The first findings from the Grey report don’t look good for Johnson – politicalbetting.com

Evening all

Moving on from Portugal, we have only a little time (well, 3 months) before Slovenia votes on April 24th.

If you think Portuguese or British politics is complex, welcome to the multi-dimensional nightmare that is Slovenia.

The latest poll - numbers compared to the last election in 2018

Slovenian Democratic Party: 26.0% (+1.1)
Svoboda: 22.8% (new)
Social Democrats: 13.9% (+4.0)
The Left: 9.3% (+0.7)
New Slovenia: 6.3% (-0.9)
Marjan Sarec's List: 5.5% (-7.1)
Alenka Bratusek's List: 4.5% (-0.6)

Svoboda is the former Green Actions Party which has been taken over by one Robert Golob, formerly State Secretary of the Republic of Slovenia and from what I can tell your average patriotic multi-billionaire businessman.

As we all know, the Slovenian National Assembly has 90 seats - the current minority coalition of the Slovenian Democratic Party, Let's Connect Slovenia and New Slovenia has 37 seats and is supported on a C&S basis by 10 MPs from smaller parties leading the Pensioners Party and the Slovenian National Party.

That's 47 and the 43 Opposition MPs come from the list parties of Marjan Sarec and Alenka Bratusek, the Social Democrats, The Left and two from Green Actions which is now Svoboda (see above).

The three main governing parties have seen their combined vote share fall from 46% to 36%.

Daveyboy1961 said:

Mexicanpete said:

.

Daveyboy1961 said:

kinabalu said:

Mexicanpete said:

Heathener said:

Mexicanpete said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

rpjs said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

IanB2 said:

Labour must be reviewing whether now is the right time to table a parliamentary confidence vote. They need to judge whether the momentum will have been lost by the time the Met eventually decide to take no action.

How could the likes of Hon Mr Bell vote confidence in Johnson after today?

They will not vote for a GE

There's no need for a Parliamentary VONC. The letters to the 1922 committee procedure is purely an internal party matter.

It was suggested Labour call a confidence vote and some conservatives would vote with Labour.

That is not the same as the 54 letters to the 1922

I don't like Johnson and I want him to go but one has to admire his comprehensive takedown of Starmer was superb. First the Saville put down which the BBC are loving.

Big Dog

StuartDickson said:

IshmaelZ said:

Carnyx said:

NorthofStoke said:

BannedinnParis said:

Cyclefree said:

I do wonder how many of the breaches of the rules - let alone the guidelines - were by Carrie and her friends.

I suspect

That may explain some of his behaviour. He simply cannot - or dare not - admit something which would put his wife in the frame.

FWIW, this is where my thinking has gone. Hence, the 'check the official diaries' comment earlier.

I've just had a horrible vision of BoJo stifling tears and saying that he has been acting all along to protect his wife and that he personally had no involvement in any wrongdoing..

Why can't he just blame her? Gets the heatd off him, and she's not official any more than, say, a Speaker's wife is.

She goes to the press

Ye

Bo

You keep repeating this on here every few minutes but that doesn't make it any the more true.

No one else, literally no one else, thinks it was a smart move. The jibe lowered the tone still further and by linking Savile to the debate today, the impression people come away with is not what you think. It's of two disresputable people who got off without investigation.

And I'm sure you don't really mean to be saying that the BBC loved the Savile comment. I mean, apart from not knowing how to spell his name, do you not know anything about the background to Jimmy Savile and the BBC?

It scythed Starmer down. Starmer was poor today. Mrs May, and Tissue price were excellent.

I thought Johnson came out swinging, and whether you and I might be disappointed that he saved his bacon, he did, because there are still not 54 MPs who were concerned enough to put their letters to Brady

Gosh did you really think Starmer was poor? I very much didn't. That for me was pitch perfect.

I'm not sure what Mexicanpete was watching to be honest.

I wasn't, I was listening on 5Live in Tesco Brewery Field carpark in Bridgend. I'd just paid my tax bill for this half year, so I wasn't in the best of spirits, then Johnson came out swinging and the rebels including Baker all fell in behind him.

Maybe I am reading it wrong, but he looks safe to me

He is safe for a while, I would agree, but only because the people with the power of sanction are his own MPs. It is still "emperor's new clothes". Even when he denies a party happened on the 13th November, and then the police say they are investigating a party in his flat on that day, yet he still won't admit it. Surely this is a job for the Standards Committee. You obviously never saw him grinning and laughing and taking the piss on screen.

He is relying on the police report to determine there is not enough evidence to proceed, which is the inevitable conclusion, despite 300 photos. That in turn allows him to bury Gray's report.

If it looks like he is losing the 2024 GE on the back of a collapsed economy he will throw in some seriously illiberal red meat, and he will win.

JBriskin3 said:

WhisperingOracle said:

JBriskin3 said:

WhisperingOracle said:

moonshine said:

WhisperingOracle said:

Heathener said:

Politics was of such higher quality back then.

You can't blame it all on Boris Johnson. It has gone downhill for years. Tony Blair wasn't a parliamentarian, preferring media briefing to the House. David Cameron was okay I suppose. Theresa May likewise. The Remainer Parliament, even though I'm a remainer, was ridiculous really.

But Boris Johnson has taken politics down into the gutter.

Grieve was an excellent parliamentarian however, and he was also the chief remainer. May tried to bypass parliament many times, which is why he came in.

