In spite of the latest EU dealings those who think Brexit was wrong still have clear 8% lead with Yo
Comments
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What does that mean for GB to NI trade if Article 16 is invoked?CarlottaVance said:
Even Mr Foster's not impressed:dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.
https://twitter.com/pmdfoster/status/1355212587676393472?s=200 -
I'm suggesting that we work with Pfizer to help them ramp up alternative production sites not that we completely stop supplying these products. As I said, it's not just us that get fucked by this. There are many, many countries that are getting the Pfizer vaccine from the Belgian manufacturing, we have an obligation to them more than we do to the EU IMO. It's sad that our actions could increase the misery for millions of our friends and neighbours, they will pay the price for the idiocy of their politicians. We can't let UK, Canadian, Mexican and citizens of other countries pay the price for the decisions of these Eurocrats.Black_Rook said:
It's a fine judgment - *IF* it comes to it, which it hasn't yet. As others have pointed out, taking action which would compromise EU vaccine production is ultimately counterproductive. There are alternative means of expressing displeasure forcefully though. The disputed status of the EU representative in London would become moot if he were to be thrown out.MaxPB said:
What would a vaccine export ban to the UK and all of he other nations not included in the EU's list of exemptions do then?Malmesbury said:
Likewise. This could kill actual, real people.Richard_Tyndall said:
Agree.Luckyguy1983 said:By the way, if vaccines ordered by the UK are blocked from export to the UK (and re-allocated to EU orders - specifically Pfizer ones), I do NOT want exports of essential ingredients from the UK to the EU blocked, UNLESS it can be specifically shown that they are needed at production sites that ARE supplying the UK. In no way do I want 'revenge' - that would be madness. The most important thing is that vaccines are made, and get given to someone, fast.
We have an obligation to the rest of the world to ensure the precious materials we supply are used for vaccines that can be exported everywhere in the world, not just where some Eurocrat decides is worthy of receiving it.
I truly, truly wish it won't come to that and this is still just posturing taken to an 11/10 position. I'm still holding on to that hope that they won't make this stupid move to block vaccine supplies, but it looks more and more likely to happen every day.0 -
Looks as though there's nothing these people won't sacrifice to try to save their own political skins.CarlottaVance said:
Even Mr Foster's not impressed:dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.
https://twitter.com/pmdfoster/status/1355212587676393472?s=200 -
Only been off the site for 3 hours and things have already moved on quite a lot since then. Didnt expect Macron to take this stance on the vaccine.0
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Now AEP is usually always wrong but that's more because of his long term thinking more than anything else.Floater said:
I cling to the fact that Ambrose wrote itTime_to_Leave said:
It’s the Telegraph, so I’d need to see another source to believe it, but that really would be mad. Seizing IP from pharma companies?! Do they want an industry...?Floater said:Well that headline dials down the rhetoric
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2021/01/29/eu-threatens-war-time-occupation-vaccine-makers-crisis-spirals/
Which means I do wonder if he is correct here and the EU may have lost all sense of commonsense - now that they need 1 billion vaccines and won't have enough for probably a year.0 -
https://twitter.com/Holbornlolz/status/1355215352112754690
I thought the UK were the ones risking this?
The EU said they never would .....3 -
The EU is a big enough market for it always to attract inward investment. But there is no getting round the fact that the Commission - and now some member states - are making absolute dicks of themselves. My guess is that it is for domestic consumption. Politicians and bureaucrats who have buggered up monumentally are bouncing any number of dead cats in the hope one gets noticed. The fact is that any EU member state could have done what the UK did. None of them chose to do so. The national governments of each country own that decision and they clearly do not want to be held to account for it. The UK has done nothing wrong. In fact, for once it has actually done the right thing. And that is the problem across the Channel.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It is not so much that but the damage they have done to themselves, and the effect it will have going forward on pharmaceutical and other inward investment into the EUNorthern_Al said:Some of us "remainers" play the long game. Several things can be true at once:
1. There's no doubt that the EU have made a complete mess of their vaccine strategy, and seem to keep digging once they are in a hole. Not much disagreement here on that, just different levels of excitability.
2. The most likely outcome is that this whole episode, which has excited so many on here, will blow over in due course and global vaccinations will continue apace. Helpfully, thus far the UK government has done well not to inflame tensions; I hope that continues.
3. Nobody I know is campaigning for, or expects, the UK to rejoin the EU in the short or medium term.
4. The vaccine shambles doesn't really tell us much about Brexit. Brexit may be a success, it may be a failure; most probably somewhere in between. But we only properly left the EU a month ago, so I don't believe anybody can be sure about how things will pan out yet. I'll give it three years before I can make a judgement.
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Cherry picking.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.0 -
Has anyone emailed the White House about this yet?dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.0 -
eek said:
Now AEP is usually always wrong but that's more because of his long term thinking more than anything else.Floater said:
I cling to the fact that Ambrose wrote itTime_to_Leave said:
It’s the Telegraph, so I’d need to see another source to believe it, but that really would be mad. Seizing IP from pharma companies?! Do they want an industry...?Floater said:Well that headline dials down the rhetoric
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2021/01/29/eu-threatens-war-time-occupation-vaccine-makers-crisis-spirals/
Which means I do wonder if he is correct here and the EU may have lost all sense of commonsense - now that they need 1 billion vaccines and won't have enough for probably a year.
The first time I read one of his articles was 2008 - I admit it scared meeek said:
Now AEP is usually always wrong but that's more because of his long term thinking more than anything else.Floater said:
I cling to the fact that Ambrose wrote itTime_to_Leave said:
It’s the Telegraph, so I’d need to see another source to believe it, but that really would be mad. Seizing IP from pharma companies?! Do they want an industry...?Floater said:Well that headline dials down the rhetoric
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2021/01/29/eu-threatens-war-time-occupation-vaccine-makers-crisis-spirals/
Which means I do wonder if he is correct here and the EU may have lost all sense of commonsense - now that they need 1 billion vaccines and won't have enough for probably a year.
