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The loneliness of the long-distance leader – politicalbetting.com

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  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,205
    Gov't best not postpone the London mayoral elections again.

    RUnning club whatsapp reckons Boris will come and personally put the bins out if we hit tier 7.
  • Didn't Boris Johnson say back last March/April every child would have the appropriate kit to be schooled from home?

    https://twitter.com/ayestotheright/status/1346163145916751876
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
    Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
    I expect the Euros to be cancelled
    Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.

    If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
    Many, many people think like Big G sadly.

    The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.

    Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.

  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,165
    edited January 2021

    HYUFD said:

    The organisational theme in the article is important ; who provides that help is important too, though. A key problem for Starmer is that many of those who do have this organisational experience are not going to provide Starmer with the political route to power ; the electorate is not waiting for 1997 reassurances on Labour, but something quite different. His main problem in that respect is that figures from the 1960s and '70s Soft Left with governmental experience are long since dead.

    Lord Hattersley is still alive I believe aged 88 and he was a Minister in Wilson and Callaghan's governments
    Not at an age to serve, though, really ; he also went somewhat native in the early part of the Blair years, as I remember, but then pursued a more independent stance reminiscent of the '60s.
    Last time I saw Roy (at the Edinburgh book festival a couple of years ago), he was frail, as you would expect for a man of fairly advanced years. Still managed to do a full hour, including a Q and A, he did have to have a sit down though.
    I've always quite liked him. He was a bit swept over and intimidated by New Labour for a while, but then gave a more honest account of things.
  • Alphabet_SoupAlphabet_Soup Posts: 3,263
    edited January 2021
    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    They will definitely be held in May even if all postal, if the US can hold its Presidential and Congressional elections in November the local elections will definitely go ahead in May.

    The District and London elections have already been delayed one year, they cannot possibly be delayed again, already large numbers of council seats are vacant because of postponed by elections
    They can't be made all-postal at the last minute. The decision needs to be made ahead of time - probably also with some thought to enabling campaigning that doesn't involve leaflet deliveries.

    Surprised they haven't announced that in Scotland already. They've given themselves the option of postponing the Holyrood election by six months.
    Don't see why you cannot still leaflet deliver, if you can still get post you can get leaflets still
    Because you might just get clobbered by someone keen to socially distance their garden path. People generally cut their postie and milkman some slack. Not politicos.
    Huh? What does that mean socially distance their garden path?
    It means people might resent unnecessary intrusions onto their property when they're hiding from the plague.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,096
    edited January 2021
    Good lad....although I think most of the dad's would prefer Mrs Wicks took the classes.
  • HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    They will definitely be held in May even if all postal, if the US can hold its Presidential and Congressional elections in November the local elections will definitely go ahead in May.

    The District and London elections have already been delayed one year, they cannot possibly be delayed again, already large numbers of council seats are vacant because of postponed by elections
    They can't be made all-postal at the last minute. The decision needs to be made ahead of time - probably also with some thought to enabling campaigning that doesn't involve leaflet deliveries.

    Surprised they haven't announced that in Scotland already. They've given themselves the option of postponing the Holyrood election by six months.
    Don't see why you cannot still leaflet deliver, if you can still get post you can get leaflets still
    The more letter boxes you touch the more likely you will spread the virus.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,697
    The small version of the thumbnail photo makes it look like he's wearing an evening dress.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,128
    edited January 2021

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    They will definitely be held in May even if all postal, if the US can hold its Presidential and Congressional elections in November the local elections will definitely go ahead in May.

    The District and London elections have already been delayed one year, they cannot possibly be delayed again, already large numbers of council seats are vacant because of postponed by elections
    They can't be made all-postal at the last minute. The decision needs to be made ahead of time - probably also with some thought to enabling campaigning that doesn't involve leaflet deliveries.

    Surprised they haven't announced that in Scotland already. They've given themselves the option of postponing the Holyrood election by six months.
    Don't see why you cannot still leaflet deliver, if you can still get post you can get leaflets still
    The more letter boxes you touch the more likely you will spread the virus.
    Less so if you deliver with gloves and use hand sanitiser and posties and delivery vans are still allowed to deliver to umpteen letterboxes
  • Good lad....although I think most of the dad's would prefer Mrs Wicks took the classes.
    Indeed, plus he's responsible making by body ache in places I didn't know existed.

    Oh get your minds out of the gutter you perverts.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,883
    Not sure the point of this to be honest. I'm sure she has been punished enough in the court of public opinion. What's a fine going to add here?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,128

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
    Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
    I expect the Euros to be cancelled
    Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.

    If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
    Many, many people think like Big G sadly.

    The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.

    Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.

    I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.

    However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,706
    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
    Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
    I expect the Euros to be cancelled
    Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.

    If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form unless they have a pre existing condition.
    Oh dear, I agree with HYUFD, I fear this is a first for me.
  • HYUFD said:

    The organisational theme in the article is important ; who provides that help is important too, though. A key problem for Starmer is that many of those who do have this organisational experience are not going to provide Starmer with the political route to power ; the electorate is not waiting for 1997 reassurances on Labour, but something quite different. His main problem in that respect is that figures from the 1960s and '70s Soft Left with governmental experience are long since dead.

