Vauxhall: Closed - Closed to avoid congestion during an event nearby. Call us on 0343 222 1234 if you need help planning your journey.
Maybe they opened it exclusively for Leon. He is a minor celebrity you know.
Some of the station was shut some was open - why on earth would I lie about such a trivial thing? I’ve no idea what trains or buses were running above or below ground
Honestly. PB
Roads still closed around Westminster by riot police
Are you in the Fitzroy Tavern watching BBC News 24?
I always preferred Uncle Ben's rice myself...until that was also deemed racist.
Ah, a staple of mine when I lived and worked in Cambridge nearly 20 years ago.
Tilda is cheaper and just as good.
Any rice really. This may not be the canonical way to hook it, but you just boil it in plenty of water, drain and pour a bit of boiling water from kettle over it to remove the remaining starch. A piece of piss. Why anyone would spend extra money on branded "easy cook" or instant rice is beyond me. Of course, basmati is worth paying extra money for as it tastes nicer.
1.5x water to rice, then you don't need to drain. Just use same container to scoop water and rice to keep it easy.
The Italians have rice correctly; don’t cook and serve it separately - integrate it into the dish and enjoy.
It must be hugely disappointing to Braverman, and a few on here, that 300,000 or whatever managed to wander through London pretty peacefully. Attempts to scrabble around to find terrible behaviour have become increasingly desperate as the day goes on, although of course a bit will be found and amplified. My spies in the crowd tell me it was 'lovely and peaceful'.
Meanwhile, Tommy and his 200 or so EDL thugs have scrapped with the police, tried to find fights with their opponents, and generally behaved like fascist thugs who have no respect for Armistice day.
The problem is not the violence, it’s the Jew hate embedded in there, in broad daylight. I hope a lot of people are arrested over the next few days and face consequences.
Suella has unhelpfully tried to insert herself into a sensitive situation and make it all about her, creating a straw man about desecration of the cenotaph and violence rather than supporting the police to do what they need to do (and which they appear to have done pretty well this time).
It's not unlikely that her intervention also increased the numbers on the march.
I always preferred Uncle Ben's rice myself...until that was also deemed racist.
Ah, a staple of mine when I lived and worked in Cambridge nearly 20 years ago.
Tilda is cheaper and just as good.
Any rice really. This may not be the canonical way to hook it, but you just boil it in plenty of water, drain and pour a bit of boiling water from kettle over it to remove the remaining starch. A piece of piss. Why anyone would spend extra money on branded "easy cook" or instant rice is beyond me. Of course, basmati is worth paying extra money for as it tastes nicer.
1.5x water to rice, then you don't need to drain. Just use same container to scoop water and rice to keep it easy.
You get starch that way. Also, cooking for 1 buggers up proportions. Washing rice before you cook it is a pain in the arse.
One prediction: Leon will be on here at some point highlighting even the slightest issue.
But I am here. And you’re trying to frame a narrative in a. way that I can see - with my own eyes - is completely preposterous
There is a big crowd to my left shooting fireworks everywhere. The riot police do nothing because there’s nothing they can do. They can’t arrest 10,000 people. The marchers have been asked to go home and they are refusing
You've gone looking for trouble from the Pro-Palestinian side and predictably, amid a crowd of hundreds of thousands, you've found it.
We all appreciated there could be trouble; the surprise is that so far there has not been more.
Meanwhile you've dismissed the neo-Nazis as "200 pathetic, drunk football hooligans".
Forgive me if I take my news from proper journalists, not some right-wing extremist with an axe to grind.
I see this predictable dismissal got four equally predictable likes from the usual suspects.
@Leon is quite right in his response to you and, despite his strong political views, I actually trust him to report the situation on the ground accurately.
My honest appraisal is that 90% of the “football hooligans” are truculent idiots looking for a fight and 10% are actual patriots feeling concern. At the same time 90% of the pro-Palestine marchers are peaceful, amiable, perhaps ill advised but well meaning and only 5-10% are sinister menacing types - all in black, masked, punchy, tinged with some real hostility - anti semitism or whatever
But do the maths
That means you’ve got 180 twattish football hooligans and 15-30,000 sinister quasi-Islamists on the streets of London
Yes, that feels about right.
Also worth noting that, due to those numbers, the police will move in on the former today and the latter later in days to come.
It's the only thing they can do given the numbers.
I think that’s right. Police have already said they are better served recording most hate crimes on camera and arresting later, unless there is an imminent threat to public order.
I have to admit after the string of abject failures in the Met over the last few years they seem to have done a very good job today.
Yes, I agree.
It's a very difficult job they've had, and I can fully believe the abuse from both sides.
I always preferred Uncle Ben's rice myself...until that was also deemed racist.
Ah, a staple of mine when I lived and worked in Cambridge nearly 20 years ago.
Tilda is cheaper and just as good.
Any rice really. This may not be the canonical way to hook it, but you just boil it in plenty of water, drain and pour a bit of boiling water from kettle over it to remove the remaining starch. A piece of piss. Why anyone would spend extra money on branded "easy cook" or instant rice is beyond me. Of course, basmati is worth paying extra money for as it tastes nicer.
1.5x water to rice, then you don't need to drain. Just use same container to scoop water and rice to keep it easy.
You get starch that way. Also, cooking for 1 buggers up proportions. Washing rice before you cook it is a pain in the arse.
Wash rice in plenty of water at least 3 x Add water 2 cups for every 1 cup rice Bring to boil Simmer for 10 mins.
Having thrown out a populist, nationalist Government and replaced it with a broad based pro-EU coalition led by an old bete noire of the anti-EU groupings over here, Donald Tusk.
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
Here we go again using "Asperger's" as an offensive casual insult.
You clearly haven't ignored what @Sunil_Prasannan writes about politics, otherwise you wouldn't have responded to his post.
It's accurate, I'm afraid.
Moral right isn't a crude numbers balancing game, and that's before you get into confirmation bias over the sources. That's what lies behind it - together with some strange reception class level attempts at trolling - and it just gets boring through repetition.
The crawling out of the woodwork we are seeing now is purely because it's hit home and you want to back what you perceive is one of your team.
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Vauxhall: Closed - Closed to avoid congestion during an event nearby. Call us on 0343 222 1234 if you need help planning your journey.
Maybe they opened it exclusively for Leon. He is a minor celebrity you know.
Some of the station was shut some was open - why on earth would I lie about such a trivial thing? I’ve no idea what trains or buses were running above or below ground
Honestly. PB
Roads still closed around Westminster by riot police
Are you in the Fitzroy Tavern watching BBC News 24?
A haven for Dr Who fans in the eighties and nineties.
Vauxhall: Closed - Closed to avoid congestion during an event nearby. Call us on 0343 222 1234 if you need help planning your journey.
Maybe they opened it exclusively for Leon. He is a minor celebrity you know.
Some of the station was shut some was open - why on earth would I lie about such a trivial thing? I’ve no idea what trains or buses were running above or below ground
Honestly. PB
Roads still closed around Westminster by riot police
Mucho apologies. I assumed you were talking about the Tube - the Main Line station is technically separate. (different gate lines).
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
One prediction: Leon will be on here at some point highlighting even the slightest issue.
But I am here. And you’re trying to frame a narrative in a. way that I can see - with my own eyes - is completely preposterous
There is a big crowd to my left shooting fireworks everywhere. The riot police do nothing because there’s nothing they can do. They can’t arrest 10,000 people. The marchers have been asked to go home and they are refusing
You've gone looking for trouble from the Pro-Palestinian side and predictably, amid a crowd of hundreds of thousands, you've found it.
We all appreciated there could be trouble; the surprise is that so far there has not been more.
Meanwhile you've dismissed the neo-Nazis as "200 pathetic, drunk football hooligans".
Forgive me if I take my news from proper journalists, not some right-wing extremist with an axe to grind.
I see this predictable dismissal got four equally predictable likes from the usual suspects.
@Leon is quite right in his response to you and, despite his strong political views, I actually trust him to report the situation on the ground accurately.
My honest appraisal is that 90% of the “football hooligans” are truculent idiots looking for a fight and 10% are actual patriots feeling concern. At the same time 90% of the pro-Palestine marchers are peaceful, amiable, perhaps ill advised but well meaning and only 5-10% are sinister menacing types - all in black, masked, punchy, tinged with some real hostility - anti semitism or whatever
But do the maths
That means you’ve got 180 twattish football hooligans and 15-30,000 sinister quasi-Islamists on the streets of London
Yes, that feels about right.
Also worth noting that, due to those numbers, the police will move in on the former today and the latter later in days to come.
It's the only thing they can do given the numbers.
I think that’s right. Police have already said they are better served recording most hate crimes on camera and arresting later, unless there is an imminent threat to public order.
I have to admit after the string of abject failures in the Met over the last few years they seem to have done a very good job today.
Yes, I agree.
It's a very difficult job they've had, and I can fully believe the abuse from both sides.
I personally witnessed a drunk coked up EDL type abuse a policeman with a stream of cuss words “you fucking loser I bet you’ve got a tiny dick why don’t you go home” and the copper calmly replied “sir, I suggest you stop swearing and go and join your friends”. That was in Parliament square
An hour later down in Vauxhall the Islamist wankers were shouting at the coppers “you racist fascist scum, you Nazis” and so on - one of them had a megaphone. Again the police looked on calmly and imperviously - only arresting those who actually got violent
We are too critical of British police. Even the Met. They do a thankless task and they often do it well
Shopping in Sainsburys Beckton and as 11am approached, the store announced they were going to observe the two minute silence. When 11am came I was bent over a shopping trolley arguing with some leeks (as you do), the staff stopped, 95% of the shoppers stopped. Those who didn't were people using the self-service checkout including one young man carrying on his phone conversation with his headphones on and three or four elderly couples who just carried on with their shopping. I must confess I didn't think charitable thoughts toward the elderly at that point.
On the way up to Wanstead for a late lunch, saw a dozen women with flags and banners heading for Manor Park to catch the train into London replete with Palestinian flags and placards.