The appalling actions of Grieve and co directly led to the elevation of Johnson to PM.

No they didn't, but this is a common rewriting of history on the Brexiter side , that we've discussed many times on here. What made an extreme populist prime minister inevitable was in fact the actions of May in gradually excluding all softer Brexit options.

If May was still PM we'd still be negotiating our terms of release.

Got Brexit Done. Signed off Section 30 letter.

If Boris is indeed Toast I will remember him fondly.

That's why she couldn't have been, as I was mentioning. She set an extremely populist agenda in motion but was just inherently incapable of delivering it, clearing the way inevitably for our friend Bozo, the most nakedly populist of the main candidates, to come in.

TMay populist agenda?

I think she was trying to get us out of the EU but wasn't very good at it.

She was a safe pair of hands when it comes to low politics though.

May realised she needed a bigger majority to get Brexit through in some form. Stacked the election, for a number of reasons, winning only a pyrrhic victory.

Boris made the exact same calculation, helped by 2 more years of, how do we put this politely, wrangling.

Country really should not be surprised we're in the position we are in.

Mexicanpete said:

Daveyboy1961 said:

Mexicanpete said:

.

Daveyboy1961 said:

kinabalu said:

Mexicanpete said:

Heathener said:

Mexicanpete said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

rpjs said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

IanB2 said:

Labour must be reviewing whether now is the right time to table a parliamentary confidence vote. They need to judge whether the momentum will have been lost by the time the Met eventually decide to take no action.

How could the likes of Hon Mr Bell vote confidence in Johnson after today?

They will not vote for a GE

There's no need for a Parliamentary VONC. The letters to the 1922 committee procedure is purely an internal party matter.

It was suggested Labour call a confidence vote and some conservatives would vote with Labour.

That is not the same as the 54 letters to the 1922

I don't like Johnson and I want him to go but one has to admire his comprehensive takedown of Starmer was superb. First the Saville put down which the BBC are loving.

Big Dog

StuartDickson said:

IshmaelZ said:

Carnyx said:

NorthofStoke said:

BannedinnParis said:

Cyclefree said:

I do wonder how many of the breaches of the rules - let alone the guidelines - were by Carrie and her friends.

I suspect

That may explain some of his behaviour. He simply cannot - or dare not - admit something which would put his wife in the frame.

FWIW, this is where my thinking has gone. Hence, the 'check the official diaries' comment earlier.

I've just had a horrible vision of BoJo stifling tears and saying that he has been acting all along to protect his wife and that he personally had no involvement in any wrongdoing..

Why can't he just blame her? Gets the heatd off him, and she's not official any more than, say, a Speaker's wife is.

She goes to the press

Ye

Bo

You keep repeating this on here every few minutes but that doesn't make it any the more true.

No one else, literally no one else, thinks it was a smart move. The jibe lowered the tone still further and by linking Savile to the debate today, the impression people come away with is not what you think. It's of two disresputable people who got off without investigation.

And I'm sure you don't really mean to be saying that the BBC loved the Savile comment. I mean, apart from not knowing how to spell his name, do you not know anything about the background to Jimmy Savile and the BBC?

It scythed Starmer down. Starmer was poor today. Mrs May, and Tissue price were excellent.

I thought Johnson came out swinging, and whether you and I might be disappointed that he saved his bacon, he did, because there are still not 54 MPs who were concerned enough to put their letters to Brady

Gosh did you really think Starmer was poor? I very much didn't. That for me was pitch perfect.

I'm not sure what Mexicanpete was watching to be honest.

I wasn't, I was listening on 5Live in Tesco Brewery Field carpark in Bridgend. I'd just paid my tax bill for this half year, so I wasn't in the best of spirits, then Johnson came out swinging and the rebels including Baker all fell in behind him.

Maybe I am reading it wrong, but he looks safe to me

He is safe for a while, I would agree, but only because the people with the power of sanction are his own MPs. It is still "emperor's new clothes". Even when he denies a party happened on the 13th November, and then the police say they are investigating a party in his flat on that day, yet he still won't admit it. Surely this is a job for the Standards Committee. You obviously never saw him grinning and laughing and taking the piss on screen.

He is relying on the police report to determine there is not enough evidence to proceed, which is the inevitable conclusion, despite 300 photos. That in turn allows him to bury Gray's report.

If it looks like he is losing the 2024 GE on the back of a collapsed economy he will throw in some seriously illiberal red meat, and he will win.

Would love to know what red meat is left to throw at people after 14 years of a Tory Government.

That said, when this blows over, we'll have the imaginary-not-imaginary culture war to contend with.

Brilliant.

HYUFD said:

dixiedean said:

Just to post the poll findings of all voters. Not just Tories.

- Two thirds of voters (64%) want Boris Johnson to resign following the Sue Gray report.
- 83% believe he broke lockdown rules
- 75% believe he is not telling the truth.

January 31, 2022

All voters don't get a say until the next general election as we have a Tory majority government.

Until then only the views of Tory MPs, Tory members and Tory voters matter as to whether Boris stays PM

And the rest of Parliament if 40 of those Tory MPs decide not to support him and vote with the opposition.

Richard_Tyndall said:

HYUFD said:

dixiedean said:

Just to post the poll findings of all voters. Not just Tories.

- Two thirds of voters (64%) want Boris Johnson to resign following the Sue Gray report.
- 83% believe he broke lockdown rules
- 75% believe he is not telling the truth.

January 31, 2022

All voters don't get a say until the next general election as we have a Tory majority government.