Someone pointed out to me that he is errr, a tad prone to excitement0 -
Hold on a minute, does that mean that there will be EU checks on the island of Ireland to ensure no vaccines are being shipped to NI?
That strikes me as a complete disaster idea.1 -
It's amazing how well the UK Govt can do when it actually resists the need to parrot the popular press. Even if they do decide that there is a need to implement retaliatory measures on some level, they would be well advised to keep quiet about it. Would be far more effective.SouthamObserver said:
The EU is a big enough market for it always to attract inward investment. But there is no getting round the fact that the Commission - and now some member states - are making absolute dicks of themselves. My guess is that it is for domestic consumption. Politicians and bureaucrats who have buggered up monumentally are bouncing any number of dead cats in the hope one gets noticed. The fact is that any EU member state could have done what the UK did. None of them chose to do so. The national governments of each country own that decision and they clearly do not want to be held to account for it. The UK has done nothing wrong. In fact, for once it has actually done the right thing. And that is the problem across the Channel.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It is not so much that but the damage they have done to themselves, and the effect it will have going forward on pharmaceutical and other inward investment into the EUNorthern_Al said:Some of us "remainers" play the long game. Several things can be true at once:
1. There's no doubt that the EU have made a complete mess of their vaccine strategy, and seem to keep digging once they are in a hole. Not much disagreement here on that, just different levels of excitability.
2. The most likely outcome is that this whole episode, which has excited so many on here, will blow over in due course and global vaccinations will continue apace. Helpfully, thus far the UK government has done well not to inflame tensions; I hope that continues.
3. Nobody I know is campaigning for, or expects, the UK to rejoin the EU in the short or medium term.
4. The vaccine shambles doesn't really tell us much about Brexit. Brexit may be a success, it may be a failure; most probably somewhere in between. But we only properly left the EU a month ago, so I don't believe anybody can be sure about how things will pan out yet. I'll give it three years before I can make a judgement.0 -
BiB - That's where remainers are right now. I wonder if any politicians will brave enough to suggest the solution to this is less Europe.SouthamObserver said:
The EU is a big enough market for it always to attract inward investment. But there is no getting round the fact that the Commission - and now some member states - are making absolute dicks of themselves. My guess is that it is for domestic consumption. Politicians and bureaucrats who have buggered up monumentally are bouncing any number of dead cats in the hope one gets noticed. The fact is that any EU member state could have done what the UK did. None of them chose to do so. The national governments of each country own that decision and they clearly do not want to be held to account for it. The UK has done nothing wrong. In fact, for once it has actually done the right thing. And that is the problem across the Channel.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It is not so much that but the damage they have done to themselves, and the effect it will have going forward on pharmaceutical and other inward investment into the EUNorthern_Al said:Some of us "remainers" play the long game. Several things can be true at once:
1. There's no doubt that the EU have made a complete mess of their vaccine strategy, and seem to keep digging once they are in a hole. Not much disagreement here on that, just different levels of excitability.
2. The most likely outcome is that this whole episode, which has excited so many on here, will blow over in due course and global vaccinations will continue apace. Helpfully, thus far the UK government has done well not to inflame tensions; I hope that continues.
3. Nobody I know is campaigning for, or expects, the UK to rejoin the EU in the short or medium term.
4. The vaccine shambles doesn't really tell us much about Brexit. Brexit may be a success, it may be a failure; most probably somewhere in between. But we only properly left the EU a month ago, so I don't believe anybody can be sure about how things will pan out yet. I'll give it three years before I can make a judgement.0 -
Specific to pharma they have got Switzerland and the UK sitting on their doorstep, both of whom have very well developed markets and tariff/quota free export deals with the EU and other major players. Both the UK and Switzerland will benefit from this folly in the long term.SouthamObserver said:
The EU is a big enough market for it always to attract inward investment. But there is no getting round the fact that the Commission - and now some member states - are making absolute dicks of themselves. My guess is that it is for domestic consumption. Politicians and bureaucrats who have buggered up monumentally are bouncing any number of dead cats in the hope one gets noticed. The fact is that any EU member state could have done what the UK did. None of them chose to do so. The national governments of each country own that decision and they clearly do not want to be held to account for it. The UK has done nothing wrong. In fact, for once it has actually done the right thing. And that is the problem across the Channel.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It is not so much that but the damage they have done to themselves, and the effect it will have going forward on pharmaceutical and other inward investment into the EUNorthern_Al said:Some of us "remainers" play the long game. Several things can be true at once:
1. There's no doubt that the EU have made a complete mess of their vaccine strategy, and seem to keep digging once they are in a hole. Not much disagreement here on that, just different levels of excitability.
2. The most likely outcome is that this whole episode, which has excited so many on here, will blow over in due course and global vaccinations will continue apace. Helpfully, thus far the UK government has done well not to inflame tensions; I hope that continues.
3. Nobody I know is campaigning for, or expects, the UK to rejoin the EU in the short or medium term.
4. The vaccine shambles doesn't really tell us much about Brexit. Brexit may be a success, it may be a failure; most probably somewhere in between. But we only properly left the EU a month ago, so I don't believe anybody can be sure about how things will pan out yet. I'll give it three years before I can make a judgement.2 -
Unfortunately this doesn't mean that Operation Perfidious Albion won't work anyway.SouthamObserver said:
The EU is a big enough market for it always to attract inward investment. But there is no getting round the fact that the Commission - and now some member states - are making absolute dicks of themselves. My guess is that it is for domestic consumption. Politicians and bureaucrats who have buggered up monumentally are bouncing any number of dead cats in the hope one gets noticed. The fact is that any EU member state could have done what the UK did. None of them chose to do so. The national governments of each country own that decision and they clearly do not want to be held to account for it. The UK has done nothing wrong. In fact, for once it has actually done the right thing. And that is the problem across the Channel.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It is not so much that but the damage they have done to themselves, and the effect it will have going forward on pharmaceutical and other inward investment into the EUNorthern_Al said:Some of us "remainers" play the long game. Several things can be true at once:
1. There's no doubt that the EU have made a complete mess of their vaccine strategy, and seem to keep digging once they are in a hole. Not much disagreement here on that, just different levels of excitability.
