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I thought it would need to be substantially different, so amended, not just 'oh, go on, give us an election'.eek said:
Yep - an election was requested this week and it should be once per a Parliamentary session.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Can't Bercow refuse this?Big_G_NorthWales said:JRM announces another attempt on a GE in the HOC on Monday
Mind you that rule has been broken a few times so lets see what happens.
Could just be a ruse to allow B. Johnson to resign, rather than go to the EU and ask for an A50 extension.0 -
@HYUFD genuine question, no need to go into details, I am not trying to trickm or embarrass you. I have to ask do you have any small doubts or concerns about the performance of the Johnson administration this week? Or do you genuinely believe that everything is going as planned and that things are all working out well?
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Boris needs to go on TV each and every day and explain that Labour is forcing a post-31 October election precisely so that he has to sign a piece of paper surrendering Britain to the EU.Stereotomy said:
Haven't you been saying for months now that the Tories would do badly in the next election if we're still in the EU after Oct 31st? Do you not believe that's the case any more, or do you think this week hasn't made that outcome any more likely?HYUFD said:
Wait until the weekend polls, then we will see what a 'disaster' it has been for BorisNigelb said:
May I gently remind you of Mrs. May's polling lead prior to the last election.HYUFD said:
10% Tory poll lead some disaster, the Westminster commentariat so out of touch now it is beyond a jokeCarlottaVance said:
You surely cannot deny that the last few days have been... sub-optimal for the Prime Minister ?
Boris: Well, here's that piece of paper [lifts up copy of extension agreement].
Vote for me on Nov 7 and this is what I'll do to it [rips up copy of extension agreement].
Rinse and repeat, cannibalize BXP, keep the voters who fear Corbyn more than Brexit. Profit!0 -
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:0 -
Interesting that four MPs have crossed to the LDs - two Labour and two Tory.
Reinforces their credentials as the sensible centre.0 -
Sorry but that’s not right. The FTPA has to be treated differently, else if you won one vote of no confidence you’d not have to face another one that session, whatever happened. It would be very eccentric for any speaker to suggest that any vote under the FTPA could only happen once.eek said:
Yep - an election was requested this week and it should be once per a Parliamentary session.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Can't Bercow refuse this?Big_G_NorthWales said:JRM announces another attempt on a GE in the HOC on Monday
Mind you that rule has been broken a few times so lets see what happens.0 -
I'm still holding that view a little bit.noneoftheabove said:The vast majority (on both leave and remain sides) who seem to believe that he really is going for no deal cannot explain why he went for prorogation dates that had no benefit at all for delivering no deal?
If he wanted prorogation to deliver no deal it would have been a month later.
If he thought that was too controversial it would have been no prorogation.
The dates he chose can only have been to signal to his followers how committed he is to no deal, whilst at the same time making no deal on Oct 31 extremely unlikely.
They achieved nothing to help with no deal, and plenty that blocked it.
So, ultimately, you think a Boris Deal passes?
Most likely an election first - that he wins - and then a Deal?0 -
And if Nicola goes for it it'll be game on.dyedwoolie said:
He could vote to amend the FTPA, it's different legislation.eek said:
Yep - an election was requested this week and it should be once per a Parliamentary session.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Can't Bercow refuse this?Big_G_NorthWales said:JRM announces another attempt on a GE in the HOC on Monday
Mind you that rule has been broken a few times so lets see what happens.0 -
That will make the decision to Prorogue wonderfully ironic.
Perhaps Mr Johnson will start providing evidence to the courts that Proroguing was after all illegal!CarlottaVance said:0 -
"Boris has past form" - and Corbyn doesnt ? I mean he has a charge sheet as long as BoJo but just on other issues.eek said:
Boris has past form which can be brought up that others just don't have.Alanbrooke said:
Boris character is hardly a surprise, the electorate are well aware of it. When all parties go down the route of character attacks they simply raise the issue that "theyre all like that" and damage themselves in the process.El_Capitano said:This "can't be trusted" line on Johnson has the potential to stick. It seems to have suddenly surfaced as the no 1 Labour attack line - whether as an edict from Labour HQ or (more likely) other MPs following Jess Phillips' lead.
Encouraging the underling you are having an affair with to have an abortion is a story that will destroy Boris's female vote.
Likewise being fired not once but twice having been caught out lying.
Normally its routine to claim that the next election will be the dirtiest ever and it rarely is, But given the lunacy at Wminster currently, this one might just live up to the billing.0 -
PURGE HIM!williamglenn said:Gove says he would back Theresa May’s deal again.
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If Brexit is Johnson’s Falklands, should there be some Peruvian Peace Proposals in the mix to replace the backstop?0
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A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:0 -
Have they settled the precise date parliament will be prorogued yet?eristdoof said:That will make the decision to Prorogue wonderfully ironic.
