@SamCoatesTimes: Leave MPs considering a post-referendum letter saying David Cameron should stay PM. Robert Syms, a leave MP, canvassing support
There was no appetite for a pre-referendum letter from leave MPs on Cameron's future, I'm told.
Downing Street have nothing to do with this, they insist.
Hmmmmmmm.
Robert is my MP.
Reading between the lines, I think there's a consensus emerging that Leave Tories will look like numpties if Remain win and they try and topple Cameron
1) One it will look undemocratic, and make them look like sore losers
2) Dave will win any confidence vote
I'm not convinced Cameron is an electoral asset any longer.
He might be on course to win a nationwide referendum, where he was the front man.
Not bad for someone who isn't an electoral asset.
Ditch the spin. You know his ratings as well as I do.
If we ditched party leaders on mid term ratings, Margaret Thatcher wouldn't have lasted as PM past 1981
@SamCoatesTimes: Leave MPs considering a post-referendum letter saying David Cameron should stay PM. Robert Syms, a leave MP, canvassing support
There was no appetite for a pre-referendum letter from leave MPs on Cameron's future, I'm told.
Downing Street have nothing to do with this, they insist.
Hmmmmmmm.
Robert is my MP.
Reading between the lines, I think there's a consensus emerging that Leave Tories will look like numpties if Remain win and they try and topple Cameron
1) One it will look undemocratic, and make them look like sore losers
2) Dave will win any confidence vote
3) Since his credibility, fairly or not, will have been shot, he will have been persuaded to move up his timetable for departure in any case, so there's less need to topple him in such an immediate and public fashion,
A dozen rebels can turn him into the lamest of lame ducks any time they like. John Major had it easy with his Bastards compared to what DC is going to have to put up with in the next couple of years.
Corbyn has agreed to a Sky tv debate in front of a young audience on Monday 20th at 6.00pm before the England match. It is reported that he will attack Boris, Gove, IDS and Farage from the left in a big way. Seems the campaign is hotting up.
On a much more pleasant subject I had the pleasure of seeing the 'Flying Scotsman' in full steam pulling an excursion along side Colwyn Bay promenade today on her way to Chester. Wonderful child hood memories of seeing her daily pass our classroom at Berwick Grammar School in the mid fifties
How can you refer to the Flying ScotsMAN as 'her'? 'It', surely?
Confused by the fact the ScotsMAN was wearing a skirt?
@faisalislam: Highly significant @sarahwollaston has decided to defect from Leave to Remain on the back of the "£350m sent to Brussels" figure
He's wrong too I guess...
It's too early to say definitively. It depends if her credibility is shot as a result, or if there is more significant pushback on the £350million claim (which given how it has been pushed I can only presume Leave feel is a key positive for them) as a result of such public repudiation from a former Leaver. And I don't know how you prove it has had an effect, since even if polls trend toward Remain, it could be for any reason.
So he's not right or wrong, he's just opining like anyone and there's no way, certainly now, to know. But there are plenty of arguments as to why it might not be significant too, eg lack of impact due to low profile etc.
Well we can all play that vile game can't we. I feel ashamed at what this country has become, with a remain campaign pitching itself at the worst of human instincts, inciting fear at every opportunity. And as for the Woolaston stunt then maybe this is quite telling what she told the Express back in February:
“I am in love with the possibilities of the EU but can no longer ignore the grinding reality of the institution.”
No doubt wan*ing off to the possibilities of an EU army, being on the hock for more Eurozone bailouts, more EU contributions to pay for the migration crisis Sarah? Something to have a titillation about for sure!
I am still trying to reconcile myself to the idea that the English media are starting to talk themselves into believing that England have a chance again. Hope truly trumps experience.
I'll be paying virtually no attention to Euro 2016 until the 24th February. We can all name 5 or 6 of the 8 teams to be eliminated in the group stages. It only gets interesting at the knock out stages. They should have gone the full hog and made it like the world cup format of 32 teams, and cut down on many meaningless qualifying games just to get to the tournament stage.
The Wollaston incident is an odd one. If it was a nuanced leave changing to a nuanced remain, I could understand it, but it seems to be a complete 180 degree about-face over a really rather minor incident. Has she been nobbled by the whips perhaps? Or was this all pre-planned? If so, can we expect a string of these over the next couple of weeks? Or am I seeing conspiracies where none exist?
Harriet Harman is so good. Actually speaking like a humanbeing and making understandable, concrete arguments about the EU, rather than this impenetrable bollocks about "outward-facing Britain" or "our place in the world" that most Labour Remain campaigners prattle on about.
@SamCoatesTimes: Leave MPs considering a post-referendum letter saying David Cameron should stay PM. Robert Syms, a leave MP, canvassing support
There was no appetite for a pre-referendum letter from leave MPs on Cameron's future, I'm told.
Downing Street have nothing to do with this, they insist.
Hmmmmmmm.
Robert is my MP.
