Is Biden going honour his commitment to make Washington DC a state in its own right? – politicalbett

Gallowgate said:

ydoethur said:

Andy_JS said:

Farage's new party Reform UK already on 5% in Wales.

https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1351302000240160768

Mostly from Labour, from the look of it.

Would fit, as their strongest area in 2019 was the Valleys.

Can't be. Brexit Party was on 5%. Now Refuck are on 5%. So no swing.

I wonder if ReformUK will re-form without the UK?

Presumably, it was named as it was to lure those dim souls wondering where UKIP had gone.....

OnlyLivingBoy said:

Leon said:

In the face of Covid, bickering about Scottish independence or speculating about statehood for DC feels like a pub brawl on the front line of the Somme.

Humanity - the entire species - all of us - is facing its greatest crisis since World War 2. This last week was the worst yet. Even if the crisis abates by summer, the economic, demographic, psychological consequences - nearly all of them awful - will be with us for a generation. So much damage is being done to so many people, places, businesses, countries.

And lurking just over the horizon is the reasonable worst-case scenario: the virus keeps mutating, rendering vaccines ineffective. In which case human society changes forever. Most travel ends. Borders close permanently. We have to spend 20% of GDP on healthcare - or let people die in the street.

This entire thread is decadent piffle.

The greatest crisis of modern times, but not serious enough to seek a softer Brexit to avoid compounding the economic trauma. That is the definition of decadent, or even negligent, government.

It's very similar to Trumpism in its religiosity, as are the copious comments all over the Daily Mail in recent weeks that Remainers are to blame for any Brexit problems as a result of Brexit "not being a proper Brexit".

Frank Lampard has got the sack apparently.

Nigel_Foremain said:

Mexicanpete said:

MarqueeMark said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

rottenborough said:

the pressure to vaccinate teachers soon and get schools open is building this morning by looks of things.

Apparently it will not stop the spread of the virus even when teachers are vaccinated

But it might stop them moaning....

Moaning is the product from X number of years of the verbal waterboarding they endure from our precious offspring.

Would you do it for 30 grand a year?

A lot of head teachers earn very high salaries for what is a demanding role, but nonetheless very secure when compared to private sector positions on those types of salary.

Therefore there is a financially rewarding career pathway for teachers should they choose it and are good enough. If a teacher decides to remain a teacher for all their career (average salary 37k, but can in some cases rise to upper 50s, that is very vocational and commendable, but it is a lifestyle choice. The idea that we should feel sorry for teachers' salaries doesn't wash with me, but it also doesn't stop me admiring what they do. And by the way, I think they should be a priority for vaccination.

On a good day in a well-run school, teaching really is the most tremendous fun, as well as being deeply meaningful. Unfortunately, not all schools are well-run in that sense.

Clearly there is an issue with salaries, given the number of subjects and places where you can't get specialist teachers full stop. On the other hand, I've seen surveys of ex-teachers typically swallowing a 5k pay cut to get out. Sorting out the lost meaning and fun would help a lot.

Leon said:

In the face of Covid, bickering about Scottish independence or speculating about statehood for DC feels like a pub brawl on the front line of the Somme.

Humanity - the entire species - all of us - is facing its greatest crisis since World War 2. This last week was the worst yet. Even if the crisis abates by summer, the economic, demographic, psychological consequences - nearly all of them awful - will be with us for a generation. So much damage is being done to so many people, places, businesses, countries.

And lurking just over the horizon is the reasonable worst-case scenario: the virus keeps mutating, rendering vaccines ineffective. In which case human society changes forever. Most travel ends. Borders close permanently. We have to spend 20% of GDP on healthcare - or let people die in the street.

This entire thread is decadent piffle.

Have you read this paper (or at least the abstract)?

https://science.sciencemag.org/content/early/2021/01/11/science.abe6522

Morris_Dancer said:

Mr. JS, to be fair, she might have a point about obesity. We're the worst country in Europe for that, and it's not great for people's health.

Not 100% true. The Maltese are even fatter than us (as are, surprisingly, the Australians, Kiwis, and Saffers). We're just the second fattest in Europe.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_obesity_rate

TOPPING said:

ydoethur said:

TOPPING said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Alistair said:

DougSeal said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Sandpit said:

HYUFD said:

Foxy said:

Theuniondivvie said:

Gordo Brown on R4 saying the UK will endure if the argument in defence of it is made properly followed by ‘we need a constitutional commission’ & some Orwellian ‘I’m a patriot not a nationalist’ guff. This fresh, new thinking is bound to do the trick.

The problem with the Union is that there is an ever decreasing sentiment for it, even if there is an economic case.

Union was largely driven by external threat, either because England felt threatened by the back door, hence conquest, or by the threat from France, Germany or Soviet Union giving a more positive reason to stand together.

There is simply little reason for it anymore other than accidents of history.

No nothing at all except to stop Customs Posts at Berwick, inevitable in the event of Scexit or to ensure our place in the G7 and as permanent members of the UN Security Council and protect our place in the world.

Plus of course Scotland and Wales and Northern Ireland all have large deficits, only London and the SE raises more in revenue than it spends so if Scotland went independent that would mean deep spending cuts and tax rises would be required from Edinburgh to avoid Scotland going bankrupt. Dublin has also ruled out a border poll for at least 5 years as it does not want to have to fund NI anytime soon

Having now left the EU CU, the Berwick border is going to be a feature of another Scotland referendum in a way that it wasn’t in 2014.

If an independent Scotland were to join the EU, is there any possible way that we don’t have physical border infrastructure on the M6 and A1, and a rebuilding of Hadrian’s wall in barbed wire?

No there isn't, there would be a hard border along Hadrian's Wall with customs posts and border guards

Hadrian's wall is in England you pillock.

I live north of Hadrian's wall and there's another 50 miles of England north of me.

The wall is just 0.6 miles from the Scottish border at Bowness-on-Solway

You can never concede a point can you?

Given he still hasn't admitted getting the EU Ref turnout in Scotland wrong yesterday I think it is safe to say it is a vanishingly rare event.

And his chances of standing for an mp are also vanishing

why do you say that?

I agree, they vanished long ago.

Or to put it another way, would anyone be mad keen to see Hyufd in Parliament?

Many sterling qualities - good manners, intelligence, an understanding of polling and polling methods matched by few on this board (and certainly better than mine) - but neither the flexibility of mind nor the intellectual courage to make proper policy based on evidence, because he simply refuses to see evidence that doesn't fit his theories. That's not what you want in an MP.

It's exactly what a government wants in an MP.

Everything @HYUFD writes on here is, in the back or front of his mind, writen so that it can be used at his PPC selection committee. It reflects govt policy and points out some of the issues with any contra-policy.

Does he fulfil other PPC selection criteria? No idea. But (if) his aim is to become an MP he is not hindering it by his posts on PB.

Are they as wry, arch and knowing as the rest of our posts? No, but that's not his aim.

I've never seen a PPC calling for razor wire at Hadrian's wall and if one did I'd expect he'd be suspended from the party PDQ.

Can you cite a real MP or PPC doing so?

Mr. Leon, ah, thank you for the correction. I'm surprised at that, but we're still far too fat and that has significant health implications.

Mr. JS, an astute comment.

Gardenwalker said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

Gardenwalker said:

One thing I do respect about HYUFD is that he voted Remain and has never recanted from conceding that Brexit is economically damaging (albeit necessary, having voted for it).

That’s actually a lot more honest than many posters who scoffed unto the end that any economic harm was just “Project Fear”.

Virtually everything that was warned about Brexit that was dismissed as "project fear" has largely come to pass. The only real Project Fear was that used by Leave fascists who wanted the gullible to believe that they were about to be overrun by Romanians

I’d give it about 8/10.

