8911 tests continuing the increase in testing shown all week and a new record amount. Very close to the 10k figure now if the rate of increase continues over the weekend it will be hit before the end of the week.
Given that the UK has left the EU, why would it participate anyway? It has clearly got its own scheme going on.
Have any of the EU initiatives got as far as Dyson ?
The UK would probably end up being a net contributer, as usual.
We'd end up with less ventilators than we started with but all the remainers would be threatening the collapse of the vital ventilator trade if we left.
Given that the UK has left the EU, why would it participate anyway? It has clearly got its own scheme going on.
Not really an either/or, is it? There is nothing at all to prevent participating in a joint procurement AND making own, additional arrangements (as other countries are doing).
Given that the UK has left the EU, why would it participate anyway? It has clearly got its own scheme going on.
Have any of the EU initiatives got as far as Dyson ?
The UK would probably end up being a net contributer, as usual.
We'd end up with less ventilators than we started with but all the remainers would be threatening the collapse of the vital ventilator trade if we left.
Given that the UK has left the EU, why would it participate anyway? It has clearly got its own scheme going on.
Not really an either/or, is it? There is nothing at all to prevent participating in a joint procurement AND making own, additional arrangements (as other countries are doing).
Given that the UK has left the EU, why would it participate anyway? It has clearly got its own scheme going on.
Have any of the EU initiatives got as far as Dyson ?
The UK would probably end up being a net contributer, as usual.
We'd end up with less ventilators than we started with but all the remainers would be threatening the collapse of the vital ventilator trade if we left.
There are reports of dramatic conditions at hospitals in the Alsace region, the epicentre of the Covid-19 epidemic in France. According to a report by the German Institute for Disaster Medicine, compiled following a visit to the University Clinic in Strasbourg and seen by German news agency dpa, medics in the hard-hit region are no longer ventilating patients aged over 80 but were merely offering “terminal care” with opiates and barbiturates.
The report said the hospital in Strasbourg was facing a mass influx of new patients at an hourly rate and that medics were continuing to offer care even after they themselves had been infected with the virus.
The Strasbourg clinic on Friday rejected some of the details in the report, saying the “overall condition” of patients was crucial for prioritising access to ventilators, not age, and that the hospital had acquired new ventilators.
Brigitte Klinkert, the president of the French departement Haut-Rhin, confirmed that Alsace hospitals were forced to triage care, meaning some patients were prioritized because of a limited number of ventilators.
“We have already been practising triage for two weeks”, Klinkert told German newspaper Die Welt. “You can’t say it often enough, because it isn’t just the German neighbours but also the French outside Alsace who still aren’t taking the situation seriously”.
Wasn't there pictures of them taking people out of there via TGV?
Yes, and a few patients have been taken over the border to Germany.
The German hospital federation said today they are confident of not having "Italian conditions" in Germany - at least not in the next 2 weeks (!). Supposedly now 30000 ventilation places in Germany, and adding 1500 a week. I'm a bit worried, because although preparation is clearly happening, there doesn't seem to be a proper nationally organised response. But this might be just the German way, lots of organisations and regional authorities cooperating behind the scenes but less of the big national announcements, I don't know (and I'm somewhat in the loop, my wife being involved in the Düsseldorf preparations. but she doesn't know either eg if there is enough PPE. there's talk of the German army being prepared to set up field hospitals and take on other tasks).
People around seem to be generally buying the official line that Germany is better prepared than some of our neighbours, but I'm not convinced, and I think there's still a danger of complacency.
Antibody testing might be available by the end of next week - but only through the health system (at least initially), or so I've heard.
I’m putting together a WhatsApp group pub quiz round, British Politics 1997-2020. Does anyone have any ideas for out-there questions, preferably hard to Google ones?
There's certainly one hell of a lot of subject material for that!
How many MPs won their next electoral test (general election or by-election), having changed political party, since 2010?
Not ideal, but not surprising. On 18 March (two days after the full lockdown) Spain had a very similar number of cases (14769) and deaths (638). However, I'm not sure how many tests were being performed in Spain at that time - my recollection ( @nichomar or @felix might know) is that they were performing fewer tests (i.e., the fraction of positives in Spain was higher).
In any event, this might suggest we have locked down (relatively) before Spain did so hopefully that means the maximum number of cases might be slightly lower here. If we have indeed performed more tests than Spain at the equivalent stage that will also have an effect.
sorry I am having a wicked laugh at my 12 year old son's expense.
He has been having a great time the last week with home schooling. We have been trying to make it as interesting as possible but of course it is not the same as being in the classroom. He was looking forward to this being the norm for the next few months.
The school has now contacted us to let us know that now they have got over the initial shakeup period and got a routine going they will be moving to online teaching which will match the curriculum they would have been doing in class. With additional homework set as normal. More importantly they have decided to go ahead with the end year school exams.
My son is mortified.
I am very amused.
We have been teaching to timetable electronically since the start of the week.
Not ideal, but not surprising. On 18 March (two days after the full lockdown) Spain had a very similar number of cases (14769) and deaths (638). However, I'm not sure how many tests were being performed in Spain at that time - my recollection ( @nichomar or @felix might know) is that they were performing fewer tests (i.e., the fraction of positives in Spain was higher).
In any event, this might suggest we have locked down (relatively) before Spain did so hopefully that means the maximum number of cases might be slightly lower here. If we have indeed performed more tests than Spain at the equivalent stage that will also have an effect.
Indeed the confirmed cases are likely to continue to increase as we continue to expand testing numbers.
The worrying concern is that the percentage of tests being positive is increasing. Still nothing like bad epidemics like Italy or NY but still not good.
The Cabinet is going to be a political version of the Diamond Princess.
We can watch the rats of infection, severe illness and so on, and extrapolate to the larger population
Hopefully the rats of infection will tail off.
I am sure it is an issue gnawing at their thoughts. They will need to hole up for a while.
I hope that's a sign you're feeling better, Foxy!
Just about to start a remote meeting. Could be a total disaster as I've never used the tech for group chat before.
Yes, bright enough to potter in the garden. It is a bit up and down though.
IF I had this disease back in January, one of the distinct symptoms is how it fluctuates. You feel terrible, you feel better, you feel terrible again. V weird.
My wife told me last night that when she caught what I had, she had a coughing fit so bad she nearly fainted on the Tube (she'd never told me this before). In retrospect it does seem like we might have had it, maybe the antibody tests will tell me, when they are released.
Good luck to you and your wife.
Severaal people have posted wondering if their flu in January/December/November was Covid-19.
I have to say this is very, very unlikely that you had Covid-19. My evidence is that the virus is clearly very contageous: even the PM has caught it. But in February there were thousands of tests being carried out and only 100 or so came back positive. The negatives would have included a lot of random testing, and people presenting with flu symptoms wanting to know if it was Flu or Covid.
On top of that in over half of all the early cases there was an obviuos trace back to China. Then there was an obvoius trace back to Italy.
