. While that was closer to the ambient inflation at the time, the 2024/25 award recognises a degree of "catch up" from the 2010s and the truth some elements of inflation remain "sticky". I hope local Government staff also receive a fair deal this year - they almost certainly won't.

    That said, the £22 billion "black hole" stunt has been poor and clumsy politics by Reeves - it's Opposition tactics, not Government strategy and has left her weakened. I assume the line is to get the pain in early and simply saying no to certain tax rises wasn't good politics in the campaign either. For what little it's worth Hunt was equally disingenuous on tax and spending. He may think he's left the economy in good shape but too many important cans were kicked down the road in the final 18 months.

    Where I disagree is the pensioners' fuel allowance which, AIUI, is being cut only for those pensioners not receiving any other benefit such as pension credit. There was an inherent absurdity about wealthy pensioners (they do exist) getting this £250 (which they didn't need). In truth, I'd prefer to have seen higher payments go to those in genuine need (£250 doesn't go that far in heating costs). The problem about any means tested system is a) the bureaucracy which is costly to set up and administer and b) the bureaucracy which deters people from claiming. Giving it to everyone is cheaper and simpler but you could say it of almost every other benefit.
    wealthy pensioners dont need the money, it was a Gordon Brown bribe to win votes. There are lots more things like it - free prescriptions ? But pre-election my usual PB lefties were all saying it was impossible to make savings and spend less. Apparently savings can be made.

    It's just a shame that having made the uncomfortable choice it will get wasted in 1970s inflation re-run.
    The problem is that the ‘wealthy’ pensioners are a much smaller proportion of the population than this forum, and media in general, might think. They’re mostly retired workers from the public sector, and those public companies privatised from the 1980s, who are on final-salary index-linked pensions. It’s perhaps 10% of pensioners.
    In 2022 the figures were;
    27% of pensioners had household wealth of £1m
    I know that there will be plenty who are asset (house) rich and cash poor, but it simply seems insane to throw goodies at this cohort.
    There is obviously an issue with the cliff edge, but if you want to tackle pensioner poverty you would be better looking at the pension credit and making sure people claimed it.

    There's roughly 1m pensioners who can be described as in material deprivation, and 570k who can't afford to heat their homes properly.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,403

    HSBC have lost another customer.

    Very Unconfirmed Reports right now, but some Sources in Syria are claiming that Brigadier General Amir Ali Hajizadeh, the Commander of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC) Aerospace Forces, has been Assassination in an Attack near the Syrian Capital of Damascus. Hajizadeh is believed to have been the Senior Commander who planned and ordered the Iranian Ballistic and Cruise Missile Attack in April against Israel.

    https://x.com/sentdefender/status/1818670645468672450

    Mossad suddenly very active.

    I wonder what is going on in Israel? Have they decided to dial down the war and feel they need to make use of the moment to eliminate as much leadership as they can, or is Netanyahu feeling the heat and trying to shore up his position?

    Or - is somebody else taking advantage in the hope Israel gets the blame? *looks hard at Mohammed Bin Salman*
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,576
    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Nigelb said:

    viewcode said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "@YouGovAmerica
    NEW: Economist/YouGov Poll, July 27-30

    % of registered voters who plan to vote for...
    Harris: 46%
    Trump: 44%

    July 21-23 poll:
    Trump: 44%
    Harris: 41%

    https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/econTabReport_5LIBPv8.pdf#page=8"

    https://x.com/YouGovAmerica/status/1818636275345150185

    Provided she doesn't mess up the VP pick, she's going to win I think.
    Kamala Harris: Basil II

    Donald Trump: Samuel of Bulgaria

    2024 election = The Battle of Kleidion

    (I fucking hope, I am still scarred by 2016.)
    Harris: Admiral Nelson

    Trump: François-Paul Brueys d'Aigalliers

    Election = Battle of the Nile

    (Joe Biden: Earl St Vincent)
    Harris - Henry, Earl of Richmond
    Trump - Richard III
    Joe Biden - Margaret Beaufort
    Scenario - Bosworth Field.
    Harris - James T. Kirk

    Biden - Spock

    Trump - Khan Noonien Singh

    Scenario - Battle of the Mutara Nebula
    Shapiro as Spock and Biden as Christopher Pike, shurely?
    Don't tell him, Pi....Oh.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,655
    ydoethur said:

    HSBC have lost another customer.

    Very Unconfirmed Reports right now, but some Sources in Syria are claiming that Brigadier General Amir Ali Hajizadeh, the Commander of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC) Aerospace Forces, has been Assassination in an Attack near the Syrian Capital of Damascus. Hajizadeh is believed to have been the Senior Commander who planned and ordered the Iranian Ballistic and Cruise Missile Attack in April against Israel.

    https://x.com/sentdefender/status/1818670645468672450

    Mossad suddenly very active.

