It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.
The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.
Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.
It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.
Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.
I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.
She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.
Posting on pb.com, probably.
I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.
Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.
Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
They may not be held in may
It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
I expect the Euros to be cancelled
Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.
If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
Many, many people think like Big G sadly.
The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.
Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.
I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.
However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
I am one of the lucky ones who is due a vaccine shortly and I am not afraid of going out
However, I practice hands face space religiously unlike many others
In short, your life has barely been disrupted at all by covid. Which is great for you. You seem oblivious to the enormous sacrifices some have made for that to be the case though.
Just moans about their lawbreaking.
Time for you to play your part. We;re reducing your pension payments by ten per cent to help with the huge costs of letting you live as usual. OK?
It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.
The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.
Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.
It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.
Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.
I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.
She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.
Posting on pb.com, probably.
I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.
Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.
Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
They may not be held in may
It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
I expect the Euros to be cancelled
Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.
If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
Many, many people think like Big G sadly.
The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.
Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.
I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.
However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
I am one of the lucky ones who is due a vaccine shortly and I am not afraid of going out
However, I practice hands face space religiously unlike many others
I agree there. I wish younger people would practise the space bit a lot more. They may feel invinceable, but they can still kill granny, and any other older people they breathe on.
It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.
The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.
Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.
It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.
Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.
I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.
She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.
Posting on pb.com, probably.
I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.
Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.
Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
They may not be held in may
It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
I expect the Euros to be cancelled
Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.
If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
Many, many people think like Big G sadly.
The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.
Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.
I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.
However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
Surely all big G has to do is make sure he stays in his bubble, stays indoors or local and doesn't meet any strangers. Then get the vaccine.
Don;t see why the rest of the country needs to be locked down to achieve that.
People in their 90s and 80s rely upon daily contact with normal people for care. Even if they're not in a care home, they will have regular at home care visits.
And over a million of them have been vaccinated so far with more every day.
Doesn't mean they don't have to be given some precautions. I'm coming to realise that people don't understand that this isn't 100% protection (whether for oneself or those whom one might infect). So it's not like having a polio or German measles jab in your childhood where you join the largely immunized and immune herd, but that we are startting from scratch.
Well it's a cost benefit thing. If you have a jab and want to keep the nation locked down forever I would say that is erring on the side of caution.
Then again with such risk aversion you would probably be staying at home anyway.
Not really - it's just that one can't go out as if there was no risk till a fair number of folk had been immunised. Selfish to get the pox and take up a NHS bed, after all.
We were talking about segregating the vulnerable. The point was made that vulnerable people interact with carers etc so that policy is difficult. But vulnerable people are also getting the vaccine now.
It's likely that the country won't be vaccinated for some months. Are you saying that everyone (it even just those vulnerable people) should stay locked down until everyone is vaccinated?
It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.
The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.
Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.
It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.
Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.
I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.
She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.
Posting on pb.com, probably.
I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.
Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.
Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
They may not be held in may
It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
I expect the Euros to be cancelled
Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.
If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
Many, many people think like Big G sadly.
The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.
Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.
I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.
However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
Surely all big G has to do is make sure he stays in his bubble, stays indoors or local and doesn't meet any strangers. Then get the vaccine.
Don;t see why the rest of the country needs to be locked down to achieve that.
People in their 90s and 80s rely upon daily contact with normal people for care. Even if they're not in a care home, they will have regular at home care visits.
And over a million of them have been vaccinated so far with more every day.
Yes that is the way out - eventually.
A million have but millions more haven't. Plus it takes a couple of weeks post-vaccination for it to take effect.
We need a good few weeks to roll this out, a fortnight for it to take effect, then we can think of rolling out restrictions - but by then R should be down too.
Not sure the point of this to be honest. I'm sure she has been punished enough in the court of public opinion. What's a fine going to add here?
Well, PS are enforcing the law - by advice, admonition, and where it is considered necessary by prosecution. Edit: I know they are doing it locally, and AramintaMoonbeam reports it in her part of the Borders as well.
Is a MP above the law?
No, but I am wondering whether she would have been charged if she wasn't an MSP. Just to confirm btw, that I am not SNP or Scottish or live in Scotland, so I don't think I can be accused of bias, i hope....
She's not a MSP to be pedantic. But I see what you mean and I don't think so.
Wonder if plod need to arrest Charles now, given he travelled to Scotland breaking the rules having tested positive for Covid and his minions infected half the local people. No doubt it will be the usual one rule for us and arrest the plebs.
I can't actually remember what the legal situation was at the time tbf. (And just in case anyone gets confused, this is not Charles of this PB parish.)
It was clearly stated at the time that he had broken the rules, brought his minions with him, put them all up in local village and caused outbreak. You can bet the toffs do not get charged for certain.
Good article. Against a government bankrupt of ideas and morals, I think Starmer has done a decent fist of setting himself up as an alternative with a moral purpose. He doesn't have any ideas either, that he is able or willing to articulate. He should make more use of Ed Miliband here. Miliband is hopeless at retail politics, but he is one of the best policymakers of recent times - to the extent the Conservatives have pinched most of his policies after first deriding them.
Starmer also needs someone to work on presentation and communication, on where the Labour Party is heading and to attack the Conservatives on corruption and incompetence, which are their weakest points.
Every vote with the government lessens his appeal to Lab supporters, as @isam's poll seems to show.
It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.
The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.
Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.
It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.
Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.
I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.
She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.
Posting on pb.com, probably.
I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.
Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.
Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
They may not be held in may
It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
I expect the Euros to be cancelled
Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.
If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
Many, many people think like Big G sadly.
The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.
Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.
I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.
However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
I am one of the lucky ones who is due a vaccine shortly and I am not afraid of going out
However, I practice hands face space religiously unlike many others
I agree there. I wish younger people would practise the space bit a lot more. They may feel invinceable, but they can still kill granny, and any other older people they breathe on.
The response of young people has, on the whole, been astonishingly good.
And the attitude of those on whose behalf they are making sacrifices not seen since WWII, astonishingly selfish, astonishingly sanctimonious and astonishingly complacent.
Watching Channel 4 News. Can't help feeling we are back to square one. They've just had a guest on from UCL - the proposed March style lockdown is not enough. The vaccines we have will stop THIS virus if we get it into people's arms now. But 2m jabs a week takes a full year to get all adults. Unless we get everyone the risk is this mutates to a form that gets around the vaccine and thus we start again.
So we need the following: 1. A full lockdown 2. Shut the borders so we stop letting it/other variants in 3. A war footing to get 3 or 4 million jabs a week done.
We won't get any of those. So we're proper fucked.
The organisational theme in the article is important ; who provides that help is important too, though. A key problem for Starmer is that many of those who do have this organisational experience are not going to provide Starmer with the political route to power ; the electorate is not waiting for 1997 reassurances on Labour, but something quite different. His main problem in that respect is that figures from the 1960s and '70s Soft Left with governmental experience are long since dead.
It's a good piece from Richard but it is also yet one more example of a popular PB oeuvre - suggestions of what Labour needs to do to win an election from posters who will not be voting Labour.
I think we are on a promise from Casino for another one soon.
Very fair point. A number of PB non Tories said that BJ would be an electoral and moral disaster, we were only half right.
Yes. It turned out that what the Tories needed to win their 1st landslide since Thatcher was a dose of BritNat and a leader palpably unsuited to be PM.
It's a tough mission to find what best counters that.
It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.
The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.
Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.
It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.
Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.
I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.
She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.
Posting on pb.com, probably.
I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.
Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.
Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
They may not be held in may
It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
I expect the Euros to be cancelled
Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.
If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
Many, many people think like Big G sadly.
The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.
Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.
I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.
However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
Surely all big G has to do is make sure he stays in his bubble, stays indoors or local and doesn't meet any strangers. Then get the vaccine.
Don;t see why the rest of the country needs to be locked down to achieve that.