Wanstead about as far removed from East Ham socially and culturally as you can imagine - a group of scouts outside Tesco selling poppies.
The bus home - rammed with people heading for Diwali events.
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
Shopping in Sainsburys Beckton and as 11am approached, the store announced they were going to observe the two minute silence. When 11am came I was bent over a shopping trolley arguing with some leeks (as you do), the staff stopped, 95% of the shoppers stopped. Those who didn't were people using the self-service checkout including one young man carrying on his phone conversation with his headphones on and three or four elderly couples who just carried on with their shopping. I must confess I didn't think charitable thoughts toward the elderly at that point.
On the way up to Wanstead for a late lunch, saw a dozen women with flags and banners heading for Manor Park to catch the train into London replete with Palestinian flags and placards.
Wanstead about as far removed from East Ham socially and culturally as you can imagine - a group of scouts outside Tesco selling poppies.
The bus home - rammed with people heading for Diwali events.
If it's any consolation the elderly in question might have been deaf and not realised the announcement.
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
Here we go again using "Asperger's" as an offensive casual insult.
You clearly haven't ignored what @Sunil_Prasannan writes about politics, otherwise you wouldn't have responded to his post.
It's accurate, I'm afraid.
Moral right isn't a crude numbers balancing game, and that's before you get into confirmation bias over the sources. That's what lies behind it - together with some strange reception class level attempts at trolling - and it just gets boring through repetition.
The crawling out of the woodwork we are seeing now is purely because it's hit home and you want to back what you perceive is one of your team.
My outrage at posters using Asperger's as a cheap aside to deride someone they disagree with has been well documented. A particular poster often used to claim Mrs May's awkward demeanour was because "she is on the spectrum". I called him out then, and I will call you out now. I have skin in this game, so kindly desist with your nasty slurs.
Now if you don't mind I will crawl back into the woodwork.
Having thrown out a populist, nationalist Government and replaced it with a broad based pro-EU coalition led by an old bete noire of the anti-EU groupings over here, Donald Tusk.
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
Here we go again using "Asperger's" as an offensive casual insult.
You clearly haven't ignored what @Sunil_Prasannan writes about politics, otherwise you wouldn't have responded to his post.
It's accurate, I'm afraid.
Moral right isn't a crude numbers balancing game, and that's before you get into confirmation bias over the sources. That's what lies behind it - together with some strange reception class level attempts at trolling - and it just gets boring through repetition.
The crawling out of the woodwork we are seeing now is purely because it's hit home and you want to back what you perceive is one of your team.
With respect, CR I think you have this one wrong. It'll likely be more because he has an autistic son and feels it shouldn't be brandished as a casual insult.
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
Here we go again using "Asperger's" as an offensive casual insult.
You clearly haven't ignored what @Sunil_Prasannan writes about politics, otherwise you wouldn't have responded to his post.
It's accurate, I'm afraid.
Moral right isn't a crude numbers balancing game, and that's before you get into confirmation bias over the sources. That's what lies behind it - together with some strange reception class level attempts at trolling - and it just gets boring through repetition.
The crawling out of the woodwork we are seeing now is purely because it's hit home and you want to back what you perceive is one of your team.
What's inaccurate about the statement:
"Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200."
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Shopping in Sainsburys Beckton and as 11am approached, the store announced they were going to observe the two minute silence. When 11am came I was bent over a shopping trolley arguing with some leeks (as you do), the staff stopped, 95% of the shoppers stopped. Those who didn't were people using the self-service checkout including one young man carrying on his phone conversation with his headphones on and three or four elderly couples who just carried on with their shopping. I must confess I didn't think charitable thoughts toward the elderly at that point.
On the way up to Wanstead for a late lunch, saw a dozen women with flags and banners heading for Manor Park to catch the train into London replete with Palestinian flags and placards.
Wanstead about as far removed from East Ham socially and culturally as you can imagine - a group of scouts outside Tesco selling poppies.
The bus home - rammed with people heading for Diwali events.
If it's any consolation the elderly in question might have been deaf and not realised the announcement.
Yes that did occur to me as well. Hearing problems increase and become acute with age yet so many just continue without seeking help. I note an increasing number of opticians are also now offering audiology services.
One prediction: Leon will be on here at some point highlighting even the slightest issue.
But I am here. And you’re trying to frame a narrative in a. way that I can see - with my own eyes - is completely preposterous
There is a big crowd to my left shooting fireworks everywhere. The riot police do nothing because there’s nothing they can do. They can’t arrest 10,000 people. The marchers have been asked to go home and they are refusing
You've gone looking for trouble from the Pro-Palestinian side and predictably, amid a crowd of hundreds of thousands, you've found it.
We all appreciated there could be trouble; the surprise is that so far there has not been more.
Meanwhile you've dismissed the neo-Nazis as "200 pathetic, drunk football hooligans".
Forgive me if I take my news from proper journalists, not some right-wing extremist with an axe to grind.
I see this predictable dismissal got four equally predictable likes from the usual suspects.
@Leon is quite right in his response to you and, despite his strong political views, I actually trust him to report the situation on the ground accurately.
My honest appraisal is that 90% of the “football hooligans” are truculent idiots looking for a fight and 10% are actual patriots feeling concern. At the same time 90% of the pro-Palestine marchers are peaceful, amiable, perhaps ill advised but well meaning and only 5-10% are sinister menacing types - all in black, masked, punchy, tinged with some real hostility - anti semitism or whatever
But do the maths
That means you’ve got 180 twattish football hooligans and 15-30,000 sinister quasi-Islamists on the streets of London
Yes, that feels about right.
Also worth noting that, due to those numbers, the police will move in on the former today and the latter later in days to come.
It's the only thing they can do given the numbers.
I think that’s right. Police have already said they are better served recording most hate crimes on camera and arresting later, unless there is an imminent threat to public order.
I have to admit after the string of abject failures in the Met over the last few years they seem to have done a very good job today.
Yes, I agree.
It's a very difficult job they've had, and I can fully believe the abuse from both sides.
I personally witnessed a drunk coked up EDL type abuse a policeman with a stream of cuss words “you fucking loser I bet you’ve got a tiny dick why don’t you go home” and the copper calmly replied “sir, I suggest you stop swearing and go and join your friends”. That was in Parliament square
An hour later down in Vauxhall the Islamist wankers were shouting at the coppers “you racist fascist scum, you Nazis” and so on - one of them had a megaphone. Again the police looked on calmly and imperviously - only arresting those who actually got violent
We are too critical of British police. Even the Met. They do a thankless task and they often do it well
I wonder how they train for that. It must be hard.
Do they get a sergeant to shout the most vile abuse at constables for an hour in a confined space, and anyone who blinks fails?
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
Here we go again using "Asperger's" as an offensive casual insult.
You clearly haven't ignored what @Sunil_Prasannan writes about politics, otherwise you wouldn't have responded to his post.
It's accurate, I'm afraid.
Moral right isn't a crude numbers balancing game, and that's before you get into confirmation bias over the sources. That's what lies behind it - together with some strange reception class level attempts at trolling - and it just gets boring through repetition.
The crawling out of the woodwork we are seeing now is purely because it's hit home and you want to back what you perceive is one of your team.
With respect, CR I think you have this one wrong. It'll likely be more because he has an autistic son and feels it shouldn't be brandished as a casual insult.
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
Here we go again using "Asperger's" as an offensive casual insult.
You clearly haven't ignored what @Sunil_Prasannan writes about politics, otherwise you wouldn't have responded to his post.
It's accurate, I'm afraid.
Moral right isn't a crude numbers balancing game, and that's before you get into confirmation bias over the sources. That's what lies behind it - together with some strange reception class level attempts at trolling - and it just gets boring through repetition.
The crawling out of the woodwork we are seeing now is purely because it's hit home and you want to back what you perceive is one of your team.
With respect, CR I think you have this one wrong. It'll likely be more because he has an autistic son and feels it shouldn't be brandished as a casual insult.
It's not an insult; it's an accurate description of the poster, as he'd admit himself.
It reduces arguments to crude number counts, that back moral certainties, rather than the deep ambiguity and fundamentally different motives that actually exist.
Early days but it "seems" today has gone about as well as might have been expected.
The huge pro-Palestinian march appears to have been relatively peaceful with the trouble coming from the EDL and it seems some with connections to football clubs (one might hope if the clubs find out so-called supporters are involved they will take some action).
However, it seems (at this point) to have been a success for the Metropolitan Police and a good start for Sir Mark Rowley. The cost of today will no doubt be quietly released down the line but the relative absence of significant trouble so far would seem to have vindicated the operational planning.
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
Here we go again using "Asperger's" as an offensive casual insult.
You clearly haven't ignored what @Sunil_Prasannan writes about politics, otherwise you wouldn't have responded to his post.
It's accurate, I'm afraid.
Moral right isn't a crude numbers balancing game, and that's before you get into confirmation bias over the sources. That's what lies behind it - together with some strange reception class level attempts at trolling - and it just gets boring through repetition.
The crawling out of the woodwork we are seeing now is purely because it's hit home and you want to back what you perceive is one of your team.
My outrage at posters using Asperger's as a cheap aside to deride someone they disagree with has been well documented. A particular poster often used to claim Mrs May's awkward demeanour was because "she is on the spectrum". I called him out then, and I will call you out now. I have skin in this game, so kindly desist with your nasty slurs.
Now if you don't mind I will crawl back into the woodwork.
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
You don't mean "with respect" at all. Just not on.
You can put away your synthetic outrage back in your pocket, where it belongs.
Despite not being on the site (for days) I saw @kinabalu try to insinuate I was a racist the day before yesterday, the basis of his argument being that I'm "anti-woke". Only one person called him out, and it wasn't you.
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
Ok, please give me an example of the BBC publishing 'absolute lies as truth'.
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
Here we go again using "Asperger's" as an offensive casual insult.