All of these point against the idea that Coronavirus was spreading widely in the UK undetected before mid-February, and the picture is similar in all European countries, just with a different take off date.
Given that the UK has left the EU, why would it participate anyway? It has clearly got its own scheme going on.
Not really an either/or, is it? There is nothing at all to prevent participating in a joint procurement AND making own, additional arrangements (as other countries are doing).
There's no such thing as a free lunch.
I don't think you understand how joint procurement processes work.
There is a competition among firms to meet the (joint) order and the offer is either acceptable in which case you sign the contract or not in which case you don't.
Participating was a no-brainer in this case and it is a major concern that the UK (apparently due to some kind of error on our part) didn't.
I’m putting together a WhatsApp group pub quiz round, British Politics 1997-2020. Does anyone have any ideas for out-there questions, preferably hard to Google ones?
Who was the shortest serving elected MP?
Alfred Dobbs, victorious in Smethwick at the 1945 General Election was killed in a car crash the day after the election.
I’m putting together a WhatsApp group pub quiz round, British Politics 1997-2020. Does anyone have any ideas for out-there questions, preferably hard to Google ones?
Who was the shortest serving elected MP?
Alfred Dobbs, victorious in Smethwick at the 1945 General Election was killed in a car crash the day after the election.
That's a good fact but a poor quiz question as he's such an obscure figure that it's completely unguessable - you either definitely know it or definitely don't.
A better question is "What unfortunate record is held by Alfred Dobbs, who was elected as Labour MP for Smethwick in 1945?"
EDIT: It's also not a great fact for a quiz about post 1997 politics.
The Cabinet is going to be a political version of the Diamond Princess.
We can watch the rats of infection, severe illness and so on, and extrapolate to the larger population
Hopefully the rats of infection will tail off.
I am sure it is an issue gnawing at their thoughts. They will need to hole up for a while.
I hope that's a sign you're feeling better, Foxy!
Just about to start a remote meeting. Could be a total disaster as I've never used the tech for group chat before.
Yes, bright enough to potter in the garden. It is a bit up and down though.
IF I had this disease back in January, one of the distinct symptoms is how it fluctuates. You feel terrible, you feel better, you feel terrible again. V weird.
My wife told me last night that when she caught what I had, she had a coughing fit so bad she nearly fainted on the Tube (she'd never told me this before). In retrospect it does seem like we might have had it, maybe the antibody tests will tell me, when they are released.
Good luck to you and your wife.
Severaal people have posted wondering if their flu in January/December/November was Covid-19.
I have to say this is very, very unlikely that you had Covid-19. My evidence is that the virus is clearly very contageous: even the PM has caught it. But in February there were thousands of tests being carried out and only 100 or so came back positive. The negatives would have included a lot of random testing, and people presenting with flu symptoms wanting to know if it was Flu or Covid.
On top of that in over half of all the early cases there was an obviuos trace back to China. Then there was an obvoius trace back to Italy.
All of these point against the idea that Coronavirus was spreading widely in the UK undetected before mid-February, and the picture is similar in all European countries, just with a different take off date.
I think also, if it were prevalent in January/February then the impact on ICU would have made itself obvious.
Given that the UK has left the EU, why would it participate anyway? It has clearly got its own scheme going on.
Not really an either/or, is it? There is nothing at all to prevent participating in a joint procurement AND making own, additional arrangements (as other countries are doing).
There's no such thing as a free lunch.
I don't think you understand how joint procurement processes work.
There is a competition among firms to meet the (joint) order and the offer is either acceptable in which case you sign the contract or not in which case you don't.
Participating was a no-brainer in this case and it is a major concern that the UK (apparently due to some kind of error on our part) didn't.
Why was it a no brainer? Time was of the essence so why outsource our order to third parties who might prioritise early shipments to Italy etc and leave us at the back of the queue?
We needed ventilators. We got ventilators. Job done.
We discussed the claim from Maajid Nawaz the other day about 25% of those who had died being Asian. Appears to be another over-represented group...
At least 5% of the deaths, 0.5% of the population. Although still very small numbers.
The Board of Deputies has collated figures from Jewish funerals to record 25 coronavirus victims from a total of 465 in Britain as of Wednesday. This proportion of 5.4 per cent could be higher because not all the dead would have had traditional funerals. Jews make up only 0.5 per cent of the UK population.
I’m putting together a WhatsApp group pub quiz round, British Politics 1997-2020. Does anyone have any ideas for out-there questions, preferably hard to Google ones?
Who was the shortest serving elected MP?
Alfred Dobbs, victorious in Smethwick at the 1945 General Election was killed in a car crash the day after the election.
That's a good fact but a poor quiz question as he's such an obscure figure that it's completely unguessable - you either definitely know it or definitely don't.
A better question is "What unfortunate record is held by Alfred Dobbs, who was elected as Labour MP for Smethwick in 1945?"
EDIT: It's also not a great fact for a quiz about post 1997 politics.
Two good points! I should have read the initial question!
Not ideal, but not surprising. On 18 March (two days after the full lockdown) Spain had a very similar number of cases (14769) and deaths (638). However, I'm not sure how many tests were being performed in Spain at that time - my recollection ( @nichomar or @felix might know) is that they were performing fewer tests (i.e., the fraction of positives in Spain was higher).
In any event, this might suggest we have locked down (relatively) before Spain did so hopefully that means the maximum number of cases might be slightly lower here. If we have indeed performed more tests than Spain at the equivalent stage that will also have an effect.
Indeed the confirmed cases are likely to continue to increase as we continue to expand testing numbers.
The worrying concern is that the percentage of tests being positive is increasing. Still nothing like bad epidemics like Italy or NY but still not good.
One of the big shocks today is they bought 58,000 defective test kits from China which gave false negatives, not sure all of them were used but it throws the testing numbers out.
There are fears about the long-term implications of a global condom shortage after the world's largest manufacturer was forced to stop production due to the coronavirus outbreak.
Karex Berhad's three factories in Malaysia have been shut for 10 days already, meaning there are already 100 million fewer condoms, the company's chief executive Goh Miah Kiat told news agency Reuters.
The company, which produces one in five of the world's condoms, is now appealing to the Malaysian government for a partial exemption from a nationwide lockdown
I'm sure there are various DIY options available to sentient beings.
Not ideal, but not surprising. On 18 March (two days after the full lockdown) Spain had a very similar number of cases (14769) and deaths (638). However, I'm not sure how many tests were being performed in Spain at that time - my recollection ( @nichomar or @felix might know) is that they were performing fewer tests (i.e., the fraction of positives in Spain was higher).
In any event, this might suggest we have locked down (relatively) before Spain did so hopefully that means the maximum number of cases might be slightly lower here. If we have indeed performed more tests than Spain at the equivalent stage that will also have an effect.
Still scary though. We are going to be rather like Spain. And their numbers are still increasing.
