Whatever happens re the Tory rebels they deserve the gratitude of all those who didn’t want a no deal .
Indeed. And the Labour rebels. Whilst CUK and TIG have been a disaster in many ways, they did show that ultimately MPs can be effective parliamentarians without the support of the party whips and patronage. With increasingly authoritarian leaders being selected in both major parties that is an important precedent.
Many of those shadow ministers are too young to recall the reality of the Thatcher years, when naïve young canvassers simply couldn’t comprehend why someone as evil as she could possibly be more popular than Neil Kinnock.
When do the parties Manifesto get published? Then hopefully the media wont obsess themselves with Brexit and we get to see what more horrors are in store (from all 3 parties)
Whatever happens re the Tory rebels they deserve the gratitude of all those who didn’t want a no deal .
Indeed. And the Labour rebels. Whilst CUK and TIG have been a disaster in many ways, they did show that ultimately MPs can be effective parliamentarians without the support of the party whips and patronage. With increasingly authoritarian leaders being selected in both major parties that is an important precedent.
True. It’s been quite astonishing just how many MPs have rebelled and resigned over the last two years . I doubt we’ll ever see this again in our lifetimes.
Me too, we could be in for a highly entertaining night, with a number of 1997 style oustings.
I want to see several major upsets in London.
In particular I want to see incumbents come third in Uxbridge, Hackney, both Islington seats and hopefully Chingford.
I don't think any of those will happen. The interesting seats in London will probably be places like Wimbledon, Putney, Kensington, Cities of London & Westminster, Finchley & Golders Green.
Good but no Ken Clarke means No rejoining the Tory party for me.
I'm less worried about Grieve or Letwin.... would prefer Phil back in.
Hammond, Clarke and Gauke can’t be allowed back in. They were intelligent and competent and therefore a threat to the current leadership, who to put it mildly are neither.
A lot may hinge on whether the "pissed off leave voter" is more flakey than the "pissed off remain voter". The marches of the two polarised viewpoints suggest the one time 48% seem considerably more motivated.
It would amuse me enormously if the ... "p*ssed off Leave voter ..." was annoyed enough that they reverted to old habits and voted UKIP in sufficient numbers to elect an MP.... whilst Farage got nothing.
The irony would be worth having a Kipper in Parliament.
When do the parties Manifesto get published? Then hopefully the media wont obsess themselves with Brexit and we get to see what more horrors are in store (from all 3 parties)
I imagine the Tory manifesto won't have anything remotely controversial at all. Keeping the triple lock, 25 years in prison for people caught with a joint, that sort of thing.
Boris restoring the Tory whip to some MPs only, apparently.
As long as Dominic Grieve isn't one.
That man has done more for this country than you’ll ever do.
..and a great deal more than any of the intellectually challenged pigmy apologists for Brexit, who allow themselves to be canon fodder for the most dishonest premier this country has ever had
Me too, we could be in for a highly entertaining night, with a number of 1997 style oustings.
I want to see several major upsets in London.
In particular I want to see incumbents come third in Uxbridge, Hackney, both Islington seats and hopefully Chingford.
I don't think any of those will happen. The interesting seats in London will probably be places like Wimbledon, Putney, Kensington, Cities of London & Westminster, Finchley & Golders Green.
No of course they won’t.
But it would be (a) fucking hilarious and (b) great news for the country if they did.
Good but no Ken Clarke means No rejoining the Tory party for me.
I'm less worried about Grieve or Letwin.... would prefer Phil back in.
Clarke is a funny one, in as much as I genuinely like the guy, but the fact remains he has been at the centre of the two biggest ruptures in the Tory party.
Thatcher in '90 and Brexit.
Grieve, Letwin and Hammond should definitely never be permitted back in to the party.
Rudd's fate seems not to have been decided but I don't really care either way on her future.
That is an interesting question. Corbyn I guess has nothing to lose - what does Boris want and what does Boris do? Leadership campaign mk2 or does he have to embrace them to show he’s not May?
Me too, we could be in for a highly entertaining night, with a number of 1997 style oustings.
I want to see several major upsets in London.
In particular I want to see incumbents come third in Uxbridge, Hackney, both Islington seats and hopefully Chingford.
