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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Boris’s flexible approach to the truth appears to be catchi

SystemSystem Posts: 12,267
edited May 2016 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Boris’s flexible approach to the truth appears to be catching up with him

Boris Johnson accused of 'dishonest gymnastics' over TTIP U-turn https://t.co/hISwWVfW4w

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,432
    Keep on laying Boris.
  • runnymederunnymede Posts: 2,536
    Pretty poor attempt at a hatchet job
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944
    This may make Boris less able to be PM but it is worth pointing out that some politicians can get away with changing positions whilst others can't.

    Churchill anyone?

    I'm not saying Boris is Churchill before anyone starts an argument but his career was littered with wrong decisions and a changed mind or two.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    Did anyone really think a Joker could be PM ?
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,080
    Could be worse. He could've gone from claiming he might recommend we leave to claiming a Leave vote could lead to World War Three.
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,765
    Agreed Mike. This revelation about Boris's flagrant contradictions is incendiary. It could prove lethal both to him and Leave more generally. What the hell was he thinking of? Did he just forget what he'd written for The Telegraph? Did he write it when drunk?
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    Could be worse. He could've gone from claiming he might recommend we leave

    He wrote an article recommending we stay, then decided to put career before country

    Or flush his career as seems more likely at this point
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944

    Could be worse. He could've gone from claiming he might recommend we leave to claiming a Leave vote could lead to World War Three.

    No that would be too ridiculous. No one could claim that with a straight face and not be laughed at by the electorate.

    On another note had the radio on at work for the radio 4 news. Christine Lagarde gave her very serious warning..

    "It could be from pretty bad to very very bad"

    A colleague laughed and laughed. Sounded like a monty python skit to him.

    When there laughing at you... you've lost them.
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944

    Agreed Mike. This revelation about Boris's flagrant contradictions is incendiary. It could prove lethal both to him and Leave more generally. What the hell was he thinking of? Did he just forget what he'd written for The Telegraph? Did he write it when drunk?

    Trust me, it will not make any difference to leave and little to his ambitions (which didn't seem likely to be fulfilled anyway.)
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,790

    Could be worse. He could've gone from claiming he might recommend we leave to claiming a Leave vote could lead to World War Three.

    Well in a few short weeks he has gone from thinking about recommending we stay to saying it would be utterly catastrophic if we did remain.

  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,765
    That Freedland article is interesting. I actually took it on good faith from some of the Leavers on here that Cameron banged on about 'World War III' in his speech the other day. It was mentioned umpteen times. Yet Freedland reveals Dave said no such thing. I should have known better.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    Any local by-elections held last Thursday ?
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,790
    Interesting point in the Grauniad piece about how many journalists play along with Boris and his clown act. When they don't, this happens:

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2013/mar/24/boris-johnson-interview-eddie-mair
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944

    Could be worse. He could've gone from claiming he might recommend we leave to claiming a Leave vote could lead to World War Three.

    Well in a few short weeks he has gone from thinking about recommending we stay to saying it would be utterly catastrophic if we did remain.

    Which sort of sums up why the public think that politicians talk rubbish.

    Boris, Cameron and Corbyn can all be argued to have changed their minds, and disagreeing with the first 2 would lead to hell on earth.... It's rubbish.
  • MonikerDiCanioMonikerDiCanio Posts: 5,792
    Post-truth journalism from notorious Blairite hack Freedland. Pass the sick bag.
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944

    That Freedland article is interesting. I actually took it on good faith from some of the Leavers on here that Cameron banged on about 'World War III' in his speech the other day. It was mentioned umpteen times. Yet Freedland reveals Dave said no such thing. I should have known better.

    It was apparently in the press releases sent to the press whos headlines caused a re write of the speech on the grounds they all laughed.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,080
    Mr. Observer, but not global war. Cameron's only rival in the hyperbole game is Miliband's destruction of the Earth nonsense.

    Mr. White, I agree, but the question is who's laughing? If it's floating voters, Remain's in deep trouble. If it's committed Leavers, it makes little difference (and may make Leave cocky and complacent).
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,756
    Nobody cares. People like him.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,080
    In unrelated news, those of you who have moneyphobia (don't know the Greek for money, alas), may wish to get rid of it by foolishly following the tips of Morris Dancer:
    http://enormo-haddock.blogspot.co.uk/2016/05/spain-pre-race-2016.html

    Worst start to a season for quite some time.
  • Does this mean that REMAIN will win?
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944

    Mr. Observer, but not global war. Cameron's only rival in the hyperbole game is Miliband's destruction of the Earth nonsense.

    Mr. White, I agree, but the question is who's laughing? If it's floating voters, Remain's in deep trouble. If it's committed Leavers, it makes little difference (and may make Leave cocky and complacent).

    It's unenthusiastic remainers who may then float in this case.
  • scoopscoop Posts: 64

    That Freedland article is interesting. I actually took it on good faith from some of the Leavers on here that Cameron banged on about 'World War III' in his speech the other day. It was mentioned umpteen times. Yet Freedland reveals Dave said no such thing. I should have known better.

