In spite of the latest EU dealings those who think Brexit was wrong still have clear 8% lead with Yo
In spite of the latest EU dealings those who think Brexit was wrong still have clear 8% lead with YouGov – politicalbetting.com
Even though the UK is now fully out of the EU there’s been almost no movement in YouGov’s Brexit tracker which has been asked at least twice a month since 2016.
Comments
-
First as the UK was to purchase vaccines (thank God).0
-
I was wrong: it appears the EU is being stupid enough to actually restrict exports.6
-
On polling, at the moment, I don't think most people are taking much notice beyond Europe are demanding their vaccine shipments of AZN.
We haven't got to a stage of your Gran / Mum can't have their vaccine because the EU have stopped deliveries out of EU factories or have had UK made ones exported.0 -
5th still way ahead of the EU in the queue.eek said:First as the UK was to purchase vaccines (thank God).
0 -
Ask again now2
-
All bets now off - stupid sodsFrancisUrquhart said:1 -
https://twitter.com/DaveKeating/status/1355172056543989761rcs1000 said:I was wrong: it appears the EU is being stupid enough to actually restrict exports.
0 -
-
-
They're trying to target elderly vulnerable people in the UK and deny them a 2nd Pfizer jab, because they were more likely to vote for Brexit.rcs1000 said:I was wrong: it appears the EU is being stupid enough to actually restrict exports.
2 -
-
EMA authorises AZ vaccine for all over 18-year-olds.2
-
The EU confirms it is introducing export controls on coronavirus vaccines made in the bloc, amid a row about shortfalls in delivery. Individual member states will decide whether to allow exports of vaccines produced in their territory.
---
I love the way the EU have dumped this decision on each country to look bad, but it is clear who is doing the threatening.2 -
How long before even more problems with customs at the border....
0 -
That sound you hear is that of the poll above being ripped up....2
-
Not targeting any particular country - and certainly not targeting the one and only European state West of bloody Kaliningrad not included on the exemption list, oh no...williamglenn said:
https://twitter.com/DaveKeating/status/1355172056543989761rcs1000 said:I was wrong: it appears the EU is being stupid enough to actually restrict exports.
This looks more and more like a plan to try to rally the 27 by picking a fight with the Evil Brits.3 -
I presume Israel aren't on the exemption list? I wouldn't want to f##k with their vaccine supplies.williamglenn said:
https://twitter.com/DaveKeating/status/1355172056543989761rcs1000 said:I was wrong: it appears the EU is being stupid enough to actually restrict exports.
1 -
That's the the thing they definitely wont use.FrancisUrquhart said:0 -
Interesting - they've taken a less cautioys view than the German authority.Floater said:2 -
COVID-19 Vaccine AstraZeneca is given as two injections into the arm, the second between 4 to 12 weeks after the first.Floater said:0 -
Any campaign for re-join, the remain out side will just have a bus with "when it came to the crunch the EU were happy to throw your Granny under this" written on the side.Floater said:That sound you hear is that of the poll above being ripped up....
3 -
So Kimbalu - what do you have to say now?0
-
The headlines started after this polling was completed - it will be interesting to see whether they've had any impact. Given "Leave/Remain" is very much tied up with identity, it might be less than expected.Floater said:Ask again now
1 -
On topic, I think this poll might prove to have been taken at peak remain.0
-
and that's when it's going to get really interesting - as we need the next set of Pfizer vaccines for those second jabs.Wulfrun_Phil said:
They're trying to target elderly vulnerable people in the UK and deny them a 2nd Pfizer jab, because they were more likely to vote for Brexit.rcs1000 said:I was wrong: it appears the EU is being stupid enough to actually restrict exports.
0 -
Are the EU now saying that Pfizer has broken its contract? Because otherwise, the only exports they'd restrict would be of surplus Belgium-produced AZ vaccines, which unfortunately don't exist. 'Completely lost the plot' is the phrase which comes to mind.7
-
Their anger I get, but the logic of some their public pronouncements, which they appear to believe, has at best been odd at times.rcs1000 said:I was wrong: it appears the EU is being stupid enough to actually restrict exports.