    I wonder what is going on in Israel? Have they decided to dial down the war and feel they need to make use of the moment to eliminate as much leadership as they can, or is Netanyahu feeling the heat and trying to shore up his position?

    Or - is somebody else taking advantage in the hope Israel gets the blame? *looks hard at Mohammed Bin Salman*
    This isn't my idea of dialling down the war.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,403

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Nigelb said:

    viewcode said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "@YouGovAmerica
    NEW: Economist/YouGov Poll, July 27-30

    % of registered voters who plan to vote for...
    Harris: 46%
    Trump: 44%

    July 21-23 poll:
    Trump: 44%
    Harris: 41%

    https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/econTabReport_5LIBPv8.pdf#page=8"

    https://x.com/YouGovAmerica/status/1818636275345150185

    Provided she doesn't mess up the VP pick, she's going to win I think.
    Kamala Harris: Basil II

    Donald Trump: Samuel of Bulgaria

    2024 election = The Battle of Kleidion

    (I fucking hope, I am still scarred by 2016.)
    Harris: Admiral Nelson

    Trump: François-Paul Brueys d'Aigalliers

    Election = Battle of the Nile

    (Joe Biden: Earl St Vincent)
    Harris - Henry, Earl of Richmond
    Trump - Richard III
    Joe Biden - Margaret Beaufort
    Scenario - Bosworth Field.
    Harris - James T. Kirk

    Biden - Spock

    Trump - Khan Noonien Singh

    Scenario - Battle of the Mutara Nebula
    Shapiro as Spock and Biden as Christopher Pike, shurely?
    Biden sacrificed himself because the needs of the many outweighed the needs of the few.
    Christopher Pike heroically saved dozens from a reactor and ended up barely functional, having to give up his Starfleet career.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,642
    edited July 31
    ydoethur said:

    HSBC have lost another customer.

    Very Unconfirmed Reports right now, but some Sources in Syria are claiming that Brigadier General Amir Ali Hajizadeh, the Commander of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC) Aerospace Forces, has been Assassination in an Attack near the Syrian Capital of Damascus. Hajizadeh is believed to have been the Senior Commander who planned and ordered the Iranian Ballistic and Cruise Missile Attack in April against Israel.

    https://x.com/sentdefender/status/1818670645468672450

    Mossad suddenly very active.

    I wonder what is going on in Israel? Have they decided to dial down the war and feel they need to make use of the moment to eliminate as much leadership as they can, or is Netanyahu feeling the heat and trying to shore up his position?

    Or - is somebody else taking advantage in the hope Israel gets the blame? *looks hard at Mohammed Bin Salman*
    Theory.

    Bibi has realised Kamala Harris is going to win so he's taking advantage that there's a lame duck in the White House.


    It's entirely possible from January the Presidency, the Senate, and the House will be controlled by the Dems which maybe unfortunate Bibi.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,655
    HYUFD said:

    @BorisJohnson
    I’m delighted to share the cover for UNLEASHED and I’m looking forward to sharing the book with you when it is published this October.
    Pre-order here: https://lnkfi.re/lAxuCn
    https://x.com/BorisJohnson/status/1818610843140907318

    A nice angle to show the width.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,791

    Good to see Britain doing so well in the medal count at the Olympics. (In general democratic nations seem to be doing quite well there, so far.)

    We used to get 5 or less golds regularly (1 in Atlanta) but in the last few Olympics we have been in the twenties (high twenties in 2 of them). I assume there are more available, but that wouldn't account for the big jump and in the last 4 Olympics we have been ranked 4th or better whereas before that 10th was a good result. We are clearly doing something right across a number of sports.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,851
    Graun feed:

    'Republic, the group campaigning against having a hereditary monarch as head of state, has released polling showing that “56% of the public believe MPs should swear allegiance to their constituents and the country, compared to just 11% who want MPs to pledge allegiance to the king”.'
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,851

    HYUFD said:

    @BorisJohnson
    I’m delighted to share the cover for UNLEASHED and I’m looking forward to sharing the book with you when it is published this October.
    Pre-order here: https://lnkfi.re/lAxuCn
    https://x.com/BorisJohnson/status/1818610843140907318

    A nice angle to show the width.
    Muscle or ...? (Not me, but other PBers would like to know.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,405
    kjh said:

    Good to see Britain doing so well in the medal count at the Olympics. (In general democratic nations seem to be doing quite well there, so far.)