Perhaps Mr Johnson will start providing evidence to the courts that Proroguing was after all illegal!CarlottaVance said:
IIRC it was felxible, between 9th and 12th September.0 -
The complaint that Corbyn isn't allowing an election will be pathetic once Labour has voted for an election.dyedwoolie said:
But they did abstain and he did get a big majority of votes for it. If they abstain they are not against nor in favour, if they move from abstain to voting no they are actively blocking. Nobody is going to buy that it's for anything other than party advantage and 'screw the country/voters'. Its simply not a tenable position to be in favour of an election and vote against oneeek said:
Only because most people intentionally abstained as it needed 434 votes to be carried and there wasn't 434 MPs in the house.dyedwoolie said:
He got a very big majority for an election last night, not enough however under FTPA, he can argue there is a clear majority for an election (289 to 58)and propose an amendment to the FTPA Monday and labour have to actively block him, showing they are playing it for party mot countryeek said:
Boris asked for an election last night and last - I really don't think he can ask for another one a week after his previous request.numbertwelve said:There seems to be a bit of a move in Labour to want a GE after 31 October.
I think this is them pushing it a little bit too far. The delay for the passage of the Brexit Bill at least has the vague sense of arguability that they’re making sure Boris doesn’t push the GE date beyond Brexit. Any further delay is just obvious naked political advantage I don’t suspect it will go down very well. Besides, if it forces Boris to reluctantly ask for an extension he can say “look at what parliament made me do, I wanted an election.”
As soon as Parliament is prorogued the opposition can start asking for an election knowing that one cannot be called until about October 22nd due to the Queen's speech debate.
And when the election is called it will be after 5+ weeks of people all calling for an election with Boris unable to respond with one.0 -
I think Corbyn does that immediately before this (the election) debate and after Benn's act is passed.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:
Then he can argue against the election as he doesn't want Boris in charge.
JRM/Boris can then prorogue Parliament having failed to get an election or lose the VONC the following day.0 -
The parliamentary and governmental situation until then may turn towards the bizarre, in that case.eristdoof said:That will make the decision to Prorogue wonderfully ironic.
Perhaps Mr Johnson will start providing evidence to the courts that Proroguing was after all illegal!CarlottaVance said:0 -
It does if the commons cannot propose an alternative PM in 14 days. It would make the election Oct 28th I think if it went through?Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:0 -
If he gets a majority of 30+ we get a deal around end of the year. The EU will be happier to negotiate solely with a govt and not having to also manage the hung parliament.kinabalu said:
I'm still holding that view a little bit.noneoftheabove said:The vast majority (on both leave and remain sides) who seem to believe that he really is going for no deal cannot explain why he went for prorogation dates that had no benefit at all for delivering no deal?
If he wanted prorogation to deliver no deal it would have been a month later.
If he thought that was too controversial it would have been no prorogation.
The dates he chose can only have been to signal to his followers how committed he is to no deal, whilst at the same time making no deal on Oct 31 extremely unlikely.
They achieved nothing to help with no deal, and plenty that blocked it.
So, ultimately, you think a Boris Deal passes?
Most likely an election first - that he wins - and then a Deal?
If he gets a majority less than 30 - not sure what happens
If he doesnt get a majority - none of the other parties will touch him with a bargepole and he will have escaped responsibility for no deal, and have a loyal base for a future comeback, probably not straight away.0 -
It's the Peruvian marching powder I'm worried about.williamglenn said:If Brexit is Johnson’s Falklands, should there be some Peruvian Peace Proposals in the mix to replace the backstop?
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But what about the risk of it passing, no alternative government being found, and Boris calling an election for after Oct 31?Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:0 -
Mr JS,
Frit was used regularly where I grew up (in Boston), although it was 'frit to death' more often.
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No, as Boris has voted against extension. Had he extended of his own free will it would have been a disaster but if Boris only extends as the law requires him to but still promises to Leave as soon as he gets the Tories a majority I doubt that affects his rating at all, in fact it probably boosts it further in opposition to diehard Remainer MPsStereotomy said:
Haven't you been saying for months now that the Tories would do badly in the next election if we're still in the EU after Oct 31st? Do you not believe that's the case any more, or do you think this week hasn't made that outcome any more likely?HYUFD said:
Wait until the weekend polls, then we will see what a 'disaster' it has been for BorisNigelb said:
May I gently remind you of Mrs. May's polling lead prior to the last election.HYUFD said:
10% Tory poll lead some disaster, the Westminster commentariat so out of touch now it is beyond a jokeCarlottaVance said:
You surely cannot deny that the last few days have been... sub-optimal for the Prime Minister ?
