It’s not as if the pinch point for 12% of global trade just got blocked, or anything like that.
Yeah, but I'd be surprised if much wood pulp is travelling through the Suez. Always ready to be proved wrong.
Not sure whether the ships used to transport wood pulp are the same as used for the trade through Suez, but if everything takes an extra ten days in each direction while the canal is closed then less stuff overall will be transported. Maybe that would be less wood pulp on a different route with the ships diverted to serve the Suez trade.
Not that I'm concerned. We still have months of our Brexit stockpile.
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The contrast in quality between VDL and Junckers comments yesterday was stark.
Yes, when an ex prime minister of Luxembourg, known for his excessive drinking, comes across as a lost political giant, you know an institution is in trouble
I was living in India at the time, and not following the news at all, but when someone told me Princess Diana (or "Lady Dee" as they put it) had died, I started reading the English language Asian Age newspaper every day for a while which had a lot of UK news in it. As a republican, I was happy to see that there seemed to be widespread disgust with the royal family. "Finally, people's eyes are opening. The monarchy will soon be finished", I thought to myself. 24 years later and it's still going. The EU is maybe an institution like the royal family, everybody knows it's crap and populated by mediocrities at best but it's tolerated because they think getting rid of it would be worse.
I know what you mean but the analogy is inexact. The British monarchy is 1500 years old, it goes right back to Athelstan, Alfred, Offa the Great, and the god Woden. It is woven through British - English, welsh. Scottish and Irish - history, since the mists of the Dark Ages. It has endured invasion and conquest, civil wars, regicide, world war, and several plagues. And it is still there. Closely wound with every national institution, the embodiment of the nation - in a glorious medley of fine music, ancient tradition, religious belief, scurrilous gossip, grand architecture, sexual misbehavior and really beautiful gardens.
Destroying it to replace it with a republic would be like tearing down a magnificent Gothic cathedral to make way for much needed office space. There may be a practical argument, but it just isn’t going to happen. The cathedral reassures in its endurance, even if bits of it keep falling off.
The EU commission is not so ancient or beloved. Tho I agree it may survive out of sheer apathy.
I think you've fallen for the mythology, common to all nationalist ideologies, that the institutions and customs of their "nation" are ancient, eternal even. The British monarchy is only a couple of years older than the EU commission.
The British monarchy is only seventy years old?
I was being generous. If you want to say that the current institution is the same as that of Athelstan, then you have to accept the European Commission is the same as the ancient Roman consuls, so the EU commission is quite a bit older than the British monarchy - on Leon's terms at least!
The British monarchy goes back to the God Odin, almost certainly, and is thus quasi-divine. No one ever said that of Charles Juncker. The present Queen is the 32nd great granddaughter of Alfred of Wessex
How does the bloodline jump from the Saxons to the Normans?
Ethelred the Unready got jumped by a Norman lady ...
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
My confusion as they appear to be different roles - are there rules on how equivalent roles are, so you cannot discriminate by the back door by pretending roles don't deserve the same pay grade?
The Equality Act principle is that men and women should be paid equally for work of equal value. That’s been true since 1971 but claims have been concentrated in the public sector - particularly local authorities. There is an entire industry of job evaluation out there, a lot of it snake oil, but it’s been around half a century. The movie “Made in Dagenham” tells the story of how it got passed - the women at Ford who put the seats together got paid more than the men that put the other bits of the cars together, because it was “unskilled” labour. There’s a scene where one of the women say “well you do it then” and of course the bosses couldn’t.
It’s been something waiting to happen in the private sector for years.
I presume you meant to say paid less, not paid more.
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The thing I don’t understand with the EU is that there seems to be a mutually positive joint statement with the UK to deescalate, and the next day UVdL is back at it again with Macron.
That's pretty easy to understand, the same way they launched salvo after salvo while others, like the Irish Commissioner, then said both sides needed to calm down, suggesting both were at fault somehow.
It's about appearing reasonable, whilst leaving open the option of acting unreasonably. If anyone questions Macron's comments, you just point to the 'official' statement.
I'm afraid I immediately thought about headless chickens!
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The contrast in quality between VDL and Junckers comments yesterday was stark.
Yes, when an ex prime minister of Luxembourg, known for his excessive drinking, comes across as a lost political giant, you know an institution is in trouble
I was living in India at the time, and not following the news at all, but when someone told me Princess Diana (or "Lady Dee" as they put it) had died, I started reading the English language Asian Age newspaper every day for a while which had a lot of UK news in it. As a republican, I was happy to see that there seemed to be widespread disgust with the royal family. "Finally, people's eyes are opening. The monarchy will soon be finished", I thought to myself. 24 years later and it's still going. The EU is maybe an institution like the royal family, everybody knows it's crap and populated by mediocrities at best but it's tolerated because they think getting rid of it would be worse.
I know what you mean but the analogy is inexact. The British monarchy is 1500 years old, it goes right back to Athelstan, Alfred, Offa the Great, and the god Woden. It is woven through British - English, welsh. Scottish and Irish - history, since the mists of the Dark Ages. It has endured invasion and conquest, civil wars, regicide, world war, and several plagues. And it is still there. Closely wound with every national institution, the embodiment of the nation - in a glorious medley of fine music, ancient tradition, religious belief, scurrilous gossip, grand architecture, sexual misbehavior and really beautiful gardens.
Destroying it to replace it with a republic would be like tearing down a magnificent Gothic cathedral to make way for much needed office space. There may be a practical argument, but it just isn’t going to happen. The cathedral reassures in its endurance, even if bits of it keep falling off.
The EU commission is not so ancient or beloved. Tho I agree it may survive out of sheer apathy.
I think you've fallen for the mythology, common to all nationalist ideologies, that the institutions and customs of their "nation" are ancient, eternal even. The British monarchy is only a couple of years older than the EU commission.
The British monarchy is only seventy years old?
That was the last time the monarchy travelled directly down the family tree.
No it isn't. The last time it didn't pass to a direct offspring (son or daughter) was 1837 when it passed from Uncle to Niece. Even then she was the Grandaughter of a former king.
It's a mathematical certainty that von der Leyen is a direct descendant of Roman consuls, so the EU commission is still older.
No the comment I answered was on direct offspring. Distant hypothetical connections do not count.
It's not hypothetical, it's far more certain than the actual paternity of most monarchs.
I mean, come on, the Treaty of Rome was actually signed on Rome's Capitoline Hill.
All institutions have their mythologies that try to appeal to "ancient" roots. It's as much a fiction for the British royal family as for anything else.
It’s not as if the pinch point for 12% of global trade just got blocked, or anything like that.
Yeah, but I'd be surprised if much wood pulp is travelling through the Suez. Always ready to be proved wrong.
Not sure whether the ships used to transport wood pulp are the same as used for the trade through Suez, but if everything takes an extra ten days in each direction while the canal is closed then less stuff overall will be transported. Maybe that would be less wood pulp on a different route with the ships diverted to serve the Suez trade.
Not that I'm concerned. We still have months of our Brexit stockpile.
There isn't a special class of goods or ships that make up "the Suez trade." Why would there be, and if there were, why should woodchip be excluded from it?
Well clearly ships that carry wood cannot easily start carrying oil.
I know that oil, gas and container ships use Suez.
I do not know whether there are ships that take wood through, or are similar. That's why I raised the point of the ships.
Indeed, many protestants see any images of Christ as idolatrous. Many believe that the cross should not be seen with an image of Christ on it as he "came down from the cross". All the more reason why the CofE's recent pronouncement that they will "remove images that cause offence" maybe a little tricky
To celebrate this cross post I have built a cross out of rolls of toilet paper.
How many religions have I offended by doing this?
Probably your partner who is in the roll-less loo on the thunderbox swearing at you.
To previous: Who are these "many Protestants"? I'll give you "a few, peripheral".
It is also rare (these days), I'd say almost unheard of, for doctrinal differences in Christians to be a source of 'offense' for those on either side. Many Protestants prefer to worship without 'graven images' of Christ, but they aren't offended by Catholics who wish to do so, and would never (for example) destroy any such images.
FPT - The Liberal Democrats voting against the extension of the Covid Act is very significant - they should be doing much more of that if they want to be more relevant in future: advocating liberalism.
Would that make me more likely to vote for them?
Yes.
Me too. It's about time we had a party in this country that understands what a liberal democracy is and what it should and should not do.
As expected when I was poo-poohed on here yesterday over the direction of travel re vax passports, it now looks as if the government is not going to lift any restrictions at all post June but continue them in another guise. Social distancing will continue unless you can produce proof that you're healthy.
And how are hospitality venues supposed to comply with this? Ah yes - ask for proof. Very well and when some council busybody or policeman comes in to ask for proof of this how are they supposed to provide it? By showing the records they've kept, maybe? Great. Go to a pub and ask them to keep medical info about you safely.
The NHS is not overwhelmed. Deaths and cases are down significantly and continuing to decrease. Vaccinations continue. These were meant to be the data points to rely on. Now the government is tearing these up and just introducing their own version of China's social credit system. Well, stuff that.
Yes, and the extension of the virus laws until September doesn't inspire any confidence that the government will ever give up these powers. Labour are equally to blame IMO, they've barely said anything about it and have voted in favour each time despite enough Tory MPs potentially willing to make the government pay attention and slim down the measures now that we're in the final stages of it.
You're going to hate the comparison but this is what it felt like being a leave supporter from 2016-2019 watching a majority of MPs try and find a way to override democracy. The whole "well the people voted for something but there's no majority in the house" attitude has come back. There's a powerlessness that I can't stand as this whole thing is starting to feel like a stitch up between government and opposition to deny us basic freedoms.
I don't hate the comparison at all. If anything it's worse than you say. Then some MPs were trying to ignore a democratic vote. This time people have voted for this useless shower of authoritarians.
People are obsessing about flags and singing Britons never shall be slaves at the Proms while obediently agreeing to be slaves.
Daily temperature tests indeed.
They can fuck right off.
Vaccines are meant to be our way out of this. Not a tunnel into ever more restrictions and controls.
If any of that were to happen, then I agree entirely they can fuck off. And I would quit the party again, as I quit it the last time we had an authoritarian as party leader.
I simply do not believe it will happen. I might be in denial, but I just don't believe it is possible that will be done.
Restrictions to end 21/6, no ifs no buts. That's my line.
Or what? You will quit the party. Who cares. I quit the party last year and they seem to have managed to put it behind them and are going from strength to strength.
Absolutely, but that's what I can do.
HYUFD likes to take pride in the fact that he has a 100% Tory voting record and I don't, but as far as I'm concerned the Party needs to win my vote not the other way around. Three times in my life I've not voted Conservative: 2001 (Labour with a pinched nose), 2002 or 2003 local elections (Lib Dem) and 2019 European Parliament (Brexit with a very pinched nose). When that's happened the party has changed not long after to improve.
If the Conservatives become authoritarian then I will vote Lib Dem or some other party. That's all I can do.
I was idly mulling over how the pandemic would have been if it had happened whilst May was PM. I suspect that - given her track record at the Home Office - we would have been locked down tighter than a nun's chuff. And would have been coming out of that lockdown about 2025.
The problems we have with Boris is his reluctance to bow to the inevitable closures and lockdowns because, yes it buggers the economy, but also because it affronts his innate liberal sensibilities. I honestly can't see him locking us down a day longer than he thinks he can without being held responsible for a third wave.
The reason "Boris" acted too slowly with the 1st wave had nothing to do with his liberal tendencies. It was his "too lazy to focus properly" tendencies.
I am not convinced he has any liberal tendencies, and recent developments, particularly the draconian policing bill reinforce that view -though it is possible he has been too lazy to read or understand what his ministers are implementing . He is solely driven by his ego and ambition.
Yes, I think so. We've never had a PM quite like this. It's unchartered territory. I hope we can get through it with body & soul intact.
I think he has "brand Boris"/getting re-elected/not getting toppled as leader tendencies.
And if brand Boris isn't about bringing the good times back and getting us all down the pub then I've been sadly mistaken.
That's my take too. Work out the line of least resistance to an outcome which (i) strengthens his personal position right now and (ii) maintains his popularity with the voter demographic he assesses he needs the most to be re-elected, and bingo, that is what he will do. Much money is to be made on the betting front by applying this technique. It would be more difficult and interesting if (i) and (ii) were in conflict, but I don't think they are atm.
Hello kinabalu - I'd like to test your Not Happening Event radar, since I'm getting the strong feeling that the most intrusive measures being floated right now that people are getting het up about are NHEs. If anything, they're a form of psychological nudge to get people to keep taking things seriously during the current unlocking. What's your take?
Yes, hello. They are mostly NHEs. Pretty sure about that. As to the motive, I agree with yours but would add one other. I don't think it does Johnson any harm at all, up in that "primus inter pares" region of our great nation that is the Red Wall, to be seen to be mulling all sorts of very thoughtful and prudent sounding things for the immediate aftermath of the pandemic. Counters the "always just wings it" aura that can all too easily develop around him. But of course nothing will come of it - quite rightly (imo) in this case.
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
My confusion as they appear to be different roles - are there rules on how equivalent roles are, so you cannot discriminate by the back door by pretending roles don't deserve the same pay grade?
