In one week Boris Johnson has done more for the cause of Irish reunificaiton than Jeremy Corbyn, John McDonnell and the IRA managed in 40 years. He should get his own mural!
Completern Irish voters vote for a united Ireland
And that, of course, is why the DUP is so keen on it!
Er,
Soft or no border with RoI and a lot of congruence with EU: check.
Hardish border with GB: check.
Sounds a lot like a not very baby but actially quite grown-up step towards reunification?
Yes, I was being ironic! Varadker has layed an absolute d, crucially, in the former Conservative and Unionist Party.
Nope, a hard border was the best chance for Irish unity, Boris has avoided that and Northern Ireland will still stay in the same Customs area as GB
No. A hard border might have reignited the Troubles although such an idea is moot as no PM could have overseen one.
Meanwhile to align NI and the RoI while detaching them, together, regulatorily from the mainland is encouraging unification.
I am not hugely surprised that you can't see this but I am happy to keep pointing it out to you.
NI and the RoI are already aligned in terms of a ity it has now
The it.
Tntrim is a great place and staunchly loyalist
Againing.
The Nationalists want a formal political unity on the island of area.
Finally you are beginning to get it. Yes. They want a formal polieen distanced from the mainland. It is a step towards that formal political unity.
The biggest step towards formal political Irish unity would have been a hard border in Ireland, this deal avoids that.
If there was a hard border most Irish counties would vote to leave ly leave the UK
You are wrong. You are getting distracted by a hard border. That was never going to happen. What we have today however is a formal arrangement to separate the island of Ireland from GB.
No, a hard border would have happened if we went to No Deal, at least from the Irish side.
What we have today is a formal arrangement to keep Northern Ireland in the UK and UK customs area while avoiding a hard border with the Republic of Ireland
Yes, I was being ironic! Varadker has layed an absolute d, crucially, in the former Conservative and Unionist Party.
Nope, a hard border was the best chance for Irish unity, Boris has avoided that and Northern Ireland will still stay in the same Customs area as GB
No. A hard border might have reignited the Troubles although such an idea is moot as no PM could have overseen one.
Meanwhile to align NI and the RoI while detaching them, together, regulatorily from the mainland is encouraging unification.
I am not hugely surprised that you can't see this but I am happy to keep pointing it out to you.
NI and the RoI are already aligned in terms of a ity it has now
The it.
Tntrim is a great place and staunchly loyalist
Againing.
The Nationalists want a formal political unity on the island of Ireland not a continuation of the de facto economic unity Ireland already largely has and which the Deal maintains while keeping Northern Ireland part of the UK and in the UK customs area.
Finally you are beginning to get it. Yes. They want a formal political unity. But they don't expect it tomorrow morning. The deal creates a difference between Great Britain on the one hand and the island of Ireland on the other.
In other words something has changed. Previously Great Britain and Northern Ireland were wholly aligned. That is no longer the case. The island of Ireland has been distanced from the mainland. It is a step towards that formal political unity.
That's not true though. Northern Ireland has always been politically separate. It wasn't aligned with GB under Stormont, nor under Direct Rule, and it isn't now.
The separation will be more noted and enshrined in treaty.
The DUP have been happy about being treated differently when it suited their purposes
This, so much. It's why their vaunted principles are not as grand as they pretend.
The indies I presume are Mann, woodcock and elphicke? He has a chance with Austin, Lewis, lloyd, field and with norman lamb
Lloyd counts as an Indy - Austin, Field and Lloyd are the three who have voted for it each time (though I don't think all were Indy at MV1), so if Mann is there as Indy is it predicting 1 less of those three? Elphicke has the whip back.
There's always Williamson!
Mann is still officially a Labour MP. Elphicke has again lost the Tory Whip since being charged.
Her constituency voted Remain anyway, 2/3 of MPs have Leave voting seats
You have said before a Tory majority would be needed to pass a deal - do you still think that is the case, or do you think it will pass, and if so how many Lab votes will it take?
It would take 20 to 30 Labour MPs which is possible if the alternative is No Deal but not if the alternative is extension.
In the unlikely event the EU agreed further extension and France does not veto then of course we are into all out war from next week with the diehard Remainers with Boris sabotaging extension at every turn with full support from Tories and Leavers
Didn’t you declare war on the diehard remainers three or four times this year already?
We have not reached October 31st yet, only if we are still in the EU then does all out war really begin
You are in serious danger of having a mental breakdown. Calm down
Those wanting to respect the Leave vote have had 7 months of biting their tongues, they will not tolerate their vote being denied again
Sadly, you have recently become far too aggresive and you are better than that. You have an amazing insight into polling and politics and are a valued poster but try and get some balance and even understanding of other peoples views
I have had enough doors slammed in my face from angry Leave voters over the last few months furious we are still in the EU 7 months after we were supposed to Leave after Leave won the referendum, to know that further extension could turn very ugly indeed regardless of my personal views.
So we have Farage now celebrating Benn Act, Starmer claiming it definitely worse deal, even though he won't have seen the text yet and Swinson of course claiming the only deal is to stay in the EU.
The HoC will say no and its going to be more silly buggering around isn't it.
No it wil be No Deal then as the EU have now refused further extension
Source?
HYUFD is not accurate.
Junckers, the Belgium PM and Macron have all said no prolongation to the deal on the 31st October but as with anything EU it is not yet definitive
BigG, why do you always write "Junckers" instead of "Juncker"? His name is the latter. I've just noticed you always do it
Maybe he's a WW2 aircraft aficionado
We've probably all heard this one, but it's a good'un.
"In 1942," he says, "the situation was really tough. The Germans had a very strong air force. I remember, " he continues, "one day I was protecting the bombers and suddenly, out of the clouds, these fokkers appeared.
(At this point, several of the children giggle.)
I looked up, and right above me was one of them. I aimed at him and shot him down. They were swarming. I immediately realized that there was another fokker behind me."
At this instant the girls in the auditorium start to giggle and boys start to laugh. The teacher stands up and says, "I think I should point out that 'Fokker' was the name of the German-Dutch aircraft company"
"That's true," says the pilot, "but these fokkers were flying Messerschmidts."
And as for Messerschmifdts - here's the Miss Shilling solution for those who don't know Zephyr's allusion [edit]:
Unforgiveable for any Labour MP to support a Deal put forward by such a vile monster as Johnson. They know how evil he is - and have no more excuse than the Tory MPs who propelled him to the Leadership.
The separation will be more noted and enshrined in treaty.
But as long as it is with the consent of the people is that really a problem. I don't believe the DUP is close to representing a majority of the people in NI so it seems to me that this is a deal that is in line with majority opinion and the fact remains that it is only with consent that there can be any closer moves towards reunification
Yes that is true. It is just the fact that it is the Conservative and Unionist Party proposing it, whereas previously they actually passed a law against precisely that, which is grounds for gobsmackedness.
So we have Farage now celebrating Benn Act, Starmer claiming it definitely worse deal, even though he won't have seen the text yet and Swinson of course claiming the only deal is to stay in the EU.
The HoC will say no and its going to be more silly buggering around isn't it.
No it wil be No Deal then as the EU have now refused further extension
Source?
HYUFD is not accurate.
Junckers, the Belgium PM and Macron have all said no prolongation to the deal on the 31st October but as with anything EU it is not yet definitive
BigG, why do you always write "Junckers" instead of "Juncker"? His name is the latter. I've just noticed you always do it
Maybe he's a WW2 aircraft aficionado
We've probably all heard this one, but it's a good'un.
"In 1942," he says, "the situation was really tough. The Germans had a very strong air force. I remember, " he continues, "one day I was protecting the bombers and suddenly, out of the clouds, these fokkers appeared.
(At this point, several of the children giggle.)
I looked up, and right above me was one of them. I aimed at him and shot him down. They were swarming. I immediately realized that there was another fokker behind me."