    We used to get 5 or less golds regularly (1 in Atlanta) but in the last few Olympics we have been in the twenties (high twenties in 2 of them). I assume there are more available, but that wouldn't account for the big jump and in the last 4 Olympics we have been ranked 4th or better whereas before that 10th was a good result. We are clearly doing something right across a number of sports.
    Lottery funding
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,642
    Carnyx said:

    Graun feed:

    'Republic, the group campaigning against having a hereditary monarch as head of state, has released polling showing that “56% of the public believe MPs should swear allegiance to their constituents and the country, compared to just 11% who want MPs to pledge allegiance to the king”.'

    Morning thread sorted.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,020
    HYUFD said:

    @BorisJohnson
    I’m delighted to share the cover for UNLEASHED and I’m looking forward to sharing the book with you when it is published this October.
    Pre-order here: https://lnkfi.re/lAxuCn
    https://x.com/BorisJohnson/status/1818610843140907318

    Whatever happened to his GB News show?
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,851

    Carnyx said:

    Graun feed:

    'Republic, the group campaigning against having a hereditary monarch as head of state, has released polling showing that “56% of the public believe MPs should swear allegiance to their constituents and the country, compared to just 11% who want MPs to pledge allegiance to the king”.'

    Morning thread sorted.
    I did wonder if you would deign to notice it. But I don't see *who* did the polling.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,851

    kjh said:

    Good to see Britain doing so well in the medal count at the Olympics. (In general democratic nations seem to be doing quite well there, so far.)

    We used to get 5 or less golds regularly (1 in Atlanta) but in the last few Olympics we have been in the twenties (high twenties in 2 of them). I assume there are more available, but that wouldn't account for the big jump and in the last 4 Olympics we have been ranked 4th or better whereas before that 10th was a good result. We are clearly doing something right across a number of sports.
    Lottery funding
    AKA tax on stupidity/benevolence, whichever one prefers.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,006
    edited July 31
    Carnyx said:

    Graun feed:

    'Republic, the group campaigning against having a hereditary monarch as head of state, has released polling showing that “56% of the public believe MPs should swear allegiance to their constituents and the country, compared to just 11% who want MPs to pledge allegiance to the king”.'

    So? The King is head of state, we have no written constitution, our constitution is based on the sovereignty of Crown in Parliament and the public give their verdict on MPs at election time they don't need an Oath to them from their MP as well!
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,439
    Carnyx said:

    Graun feed:

    'Republic, the group campaigning against having a hereditary monarch as head of state, has released polling showing that “56% of the public believe MPs should swear allegiance to their constituents and the country, compared to just 11% who want MPs to pledge allegiance to the king”.'

    Would that tet the Shinners take their seats?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,642
    Carnyx said:

    kjh said:

    Good to see Britain doing so well in the medal count at the Olympics. (In general democratic nations seem to be doing quite well there, so far.)

    We used to get 5 or less golds regularly (1 in Atlanta) but in the last few Olympics we have been in the twenties (high twenties in 2 of them). I assume there are more available, but that wouldn't account for the big jump and in the last 4 Olympics we have been ranked 4th or better whereas before that 10th was a good result. We are clearly doing something right across a number of sports.
    Lottery funding
    AKA tax on stupidity/benevolence, whichever one prefers.
    I consider the lottery/scratchcards as a tax on poor people.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,403
    Carnyx said:

    Graun feed:

    'Republic, the group campaigning against having a hereditary monarch as head of state, has released polling showing that “56% of the public believe MPs should swear allegiance to their constituents and the country, compared to just 11% who want MPs to pledge allegiance to the king”.'

    Meanwhile, Republicans in the US believe that what their country really needs is a King...
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,851
    edited July 31
    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    Graun feed:

    'Republic, the group campaigning against having a hereditary monarch as head of state, has released polling showing that “56% of the public believe MPs should swear allegiance to their constituents and the country, compared to just 11% who want MPs to pledge allegiance to the king”.'

    So, the King is head of state, we have no written constitution, our constitution is based on the sovereignty of Crown in Parliament and the public give their verdict on MPs at election time they don't need an Oath to them from their MP as well!
    Completely missing the point.

    It might also be remarked that the King has proven rather keen on changing and affecting the law of the land directly in ways that, erm, affect his personal interests. That is, not through his MP. Not so much of that lately, but you might like to consider how that sits alongside your excited reflex reflux.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,586
    edited July 31

    kjh said:

    Good to see Britain doing so well in the medal count at the Olympics. (In general democratic nations seem to be doing quite well there, so far.)

    We used to get 5 or less golds regularly (1 in Atlanta) but in the last few Olympics we have been in the twenties (high twenties in 2 of them). I assume there are more available, but that wouldn't account for the big jump and in the last 4 Olympics we have been ranked 4th or better whereas before that 10th was a good result. We are clearly doing something right across a number of sports.
    Lottery funding
    A combination of the lottery funding (which pays for elite facilities, and a stipend for athletes and coaches to enable them to work full time on the programme), a determined effort to target 2012 aggressively for medals, and the legacy of those Games inspiring the next generation of British athletes into Olympic sports.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,405

    Carnyx said:

    kjh said:

    Good to see Britain doing so well in the medal count at the Olympics. (In general democratic nations seem to be doing quite well there, so far.)