The Equality Act principle is that men and women should be paid equally for work of equal value. That’s been true since 1971 but claims have been concentrated in the public sector - particularly local authorities. There is an entire industry of job evaluation out there, a lot of it snake oil, but it’s been around half a century. The movie “Made in Dagenham” tells the story of how it got passed - the women at Ford who put the seats together got paid more than the men that put the other bits of the cars together, because it was “unskilled” labour. There’s a scene where one of the women say “well you do it then” and of course the bosses couldn’t.
It’s been something waiting to happen in the private sector for years.
I presume you meant to say paid less, not paid more.
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The contrast in quality between VDL and Junckers comments yesterday was stark.
Yes, when an ex prime minister of Luxembourg, known for his excessive drinking, comes across as a lost political giant, you know an institution is in trouble
I was living in India at the time, and not following the news at all, but when someone told me Princess Diana (or "Lady Dee" as they put it) had died, I started reading the English language Asian Age newspaper every day for a while which had a lot of UK news in it. As a republican, I was happy to see that there seemed to be widespread disgust with the royal family. "Finally, people's eyes are opening. The monarchy will soon be finished", I thought to myself. 24 years later and it's still going. The EU is maybe an institution like the royal family, everybody knows it's crap and populated by mediocrities at best but it's tolerated because they think getting rid of it would be worse.
I know what you mean but the analogy is inexact. The British monarchy is 1500 years old, it goes right back to Athelstan, Alfred, Offa the Great, and the god Woden. It is woven through British - English, welsh. Scottish and Irish - history, since the mists of the Dark Ages. It has endured invasion and conquest, civil wars, regicide, world war, and several plagues. And it is still there. Closely wound with every national institution, the embodiment of the nation - in a glorious medley of fine music, ancient tradition, religious belief, scurrilous gossip, grand architecture, sexual misbehavior and really beautiful gardens.
Destroying it to replace it with a republic would be like tearing down a magnificent Gothic cathedral to make way for much needed office space. There may be a practical argument, but it just isn’t going to happen. The cathedral reassures in its endurance, even if bits of it keep falling off.
The EU commission is not so ancient or beloved. Tho I agree it may survive out of sheer apathy.
I think you've fallen for the mythology, common to all nationalist ideologies, that the institutions and customs of their "nation" are ancient, eternal even. The British monarchy is only a couple of years older than the EU commission.
The British monarchy is only seventy years old?
I was being generous. If you want to say that the current institution is the same as that of Athelstan, then you have to accept the European Commission is the same as the ancient Roman consuls, so the EU commission is quite a bit older than the British monarchy - on Leon's terms at least!
The British monarchy goes back to the God Odin, almost certainly, and is thus quasi-divine. No one ever said that of Charles Juncker. The present Queen is the 32nd great granddaughter of Alfred of Wessex
How does the bloodline jump from the Saxons to the Normans?
Ethelred the Unready got jumped by a Norman lady ...
(gets coat)
I'm a direct descendant of Æthelred 'the Unready'.
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
Can you explain it to us ? Warehouse and shopfront work seem different beasts to me.
This is a long going issue - not just that there should be equal pay for exactly equal work, but that traditional sex-differentiation of work types is also an issue to be addressed.
The hardest job I ever did involved shifting tyres onto lorries in a warehouse.
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
Can you explain it to us ? Warehouse and shopfront work seem different beasts to me.
One of the workers said on the radio today that one does the reverse of the other. One loads cages of good, the other unloads cages of goods. Basically the same job. One defence of the warehouse was it was cold and therefore worth more, which seems a bit borderline to me.
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The thing I don’t understand with the EU is that there seems to be a mutually positive joint statement with the UK to deescalate, and the next day UVdL is back at it again with Macron.
Positive statements don't make the mess go away, so it's back to blaming others.
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
My confusion as they appear to be different roles - are there rules on how equivalent roles are, so you cannot discriminate by the back door by pretending roles don't deserve the same pay grade?
The Equality Act principle is that men and women should be paid equally for work of equal value. That’s been true since 1971 but claims have been concentrated in the public sector - particularly local authorities. There is an entire industry of job evaluation out there, a lot of it snake oil, but it’s been around half a century. The movie “Made in Dagenham” tells the story of how it got passed - the women at Ford who put the seats together got paid more less than the men that put the other bits of the cars together, because it was “unskilled” labour. There’s a scene where one of the women say “well you do it then” and of course the bosses couldn’t.
It’s been something waiting to happen in the private sector for years.
Just been looking at the COVID data on Worldometer and I notice there are some quite big differences in deaths as a percentage of cases within Europe. Obviously that stat is heavily influenced by the amount of testing going on, but even so I find it curious that we're towards the top of the list given we've been quite good on testing.
Country: cases, deaths, deaths as a percentage of cases
Italy and the UK were both utterly clobbered by the first wave - our 'shown' CFR was ~ 13% at one point I remember.
It’s estimated that 25-30% of us have had it. We’ve done some hard yards.
Isn't it almost impossible to tell the true total that has had it now we're into mass vaccinations now wrt antibodies ? Edit Though 0 - 15 should still be a "virgin sample" I think.
(Others with better knowledge may correct, but as I understand it) vaccination will give different test results to infection. The vaccine stimulates antibodies targeting the spike protein (only). Infection will stimulate production of antibodies for other parts too. So you'll have a different mix of antibodies if infected compared to if vaccinated.
That's right. The virus nucleocapsid protein, which makes no part of any vaccine, is highly immunogenic, and of you've been infected, you produce a ton of antibodies against it (which incidentally are also pretty useless in preventing further infection).
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
Can you explain it to us ? Warehouse and shopfront work seem different beasts to me.
One of the workers said on the radio today that one does the reverse of the other. One loads cages of good, the other unloads cages of goods. Basically the same job. One defence of the warehouse was it was cold and therefore worth more, which seems a bit borderline to me.
That seems the obvious difference. A few comments btl on the Mail story suggest that in the warehouse you are working solidly. No standing around having a gossip.
Maybe they want to take a shortcut to herd immunity
As far as I can tell what Merkel cancelled wouldn't have made any difference anyway. She cancelled the dumb idea of forcing supermarkets to close the Thursday before Easter as well as the usual Good Friday, Sunday and Easter Monday, which would only have made the usual "Easter Saturday" supermarket crush even worse than other years. A few other shops would have been affected on the Thursday and Saturday, but non-essential shops are anyway subject to restrictions so I don't think that could have made much difference either way. Non-essential workplaces would also have been asked to close for 5 days, but again as most of these would be anyway more or less closed at the weekend and on the Friday and Monday which are public holidays, I can't see how it would have helped much. I mean even 5 real days wouldn't make much difference, so 5 days 4 of which are anyway holidays is a complete waste of time.
Plus they went back on the proposed ban on in-person religious services over Easter. Probably the only bit of the proposals that made any sense (easy for me to say, having never been to an Easter service in my life), but it shows how powerful the churches are in Germany that this ban was also scrapped.
Merkel's (and Germany's) problem is that having done almost nothing for a whole year, she finds she no longer has any authority to try and persuade people to do even small things now.
The situation is deteriorating so rapidly that I guess the Bundesländer will just start imposing more emergency measures within a few days without necessarily getting agreement with others.
It's very sad because anyone with half a brain can see what will happen. Here in Spain the uptick is just starting but instead of acting quickly to stem it we are relaxing the rules for Easter which will probably allow the 4th wave to take hold. I'm not sure that our rulers anywhere ever seem to learn. This is why I'm more sympathetic to the current ultra caution in the UK. It would be awful to waste the vaccine premium when the country is over half way there.
The EU's failure to learn from the errors made by the UK late 2020 is probably more egregious even than trying to steal vaccine to which it is not entitled. And German going to Ibiza with no checks on return.
It really has had a mare. And that is not just a gloating Brexiteer mind-set. This Brexiteer takes no pleasure in the deaths they will undoubtedly cause. It just makes me profoundly sad that the waste of life in the UK didn't get picked up as a text book of what not to do. It now looks like being an even greater loss of life across the continent. Really distressing.
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
Can you explain it to us ? Warehouse and shopfront work seem different beasts to me.
Made in Dagenham is well worth a watch. Very entertaining film that additionally benefits from featuring the fragrant Rosamund Pike.
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
My confusion as they appear to be different roles - are there rules on how equivalent roles are, so you cannot discriminate by the back door by pretending roles don't deserve the same pay grade?
The Equality Act principle is that men and women should be paid equally for work of equal value. That’s been true since 1971 but claims have been concentrated in the public sector - particularly local authorities. There is an entire industry of job evaluation out there, a lot of it snake oil, but it’s been around half a century. The movie “Made in Dagenham” tells the story of how it got passed - the women at Ford who put the seats together got paid more less than the men that put the other bits of the cars together, because it was “unskilled” labour. There’s a scene where one of the women say “well you do it then” and of course the bosses couldn’t.
It’s been something waiting to happen in the private sector for years.
You mean got paid less
Yep. Good job I don’t work in a profession where those sorts of slips are important.
Interesting aside on the Islamic rules discussion.
I am reading an account at the moment of a British officer serving with an Indian cavalry regiment on the East Persian Cordon during WW1. Basically it was a line of forts and patrols which ran all the way up the eastern side of Persia to prevent German agents getting through to Afghanistan. One of the things that has struck me is how often he refers to visiting senior Moslem dignitaries in Persian towns and sharing the very fine Persian wine with them.
Not knowing much about this aspect of the religion my question is, when did the consumption of alcohol become an absolute no-no in the Moslem world? We know that some very fine wines originated in Shiraz in Iran and I assume this has to be after the Moslem conquest in the 7th century. So how come alcohol is now considered such a great evil in Islam?
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
Can you explain it to us ? Warehouse and shopfront work seem different beasts to me.
One of the workers said on the radio today that one does the reverse of the other. One loads cages of good, the other unloads cages of goods. Basically the same job. One defence of the warehouse was it was cold and therefore worth more, which seems a bit borderline to me.
That seems the obvious difference. A few comments btl on the Mail story suggest that in the warehouse you are working solidly. No standing around having a gossip.
Good point. I can see how the warehouse might be more strenuous. Also not having people constantly asking you where the Hobnobs are. Not sure if you should be paid more or less for that.
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
Can you explain it to us ? Warehouse and shopfront work seem different beasts to me.
This is a long going issue - not just that there should be equal pay for exactly equal work, but that traditional sex-differentiation of work types is also an issue to be addressed.
In the landmark Dagenham case, the female jobs were seamstressing – women actually have an advantage in sewing work, because of their smaller hands and fingers. So it's not likely that those jobs would be taken by men on any great scale because women tend to be better candidates.
FPT - The Liberal Democrats voting against the extension of the Covid Act is very significant - they should be doing much more of that if they want to be more relevant in future: advocating liberalism.
Would that make me more likely to vote for them?
Yes.
Me too. It's about time we had a party in this country that understands what a liberal democracy is and what it should and should not do.
As expected when I was poo-poohed on here yesterday over the direction of travel re vax passports, it now looks as if the government is not going to lift any restrictions at all post June but continue them in another guise. Social distancing will continue unless you can produce proof that you're healthy.
And how are hospitality venues supposed to comply with this? Ah yes - ask for proof. Very well and when some council busybody or policeman comes in to ask for proof of this how are they supposed to provide it? By showing the records they've kept, maybe? Great. Go to a pub and ask them to keep medical info about you safely.
The NHS is not overwhelmed. Deaths and cases are down significantly and continuing to decrease. Vaccinations continue. These were meant to be the data points to rely on. Now the government is tearing these up and just introducing their own version of China's social credit system. Well, stuff that.
Yes, and the extension of the virus laws until September doesn't inspire any confidence that the government will ever give up these powers. Labour are equally to blame IMO, they've barely said anything about it and have voted in favour each time despite enough Tory MPs potentially willing to make the government pay attention and slim down the measures now that we're in the final stages of it.
You're going to hate the comparison but this is what it felt like being a leave supporter from 2016-2019 watching a majority of MPs try and find a way to override democracy. The whole "well the people voted for something but there's no majority in the house" attitude has come back. There's a powerlessness that I can't stand as this whole thing is starting to feel like a stitch up between government and opposition to deny us basic freedoms.
I don't hate the comparison at all. If anything it's worse than you say. Then some MPs were trying to ignore a democratic vote. This time people have voted for this useless shower of authoritarians.
People are obsessing about flags and singing Britons never shall be slaves at the Proms while obediently agreeing to be slaves.
Daily temperature tests indeed.
They can fuck right off.
Vaccines are meant to be our way out of this. Not a tunnel into ever more restrictions and controls.
If any of that were to happen, then I agree entirely they can fuck off. And I would quit the party again, as I quit it the last time we had an authoritarian as party leader.
I simply do not believe it will happen. I might be in denial, but I just don't believe it is possible that will be done.
Restrictions to end 21/6, no ifs no buts. That's my line.
Or what? You will quit the party. Who cares. I quit the party last year and they seem to have managed to put it behind them and are going from strength to strength.