Spain's numbers seem to have plateaued a bit though - the overall cases are certainly increasing but the rate is falling it seems (the health minister today said they were near the peak). We can expect thousands of new cases a day for the next week before we hit our plateau though (as everywhere else in Europe). In terms of the UK London will clearly be bad, with the rest of the country being a bit better. But we are looking at thousands rather than many tens of thousands of deaths most likely.
How many have/had it but are asymptomatic and untested?
Hopefully a very high percentage.
There are also people who are symptomatic and untested. The NHS does not normally do testing for mild symptoms, except it would appear for people in a high profile position.
Given that the UK has left the EU, why would it participate anyway? It has clearly got its own scheme going on.
Have any of the EU initiatives got as far as Dyson ?
The UK would probably end up being a net contributer, as usual.
We'd end up with less ventilators than we started with but all the remainers would be threatening the collapse of the vital ventilator trade if we left.
Not ideal, but not surprising. On 18 March (two days after the full lockdown) Spain had a very similar number of cases (14769) and deaths (638). However, I'm not sure how many tests were being performed in Spain at that time - my recollection ( @nichomar or @felix might know) is that they were performing fewer tests (i.e., the fraction of positives in Spain was higher).
In any event, this might suggest we have locked down (relatively) before Spain did so hopefully that means the maximum number of cases might be slightly lower here. If we have indeed performed more tests than Spain at the equivalent stage that will also have an effect.
Indeed the confirmed cases are likely to continue to increase as we continue to expand testing numbers.
The worrying concern is that the percentage of tests being positive is increasing. Still nothing like bad epidemics like Italy or NY but still not good.
In Italy, the "percentage positive" peaked at about 35%.
Am I the only one who doesn't give a shit about this story?
No. We got the ventilators we wanted who gives a shit how?
it does seem odd - if the UK wasn't getting ventilators you could understand it but the complaint seems to be that the UK didn't join in a vague procurement arrangement.
The Cabinet is going to be a political version of the Diamond Princess.
We can watch the rats of infection, severe illness and so on, and extrapolate to the larger population
Hopefully the rats of infection will tail off.
I am sure it is an issue gnawing at their thoughts. They will need to hole up for a while.
I hope that's a sign you're feeling better, Foxy!
Just about to start a remote meeting. Could be a total disaster as I've never used the tech for group chat before.
Yes, bright enough to potter in the garden. It is a bit up and down though.
IF I had this disease back in January, one of the distinct symptoms is how it fluctuates. You feel terrible, you feel better, you feel terrible again. V weird.
My wife told me last night that when she caught what I had, she had a coughing fit so bad she nearly fainted on the Tube (she'd never told me this before). In retrospect it does seem like we might have had it, maybe the antibody tests will tell me, when they are released.
Good luck to you and your wife.
Severaal people have posted wondering if their flu in January/December/November was Covid-19.
I have to say this is very, very unlikely that you had Covid-19. My evidence is that the virus is clearly very contageous: even the PM has caught it. But in February there were thousands of tests being carried out and only 100 or so came back positive. The negatives would have included a lot of random testing, and people presenting with flu symptoms wanting to know if it was Flu or Covid.
On top of that in over half of all the early cases there was an obviuos trace back to China. Then there was an obvoius trace back to Italy.
All of these point against the idea that Coronavirus was spreading widely in the UK undetected before mid-February, and the picture is similar in all European countries, just with a different take off date.
I think also, if it were prevalent in January/February then the impact on ICU would have made itself obvious.
How are you Foxy? Would be interesting to know how the virus proceeds from someone who has it and is a medical bod.
The Cabinet is going to be a political version of the Diamond Princess.
We can watch the rats of infection, severe illness and so on, and extrapolate to the larger population
Hopefully the rats of infection will tail off.
I am sure it is an issue gnawing at their thoughts. They will need to hole up for a while.
I hope that's a sign you're feeling better, Foxy!
Just about to start a remote meeting. Could be a total disaster as I've never used the tech for group chat before.
Yes, bright enough to potter in the garden. It is a bit up and down though.
IF I had this disease back in January, one of the distinct symptoms is how it fluctuates. You feel terrible, you feel better, you feel terrible again. V weird.
My wife told me last night that when she caught what I had, she had a coughing fit so bad she nearly fainted on the Tube (she'd never told me this before). In retrospect it does seem like we might have had it, maybe the antibody tests will tell me, when they are released.
Good luck to you and your wife.
Severaal people have posted wondering if their flu in January/December/November was Covid-19.
I have to say this is very, very unlikely that you had Covid-19. My evidence is that the virus is clearly very contageous: even the PM has caught it. But in February there were thousands of tests being carried out and only 100 or so came back positive. The negatives would have included a lot of random testing, and people presenting with flu symptoms wanting to know if it was Flu or Covid.
On top of that in over half of all the early cases there was an obviuos trace back to China. Then there was an obvoius trace back to Italy.
All of these point against the idea that Coronavirus was spreading widely in the UK undetected before mid-February, and the picture is similar in all European countries, just with a different take off date.
Why "even the PM"? Surely, given the number of people he meets, he's one of the most likely people to get it in the country.
Am I the only one who doesn't give a shit about this story?
No. We got the ventilators we wanted who gives a shit how?
it does seem odd - if the UK wasn't getting ventilators you could understand it but the complaint seems to be that the UK didn't join in a vague procurement arrangement.
It would be surprising if sharing production wasn't a requirement of joining the scheme.
Given that the UK has left the EU, why would it participate anyway? It has clearly got its own scheme going on.
Not really an either/or, is it? There is nothing at all to prevent participating in a joint procurement AND making own, additional arrangements (as other countries are doing).
There's no such thing as a free lunch.
I don't think you understand how joint procurement processes work.
There is a competition among firms to meet the (joint) order and the offer is either acceptable in which case you sign the contract or not in which case you don't.
Participating was a no-brainer in this case and it is a major concern that the UK (apparently due to some kind of error on our part) didn't.
Why was it a no brainer? Time was of the essence so why outsource our order to third parties who might prioritise early shipments to Italy etc and leave us at the back of the queue?
We needed ventilators. We got ventilators. Job done.
Because you can easily do both.
Participating in a procurement process doesn't prevent you from pursuing other options. If the lead times promised by the successful tenderer are unacceptable, you just don't sign the contract, and there is nothing to prevent you from pursuing other options, even as the procurement proceeds.
Also, it is not (yet) clear that we do have sufficient ventilators. The Dyson order may stumble, and the numbers may be insufficient for our needs. We'd clearly be in a better place with the Dyson order but with the opportunity to get more from other suppliers.
Given that the UK has left the EU, why would it participate anyway? It has clearly got its own scheme going on.
Have any of the EU initiatives got as far as Dyson ?
The UK would probably end up being a net contributer, as usual.
We'd end up with less ventilators than we started with but all the remainers would be threatening the collapse of the vital ventilator trade if we left.
Am I the only one who doesn't give a shit about this story?
No. We got the ventilators we wanted who gives a shit how?
it does seem odd - if the UK wasn't getting ventilators you could understand it but the complaint seems to be that the UK didn't join in a vague procurement arrangement.