2. The most likely outcome is that this whole episode, which has excited so many on here, will blow over in due course and global vaccinations will continue apace. Helpfully, thus far the UK government has done well not to inflame tensions; I hope that continues.
3. Nobody I know is campaigning for, or expects, the UK to rejoin the EU in the short or medium term.
4. The vaccine shambles doesn't really tell us much about Brexit. Brexit may be a success, it may be a failure; most probably somewhere in between. But we only properly left the EU a month ago, so I don't believe anybody can be sure about how things will pan out yet. I'll give it three years before I can make a judgement.
In other news, I've the BBC Six O'Clock bulletin on as background noise, where they have just reported that a senior EU official has accused Boris Johnson of wanting to start a vaccine war.
On the one hand, it's all a bit Comical Ali. On the other hand, if you live in the Republic of Ireland (where Anglophobia is widespread) and you're watching your healthcare system being starved of jabs whilst people drop like flies all around you, then whose version of events are you going to buy?1 -
At least that’s clear as day. I feel sorry for Ireland - the country with the most to lose in the EU. Let’s give them some of our vaccinesRobD said:
Was clear from the start they were just using the border for their own political interest. They don't give two hoots about the people there.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.0 -
Breaking on ITV Wales
Drakeford rejects Starmer's policy on teacher vaccinations saying they must follow the JCVI recommendations which, at present, do not include mass teacher vaccinations0 -
German story has been updated to reduce AZ over 65s effectiveness from 8% to 6.3%Black_Rook said:
The European Commission is co-ordinating a diversionary attack on the UK, to mask its own failings.Control_Freak said:Hi, long time lurker.
Love the site, a fantastic resource for both diverse and educated views of all sides of arguments.
I have been addicted to the threads over the last couple of days, especially regarding the somewhat strange behaviour of 1. The EU. 2. Germany. 3 France (now joining the fray)
It was all looking rather haphazard until number 3. Why is Macron also saying AZN is shit?
Bit of a conspiracy theory, and I hope I am wrong, but what if there is about to be a real problem with infection rates, hospitalisations and death in Germany, France etc in the very near future. They may have wind of this coming (see Portugal) and are trying to mitigate the absolute shitstorm that will be coming their way. Given that it is mainly old people who shuffle off their mortal coil for this virus, how could you cover your arse for not acting sooner:
1. Try and get (steal?) as much vaccine as soon as possible, and get cracking
2. If you can’t get said vaccine, then say that it is rubbish for the aged, and hey presto! It doesn’t matter that we have massive deaths of the elderly, as even if we could have gotten the vaccine (we didn’t, because we are useless), it wouldn’t have had any beneficial effect on the elderly anyway!
As I say, I hope I am wrong.
The Germans aren't mental (I think the 8% story a couple of days ago is most likely the product of individual idiocy rather than official conspiracy,) but they've had a lot of deaths themselves and are probably frightened of how long this is going to drag on for whilst they wait for the jab supply to free up. This is understandable, even if the measures that they're promoting could be very damaging - *IF* they were to go as far as to use them. Remember, everything so far has been sabre-rattling rhetoric and angry paper shuffling.
Macron is a dickhead.0 -
Boris only makes a decision when the decision is forced on him.alex_ said:
It's amazing how well the UK Govt can do when it actually resists the need to parrot the popular press.SouthamObserver said:
The EU is a big enough market for it always to attract inward investment. But there is no getting round the fact that the Commission - and now some member states - are making absolute dicks of themselves. My guess is that it is for domestic consumption. Politicians and bureaucrats who have buggered up monumentally are bouncing any number of dead cats in the hope one gets noticed. The fact is that any EU member state could have done what the UK did. None of them chose to do so. The national governments of each country own that decision and they clearly do not want to be held to account for it. The UK has done nothing wrong. In fact, for once it has actually done the right thing. And that is the problem across the Channel.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It is not so much that but the damage they have done to themselves, and the effect it will have going forward on pharmaceutical and other inward investment into the EUNorthern_Al said:Some of us "remainers" play the long game. Several things can be true at once:
1. There's no doubt that the EU have made a complete mess of their vaccine strategy, and seem to keep digging once they are in a hole. Not much disagreement here on that, just different levels of excitability.
2. The most likely outcome is that this whole episode, which has excited so many on here, will blow over in due course and global vaccinations will continue apace. Helpfully, thus far the UK government has done well not to inflame tensions; I hope that continues.
3. Nobody I know is campaigning for, or expects, the UK to rejoin the EU in the short or medium term.
4. The vaccine shambles doesn't really tell us much about Brexit. Brexit may be a success, it may be a failure; most probably somewhere in between. But we only properly left the EU a month ago, so I don't believe anybody can be sure about how things will pan out yet. I'll give it three years before I can make a judgement.