At this instant the girls in the auditorium start to giggle and boys start to laugh. The teacher stands up and says, "I think I should point out that 'Fokker' was the name of the German-Dutch aircraft company"
"That's true," says the pilot, "but these fokkers were flying Messerschmidts."
And as for Messerschmifdts - here's the Miss Shilling solution for those who don't know:
So we have Farage now celebrating Benn Act, Starmer claiming it definitely worse deal, even though he won't have seen the text yet and Swinson of course claiming the only deal is to stay in the EU.
The HoC will say no and its going to be more silly buggering around isn't it.
No it wil be No Deal then as the EU have now refused further extension
Source?
HYUFD is not accurate.
Junckers, the Belgium PM and Macron have all said no prolongation to the deal on the 31st October but as with anything EU it is not yet definitive
BigG, why do you always write "Junckers" instead of "Juncker"? His name is the latter. I've just noticed you always do it
Maybe he's a WW2 aircraft aficionado
We've probably all heard this one, but it's a good'un.
"In 1942," he says, "the situation was really tough. The Germans had a very strong air force. I remember, " he continues, "one day I was protecting the bombers and suddenly, out of the clouds, these fokkers appeared.
(At this point, several of the children giggle.)
I looked up, and right above me was one of them. I aimed at him and shot him down. They were swarming. I immediately realized that there was another fokker behind me."
At this instant the girls in the auditorium start to giggle and boys start to laugh. The teacher stands up and says, "I think I should point out that 'Fokker' was the name of the German-Dutch aircraft company"
"That's true," says the pilot, "but these fokkers were flying Messerschmidts."
And as for Messerschmifdts - here's the Miss Shilling solution for those who don't know Zephyr's allusion [edit]:
So we have Farage now celebrating Benn Act, Starmer claiming it definitely worse deal, even though he won't have seen the text yet and Swinson of course claiming the only deal is to stay in the EU.
The HoC will say no and its going to be more silly buggering around isn't it.
No it wil be No Deal then as the EU have now refused further extension
Source?
HYUFD is not accurate.
Junckers, the Belgium PM and Macron have all said no prolongation to the deal on the 31st October but as with anything EU it is not yet definitive
BigG, why do you always write "Junckers" instead of "Juncker"? His name is the latter. I've just noticed you always do it
Maybe he's a WW2 aircraft aficionado
We've probably all heard this one, but it's a good'un.
"In 1942," he says, "the situation was really tough. The Germans had a very strong air force. I remember, " he continues, "one day I was protecting the bombers and suddenly, out of the clouds, these fokkers appeared.
(At this point, several of the children giggle.)
I looked up, and right above me was one of them. I aimed at him and shot him down. They were swarming. I immediately realized that there was another fokker behind me."
At this instant the girls in the auditorium start to giggle and boys start to laugh. The teacher stands up and says, "I think I should point out that 'Fokker' was the name of the German-Dutch aircraft company"
"That's true," says the pilot, "but these fokkers were flying Messerschmidts."
And as for Messerschmifdts - here's the Miss Shilling solution for those who don't know:
Unforgiveable for any Labour MP to support a Deal put forward by such a vile monster as Johnson. They know how evil he is - and have no more excuse than the Tory MPs who propelled him to the Leadership.
Yes, I was being ironic! Varadker has layed an absolute d, crucially, in the former Conservative and Unionist Party.
Nope, a hard border was the best chance for Irish unity, Boris has avoided that and Northern Ireland will still stay in the same Customs area as GB
No. A hard border might have reignited the Troubles although such an idea is moot as no PM could have overseen one.
Meanwhile to align NI and the RoI while detaching them, together, regulatorily from the mainland is encouraging unification.
I am not hugely surprised that you can't see this but I am happy to keep pointing it out to you.
NI and the RoI are already aligned in terms of a ity it has now
The it.
Tntrim is a great place and staunchly loyalist
Againing.
The Nationalists want a formal political unity on the island of Ireland not a continuation of the de facto economic unity Ireland already largely has and which the Deal maintains while keeping Northern Ireland part of the UK and in the UK customs area.
Finally you are beginning to get it. Yes. They want a formal political unity. But they don't expect it tomorrow morning. The deal creates a difference between Great Britain on the one hand and the island ofity.
That's not true though. Northern Ireland has always been politically separate. It wasn't aligned with GB under Stormont, nor under Direct Rule, and it isn't now.
The separation will be more noted and enshrined in treaty.
The DUP have been happy about being treated differently when it suited their purposes, they should have been looking longer term and aimed af full integration with GB.
Meanwhile the RoI is no longer the backward craphole dominated by the Catholic church it once was and the memories of WW2 and needs of the Cold War have gone so reducing goodwill toward NI.
The underlying truth, which I'm not sure the DUP have ever understood, is that English people don't look upon NI as being part of the same country in the way they do Scotland and Wales let alone the different parts of England.
Which is in many ways a shame as it is very much like England and the people there are beyond friendly, most of them, and very aware of the absurdity of their situation.
Unforgiveable for any Labour MP to support a Deal put forward by such a vile monster as Johnson. They know how evil he is - and have no more excuse than the Tory MPs who propelled him to the Leadership.
Unforgivable for any Tory MP to join a vile monster like Corbyn and oppose this Brexit Deal.
They know how evil he is - and have no more excuse than the Labour MPs who nominated him for the Leadership
Remainers and Faragists are really trying to spin things hard but I don't see any of their arguments really having punch. When I was arguing for May's deal, it was hard to defend the lack of consent in the backstop. And while I want the UK in the Customs Union, I could see how the inability to sign our own trade deals was powerful to Leavers.
Now though, there is not much the opponents have. They are trying to push this "carving up the UK" line but it doesn't stick. NI has always been constitutionally in the UK but a more mixed status pratically: British but with the right to Irish passports, represented at Westminster but with her own law, representative democracy but with extra double majority requirements for Irish nationalists. This deal continues that grand tradition: under UK law but with regulatory exceptions for agrifood and industrial goods, checks on goods but not personal possessions, part of UK trade deals but with access to the single market. There is no sizable shift, even while Remainers try to play it up, because it is the only line they have.
Unforgiveable for any Labour MP to support a Deal put forward by such a vile monster as Johnson. They know how evil he is - and have no more excuse than the Tory MPs who propelled him to the Leadership.
Vile monster? The hyperbole does you no favours.
Plus it is about the deal not the man. And whether it is an acceptable deal for Labour to vote for it cannot be an evil deal if the EU signed up to it. And if the concern is what he might do after a deal, well, that's just saying what might he do if he wins an election, which plenty of people think could happen regardless so it makes no difference.
So we have Farage now celebrating Benn Act, Starmer claiming it definitely worse deal, even though he won't have seen the text yet and Swinson of course claiming the only deal is to stay in the EU.
The HoC will say no and its going to be more silly buggering around isn't it.
No it wil be No Deal then as the EU have now refused further extension
Source?
HYUFD is not accurate.
Junckers, the Belgium PM and Macron have all said no prolongation to the deal on the 31st October but as with anything EU it is not yet definitive
BigG, why do you always write "Junckers" instead of "Juncker"? His name is the latter. I've just noticed you always do it
Maybe he's a WW2 aircraft aficionado
We've probably all heard this one, but it's a good'un.
"In 1942," he says, "the situation was really tough. The Germans had a very strong air force. I remember, " he continues, "one day I was protecting the bombers and suddenly, out of the clouds, these fokkers appeared.
(At this point, several of the children giggle.)
I looked up, and right above me was one of them. I aimed at him and shot him down. They were swarming. I immediately realized that there was another fokker behind me."
At this instant the girls in the auditorium start to giggle and boys start to laugh. The teacher stands up and says, "I think I should point out that 'Fokker' was the name of the German-Dutch aircraft company"
"That's true," says the pilot, "but these fokkers were flying Messerschmidts."