Indeed. Joint procurement makes sense for penny pinching because you can use your combined spending power to drive the cost down (so long as cost savings beat the expense of doing that). They don't especially make the procurement faster.
Given the priority was speed not cost it seems we did the right thing. We wanted something, we appealed for it and we got it. Job done.
The Cabinet is going to be a political version of the Diamond Princess.
We can watch the rats of infection, severe illness and so on, and extrapolate to the larger population
Hopefully the rats of infection will tail off.
I am sure it is an issue gnawing at their thoughts. They will need to hole up for a while.
I hope that's a sign you're feeling better, Foxy!
Just about to start a remote meeting. Could be a total disaster as I've never used the tech for group chat before.
Yes, bright enough to potter in the garden. It is a bit up and down though.
IF I had this disease back in January, one of the distinct symptoms is how it fluctuates. You feel terrible, you feel better, you feel terrible again. V weird.
My wife told me last night that when she caught what I had, she had a coughing fit so bad she nearly fainted on the Tube (she'd never told me this before). In retrospect it does seem like we might have had it, maybe the antibody tests will tell me, when they are released.
Good luck to you and your wife.
Severaal people have posted wondering if their flu in January/December/November was Covid-19.
I have to say this is very, very unlikely that you had Covid-19. My evidence is that the virus is clearly very contageous: even the PM has caught it. But in February there were thousands of tests being carried out and only 100 or so came back positive. The negatives would have included a lot of random testing, and people presenting with flu symptoms wanting to know if it was Flu or Covid.
On top of that in over half of all the early cases there was an obviuos trace back to China. Then there was an obvoius trace back to Italy.
All of these point against the idea that Coronavirus was spreading widely in the UK undetected before mid-February, and the picture is similar in all European countries, just with a different take off date.
In January I was in Bangkok for three weeks, surrounded by Chinese tourists in my hotel, bars, restaurants. Thailand was an early hotspot.
If it wasn't for that Thai trip, then I would never have even suspected corona.
Two weeks after I got back, the government put Thailand on the list of places-of-recent-travel, where they wanted to test you if you had symptoms
Yet the case numbers in Thailand have remained comparatively tiny throughout.
Am I the only one who doesn't give a shit about this story?
No. We got the ventilators we wanted who gives a shit how?
it does seem odd - if the UK wasn't getting ventilators you could understand it but the complaint seems to be that the UK didn't join in a vague procurement arrangement.
There's nothing vague about it. It's a group of Governments advertising a contract and getting suppliers to bid.
I am also stunned how many people on here seem to think, "Brilliant - all our ventilator needs are now met by Dyson". Firstly, we don't know what peak demand for ventilators will be, and would clearly like to get more than Dyson can supply. Secondly, we have the problem of a single supplier who has never made ventilators - hopefully they will meet specs and timescales, but it'd be really good to hedge that risk.
Yay, my 70 year old parents live in one of the very few places with no cases at all.
They've still not left the house for a week though.
Not Rutland? I think those are being counted as Leics, as we are one CCG.
Oakham School (my daughter`s) has announced a 25% reduction in fees for the summer term. Some parents were complaining about being charged full fees when their children are not at school! They are teaching by remote lessons, online. Boarders being charged 75% of day rates.
I do think that one of the enduring consequences of all this is the effect on private schools. They are not awash with money, as many think. Finances are generally very tight indeed. This, combined with some parents withdrawal of their children for financial reasons together with the possible (likely) loss of summer holiday revenues (by letting the school out to summer renters and functions) will do for many.
May be an opportunity for the government to snap some up at low cost and expand the state sector?
Given that the UK has left the EU, why would it participate anyway? It has clearly got its own scheme going on.
Not really an either/or, is it? There is nothing at all to prevent participating in a joint procurement AND making own, additional arrangements (as other countries are doing).
There's no such thing as a free lunch.
I don't think you understand how joint procurement processes work.
There is a competition among firms to meet the (joint) order and the offer is either acceptable in which case you sign the contract or not in which case you don't.
Participating was a no-brainer in this case and it is a major concern that the UK (apparently due to some kind of error on our part) didn't.
Why was it a no brainer? Time was of the essence so why outsource our order to third parties who might prioritise early shipments to Italy etc and leave us at the back of the queue?
We needed ventilators. We got ventilators. Job done.
Because you can easily do both.
Participating in a procurement process doesn't prevent you from pursuing other options. If the lead times promised by the successful tenderer are unacceptable, you just don't sign the contract, and there is nothing to prevent you from pursuing other options, even as the procurement proceeds.
Also, it is not (yet) clear that we do have sufficient ventilators. The Dyson order may stumble, and the numbers may be insufficient for our needs. We'd clearly be in a better place with the Dyson order but with the opportunity to get more from other suppliers.
We aren't just buying from Dyson. We've got a considerable number coming in from many sources now.
Am I the only one who doesn't give a shit about this story?
No. We got the ventilators we wanted who gives a shit how?
it does seem odd - if the UK wasn't getting ventilators you could understand it but the complaint seems to be that the UK didn't join in a vague procurement arrangement.
There's nothing vague about it. It's a group of Governments advertising a contract and getting suppliers to bid.
I am also stunned how many people on here seem to think, "Brilliant - all our ventilator needs are now met by Dyson". Firstly, we don't know what peak demand for ventilators will be, and would clearly like to get more than Dyson can supply. Secondly, we have the problem of a single supplier who has never made ventilators - hopefully they will meet specs and timescales, but it'd be really good to hedge that risk.
Jenrick on radio today saying that Dyson will not be supplying any "for weeks" because they are not designed yet, let alone manufactured.
Yay, my 70 year old parents live in one of the very few places with no cases at all.
They've still not left the house for a week though.
Not Rutland? I think those are being counted as Leics, as we are one CCG.
Oakham School (my daughter`s) has announced a 25% reduction in fees for the summer term. Some parents were complaining about being charged full fees when their children are not at school! They are teaching by remote lessons, online. Boarders being charged 75% of day rates.
I do think that one of the enduring consequences of all this is the effect on private schools. They are not awash with money, as many think. Finances are generally very tight indeed. This, combined with some parents withdrawal of their children for financial reasons together with the possible (likely) loss of summer holiday revenues (by letting the school out to summer renters and functions) will do for many.
May be an opportunity for the government to snap some up at low cost and expand the state sector?
Plus rich overseas pupils generally and Chinese ones specifically likely to dry up.
Given that the UK has left the EU, why would it participate anyway? It has clearly got its own scheme going on.
Not really an either/or, is it? There is nothing at all to prevent participating in a joint procurement AND making own, additional arrangements (as other countries are doing).
There's no such thing as a free lunch.
I don't think you understand how joint procurement processes work.
There is a competition among firms to meet the (joint) order and the offer is either acceptable in which case you sign the contract or not in which case you don't.
Participating was a no-brainer in this case and it is a major concern that the UK (apparently due to some kind of error on our part) didn't.