And raising the emotional tone and making wild accusations is ready not on, without then blaming others for their own choices.
Have they learned nothing from Brexit? Did they not rightly spend all that time criticising these kinds of self defeating tactics scapegoating others?
Are they unable to see how they are behaving in a way theyd condemn in others?0 -
2
-
you hope...TrèsDifficile said:On topic, I think this poll might prove to have been taken at peak remain.
0 -
So just to clarify - the EU is really saying that contracts for the delivery of vaccine have to be honoured, but only when the delivery is to the EU?????????FrancisUrquhart said:The EU confirms it is introducing export controls on coronavirus vaccines made in the bloc, amid a row about shortfalls in delivery. Individual member states will decide whether to allow exports of vaccines produced in their territory.
---
I love the way the EU have dumped this decision on each country to look bad, but it is clear who is doing the threatening.5 -
Sounds about right.Chris said:
So just to clarify - the EU is really saying that contracts for the delivery of vaccine have to be honoured, but only when the delivery is to the EU?????????FrancisUrquhart said:The EU confirms it is introducing export controls on coronavirus vaccines made in the bloc, amid a row about shortfalls in delivery. Individual member states will decide whether to allow exports of vaccines produced in their territory.
---
I love the way the EU have dumped this decision on each country to look bad, but it is clear who is doing the threatening.0 -
Haven't Pfizer also got production issues due to a temporary shortfall to allow more scaling up.Richard_Nabavi said:Are the EU now saying that Pfizer has broken its contract? Because otherwise, the only exports they'd restrict would be of surplus Belgium-produced AZ vaccines, which unfortunately don't exist. 'Completely lost the plot' is the phrase which comes to mind.
0 -
Gosh it's getting serious.williamglenn said:
https://twitter.com/DaveKeating/status/1355172056543989761rcs1000 said:I was wrong: it appears the EU is being stupid enough to actually restrict exports.
1 -
0
-
Oof!FrancisUrquhart said:
Any campaign for re-join, the remain out side will just have a bus with "when it came to the crunch the EU were happy to throw your Granny under this" written on the side.Floater said:That sound you hear is that of the poll above being ripped up....
0 -
Yet 52% of voters would still vote to stay out now, only 48% to rejoin the EU ie zero change from the referendum result in 2016 now No Deal has been avoided.
The 48% who think Brexit was wrong all want to rejoin but the 52% Leave majority still want to give Brexit a chance
https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1347501867253854210?s=200 -
Firmly predict. Bookmark the comment.Daveyboy1961 said:
you hope...TrèsDifficile said:On topic, I think this poll might prove to have been taken at peak remain.
0 -
If the EU manages to dick about with US vaccine supplies, events are going to develop not necessarily to its advantage.1
-
I don't now about Covid, anybody got a jab that is 95% effective against Stoopid?3
-
Crickey they are going to f##k with the US....now that's brave. Uncle Joe might not be so pro-European in a few weeks if they do this.1
-
To think when I originally posted what the Germans were proposing just a few days ago there were howls from people who said this would never happenGIN1138 said:
Gosh it's getting serious.williamglenn said:
https://twitter.com/DaveKeating/status/1355172056543989761rcs1000 said:I was wrong: it appears the EU is being stupid enough to actually restrict exports.
3 -
Leaving the EU?MarqueeMark said:I don't now about Covid, anybody got a jab that is 95% effective against Stoopid?
** innocent face***0 -
Is the US importing any vaccines manufactured in the EU?FrancisUrquhart said:Crickey they are going to f##k with the US....now that's brave. Uncle Joe might not be so pro-European in a few weeks if they do this.
0 -
I do love the repetition of simple phrases like 'contracts are binding' when the meaning of the contract is disputed.
Its giving me Brexit is Brexit flashbacks, a stock phrase that doesnt really mean anything in practice.