    We used to get 5 or less golds regularly (1 in Atlanta) but in the last few Olympics we have been in the twenties (high twenties in 2 of them). I assume there are more available, but that wouldn't account for the big jump and in the last 4 Olympics we have been ranked 4th or better whereas before that 10th was a good result. We are clearly doing something right across a number of sports.
    Lottery funding
    AKA tax on stupidity/benevolence, whichever one prefers.
    I consider the lottery/scratchcards as a tax on poor people.
    Let's ban lawyers from buying them
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    HYUFD said:

    @BorisJohnson
    I’m delighted to share the cover for UNLEASHED and I’m looking forward to sharing the book with you when it is published this October.
    Pre-order here: https://lnkfi.re/lAxuCn
    https://x.com/BorisJohnson/status/1818610843140907318

    When was Johnson ever “leashed”? It wasn’t fucking short enough if he was.
  • Alphabet_SoupAlphabet_Soup Posts: 3,250
    How old is the average pensioner? 75 maybe.

    How long have they got? Perhaps 10 years.

    So the WFA clawback is going to cost them about £2500 altogether.

    It's going to cost non-pensioners twice as much.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,851

    Carnyx said:

    Graun feed:

    'Republic, the group campaigning against having a hereditary monarch as head of state, has released polling showing that “56% of the public believe MPs should swear allegiance to their constituents and the country, compared to just 11% who want MPs to pledge allegiance to the king”.'

    Would that tet the Shinners take their seats?
    Not sure, in all seriousness: allegiance to the UK might be a sticky point, depending on the wording.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,642
    Blimey.

    NC is a state Trump won in 2020

    FLASH: The Donald Trump campaign is placing new TV ad spending in NORTH CAROLINA. Start date is tomorrow, 8/1

    This follows the Kamala Harris campaign going up on TV there starting today

    https://x.com/guycecil/status/1818680012674916368
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,020
    edited July 31
    ydoethur said:

    HSBC have lost another customer.

    Very Unconfirmed Reports right now, but some Sources in Syria are claiming that Brigadier General Amir Ali Hajizadeh, the Commander of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC) Aerospace Forces, has been Assassination in an Attack near the Syrian Capital of Damascus. Hajizadeh is believed to have been the Senior Commander who planned and ordered the Iranian Ballistic and Cruise Missile Attack in April against Israel.

    https://x.com/sentdefender/status/1818670645468672450

    Mossad suddenly very active.

    I wonder what is going on in Israel? Have they decided to dial down the war and feel they need to make use of the moment to eliminate as much leadership as they can, or is Netanyahu feeling the heat and trying to shore up his position?

    Or - is somebody else taking advantage in the hope Israel gets the blame? *looks hard at Mohammed Bin Salman*
    Seems highly unlikely the motivate is dialling things down because killing top Hamas bloke while in Iran staying in Iranian regime accommodation is only going to spark a counter action, plus they got a top Hezbollah and Iranian. That says to me the opposite of dampening down tensions.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,405
    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    Graun feed:

    'Republic, the group campaigning against having a hereditary monarch as head of state, has released polling showing that “56% of the public believe MPs should swear allegiance to their constituents and the country, compared to just 11% who want MPs to pledge allegiance to the king”.'

    So, the King is head of state, we have no written constitution, our constitution is based on the sovereignty of Crown in Parliament and the public give their verdict on MPs at election time they don't need an Oath to them from their MP as well!
    Completely missing the point.

    It might also be remarked that the King has proven rather keen on changing and affecting the law of the land directly in ways that, erm, affect his personal interests. That is, not through his MP. Not so much of that lately, but you might like to consider how that sits alongside your excited reflex reflux.
    And you think an elected President would be less so ?
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541

    ydoethur said:

    HSBC have lost another customer.

    Very Unconfirmed Reports right now, but some Sources in Syria are claiming that Brigadier General Amir Ali Hajizadeh, the Commander of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC) Aerospace Forces, has been Assassination in an Attack near the Syrian Capital of Damascus. Hajizadeh is believed to have been the Senior Commander who planned and ordered the Iranian Ballistic and Cruise Missile Attack in April against Israel.

    https://x.com/sentdefender/status/1818670645468672450

    Mossad suddenly very active.

    I wonder what is going on in Israel? Have they decided to dial down the war and feel they need to make use of the moment to eliminate as much leadership as they can, or is Netanyahu feeling the heat and trying to shore up his position?