As that hasn't occurred here yet (and won't unless and until the EU blocks a pfizer delivery) he won't say anything.0 -
POKWAS.Big_G_NorthWales said:Breaking on ITV Wales
Drakeford rejects Starmer's policy on teacher vaccinations saying they must follow the JCVI recommendations which, at present, do not include mass teacher vaccinations0 -
Good for him.Big_G_NorthWales said:Breaking on ITV Wales
Drakeford rejects Starmer's policy on teacher vaccinations saying they must follow the JCVI recommendations which, at present, do not include mass teacher vaccinations0 -
He actually seems to be making some good calls recentlyBig_G_NorthWales said:Breaking on ITV Wales
Drakeford rejects Starmer's policy on teacher vaccinations saying they must follow the JCVI recommendations which, at present, do not include mass teacher vaccinations0 -
Ireland isn't actually a very big country. We could probably do it.Razedabode said:
At least that’s clear as day. I feel sorry for Ireland - the country with the most to lose in the EU. Let’s give them some of our vaccinesRobD said:
Was clear from the start they were just using the border for their own political interest. They don't give two hoots about the people there.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.1 -
It's an absurd claim, but he makes an easy villain.Black_Rook said:
Unfortunately this doesn't mean that Operation Perfidious Albion won't work anyway.SouthamObserver said:
The EU is a big enough market for it always to attract inward investment. But there is no getting round the fact that the Commission - and now some member states - are making absolute dicks of themselves. My guess is that it is for domestic consumption. Politicians and bureaucrats who have buggered up monumentally are bouncing any number of dead cats in the hope one gets noticed. The fact is that any EU member state could have done what the UK did. None of them chose to do so. The national governments of each country own that decision and they clearly do not want to be held to account for it. The UK has done nothing wrong. In fact, for once it has actually done the right thing. And that is the problem across the Channel.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It is not so much that but the damage they have done to themselves, and the effect it will have going forward on pharmaceutical and other inward investment into the EUNorthern_Al said:Some of us "remainers" play the long game. Several things can be true at once:
1. There's no doubt that the EU have made a complete mess of their vaccine strategy, and seem to keep digging once they are in a hole. Not much disagreement here on that, just different levels of excitability.
2. The most likely outcome is that this whole episode, which has excited so many on here, will blow over in due course and global vaccinations will continue apace. Helpfully, thus far the UK government has done well not to inflame tensions; I hope that continues.
3. Nobody I know is campaigning for, or expects, the UK to rejoin the EU in the short or medium term.
4. The vaccine shambles doesn't really tell us much about Brexit. Brexit may be a success, it may be a failure; most probably somewhere in between. But we only properly left the EU a month ago, so I don't believe anybody can be sure about how things will pan out yet. I'll give it three years before I can make a judgement.
In other news, I've the BBC Six O'Clock bulletin on as background noise, where they have just reported that a senior EU official has accused Boris Johnson of wanting to start a vaccine war.
On the one hand, it's all a bit Comical Ali. On the other hand, if you live in the Republic of Ireland (where Anglophobia is widespread) and you're watching your healthcare system being starved of jabs whilst people drop like flies all around you, then whose version of events are you going to buy?
In any case, haven't they said this is between them and AZ? Why is Boris Johnson even coming up, he's not on the AZ board.0 -
In that case the justified concern about deaths in care homes (though mysteriously concentrated mainly on those north of Gretna) will become somewhat muted.Carnyx said:
If the Scots get away with a small fraction of the care home outbreaks that England have - apparently, see TUD's post - been having, it may well be more than justified.
Slight absence of world beatingness in this area.
'Target date for care home vaccinations missed'
https://tinyurl.com/y8c24zcc0 -
Is the New Europrean still going?TheScreamingEagles said://twitter.com/cjayanetti/status/1355217220520058884
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In about seven days, given current rates.alex_ said:
Ireland isn't actually a very big country. We could probably do it.Razedabode said:
At least that’s clear as day. I feel sorry for Ireland - the country with the most to lose in the EU. Let’s give them some of our vaccinesRobD said:
Was clear from the start they were just using the border for their own political interest. They don't give two hoots about the people there.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.0 -
Voice of wisdom. Much needed. Not called "Old King Cole" for nothing.OldKingCole said:
I've already said. This hasn't put me off ReJoining. NO WAY!MarqueeMark said:
*Your call cannot be answered at this time. Please try later."felix said:I'm finding this thread boringly one sided and partisan - is there anyone out there to help Kinabalu and None of the Above - what's happened to you. These people need help! Now! We have a serious Remain shortage. Paging! Paging! They can't all have urgent vaccine appointments surely.
Yes Ursula vdl has made a bog of this one. Yes it's up with one or two of Trump/Boris's dafter policies. But. BUT It's ONE. And I'm certain wiser heads will prevail after the weekend.
And before anyone preens themselves and say look how well UK has done; it was the pharmaceutical industry that did well. Initially anyway. Not the government.1 -
Tbh, the alternative of a hard internal border seems mental so now I think we should extend the hand of friendship to Ireland and include them in our vaccine programme if they agree to be.alex_ said:
Ireland isn't actually a very big country. We could probably do it.Razedabode said:
At least that’s clear as day. I feel sorry for Ireland - the country with the most to lose in the EU. Let’s give them some of our vaccinesRobD said:
Was clear from the start they were just using the border for their own political interest. They don't give two hoots about the people there.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.1 -
6.5 million people - we've got enough on order...alex_ said:
Ireland isn't actually a very big country. We could probably do it.Razedabode said:
At least that’s clear as day. I feel sorry for Ireland - the country with the most to lose in the EU. Let’s give them some of our vaccinesRobD said:
Was clear from the start they were just using the border for their own political interest. They don't give two hoots about the people there.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.0 -
0
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HMG budget in March/April should be a total EU ratfuck. Deregulate and troll them where it hurts the most.MaxPB said:
Absolutely agree with this, we have an amazing research base, top expertise and a great skills base coming out of our universities.Gallowgate said:
There's relatively cheap green field land available in Northumberland and County Durham, combined with a decent knowledge base from the universities and GSK's existing presence. It would be perfect opportunity, in my opinion, for the government to offer tax incentives for new pharma to open or expand their manufacturing and research presence here in the North East. It would also be well received in the Tory's new seats.FrancisUrquhart said:The obvious response from the UK government is to announce some sort of scheme where new big pharma production will get some sort of tax break.
Open for business....
An industrial strategy on this would be very welcome.
Revenge is a dish best served cold.3 -
We should donate to Ireland enough doses to cover their over 65’s.
That would seriously piss off the Germans/French.