Slower growth? Check.
Fall in pound? Check.
Increased inflation? Only a little only (so far)
Increased indy sentiment? Check.
Succour to populists and alt-rightest? Check.
Trade restrictions? Check.
Loss of rights? Check.
Damage to relations with key allies? Check.
Loss of U.K. influence? Check.
Fall in house prices? Not really.

You've managed to forget:

Immediate two year recession
Higher unemployment
Car factories shutting down
City relocating to Frankfurt
Lower stock prices
Cuts in pensions
Crops rotting in the fields
Refugee camps in Kent

.

Philip_Thompson said:

TOPPING said:

ydoethur said:

TOPPING said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Alistair said:

DougSeal said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Sandpit said:

HYUFD said:

Foxy said:

Theuniondivvie said:

Gordo Brown on R4 saying the UK will endure if the argument in defence of it is made properly followed by ‘we need a constitutional commission’ & some Orwellian ‘I’m a patriot not a nationalist’ guff. This fresh, new thinking is bound to do the trick.

The problem with the Union is that there is an ever decreasing sentiment for it, even if there is an economic case.

Union was largely driven by external threat, either because England felt threatened by the back door, hence conquest, or by the threat from France, Germany or Soviet Union giving a more positive reason to stand together.

There is simply little reason for it anymore other than accidents of history.

No nothing at all except to stop Customs Posts at Berwick, inevitable in the event of Scexit or to ensure our place in the G7 and as permanent members of the UN Security Council and protect our place in the world.

Plus of course Scotland and Wales and Northern Ireland all have large deficits, only London and the SE raises more in revenue than it spends so if Scotland went independent that would mean deep spending cuts and tax rises would be required from Edinburgh to avoid Scotland going bankrupt. Dublin has also ruled out a border poll for at least 5 years as it does not want to have to fund NI anytime soon

Having now left the EU CU, the Berwick border is going to be a feature of another Scotland referendum in a way that it wasn’t in 2014.

If an independent Scotland were to join the EU, is there any possible way that we don’t have physical border infrastructure on the M6 and A1, and a rebuilding of Hadrian’s wall in barbed wire?

No there isn't, there would be a hard border along Hadrian's Wall with customs posts and border guards

Hadrian's wall is in England you pillock.

I live north of Hadrian's wall and there's another 50 miles of England north of me.

The wall is just 0.6 miles from the Scottish border at Bowness-on-Solway

You can never concede a point can you?

Given he still hasn't admitted getting the EU Ref turnout in Scotland wrong yesterday I think it is safe to say it is a vanishingly rare event.

And his chances of standing for an mp are also vanishing

why do you say that?

I agree, they vanished long ago.

Or to put it another way, would anyone be mad keen to see Hyufd in Parliament?

Many sterling qualities - good manners, intelligence, an understanding of polling and polling methods matched by few on this board (and certainly better than mine) - but neither the flexibility of mind nor the intellectual courage to make proper policy based on evidence, because he simply refuses to see evidence that doesn't fit his theories. That's not what you want in an MP.

It's exactly what a government wants in an MP.

Everything @HYUFD writes on here is, in the back or front of his mind, writen so that it can be used at his PPC selection committee. It reflects govt policy and points out some of the issues with any contra-policy.

Does he fulfil other PPC selection criteria? No idea. But (if) his aim is to become an MP he is not hindering it by his posts on PB.

Are they as wry, arch and knowing as the rest of our posts? No, but that's not his aim.

I've never seen a PPC calling for razor wire at Hadrian's wall and if one did I'd expect he'd be suspended from the party PDQ.

Can you cite a real MP or PPC doing so?

Good morning Philip.

Sad to say you have a track record for misunderestimating things. Do me a huge favour and repost the bit where he did that.

TIA.

Gardenwalker said:

ydoethur said:

Mexicanpete said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

ydoethur said:

TOPPING said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Alistair said:

DougSeal said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Sandpit said:

HYUFD said:

Foxy said:

Theuniondivvie said:

Gordo Brown on R4 saying the UK will endure if the argument in defence of it is made properly followed by ‘we need a constitutional commission’ & some Orwellian ‘I’m a patriot not a nationalist’ guff. This fresh, new thinking is bound to do the trick.

The problem with the Union is that there is an ever decreasing sentiment for it, even if there is an economic case.

Union was largely driven by external threat, either because England felt threatened by the back door, hence conquest, or by the threat from France, Germany or Soviet Union giving a more positive reason to stand together.

There is simply little reason for it anymore other than accidents of history.

No nothing at all except to stop Customs Posts at Berwick, inevitable in the event of Scexit or to ensure our place in the G7 and as permanent members of the UN Security Council and protect our place in the world.

Plus of course Scotland and Wales and Northern Ireland all have large deficits, only London and the SE raises more in revenue than it spends so if Scotland went independent that would mean deep spending cuts and tax rises would be required from Edinburgh to avoid Scotland going bankrupt. Dublin has also ruled out a border poll for at least 5 years as it does not want to have to fund NI anytime soon

Having now left the EU CU, the Berwick border is going to be a feature of another Scotland referendum in a way that it wasn’t in 2014.

If an independent Scotland were to join the EU, is there any possible way that we don’t have physical border infrastructure on the M6 and A1, and a rebuilding of Hadrian’s wall in barbed wire?

No there isn't, there would be a hard border along Hadrian's Wall with customs posts and border guards

Hadrian's wall is in England you pillock.

I live north of Hadrian's wall and there's another 50 miles of England north of me.

The wall is just 0.6 miles from the Scottish border at Bowness-on-Solway

You can never concede a point can you?

Given he still hasn't admitted getting the EU Ref turnout in Scotland wrong yesterday I think it is safe to say it is a vanishingly rare event.

And his chances of standing for an mp are also vanishing

why do you say that?

I agree, they vanished long ago.

Or to put it another way, would anyone be mad keen to see Hyufd in Parliament?

Many sterling qualities - good manners, intelligence, an understanding of polling and polling methods matched by few on this board (and certainly better than mine) - but neither the flexibility of mind nor the intellectual courage to make proper policy based on evidence, because he simply refuses to see evidence that doesn't fit his theories. That's not what you want in an MP.

Ah but @HYUFD only went to Warwick University so unfortunately he is not intelligent enough to be an MP by his own measure.

Shame, but we only want the best.

True, but he also spent a year at the greatest university in the world.

Cardigan Bay Poly?

Oh dear, people still confuse Aberystwyth and Lampeter.

I’ve always been intrigued by Lampeter, since a old connection of mine from student days - scion of a NZ wine dynasty - went off to do a PhD in Philosophy there.

It seemed an odd choice, tbh.

I recall there used to be (probably still is) a large shop on the edge of the Lampeter. A sign, on the side of the builidng, proclaimed "Cardiganshire's largest Superstore". In those days (early 8os) Cardiganshire was still dry and you had to walk across the bridge spanning the Teifi to get a drink in the Cwmann Tavern on a Sunday.

Root out. Said we shouldn't expect too much of him.

A lot now riding on Dan Lawrence. This should show his mettle.

Scott_xP said:

https://twitter.com/jessicaelgot/status/1353645621908004866

The campaign is run by a former Labour adviser, Adam McNicholas.

Not really Lincoln Project which was own party members turning on Trump.

Also we have had Led by Donkeys doing this since Brexit vote.

ydoethur said:

Root out. Said we shouldn't expect too much of him.

A lot now riding on Dan Lawrence. This should show his mettle.

The tail is now exposed, no doubt about it.

Philip_Thompson said:

TOPPING said:

ydoethur said:

TOPPING said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Alistair said:

DougSeal said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Sandpit said:

HYUFD said:

Foxy said:

Theuniondivvie said:

Gordo Brown on R4 saying the UK will endure if the argument in defence of it is made properly followed by ‘we need a constitutional commission’ & some Orwellian ‘I’m a patriot not a nationalist’ guff. This fresh, new thinking is bound to do the trick.