Until then only the views of Tory MPs, Tory members and Tory voters matter as to whether Boris stays PM

And the rest of Parliament if 40 of those Tory MPs decide not to support him and vote with the opposition.

That definitely won’t happen.

Not unless Boris is caught with a live boy or dead girl in his bed, and maybe not even then.

No, the Tory MPs need to be both disgusted with Boris (one senses they are) AND believe that replacing him will restore Tory fortunes. It’s the last bit we’re stuck on.

BannedinnParis said:

Daveyboy1961 said:

HYUFD said:

dixiedean said:

Just to post the poll findings of all voters. Not just Tories.

- Two thirds of voters (64%) want Boris Johnson to resign following the Sue Gray report.
- 83% believe he broke lockdown rules
- 75% believe he is not telling the truth.

January 31, 2022

All voters don't get a say until the next general election as we have a Tory majority government.

Until then only the views of Tory MPs, Tory members and Tory voters matter as to whether Boris stays PM

Classic, the rest of the world doesn't count.

Well, no.

Obvious point is obvious.

I know, I was just sounding off.....

eek said:

Mexicanpete said:

Daveyboy1961 said:

Mexicanpete said:

.

Daveyboy1961 said:

kinabalu said:

Mexicanpete said:

Heathener said:

Mexicanpete said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

rpjs said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

IanB2 said:

Labour must be reviewing whether now is the right time to table a parliamentary confidence vote. They need to judge whether the momentum will have been lost by the time the Met eventually decide to take no action.

How could the likes of Hon Mr Bell vote confidence in Johnson after today?

They will not vote for a GE

There's no need for a Parliamentary VONC. The letters to the 1922 committee procedure is purely an internal party matter.

It was suggested Labour call a confidence vote and some conservatives would vote with Labour.

That is not the same as the 54 letters to the 1922

I don't like Johnson and I want him to go but one has to admire his comprehensive takedown of Starmer was superb. First the Saville put down which the BBC are loving.

Big Dog

StuartDickson said:

IshmaelZ said:

Carnyx said:

NorthofStoke said:

BannedinnParis said:

Cyclefree said:

I do wonder how many of the breaches of the rules - let alone the guidelines - were by Carrie and her friends.

I suspect

That may explain some of his behaviour. He simply cannot - or dare not - admit something which would put his wife in the frame.

FWIW, this is where my thinking has gone. Hence, the 'check the official diaries' comment earlier.

I've just had a horrible vision of BoJo stifling tears and saying that he has been acting all along to protect his wife and that he personally had no involvement in any wrongdoing..

Why can't he just blame her? Gets the heatd off him, and she's not official any more than, say, a Speaker's wife is.

She goes to the press

Ye

Bo

You keep repeating this on here every few minutes but that doesn't make it any the more true.

No one else, literally no one else, thinks it was a smart move. The jibe lowered the tone still further and by linking Savile to the debate today, the impression people come away with is not what you think. It's of two disresputable people who got off without investigation.

And I'm sure you don't really mean to be saying that the BBC loved the Savile comment. I mean, apart from not knowing how to spell his name, do you not know anything about the background to Jimmy Savile and the BBC?

It scythed Starmer down. Starmer was poor today. Mrs May, and Tissue price were excellent.

I thought Johnson came out swinging, and whether you and I might be disappointed that he saved his bacon, he did, because there are still not 54 MPs who were concerned enough to put their letters to Brady

Gosh did you really think Starmer was poor? I very much didn't. That for me was pitch perfect.

I'm not sure what Mexicanpete was watching to be honest.

I wasn't, I was listening on 5Live in Tesco Brewery Field carpark in Bridgend. I'd just paid my tax bill for this half year, so I wasn't in the best of spirits, then Johnson came out swinging and the rebels including Baker all fell in behind him.

Maybe I am reading it wrong, but he looks safe to me

He is safe for a while, I would agree, but only because the people with the power of sanction are his own MPs. It is still "emperor's new clothes". Even when he denies a party happened on the 13th November, and then the police say they are investigating a party in his flat on that day, yet he still won't admit it. Surely this is a job for the Standards Committee. You obviously never saw him grinning and laughing and taking the piss on screen.

He is relying on the police report to determine there is not enough evidence to proceed, which is the inevitable conclusion, despite 300 photos. That in turn allows him to bury Gray's report.

If it looks like he is losing the 2024 GE on the back of a collapsed economy he will throw in some seriously illiberal red meat, and he will win.

Would love to know what red meat is left to throw at people after 14 years of a Tory Government.

Capital punishment referendum for nonces?

WhisperingOracle said:

JBriskin3 said:

BannedinnParis said:

May realised she needed a bigger majority to get Brexit through in some form. Stacked the election, for a number of reasons, winning only a pyrrhic victory.

Boris made the exact same calculation, helped by 2 more years of, how do we put this politely, wrangling.

Country really should not be surprised we're in the position we are in.

Good Analysis

WhisperingOracle said:

Red lines, hard brexit, increasingly clear that she was on a course to a minimal deal, I was meaning, really. She certainly wasn't very good at implementing all that she had set the scene for by continually gratifying the ERG, though.

Bad Analysis

The crucial missing word is in the first sentence - May realised she needed a bigger majority to get *Hard* Brexit through in some form. Soft Brexit wouldn't have kept her in power, so, despite being a much more diligent and sometimes honourable prime minister than Boris Johnson, it was much her now forgotten opportunism that led to Boris as anything else.