And as for Messerschmifdts - here's the Miss Shilling solution for those who don't know Zephyr's allusion [edit]:
So we have Farage now celebrating Benn Act, Starmer claiming it definitely worse deal, even though he won't have seen the text yet and Swinson of course claiming the only deal is to stay in the EU.
The HoC will say no and its going to be more silly buggering around isn't it.
No it wil be No Deal then as the EU have now refused further extension
Source?
HYUFD is not accurate.
Junckers, the Belgium PM and Macron have all said no prolongation to the deal on the 31st October but as with anything EU it is not yet definitive
BigG, why do you always write "Junckers" instead of "Juncker"? His name is the latter. I've just noticed you always do it
Maybe he's a WW2 aircraft aficionado
We've probably all heard this one, but it's a good'un.
"In 1942," he says, "the situation was really tough. The Germans had a very strong air force. I remember, " he continues, "one day I was protecting the bombers and suddenly, out of the clouds, these fokkers appeared.
(At this point, several of the children giggle.)
I looked up, and right above me was one of them. I aimed at him and shot him down. They were swarming. I immediately realized that there was another fokker behind me."
At this instant the girls in the auditorium start to giggle and boys start to laugh. The teacher stands up and says, "I think I should point out that 'Fokker' was the name of the German-Dutch aircraft company"
"That's true," says the pilot, "but these fokkers were flying Messerschmidts."
And as for Messerschmifdts - here's the Miss Shilling solution for those who don't know:
Unforgiveable for any Labour MP to support a Deal put forward by such a vile monster as Johnson. They know how evil he is - and have no more excuse than the Tory MPs who propelled him to the Leadership.
Unforgivable for any Tory MP to join a vile monster like Corbyn and oppose this Brexit Deal.
They know how evil he is - and have no more excuse than the Labour MPs who nominated him for the Leadership
And I will say the same to you. Such hyperbole is unnecessary. Corbyn isn't a vile monster, and neither is Johnson.
Unforgiveable for any Labour MP to support a Deal put forward by such a vile monster as Johnson. They know how evil he is - and have no more excuse than the Tory MPs who propelled him to the Leadership.
Vile monster? The hyperbole does you no favours.
Plus it is about the deal not the man. And whether it is an acceptable deal for Labour to vote for it cannot be an evil deal if the EU signed up to it. And if the concern is what he might do after a deal, well, that's just saying what might he do if he wins an election, which plenty of people think could happen regardless so it makes no difference.
Exactly. Saying you are fine with the WA but have an issue with the PD is basivally saying they don't have confidence in their own electotal platform.
I expect the transition period to last at least two years . Any trade deal won’t happen quickly with the EU and then you normally have a delay before implementation.
And trade deals with other countries if they happen the same . At the end of December 2020 I expect the message will be it’s not worth making business go to WTO and then have to go through two sets of changes .
Because all this will be coming after an election which the Tories will likely win which means they don’t have to worry about Farage causing too much damage and the public by then could care less .
The symbolism of Brexit happening is a big thing , after that the public will tune out.
Unforgiveable for any Labour MP to support a Deal put forward by such a vile monster as Johnson. They know how evil he is - and have no more excuse than the Tory MPs who propelled him to the Leadership.
Unforgivable for any Tory MP to join a vile monster like Corbyn and oppose this Brexit Deal.
They know how evil he is - and have no more excuse than the Labour MPs who nominated him for the Leadership
And I will say the same to you. Such hyperbole is unnecessary. Corbyn isn't a vile monster, and neither is Johnson.
Corbyn commemorated the killers of innocent Jewish athletes.
So we have Farage now celebrating Benn Act, Starmer claiming it definitely worse deal, even though he won't have seen the text yet and Swinson of course claiming the only deal is to stay in the EU.
The HoC will say no and its going to be more silly buggering around isn't it.
No it wil be No Deal then as the EU have now refused further extension
Source?
HYUFD is not accurate.
Junckers, the Belgium PM and Macron have all said no prolongation to the deal on the 31st October but as with anything EU it is not yet definitive
BigG, why do you always write "Junckers" instead of "Juncker"? His name is the latter. I've just noticed you always do it
Maybe he's a WW2 aircraft aficionado
We've probably all heard this one, but it's a good'un.
"In 1942," he says, "the situation was really tough. The Germans had a very strong air force. I remember, " he continues, "one day I was protecting the bombers and suddenly, out of the clouds, these fokkers appeared.
(At this point, several of the children giggle.)
I looked up, and right above me was one of them. I aimed at him and shot him down. They were swarming. I immediately realized that there was another fokker behind me."
At this instant the girls in the auditorium start to giggle and boys start to laugh. The teacher stands up and says, "I think I should point out that 'Fokker' was the name of the German-Dutch aircraft company"
"That's true," says the pilot, "but these fokkers were flying Messerschmidts."
And as for Messerschmifdts - here's the Miss Shilling solution for those who don't know:
Surely - temporarily didn't lose the war. But none the less important.
An invasion of England hinged on the air war that summer? And it was touch and go?
Hitler had little chance of a successful invasion of the UK with the RN dominating the channel. Reverse DDay and much less successful. His best bet was to bomb the airfields instead of London and try and get air superiority. Even then a tough ask.
Unforgiveable for any Labour MP to support a Deal put forward by such a vile monster as Johnson. They know how evil he is - and have no more excuse than the Tory MPs who propelled him to the Leadership.
Unforgivable for any Tory MP to join a vile monster like Corbyn and oppose this Brexit Deal.
They know how evil he is - and have no more excuse than the Labour MPs who nominated him for the Leadership
And I will say the same to you. Such hyperbole is unnecessary. Corbyn isn't a vile monster, and neither is Johnson.
Corbyn commemorated the killers of innocent Jewish athletes.
So we have Farage now celebrating Benn Act, Starmer claiming it definitely worse deal, even though he won't have seen the text yet and Swinson of course claiming the only deal is to stay in the EU.
The HoC will say no and its going to be more silly buggering around isn't it.
No it wil be No Deal then as the EU have now refused further extension
Source?
HYUFD is not accurate.
Junckers, the Belgium PM and Macron have all said no prolongation to the deal on the 31st October but as with anything EU it is not yet definitive
BigG, why do you always write "Junckers" instead of "Juncker"? His name is the latter. I've just noticed you always do it
Maybe he's a WW2 aircraft aficionado
We've probably all heard this one, but it's a good'un.
"In 1942," he says, "the situation was really tough. The Germans had a very strong air force. I remember, " he continues, "one day I was protecting the bombers and suddenly, out of the clouds, these fokkers appeared.
(At this point, several of the children giggle.)
I looked up, and right above me was one of them. I aimed at him and shot him down. They were swarming. I immediately realized that there was another fokker behind me."
At this instant the girls in the auditorium start to giggle and boys start to laugh. The teacher stands up and says, "I think I should point out that 'Fokker' was the name of the German-Dutch aircraft company"
"That's true," says the pilot, "but these fokkers were flying Messerschmidts."
And as for Messerschmifdts - here's the Miss Shilling solution for those who don't know:
Surely - temporarily didn't lose the war. But none the less important.
An invasion of England hinged on the air war that summer? And it was touch and go?
Oh yes, it helped stop that. But IIRC they'd moved onto more sophisticated carburettor systems pretty soen after that. Miss S's O was a temporary - but effecti ve and above all prompt - expedient.
So we have Farage now celebrating Benn Act, Starmer claiming it definitely worse deal, even though he won't have seen the text yet and Swinson of course claiming the only deal is to stay in the EU.
The HoC will say no and its going to be more silly buggering around isn't it.
No it wil be No Deal then as the EU have now refused further extension
Source?
HYUFD is not accurate.