The problem with the Union is that there is an ever decreasing sentiment for it, even if there is an economic case.

Union was largely driven by external threat, either because England felt threatened by the back door, hence conquest, or by the threat from France, Germany or Soviet Union giving a more positive reason to stand together.

There is simply little reason for it anymore other than accidents of history.

No nothing at all except to stop Customs Posts at Berwick, inevitable in the event of Scexit or to ensure our place in the G7 and as permanent members of the UN Security Council and protect our place in the world.

Plus of course Scotland and Wales and Northern Ireland all have large deficits, only London and the SE raises more in revenue than it spends so if Scotland went independent that would mean deep spending cuts and tax rises would be required from Edinburgh to avoid Scotland going bankrupt. Dublin has also ruled out a border poll for at least 5 years as it does not want to have to fund NI anytime soon

Having now left the EU CU, the Berwick border is going to be a feature of another Scotland referendum in a way that it wasn’t in 2014.

If an independent Scotland were to join the EU, is there any possible way that we don’t have physical border infrastructure on the M6 and A1, and a rebuilding of Hadrian’s wall in barbed wire?

No there isn't, there would be a hard border along Hadrian's Wall with customs posts and border guards

Hadrian's wall is in England you pillock.

I live north of Hadrian's wall and there's another 50 miles of England north of me.

The wall is just 0.6 miles from the Scottish border at Bowness-on-Solway

You can never concede a point can you?

Given he still hasn't admitted getting the EU Ref turnout in Scotland wrong yesterday I think it is safe to say it is a vanishingly rare event.

And his chances of standing for an mp are also vanishing

why do you say that?

I agree, they vanished long ago.

Or to put it another way, would anyone be mad keen to see Hyufd in Parliament?

Many sterling qualities - good manners, intelligence, an understanding of polling and polling methods matched by few on this board (and certainly better than mine) - but neither the flexibility of mind nor the intellectual courage to make proper policy based on evidence, because he simply refuses to see evidence that doesn't fit his theories. That's not what you want in an MP.

It's exactly what a government wants in an MP.

Everything @HYUFD writes on here is, in the back or front of his mind, writen so that it can be used at his PPC selection committee. It reflects govt policy and points out some of the issues with any contra-policy.

Does he fulfil other PPC selection criteria? No idea. But (if) his aim is to become an MP he is not hindering it by his posts on PB.

Are they as wry, arch and knowing as the rest of our posts? No, but that's not his aim.

I've never seen a PPC calling for razor wire at Hadrian's wall and if one did I'd expect he'd be suspended from the party PDQ.

Can you cite a real MP or PPC doing so?

The original post I was replying to was from Sandpit who said 'If an independent Scotland were to join the EU, is there any possible way that we don’t have physical border infrastructure on the M6 and A1, and a rebuilding of Hadrian’s wall in barbed wire?'

So it was Sandpit who raised barbed wire not me.

I nonetheless agreed with his general point stating that 'No there isn't, there would be a hard border along Hadrian's Wall with customs posts and border guards.'

I am also not going to take any lectures from you and BigG about my position in the party when I have never once voted Labour in a general election but always for a Tory government when you both voted for Blair and New Labour!!

DavidL said:

ydoethur said:

Root out. Said we shouldn't expect too much of him.

A lot now riding on Dan Lawrence. This should show his mettle.

The tail is now exposed, no doubt about it.

I wouldn't describe Lawrence as part of the tail.

Nigel_Foremain said:

Gardenwalker said:

One thing I do respect about HYUFD is that he voted Remain and has never recanted from conceding that Brexit is economically damaging (albeit necessary, having voted for it).

That’s actually a lot more honest than many posters who scoffed unto the end that any economic harm was just “Project Fear”.

Virtually everything that was warned about Brexit that was dismissed as "project fear" has largely come to pass. The only real Project Fear was that used by Leave fascists who wanted the gullible to believe that they were about to be overrun by Romanians

We are 25 days into a project designed for decades.

HYUFD said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TOPPING said:

ydoethur said:

TOPPING said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Alistair said:

DougSeal said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Sandpit said:

HYUFD said:

Foxy said:

Theuniondivvie said:

Gordo Brown on R4 saying the UK will endure if the argument in defence of it is made properly followed by ‘we need a constitutional commission’ & some Orwellian ‘I’m a patriot not a nationalist’ guff. This fresh, new thinking is bound to do the trick.

The problem with the Union is that there is an ever decreasing sentiment for it, even if there is an economic case.

Union was largely driven by external threat, either because England felt threatened by the back door, hence conquest, or by the threat from France, Germany or Soviet Union giving a more positive reason to stand together.

There is simply little reason for it anymore other than accidents of history.

No nothing at all except to stop Customs Posts at Berwick, inevitable in the event of Scexit or to ensure our place in the G7 and as permanent members of the UN Security Council and protect our place in the world.

Plus of course Scotland and Wales and Northern Ireland all have large deficits, only London and the SE raises more in revenue than it spends so if Scotland went independent that would mean deep spending cuts and tax rises would be required from Edinburgh to avoid Scotland going bankrupt. Dublin has also ruled out a border poll for at least 5 years as it does not want to have to fund NI anytime soon

Having now left the EU CU, the Berwick border is going to be a feature of another Scotland referendum in a way that it wasn’t in 2014.

If an independent Scotland were to join the EU, is there any possible way that we don’t have physical border infrastructure on the M6 and A1, and a rebuilding of Hadrian’s wall in barbed wire?

No there isn't, there would be a hard border along Hadrian's Wall with customs posts and border guards

Hadrian's wall is in England you pillock.

I live north of Hadrian's wall and there's another 50 miles of England north of me.

The wall is just 0.6 miles from the Scottish border at Bowness-on-Solway

You can never concede a point can you?

Given he still hasn't admitted getting the EU Ref turnout in Scotland wrong yesterday I think it is safe to say it is a vanishingly rare event.

And his chances of standing for an mp are also vanishing

why do you say that?

I agree, they vanished long ago.

Or to put it another way, would anyone be mad keen to see Hyufd in Parliament?

Many sterling qualities - good manners, intelligence, an understanding of polling and polling methods matched by few on this board (and certainly better than mine) - but neither the flexibility of mind nor the intellectual courage to make proper policy based on evidence, because he simply refuses to see evidence that doesn't fit his theories. That's not what you want in an MP.

It's exactly what a government wants in an MP.

Everything @HYUFD writes on here is, in the back or front of his mind, writen so that it can be used at his PPC selection committee. It reflects govt policy and points out some of the issues with any contra-policy.

Does he fulfil other PPC selection criteria? No idea. But (if) his aim is to become an MP he is not hindering it by his posts on PB.

Are they as wry, arch and knowing as the rest of our posts? No, but that's not his aim.

I've never seen a PPC calling for razor wire at Hadrian's wall and if one did I'd expect he'd be suspended from the party PDQ.

Can you cite a real MP or PPC doing so?

The original post I was replying to was from Sandpit who said 'If an independent Scotland were to join the EU, is there any possible way that we don’t have physical border infrastructure on the M6 and A1, and a rebuilding of Hadrian’s wall in barbed wire?'

So it was Sandpit who raised barbed wire not me.

Probably not deliberate, but that is an awesome pun.

Nigel_Foremain said:

Mexicanpete said:

MarqueeMark said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

rottenborough said:

the pressure to vaccinate teachers soon and get schools open is building this morning by looks of things.

Apparently it will not stop the spread of the virus even when teachers are vaccinated

But it might stop them moaning....

Moaning is the product from X number of years of the verbal waterboarding they endure from our precious offspring.

Would you do it for 30 grand a year?

A lot of head teachers earn very high salaries for what is a demanding role, but nonetheless very secure when compared to private sector positions on those types of salary.