Edit: beaten to it by @Razedabode !3 -
I think that's fair - the EU are just using them as disposable pawnsMaxPB said:
Tbh, the alternative of a hard internal border seems mental so now I think we should extend the hand of friendship to Ireland and include them in our vaccine programme if they agree to be.alex_ said:
Ireland isn't actually a very big country. We could probably do it.Razedabode said:
At least that’s clear as day. I feel sorry for Ireland - the country with the most to lose in the EU. Let’s give them some of our vaccinesRobD said:
Was clear from the start they were just using the border for their own political interest. They don't give two hoots about the people there.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.1 -
What a bunch of incel virgins these Scot Nats are.Floater said:https://twitter.com/UKDefJournal/status/1354918962451120129
Ok - own up, which of you nats was it
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Many of us Brexiteers were pilloried for saying so on here at the time.RobD said:
Was clear from the start they were just using the border for their own political interest. They don't give two hoots about the people there.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.0 -
And how many over 70s?AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
6.5 million people - we've got enough on order...alex_ said:
Ireland isn't actually a very big country. We could probably do it.Razedabode said:
At least that’s clear as day. I feel sorry for Ireland - the country with the most to lose in the EU. Let’s give them some of our vaccinesRobD said:
Was clear from the start they were just using the border for their own political interest. They don't give two hoots about the people there.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.0 -
“We’d love to share with the Republic and the only thing that could make it difficult is some idiot triggering a hard border via the NI protocol”....AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
6.5 million people - we've got enough on order...alex_ said:
Ireland isn't actually a very big country. We could probably do it.Razedabode said:
At least that’s clear as day. I feel sorry for Ireland - the country with the most to lose in the EU. Let’s give them some of our vaccinesRobD said:
Was clear from the start they were just using the border for their own political interest. They don't give two hoots about the people there.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.
1 -
The plants that work properly are in the UK. AZ has been using contractual obligations to the British Government to cover its arse on supply. The Commission has been caught with its kecks down, and is incandescent. The UK makes a convenient scapegoat.kle4 said:
It's an absurd claim, but he makes an easy villain.Black_Rook said:
Unfortunately this doesn't mean that Operation Perfidious Albion won't work anyway.SouthamObserver said:
The EU is a big enough market for it always to attract inward investment. But there is no getting round the fact that the Commission - and now some member states - are making absolute dicks of themselves. My guess is that it is for domestic consumption. Politicians and bureaucrats who have buggered up monumentally are bouncing any number of dead cats in the hope one gets noticed. The fact is that any EU member state could have done what the UK did. None of them chose to do so. The national governments of each country own that decision and they clearly do not want to be held to account for it. The UK has done nothing wrong. In fact, for once it has actually done the right thing. And that is the problem across the Channel.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It is not so much that but the damage they have done to themselves, and the effect it will have going forward on pharmaceutical and other inward investment into the EUNorthern_Al said:Some of us "remainers" play the long game. Several things can be true at once:
1. There's no doubt that the EU have made a complete mess of their vaccine strategy, and seem to keep digging once they are in a hole. Not much disagreement here on that, just different levels of excitability.
2. The most likely outcome is that this whole episode, which has excited so many on here, will blow over in due course and global vaccinations will continue apace. Helpfully, thus far the UK government has done well not to inflame tensions; I hope that continues.
3. Nobody I know is campaigning for, or expects, the UK to rejoin the EU in the short or medium term.
4. The vaccine shambles doesn't really tell us much about Brexit. Brexit may be a success, it may be a failure; most probably somewhere in between. But we only properly left the EU a month ago, so I don't believe anybody can be sure about how things will pan out yet. I'll give it three years before I can make a judgement.
In other news, I've the BBC Six O'Clock bulletin on as background noise, where they have just reported that a senior EU official has accused Boris Johnson of wanting to start a vaccine war.
On the one hand, it's all a bit Comical Ali. On the other hand, if you live in the Republic of Ireland (where Anglophobia is widespread) and you're watching your healthcare system being starved of jabs whilst people drop like flies all around you, then whose version of events are you going to buy?
In any case, haven't they said this is between them and AZ? Why is Boris Johnson even coming up, he's not on the AZ board.
As I said earlier, there is a reason why the UK is the only country in Europe West of Kaliningrad to be excluded from the exemption list for the proposed import control regulations. They hate us.0 -
Yup, fuck the idea of alignment. Let's get into the CPTPP and start talking to the US about consolidation of NYLon as the only real places to do business.Casino_Royale said:
HMG budget in March/April should be a total EU ratfuck. Deregulate and troll them where it hurts the most.MaxPB said:
Absolutely agree with this, we have an amazing research base, top expertise and a great skills base coming out of our universities.Gallowgate said:
There's relatively cheap green field land available in Northumberland and County Durham, combined with a decent knowledge base from the universities and GSK's existing presence. It would be perfect opportunity, in my opinion, for the government to offer tax incentives for new pharma to open or expand their manufacturing and research presence here in the North East. It would also be well received in the Tory's new seats.FrancisUrquhart said:The obvious response from the UK government is to announce some sort of scheme where new big pharma production will get some sort of tax break.
Open for business....
An industrial strategy on this would be very welcome.
Revenge is a dish best served cold.5 -
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The heart of Novavax's technology is not the S protein fragment used (it's a protein vaccine), but the nanoparticle used as an adjuvant (Matrix-M is their trademarked name for it) which is based on saponin, a glycoside extracted from bark of the Soapbark Tree (Quillaja saponaria Molina), grown at certain latitudes in Chile.Nigelb said:
I posted a link a few days back from someone who had listed the various components listed for the respective vaccines, and there were significant differences between Pfizer and Moderna.rcs1000 said:
Is it done very differently to CureVac and Pfizer?Nigelb said:
Maybe - but I suspect that will be quite difficult.rcs1000 said:
There's actually a lot of this going on right now, and this is another reason to get increasingly comfortable about vaccine supply going forward.Gallowgate said:
Sanofi have already agreed to produce the Pfizer jab under license I believe.Luckyguy1983 said:So how do we increase vacc. supply so there is genuinely more now (or soon) rather than arguing over the same pie?