You clearly haven't ignored what @Sunil_Prasannan writes about politics, otherwise you wouldn't have responded to his post.
It's accurate, I'm afraid.
Moral right isn't a crude numbers balancing game, and that's before you get into confirmation bias over the sources. That's what lies behind it - together with some strange reception class level attempts at trolling - and it just gets boring through repetition.
The crawling out of the woodwork we are seeing now is purely because it's hit home and you want to back what you perceive is one of your team.
What's inaccurate about the statement:
"Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200."
It's largely irrelevant, proportionality isn't a numbers game. Israel is *not* entitled to retaliate by killing the same number of Palestinians. What it is entitled to do is to destroy Hamas's means of waging war.
One prediction: Leon will be on here at some point highlighting even the slightest issue.
But I am here. And you’re trying to frame a narrative in a. way that I can see - with my own eyes - is completely preposterous
There is a big crowd to my left shooting fireworks everywhere. The riot police do nothing because there’s nothing they can do. They can’t arrest 10,000 people. The marchers have been asked to go home and they are refusing
You've gone looking for trouble from the Pro-Palestinian side and predictably, amid a crowd of hundreds of thousands, you've found it.
We all appreciated there could be trouble; the surprise is that so far there has not been more.
Meanwhile you've dismissed the neo-Nazis as "200 pathetic, drunk football hooligans".
Forgive me if I take my news from proper journalists, not some right-wing extremist with an axe to grind.
I see this predictable dismissal got four equally predictable likes from the usual suspects.
@Leon is quite right in his response to you and, despite his strong political views, I actually trust him to report the situation on the ground accurately.
My honest appraisal is that 90% of the “football hooligans” are truculent idiots looking for a fight and 10% are actual patriots feeling concern. At the same time 90% of the pro-Palestine marchers are peaceful, amiable, perhaps ill advised but well meaning and only 5-10% are sinister menacing types - all in black, masked, punchy, tinged with some real hostility - anti semitism or whatever
But do the maths
That means you’ve got 180 twattish football hooligans and 15-30,000 sinister quasi-Islamists on the streets of London
Yes, that feels about right.
Also worth noting that, due to those numbers, the police will move in on the former today and the latter later in days to come.
It's the only thing they can do given the numbers.
I think that’s right. Police have already said they are better served recording most hate crimes on camera and arresting later, unless there is an imminent threat to public order.
I have to admit after the string of abject failures in the Met over the last few years they seem to have done a very good job today.
Yes, I agree.
It's a very difficult job they've had, and I can fully believe the abuse from both sides.
I personally witnessed a drunk coked up EDL type abuse a policeman with a stream of cuss words “you fucking loser I bet you’ve got a tiny dick why don’t you go home” and the copper calmly replied “sir, I suggest you stop swearing and go and join your friends”. That was in Parliament square
An hour later down in Vauxhall the Islamist wankers were shouting at the coppers “you racist fascist scum, you Nazis” and so on - one of them had a megaphone. Again the police looked on calmly and imperviously - only arresting those who actually got violent
We are too critical of British police. Even the Met. They do a thankless task and they often do it well
I wonder how they train for that. It must be hard.
Do they get a sergeant to shout the most vile abuse at constables for an hour in a confined space, and anyone who blinks fails?
Must be. Or something slightly similar to it.
I don’t know. But it is properly impressive
I made sure to be nice to the cops whenever I could! Saying Thankyou and Good job etc
Also I wanted them around me at scary moments
The irony of course is that any of the twats abusing them would be begging for police help if they got isolated in the wrong crowd
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
Ok, please give me an example of the BBC publishing 'absolute lies as truth'.
Just about any of their reporting on it stuff qualifies
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
Ok, please give me an example of the BBC publishing 'absolute lies as truth'.
Just about any of their reporting on it stuff qualifies
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
Ok, please give me an example of the BBC publishing 'absolute lies as truth'.
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
You don't mean "with respect" at all. Just not on.
You can put away your synthetic outrage back in your pocket, where it belongs.
Despite not being on the site (for days) I saw @kinabalu try to insinuate I was a racist the day before yesterday, the basis of his argument being that I'm "anti-woke". Only one person called him out, and it wasn't you.
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
Ok, please give me an example of the BBC publishing 'absolute lies as truth'.
Just about any of their reporting on it stuff qualifies
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
Here we go again using "Asperger's" as an offensive casual insult.
You clearly haven't ignored what @Sunil_Prasannan writes about politics, otherwise you wouldn't have responded to his post.
It's accurate, I'm afraid.
Moral right isn't a crude numbers balancing game, and that's before you get into confirmation bias over the sources. That's what lies behind it - together with some strange reception class level attempts at trolling - and it just gets boring through repetition.
The crawling out of the woodwork we are seeing now is purely because it's hit home and you want to back what you perceive is one of your team.
What's inaccurate about the statement:
"Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200."
It's largely irrelevant, proportionality isn't a numbers game. Israel is *not* entitled to retaliate by killing the same number of Palestinians. What it is entitled to do is to destroy Hamas's means of waging war.
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
You don't mean "with respect" at all. Just not on.
You can put away your synthetic outrage back in your pocket, where it belongs.
Despite not being on the site (for days) I saw @kinabalu try to insinuate I was a racist the day before yesterday, the basis of his argument being that I'm "anti-woke". Only one person called him out, and it wasn't you.
The silence from posters like you was deafening.
Eh? I'm pretty sure @kinabalu said specifically that you weren't a racist iin his opinion!
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
Ok, please give me an example of the BBC publishing 'absolute lies as truth'.
Just about any of their reporting on it stuff qualifies
Such as?
It's bollocks Sunil, Pagan just comes out with this crap, evidence is not required.
One prediction: Leon will be on here at some point highlighting even the slightest issue.
But I am here. And you’re trying to frame a narrative in a. way that I can see - with my own eyes - is completely preposterous
There is a big crowd to my left shooting fireworks everywhere. The riot police do nothing because there’s nothing they can do. They can’t arrest 10,000 people. The marchers have been asked to go home and they are refusing
You've gone looking for trouble from the Pro-Palestinian side and predictably, amid a crowd of hundreds of thousands, you've found it.
We all appreciated there could be trouble; the surprise is that so far there has not been more.
Meanwhile you've dismissed the neo-Nazis as "200 pathetic, drunk football hooligans".
Forgive me if I take my news from proper journalists, not some right-wing extremist with an axe to grind.
I see this predictable dismissal got four equally predictable likes from the usual suspects.
@Leon is quite right in his response to you and, despite his strong political views, I actually trust him to report the situation on the ground accurately.
My honest appraisal is that 90% of the “football hooligans” are truculent idiots looking for a fight and 10% are actual patriots feeling concern. At the same time 90% of the pro-Palestine marchers are peaceful, amiable, perhaps ill advised but well meaning and only 5-10% are sinister menacing types - all in black, masked, punchy, tinged with some real hostility - anti semitism or whatever
But do the maths
That means you’ve got 180 twattish football hooligans and 15-30,000 sinister quasi-Islamists on the streets of London
Yes, that feels about right.
Also worth noting that, due to those numbers, the police will move in on the former today and the latter later in days to come.
It's the only thing they can do given the numbers.
I think that’s right. Police have already said they are better served recording most hate crimes on camera and arresting later, unless there is an imminent threat to public order.
I have to admit after the string of abject failures in the Met over the last few years they seem to have done a very good job today.
Yes, I agree.
It's a very difficult job they've had, and I can fully believe the abuse from both sides.
I personally witnessed a drunk coked up EDL type abuse a policeman with a stream of cuss words “you fucking loser I bet you’ve got a tiny dick why don’t you go home” and the copper calmly replied “sir, I suggest you stop swearing and go and join your friends”. That was in Parliament square
An hour later down in Vauxhall the Islamist wankers were shouting at the coppers “you racist fascist scum, you Nazis” and so on - one of them had a megaphone. Again the police looked on calmly and imperviously - only arresting those who actually got violent
We are too critical of British police. Even the Met. They do a thankless task and they often do it well
We hear plenty about the 2% (ok, may 5% in the Met) of racist, corrupt, mysoginistic, authoritarian police officers. We don’t hear about the 98% of decent coppers just trying to do a difficult job because they want their patch to be a place where ordinary folk like themselves can go about their business in safety.
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
Ok, please give me an example of the BBC publishing 'absolute lies as truth'.
Erhhh, a couple of weeks ago...Gaza....hospital...500 dead...BBC journalist, this had to be Israel, only Israel could cause this kind of damage.
Sees "massive crater" and its the size of a pot hole. Then BBC Gaza reporter says they are still carrying the dead out because there are so many over 24hrs later, no actual footage despite being there, because well, it was 30 people and a few cars.
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
Ok, please give me an example of the BBC publishing 'absolute lies as truth'.
Just about any of their reporting on it stuff qualifies
Oh right, that's convinced me.
I reallly dont care if you dont believe me. I am happy in my opinion that all main stream media is totally lying. You go on believing your sources are telling you the truth and carry on being totally deluded
Sums things up in a nutshell... (((Dan Hodges))) @DPJHodges · 1h In any other context the Left say “if a minority community say they find something offensive or oppressive we must respect that and listen to their lived experience”. Then we have “From the River to the Sea”. At which point it becomes “shut up, we’ll decide what it means”.
I don't agree with the view that just because a group finds something offensive it automatically should be accepted as such (though it should be reasonably considered when deciding it), but it is a fair point that those who do adopt that approach cannot reasonably reject it for one specific area or group.
For me the key indicator it is an offensive slogan is the attempts made to modulate it, the 'between the river and the sea' variant seen a bit recently. It's a tacit admission the original being seen as problematic has some acceptance behind it, so best to adjust.
From the Mersey to the Dee, Cheshire will be free!
Good times - a government administrative reorganisation that, whilst not perfect or complete, has been positive and effective for many areas.
'Cheshire West and Cheshire' still remains one of the stupidest and clumsiest names imaginable for a county.