I mean, if a meteor strike took out all AZ sites they couldn't deliver but would be covered, so there are circumstances where delivery is accepted might fail. This is an argument over if that is now the case under the contract, not an argument that contracts are binding or not.1 -
Excluding 12% don't knows who could go either way.HYUFD said:Yet 52% of voters would still vote to stay out now, only 48% to rejoin the EU
https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1347501867253854210?s=20
Which means it could be 60-40% leave or 52-48% remain.0 -
Yes, but they don't seem to be blaming Pfizer for that. I wonder why not...eek said:
Haven't Pfizer also got production issues due to a temporary shortfall to allow more scaling up.Richard_Nabavi said:Are the EU now saying that Pfizer has broken its contract? Because otherwise, the only exports they'd restrict would be of surplus Belgium-produced AZ vaccines, which unfortunately don't exist. 'Completely lost the plot' is the phrase which comes to mind.
0 -
Scaling up caused by the EU belatedly increasing their order.....eek said:
Haven't Pfizer also got production issues due to a temporary shortfall to allow more scaling up.Richard_Nabavi said:Are the EU now saying that Pfizer has broken its contract? Because otherwise, the only exports they'd restrict would be of surplus Belgium-produced AZ vaccines, which unfortunately don't exist. 'Completely lost the plot' is the phrase which comes to mind.
1 -
I think that's what it must be seen as - and purely in that regard, it's had some success. Instead of discussing what a fuck up the EU has made of this, the discussion is about the greedy Brits stealing all the vaccines.Black_Rook said:
Not targeting any particular country - and certainly not targeting the one and only European state West of bloody Kaliningrad not included on the exemption list, oh no...williamglenn said:
https://twitter.com/DaveKeating/status/1355172056543989761rcs1000 said:I was wrong: it appears the EU is being stupid enough to actually restrict exports.
This looks more and more like a plan to try to rally the 27 by picking a fight with the Evil Brits.
This has been at the expense of leaving Remaineristas in the UK (particularly in Scotland it must be said) very high and dry, but if that's being considered at all, I think it's being seen as a very small price to pay.0 -
Honest question - how much of this is spite because we left?0
-
You can imagine how Donald would have reacted...FrancisUrquhart said:Crickey they are going to f##k with the US....now that's brave. Uncle Joe might not be so pro-European in a few weeks if they do this.
1 -
Events of the last few days make option B a lot less likely wouldn't you say?eek said:
Excluding 12% don't knows who could go either way.HYUFD said:Yet 52% of voters would still vote to stay out now, only 48% to rejoin the EU
https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1347501867253854210?s=20
Which means it could be 60-40% leave or 52-48% remain.0 -
They can just block Pfizer from supplying us. Insisting that AZ send its UK made supply is proving trickier.Richard_Nabavi said:
Yes, but they don't seem to be blaming Pfizer for that. I wonder why not...eek said:
Haven't Pfizer also got production issues due to a temporary shortfall to allow more scaling up.Richard_Nabavi said:Are the EU now saying that Pfizer has broken its contract? Because otherwise, the only exports they'd restrict would be of surplus Belgium-produced AZ vaccines, which unfortunately don't exist. 'Completely lost the plot' is the phrase which comes to mind.
0 -
Its green eyed jealousy because we're doing better than them.Floater said:Honest question - how much of this is spite because we left?
0 -
I seemed to remember Max saying that some base ingredients for the Pfizer vaccine come from the UK...this could get very messy very quickly.1
-
It's amazing that Bild seems to be the grown up in the room in Germany, pointing out that export bans will result in retaliation from other nations which ends in no vaccines being produced at all.
That's like The Sun telling the PM to calm down.5 -
EMA approve AZN for all over 18s0
-
It's spite because we're visibly doing something better than them, and when the Commission made a song and dance about taking over vaccine procurement from the member states, the optics of that are terrible for them.Floater said:Honest question - how much of this is spite because we left?