Therefore there is a financially rewarding career pathway for teachers should they choose it and are good enough. If a teacher decides to remain a teacher for all their career (average salary 37k, but can in some cases rise to upper 50s, that is very vocational and commendable, but it is a lifestyle choice. The idea that we should feel sorry for teachers' salaries doesn't wash with me, but it also doesn't stop me admiring what they do. And by the way, I think they should be a priority for vaccination.

The percentage of teachers who become headteachers or ever senior teaching staff is miniscule. Presumably with the burgeoning number of multiple academy organisations run by minor captains of industry that opportunity is reduced further.

Starmer is back self isolating again after being contacted by test and trace.

Philip_Thompson said:

TOPPING said:

.

Philip_Thompson said:

TOPPING said:

ydoethur said:

TOPPING said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Alistair said:

DougSeal said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Sandpit said:

HYUFD said:

Foxy said:

Theuniondivvie said:

Gordo Brown on R4 saying the UK will endure if the argument in defence of it is made properly followed by ‘we need a constitutional commission’ & some Orwellian ‘I’m a patriot not a nationalist’ guff. This fresh, new thinking is bound to do the trick.

The problem with the Union is that there is an ever decreasing sentiment for it, even if there is an economic case.

Union was largely driven by external threat, either because England felt threatened by the back door, hence conquest, or by the threat from France, Germany or Soviet Union giving a more positive reason to stand together.

There is simply little reason for it anymore other than accidents of history.

No nothing at all except to stop Customs Posts at Berwick, inevitable in the event of Scexit or to ensure our place in the G7 and as permanent members of the UN Security Council and protect our place in the world.

Plus of course Scotland and Wales and Northern Ireland all have large deficits, only London and the SE raises more in revenue than it spends so if Scotland went independent that would mean deep spending cuts and tax rises would be required from Edinburgh to avoid Scotland going bankrupt. Dublin has also ruled out a border poll for at least 5 years as it does not want to have to fund NI anytime soon

Having now left the EU CU, the Berwick border is going to be a feature of another Scotland referendum in a way that it wasn’t in 2014.

If an independent Scotland were to join the EU, is there any possible way that we don’t have physical border infrastructure on the M6 and A1, and a rebuilding of Hadrian’s wall in barbed wire?

No there isn't, there would be a hard border along Hadrian's Wall with customs posts and border guards

Hadrian's wall is in England you pillock.

I live north of Hadrian's wall and there's another 50 miles of England north of me.

The wall is just 0.6 miles from the Scottish border at Bowness-on-Solway

You can never concede a point can you?

Given he still hasn't admitted getting the EU Ref turnout in Scotland wrong yesterday I think it is safe to say it is a vanishingly rare event.

And his chances of standing for an mp are also vanishing

why do you say that?

I agree, they vanished long ago.

Or to put it another way, would anyone be mad keen to see Hyufd in Parliament?

Many sterling qualities - good manners, intelligence, an understanding of polling and polling methods matched by few on this board (and certainly better than mine) - but neither the flexibility of mind nor the intellectual courage to make proper policy based on evidence, because he simply refuses to see evidence that doesn't fit his theories. That's not what you want in an MP.

It's exactly what a government wants in an MP.

Everything @HYUFD writes on here is, in the back or front of his mind, writen so that it can be used at his PPC selection committee. It reflects govt policy and points out some of the issues with any contra-policy.

Does he fulfil other PPC selection criteria? No idea. But (if) his aim is to become an MP he is not hindering it by his posts on PB.

Are they as wry, arch and knowing as the rest of our posts? No, but that's not his aim.

I've never seen a PPC calling for razor wire at Hadrian's wall and if one did I'd expect he'd be suspended from the party PDQ.

Can you cite a real MP or PPC doing so?

Good morning Philip.

Sad to say you have a track record for misunderestimating things. Do me a huge favour and repost the bit where he did that.

TIA.

Seriously? This is not government policy. Please quote any PPC or MP saying this without being suspended from the party?

HYUFD said:

Sandpit said:

Foxy said:

Sandpit said:

HYUFD said:

Foxy said:

Theuniondivvie said:

Gordo Brown on R4 saying the UK will endure if the argument in defence of it is made properly followed by ‘we need a constitutional commission’ & some Orwellian ‘I’m a patriot not a nationalist’ guff. This fresh, new thinking is bound to do the trick.

The problem with the Union is that there is an ever decreasing sentiment for it, even if there is an economic case.

Union was largely driven by external threat, either because England felt threatened by the back door, hence conquest, or by the threat from France, Germany or Soviet Union giving a more positive reason to stand together.

There is simply little reason for it anymore other than accidents of history.

No nothing at all except to stop Customs Posts at Berwick, inevitable in the event of Scexit or to ensure our place in the G7 and as permanent members of the UN Security Council and protect our place in the world.

Plus of course Scotland and Wales and Northern Ireland all have large deficits, only London and the SE raises more in revenue than it spends so if Scotland went independent that would mean deep spending cuts and tax rises would be required from Edinburgh to avoid Scotland going bankrupt. Dublin has also ruled out a border poll for at least 5 years as it does not want to have to fund NI anytime soon

Having now left the EU CU, the Berwick border is going to be a feature of another Scotland referendum in a way that it wasn’t in 2014.

If an independent Scotland were to join the EU, is there any possible way that we don’t have physical border infrastructure on the M6 and A1, and a rebuilding of Hadrian’s wall in barbed wire?

Such borders are only necessary as long as they are needed in the Irish Sea and at Dover.

The Anglo-Scottish border is only a nightmare if England chooses for it to be a nightmare elsewhere.

Whole point of discussing it first, would be to get agreement that there will not be a physical border between England and Scotland.

That’s not a problem for England, but is a potential problem for Scotland if they wish to join the EU.

Indeed, England could correctly say that if Scotland wishes to stay part of the UK single market and stay out of the EU and EEA and EU Customs Union a hard border could be avoided.

However if Scotland voted for independence to rejoin the EU, the EEA or Customs Union, the border guards and razor wire would be sent to Berwick the next day

Huh? A bit of hyperbole (razor wire). And he says "would be" - indicating a hypothetical course of action, speculating on UK govt's actions.

He doesn't say "I want", "I would", or give any endorsement of the mooted course of action.

YBarddCwsc said:

DougSeal said:

Leon said:

In the face of Covid, bickering about Scottish independence or speculating about statehood for DC feels like a pub brawl on the front line of the Somme.

Humanity - the entire species - all of us - is facing its greatest crisis since World War 2. This last week was the worst yet. Even if the crisis abates by summer, the economic, demographic, psychological consequences - nearly all of them awful - will be with us for a generation. So much damage is being done to so many people, places, businesses, countries.

And lurking just over the horizon is the reasonable worst-case scenario: the virus keeps mutating, rendering vaccines ineffective. In which case human society changes forever. Most travel ends. Borders close permanently. We have to spend 20% of GDP on healthcare - or let people die in the street.

This entire thread is decadent piffle.

Have you read this paper (or at least the abstract)?

https://science.sciencemag.org/content/early/2021/01/11/science.abe6522https://science.sciencemag.org/content/early/2021/01/11/science.abe6522

It is a model. How has the model been calibrated? Against existing coronaviruses. So the result is that COVID will behave in the same way.

An unsurprising result, given the assumption.

The track record of modellers in the COVID pandemic has been ... err ... very modest.

Our main problem has been too much reliance on theoretical work, and not enough on empirical data-driven research.

Did you read the piece. They analysed data, per -

"We reanalyze a detailed dataset (my emphasis) that estimates age-specific seroprevalence based on both IgM (acute response) and IgG (long-term memory) against all four circulating HCoVs in children and adults (10) to estimate parameter ranges for transmission and waning of immunity"

IshmaelZ said:

TrèsDifficile said:

I'd like to propose that all header writers include a paragraph about HYUFD.