Why didn't they just call them 'Chester' and 'Crewe?'
Yes, it's a tautology. Chester is in West Cheshire. West Cheshire is tge western half of the county of Chester. Either half of the name would have done. Though 'Crewe' is more of a stretch. My main complaint about Cheshire East is that East Cheshire would have been better.
Anyway, 'From the Pennines to the Dee' would work better.
From the Pennines to the Dee Let's stop and have a cup of tea
By the way, Cheshire is absolutely heartbreakingly beautiful today. I've been to Lymm. You can see why people take to religion on a day like this: you need something to thank for such beauty.
My parents have spectacular views of the Cheshire plain from their kitchen window. When the sun sets in the west over the Welsh mountains it’s genuinely special.
I'm assuming they've moved in from Timperley then! One of my favourite views is of the sunset over Cheshire from the western fringes of tge Peak District. Lucky them that they get that view without even having to leave the house. I often wish I'd been more romantic in my choice of where to live. Sale is all well and good, but the only real view of the sunset is from the footbridge over the M60. Young people: when it comes to putting down roots, choose somewhere with hills.
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
Here we go again using "Asperger's" as an offensive casual insult.
You clearly haven't ignored what @Sunil_Prasannan writes about politics, otherwise you wouldn't have responded to his post.
It's accurate, I'm afraid.
Moral right isn't a crude numbers balancing game, and that's before you get into confirmation bias over the sources. That's what lies behind it - together with some strange reception class level attempts at trolling - and it just gets boring through repetition.
The crawling out of the woodwork we are seeing now is purely because it's hit home and you want to back what you perceive is one of your team.
What's inaccurate about the statement:
"Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200."
I don't think there's anything wrong with that statement; and it's actually to Israel's credit that they have updated the figures.
But it's also rather irrelevant? It doesn't make what Hamas did any less of an atrocity.
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
Here we go again using "Asperger's" as an offensive casual insult.
You clearly haven't ignored what @Sunil_Prasannan writes about politics, otherwise you wouldn't have responded to his post.
It's accurate, I'm afraid.
Moral right isn't a crude numbers balancing game, and that's before you get into confirmation bias over the sources. That's what lies behind it - together with some strange reception class level attempts at trolling - and it just gets boring through repetition.
The crawling out of the woodwork we are seeing now is purely because it's hit home and you want to back what you perceive is one of your team.
What's inaccurate about the statement:
"Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200."
It's largely irrelevant, proportionality isn't a numbers game. Israel is *not* entitled to retaliate by killing the same number of Palestinians. What it is entitled to do is to destroy Hamas's means of waging war.
Bombing children is NOT self-defence.
No it isn't, but when your enemy digs in among the civilian population, you have a hard choice. And there will always be civilian casualties in any military operation. Estimates on this site have suggested Israel needs to kill ~30,000 Hamas fighters, you would expect a broadly proportionate level of civilian casualties.
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
You don't mean "with respect" at all. Just not on.
You can put away your synthetic outrage back in your pocket, where it belongs.
Despite not being on the site (for days) I saw @kinabalu try to insinuate I was a racist the day before yesterday, the basis of his argument being that I'm "anti-woke". Only one person called him out, and it wasn't you.
The silence from posters like you was deafening.
Eh? I'm pretty sure @kinabalu said specifically that you weren't a racist iin his opinion!
No, I read it, and the inference was very clear.
I was quite restrained in not responding to it, I thought. I can't guarantee I will continue to be if it happens again.
Early days but it "seems" today has gone about as well as might have been expected.
The huge pro-Palestinian march appears to have been relatively peaceful with the trouble coming from the EDL and it seems some with connections to football clubs (one might hope if the clubs find out so-called supporters are involved they will take some action).
However, it seems (at this point) to have been a success for the Metropolitan Police and a good start for Sir Mark Rowley. The cost of today will no doubt be quietly released down the line but the relative absence of significant trouble so far would seem to have vindicated the operational planning.
Also, a reminder that, historically, most violence has been perpetrated by the right, not the left.
One prediction: Leon will be on here at some point highlighting even the slightest issue.
But I am here. And you’re trying to frame a narrative in a. way that I can see - with my own eyes - is completely preposterous
There is a big crowd to my left shooting fireworks everywhere. The riot police do nothing because there’s nothing they can do. They can’t arrest 10,000 people. The marchers have been asked to go home and they are refusing
You've gone looking for trouble from the Pro-Palestinian side and predictably, amid a crowd of hundreds of thousands, you've found it.
We all appreciated there could be trouble; the surprise is that so far there has not been more.
Meanwhile you've dismissed the neo-Nazis as "200 pathetic, drunk football hooligans".
Forgive me if I take my news from proper journalists, not some right-wing extremist with an axe to grind.
I see this predictable dismissal got four equally predictable likes from the usual suspects.
@Leon is quite right in his response to you and, despite his strong political views, I actually trust him to report the situation on the ground accurately.
My honest appraisal is that 90% of the “football hooligans” are truculent idiots looking for a fight and 10% are actual patriots feeling concern. At the same time 90% of the pro-Palestine marchers are peaceful, amiable, perhaps ill advised but well meaning and only 5-10% are sinister menacing types - all in black, masked, punchy, tinged with some real hostility - anti semitism or whatever
But do the maths
That means you’ve got 180 twattish football hooligans and 15-30,000 sinister quasi-Islamists on the streets of London
Yes, that feels about right.
Also worth noting that, due to those numbers, the police will move in on the former today and the latter later in days to come.
It's the only thing they can do given the numbers.
I think that’s right. Police have already said they are better served recording most hate crimes on camera and arresting later, unless there is an imminent threat to public order.
I have to admit after the string of abject failures in the Met over the last few years they seem to have done a very good job today.
Yes, I agree.
It's a very difficult job they've had, and I can fully believe the abuse from both sides.
I personally witnessed a drunk coked up EDL type abuse a policeman with a stream of cuss words “you fucking loser I bet you’ve got a tiny dick why don’t you go home” and the copper calmly replied “sir, I suggest you stop swearing and go and join your friends”. That was in Parliament square
An hour later down in Vauxhall the Islamist wankers were shouting at the coppers “you racist fascist scum, you Nazis” and so on - one of them had a megaphone. Again the police looked on calmly and imperviously - only arresting those who actually got violent
We are too critical of British police. Even the Met. They do a thankless task and they often do it well
We hear plenty about the 2% (ok, may 5% in the Met) of racist, corrupt, mysoginistic, authoritarian police officers. We don’t hear about the 98% of decent coppers just trying to do a difficult job because they want their patch to be a place where ordinary folk like themselves can go about their business in safety.
As has often been said, you need to experience the police anywhere else in the world - America, France, Russia, Brazil, Italy, China, India - and then you realise how lucky we are to have British police
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
You don't mean "with respect" at all. Just not on.
You can put away your synthetic outrage back in your pocket, where it belongs.
Despite not being on the site (for days) I saw @kinabalu try to insinuate I was a racist the day before yesterday, the basis of his argument being that I'm "anti-woke". Only one person called him out, and it wasn't you.
The silence from posters like you was deafening.
Eh? I'm pretty sure @kinabalu said specifically that you weren't a racist iin his opinion!
I was struck by that, too, so went back to check.
This was the comment: … But there’s a difference between you and (eg) him. The reason he (CR) can’t stand ‘woke’ is he thinks it makes everything about race, which is counterproductive and racist in itself. I think it’s a bad take myself but there’s no question he’s sincere. You call tell he is because other than in discussions about ‘woke’ he never mentions race. He doesn’t think it’s a factor in anything, and if it is it shouldn’t be, so you don’t find him banging on about it. Same with lots of other antiwokies…
I think CR likely misinterpreted the slightly ambiguous bolded bit. It’s fairly clearly NOT saying CR is racist, but it’s easy to see how it might be read the wrong way.
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
Ok, please give me an example of the BBC publishing 'absolute lies as truth'.
Just about any of their reporting on it stuff qualifies
Such as?
It's bollocks Sunil, Pagan just comes out with this crap, evidence is not required.
I am not defending any main stream media as a source of truth neither left nor right. You however are defending the bbc because they share your views....go figure who is correct...clue its not you
Early days but it "seems" today has gone about as well as might have been expected.
The huge pro-Palestinian march appears to have been relatively peaceful with the trouble coming from the EDL and it seems some with connections to football clubs (one might hope if the clubs find out so-called supporters are involved they will take some action).
However, it seems (at this point) to have been a success for the Metropolitan Police and a good start for Sir Mark Rowley. The cost of today will no doubt be quietly released down the line but the relative absence of significant trouble so far would seem to have vindicated the operational planning.
Also, a reminder that, historically, most violence has been perpetrated by the right, not the left.
One prediction: Leon will be on here at some point highlighting even the slightest issue.
But I am here. And you’re trying to frame a narrative in a. way that I can see - with my own eyes - is completely preposterous
There is a big crowd to my left shooting fireworks everywhere. The riot police do nothing because there’s nothing they can do. They can’t arrest 10,000 people. The marchers have been asked to go home and they are refusing
You've gone looking for trouble from the Pro-Palestinian side and predictably, amid a crowd of hundreds of thousands, you've found it.
We all appreciated there could be trouble; the surprise is that so far there has not been more.
Meanwhile you've dismissed the neo-Nazis as "200 pathetic, drunk football hooligans".
Forgive me if I take my news from proper journalists, not some right-wing extremist with an axe to grind.
I see this predictable dismissal got four equally predictable likes from the usual suspects.
@Leon is quite right in his response to you and, despite his strong political views, I actually trust him to report the situation on the ground accurately.
Of course you do. It iis what you want to believe.
No. I genuinely believe @Leon to be fair in his reporting and to report back what he sees on the ground. For example, the fairness of the police. I don't doubt he'd be quick to report on the activities of Tommy Robinson and his ilk if he saw it.
The bigger question is those being so quick to dismiss what he says because it's inconvenient for them.