I don't think any of those will happen. The interesting seats in London will probably be places like Wimbledon, Putney, Kensington, Cities of London & Westminster, Finchley & Golders Green.
I sincerely hope Luciana Berger gets elected in Finchley and Golders Green.
Good but no Ken Clarke means No rejoining the Tory party for me.
I'm less worried about Grieve or Letwin.... would prefer Phil back in.
Clarke is a funny one, in as much as I genuinely like the guy, but the fact remains he has been at the centre of the two biggest ruptures in the Tory party.
Thatcher in '90 and Brexit.
Grieve, Letwin and Hammond should definitely never be permitted back in to the party.
Rudd's fate seems not to have been decided but I don't really care either way on her future.
Rudd did not lose the whip, she gave it up herself in protest. Not sure it would be good optics to reinstate it possibly against her will.
That is an interesting question. Corbyn I guess has nothing to lose - what does Boris want and what does Boris do? Leadership campaign mk2 or does he have to embrace them to show he’s not May?
In Boris’s interest for Swinson to be there but not in Jezza’s.
Good but no Ken Clarke means No rejoining the Tory party for me.
I'm less worried about Grieve or Letwin.... would prefer Phil back in.
Testify, although I shall be campaigning for a Tory in this election campaign, just one.
Phil Hammond?
There's this chap in Stoke that's quite good and all One Nation Tories should support.
I’ll buy it. Who is it?
If you say ‘Tissue Price’ be aware that you have just condemned him to defeat at the hands of highly parochial and definitely non-Stoke voters in Newcastle under Lyme...
Good but no Ken Clarke means No rejoining the Tory party for me.
I'm less worried about Grieve or Letwin.... would prefer Phil back in.
Testify, although I shall be campaigning for a Tory in this election campaign, just one.
Phil Hammond?
There's this chap in Stoke that's quite good and all One Nation Tories should support.
I’ll buy it. Who is it?
If you say ‘Tissue Price’ be aware that you have just condemned him to defeat at the hands of highly parochial and definitely non-Stoke voters in Newcastle under Lyme...
Yeah I meant him and Staffordshire.
In my defence I've spent most of today in a sexual harassment seminar.
Good but no Ken Clarke means No rejoining the Tory party for me.
I'm less worried about Grieve or Letwin.... would prefer Phil back in.
Testify, although I shall be campaigning for a Tory in this election campaign, just one.
Phil Hammond?
There's this chap in Stoke that's quite good and all One Nation Tories should support.
I’ll buy it. Who is it?
If you say ‘Tissue Price’ be aware that you have just condemned him to defeat at the hands of highly parochial and definitely non-Stoke voters in Newcastle under Lyme...
Yeah I meant him and Staffordshire.
In my defence I've spent most of today in a sexual harassment seminar.
I don’t know what’s more shocking about that post...the confusion over Newcastle under Lyme or the implication that you have seminars on sexually harassing people.
Good but no Ken Clarke means No rejoining the Tory party for me.
I'm less worried about Grieve or Letwin.... would prefer Phil back in.
Testify, although I shall be campaigning for a Tory in this election campaign, just one.
Phil Hammond?
There's this chap in Stoke that's quite good and all One Nation Tories should support.
I’ll buy it. Who is it?
If you say ‘Tissue Price’ be aware that you have just condemned him to defeat at the hands of highly parochial and definitely non-Stoke voters in Newcastle under Lyme...
Yeah I meant him and Staffordshire.
In my defence I've spent most of today in a sexual harassment seminar.
I don’t know what’s more shocking about that post...the confusion over Newcastle under Lyme or the implication that you have seminars on sexually harassing people.
Top tip, put the sexual harassment complaint forms in the bottom draw, that way you'll get a cracking view of their arse when they go to get one.
This seminar was so tedious, I would have eaten a pizza with a pineapple on it if it meant I could left earlier.
Good but no Ken Clarke means No rejoining the Tory party for me.
I'm less worried about Grieve or Letwin.... would prefer Phil back in.
Testify, although I shall be campaigning for a Tory in this election campaign, just one.
Phil Hammond?
There's this chap in Stoke that's quite good and all One Nation Tories should support.
I’ll buy it. Who is it?