Reading between the lines, I think there's a consensus emerging that Leave Tories will look like numpties if Remain win and they try and topple Cameron
1) One it will look undemocratic, and make them look like sore losers
2) Dave will win any confidence vote
Cameron would be a fool to even stand in a confidence motion; he's said he won't be fighting the next election anyway. Would grind government to a halt.
So 50 MPs should be able to ride roughshod over 280 MPs and 11 million voters.
Brilliant.
He said he wasn't going to fight the next election.
Surprise surprise, that removes a good deal of his authority.
The Wollaston incident is an odd one. If it was a nuanced leave changing to a nuanced remain, I could understand it, but it seems to be a complete 180 degree about-face over a really rather minor incident. Has she been nobbled by the whips perhaps? Or was this all pre-planned? If so, can we expect a string of these over the next couple of weeks? Or am I seeing conspiracies where none exist?
She's the MP to be least likely nobbled by the whips
Well we can all play that vile game can't we. I feel ashamed at what this country has become, with a remain campaign pitching itself at the worst of human instincts, inciting fear at every opportunity. And as for the Woolaston stunt then maybe this is quite telling what she told the Express back in February:
“I am in love with the possibilities of the EU but can no longer ignore the grinding reality of the institution.”
No doubt wan*ing off to the possibilities of an EU army, being on the hock for more Eurozone bailouts, more EU contributions to pay for the migration crisis Sarah? Something to have a titillation about for sure!
I am still trying to reconcile myself to the idea that the English media are starting to talk themselves into believing that England have a chance again. Hope truly trumps experience.
I'll be paying virtually no attention to Euro 2016 until the 24th February. We can all name 5 or 6 of the 8 teams to be eliminated in the group stages. It only gets interesting at the knock out stages. They should have gone the full hog and made it like the world cup format of 32 teams, and cut down on many meaningless qualifying games just to get to the tournament stage.
Mr Hunchman, it will all be over a long time before 24th February.
@SamCoatesTimes: Leave MPs considering a post-referendum letter saying David Cameron should stay PM. Robert Syms, a leave MP, canvassing support
There was no appetite for a pre-referendum letter from leave MPs on Cameron's future, I'm told.
Downing Street have nothing to do with this, they insist.
Hmmmmmmm.
Robert is my MP.
Reading between the lines, I think there's a consensus emerging that Leave Tories will look like numpties if Remain win and they try and topple Cameron
1) One it will look undemocratic, and make them look like sore losers
2) Dave will win any confidence vote
Cameron would be a fool to even stand in a confidence motion; he's said he won't be fighting the next election anyway. Would grind government to a halt.
So 50 MPs should be able to ride roughshod over 280 MPs and 11 million voters.
Brilliant.
He said he wasn't going to fight the next election.
Surprise surprise, that removes a good deal of his authority.
Brilliant.
A bit like any US President at the start of their second term
Corbyn has agreed to a Sky tv debate in front of a young audience on Monday 20th at 6.00pm before the England match. It is reported that he will attack Boris, Gove, IDS and Farage from the left in a big way. Seems the campaign is hotting up.
On a much more pleasant subject I had the pleasure of seeing the 'Flying Scotsman' in full steam pulling an excursion along side Colwyn Bay promenade today on her way to Chester. Wonderful child hood memories of seeing her daily pass our classroom at Berwick Grammar School in the mid fifties
How can you refer to the Flying ScotsMAN as 'her'? 'It', surely?
Confused by the fact the ScotsMAN was wearing a skirt?
I like that but we all called her 'her' - maybe it was an affectionate term at the time but I am too old to remember
The Wollaston incident is an odd one. If it was a nuanced leave changing to a nuanced remain, I could understand it, but it seems to be a complete 180 degree about-face over a really rather minor incident. Has she been nobbled by the whips perhaps? Or was this all pre-planned? If so, can we expect a string of these over the next couple of weeks? Or am I seeing conspiracies where none exist?
If Jeremy Corbyn switches to Remain then we'll know there is a conspiracy.
Catching up with it now on iPlayer. Osborne not doing too badly. Will be interesting to read through the PB archives (what a life I lead) to see the reaction, and how wrong I am
@SamCoatesTimes: Leave MPs considering a post-referendum letter saying David Cameron should stay PM. Robert Syms, a leave MP, canvassing support
There was no appetite for a pre-referendum letter from leave MPs on Cameron's future, I'm told.
Downing Street have nothing to do with this, they insist.
Hmmmmmmm.
Robert is my MP.
Reading between the lines, I think there's a consensus emerging that Leave Tories will look like numpties if Remain win and they try and topple Cameron
1) One it will look undemocratic, and make them look like sore losers
2) Dave will win any confidence vote
3) Since his credibility, fairly or not, will have been shot, he will have been persuaded to move up his timetable for departure in any case, so there's less need to topple him in such an immediate and public fashion,
A dozen rebels can turn him into the lamest of lame ducks any time they like. John Major had it easy with his Bastards compared to what DC is going to have to put up with in the next couple of years.