The idea that #leon would give an unbiased view had me rolling around laughing.
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
Here we go again using "Asperger's" as an offensive casual insult.
You clearly haven't ignored what @Sunil_Prasannan writes about politics, otherwise you wouldn't have responded to his post.
It's accurate, I'm afraid.
Moral right isn't a crude numbers balancing game, and that's before you get into confirmation bias over the sources. That's what lies behind it - together with some strange reception class level attempts at trolling - and it just gets boring through repetition.
The crawling out of the woodwork we are seeing now is purely because it's hit home and you want to back what you perceive is one of your team.
What's inaccurate about the statement:
"Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200."
It's largely irrelevant, proportionality isn't a numbers game. Israel is *not* entitled to retaliate by killing the same number of Palestinians. What it is entitled to do is to destroy Hamas's means of waging war.
Bombing children is NOT self-defence.
No it isn't, but when your enemy digs in among the civilian population, you have a hard choice. And there will always be civilian casualties in any military operation. Estimates on this site have suggested Israel needs to kill ~30,000 Hamas fighters, you would expect a broadly proportionate level of civilian casualties.
Yes, and that's why war is such a tragedy and still, even more tragically, sometimes still necessary.
Israel couldn't do anything else but respond to the cold-blooded murder of over 1,000 of it citizens - and abduction of nearly 250 more - without a security operation to destroy Hamas's command and infrastructure.
What else was it supposed to do? Shrug it all off, leave the hostages to their fate, and rebuild the border fence?
Ludicrous.
It has been overzealous its bombing, and a little too careless of some of the refuge areas, but given what war is and how Hamas operates - who won't oblige them by exposing themselves in the open to be neatly vaporised without collateral, and are quite happy to take shelter in hospitals and civil centres because it suits them - serious civilian casualties were inevitable.
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
Here we go again using "Asperger's" as an offensive casual insult.
You clearly haven't ignored what @Sunil_Prasannan writes about politics, otherwise you wouldn't have responded to his post.
It's accurate, I'm afraid.
Moral right isn't a crude numbers balancing game, and that's before you get into confirmation bias over the sources. That's what lies behind it - together with some strange reception class level attempts at trolling - and it just gets boring through repetition.
The crawling out of the woodwork we are seeing now is purely because it's hit home and you want to back what you perceive is one of your team.
What's inaccurate about the statement:
"Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200."
It's the number of dead, not the number of victims, so it doesn't include any of: - the hostages - the wounded - the families of those killed, wounded or take hostage
In addition, every one of the nearly 10,000 rockets Hamas has fired at Israel since that day is a war crime (since they're specifically targeting civilian areas), so the number of "victims" (ie, anyone who's had their lives disrupted by air raid sirens) is actually in the millions.
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
Ok, please give me an example of the BBC publishing 'absolute lies as truth'.
Just about any of their reporting on it stuff qualifies
Oh right, that's convinced me.
I reallly dont care if you dont believe me. I am happy in my opinion that all main stream media is totally lying. You go on believing your sources are telling you the truth and carry on being totally deluded
On PB, were are (mostly) blessed to be able to listen to BBC, ITV, Channel 4, RT, GB News, Al Jazeera and France 24, and sift the truth from the propaganda. Unfortunately, many people choose the news outlet they most agree with and accept their commentary as the truth.
Early days but it "seems" today has gone about as well as might have been expected.
The huge pro-Palestinian march appears to have been relatively peaceful with the trouble coming from the EDL and it seems some with connections to football clubs (one might hope if the clubs find out so-called supporters are involved they will take some action).
However, it seems (at this point) to have been a success for the Metropolitan Police and a good start for Sir Mark Rowley. The cost of today will no doubt be quietly released down the line but the relative absence of significant trouble so far would seem to have vindicated the operational planning.
Also, a reminder that, historically, most violence has been perpetrated by the right, not the left.
Michael Collins, Rosa Luxemburg and Vladimir Ulyanov would be most disappointed to hear you say that.
One prediction: Leon will be on here at some point highlighting even the slightest issue.
But I am here. And you’re trying to frame a narrative in a. way that I can see - with my own eyes - is completely preposterous
There is a big crowd to my left shooting fireworks everywhere. The riot police do nothing because there’s nothing they can do. They can’t arrest 10,000 people. The marchers have been asked to go home and they are refusing
You've gone looking for trouble from the Pro-Palestinian side and predictably, amid a crowd of hundreds of thousands, you've found it.
We all appreciated there could be trouble; the surprise is that so far there has not been more.
Meanwhile you've dismissed the neo-Nazis as "200 pathetic, drunk football hooligans".
Forgive me if I take my news from proper journalists, not some right-wing extremist with an axe to grind.
I see this predictable dismissal got four equally predictable likes from the usual suspects.
@Leon is quite right in his response to you and, despite his strong political views, I actually trust him to report the situation on the ground accurately.
Of course you do. It iis what you want to believe.
No. I genuinely believe @Leon to be fair in his reporting and to report back what he sees on the ground. For example, the fairness of the police. I don't doubt he'd be quick to report on the activities of Tommy Robinson and his ilk if he saw it.
The bigger question is those being so quick to dismiss what he says because it's inconvenient for them.
The idea that #leon would give an unbiased view had me rolling around laughing.
In reality, the report of one individual, however perceptive and unbiased, about a protest involving several hundred thousand, isn’t objective in any real sense. Leon is probably as good (or poor) an eyewitness as any of us, though.
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
Here we go again using "Asperger's" as an offensive casual insult.
You clearly haven't ignored what @Sunil_Prasannan writes about politics, otherwise you wouldn't have responded to his post.
It's accurate, I'm afraid.
Moral right isn't a crude numbers balancing game, and that's before you get into confirmation bias over the sources. That's what lies behind it - together with some strange reception class level attempts at trolling - and it just gets boring through repetition.
The crawling out of the woodwork we are seeing now is purely because it's hit home and you want to back what you perceive is one of your team.
My outrage at posters using Asperger's as a cheap aside to deride someone they disagree with has been well documented. A particular poster often used to claim Mrs May's awkward demeanour was because "she is on the spectrum". I called him out then, and I will call you out now. I have skin in this game, so kindly desist with your nasty slurs.
Now if you don't mind I will crawl back into the woodwork.
You go right ahead, it's where suits you best.
And there was me, anticipating a contrite apology for misrepresenting my post as chumocratic wokery.
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
You don't mean "with respect" at all. Just not on.
You can put away your synthetic outrage back in your pocket, where it belongs.
Despite not being on the site (for days) I saw @kinabalu try to insinuate I was a racist the day before yesterday, the basis of his argument being that I'm "anti-woke". Only one person called him out, and it wasn't you.
The silence from posters like you was deafening.
Eh? I'm pretty sure @kinabalu said specifically that you weren't a racist iin his opinion!
No, I read it, and the inference was very clear.
I was quite restrained in not responding to it, I thought. I can't guarantee I will continue to be if it happens again.
Fckn hell, talk about stubbornly inserting the wrong end of the stick. Kinabalu can speak for himself but this is what he wrote. Fwiw (I sense you're not in the mood to accept a backhanded compliment) I agree with him.
'The reason he (CR) can’t stand ‘woke’ is he thinks it makes everything about race, which is counterproductive and racist in itself. I think it’s a bad take myself but there’s no question he’s sincere. You call tell he is because other than in discussions about ‘woke’ he never mentions race. He doesn’t think it’s a factor in anything, and if it is it shouldn’t be, so you don’t find him banging on about it.'
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
Ok, please give me an example of the BBC publishing 'absolute lies as truth'.
Just about any of their reporting on it stuff qualifies
Oh right, that's convinced me.
I reallly dont care if you dont believe me. I am happy in my opinion that all main stream media is totally lying. You go on believing your sources are telling you the truth and carry on being totally deluded
On PB, were are (mostly) blessed to be able to listen to BBC, ITV, Channel 4, RT, GB News, Al Jazeera and France 24, and sift the truth from the propaganda. Unfortunately, many people choose the news outlet they most agree with and accept their commentary as the truth.
My point exactly there is no main stream media anymore that does not bow to an agenda. Maybe there never was and we just didnt know because it was our only source
Officers have detained a breakaway group of around 150 people from the pro-Palestinian demonstration in Grosvenor Place.
The group were firing fireworks and many are wearing face coverings. Officers are using their Section 60 and 60AA powers to detain and search those involved.
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
Here we go again using "Asperger's" as an offensive casual insult.
You clearly haven't ignored what @Sunil_Prasannan writes about politics, otherwise you wouldn't have responded to his post.
It's accurate, I'm afraid.
Moral right isn't a crude numbers balancing game, and that's before you get into confirmation bias over the sources. That's what lies behind it - together with some strange reception class level attempts at trolling - and it just gets boring through repetition.
The crawling out of the woodwork we are seeing now is purely because it's hit home and you want to back what you perceive is one of your team.
What's inaccurate about the statement:
"Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200."
It's largely irrelevant, proportionality isn't a numbers game. Israel is *not* entitled to retaliate by killing the same number of Palestinians. What it is entitled to do is to destroy Hamas's means of waging war.
Entitled does not really matter, and in any case arbiters may differ. The realpolitik is that Israel can do more-or-less what it, or what Netanyahu, wants. It might be counterproductive but even that depends on what is the long term aim, assuming there is one. Similarly Hamas has done what it did, for who knows what purpose.
Despite failing to win a parliamentary seat before, though he came close in Thanet in 2015, Farage did at one stage lead a party which led the Tories and Labour in some polls in June 2019 after May delayed Brexit in the form of the Brexit Party. He also one the European elections in 2019 and in 2014 too with UKIP.
I highly doubt he will ever be Conservative leader though, CCHQ would block him getting on the parliamentary candidates list for starters unless say Braverman or Rees Mogg were Tory leader
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
Ok, please give me an example of the BBC publishing 'absolute lies as truth'.
Just about any of their reporting on it stuff qualifies
Such as?