If you say ‘Tissue Price’ be aware that you have just condemned him to defeat at the hands of highly parochial and definitely non-Stoke voters in Newcastle under Lyme...
Yeah I meant him and Staffordshire.
In my defence I've spent most of today in a sexual harassment seminar.
There are so many things I could say to that, but I think I will just let it slide.....
I was referring to the two different seats of SOT central and SOT North. SOT has three seats. SOT Central is basically innercity. SOT North is partly innercity plus small towns and villages. The reason i mentioned these two seats was in response to hyufd saying the tories could pick up strong leave seats where Labour had the seats.
You may have meant it, but as far as I can see you didn’t say it.
Indeed, on paper SOTS should be less amenable to the Tories than SOTN.
So I don’t see your point matches the facts. It’s me and Ystradgynlais all over again.
By the way, will I make people jealous if I say I’m outside on a balcony in shirtsleeves, shorts and sandals?
Not me because I’m in exactly the same situation.
Just missed the Madeira Organ Festival, exasperatingly. And I need to be home by Sunday to play for Messy Church. I think “Messy Church” means I play Messiaen for the out voluntary, right?
Good but no Ken Clarke means No rejoining the Tory party for me.
I'm less worried about Grieve or Letwin.... would prefer Phil back in.
Testify, although I shall be campaigning for a Tory in this election campaign, just one.
Phil Hammond?
There's this chap in Stoke that's quite good and all One Nation Tories should support.
I’ll buy it. Who is it?
If you say ‘Tissue Price’ be aware that you have just condemned him to defeat at the hands of highly parochial and definitely non-Stoke voters in Newcastle under Lyme...
Yeah I meant him and Staffordshire.
In my defence I've spent most of today in a sexual harassment seminar.
I don’t know what’s more shocking about that post...the confusion over Newcastle under Lyme or the implication that you have seminars on sexually harassing people.
Off topic, Chris Grayling has to be the worst transport secretary of all time.
He’s completely buggered up the railway network and franchising system and the price we’ll all be likely to pay now is nationalisation.
To be fair to Chris Grayling, he'd previously buggered up the criminal justice system, since when a fifth of murders are now down to prisoners on parole, so it is not like the PM had not been warned he was a liability.
That is an interesting question. Corbyn I guess has nothing to lose - what does Boris want and what does Boris do? Leadership campaign mk2 or does he have to embrace them to show he’s not May?
In Boris’s interest for Swinson to be there but not in Jezza’s.
That’s a fair point. Same with Farage in reverse. Johnson and Corbyn will be trading off opposition leaders like football stickers.
Good but no Ken Clarke means No rejoining the Tory party for me.
I'm less worried about Grieve or Letwin.... would prefer Phil back in.
Testify, although I shall be campaigning for a Tory in this election campaign, just one.
Phil Hammond?
There's this chap in Stoke that's quite good and all One Nation Tories should support.
I’ll buy it. Who is it?
If you say ‘Tissue Price’ be aware that you have just condemned him to defeat at the hands of highly parochial and definitely non-Stoke voters in Newcastle under Lyme...
Yeah I meant him and Staffordshire.
In my defence I've spent most of today in a sexual harassment seminar.
There are so many things I could say to that, but I think I will just let it slide.....
With hindsight, so should I have done...a grossly inappropriate comment made in reply to mine.
Oh, and something about the forms going in the bottom drawer as well.
The Tories should be hoping to take all the strongest Leave voting seats and the LDs will equally be hoping to take the strongest Remain voting seats
Will it be that symmetrical? I wonder. Apart from on BBC news broadcasts I haven't really picked up the feeling that people in the North are that fussed about Brexit. While my little home counties town supplied quite a contingent to the People's Vote march.
The North certainly doesn't seem fussed about going on a People's Vote march that much is true.
Well they aren't marching at all are they. My point was that maybe Brexiters aren't as motivated as all that compared to leavers, so HYFUD may find that Brexit loses the Tories support in their normally strong areas without as much compensation in places that don't generally back them.
Yes you can certainly make a case that remainers are more fired up - if there were 1m people motivated enough to turn up for a demo then perhaps 5 times that number are motivated enough to vote tactically? 5 million is a lot of votes, enough to swing many constituencies.
Twill be an interesting election....