That's precisely why I don't think he will last years. The longer he sticks around the better the chance his favoured successor will have of, er, succeeding him, and the Leavers aren't going to accept another Cameroon(Remain sub-type). If he decides to go in, say, 2017, those rebels might be persuaded to play nice for that short period, on the understanding someone more amendable to them will have the best chance so soon after the referendum, with Osborne for one's reputation unlikely to have recovered.
@SamCoatesTimes: Leave MPs considering a post-referendum letter saying David Cameron should stay PM. Robert Syms, a leave MP, canvassing support
There was no appetite for a pre-referendum letter from leave MPs on Cameron's future, I'm told.
Downing Street have nothing to do with this, they insist.
Hmmmmmmm.
Robert is my MP.
Reading between the lines, I think there's a consensus emerging that Leave Tories will look like numpties if Remain win and they try and topple Cameron
1) One it will look undemocratic, and make them look like sore losers
2) Dave will win any confidence vote
Cameron would be a fool to even stand in a confidence motion; he's said he won't be fighting the next election anyway. Would grind government to a halt.
So 50 MPs should be able to ride roughshod over 280 MPs and 11 million voters.
Brilliant.
He said he wasn't going to fight the next election.
Surprise surprise, that removes a good deal of his authority.
Brilliant.
A bit like any US President at the start of their second term
No, not in any way like that. He is under no constitutional obligation to stay on, and has no direct mandate from the public.
Cameron is leader of a party that knows how to depose weak leaders. Even Labour gets rid of lame duck PMs.
Well we can all play that vile game can't we. I feel ashamed at what this country has become, with a remain campaign pitching itself at the worst of human instincts, inciting fear at every opportunity. And as for the Woolaston stunt then maybe this is quite telling what she told the Express back in February:
“I am in love with the possibilities of the EU but can no longer ignore the grinding reality of the institution.”
No doubt wan*ing off to the possibilities of an EU army, being on the hock for more Eurozone bailouts, more EU contributions to pay for the migration crisis Sarah? Something to have a titillation about for sure!
I am still trying to reconcile myself to the idea that the English media are starting to talk themselves into believing that England have a chance again. Hope truly trumps experience.
I'll be paying virtually no attention to Euro 2016 until the 24th February. We can all name 5 or 6 of the 8 teams to be eliminated in the group stages. It only gets interesting at the knock out stages. They should have gone the full hog and made it like the world cup format of 32 teams, and cut down on many meaningless qualifying games just to get to the tournament stage.
Mr Hunchman, it will all be over a long time before 24th February.
Oh god, too many long nights recently spent following the money trail over 788 790 Finchley Road!
Catching up with it now on iPlayer. Osborne not doing too badly. Will be interesting to read through the PB archives (what a life I lead) to see the reaction, and how wrong I am
Osborne was so crap, the price on Remain has collapsed from 74% to erm 74%
The Wollaston incident is an odd one. If it was a nuanced leave changing to a nuanced remain, I could understand it, but it seems to be a complete 180 degree about-face over a really rather minor incident. Has she been nobbled by the whips perhaps? Or was this all pre-planned? If so, can we expect a string of these over the next couple of weeks? Or am I seeing conspiracies where none exist?
She's the MP to be least likely nobbled by the whips
Well, yes, that was my impression. But it seems odd, no? I know you're pleased that she's come over to your side, and I know people change their minds, but few people change their minds so soon after writing an article arguing the exact opposite.
@David_Cameron: A powerful intervention by @sarahwollaston, an MP and Dr who will no longer vote Leave because she thinks it will damage the economy & NHS.
Hayward on Newsnight saying Leave is massively underestimated in the polls.
LEAVE may well be massively underestimated in the polls, and indeed I have a bet[1] partly based on that proposition. But is he offering any actual *evidence* to support that? Genuine question
Gods, Twitter is just fill of vile gits spewing bile, isn't it? He could have be saying puppies are nice and I'd bet the replies would have been the same.
The Wollaston incident is an odd one. If it was a nuanced leave changing to a nuanced remain, I could understand it, but it seems to be a complete 180 degree about-face over a really rather minor incident. Has she been nobbled by the whips perhaps? Or was this all pre-planned? If so, can we expect a string of these over the next couple of weeks? Or am I seeing conspiracies where none exist?
I think this is a one off. She is very independently minded and has huge integrity. She clearly disagreed with the figure of 350 million and it's connection with the NHS. It is also likely that she was influenced by the overwhelming economic arguments.
Corbyn has agreed to a Sky tv debate in front of a young audience on Monday 20th at 6.00pm before the England match. It is reported that he will attack Boris, Gove, IDS and Farage from the left in a big way. Seems the campaign is hotting up.
On a much more pleasant subject I had the pleasure of seeing the 'Flying Scotsman' in full steam pulling an excursion along side Colwyn Bay promenade today on her way to Chester. Wonderful child hood memories of seeing her daily pass our classroom at Berwick Grammar School in the mid fifties
How can you refer to the Flying ScotsMAN as 'her'? 'It', surely?
Confused by the fact the ScotsMAN was wearing a skirt?