May was a Remainer and probably started by hoping for a soft Brexit.

However, her style (radio silence for months and months) allowed the hard right to position hard Brexit as the only true way, and she was too frit to stare them down.

2024 will be 20 years after the Kilroy-Silk UKIP broke through in Euro elections.

Ain't nobody got time for refighting all of that.

"hold my pint ... "

Carnyx said:

MarqueeMark said:

Carnyx said:

Tres said:

HYUFD said:

SeaShantyIrish2 said:

"He’s made us all look corrupt and made the country feel like fools"

Any party that makes the likes of Boris Johnson - or Donald Trump - its leader IS corrupt, by definition.

And any country that elects their like, such as the UK - or USA - and puts them into power is ipso facto a pack of fools.

EDIT - I point this out, mainly in derision of the "made us" in the chastened Tory MPs remark. Much like Joe Rogan "sorry if I pissed you off".

Or any alleged "apology" ever uttered (apparently) by Boris Johnson.

So that makes Italy which elected Berlusconi or France which elected Sarkozy and Fillon, all convicted criminals, corrupt too?

Have you never visited France or Italy?

Bit unfair. HYUFD was urging us to be patriotic post-Brexit - something along the lines of taking our dirty weekends in Swansea or Skegness or somewhere like that the other week. Maybe even Brighton for all I know.

That brings back great memories of dirty weekends in Brighton with a Japanese lady.,,,

Did you have kippers on the Brighton Belle?

More likely to get kippers on the Clacton train.

Andy_JS said:

Jonathan said:

Starmer was excellent today. But today is not about the opposition. It’s about Tory MPs and what they stand for.

The number of letters must be very close to 54 tonight.

I very much hope so but I worry they’ve bottled it.

It feels like the Tory MPs are dejected and miserable about the whole thing, but that they haven’t got the guts to pull the trigger yet. I think some of them are still hoping against hope that he’ll fall on his sword without there having to be any of this nasty business. Which is obviously not going to happen.

I think some of them want to wait till May. Let Boris take the electoral hit.

numbertwelve said:

Andy_JS said:

Jonathan said:

Starmer was excellent today. But today is not about the opposition. It’s about Tory MPs and what they stand for.

The number of letters must be very close to 54 tonight.

I very much hope so but I worry they’ve bottled it.

It feels like the Tory MPs are dejected and miserable about the whole thing, but that they haven’t got the guts to pull the trigger yet. I think some of them are still hoping against hope that he’ll fall on his sword without there having to be any of this nasty business. Which is obviously not going to happen.

I think some of them want to wait till May. Let Boris take the electoral hit.

Good news for Labour council candidates.

Terrible news for the country.

WhisperingOracle said:

Gardenwalker said:

WhisperingOracle said:

JBriskin3 said:

BannedinnParis said:

May realised she needed a bigger majority to get Brexit through in some form. Stacked the election, for a number of reasons, winning only a pyrrhic victory.

Boris made the exact same calculation, helped by 2 more years of, how do we put this politely, wrangling.

Country really should not be surprised we're in the position we are in.

Good Analysis

WhisperingOracle said:

Red lines, hard brexit, increasingly clear that she was on a course to a minimal deal, I was meaning, really. She certainly wasn't very good at implementing all that she had set the scene for by continually gratifying the ERG, though.

Bad Analysis

The crucial missing word is in the first sentence - May realised she needed a bigger majority to get *Hard* Brexit through in some form. Soft Brexit wouldn't have kept her in power, so, despite being a much more diligent and sometimes honourable prime minister than Boris Johnson, it was much her now forgotten opportunism that led to Boris as anything else.

May was a Remainer and probably started by hoping for a soft Brexit.

However, her style (radio silence for months and months) allowed the hard right to position hard Brexit as the only true way, and she was too frit to stare them down.

I agree, except it wasn't just silence. She increasingly positioned herself, explicitly, to the harder Brexit side, just to survive.

Yes. Citizens of nowhere etc. She got high on the Daily Mail supply.

Watching Ch4 News it's easy to imagine him going and quickly. It was something from the Kindergarten. Quite embarrassing for all Tories and all Johnson supporters. He's a lump and a man child. Watching Ruth Davidson crying was quite shocking

IshmaelZ said:

EITHER 54 letters announced tomorrow

OR I never vote tory again, unless my MP (G Cox, Con) has crossed the floor by close of business

Never been so disgusted

Peter Gibson (Darlington) has gone from Boris is a disgrace prior to today to time to move on to other (more important) matters.

I don't see 54 letters arriving anytime soon.

Roger said:

Watching Ch4 News it's easy to imagine him going and quickly. It was something from the Kindergarten. Quite embarrassing for all Tories and all Johnson supporters. He's a lump and a man child. Watching Ruth Davidson crying was quite shocking

The clip
https://twitter.com/channel4news/status/1488235127847243780?s=21

numbertwelve said:

Andy_JS said:

Jonathan said:

Starmer was excellent today. But today is not about the opposition. It’s about Tory MPs and what they stand for.

The number of letters must be very close to 54 tonight.

I very much hope so but I worry they’ve bottled it.

It feels like the Tory MPs are dejected and miserable about the whole thing, but that they haven’t got the guts to pull the trigger yet. I think some of them are still hoping against hope that he’ll fall on his sword without there having to be any of this nasty business. Which is obviously not going to happen.