It's bollocks Sunil, Pagan just comes out with this crap, evidence is not required.
I am not defending any main stream media as a source of truth neither left nor right. You however are defending the bbc because they share your views....go figure who is correct...clue its not you
Point 1. I haven't actually defended the BBC, I merely challenged your rather silly view that they are on a par with Russia Today. You don't think that a media outlet funded by Putin is likely to be rather more biased than one committed by the laws of the UK to be unbiased? I am not saying the BBC is perfect, far from it but it would be interesting to see many others on PB rate the BBC as no more reliable than RT.
Point 2. If you feel you cannot rely on any main stream media for the truth you might as well just give up because you're never going to be able to determine the truth. Or do you have some non-mainstream media you trust?
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
Ok, please give me an example of the BBC publishing 'absolute lies as truth'.
Just about any of their reporting on it stuff qualifies
Oh right, that's convinced me.
I reallly dont care if you dont believe me. I am happy in my opinion that all main stream media is totally lying. You go on believing your sources are telling you the truth and carry on being totally deluded
On PB, were are (mostly) blessed to be able to listen to BBC, ITV, Channel 4, RT, GB News, Al Jazeera and France 24, and sift the truth from the propaganda. Unfortunately, many people choose the news outlet they most agree with and accept their commentary as the truth.
My point exactly there is no main stream media anymore that does not bow to an agenda. Maybe there never was and we just didnt know because it was our only source
That's probably true - looking for the complete, unvarnished truth in the broadcast media is akin to looking for completely objective commentary and analysis on PB.
You won't find it.
One option is to try and sift through all the "truths" to try to find something that's objective but it bumps up against your agenda (everyone has one). You can either find a truth that matches yours and accept it or accept there is no absolute truth and try to weigh up all the accounts and analysis as disapassionately as possible to reach a conclusion.
The former is easier and that's why a lot of people go down that road. The latter takes time and thought.
Shopping in Sainsburys Beckton and as 11am approached, the store announced they were going to observe the two minute silence. When 11am came I was bent over a shopping trolley arguing with some leeks (as you do), the staff stopped, 95% of the shoppers stopped. Those who didn't were people using the self-service checkout including one young man carrying on his phone conversation with his headphones on and three or four elderly couples who just carried on with their shopping. I must confess I didn't think charitable thoughts toward the elderly at that point.
On the way up to Wanstead for a late lunch, saw a dozen women with flags and banners heading for Manor Park to catch the train into London replete with Palestinian flags and placards.
Wanstead about as far removed from East Ham socially and culturally as you can imagine - a group of scouts outside Tesco selling poppies.
The bus home - rammed with people heading for Diwali events.
Lots of family Diwali fireworks round here tonight. Five minutes from there, then five from somewhere else, and so on for the past hour or so.
Officers have detained a breakaway group of around 150 people from the pro-Palestinian demonstration in Grosvenor Place.
The group were firing fireworks and many are wearing face coverings. Officers are using their Section 60 and 60AA powers to detain and search those involved.
Officers have detained a breakaway group of around 150 people from the pro-Palestinian demonstration in Grosvenor Place.
The group were firing fireworks and many are wearing face coverings. Officers are using their Section 60 and 60AA powers to detain and search those involved.
Leon, Flinter Knappers Gazette, our man on the spot.
Indeed. What did I say
Listen to the BBC and the march was all kumbaya and lovely people singing Imagine. Listen to me and there are nasty wankers shooting fireworks and much else
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
You don't mean "with respect" at all. Just not on.
You can put away your synthetic outrage back in your pocket, where it belongs.
Despite not being on the site (for days) I saw @kinabalu try to insinuate I was a racist the day before yesterday, the basis of his argument being that I'm "anti-woke". Only one person called him out, and it wasn't you.
The silence from posters like you was deafening.
Eh? I'm pretty sure @kinabalu said specifically that you weren't a racist iin his opinion!
No, I read it, and the inference was very clear.
I was quite restrained in not responding to it, I thought. I can't guarantee I will continue to be if it happens again.
Fckn hell, talk about stubbornly inserting the wrong end of the stick. Kinabalu can speak for himself but this is what he wrote. Fwiw (I sense you're not in the mood to accept a backhanded compliment) I agree with him.
'The reason he (CR) can’t stand ‘woke’ is he thinks it makes everything about race, which is counterproductive and racist in itself. I think it’s a bad take myself but there’s no question he’s sincere. You call tell he is because other than in discussions about ‘woke’ he never mentions race. He doesn’t think it’s a factor in anything, and if it is it shouldn’t be, so you don’t find him banging on about it.'
To be fair, this - … The reason he (CR) can’t stand ‘woke’ is he thinks it makes everything about race, which is counterproductive and racist in itself... - would have been considerably less ambiguous is written: … The reason he (CR) can’t stand ‘woke’ is he thinks it makes everything about race, which he thinks is counterproductive and racist in itself.
That’s fairly clearly kinablu’s meaning, especially in the context of the rest of the paragraph, but one can see how it might not read like that.
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
Ok, please give me an example of the BBC publishing 'absolute lies as truth'.
Just about any of their reporting on it stuff qualifies
Such as?
It's bollocks Sunil, Pagan just comes out with this crap, evidence is not required.
I am not defending any main stream media as a source of truth neither left nor right. You however are defending the bbc because they share your views....go figure who is correct...clue its not you
Point 1. I haven't actually defended the BBC, I merely challenged your rather silly view that they are on a par with Russia Today. You don't think that a media outlet funded by Putin is likely to be rather more biased than one committed by the laws of the UK to be unbiased? I am not saying the BBC is perfect, far from it but it would be interesting to see many others on PB rate the BBC as no more reliable than RT.
Point 2. If you feel you cannot rely on any main stream media for the truth you might as well just give up because you're never going to be able to determine the truth. Or do you have some non-mainstream media you trust?
Main stream media always has someone steering the strings. The bbc has lied repeatedly about it things so no idea why you think I should give them credence. All main stream media is corrupt and in the arms of those with agenda's...isnt that the left wing trope anyway....tories only get elected because mainstream media attack the assholes you choose as leaders like corbyn?
British values required two things to happen today.
First, that the Armistice service take place without attack or vandalism.
Second, that people be able to exercise their freedom of speech and demonstration without attack. (Whether you agree with their feelings or not)
To date the Met Police seem to have performed their very difficult task with considerable skill and success. Without their recent change of leadership I suspect that things would have gone much worse.
A very good day for British values and for all real British patriots. A very bad day for most members of the Vladimir Putin Fan Club (except Galloway I suppose).
Officers have detained a breakaway group of around 150 people from the pro-Palestinian demonstration in Grosvenor Place.
The group were firing fireworks and many are wearing face coverings. Officers are using their Section 60 and 60AA powers to detain and search those involved.
Leon, Flinter Knappers Gazette, our man on the spot.
Indeed. What did I say
Listen to the BBC and the march was all kumbaya and lovely people singing Imagine. Listen to me and there are nasty wankers shooting fireworks and much else
And who’s right? Me
If you search twitter, you can see there was some nasty stuff going on the fringes,
This man tried to stab @SavaSavadkoohi with a knife today at 3:15 pm at Vauxhall Bridge in London because Sava carried a sign saying “Hamas is Isis”
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
You don't mean "with respect" at all. Just not on.
You can put away your synthetic outrage back in your pocket, where it belongs.
Despite not being on the site (for days) I saw @kinabalu try to insinuate I was a racist the day before yesterday, the basis of his argument being that I'm "anti-woke". Only one person called him out, and it wasn't you.
The silence from posters like you was deafening.
Eh? I'm pretty sure @kinabalu said specifically that you weren't a racist iin his opinion!
No, I read it, and the inference was very clear.
I was quite restrained in not responding to it, I thought. I can't guarantee I will continue to be if it happens again.
Fckn hell, talk about stubbornly inserting the wrong end of the stick. Kinabalu can speak for himself but this is what he wrote. Fwiw (I sense you're not in the mood to accept a backhanded compliment) I agree with him.
'The reason he (CR) can’t stand ‘woke’ is he thinks it makes everything about race, which is counterproductive and racist in itself. I think it’s a bad take myself but there’s no question he’s sincere. You call tell he is because other than in discussions about ‘woke’ he never mentions race. He doesn’t think it’s a factor in anything, and if it is it shouldn’t be, so you don’t find him banging on about it.'
To be fair, this - … The reason he (CR) can’t stand ‘woke’ is he thinks it makes everything about race, which is counterproductive and racist in itself... - would have been considerably less ambiguous is written: … The reason he (CR) can’t stand ‘woke’ is he thinks it makes everything about race, which he thinks is counterproductive and racist in itself.
That’s fairly clearly kinablu’s meaning, especially in the context of the rest of the paragraph, but one can see how it might not read like that.
Yeah, fair, but as you imply perhaps a desire to be offended and the red mist obscured the ability to see the intended point. CR is neurotically obsessed with Woke and on a ridiculously short fuse, but I've never seen the slightest sign of racism in his posts.
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
Ok, please give me an example of the BBC publishing 'absolute lies as truth'.
Just about any of their reporting on it stuff qualifies
Such as?
It's bollocks Sunil, Pagan just comes out with this crap, evidence is not required.
I am not defending any main stream media as a source of truth neither left nor right. You however are defending the bbc because they share your views....go figure who is correct...clue its not you
Point 1. I haven't actually defended the BBC, I merely challenged your rather silly view that they are on a par with Russia Today. You don't think that a media outlet funded by Putin is likely to be rather more biased than one committed by the laws of the UK to be unbiased? I am not saying the BBC is perfect, far from it but it would be interesting to see many others on PB rate the BBC as no more reliable than RT.
Point 2. If you feel you cannot rely on any main stream media for the truth you might as well just give up because you're never going to be able to determine the truth. Or do you have some non-mainstream media you trust?