Yes. I didn't get this first hand I'm afraid, but I have heard that the Lib Dems fancy their chances in Guildford. There aren't huge numbers of seats like Guildford of course, but even so the Tories can't really afford to go backwards.
LDs have won Guildford before and it's pretty Remainy.
LDs will.win Guildford
Courageous prediction. They were a long way behind in 2017.
Don’t forget that @HYUFD has assured us that Sunderland Central will go Tory.
Sunderland Central is 135th on the Tory target list, if Boris won Sunderland Central he would have a bigger majority than Blair did in 1997 so unlikely
I was referring to the two different seats of SOT central and SOT North. SOT has three seats. SOT Central is basically innercity. SOT North is partly innercity plus small towns and villages. The reason i mentioned these two seats was in response to hyufd saying the tories could pick up strong leave seats where Labour had the seats.
You may have meant it, but as far as I can see you didn’t say it.
Indeed, on paper SOTS should be less amenable to the Tories than SOTN.
So I don’t see your point matches the facts. It’s me and Ystradgynlais all over again.
By the way, will I make people jealous if I say I’m outside on a balcony in shirtsleeves, shorts and sandals?
Not me because I’m in exactly the same situation.
Just missed the Madeira Organ Festival, exasperatingly. And I need to be home by Sunday to play for Messy Church. I think “Messy Church” means I play Messiaen for the out voluntary, right?
Of course.
And don’t forget to play Send in the Clowns as the minister arrives. That always gets a good laugh,,,
Good but no Ken Clarke means No rejoining the Tory party for me.
I'm less worried about Grieve or Letwin.... would prefer Phil back in.
Testify, although I shall be campaigning for a Tory in this election campaign, just one.
Phil Hammond?
There's this chap in Stoke that's quite good and all One Nation Tories should support.
I’ll buy it. Who is it?
If you say ‘Tissue Price’ be aware that you have just condemned him to defeat at the hands of highly parochial and definitely non-Stoke voters in Newcastle under Lyme...
Yeah I meant him and Staffordshire.
In my defence I've spent most of today in a sexual harassment seminar.
There are so many things I could say to that, but I think I will just let it slide.....
With hindsight, so should I have done...a grossly inappropriate comment made in reply to mine.
Oh, and something about the forms going in the bottom drawer as well.
Many years ago at a previous employer we had to do a questionnaire on the topic of 'sexual harassment hurts everyone' one question was 'Do you have a problem with a woman in a position of authority'? I replied with 'I've never had a problem with a woman in any position'
The Tories should be hoping to take all the strongest Leave voting seats and the LDs will equally be hoping to take the strongest Remain voting seats
Will it be that symmetrical? I wonder. Apart from on BBC news broadcasts I haven't really picked up the feeling that people in the North are that fussed about Brexit. While my little home counties town supplied quite a contingent to the People's Vote march.
The North certainly doesn't seem fussed about going on a People's Vote march that much is true.
Well they aren't marching at all are they. My point was that maybe Brexiters aren't as motivated as all that compared to leavers, so HYFUD may find that Brexit loses the Tories support in their normally strong areas without as much compensation in places that don't generally back them.
Yes you can certainly make a case that remainers are more fired up - if there were 1m people motivated enough to turn up for a demo then perhaps 5 times that number are motivated enough to vote tactically? 5 million is a lot of votes, enough to swing many constituencies.
Twill be an interesting election....
Yes. I didn't get this first hand I'm afraid, but I have heard that the Lib Dems fancy their chances in Guildford. There aren't huge numbers of seats like Guildford of course, but even so the Tories can't really afford to go backwards.
LDs have won Guildford before and it's pretty Remainy.
LDs will.win Guildford
Courageous prediction. They were a long way behind in 2017.
Good but no Ken Clarke means No rejoining the Tory party for me.
I'm less worried about Grieve or Letwin.... would prefer Phil back in.
Testify, although I shall be campaigning for a Tory in this election campaign, just one.
Phil Hammond?
There's this chap in Stoke that's quite good and all One Nation Tories should support.
I’ll buy it. Who is it?
If you say ‘Tissue Price’ be aware that you have just condemned him to defeat at the hands of highly parochial and definitely non-Stoke voters in Newcastle under Lyme...
Yeah I meant him and Staffordshire.