People in their 90s and 80s rely upon daily contact with normal people for care. Even if they're not in a care home, they will have regular at home care visits.
And over a million of them have been vaccinated so far with more every day.
Doesn't mean they don't have to be given some precautions. I'm coming to realise that people don't understand that this isn't 100% protection (whether for oneself or those whom one might infect). So it's not like having a polio or German measles jab in your childhood where you join the largely immunized and immune herd, but that we are startting from scratch.
Well it's a cost benefit thing. If you have a jab and want to keep the nation locked down forever I would say that is erring on the side of caution.
Then again with such risk aversion you would probably be staying at home anyway.
Not really - it's just that one can't go out as if there was no risk till a fair number of folk had been immunised. Selfish to get the pox and take up a NHS bed, after all.
We were talking about segregating the vulnerable. The point was made that vulnerable people interact with carers etc so that policy is difficult. But vulnerable people are also getting the vaccine now.
It's likely that the country won't be vaccinated for some months. Are you saying that everyone (it even just those vulnerable people) should stay locked down until everyone is vaccinated?
We are looking at 2-3 months to vaccinate the vulnerable.
Should we be locked down for maybe 2 months? Perhaps if there is no alternative and it means we can then get a better back to normal in the Spring. Perhaps.
A lockdown should always be the last resort, but the vaccine does mean there is an end in sight. We're at the foothills not the summit of the rollout though.
It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.
The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.
Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.
It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.
Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.
I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.
She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.
Posting on pb.com, probably.
I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.
Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.
Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
They may not be held in may
It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
I expect the Euros to be cancelled
Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.
If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
Many, many people think like Big G sadly.
The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.
Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.
I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.
However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
I am one of the lucky ones who is due a vaccine shortly and I am not afraid of going out
However, I practice hands face space religiously unlike many others
In short, your life has barely been disrupted at all by covid. Which is great for you. You seem oblivious to the enormous sacrifices some have made for that to be the case though.
Just moans about their lawbreaking.
Time for you to play your part. We;re reducing your pension payments by ten per cent to help with the huge costs of letting you live as usual. OK?
That is a rather unkind and ungenrous comment and of course I know of the sacrifices made including the stress and strains within my family will reduced income and juggling their children's needs
I do reject the selfishness of those who do not comply as they are de facto the ones responsible for the spreading of the virus more than those who follow the rules
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.
The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.
Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.
It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.
Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.
I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.
She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.
Posting on pb.com, probably.
I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.
Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.
Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
They may not be held in may
It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
I expect the Euros to be cancelled
Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.
If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
Many, many people think like Big G sadly.
The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.
Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.
I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.
However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
I am one of the lucky ones who is due a vaccine shortly and I am not afraid of going out
However, I practice hands face space religiously unlike many others
In short, your life has barely been disrupted at all by covid. Which is great for you. You seem oblivious to the enormous sacrifices some have made for that to be the case though.
Just moans about their lawbreaking.
Time for you to play your part. We;re reducing your pension payments by ten per cent to help with the huge costs of letting you live as usual. OK?
Greedy gits wanting to rob poor pensioners who worked all their lives for their meagre pensions, skanky pimply youngsters who would faint at having to do a hard days work now want to rob them to compensate their fecklessness. On your bike you halfwit.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
Good article. Against a government bankrupt of ideas and morals, I think Starmer has done a decent fist of setting himself up as an alternative with a moral purpose. He doesn't have any ideas either, that he is able or willing to articulate. He should make more use of Ed Miliband here. Miliband is hopeless at retail politics, but he is one of the best policymakers of recent times - to the extent the Conservatives have pinched most of his policies after first deriding them.
Starmer also needs someone to work on presentation and communication, on where the Labour Party is heading and to attack the Conservatives on corruption and incompetence, which are their weakest points.
Every vote with the government lessens his appeal to Lab supporters, as @isam's poll seems to show.
Starmer needs to engage on Brexit. Just hoping it goes away means he gets defined on it by Johnson. I think he can make a case for voting tactically in favour or against a deal, but he does need to explain how he means to go forward from here and why it is better than what Johnson is doing.
It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.
The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.
Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.
It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.
Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.
I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.
She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.
Posting on pb.com, probably.
I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.
Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.
Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
They may not be held in may
It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
I expect the Euros to be cancelled
Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.
If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
Many, many people think like Big G sadly.
The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.
Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.
I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.
However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
Surely all big G has to do is make sure he stays in his bubble, stays indoors or local and doesn't meet any strangers. Then get the vaccine.
Don;t see why the rest of the country needs to be locked down to achieve that.
People in their 90s and 80s rely upon daily contact with normal people for care. Even if they're not in a care home, they will have regular at home care visits.
And over a million of them have been vaccinated so far with more every day.
Doesn't mean they don't have to be given some precautions. I'm coming to realise that people don't understand that this isn't 100% protection (whether for oneself or those whom one might infect). So it's not like having a polio or German measles jab in your childhood where you join the largely immunized and immune herd, but that we are startting from scratch.
Well it's a cost benefit thing. If you have a jab and want to keep the nation locked down forever I would say that is erring on the side of caution.
Then again with such risk aversion you would probably be staying at home anyway.
Not really - it's just that one can't go out as if there was no risk till a fair number of folk had been immunised. Selfish to get the pox and take up a NHS bed, after all.
We were talking about segregating the vulnerable. The point was made that vulnerable people interact with carers etc so that policy is difficult. But vulnerable people are also getting the vaccine now.
It's likely that the country won't be vaccinated for some months. Are you saying that everyone (it even just those vulnerable people) should stay locked down until everyone is vaccinated?
People's conceptions seem to be based on a preexisting herd immunity - so we have a 'normal' situatuion for German measles where a non-trivial percentage of the population is already innumised even when that injection is only partially successful on an individual level. In the current situation, it's not possible to go an d hug granny without some risk even if she has been immunised first. That rtisk will only reduce once a decent proportion have been immunised. So granny has to wait n weeks after her jab has 'taken' before she and her family can relax. The exact timi8ngs and percentages are of course a partly epidemiological and partly politico-economic calculation. Hopefully the percentage of population jabbed will be nearer 50% than 100%, but IANAE - I was just commenting on a popssible flaw in public understanding.
It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.
The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.
Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.
It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.
Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.
I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.
She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.
Posting on pb.com, probably.
I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.
Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.
Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
They may not be held in may
It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
I expect the Euros to be cancelled
Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.
If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
Many, many people think like Big G sadly.
The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.
Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.
I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.
However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
I am one of the lucky ones who is due a vaccine shortly and I am not afraid of going out
However, I practice hands face space religiously unlike many others
In short, your life has barely been disrupted at all by covid. Which is great for you. You seem oblivious to the enormous sacrifices some have made for that to be the case though.
Just moans about their lawbreaking.
Time for you to play your part. We;re reducing your pension payments by ten per cent to help with the huge costs of letting you live as usual. OK?
Greedy gits wanting to rob poor pensioners who worked all their lives for their meagre pensions, skanky pimply youngsters who would faint at having to do a hard days work now want to rob them to compensate their fecklessness. On your bike you halfwit.
I think I may have said something similar Malc, but in a more polite way !!!
Watching Channel 4 News. Can't help feeling we are back to square one. They've just had a guest on from UCL - the proposed March style lockdown is not enough. The vaccines we have will stop THIS virus if we get it into people's arms now. But 2m jabs a week takes a full year to get all adults. Unless we get everyone the risk is this mutates to a form that gets around the vaccine and thus we start again.
So we need the following: 1. A full lockdown 2. Shut the borders so we stop letting it/other variants in 3. A war footing to get 3 or 4 million jabs a week done.
We won't get any of those. So we're proper fucked.