I like that but we all called her 'her' - maybe it was an affectionate term at the time but I am too old to remember
Don't over think it. Boats and trains are always female
@SamCoatesTimes: Leave MPs considering a post-referendum letter saying David Cameron should stay PM. Robert Syms, a leave MP, canvassing support
There was no appetite for a pre-referendum letter from leave MPs on Cameron's future, I'm told.
Downing Street have nothing to do with this, they insist.
Hmmmmmmm.
Robert is my MP.
Reading between the lines, I think there's a consensus emerging that Leave Tories will look like numpties if Remain win and they try and topple Cameron
1) One it will look undemocratic, and make them look like sore losers
2) Dave will win any confidence vote
3) Since his credibility, fairly or not, will have been shot, he will have been persuaded to move up his timetable for departure in any case, so there's less need to topple him in such an immediate and public fashion,
A dozen rebels can turn him into the lamest of lame ducks any time they like. John Major had it easy with his Bastards compared to what DC is going to have to put up with in the next couple of years.
That's precisely why I don't think he will last years. The longer he sticks around the better the chance his favoured successor will have of, er, succeeding him, and the Leavers aren't going to accept another Cameroon(Remain sub-type). If he decides to go in, say, 2017, those rebels might be persuaded to play nice for that short period, on the understanding someone more amendable to them will have the best chance so soon after the referendum, with Osborne for one's reputation unlikely to have recovered.
Theresa May. 7/1 (still) for next PM. 3rd favourite behind Johnson and Osborne for some reason. Who else can hold the party together if it's not 60-40 in the referendum?
Edit: Shadsy also still has 10/1 on the next general election being in each of this year and the next two. Value on all three I say.
Well we can all play that vile game can't we. I feel ashamed at what this country has become, with a remain campaign pitching itself at the worst of human instincts, inciting fear at every opportunity. And as for the Woolaston stunt then maybe this is quite telling what she told the Express back in February:
“I am in love with the possibilities of the EU but can no longer ignore the grinding reality of the institution.”
No doubt wan*ing off to the possibilities of an EU army, being on the hock for more Eurozone bailouts, more EU contributions to pay for the migration crisis Sarah? Something to have a titillation about for sure!
Well we can all play that vile game can't we. I feel ashamed at what this country has become, with a remain campaign pitching itself at the worst of human instincts, inciting fear at every opportunity. And as for the Woolaston stunt then maybe this is quite telling what she told the Express back in February:
“I am in love with the possibilities of the EU but can no longer ignore the grinding reality of the institution.”
No doubt wan*ing off to the possibilities of an EU army, being on the hock for more Eurozone bailouts, more EU contributions to pay for the migration crisis Sarah? Something to have a titillation about for sure!
Didn't Cameron's aide get charged with child sex crimes?
The Wollaston incident is an odd one. If it was a nuanced leave changing to a nuanced remain, I could understand it, but it seems to be a complete 180 degree about-face over a really rather minor incident. Has she been nobbled by the whips perhaps? Or was this all pre-planned? If so, can we expect a string of these over the next couple of weeks? Or am I seeing conspiracies where none exist?
She's the MP to be least likely nobbled by the whips
Well, yes, that was my impression. But it seems odd, no? I know you're pleased that she's come over to your side, and I know people change their minds, but few people change their minds so soon after writing an article arguing the exact opposite.
Her tweets archive is providing entertainment right now.
Hayward on Newsnight saying Leave is massively underestimated in the polls.
LEAVE may well be massively underestimated in the polls, and indeed I have a bet[1] partly based on that proposition. But is he offering any actual *evidence* to support that? Genuine question
Hayward on Newsnight saying Leave is massively underestimated in the polls.
LEAVE may well be massively underestimated in the polls, and indeed I have a bet[1] partly based on that proposition. But is he offering any actual *evidence* to support that? Genuine question
[1] I may have mentioned it.
He's spoken to some friends in Surrey, is what it seemed to amount to.
@SamCoatesTimes: Leave MPs considering a post-referendum letter saying David Cameron should stay PM. Robert Syms, a leave MP, canvassing support
There was no appetite for a pre-referendum letter from leave MPs on Cameron's future, I'm told.
Downing Street have nothing to do with this, they insist.
Hmmmmmmm.
Robert is my MP.
Reading between the lines, I think there's a consensus emerging that Leave Tories will look like numpties if Remain win and they try and topple Cameron
1) One it will look undemocratic, and make them look like sore losers
2) Dave will win any confidence vote
Cameron would be a fool to even stand in a confidence motion; he's said he won't be fighting the next election anyway. Would grind government to a halt.
So 50 MPs should be able to ride roughshod over 280 MPs and 11 million voters.
Brilliant.
The EU is so undemocratic, that the losing anti-EU side of the referendum should be allowed overturn the elected prime minister as a minority of their parliamentary party.
Well we can all play that vile game can't we. I feel ashamed at what this country has become, with a remain campaign pitching itself at the worst of human instincts, inciting fear at every opportunity. And as for the Woolaston stunt then maybe this is quite telling what she told the Express back in February:
“I am in love with the possibilities of the EU but can no longer ignore the grinding reality of the institution.”