Junckers, the Belgium PM and Macron have all said no prolongation to the deal on the 31st October but as with anything EU it is not yet definitive
BigG, why do you always write "Junckers" instead of "Juncker"? His name is the latter. I've just noticed you always do it
Maybe he's a WW2 aircraft aficionado
We've probably all heard this one, but it's a good'un.
"In 1942," he says, "the situation was really tough. The Germans had a very strong air force. I remember, " he continues, "one day I was protecting the bombers and suddenly, out of the clouds, these fokkers appeared.
(At this point, several of the children giggle.)
I looked up, and right above me was one of them. I aimed at him and shot him down. They were swarming. I immediately realized that there was another fokker behind me."
At this instant the girls in the auditorium start to giggle and boys start to laugh. The teacher stands up and says, "I think I should point out that 'Fokker' was the name of the German-Dutch aircraft company"
"That's true," says the pilot, "but these fokkers were flying Messerschmidts."
And as for Messerschmifdts - here's the Miss Shilling solution for those who don't know Zephyr's allusion [edit]:
Maybe Warren has a secret plan to win the election. Maybe, if she wraps up the nomination, she’ll modify Medicare for All and repackage herself as a sensible progressive who can unite the country. But Tuesday’s performance suggests otherwise. It suggests that the senator we’ve seen in recent encounters—dismissive of religious conservatives, defiant about making false statements, only vaguely apologetic for having claimed Native American ancestry—is the real Elizabeth Warren. Tenacity isn’t always a virtue
So we have Farage now celebrating Benn Act, Starmer claiming it definitely worse deal, even though he won't have seen the text yet and Swinson of course claiming the only deal is to stay in the EU.
The HoC will say no and its going to be more silly buggering around isn't it.
No it wil be No Deal then as the EU have now refused further extension
Source?
HYUFD is not accurate.
Junckers, the Belgium PM and Macron have all said no prolongation to the deal on the 31st October but as with anything EU it is not yet definitive
BigG, why do you always write "Junckers" instead of "Juncker"? His name is the latter. I've just noticed you always do it
Maybe he's a WW2 aircraft aficionado
We've probably all heard this one, but it's a good'un.
"In 1942," he says, "the situation was really tough. The Germans had a very strong air force. I remember, " he continues, "one day I was protecting the bombers and suddenly, out of the clouds, these fokkers appeared.
(At this point, several of the children giggle.)
I looked up, and right above me was one of them. I aimed at him and shot him down. They were swarming. I immediately realized that there was another fokker behind me."
At this instant the girls in the auditorium start to giggle and boys start to laugh. The teacher stands up and says, "I think I should point out that 'Fokker' was the name of the German-Dutch aircraft company"
"That's true," says the pilot, "but these fokkers were flying Messerschmidts."
While it's true Fokker built aircraft for Germany in WW1, by the time WW2 broke out, he had moved to the Netherlands and built aircraft for them, mostly pre-war.
When the history book on the Trump presidency are being written the chapter entitled "Why did mainstream Republicans go along with him for so long" will just be a single word. And that word will be "Judges"
No. A hard border might have reignited the Troubles although such an idea is moot as no PM could have overseen one.
Meanwhile to align NI and the RoI while detaching them, together, regulatorily from the mainland is encouraging unification.
I am not hugely surprised that you can't see this but I am happy to keep pointing it out to you.
NI and the RoI are already aligned in terms of a ity it has now
The it.
Tntrim is a great place and staunchly loyalist
Againing.
The Nationalists want a formal political unity on the island of Ireland not a continuation of the de facto economic unity Ireland already largely has and which the Deal maintains while keeping Northern Ireland part of the UK and in the UK customs area.
Finally you are beginning to get it. Yes. They want a formal political unity. But they don't expect it tomorrow morning. The deal creates a difference between Great Britain on the one hand and the island ofity.
That's not true though. Northern Ireland has always been politically separate. It wasn't aligned with GB under Stormont, nor under Direct Rule, and it isn't now.
The separation will be more noted and enshrined in treaty.
The DUP have been happy about being treated differently when it suited their purposes, they should have been looking longer term and aimed af full integration with GB.
Meanwhile the RoI is no longer the backward craphole dominated by the Catholic church it once was and the memories of WW2 and needs of the Cold War have gone so reducing goodwill toward NI.
The underlying truth, which I'm not sure the DUP have ever understood, is that English people don't look upon NI as being part of the same country in the way they do Scotland and Wales let alone the different parts of England.
Which is in many ways a shame as it is very much like England and the people there are beyond friendly, most of them, and very aware of the absurdity of their situation.
To my mind the three northern counties seem similar to Scotland and the three southern counties are more like SW England.
In one week Boris Johnson has done more for the cause of Irish reunificaiton than Jeremy Corbyn, John McDonnell and the IRA managed in 40 years. He should get his own mural!
Completern Irish voters vote for a united Ireland
And that, of course, is why the DUP is so keen on it!
Er,
Soft or no border with RoI and a lot of congruence with EU: check.
Hardish border with GB: check.
Sounds a lot like a not very baby but actially quite grown-up step towards reunification?
Yes, I was being ironic! Varadker has layed an absolute d, crucially, in the former Conservative and Unionist Party.
Nope, a hard border was the best chance for Irish unity, Boris has avoided that and Northern Ireland will still stay in the same Customs area as GB
No. A hard border might have reignited the Troubles although such an idea is moot as no PM could have overseen one.
Meanwhile to align NI and the RoI while detaching them, together, regulatorily from the mainland is encouraging unification.
I am not hugely surprised that you can't see this but I am happy to keep pointing it out to you.
NI and the RoI are already aligned in terms of a ity it has now
The it.
Tntrim is a great place and staunchly loyalist
Againing.
The Nationalists want a formal political unity on the island of area.
Finally you are beginning to get it. Yes. They want a formal polieen distanced from the mainland. It is a step towards that formal political unity.
The biggest step towards formal political Irish unity would have been a hard border in Ireland, this deal avoids that.
If there was a hard border most Irish counties would vote to leave the UK and for Irish unity with the exception of Antrim which might declare UDI rather than be forced to join the Republic of Ireland agsinst its will but would still likely leave the UK
You are wrong. You are getting distracted by a hard border. That was never going to happen. What we have today however is a formal arrangement to separate the island of Ireland from GB.
Nonsense. UK citizenship. UK representation. UK service regulation. UK tariffs.
For the record, I am hopeful this deal will be passed. I bang on about systems a lot, and it's crucial that people have faith in the democratic system.
The judgement on Boris will be mixed; pleased he carried out the voters mandate; but historians will ask why he vehmently opposed a deal, and then meekly signed up to something that crossed at least as many red lines.
I hope now we can all concentrate on more important things. Like the US elections.
No, a hard border would have happened if we went to No Deal, at least from the Irish side.
What we have today is a formal arrangement to keep Northern Ireland in the UK and UK customs area while avoiding a hard border with the Republic of Ireland
The fact that you need to proclaim that NI is staying in the UK is noteworthy. But NI will also be bound by EU rules whereas the UK won't be. That was Boris' big win. Why you are so happy
And so there has been a formal separation between Great Britain and the island of Ireland.
Something changed and what changed is that NI will align with the EU more closely and Great Britain much less so.
The fact that the deal has been agreed and the backstop junked is the clue you should follow up on.
And the door opens for Chuka in Cities of London and Westminster to ascend to the Commons as its new LD MP and become the Messiah for the Remainers and liberals
So we have Farage now celebrating Benn Act, Starmer claiming it definitely worse deal, even though he won't have seen the text yet and Swinson of course claiming the only deal is to stay in the EU.
The HoC will say no and its going to be more silly buggering around isn't it.
No it wil be No Deal then as the EU have now refused further extension
Source?
HYUFD is not accurate.