Why was it a no brainer? Time was of the essence so why outsource our order to third parties who might prioritise early shipments to Italy etc and leave us at the back of the queue?
We needed ventilators. We got ventilators. Job done.
Because you can easily do both.
Participating in a procurement process doesn't prevent you from pursuing other options. If the lead times promised by the successful tenderer are unacceptable, you just don't sign the contract, and there is nothing to prevent you from pursuing other options, even as the procurement proceeds.
Also, it is not (yet) clear that we do have sufficient ventilators. The Dyson order may stumble, and the numbers may be insufficient for our needs. We'd clearly be in a better place with the Dyson order but with the opportunity to get more from other suppliers.
We aren't just buying from Dyson. We've got a considerable number coming in from many sources now.
Look, I fervently hope that the numbers we have got coming online meet the requirement for the coming peak and future peaks in this such that the NHS never has to make the choice of which patient gets the ventilator.
But I think you're being incredibly complacent to think that's definitely the case and that we can afford to sit opportunities out.
Am I the only one who doesn't give a shit about this story?
No. We got the ventilators we wanted who gives a shit how?
it does seem odd - if the UK wasn't getting ventilators you could understand it but the complaint seems to be that the UK didn't join in a vague procurement arrangement.
There's nothing vague about it. It's a group of Governments advertising a contract and getting suppliers to bid.
I am also stunned how many people on here seem to think, "Brilliant - all our ventilator needs are now met by Dyson". Firstly, we don't know what peak demand for ventilators will be, and would clearly like to get more than Dyson can supply. Secondly, we have the problem of a single supplier who has never made ventilators - hopefully they will meet specs and timescales, but it'd be really good to hedge that risk.
There isn't a single supplier....there are 3 strands.
#1 Increased output of existing UK manufacturers and importing what we can get. AFAIK, there are only limited makers of ventilators at scale in Europe, one is in the UK and the other is German.
#2 The Dyson project
#3 Another consortium is headed by an existing manufacturers, who has agreed for a load of companies to use their IP to make all the bits to create clones.
However, I don't know why we haven't gone with Mr G-Tech or Oxford Unis scrapheap challenge models, at least as a back-up or a bridge until the rest come online. Both of these say they can make 1000s of week of them.
The Cabinet is going to be a political version of the Diamond Princess.
We can watch the rats of infection, severe illness and so on, and extrapolate to the larger population
Hopefully the rats of infection will tail off.
I am sure it is an issue gnawing at their thoughts. They will need to hole up for a while.
I hope that's a sign you're feeling better, Foxy!
Just about to start a remote meeting. Could be a total disaster as I've never used the tech for group chat before.
Yes, bright enough to potter in the garden. It is a bit up and down though.
IF I had this disease back in January, one of the distinct symptoms is how it fluctuates. You feel terrible, you feel better, you feel terrible again. V weird.
My wife told me last night that when she caught what I had, she had a coughing fit so bad she nearly fainted on the Tube (she'd never told me this before). In retrospect it does seem like we might have had it, maybe the antibody tests will tell me, when they are released.
Good luck to you and your wife.
Severaal people have posted wondering if their flu in January/December/November was Covid-19.
I have to say this is very, very unlikely that you had Covid-19. My evidence is that the virus is clearly very contageous: even the PM has caught it. But in February there were thousands of tests being carried out and only 100 or so came back positive. The negatives would have included a lot of random testing, and people presenting with flu symptoms wanting to know if it was Flu or Covid.
On top of that in over half of all the early cases there was an obviuos trace back to China. Then there was an obvoius trace back to Italy.
All of these point against the idea that Coronavirus was spreading widely in the UK undetected before mid-February, and the picture is similar in all European countries, just with a different take off date.
Why "even the PM"? Surely, given the number of people he meets, he's one of the most likely people to get it in the country.
I doubt if Boris spends his rush hours on the Tube.
Yay, my 70 year old parents live in one of the very few places with no cases at all.
They've still not left the house for a week though.
Not Rutland? I think those are being counted as Leics, as we are one CCG.
Oakham School (my daughter`s) has announced a 25% reduction in fees for the summer term. Some parents were complaining about being charged full fees when their children are not at school! They are teaching by remote lessons, online. Boarders being charged 75% of day rates.
I do think that one of the enduring consequences of all this is the effect on private schools. They are not awash with money, as many think. Finances are generally very tight indeed. This, combined with some parents withdrawal of their children for financial reasons together with the possible (likely) loss of summer holiday revenues (by letting the school out to summer renters and functions) will do for many.
May be an opportunity for the government to snap some up at low cost and expand the state sector?
Losing the lucrative overseas students too most likely, which will also hit Universities and accommodation companies.
Am I the only one who doesn't give a shit about this story?
No. We got the ventilators we wanted who gives a shit how?
it does seem odd - if the UK wasn't getting ventilators you could understand it but the complaint seems to be that the UK didn't join in a vague procurement arrangement.
Indeed. Joint procurement makes sense for penny pinching because you can use your combined spending power to drive the cost down (so long as cost savings beat the expense of doing that). They don't especially make the procurement faster.
Given the priority was speed not cost it seems we did the right thing. We wanted something, we appealed for it and we got it. Job done.
6 months ago we would have heard how Brexit would be a disaster as we wouldn't have access to the joint EU ventilator development program which would mean millions would die....
Am I the only one who doesn't give a shit about this story?
No. We got the ventilators we wanted who gives a shit how?
it does seem odd - if the UK wasn't getting ventilators you could understand it but the complaint seems to be that the UK didn't join in a vague procurement arrangement.
There's nothing vague about it. It's a group of Governments advertising a contract and getting suppliers to bid.
I am also stunned how many people on here seem to think, "Brilliant - all our ventilator needs are now met by Dyson". Firstly, we don't know what peak demand for ventilators will be, and would clearly like to get more than Dyson can supply. Secondly, we have the problem of a single supplier who has never made ventilators - hopefully they will meet specs and timescales, but it'd be really good to hedge that risk.
Our government is speaking to manufacturers directly. Why would we need a middle organisation to speak to other suppliers? What is to stop suppliers speaking to the UK directly?
On today's figures for Spain they definitely show a smaller rate of increase - pleasingly in our relatively unaffected area as well as the others. I notice that Murcia's were less good but most seemed to flattening the curve somewhat. The UK is currently rising much more steeply but starting from a lower base they should, given the lockdown, escape a little relatively lightly. If my sister is typical - they are absolutely terrifed and not leavnig the house at all - they live in Sunderland - a city of 300,000+ with some 27 cases! I have tried to calm her nerves.
We haven't "spurned ventilators" we have done our own procurement rather than outsource our procurement to a third party.
Not. An. Either. Or.
We are speaking to many manufacturers. What does the EU procurement offer that our own can't handle? Which manufacturers are they speaking to that we can't speak to and why?
Given that the UK has left the EU, why would it participate anyway? It has clearly got its own scheme going on.
Not really an either/or, is it? There is nothing at all to prevent participating in a joint procurement AND making own, additional arrangements (as other countries are doing).