    Or - is somebody else taking advantage in the hope Israel gets the blame? *looks hard at Mohammed Bin Salman*
    Theory.

    Bibi has realised Kamala Harris is going to win so he's taking advantage that there's a lame duck in the White House.


    It's entirely possible from January the Presidency, the Senate, and the House will be controlled by the Dems which maybe unfortunate Bibi.
    Possible but unlikely.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,642

    Carnyx said:

    kjh said:

    Good to see Britain doing so well in the medal count at the Olympics. (In general democratic nations seem to be doing quite well there, so far.)

    We used to get 5 or less golds regularly (1 in Atlanta) but in the last few Olympics we have been in the twenties (high twenties in 2 of them). I assume there are more available, but that wouldn't account for the big jump and in the last 4 Olympics we have been ranked 4th or better whereas before that 10th was a good result. We are clearly doing something right across a number of sports.
    Lottery funding
    AKA tax on stupidity/benevolence, whichever one prefers.
    I consider the lottery/scratchcards as a tax on poor people.
    Let's ban lawyers from buying them
    No need for a ban, I reckon it is twenty years since I bought one.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,586
    “A statement from the broadcaster said: “In November 2023, whilst Mr Edwards was suspended, the BBC as his employer at the time was made aware in confidence that he had been arrested on suspicion of serious offences and released on bail whilst the police continued their investigation.”

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/07/31/huw-edwards-guilty-latest/
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,439

    Carnyx said:

    kjh said:

    Good to see Britain doing so well in the medal count at the Olympics. (In general democratic nations seem to be doing quite well there, so far.)

    We used to get 5 or less golds regularly (1 in Atlanta) but in the last few Olympics we have been in the twenties (high twenties in 2 of them). I assume there are more available, but that wouldn't account for the big jump and in the last 4 Olympics we have been ranked 4th or better whereas before that 10th was a good result. We are clearly doing something right across a number of sports.
    Lottery funding
    AKA tax on stupidity/benevolence, whichever one prefers.
    I consider the lottery/scratchcards as a tax on poor people.
    Bread and circuses.

    I always wonder over the chap on the Postcode lottery ad; "We had a ten year plan. Now it's a next week plan!"

    Not for a betting site to criticise, I suppose, but there seem to be a lot of 'low level' gambling sites now. Including the mad one which effectively gives one the answer, but requires one to phone via premium rate number, and the one which 'gives away' high value houses.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    Didn’t post last night or the night before as I didn’t want to get dragged into two of the most depressing and putrid evenings on PB I’ve ever seen.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,851
    edited July 31

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    Graun feed:

    'Republic, the group campaigning against having a hereditary monarch as head of state, has released polling showing that “56% of the public believe MPs should swear allegiance to their constituents and the country, compared to just 11% who want MPs to pledge allegiance to the king”.'

    So, the King is head of state, we have no written constitution, our constitution is based on the sovereignty of Crown in Parliament and the public give their verdict on MPs at election time they don't need an Oath to them from their MP as well!
    Completely missing the point.

    It might also be remarked that the King has proven rather keen on changing and affecting the law of the land directly in ways that, erm, affect his personal interests. That is, not through his MP. Not so much of that lately, but you might like to consider how that sits alongside your excited reflex reflux.
    And you think an elected President would be less so ?
    Kings are supposed to be above such stuff.

    But it's not my opinion - or yours - that matters. It's the fact that so many people purportedly have that response to the poll, which surprises me a little. I'll be interested to see what TSE comes up with tomorrow.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,405

    Carnyx said:

    kjh said:

    Good to see Britain doing so well in the medal count at the Olympics. (In general democratic nations seem to be doing quite well there, so far.)

    We used to get 5 or less golds regularly (1 in Atlanta) but in the last few Olympics we have been in the twenties (high twenties in 2 of them). I assume there are more available, but that wouldn't account for the big jump and in the last 4 Olympics we have been ranked 4th or better whereas before that 10th was a good result. We are clearly doing something right across a number of sports.
    Lottery funding
    AKA tax on stupidity/benevolence, whichever one prefers.
    I consider the lottery/scratchcards as a tax on poor people.
    Let's ban lawyers from buying them
    No need for a ban, I reckon it is twenty years since I bought one.
    Thats because youre a tight fisted git with no romance in your soul
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,403

    ydoethur said:

    HSBC have lost another customer.

    Very Unconfirmed Reports right now, but some Sources in Syria are claiming that Brigadier General Amir Ali Hajizadeh, the Commander of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC) Aerospace Forces, has been Assassination in an Attack near the Syrian Capital of Damascus. Hajizadeh is believed to have been the Senior Commander who planned and ordered the Iranian Ballistic and Cruise Missile Attack in April against Israel.

    https://x.com/sentdefender/status/1818670645468672450

    Mossad suddenly very active.