    This was discussed at great length last night.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,932
    Dishonest politician shocker !!!!!!

    On the scale of the lies told about Iraq, immigration, the banks, government debt and university tuition fees I doubt these are going to register very high.
  • The_TaxmanThe_Taxman Posts: 2,979
    Boris Johnson is pretty unremarkable as a politician. His legacy from being mayor of London seems to be those bikes you can hire and route master buses! Not a very great footnote in history. Even Ken Livingstone left more of a legacy with his congestion charge and the revenue raising powers encapsulated by its imposition. This is from a person who cannot stand Livingstone and his slimy voice and mannerisms.

    I can never understand why Boris is given a free ride in the media, he is just a complete joke with pretty poor judgement. I don't think Johnson is fit to be PM, he would be a disaster once the novelty wore off. I don't think much of autistic Osborne either as a replacement for Cameron.

    One person I do think looks right for the role as PM is the Chief Whip, Mark Harper. He would not be the first Chief Whip to get to No.10 either as Ted Heath was Chief Whip in the 1950s. But for Harper to become PM, it would mean Cameron staying on until 2019 as Harper would need a stint in a great office of state and the media exposure linked to such a role. Harper is obviously trusted as he is Chief Whip in a parliament where the Government has a slim majority, so we shall see.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    This may make Boris less able to be PM but it is worth pointing out that some politicians can get away with changing positions whilst others can't.

    Churchill anyone?

    I'm not saying Boris is Churchill before anyone starts an argument but his career was littered with wrong decisions and a changed mind or two.

    Perhaps Boris meant that TTIP was "Churchillian" in the sense of being a half baked scheme, poorly thought through and destined to fail. Winston had plenty of these (though clearly in the 1940-43 period was the man of the moment who put the backbone into our fight against nazism).
  • David_EvershedDavid_Evershed Posts: 6,506

    That Freedland article is interesting. I actually took it on good faith from some of the Leavers on here that Cameron banged on about 'World War III' in his speech the other day. It was mentioned umpteen times. Yet Freedland reveals Dave said no such thing. I should have known better.


    I heard Cameron talking about the First Wold War and the Second World War and then saying the EU then stopped such things and that the UK LEAVING the EU would increase the risk of such things happening again.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    Does this mean that REMAIN will win?

    The betting markets and the vast majority of PBers in the Feb 29th Nojam think so!
  • VapidBilgeVapidBilge Posts: 412

    In unrelated news, those of you who have moneyphobia (don't know the Greek for money, alas), may wish to get rid of it by foolishly following the tips of Morris Dancer:
    http://enormo-haddock.blogspot.co.uk/2016/05/spain-pre-race-2016.html

    Worst start to a season for quite some time.

    http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Chrematophobia
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,080
    Mr. Bilge, cheers :)

    For writing purposes, I had to look up what murder of one's wife was (Latin, rather than Greek) = uxoricide.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,312

    Does this mean that REMAIN will win?

    The betting markets and the vast majority of PBers in the Feb 29th Nojam think so!
    I think I went 58-42 Remain. Things are not playing out quite as I expected - I still think a comfortable Remain win is likely, but I'm not nearly as sure now.
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944

    This may make Boris less able to be PM but it is worth pointing out that some politicians can get away with changing positions whilst others can't.

    Churchill anyone?

    I'm not saying Boris is Churchill before anyone starts an argument but his career was littered with wrong decisions and a changed mind or two.

    Perhaps Boris meant that TTIP was "Churchillian" in the sense of being a half baked scheme, poorly thought through and destined to fail. Winston had plenty of these (though clearly in the 1940-43 period was the man of the moment who put the backbone into our fight against nazism).
    Or perhaps my local MP thinks Boris reminds him of his grandfather? Who knows.
  • Aren't this and the previous thread published in the wrong order?
    The Eurovision one should have been for this evening.
    The Spanish, Bulgarian and even the French entries are surprisingly good this year.
    But I think the top 4 will be Russia, Australia, Sweden and Ukraine although not necessarily in that order.
    Betfair had the UK at 3.4 to finish 22nd or lower which looks a bit of value for a bottom 5 finish.
    We're 3rd in the betting to finish last with Germany as favourites.
  • David_EvershedDavid_Evershed Posts: 6,506
    If Australia wins the Eurovision contest then the World will have been turned upside down. :)
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    Not only is Boris an enigma, so is his family history unless someone can clear this up.

    His great-grandfather was Ali Kemal. But his dad's surname is Johnson. How did Kemal morph into Johnson ?

    Was being born on the wrong side of the blanket involved ? Probably not as it would have been a big deal in those days.
  • ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133
    Did a comment with poll figures just get deleted? Embargo broken?
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    tlg86 said:

    Does this mean that REMAIN will win?

    The betting markets and the vast majority of PBers in the Feb 29th Nojam think so!
    I think I went 58-42 Remain. Things are not playing out quite as I expected - I still think a comfortable Remain win is likely, but I'm not nearly as sure now.
    It would be interesting to have a second NoJam on the subject (he says still flushed with his victory in the London mayoral contest). I went for Leave on 41.57 and a 67% turnout. I may have been a little optomistic on the turnout.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,932
    So fellow PBers whose opinions should we discount:

    Boris for getting the exchange rate wrong ?
    Osborne for borrowing £172bn more than he said he would ?
    Cameron for lying about "paying down Britain's debts" ?