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That has to go through the Lords and could be blocked there.GIN1138 said:
And if Nicola goes for it it'll be game on.dyedwoolie said:
He could vote to amend the FTPA, it's different legislation.eek said:
Yep - an election was requested this week and it should be once per a Parliamentary session.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Can't Bercow refuse this?Big_G_NorthWales said:JRM announces another attempt on a GE in the HOC on Monday
Mind you that rule has been broken a few times so lets see what happens.0 -
Or thurs oct 31st, purdah till 10pm on Brexit daydyedwoolie said:
It does if the commons cannot propose an alternative PM in 14 days. It would make the election Oct 28th I think if it went through?Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:0 -
The diehard retainers are becoming diehard remainers...Dura_Ace said:
PURGE HIM!williamglenn said:Gove says he would back Theresa May’s deal again.
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And the opposition will reply that you can't trust Boris to keep his word about anything. If he wins he will bring back May's deal/go over the cliff (depending on which opposition party we are talking about).blueblue said:
Boris needs to go on TV each and every day and explain that Labour is forcing a post-31 October election precisely so that he has to sign a piece of paper surrendering Britain to the EU.Stereotomy said:
Haven't you been saying for months now that the Tories would do badly in the next election if we're still in the EU after Oct 31st? Do you not believe that's the case any more, or do you think this week hasn't made that outcome any more likely?HYUFD said:
Wait until the weekend polls, then we will see what a 'disaster' it has been for BorisNigelb said:
May I gently remind you of Mrs. May's polling lead prior to the last election.HYUFD said:
10% Tory poll lead some disaster, the Westminster commentariat so out of touch now it is beyond a jokeCarlottaVance said:
You surely cannot deny that the last few days have been... sub-optimal for the Prime Minister ?
Boris: Well, here's that piece of paper [lifts up copy of extension agreement].
Vote for me on Nov 7 and this is what I'll do to it [rips up copy of extension agreement].
Rinse and repeat, cannibalize BXP, keep the voters who fear Corbyn more than Brexit. Profit!
You can't trust Boris.0 -
Yeah exactly. It's a bizarre choice of attack line.eristdoof said:=
The complaint that Corbyn isn't allowing an election will be pathetic once Labour has voted for an election.0 -
Last night the FTPA did the job it was designed to do.
A Prime Minister shouldn't be able to call a snap election just because it benefits him. Both sides of the house have to agree.0 -
Boris will have to, by law, request an a50 extension because of the new Act.Stereotomy said:
But what about the risk of it passing, no alternative government being found, and Boris calling an election for after Oct 31?Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:0 -
The 'Do Not Prorogue' petition has levelled off at just over 1.7m but I am expecting a lot more signatures to come flooding in from hard Brexiteers who realise that prorogation is now boxing them into an extension beyond 31 October.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/2691570 -
Listening to JRM announcing the next attempt at the GE, Bercow was very relaxed and, believe it or not, there was a good humoured exchange between the two.Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:
Labour did not object so Monday is decision time for Corbyn0 -
Its a here today, gone tomorrow line. It wont have much impact on floating voters in 6-10 weeks time.Stereotomy said:
Yeah exactly. It's a bizarre choice of attack line.eristdoof said:=
The complaint that Corbyn isn't allowing an election will be pathetic once Labour has voted for an election.0 -
And the UK apparently a one party state come November.CarlottaVance said:LibDems and graphics!
https://twitter.com/leonardocarella/status/1169577237110284288?s=201 -
He may. He may also attach conditions to any request.Jonathan said:
Boris will have to, by law, request an a50 extension because of the new Act.Stereotomy said:
But what about the risk of it passing, no alternative government being found, and Boris calling an election for after Oct 31?Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:0 -
And if he says "I'm not signing it - either call an election, VONC me, or go **** yourselves"?Jonathan said:
Boris will have to, by law, request an a50 extension because of the new Act.Stereotomy said:
But what about the risk of it passing, no alternative government being found, and Boris calling an election for after Oct 31?Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:0 -
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But Cummings could not care less about NI.CarlottaVance said:
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To misquote our friend Mr Trump, "Lock him up"blueblue said:
And if he says "I'm not signing it - either call an election, VONC me, or go **** yourselves"?Jonathan said:
Boris will have to, by law, request an a50 extension because of the new Act.Stereotomy said:
But what about the risk of it passing, no alternative government being found, and Boris calling an election for after Oct 31?Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:0 -
The one thing Corbyn does need to do over the weekend is come up with an actual, alternative date for the election. Say "it should be on [x] of November of December" then challenge Boris to back it, and if he refuses, asking him why he's so "frit" of the scrutiny that would come with a long campaign.0
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Good luck labour selling that to the electorate. 'We whipped our unelected Lords to stop you having a vote. But we want a vote 2 weeks later. We will tell you when you may vote, you will comply'eek said:
That has to go through the Lords and could be blocked there.GIN1138 said:
And if Nicola goes for it it'll be game on.dyedwoolie said:
He could vote to amend the FTPA, it's different legislation.eek said:
Yep - an election was requested this week and it should be once per a Parliamentary session.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Can't Bercow refuse this?Big_G_NorthWales said:JRM announces another attempt on a GE in the HOC on Monday
Mind you that rule has been broken a few times so lets see what happens.0 -
They do know that he's not (or, rather, wasn't) the PM, don't they?Scott_P said:0 -
I'm not sure he could. Its not a bill being brought back unaltered. Its a HoC vote for a GE.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Can't Bercow refuse this?Big_G_NorthWales said:JRM announces another attempt on a GE in the HOC on Monday
If he could/did, it would be politically 'brave'.0 -
He will be in contempt of parliament... Lock him up!blueblue said:
And if he says "I'm not signing it - either call an election, VONC me, or go **** yourselves"?Jonathan said:
Boris will have to, by law, request an a50 extension because of the new Act.Stereotomy said:
But what about the risk of it passing, no alternative government being found, and Boris calling an election for after Oct 31?Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said: 0 -
But you can trust Corbyn to be a loony lefty. Hence the extreme difficulty he'll have in winning a majority.anothernick said:
And the opposition will reply that you can't trust Boris to keep his word about anything. If he wins he will bring back May's deal/go over the cliff (depending on which opposition party we are talking about).blueblue said:
Boris needs to go on TV each and every day and explain that Labour is forcing a post-31 October election precisely so that he has to sign a piece of paper surrendering Britain to the EU.Stereotomy said:
Haven't you been saying for months now that the Tories would do badly in the next election if we're still in the EU after Oct 31st? Do you not believe that's the case any more, or do you think this week hasn't made that outcome any more likely?HYUFD said:
Wait until the weekend polls, then we will see what a 'disaster' it has been for BorisNigelb said:
May I gently remind you of Mrs. May's polling lead prior to the last election.HYUFD said:
10% Tory poll lead some disaster, the Westminster commentariat so out of touch now it is beyond a jokeCarlottaVance said:
You surely cannot deny that the last few days have been... sub-optimal for the Prime Minister ?
Boris: Well, here's that piece of paper [lifts up copy of extension agreement].
Vote for me on Nov 7 and this is what I'll do to it [rips up copy of extension agreement].
Rinse and repeat, cannibalize BXP, keep the voters who fear Corbyn more than Brexit. Profit!
You can't trust Boris.0 -
He also doesn’t need bad polls as the breadcrumbs to his election chicken.Danny565 said:The one thing Corbyn does need to do over the weekend is come up with an actual, alternative date for the election. Say "it should be on [x] of November of December" then challenge Boris to back it, and if he refuses, asking him why he's so "frit" of the scrutiny that would come with a long campaign.
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Which is on Monday and fulfils Corbyn's statement in the HOC when he said labour would vote for a GE once the Act received RAScott_P said:0 -
This is an outright lie. If the search facility on this forum was decent I would find the your posts. You clearly wrote, that if we had not Brexited by the 31st of October then tories would lose huge numbers of votes to the Brexit party.HYUFD said:
No, as Boris has voted against extension. Had he extended of his own free will it would have been a disaster but if Boris only extends as the law requires him to but still promises to Leave as soon as he gets the Tories a majority I doubt that affects his rating at all, in fact it probably boosts it further in opposition to diehard Remainer MPsStereotomy said:
Haven't you been saying for months now that the Tories would do badly in the next election if we're still in the EU after Oct 31st? Do you not believe that's the case any more, or do you think this week hasn't made that outcome any more likely?HYUFD said:
Wait until the weekend polls, then we will see what a 'disaster' it has been for BorisNigelb said:
May I gently remind you of Mrs. May's polling lead prior to the last election.HYUFD said:
10% Tory poll lead some disaster, the Westminster commentariat so out of touch now it is beyond a jokeCarlottaVance said:
You surely cannot deny that the last few days have been... sub-optimal for the Prime Minister ?0 -
It seems rather likely that the bill will pass, pro roguing will go ahead and Boris won't agree an extension with the EU and thus we leave with no deal.0
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Danny565 said:
Yes if only there was a conference season where every man and his dog will take credit for shackling Boris and frustrating the result of the referendum. Then Boris will have plenty of quotes to use in his own speech as to why he tried everything he could including offering an election and Parliament refused. I’m pretty sure they already have the montage of clips of senior labour politician demanding an electionAramintaMoonbeamQC said:
It is perfect. Simple line, plenty of evidence - even his own brother doesn't trust him etc etc.El_Capitano said:This "can't be trusted" line on Johnson has the potential to stick. It seems to have suddenly surfaced as the no 1 Labour attack line - whether as an edict from Labour HQ or (more likely) other MPs following Jess Phillips' lead.