    Lord Hattersley is still alive I believe aged 88 and he was a Minister in Wilson and Callaghan's governments
    Not at an age to serve, though, really ; he also went somewhat native in the early part of the Blair years, as I remember, but then pursued a more independent stance reminiscent of the '60s.
    Last time I saw Roy (at the Edinburgh book festival a couple of years ago), he was frail, as you would expect for a man of fairly advanced years. Still managed to do a full hour, including a Q and A, he did have to have a sit down though.
    I've always quite liked him. He was a bit swept over and intimidated by New Labour for a while, but then gave a more honest account of things.
    He's always great at the Book Festival, very knowledgable, great anecdotes, sharp as a tack even heading towards 90. Last time he said he'd seen Menzies Campbell on the way in, who'd bet him he couldn't last the whole hour standing up, and he was reluctant to take a seat and lose the bet.

    Also, my old boss had been a teacher in inner London in the late 70s/early 80s. Was at an election hustings at the school when the National Front turned up, and things got a bit edgy. Claimed Hattersley jumped off the stage and decked one of them.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,992

    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    They will definitely be held in May even if all postal, if the US can hold its Presidential and Congressional elections in November the local elections will definitely go ahead in May.

    The District and London elections have already been delayed one year, they cannot possibly be delayed again, already large numbers of council seats are vacant because of postponed by elections
    They can't be made all-postal at the last minute. The decision needs to be made ahead of time - probably also with some thought to enabling campaigning that doesn't involve leaflet deliveries.

    Surprised they haven't announced that in Scotland already. They've given themselves the option of postponing the Holyrood election by six months.
    Don't see why you cannot still leaflet deliver, if you can still get post you can get leaflets still
    Because you might just get clobbered by someone keen to socially distance their garden path. People generally cut their postie and milkman some slack. Not politicos.
    Huh? What does that mean socially distance their garden path?
    It means people might resent unnecessary intrusions onto their property when they're hiding from the plague.
    These are exactly the sort of people who need election literature. Or indeed any literature. Or even a working BBC news channel.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited January 2021

    The small version of the thumbnail photo makes it look like he's wearing an evening dress.
    And it's all done in the best POSSIBLE taste!


  • They forgot "a Covid-positive, can-do attitude".
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,364
    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    MaxPB said:

    The EU’s attempts at securing more doses of the only COVID-19 vaccine it has authorised come amid concern in some capitals that a separate German order for the same shot might compete with broader supplies for the 27-country bloc.

    Germany said on Monday that it had agreed with BioNTech last September to supply an additional 30 million doses on a bilateral basis........

    The bilateral German deal predates by two months the EU contract for the BioNTech/Pfizer vaccine that was signed in November after talks that had been going on at least since July.


    https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-health-coronavirus-eu-pfizer-idUKKBN2991WF?taid=5ff353405b2aa000013649c0&utm_campaign=trueAnthem:+Trending+Content&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter

    The whole EU scheme is such a fucking disaster. One of my italian colleagues is worried that his family back home will be waiting until the end of the year to get jabbed while he'll get it by the end of June.
    It is spicily ironic that probably the single best example of why the EU is a mess and it is maybe best to leave, has come at the moment we finally leave, more than four years after the vote.
    Though it isn't much of an example, except in the wet dreams of Brexiteers who are oh so desperate to find something positive about the stupidity known as Brexit. The only reason why UK has any advantage is because we had a very good regulatory body (MHRA) that managed, through it's very good relationship with the pharma sector to speed up regulatory approval. The MHRA was widely recognised in the EU as the regulatory model and it followed EU safety and efficacy protocols that it helped to design when evaluating the approval process. That speedy response would still have happened (sorry to disappoint you) had we still been members of the EU. Also we have been helped by having a very strong pharma industry in the UK, including AZ domiciled here. It chose to be domiciled here at the time, partly because it's part UK heritage, but also because we were part of the EU.

    Bozo and his team of lightweights will no doubt try to pick up any reflected glory that they can steal from the scientists who developed the vaccines, but there has been zero benefit to the UK in our recent retreat from engagement with the EU.

    You will need to keep looking for a benefit for Brexit. Good luck because even Bozo himself could not think of any genuine benefits when recently asked by Andrew Marr.
    What have vaccine delivery contracts got to do with the MHRA?
    "Look - squirrel!"

    To be fair, the EU vaccine initiative was exactly the kind of thing that the EU is worst at - in a rapidly changing environment, in an emergency, stopping the big powers doing their own thing.

    What the EU is best at is a common, slowly agreed, set of rules for a relatively static environment.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    malcolmg said:

    Floater said:

    Following on from the story TSE linked to about Colchester hospital

    Just been hearing its pretty grim capacity wise right now and the docs around when the arseholes tried to "prove" they were empty might have been a little bit annoyed with their unwanted guests and might have made that pretty clear........

    My local NHS area Ayrshire and Arran are running at 96% capacity for covid today
    I'm told Colchester has no ICU capacity left and patients are being sent elsewhere for that
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,992
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    They will definitely be held in May even if all postal, if the US can hold its Presidential and Congressional elections in November the local elections will definitely go ahead in May.

    The District and London elections have already been delayed one year, they cannot possibly be delayed again, already large numbers of council seats are vacant because of postponed by elections
    They can't be made all-postal at the last minute. The decision needs to be made ahead of time - probably also with some thought to enabling campaigning that doesn't involve leaflet deliveries.

    Surprised they haven't announced that in Scotland already. They've given themselves the option of postponing the Holyrood election by six months.
    Don't see why you cannot still leaflet deliver, if you can still get post you can get leaflets still
    The more letter boxes you touch the more likely you will spread the virus.
    Less so if you deliver with gloves and use hand sanitaser and posties and delivery vans are still allowed to deliver to umpteen letterboxes
    I need to find some hand sanitaser.