Then at least all of these tortuously boring posts about his posts would be on topic.

You don't know what tortuously means.

I have recently flipped from being concerned on HYUFD's behalf that his posting may wreck his prospects of a political career, to being certain it will and being glad about that.

He was warned.

There is nothing I have posted the vast majority of the current Tory Party would not agree with (except perhaps for my pro Remain posts before the EU referendum) but then few PBers are ardent supporters of the current Tory government and PM Boris

Andy_JS said:

"Pensions minister Therese Coffey turns off her camera during brutal GMB row with Piers Morgan after she blames 'age and obesity of population for UK having world's worst Covid death rate'"

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9183635/Therese-Coffey-TURNS-camera-brutal-row-Piers-Morgan.html

She actually had an interview on the Today programme to go to, Morgan starter his interview late

HYUFD said:

Leon said:

In the face of Covid, bickering about Scottish independence or speculating about statehood for DC feels like a pub brawl on the front line of the Somme.

Humanity - the entire species - all of us - is facing its greatest crisis since World War 2. This last week was the worst yet. Even if the crisis abates by summer, the economic, demographic, psychological consequences - nearly all of them awful - will be with us for a generation. So much damage is being done to so many people, places, businesses, countries.

And lurking just over the horizon is the reasonable worst-case scenario: the virus keeps mutating, rendering vaccines ineffective. In which case human society changes forever. Most travel ends. Borders close permanently. We have to spend 20% of GDP on healthcare - or let people die in the street.

This entire thread is decadent piffle.

Yes Covid is serious but you even over 80s who get it are more likely to survive it than not.

If we got a virus with a much more deadly death rate then yes your apocalyptic scenario might come to pass but Covid is not it.

At the moment even allowing for some mutations the vaccine looks effective

Head

Desk

Thump

Did you really just say Scottish independence is a more serious issue than a pandemic that even on official figures is rapidly approaching being the fifth deadliest of all time?

Gardenwalker said:

It’s been said before, but nobody at all is talking about the Brexit upside, Brexit dividend, etc.

Last known references were before Christmas when govt advertising was telling small businesses to prepare for “Brexit opportunities”. Presume that campaign has been chopped.

The only debate is on how bad the damage is, potential mitigation, and why Remainers are to blame.

Covid is still masking everything and keeping it off the the leads of many news items, but I have a strong feeling that part of the recent dropping of Tory support in many polls is first-hand small business experience, then passed on to friends and associates who are undecided voters, in a subcultural strand still unnoticed by the media.

FrancisUrquhart said:

ydoethur said:

Root out. Said we shouldn't expect too much of him.

A lot now riding on Dan Lawrence. This should show his mettle.

164 looks a long way....

Looks further away now...

OldKingCole said:

DavidL said:

ydoethur said:

Root out. Said we shouldn't expect too much of him.

A lot now riding on Dan Lawrence. This should show his mettle.

The tail is now exposed, no doubt about it.

I wouldn't describe Lawrence as part of the tail.

You were saying?

algarkirk said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

Gardenwalker said:

One thing I do respect about HYUFD is that he voted Remain and has never recanted from conceding that Brexit is economically damaging (albeit necessary, having voted for it).

That’s actually a lot more honest than many posters who scoffed unto the end that any economic harm was just “Project Fear”.

Virtually everything that was warned about Brexit that was dismissed as "project fear" has largely come to pass. The only real Project Fear was that used by Leave fascists who wanted the gullible to believe that they were about to be overrun by Romanians

We are 25 days into a project designed for decades.

Even at these low interest rates the NPV destruction however occurs right at the beginning.

Mexicanpete said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

Mexicanpete said:

MarqueeMark said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

rottenborough said:

the pressure to vaccinate teachers soon and get schools open is building this morning by looks of things.

Apparently it will not stop the spread of the virus even when teachers are vaccinated

But it might stop them moaning....

Moaning is the product from X number of years of the verbal waterboarding they endure from our precious offspring.

Would you do it for 30 grand a year?

A lot of head teachers earn very high salaries for what is a demanding role, but nonetheless very secure when compared to private sector positions on those types of salary.

Therefore there is a financially rewarding career pathway for teachers should they choose it and are good enough. If a teacher decides to remain a teacher for all their career (average salary 37k, but can in some cases rise to upper 50s, that is very vocational and commendable, but it is a lifestyle choice. The idea that we should feel sorry for teachers' salaries doesn't wash with me, but it also doesn't stop me admiring what they do. And by the way, I think they should be a priority for vaccination.

The percentage of teachers who become headteachers or ever senior teaching staff is miniscule. Presumably with the burgeoning number of multiple academy organisations run by minor captains of industry that opportunity is reduced further.

According to the Great God Google, in 2016...

"In the 3,400 secondary schools in 2016, there were 3,600 headteachers, 5,300 deputy headteachers, 13,600 assistant headteachers, 81,800 middle leaders and 103,800 classroom teachers"

The first thing I wonder is about "13,600 assistant headteachers" - is this a good post, or is it one of those all-the-work-but-not-the-money-while-you wait-for-promotion things?

ydoethur said:

YBarddCwsc said:

Gardenwalker said:

I’ve always been intrigued by Lampeter, since a old connection of mine from student days - scion of a NZ wine dynasty - went off to do a PhD in Philosophy there.

It seemed an odd choice, tbh.

A very odd choice.

The university passes itself off under the moniker University Wales Trinity St David nowadays and has become a huge sprawling campus incorporating Lampeter, Swansea & Carmarthen.

It has -- shall we say -- very good connections with the Welsh Government.

It has a very highly paid Vice Chancellor -- a tenth-rate academic who has published virtually nothing -- but has very well attuned good political antennae and can keep the Welsh Government money flowing.

Sadly typical of the moribund state of Welsh life under Labour.

He's actually trying to close Lampeter at the moment. He couldn't before because an impact assessment said there would be too much damage to the local economy. Since then student numbers have dropped 80% due to a deliberate policy of moving departments to Carmarthen and a second impact assessment will probably take a different view as a result.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-48747118

Isn't most of their real estate along Fabian Way (NPT) at vast, recent expense. Both Lampeter and Trinity College have been made superfluous to requirements.

It seemed an odd idea to have two Universities in Swansea (well one, plus one nearly in Swansea) when Cardiff couldn't afford to sustain two in the 1980s. University College Cardiff was on the brink during my time there.

WhisperingOracle said:

Gardenwalker said:

It’s been said before, but nobody at all is talking about the Brexit upside, Brexit dividend, etc.

Last known references were before Christmas when govt advertising was telling small businesses to prepare for “Brexit opportunities”. Presume that campaign has been chopped.

The only debate is on how bad the damage is, potential mitigation, and why Remainers are to blame.

Covid is still masking everything and keeping it off the the leads of many news items, but I have a strong feeling that part of the recent dropping of Tory support in many polls is first-hand small business experience, then passed on to friends and associates who are undecided voters, in a subcultural strand still unnoticed by the media.

Citation required for 'dropping of Tory support'

Gardenwalker said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

Gardenwalker said:

One thing I do respect about HYUFD is that he voted Remain and has never recanted from conceding that Brexit is economically damaging (albeit necessary, having voted for it).

That’s actually a lot more honest than many posters who scoffed unto the end that any economic harm was just “Project Fear”.

Virtually everything that was warned about Brexit that was dismissed as "project fear" has largely come to pass. The only real Project Fear was that used by Leave fascists who wanted the gullible to believe that they were about to be overrun by Romanians

I’d give it about 8/10.

Slower growth? Check.
Fall in pound? Check.
Increased inflation? Only a little only (so far)
Increased indy sentiment? Check.
Succour to populists and alt-rightest? Check.
Trade restrictions? Check.
Loss of rights? Check.
Damage to relations with key allies? Check.
Loss of U.K. influence? Check.
Fall in house prices? Not really.