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the French always laugh at us and we themScott_P said:FFS, the French are laughing at us
https://twitter.com/carlgardner/status/11695821669274460280 -
Nope - Monday Corbyn says he wants a VONC.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Listening to JRM announcing the next attempt at the GE, Bercow was very relaxed and, believe it or not, there was a good humoured exchange between the two.Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:
Labour did not object so Monday is decision time for Corbyn
That allows him to repeat during the election debate that Boris cannot be trusted.
Then on Tuesday we see how the VONC plays out and on Wednesday there can always be another election debate if Boris wins the VONC (he won't).0 -
That was broadly the rationale for my (quite big!) lay of 2019 No Deal.noneoftheabove said:If he gets a majority of 30+ we get a deal around end of the year. The EU will be happier to negotiate solely with a govt and not having to also manage the hung parliament.
If he gets a majority less than 30 - not sure what happens
If he doesnt get a majority - none of the other parties will touch him with a bargepole and he will have escaped responsibility for no deal, and have a loyal base for a future comeback, probably not straight away.
He must win an election if he wants to do it.
But if he wins an election he can do a Deal instead.0 -
Not really a problem, as extrapolating from the graph within a few months the whole country will be Libdem MPs. The issue for me would be where we will get enough immigrants to get the future Libdem MPs after that? How we would manage the point scoring system?Nigelb said:
And the UK apparently a one party state come November.CarlottaVance said:LibDems and graphics!
https://twitter.com/leonardocarella/status/1169577237110284288?s=200 -
In any event, it will still need a 2/3rds majority, so Corbyn holds the power.TheValiant said:
I'm not sure he could. Its not a bill being brought back unaltered. Its a HoC vote for a GE.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Can't Bercow refuse this?Big_G_NorthWales said:JRM announces another attempt on a GE in the HOC on Monday
If he could/did, it would be politically 'brave'.0 -
What a piece of shit Johnson is. Even his brother can't stick him....0
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They are going well, the images of diehard Remainer MPs and Corbyn blocking Boris delivering Brexit is all that mattersJonathan said:@HYUFD genuine question, no need to go into details, I am not trying to trickm or embarrass you. I have to ask do you have any small doubts or concerns about the performance of the Johnson administration this week? Or do you genuinely believe that everything is going as planned and that things are all working out well?
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No as Swinson would veto Corbyn as PMJonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:0 -
I request an extension to Jan 31 2020, and Calais back.TGOHF said:
He may. He may also attach conditions to any request.Jonathan said:
Boris will have to, by law, request an a50 extension because of the new Act.Stereotomy said:
But what about the risk of it passing, no alternative government being found, and Boris calling an election for after Oct 31?Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:1 -
You seem very scared of a GEeek said:
Nope - Monday Corbyn says he wants a VONC.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Listening to JRM announcing the next attempt at the GE, Bercow was very relaxed and, believe it or not, there was a good humoured exchange between the two.Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:
Labour did not object so Monday is decision time for Corbyn
That allows him to repeat during the election debate that Boris cannot be trusted.
Then on Tuesday we see how the VONC plays out and on Wednesday there can always be another election debate if Boris wins the VONC (he won't).0 -
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That would send a lot of Lab -> Lib switchers back to Labour and help attract more potential Con -> Lib switchers.HYUFD said:
No as Swinson would veto Corbyn as PMJonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:0 -
Nope - I just want it after October 31st...Big_G_NorthWales said:
You seem very scared of a GEeek said:
Nope - Monday Corbyn says he wants a VONC.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Listening to JRM announcing the next attempt at the GE, Bercow was very relaxed and, believe it or not, there was a good humoured exchange between the two.Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:
Labour did not object so Monday is decision time for Corbyn
That allows him to repeat during the election debate that Boris cannot be trusted.
Then on Tuesday we see how the VONC plays out and on Wednesday there can always be another election debate if Boris wins the VONC (he won't).
Edit to add - because Boris cannot be trusted.0 -
Surely Heidi Allen must be next in the drip drip drip of new Lib Dems0
-
Because he knows commie Corbyn would get creamed.Big_G_NorthWales said:
You seem very scared of a GEeek said:
Nope - Monday Corbyn says he wants a VONC.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Listening to JRM announcing the next attempt at the GE, Bercow was very relaxed and, believe it or not, there was a good humoured exchange between the two.Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:
Labour did not object so Monday is decision time for Corbyn
That allows him to repeat during the election debate that Boris cannot be trusted.
Then on Tuesday we see how the VONC plays out and on Wednesday there can always be another election debate if Boris wins the VONC (he won't).0 -
Isn't HoC proroguing on after Monday ?eek said:
Nope - Monday Corbyn says he wants a VONC.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Listening to JRM announcing the next attempt at the GE, Bercow was very relaxed and, believe it or not, there was a good humoured exchange between the two.Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:
Labour did not object so Monday is decision time for Corbyn
That allows him to repeat during the election debate that Boris cannot be trusted.