    Perhaps we are getting an insight into how @Dura_Ace buggered up his wrist.
  • Thinking of other much missed Corbynistas, what's Chris 'wingnut' Williamson up to these days?
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,851

    This perfectly captures Johnson's cheerful, unashamed opportunism.
    True but it's also giving Sturgeon undeserved credit.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    They will definitely be held in May even if all postal, if the US can hold its Presidential and Congressional elections in November the local elections will definitely go ahead in May.

    The District and London elections have already been delayed one year, they cannot possibly be delayed again, already large numbers of council seats are vacant because of postponed by elections
    They can't be made all-postal at the last minute. The decision needs to be made ahead of time - probably also with some thought to enabling campaigning that doesn't involve leaflet deliveries.

    Surprised they haven't announced that in Scotland already. They've given themselves the option of postponing the Holyrood election by six months.
    Don't see why you cannot still leaflet deliver, if you can still get post you can get leaflets still
    Because you might just get clobbered by someone keen to socially distance their garden path. People generally cut their postie and milkman some slack. Not politicos.
    Huh? What does that mean socially distance their garden path?
    Geroff my land! Maybe?
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Didn't Boris Johnson say back last March/April every child would have the appropriate kit to be schooled from home?

    https://twitter.com/ayestotheright/status/1346163145916751876

    Why given instead of lent?
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300
    Adagio: Sehr feierlich und sehr langsam

    Boris Johnson will follow that introduction.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,355

    malcolmg said:

    Carnyx said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
    ISTR they were postponed for a whole year because the government in London wanted to use that slot for its own elections. I think when the fixed term act was brought in? Memory is a bit dim on that.
    Be excellent for Independence if Westminster try to postpone the election. One can but hope they really are that stupid.
    Nicola will be the one cancelling it not Westminster
    If she does she is finished.
  • My 10,000th post is going to be held back for something truly momentous coming to pass....
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,882
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    They will definitely be held in May even if all postal, if the US can hold its Presidential and Congressional elections in November the local elections will definitely go ahead in May.

    The District and London elections have already been delayed one year, they cannot possibly be delayed again, already large numbers of council seats are vacant because of postponed by elections
    They can't be made all-postal at the last minute. The decision needs to be made ahead of time - probably also with some thought to enabling campaigning that doesn't involve leaflet deliveries.

    Surprised they haven't announced that in Scotland already. They've given themselves the option of postponing the Holyrood election by six months.
    Don't see why you cannot still leaflet deliver, if you can still get post you can get leaflets still
    The more letter boxes you touch the more likely you will spread the virus.
    Less so if you deliver with gloves and use hand sanitaser and posties and delivery vans are still allowed to deliver to umpteen letterboxes
    That sort of thing goes straight in the recycling bin outside the door Like fish fingers, I don't know where it's been, andf I don't need to read it to know what the Scons think. Or indeed any other party.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,218
    edited January 2021
    kle4 said:

    kinabalu said:

    kle4 said:

    kle4 said:

    Jesus Christ...I have just stumbled across this...these people must be in a permanent state of offended by everything, everyone, everywhere...

    https://twitter.com/Abebab/status/1311589200773480449?s=19

    I'm unable to grasp what their proposed solution is to the problem they have identified. Oh, there's a lot of words about what needs doing, but I couldn't really follow it.

    Thankfully I did history, and there's no concerns about cultural or structural issues there.
    Apparently worship of the written word is an example of white supremacy culture in academia.

    https://twitter.com/uche_blackstock/status/1213063328572092416

    https://twitter.com/uche_blackstock/status/1213619207868440576
    I can't say I worhsip those written words because I'm baffled - pefectionism and inidividualism are characteristics of white supremacy culture? Is there some wider context that makes that less insulting to non-white people?
    There is a context, yes. But also it isn't prima facie insulting to non-white people because perfectionism and individualism are not slam dunk positive qualities. Both can be toxic. In fact if you just immediately assume that these 2 things ARE necessarily virtues you are providing some credence to the narrative you and so many others are so keen to lampoon.
    I wasn't lampooning them, I asked a question because whether they are virtues or not - and whilst both can be toxic, so can virutally anything, so that means nothing - I am confused at the idea they must be white supremacy characteristics. The perceived insult I saw was not that they are always positive - though I do think more positive than not - but because I was confused at the idea that as a positive or negative they are predominantly white.

    I asked for context precisely because I assumed there was more to it than merely the tweet, so up yours for assuming it was lampooning - why did you jump to that conclusion when my words said nothing of the kind?

    How is someone supposed to ask for context, if they get insulted for doing so?
    I disagree that virtually all characteristics are ambiguous and can be toxic. There are lots that can only be positive. Bet we could list a few in no time. And to be very very precise - like you always are, it's your USP - I meant that I sensed you were prepping for a lampoon, not that you were already doing one. IE that given the right response you would be going for it. A jolly good lampooning of some woke.

    Not so, you are saying. So my apologies for that. But it's not really the point. Point is, you said that classing individualism and perfectionism as white traits seems on the face of it - i.e. without further context - to be insulting to non-whites. And I make the point back that you are therefore inherently assuming those traits to be positive - when it is at the very least arguable - and thus giving some credence to the narrative you were seeking context on.

    That's where we are. And it could easily be where we'll finish. In fact it probably ought to be. But it was a worthwhile exchange.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,601

    This article details some of the contingency plans for the Holyrood election that the Scottish Parliament have considered:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-54973251

    Nicola just writes out random results of her choice on a blackboard?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,381
    ydoethur said:
    To be fair Ferrier was much, much worse, oh and Cummings is exempt from prosecution, because he is/was/ will be very important.
  • Pulpstar said:

    Why is Boris constantly listening to the Shapps and the Williamsons in the cabinet ?!