    Or we could ignore them all and try to think for ourselves.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,312

    tlg86 said:

    Does this mean that REMAIN will win?

    The betting markets and the vast majority of PBers in the Feb 29th Nojam think so!
    I think I went 58-42 Remain. Things are not playing out quite as I expected - I still think a comfortable Remain win is likely, but I'm not nearly as sure now.
    It would be interesting to have a second NoJam on the subject (he says still flushed with his victory in the London mayoral contest). I went for Leave on 41.57 and a 67% turnout. I may have been a little optomistic on the turnout.
    I went 72% turnout! Of course, we've all seen Jack's ARSE since then so that may make a difference.
  • agingjbagingjb Posts: 76
    The possibility of any candidate gaining the Tory leadership depends critically on securing first or second place in an exhaustive ballot of Tory MPs. Who are those two people likely to be? Is Boris likely to be one of them? And, since this a betting site, what are the estimated odds for Boris (and May, Gove etc.)?
  • scoopscoop Posts: 64

    Did a comment with poll figures just get deleted? Embargo broken?

    It is still on OGH's Twitter feed.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,790

    Dishonest politician shocker !!!!!!

    On the scale of the lies told about Iraq, immigration, the banks, government debt and university tuition fees I doubt these are going to register very high.

    Boris has not yet been in a position where he's been able to tell a Big Lie. But his track record indicates he would have no compunction in doing so.

  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,932
    surbiton said:

    Not only is Boris an enigma, so is his family history unless someone can clear this up.

    His great-grandfather was Ali Kemal. But his dad's surname is Johnson. How did Kemal morph into Johnson ?

    Was being born on the wrong side of the blanket involved ? Probably not as it would have been a big deal in those days.

    ' Johnson was born in 1940 in Penzance, Cornwall, the son of Osman Kemal Wilfred Johnson and Irene Williams, daughter of Stanley F. Williams of Bromley, Kent, by his marriage to Marie Louise de Pfeffel (or Freiin von Pfeffel) in Paris on 15 August 1882.[2] His paternal grandfather Ali Kemal Bey, one of the last interior ministers of the Ottoman Empire government, was assassinated during the Turkish War of Independence. Stanley's father was born Osman Wilfred Kemal or Osman Ali in England in Bournemouth, Hampshire, in 1909, his Anglo-Swiss mother Winifred dying shortly after giving birth.

    After Ali Kemal returned to Turkey in 1912, Stanley's father and aunt were brought up by their English grandmother Margaret Brun (née Johnson) and took her maiden name, Stanley's father becoming simply Wilfred Johnson. '

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanley_Johnson_(writer)
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,432
    The ComRes poll embargo ends at 7.30 pm.

    Y'all have to wait until then to officially discuss it.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,932

    Dishonest politician shocker !!!!!!

    On the scale of the lies told about Iraq, immigration, the banks, government debt and university tuition fees I doubt these are going to register very high.

    Boris has not yet been in a position where he's been able to tell a Big Lie. But his track record indicates he would have no compunction in doing so.

    I don't doubt that for a minute.

    It is the standard assumption most people have about most politicians.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,432
    Has always amused me that Piers Gaveston has caused both Boris Johnson and David Cameron so much grief.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,932
    surbiton said:
    Isn't Labour policy now to reopen the coal mines ?

    Although I don't think which coal mines to be reopened was specified - the ones shut by Blair or the ones shut by Wilson.

  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    "A narrative is starting to develop which could destroy the favourite’s leadership ambitions",

    And Mike Smithson is doing all he can to help that narrative along, along with weasel Freedland and fatty Soames.

    OGH has nailed his remain credentials firmly to the greasy pole.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,432

    surbiton said:

    Not only is Boris an enigma, so is his family history unless someone can clear this up.

    His great-grandfather was Ali Kemal. But his dad's surname is Johnson. How did Kemal morph into Johnson ?

    Was being born on the wrong side of the blanket involved ? Probably not as it would have been a big deal in those days.

    ' Johnson was born in 1940 in Penzance, Cornwall, the son of Osman Kemal Wilfred Johnson and Irene Williams, daughter of Stanley F. Williams of Bromley, Kent, by his marriage to Marie Louise de Pfeffel (or Freiin von Pfeffel) in Paris on 15 August 1882.[2] His paternal grandfather Ali Kemal Bey, one of the last interior ministers of the Ottoman Empire government, was assassinated during the Turkish War of Independence. Stanley's father was born Osman Wilfred Kemal or Osman Ali in England in Bournemouth, Hampshire, in 1909, his Anglo-Swiss mother Winifred dying shortly after giving birth.