I just can't work out why the government just can't ever pull the trigger on border closure policy. It is completely beyond me why when they have tried basically everything else, it is never on the agenda.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
Watching Channel 4 News. Can't help feeling we are back to square one. They've just had a guest on from UCL - the proposed March style lockdown is not enough. The vaccines we have will stop THIS virus if we get it into people's arms now. But 2m jabs a week takes a full year to get all adults. Unless we get everyone the risk is this mutates to a form that gets around the vaccine and thus we start again.
So we need the following: 1. A full lockdown 2. Shut the borders so we stop letting it/other variants in 3. A war footing to get 3 or 4 million jabs a week done.
We won't get any of those. So we're proper fucked.
As I said earlier, to enormous ridicule and scorn, the seeds for post vaccination lockdowns are already being sown. Now you can see it for yourself.
We are never getting out. Ever.
The idea that these vaccines will set us free is flawed.
It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.
The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.
Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.
It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.
Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.
I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.
She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.
Posting on pb.com, probably.
I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.
Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.
Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
They may not be held in may
It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
I expect the Euros to be cancelled
Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.
If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form unless they have a pre existing condition.
The moment the weather turns, the moment we get more sunlight in the evening - sometime in mid-March.
Starmer just looks haunted. Like he's been caught out in an awful lie and he's just going through the motions. He has an air of a man that thinks everyone has decided that he can't be trusted and should be in prison.
I really can't work it out.
What he actually says is sensible enough, and he seems to have some degree of control of, that worst of all things for leaders, his own party.
The only thing I can think of that'd fit was that he's, late in the day, realised what a shower Labour are. I don't see it, but it's my only theory.
Anyone have anything better? I presume we all see the hesitancy?
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
Just wait until he goes for phase 3 - tattooing the flag across his face.
I like to think politicians have special suits which include collapsable poles which erect a flaf 4ft behind them and 2ft to the left.
Thus must explain why Boris keeps having at least 4 flags behind him - escalation.
The flags behind the Brexit deal photo op did look particularly ridiculous - about four thickly draped together in a way previous British governments would have considered tasteless and "terribly American" ; somehow reminiscent of the way the paint-em-on, super-profusion of christmas iights on shops and houses that is now popular was considered tasteless only a few years ago.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
Just wait until he goes for phase 3 - tattooing the flag across his face.
I like to think politicians have special suits which include collapsable poles which erect a flaf 4ft behind them and 2ft to the left.
Thus must explain why Boris keeps having at least 4 flags behind him - escalation.
The flags behind the Brexit deal photo op did look particularly ridiculous - a bit three or four thickly draped together in a way previous British governments would have considered tasteless ; somehow reminiscent of the way the paint-em-on, super-profusion of christmas iights on shops that are now popular used to be considered tasteless.
It's the four identical flags so close together that gets me. If you're going to have at least four behind you, why not go all out and have ones for each Home nation, and a Union one?
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
Just wait until he goes for phase 3 - tattooing the flag across his face.
I like to think politicians have special suits which include collapsable poles which erect a flaf 4ft behind them and 2ft to the left.
Thus must explain why Boris keeps having at least 4 flags behind him - escalation.
The flags behind the Brexit deal photo op did look particularly ridiculous - about four thickly draped together in a way previous British governments would have considered tasteless ; somehow reminiscent of the way the paint-em-on, super-profusion of christmas iights on shops that are now popular used to be considered tasteless.
Ian Murray [edit] doesn't need collapsible poles in his suit. He does like to appeal to his Morningside matrons, though I don't think they would approve of his excuse:
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
Good article. Against a government bankrupt of ideas and morals, I think Starmer has done a decent fist of setting himself up as an alternative with a moral purpose. He doesn't have any ideas either, that he is able or willing to articulate. He should make more use of Ed Miliband here. Miliband is hopeless at retail politics, but he is one of the best policymakers of recent times - to the extent the Conservatives have pinched most of his policies after first deriding them.
Starmer also needs someone to work on presentation and communication, on where the Labour Party is heading and to attack the Conservatives on corruption and incompetence, which are their weakest points.
Every vote with the government lessens his appeal to Lab supporters, as @isam's poll seems to show.
Starmer needs to engage on Brexit. Just hoping it goes away means he gets defined on it by Johnson. I think he can make a case for voting tactically in favour or against a deal, but he does need to explain how he means to go forward from here and why it is better than what Johnson is doing.
Unlike some on here, the overwhelming message I got on doorsteps last autumn/winter is that people are sick to death of endless Brexit meanderings.
Starmer knows he cannot win on Brexit. Even if it turns out to be a disaster (which I very much doubt), being seen as the doomonger or naysayer is counter productive. If you know you cannot win the trick is to avoid the battle. Everyone but paid up Europhiles can see that.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
Just wait until he goes for phase 3 - tattooing the flag across his face.
I like to think politicians have special suits which include collapsable poles which erect a flaf 4ft behind them and 2ft to the left.
Thus must explain why Boris keeps having at least 4 flags behind him - escalation.
The flags behind the Brexit deal photo op did look particularly ridiculous - a bit three or four thickly draped together in a way previous British governments would have considered tasteless ; somehow reminiscent of the way the paint-em-on, super-profusion of christmas iights on shops that are now popular used to be considered tasteless.
It's the four identical flags so close together that gets me. If you're going to have at least four behind you, why not go all out and have ones for each Home nation, and a Union one?
Can't win. If they are all opn the level, you piss off some voters. If the Union Flag is higher or lower, you piss off a different lot.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
The *only* thing he got right in that interview was the flag. hand-wringing wishy and indeed washy. Mrs RP (a Labour councillor until last May): "GROW A FUCKING BACKBONE MAN!"
It is probably easier and cheaper to give the kit away. If you lent (say) 100,000 tablets, how would you get them back and what would you do with them once you had?
Watching Channel 4 News. Can't help feeling we are back to square one. They've just had a guest on from UCL - the proposed March style lockdown is not enough. The vaccines we have will stop THIS virus if we get it into people's arms now. But 2m jabs a week takes a full year to get all adults. Unless we get everyone the risk is this mutates to a form that gets around the vaccine and thus we start again.
So we need the following: 1. A full lockdown 2. Shut the borders so we stop letting it/other variants in 3. A war footing to get 3 or 4 million jabs a week done.
We won't get any of those. So we're proper fucked.
As I said earlier, to enormous ridicule and scorn, the seeds for post vaccination lockdowns are already being sown. Now you can see it for yourself.
We are never getting out. Ever.
The idea that these vaccines will set us free is flawed.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
The *only* thing he got right in that interview was the flag. hand-wringing wishy and indeed washy. Mrs RP (a Labour councillor until last May): "GROW A FUCKING BACKBONE MAN!"
Terrible interview. Like Ed Miliband's 'get around the table' strike video.
@viewcode Thank you for your message. I have responded. Appreciated.
I think I got myself into a bit of a pickle in the last thread. In trying to respond to a specific challenge and using simplistic responses for brevity I dug myself into a hole.
I don't think the EU is particularly democratic nor the UK as I would like to see either of them, but equally they are not totally undemocratic either. Both having different strengths and weaknesses.
All I wanted to do is point out that it is nonsense to categorize one as democratic and the other not. They have different systems with different strengths, but in particular different weaknesses.
I suspect @Richard_Tyndall we probably don't disagree much, but you responded to my simplistic response to a nonsense post (not yours) and I wouldn't disagree with any of your assertions in response to my posts which were made to make a simple point to just point out differences.
Made worse by the comment 'Yet more bollocks'. Don't mind being told I am talking bollocks. It was the 'yet more' that flabbergasted me as it was my first post so I was paranoid about what previous bollocks I posted?
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
Just wait until he goes for phase 3 - tattooing the flag across his face.
I like to think politicians have special suits which include collapsable poles which erect a flaf 4ft behind them and 2ft to the left.
Thus must explain why Boris keeps having at least 4 flags behind him - escalation.