I think some of them want to wait till May. Let Boris take the electoral hit.

Why lose many hundreds of councillors - your best foot-soldiers - whilst you dither until May?

JFDI.....

eek said:

IshmaelZ said:

EITHER 54 letters announced tomorrow

OR I never vote tory again, unless my MP (G Cox, Con) has crossed the floor by close of business

Never been so disgusted

Peter Gibson (Darlington) has gone from Boris is a disgrace prior to today to time to move on to other (more important) matters.

I don't see 54 letters arriving anytime soon.

I certainly won't be voting conservative again as long as this shower of sh*t remains in charge.

And if the rest of the party don't have the balls to defenestrate him, it makes it hard for me to vote for any of them either. For similar reasons I remain cautious about Labour, considering they allowed the sh*t show that was Corbyn for years.

Cicero said:

Gardenwalker said:

WhisperingOracle said:

Gardenwalker said:

WhisperingOracle said:

JBriskin3 said:

BannedinnParis said:

May realised she needed a bigger majority to get Brexit through in some form. Stacked the election, for a number of reasons, winning only a pyrrhic victory.

Boris made the exact same calculation, helped by 2 more years of, how do we put this politely, wrangling.

Country really should not be surprised we're in the position we are in.

Good Analysis

WhisperingOracle said:

Red lines, hard brexit, increasingly clear that she was on a course to a minimal deal, I was meaning, really. She certainly wasn't very good at implementing all that she had set the scene for by continually gratifying the ERG, though.

Bad Analysis

The crucial missing word is in the first sentence - May realised she needed a bigger majority to get *Hard* Brexit through in some form. Soft Brexit wouldn't have kept her in power, so, despite being a much more diligent and sometimes honourable prime minister than Boris Johnson, it was much her now forgotten opportunism that led to Boris as anything else.

May was a Remainer and probably started by hoping for a soft Brexit.

However, her style (radio silence for months and months) allowed the hard right to position hard Brexit as the only true way, and she was too frit to stare them down.

I agree, except it wasn't just silence. She increasingly positioned herself, explicitly, to the harder Brexit side, just to survive.

Yes. Citizens of nowhere etc. She got high on the Daily Mail supply.

The citizens of Nowhere was the second most disgraceful speech ever made by a British PM. I think today´s PMQs has set a new bar so low that even a limbo dancer will struggle.

Yes, absolutely correct.

It was the moment I knew I was no longer welcome in the UK. Many of my friends (often expats) felt the same.

MarqueeMark said:

numbertwelve said:

Andy_JS said:

Jonathan said:

Starmer was excellent today. But today is not about the opposition. It’s about Tory MPs and what they stand for.

The number of letters must be very close to 54 tonight.

I very much hope so but I worry they’ve bottled it.

It feels like the Tory MPs are dejected and miserable about the whole thing, but that they haven’t got the guts to pull the trigger yet. I think some of them are still hoping against hope that he’ll fall on his sword without there having to be any of this nasty business. Which is obviously not going to happen.

I think some of them want to wait till May. Let Boris take the electoral hit.

Why lose many hundreds of councillors - your best foot-soldiers - whilst you dither until May?

JFDI.....

Because the new leader doesn't want to kick off with some heavy electoral losses?

Difficult, I agree Mark, but there is a case for letting BJ take all the flak.

dixiedean said:

HYUFD said:

IanB2 said:

HYUFD said:

dixiedean said:

HYUFD said:

Applicant said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Gardenwalker said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Between Boris Johnson's performance today and that poll finding I have lost faith in my country.

Take my advice.

Emigrate.

Tempted to move to France, Canada, or Australia.

Well, you can knock Canada off the list - that's where the Hawaiian pizza was invented.

If you think our winters are cold and dark, try Canada's

Vancouver isn't cold. Nor is populated Canada darker. It's much further south than us.
Most Canadians live south of Seattle. One of my favourite facts.

Winnipeg has over 600,000 people and is -6 Celsius today. Edmonton has over 1 million people and is -15 degrees Celsius today.

Parts of populated Canada certainly do get very cold in winter

Nevertheless you also said “dark”. Sunset in Winnipeg today will be, in local time, a whole half hour later than mine - and I have one of the longest winter daylight spans in the UK.

Edmonton, population over 1 million, is north of us and therefore darker than us in winter too as well as colder

Edmonton is 53.56°N.
That's a lot more south than me.

There's a reason the Glaswegians are revolting:



Just about everywhere in the US is less cloudy than the UK, although I suspect the map is not picking up specific areas such as the Olympics west of Seattle. Most of Canada too.

You have to go somewhere like Kerguelen in the Southern Ocean to get significantly worse.

I expect there is a satellite derived map somewhere but I haven't found it.

(There's a version with a scale but it is a bit big to post inline)
https://external-preview.redd.it/OHaEsE5gvooo7czRlTObIht4NSUrvxU1rxSebiz4mGw.png?auto=webp&s=306df060fd5ffc6db94e5cfcb5977cc89f87c8d8

Peter_the_Punter said:

MarqueeMark said:

numbertwelve said:

Andy_JS said:

Jonathan said:

Starmer was excellent today. But today is not about the opposition. It’s about Tory MPs and what they stand for.

The number of letters must be very close to 54 tonight.

I very much hope so but I worry they’ve bottled it.

It feels like the Tory MPs are dejected and miserable about the whole thing, but that they haven’t got the guts to pull the trigger yet. I think some of them are still hoping against hope that he’ll fall on his sword without there having to be any of this nasty business. Which is obviously not going to happen.