    I wonder what is going on in Israel? Have they decided to dial down the war and feel they need to make use of the moment to eliminate as much leadership as they can, or is Netanyahu feeling the heat and trying to shore up his position?

    Or - is somebody else taking advantage in the hope Israel gets the blame? *looks hard at Mohammed Bin Salman*
    Seems highly unlikely the motivate is dialling things down because killing top Hamas bloke while in Iran staying in Iranian regime accommodation is only going to spark a counter action, plus they got a top Hezbollah and Iranian. That says to me the opposite of dampening down tensions.
    The other thing that makes it seem unlikely is that usually assassinating the leadership in this fashion means somebody more ruthless and extreme takes power - the ones willing to seize the moment.

    But it's certainly dramatic.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,765

    Blimey.

    NC is a state Trump won in 2020

    FLASH: The Donald Trump campaign is placing new TV ad spending in NORTH CAROLINA. Start date is tomorrow, 8/1

    This follows the Kamala Harris campaign going up on TV there starting today

    https://x.com/guycecil/status/1818680012674916368

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0b7GKNrxZ4&ab_channel=HenryvKeiper
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,020
    edited July 31
    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    HSBC have lost another customer.

    Very Unconfirmed Reports right now, but some Sources in Syria are claiming that Brigadier General Amir Ali Hajizadeh, the Commander of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC) Aerospace Forces, has been Assassination in an Attack near the Syrian Capital of Damascus. Hajizadeh is believed to have been the Senior Commander who planned and ordered the Iranian Ballistic and Cruise Missile Attack in April against Israel.

    https://x.com/sentdefender/status/1818670645468672450

    Mossad suddenly very active.

    I wonder what is going on in Israel? Have they decided to dial down the war and feel they need to make use of the moment to eliminate as much leadership as they can, or is Netanyahu feeling the heat and trying to shore up his position?

    Or - is somebody else taking advantage in the hope Israel gets the blame? *looks hard at Mohammed Bin Salman*
    Seems highly unlikely the motivate is dialling things down because killing top Hamas bloke while in Iran staying in Iranian regime accommodation is only going to spark a counter action, plus they got a top Hezbollah and Iranian. That says to me the opposite of dampening down tensions.
    The other thing that makes it seem unlikely is that usually assassinating the leadership in this fashion means somebody more ruthless and extreme takes power - the ones willing to seize the moment.

    But it's certainly dramatic.
    If I had to guess its a message from Israel, we can get you, anytime anywhere and we will do so, we are far beyond caring what others think. You fire a rocket into a kids football match, you die. I am also guessing Israel think all the hostages are dead now.

    Such thinking doesn't exactly get you towards a ceasefire and a two state solution.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,403
    Omnium said:

    Blimey.

    NC is a state Trump won in 2020

    FLASH: The Donald Trump campaign is placing new TV ad spending in NORTH CAROLINA. Start date is tomorrow, 8/1

    This follows the Kamala Harris campaign going up on TV there starting today

    https://x.com/guycecil/status/1818680012674916368

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0b7GKNrxZ4&ab_channel=HenryvKeiper
    How much money do the Republicans have to spend at this moment?

    If Trump's having to shore up his flank then that leaves less for the swing states and the downballot races.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,403

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    HSBC have lost another customer.

    Very Unconfirmed Reports right now, but some Sources in Syria are claiming that Brigadier General Amir Ali Hajizadeh, the Commander of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC) Aerospace Forces, has been Assassination in an Attack near the Syrian Capital of Damascus. Hajizadeh is believed to have been the Senior Commander who planned and ordered the Iranian Ballistic and Cruise Missile Attack in April against Israel.

    https://x.com/sentdefender/status/1818670645468672450

    Mossad suddenly very active.

    I wonder what is going on in Israel? Have they decided to dial down the war and feel they need to make use of the moment to eliminate as much leadership as they can, or is Netanyahu feeling the heat and trying to shore up his position?

    Or - is somebody else taking advantage in the hope Israel gets the blame? *looks hard at Mohammed Bin Salman*
    Seems highly unlikely the motivate is dialling things down because killing top Hamas bloke while in Iran staying in Iranian regime accommodation is only going to spark a counter action, plus they got a top Hezbollah and Iranian. That says to me the opposite of dampening down tensions.
    The other thing that makes it seem unlikely is that usually assassinating the leadership in this fashion means somebody more ruthless and extreme takes power - the ones willing to seize the moment.

    But it's certainly dramatic.
    If I had to guess its a message from Israel, we can get you, anytime anywhere and we will do so, we are far beyond caring what others think. You fire a rocket into a kids football match, you die.