The flags behind the Brexit deal photo op did look particularly ridiculous - a bit three or four thickly draped together in a way previous British governments would have considered tasteless ; somehow reminiscent of the way the paint-em-on, super-profusion of christmas iights on shops that are now popular used to be considered tasteless.
It's the four identical flags so close together that gets me. If you're going to have at least four behind you, why not go all out and have ones for each Home nation, and a Union one?
Can't win. If they are all opn the level, you piss off some voters. If the Union Flag is higher or lower, you piss off a different lot.
Alright, just one flag, but it's a fusion of the home nation flags in some way...wait.
Still think the Union would be safe if this was the flag - would even the Scots want to leave a nation this badass?
Starmer just looks haunted. Like he's been caught out in an awful lie and he's just going through the motions. He has an air of a man that thinks everyone has decided that he can't be trusted and should be in prison.
I really can't work it out.
What he actually says is sensible enough, and he seems to have some degree of control of, that worst of all things for leaders, his own party.
The only thing I can think of that'd fit was that he's, late in the day, realised what a shower Labour are. I don't see it, but it's my only theory.
Anyone have anything better? I presume we all see the hesitancy?
Leadership, especially of an opposition party, involves a degree of informed gambling. I'm not sure it fits his capabilities.
To think that the PM had half an hour on the BBC’s prime political interview spot just yesterday, which he spent almost entirely ducking, weaving and dodging the most gentle lines of questioning from Andrew Marr, and pretty much the only specific answer that Marr managed to get out of him - that he was committed to reopening schools to timetable - is about to be abandoned just one day later.
On topic, some excellent points made by Richard in the header.
Also, don't forget that Blair had a team that spoke to the various parts of the Labour coalition, including Brown, Prescott, Donald Dewar and Cook.
So he both had a close knit team all singing from the same hymn sheet *and* they were each capable of taking that message to the right part of the Labour consistency and bringing them along with them (Dewar/Brown - Scottish Labour, Prescott - WWC/union voters and Middle England - Blair).
Watching Channel 4 News. Can't help feeling we are back to square one. They've just had a guest on from UCL - the proposed March style lockdown is not enough. The vaccines we have will stop THIS virus if we get it into people's arms now. But 2m jabs a week takes a full year to get all adults. Unless we get everyone the risk is this mutates to a form that gets around the vaccine and thus we start again.
So we need the following: 1. A full lockdown 2. Shut the borders so we stop letting it/other variants in 3. A war footing to get 3 or 4 million jabs a week done.
We won't get any of those. So we're proper fucked.
As I said earlier, to enormous ridicule and scorn, the seeds for post vaccination lockdowns are already being sown. Now you can see it for yourself.
We are never getting out. Ever.
The idea that these vaccines will set us free is flawed.
Allow me to add to the earlier ridicule and scorn: you are being completely ridiculous.
No government and no population would promote, or stand for, endless lockdowns.
If there's a vaccine in the offing (and there are numerous) then it's clearly worth containing the virus until people can be vaccinated. If there was no possibility of a vaccine, other strategies (better treatments, herd immunity) would be pursued; the same would apply in the extremely unlikely event that the virus can mutate and resist vaccines faster than we can develop them.
You seem to think that lockdowns are being used as some sinsister form of population control by the government. But they are not, they really aren't.
Starmer just looks haunted. Like he's been caught out in an awful lie and he's just going through the motions. He has an air of a man that thinks everyone has decided that he can't be trusted and should be in prison.
I really can't work it out.
What he actually says is sensible enough, and he seems to have some degree of control of, that worst of all things for leaders, his own party.
The only thing I can think of that'd fit was that he's, late in the day, realised what a shower Labour are. I don't see it, but it's my only theory.
Anyone have anything better? I presume we all see the hesitancy?
I did think he looked awful in that interview - the weird repetitions and the half-bored, half-angry vacillation reached Milibandish proportions - in a way that seems to go beyond my usual unexalted opinion of him.
If he's getting this stressed when he has no responsibility for anything...
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
The *only* thing he got right in that interview was the flag. hand-wringing wishy and indeed washy. Mrs RP (a Labour councillor until last May): "GROW A FUCKING BACKBONE MAN!"
It doesn't matter. No-one will watch the interview or hear what he has to say.
They will notice the flag. But only if it's consistent and part of a trend (Starmer has a habit of one-offs).
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
The *only* thing he got right in that interview was the flag. hand-wringing wishy and indeed washy. Mrs RP (a Labour councillor until last May): "GROW A FUCKING BACKBONE MAN!"
It doesn't matter. No-one will watch the interview or hear what he has to say.
They will notice the flag. But only if it's consistent and part of a trend (Starmer has a habit of one-offs).
This will have a wider reach, and very sensible it is too:
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
I'm far from enraged but I'm not impressed. Hope it's a passing phase.
If you want to regain power you need to be comfortable with Labour making the flag its own.
This shouldn't be controversial. It represents the country you aspire to govern.
If you hate it, and the flag that represents it, then why would voters trust you to govern it?
I don't hate it. It can flutter in the background occasionally. I certainly don't want to see a different country's flag instead. But I do not want to see Starmer wrapping himself in it. And I am not alone. Labour need me and ilk as well as the Red Wall.
Starmer just looks haunted. Like he's been caught out in an awful lie and he's just going through the motions. He has an air of a man that thinks everyone has decided that he can't be trusted and should be in prison.
I really can't work it out.
What he actually says is sensible enough, and he seems to have some degree of control of, that worst of all things for leaders, his own party.
The only thing I can think of that'd fit was that he's, late in the day, realised what a shower Labour are. I don't see it, but it's my only theory.
Anyone have anything better? I presume we all see the hesitancy?
Starmer is also up against the faultless, perfectionist campaigning machine that is Boris Johnson.
Personally, I see in Johnson a stuttering clown, but over 15 million voters see fluency and vision, which is key.
On topic, some excellent points made by Richard in the header.
Also, don't forget that Blair had a team that spoke to the various parts of the Labour coalition, including Brown, Prescott, Donald Dewar and Cook.
So he both had a close knit team all singing from the same hymn sheet *and* they were each capable of taking that message to the right part of the Labour consistency and bringing them along with them (Dewar/Brown - Scottish Labour, Prescott - WWC/union voters and Middle England - Blair).
I agree. I think Blair gets the credit for a very disciplined team of stars.
Straw and Blunkett particularly. Sure, Dewar and Prescott spoke to certain constituencies, but I could imagine 100s of Conservative Associations selecting Straw and Blunkett as Conservative MPs. Such was their sensible positioning and flawless comms.
Watching Channel 4 News. Can't help feeling we are back to square one. They've just had a guest on from UCL - the proposed March style lockdown is not enough. The vaccines we have will stop THIS virus if we get it into people's arms now. But 2m jabs a week takes a full year to get all adults. Unless we get everyone the risk is this mutates to a form that gets around the vaccine and thus we start again.
So we need the following: 1. A full lockdown 2. Shut the borders so we stop letting it/other variants in 3. A war footing to get 3 or 4 million jabs a week done.
We won't get any of those. So we're proper fucked.
As I said earlier, to enormous ridicule and scorn, the seeds for post vaccination lockdowns are already being sown. Now you can see it for yourself.
We are never getting out. Ever.
The idea that these vaccines will set us free is flawed.
People sometimes attract ridicule and scorn by being ridiculous and contemptible.
Have a look at this story and a think about the ludicrous nonsense about underoccupied ICU beds you have been touting recently.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
Watching Channel 4 News. Can't help feeling we are back to square one. They've just had a guest on from UCL - the proposed March style lockdown is not enough. The vaccines we have will stop THIS virus if we get it into people's arms now. But 2m jabs a week takes a full year to get all adults. Unless we get everyone the risk is this mutates to a form that gets around the vaccine and thus we start again.
So we need the following: 1. A full lockdown 2. Shut the borders so we stop letting it/other variants in 3. A war footing to get 3 or 4 million jabs a week done.