I think some of them want to wait till May. Let Boris take the electoral hit.

Why lose many hundreds of councillors - your best foot-soldiers - whilst you dither until May?

JFDI.....

Because the new leader doesn't want to kick off with some heavy electoral losses?

Difficult, I agree Mark, but there is a case for letting BJ take all the flak.

He will take it anyway. New leader will simply say, 'we are suffering a deserved punishment for the incompetence and criminality of the former leader. The British people are angry, and understandably so. It is now up to us to work hard on the cost of living crisis, the lack of investment in the north and the antiquated governmental system that doesn't meet the needs of the people to regain their trust.'

My twitter's hinting that Nadine was drunk for her media stint.

Does Ms/(Mrs?) Davidson have the same excuse?

solarflare said:

Polruan said:

Liz Truss saving that Covid isolation for when it *really* matters to avoid the media round.

https://twitter.com/trussliz/status/1488243196509495299?s=21

Lol that is epic handy timing.

Clear evidence of her lateral thinking.

solarflare said:

Polruan said:

Liz Truss saving that Covid isolation for when it *really* matters to avoid the media round.

https://twitter.com/trussliz/status/1488243196509495299?s=21

Lol that is epic handy timing.

Saves her having to use dental treatment as an excuse.

Anabobazina said:

Andy_JS said:

Jonathan said:

Starmer was excellent today. But today is not about the opposition. It’s about Tory MPs and what they stand for.

The number of letters must be very close to 54 tonight.

Nowhere near. There will be 30 odd. You are confusing the PCP for vertebrates. Schoolboy error.

Gary Gibbon on C4 News, whom I rate on these matters, reckons the numbers are there, but they’re split on whether to break cover now, or later.

HYUFD said:

dixiedean said:

Just to post the poll findings of all voters. Not just Tories.

- Two thirds of voters (64%) want Boris Johnson to resign following the Sue Gray report.
- 83% believe he broke lockdown rules
- 75% believe he is not telling the truth.

January 31, 2022

All voters don't get a say until the next general election as we have a Tory majority government.

Until then only the views of Tory MPs, Tory members and Tory voters matter as to whether Boris stays PM

Weren't you saying similar about keeping Owen Patterson as an MP ?

Farooq said:

IshmaelZ said:

EITHER 54 letters announced tomorrow

OR I never vote tory again, unless my MP (G Cox, Con) has crossed the floor by close of business

Never been so disgusted

Never say never... I said I would never vote Labour after Iraq, but I have forgiven them that now that
1. A long time has passed
2. Their leader apologised specifically for it and meant it
3. The Conservatives have become just so fucking terrible

Not so young then...

Foxy said:

Polruan said:

Liz Truss saving that Covid isolation for when it *really* matters to avoid the media round.

https://twitter.com/trussliz/status/1488243196509495299?s=21

Hasn't anyone told her that ita all over?

We're due Harry and Pippa tonight.

IshmaelZ said:

EITHER 54 letters announced tomorrow

OR I never vote tory again, unless my MP (G Cox, Con) has crossed the floor by close of business

Never been so disgusted

I think he's a dead man walking but I'm not sure why they keep saying we've all been made to look like idiots. Those who voted for him particularly the red wallers have always looked like idiots to me but I don't see that the fact of him ignoring his own rules should make those of us who didn't feel like idiots.

One term MP backs Boris.

https://twitter.com/garysambrook89/status/1488243552874283011?s=21

Flatlander said:

dixiedean said:

HYUFD said:

IanB2 said:

HYUFD said:

dixiedean said:

HYUFD said:

Applicant said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Gardenwalker said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Between Boris Johnson's performance today and that poll finding I have lost faith in my country.

Take my advice.

Emigrate.

Tempted to move to France, Canada, or Australia.

Well, you can knock Canada off the list - that's where the Hawaiian pizza was invented.

If you think our winters are cold and dark, try Canada's

Vancouver isn't cold. Nor is populated Canada darker. It's much further south than us.
Most Canadians live south of Seattle. One of my favourite facts.

Winnipeg has over 600,000 people and is -6 Celsius today. Edmonton has over 1 million people and is -15 degrees Celsius today.

Parts of populated Canada certainly do get very cold in winter

Nevertheless you also said “dark”. Sunset in Winnipeg today will be, in local time, a whole half hour later than mine - and I have one of the longest winter daylight spans in the UK.

Edmonton, population over 1 million, is north of us and therefore darker than us in winter too as well as colder

Edmonton is 53.56°N.
That's a lot more south than me.

There's a reason the Glaswegians are revolting:



Just about everywhere in the US is less cloudy than the UK, although I suspect the map is not picking up specific areas such as the Olympics west of Seattle. Most of Canada too.

You have to go somewhere like Kerguelen in the Southern Ocean to get significantly worse.

I expect there is a satellite derived map somewhere but I haven't found it.

(There's a version with a scale but it is a bit big to post inline)
https://external-preview.redd.it/OHaEsE5gvooo7czRlTObIht4NSUrvxU1rxSebiz4mGw.png?auto=webp&s=306df060fd5ffc6db94e5cfcb5977cc89f87c8d8

The 2 August 2027 total solar eclipse passes through Luxor, which according to one site I looked at has a 100% chance of sunshine (presumably rounded to the nearest 1%).