In my defence I've spent most of today in a sexual harassment seminar.
There are so many things I could say to that, but I think I will just let it slide.....
With hindsight, so should I have done...a grossly inappropriate comment made in reply to mine.
Oh, and something about the forms going in the bottom drawer as well.
Many years ago at a previous employer we had to do a questionnaire on the topic of 'sexual harassment hurts everyone' one question was 'Do you have a problem with a woman in a position of authority'? I replied with 'I've never had a problem with a woman in any position'
The Tory party traditionally take women in a position of authority from behind.
Me too, we could be in for a highly entertaining night, with a number of 1997 style oustings.
I want to see several major upsets in London.
In particular I want to see incumbents come third in Uxbridge, Hackney, both Islington seats and hopefully Chingford.
“Were you up for JRM?”
I would love to see it.
For balance, that tit in Brighton Kemptown needs to go, as well.
A few changes in Durham and Northumberland would do nobody any harm either. Pidcock, Lavery, et al are hardly ornaments to the Commons.
North West Durham is interesting. Never gone Tory, sizeable LD vote prior to 2010.
City of Durham also.
I remember the Cleggasm - City of Durham, Blaydon and goodness knows where else all going to the LibDems. And of course Ealing Central, where they came third.
I was referring to the two different seats of SOT central and SOT North. SOT has three seats. SOT Central is basically innercity. SOT North is partly innercity plus small towns and villages. The reason i mentioned these two seats was in response to hyufd saying the tories could pick up strong leave seats where Labour had the seats.
You may have meant it, but as far as I can see you didn’t say it.
Indeed, on paper SOTS should be less amenable to the Tories than SOTN.
So I don’t see your point matches the facts. It’s me and Ystradgynlais all over again.
By the way, will I make people jealous if I say I’m outside on a balcony in shirtsleeves, shorts and sandals?
Not me because I’m in exactly the same situation.
Just missed the Madeira Organ Festival, exasperatingly. And I need to be home by Sunday to play for Messy Church. I think “Messy Church” means I play Messiaen for the out voluntary, right?
Of course.
And don’t forget to play Send in the Clowns as the minister arrives. That always gets a good laugh,,,
Never had the guts to do that! Our previous vicar got elevated to Archdeacon. She was a dedicated Trekkie, so at her final service I played her in to the Star Trek theme...
Me too, we could be in for a highly entertaining night, with a number of 1997 style oustings.
I want to see several major upsets in London.
In particular I want to see incumbents come third in Uxbridge, Hackney, both Islington seats and hopefully Chingford.
“Were you up for JRM?”
I would love to see it.
For balance, that tit in Brighton Kemptown needs to go, as well.
A few changes in Durham and Northumberland would do nobody any harm either. Pidcock, Lavery, et al are hardly ornaments to the Commons.
North West Durham is interesting. Never gone Tory, sizeable LD vote prior to 2010.
City of Durham also.
I remember the Cleggasm - City of Durham, Blaydon and goodness knows where else all going to the LibDems. And of course Ealing Central, where they came third.
Don't forget some Lib Dems were talking about gaining Witney in 2010.
Me too, we could be in for a highly entertaining night, with a number of 1997 style oustings.
I want to see several major upsets in London.
In particular I want to see incumbents come third in Uxbridge, Hackney, both Islington seats and hopefully Chingford.
“Were you up for JRM?”
I would love to see it.
For balance, that tit in Brighton Kemptown needs to go, as well.
A few changes in Durham and Northumberland would do nobody any harm either. Pidcock, Lavery, et al are hardly ornaments to the Commons.
North West Durham is interesting. Never gone Tory, sizeable LD vote prior to 2010.
City of Durham also.
I remember the Cleggasm - City of Durham, Blaydon and goodness knows where else all going to the LibDems. And of course Ealing Central, where they came third.
Don't forget some Lib Dems were talking about gaining Witney in 2010.
More interested to see how many former LD voters 'return' to them, having stayed away post coalition. That, coupled with the impact of BXP candidates, may lead to some unexpected seats changing hands Lab >Tory and vice versa.
I'm not expecting to see PM Swinson, and the SNP will throw everything at it to try and unseat her.