No doubt wan*ing off to the possibilities of an EU army, being on the hock for more Eurozone bailouts, more EU contributions to pay for the migration crisis Sarah? Something to have a titillation about for sure!
Well we can all play that vile game can't we. I feel ashamed at what this country has become, with a remain campaign pitching itself at the worst of human instincts, inciting fear at every opportunity. And as for the Woolaston stunt then maybe this is quite telling what she told the Express back in February:
“I am in love with the possibilities of the EU but can no longer ignore the grinding reality of the institution.”
No doubt wan*ing off to the possibilities of an EU army, being on the hock for more Eurozone bailouts, more EU contributions to pay for the migration crisis Sarah? Something to have a titillation about for sure!
Didn't Cameron's aide get charged with child sex crimes?
@SamCoatesTimes: Leave MPs considering a post-referendum letter saying David Cameron should stay PM. Robert Syms, a leave MP, canvassing support
There was no appetite for a pre-referendum letter from leave MPs on Cameron's future, I'm told.
Downing Street have nothing to do with this, they insist.
Hmmmmmmm.
Robert is my MP.
Reading between the lines, I think there's a consensus emerging that Leave Tories will look like numpties if Remain win and they try and topple Cameron
1) One it will look undemocratic, and make them look like sore losers
2) Dave will win any confidence vote
Cameron would be a fool to even stand in a confidence motion; he's said he won't be fighting the next election anyway. Would grind government to a halt.
So 50 MPs should be able to ride roughshod over 280 MPs and 11 million voters.
Brilliant.
That's the way it works in the Conservative party or haven't you noticed?
The Wollaston incident is an odd one. If it was a nuanced leave changing to a nuanced remain, I could understand it, but it seems to be a complete 180 degree about-face over a really rather minor incident. Has she been nobbled by the whips perhaps? Or was this all pre-planned? If so, can we expect a string of these over the next couple of weeks? Or am I seeing conspiracies where none exist?
I think this is a one off. She is very independently minded and has huge integrity. She clearly disagreed with the figure of 350 million and it's connection with the NHS. It is also likely that she was influenced by the overwhelming economic arguments.
Well, yes, but it's not as if the economic arguments have changed in the last eight weeks or so since she chose her side, or suddenly been expressed with hitherto unmanaged lucidity. I don't object to her choosing Remain - I just find it odd that if that's what she thinks she didn't start out as Remain.
@faisalislam: Highly significant @sarahwollaston has decided to defect from Leave to Remain on the back of the "£350m sent to Brussels" figure
He's wrong too I guess...
It's too early to say definitively. It depends if her credibility is shot as a result, or if there is more significant pushback on the £350million claim (which given how it has been pushed I can only presume Leave feel is a key positive for them) as a result of such public repudiation from a former Leaver. And I don't know how you prove it has had an effect, since even if polls trend toward Remain, it could be for any reason.
So he's not right or wrong, he's just opining like anyone and there's no way, certainly now, to know. But there are plenty of arguments as to why it might not be significant too, eg lack of impact due to low profile etc.
In her interview she talked more about the disruption caused by Brexit, that she wasn't aware of previously, than the fact the quoted figure was a lie. Maybe she is disingenuous but it could be a reason for changing your mind, whereas your fellow campaigners behaving badly shouldn't affect your fundamental beliefs. The interview has the potential to be damaging to Leave if it gets widely aired because her issues are ones that will certainly resonate with the "sceptical but could be convinced" crowd who will actually decide this referendum.
Well we can all play that vile game can't we. I feel ashamed at what this country has become, with a remain campaign pitching itself at the worst of human instincts, inciting fear at every opportunity. And as for the Woolaston stunt then maybe this is quite telling what she told the Express back in February:
“I am in love with the possibilities of the EU but can no longer ignore the grinding reality of the institution.”
No doubt wan*ing off to the possibilities of an EU army, being on the hock for more Eurozone bailouts, more EU contributions to pay for the migration crisis Sarah? Something to have a titillation about for sure!
Well we can all play that vile game can't we. I feel ashamed at what this country has become, with a remain campaign pitching itself at the worst of human instincts, inciting fear at every opportunity. And as for the Woolaston stunt then maybe this is quite telling what she told the Express back in February:
“I am in love with the possibilities of the EU but can no longer ignore the grinding reality of the institution.”
No doubt wan*ing off to the possibilities of an EU army, being on the hock for more Eurozone bailouts, more EU contributions to pay for the migration crisis Sarah? Something to have a titillation about for sure!
Didn't Cameron's aide get charged with child sex crimes?
Yep, and it got removed from this thread.
Your rather large font size probably did that. No one likes a shouty mc shout face on these boards, as Chris Evans proves.
So will Wollaston be joining Labour Leave in the morning?
Welcome aboard Doc!
Meanwhile, I guess George Osborne didn't make Airfix models as a boy, otherwise he might know that wings are a fairly fundamental part of an aeroplane.