One possibility I can spot is for Sanofi to abandon their vaccine attempt (which I assume they are keeping manufacturing capacity aside for) and turn their manufacturing over to one of the other vaccines - Valneva looks the likeliest, as the French will never agree to AZN, and Pfizer has big issues concerning usability.
EDIT: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-01-27/sanofi-to-make-millions-of-biontech-pfizer-s-covid-vaccine-doses
So: Bayer has already started manufacturing on behalf of CureVac, and both Novartis and Sanofi will be making the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine. The Serum Institute of India is making both the AZN and Novavax vaccines.
I haven't yet seen any announcements from other people producing Moderna. But I presume they're in negotiations with people.
Moderna has what is for them seriously valuable IP in terms of formulating the mRNA in lipid nanoparticles for delivery, and some of that is likely to be commercial secrets rather than patentable processes. Getting them to share might take some effort.
The details of how it's actually manufactured are obviously not public, but the characteristics of the lipid blob which encapsulates the active mRNA are important both for the stability of the molecule (which otherwise would degrade very rapidly), and getting it into cells once injected, so that it can do its stuff.
Given they've worked on this for a decade or more, I think we can guess that it is important and commercially very valuable.
Scroll down the page a bit for info: https://www.novavax.com/our-unique-technology#matrix-m-adjuvant-technology0 -
Can't be more than 1m, that's a small number.alex_ said:
And how many over 70s?AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
6.5 million people - we've got enough on order...alex_ said:
Ireland isn't actually a very big country. We could probably do it.Razedabode said:
At least that’s clear as day. I feel sorry for Ireland - the country with the most to lose in the EU. Let’s give them some of our vaccinesRobD said:
Was clear from the start they were just using the border for their own political interest. They don't give two hoots about the people there.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.0 -
When you put it like that .....CarlottaVance said:
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Can't have many toys left in the pram now.CarlottaVance said:1 -
Looks like a latin fan on top right though, greeting everyone with a rather classical 'Ave'.TheScreamingEagles said:
What a bunch of incel virgins these Scot Nats are.Floater said:https://twitter.com/UKDefJournal/status/1354918962451120129
Ok - own up, which of you nats was it1 -
Not to the EU vaccination procurement team......MaxPB said:
Can't be more than 1m, that's a small number.alex_ said:
And how many over 70s?AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
6.5 million people - we've got enough on order...alex_ said:
Ireland isn't actually a very big country. We could probably do it.Razedabode said:
At least that’s clear as day. I feel sorry for Ireland - the country with the most to lose in the EU. Let’s give them some of our vaccinesRobD said:
Was clear from the start they were just using the border for their own political interest. They don't give two hoots about the people there.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.1 -
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I've looked. 700k over 65.MaxPB said:
Can't be more than 1m, that's a small number.alex_ said:
And how many over 70s?AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
6.5 million people - we've got enough on order...alex_ said:
Ireland isn't actually a very big country. We could probably do it.Razedabode said:
At least that’s clear as day. I feel sorry for Ireland - the country with the most to lose in the EU. Let’s give them some of our vaccinesRobD said:
Was clear from the start they were just using the border for their own political interest. They don't give two hoots about the people there.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.1 -
williamglenn said:
https://twitter.com/DaveKeating/status/1355172056543989761rcs1000 said:I was wrong: it appears the EU is being stupid enough to actually restrict exports.
kle4 said:
That's the the thing they definitely wont use.FrancisUrquhart said:
Can't the US source Pfizer from Kalamazoo ?Time_to_Leave said:The EU needs to calm down and stop. Now. Never mind the relationship with us, if they start the new Biden era by preventing him hitting his vaccine target, even if unintentionally, it will have an impact.
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Tbh, we should give them 2m AZ doses over the next few weeks so they can fully jab their over 70s. It's a small sacrifice for us and it prevents any kind of risk of border checks.Floater said:
Not to the EU vaccination procurement team......MaxPB said:
Can't be more than 1m, that's a small number.alex_ said:
And how many over 70s?AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
6.5 million people - we've got enough on order...alex_ said:
Ireland isn't actually a very big country. We could probably do it.Razedabode said:
At least that’s clear as day. I feel sorry for Ireland - the country with the most to lose in the EU. Let’s give them some of our vaccinesRobD said:
Was clear from the start they were just using the border for their own political interest. They don't give two hoots about the people there.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.1 -
That from Adam Boulton is astonishing considering how pro EU he isCarlottaVance said:
Just need Ian Dunt to condemn the EU to make it surreal
And of course Nicola0 -
I wondered what @BluestBlue looked like.Luckyguy1983 said:
Looks like a latin fan on top right though, greeting everyone with a rather classical 'Ave'.TheScreamingEagles said:
What a bunch of incel virgins these Scot Nats are.Floater said:https://twitter.com/UKDefJournal/status/1354918962451120129
Ok - own up, which of you nats was it3 -
That gives me a funny idea.RobD said:
Can't have many toys left in the pram now.CarlottaVance said:
UK PM - "Everyone stop. Find a corner, stand in it for 1 minute per year of your age. Think about what you have done. Then we all shake hands, and say sorry. And not do it again."1 -
Remember the Internal market bill...that clauses about if the EU act like twats....and all the press said its illegal and besides the EU would never do things like that.8
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To be fair to them, it's nice of the EU to help unite Britain.5
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McPlod not knocking on their doors for some odd reason?TheScreamingEagles said:
What a bunch of incel virgins these Scot Nats are.Floater said:https://twitter.com/UKDefJournal/status/1354918962451120129
Ok - own up, which of you nats was it0 -
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Come, be precise. Scot Nats are party members. Independistas or Yessers is the word you are seeking.TheScreamingEagles said:
What a bunch of incel virgins these Scot Nats are.Floater said:https://twitter.com/UKDefJournal/status/1354918962451120129
Ok - own up, which of you nats was it0 -
James O'Brien.Big_G_NorthWales said:
That from Adam Boulton is astonishing considering how pro EU he isCarlottaVance said:
Just need Ian Dunt to condemn the EU to make it surreal
And of course Nicola1 -
What's to stop Pfizer shipping vaccine to some random country and then onwards to the UK? Perhaps we could up our order and donate the difference to whichever country acts as go between.1
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We can only do this if we have this capacity sitting idle because of a difference between jabbing capacity and vaccine stock. If we do - yep. If it's 2m British taxpayers going without, no. It cannot be - much as this would be a great gesture, the first duty of our Government must be to protect British lives.MaxPB said:
Tbh, we should give them 2m AZ doses over the next few weeks so they can fully jab their over 70s. It's a small sacrifice for us and it prevents any kind of risk of border checks.Floater said:
Not to the EU vaccination procurement team......MaxPB said:
Can't be more than 1m, that's a small number.alex_ said:
And how many over 70s?AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
6.5 million people - we've got enough on order...alex_ said:
Ireland isn't actually a very big country. We could probably do it.Razedabode said:
At least that’s clear as day. I feel sorry for Ireland - the country with the most to lose in the EU. Let’s give them some of our vaccinesRobD said:
Was clear from the start they were just using the border for their own political interest. They don't give two hoots about the people there.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.0 -
Only risk....I think we are well past that.CarlottaVance said:4 -
It is an apt metaphor. Whether you like or dislike the EU they usually maintain their cool or at least appear calculating. This has been flailing, and resorting to the tactics of those they claim to be against.Scott_xP said:2 -
Scarily plausible. I am searching for, and failing to find, any other explanation for Macron's truly bizarre, idiotically dangerous remarks.Control_Freak said:Hi, long time lurker.