Socialism on the rise amongst Democratic and Labour voters is not the same as Socialism being on the rise amongst all voters (good poll for Bernie and Warren though)
Donald Tusk will be retiring at the end of November .
He will be sadly missed by Remainers .
He was always on our side and passionately believed in all that’s good about working together and being part of that bigger European family .
Donald Tusk was impressive. Hard to imagine his successor will do better.
This lady replacing Juncker, on the other hand, will only have to stand upright without swaying to be a distinct improvement.
One of the nice little gems from Cameron's memoirs is that both he and Merkel were not keen on Juncker's appointment. Hindsight suggests their misgivings were justified.
Donald Tusk will be retiring at the end of November .
He will be sadly missed by Remainers .
He was always on our side and passionately believed in all that’s good about working together and being part of that bigger European family .
Donald Tusk was impressive. Hard to imagine his successor will do better.
This lady replacing Juncker, on the other hand, will only have to stand upright without swaying to be a distinct improvement.
One of the nice little gems from Cameron's memoirs is that both he and Merkel were not keen on Juncker's appointment. Hindsight suggests their misgivings were justified.
A drunken oaf dismissed as PM of Luxembourg after his security service was caught rigging elections and who made his country a byword for tax fraud might not have been the smart choice? Who would have thought that, eh?
Which begs the question - why did Merkel not block him if she realised this? I suspect she was merely urbanely agreeing with Cameron to his face to try and change his mind, rather than saying what she thought. If she had had misgivings, Juncker would have been discarded faster than a Labour MP caught talking common sense.
Don’t forget that @HYUFD has assured us that Sunderland Central will go Tory.
Sunderland Central is 135th on the Tory target list, if Boris won Sunderland Central he would have a bigger majority than Blair did in 1997 so unlikely
Talking of Blair; Sedgefield might be interesting.
Comments
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/10/29/beware-writing-labour-baffling-general-election/
The irony would be worth having a Kipper in Parliament.
But it would be (a) fucking hilarious and (b) great news for the country if they did.
Thatcher in '90 and Brexit.
Grieve, Letwin and Hammond should definitely never be permitted back in to the party.
Rudd's fate seems not to have been decided but I don't really care either way on her future.
https://twitter.com/rowenamason/status/1189250019272089600
If you say ‘Tissue Price’ be aware that you have just condemned him to defeat at the hands of highly parochial and definitely non-Stoke voters in Newcastle under Lyme...
In my defence I've spent most of today in a sexual harassment seminar.
🍿 🍿
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umfxgjzz1jM
Every cloud has a silver lining.
This seminar was so tedious, I would have eaten a pizza with a pineapple on it if it meant I could left earlier.
Just missed the Madeira Organ Festival, exasperatingly. And I need to be home by Sunday to play for Messy Church. I think “Messy Church” means I play Messiaen for the out voluntary, right?
Oh, and something about the forms going in the bottom drawer as well.
https://twitter.com/TomMcTague/status/1189102503343861761
https://twitter.com/adampayne26/status/1189254266172645378
Cannot wait for this omnishambles to kick off.
And don’t forget to play Send in the Clowns as the minister arrives. That always gets a good laugh,,,
Admittedly they do that to the men as well.
https://twitter.com/ryanobles/status/1189210805809627141
Bernie! Bernie! Bernie!
He will be sadly missed by Remainers .
He was always on our side and passionately believed in all that’s good about working together and being part of that bigger European family .
This lady replacing Juncker, on the other hand, will only have to stand upright without swaying to be a distinct improvement.
I'm not expecting to see PM Swinson, and the SNP will throw everything at it to try and unseat her.
https://labourlist.org/2018/03/trade-union-organiser-to-contest-ed-balls-old-seat-of-morley-and-outwood/
My worst nightmare was a no deal , or no negotiated deal and Bozo trashing the EU in an election and destroying future relations .
This way Remainers get one last chance however small , and if it doesn’t happen then leaving with a deal I can accept and move on.
I've said I should be campaigning for a Tory candidate in this election.
Which begs the question - why did Merkel not block him if she realised this? I suspect she was merely urbanely agreeing with Cameron to his face to try and change his mind, rather than saying what she thought. If she had had misgivings, Juncker would have been discarded faster than a Labour MP caught talking common sense.