Too busy studying Machiavelli, the Prince. Which is an extremely underrated book which frequently had me laughing out loud with its cynicism and insights into human nature.
Corbyn has agreed to a Sky tv debate in front of a young audience on Monday 20th at 6.00pm before the England match. It is reported that he will attack Boris, Gove, IDS and Farage from the left in a big way. Seems the campaign is hotting up.
On a much more pleasant subject I had the pleasure of seeing the 'Flying Scotsman' in full steam pulling an excursion along side Colwyn Bay promenade today on her way to Chester. Wonderful child hood memories of seeing her daily pass our classroom at Berwick Grammar School in the mid fifties
How can you refer to the Flying ScotsMAN as 'her'? 'It', surely?
Confused by the fact the ScotsMAN was wearing a skirt?
I like that but we all called her 'her' - maybe it was an affectionate term at the time but I am too old to remember
Don't over think it. Boats and trains are always female
The Wollaston incident is an odd one. If it was a nuanced leave changing to a nuanced remain, I could understand it, but it seems to be a complete 180 degree about-face over a really rather minor incident. Has she been nobbled by the whips perhaps? Or was this all pre-planned? If so, can we expect a string of these over the next couple of weeks? Or am I seeing conspiracies where none exist?
I think this is a one off. She is very independently minded and has huge integrity. She clearly disagreed with the figure of 350 million and it's connection with the NHS. It is also likely that she was influenced by the overwhelming economic arguments.
Given what she was saying only a few days ago, as quoted up-thread, I think the idea that she has huge integrity is perhaps a little weak. In fact she has actually proved she cannot be trusted from one day to the next, just another mendacious politician.
I wonder if she treats her patients with the same cavalier attitude that she does her voters.
Well we can all play that vile game can't we. I feel ashamed at what this country has become, with a remain campaign pitching itself at the worst of human instincts, inciting fear at every opportunity. And as for the Woolaston stunt then maybe this is quite telling what she told the Express back in February:
“I am in love with the possibilities of the EU but can no longer ignore the grinding reality of the institution.”
No doubt wan*ing off to the possibilities of an EU army, being on the hock for more Eurozone bailouts, more EU contributions to pay for the migration crisis Sarah? Something to have a titillation about for sure!
Well we can all play that vile game can't we. I feel ashamed at what this country has become, with a remain campaign pitching itself at the worst of human instincts, inciting fear at every opportunity. And as for the Woolaston stunt then maybe this is quite telling what she told the Express back in February:
“I am in love with the possibilities of the EU but can no longer ignore the grinding reality of the institution.”
No doubt wan*ing off to the possibilities of an EU army, being on the hock for more Eurozone bailouts, more EU contributions to pay for the migration crisis Sarah? Something to have a titillation about for sure!
Didn't Cameron's aide get charged with child sex crimes?
Yep, and it got removed from this thread.
Your rather large font size probably did that. No one likes a shouty mc shout face on these boards, as Chris Evans proves.
That would be fair enough if people weren't posting even larger font sizes in their graphics.
@SamCoatesTimes: Leave MPs considering a post-referendum letter saying David Cameron should stay PM. Robert Syms, a leave MP, canvassing support
There was no appetite for a pre-referendum letter from leave MPs on Cameron's future, I'm told.
Downing Street have nothing to do with this, they insist.
Hmmmmmmm.
Robert is my MP.
Reading between the lines, I think there's a consensus emerging that Leave Tories will look like numpties if Remain win and they try and topple Cameron
1) One it will look undemocratic, and make them look like sore losers
2) Dave will win any confidence vote
I'm not convinced Cameron is an electoral asset any longer.
He might be on course to win a nationwide referendum, where he was the front man.
Not bad for someone who isn't an electoral asset.
Ditch the spin. You know his ratings as well as I do.
If we ditched party leaders on mid term ratings, Margaret Thatcher wouldn't have lasted as PM past 1981
mid term? Ah, so you agree Cameron will be gone in 2017 then, if this is his mid term?
@SamCoatesTimes: Leave MPs considering a post-referendum letter saying David Cameron should stay PM. Robert Syms, a leave MP, canvassing support
There was no appetite for a pre-referendum letter from leave MPs on Cameron's future, I'm told.
Downing Street have nothing to do with this, they insist.
Hmmmmmmm.
Robert is my MP.
Reading between the lines, I think there's a consensus emerging that Leave Tories will look like numpties if Remain win and they try and topple Cameron
1) One it will look undemocratic, and make them look like sore losers
2) Dave will win any confidence vote
I'm not convinced Cameron is an electoral asset any longer.
He might be on course to win a nationwide referendum, where he was the front man.
Not bad for someone who isn't an electoral asset.
Ditch the spin. You know his ratings as well as I do.
If we ditched party leaders on mid term ratings, Margaret Thatcher wouldn't have lasted as PM past 1981
mid term? Ah, so you agree Cameron will be gone in 2017 then, if this is his mid term?
My own hunch is that if Remain wins, he'll announce his departure date, probably 2018.