    After Ali Kemal returned to Turkey in 1912, Stanley's father and aunt were brought up by their English grandmother Margaret Brun (née Johnson) and took her maiden name, Stanley's father becoming simply Wilfred Johnson. '

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanley_Johnson_(writer)
    I thought they took on the Johnson name because they were here during the First World War, and with The Ottoman Empire siding with the Germans, it was thought it was apt to change their family name to something a bit more English.

    I've believe the Saxe-Coburg and Gotha family did the same.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,170
    surbiton said:
    The statement that solar has "exploded" isn't really reinforced by the graph in the article. More like coal has tanked! :p
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,451
    edited May 2016
    Boris will just smile, run is hand through his tussled hair and bluster his way out of it... He always does.
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    Could be worse. He could've gone from claiming he might recommend we leave to claiming a Leave vote could lead to World War Three.

    Well in a few short weeks he has gone from thinking about recommending we stay to saying it would be utterly catastrophic if we did remain.

    Surely he must have crossed David Cameron moving in the opposite direction.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,080
    edited May 2016
    Mr. Eagles, he buggered Edward II too.


    Edited for the purposes of mirth.
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944

    surbiton said:
    Isn't Labour policy now to reopen the coal mines ?

    Although I don't think which coal mines to be reopened was specified - the ones shut by Blair or the ones shut by Wilson.

    Or, if he only has a small budget, the ones shut by Thatcher?
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,451

    The ComRes poll embargo ends at 7.30 pm.

    Y'all have to wait until then to officially discuss it.

    Did you break the embargo? A session of thirty lashes in Mr and Mrs Jack W's "dungeon" in that case! :smiley:
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,432

    Mr. Eagles, he didn't do much for Edward II's career either.

    Edward II was one of the primary reasons I became so interested in history.

    Who knew tales of sticking red hot pokers up people's bums would appeal to school children so much
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,765
    It's no surprise that Leave have been inventing quotations - saying that Cameron claimed that Brexit would result in the outbreak of a Third World War etc. Shouts of 'Project Fear', the notion that any predictions of a downside to Brexit can be blithely discounted, have been Leave's chief weapon. So by falsely attributing obviously over-the-top claims to high-profile Remainers, they hope to cast mistrust upon the utterances their opponents are genuinely making. It's ugly, but you can understand the tactic.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,080
    Mr. Eagles, alas, that's likely a made up tale (fortunately for Edward II).
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,432
    edited May 2016
    GIN1138 said:

    The ComRes poll embargo ends at 7.30 pm.

    Y'all have to wait until then to officially discuss it.

    Did you break the embargo? A session of thirty lashes in Mr and Mrs Jack W's "dungeon" in that case! :smiley:
    I've never broken an embargo. Is the most stressful thing for me, when I have embargoed polling and I'm scared I'll break it with a case of premature publishing.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,170

    GIN1138 said:

    The ComRes poll embargo ends at 7.30 pm.

    Y'all have to wait until then to officially discuss it.

    Did you break the embargo? A session of thirty lashes in Mr and Mrs Jack W's "dungeon" in that case! :smiley:
    I've never broken an embargo. Is the most stressful thing for me, when I have embargoed polling and I'm scared I'll break it with a case of premature publishing.
    Well, at least it's not a superembargo and we can actually talk about it without fear of being sued.... :D
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,432

    Mr. Eagles, alas, that's likely a made up tale (fortunately for Edward II).

    I know, but it made us all laugh.

    I've realised with that story, and all those tales of the sexual appetites of the Romans & Greeks, no wonder my mind has been in the gutter since the age of 12.
  • volcanopetevolcanopete Posts: 2,078
    The Eddie Mair interview with Boris Johnson set the standard."You're a nasty piece of work,aren't you?" is devastating.The 5-2 back price is joke.He is simply not fit for the office of Primus Inter Pares.Of those Tories in the Leave camp,Gove is surely better value at 8-1.He was even better at 28-1.For the Tory right,and another from the Leave camp,Liam Fox continues to poll well in Con Home polls,far better than the 40-1he's currently priced at.
    For the next Tory leader,lay Johnson,back Gove and back Fox at 40-1.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,932

    surbiton said:

    Not only is Boris an enigma, so is his family history unless someone can clear this up.

    His great-grandfather was Ali Kemal. But his dad's surname is Johnson. How did Kemal morph into Johnson ?

    Was being born on the wrong side of the blanket involved ? Probably not as it would have been a big deal in those days.

    ' Johnson was born in 1940 in Penzance, Cornwall, the son of Osman Kemal Wilfred Johnson and Irene Williams, daughter of Stanley F. Williams of Bromley, Kent, by his marriage to Marie Louise de Pfeffel (or Freiin von Pfeffel) in Paris on 15 August 1882.[2] His paternal grandfather Ali Kemal Bey, one of the last interior ministers of the Ottoman Empire government, was assassinated during the Turkish War of Independence. Stanley's father was born Osman Wilfred Kemal or Osman Ali in England in Bournemouth, Hampshire, in 1909, his Anglo-Swiss mother Winifred dying shortly after giving birth.