Absolutely, but that's what I can do.
HYUFD likes to take pride in the fact that he has a 100% Tory voting record and I don't, but as far as I'm concerned the Party needs to win my vote not the other way around. Three times in my life I've not voted Conservative: 2001 (Labour with a pinched nose), 2002 or 2003 local elections (Lib Dem) and 2019 European Parliament (Brexit with a very pinched nose). When that's happened the party has changed not long after to improve.
If the Conservatives become authoritarian then I will vote Lib Dem or some other party. That's all I can do.
I was idly mulling over how the pandemic would have been if it had happened whilst May was PM. I suspect that - given her track record at the Home Office - we would have been locked down tighter than a nun's chuff. And would have been coming out of that lockdown about 2025.
The problems we have with Boris is his reluctance to bow to the inevitable closures and lockdowns because, yes it buggers the economy, but also because it affronts his innate liberal sensibilities. I honestly can't see him locking us down a day longer than he thinks he can without being held responsible for a third wave.
The reason "Boris" acted too slowly with the 1st wave had nothing to do with his liberal tendencies. It was his "too lazy to focus properly" tendencies.
He was too slow to lock down at the start and now he's in danger of going too far in the opposite direction. I agree that having T May in Downing Street would probably have been better.
I think I agree. Although, for me, the roadmap is at the same time too slow and is right to be too slow, if that makes sense. But he definitely screwed up badly on both waves. Plus on various other things which have been well ventilated here. The case for Johnson (over anyone) imo boils down to the vaccines. If you can successfully prosecute the argument that he personally was key to this, in a way an alternative leader would not have been, then he claws his way to an overall assessment of "could have been worse". However this is not to prejudice the outcome of the public inquiry. They might find that it could NOT have been worse, in which case I will be happy to accept that.
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
The twitter debate is interesting in that there are quite a few bots (<5 followers, <5 followed, very recent joiners) involved in spreading narratives.
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The thing I don’t understand with the EU is that there seems to be a mutually positive joint statement with the UK to deescalate, and the next day UVdL is back at it again with Macron.
Positive statements don't make the mess go away, so it's back to blaming others.
Yes, the strategy has now shifted, IMO, from blaming Britain to trying to shift the blame onto countries that don't use the export ban measures. So now it's Belgium, the Netherlands etc... in the firing line having spectacularly failed to force the UK to give up its first option on all UK made AZ doses.
Ultimately the main objective of the EU and supporters of Ursula is to shift the blame away from the commission. Having a new target in Belgium and the Netherlands is much easier than the UK becuase now that we're out there's really not very much they can do that won't result in a very large retaliation.
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The thing I don’t understand with the EU is that there seems to be a mutually positive joint statement with the UK to deescalate, and the next day UVdL is back at it again with Macron.
Positive statements don't make the mess go away, so it's back to blaming others.
Yes, the strategy has now shifted, IMO, from blaming Britain to trying to shift the blame onto countries that don't use the export ban measures. So now it's Belgium, the Netherlands etc... in the firing line having spectacularly failed to force the UK to give up its first option on all UK made AZ doses.
Ultimately the main objective of the EU and supporters of Ursula is to shift the blame away from the commission. Having a new target in Belgium and the Netherlands is much easier than the UK becuase now that we're out there's really not very much they can do that won't result in a very large retaliation.
Well, unless it ultimately results in Bexit and Nexit...
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The contrast in quality between VDL and Junckers comments yesterday was stark.
Yes, when an ex prime minister of Luxembourg, known for his excessive drinking, comes across as a lost political giant, you know an institution is in trouble
I was living in India at the time, and not following the news at all, but when someone told me Princess Diana (or "Lady Dee" as they put it) had died, I started reading the English language Asian Age newspaper every day for a while which had a lot of UK news in it. As a republican, I was happy to see that there seemed to be widespread disgust with the royal family. "Finally, people's eyes are opening. The monarchy will soon be finished", I thought to myself. 24 years later and it's still going. The EU is maybe an institution like the royal family, everybody knows it's crap and populated by mediocrities at best but it's tolerated because they think getting rid of it would be worse.
I know what you mean but the analogy is inexact. The British monarchy is 1500 years old, it goes right back to Athelstan, Alfred, Offa the Great, and the god Woden. It is woven through British - English, welsh. Scottish and Irish - history, since the mists of the Dark Ages. It has endured invasion and conquest, civil wars, regicide, world war, and several plagues. And it is still there. Closely wound with every national institution, the embodiment of the nation - in a glorious medley of fine music, ancient tradition, religious belief, scurrilous gossip, grand architecture, sexual misbehavior and really beautiful gardens.
Destroying it to replace it with a republic would be like tearing down a magnificent Gothic cathedral to make way for much needed office space. There may be a practical argument, but it just isn’t going to happen. The cathedral reassures in its endurance, even if bits of it keep falling off.
The EU commission is not so ancient or beloved. Tho I agree it may survive out of sheer apathy.
I think you've fallen for the mythology, common to all nationalist ideologies, that the institutions and customs of their "nation" are ancient, eternal even. The British monarchy is only a couple of years older than the EU commission.
The British monarchy is only seventy years old?
I was being generous. If you want to say that the current institution is the same as that of Athelstan, then you have to accept the European Commission is the same as the ancient Roman consuls, so the EU commission is quite a bit older than the British monarchy - on Leon's terms at least!
The British monarchy goes back to the God Odin, almost certainly, and is thus quasi-divine. No one ever said that of Charles Juncker. The present Queen is the 32nd great granddaughter of Alfred of Wessex
How does the bloodline jump from the Saxons to the Normans?
Ethelred the Unready got jumped by a Norman lady ...
(gets coat)
I'm a direct descendant of Æthelred 'the Unready'.
Neither Harold nor William the Conqueror were descendants of Alfred the Great; there is little to choose between their claims. Even Henry Tudor had a claim of sorts.
For some reasonit makes me think of an old game I've mentioned before, Republic: The Revolution, where during the course of things the political faction you run splits, and one of your major figures seeks to take you down. You can overcome it and then even recruit them back into the fold, with reports of some thinking the spat then reconciliation was just to make you seem stronger.
I have no idea of Salmond seeking SNP alternatives would make a difference, but if he instead were to say despite it all, vote SNP?
Totally without any inside info, but I suspect it'll be something like him running for one of the alt nat parties on the list while strongly advising folk to vote SNP on constituency, that way it would leave a tiny thread back to the SNP.
I think one unexamined aspect of this clusterfcuk is how Salmond feels about completely burning his bridges with the party that he's been committed to most of his life. Not sure if all bridges aren't already burnt mind, but no doubt there are people telling Salmond that Sturgeon is a passing fancy, busted flush etc and the party & nation are waiting for the return of the king. Fwiw I think he's been poorly advised, particularly recently.
Interesting aside on the Islamic rules discussion.
I am reading an account at the moment of a British officer serving with an Indian cavalry regiment on the East Persian Cordon during WW1. Basically it was a line of forts and patrols which ran all the way up the eastern side of Persia to prevent German agents getting through to Afghanistan. One of the things that has struck me is how often he refers to visiting senior Moslem dignitaries in Persian towns and sharing the very fine Persian wine with them.
Not knowing much about this aspect of the religion my question is, when did the consumption of alcohol become an absolute no-no in the Moslem world? We know that some very fine wines originated in Shiraz in Iran and I assume this has to be after the Moslem conquest in the 7th century. So how come alcohol is now considered such a great evil in Islam?
The basic ban on intoxicants comes from the Quran as intoxication prevents people from proper remembrance of God.
I think we have to see the spread of Islam through the same lens as we see the spread of Christianity - not a complete replacement of beliefs and practices/habits that pre-existed, but a more a melding over, thereby resulting in regional differences in outcome that persisted for long periods.
I suspect that globalization has facilitated the concept of 'one true Islam'.
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The contrast in quality between VDL and Junckers comments yesterday was stark.
Yes, when an ex prime minister of Luxembourg, known for his excessive drinking, comes across as a lost political giant, you know an institution is in trouble
I was living in India at the time, and not following the news at all, but when someone told me Princess Diana (or "Lady Dee" as they put it) had died, I started reading the English language Asian Age newspaper every day for a while which had a lot of UK news in it. As a republican, I was happy to see that there seemed to be widespread disgust with the royal family. "Finally, people's eyes are opening. The monarchy will soon be finished", I thought to myself. 24 years later and it's still going. The EU is maybe an institution like the royal family, everybody knows it's crap and populated by mediocrities at best but it's tolerated because they think getting rid of it would be worse.
I know what you mean but the analogy is inexact. The British monarchy is 1500 years old, it goes right back to Athelstan, Alfred, Offa the Great, and the god Woden. It is woven through British - English, welsh. Scottish and Irish - history, since the mists of the Dark Ages. It has endured invasion and conquest, civil wars, regicide, world war, and several plagues. And it is still there. Closely wound with every national institution, the embodiment of the nation - in a glorious medley of fine music, ancient tradition, religious belief, scurrilous gossip, grand architecture, sexual misbehavior and really beautiful gardens.
Destroying it to replace it with a republic would be like tearing down a magnificent Gothic cathedral to make way for much needed office space. There may be a practical argument, but it just isn’t going to happen. The cathedral reassures in its endurance, even if bits of it keep falling off.
The EU commission is not so ancient or beloved. Tho I agree it may survive out of sheer apathy.
I think you've fallen for the mythology, common to all nationalist ideologies, that the institutions and customs of their "nation" are ancient, eternal even. The British monarchy is only a couple of years older than the EU commission.
The British monarchy is only seventy years old?
I was being generous. If you want to say that the current institution is the same as that of Athelstan, then you have to accept the European Commission is the same as the ancient Roman consuls, so the EU commission is quite a bit older than the British monarchy - on Leon's terms at least!
The British monarchy goes back to the God Odin, almost certainly, and is thus quasi-divine. No one ever said that of Charles Juncker. The present Queen is the 32nd great granddaughter of Alfred of Wessex
How does the bloodline jump from the Saxons to the Normans?
Ethelred the Unready got jumped by a Norman lady ...
(gets coat)
I'm a direct descendant of Æthelred 'the Unready'.
Neither Harold nor William the Conqueror were descendants of Alfred the Great; there is little to choose between their claims. Even Henry Tudor had a claim of sorts.
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The contrast in quality between VDL and Junckers comments yesterday was stark.
Yes, when an ex prime minister of Luxembourg, known for his excessive drinking, comes across as a lost political giant, you know an institution is in trouble
I was living in India at the time, and not following the news at all, but when someone told me Princess Diana (or "Lady Dee" as they put it) had died, I started reading the English language Asian Age newspaper every day for a while which had a lot of UK news in it. As a republican, I was happy to see that there seemed to be widespread disgust with the royal family. "Finally, people's eyes are opening. The monarchy will soon be finished", I thought to myself. 24 years later and it's still going. The EU is maybe an institution like the royal family, everybody knows it's crap and populated by mediocrities at best but it's tolerated because they think getting rid of it would be worse.
I know what you mean but the analogy is inexact. The British monarchy is 1500 years old, it goes right back to Athelstan, Alfred, Offa the Great, and the god Woden. It is woven through British - English, welsh. Scottish and Irish - history, since the mists of the Dark Ages. It has endured invasion and conquest, civil wars, regicide, world war, and several plagues. And it is still there. Closely wound with every national institution, the embodiment of the nation - in a glorious medley of fine music, ancient tradition, religious belief, scurrilous gossip, grand architecture, sexual misbehavior and really beautiful gardens.
Destroying it to replace it with a republic would be like tearing down a magnificent Gothic cathedral to make way for much needed office space. There may be a practical argument, but it just isn’t going to happen. The cathedral reassures in its endurance, even if bits of it keep falling off.
The EU commission is not so ancient or beloved. Tho I agree it may survive out of sheer apathy.
I think you've fallen for the mythology, common to all nationalist ideologies, that the institutions and customs of their "nation" are ancient, eternal even. The British monarchy is only a couple of years older than the EU commission.
The British monarchy is only seventy years old?
That was the last time the monarchy travelled directly down the family tree.
No it isn't. The last time it didn't pass to a direct offspring (son or daughter) was 1837 when it passed from Uncle to Niece. Even then she was the Grandaughter of a former king.
It's a mathematical certainty that von der Leyen is a direct descendant of Roman consuls, so the EU commission is still older.
The Romans made some pretty odd appointments, too.
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
Can you explain it to us ? Warehouse and shopfront work seem different beasts to me.
This is a long going issue - not just that there should be equal pay for exactly equal work, but that traditional sex-differentiation of work types is also an issue to be addressed.
The hardest job I ever did involved shifting tyres onto lorries in a warehouse.
Yes, I did something similar in a vineyard.
Reminds you why the middle classes don't so manual labour.
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The thing I don’t understand with the EU is that there seems to be a mutually positive joint statement with the UK to deescalate, and the next day UVdL is back at it again with Macron.
Positive statements don't make the mess go away, so it's back to blaming others.
Yes, the strategy has now shifted, IMO, from blaming Britain to trying to shift the blame onto countries that don't use the export ban measures. So now it's Belgium, the Netherlands etc... in the firing line having spectacularly failed to force the UK to give up its first option on all UK made AZ doses.