@SamCoatesTimes: Leave MPs considering a post-referendum letter saying David Cameron should stay PM. Robert Syms, a leave MP, canvassing support
There was no appetite for a pre-referendum letter from leave MPs on Cameron's future, I'm told.
Downing Street have nothing to do with this, they insist.
Have a small handful of #Brexit Tory MPs gone too far and allowed their personal animosity towards Cameron and Osborne cloud their judgement in briefings to the media over the last couple of weeks?
Well we can all play that vile game can't we. I feel ashamed at what this country has become, with a remain campaign pitching itself at the worst of human instincts, inciting fear at every opportunity. And as for the Woolaston stunt then maybe this is quite telling what she told the Express back in February:
“I am in love with the possibilities of the EU but can no longer ignore the grinding reality of the institution.”
No doubt wan*ing off to the possibilities of an EU army, being on the hock for more Eurozone bailouts, more EU contributions to pay for the migration crisis Sarah? Something to have a titillation about for sure!
Didn't Cameron's aide get charged with child sex crimes?
Yep, and it got removed from this thread.
Your rather large font size probably did that. No one likes a shouty mc shout face on these boards, as Chris Evans proves.
That would be fair enough if people weren't posting even larger font sizes in their graphics.
Surely you can see the distinction. One's an image of the front page. If you had mocked up the front page it would have probably survived. If you absolutely must emphasise text, I'd suggest just making it bold!
Well we can all play that vile game can't we. I feel ashamed at what this country has become, with a remain campaign pitching itself at the worst of human instincts, inciting fear at every opportunity. And as for the Woolaston stunt then maybe this is quite telling what she told the Express back in February:
“I am in love with the possibilities of the EU but can no longer ignore the grinding reality of the institution.”
No doubt wan*ing off to the possibilities of an EU army, being on the hock for more Eurozone bailouts, more EU contributions to pay for the migration crisis Sarah? Something to have a titillation about for sure!
I am still trying to reconcile myself to the idea that the English media are starting to talk themselves into believing that England have a chance again. Hope truly trumps experience.
I'll be paying virtually no attention to Euro 2016 until the 24th February. We can all name 5 or 6 of the 8 teams to be eliminated in the group stages. It only gets interesting at the knock out stages. They should have gone the full hog and made it like the world cup format of 32 teams, and cut down on many meaningless qualifying games just to get to the tournament stage.
Mr Hunchman, it will all be over a long time before 24th February.
Oh god, too many long nights recently spent following the money trail over 788 790 Finchley Road!
One of these days you might elaborate on what goes on in this mysterious building on Finchley Road.
@SamCoatesTimes: Leave MPs considering a post-referendum letter saying David Cameron should stay PM. Robert Syms, a leave MP, canvassing support
There was no appetite for a pre-referendum letter from leave MPs on Cameron's future, I'm told.
Downing Street have nothing to do with this, they insist.
Hmmmmmmm.
Robert is my MP.
Reading between the lines, I think there's a consensus emerging that Leave Tories will look like numpties if Remain win and they try and topple Cameron
1) One it will look undemocratic, and make them look like sore losers
2) Dave will win any confidence vote
I'm not convinced Cameron is an electoral asset any longer.
He might be on course to win a nationwide referendum, where he was the front man.
Not bad for someone who isn't an electoral asset.
Ditch the spin. You know his ratings as well as I do.
If we ditched party leaders on mid term ratings, Margaret Thatcher wouldn't have lasted as PM past 1981
mid term? Ah, so you agree Cameron will be gone in 2017 then, if this is his mid term?
My own hunch is that if Remain wins, he'll announce his departure date, probably 2018.
Seems credible, at the outer limit. 2019 always seemed the latest, in order to give his successor a good run in, and with this additional pressure that seems too much.
But then again it looks like Boris may well be PM in a few months as it is.
Catching up with it now on iPlayer. Osborne not doing too badly. Will be interesting to read through the PB archives (what a life I lead) to see the reaction, and how wrong I am
Osborne was so crap, the price on Remain has collapsed from 74% to erm 74%
JCB, one of the countries foremost manufacturers, have written to their staff saying Brexit is nothing to be concerned about and that the EU is a declining power.
The Wollaston incident is an odd one. If it was a nuanced leave changing to a nuanced remain, I could understand it, but it seems to be a complete 180 degree about-face over a really rather minor incident. Has she been nobbled by the whips perhaps? Or was this all pre-planned? If so, can we expect a string of these over the next couple of weeks? Or am I seeing conspiracies where none exist?
I think this is a one off. She is very independently minded and has huge integrity. She clearly disagreed with the figure of 350 million and it's connection with the NHS. It is also likely that she was influenced by the overwhelming economic arguments.
Given what she was saying only a few days ago, as quoted up-thread, I think the idea that she has huge integrity is perhaps a little weak. In fact she has actually proved she cannot be trusted from one day to the next, just another mendacious politician.
I wonder if she treats her patients with the same cavalier attitude that she does her voters.
Politics is a very seperate sphere to medicine.