    Why was Winston constantly listening to the Brackens and the Beaverbrooks in HIS cabinet?

    One of the few ways that Johnson is actually similar to Churchill - they both loved circus tents and echo chambers.
  • fox327fox327 Posts: 370
    RobD said:

    HYUFD said:

    already large numbers of council seats are vacant because of postponed by elections

    Who cares?
    It's an interesting question. How many vacant seats is acceptable. 5%, 10%.. 50%?
    There were no elections to the Parliament of Lebanon from 1972 to 1992. That parliament must have become very out of date, unrepresentative and tired. I think that the parliaments, legislatures, committees, and boards of directors and governors of society do matter, and need to be renewed despite the epidemic.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,421

    My 10,000th post is going to be held back for something truly momentous coming to pass....

    The irony being, you used it to announce you wouldn’t be using it...
  • dr_spyn said:

    Adagio: Sehr feierlich und sehr langsam

    Boris Johnson will follow that introduction.

    "In this grave hour..."
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,355
    ydoethur said:

    malcolmg said:

    Carnyx said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
    ISTR they were postponed for a whole year because the government in London wanted to use that slot for its own elections. I think when the fixed term act was brought in? Memory is a bit dim on that.
    Be excellent for Independence if Westminster try to postpone the election. One can but hope they really are that stupid.
    Nicola will be the one cancelling it not Westminster
    I doubt if she can without a vote in Westminster.
    Don't be a silly boy
  • Charles said:

    Didn't Boris Johnson say back last March/April every child would have the appropriate kit to be schooled from home?

    https://twitter.com/ayestotheright/status/1346163145916751876

    Why given instead of lent?
    Lent works as well, but the PM has lied once again.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,882
    edited January 2021

    Not sure the point of this to be honest. I'm sure she has been punished enough in the court of public opinion. What's a fine going to add here?
    Well, PS are enforcing the law - by advice, admonition, and where it is considered necessary by prosecution. Edit: I know they are doing it locally, and AramintaMoonbeam reports it in her part of the Borders as well.

    Is a MP above the law?

    Edit: you mean "what would a fine add here?" Charged, not convicted yet.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,766

    Bollocks. I miscounted...

    Whoops!
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,992
    ydoethur said:

    My 10,000th post is going to be held back for something truly momentous coming to pass....

    The irony being, you used it to announce you wouldn’t be using it...
    Dear god man you're a bit wound up. Just sit back and appreciate the artistry.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
    Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
    I expect the Euros to be cancelled
    Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.

    If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
    Many, many people think like Big G sadly.

    The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.

    Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.

    I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.

    However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
    Surely all big G has to do is make sure he stays in his bubble, stays indoors or local and doesn't meet any strangers. Then get the vaccine.

    Don;t see why the rest of the country needs to be locked down to achieve that.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,208
    Leon said:

    MaxPB said:

    The EU’s attempts at securing more doses of the only COVID-19 vaccine it has authorised come amid concern in some capitals that a separate German order for the same shot might compete with broader supplies for the 27-country bloc.

    Germany said on Monday that it had agreed with BioNTech last September to supply an additional 30 million doses on a bilateral basis........

    The bilateral German deal predates by two months the EU contract for the BioNTech/Pfizer vaccine that was signed in November after talks that had been going on at least since July.


    https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-health-coronavirus-eu-pfizer-idUKKBN2991WF?taid=5ff353405b2aa000013649c0&utm_campaign=trueAnthem:+Trending+Content&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter

    The whole EU scheme is such a fucking disaster. One of my italian colleagues is worried that his family back home will be waiting until the end of the year to get jabbed while he'll get it by the end of June.
    It is spicily ironic that probably the single best example of why the EU is a mess and it is maybe best to leave, has come at the moment we finally leave, more than four years after the vote.
    Strangely, I agree with you. The EU is slooooow. This is one of the times where speed is of the essence.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,697

    dr_spyn said:

    Adagio: Sehr feierlich und sehr langsam

    Boris Johnson will follow that introduction.

    "In this grave hour..."
    "I have to tell you now that no such undertaking has been received, and that consequently this country is at war with coronavirus..."
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,992
    edited January 2021
    isam said:
    As the LotO has supported the government in every single vote I'm amazed it is that high.
  • isam said:
    BIg drop right at the end of year among Labour voters for Starmer. Looks like voting for the deal.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,355

    Not sure the point of this to be honest. I'm sure she has been punished enough in the court of public opinion. What's a fine going to add here?
    Pretty pathetic given the amount of bigwigs that have got away with it.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,883
    Carnyx said:

    Not sure the point of this to be honest. I'm sure she has been punished enough in the court of public opinion. What's a fine going to add here?
    Well, PS are enforcing the law - by advice, admonition, and where it is considered necessary by prosecution. Edit: I know they are doing it locally, and AramintaMoonbeam reports it in her part of the Borders as well.

    Is a MP above the law?
    No, but I am wondering whether she would have been charged if she wasn't an MSP. Just to confirm btw, that I am not SNP or Scottish or live in Scotland, so I don't think I can be accused of bias, i hope....
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,218

    kinabalu said:

    The organisational theme in the article is important ; who provides that help is important too, though. A key problem for Starmer is that many of those who do have this organisational experience are not going to provide Starmer with the political route to power ; the electorate is not waiting for 1997 reassurances on Labour, but something quite different. His main problem in that respect is that figures from the 1960s and '70s Soft Left with governmental experience are long since dead.