Ultimately the main objective of the EU and supporters of Ursula is to shift the blame away from the commission. Having a new target in Belgium and the Netherlands is much easier than the UK becuase now that we're out there's really not very much they can do that won't result in a very large retaliation.
Well, unless it ultimately results in Bexit and Nexit...
Which would be about par for this lot.
Lol, could you imagine Belgium leaving the EU.
I think that's why the commission has targeted Belgium, they've got nowhere else to go.
Alex*, 12, a dual heritage pupil at a school in Bristol, had been in year 7 for less than two weeks when he was wrongly accused by a teacher of having stolen cookies from the canteen at lunchtime.
At first he was told off by a teacher. But then the teacher asked a police officer based at the school to speak to him too.
When the officer spoke to Alex, they are alleged to have told him he wouldn’t be taken down to the police station on this occasion. Alex says he was also warned that he did not want to get a criminal record in the future and if he did, he would be unable to travel to the US.
“My heart was beating really fast. I felt scared, and I’ve never felt like that before,” Alex said, describing the moment he was spoken to by the officer.
The next day, Alex’s mother was contacted by the school regarding what had happened. When she found out her son had been spoken to by a police officer, she was “absolutely furious”.
“I was incredibly angry that my son has been interviewed by a police officer without a parent being present. To me, it was just completely over-the-top, completely heavy-handed and completely incorrectly handled.
“My son was petrified, and he was very upset as a result. I find it hard to believe that a middle-class white pupil from a more affluent part of the school’s catchment area would have been treated or spoken to in this way.
“This was a terrifying episode for my son, which led to him being too anxious to attend school for a number of months.”
After she approached the school for an explanation, the school launched an investigation into the incident. The mother also sent a complaint to Avon and Somerset police.
In written correspondence from the school’s deputy headteacher to the mother, seen by the Guardian, an investigation into the incident concluded that “there was no evidence that Alex had stolen cookies as he did pay for them immediately upon being asked to do so”, and the teacher “should not have jumped to the conclusion that he had stolen them”.
The letter said Alex was in the queue with another student who had stolen something earlier, and that “the two incidents [were] conflated as one, which was not appropriate”.
It added that the teacher who had spoken to Alex had “presumed” his guilt as a consequence.
Furthermore, the school said the police officer should not have been involved in the incident. Although the letter states that the manner of the meeting between Alex and the officer was “not confrontational”, the conclusion was that “it was inappropriate for this conversation to be had with Alex in the first place as there is no evidence that he had stolen”.
Still never let the police never complain about them being under resourced if they have the resources to investigate things like this.
What a load of guardianista bollocks. Exactly this happened regularly to white kids in rural England decades ago. I know, because it happened to me, and several friends
The idea is, if you think a kid may be going off the rails, give him a tiny scare when he’s young, and he’ll wise up. Better than a big nasty scare when he’s older
It works, it’s good, it’s sensible.
This new Guardian campaign against ‘racist British schools’ is as desperate as it is disgraceful. This paper is drowning. God knows what their ad income is
The Guardian relies on whole brigades of teachers etc to be its uncritical readers. It is remarkable that they are prepared to label them as racist. They are usually expert at othering evils of every sort. It's a bit like the Sun accusing white van man of being lazy scrounging lefties and disrespecting the flag of St George.
Yes, quite. Which is why it strikes me as desperate and needy. They must have run out of UK institutions to target as ‘racist’ - literally, they’ve done everyone else - but their income still plunges and online ads still dwindle? - so the editor thought ‘fuck it, schools’. And here we are
Have they thought of trying to be an excellent online newspaper?
The Guardian being any form of excellent newspaper would be a start.
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
Can you explain it to us ? Warehouse and shopfront work seem different beasts to me.
This is a long going issue - not just that there should be equal pay for exactly equal work, but that traditional sex-differentiation of work types is also an issue to be addressed.
The hardest job I ever did involved shifting tyres onto lorries in a warehouse.
Yes, I did something similar in a vineyard.
Reminds you why the middle classes don't so manual labour.
Quite. I remember hand-singling turnips in fields, and hacking my way through an overgrown conifer plantation for blazing trees for felling in the pouring rain. . My least favourite jobs of all time.
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The contrast in quality between VDL and Junckers comments yesterday was stark.
Yes, when an ex prime minister of Luxembourg, known for his excessive drinking, comes across as a lost political giant, you know an institution is in trouble
I was living in India at the time, and not following the news at all, but when someone told me Princess Diana (or "Lady Dee" as they put it) had died, I started reading the English language Asian Age newspaper every day for a while which had a lot of UK news in it. As a republican, I was happy to see that there seemed to be widespread disgust with the royal family. "Finally, people's eyes are opening. The monarchy will soon be finished", I thought to myself. 24 years later and it's still going. The EU is maybe an institution like the royal family, everybody knows it's crap and populated by mediocrities at best but it's tolerated because they think getting rid of it would be worse.
I know what you mean but the analogy is inexact. The British monarchy is 1500 years old, it goes right back to Athelstan, Alfred, Offa the Great, and the god Woden. It is woven through British - English, welsh. Scottish and Irish - history, since the mists of the Dark Ages. It has endured invasion and conquest, civil wars, regicide, world war, and several plagues. And it is still there. Closely wound with every national institution, the embodiment of the nation - in a glorious medley of fine music, ancient tradition, religious belief, scurrilous gossip, grand architecture, sexual misbehavior and really beautiful gardens.
Destroying it to replace it with a republic would be like tearing down a magnificent Gothic cathedral to make way for much needed office space. There may be a practical argument, but it just isn’t going to happen. The cathedral reassures in its endurance, even if bits of it keep falling off.
The EU commission is not so ancient or beloved. Tho I agree it may survive out of sheer apathy.
I think you've fallen for the mythology, common to all nationalist ideologies, that the institutions and customs of their "nation" are ancient, eternal even. The British monarchy is only a couple of years older than the EU commission.
The British monarchy is only seventy years old?
That was the last time the monarchy travelled directly down the family tree.
No it isn't. The last time it didn't pass to a direct offspring (son or daughter) was 1837 when it passed from Uncle to Niece. Even then she was the Grandaughter of a former king.
It's a mathematical certainty that von der Leyen is a direct descendant of Roman consuls, so the EU commission is still older.
No the comment I answered was on direct offspring. Distant hypothetical connections do not count.
It's not hypothetical, it's far more certain than the actual paternity of most monarchs.
I mean, come on, the Treaty of Rome was actually signed on Rome's Capitoline Hill.
All institutions have their mythologies that try to appeal to "ancient" roots. It's as much a fiction for the British royal family as for anything else.
Nah, at least at the time of the great fractures in the line of the Monarchy (The start of the Georgian era, The Stuart era and the Tudor era being the most recent) you could see the tenuous bloodline connections and they were used to justify the ascensions. In the case of the EU they just formed a new gang and decided to model it on the Roman Empire with no reasonable case at all. The EU has even less of a case than the Hapsburg's did.
If you are going to appeal to ancient roots you should at least try and find some justification in history.
Incidently, as I have bored people with before on here, the Hapsburg's only got to play with the Holy Roman Empire because one of my ancestors Sir William Tyndall turned down the Throne of Bohemia before it was subsequently offered to them.
Such is Europe's loss. I am sure we would have run a much more enlightened Holy Roman Empire .
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The contrast in quality between VDL and Junckers comments yesterday was stark.
Yes, when an ex prime minister of Luxembourg, known for his excessive drinking, comes across as a lost political giant, you know an institution is in trouble
I was living in India at the time, and not following the news at all, but when someone told me Princess Diana (or "Lady Dee" as they put it) had died, I started reading the English language Asian Age newspaper every day for a while which had a lot of UK news in it. As a republican, I was happy to see that there seemed to be widespread disgust with the royal family. "Finally, people's eyes are opening. The monarchy will soon be finished", I thought to myself. 24 years later and it's still going. The EU is maybe an institution like the royal family, everybody knows it's crap and populated by mediocrities at best but it's tolerated because they think getting rid of it would be worse.
I know what you mean but the analogy is inexact. The British monarchy is 1500 years old, it goes right back to Athelstan, Alfred, Offa the Great, and the god Woden. It is woven through British - English, welsh. Scottish and Irish - history, since the mists of the Dark Ages. It has endured invasion and conquest, civil wars, regicide, world war, and several plagues. And it is still there. Closely wound with every national institution, the embodiment of the nation - in a glorious medley of fine music, ancient tradition, religious belief, scurrilous gossip, grand architecture, sexual misbehavior and really beautiful gardens.
Destroying it to replace it with a republic would be like tearing down a magnificent Gothic cathedral to make way for much needed office space. There may be a practical argument, but it just isn’t going to happen. The cathedral reassures in its endurance, even if bits of it keep falling off.
The EU commission is not so ancient or beloved. Tho I agree it may survive out of sheer apathy.
I think you've fallen for the mythology, common to all nationalist ideologies, that the institutions and customs of their "nation" are ancient, eternal even. The British monarchy is only a couple of years older than the EU commission.
The British monarchy is only seventy years old?
I was being generous. If you want to say that the current institution is the same as that of Athelstan, then you have to accept the European Commission is the same as the ancient Roman consuls, so the EU commission is quite a bit older than the British monarchy - on Leon's terms at least!
The British monarchy goes back to the God Odin, almost certainly, and is thus quasi-divine. No one ever said that of Charles Juncker. The present Queen is the 32nd great granddaughter of Alfred of Wessex
How does the bloodline jump from the Saxons to the Normans?
Ethelred the Unready got jumped by a Norman lady ...
(gets coat)
I'm a direct descendant of Æthelred 'the Unready'.
Neither Harold nor William the Conqueror were descendants of Alfred the Great; there is little to choose between their claims. Even Henry Tudor had a claim of sorts.
Henry I married a direct descendant of Woden
... a great-granddaughter of Edmund Ironside and descendant of Alfred. Harold's claim in any case was they the throne was elective and he had been appointed by the Witan.
Interesting aside on the Islamic rules discussion.
I am reading an account at the moment of a British officer serving with an Indian cavalry regiment on the East Persian Cordon during WW1. Basically it was a line of forts and patrols which ran all the way up the eastern side of Persia to prevent German agents getting through to Afghanistan. One of the things that has struck me is how often he refers to visiting senior Moslem dignitaries in Persian towns and sharing the very fine Persian wine with them.
Not knowing much about this aspect of the religion my question is, when did the consumption of alcohol become an absolute no-no in the Moslem world? We know that some very fine wines originated in Shiraz in Iran and I assume this has to be after the Moslem conquest in the 7th century. So how come alcohol is now considered such a great evil in Islam?
The basic ban on intoxicants comes from the Quran as intoxication prevents people from proper remembrance of God.
How wrong they were, so many mornings I've woken uttering 'Oh Christ' etc.
Interesting aside on the Islamic rules discussion.
I am reading an account at the moment of a British officer serving with an Indian cavalry regiment on the East Persian Cordon during WW1. Basically it was a line of forts and patrols which ran all the way up the eastern side of Persia to prevent German agents getting through to Afghanistan. One of the things that has struck me is how often he refers to visiting senior Moslem dignitaries in Persian towns and sharing the very fine Persian wine with them.
Not knowing much about this aspect of the religion my question is, when did the consumption of alcohol become an absolute no-no in the Moslem world? We know that some very fine wines originated in Shiraz in Iran and I assume this has to be after the Moslem conquest in the 7th century. So how come alcohol is now considered such a great evil in Islam?
Yes. have a quick glance at old Omar.
'I often wonder what the vintners buy One half so precious as the goods they sell'
Also, depictions of the prophet and generally has a mixed history in Islam - some for, some against; a parallel with the history of depictions in Christianity. Loads of medieval manuscripts depict the prophet. Incidentally some modern publications reproduce them and so far as I can see no-one much has made a fuss.
FPT - The Liberal Democrats voting against the extension of the Covid Act is very significant - they should be doing much more of that if they want to be more relevant in future: advocating liberalism.
Would that make me more likely to vote for them?
Yes.
Me too. It's about time we had a party in this country that understands what a liberal democracy is and what it should and should not do.
As expected when I was poo-poohed on here yesterday over the direction of travel re vax passports, it now looks as if the government is not going to lift any restrictions at all post June but continue them in another guise. Social distancing will continue unless you can produce proof that you're healthy.
And how are hospitality venues supposed to comply with this? Ah yes - ask for proof. Very well and when some council busybody or policeman comes in to ask for proof of this how are they supposed to provide it? By showing the records they've kept, maybe? Great. Go to a pub and ask them to keep medical info about you safely.
The NHS is not overwhelmed. Deaths and cases are down significantly and continuing to decrease. Vaccinations continue. These were meant to be the data points to rely on. Now the government is tearing these up and just introducing their own version of China's social credit system. Well, stuff that.
Yes, and the extension of the virus laws until September doesn't inspire any confidence that the government will ever give up these powers. Labour are equally to blame IMO, they've barely said anything about it and have voted in favour each time despite enough Tory MPs potentially willing to make the government pay attention and slim down the measures now that we're in the final stages of it.