Junckers, the Belgium PM and Macron have all said no prolongation to the deal on the 31st October but as with anything EU it is not yet definitive
BigG, why do you always write "Junckers" instead of "Juncker"? His name is the latter. I've just noticed you always do it
Maybe he's a WW2 aircraft aficionado
We've probably all heard this one, but it's a good'un.
"In 1942," he says, "the situation was really tough. The Germans had a very strong air force. I remember, " he continues, "one day I was protecting the bombers and suddenly, out of the clouds, these fokkers appeared.
(At this point, several of the children giggle.)
I looked up, and right above me was one of them. I aimed at him and shot him down. They were swarming. I immediately realized that there was another fokker behind me."
At this instant the girls in the auditorium start to giggle and boys start to laugh. The teacher stands up and says, "I think I should point out that 'Fokker' was the name of the German-Dutch aircraft company"
"That's true," says the pilot, "but these fokkers were flying Messerschmidts."
While it's true Fokker built aircraft for Germany in WW1, by the time WW2 broke out, he had moved to the Netherlands and built aircraft for them, mostly pre-war.
That's unusually pedantic of you. What have you done with the real Sunil?
Maybe Warren has a secret plan to win the election. Maybe, if she wraps up the nomination, she’ll modify Medicare for All and repackage herself as a sensible progressive who can unite the country. But Tuesday’s performance suggests otherwise. It suggests that the senator we’ve seen in recent encounters—dismissive of religious conservatives, defiant about making false statements, only vaguely apologetic for having claimed Native American ancestry—is the real Elizabeth Warren. Tenacity isn’t always a virtue
For the record, I am hopeful this deal will be passed. I bang on about systems a lot, and it's crucial that people have faith in the democratic system.
The judgement on Boris will be mixed; pleased he carried out the voters mandate; but historians will ask why he vehmently opposed a deal, and then meekly signed up to something that crossed at least as many red lines.
I hope now we can all concentrate on more important things. Like the US elections.
Well, we should have a clearer idea by Staurday evening, I guess.
For the record, I am hopeful this deal will be passed. I bang on about systems a lot, and it's crucial that people have faith in the democratic system.
The judgement on Boris will be mixed; pleased he carried out the voters mandate; but historians will ask why he vehmently opposed a deal, and then meekly signed up to something that crossed at least as many red lines.
I hope now we can all concentrate on more important things. Like the US elections.
Maybe Warren has a secret plan to win the election. Maybe, if she wraps up the nomination, she’ll modify Medicare for All and repackage herself as a sensible progressive who can unite the country. But Tuesday’s performance suggests otherwise. It suggests that the senator we’ve seen in recent encounters—dismissive of religious conservatives, defiant about making false statements, only vaguely apologetic for having claimed Native American ancestry—is the real Elizabeth Warren. Tenacity isn’t always a virtue
I expect the transition period to last at least two years . Any trade deal won’t happen quickly with the EU and then you normally have a delay before implementation.
And trade deals with other countries if they happen the same . At the end of December 2020 I expect the message will be it’s not worth making business go to WTO and then have to go through two sets of changes .
Because all this will be coming after an election which the Tories will likely win which means they don’t have to worry about Farage causing too much damage and the public by then could care less .
The symbolism of Brexit happening is a big thing , after that the public will tune out.
On the subject of US elections, there were two US economic datapoints out today that should strike fear into the hearts of Trump and his supporters.
Industrial Production in September fell 0.4% from August. Worse, it was down year-over-year for the first time.
Consumer spending also went into reverse in September, falling from August although still up on a year ago. (Note: industrial production worse than consumer spending suggests that the US trade deficit is widening, not narrowing.)
There's a real slow moving car crash happening here. House prices across most of the US seem to be coming down (albeit gently) right now. If that worsens, it will gum up consumer spending. Trump now wants start the money printing presses. It may work, but the truth is that economies need the occasional recession to rectify misallocated capital.
So we have Farage now celebrating Benn Act, Starmer claiming it definitely worse deal, even though he won't have seen the text yet and Swinson of course claiming the only deal is to stay in the EU.
The HoC will say no and its going to be more silly buggering around isn't it.
No it wil be No Deal then as the EU have now refused further extension
Source?
HYUFD is not accurate.
Junckers, the Belgium PM and Macron have all said no prolongation to the deal on the 31st October but as with anything EU it is not yet definitive
BigG, why do you always write "Junckers" instead of "Juncker"? His name is the latter. I've just noticed you always do it
Maybe he's a WW2 aircraft aficionado
We've probably all heard this one, but it's a good'un.
"In 1942," he says, "the situation was really tough. The Germans had a very strong air force. I remember, " he continues, "one day I was protecting the bombers and suddenly, out of the clouds, these fokkers appeared.
(At this point, several of the children giggle.)
I looked up, and right above me was one of them. I aimed at him and shot him down. They were swarming. I immediately realized that there was another fokker behind me."
At this instant the girls in the auditorium start to giggle and boys start to laugh. The teacher stands up and says, "I think I should point out that 'Fokker' was the name of the German-Dutch aircraft company"
"That's true," says the pilot, "but these fokkers were flying Messerschmidts."
While it's true Fokker built aircraft for Germany in WW1, by the time WW2 broke out, he had moved to the Netherlands and built aircraft for them, mostly pre-war.
That's unusually pedantic of you. What have you done with the real Sunil?
Then of course, there was the Focke-Wulf company, wot built the Fw-190, arguably a better all-rounder than the Messerschmitt 109
Maybe Warren has a secret plan to win the election. Maybe, if she wraps up the nomination, she’ll modify Medicare for All and repackage herself as a sensible progressive who can unite the country. But Tuesday’s performance suggests otherwise. It suggests that the senator we’ve seen in recent encounters—dismissive of religious conservatives, defiant about making false statements, only vaguely apologetic for having claimed Native American ancestry—is the real Elizabeth Warren. Tenacity isn’t always a virtue
Remainers and Faragists are really trying to spin things hard but I don't see any of their arguments really having punch. When I was arguing for May's deal, it was hard to defend the lack of consent in the backstop. And while I want the UK in the Customs Union, I could see how the inability to sign our own trade deals was powerful to Leavers.
Now though, there is not much the opponents have. They are trying to push this "carving up the UK" line but it doesn't stick. NI has always been constitutionally in the UK but a more mixed status pratically: British but with the right to Irish passports, represented at Westminster but with her own law, representative democracy but with extra double majority requirements for Irish nationalists. This deal continues that grand tradition: under UK law but with regulatory exceptions for agrifood and industrial goods, checks on goods but not personal possessions, part of UK trade deals but with access to the single market. There is no sizable shift, even while Remainers try to play it up, because it is the only line they have.
There will be a border down the Irish Sea. As explained by that arch remainer Nigel Farage today in Brussels.
That is a bold move for the Conservative and Unionist Party.
The Democrats walked out of the meeting, in protest of Trump’s insults. Speaking to reporters afterward, Pelosi said, “I think now we have to pray for his health, because this was a very serious meltdown on the part of the president.”
As the evidence mounts of Trump’s abuses and obstructions, will some Republican senators see the impeachment process as an opportunity to rid themselves of a president that they must be regarding as increasingly dangerous? A few weeks ago, the question would have been asinine. Now it’s, at the very least, not implausible.
The Democrats walked out of the meeting, in protest of Trump’s insults. Speaking to reporters afterward, Pelosi said, “I think now we have to pray for his health, because this was a very serious meltdown on the part of the president.”
As the evidence mounts of Trump’s abuses and obstructions, will some Republican senators see the impeachment process as an opportunity to rid themselves of a president that they must be regarding as increasingly dangerous? A few weeks ago, the question would have been asinine. Now it’s, at the very least, not implausible.
The Republicans said very much the same about Pelosi funnily enough She needs to stop ducking a vote on formalizing impeachment proceedings, until that trump is free to avoid subpoenas etc without sanction
And the door opens for Chuka in Cities of London and Westminster to ascend to the Commons as its new LD MP and become the Messiah for the Remainers and liberals
Chuka will be pissed off. He will have to redo all his election bumph without a green activist in a headlock.....