With a six minute totality duration Luxor will be the place to be that day.

Farooq said:

Nadine Dorries is clearly an idiot, but she didn't seem drunk to me. Not at all. Playing a bad hand badly, and seemingly surly and defensive. But not drunk.

The best bits were the closing exchanges and half-smiles and knowing glances as the interview concluded

Benpointer said:

Flatlander said:

dixiedean said:

HYUFD said:

IanB2 said:

HYUFD said:

dixiedean said:

HYUFD said:

Applicant said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Gardenwalker said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Between Boris Johnson's performance today and that poll finding I have lost faith in my country.

Take my advice.

Emigrate.

Tempted to move to France, Canada, or Australia.

Well, you can knock Canada off the list - that's where the Hawaiian pizza was invented.

If you think our winters are cold and dark, try Canada's

Vancouver isn't cold. Nor is populated Canada darker. It's much further south than us.
Most Canadians live south of Seattle. One of my favourite facts.

Winnipeg has over 600,000 people and is -6 Celsius today. Edmonton has over 1 million people and is -15 degrees Celsius today.

Parts of populated Canada certainly do get very cold in winter

Nevertheless you also said “dark”. Sunset in Winnipeg today will be, in local time, a whole half hour later than mine - and I have one of the longest winter daylight spans in the UK.

Edmonton, population over 1 million, is north of us and therefore darker than us in winter too as well as colder

Edmonton is 53.56°N.
That's a lot more south than me.

There's a reason the Glaswegians are revolting:



Just about everywhere in the US is less cloudy than the UK, although I suspect the map is not picking up specific areas such as the Olympics west of Seattle. Most of Canada too.

You have to go somewhere like Kerguelen in the Southern Ocean to get significantly worse.

I expect there is a satellite derived map somewhere but I haven't found it.

(There's a version with a scale but it is a bit big to post inline)
https://external-preview.redd.it/OHaEsE5gvooo7czRlTObIht4NSUrvxU1rxSebiz4mGw.png?auto=webp&s=306df060fd5ffc6db94e5cfcb5977cc89f87c8d8

The 2 August 2027 total solar eclipse passes through Luxor, which according to one site I looked at has a 100% chance of sunshine (presumably rounded to the nearest 1%).

With a six minute totality duration Luxor will be the place to be that day.

Luxor’s no place to be in August

Farooq said:

JBriskin3 said:

Farooq said:

IshmaelZ said:

EITHER 54 letters announced tomorrow

OR I never vote tory again, unless my MP (G Cox, Con) has crossed the floor by close of business

Never been so disgusted

Never say never... I said I would never vote Labour after Iraq, but I have forgiven them that now that
1. A long time has passed
2. Their leader apologised specifically for it and meant it
3. The Conservatives have become just so fucking terrible

Not so young then...

No, alas.
Anyway, you promised me an elixir of youth. I'll do you a swap if you like. I'll give you a year's supply of toothpaste in exchange.

I'm guessing that's about half a tube for you.

Since the vid I've had the teeth polished up a bit and I brush my teeth (nearly) everyday but they are still fucked. I've got enough toothpaste so don't need any toothpaste backhanders.

Carnyx said:

MarqueeMark said:

Carnyx said:

Tres said:

HYUFD said:

SeaShantyIrish2 said:

"He’s made us all look corrupt and made the country feel like fools"

Any party that makes the likes of Boris Johnson - or Donald Trump - its leader IS corrupt, by definition.

And any country that elects their like, such as the UK - or USA - and puts them into power is ipso facto a pack of fools.

EDIT - I point this out, mainly in derision of the "made us" in the chastened Tory MPs remark. Much like Joe Rogan "sorry if I pissed you off".

Or any alleged "apology" ever uttered (apparently) by Boris Johnson.

So that makes Italy which elected Berlusconi or France which elected Sarkozy and Fillon, all convicted criminals, corrupt too?

Have you never visited France or Italy?

Bit unfair. HYUFD was urging us to be patriotic post-Brexit - something along the lines of taking our dirty weekends in Swansea or Skegness or somewhere like that the other week. Maybe even Brighton for all I know.

That brings back great memories of dirty weekends in Brighton with a Japanese lady.,,,

Did you have kippers on the Brighton Belle?

Just sushi....

I see Newcastle are putting together a great squad....for the Championship.

Fairliered said:

Carnyx said:

MarqueeMark said:

Carnyx said:

Tres said:

HYUFD said:

SeaShantyIrish2 said:

"He’s made us all look corrupt and made the country feel like fools"

Any party that makes the likes of Boris Johnson - or Donald Trump - its leader IS corrupt, by definition.

And any country that elects their like, such as the UK - or USA - and puts them into power is ipso facto a pack of fools.

EDIT - I point this out, mainly in derision of the "made us" in the chastened Tory MPs remark. Much like Joe Rogan "sorry if I pissed you off".

Or any alleged "apology" ever uttered (apparently) by Boris Johnson.

So that makes Italy which elected Berlusconi or France which elected Sarkozy and Fillon, all convicted criminals, corrupt too?

Have you never visited France or Italy?

Bit unfair. HYUFD was urging us to be patriotic post-Brexit - something along the lines of taking our dirty weekends in Swansea or Skegness or somewhere like that the other week. Maybe even Brighton for all I know.

That brings back great memories of dirty weekends in Brighton with a Japanese lady.,,,

Did you have kippers on the Brighton Belle?

More likely to get kippers on the Clacton train.