We won't get any of those. So we're proper fucked.
As I said earlier, to enormous ridicule and scorn, the seeds for post vaccination lockdowns are already being sown. Now you can see it for yourself.
We are never getting out. Ever.
The idea that these vaccines will set us free is flawed.
Just to get this straight, governments see CV19 as a way of enforcing control over their citizens and subjecting them to constant lockdowns, because this will (a) be great for the economy, (b) be really popular, and (c) result in their re-election.
Politicians are not brilliant and machiavellian. They are simple folk who couldn't get decent jobs, who run in terror of their electorate or selectorate (see members of the Republican party in the US for an example of this).
They want one thing: no not utter control of the populace, but to be re-elected, and to climb the greasy poll.
At every stage, they will do what the focus groups tell them will lead to them being most popular. Hence have some money to dine out. Hence open for Christmas. Hence allowing (and even encouraging) people to have summer holidays in Covid hotspots.
More restrictions are popular right now with most of the population. Why? Because people are scared and hospitals are filling. The politicians are followers, not leaders. They do what they are told will make them more popular.
And this is why your contention is deranged: do you really think that - as death rates and hospitalisations come down - it won't be a vote winner to remove restrictions?
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
The *only* thing he got right in that interview was the flag. hand-wringing wishy and indeed washy. Mrs RP (a Labour councillor until last May): "GROW A FUCKING BACKBONE MAN!"
Terrible interview. Like Ed Miliband's 'get around the table' strike video.
Aw man, that one was great. I wish more politicians got caught out like that, but so many of them are so afraid of scrutiny you don't even get the chance.
I miss Ed M. Remember the Ed Stone? What a time to be alive that was.
Watching Channel 4 News. Can't help feeling we are back to square one. They've just had a guest on from UCL - the proposed March style lockdown is not enough. The vaccines we have will stop THIS virus if we get it into people's arms now. But 2m jabs a week takes a full year to get all adults. Unless we get everyone the risk is this mutates to a form that gets around the vaccine and thus we start again.
So we need the following: 1. A full lockdown 2. Shut the borders so we stop letting it/other variants in 3. A war footing to get 3 or 4 million jabs a week done.
We won't get any of those. So we're proper fucked.
As I said earlier, to enormous ridicule and scorn, the seeds for post vaccination lockdowns are already being sown. Now you can see it for yourself.
We are never getting out. Ever.
The idea that these vaccines will set us free is flawed.
Allow me to add to the earlier ridicule and scorn: you are being completely ridiculous.
No government and no population would promote, or stand for, endless lockdowns.
If there's a vaccine in the offing (and there are numerous) then it's clearly worth containing the virus until people can be vaccinated. If there was no possibility of a vaccine, other strategies (better treatments, herd immunity) would be pursued; the same would apply in the extremely unlikely event that the virus can mutate and resist vaccines faster than we can develop them.
You seem to think that lockdowns are being used as some sinsister form of population control by the government. But they are not, they really aren't.
If lockdowns were perpetual, there would be no economy to tax, so very little government.
Watching Channel 4 News. Can't help feeling we are back to square one. They've just had a guest on from UCL - the proposed March style lockdown is not enough. The vaccines we have will stop THIS virus if we get it into people's arms now. But 2m jabs a week takes a full year to get all adults. Unless we get everyone the risk is this mutates to a form that gets around the vaccine and thus we start again.
So we need the following: 1. A full lockdown 2. Shut the borders so we stop letting it/other variants in 3. A war footing to get 3 or 4 million jabs a week done.
We won't get any of those. So we're proper fucked.
As I said earlier, to enormous ridicule and scorn, the seeds for post vaccination lockdowns are already being sown. Now you can see it for yourself.
We are never getting out. Ever.
The idea that these vaccines will set us free is flawed.
Allow me to add to the earlier ridicule and scorn: you are being completely ridiculous.
No government and no population would promote, or stand for, endless lockdowns.
If there's a vaccine in the offing (and there are numerous) then it's clearly worth containing the virus until people can be vaccinated. If there was no possibility of a vaccine, other strategies (better treatments, herd immunity) would be pursued; the same would apply in the extremely unlikely event that the virus can mutate and resist vaccines faster than we can develop them.
You seem to think that lockdowns are being used as some sinsister form of population control by the government. But they are not, they really aren't.
I'm still none the wiser what the sinister motivation is, or why lockdown is seen by some controlling force as a desirable end in itself.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
The *only* thing he got right in that interview was the flag. hand-wringing wishy and indeed washy. Mrs RP (a Labour councillor until last May): "GROW A FUCKING BACKBONE MAN!"
Terrible interview. Like Ed Miliband's 'get around the table' strike video.
Aw man, that one was great. I wish more politicians got caught out like that, but so many of them are so afraid of scrutiny you don't even get the chance.
I miss Ed M. Remember the Ed Stone? What a time to be alive that was.
Haha indeed. I remember reading that whilst eating a full english on a weekend at my local cafe (my gf was away and the kitchen was being ripped apart pre replacement - times were dire!). Rang my father and said 'we've won the next election' - such was my conviction that the British people wouldn't warm to 'an NHS with the time to care' and other nonsense phrases.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
Just wait until he goes for phase 3 - tattooing the flag across his face.
I like to think politicians have special suits which include collapsable poles which erect a flaf 4ft behind them and 2ft to the left.
Thus must explain why Boris keeps having at least 4 flags behind him - escalation.
The flags behind the Brexit deal photo op did look particularly ridiculous - a bit three or four thickly draped together in a way previous British governments would have considered tasteless ; somehow reminiscent of the way the paint-em-on, super-profusion of christmas iights on shops that are now popular used to be considered tasteless.
It's the four identical flags so close together that gets me. If you're going to have at least four behind you, why not go all out and have ones for each Home nation, and a Union one?
Picking a flag to represent Northern Ireland apparently is a bit of a thorny issue ...
“Liverpool are starting an outfield of three forwards, four attacking midfielders, two attack-minded fullbacks, and one holding midfielder,” notes Paul Done. “Heavy metal football has returned.”
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
I commented on the flag when I heard his live broadcast on Sky
FFS , he is totally useless, and people in England immediately think he is good because he puts a flag behind himself. Is it any wonder the UK is F***ed , never mind that you are totally and utterly devoid of any ideas, you have a flag behind you.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
I'm far from enraged but I'm not impressed. Hope it's a passing phase.
If you want to regain power you need to be comfortable with Labour making the flag its own.
This shouldn't be controversial. It represents the country you aspire to govern.
If you hate it, and the flag that represents it, then why would voters trust you to govern it?
I don't hate it. It can flutter in the background occasionally. I certainly don't want to see a different country's flag instead. But I do not want to see Starmer wrapping himself in it. And I am not alone. Labour need me and ilk as well as the Red Wall.
Frankly, where else will you go if Labour does become more overtly patriotic?
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
The *only* thing he got right in that interview was the flag. hand-wringing wishy and indeed washy. Mrs RP (a Labour councillor until last May): "GROW A FUCKING BACKBONE MAN!"
Terrible interview. Like Ed Miliband's 'get around the table' strike video.
Aw man, that one was great. I wish more politicians got caught out like that, but so many of them are so afraid of scrutiny you don't even get the chance.
I miss Ed M. Remember the Ed Stone? What a time to be alive that was.
Haha indeed. I remember reading that whilst eating a full english on a weekend at my local cafe (my gf was away and the kitchen was being ripped apart pre replacement - times were dire!). Rang my father and said 'we've won the next election' - such was my conviction that the British people wouldn't warm to 'an NHS with the time to care' and other nonsense phrases.
2 additional points add to the hilarity for me.
The really plain, generic font, which just seemed out of place on a 7ft slab.
And that Labour got fined for not declaring its costs properly.