No, a hard border would have happened if we went to No Deal, at least from the Irish side.
What we have today is a formal arrangement to keep Northern Ireland in the UK and UK customs area while avoiding a hard border with the Republic of Ireland
The fact that you need to proclaim that NI is staying in the UK is noteworthy. But NI will also be bound by EU rules whereas the UK won't be. That was Boris' big win. Why you are so happy
And so there has been a formal separation between Great Britain and the island of Ireland.
Something changed and what changed is that NI will align with the EU more closely and Great Britain much less so.
The fact that the deal has been agreed and the backstop junked is the clue you should follow up on.
And had NI not aligned more closely with the EU and had a hard border with the Republic of Ireland then a majority of Northern Irish voters would likely have voted to Leave the UK completely and join the Republic of Ireland
Remainers and Faragists are really trying to spin things hard but I don't see any of their arguments really having punch. When I was arguing for May's deal, it was hard to defend the lack of consent in the backstop. And while I want the UK in the Customs Union, I could see how the inability to sign our own trade deals was powerful to Leavers.
Now though, there is not much the opponents have. They are trying to push this "carving up the UK" line but it doesn't stick. NI has always been constitutionally in the UK but a more mixed status pratically: British but with the right to Irish passports, represented at Westminster but with her own law, representative democracy but with extra double majority requirements for Irish nationalists. This deal continues that grand tradition: under UK law but with regulatory exceptions for agrifood and industrial goods, checks on goods but not personal possessions, part of UK trade deals but with access to the single market. There is no sizable shift, even while Remainers try to play it up, because it is the only line they have.
There will be a border down the Irish Sea. As explained by that arch remainer Nigel Farage today in Brussels.
That is a bold move for the Conservative and Unionist Party.
What party ???
I don't think I've ever seen that party on any ballot paper I've had.
People concerned about the Unionist aspect should have taken note of that.
Nearly 60 and put on Breakfast... It's almost as though she's upset someone at SKY!
Well that about sums up your attitude to life, it was a job swap between Sarah Jane me and her, for whatever reason the fact that she is nearly 60 is a disgrace to use as any explanation for this change.
But nowhere near as hard as staying in the EU beyond 31st October and the Tories have a 15% lead over Labour in the latest Yougov even with the Brexit Party on 11%
Remainers and Faragists are really trying to spin things hard but I don't see any of their arguments really having punch. When I was arguing for May's deal, it was hard to defend the lack of consent in the backstop. And while I want the UK in the Customs Union, I could see how the inability to sign our own trade deals was powerful to Leavers.
Now though, there is not much the opponents have. They are trying to push this "carving up the UK" line but it doesn't stick. NI has always been constitutionally in the UK but a more mixed status pratically: British but with the right to Irish passports, represented at Westminster but with her own law, representative democracy but with extra double majority requirements for Irish nationalists. This deal continues that grand tradition: under UK law but with regulatory exceptions for agrifood and industrial goods, checks on goods but not personal possessions, part of UK trade deals but with access to the single market. There is no sizable shift, even while Remainers try to play it up, because it is the only line they have.
It's an arrangement that is probably unworkable for Northern Ireland as it stands. Admittedly that was always the case with the Irish backstop. But we have moved from it being the worst case if all else fails to it being the actual policy. It's an arrangement that, unless changed, offers so little to the rest of the UK, we might literally have no deal with the EU in a year's time.
I am struggling to see any benefit to this deal beyond avoiding an immediate chaotic exit.
Oh. And the only NI consent for this Brexit is that absolutely everyone in NI is now opposed.
They opened it changed it to add the line British Prime minister picks up the DUP and throws them under a bus.
Go on, say that’s not true
I’ll say it’s not true.
What they’ve done is taken it back to the deal they put forward as their best case scenario in 2017, before May extracted several important concessions.
And yet the Brexiteers have not looked at it closely enough to see it. Nor do they understand that this means that the EU will no longer be interested in negotiating a free trade deal unless we stay in CAP, CFP, etc because they now have all the leverage they need to walk away, instead of us ending up half in, half out by default.
I bet Barnier can’t believe his luck.
Admittedly, one bright spot is that the European Parliament will probably raise no objections whereas I was always nervous somebody with half a brain would spot what the EU had given away before.
You've hit the nail on the head there. The removal of GB from the backstop and putting NI into a frontstop radically rebalances the FTA negotiations in the EU's favour. Not that Boris cares.
So we have Farage now celebrating Benn Act, Starmer claiming it definitely worse deal, even though he won't have seen the text yet and Swinson of course claiming the only deal is to stay in the EU.
The HoC will say no and its going to be more silly buggering around isn't it.
No it wil be No Deal then as the EU have now refused further extension
Source?
HYUFD is not accurate.
Junckers, the Belgium PM and Macron have all said no prolongation to the deal on the 31st October but as with anything EU it is not yet definitive
BigG, why do you always write "Junckers" instead of "Juncker"? His name is the latter. I've just noticed you always do it
Maybe he's a WW2 aircraft aficionado
We've probably all heard this one, but it's a good'un.
"In 1942," he says, "the situation was really tough. The Germans had a very strong air force. I remember, " he continues, "one day I was protecting the bombers and suddenly, out of the clouds, these fokkers appeared.
(At this point, several of the children giggle.)
I looked up, and right above me was one of them. I aimed at him and shot him down. They were swarming. I immediately realized that there was another fokker behind me."
At this instant the girls in the auditorium start to giggle and boys start to laugh. The teacher stands up and says, "I think I should point out that 'Fokker' was the name of the German-Dutch aircraft company"
"That's true," says the pilot, "but these fokkers were flying Messerschmidts."
And as for Messerschmifdts - here's the Miss Shilling solution for those who don't know:
And the door opens for Chuka in Cities of London and Westminster to ascend to the Commons as its new LD MP and become the Messiah for the Remainers and liberals
Chuka will be pissed off. He will have to redo all his election bumph without a green activist in a headlock.....
I am sure just putting some posters of himself up with a halo and surrounded by angels draped in EU flags would suffice
No, a hard border would have happened if we went to No Deal, at least from the Irish side.
What we have today is a formal arrangement to keep Northern Ireland in the UK and UK customs area while avoiding a hard border with the Republic of Ireland
The fact that you need to proclaim that NI is staying in the UK is noteworthy. But NI will also be bound by EU rules whereas the UK won't be. That was Boris' big win. Why you are so happy
And so there has been a formal separation between Great Britain and the island of Ireland.
Something changed and what changed is that NI will align with the EU more closely and Great Britain much less so.
The fact that the deal has been agreed and the backstop junked is the clue you should follow up on.
And had NI not aligned more closely with the EU and had a hard border with the Republic of Ireland then a majority of Northern Irish voters would likely have voted to Leave the UK completely and join the Republic of Ireland
Yes exactly! Finally! So instead they've got an aligned island of Ireland. It's win win for the nationalists.
Remainers and Faragists are really trying to spin things hard but I don't see any of their arguments really having punch. When I was arguing for May's deal, it was hard to defend the lack of consent in the backstop. And while I want the UK in the Customs Union, I could see how the inability to sign our own trade deals was powerful to Leavers.
Now though, there is not much the opponents have. They are trying to push this "carving up the UK" line but it doesn't stick. NI has always been constitutionally in the UK but a more mixed status pratically: British but with the right to Irish passports, represented at Westminster but with her own law, representative democracy but with extra double majority requirements for Irish nationalists. This deal continues that grand tradition: under UK law but with regulatory exceptions for agrifood and industrial goods, checks on goods but not personal possessions, part of UK trade deals but with access to the single market. There is no sizable shift, even while Remainers try to play it up, because it is the only line they have.