Then on Tuesday we see how the VONC plays out and on Wednesday there can always be another election debate if Boris wins the VONC (he won't).
0 -
Mr G,
"You seem very scared of a GE."
He's frit to death on it, to use the current political vernacular.
0 -
I request an extension but I am afraid there is no budget for any contributions.dyedwoolie said:
I request an extension to Jan 31 2020, and Calais back.TGOHF said:
He may. He may also attach conditions to any request.Jonathan said:
Boris will have to, by law, request an a50 extension because of the new Act.Stereotomy said:
But what about the risk of it passing, no alternative government being found, and Boris calling an election for after Oct 31?Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:0 -
This "scared" line is nonsensical. Why would somebody be scared of an election now but not in November?eek said:
Nope - I just want it after October 31st...Big_G_NorthWales said:
You seem very scared of a GEeek said:
Nope - Monday Corbyn says he wants a VONC.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Listening to JRM announcing the next attempt at the GE, Bercow was very relaxed and, believe it or not, there was a good humoured exchange between the two.Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:
Labour did not object so Monday is decision time for Corbyn
That allows him to repeat during the election debate that Boris cannot be trusted.
Then on Tuesday we see how the VONC plays out and on Wednesday there can always be another election debate if Boris wins the VONC (he won't).
Edit to add - because Boris cannot be trusted.0 -
-
All the more reason to ask for a VONC if it can't be debated because of Government tricks...surbiton19 said:
Isn't HoC proroguing on after Monday ?eek said:
Nope - Monday Corbyn says he wants a VONC.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Listening to JRM announcing the next attempt at the GE, Bercow was very relaxed and, believe it or not, there was a good humoured exchange between the two.Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:
Labour did not object so Monday is decision time for Corbyn
That allows him to repeat during the election debate that Boris cannot be trusted.
Then on Tuesday we see how the VONC plays out and on Wednesday there can always be another election debate if Boris wins the VONC (he won't).0 -
If he can't be trusted then how can he be trusted to sign the letter before the 31st ?eek said:
Nope - I just want it after October 31st...Big_G_NorthWales said:
You seem very scared of a GEeek said:
Nope - Monday Corbyn says he wants a VONC.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Listening to JRM announcing the next attempt at the GE, Bercow was very relaxed and, believe it or not, there was a good humoured exchange between the two.Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:
Labour did not object so Monday is decision time for Corbyn
That allows him to repeat during the election debate that Boris cannot be trusted.
Then on Tuesday we see how the VONC plays out and on Wednesday there can always be another election debate if Boris wins the VONC (he won't).
Edit to add - because Boris cannot be trusted.0 -
With respect Ben, the SNP hold the power. If they agree 15th October Corbyn will be snookeredBenpointer said:
In any event, it will still need a 2/3rds majority, so Corbyn holds the power.TheValiant said:
I'm not sure he could. Its not a bill being brought back unaltered. Its a HoC vote for a GE.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Can't Bercow refuse this?Big_G_NorthWales said:JRM announces another attempt on a GE in the HOC on Monday
If he could/did, it would be politically 'brave'.0 -
I am "afraid" of a GE on Johnson's terms because it would benefit... Johnson. It is good politics to not allow him what he wants. A GE after 31st Oct is beneficial to every party leader not named Boris Johnson.blueblue said:
Because he knows commie Corbyn would get creamed.Big_G_NorthWales said:
You seem very scared of a GEeek said:
Nope - Monday Corbyn says he wants a VONC.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Listening to JRM announcing the next attempt at the GE, Bercow was very relaxed and, believe it or not, there was a good humoured exchange between the two.Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:
Labour did not object so Monday is decision time for Corbyn
That allows him to repeat during the election debate that Boris cannot be trusted.
Then on Tuesday we see how the VONC plays out and on Wednesday there can always be another election debate if Boris wins the VONC (he won't).0 -
0
-
Politically much better for Corbyn to force Boris to extend A50.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Which is on Monday and fulfils Corbyn's statement in the HOC when he said labour would vote for a GE once the Act received RAScott_P said:
But he needs to tread carefully and it will be interesting to see what explanation Labour can come up with as to why they favour a post 31 Oct election.0 -
Downthread you were saying didnt want Corbyn as PM either. They will both simply slag each other to a standstill.eek said:
Nope - I just want it after October 31st...Big_G_NorthWales said:
You seem very scared of a GEeek said:
Nope - Monday Corbyn says he wants a VONC.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Listening to JRM announcing the next attempt at the GE, Bercow was very relaxed and, believe it or not, there was a good humoured exchange between the two.Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:
Labour did not object so Monday is decision time for Corbyn
That allows him to repeat during the election debate that Boris cannot be trusted.