Or the Mallaig one of long, long ago (alas).

MarqueeMark said:

Carnyx said:

MarqueeMark said:

Carnyx said:

Tres said:

HYUFD said:

SeaShantyIrish2 said:

"He’s made us all look corrupt and made the country feel like fools"

Any party that makes the likes of Boris Johnson - or Donald Trump - its leader IS corrupt, by definition.

And any country that elects their like, such as the UK - or USA - and puts them into power is ipso facto a pack of fools.

EDIT - I point this out, mainly in derision of the "made us" in the chastened Tory MPs remark. Much like Joe Rogan "sorry if I pissed you off".

Or any alleged "apology" ever uttered (apparently) by Boris Johnson.

So that makes Italy which elected Berlusconi or France which elected Sarkozy and Fillon, all convicted criminals, corrupt too?

Have you never visited France or Italy?

Bit unfair. HYUFD was urging us to be patriotic post-Brexit - something along the lines of taking our dirty weekends in Swansea or Skegness or somewhere like that the other week. Maybe even Brighton for all I know.

That brings back great memories of dirty weekends in Brighton with a Japanese lady.,,,

Did you have kippers on the Brighton Belle?

Just sushi....

Ah, not so long ago. But JJ has pointed out we may be able to in future ... *contemplates a day outing with my Camden friend*

Roger said:

JBriskin3 said:

WhisperingOracle said:

JBriskin3 said:

BannedinnParis said:

May realised she needed a bigger majority to get Brexit through in some form. Stacked the election, for a number of reasons, winning only a pyrrhic victory.

Boris made the exact same calculation, helped by 2 more years of, how do we put this politely, wrangling.

Country really should not be surprised we're in the position we are in.

Good Analysis

WhisperingOracle said:

Red lines, hard brexit, increasingly clear that she was on a course to a minimal deal, I was meaning, really. She certainly wasn't very good at implementing all that she had set the scene for by continually gratifying the ERG, though.

Bad Analysis

The crucial missing word is in the first sentence - May realised she needed a bigger majority to get *Hard* Brexit through in some form. Soft Brexit wouldn't have allowed her to stay on as Tory leader, so, despite being a much more diligent and sometimes honourable prime minister than Boris Johnson, it was much her now forgotten opportunism that led to Boris as anything else.

Hard and Soft Brexit is Remoaner language.

Both May and Boris were merely trying to get out of the EU which proved to be far more difficult than leaving a "democratic" institution should be.

...and Remoaner is the language of a moron.

Well there was > 650 / 2 of them at one point.

Scott_xP said:

Am told Boris Johnson compared himself to Othello while addressing Conservative MPs tonight. He said he always sees the best in people, unlike Dominic Cummings (who he cast as Iago)
https://twitter.com/hzeffman/status/1488249949284409354

..and even better in himself.

Gallowgate said:

JBriskin3 said:

Roger said:

JBriskin3 said:

WhisperingOracle said:

JBriskin3 said:

BannedinnParis said:

May realised she needed a bigger majority to get Brexit through in some form. Stacked the election, for a number of reasons, winning only a pyrrhic victory.

Boris made the exact same calculation, helped by 2 more years of, how do we put this politely, wrangling.

Country really should not be surprised we're in the position we are in.

Good Analysis

WhisperingOracle said:

Red lines, hard brexit, increasingly clear that she was on a course to a minimal deal, I was meaning, really. She certainly wasn't very good at implementing all that she had set the scene for by continually gratifying the ERG, though.

Bad Analysis

The crucial missing word is in the first sentence - May realised she needed a bigger majority to get *Hard* Brexit through in some form. Soft Brexit wouldn't have allowed her to stay on as Tory leader, so, despite being a much more diligent and sometimes honourable prime minister than Boris Johnson, it was much her now forgotten opportunism that led to Boris as anything else.

Hard and Soft Brexit is Remoaner language.

Both May and Boris were merely trying to get out of the EU which proved to be far more difficult than leaving a "democratic" institution should be.

...and Remoaner is the language of a moron.

Well there was > 650 / 2 of them at one point.

Damn right there was lad

Yes well I was referring to Remoaners.

Sorry for not making that clear.

EDIT: Remoaner MPs

Katy Balls: Gray’s update, in which she was more than keen to stress this was not her report and just a summary, and Johnson’s response to it, has put him back in the danger zone.

When he needed to be statesmanlike and contrite, he was angry and combative – even refusing to commit to publishing the full report once the police investigation was concluded (a position Downing Street has already had to U-turn on).

His attack on Keir Starmer for the failure to prosecute Jimmy Savile (a claim that has been disproven) dismayed even his own MPs – while his questioning of drug use by the Labour frontbench was viewed as simply bizarre. “It was terrible,” says one member of the payroll… behind the scenes, discomfort is building. Johnson’s response to the report has only added to doubts about his future. For all the talk from Johnson of change in how No 10 operates, the part that most worries MPs is that he may not realise that he needs to change, too.

Roger said:

Watching Ch4 News it's easy to imagine him going and quickly. It was something from the Kindergarten. Quite embarrassing for all Tories and all Johnson supporters. He's a lump and a man child. Watching Ruth Davidson crying was quite shocking

JBriskin3 said:

My twitter's hinting that Nadine was drunk for her media stint.

Does Ms/(Mrs?) Davidson have the same excuse?

Lady Davidson, actually, now she doesn't bother to get elected any more. What's she been doing?