Love the site, a fantastic resource for both diverse and educated views of all sides of arguments.
I have been addicted to the threads over the last couple of days, especially regarding the somewhat strange behaviour of 1. The EU. 2. Germany. 3 France (now joining the fray)
It was all looking rather haphazard until number 3. Why is Macron also saying AZN is shit?
Bit of a conspiracy theory, and I hope I am wrong, but what if there is about to be a real problem with infection rates, hospitalisations and death in Germany, France etc in the very near future. They may have wind of this coming (see Portugal) and are trying to mitigate the absolute shitstorm that will be coming their way. Given that it is mainly old people who shuffle off their mortal coil for this virus, how could you cover your arse for not acting sooner:
1. Try and get (steal?) as much vaccine as soon as possible, and get cracking
2. If you can’t get said vaccine, then say that it is rubbish for the aged, and hey presto! It doesn’t matter that we have massive deaths of the elderly, as even if we could have gotten the vaccine (we didn’t, because we are useless), it wouldn’t have had any beneficial effect on the elderly anyway!
As I say, I hope I am wrong.
It's possibly worse, in its destructive foolishness, than any one thing Trump ever sad.2 -
He’s currently battling COVIDBig_G_NorthWales said:
That from Adam Boulton is astonishing considering how pro EU he isCarlottaVance said:
Just need Ian Dunt to condemn the EU to make it surreal
And of course Nicola
https://twitter.com/IanDunt/status/1355114907046457345?s=200 -
Ooo er. It's going all Scarface on here.Casino_Royale said:
HMG budget in March/April should be a total EU ratfuck. Deregulate and troll them where it hurts the most.MaxPB said:
Absolutely agree with this, we have an amazing research base, top expertise and a great skills base coming out of our universities.Gallowgate said:
There's relatively cheap green field land available in Northumberland and County Durham, combined with a decent knowledge base from the universities and GSK's existing presence. It would be perfect opportunity, in my opinion, for the government to offer tax incentives for new pharma to open or expand their manufacturing and research presence here in the North East. It would also be well received in the Tory's new seats.FrancisUrquhart said:The obvious response from the UK government is to announce some sort of scheme where new big pharma production will get some sort of tax break.
Open for business....
An industrial strategy on this would be very welcome.
Revenge is a dish best served cold.
I think I should drift gently into my weekend.
Watch the blood pressure chaps. We don't want to lose anybody.0 -
yeah - I'm surprised at Adam Boulton - but fair playBig_G_NorthWales said:
That from Adam Boulton is astonishing considering how pro EU he isCarlottaVance said:
Just need Ian Dunt to condemn the EU to make it surreal
And of course Nicola0 -
1
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BBC London news reporting that some boroughs are only at 40% in terms of carers agreeing to have the vaccine.0
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We will give them to them (in UK Aid boxes) when we're good and ready, and not before.MaxPB said:
Tbh, we should give them 2m AZ doses over the next few weeks so they can fully jab their over 70s. It's a small sacrifice for us and it prevents any kind of risk of border checks.Floater said:
Not to the EU vaccination procurement team......MaxPB said:
Can't be more than 1m, that's a small number.alex_ said:
And how many over 70s?AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
6.5 million people - we've got enough on order...alex_ said:
Ireland isn't actually a very big country. We could probably do it.Razedabode said:
At least that’s clear as day. I feel sorry for Ireland - the country with the most to lose in the EU. Let’s give them some of our vaccinesRobD said:
Was clear from the start they were just using the border for their own political interest. They don't give two hoots about the people there.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.
They can't be seen to have won anything from this whatsoever.0 -
When I said the EU big whigs were acting like Cartman from South Park, I think I was underplaying it.5
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Not yet convinced it's not simply malfunctioning.Big_G_NorthWales said:0 -
Is that our very own 'Ave It! relocated slightly further north than his usual Watford?Luckyguy1983 said:
Looks like a latin fan on top right though, greeting everyone with a rather classical 'Ave'.TheScreamingEagles said:
What a bunch of incel virgins these Scot Nats are.Floater said:https://twitter.com/UKDefJournal/status/1354918962451120129
Ok - own up, which of you nats was it1 -
I did not know that and wish him and his wife wellCarlottaVance said:
He’s currently battling COVIDBig_G_NorthWales said:
That from Adam Boulton is astonishing considering how pro EU he isCarlottaVance said:
Just need Ian Dunt to condemn the EU to make it surreal
And of course Nicola
https://twitter.com/IanDunt/status/1355114907046457345?s=200 -
Brussels to Northern Ireland: fuck youRobD said:
Was clear from the start they were just using the border for their own political interest. They don't give two hoots about the people there.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.1 -
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The government needs to act on this. We really can't have front line healthcare workers not being vaccinated, especially ones that deal with the most vulnerable every day.tlg86 said:BBC London news reporting that some boroughs are only at 40% in terms of carers agreeing to have the vaccine.