Then on Tuesday we see how the VONC plays out and on Wednesday there can always be another election debate if Boris wins the VONC (he won't).
Edit to add - because Boris cannot be trusted.0 -
This is an article which is both fairly devastating about Biden, and at the same time an explanation of his enduring popularity:
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2019/09/joe-biden-iraq-vote-what-now.html
I'm not convinced that constantly reflecting the opinions of the average US voter (as they change over time) is quite the qualification for actually leading the country...0 -
Do Labour have any Lord True on their side in the Lords ?Big_G_NorthWales said:
With respect Ben, the SNP hold the power. If they agree 15th October Corbyn will be snookeredBenpointer said:
In any event, it will still need a 2/3rds majority, so Corbyn holds the power.TheValiant said:
I'm not sure he could. Its not a bill being brought back unaltered. Its a HoC vote for a GE.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Can't Bercow refuse this?Big_G_NorthWales said:JRM announces another attempt on a GE in the HOC on Monday
If he could/did, it would be politically 'brave'.1 -
They must be tempted to get a GE win on the board before the Salmond case hits the courts, and all the dirty linen is aired.Big_G_NorthWales said:
With respect Ben, the SNP hold the power. If they agree 15th October Corbyn will be snookeredBenpointer said:
In any event, it will still need a 2/3rds majority, so Corbyn holds the power.TheValiant said:
I'm not sure he could. Its not a bill being brought back unaltered. Its a HoC vote for a GE.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Can't Bercow refuse this?Big_G_NorthWales said:JRM announces another attempt on a GE in the HOC on Monday
If he could/did, it would be politically 'brave'.0 -
How? Con + SNP doesn't = 2/3rdsBig_G_NorthWales said:
With respect Ben, the SNP hold the power. If they agree 15th October Corbyn will be snookeredBenpointer said:
In any event, it will still need a 2/3rds majority, so Corbyn holds the power.TheValiant said:
I'm not sure he could. Its not a bill being brought back unaltered. Its a HoC vote for a GE.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Can't Bercow refuse this?Big_G_NorthWales said:JRM announces another attempt on a GE in the HOC on Monday
If he could/did, it would be politically 'brave'.0 -
Hardly a surprise as politically she is far closer to Boris Johnson than Jeremy Corbyn. It would not surprise me if she would prop up a Tory government after the GE in exchange for a workaround on Brexit. Leopards and spots and all that.HYUFD said:
No as Swinson would veto Corbyn as PMJonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:0 -
SNP MP on 5live at lunchtime seemed to suggest they are thinking the same as Labour.Big_G_NorthWales said:
With respect Ben, the SNP hold the power. If they agree 15th October Corbyn will be snookeredBenpointer said:
In any event, it will still need a 2/3rds majority, so Corbyn holds the power.TheValiant said:
I'm not sure he could. Its not a bill being brought back unaltered. Its a HoC vote for a GE.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Can't Bercow refuse this?Big_G_NorthWales said:JRM announces another attempt on a GE in the HOC on Monday
If he could/did, it would be politically 'brave'.0 -
He can't, but it will be easier to get Parliament (and/or possibly the courts) to intervene outside of an election period.Pulpstar said:
If he can't be trusted then how can he be trusted to sign the letter before the 31st ?eek said:
Nope - I just want it after October 31st...Big_G_NorthWales said:
You seem very scared of a GEeek said:
Nope - Monday Corbyn says he wants a VONC.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Listening to JRM announcing the next attempt at the GE, Bercow was very relaxed and, believe it or not, there was a good humoured exchange between the two.Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:
Labour did not object so Monday is decision time for Corbyn
That allows him to repeat during the election debate that Boris cannot be trusted.
Then on Tuesday we see how the VONC plays out and on Wednesday there can always be another election debate if Boris wins the VONC (he won't).
Edit to add - because Boris cannot be trusted.0 -
Thankyou148grss said:
I am "afraid" of a GE on Johnson's terms because it would benefit... Johnson. It is good politics to not allow him what he wants. A GE after 31st Oct is beneficial to every party leader not named Boris Johnson.blueblue said:
Because he knows commie Corbyn would get creamed.Big_G_NorthWales said:
You seem very scared of a GEeek said:
Nope - Monday Corbyn says he wants a VONC.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Listening to JRM announcing the next attempt at the GE, Bercow was very relaxed and, believe it or not, there was a good humoured exchange between the two.Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:
Labour did not object so Monday is decision time for Corbyn
That allows him to repeat during the election debate that Boris cannot be trusted.