9 -
0
-
They are trying to pretend only they have experienced under delivery so that a company and an outside country can blamed for an 'unfair' situation.Chris said:
So just to clarify - the EU is really saying that contracts for the delivery of vaccine have to be honoured, but only when the delivery is to the EU?????????FrancisUrquhart said:The EU confirms it is introducing export controls on coronavirus vaccines made in the bloc, amid a row about shortfalls in delivery. Individual member states will decide whether to allow exports of vaccines produced in their territory.
---
I love the way the EU have dumped this decision on each country to look bad, but it is clear who is doing the threatening.
That is not true so it is a very cynical move. Smug utterances in future around fair play will get laughed out of the room, they've sacrificed integrity on the altar of populism and denial of responsibility.
That's wrong when others do it and it's wrong when the EU do it.1 -
I remember fondly the sincerity with which Boris haters predicted he'd fuck up vaccine procurement and then delivery.2
-
They seem very frustrated that we are not the sick man of Europe they thought was inevitable.Floater said:Honest question - how much of this is spite because we left?
They had a limo at Brussels airport waiting for us to crawl back for membership and everything....1 -
Before this EU debacleeek said:
Excluding 12% don't knows who could go either way.HYUFD said:Yet 52% of voters would still vote to stay out now, only 48% to rejoin the EU
https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1347501867253854210?s=20
Which means it could be 60-40% leave or 52-48% remain.0 -
That can only be Pfizer, surely?
What is the rationale for the measure?
The objective of this measure is to ensure timely access to COVID-19 vaccines for all EU citizens and to tackle the current lack of transparency of vaccine exports outside the EU.
https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/qanda_21_308
Perhaps the UK should ask Pfizer to switch sourcing to the US? And send the raw materials.2 -
Yeah but May got the boot.....MarqueeMark said:
They seem very frustrated that we are not the sick man of Europe they thought was inevitable.Floater said:Honest question - how much of this is spite because we left?
They had a limo at Brussels airport waiting for us to crawl back for membership and everything....0 -
The key question is whether there are enough second Pfizer doses already in the U.K. to match up with what’s been injected or another source that can compensate (e.g. US sites). If so, then presumably our Government can sit back, say nothing, and let the EU have a mardy.0
-
Now all that moaning about one clause in the Internal Market Bill, that if the EU starting being twats we could do something about it and we were all told that it is totally illegal in international law and the EU would never behave like that.5
-
Imo, very little directly as spite but it is related and cynical. It is a show for internal EU audiences, and yes the meme of the UK being the bad guy because of the Brexit negotiations fits nicely into their little political pantomime. It is not aimed at us, there wont be a vaccine export ban and AZ will continue to supply as they planned to but "something has been seen to be done" by their voters. The reputational hit the EU takes in UK political opinion is collateral damage, not the target.Floater said:Honest question - how much of this is spite because we left?
2 -
I presume from next week they won't be giving anybody Pfizer just to be on the safe side. Not great for getting the numbers up to 500k / day and hitting the mid Feb target.Time_to_Leave said:The key question is whether there are enough second Pfizer doses already in the U.K. to match up with what’s been injected or another source that can compensate (e.g. US sites). If so, then presumably our Government can sit back, say nothing, and let the EU have a mardy.
2 -
As expected. Just how much succour has the German regulator, newspaper and health ministry given to anti-vaxxers over the last few days.williamglenn said:EMA authorises AZ vaccine for all over 18-year-olds.
This is quite possibly the most unedifying episode in the EU's history.12 -
-
To be fair, German history. And clearly there it's up against stiffer competition.MaxPB said:
As expected. Just how much succour has the German regulator, newspaper and health ministry given to anti-vaxxers over the last few days.williamglenn said:EMA authorises AZ vaccine for all over 18-year-olds.