There will be a border down the Irish Sea. As explained by that arch remainer Nigel Farage today in Brussels.
That is a bold move for the Conservative and Unionist Party.
What party ???
I don't think I've ever seen that party on any ballot paper I've had.
People concerned about the Unionist aspect should have taken note of that.
The party that Jacob Rees Mogg is a member of. The same party that outlawed the creation of a border down the Irish Sea.
Remainers and Faragists are really trying to spin things hard but I don't see any of their arguments really having punch. When I was arguing for May's deal, it was hard to defend the lack of consent in the backstop. And while I want the UK in the Customs Union, I could see how the inability to sign our own trade deals was powerful to Leavers.
Now though, there is not much the opponents have. They are trying to push this "carving up the UK" line but it doesn't stick. NI has always been constitutionally in the UK but a more mixed status pratically: British but with the right to Irish passports, represented at Westminster but with her own law, representative democracy but with extra double majority requirements for Irish nationalists. This deal continues that grand tradition: under UK law but with regulatory exceptions for agrifood and industrial goods, checks on goods but not personal possessions, part of UK trade deals but with access to the single market. There is no sizable shift, even while Remainers try to play it up, because it is the only line they have.
It's an arrangement that is probably unworkable for Northern Ireland as it stands. Admittedly that was always the case with the Irish backstop. But we have moved from it being the worst case if all else fails to it being the actual policy. It's an arrangement that, unless changed, offers so little to the rest of the UK, we might literally have no deal with the EU in a year's time.
I am struggling to see any benefit to this deal beyond avoiding an immediate chaotic exit.
It takes GB out of the EU, the single market and customs union, it ends free movement from the EU and lets us do our own trade deals and it avoids a hard border in Ireland
No, a hard border would have happened if we went to No Deal, at least from the Irish side.
What we have today is a formal arrangement to keep Northern Ireland in the UK and UK customs area while avoiding a hard border with the Republic of Ireland
The fact that you need to proclaim that NI is staying in the UK is noteworthy. But NI will also be bound by EU rules whereas the UK won't be. That was Boris' big win. Why you are so happy
And so there has been a formal separation between Great Britain and the island of Ireland.
Something changed and what changed is that NI will align with the EU more closely and Great Britain much less so.
The fact that the deal has been agreed and the backstop junked is the clue you should follow up on.
And had NI not aligned more closely with the EU and had a hard border with the Republic of Ireland then a majority of Northern Irish voters would likely have voted to Leave the UK completely and join the Republic of Ireland
Yes exactly! Finally! So instead they've got an aligned island of Ireland. It's win win for the nationalists.
No as Northern Ireland stays in the UK without a hard border making Irish unity likely, so still the Nationalists aim is defeated
And the door opens for Chuka in Cities of London and Westminster to ascend to the Commons as its new LD MP and become the Messiah for the Remainers and liberals
Chuka will be pissed off. He will have to redo all his election bumph without a green activist in a headlock.....
I am sure just putting some posters of himself up with a halo and surrounded by angels draped in EU flags would suffice
Nearly 60 and put on Breakfast... It's almost as though she's upset someone at SKY!
Well that about sums up your attitude to life, it was a job swap between Sarah Jane me and her, for whatever reason the fact that she is nearly 60 is a disgrace to use as any explanation for this change.
I was joking... And given Kay has made a career of putting her foot in it - including, for example, asking serial killer Steve Wrights girlfriend whether he would still have been a serial killer if they'd had a better sex life - it kind of goes with the territory to have a laugh at Miss Burley's expense.
But of course if I've caused offence, upset or general disagreement to you or anyone else then I withdraw the comment and apologize.
I suspect today's events have ensured the Conservatives will be in Government for the next five years and maybe for the next decade. It's hard to see whatever happens on Saturday how Boris won't win a majority at the next GE which will hypothetically take us to 2025.
I have considerable reservations about his "tsunami of Tory ideas" and suspect his tax cutting lunacy will eventually lead to a mountain of debt and a recession of some severity but the question will be how the Opposition will re-define itself in the early 2020s and the degree to which that transformation will be complete by 2025.
I could imagine environmental themes gaining more attention with time and it may be a more overtly pro-environment (not Green) movement which may be Labour or the LDs or an amalgam will emerge. It may also be the benefits of leaving the EU will look exaggerated with time and while that may not translate into a desire to rejoin, it may instigate a form of buyer's remorse.
All things pass and I suspect in 2025 we could be looking at a very different political environment but I am to be honest quite disheartened this evening. In hindsight I don't think there's anything the anti-Conservative forces could have done once the ComRes poll showed Boris winning a majority. From that point his election as Conservative leader was guaranteed.
Were he facing a more astute and popular Opposition leader I think his obvious limitations would be exposed but he has the ideal opponent in Corbyn who he can verbally wrong-foot with ease.
Johnson also has had, as Blair and Thatcher had in their time, more than his share of luck. That will run out one time and perhaps spectacularly but he is the dominant political figure of the moment.
They opened it changed it to add the line British Prime minister picks up the DUP and throws them under a bus.
Go on, say that’s not true
I’ll say it’s not true.
What they’ve done is taken it back to the deal they put forward as their best case scenario in 2017, before May extracted several important concessions.
And yet the Brexiteers have not looked at it closely enough to see it. Nor do they understand that this means that the EU will no longer be interested in negotiating a free trade deal unless we stay in CAP, CFP, etc because they now have all the leverage they need to walk away, instead of us ending up half in, half out by default.
I bet Barnier can’t believe his luck.
Admittedly, one bright spot is that the European Parliament will probably raise no objections whereas I was always nervous somebody with half a brain would spot what the EU had given away before.
You've hit the nail on the head there. The removal of GB from the backstop and putting NI into a frontstop radically rebalances the FTA negotiations in the EU's favour. Not that Boris cares.
Remainers and Faragists are really trying to spin things hard but I don't see any of their arguments really having punch. When I was arguing for May's deal, it was hard to defend the lack of consent in the backstop. And while I want the UK in the Customs Union, I could see how the inability to sign our own trade deals was powerful to Leavers.
Now though, there is not much the opponents have. They are trying to push this "carving up the UK" line but it doesn't stick. NI has always been constitutionally in the UK but a more mixed status pratically: British but with the right to Irish passports, represented at Westminster but with her own law, representative democracy but with extra double majority requirements for Irish nationalists. This deal continues that grand tradition: under UK law but with regulatory exceptions for agrifood and industrial goods, checks on goods but not personal possessions, part of UK trade deals but with access to the single market. There is no sizable shift, even while Remainers try to play it up, because it is the only line they have.
It's an arrangement that is probably unworkable for Northern Ireland as it stands. Admittedly that was always the case with the Irish backstop. But we have moved from it being the worst case if all else fails to it being the actual policy. It's an arrangement that, unless changed, offers so little to the rest of the UK, we might literally have no deal with the EU in a year's time.
I am struggling to see any benefit to this deal beyond avoiding an immediate chaotic exit.
It takes GB out of the EU, the single market and customs union, it ends free movement from the EU and lets us do our own trade deals and it avoids a hard border in Ireland
You're on fire tonight. You've got it. It takes GB out of those institutions. It doesn't take the UK (GB and NI) effectively out of them.
So we have Farage now celebrating Benn Act, Starmer claiming it definitely worse deal, even though he won't have seen the text yet and Swinson of course claiming the only deal is to stay in the EU.
The HoC will say no and its going to be more silly buggering around isn't it.
No it wil be No Deal then as the EU have now refused further extension
Source?
HYUFD is not accurate.
Junckers, the Belgium PM and Macron have all said no prolongation to the deal on the 31st October but as with anything EU it is not yet definitive
BigG, why do you always write "Junckers" instead of "Juncker"? His name is the latter. I've just noticed you always do it
And the door opens for Chuka in Cities of London and Westminster to ascend to the Commons as its new LD MP and become the Messiah for the Remainers and liberals
Chuka will be pissed off. He will have to redo all his election bumph without a green activist in a headlock.....