Main stream media always has someone steering the strings. The bbc has lied repeatedly about it things so no idea why you think I should give them credence. All main stream media is corrupt and in the arms of those with agenda's...isnt that the left wing trope anyway....tories only get elected because mainstream media attack the assholes you choose as leaders like corbyn?
I am not nor ever have been a member of any party, so didn't choose Corbyn or anyone else for that matter.
You're right though that both the left and right accuse the BBC of bias, which is why I reckon they (the BBC) probably get it right most of the time. RT, not so much.
War crimes continue to be committed in Gaza, but the World remains largely silent. Well done Macron for calling for a ceasefire.
I remember reading post after post from you about War Crimes on 7th October, and thereafter.
Well done you for taking such a strong moral stance.
Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200.
With respect, as a nerdy, obsessive, contrarian and off-the-scale aspergery train-nerd I sort of think you're essentially harmless and at the same time not really worth listening to on politics so I ignore what you say.
You don't mean "with respect" at all. Just not on.
You can put away your synthetic outrage back in your pocket, where it belongs.
Despite not being on the site (for days) I saw @kinabalu try to insinuate I was a racist the day before yesterday, the basis of his argument being that I'm "anti-woke". Only one person called him out, and it wasn't you.
The silence from posters like you was deafening.
Eh? I'm pretty sure @kinabalu said specifically that you weren't a racist iin his opinion!
No, I read it, and the inference was very clear.
I was quite restrained in not responding to it, I thought. I can't guarantee I will continue to be if it happens again.
Fckn hell, talk about stubbornly inserting the wrong end of the stick. Kinabalu can speak for himself but this is what he wrote. Fwiw (I sense you're not in the mood to accept a backhanded compliment) I agree with him.
'The reason he (CR) can’t stand ‘woke’ is he thinks it makes everything about race, which is counterproductive and racist in itself. I think it’s a bad take myself but there’s no question he’s sincere. You call tell he is because other than in discussions about ‘woke’ he never mentions race. He doesn’t think it’s a factor in anything, and if it is it shouldn’t be, so you don’t find him banging on about it.'
To be fair, this - … The reason he (CR) can’t stand ‘woke’ is he thinks it makes everything about race, which is counterproductive and racist in itself... - would have been considerably less ambiguous is written: … The reason he (CR) can’t stand ‘woke’ is he thinks it makes everything about race, which he thinks is counterproductive and racist in itself.
That’s fairly clearly kinablu’s meaning, especially in the context of the rest of the paragraph, but one can see how it might not read like that.
Yes, thanks - it does look like I misread it and I'm happy to withdraw on that basis.
I got fixated on the "racist in itself" bit, which I took to mean he was accusing me of being so just for holding anti-Woke views - and that was in and amongst a bunch of other posts in which he was acted as racistfinder pursuivant - but in skimming through the thread on catch-up I was clearly too quick to take offence.
Officers have detained a breakaway group of around 150 people from the pro-Palestinian demonstration in Grosvenor Place.
The group were firing fireworks and many are wearing face coverings. Officers are using their Section 60 and 60AA powers to detain and search those involved.
Leon, Flinter Knappers Gazette, our man on the spot.
Indeed. What did I say
Listen to the BBC and the march was all kumbaya and lovely people singing Imagine. Listen to me and there are nasty wankers shooting fireworks and much else
And who’s right? Me
If you search twitter, you can see there was some nasty stuff going on the fringes,
This man tried to stab @SavaSavadkoohi with a knife today at 3:15 pm at Vauxhall Bridge in London because Sava carried a sign saying “Hamas is Isis”
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
Ok, please give me an example of the BBC publishing 'absolute lies as truth'.
Just about any of their reporting on it stuff qualifies
Such as?
It's bollocks Sunil, Pagan just comes out with this crap, evidence is not required.
I am not defending any main stream media as a source of truth neither left nor right. You however are defending the bbc because they share your views....go figure who is correct...clue its not you
Point 1. I haven't actually defended the BBC, I merely challenged your rather silly view that they are on a par with Russia Today. You don't think that a media outlet funded by Putin is likely to be rather more biased than one committed by the laws of the UK to be unbiased? I am not saying the BBC is perfect, far from it but it would be interesting to see many others on PB rate the BBC as no more reliable than RT.
Point 2. If you feel you cannot rely on any main stream media for the truth you might as well just give up because you're never going to be able to determine the truth. Or do you have some non-mainstream media you trust?
Main stream media always has someone steering the strings. The bbc has lied repeatedly about it things so no idea why you think I should give them credence. All main stream media is corrupt and in the arms of those with agenda's...isnt that the left wing trope anyway....tories only get elected because mainstream media attack the assholes you choose as leaders like corbyn?
I am not nor ever have been a member of any party, so didn't choose Corbyn or anyone else for that matter.
You're right though that both the left and right accuse the BBC of bias, which is why I reckon they (the BBC) probably get it right most of the time. RT, not so much.
The bbc is as biassed about things as anyone else. As I said its because journalists now feel themselves important , thought leaders rather than informing unbiassedly
Officers have detained a breakaway group of around 150 people from the pro-Palestinian demonstration in Grosvenor Place.
The group were firing fireworks and many are wearing face coverings. Officers are using their Section 60 and 60AA powers to detain and search those involved.
Marie Le Conte @youngvulgarian · 6h keep having that chat with various friends but think someone really ought to do a proper, long, very reported piece on how coke is just....everywhere now, it's less represented in pop culture than it used to be but is much more of a thing than it once was
@Leon is on the ground in what could be snort central - what's your view?
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
Ok, please give me an example of the BBC publishing 'absolute lies as truth'.
Just about any of their reporting on it stuff qualifies
Such as?
It's bollocks Sunil, Pagan just comes out with this crap, evidence is not required.
I am not defending any main stream media as a source of truth neither left nor right. You however are defending the bbc because they share your views....go figure who is correct...clue its not you
Point 1. I haven't actually defended the BBC, I merely challenged your rather silly view that they are on a par with Russia Today. You don't think that a media outlet funded by Putin is likely to be rather more biased than one committed by the laws of the UK to be unbiased? I am not saying the BBC is perfect, far from it but it would be interesting to see many others on PB rate the BBC as no more reliable than RT.
Point 2. If you feel you cannot rely on any main stream media for the truth you might as well just give up because you're never going to be able to determine the truth. Or do you have some non-mainstream media you trust?
Main stream media always has someone steering the strings. The bbc has lied repeatedly about it things so no idea why you think I should give them credence. All main stream media is corrupt and in the arms of those with agenda's...isnt that the left wing trope anyway....tories only get elected because mainstream media attack the assholes you choose as leaders like corbyn?
I am not nor ever have been a member of any party, so didn't choose Corbyn or anyone else for that matter.
You're right though that both the left and right accuse the BBC of bias, which is why I reckon they (the BBC) probably get it right most of the time. RT, not so much.
The bbc is as biassed about things as anyone else. As I said its because journalists now feel themselves important , thought leaders rather than informing unbiassedly
Too often now all main stream media has moved from ....here is whats happened....to here is what happened and this is how you should feel about it
Well I’ve just seen Palestinian protestors shooting fireworks into Vauxhall station so these BBC guys aren’t trying very hard
I'm not there, but I suspect the BBC see it as their duty to unify, calm things down, and generally try and be "balanced". Moreover, due to health & safety and corporate policy, they probably report at a slight distance.
So they're not going to see as much bad behaviour and would be reluctant to highlight it even if they did, in case it cuts across that.
Trusting the reporting of the bbc is like trusting russia today.
Whose reporting would you trust Pagan?
None frankly they all have agenda's, thats why I read several and try and work out the truth. The bbc is as biassed as the mail, the guardian and the telegraphs. Jounalists no longer report the ungarnished truth, they report their opinions of the truth
I think if you judge them all as bad as Russia Today you lack any discernment.
Why I have seen russia today publish absolute lies as truth, have also seen just about every news source doing it including the bbc. Journalists have got to self important and have decided their perceived truth is more important than actual truth so we get fed their bullshit....they need to be told they aren't as important as they think they are and reminded of what there job is meant to be
Ok, please give me an example of the BBC publishing 'absolute lies as truth'.
Just about any of their reporting on it stuff qualifies
Such as?
It's bollocks Sunil, Pagan just comes out with this crap, evidence is not required.
I am not defending any main stream media as a source of truth neither left nor right. You however are defending the bbc because they share your views....go figure who is correct...clue its not you
Point 1. I haven't actually defended the BBC, I merely challenged your rather silly view that they are on a par with Russia Today. You don't think that a media outlet funded by Putin is likely to be rather more biased than one committed by the laws of the UK to be unbiased? I am not saying the BBC is perfect, far from it but it would be interesting to see many others on PB rate the BBC as no more reliable than RT.
Point 2. If you feel you cannot rely on any main stream media for the truth you might as well just give up because you're never going to be able to determine the truth. Or do you have some non-mainstream media you trust?
Main stream media always has someone steering the strings. The bbc has lied repeatedly about it things so no idea why you think I should give them credence. All main stream media is corrupt and in the arms of those with agenda's...isnt that the left wing trope anyway....tories only get elected because mainstream media attack the assholes you choose as leaders like corbyn?
I am not nor ever have been a member of any party, so didn't choose Corbyn or anyone else for that matter.
You're right though that both the left and right accuse the BBC of bias, which is why I reckon they (the BBC) probably get it right most of the time. RT, not so much.
The bbc is as biassed about things as anyone else. As I said its because journalists now feel themselves important , thought leaders rather than informing unbiassedly
The BBC is biased is a boring PB topic, but I always repeat what the likes of Andrew Marr has said, it isn't about right and left, it is that the BBC have a problem with group think, formed by being an overwhelmingly young liberal metropolitan work.
And you can see it, social issues, immigration, there is nought between them and the Guardian. Any talk of getting tough on immigration gets the but but but what about the fruit pickers. Economics, its more restrained, but you see the outrage bus firing up if taxes start going on on £100k a year workers or people who have personal service companies....we saw it when Brown did it, we saw it when Hammond did it, and Corbyn got lots of close "inspection" over all the taxes he would want to impose.