This is quite possibly the most unedifying episode in the EU's history.1 -
The EU's policy appears to be to kill Brits.0
-
Outrageous.CarlottaVance said:Not just the UK missing......
https://twitter.com/nickgutteridge/status/1355174594097897480?s=200 -
Yes, you have to guess contingency plans have been put into effect over the last week. The team planning our vaccine rollout are demonstrably not idiotsFrancisUrquhart said:
I presume from next week they won't be giving anybody Pfizer just to be on the safe side. Not great for getting the numbers up to 500k / day and hitting the mid Feb target.Time_to_Leave said:The key question is whether there are enough second Pfizer doses already in the U.K. to match up with what’s been injected or another source that can compensate (e.g. US sites). If so, then presumably our Government can sit back, say nothing, and let the EU have a mardy.
2 -
Good rule of thumb on reasonableness - how would Party A react if Party B tried the same thing?Pulpstar said:I have never, ever ever in my life come across a situation where a customer has demanded that a supplier publish a contract with another customer.
You'd be laughed out of town if you demanded this in the commercial world. Appalling behaviour from UVDL. It's up to the UK Gov't and Astra whether or not they want our contract made public (And why should either party want to have it public), nothing at all to do with the EU.
That is, would the EU think their behaviour was reasonable if the UK had done the same thing?
Everyone on planet Earth can answer that question, even if they are very pro-EU.1 -
If they actually do this the the government has no choice but to take it up with Pfizer and ask to which site they should ask the exports to be redirected to ensure timely delivery of UK and other non-EU countries vaccine supplies.FrancisUrquhart said:I seemed to remember Max saying that some base ingredients for the Pfizer vaccine come from the UK...this could get very messy very quickly.
4 -
It is the notification system, not the ban.rcs1000 said:I was wrong: it appears the EU is being stupid enough to actually restrict exports.
0 -
Hmmm.CarlottaVance said:Not just the UK missing......
https://twitter.com/nickgutteridge/status/1355174594097897480?s=20
Ceuta etc on that exempt list. Gibraltar not. Reunion etc not.
Is that because the French treat overseas territories as part of France itself?
Also South Americas & North Americas and Oz / NZ / India not exempt.
What about Canaries, Azores, Greenland?0 -
The thing is all this behaviour by the EU is giving Boris so much political cover over a) not hitting vaccine target and b) issues with Brexit.
He can just point now and say look at that, its like the mafia, they are happy for your Gran to die rather than admit a balls up, do you serious want to be in that club (*albeit it said in more diplomatic terms) ?0 -
It would be hilarious is we’d just don’t a secret side deal with the Swiss or Norwegians and merrily redirected our imports from there.Chris said:
Outrageous.CarlottaVance said:Not just the UK missing......
https://twitter.com/nickgutteridge/status/1355174594097897480?s=20
0 -
Boris can announce from his winter palace on Mount High Ground that we will not block those base ingredients.FrancisUrquhart said:I seemed to remember Max saying that some base ingredients for the Pfizer vaccine come from the UK...this could get very messy very quickly.
0 -
For those thinking that urgent context plays a role in the level of caution by regulators, while Germany is not having a great time of things right now, there are places in the wider EU with a much worse time of it, whose need is greater. Consequences of not granting for over 65s in those places is presumably greater.NickPalmer said:
Interesting - they've taken a less cautioys view than the German authority.Floater said:0 -
Honestly, I'm genuinely quite shocked that they've gone down the export ban route. What pharmaceutical company will want to operate under these conditions in the future?
This is the kind of stuff I expect from China, Russia, India or Trump's USA. They aren't in great company.6 -
Any nonsense from the EU has come too late to derail the mid-February target. I'm quite sure that the NHS will press ahead with the Pfizer jabs - I've no idea if we have enough already onshore for all the boosters but regardless one shot is still going to be miles better than giving people nothing.FrancisUrquhart said:
I presume from next week they won't be giving anybody Pfizer just to be on the safe side. Not great for getting the numbers up to 500k / day and hitting the mid Feb target.Time_to_Leave said:The key question is whether there are enough second Pfizer doses already in the U.K. to match up with what’s been injected or another source that can compensate (e.g. US sites). If so, then presumably our Government can sit back, say nothing, and let the EU have a mardy.