    Such thinking doesn't exactly get you towards a ceasefire and a two state solution.

    I am also guessing Israel think all the hostages are dead now.
    Since Netanyahu doesn't want a ceasefire, and has been trying all his life to annex the West Bank, that doesn't seem conclusive.

    The latter is sadly very possible.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,851
    DougSeal said:

    Didn’t post last night or the night before as I didn’t want to get dragged into two of the most depressing and putrid evenings on PB I’ve ever seen.

    Very much a Glasgow bin lorry fire, as I commented (but then cleared off).

    Never mind, there's another subject to get aerated about. Info is coming in on the Graun feed of Welsh gmt data showing a reduction in casualties and accidents in Wales. Though the stat significance is unclear so far. Interestingly Graun is reporting complementary data from insurers and so on.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,439
    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    HSBC have lost another customer.

    Very Unconfirmed Reports right now, but some Sources in Syria are claiming that Brigadier General Amir Ali Hajizadeh, the Commander of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC) Aerospace Forces, has been Assassination in an Attack near the Syrian Capital of Damascus. Hajizadeh is believed to have been the Senior Commander who planned and ordered the Iranian Ballistic and Cruise Missile Attack in April against Israel.

    https://x.com/sentdefender/status/1818670645468672450

    Mossad suddenly very active.

    I wonder what is going on in Israel? Have they decided to dial down the war and feel they need to make use of the moment to eliminate as much leadership as they can, or is Netanyahu feeling the heat and trying to shore up his position?

    Or - is somebody else taking advantage in the hope Israel gets the blame? *looks hard at Mohammed Bin Salman*
    Seems highly unlikely the motivate is dialling things down because killing top Hamas bloke while in Iran staying in Iranian regime accommodation is only going to spark a counter action, plus they got a top Hezbollah and Iranian. That says to me the opposite of dampening down tensions.
    The other thing that makes it seem unlikely is that usually assassinating the leadership in this fashion means somebody more ruthless and extreme takes power - the ones willing to seize the moment.

    But it's certainly dramatic.
    If I had to guess its a message from Israel, we can get you, anytime anywhere and we will do so, we are far beyond caring what others think. You fire a rocket into a kids football match, you die.

    Such thinking doesn't exactly get you towards a ceasefire and a two state solution.

    I am also guessing Israel think all the hostages are dead now.
    Since Netanyahu doesn't want a ceasefire, and has been trying all his life to annex the West Bank, that doesn't seem conclusive.

    The latter is sadly very possible.
    Well, the way the Israelis have been pouring explosives into Gaze, that's highly likely.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,439

    Carnyx said:

    kjh said:

    Good to see Britain doing so well in the medal count at the Olympics. (In general democratic nations seem to be doing quite well there, so far.)

    We used to get 5 or less golds regularly (1 in Atlanta) but in the last few Olympics we have been in the twenties (high twenties in 2 of them). I assume there are more available, but that wouldn't account for the big jump and in the last 4 Olympics we have been ranked 4th or better whereas before that 10th was a good result. We are clearly doing something right across a number of sports.
    Lottery funding
    AKA tax on stupidity/benevolence, whichever one prefers.
    I consider the lottery/scratchcards as a tax on poor people.
    Let's ban lawyers from buying them
    No need for a ban, I reckon it is twenty years since I bought one.
    Thats because youre a tight fisted git with no romance in your soul
    You haven't read the earlier posts about the violin!
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,765
    ydoethur said:

    Omnium said:

    Blimey.

    NC is a state Trump won in 2020

    FLASH: The Donald Trump campaign is placing new TV ad spending in NORTH CAROLINA. Start date is tomorrow, 8/1

    This follows the Kamala Harris campaign going up on TV there starting today

    https://x.com/guycecil/status/1818680012674916368

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0b7GKNrxZ4&ab_channel=HenryvKeiper
    How much money do the Republicans have to spend at this moment?

    If Trump's having to shore up his flank then that leaves less for the swing states and the downballot races.
    I don't think that the money really matters that much other than the comfort that it gives.

    What really matters is the reality/intent/message (all mixed up). Trump has always been show rather than substance. That works if the show can successfully distract everyone. Harris messes up the entire show, and all of a sudden we see the real Donald Trump. The Republicans aren't stupid, and that's why they will panic.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559
    ydoethur said:

    Nigelb said:

    viewcode said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "@YouGovAmerica
    NEW: Economist/YouGov Poll, July 27-30

    % of registered voters who plan to vote for...
    Harris: 46%
    Trump: 44%

    July 21-23 poll:
    Trump: 44%
    Harris: 41%

    https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/econTabReport_5LIBPv8.pdf#page=8"

    https://x.com/YouGovAmerica/status/1818636275345150185

    Provided she doesn't mess up the VP pick, she's going to win I think.
    Kamala Harris: Basil II