You're going to hate the comparison but this is what it felt like being a leave supporter from 2016-2019 watching a majority of MPs try and find a way to override democracy. The whole "well the people voted for something but there's no majority in the house" attitude has come back. There's a powerlessness that I can't stand as this whole thing is starting to feel like a stitch up between government and opposition to deny us basic freedoms.
I don't hate the comparison at all. If anything it's worse than you say. Then some MPs were trying to ignore a democratic vote. This time people have voted for this useless shower of authoritarians.
People are obsessing about flags and singing Britons never shall be slaves at the Proms while obediently agreeing to be slaves.
Daily temperature tests indeed.
They can fuck right off.
Vaccines are meant to be our way out of this. Not a tunnel into ever more restrictions and controls.
If any of that were to happen, then I agree entirely they can fuck off. And I would quit the party again, as I quit it the last time we had an authoritarian as party leader.
I simply do not believe it will happen. I might be in denial, but I just don't believe it is possible that will be done.
Restrictions to end 21/6, no ifs no buts. That's my line.
Or what? You will quit the party. Who cares. I quit the party last year and they seem to have managed to put it behind them and are going from strength to strength.
Absolutely, but that's what I can do.
HYUFD likes to take pride in the fact that he has a 100% Tory voting record and I don't, but as far as I'm concerned the Party needs to win my vote not the other way around. Three times in my life I've not voted Conservative: 2001 (Labour with a pinched nose), 2002 or 2003 local elections (Lib Dem) and 2019 European Parliament (Brexit with a very pinched nose). When that's happened the party has changed not long after to improve.
If the Conservatives become authoritarian then I will vote Lib Dem or some other party. That's all I can do.
I was idly mulling over how the pandemic would have been if it had happened whilst May was PM. I suspect that - given her track record at the Home Office - we would have been locked down tighter than a nun's chuff. And would have been coming out of that lockdown about 2025.
The problems we have with Boris is his reluctance to bow to the inevitable closures and lockdowns because, yes it buggers the economy, but also because it affronts his innate liberal sensibilities. I honestly can't see him locking us down a day longer than he thinks he can without being held responsible for a third wave.
The reason "Boris" acted too slowly with the 1st wave had nothing to do with his liberal tendencies. It was his "too lazy to focus properly" tendencies.
I am not convinced he has any liberal tendencies, and recent developments, particularly the draconian policing bill reinforce that view -though it is possible he has been too lazy to read or understand what his ministers are implementing . He is solely driven by his ego and ambition.
Yes, I think so. We've never had a PM quite like this. It's unchartered territory. I hope we can get through it with body & soul intact.
I think he has "brand Boris"/getting re-elected/not getting toppled as leader tendencies.
And if brand Boris isn't about bringing the good times back and getting us all down the pub then I've been sadly mistaken.
That's my take too. Work out the line of least resistance to an outcome which (i) strengthens his personal position right now and (ii) maintains his popularity with the voter demographic he assesses he needs the most to be re-elected, and bingo, that is what he will do. Much money is to be made on the betting front by applying this technique. It would be more difficult and interesting if (i) and (ii) were in conflict, but I don't think they are atm.
Hello kinabalu - I'd like to test your Not Happening Event radar, since I'm getting the strong feeling that the most intrusive measures being floated right now that people are getting het up about are NHEs. If anything, they're a form of psychological nudge to get people to keep taking things seriously during the current unlocking. What's your take?
Yes, hello. They are mostly NHEs. Pretty sure about that. As to the motive, I agree with yours but would add one other. I don't think it does Johnson any harm at all, up in that "primus inter pares" region of our great nation that is the Red Wall, to be seen to be mulling all sorts of very thoughtful and prudent sounding things for the immediate aftermath of the pandemic. Counters the "always just wings it" aura that can all too easily develop around him. But of course nothing will come of it - quite rightly (imo) in this case.
That makes sense, thanks. Nice to know I'm not going completely mad.
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The thing I don’t understand with the EU is that there seems to be a mutually positive joint statement with the UK to deescalate, and the next day UVdL is back at it again with Macron.
Positive statements don't make the mess go away, so it's back to blaming others.
Yes, the strategy has now shifted, IMO, from blaming Britain to trying to shift the blame onto countries that don't use the export ban measures. So now it's Belgium, the Netherlands etc... in the firing line having spectacularly failed to force the UK to give up its first option on all UK made AZ doses.
Ultimately the main objective of the EU and supporters of Ursula is to shift the blame away from the commission. Having a new target in Belgium and the Netherlands is much easier than the UK becuase now that we're out there's really not very much they can do that won't result in a very large retaliation.
It risks a dynamic where the large countries feel they are being thwarted by small free-trading countries, and the small free-trading countries feel being attached to large countries is a liability.
Interesting aside on the Islamic rules discussion.
I am reading an account at the moment of a British officer serving with an Indian cavalry regiment on the East Persian Cordon during WW1. Basically it was a line of forts and patrols which ran all the way up the eastern side of Persia to prevent German agents getting through to Afghanistan. One of the things that has struck me is how often he refers to visiting senior Moslem dignitaries in Persian towns and sharing the very fine Persian wine with them.
Not knowing much about this aspect of the religion my question is, when did the consumption of alcohol become an absolute no-no in the Moslem world? We know that some very fine wines originated in Shiraz in Iran and I assume this has to be after the Moslem conquest in the 7th century. So how come alcohol is now considered such a great evil in Islam?
The basic ban on intoxicants comes from the Quran as intoxication prevents people from proper remembrance of God.
I think we have to see the spread of Islam through the same lens as we see the spread of Christianity - not a complete replacement of beliefs and practices/habits that pre-existed, but a more a melding over, thereby resulting in regional differences in outcome that persisted for long periods.
I suspect that globalization has facilitated the concept of 'one true Islam'.
I am just surprised I suppose with how recently these things have coalesced
Interesting aside on the Islamic rules discussion.
I am reading an account at the moment of a British officer serving with an Indian cavalry regiment on the East Persian Cordon during WW1. Basically it was a line of forts and patrols which ran all the way up the eastern side of Persia to prevent German agents getting through to Afghanistan. One of the things that has struck me is how often he refers to visiting senior Moslem dignitaries in Persian towns and sharing the very fine Persian wine with them.
Not knowing much about this aspect of the religion my question is, when did the consumption of alcohol become an absolute no-no in the Moslem world? We know that some very fine wines originated in Shiraz in Iran and I assume this has to be after the Moslem conquest in the 7th century. So how come alcohol is now considered such a great evil in Islam?
The basic ban on intoxicants comes from the Quran as intoxication prevents people from proper remembrance of God.
I think we have to see the spread of Islam through the same lens as we see the spread of Christianity - not a complete replacement of beliefs and practices/habits that pre-existed, but a more a melding over, thereby resulting in regional differences in outcome that persisted for long periods.
I suspect that globalization has facilitated the concept of 'one true Islam'.
Not sure the Iranians and Saudis have an agreement on the one truth.
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The thing I don’t understand with the EU is that there seems to be a mutually positive joint statement with the UK to deescalate, and the next day UVdL is back at it again with Macron.
Positive statements don't make the mess go away, so it's back to blaming others.
Yes, the strategy has now shifted, IMO, from blaming Britain to trying to shift the blame onto countries that don't use the export ban measures. So now it's Belgium, the Netherlands etc... in the firing line having spectacularly failed to force the UK to give up its first option on all UK made AZ doses.
Ultimately the main objective of the EU and supporters of Ursula is to shift the blame away from the commission. Having a new target in Belgium and the Netherlands is much easier than the UK becuase now that we're out there's really not very much they can do that won't result in a very large retaliation.
Well, unless it ultimately results in Bexit and Nexit...
Which would be about par for this lot.
Lol, could you imagine Belgium leaving the EU.
I think that's why the commission has targeted Belgium, they've got nowhere else to go.
We could invite them into the British Commonwealth. As a thank you for hosting so many of our wars over the years.
And we'll put in a good word if they want to join the CPTPP.....
Presumably Eck is standing for the Salmond Nationalist Party...
AFI has been releasing its regional list today. Craig Murray #1 in Lothian, Martin Keatings #1 in Mid-Scotland & Fife and Tommy Sheridan in Glasgow so far....
On topic, there is a tendency on here to paint anything to with election rules as those nasty Republicans looking to disenfranchise voters while the saintly Democrats do their best for justice.
The simple fact is Mike's argument would have a lot more effect if, just once, it was recognised what the Democrats are doing to weight the system in their favour or the actions they took before November were acknowledged. Courts have ruled in several states that Democrat Secretaries of State overstepped their boundaries in changing rules without the authorisation of legislatures that had the proper authority or, as in PA, Democrat-controlled courts giving themselves powers which they didn't have. And that is without getting onto the monstrosity that is HR1, which is a blatant attempt at rigging.
And yet, the Democrats consistently try to make it easier for people to vote, and the Republicans consistently try to make it harder for people to vote.
We saw this the other day on Nancy Pelosi's blatant attempts to overturn the IA-2 result and hand the seat to the Democrat loser. People like @rpjs who would wet their pants at the signs of Trump doing anything, come out "well, under the Constitution, the House has the authority to change the result". Yeah? Well, under the Constitution, Republican controlled state legislatures could have sent their own delegates. What would have been the screams on here if the Republican did that and cited the Constitution.
You clearly missed my reply where I said based on my experience as a voter and Lib Dem activist in Winchester in 1997 that I thought trying to overturn a close election result is usually politically a stupid move, no matter that it is legally/constitutionally permissable.
Also, the problem with the Republican calls after the election to take the appointment of the presidential electors was that it can't be done retrospectively. The Founding Fathers clearly disliked this idea so much that they specifically banned it in the US Constitution not once, but twice, specifically saying that neither the federal nor state governments can legislate retrospectively (and as the states have all delegated their power to appoint electors to the people through legislation, legislation is how they would have to take it back).
And it's interesting that although after the newly elected state houses assembled at the start of the year, there were several proposals in red states to enact to give their legislatures the power to overrule the popular vote and exercise their constitutional power to appoint presidential electors should the wrong candidate win there be allegations of irregularities, I'm not aware of any actually having gone through with it yet. I wonder why?
So normally I would look at what Georgia has done and said "this is not the route". But you know what, f**k it, I'm sick of the hypocrisy and preaching so I say bring it on and I hope every Republican state does this sort of thing. It's the only way the Democrats will ever learn.
Welcome to my, and the Democrats, world. It's all very well saying "when they go low, we go high" but that doesn't help much in the real world, and now that the Republicans seem to have decided to any pretense of being a legitimate conservative political power but instead have embarked on the road to, at best, a Peronist cult, or at worse, outright fascism, sadly I don't think the Democrats have that luxury any more.
Oh, and while we're on the topic of hypocrisy, perhaps we could observe a minute of silence for the solemnly announced "principle" embraced by McConnell and the GQP leadership that it is unconscionable for the Senate to approve a SCOTUS pick if the president is in the last year of his term. That lasted all of four years until it was going to have to be applied to their side.
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The thing I don’t understand with the EU is that there seems to be a mutually positive joint statement with the UK to deescalate, and the next day UVdL is back at it again with Macron.
Positive statements don't make the mess go away, so it's back to blaming others.
Yes, the strategy has now shifted, IMO, from blaming Britain to trying to shift the blame onto countries that don't use the export ban measures. So now it's Belgium, the Netherlands etc... in the firing line having spectacularly failed to force the UK to give up its first option on all UK made AZ doses.
Ultimately the main objective of the EU and supporters of Ursula is to shift the blame away from the commission. Having a new target in Belgium and the Netherlands is much easier than the UK becuase now that we're out there's really not very much they can do that won't result in a very large retaliation.
Well, unless it ultimately results in Bexit and Nexit...
Which would be about par for this lot.
Lol, could you imagine Belgium leaving the EU.
I think that's why the commission has targeted Belgium, they've got nowhere else to go.
We could invite them into the British Commonwealth. As a thank you for hosting so many of our wars over the years.
And we'll put in a good word if they want to join the CPTPP.....
We could invite them to join the United Kingdom. It might prompt us to develop a proper federal constitution
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The Europeans I know, who are living here and so should be rather more exposed to UK news than the average resident of the EU think she's behaving badly but has a good point. I would be amazed if the average man on the Tiergarten omnibus wasn't much more in line with her views.
As for the British take, I think you're somewhat over estimating the current UK government's reputation around the world for honesty and good behaviour.
I strongly suspect that an EU vaccine export ban would be hugely popular in the EU. That doesn't make it right or sensible, but it's foolish to think that there's some upsurge of EU citizens determined to protect the UK and other countries' contractual rights to vaccines produced in the EU while they're dying in their thousands.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The Europeans I know, who are living here and so should be rather more exposed to UK news than the average resident of the EU think she's behaving badly but has a good point. I would be amazed if the average man on the Tiergarten omnibus wasn't much more in line with her views.
As for the British take, I think you're somewhat over estimating the current UK government's reputation around the world for honesty and good behaviour.