I'd give it the following
Fall in pound? Check. (But I'd argue in the circumstances this is a good thing)
Increased indy sentiment? Check.
Trade restrictions? Check. (Negligible, just paperwork not tariffs etc)
Loss of rights? Check. (Those that were acknowkledged during the referendum)

Slower growth? ❌
- Objectively the UK had faster, not slower, growth than the Eurozone in the past decade "despite Brexit"

Increased inflation? ❌
- Objectively the UK has below-target inflation.

Succour to populists and alt-rightest? ❌
- Objectively opinion polls are showing reduced tolerance of alt-rightists and populists and greater acceptance of immigrants and immigration.

Loss of U.K. influence? ❌
- I can't see any objective way to measure this but UK has been capable of reaching agreements with those they want to do so, on a similar basis as we could before.

Damage to relations with key allies? ❌
- Allies have accepted Brexit and moved on. They view it as Britain being Britain and not objectively damaged.

Fall in house prices? Not really.
- Which is a shame but nevermind.

HYUFD said:

Andy_JS said:

"Pensions minister Therese Coffey turns off her camera during brutal GMB row with Piers Morgan after she blames 'age and obesity of population for UK having world's worst Covid death rate'"

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9183635/Therese-Coffey-TURNS-camera-brutal-row-Piers-Morgan.html

She actually had an interview on the Today programme to go to, Morgan starter his interview late

Not a good look whatever the excuse. I assume she had the 8:35 Today slot in which case she should have told GMB where to go when they started running late.

TOPPING said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TOPPING said:

.

Philip_Thompson said:

TOPPING said:

ydoethur said:

TOPPING said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Alistair said:

DougSeal said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Sandpit said:

HYUFD said:

Foxy said:

Theuniondivvie said:

Gordo Brown on R4 saying the UK will endure if the argument in defence of it is made properly followed by ‘we need a constitutional commission’ & some Orwellian ‘I’m a patriot not a nationalist’ guff. This fresh, new thinking is bound to do the trick.

The problem with the Union is that there is an ever decreasing sentiment for it, even if there is an economic case.

Union was largely driven by external threat, either because England felt threatened by the back door, hence conquest, or by the threat from France, Germany or Soviet Union giving a more positive reason to stand together.

There is simply little reason for it anymore other than accidents of history.

No nothing at all except to stop Customs Posts at Berwick, inevitable in the event of Scexit or to ensure our place in the G7 and as permanent members of the UN Security Council and protect our place in the world.

Plus of course Scotland and Wales and Northern Ireland all have large deficits, only London and the SE raises more in revenue than it spends so if Scotland went independent that would mean deep spending cuts and tax rises would be required from Edinburgh to avoid Scotland going bankrupt. Dublin has also ruled out a border poll for at least 5 years as it does not want to have to fund NI anytime soon

Having now left the EU CU, the Berwick border is going to be a feature of another Scotland referendum in a way that it wasn’t in 2014.

If an independent Scotland were to join the EU, is there any possible way that we don’t have physical border infrastructure on the M6 and A1, and a rebuilding of Hadrian’s wall in barbed wire?

No there isn't, there would be a hard border along Hadrian's Wall with customs posts and border guards

Hadrian's wall is in England you pillock.

I live north of Hadrian's wall and there's another 50 miles of England north of me.

The wall is just 0.6 miles from the Scottish border at Bowness-on-Solway

You can never concede a point can you?

Given he still hasn't admitted getting the EU Ref turnout in Scotland wrong yesterday I think it is safe to say it is a vanishingly rare event.

And his chances of standing for an mp are also vanishing

why do you say that?

I agree, they vanished long ago.

Or to put it another way, would anyone be mad keen to see Hyufd in Parliament?

Many sterling qualities - good manners, intelligence, an understanding of polling and polling methods matched by few on this board (and certainly better than mine) - but neither the flexibility of mind nor the intellectual courage to make proper policy based on evidence, because he simply refuses to see evidence that doesn't fit his theories. That's not what you want in an MP.

It's exactly what a government wants in an MP.

Everything @HYUFD writes on here is, in the back or front of his mind, writen so that it can be used at his PPC selection committee. It reflects govt policy and points out some of the issues with any contra-policy.

Does he fulfil other PPC selection criteria? No idea. But (if) his aim is to become an MP he is not hindering it by his posts on PB.

Are they as wry, arch and knowing as the rest of our posts? No, but that's not his aim.

I've never seen a PPC calling for razor wire at Hadrian's wall and if one did I'd expect he'd be suspended from the party PDQ.

Can you cite a real MP or PPC doing so?

Good morning Philip.

Sad to say you have a track record for misunderestimating things. Do me a huge favour and repost the bit where he did that.

TIA.

Seriously? This is not government policy. Please quote any PPC or MP saying this without being suspended from the party?

HYUFD said:

Sandpit said:

Foxy said:

Sandpit said:

HYUFD said:

Foxy said:

Theuniondivvie said:

Gordo Brown on R4 saying the UK will endure if the argument in defence of it is made properly followed by ‘we need a constitutional commission’ & some Orwellian ‘I’m a patriot not a nationalist’ guff. This fresh, new thinking is bound to do the trick.

The problem with the Union is that there is an ever decreasing sentiment for it, even if there is an economic case.

Union was largely driven by external threat, either because England felt threatened by the back door, hence conquest, or by the threat from France, Germany or Soviet Union giving a more positive reason to stand together.

There is simply little reason for it anymore other than accidents of history.

No nothing at all except to stop Customs Posts at Berwick, inevitable in the event of Scexit or to ensure our place in the G7 and as permanent members of the UN Security Council and protect our place in the world.

Plus of course Scotland and Wales and Northern Ireland all have large deficits, only London and the SE raises more in revenue than it spends so if Scotland went independent that would mean deep spending cuts and tax rises would be required from Edinburgh to avoid Scotland going bankrupt. Dublin has also ruled out a border poll for at least 5 years as it does not want to have to fund NI anytime soon

Having now left the EU CU, the Berwick border is going to be a feature of another Scotland referendum in a way that it wasn’t in 2014.

If an independent Scotland were to join the EU, is there any possible way that we don’t have physical border infrastructure on the M6 and A1, and a rebuilding of Hadrian’s wall in barbed wire?

Such borders are only necessary as long as they are needed in the Irish Sea and at Dover.

The Anglo-Scottish border is only a nightmare if England chooses for it to be a nightmare elsewhere.

Whole point of discussing it first, would be to get agreement that there will not be a physical border between England and Scotland.

That’s not a problem for England, but is a potential problem for Scotland if they wish to join the EU.

Indeed, England could correctly say that if Scotland wishes to stay part of the UK single market and stay out of the EU and EEA and EU Customs Union a hard border could be avoided.

However if Scotland voted for independence to rejoin the EU, the EEA or Customs Union, the border guards and razor wire would be sent to Berwick the next day

Huh? A bit of hyperbole (razor wire). And he says "would be" - indicating a hypothetical course of action, speculating on UK govt's actions.

He doesn't say "I want", "I would", or give any endorsement of the mooted course of action.

To quote the POTUS "come on, man!"

He's constantly endorsing that.

Malmesbury said:

Mexicanpete said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

Mexicanpete said:

MarqueeMark said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

rottenborough said:

the pressure to vaccinate teachers soon and get schools open is building this morning by looks of things.

Apparently it will not stop the spread of the virus even when teachers are vaccinated

But it might stop them moaning....

Moaning is the product from X number of years of the verbal waterboarding they endure from our precious offspring.

Would you do it for 30 grand a year?

A lot of head teachers earn very high salaries for what is a demanding role, but nonetheless very secure when compared to private sector positions on those types of salary.