    It's a good piece from Richard but it is also yet one more example of a popular PB oeuvre - suggestions of what Labour needs to do to win an election from posters who will not be voting Labour.

    I think we are on a promise from Casino for another one soon.
    Except that Richard is one of those ex-Tories who is disillusioned with the direction of the party that used to be known as Conservative. There will be many such people that Starmer will need to persuade to lend their vote to him, or perhaps vote LD or just stay at home. This was how Blair was successful. He managed to convince many moderate Tories that he was not a threat. I suspect that many people stayed loyal to the blue brand at the last election because team Corbyn was even more terrifying than the prospect of a joke government under Bozo.

    On your last point I think you may be forgiven for completely ignoring any views from Casino !
    Yes, fair enough. It was a cheapish comment born from peevishness. I have retracted. More the merrier as regards ideas on what Labour needs to do.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,992
    malcolmg said:

    Not sure the point of this to be honest. I'm sure she has been punished enough in the court of public opinion. What's a fine going to add here?
    Pretty pathetic given the amount of bigwigs that have got away with it.
    Have to agree here. It shouldn't have come to criminality.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,421
    TOPPING said:

    ydoethur said:

    My 10,000th post is going to be held back for something truly momentous coming to pass....

    The irony being, you used it to announce you wouldn’t be using it...
    Dear god man you're a bit wound up. Just sit back and appreciate the artistry.
    I know my punning skills are truly awesome but I don’t quite qualify as a ‘god man.’
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,882

    Carnyx said:

    Not sure the point of this to be honest. I'm sure she has been punished enough in the court of public opinion. What's a fine going to add here?
    Well, PS are enforcing the law - by advice, admonition, and where it is considered necessary by prosecution. Edit: I know they are doing it locally, and AramintaMoonbeam reports it in her part of the Borders as well.

    Is a MP above the law?
    No, but I am wondering whether she would have been charged if she wasn't an MSP. Just to confirm btw, that I am not SNP or Scottish or live in Scotland, so I don't think I can be accused of bias, i hope....
    She's not a MSP to be pedantic. But I see what you mean and I don't think so.
  • HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
    Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
    I expect the Euros to be cancelled
    Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.

    If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
    Many, many people think like Big G sadly.

    The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.

    Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.

    I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.

    However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
    Surely all big G has to do is make sure he stays in his bubble, stays indoors or local and doesn't meet any strangers. Then get the vaccine.

    Don;t see why the rest of the country needs to be locked down to achieve that.
    People in their 90s and 80s rely upon daily contact with normal people for care. Even if they're not in a care home, they will have regular at home care visits.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    ...

    isam said:
    BIg drop right at the end of year among Labour voters for Starmer. Looks like voting for the deal.
    I had put that down to getting rid of Corbyn
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,601

    Bollocks. I miscounted...

    There's always 20,000....
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,165
    edited January 2021
    isam said:

    ...

    isam said:
    BIg drop right at the end of year among Labour voters for Starmer. Looks like voting for the deal.
    I had put that down to getting rid of Corbyn
    Given the dates on the survey and the extent of the drop, it could be the combined effect of both. I've thought and mentioned before that those have seemed to me his first two unforced errors in an otherwise great year.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,992
    ydoethur said:

    TOPPING said:

    ydoethur said:

    My 10,000th post is going to be held back for something truly momentous coming to pass....

    The irony being, you used it to announce you wouldn’t be using it...
    Dear god man you're a bit wound up. Just sit back and appreciate the artistry.
    I know my punning skills are truly awesome but I don’t quite qualify as a ‘god man.’
    @Scrapheap_as_was is obviously too modest to point out his construction.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,883
    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Not sure the point of this to be honest. I'm sure she has been punished enough in the court of public opinion. What's a fine going to add here?
    Well, PS are enforcing the law - by advice, admonition, and where it is considered necessary by prosecution. Edit: I know they are doing it locally, and AramintaMoonbeam reports it in her part of the Borders as well.

    Is a MP above the law?
    No, but I am wondering whether she would have been charged if she wasn't an MSP. Just to confirm btw, that I am not SNP or Scottish or live in Scotland, so I don't think I can be accused of bias, i hope....
    She's not a MSP to be pedantic. But I see what you mean and I don't think so.
    apologies, MP.
  • They forgot "a Covid-positive, can-do attitude".
    British Triumph
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,208
    It's grim out there, but there might a straw to clutch onto. The extremely high case rates (>1000 / 100 000/ week) in Essex and South Wales are stabilising or coming down, I think. If you do full lockdown and ignore all instructions from the fireplace salesman (forgotten his name) on keeping schools open you will probably get through to vaccines kicking in.

    I really hope so.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,421

    They forgot "a Covid-positive, can-do attitude".
    British Triumph
    A Triumph Snag?
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Charles said:

    Didn't Boris Johnson say back last March/April every child would have the appropriate kit to be schooled from home?

    https://twitter.com/ayestotheright/status/1346163145916751876

    Why given instead of lent?
    Lent works as well, but the PM has lied once again.
    Cynic that I am I would check what “access to a lapto, desktop or tablet means”.

    I suspect it could mean “exclusive access” to juice the numbers
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    edited January 2021

    Didn't Boris Johnson say back last March/April every child would have the appropriate kit to be schooled from home?

    https://twitter.com/ayestotheright/status/1346163145916751876

    Hire a skywriter to spell out lessons in the air. Expensive, sure, but you can reach a lot of people on clear days, so the costs scale up well.

    I've submitted the plan to the Minister, and am getting some encouraging noises.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,992

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
    Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
    I expect the Euros to be cancelled
    Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.

    If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
    Many, many people think like Big G sadly.