There's no such thing as a free lunch.
I don't think you understand how joint procurement processes work.
There is a competition among firms to meet the (joint) order and the offer is either acceptable in which case you sign the contract or not in which case you don't.
Participating was a no-brainer in this case and it is a major concern that the UK (apparently due to some kind of error on our part) didn't.
Why was it a no brainer? Time was of the essence so why outsource our order to third parties who might prioritise early shipments to Italy etc and leave us at the back of the queue?
We needed ventilators. We got ventilators. Job done.
Because you can easily do both.
Participating in a procurement process doesn't prevent you from pursuing other options. If the lead times promised by the successful tenderer are unacceptable, you just don't sign the contract, and there is nothing to prevent you from pursuing other options, even as the procurement proceeds.
Also, it is not (yet) clear that we do have sufficient ventilators. The Dyson order may stumble, and the numbers may be insufficient for our needs. We'd clearly be in a better place with the Dyson order but with the opportunity to get more from other suppliers.
We aren't just buying from Dyson. We've got a considerable number coming in from many sources now.
Am I the only one who doesn't give a shit about this story?
No. We got the ventilators we wanted who gives a shit how?
it does seem odd - if the UK wasn't getting ventilators you could understand it but the complaint seems to be that the UK didn't join in a vague procurement arrangement.
There's nothing vague about it. It's a group of Governments advertising a contract and getting suppliers to bid.
I am also stunned how many people on here seem to think, "Brilliant - all our ventilator needs are now met by Dyson". Firstly, we don't know what peak demand for ventilators will be, and would clearly like to get more than Dyson can supply. Secondly, we have the problem of a single supplier who has never made ventilators - hopefully they will meet specs and timescales, but it'd be really good to hedge that risk.
Our government is speaking to manufacturers directly. Why would we need a middle organisation to speak to other suppliers? What is to stop suppliers speaking to the UK directly?
Generally, for any product, a company will prioritise production and set a more competitive price for an order of 100,000 than for an order of 10,000.
Yay, my 70 year old parents live in one of the very few places with no cases at all.
They've still not left the house for a week though.
Not Rutland? I think those are being counted as Leics, as we are one CCG.
Oakham School (my daughter`s) has announced a 25% reduction in fees for the summer term. Some parents were complaining about being charged full fees when their children are not at school! They are teaching by remote lessons, online. Boarders being charged 75% of day rates.
I do think that one of the enduring consequences of all this is the effect on private schools. They are not awash with money, as many think. Finances are generally very tight indeed. This, combined with some parents withdrawal of their children for financial reasons together with the possible (likely) loss of summer holiday revenues (by letting the school out to summer renters and functions) will do for many.
May be an opportunity for the government to snap some up at low cost and expand the state sector?
Losing the lucrative overseas students too most likely, which will also hit Universities and accommodation companies.
Yes - and it would be politically problematic (to put it mildly) for the government to financial support these schools. I think they will either close or will end up in the state sector. I think this would be a shame (but no doubt others will disagree).
Given that the UK has left the EU, why would it participate anyway? It has clearly got its own scheme going on.
Not really an either/or, is it? There is nothing at all to prevent participating in a joint procurement AND making own, additional arrangements (as other countries are doing).
There's no such thing as a free lunch.
I don't think you understand how joint procurement processes work.
There is a competition among firms to meet the (joint) order and the offer is either acceptable in which case you sign the contract or not in which case you don't.
Participating was a no-brainer in this case and it is a major concern that the UK (apparently due to some kind of error on our part) didn't.
Why was it a no brainer? Time was of the essence so why outsource our order to third parties who might prioritise early shipments to Italy etc and leave us at the back of the queue?
We needed ventilators. We got ventilators. Job done.
Because you can easily do both.
Participating in a procurement process doesn't prevent you from pursuing other options. If the lead times promised by the successful tenderer are unacceptable, you just don't sign the contract, and there is nothing to prevent you from pursuing other options, even as the procurement proceeds.
Also, it is not (yet) clear that we do have sufficient ventilators. The Dyson order may stumble, and the numbers may be insufficient for our needs. We'd clearly be in a better place with the Dyson order but with the opportunity to get more from other suppliers.
We aren't just buying from Dyson. We've got a considerable number coming in from many sources now.
Look, I fervently hope that the numbers we have got coming online meet the requirement for the coming peak and future peaks in this such that the NHS never has to make the choice of which patient gets the ventilator.
But I think you're being incredibly complacent to think that's definitely the case and that we can afford to sit opportunities out.
We aren't sitting out opportunities. We had the opportunity to speak to manufacturers directly, we did so and orders have already been placed. A third party starting that again once we've already placed orders will do what exactly ?
Am I the only one who doesn't give a shit about this story?
No. We got the ventilators we wanted who gives a shit how?
it does seem odd - if the UK wasn't getting ventilators you could understand it but the complaint seems to be that the UK didn't join in a vague procurement arrangement.
There's nothing vague about it. It's a group of Governments advertising a contract and getting suppliers to bid.
I am also stunned how many people on here seem to think, "Brilliant - all our ventilator needs are now met by Dyson". Firstly, we don't know what peak demand for ventilators will be, and would clearly like to get more than Dyson can supply. Secondly, we have the problem of a single supplier who has never made ventilators - hopefully they will meet specs and timescales, but it'd be really good to hedge that risk.
Our government is speaking to manufacturers directly. Why would we need a middle organisation to speak to other suppliers? What is to stop suppliers speaking to the UK directly?
Generally, for any product, a company will prioritise production and set a more competitive price for an order of 100,000 than for an order of 10,000.
But if most of the 100,000 end up in Spain and Italy, what use does the NHS get from them?
This site has a wealth of data updated daily at about this time. It includes number of tests, deaths per million plus a lot of explanatory material. NB I can't control the colour of the lines.
Given that the UK has left the EU, why would it participate anyway? It has clearly got its own scheme going on.
Not really an either/or, is it? There is nothing at all to prevent participating in a joint procurement AND making own, additional arrangements (as other countries are doing).
There's no such thing as a free lunch.
I don't think you understand how joint procurement processes work.
There is a competition among firms to meet the (joint) order and the offer is either acceptable in which case you sign the contract or not in which case you don't.
Participating was a no-brainer in this case and it is a major concern that the UK (apparently due to some kind of error on our part) didn't.
Why was it a no brainer? Time was of the essence so why outsource our order to third parties who might prioritise early shipments to Italy etc and leave us at the back of the queue?
We needed ventilators. We got ventilators. Job done.
Because you can easily do both.
Participating in a procurement process doesn't prevent you from pursuing other options. If the lead times promised by the successful tenderer are unacceptable, you just don't sign the contract, and there is nothing to prevent you from pursuing other options, even as the procurement proceeds.
Also, it is not (yet) clear that we do have sufficient ventilators. The Dyson order may stumble, and the numbers may be insufficient for our needs. We'd clearly be in a better place with the Dyson order but with the opportunity to get more from other suppliers.