Therefore there is a financially rewarding career pathway for teachers should they choose it and are good enough. If a teacher decides to remain a teacher for all their career (average salary 37k, but can in some cases rise to upper 50s, that is very vocational and commendable, but it is a lifestyle choice. The idea that we should feel sorry for teachers' salaries doesn't wash with me, but it also doesn't stop me admiring what they do. And by the way, I think they should be a priority for vaccination.

The percentage of teachers who become headteachers or ever senior teaching staff is miniscule. Presumably with the burgeoning number of multiple academy organisations run by minor captains of industry that opportunity is reduced further.

According to the Great God Google, in 2016...

"In the 3,400 secondary schools in 2016, there were 3,600 headteachers, 5,300 deputy headteachers, 13,600 assistant headteachers, 81,800 middle leaders and 103,800 classroom teachers"

The first thing I wonder is about "13,600 assistant headteachers" - is this a good post, or is it one of those all-the-work-but-not-the-money-while-you wait-for-promotion things?

My late father was the Deputy Head of a Comprehensive School. He worked like a dog. The Headmaster was more like the figurehead, pressing flesh and schmoozing with the great and the good of Hereford and Worcester County (as was).

HYUFD said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TOPPING said:

ydoethur said:

TOPPING said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Alistair said:

DougSeal said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Sandpit said:

HYUFD said:

Foxy said:

Theuniondivvie said:

Gordo Brown on R4 saying the UK will endure if the argument in defence of it is made properly followed by ‘we need a constitutional commission’ & some Orwellian ‘I’m a patriot not a nationalist’ guff. This fresh, new thinking is bound to do the trick.

The problem with the Union is that there is an ever decreasing sentiment for it, even if there is an economic case.

Union was largely driven by external threat, either because England felt threatened by the back door, hence conquest, or by the threat from France, Germany or Soviet Union giving a more positive reason to stand together.

There is simply little reason for it anymore other than accidents of history.

No nothing at all except to stop Customs Posts at Berwick, inevitable in the event of Scexit or to ensure our place in the G7 and as permanent members of the UN Security Council and protect our place in the world.

Plus of course Scotland and Wales and Northern Ireland all have large deficits, only London and the SE raises more in revenue than it spends so if Scotland went independent that would mean deep spending cuts and tax rises would be required from Edinburgh to avoid Scotland going bankrupt. Dublin has also ruled out a border poll for at least 5 years as it does not want to have to fund NI anytime soon

Having now left the EU CU, the Berwick border is going to be a feature of another Scotland referendum in a way that it wasn’t in 2014.

If an independent Scotland were to join the EU, is there any possible way that we don’t have physical border infrastructure on the M6 and A1, and a rebuilding of Hadrian’s wall in barbed wire?

No there isn't, there would be a hard border along Hadrian's Wall with customs posts and border guards

Hadrian's wall is in England you pillock.

I live north of Hadrian's wall and there's another 50 miles of England north of me.

The wall is just 0.6 miles from the Scottish border at Bowness-on-Solway

You can never concede a point can you?

Given he still hasn't admitted getting the EU Ref turnout in Scotland wrong yesterday I think it is safe to say it is a vanishingly rare event.

And his chances of standing for an mp are also vanishing

why do you say that?

I agree, they vanished long ago.

Or to put it another way, would anyone be mad keen to see Hyufd in Parliament?

Many sterling qualities - good manners, intelligence, an understanding of polling and polling methods matched by few on this board (and certainly better than mine) - but neither the flexibility of mind nor the intellectual courage to make proper policy based on evidence, because he simply refuses to see evidence that doesn't fit his theories. That's not what you want in an MP.

It's exactly what a government wants in an MP.

Everything @HYUFD writes on here is, in the back or front of his mind, writen so that it can be used at his PPC selection committee. It reflects govt policy and points out some of the issues with any contra-policy.

Does he fulfil other PPC selection criteria? No idea. But (if) his aim is to become an MP he is not hindering it by his posts on PB.

Are they as wry, arch and knowing as the rest of our posts? No, but that's not his aim.

I've never seen a PPC calling for razor wire at Hadrian's wall and if one did I'd expect he'd be suspended from the party PDQ.

Can you cite a real MP or PPC doing so?

The original post I was replying to was from Sandpit who said 'If an independent Scotland were to join the EU, is there any possible way that we don’t have physical border infrastructure on the M6 and A1, and a rebuilding of Hadrian’s wall in barbed wire?'

So it was Sandpit who raised barbed wire not me.

I nonetheless agreed with his general point stating that 'No there isn't, there would be a hard border along Hadrian's Wall with customs posts and border guards.'

I am also not going to take any lectures from you and BigG about my position in the party when I have never once voted Labour in a general election but always for a Tory government when you both voted for Blair and New Labour!!

The context of my comment was that a hard customs border might be imposed by Scotland joining the EU, and therefore we should negotiate at tthe start of the separation process for there to be no hard border - much as the EU did with the UK with regard to the border in Ireland.

Malmesbury said:

Mexicanpete said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

Mexicanpete said:

MarqueeMark said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

rottenborough said:

the pressure to vaccinate teachers soon and get schools open is building this morning by looks of things.

Apparently it will not stop the spread of the virus even when teachers are vaccinated

But it might stop them moaning....

Moaning is the product from X number of years of the verbal waterboarding they endure from our precious offspring.

Would you do it for 30 grand a year?

A lot of head teachers earn very high salaries for what is a demanding role, but nonetheless very secure when compared to private sector positions on those types of salary.

Therefore there is a financially rewarding career pathway for teachers should they choose it and are good enough. If a teacher decides to remain a teacher for all their career (average salary 37k, but can in some cases rise to upper 50s, that is very vocational and commendable, but it is a lifestyle choice. The idea that we should feel sorry for teachers' salaries doesn't wash with me, but it also doesn't stop me admiring what they do. And by the way, I think they should be a priority for vaccination.

The percentage of teachers who become headteachers or ever senior teaching staff is miniscule. Presumably with the burgeoning number of multiple academy organisations run by minor captains of industry that opportunity is reduced further.

According to the Great God Google, in 2016...

"In the 3,400 secondary schools in 2016, there were 3,600 headteachers, 5,300 deputy headteachers, 13,600 assistant headteachers, 81,800 middle leaders and 103,800 classroom teachers"

The first thing I wonder is about "13,600 assistant headteachers" - is this a good post, or is it one of those all-the-work-but-not-the-money-while-you wait-for-promotion things?

It's a fancy title for all the jobs the actual senior leaders can't be bothered to do themselves.

HYUFD said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TOPPING said:

ydoethur said:

TOPPING said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Alistair said:

DougSeal said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Sandpit said:

HYUFD said:

Foxy said:

Theuniondivvie said:

Gordo Brown on R4 saying the UK will endure if the argument in defence of it is made properly followed by ‘we need a constitutional commission’ & some Orwellian ‘I’m a patriot not a nationalist’ guff. This fresh, new thinking is bound to do the trick.

The problem with the Union is that there is an ever decreasing sentiment for it, even if there is an economic case.

Union was largely driven by external threat, either because England felt threatened by the back door, hence conquest, or by the threat from France, Germany or Soviet Union giving a more positive reason to stand together.

There is simply little reason for it anymore other than accidents of history.

No nothing at all except to stop Customs Posts at Berwick, inevitable in the event of Scexit or to ensure our place in the G7 and as permanent members of the UN Security Council and protect our place in the world.

Plus of course Scotland and Wales and Northern Ireland all have large deficits, only London and the SE raises more in revenue than it spends so if Scotland went independent that would mean deep spending cuts and tax rises would be required from Edinburgh to avoid Scotland going bankrupt. Dublin has also ruled out a border poll for at least 5 years as it does not want to have to fund NI anytime soon

Having now left the EU CU, the Berwick border is going to be a feature of another Scotland referendum in a way that it wasn’t in 2014.