    After Ali Kemal returned to Turkey in 1912, Stanley's father and aunt were brought up by their English grandmother Margaret Brun (née Johnson) and took her maiden name, Stanley's father becoming simply Wilfred Johnson. '

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanley_Johnson_(writer)
    I thought they took on the Johnson name because they were here during the First World War, and with The Ottoman Empire siding with the Germans, it was thought it was apt to change their family name to something a bit more English.

    I've believe the Saxe-Coburg and Gotha family did the same.
    So if Churchill hadn't seized the Turkish dreadnoughts Boris Kemal would have been London's Mayor.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053

    It's no surprise that Leave have been inventing quotations - saying that Cameron claimed that Brexit would result in the outbreak of a Third World War etc. Shouts of 'Project Fear', the notion that any predictions of a downside to Brexit can be blithely discounted, have been Leave's chief weapon. So by falsely attributing obviously over-the-top claims to high-profile Remainers, they hope to cast mistrust upon the utterances their opponents are genuinely making. It's ugly, but you can understand the tactic.

    Cameron DID say that that a Brexit would leave to war. No if's, no buts. So what war would that be, and with whom? So grow up @Stark_Dawning or we will have to call you by your real name, @Stark_bonkers.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,451

    GIN1138 said:

    The ComRes poll embargo ends at 7.30 pm.

    Y'all have to wait until then to officially discuss it.

    Did you break the embargo? A session of thirty lashes in Mr and Mrs Jack W's "dungeon" in that case! :smiley:
    I've never broken an embargo. Is the most stressful thing for me, when I have embargoed polling and I'm scared I'll break it with a case of premature publishing.
    Premature Publishing???????? :open_mouth:
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,080
    Mr. Eagles, don't blame the Greeks or Romans for your depraved deviancy.
  • FeersumEnjineeyaFeersumEnjineeya Posts: 4,581
    surbiton said:
    Good news, but rather deceptive. Electricity demand is quite low at this time of year, while the days are long. This means that coal generation, being expensive and polluting, can be shut down, while conditions are good for maximum solar generation. Come September, coal generation will be ramping up again to meet demand, while solar will be fading. Of course, coal is on the way out, being replaced with gas/renewables, but it'll take somewhat longer than this graph implies!
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    edited May 2016

    Mr. Eagles, alas, that's likely a made up tale (fortunately for Edward II).

    What, they never used a table to open his orifice up; so as to make a smooth transition?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,432
    GIN1138 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    The ComRes poll embargo ends at 7.30 pm.

    Y'all have to wait until then to officially discuss it.

    Did you break the embargo? A session of thirty lashes in Mr and Mrs Jack W's "dungeon" in that case! :smiley:
    I've never broken an embargo. Is the most stressful thing for me, when I have embargoed polling and I'm scared I'll break it with a case of premature publishing.
    Premature Publishing???????? :open_mouth:
    Yeah, the worst embargo was during the Indyref, someone decided that a good time for an embargo to end was 2.01 am.

    I had that poll since 12.30pm the previous day.
  • BromptonautBromptonaut Posts: 1,113

    This may make Boris less able to be PM but it is worth pointing out that some politicians can get away with changing positions whilst others can't.

    Churchill anyone?

    I'm not saying Boris is Churchill before anyone starts an argument but his career was littered with wrong decisions and a changed mind or two.

    Perhaps Boris meant that TTIP was "Churchillian" in the sense of being a half baked scheme, poorly thought through and destined to fail. Winston had plenty of these (though clearly in the 1940-43 period was the man of the moment who put the backbone into our fight against nazism).
    Boris probably wished he'd made the bikes out of concrete and sunk them off the French coast.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,080
    Mr. K, Edward II survived years into the reign of Edward III, according to Ian Mortimer (who has written biographies of both Sir Roger Mortimer and Edward III, which are well worth reading).
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,158

    The Eddie Mair interview with Boris Johnson set the standard."You're a nasty piece of work,aren't you?" is devastating.The 5-2 back price is joke.He is simply not fit for the office of Primus Inter Pares.Of those Tories in the Leave camp,Gove is surely better value at 8-1.He was even better at 28-1.For the Tory right,and another from the Leave camp,Liam Fox continues to poll well in Con Home polls,far better than the 40-1he's currently priced at.
    For the next Tory leader,lay Johnson,back Gove and back Fox at 40-1.

    Can't see Fox say making any higher than 4th or 5th on a ballot of MPs
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944

    It's no surprise that Leave have been inventing quotations - saying that Cameron claimed that Brexit would result in the outbreak of a Third World War etc. Shouts of 'Project Fear', the notion that any predictions of a downside to Brexit can be blithely discounted, have been Leave's chief weapon. So by falsely attributing obviously over-the-top claims to high-profile Remainers, they hope to cast mistrust upon the utterances their opponents are genuinely making. It's ugly, but you can understand the tactic.

    That all comes from the papers who were briefed the night before.

    They all ridiculed the idea so either the briefings were wrong, all the papers made it up, or he changed the speech because he was laughed at,

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,432

    surbiton said:

    Not only is Boris an enigma, so is his family history unless someone can clear this up.

    His great-grandfather was Ali Kemal. But his dad's surname is Johnson. How did Kemal morph into Johnson ?