Then on Tuesday we see how the VONC plays out and on Wednesday there can always be another election debate if Boris wins the VONC (he won't)., the real reason isn't that Johnson can't be trusted - it is the wish to either humiliate him by making him sign the letter, be forced to resign or break the law. 0 -
FFS if they saw what happens to male chicks....TGOHF said:Speaking of chickens...
https://twitter.com/ritapanahi/status/1169520150615220231?s=210 -
Likely to be a totally bifurcated view in the country of all these coming and goings. The confirmation bias is strong on this website. Let’s see some polls gang before jumping to any hasty conclusions.0
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Not at all. Con + SNP does not exceed 2/3rds of the HoC.Big_G_NorthWales said:
With respect Ben, the SNP hold the power. If they agree 15th October Corbyn will be snookeredBenpointer said:
In any event, it will still need a 2/3rds majority, so Corbyn holds the power.TheValiant said:
I'm not sure he could. Its not a bill being brought back unaltered. Its a HoC vote for a GE.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Can't Bercow refuse this?Big_G_NorthWales said:JRM announces another attempt on a GE in the HOC on Monday
If he could/did, it would be politically 'brave'.0 -
Or demand a rebate due to the effect of the EUs delay in agreeing an acceptable deal on the British taxpayerTGOHF said:
I request an extension but I am afraid there is no budget for any contributions.dyedwoolie said:
I request an extension to Jan 31 2020, and Calais back.TGOHF said:
He may. He may also attach conditions to any request.Jonathan said:
Boris will have to, by law, request an a50 extension because of the new Act.Stereotomy said:
But what about the risk of it passing, no alternative government being found, and Boris calling an election for after Oct 31?Jonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:0 -
As Corbyn cannot win a majority I'm hoping that that is the case. It's one reason why I don't mind Corbyn leading things now as Labour cannot win a majority anymore and if Labour lose a few seats it's valid that the Lib Dems and SNP ask for another leader in return for support. Corbyn having been PM may well accept that.Stereotomy said:
That would send a lot of Lab -> Lib switchers back to Labour and help attract more potential Con -> Lib switchers.HYUFD said:
No as Swinson would veto Corbyn as PMJonathan said:
A VONC doesn't necessarily lead to an election at all let alone before 31 Oct, but it does solve the problem of the Tories calling him frit. He could get into no10 to enact yesterdays Bill.surbiton19 said:
Why ? He doesn't want an election before 31st October.Jonathan said:
Corbyn should table a VONC instead.CarlottaVance said:0 -
Allen seemed to be genuinely interested in staying independent to help coordinate cooperation between the different remain parties. With an extra clutch of Independent Conservatives she may feel she can do more good from a less partisan position than as a member of the Lib Dems - though of course the imminence of a general election may have an influence.Gallowgate said:Surely Heidi Allen must be next in the drip drip drip of new Lib Dems
1 -
Certainly, but the issue at this election is whether or not the Tories get a majority. If they don't Brexit is over.blueblue said:
But you can trust Corbyn to be a loony lefty. Hence the extreme difficulty he'll have in winning a majority.anothernick said:
And the opposition will reply that you can't trust Boris to keep his word about anything. If he wins he will bring back May's deal/go over the cliff (depending on which opposition party we are talking about).blueblue said:
Boris needs to go on TV each and every day and explain that Labour is forcing a post-31 October election precisely so that he has to sign a piece of paper surrendering Britain to the EU.Stereotomy said:
Haven't you been saying for months now that the Tories would do badly in the next election if we're still in the EU after Oct 31st? Do you not believe that's the case any more, or do you think this week hasn't made that outcome any more likely?HYUFD said:
Wait until the weekend polls, then we will see what a 'disaster' it has been for BorisNigelb said:
May I gently remind you of Mrs. May's polling lead prior to the last election.HYUFD said:
10% Tory poll lead some disaster, the Westminster commentariat so out of touch now it is beyond a jokeCarlottaVance said:
You surely cannot deny that the last few days have been... sub-optimal for the Prime Minister ?
Boris: Well, here's that piece of paper [lifts up copy of extension agreement].
Vote for me on Nov 7 and this is what I'll do to it [rips up copy of extension agreement].
Rinse and repeat, cannibalize BXP, keep the voters who fear Corbyn more than Brexit. Profit!
You can't trust Boris.0 -
It would be politically impossible for Corbyn to say noStereotomy said:
How? Con + SNP doesn't = 2/3rdsBig_G_NorthWales said:
With respect Ben, the SNP hold the power. If they agree 15th October Corbyn will be snookeredBenpointer said:
In any event, it will still need a 2/3rds majority, so Corbyn holds the power.TheValiant said:
I'm not sure he could. Its not a bill being brought back unaltered. Its a HoC vote for a GE.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
Can't Bercow refuse this?Big_G_NorthWales said:JRM announces another attempt on a GE in the HOC on Monday
If he could/did, it would be politically 'brave'.0
This discussion has been closed.