If an independent Scotland were to join the EU, is there any possible way that we don’t have physical border infrastructure on the M6 and A1, and a rebuilding of Hadrian’s wall in barbed wire?

No there isn't, there would be a hard border along Hadrian's Wall with customs posts and border guards

Hadrian's wall is in England you pillock.

I live north of Hadrian's wall and there's another 50 miles of England north of me.

The wall is just 0.6 miles from the Scottish border at Bowness-on-Solway

You can never concede a point can you?

Given he still hasn't admitted getting the EU Ref turnout in Scotland wrong yesterday I think it is safe to say it is a vanishingly rare event.

And his chances of standing for an mp are also vanishing

why do you say that?

I agree, they vanished long ago.

Or to put it another way, would anyone be mad keen to see Hyufd in Parliament?

Many sterling qualities - good manners, intelligence, an understanding of polling and polling methods matched by few on this board (and certainly better than mine) - but neither the flexibility of mind nor the intellectual courage to make proper policy based on evidence, because he simply refuses to see evidence that doesn't fit his theories. That's not what you want in an MP.

It's exactly what a government wants in an MP.

Everything @HYUFD writes on here is, in the back or front of his mind, writen so that it can be used at his PPC selection committee. It reflects govt policy and points out some of the issues with any contra-policy.

Does he fulfil other PPC selection criteria? No idea. But (if) his aim is to become an MP he is not hindering it by his posts on PB.

Are they as wry, arch and knowing as the rest of our posts? No, but that's not his aim.

I've never seen a PPC calling for razor wire at Hadrian's wall and if one did I'd expect he'd be suspended from the party PDQ.

Can you cite a real MP or PPC doing so?

The original post I was replying to was from Sandpit who said 'If an independent Scotland were to join the EU, is there any possible way that we don’t have physical border infrastructure on the M6 and A1, and a rebuilding of Hadrian’s wall in barbed wire?'

So it was Sandpit who raised barbed wire not me.

I nonetheless agreed with his general point stating that 'No there isn't, there would be a hard border along Hadrian's Wall with customs posts and border guards.'

I am also not going to take any lectures from you and BigG about my position in the party when I have never once voted Labour in a general election but always for a Tory government when you both voted for Blair and New Labour!!

Here are your shameful comments from 8.38am today


HYUFD Posts: 81,696
8:38AM edited 8:40AM

Indeed, England could correctly say that if Scotland wishes to stay part of the UK single market and stay out of the EU and EEA and EU Customs Union a hard border could be avoided.

However if Scotland voted for independence to rejoin the EU, the EEA or Customs Union, the border guards and razor wire would be sent to Berwick the next day

ydoethur said:

DougSeal said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

Leon said:

In the face of Covid, bickering about Scottish independence or speculating about statehood for DC feels like a pub brawl on the front line of the Somme.

Humanity - the entire species - all of us - is facing its greatest crisis since World War 2. This last week was the worst yet. Even if the crisis abates by summer, the economic, demographic, psychological consequences - nearly all of them awful - will be with us for a generation. So much damage is being done to so many people, places, businesses, countries.

And lurking just over the horizon is the reasonable worst-case scenario: the virus keeps mutating, rendering vaccines ineffective. In which case human society changes forever. Most travel ends. Borders close permanently. We have to spend 20% of GDP on healthcare - or let people die in the street.

This entire thread is decadent piffle.

Yes Covid is serious but you even over 80s who get it are more likely to survive it than not.

If we got a virus with a much more deadly death rate then yes your apocalyptic scenario might come to pass but Covid is not it.

At the moment even allowing for some mutations the vaccine looks effective

Head

Desk

Thump

Did you really just say Scottish independence is a more serious issue than a pandemic that even on official figures is rapidly approaching being the fifth deadliest of all time?

Where did you get 5th deadliest from?

Number 5 is about 5 million dead, according to WIkipedia which as we know is never wrong.

At the moment officially it's on about number 14, but that's definitely underestimating the current number of deaths and probably overestimating the death rate of a few above.

One of those claims that is both true and untrue simultaneously.

Its true in numerical absolute numbers.

Its false in real percentage of population numbers.

Of course the border is actually more than 2 miles north of Berwick. You have to go past the lovely Morrisons first.

Andy_JS said:

England ballsing things up in Galle. 89/4,

On average a team doubles the score they were on at the fall of the 4th wicket. So the central estimate would have England scoring 178 all out, just ahead of the 164 required.

Philip_Thompson said:

Gardenwalker said:

Nigel_Foremain said:

Gardenwalker said:

One thing I do respect about HYUFD is that he voted Remain and has never recanted from conceding that Brexit is economically damaging (albeit necessary, having voted for it).

That’s actually a lot more honest than many posters who scoffed unto the end that any economic harm was just “Project Fear”.

Virtually everything that was warned about Brexit that was dismissed as "project fear" has largely come to pass. The only real Project Fear was that used by Leave fascists who wanted the gullible to believe that they were about to be overrun by Romanians

I’d give it about 8/10.

Slower growth? Check.
Fall in pound? Check.
Increased inflation? Only a little only (so far)
Increased indy sentiment? Check.
Succour to populists and alt-rightest? Check.
Trade restrictions? Check.
Loss of rights? Check.
Damage to relations with key allies? Check.
Loss of U.K. influence? Check.
Fall in house prices? Not really.

I'd give it the following
Fall in pound? Check. (But I'd argue in the circumstances this is a good thing)
Increased indy sentiment? Check.
Trade restrictions? Check. (Negligible, just paperwork not tariffs etc)
Loss of rights? Check. (Those that were acknowkledged during the referendum)

Slower growth? ❌
- Objectively the UK had faster, not slower, growth than the Eurozone in the past decade "despite Brexit"

Increased inflation? ❌
- Objectively the UK has below-target inflation.

Succour to populists and alt-rightest? ❌
- Objectively opinion polls are showing reduced tolerance of alt-rightists and populists and greater acceptance of immigrants and immigration.

Loss of U.K. influence? ❌
- I can't see any objective way to measure this but UK has been capable of reaching agreements with those they want to do so, on a similar basis as we could before.

Damage to relations with key allies? ❌
- Allies have accepted Brexit and moved on. They view it as Britain being Britain and not objectively damaged.

Fall in house prices? Not really.
- Which is a shame but nevermind.

I'll give you the first two red crosses, but with regards to the remainder, you're having a laugh!

Gallowgate said:

Of course the border is actually more than 2 miles north of Berwick. You have to go past the lovely Morrisons first.

the Morrisons with more alcohol sales than any other due to it being cheaper than anywhere else on the borders for alcohol.

eek said:

Gallowgate said:

Of course the border is actually more than 2 miles north of Berwick. You have to go past the lovely Morrisons first.

the Morrisons with more alcohol sales than any other due to it being cheaper than anywhere else on the borders for cheap alcohol.

@HYUFD and his border guards will soon put a stop to that.

Mexicanpete said:

My late father was the Deputy Head of a Comprehensive School. He worked like a dog. The Headmaster was more like the figurehead, pressing flesh and schmoozing with the great and the good of Hereford and Worcester County (as was).

My late mother was a music teacher and later Head of Music at a grammar school. When I was at university and living at home she used to pay me to do her marking. I had NFI what I was doing.

Gallowgate said:

Of course the border is actually more than 2 miles north of Berwick. You have to go past the lovely Morrisons first.

I passed my driving test on my 17th birthday, (My father had taught me for months on an old disused airfield) and to celebrate I drove his Austin Westminster on my own of course at a very fast speed (speed not admitted) along the stretch from Berwick and over the border only stopping when I arrived at Eyemouth

LostPassword said:

Andy_JS said:

England ballsing things up in Galle. 89/4,

On average a team doubles the score they were on at the fall of the 4th wicket. So the central estimate would have England scoring 178 all out, just ahead of the 164 required.

On average, they're not batting on a turning wicket in Sri Lanka.