    Donald Trump: Samuel of Bulgaria

    2024 election = The Battle of Kleidion

    (I fucking hope, I am still scarred by 2016.)
    Harris: Admiral Nelson

    Trump: François-Paul Brueys d'Aigalliers

    Election = Battle of the Nile

    (Joe Biden: Earl St Vincent)
    Harris - Henry, Earl of Richmond
    Trump - Richard III
    Joe Biden - Margaret Beaufort
    Scenario - Bosworth Field.
    Fearless Forecast - When his time finally comes, Donald J. Trump will be laid to (at least a semblance of) rest, underneath his beloved parking space in the back lot at Mar-a-Lardo (sp).
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,642

    Carnyx said:

    kjh said:

    Good to see Britain doing so well in the medal count at the Olympics. (In general democratic nations seem to be doing quite well there, so far.)

    We used to get 5 or less golds regularly (1 in Atlanta) but in the last few Olympics we have been in the twenties (high twenties in 2 of them). I assume there are more available, but that wouldn't account for the big jump and in the last 4 Olympics we have been ranked 4th or better whereas before that 10th was a good result. We are clearly doing something right across a number of sports.
    Lottery funding
    AKA tax on stupidity/benevolence, whichever one prefers.
    I consider the lottery/scratchcards as a tax on poor people.
    Let's ban lawyers from buying them
    No need for a ban, I reckon it is twenty years since I bought one.
    Thats because youre a tight fisted git with no romance in your soul
    I refer you to my earlier post involving the violinist.

    Apparently I am the epitome of the maxim of 'more money than sense'.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,765

    Carnyx said:

    kjh said:

    Good to see Britain doing so well in the medal count at the Olympics. (In general democratic nations seem to be doing quite well there, so far.)

    We used to get 5 or less golds regularly (1 in Atlanta) but in the last few Olympics we have been in the twenties (high twenties in 2 of them). I assume there are more available, but that wouldn't account for the big jump and in the last 4 Olympics we have been ranked 4th or better whereas before that 10th was a good result. We are clearly doing something right across a number of sports.
    Lottery funding
    AKA tax on stupidity/benevolence, whichever one prefers.
    I consider the lottery/scratchcards as a tax on poor people.
    Let's ban lawyers from buying them
    No need for a ban, I reckon it is twenty years since I bought one.
    Thats because youre a tight fisted git with no romance in your soul
    I refer you to my earlier post involving the violinist.

    Apparently I am the epitome of the maxim of 'more money than sense'.
    Unless you're a very poor man ind...... ah hang on.. is that a banhammer I see above me?
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,843

    ydoethur said:

    Nigelb said:

    viewcode said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "@YouGovAmerica
    NEW: Economist/YouGov Poll, July 27-30

    % of registered voters who plan to vote for...
    Harris: 46%
    Trump: 44%

    July 21-23 poll:
    Trump: 44%
    Harris: 41%

    https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/econTabReport_5LIBPv8.pdf#page=8"

    https://x.com/YouGovAmerica/status/1818636275345150185

    Provided she doesn't mess up the VP pick, she's going to win I think.
    Kamala Harris: Basil II

    Donald Trump: Samuel of Bulgaria

    2024 election = The Battle of Kleidion

    (I fucking hope, I am still scarred by 2016.)
    Harris: Admiral Nelson

    Trump: François-Paul Brueys d'Aigalliers

    Election = Battle of the Nile

    (Joe Biden: Earl St Vincent)
    Harris - Henry, Earl of Richmond
    Trump - Richard III
    Joe Biden - Margaret Beaufort
    Scenario - Bosworth Field.
    Fearless Forecast - When his time finally comes, Donald J. Trump will be laid to (at least a semblance of) rest, underneath his beloved parking space in the back lot at Mar-a-Lardo (sp).
    Mar-a-Leicester.
  • Carnyx said:

    kjh said:

    Good to see Britain doing so well in the medal count at the Olympics. (In general democratic nations seem to be doing quite well there, so far.)

    We used to get 5 or less golds regularly (1 in Atlanta) but in the last few Olympics we have been in the twenties (high twenties in 2 of them). I assume there are more available, but that wouldn't account for the big jump and in the last 4 Olympics we have been ranked 4th or better whereas before that 10th was a good result. We are clearly doing something right across a number of sports.
    Lottery funding
    AKA tax on stupidity/benevolence, whichever one prefers.
    I consider the lottery/scratchcards as a tax on poor people.
    Let's ban lawyers from buying them
    No need for a ban, I reckon it is twenty years since I bought one.
    Thats because youre a tight fisted git with no romance in your soul
    For not paying the stupidity tax?
This discussion has been closed.