I strongly suspect that an EU vaccine export ban would be hugely popular in the EU. That doesn't make it right or sensible, but it's foolish to think that there's some upsurge of EU citizens determined to protect the UK and other countries' contractual rights to vaccines produced in the EU while they're dying in their thousands.
I've just realised something. Nigel Farage hasn't stuck his oar in on vaccines. Thankfully, he seems to be silent on this.
When you are in the position the you are *more* stupid than Nigel Farage.....
Interesting aside on the Islamic rules discussion.
I am reading an account at the moment of a British officer serving with an Indian cavalry regiment on the East Persian Cordon during WW1. Basically it was a line of forts and patrols which ran all the way up the eastern side of Persia to prevent German agents getting through to Afghanistan. One of the things that has struck me is how often he refers to visiting senior Moslem dignitaries in Persian towns and sharing the very fine Persian wine with them.
Not knowing much about this aspect of the religion my question is, when did the consumption of alcohol become an absolute no-no in the Moslem world? We know that some very fine wines originated in Shiraz in Iran and I assume this has to be after the Moslem conquest in the 7th century. So how come alcohol is now considered such a great evil in Islam?
The basic ban on intoxicants comes from the Quran as intoxication prevents people from proper remembrance of God.
You'll know you've got the world's bravest theatre director when you find one willing to put on an adaptation of Euripides' Bacchae, only set in Riyadh instead of Thebes...
Would-be Chancellor candidate Markus Söder says Germany needs to shift from chamomile tea to Red Bull mode and that politicians shouldn't lose their nerve.
Would-be Chancellor candidate Markus Söder says Germany needs to shift from chamomile tea to Red Bull mode and that politicians shouldn't lose their nerve.
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The thing I don’t understand with the EU is that there seems to be a mutually positive joint statement with the UK to deescalate, and the next day UVdL is back at it again with Macron.
Positive statements don't make the mess go away, so it's back to blaming others.
Yes, the strategy has now shifted, IMO, from blaming Britain to trying to shift the blame onto countries that don't use the export ban measures. So now it's Belgium, the Netherlands etc... in the firing line having spectacularly failed to force the UK to give up its first option on all UK made AZ doses.
Ultimately the main objective of the EU and supporters of Ursula is to shift the blame away from the commission. Having a new target in Belgium and the Netherlands is much easier than the UK becuase now that we're out there's really not very much they can do that won't result in a very large retaliation.
Well, unless it ultimately results in Bexit and Nexit...
Which would be about par for this lot.
Lol, could you imagine Belgium leaving the EU.
I think that's why the commission has targeted Belgium, they've got nowhere else to go.
We could invite them into the British Commonwealth. As a thank you for hosting so many of our wars over the years.
And we'll put in a good word if they want to join the CPTPP.....
We could invite them to join the United Kingdom. It might prompt us to develop a proper federal constitution
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The contrast in quality between VDL and Junckers comments yesterday was stark.
Yes, when an ex prime minister of Luxembourg, known for his excessive drinking, comes across as a lost political giant, you know an institution is in trouble
I was living in India at the time, and not following the news at all, but when someone told me Princess Diana (or "Lady Dee" as they put it) had died, I started reading the English language Asian Age newspaper every day for a while which had a lot of UK news in it. As a republican, I was happy to see that there seemed to be widespread disgust with the royal family. "Finally, people's eyes are opening. The monarchy will soon be finished", I thought to myself. 24 years later and it's still going. The EU is maybe an institution like the royal family, everybody knows it's crap and populated by mediocrities at best but it's tolerated because they think getting rid of it would be worse.
I know what you mean but the analogy is inexact. The British monarchy is 1500 years old, it goes right back to Athelstan, Alfred, Offa the Great, and the god Woden. It is woven through British - English, welsh. Scottish and Irish - history, since the mists of the Dark Ages. It has endured invasion and conquest, civil wars, regicide, world war, and several plagues. And it is still there. Closely wound with every national institution, the embodiment of the nation - in a glorious medley of fine music, ancient tradition, religious belief, scurrilous gossip, grand architecture, sexual misbehavior and really beautiful gardens.
Destroying it to replace it with a republic would be like tearing down a magnificent Gothic cathedral to make way for much needed office space. There may be a practical argument, but it just isn’t going to happen. The cathedral reassures in its endurance, even if bits of it keep falling off.
The EU commission is not so ancient or beloved. Tho I agree it may survive out of sheer apathy.
I think you've fallen for the mythology, common to all nationalist ideologies, that the institutions and customs of their "nation" are ancient, eternal even. The British monarchy is only a couple of years older than the EU commission.
The British monarchy is only seventy years old?
That was the last time the monarchy travelled directly down the family tree.
No it isn't. The last time it didn't pass to a direct offspring (son or daughter) was 1837 when it passed from Uncle to Niece. Even then she was the Grandaughter of a former king.
It's a mathematical certainty that von der Leyen is a direct descendant of Roman consuls, so the EU commission is still older.
The Romans made some pretty odd appointments, too.
We will all be descended from more or less everyone. The royal trick is to be able to do it convincingly back to about 650 with names and some degree of evidence. Nothing of course can overcome the perennial fact that everyone on the planet is more sure about who their mother is than who their father is, and there is no time at which this has not been true.
For genealogists there is always the question of whether anyone after about 600 can prove descent from antiquity (pre about 450/500) with no breaks in the chain; so far as I know, while this engages much better minds than mine, at least in the west this still can't be done. Woden doesn't count.
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The thing I don’t understand with the EU is that there seems to be a mutually positive joint statement with the UK to deescalate, and the next day UVdL is back at it again with Macron.
Positive statements don't make the mess go away, so it's back to blaming others.
Yes, the strategy has now shifted, IMO, from blaming Britain to trying to shift the blame onto countries that don't use the export ban measures. So now it's Belgium, the Netherlands etc... in the firing line having spectacularly failed to force the UK to give up its first option on all UK made AZ doses.
Ultimately the main objective of the EU and supporters of Ursula is to shift the blame away from the commission. Having a new target in Belgium and the Netherlands is much easier than the UK becuase now that we're out there's really not very much they can do that won't result in a very large retaliation.
It risks a dynamic where the large countries feel they are being thwarted by small free-trading countries, and the small free-trading countries feel being attached to large countries is a liability.
Yes, the Netherlands especially seems like it will end up taking the role of whipping boy just as the UK did for so many years. The dynamic of the EU has completely changed without the UK acting in that "this is stupid because..." role and other countries have needed to fill it where previously they would have been counting on us doing it and speaking out against us as bad Europeans at the same time.
Ultimately, I don't see anything changing for the EU, no one is going to leave after watching the 4.5 years it took us to finally leave but the internal arguments and contractions will just continue to grow and fester. I don't know how, without the UK being their object of common hatred, the EU will stay united.
On topic, there is a tendency on here to paint anything to with election rules as those nasty Republicans looking to disenfranchise voters while the saintly Democrats do their best for justice.
The simple fact is Mike's argument would have a lot more effect if, just once, it was recognised what the Democrats are doing to weight the system in their favour or the actions they took before November were acknowledged. Courts have ruled in several states that Democrat Secretaries of State overstepped their boundaries in changing rules without the authorisation of legislatures that had the proper authority or, as in PA, Democrat-controlled courts giving themselves powers which they didn't have. And that is without getting onto the monstrosity that is HR1, which is a blatant attempt at rigging.
And yet, the Democrats consistently try to make it easier for people to vote, and the Republicans consistently try to make it harder for people to vote.
We saw this the other day on Nancy Pelosi's blatant attempts to overturn the IA-2 result and hand the seat to the Democrat loser. People like @rpjs who would wet their pants at the signs of Trump doing anything, come out "well, under the Constitution, the House has the authority to change the result". Yeah? Well, under the Constitution, Republican controlled state legislatures could have sent their own delegates. What would have been the screams on here if the Republican did that and cited the Constitution.
You clearly missed my reply where I said based on my experience as a voter and Lib Dem activist in Winchester in 1997 that I thought trying to overturn a close election result is usually politically a stupid move, no matter that it is legally/constitutionally permissable.
Also, the problem with the Republican calls after the election to take the appointment of the presidential electors was that it can't be done retrospectively. The Founding Fathers clearly disliked this idea so much that they specifically banned it in the US Constitution not once, but twice, specifically saying that neither the federal nor state governments can legislate retrospectively (and as the states have all delegated their power to appoint electors to the people through legislation, legislation is how they would have to take it back).
And it's interesting that although after the newly elected state houses assembled at the start of the year, there were several proposals in red states to enact to give their legislatures the power to overrule the popular vote and exercise their constitutional power to appoint presidential electors should the wrong candidate win there be allegations of irregularities, I'm not aware of any actually having gone through with it yet. I wonder why?
So normally I would look at what Georgia has done and said "this is not the route". But you know what, f**k it, I'm sick of the hypocrisy and preaching so I say bring it on and I hope every Republican state does this sort of thing. It's the only way the Democrats will ever learn.
Welcome to my, and the Democrats, world. It's all very well saying "when they go low, we go high" but that doesn't help much in the real world, and now that the Republicans seem to have decided to any pretense of being a legitimate conservative political power but instead have embarked on the road to, at best, a Peronist cult, or at worse, outright fascism, sadly I don't think the Democrats have that luxury any more.
Oh, and while we're on the topic of hypocrisy, perhaps we could observe a minute of silence for the solemnly announced "principle" embraced by McConnell and the GQP leadership that it is unconscionable for the Senate to approve a SCOTUS pick if the president is in the last year of his term. That lasted all of four years until it was going to have to be applied to their side.
Spot on, Mr Ed must be very unhappy that Trump lost.
I've read some dumbass things on here over the past few years, but the notion that today's European Commission is a straight continuation of the ancient Roman consuls - and not only that, but its lineage is more direct than that of the British Royal Family - takes the cake, biscuit and the whole rest of the dessert platter as well.
The article mentions that 787 homicides took place in Chicago in 2020, a city with a population of about 2.7 million people. 787 is probably more than took place in any single European country, including Germany, UK, Italy, etc.
Wusses. When I first arrived in New York to live there in January 1992, we had well over 2000 murders reported for 1991. Of course, the city was already beginning to go soft - 1991 was a big reduction on 1990:
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
Can you explain it to us ? Warehouse and shopfront work seem different beasts to me.
Job evaluation can assess the skills and responsibilities involved in the respective tasks to make some sort of a comparison.
And if you haven’t got a direct market justification for any differential that job evaluation can’t explain, then you have a problem nowadays.
I've read some dumbass things on here over the past few years, but the notion that today's European Commission is a straight continuation of the ancient Roman consuls - and not only that, but its lineage is more direct than that of the British Royal Family - takes the cake, biscuit and the whole rest of the dessert platter as well.
Wait till you hear the one about the legitimacy of a royal line resting on them being directly descended from a god, a Germanic god to boot!
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
Can you explain it to us ? Warehouse and shopfront work seem different beasts to me.
This is a long going issue - not just that there should be equal pay for exactly equal work, but that traditional sex-differentiation of work types is also an issue to be addressed.
The hardest job I ever did involved shifting tyres onto lorries in a warehouse.
Yes, I did something similar in a vineyard.
Reminds you why the middle classes don't so manual labour.
Hardest one I ever did was in a strawberry factory. Had to stand at a conveyor belt for 2 hours at a time, punctuated by 10 min breaks, peering down at the fruit coming through, job being to spot the bad ones, grab it, and toss it over my shoulder into a big bin. I did it for 3 weeks and could not have done a single day more. I often used to think back to that experience, many years later, when I was poncing about on a City trading floor and earning so much more for doing so much less. This probably lies at the heart of my deep skepticism about the link between value added and remuneration in the capitalist economy.
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
Can you explain it to us ? Warehouse and shopfront work seem different beasts to me.
Job evaluation can assess the skills and responsibilities involved in the respective tasks to make some sort of a comparison.
And if you haven’t got a direct market justification for any differential that job evaluation can’t explain, then you have a problem nowadays.
Surely warehouse work needs training that shop floor workers don't? They must occasionally have to operate things like cranes and forklifts, for example.
Britain will struggle to source second Covid jabs for those who have already had their first dose but the EU will not be “blackmailed” into exporting vaccine to solve the problem, France’s foreign minister has claimed.
Jean-Yves Le Drian, a close political ally of the French president, Emmanuel Macron, claimed that the UK’s success had been built on driving forward with first jabs without having secured the second necessary for full vaccination.
The EU and the UK are locked in talks about the fate of Oxford/AstraZeneca jabs produced in a factory in the Netherlands.
In an interview with FranceInfo radio, Le Drian suggested that the EU should not have to lose out on the doses to help Britain with a problem of its own making. EU officials and top-rank politicians have repeatedly said they will block any export request by AstraZeneca.
Interesting aside on the Islamic rules discussion.
I am reading an account at the moment of a British officer serving with an Indian cavalry regiment on the East Persian Cordon during WW1. Basically it was a line of forts and patrols which ran all the way up the eastern side of Persia to prevent German agents getting through to Afghanistan. One of the things that has struck me is how often he refers to visiting senior Moslem dignitaries in Persian towns and sharing the very fine Persian wine with them.