Besides, it is nearly February already. My husband (who is shielding) has just got his appointment through for February 3rd. Best news in months.8 -
No wonder the EU were happy to get into bed with China, despite them being responsible for us all being locked in our houses and trashing the Western economies...MaxPB said:Honestly, I'm genuinely quite shocked that they've gone down the export ban route. What pharmaceutical company will want to operate under these conditions in the future?
This is the kind of stuff I expect from China, Russia, India or Trump's USA. They aren't in great company.0 -
It's almost like there isn't a conspiracy by AZ and the UK against the EU, but that vaccine developers - who though regretting the delays are probably feeling hard done by after an incredible year of progress - are all experiencing problems given the process and how many need their supplies urgently.Floater said:
But like online trolls, the EU prefers the conspiracy angle.1 -
Should they approve it, I wonder if the Americans would be willing to trade AZ for Pfizer so we can do the second jabs with like for like?Time_to_Leave said:The key question is whether there are enough second Pfizer doses already in the U.K. to match up with what’s been injected or another source that can compensate (e.g. US sites). If so, then presumably our Government can sit back, say nothing, and let the EU have a mardy.
0 -
Is it really that straightforward? They need chemicals made here to produce it? They can’t be that stupid..:. can they?MaxPB said:
If they actually do this the the government has no choice but to take it up with Pfizer and ask to which site they should ask the exports to be redirected to ensure timely delivery of UK and other non-EU countries vaccine supplies.FrancisUrquhart said:I seemed to remember Max saying that some base ingredients for the Pfizer vaccine come from the UK...this could get very messy very quickly.
1 -
If CCHQ had been asked to write the script, they could not have come up with something more perfect.FrancisUrquhart said:The thing is all this behaviour by the EU is giving Boris so much political cover over a) not hitting vaccine target and b) issues with Brexit.
He can just point now and say look at that, its like the mafia, they are happy for your Gran to die rather than admit a balls up, do you serious want to be in that club (*albeit it said in more diplomatic terms) ?
(Unfortunately for those of us who would like to be rid of Boris).0 -
I maintain the IM Bill move was an unnecessarily risky bluff and should not have been done, but the idea the EU would not react in selfish, self defeating fashion has certainly been debunked.FrancisUrquhart said:Now all that moaning about one clause in the Internal Market Bill, that if the EU starting being twats we could do something about it and we were all told that it is totally illegal in international law and the EU would never behave like that.
0 -
Surely the EU are desperate for supplies coming from the UK more than the UK is desperate for supplies coming from the EU?MaxPB said:
If they actually do this the the government has no choice but to take it up with Pfizer and ask to which site they should ask the exports to be redirected to ensure timely delivery of UK and other non-EU countries vaccine supplies.FrancisUrquhart said:I seemed to remember Max saying that some base ingredients for the Pfizer vaccine come from the UK...this could get very messy very quickly.
If the UK reciprocated by saying the UK's AZN facilities can't export to the EU in the future until UK and Covax contracts are honoured then how would that help the EU?
All seems like madness because they can't accept the screwed up.0 -
Who would have thought Trump has been succeeded by the EU and UVDLCarlottaVance said:0 -
So they’re letting Israel off. UK, USA, UAE and a few small Asian countries though, they are screwed.CarlottaVance said:Not just the UK missing......
https://twitter.com/nickgutteridge/status/1355174594097897480?s=20
Eagerly awaiting Joe Biden’s response...1 -
It is my hope that he does. He should announceMarqueeMark said:
Boris can announce from his winter palace on Mount High Ground that we will not block those base ingredients.FrancisUrquhart said:I seemed to remember Max saying that some base ingredients for the Pfizer vaccine come from the UK...this could get very messy very quickly.
- No plans to block export of vaccine
- No plans to block export of materials for production of vaccine.
1 -
Predicting Boris will mess things up is not, in general terms, unreasonable, given the views of many on his record. Not altering position if he does not end up doing so is a different matter.TrèsDifficile said:I remember fondly the sincerity with which Boris haters predicted he'd fuck up vaccine procurement and then delivery.
0