Anecdote alert: first spontaneous mentions of the referendum by patients today. Older county set people on both occasions. I didn't ask how they were voting.
Catching up with it now on iPlayer. Osborne not doing too badly. Will be interesting to read through the PB archives (what a life I lead) to see the reaction, and how wrong I am
Osborne was so crap, the price on Remain has collapsed from 74% to erm 74%
@SamCoatesTimes: Leave MPs considering a post-referendum letter saying David Cameron should stay PM. Robert Syms, a leave MP, canvassing support
There was no appetite for a pre-referendum letter from leave MPs on Cameron's future, I'm told.
Downing Street have nothing to do with this, they insist.
Hmmmmmmm.
Robert is my MP.
Reading between the lines, I think there's a consensus emerging that Leave Tories will look like numpties if Remain win and they try and topple Cameron
1) One it will look undemocratic, and make them look like sore losers
2) Dave will win any confidence vote
I'm not convinced Cameron is an electoral asset any longer.
He might be on course to win a nationwide referendum, where he was the front man.
Not bad for someone who isn't an electoral asset.
Ditch the spin. You know his ratings as well as I do.
If we ditched party leaders on mid term ratings, Margaret Thatcher wouldn't have lasted as PM past 1981
mid term? Ah, so you agree Cameron will be gone in 2017 then, if this is his mid term?
My own hunch is that if Remain wins, he'll announce his departure date, probably 2018.
Seems credible, at the outer limit. 2019 always seemed the latest, in order to give his successor a good run in, and with this additional pressure that seems too much.
But then again it looks like Boris may well be PM in a few months as it is.
I suspect we'll follow the timetable as was in 2005.
Beauty parade at the conference, nominations close a week afterwards.
MPs short-list the final two by mid October, new leader in place by December.
Well we can all play that vile game can't we. I feel ashamed at what this country has become, with a remain campaign pitching itself at the worst of human instincts, inciting fear at every opportunity. And as for the Woolaston stunt then maybe this is quite telling what she told the Express back in February:
“I am in love with the possibilities of the EU but can no longer ignore the grinding reality of the institution.”
No doubt wan*ing off to the possibilities of an EU army, being on the hock for more Eurozone bailouts, more EU contributions to pay for the migration crisis Sarah? Something to have a titillation about for sure!
Didn't Cameron's aide get charged with child sex crimes?
Yep, and it got removed from this thread.
Your rather large font size probably did that. No one likes a shouty mc shout face on these boards, as Chris Evans proves.
That would be fair enough if people weren't posting even larger font sizes in their graphics.
Surely you can see the distinction. One's an image of the front page. If you had mocked up the front page it would have probably survived. If you absolutely must emphasise text, I'd suggest just making it bold!
Shame there is always a large font size posting at the end of every thread.
Hayward on Newsnight saying Leave is massively underestimated in the polls.
LEAVE may well be massively underestimated in the polls, and indeed I have a bet[1] partly based on that proposition. But is he offering any actual *evidence* to support that? Genuine question
[1] I may have mentioned it.
He's spoken to some friends in Surrey, is what it seemed to amount to.
Comments
So if any Remainers want to quote me experts I have a life time of listening to them and finding out they are wrong.
So he's not right or wrong, he's just opining like anyone and there's no way, certainly now, to know. But there are plenty of arguments as to why it might not be significant too, eg lack of impact due to low profile etc.
Surprise surprise, that removes a good deal of his authority.
Brilliant.
George Osborne vs Andrew Neil - transcript: https://t.co/nSKcquHe9O
Do these people genuinely exist?
Not Welsh?
Not British?
'European'??
Night all...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XRso9gEnO74
Cameron is leader of a party that knows how to depose weak leaders. Even Labour gets rid of lame duck PMs.
I knew she was too sensible for Leave.
[1] I may have mentioned it.
Influence? No one gives a toss.
Jobs and pensions? Not a lot will happen
The economy? Same
NHS? Probably get a bit better
Migration? That will fall.
Edit: Shadsy also still has 10/1 on the next general election being in each of this year and the next two. Value on all three I say.
Interesting that most of the South Wales vox pops went for Leave. I think TSE is bang on that Wales will be a CaTAFFsrophe for Remain.
Are pollsters filtering out those EU nationals who are not elegible to vote?
You're not wobbling to Remain are you Sean?
I know the Populus and YouGov polls I take part in ask that.
Do I get a prize if I am right?
Like I said.
I wonder if she treats her patients with the same cavalier attitude that she does her voters.
Still, some seem to get off on the attention.
Sun
Big Brother dominatrix claims she did cocaine with George Osborne https://t.co/85J1Hrd5la https://t.co/CgeHXZdtg0
http://www.investing.com/currencies/gbp-usd
But then again it looks like Boris may well be PM in a few months as it is.
Anecdote alert: first spontaneous mentions of the referendum by patients today. Older county set people on both occasions. I didn't ask how they were voting.
Can't wait.
Beauty parade at the conference, nominations close a week afterwards.
MPs short-list the final two by mid October, new leader in place by December.
Shame.