“Liverpool are starting an outfield of three forwards, four attacking midfielders, two attack-minded fullbacks, and one holding midfielder,” notes Paul Done. “Heavy metal football has returned.”
Bednarek of Southampton is dangerous at set pieces. With no real CBs playing for Liverpool maybe he is a decent bet to score/score first at a big price
Ed M has matured into a great politician, not just a good policymaker. Unfortunately he wasn't in 2015.
People need time to grow into a role. Sometimes losing will need to be part of that. Unfortunately we're not inclind to give people second chances anymore.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
The *only* thing he got right in that interview was the flag. hand-wringing wishy and indeed washy. Mrs RP (a Labour councillor until last May): "GROW A FUCKING BACKBONE MAN!"
It doesn't matter. No-one will watch the interview or hear what he has to say.
They will notice the flag. But only if it's consistent and part of a trend (Starmer has a habit of one-offs).
Only mentally deficient halfwitted cretins will be happy with a clown with a flag behind him............ oooh wait it worked for the last one
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
I commented on the flag when I heard his live broadcast on Sky
FFS , he is totally useless, and people in England immediately think he is good because he puts a flag behind himself. Is it any wonder the UK is F***ed , never mind that you are totally and utterly devoid of any ideas, you have a flag behind you.
The last vestige of the scoundrel has become the sign of a wise moderate!
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
I commented on the flag when I heard his live broadcast on Sky
FFS , he is totally useless, and people in England immediately think he is good because he puts a flag behind himself. Is it any wonder the UK is F***ed , never mind that you are totally and utterly devoid of any ideas, you have a flag behind you.
I don't really get this patriotism stuff at all. You want politicians you can trust not to defecate on the Cenotaph or sell secrets to Russia (Corbyn fell down on both counts) but beyond that, eeeuw. Most people love their mothers, but don't go around advertising the fact or claiming it as a key driver of their choices. The concept of loving one's country is to me intuitively much harder to grasp, and to be treated with at least equal reticence.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
I commented on the flag when I heard his live broadcast on Sky
FFS , he is totally useless, and people in England immediately think he is good because he puts a flag behind himself. Is it any wonder the UK is F***ed , never mind that you are totally and utterly devoid of any ideas, you have a flag behind you.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
I commented on the flag when I heard his live broadcast on Sky
FFS , he is totally useless, and people in England immediately think he is good because he puts a flag behind himself. Is it any wonder the UK is F***ed , never mind that you are totally and utterly devoid of any ideas, you have a flag behind you.
Ed M has matured into a great politician, not just a good policymaker. Unfortunately he wasn't in 2015.
People need time to grow into a role. Sometimes losing will need to be part of that. Unfortunately we're not inclind to give people second chances anymore.
Very true: I read somewhere that people's second start-up was much more likely to succeed than their first, yet VCs would usually prefer to back a first start-up than someone who was on their second after an early failure.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
I'm far from enraged but I'm not impressed. Hope it's a passing phase.
If you want to regain power you need to be comfortable with Labour making the flag its own.
This shouldn't be controversial. It represents the country you aspire to govern.
If you hate it, and the flag that represents it, then why would voters trust you to govern it?
I don't hate it. It can flutter in the background occasionally. I certainly don't want to see a different country's flag instead. But I do not want to see Starmer wrapping himself in it. And I am not alone. Labour need me and ilk as well as the Red Wall.
Less flags, not more.
We don't need a large Union Jack, sagging limply in the background, to improve our attention.
And there is no way SKS can beat Boris in flag envy.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
I'm far from enraged but I'm not impressed. Hope it's a passing phase.
If you want to regain power you need to be comfortable with Labour making the flag its own.
This shouldn't be controversial. It represents the country you aspire to govern.
If you hate it, and the flag that represents it, then why would voters trust you to govern it?
I don't hate it. It can flutter in the background occasionally. I certainly don't want to see a different country's flag instead. But I do not want to see Starmer wrapping himself in it. And I am not alone. Labour need me and ilk as well as the Red Wall.
Frankly, where else will you go if Labour does become more overtly patriotic?
For liberals more generally, the Greens and LD's, and for unhappy national-populists in the reverse scenario the Tories and UKIP ; it's not 1997. This is why Starmer has to be extremely careful in the way he maintains a balance, and also how he formulates policy.
“Liverpool are starting an outfield of three forwards, four attacking midfielders, two attack-minded fullbacks, and one holding midfielder,” notes Paul Done. “Heavy metal football has returned.”
Have the Liverpool coaching team been listening to the KLF releases? The KLF/Extreme Noise Terror rendition of 3am Eternal is Heavy Metal something
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
I commented on the flag when I heard his live broadcast on Sky
FFS , he is totally useless, and people in England immediately think he is good because he puts a flag behind himself. Is it any wonder the UK is F***ed , never mind that you are totally and utterly devoid of any ideas, you have a flag behind you.
Really? If you say so.
The duct tape on the floor across the parquet and carpet is an extra classy touch...
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
Just wait until he goes for phase 3 - tattooing the flag across his face.
I like to think politicians have special suits which include collapsable poles which erect a flaf 4ft behind them and 2ft to the left.
Thus must explain why Boris keeps having at least 4 flags behind him - escalation.
The flags behind the Brexit deal photo op did look particularly ridiculous - a bit three or four thickly draped together in a way previous British governments would have considered tasteless ; somehow reminiscent of the way the paint-em-on, super-profusion of christmas iights on shops that are now popular used to be considered tasteless.
It's the four identical flags so close together that gets me. If you're going to have at least four behind you, why not go all out and have ones for each Home nation, and a Union one?
Can't win. If they are all opn the level, you piss off some voters. If the Union Flag is higher or lower, you piss off a different lot.
Alright, just one flag, but it's a fusion of the home nation flags in some way...wait.
Still think the Union would be safe if this was the flag - would even the Scots want to leave a nation this badass?
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
I commented on the flag when I heard his live broadcast on Sky
FFS , he is totally useless, and people in England immediately think he is good because he puts a flag behind himself. Is it any wonder the UK is F***ed , never mind that you are totally and utterly devoid of any ideas, you have a flag behind you.
I don't really get this patriotism stuff at all. You want politicians you can trust not to defecate on the Cenotaph or sell secrets to Russia (Corbyn fell down on both counts) but beyond that, eeeuw. Most people love their mothers, but don't go around advertising the fact or claiming it as a key driver of their choices. The concept of loving one's country is to me intuitively much harder to grasp, and to be treated with at least equal reticence.
When I was young, any politician that insisted on being photographed in front of flags would be considered highly suspect, if not actually a neo-Nazi. I also recall fondly that British immigration officers were civil servants who wore business suits, not the paramilitary garb of most countries.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
I commented on the flag when I heard his live broadcast on Sky
FFS , he is totally useless, and people in England immediately think he is good because he puts a flag behind himself. Is it any wonder the UK is F***ed , never mind that you are totally and utterly devoid of any ideas, you have a flag behind you.
I don't really get this patriotism stuff at all. You want politicians you can trust not to defecate on the Cenotaph or sell secrets to Russia (Corbyn fell down on both counts) but beyond that, eeeuw. Most people love their mothers, but don't go around advertising the fact or claiming it as a key driver of their choices. The concept of loving one's country is to me intuitively much harder to grasp, and to be treated with at least equal reticence.
Horrible to see someone faking it this way.
Although I think mass immigration is a bad idea, I wouldn't say I was patriotic or proud to be English, even less that British is best or any such nonsense. Cringe tastic really. Maybe he always has a Union Jack in his office like that, I wouldn't know, but it seems so obviously staged,
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
I commented on the flag when I heard his live broadcast on Sky
FFS , he is totally useless, and people in England immediately think he is good because he puts a flag behind himself. Is it any wonder the UK is F***ed , never mind that you are totally and utterly devoid of any ideas, you have a flag behind you.
Really? If you say so.