We aren't just buying from Dyson. We've got a considerable number coming in from many sources now.
I am sure there are good reasons, but I think there is going to be considerable public pressure on the Government to reveal them.
There has to be some sort of safety concern. I know initially they were asked to make modifications, which they did. Still, I think I would have told them to carry on as a back-up option to the other 3 strands.
At worst, you have them, then say you have a 50 year old and a 90 year old old, stick the "proper" one on the 50 year old and the scrapheap challenge one on the 90 year old...without being too brutal, the likelihood of the 90 year old making it anyway is quite slim, so it is better than nothing and if it fails, it fails.
Truly shocking numbers just announced for the UK yesterday ... Cumulative Covid-19 Cases increase by 25.1% from 11,658 to 14,579, Cumulative Deaths increase by 31.3% from 578 to 759. In percentage terms, these are worse than just about any other major country and at a time when one might have hoped for some element of downturn after the much harsher controls were introduced on Monday, all the more worrying therefore.
This site has a wealth of data updated daily at about this time. It includes number of tests, deaths per million plus a lot of explanatory material. NB I can't control the colour of the lines.
Thanks for posting these Barnesian - they are interesting.
Quite why anyone thinks we should have added an extra layer of EU bureaucracy and EU politics into our urgent sourcing of more ventilators is a mystery to me.
Am I the only one who doesn't give a shit about this story?
No. We got the ventilators we wanted who gives a shit how?
it does seem odd - if the UK wasn't getting ventilators you could understand it but the complaint seems to be that the UK didn't join in a vague procurement arrangement.
There's nothing vague about it. It's a group of Governments advertising a contract and getting suppliers to bid.
I am also stunned how many people on here seem to think, "Brilliant - all our ventilator needs are now met by Dyson". Firstly, we don't know what peak demand for ventilators will be, and would clearly like to get more than Dyson can supply. Secondly, we have the problem of a single supplier who has never made ventilators - hopefully they will meet specs and timescales, but it'd be really good to hedge that risk.
Our government is speaking to manufacturers directly. Why would we need a middle organisation to speak to other suppliers? What is to stop suppliers speaking to the UK directly?
Generally, for any product, a company will prioritise production and set a more competitive price for an order of 100,000 than for an order of 10,000.
Price is not an issue today and we aren't into generalities but specifics. If we order direct from manufacturers we can get them direct but if we order as part of an order for 110k we could (and probably should) be put to the back of the queue of that 110k as higher priorities for the EU (like Italy, Spain and its actual members) get first priority.
OTOH by ordering direct with domestic manufacturers we can be first priority.
Am I the only one who doesn't give a shit about this story?
No. We got the ventilators we wanted who gives a shit how?
it does seem odd - if the UK wasn't getting ventilators you could understand it but the complaint seems to be that the UK didn't join in a vague procurement arrangement.
There's nothing vague about it. It's a group of Governments advertising a contract and getting suppliers to bid.
I am also stunned how many people on here seem to think, "Brilliant - all our ventilator needs are now met by Dyson". Firstly, we don't know what peak demand for ventilators will be, and would clearly like to get more than Dyson can supply. Secondly, we have the problem of a single supplier who has never made ventilators - hopefully they will meet specs and timescales, but it'd be really good to hedge that risk.
Our government is speaking to manufacturers directly. Why would we need a middle organisation to speak to other suppliers? What is to stop suppliers speaking to the UK directly?
And yet the official reason for not participating is this: A UK government spokesperson said: "Owing to an initial communication problem, the UK did not receive an invitation in time to join in four joint procurements in response to the coronavirus pandemic.
"As the (European) Commission has confirmed, we are eligible to participate in joint procurements during the transition period, following our departure from the EU earlier this year.
"As those four initial procurement schemes had already gone out to tender we were unable to take part in these, but we will consider participating in future procurement schemes on the basis of public health requirements at the time." https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-52052694
also: Why are other European governments participating if it's such a waste of time?
Maybe it's not a big deal and won't make a lot of difference at the end of the day, but the robotic insistence by some posters on here that the current UK government can, almost by definition, only have always made the best possible decision in every circumstance is kind of scary.
Am I the only one who doesn't give a shit about this story?
No. We got the ventilators we wanted who gives a shit how?
it does seem odd - if the UK wasn't getting ventilators you could understand it but the complaint seems to be that the UK didn't join in a vague procurement arrangement.
There's nothing vague about it. It's a group of Governments advertising a contract and getting suppliers to bid.
I am also stunned how many people on here seem to think, "Brilliant - all our ventilator needs are now met by Dyson". Firstly, we don't know what peak demand for ventilators will be, and would clearly like to get more than Dyson can supply. Secondly, we have the problem of a single supplier who has never made ventilators - hopefully they will meet specs and timescales, but it'd be really good to hedge that risk.
There isn't a single supplier....there are 3 strands.
#1 Increased output of existing UK manufacturers and importing what we can get. AFAIK, there are only limited makers of ventilators at scale in Europe, one is in the UK and the other is German.
#2 The Dyson project
#3 Another consortium is headed by an existing manufacturers, who has agreed for a load of companies to use their IP to make all the bits to create clones.
However, I don't know why we haven't gone with Mr G-Tech or Oxford Unis scrapheap challenge models, at least as a back-up or a bridge until the rest come online. Both of these say they can make 1000s of week of them.
If push comes to shove, sign me up for a dodgy untested unpretty ventilator that probably works, versus a super top-end version that will be delivered a month after I'm dead....
The Cabinet is going to be a political version of the Diamond Princess.
We can watch the rats of infection, severe illness and so on, and extrapolate to the larger population
Hopefully the rats of infection will tail off.
I am sure it is an issue gnawing at their thoughts. They will need to hole up for a while.
I hope that's a sign you're feeling better, Foxy!
Just about to start a remote meeting. Could be a total disaster as I've never used the tech for group chat before.
Yes, bright enough to potter in the garden. It is a bit up and down though.
IF I had this disease back in January, one of the distinct symptoms is how it fluctuates. You feel terrible, you feel better, you feel terrible again. V weird.
My wife told me last night that when she caught what I had, she had a coughing fit so bad she nearly fainted on the Tube (she'd never told me this before). In retrospect it does seem like we might have had it, maybe the antibody tests will tell me, when they are released.
Good luck to you and your wife.
Severaal people have posted wondering if their flu in January/December/November was Covid-19.
I have to say this is very, very unlikely that you had Covid-19. My evidence is that the virus is clearly very contageous: even the PM has caught it. But in February there were thousands of tests being carried out and only 100 or so came back positive. The negatives would have included a lot of random testing, and people presenting with flu symptoms wanting to know if it was Flu or Covid.
On top of that in over half of all the early cases there was an obviuos trace back to China. Then there was an obvoius trace back to Italy.
All of these point against the idea that Coronavirus was spreading widely in the UK undetected before mid-February, and the picture is similar in all European countries, just with a different take off date.