    Was being born on the wrong side of the blanket involved ? Probably not as it would have been a big deal in those days.

    ' Johnson was born in 1940 in Penzance, Cornwall, the son of Osman Kemal Wilfred Johnson and Irene Williams, daughter of Stanley F. Williams of Bromley, Kent, by his marriage to Marie Louise de Pfeffel (or Freiin von Pfeffel) in Paris on 15 August 1882.[2] His paternal grandfather Ali Kemal Bey, one of the last interior ministers of the Ottoman Empire government, was assassinated during the Turkish War of Independence. Stanley's father was born Osman Wilfred Kemal or Osman Ali in England in Bournemouth, Hampshire, in 1909, his Anglo-Swiss mother Winifred dying shortly after giving birth.

    After Ali Kemal returned to Turkey in 1912, Stanley's father and aunt were brought up by their English grandmother Margaret Brun (née Johnson) and took her maiden name, Stanley's father becoming simply Wilfred Johnson. '

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanley_Johnson_(writer)
    I thought they took on the Johnson name because they were here during the First World War, and with The Ottoman Empire siding with the Germans, it was thought it was apt to change their family name to something a bit more English.

    I've believe the Saxe-Coburg and Gotha family did the same.
    So if Churchill hadn't seized the Turkish dreadnoughts Boris Kemal would have been London's Mayor.
    Indeed, I don't think Churchill was ever that keen on the Turks.

    The Dardanelles offensive going mammary glands up on his watch had something to do with it.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,451
    edited May 2016

    GIN1138 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    The ComRes poll embargo ends at 7.30 pm.

    Y'all have to wait until then to officially discuss it.

    Did you break the embargo? A session of thirty lashes in Mr and Mrs Jack W's "dungeon" in that case! :smiley:
    I've never broken an embargo. Is the most stressful thing for me, when I have embargoed polling and I'm scared I'll break it with a case of premature publishing.
    Premature Publishing???????? :open_mouth:
    Yeah, the worst embargo was during the Indyref, someone decided that a good time for an embargo to end was 2.01 am.

    I had that poll since 12.30pm the previous day.
    Are we getting an #EuRef question with tonight's ComRes?
  • FeersumEnjineeyaFeersumEnjineeya Posts: 4,581

    It's no surprise that Leave have been inventing quotations - saying that Cameron claimed that Brexit would result in the outbreak of a Third World War etc. Shouts of 'Project Fear', the notion that any predictions of a downside to Brexit can be blithely discounted, have been Leave's chief weapon. So by falsely attributing obviously over-the-top claims to high-profile Remainers, they hope to cast mistrust upon the utterances their opponents are genuinely making. It's ugly, but you can understand the tactic.

    It's the "reductio ad ridiculum" fallacy used as a rhetorical device. Exaggerate and ridicule.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,432
    GIN1138 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    The ComRes poll embargo ends at 7.30 pm.

    Y'all have to wait until then to officially discuss it.

    Did you break the embargo? A session of thirty lashes in Mr and Mrs Jack W's "dungeon" in that case! :smiley:
    I've never broken an embargo. Is the most stressful thing for me, when I have embargoed polling and I'm scared I'll break it with a case of premature publishing.
    Premature Publishing???????? :open_mouth:
    Yeah, the worst embargo was during the Indyref, someone decided that a good time for an embargo to end was 2.01 am.

    I had that poll since 12.30pm the previous day.
    Are we getting an #EuRef question with tonight's ComRes?
    I don't think so.

    We're getting an avalanche of EU related questions though.
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 10,001
    Good lord. Benedict is back.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,451

    GIN1138 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    The ComRes poll embargo ends at 7.30 pm.

    Y'all have to wait until then to officially discuss it.

    Did you break the embargo? A session of thirty lashes in Mr and Mrs Jack W's "dungeon" in that case! :smiley:
    I've never broken an embargo. Is the most stressful thing for me, when I have embargoed polling and I'm scared I'll break it with a case of premature publishing.
    Premature Publishing???????? :open_mouth:
    Yeah, the worst embargo was during the Indyref, someone decided that a good time for an embargo to end was 2.01 am.

    I had that poll since 12.30pm the previous day.
    Are we getting an #EuRef question with tonight's ComRes?
    I don't think so.

    We're getting an avalanche of EU related questions though.
    What's the point of that if we don't get the only one that counts?

    Tut.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,932

    surbiton said:

    Not only is Boris an enigma, so is his family history unless someone can clear this up.

    His great-grandfather was Ali Kemal. But his dad's surname is Johnson. How did Kemal morph into Johnson ?

    Was being born on the wrong side of the blanket involved ? Probably not as it would have been a big deal in those days.

    ' Johnson was born in 1940 in Penzance, Cornwall, the son of Osman Kemal Wilfred Johnson and Irene Williams, daughter of Stanley F. Williams of Bromley, Kent, by his marriage to Marie Louise de Pfeffel (or Freiin von Pfeffel) in Paris on 15 August 1882.[2] His paternal grandfather Ali Kemal Bey, one of the last interior ministers of the Ottoman Empire government, was assassinated during the Turkish War of Independence. Stanley's father was born Osman Wilfred Kemal or Osman Ali in England in Bournemouth, Hampshire, in 1909, his Anglo-Swiss mother Winifred dying shortly after giving birth.