    The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.

    Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.

    I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.

    However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
    Surely all big G has to do is make sure he stays in his bubble, stays indoors or local and doesn't meet any strangers. Then get the vaccine.

    Don;t see why the rest of the country needs to be locked down to achieve that.
    People in their 90s and 80s rely upon daily contact with normal people for care. Even if they're not in a care home, they will have regular at home care visits.
    And over a million of them have been vaccinated so far with more every day.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    Ok, she can carry the glock, but why is she taking her family into Congress such that they need to be protected from it?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,421
    FF43 said:

    It's grim out there, but there might a straw to clutch onto. The extremely high case rates (>1000 / 100 000/ week) in Essex and South Wales are stabilising or coming down, I think. If you do full lockdown and ignore all instructions from the fireplace salesman (forgotten his name) on keeping schools open you will probably get through to vaccines kicking in.

    I really hope so.

    Mr DisgracedNational SecurityRisk.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,355
    edited January 2021
    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Not sure the point of this to be honest. I'm sure she has been punished enough in the court of public opinion. What's a fine going to add here?
    Well, PS are enforcing the law - by advice, admonition, and where it is considered necessary by prosecution. Edit: I know they are doing it locally, and AramintaMoonbeam reports it in her part of the Borders as well.

    Is a MP above the law?
    No, but I am wondering whether she would have been charged if she wasn't an MSP. Just to confirm btw, that I am not SNP or Scottish or live in Scotland, so I don't think I can be accused of bias, i hope....
    She's not a MSP to be pedantic. But I see what you mean and I don't think so.
    Wonder if plod need to arrest Charles now, given he travelled to Scotland breaking the rules having tested positive for Covid and his minions infected half the local people.
    No doubt it will be the usual one rule for us and arrest the plebs.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486
    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
    Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
    I expect the Euros to be cancelled
    Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.

    If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form unless they have a pre existing condition.
    Yes, this is getting utterly ridiculous now: PBers ‘cancelling’ events that are five or six months in the future. There is a limit to this, there has to be.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,883
    Carnyx said:

    Not sure the point of this to be honest. I'm sure she has been punished enough in the court of public opinion. What's a fine going to add here?
    Well, PS are enforcing the law - by advice, admonition, and where it is considered necessary by prosecution. Edit: I know they are doing it locally, and AramintaMoonbeam reports it in her part of the Borders as well.

    Is a MP above the law?

    Edit: you mean "what would a fine add here?" Charged, not convicted yet.
    ok
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126

    Carnyx said:

    Not sure the point of this to be honest. I'm sure she has been punished enough in the court of public opinion. What's a fine going to add here?
    Well, PS are enforcing the law - by advice, admonition, and where it is considered necessary by prosecution. Edit: I know they are doing it locally, and AramintaMoonbeam reports it in her part of the Borders as well.

    Is a MP above the law?
    No, but I am wondering whether she would have been charged if she wasn't an MSP. Just to confirm btw, that I am not SNP or Scottish or live in Scotland, so I don't think I can be accused of bias, i hope....
    I thought at the time it looked like an apology or fine situation. I suppose in terms of public interest they might argue her position makes it particularly egregious.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126

    Bollocks. I miscounted...

    You'll get other opportunities. Trust me.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,882
    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
    Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
    I expect the Euros to be cancelled
    Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.

    If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
    Many, many people think like Big G sadly.

    The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.

    Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.

    I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.

    However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
    Surely all big G has to do is make sure he stays in his bubble, stays indoors or local and doesn't meet any strangers. Then get the vaccine.

    Don;t see why the rest of the country needs to be locked down to achieve that.
    People in their 90s and 80s rely upon daily contact with normal people for care. Even if they're not in a care home, they will have regular at home care visits.
    And over a million of them have been vaccinated so far with more every day.
    Doesn't mean they don't have to be given some precautions. I'm coming to realise that people don't understand that this isn't 100% protection (whether for oneself or those whom one might infect). So it's not like having a polio or German measles jab in your childhood where you join the largely immunized and immune herd, but that we are startting from scratch.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,487

    Bollocks. I miscounted...

    Post of the year.
  • HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
    Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
    I expect the Euros to be cancelled
    Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.

    If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form unless they have a pre existing condition.
    Euros as in UEFA cup which is not just upto the UK but the whole of Europe including France
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,882
    malcolmg said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Not sure the point of this to be honest. I'm sure she has been punished enough in the court of public opinion. What's a fine going to add here?
    Well, PS are enforcing the law - by advice, admonition, and where it is considered necessary by prosecution. Edit: I know they are doing it locally, and AramintaMoonbeam reports it in her part of the Borders as well.

    Is a MP above the law?
    No, but I am wondering whether she would have been charged if she wasn't an MSP. Just to confirm btw, that I am not SNP or Scottish or live in Scotland, so I don't think I can be accused of bias, i hope....
    She's not a MSP to be pedantic. But I see what you mean and I don't think so.
    Wonder if plod need to arrest Charles now, given he travelled to Scotland breaking the rules having tested positive for Covid and his minions infected half the local people.
    No doubt it will be the usual one rule for us and arrest the plebs.
    I can't actually remember what the legal situation was at the time tbf. (And just in case anyone gets confused, this is not Charles of this PB parish.)
  • kinabalu said:

    The organisational theme in the article is important ; who provides that help is important too, though. A key problem for Starmer is that many of those who do have this organisational experience are not going to provide Starmer with the political route to power ; the electorate is not waiting for 1997 reassurances on Labour, but something quite different. His main problem in that respect is that figures from the 1960s and '70s Soft Left with governmental experience are long since dead.