Why "even the PM"? Surely, given the number of people he meets, he's one of the most likely people to get it in the country.
I doubt if Boris spends his rush hours on the Tube.
Churchill did though. I know, 'cause I watched that movie.
Comments
https://twitter.com/ChefKenHom/status/1243144762842140674
In any event, this might suggest we have locked down (relatively) before Spain did so hopefully that means the maximum number of cases might be slightly lower here. If we have indeed performed more tests than Spain at the equivalent stage that will also have an effect.
Regional breakdown and maps here. Looks like the same hotspots getting worse.
https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-uk-tracker-how-many-cases-are-in-your-area-updated-daily-11956258
The worrying concern is that the percentage of tests being positive is increasing. Still nothing like bad epidemics like Italy or NY but still not good.
I have to say this is very, very unlikely that you had Covid-19.
My evidence is that the virus is clearly very contageous: even the PM has caught it. But in February there were thousands of tests being carried out and only 100 or so came back positive. The negatives would have included a lot of random testing, and people presenting with flu symptoms wanting to know if it was Flu or Covid.
On top of that in over half of all the early cases there was an obviuos trace back to China. Then there was an obvoius trace back to Italy.
All of these point against the idea that Coronavirus was spreading widely in the UK undetected before mid-February, and the picture is similar in all European countries, just with a different take off date.
There is a competition among firms to meet the (joint) order and the offer is either acceptable in which case you sign the contract or not in which case you don't.
Participating was a no-brainer in this case and it is a major concern that the UK (apparently due to some kind of error on our part) didn't.
Alfred Dobbs, victorious in Smethwick at the 1945 General Election was killed in a car crash the day after the election.
Now that was funny
https://www.awong.co.uk/
A better question is "What unfortunate record is held by Alfred Dobbs, who was elected as Labour MP for Smethwick in 1945?"
EDIT: It's also not a great fact for a quiz about post 1997 politics.
They've still not left the house for a week though.
We needed ventilators. We got ventilators. Job done.
At least 5% of the deaths, 0.5% of the population. Although still very small numbers.
The Board of Deputies has collated figures from Jewish funerals to record 25 coronavirus victims from a total of 465 in Britain as of Wednesday. This proportion of 5.4 per cent could be higher because not all the dead would have had traditional funerals. Jews make up only 0.5 per cent of the UK population.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8159589/Jewish-leaders-urge-community-preserve-life-amid-coronavirus.html
The worrying concern is that the percentage of tests being positive is increasing. Still nothing like bad epidemics like Italy or NY but still not good.
One of the big shocks today is they bought 58,000 defective test kits from China which gave false negatives, not sure all of them were used but it throws the testing numbers out.
Spain's numbers seem to have plateaued a bit though - the overall cases are certainly increasing but the rate is falling it seems (the health minister today said they were near the peak). We can expect thousands of new cases a day for the next week before we hit our plateau though (as everywhere else in Europe). In terms of the UK London will clearly be bad, with the rest of the country being a bit better. But we are looking at thousands rather than many tens of thousands of deaths most likely.
The worrying concern is that the percentage of tests being positive is increasing. Still nothing like bad epidemics like Italy or NY but still not good.
In Italy, the "percentage positive" peaked at about 35%.
I think those are being counted as Leics, as we are one CCG.
Participating in a procurement process doesn't prevent you from pursuing other options. If the lead times promised by the successful tenderer are unacceptable, you just don't sign the contract, and there is nothing to prevent you from pursuing other options, even as the procurement proceeds.
Also, it is not (yet) clear that we do have sufficient ventilators. The Dyson order may stumble, and the numbers may be insufficient for our needs. We'd clearly be in a better place with the Dyson order but with the opportunity to get more from other suppliers.
Looks like they'll be staying home for a couple more weeks then. Good luck to your colleagues whom they hopefully won't be meeting.
Given the priority was speed not cost it seems we did the right thing. We wanted something, we appealed for it and we got it. Job done.
https://twitter.com/bneeditor/status/1243480680752910336?s=20
I am also stunned how many people on here seem to think, "Brilliant - all our ventilator needs are now met by Dyson". Firstly, we don't know what peak demand for ventilators will be, and would clearly like to get more than Dyson can supply. Secondly, we have the problem of a single supplier who has never made ventilators - hopefully they will meet specs and timescales, but it'd be really good to hedge that risk.
I do think that one of the enduring consequences of all this is the effect on private schools. They are not awash with money, as many think. Finances are generally very tight indeed. This, combined with some parents withdrawal of their children for financial reasons together with the possible (likely) loss of summer holiday revenues (by letting the school out to summer renters and functions) will do for many.
May be an opportunity for the government to snap some up at low cost and expand the state sector?
Also Leavers: on no account should Britain participate with the EU in any aspect of tackling Covid-19.
This decision to spurn ventilators procured through the offices of the EU really could result in unnecessary deaths.
But I think you're being incredibly complacent to think that's definitely the case and that we can afford to sit opportunities out.
#1 Increased output of existing UK manufacturers and importing what we can get. AFAIK, there are only limited makers of ventilators at scale in Europe, one is in the UK and the other is German.
#2 The Dyson project
#3 Another consortium is headed by an existing manufacturers, who has agreed for a load of companies to use their IP to make all the bits to create clones.
However, I don't know why we haven't gone with Mr G-Tech or Oxford Unis scrapheap challenge models, at least as a back-up or a bridge until the rest come online. Both of these say they can make 1000s of week of them.
https://www.worcesternews.co.uk/news/18339699.worcesters-gtech-told-not-produce-much-needed-ventilators-government-chief-executive-says/
I am sure there are good reasons, but I think there is going to be considerable public pressure on the Government to reveal them.
https://twitter.com/angusmacneilsnp/status/1243511170201530369?s=21
"Nope, doesn't work. But report to the President that we still have ventilators a-plenty...."
This site has a wealth of data updated daily at about this time. It includes number of tests, deaths per million plus a lot of explanatory material.
NB I can't control the colour of the lines.
At worst, you have them, then say you have a 50 year old and a 90 year old old, stick the "proper" one on the 50 year old and the scrapheap challenge one on the 90 year old...without being too brutal, the likelihood of the 90 year old making it anyway is quite slim, so it is better than nothing and if it fails, it fails.
OTOH by ordering direct with domestic manufacturers we can be first priority.
A UK government spokesperson said: "Owing to an initial communication problem, the UK did not receive an invitation in time to join in four joint procurements in response to the coronavirus pandemic.
"As the (European) Commission has confirmed, we are eligible to participate in joint procurements during the transition period, following our departure from the EU earlier this year.
"As those four initial procurement schemes had already gone out to tender we were unable to take part in these, but we will consider participating in future procurement schemes on the basis of public health requirements at the time."
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-52052694
also:
Why are other European governments participating if it's such a waste of time?
Maybe it's not a big deal and won't make a lot of difference at the end of the day, but the robotic insistence by some posters on here that the current UK government can, almost by definition, only have always made the best possible decision in every circumstance is kind of scary.