The duct tape on the floor across the parquet and carpet is an extra classy touch...
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
The *only* thing he got right in that interview was the flag. hand-wringing wishy and indeed washy. Mrs RP (a Labour councillor until last May): "GROW A FUCKING BACKBONE MAN!"
Terrible interview. Like Ed Miliband's 'get around the table' strike video.
Aw man, that one was great. I wish more politicians got caught out like that, but so many of them are so afraid of scrutiny you don't even get the chance.
I miss Ed M. Remember the Ed Stone? What a time to be alive that was.
I know to many people it may seem silly to have got emotional over Ed’s resignation, but it wasn’t anything like the reaction to Zayn Malik leaving One Direction, as some have carelessly compared it. We’d had the chance to have this amazing person as prime minister: a chance for equality, a chance for change, a chance for someone who truly cared about the people to lead them. To watch our country waste that chance and to see someone who had worked so unbelievably hard and was so deserving lose was utterly devastating. I don’t know when I’m going to get over that feeling of loss, that sick, hollow feeling in my stomach, when I think about what could have been. Ed Miliband was the best prime minister we never had.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
I commented on the flag when I heard his live broadcast on Sky
FFS , he is totally useless, and people in England immediately think he is good because he puts a flag behind himself. Is it any wonder the UK is F***ed , never mind that you are totally and utterly devoid of any ideas, you have a flag behind you.
Really? If you say so.
The duct tape on the floor across the parquet and carpet is an extra classy touch...
That's why all this talk about flags every time Johnson gives a press conference is utterly ridiculous. Literally every leader everywhere does it.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
Just wait until he goes for phase 3 - tattooing the flag across his face.
I like to think politicians have special suits which include collapsable poles which erect a flaf 4ft behind them and 2ft to the left.
Thus must explain why Boris keeps having at least 4 flags behind him - escalation.
The flags behind the Brexit deal photo op did look particularly ridiculous - a bit three or four thickly draped together in a way previous British governments would have considered tasteless ; somehow reminiscent of the way the paint-em-on, super-profusion of christmas iights on shops that are now popular used to be considered tasteless.
It's the four identical flags so close together that gets me. If you're going to have at least four behind you, why not go all out and have ones for each Home nation, and a Union one?
Can't win. If they are all opn the level, you piss off some voters. If the Union Flag is higher or lower, you piss off a different lot.
Alright, just one flag, but it's a fusion of the home nation flags in some way...wait.
Still think the Union would be safe if this was the flag - would even the Scots want to leave a nation this badass?
YES, it is just a butchers apron in disguise.
Not swayed by a dragon in the centre? There's no helping some people.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
The *only* thing he got right in that interview was the flag. hand-wringing wishy and indeed washy. Mrs RP (a Labour councillor until last May): "GROW A FUCKING BACKBONE MAN!"
Terrible interview. Like Ed Miliband's 'get around the table' strike video.
Aw man, that one was great. I wish more politicians got caught out like that, but so many of them are so afraid of scrutiny you don't even get the chance.
I miss Ed M. Remember the Ed Stone? What a time to be alive that was.
I know to many people it may seem silly to have got emotional over Ed’s resignation, but it wasn’t anything like the reaction to Zayn Malik leaving One Direction, as some have carelessly compared it. We’d had the chance to have this amazing person as prime minister: a chance for equality, a chance for change, a chance for someone who truly cared about the people to lead them. To watch our country waste that chance and to see someone who had worked so unbelievably hard and was so deserving lose was utterly devastating. I don’t know when I’m going to get over that feeling of loss, that sick, hollow feeling in my stomach, when I think about what could have been. Ed Miliband was the best prime minister we never had.
Not sure I could handle chaos after these last five years.
Watching Channel 4 News. Can't help feeling we are back to square one. They've just had a guest on from UCL - the proposed March style lockdown is not enough. The vaccines we have will stop THIS virus if we get it into people's arms now. But 2m jabs a week takes a full year to get all adults. Unless we get everyone the risk is this mutates to a form that gets around the vaccine and thus we start again.
So we need the following: 1. A full lockdown 2. Shut the borders so we stop letting it/other variants in 3. A war footing to get 3 or 4 million jabs a week done.
We won't get any of those. So we're proper fucked.
As I said earlier, to enormous ridicule and scorn, the seeds for post vaccination lockdowns are already being sown. Now you can see it for yourself.
We are never getting out. Ever.
The idea that these vaccines will set us free is flawed.
Allow me to add to the earlier ridicule and scorn: you are being completely ridiculous.
No government and no population would promote, or stand for, endless lockdowns.
If there's a vaccine in the offing (and there are numerous) then it's clearly worth containing the virus until people can be vaccinated. If there was no possibility of a vaccine, other strategies (better treatments, herd immunity) would be pursued; the same would apply in the extremely unlikely event that the virus can mutate and resist vaccines faster than we can develop them.
You seem to think that lockdowns are being used as some sinsister form of population control by the government. But they are not, they really aren't.
I'm still none the wiser what the sinister motivation is, or why lockdown is seen by some controlling force as a desirable end in itself.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
The *only* thing he got right in that interview was the flag. hand-wringing wishy and indeed washy. Mrs RP (a Labour councillor until last May): "GROW A FUCKING BACKBONE MAN!"
It doesn't matter. No-one will watch the interview or hear what he has to say.
They will notice the flag. But only if it's consistent and part of a trend (Starmer has a habit of one-offs).
Only mentally deficient halfwitted cretins will be happy with a clown with a flag behind him............ oooh wait it worked for the last one
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
I'm far from enraged but I'm not impressed. Hope it's a passing phase.
If you want to regain power you need to be comfortable with Labour making the flag its own.
This shouldn't be controversial. It represents the country you aspire to govern.
If you hate it, and the flag that represents it, then why would voters trust you to govern it?
I don't hate it. It can flutter in the background occasionally. I certainly don't want to see a different country's flag instead. But I do not want to see Starmer wrapping himself in it. And I am not alone. Labour need me and ilk as well as the Red Wall.
Less flags, not more.
We don't need a large Union Jack, sagging limply in the background, to improve our attention.
And there is no way SKS can beat Boris in flag envy.
“Liverpool are starting an outfield of three forwards, four attacking midfielders, two attack-minded fullbacks, and one holding midfielder,” notes Paul Done. “Heavy metal football has returned.”
Have the Liverpool coaching team been listening to the KLF releases? The KLF/Extreme Noise Terror rendition of 3am Eternal is Heavy Metal something
Maybe, it was a line Klopp used years ago when he was Borussia Dortmund manager and he took on Wenger's Arsenal.
“[Arsene Wenger] likes having the ball, playing football, passes. It’s like an orchestra, but it is a silent song. I like heavy metal more. I always want it loud.”
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
I'm far from enraged but I'm not impressed. Hope it's a passing phase.
If you want to regain power you need to be comfortable with Labour making the flag its own.
This shouldn't be controversial. It represents the country you aspire to govern.
If you hate it, and the flag that represents it, then why would voters trust you to govern it?
I don't hate it. It can flutter in the background occasionally. I certainly don't want to see a different country's flag instead. But I do not want to see Starmer wrapping himself in it. And I am not alone. Labour need me and ilk as well as the Red Wall.
Less flags, not more.
We don't need a large Union Jack, sagging limply in the background, to improve our attention.
And there is no way SKS can beat Boris in flag envy.
Probably the best feature of Johnson's Premiership are the crisp Union flags to the left and right of him at his sombre Rooseveltian addresses to the Nation.
Johnson owns the Union flag! We may soon no longer own a Union, but he will still own the flag!
Comments
Just moans about their lawbreaking.
Time for you to play your part. We;re reducing your pension payments by ten per cent to help with the huge costs of letting you live as usual. OK?
It's likely that the country won't be vaccinated for some months. Are you saying that everyone (it even just those vulnerable people) should stay locked down until everyone is vaccinated?