    It's a good piece from Richard but it is also yet one more example of a popular PB oeuvre - suggestions of what Labour needs to do to win an election from posters who will not be voting Labour.

    I think we are on a promise from Casino for another one soon.
    Very fair point.
    A number of PB non Tories said that BJ would be an electoral and moral disaster, we were only half right.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,882

    Carnyx said:

    Not sure the point of this to be honest. I'm sure she has been punished enough in the court of public opinion. What's a fine going to add here?
    Well, PS are enforcing the law - by advice, admonition, and where it is considered necessary by prosecution. Edit: I know they are doing it locally, and AramintaMoonbeam reports it in her part of the Borders as well.

    Is a MP above the law?

    Edit: you mean "what would a fine add here?" Charged, not convicted yet.
    ok
    Just being pedantic - it did say 'charged' in that URL - but I am always very nervous about coimmenting on a live court case.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,992
    kle4 said:

    Ok, she can carry the glock, but why is she taking her family into Congress such that they need to be protected from it?
    Given the time of year I wonder if it's a Glock 7?
  • Didn't Boris Johnson say back last March/April every child would have the appropriate kit to be schooled from home?

    https://twitter.com/ayestotheright/status/1346163145916751876

    Governess, Boden kids' catalogue and tennis court in the garden?
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,798
    Charles said:

    Charles said:

    Didn't Boris Johnson say back last March/April every child would have the appropriate kit to be schooled from home?

    https://twitter.com/ayestotheright/status/1346163145916751876

    Why given instead of lent?
    Lent works as well, but the PM has lied once again.
    Cynic that I am I would check what “access to a lapto, desktop or tablet means”.

    I suspect it could mean “exclusive access” to juice the numbers
    Exclusive access is what matters, surely. Our three kids start online lessons tomorrow. Each kid has a full school day of online lessons. If they didn't have a laptop each that would be impossible.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,882
    FF43 said:

    It's grim out there, but there might a straw to clutch onto. The extremely high case rates (>1000 / 100 000/ week) in Essex and South Wales are stabilising or coming down, I think. If you do full lockdown and ignore all instructions from the fireplace salesman (forgotten his name) on keeping schools open you will probably get through to vaccines kicking in.

    I really hope so.

    If I lived in Essex I wouldn't want canvassers and leaflet distributors from any party coming to my door.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,766
    Well, I said yesterday that Johnson would end up doing a 5pm press conference to announce new national lockdown.

    I was wrong by 3 hours by looks of it.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126

    kinabalu said:

    The organisational theme in the article is important ; who provides that help is important too, though. A key problem for Starmer is that many of those who do have this organisational experience are not going to provide Starmer with the political route to power ; the electorate is not waiting for 1997 reassurances on Labour, but something quite different. His main problem in that respect is that figures from the 1960s and '70s Soft Left with governmental experience are long since dead.

    It's a good piece from Richard but it is also yet one more example of a popular PB oeuvre - suggestions of what Labour needs to do to win an election from posters who will not be voting Labour.

    I think we are on a promise from Casino for another one soon.
    Very fair point.
    A number of PB non Tories said that BJ would be an electoral and moral disaster, we were only half right.
    You know what they say: in the land of the never rights, the half rights are right. Or something.

    I'd consider voting Starmer, and the failure of the LDs to recover means Labour may be consolidating second places in areas they previously would not even get that.
  • HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
    Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
    I expect the Euros to be cancelled
    Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.

    If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
    Many, many people think like Big G sadly.

    The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.

    Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.

    I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.

    However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
    I am one of the lucky ones who is due a vaccine shortly and I am not afraid of going out

    However, I practice hands face space religiously unlike many others
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,992
    Carnyx said:

    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
    Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
    I expect the Euros to be cancelled
    Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.

    If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
    Many, many people think like Big G sadly.

    The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.

    Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.

    I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.

    However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
    Surely all big G has to do is make sure he stays in his bubble, stays indoors or local and doesn't meet any strangers. Then get the vaccine.

    Don;t see why the rest of the country needs to be locked down to achieve that.
    People in their 90s and 80s rely upon daily contact with normal people for care. Even if they're not in a care home, they will have regular at home care visits.
    And over a million of them have been vaccinated so far with more every day.
    Doesn't mean they don't have to be given some precautions. I'm coming to realise that people don't understand that this isn't 100% protection (whether for oneself or those whom one might infect). So it's not like having a polio or German measles jab in your childhood where you join the largely immunized and immune herd, but that we are startting from scratch.
    Well it's a cost benefit thing. If you have a jab and want to keep the nation locked down forever I would say that is erring on the side of caution.

    Then again with such risk aversion you would probably be staying at home anyway.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,165
    edited January 2021
    kle4 said:

    Ok, she can carry the glock, but why is she taking her family into Congress such that they need to be protected from it?

    There seems to be a strange phenomenon at the moment where rightwing women are often looking like the vanguard of American ultra- conservatism. Ketzel is another one. Trump's rally today was also organised by one of the new conservarive sisterhood, if I saw correctly from what was posted up from OANN. Maybe someone like Mindy Robinson with her semi-automatic rifle and Baywatch-Stepford glaze will be President in 2028.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,882
    TOPPING said:

    Carnyx said:

    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
    Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
    I expect the Euros to be cancelled
    Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.

    If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
    Many, many people think like Big G sadly.

    The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.

    Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.

    I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.

    However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
    Surely all big G has to do is make sure he stays in his bubble, stays indoors or local and doesn't meet any strangers. Then get the vaccine.