It is why New Labour-esque stances seem to get the lightest of dusting.
Comments
A minister without judgment
This could have been great but the bloody lamppost got in the way
One of my main impressions of the day is what a magnificent city London is. The collision of old and new just gets better
It's a very difficult job they've had, and I can fully believe the abuse from both sides.
Add water 2 cups for every 1 cup rice
Bring to boil
Simmer for 10 mins.
Simples.
Moral right isn't a crude numbers balancing game, and that's before you get into confirmation bias over the sources. That's what lies behind it - together with some strange reception class level attempts at trolling - and it just gets boring through repetition.
The crawling out of the woodwork we are seeing now is purely because it's hit home and you want to back what you perceive is one of your team.
Britains Thirst.
An hour later down in Vauxhall the Islamist wankers were shouting at the coppers “you racist fascist scum, you Nazis” and so on - one of them had a megaphone. Again the police looked on calmly and imperviously - only arresting those who actually got violent
We are too critical of British police. Even the Met. They do a thankless task and they often do it well
Armistice Day Anecdotes:
Shopping in Sainsburys Beckton and as 11am approached, the store announced they were going to observe the two minute silence. When 11am came I was bent over a shopping trolley arguing with some leeks (as you do), the staff stopped, 95% of the shoppers stopped. Those who didn't were people using the self-service checkout including one young man carrying on his phone conversation with his headphones on and three or four elderly couples who just carried on with their shopping. I must confess I didn't think charitable thoughts toward the elderly at that point.
On the way up to Wanstead for a late lunch, saw a dozen women with flags and banners heading for Manor Park to catch the train into London replete with Palestinian flags and placards.
Wanstead about as far removed from East Ham socially and culturally as you can imagine - a group of scouts outside Tesco selling poppies.
The bus home - rammed with people heading for Diwali events.
Now if you don't mind I will crawl back into the woodwork.
"Israel seems to have very recently reduced the number of victims of those War Crimes from 1,400 to 1,200."
Do they get a sergeant to shout the most vile abuse at constables for an hour in a confined space, and anyone who blinks fails?
Must be. Or something slightly similar to it.
It reduces arguments to crude number counts, that back moral certainties, rather than the deep ambiguity and fundamentally different motives that actually exist.
The huge pro-Palestinian march appears to have been relatively peaceful with the trouble coming from the EDL and it seems some with connections to football clubs (one might hope if the clubs find out so-called supporters are involved they will take some action).
However, it seems (at this point) to have been a success for the Metropolitan Police and a good start for Sir Mark Rowley. The cost of today will no doubt be quietly released down the line but the relative absence of significant trouble so far would seem to have vindicated the operational planning.
Despite not being on the site (for days) I saw @kinabalu try to insinuate I was a racist the day before yesterday, the basis of his argument being that I'm "anti-woke". Only one person called him out, and it wasn't you.
The silence from posters like you was deafening.
I made sure to be nice to the cops whenever I could! Saying Thankyou and Good job etc
Also I wanted them around me at scary moments
The irony of course is that any of the twats abusing them would be begging for police help if they got isolated in the wrong crowd
Sees "massive crater" and its the size of a pot hole. Then BBC Gaza reporter says they are still carrying the dead out because there are so many over 24hrs later, no actual footage despite being there, because well, it was 30 people and a few cars.
One of my favourite views is of the sunset over Cheshire from the western fringes of tge Peak District. Lucky them that they get that view without even having to leave the house.
I often wish I'd been more romantic in my choice of where to live. Sale is all well and good, but the only real view of the sunset is from the footbridge over the M60. Young people: when it comes to putting down roots, choose somewhere with hills.
But it's also rather irrelevant? It doesn't make what Hamas did any less of an atrocity.
Five hundred yards from the riot police there’s a massive party on this boat
I was quite restrained in not responding to it, I thought. I can't guarantee I will continue to be if it happens again.
This was the comment:
… But there’s a difference between you and (eg) him. The reason he (CR) can’t stand ‘woke’ is he thinks it makes everything about race, which is counterproductive and racist in itself. I think it’s a bad take myself but there’s no question he’s sincere. You call tell he is because other than in discussions about ‘woke’ he never mentions race. He doesn’t think it’s a factor in anything, and if it is it shouldn’t be, so you don’t find him banging on about it. Same with lots of other antiwokies…
I think CR likely misinterpreted the slightly ambiguous bolded bit. It’s fairly clearly NOT saying CR is racist, but it’s easy to see how it might be read the wrong way.
Israel couldn't do anything else but respond to the cold-blooded murder of over 1,000 of it citizens - and abduction of nearly 250 more - without a security operation to destroy Hamas's command and infrastructure.
What else was it supposed to do? Shrug it all off, leave the hostages to their fate, and rebuild the border fence?
Ludicrous.
It has been overzealous its bombing, and a little too careless of some of the refuge areas, but given what war is and how Hamas operates - who won't oblige them by exposing themselves in the open to be neatly vaporised without collateral, and are quite happy to take shelter in hospitals and civil centres because it suits them - serious civilian casualties were inevitable.
- the hostages
- the wounded
- the families of those killed, wounded or take hostage
In addition, every one of the nearly 10,000 rockets Hamas has fired at Israel since that day is a war crime (since they're specifically targeting civilian areas), so the number of "victims" (ie, anyone who's had their lives disrupted by air raid sirens) is actually in the millions.
Leon is probably as good (or poor) an eyewitness as any of us, though.
'The reason he (CR) can’t stand ‘woke’ is he thinks it makes everything about race, which is counterproductive and racist in itself. I think it’s a bad take myself but there’s no question he’s sincere. You call tell he is because other than in discussions about ‘woke’ he never mentions race. He doesn’t think it’s a factor in anything, and if it is it shouldn’t be, so you don’t find him banging on about it.'
The group were firing fireworks and many are wearing face coverings. Officers are using their Section 60 and 60AA powers to detain and search those involved.
https://x.com/metpoliceuk/status/1723420872403296605?s=20
Leon, Flinter Knappers Gazette, our man on the spot.
I highly doubt he will ever be Conservative leader though, CCHQ would block him getting on the parliamentary candidates list for starters unless say Braverman or Rees Mogg were Tory leader
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2019_United_Kingdom_general_election
Point 2. If you feel you cannot rely on any main stream media for the truth you might as well just give up because you're never going to be able to determine the truth. Or do you have some non-mainstream media you trust?
You won't find it.
One option is to try and sift through all the "truths" to try to find something that's objective but it bumps up against your agenda (everyone has one). You can either find a truth that matches yours and accept it or accept there is no absolute truth and try to weigh up all the accounts and analysis as disapassionately as possible to reach a conclusion.
The former is easier and that's why a lot of people go down that road. The latter takes time and thought.
Listen to the BBC and the march was all kumbaya and lovely people singing Imagine. Listen to me and there are nasty wankers shooting fireworks and much else
And who’s right? Me
… The reason he (CR) can’t stand ‘woke’ is he thinks it makes everything about race, which is counterproductive and racist in itself...
- would have been considerably less ambiguous is written:
… The reason he (CR) can’t stand ‘woke’ is he thinks it makes everything about race, which he thinks is counterproductive and racist in itself.
That’s fairly clearly kinablu’s meaning, especially in the context of the rest of the paragraph, but one can see how it might not read like that.
While our troops secured the route, armed terrorists approached and fired RPGs. In response, IDF troops struck the terrorists.
Listen to a conversation between a senior official in the Rantisi hospital and a senior officer in @COGATonline
https://x.com/IDF/status/1723419278383223295?s=20
First, that the Armistice service take place without attack or vandalism.
Second, that people be able to exercise their freedom of speech and demonstration without attack. (Whether you agree with their feelings or not)
To date the Met Police seem to have performed their very difficult task with considerable skill and success. Without their recent change of leadership I suspect that things would have gone much worse.
A very good day for British values and for all real British patriots. A very bad day for most members of the Vladimir Putin Fan Club (except Galloway I suppose).
This man tried to stab @SavaSavadkoohi with a knife today at 3:15 pm at Vauxhall Bridge in London because Sava carried a sign saying “Hamas is Isis”
https://x.com/visegrad24/status/1723410151472812306?s=20
Anti-Israel protesters setting off smoke bombs in front of a synagogue in London.
https://x.com/visegrad24/status/1723421504459698615?s=20
Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion, too
You're right though that both the left and right accuse the BBC of bias, which is why I reckon they (the BBC) probably get it right most of the time. RT, not so much.
I got fixated on the "racist in itself" bit, which I took to mean he was accusing me of being so just for holding anti-Woke views - and that was in and amongst a bunch of other posts in which he was acted as racistfinder pursuivant - but in skimming through the thread on catch-up I was clearly too quick to take offence.
🚨🚨🚨Fireworks fired at police, missiles thrown and verbal abuse. Police form line to stop protesters near Victoria station 🚨🚨🚨
https://x.com/incmonocle/status/1723413581469778359?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw
I tried to tell you. I was there. Did you listen? No, because you didn’t want to hear it
I take it then you will gracefully concede that rather than continue the dismissive sneering that you did earlier?
Oh, wait a minute..
@youngvulgarian
·
6h
keep having that chat with various friends but think someone really ought to do a proper, long, very reported piece on how coke is just....everywhere now, it's less represented in pop culture than it used to be but is much more of a thing than it once was
@Leon is on the ground in what could be snort central - what's your view?
And you can see it, social issues, immigration, there is nought between them and the Guardian. Any talk of getting tough on immigration gets the but but but what about the fruit pickers. Economics, its more restrained, but you see the outrage bus firing up if taxes start going on on £100k a year workers or people who have personal service companies....we saw it when Brown did it, we saw it when Hammond did it, and Corbyn got lots of close "inspection" over all the taxes he would want to impose.
It is why New Labour-esque stances seem to get the lightest of dusting.