A million have but millions more haven't. Plus it takes a couple of weeks post-vaccination for it to take effect.
We need a good few weeks to roll this out, a fortnight for it to take effect, then we can think of rolling out restrictions - but by then R should be down too.
You can bet the toffs do not get charged for certain.
And the attitude of those on whose behalf they are making sacrifices not seen since WWII, astonishingly selfish, astonishingly sanctimonious and astonishingly complacent.
So we need the following:
1. A full lockdown
2. Shut the borders so we stop letting it/other variants in
3. A war footing to get 3 or 4 million jabs a week done.
We won't get any of those. So we're proper fucked.
It's a tough mission to find what best counters that.
Should we be locked down for maybe 2 months? Perhaps if there is no alternative and it means we can then get a better back to normal in the Spring. Perhaps.
A lockdown should always be the last resort, but the vaccine does mean there is an end in sight. We're at the foothills not the summit of the rollout though.
I do reject the selfishness of those who do not comply as they are de facto the ones responsible for the spreading of the virus more than those who follow the rules
Interesting seat for an ex MP or two.
Doing things as simple as this - being interviewed with his country's flag behind him - is exactly the sort of thing he should be doing more of.
The fact it's triggered unreconstructed metropolitan Lefties like Michael Crick - who thinks it's akin to a BNP rally if there's too many of them - being a clear sign of the problem:
https://twitter.com/PaulEmbery/status/1346153400476573698?s=19
I like to think politicians have special suits which include collapsable poles which erect a flaf 4ft behind them and 2ft to the left.
Thus must explain why Boris keeps having at least 4 flags behind him - escalation.
https://twitter.com/Suffolklord/status/1346164368107593731?s=20
We are never getting out. Ever.
The idea that these vaccines will set us free is flawed.
FTR, its about 12 weeks to clocks changing.
That's a very, very long drag.
I really can't work it out.
What he actually says is sensible enough, and he seems to have some degree of control of, that worst of all things for leaders, his own party.
The only thing I can think of that'd fit was that he's, late in the day, realised what a shower Labour are. I don't see it, but it's my only theory.
Anyone have anything better? I presume we all see the hesitancy?
https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/scottish-independence/ian-murray-union-flag-jacket-photo-result-few-ciders-glastonbury-1375948
This shouldn't be controversial. It represents the country you aspire to govern.
If you hate it, and the flag that represents it, then why would voters trust you to govern it?
Starmer knows he cannot win on Brexit. Even if it turns out to be a disaster (which I very much doubt), being seen as the doomonger or naysayer is counter productive. If you know you cannot win the trick is to avoid the battle. Everyone but paid up Europhiles can see that.
I think I got myself into a bit of a pickle in the last thread. In trying to respond to a specific challenge and using simplistic responses for brevity I dug myself into a hole.
I don't think the EU is particularly democratic nor the UK as I would like to see either of them, but equally they are not totally undemocratic either. Both having different strengths and weaknesses.
All I wanted to do is point out that it is nonsense to categorize one as democratic and the other not. They have different systems with different strengths, but in particular different weaknesses.
I suspect @Richard_Tyndall we probably don't disagree much, but you responded to my simplistic response to a nonsense post (not yours) and I wouldn't disagree with any of your assertions in response to my posts which were made to make a simple point to just point out differences.
Made worse by the comment 'Yet more bollocks'. Don't mind being told I am talking bollocks. It was the 'yet more' that flabbergasted me as it was my first post so I was paranoid about what previous bollocks I posted?
Still think the Union would be safe if this was the flag - would even the Scots want to leave a nation this badass?
Also, don't forget that Blair had a team that spoke to the various parts of the Labour coalition, including Brown, Prescott, Donald Dewar and Cook.
So he both had a close knit team all singing from the same hymn sheet *and* they were each capable of taking that message to the right part of the Labour consistency and bringing them along with them (Dewar/Brown - Scottish Labour, Prescott - WWC/union voters and Middle England - Blair).
No government and no population would promote, or stand for, endless lockdowns.
If there's a vaccine in the offing (and there are numerous) then it's clearly worth containing the virus until people can be vaccinated. If there was no possibility of a vaccine, other strategies (better treatments, herd immunity) would be pursued; the same would apply in the extremely unlikely event that the virus can mutate and resist vaccines faster than we can develop them.
You seem to think that lockdowns are being used as some sinsister form of population control by the government. But they are not, they really aren't.
If he's getting this stressed when he has no responsibility for anything...
They will notice the flag. But only if it's consistent and part of a trend (Starmer has a habit of one-offs).
https://twitter.com/Keir_Starmer/status/1346137101302194177?s=20
Personally, I see in Johnson a stuttering clown, but over 15 million voters see fluency and vision, which is key.
Starmer appears neither fluent, nor visionary.
Straw and Blunkett particularly. Sure, Dewar and Prescott spoke to certain constituencies, but I could imagine 100s of Conservative Associations selecting Straw and Blunkett as Conservative MPs. Such was their sensible positioning and flawless comms.
Have a look at this story and a think about the ludicrous nonsense about underoccupied ICU beds you have been touting recently.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-essex-55531589
Ashamed at all?
Politicians are not brilliant and machiavellian. They are simple folk who couldn't get decent jobs, who run in terror of their electorate or selectorate (see members of the Republican party in the US for an example of this).
They want one thing: no not utter control of the populace, but to be re-elected, and to climb the greasy poll.
At every stage, they will do what the focus groups tell them will lead to them being most popular. Hence have some money to dine out. Hence open for Christmas. Hence allowing (and even encouraging) people to have summer holidays in Covid hotspots.
More restrictions are popular right now with most of the population. Why? Because people are scared and hospitals are filling. The politicians are followers, not leaders. They do what they are told will make them more popular.
And this is why your contention is deranged: do you really think that - as death rates and hospitalisations come down - it won't be a vote winner to remove restrictions?
I miss Ed M. Remember the Ed Stone? What a time to be alive that was.
https://twitter.com/MichaelLCrick/status/1346172370927689729?s=20
https://twitter.com/ShehabKhan/status/1346136159576055810?s=20
The really plain, generic font, which just seemed out of place on a 7ft slab.
And that Labour got fined for not declaring its costs properly.
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-37760562
Pretty naff, but its all about selling a product
We don't need a large Union Jack, sagging limply in the background, to improve our attention.
And there is no way SKS can beat Boris in flag envy.
The duct tape on the floor across the parquet and carpet is an extra classy touch...
Although I think mass immigration is a bad idea, I wouldn't say I was patriotic or proud to be English, even less that British is best or any such nonsense. Cringe tastic really. Maybe he always has a Union Jack in his office like that, I wouldn't know, but it seems so obviously staged,
I know to many people it may seem silly to have got emotional over Ed’s resignation, but it wasn’t anything like the reaction to Zayn Malik leaving One Direction, as some have carelessly compared it. We’d had the chance to have this amazing person as prime minister: a chance for equality, a chance for change, a chance for someone who truly cared about the people to lead them. To watch our country waste that chance and to see someone who had worked so unbelievably hard and was so deserving lose was utterly devastating. I don’t know when I’m going to get over that feeling of loss, that sick, hollow feeling in my stomach, when I think about what could have been. Ed Miliband was the best prime minister we never had.
It’s a flag. Nobody normal cares. Only frothers on both the right and the left care enough to comment.
Fewer flags, not less, shirley?
“[Arsene Wenger] likes having the ball, playing football, passes. It’s like an orchestra, but it is a silent song. I like heavy metal more. I always want it loud.”
https://www.standard.co.uk/sport/football/arsenal-play-football-like-an-orchestra-but-i-prefer-heavy-metal-jurgen-klopp-8920540.html
Johnson owns the Union flag! We may soon no longer own a Union, but he will still own the flag!