I am sure just putting some posters of himself up with a halo and surrounded by angels draped in EU flags would suffice
As an act of sweet revenge, I wonder whether the DUP might now be inclined to support a VNOC - and even be prepared to install Corbyn as PM on a short term basis. Were I in their position I would contemplate that .
As an act of sweet revenge, I wonder whether the DUP might now be inclined to support a VNOC - and even be prepared to install Corbyn as PM on a short term basis. Were I in their position I would contemplate that .
I doubt they would ever do that given his past associations.
Nearly 60 and put on Breakfast... It's almost as though she's upset someone at SKY!
Well that about sums up your attitude to life, it was a job swap between Sarah Jane me and her, for whatever reason the fact that she is nearly 60 is a disgrace to use as any explanation for this change.
I was joking... And given Kay has made a career of putting her foot in it - including, for example, asking serial killer Steve Wrights ex-girlfriend whether he would still been a serial killer if they'd had a better sex life - it kind of goes with the territory to have a laugh at Miss Burley's expense.
But of course if I've caused offence, upset or general disagreement to you or anyone else then I withdraw the comment and apologize.
Ok a joke is a joke but in a world where female presenters feel threatened by their age unlike male presenters then it needs a bit more thought.
As an act of sweet revenge, I wonder whether the DUP might now be inclined to support a VNOC - and even be prepared to install Corbyn as PM on a short term basis. Were I in their position I would contemplate that .
Still not enough with the LDs against him plus the several indies that would never vote for him
The Democrats walked out of the meeting, in protest of Trump’s insults. Speaking to reporters afterward, Pelosi said, “I think now we have to pray for his health, because this was a very serious meltdown on the part of the president.”
As the evidence mounts of Trump’s abuses and obstructions, will some Republican senators see the impeachment process as an opportunity to rid themselves of a president that they must be regarding as increasingly dangerous? A few weeks ago, the question would have been asinine. Now it’s, at the very least, not implausible.
The Republicans said very much the same about Pelosi funnily enough She needs to stop ducking a vote on formalizing impeachment proceedings, until that trump is free to avoid subpoenas etc without sanction
No he's not. That's something he just made up. The House has full over sight powers at all times.
There is no "we are starting investigation of material to decided if we will hold an impeachment vote" step to vote on.
As an act of sweet revenge, I wonder whether the DUP might now be inclined to support a VNOC - and even be prepared to install Corbyn as PM on a short term basis. Were I in their position I would contemplate that .
Without Corbyn maybe but absolutely no chance with him there .
Comments
What we have today is a formal arrangement to keep Northern Ireland in the UK and UK customs area while avoiding a hard border with the Republic of Ireland
I salute your not wanting to be unkind to Ross T, you're a better man than me.
https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=HZ18AwAAQBAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq="shilling's+orifice"+quill&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiryP3qhqTlAhUUtHEKHSPgDFgQ6AEIbjAK#v=onepage&q=shilling's&f=false
That could be a problem.
They know how evil he is - and have no more excuse than the Labour MPs who nominated him for the Leadership
Now though, there is not much the opponents have. They are trying to push this "carving up the UK" line but it doesn't stick. NI has always been constitutionally in the UK but a more mixed status pratically: British but with the right to Irish passports, represented at Westminster but with her own law, representative democracy but with extra double majority requirements for Irish nationalists. This deal continues that grand tradition: under UK law but with regulatory exceptions for agrifood and industrial goods, checks on goods but not personal possessions, part of UK trade deals but with access to the single market. There is no sizable shift, even while Remainers try to play it up, because it is the only line they have.
https://www.popularmechanics.com/flight/a22201/brass-ring-spitfire-engineering-wwii/
And trade deals with other countries if they happen the same . At the end of December 2020 I expect the message will be it’s not worth making business go to WTO and then have to go through two sets of changes .
Because all this will be coming after an election which the Tories will likely win which means they don’t have to worry about Farage causing too much damage and the public by then could care less .
The symbolism of Brexit happening is a big thing , after that the public will tune out.
Other things won the war in Europe.
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2019/10/elizabeth-warren-ideologue-health-care-antitrust.html
She'll lose if she keeps Medicare for All imho.
https://twitter.com/jbendery/status/1184911426630107138?s=19
But that's from only limited personal experience.
The judgement on Boris will be mixed; pleased he carried out the voters mandate; but historians will ask why he vehmently opposed a deal, and then meekly signed up to something that crossed at least as many red lines.
I hope now we can all concentrate on more important things. Like the US elections.
And so there has been a formal separation between Great Britain and the island of Ireland.
Something changed and what changed is that NI will align with the EU more closely and Great Britain much less so.
The fact that the deal has been agreed and the backstop junked is the clue you should follow up on.
That's a really easy one.
Critical of the govt but will vote for the deal. Then stand down at the GE. Brexit claims another one
Industrial Production in September fell 0.4% from August. Worse, it was down year-over-year for the first time.
Consumer spending also went into reverse in September, falling from August although still up on a year ago. (Note: industrial production worse than consumer spending suggests that the US trade deficit is widening, not narrowing.)
There's a real slow moving car crash happening here. House prices across most of the US seem to be coming down (albeit gently) right now. If that worsens, it will gum up consumer spending. Trump now wants start the money printing presses. It may work, but the truth is that economies need the occasional recession to rectify misallocated capital.
Anyone told Tom???
That is a bold move for the Conservative and Unionist Party.
As the evidence mounts of Trump’s abuses and obstructions, will some Republican senators see the impeachment process as an opportunity to rid themselves of a president that they must be regarding as increasingly dangerous? A few weeks ago, the question would have been asinine. Now it’s, at the very least, not implausible.
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2019/10/trump-syria-turkey-meltdown.html
She needs to stop ducking a vote on formalizing impeachment proceedings, until that trump is free to avoid subpoenas etc without sanction
I don't think I've ever seen that party on any ballot paper I've had.
People concerned about the Unionist aspect should have taken note of that.
I am struggling to see any benefit to this deal beyond avoiding an immediate chaotic exit.
Oh. And the only NI consent for this Brexit is that absolutely everyone in NI is now opposed.
That party.
But of course if I've caused offence, upset or general disagreement to you or anyone else then I withdraw the comment and apologize.
I suspect today's events have ensured the Conservatives will be in Government for the next five years and maybe for the next decade. It's hard to see whatever happens on Saturday how Boris won't win a majority at the next GE which will hypothetically take us to 2025.
I have considerable reservations about his "tsunami of Tory ideas" and suspect his tax cutting lunacy will eventually lead to a mountain of debt and a recession of some severity but the question will be how the Opposition will re-define itself in the early 2020s and the degree to which that transformation will be complete by 2025.
I could imagine environmental themes gaining more attention with time and it may be a more overtly pro-environment (not Green) movement which may be Labour or the LDs or an amalgam will emerge. It may also be the benefits of leaving the EU will look exaggerated with time and while that may not translate into a desire to rejoin, it may instigate a form of buyer's remorse.
All things pass and I suspect in 2025 we could be looking at a very different political environment but I am to be honest quite disheartened this evening. In hindsight I don't think there's anything the anti-Conservative forces could have done once the ComRes poll showed Boris winning a majority. From that point his election as Conservative leader was guaranteed.
Were he facing a more astute and popular Opposition leader I think his obvious limitations would be exposed but he has the ideal opponent in Corbyn who he can verbally wrong-foot with ease.
Johnson also has had, as Blair and Thatcher had in their time, more than his share of luck. That will run out one time and perhaps spectacularly but he is the dominant political figure of the moment.
Pause.
Ah, my coat...
There is no "we are starting investigation of material to decided if we will hold an impeachment vote" step to vote on.