    After Ali Kemal returned to Turkey in 1912, Stanley's father and aunt were brought up by their English grandmother Margaret Brun (née Johnson) and took her maiden name, Stanley's father becoming simply Wilfred Johnson. '

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanley_Johnson_(writer)
    I thought they took on the Johnson name because they were here during the First World War, and with The Ottoman Empire siding with the Germans, it was thought it was apt to change their family name to something a bit more English.

    I've believe the Saxe-Coburg and Gotha family did the same.
    So if Churchill hadn't seized the Turkish dreadnoughts Boris Kemal would have been London's Mayor.
    Indeed, I don't think Churchill was ever that keen on the Turks.

    The Dardanelles offensive going mammary glands up on his watch had something to do with it.
    Liberals, as Churchill was at the time, were traditionally anti-Turkish.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,432
    I love the deluded Corbynites, when Labour wins its down to Corbyn, when they lose, it's not Corbyn's fault.

    https://twitter.com/JeremyJHardy/status/731469546062815232
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,432
    GIN1138 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    The ComRes poll embargo ends at 7.30 pm.

    Y'all have to wait until then to officially discuss it.

    Did you break the embargo? A session of thirty lashes in Mr and Mrs Jack W's "dungeon" in that case! :smiley:
    I've never broken an embargo. Is the most stressful thing for me, when I have embargoed polling and I'm scared I'll break it with a case of premature publishing.
    Premature Publishing???????? :open_mouth:
    Yeah, the worst embargo was during the Indyref, someone decided that a good time for an embargo to end was 2.01 am.

    I had that poll since 12.30pm the previous day.
    Are we getting an #EuRef question with tonight's ComRes?
    I don't think so.

    We're getting an avalanche of EU related questions though.
    What's the point of that if we don't get the only one that counts?

    Tut.
    I believe ComRes think phone polls are more accurate on the referendum than online ones.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,451

    Good lord. Benedict is back.

    Maybe James Burdett, SallyC, Ted and GrumpyOldMan/Coldstone will be next? :smiley:
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    TSE As Guest Editor Of PB
    Was Racked With Nerves For All To See
    For A Polling Embargo
    Caused An Ejaculation No Show
    And His Red Shoes Were All A Go Go
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,726

    It's no surprise that Leave have been inventing quotations - saying that Cameron claimed that Brexit would result in the outbreak of a Third World War etc. Shouts of 'Project Fear', the notion that any predictions of a downside to Brexit can be blithely discounted, have been Leave's chief weapon. So by falsely attributing obviously over-the-top claims to high-profile Remainers, they hope to cast mistrust upon the utterances their opponents are genuinely making. It's ugly, but you can understand the tactic.

    Why am I not surprised that it is Stark Dawning - fanatical and thoroughly dishonest cheerleader for Remain who is trying to rewrite history.

    Let's just make this clear once and for all Stark when it comes to EU matters you cannot be trusted on anything. You are fundamentally dishonest.
  • Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    GIN1138 said:

    Good lord. Benedict is back.

    Maybe James Burdett, SallyC, Ted and GrumpyOldMan/Coldstone will be next? :smiley:
    Coldstone is on a mission with his crack team of Gas Board special forces.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,432
    I know some Leave Tories who thought Boris coming out for Leave would be a long term negative for Leave.

    If he can't get his father or brother to back Leave, how's he going to persuade the country?
  • mattmatt Posts: 3,789
    I haven't read the comments below this but I'm confident there are a surfeit of "establishment" and "what do they know" themed posts.
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 10,001

    Has always amused me that Piers Gaveston has caused both Boris Johnson and David Cameron so much grief.

    The fact that they should belong to a society named in honour of the supposed homosexual lover of King Edward II has put them up in my estimation. According to wiki the society's motto is '(Sane) non memini ne audisse unum alterum ita dilixisse' which roughly translates as 'Truly, none remember hearing of a man enjoying another so much'

  • Scrapheap_as_wasScrapheap_as_was Posts: 10,069
    I have just been phoned by a pollster for the first time in my life. Ipsos Mori...

    1. Saying I voted independent last election confused them cos of my being in the people's republic of bercow and so couldn't vote blue, red or orange.

    2. Expect a surge to remain from tory voters.

    3. Corbyn is very satisfactory but not ready to be PM.

    4. Interesting Qs on Europe including Dave vs Boris quotes re European war risk and also how satisfied I am with QE2, Charles and William.


    The Mail I presume???
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,563

    I love the deluded Corbynites, when Labour wins its down to Corbyn, when they lose, it's not Corbyn's fault.

    https://twitter.com/JeremyJHardy/status/731469546062815232

    Evening all,

    I was impressed by Sadiq's Guardian interview - basically gave Jezza and Moamentum both barrels as far as winning, gaining power, changing stuff and not engineering "yet another heroic failure". Top hole. I am warming to the guy if he keeps this up for next couple of years (even though my money was on Tessa to be the candidate).
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,432

    I have just been phoned by a pollster for the first time in my life. Ipsos Mori...