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That's a nothing figure tbh, we should definitely ask.alex_ said:
I've looked. 700k over 65.MaxPB said:
Can't be more than 1m, that's a small number.alex_ said:
And how many over 70s?AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
6.5 million people - we've got enough on order...alex_ said:
Ireland isn't actually a very big country. We could probably do it.Razedabode said:
At least that’s clear as day. I feel sorry for Ireland - the country with the most to lose in the EU. Let’s give them some of our vaccinesRobD said:
Was clear from the start they were just using the border for their own political interest. They don't give two hoots about the people there.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.0 -
If it's an incel virgin thing, UK Defence Journal are certainly the right boys to highlight it.TheScreamingEagles said:
What a bunch of incel virgins these Scot Nats are.Floater said:https://twitter.com/UKDefJournal/status/1354918962451120129
Ok - own up, which of you nats was it0 -
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Jabs not crabs would seem more apposite.CarlottaVance said:3 -
Okay, they are members of the Waffen Yes Yes or the Yestapo.Carnyx said:
Come, be precise. Scot Nats are party members. Independistas or Yessers is the word you are seeking.TheScreamingEagles said:
What a bunch of incel virgins these Scot Nats are.Floater said:https://twitter.com/UKDefJournal/status/1354918962451120129
Ok - own up, which of you nats was it4 -
Back to sweary tweets next week....CarlottaVance said:
He’s currently battling COVIDBig_G_NorthWales said:
That from Adam Boulton is astonishing considering how pro EU he isCarlottaVance said:
Just need Ian Dunt to condemn the EU to make it surreal
And of course Nicola
https://twitter.com/IanDunt/status/1355114907046457345?s=200 -
I'd always visualised him wearing one of those sculpted & gilded breastplates, perhaps a laurel wreath. Disappointing.Carnyx said:
I wondered what @BluestBlue looked like.Luckyguy1983 said:
Looks like a latin fan on top right though, greeting everyone with a rather classical 'Ave'.TheScreamingEagles said:
What a bunch of incel virgins these Scot Nats are.Floater said:https://twitter.com/UKDefJournal/status/1354918962451120129
Ok - own up, which of you nats was it0 -
This weekends paper are going to be a horror show for the EU0
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It has to be Meeks for me.Big_G_NorthWales said:
That from Adam Boulton is astonishing considering how pro EU he isCarlottaVance said:
Just need Ian Dunt to condemn the EU to make it surreal
And of course Nicola
He must have insulted every Leaver on pb.com many, many times with his ridiculous assertions.
Meeks seems to be maintaining a "dignified silence" on Twitter. Or at least a silence.5 -
Or start loudly making overtures to Ireland/Denmark/Sweden about enlarging the CTA and the potential for a Free Trade Area across the North Sea if they ever wanted to think about leaving the EU...MaxPB said:
Yup, fuck the idea of alignment. Let's get into the CPTPP and start talking to the US about consolidation of NYLon as the only real places to do business.Casino_Royale said:
HMG budget in March/April should be a total EU ratfuck. Deregulate and troll them where it hurts the most.MaxPB said:
Absolutely agree with this, we have an amazing research base, top expertise and a great skills base coming out of our universities.Gallowgate said:
There's relatively cheap green field land available in Northumberland and County Durham, combined with a decent knowledge base from the universities and GSK's existing presence. It would be perfect opportunity, in my opinion, for the government to offer tax incentives for new pharma to open or expand their manufacturing and research presence here in the North East. It would also be well received in the Tory's new seats.FrancisUrquhart said:The obvious response from the UK government is to announce some sort of scheme where new big pharma production will get some sort of tax break.
Open for business....
An industrial strategy on this would be very welcome.
Revenge is a dish best served cold.0 -
The problem is, they have safety in numbers. If it was the odd person, you could sack them. You can't sack 40% (okay, it might not be quite that many) of your staff.Pulpstar said:
Ship them off to France.tlg86 said:BBC London news reporting that some boroughs are only at 40% in terms of carers agreeing to have the vaccine.
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I presume he is still blaming racist leave voters for all this.tlg86 said:
James O'Brien.Big_G_NorthWales said:
That from Adam Boulton is astonishing considering how pro EU he isCarlottaVance said:
Just need Ian Dunt to condemn the EU to make it surreal
And of course Nicola1 -
Giving 1.4m doses to the Republic isn't a win for anyone other than common sense to prevent a hard border on the island. The idea just seems mental to me because there will have to be a border checking to see if vaccine doses are being taken into NI.Casino_Royale said:
We will give them to them (in UK Aid boxes) when we're good and ready, and not before.MaxPB said:
Tbh, we should give them 2m AZ doses over the next few weeks so they can fully jab their over 70s. It's a small sacrifice for us and it prevents any kind of risk of border checks.Floater said:
Not to the EU vaccination procurement team......MaxPB said:
Can't be more than 1m, that's a small number.alex_ said:
And how many over 70s?AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
6.5 million people - we've got enough on order...alex_ said:
Ireland isn't actually a very big country. We could probably do it.Razedabode said:
At least that’s clear as day. I feel sorry for Ireland - the country with the most to lose in the EU. Let’s give them some of our vaccinesRobD said:
Was clear from the start they were just using the border for their own political interest. They don't give two hoots about the people there.dr_spyn said:What a carve up.
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1355212119277522945
EU fall into their own Irish bear trap.
They can't be seen to have won anything from this whatsoever.0 -
Please don't make me have to root for Michael Gove.
https://twitter.com/SebastianEPayne/status/13552238108621004816