Not knowing much about this aspect of the religion my question is, when did the consumption of alcohol become an absolute no-no in the Moslem world? We know that some very fine wines originated in Shiraz in Iran and I assume this has to be after the Moslem conquest in the 7th century. So how come alcohol is now considered such a great evil in Islam?
The basic ban on intoxicants comes from the Quran as intoxication prevents people from proper remembrance of God.
I think we have to see the spread of Islam through the same lens as we see the spread of Christianity - not a complete replacement of beliefs and practices/habits that pre-existed, but a more a melding over, thereby resulting in regional differences in outcome that persisted for long periods.
I suspect that globalization has facilitated the concept of 'one true Islam'.
I am just surprised I suppose with how recently these things have coalesced
It doesn't help that the oil rich Saudis have one of the most intolerant and hate-filled sects and have been exporting their version with the funding of madrasas.
Presumably Eck is standing for the Salmond Nationalist Party...
AFI has been releasing its regional list today. Craig Murray #1 in Lothian, Martin Keatings #1 in Mid-Scotland & Fife and Tommy Sheridan in Glasgow so far....
Dispel that rumour - the #1 AFI candidate for NE Scotland is not the Return of the King....
Britain will struggle to source second Covid jabs for those who have already had their first dose but the EU will not be “blackmailed” into exporting vaccine to solve the problem, France’s foreign minister has claimed.
Jean-Yves Le Drian, a close political ally of the French president, Emmanuel Macron, claimed that the UK’s success had been built on driving forward with first jabs without having secured the second necessary for full vaccination.
The EU and the UK are locked in talks about the fate of Oxford/AstraZeneca jabs produced in a factory in the Netherlands.
In an interview with FranceInfo radio, Le Drian suggested that the EU should not have to lose out on the doses to help Britain with a problem of its own making. EU officials and top-rank politicians have repeatedly said they will block any export request by AstraZeneca.
Britain will struggle to source second Covid jabs for those who have already had their first dose but the EU will not be “blackmailed” into exporting vaccine to solve the problem, France’s foreign minister has claimed.
Jean-Yves Le Drian, a close political ally of the French president, Emmanuel Macron, claimed that the UK’s success had been built on driving forward with first jabs without having secured the second necessary for full vaccination.
The EU and the UK are locked in talks about the fate of Oxford/AstraZeneca jabs produced in a factory in the Netherlands.
In an interview with FranceInfo radio, Le Drian suggested that the EU should not have to lose out on the doses to help Britain with a problem of its own making. EU officials and top-rank politicians have repeatedly said they will block any export request by AstraZeneca.
No, we aren't. Again, it's all an exercise in "look a squirrel". The UK is basically self sufficient for second doses of AZ which is really all we need. The first dose programmes will shift to Moderna and Novavax from April.
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
Can you explain it to us ? Warehouse and shopfront work seem different beasts to me.
This is a long going issue - not just that there should be equal pay for exactly equal work, but that traditional sex-differentiation of work types is also an issue to be addressed.
The hardest job I ever did involved shifting tyres onto lorries in a warehouse.
Yes, I did something similar in a vineyard.
Reminds you why the middle classes don't so manual labour.
Hardest one I ever did was in a strawberry factory. Had to stand at a conveyor belt for 2 hours at a time, punctuated by 10 min breaks, peering down at the fruit coming through, job being to spot the bad ones, grab it, and toss it over my shoulder into a big bin. I did it for 3 weeks and could not have done a single day more. I often used to think back to that experience, many years later, when I was poncing about on a City trading floor and earning so much more for doing so much less. This probably lies at the heart of my deep skepticism about the link between value added and remuneration in the capitalist economy.
Oh there is very little link between value added and remuneration. The biggest factor is the profit margin in where you are working.
Britain will struggle to source second Covid jabs for those who have already had their first dose but the EU will not be “blackmailed” into exporting vaccine to solve the problem, France’s foreign minister has claimed.
Jean-Yves Le Drian, a close political ally of the French president, Emmanuel Macron, claimed that the UK’s success had been built on driving forward with first jabs without having secured the second necessary for full vaccination.
The EU and the UK are locked in talks about the fate of Oxford/AstraZeneca jabs produced in a factory in the Netherlands.
In an interview with FranceInfo radio, Le Drian suggested that the EU should not have to lose out on the doses to help Britain with a problem of its own making. EU officials and top-rank politicians have repeatedly said they will block any export request by AstraZeneca.
According to some reports we're due all of the Halix plants output. Currently the Halix production hasn't been sent to anyone yet and the EU very much want it.
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
Can you explain it to us ? Warehouse and shopfront work seem different beasts to me.
This is a long going issue - not just that there should be equal pay for exactly equal work, but that traditional sex-differentiation of work types is also an issue to be addressed.
The hardest job I ever did involved shifting tyres onto lorries in a warehouse.
Yes, I did something similar in a vineyard.
Reminds you why the middle classes don't so manual labour.
Quite. I remember hand-singling turnips in fields, and hacking my way through an overgrown conifer plantation for blazing trees for felling in the pouring rain. . My least favourite jobs of all time.
My first properly paid job was at the local abattoir...
I sense this thread may be about to go full "Four Yorkshiremen".
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
Can you explain it to us ? Warehouse and shopfront work seem different beasts to me.
This is a long going issue - not just that there should be equal pay for exactly equal work, but that traditional sex-differentiation of work types is also an issue to be addressed.
The hardest job I ever did involved shifting tyres onto lorries in a warehouse.
Yes, I did something similar in a vineyard.
Reminds you why the middle classes don't so manual labour.
Quite. I remember hand-singling turnips in fields, and hacking my way through an overgrown conifer plantation for blazing trees for felling in the pouring rain. . My least favourite jobs of all time.
My first properly paid job was at the local abattoir...
I sense this thread may be about to go full "Four Yorkshiremen".
How about providing a not-for-profit vaccine freely licenced (like the UK)?
She lies every time she opens her mouth. Or perhaps she simply does not understand that the EU does not own private property located within the confines of the EU.
The lack of challenge to the narrative is depressing. The media has just turned into a copy/paste of press releases.
There are plenty of Europeans who don’t buy her bullshit. See social media. They can read British media (like Macron, daily) and see an entirely different but very plausible take. And this British take has spread around the world, thanks to the EU doing inexcusably nutty things, like banning AZ at the same time as it seizes it.
Ursula knows she will be remembered for this. She’s flubbed the biggest job in the history of the EU. They must be panicking in the Commission. I do feel sorry for them as individuals, it was the nature of the institution that bedeviled them. There was no personal malice aforethought.
Tho they are now clearly lying
The contrast in quality between VDL and Junckers comments yesterday was stark.
Yes, when an ex prime minister of Luxembourg, known for his excessive drinking, comes across as a lost political giant, you know an institution is in trouble
I was living in India at the time, and not following the news at all, but when someone told me Princess Diana (or "Lady Dee" as they put it) had died, I started reading the English language Asian Age newspaper every day for a while which had a lot of UK news in it. As a republican, I was happy to see that there seemed to be widespread disgust with the royal family. "Finally, people's eyes are opening. The monarchy will soon be finished", I thought to myself. 24 years later and it's still going. The EU is maybe an institution like the royal family, everybody knows it's crap and populated by mediocrities at best but it's tolerated because they think getting rid of it would be worse.
I know what you mean but the analogy is inexact. The British monarchy is 1500 years old, it goes right back to Athelstan, Alfred, Offa the Great, and the god Woden. It is woven through British - English, welsh. Scottish and Irish - history, since the mists of the Dark Ages. It has endured invasion and conquest, civil wars, regicide, world war, and several plagues. And it is still there. Closely wound with every national institution, the embodiment of the nation - in a glorious medley of fine music, ancient tradition, religious belief, scurrilous gossip, grand architecture, sexual misbehavior and really beautiful gardens.
Destroying it to replace it with a republic would be like tearing down a magnificent Gothic cathedral to make way for much needed office space. There may be a practical argument, but it just isn’t going to happen. The cathedral reassures in its endurance, even if bits of it keep falling off.
The EU commission is not so ancient or beloved. Tho I agree it may survive out of sheer apathy.
I think you've fallen for the mythology, common to all nationalist ideologies, that the institutions and customs of their "nation" are ancient, eternal even. The British monarchy is only a couple of years older than the EU commission.
The British monarchy is only seventy years old?
That was the last time the monarchy travelled directly down the family tree.
No it isn't. The last time it didn't pass to a direct offspring (son or daughter) was 1837 when it passed from Uncle to Niece. Even then she was the Grandaughter of a former king.
It's a mathematical certainty that von der Leyen is a direct descendant of Roman consuls, so the EU commission is still older.
The Romans made some pretty odd appointments, too.
We will all be descended from more or less everyone. The royal trick is to be able to do it convincingly back to about 650 with names and some degree of evidence. Nothing of course can overcome the perennial fact that everyone on the planet is more sure about who their mother is than who their father is, and there is no time at which this has not been true.
For genealogists there is always the question of whether anyone after about 600 can prove descent from antiquity (pre about 450/500) with no breaks in the chain; so far as I know, while this engages much better minds than mine, at least in the west this still can't be done. Woden doesn't count.
Around half of people tested who have the surname “Cohen” share something called the “Cohen Modal Haplotype” that indicates that they are descended from the ancient Israelite priestly caste.
I've read some dumbass things on here over the past few years, but the notion that today's European Commission is a straight continuation of the ancient Roman consuls - and not only that, but its lineage is more direct than that of the British Royal Family - takes the cake, biscuit and the whole rest of the dessert platter as well.
Wait till you hear the one about the legitimacy of a royal line resting on them being directly descended from a god, a Germanic god to boot!
Tbf at least Leon realised it was a joke, the insecurity of all the others about the royal family was hilarious.
Britain will struggle to source second Covid jabs for those who have already had their first dose but the EU will not be “blackmailed” into exporting vaccine to solve the problem, France’s foreign minister has claimed.
Jean-Yves Le Drian, a close political ally of the French president, Emmanuel Macron, claimed that the UK’s success had been built on driving forward with first jabs without having secured the second necessary for full vaccination.
The EU and the UK are locked in talks about the fate of Oxford/AstraZeneca jabs produced in a factory in the Netherlands.
In an interview with FranceInfo radio, Le Drian suggested that the EU should not have to lose out on the doses to help Britain with a problem of its own making. EU officials and top-rank politicians have repeatedly said they will block any export request by AstraZeneca.
No, we aren't. Again, it's all an exercise in "look a squirrel". The UK is basically self sufficient for second doses of AZ which is really all we need. The first dose programmes will shift to Moderna and Novavax from April.
Significantly though, he has set the precedent. Countries apparently shouldn’t help other countries out of “problems of their own making”. Ok.
Would-be Chancellor candidate Markus Söder says Germany needs to shift from chamomile tea to Red Bull mode and that politicians shouldn't lose their nerve.
He's talking about showing leadership on the relationship between economy and environment and not making small consensus moves, but proper advances. Seems fair enough to me.
Britain will struggle to source second Covid jabs for those who have already had their first dose but the EU will not be “blackmailed” into exporting vaccine to solve the problem, France’s foreign minister has claimed.
Jean-Yves Le Drian, a close political ally of the French president, Emmanuel Macron, claimed that the UK’s success had been built on driving forward with first jabs without having secured the second necessary for full vaccination.
The EU and the UK are locked in talks about the fate of Oxford/AstraZeneca jabs produced in a factory in the Netherlands.
In an interview with FranceInfo radio, Le Drian suggested that the EU should not have to lose out on the doses to help Britain with a problem of its own making. EU officials and top-rank politicians have repeatedly said they will block any export request by AstraZeneca.
No, we aren't. Again, it's all an exercise in "look a squirrel". The UK is basically self sufficient for second doses of AZ which is really all we need. The first dose programmes will shift to Moderna and Novavax from April.
Britain will struggle to source second Covid jabs for those who have already had their first dose but the EU will not be “blackmailed” into exporting vaccine to solve the problem, France’s foreign minister has claimed.
Jean-Yves Le Drian, a close political ally of the French president, Emmanuel Macron, claimed that the UK’s success had been built on driving forward with first jabs without having secured the second necessary for full vaccination.
The EU and the UK are locked in talks about the fate of Oxford/AstraZeneca jabs produced in a factory in the Netherlands.
In an interview with FranceInfo radio, Le Drian suggested that the EU should not have to lose out on the doses to help Britain with a problem of its own making. EU officials and top-rank politicians have repeatedly said they will block any export request by AstraZeneca.
No, we aren't. Again, it's all an exercise in "look a squirrel". The UK is basically self sufficient for second doses of AZ which is really all we need. The first dose programmes will shift to Moderna and Novavax from April.
You don't think we're due anything from Halix? According to reports earlier this week we are?
I am utterly baffled by the surprise shown on here to the Asda decision which is based on a law that has been in place since 1971 - the Equal Pay Act (now consolidated into the Equality Act). There is nothing that remarkable in there.
Can you explain it to us ? Warehouse and shopfront work seem different beasts to me.