    Don;t see why the rest of the country needs to be locked down to achieve that.
    People in their 90s and 80s rely upon daily contact with normal people for care. Even if they're not in a care home, they will have regular at home care visits.
    And over a million of them have been vaccinated so far with more every day.
    Doesn't mean they don't have to be given some precautions. I'm coming to realise that people don't understand that this isn't 100% protection (whether for oneself or those whom one might infect). So it's not like having a polio or German measles jab in your childhood where you join the largely immunized and immune herd, but that we are startting from scratch.
    Well it's a cost benefit thing. If you have a jab and want to keep the nation locked down forever I would say that is erring on the side of caution.

    Then again with such risk aversion you would probably be staying at home anyway.
    Not really - it's just that one can't go out as if there was no risk till a fair number of folk had been immunised. Selfish to get the pox and take up a NHS bed, after all.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,208
    edited January 2021
    Good article. Against a government bankrupt of ideas and morals, I think Starmer has done a decent fist of setting himself up as an alternative with a moral purpose. He doesn't have any ideas either, that he is able or willing to articulate. He should make more use of Ed Miliband here. Miliband is hopeless at retail politics, but he is one of the best policymakers of recent times - to the extent the Conservatives have pinched most of his policies after first deriding them.

    Starmer also needs someone to work on presentation and communication, on where the Labour Party is heading and to attack the Conservatives on corruption and incompetence, which are their weakest points.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126


    There seems to be a strange phenomenon at the moment where it's rightwing women who are the vanguard in American politics. Trump's rally today was also organised by one of the new conservarive sisterhood, if I saw correctly from what was posted up from OANN. Maybe someone like Mindy Robinson with her semi-automatic rifle and Baywatch-Stepford glaze will be President in 2028.

    Good for the sisterhood, I guess. I have high hopes that one day when we hear that some extreme right/left winger has done something really crazy, our default mental picture will be blessedly gender neutral.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486
    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    FPT



    Has he told Drakeford

    It is obvious that no one -- least of all SKS -- tells Drakeford anything.

    The disparity between Starmer's proclamations & Drakeford's actions are so glaring that the only explanation is that Labour have completely forgotten that they are running Wales.

    Possibly Labour have been running Wales for so long, they just think it is the place where they can mooch around in flip-flops and nothing ever gets done there.

    It is very common. OGH was earlier fulminating about the folly of keeping the schools open.

    Apparently OGH is unaware that the last LibDem in power anywhere (darling Kirsty) is actually in charge of the Welsh education portfolio, and is busy keeping the schools in Wales open.

    I have given up expecting any consistency between what English Labour and LibDem politicians say, and what their representatives in the Welsh Government actually do.
    I totally agree and of course Kirsty, the Liberal Democrat, is the one in charge of schools but not for much longer thankfully
    Yes, dear, dim Kirsty will be gone, retiring.

    She will be going on to do whatever failed LibDems go on to do.

    Posting on pb.com, probably. :)
    I think BigG. was alluding to the new Conservative Ed. Sec. in Paul Davies' first cabinet. Not beyond the realms of probability.

    Starmer's defeat in Wales will not look good against a resurgent Johnson and the Conservatives nationally, post Brexit, and post vaccine.
    Any Labour defeat or more likely seats lost in Wales will be down to Drakeford, as poor performance for SLab in Scotland can be blamed on Leonard, both are Corbynites so not part of the Starmer project.

    Starmer however is likely to make gains in England though regardless, for example last time the county council seats were up in 2017 the Tories were 11% ahead, even with Deltapoll's post Deal poll today they are only 5% ahead. Labour are also likely to win big in London in both the Mayoral and Assembly polls
    They may not be held in may
    It must be within the realms of the possible that the Holyrood elex will be postponed
    Having it in the week of the Scotland v England match in the Euros would be ... interesting.
    I expect the Euros to be cancelled
    Oh for goodness sake BigG, shall we just cancel all human life for this year too and decide to shut ourselves up for the rest of the year already.

    If the vaccinations have not significantly reduced the case rate by Spring and lockdowns are still ongoing I expect the level of non compliance will start to rise, especially amongst the young, they are not going to accept being confined to their residences for the rest of their lives. That is especially the case given Covid is a disease of no real threat to the under 50s even in the mutant faster spreading form.
    Many, many people think like Big G sadly.

    The impact of these lock downs is being felt very, very unevenly.

    Some people have lost everything. Others barely affected. Some people have better lives.

    I can understand BigG not wanting to go out until Covid is basically eliminated, he is near his 8th decade and that is fair enough, he is being safe.

    However for others, especially the young who are more likely to work in hospitality which has been hit hard by lockdown and want to live their lives not be constrained by everlasting lockdowns for a disease of little risk to them then I agree it is a different story
    Surely all big G has to do is make sure he stays in his bubble, stays indoors or local and doesn't meet any strangers. Then get the vaccine.

    Don;t see why the rest of the country needs to be locked down to achieve that.
    People in their 90s and 80s rely upon daily contact with normal people for care. Even if they're not in a care home, they will have regular at home care visits.
    And over a million of them have been vaccinated so far with more every day.
    Indeed, which is why hitting the 15m priority group target quickly is so crucial. Thereafter risk segmentation is very viable.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,487

    tlg86 said:

    Oppositions don't win elections, governments lose them.

    Being dull and competent may well work, it has in the past.

    Examples?
    Attlee 1945.

    Wilson 1964.

    Major 1992 might be an inelegant example.
    I'd argue for the first two Labour definitely won those too.

    They had the more compelling positive vision. Same for 1997 as well.
This discussion has been closed.