    1. Saying I voted independent last election confused them cos of my being in the people's republic of bercow and so couldn't vote blue, red or orange.

    2. Expect a surge to remain from tory voters.

    3. Corbyn is very satisfactory but not ready to be PM.

    4. Interesting Qs on Europe including Dave vs Boris quotes re European war risk and also how satisfied I am with QE2, Charles and William.


    The Mail I presume???

    No, it'll be the Ipsos Mori poll for The Evening Standard, that'll come out next Wednesdayish
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,765

    It's no surprise that Leave have been inventing quotations - saying that Cameron claimed that Brexit would result in the outbreak of a Third World War etc. Shouts of 'Project Fear', the notion that any predictions of a downside to Brexit can be blithely discounted, have been Leave's chief weapon. So by falsely attributing obviously over-the-top claims to high-profile Remainers, they hope to cast mistrust upon the utterances their opponents are genuinely making. It's ugly, but you can understand the tactic.

    That all comes from the papers who were briefed the night before.

    They all ridiculed the idea so either the briefings were wrong, all the papers made it up, or he changed the speech because he was laughed at,

    Could you provide a link to this press release that caused such hilarity? I'd like to see how it differs from what Cameron actually later went on to say.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,432

    Has always amused me that Piers Gaveston has caused both Boris Johnson and David Cameron so much grief.

    The fact that they should belong to a society named in honour of the supposed homosexual lover of King Edward II has put them up in my estimation. According to wiki the society's motto is '(Sane) non memini ne audisse unum alterum ita dilixisse' which roughly translates as 'Truly, none remember hearing of a man enjoying another so much'

    Neither of them were members, my friends who attended Oxford say the Ashcroft story was bollocks, there was no way you could be concurrently members of The Piers Gaveston Society and the Bullingdon Club.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,726
    edited May 2016
    On topic I think it would take a true Leave fanatic to claim that Boris has been anything but a mixed blessing for us.

    His mere presence on the Leave side seems to be enough to gain considerable support. Which is a good job because the majority of the time what he actually says and does is as likely to set us back as help.
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944

    It's no surprise that Leave have been inventing quotations - saying that Cameron claimed that Brexit would result in the outbreak of a Third World War etc. Shouts of 'Project Fear', the notion that any predictions of a downside to Brexit can be blithely discounted, have been Leave's chief weapon. So by falsely attributing obviously over-the-top claims to high-profile Remainers, they hope to cast mistrust upon the utterances their opponents are genuinely making. It's ugly, but you can understand the tactic.

    That all comes from the papers who were briefed the night before.

    They all ridiculed the idea so either the briefings were wrong, all the papers made it up, or he changed the speech because he was laughed at,

    Could you provide a link to this press release that caused such hilarity? I'd like to see how it differs from what Cameron actually later went on to say.
    I said briefing not press release, and offered two other "equally plausible" explanations.

    1. All the papers are secretly in cahoots with leave.

    2. The person doing the briefing made it up.
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 10,001

    Has always amused me that Piers Gaveston has caused both Boris Johnson and David Cameron so much grief.

    The fact that they should belong to a society named in honour of the supposed homosexual lover of King Edward II has put them up in my estimation. According to wiki the society's motto is '(Sane) non memini ne audisse unum alterum ita dilixisse' which roughly translates as 'Truly, none remember hearing of a man enjoying another so much'

    Neither of them were members, my friends who attended Oxford say the Ashcroft story was bollocks, there was no way you could be concurrently members of The Piers Gaveston Society and the Bullingdon Club.
    Perhaps it suits Cameron to have people believe he was a member of Piers Gaveston what with his gay marriage supporting, occasionally metrosexual image
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,432

    Has always amused me that Piers Gaveston has caused both Boris Johnson and David Cameron so much grief.

    The fact that they should belong to a society named in honour of the supposed homosexual lover of King Edward II has put them up in my estimation. According to wiki the society's motto is '(Sane) non memini ne audisse unum alterum ita dilixisse' which roughly translates as 'Truly, none remember hearing of a man enjoying another so much'

    Neither of them were members, my friends who attended Oxford say the Ashcroft story was bollocks, there was no way you could be concurrently members of The Piers Gaveston Society and the Bullingdon Club.
    Perhaps it suits Cameron to have people believe he was a member of Piers Gaveston what with his gay marriage supporting, occasionally metrosexual image
    David Cameron voted to retain section 28.

    The Bullingdon story came out the moment he ran to be Tory Leader, if he was a member of the Piers Gaveston, that too would have come out pretty sharpish, not a decade later.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @LadPolitics: Mitt re-enters the betting at 200/1 with Ladbrokes. https://t.co/XtjN7H8LVE
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @georgegalloway: After discussions with my friends in the labour movement I've decided not to run in Tooting. The dangers of a Tory victory are too great.
This discussion has been closed.