This is a long going issue - not just that there should be equal pay for exactly equal work, but that traditional sex-differentiation of work types is also an issue to be addressed.
The hardest job I ever did involved shifting tyres onto lorries in a warehouse.
Yes, I did something similar in a vineyard.
Reminds you why the middle classes don't so manual labour.
Hardest one I ever did was in a strawberry factory. Had to stand at a conveyor belt for 2 hours at a time, punctuated by 10 min breaks, peering down at the fruit coming through, job being to spot the bad ones, grab it, and toss it over my shoulder into a big bin. I did it for 3 weeks and could not have done a single day more. I often used to think back to that experience, many years later, when I was poncing about on a City trading floor and earning so much more for doing so much less. This probably lies at the heart of my deep skepticism about the link between value added and remuneration in the capitalist economy.
Luxury , as an 8 or 9 year old I walked behind tractor picking up stones/rocks and threw them in trailer , 5 shillings a week , 5 days 8-5 , farmer's wife did provide lovely tea and cakes etc at lunch time.
Britain will struggle to source second Covid jabs for those who have already had their first dose but the EU will not be “blackmailed” into exporting vaccine to solve the problem, France’s foreign minister has claimed.
Jean-Yves Le Drian, a close political ally of the French president, Emmanuel Macron, claimed that the UK’s success had been built on driving forward with first jabs without having secured the second necessary for full vaccination.
The EU and the UK are locked in talks about the fate of Oxford/AstraZeneca jabs produced in a factory in the Netherlands.
In an interview with FranceInfo radio, Le Drian suggested that the EU should not have to lose out on the doses to help Britain with a problem of its own making. EU officials and top-rank politicians have repeatedly said they will block any export request by AstraZeneca.
No, we aren't. Again, it's all an exercise in "look a squirrel". The UK is basically self sufficient for second doses of AZ which is really all we need. The first dose programmes will shift to Moderna and Novavax from April.
what about pfizer
They have been stockpiling Pfizer for the last 6 weeks for the 2nd doses, there is plenty in the country. The EU threats are empty and pointless.
Presumably Eck is standing for the Salmond Nationalist Party...
AFI has been releasing its regional list today. Craig Murray #1 in Lothian, Martin Keatings #1 in Mid-Scotland & Fife and Tommy Sheridan in Glasgow so far....
Dispel that rumour - the #1 AFI candidate for NE Scotland is not the Return of the King....
FPT - The Liberal Democrats voting against the extension of the Covid Act is very significant - they should be doing much more of that if they want to be more relevant in future: advocating liberalism.
Would that make me more likely to vote for them?
Yes.
Me too. It's about time we had a party in this country that understands what a liberal democracy is and what it should and should not do.
As expected when I was poo-poohed on here yesterday over the direction of travel re vax passports, it now looks as if the government is not going to lift any restrictions at all post June but continue them in another guise. Social distancing will continue unless you can produce proof that you're healthy.
And how are hospitality venues supposed to comply with this? Ah yes - ask for proof. Very well and when some council busybody or policeman comes in to ask for proof of this how are they supposed to provide it? By showing the records they've kept, maybe? Great. Go to a pub and ask them to keep medical info about you safely.
The NHS is not overwhelmed. Deaths and cases are down significantly and continuing to decrease. Vaccinations continue. These were meant to be the data points to rely on. Now the government is tearing these up and just introducing their own version of China's social credit system. Well, stuff that.
Yes, and the extension of the virus laws until September doesn't inspire any confidence that the government will ever give up these powers. Labour are equally to blame IMO, they've barely said anything about it and have voted in favour each time despite enough Tory MPs potentially willing to make the government pay attention and slim down the measures now that we're in the final stages of it.
You're going to hate the comparison but this is what it felt like being a leave supporter from 2016-2019 watching a majority of MPs try and find a way to override democracy. The whole "well the people voted for something but there's no majority in the house" attitude has come back. There's a powerlessness that I can't stand as this whole thing is starting to feel like a stitch up between government and opposition to deny us basic freedoms.
Restrictions are ending on 21/6
If the COVID rules had been extended until 30/6 as some suggested the government would have been scrambling if the final unlocking created issues
An extension to 30/9 makes a huge amount of sense from a practical perspective
FPT - The Liberal Democrats voting against the extension of the Covid Act is very significant - they should be doing much more of that if they want to be more relevant in future: advocating liberalism.
Would that make me more likely to vote for them?
Yes.
Me too. It's about time we had a party in this country that understands what a liberal democracy is and what it should and should not do.
As expected when I was poo-poohed on here yesterday over the direction of travel re vax passports, it now looks as if the government is not going to lift any restrictions at all post June but continue them in another guise. Social distancing will continue unless you can produce proof that you're healthy.
And how are hospitality venues supposed to comply with this? Ah yes - ask for proof. Very well and when some council busybody or policeman comes in to ask for proof of this how are they supposed to provide it? By showing the records they've kept, maybe? Great. Go to a pub and ask them to keep medical info about you safely.
The NHS is not overwhelmed. Deaths and cases are down significantly and continuing to decrease. Vaccinations continue. These were meant to be the data points to rely on. Now the government is tearing these up and just introducing their own version of China's social credit system. Well, stuff that.
Yes, and the extension of the virus laws until September doesn't inspire any confidence that the government will ever give up these powers. Labour are equally to blame IMO, they've barely said anything about it and have voted in favour each time despite enough Tory MPs potentially willing to make the government pay attention and slim down the measures now that we're in the final stages of it.
You're going to hate the comparison but this is what it felt like being a leave supporter from 2016-2019 watching a majority of MPs try and find a way to override democracy. The whole "well the people voted for something but there's no majority in the house" attitude has come back. There's a powerlessness that I can't stand as this whole thing is starting to feel like a stitch up between government and opposition to deny us basic freedoms.
Restrictions are ending on 21/6
If the COVID rules had been extended until 30/6 as some suggested the government would have been scrambling if the final unlocking created issues
An extension to 30/9 makes a huge amount of sense from a practical perspective
Comments
(gets coat)
I mean, come on, the Treaty of Rome was actually signed on Rome's Capitoline Hill.
All institutions have their mythologies that try to appeal to "ancient" roots. It's as much a fiction for the British royal family as for anything else.
And as actual liberals?
The virus nucleocapsid protein, which makes no part of any vaccine, is highly immunogenic, and of you've been infected, you produce a ton of antibodies against it (which incidentally are also pretty useless in preventing further infection).
It really has had a mare. And that is not just a gloating Brexiteer mind-set. This Brexiteer takes no pleasure in the deaths they will undoubtedly cause. It just makes me profoundly sad that the waste of life in the UK didn't get picked up as a text book of what not to do. It now looks like being an even greater loss of life across the continent. Really distressing.
Just get your act together guys.
Verstappen was fastest, three-tenths ahead of Bottas, with Norris next, then Hamilton.
Still too early to draw pace conclusions, for me at least.
Made in Dagenham is well worth a watch. Very entertaining film that additionally benefits from featuring the fragrant Rosamund Pike.
I am reading an account at the moment of a British officer serving with an Indian cavalry regiment on the East Persian Cordon during WW1. Basically it was a line of forts and patrols which ran all the way up the eastern side of Persia to prevent German agents getting through to Afghanistan. One of the things that has struck me is how often he refers to visiting senior Moslem dignitaries in Persian towns and sharing the very fine Persian wine with them.
Not knowing much about this aspect of the religion my question is, when did the consumption of alcohol become an absolute no-no in the Moslem world? We know that some very fine wines originated in Shiraz in Iran and I assume this has to be after the Moslem conquest in the 7th century. So how come alcohol is now considered such a great evil in Islam?
(Before anybody else does it!)
Ever.
Ultimately the main objective of the EU and supporters of Ursula is to shift the blame away from the commission. Having a new target in Belgium and the Netherlands is much easier than the UK becuase now that we're out there's really not very much they can do that won't result in a very large retaliation.
Which would be about par for this lot.
I think one unexamined aspect of this clusterfcuk is how Salmond feels about completely burning his bridges with the party that he's been committed to most of his life. Not sure if all bridges aren't already burnt mind, but no doubt there are people telling Salmond that Sturgeon is a passing fancy, busted flush etc and the party & nation are waiting for the return of the king. Fwiw I think he's been poorly advised, particularly recently.
I think we have to see the spread of Islam through the same lens as we see the spread of Christianity - not a complete replacement of beliefs and practices/habits that pre-existed, but a more a melding over, thereby resulting in regional differences in outcome that persisted for long periods.
I suspect that globalization has facilitated the concept of 'one true Islam'.
Both of them are aiming to deprive Nippy of seats...
Reminds you why the middle classes don't so manual labour.
I think that's why the commission has targeted Belgium, they've got nowhere else to go.
If you are going to appeal to ancient roots you should at least try and find some justification in history.
Incidently, as I have bored people with before on here, the Hapsburg's only got to play with the Holy Roman Empire because one of my ancestors Sir William Tyndall turned down the Throne of Bohemia before it was subsequently offered to them.
Such is Europe's loss. I am sure we would have run a much more enlightened Holy Roman Empire
'I often wonder what the vintners buy
One half so precious as the goods they sell'
Also, depictions of the prophet and generally has a mixed history in Islam - some for, some against; a parallel with the history of depictions in Christianity. Loads of medieval manuscripts depict the prophet. Incidentally some modern publications reproduce them and so far as I can see no-one much has made a fuss.
Yay production increases (I assume anyway).
And we'll put in a good word if they want to join the CPTPP.....
"Hans, are we the baddies?" You clearly missed my reply where I said based on my experience as a voter and Lib Dem activist in Winchester in 1997 that I thought trying to overturn a close election result is usually politically a stupid move, no matter that it is legally/constitutionally permissable.
Also, the problem with the Republican calls after the election to take the appointment of the presidential electors was that it can't be done retrospectively. The Founding Fathers clearly disliked this idea so much that they specifically banned it in the US Constitution not once, but twice, specifically saying that neither the federal nor state governments can legislate retrospectively (and as the states have all delegated their power to appoint electors to the people through legislation, legislation is how they would have to take it back).
And it's interesting that although after the newly elected state houses assembled at the start of the year, there were several proposals in red states to enact to give their legislatures the power to overrule the popular vote and exercise their constitutional power to appoint presidential electors should the wrong candidate win there be allegations of irregularities, I'm not aware of any actually having gone through with it yet. I wonder why? Welcome to my, and the Democrats, world. It's all very well saying "when they go low, we go high" but that doesn't help much in the real world, and now that the Republicans seem to have decided to any pretense of being a legitimate conservative political power but instead have embarked on the road to, at best, a Peronist cult, or at worse, outright fascism, sadly I don't think the Democrats have that luxury any more.
Oh, and while we're on the topic of hypocrisy, perhaps we could observe a minute of silence for the solemnly announced "principle" embraced by McConnell and the GQP leadership that it is unconscionable for the Senate to approve a SCOTUS pick if the president is in the last year of his term. That lasted all of four years until it was going to have to be applied to their side.
https://twitter.com/Markus_Soeder/status/1375436865940111363
But only if they promise to vote for Boris.....
For genealogists there is always the question of whether anyone after about 600 can prove descent from antiquity (pre about 450/500) with no breaks in the chain; so far as I know, while this engages much better minds than mine, at least in the west this still can't be done. Woden doesn't count.
Ultimately, I don't see anything changing for the EU, no one is going to leave after watching the 4.5 years it took us to finally leave but the internal arguments and contractions will just continue to grow and fester. I don't know how, without the UK being their object of common hatred, the EU will stay united.
Job evaluation can assess the skills and responsibilities involved in the respective tasks to make some sort of a comparison.
And if you haven’t got a direct market justification for any differential that job evaluation can’t explain, then you have a problem nowadays.
Jean-Yves Le Drian, a close political ally of the French president, Emmanuel Macron, claimed that the UK’s success had been built on driving forward with first jabs without having secured the second necessary for full vaccination.
The EU and the UK are locked in talks about the fate of Oxford/AstraZeneca jabs produced in a factory in the Netherlands.
In an interview with FranceInfo radio, Le Drian suggested that the EU should not have to lose out on the doses to help Britain with a problem of its own making. EU officials and top-rank politicians have repeatedly said they will block any export request by AstraZeneca.
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/mar/26/france-uk-struggle-source-second-covid-jabs-eu-blackmail
Are we due much from the Netherlands?
https://twitter.com/action4indy/status/1375372731580039169/photo/1
ISP?
Hope that doesn't lead to a collapse now like the first ODI.
https://twitter.com/GerryHassan/status/1375436303320416257?s=20
https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1375406665718190083
I sense this thread may be about to go full "Four Yorkshiremen".
My first job....
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-eu-uk-idUSKBN2BD0RZ
https://twitter.com/jonworth/status/1374374766161760259
If the COVID rules had been extended until 30/6 as some suggested the government would have been scrambling if the final unlocking created issues
An extension to 30/9 makes a huge amount of sense from a practical perspective
If the COVID rules had been extended until 30/6 as some suggested the government would have been scrambling if the final unlocking created issues
An extension to 30/9 makes a huge amount of sense from a practical perspective