Mrs May is desperate to retoxify the Tory brand isn't she?
The D U fucking P.
We've done a deal with the party of Sammy 'The gays are poofs and perverts' Wilson.
Trust me in 2015 English voters weren't keen on sending their money to Scotland, they won't be happy about sending English money to Northern Ireland.
What has Northern Ireland ever done for England except brought terrorism to the mainland ?
Mrs May needs to be deposed before she fatally damages the Tories, if she already hasn't.
The Conservatives are not called the Conservative and Unionist Party for nothing, we are a United Kingdom of 4 nations and the largest party in one of those nations has as much right to get some influence on legislation as the SNP would have done had Corbyn been able to form a majority with them. The fact the Tories made by far and away their biggest gains in Scotland last night only confirms the fantasy of some rightwingers that an independent England freed of its Celtic cousins and Ulster would have a permanent Tory majority is precisely that
Seriously, hooking up with the DUP is going to go down as a worse mistake than calling the election in the first place.
They are the racist uncle who hates poofs that ruins Christmas for you every year
As opposed to the antisemites, Hococaust deniers with 'friends' who hang gays sat across the floor of the Commons wearing red rosettes?
Ireland is just more socially conservative than England, and most of their social policy is devolved anyway. All the DUP seem to be saying is that they'll vote with the Queen's Speech and the Budget if there's some infrastructure cash and favourable tax policy heading across the Irish Sea. Sounds reasonable to me, given the alternative.
The DUP are cute hoors, who'll sell their votes to the Tories. They're not going to ban Christmas and maypoles.
The stank of their homophobia and religious backwardness will be hard to wash off.
The DUP have just won a stonking victory in Northern Ireland. They're fully entitled to participate in our political life. Northern Ireland is simply a much more religious place than most of the rest of the UK. but, they're realists. They're not going to impose hardline Protestantism on the rest of us.
No they won't, but half of what they say and believe in will spook the horses in the UK.
So Harold..tell me everything they believe then?
From what I remember they are anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage and have a number of creationists in their senior membership. Shall I do some googling?
Seriously, hooking up with the DUP is going to go down as a worse mistake than calling the election in the first place.
They are the racist uncle who hates poofs that ruins Christmas for you every year
As opposed to the antisemites, Hococaust deniers with 'friends' who hang gays sat across the floor of the Commons wearing red rosettes?
Ireland is just more socially conservative than England, and most of their social policy is devolved anyway. All the DUP seem to be saying is that they'll vote with the Queen's Speech and the Budget if there's some infrastructure cash and favourable tax policy heading across the Irish Sea. Sounds reasonable to me, given the alternative.
The DUP are cute hoors, who'll sell their votes to the Tories. They're not going to ban Christmas and maypoles.
The stank of their homophobia and religious backwardness will be hard to wash off.
The DUP have just won a stonking victory in Northern Ireland. They're fully entitled to participate in our political life. Northern Ireland is simply a much more religious place than most of the rest of the UK. but, they're realists. They're not going to impose hardline Protestantism on the rest of us.
A lot of people are going to learn for the first time that young women are being prosecuted by the state for having abortions NI.
I'm waiting for the first question to May on it.
NI has been out of site and out of mind for 20 years - not anymore.
Most Northern Irish politicians are hostile to abortion. It's a devolved matter.
I don't think you get it. It's now a UK matter. Everything the DUP now does reflects on the Cons as they are working with them. The denial of evolution, the Ulster Resistance, everything.
Imagine if you will Labour had formed a coalition/agreement with Sinn Fein. That is what is happening now.
Plus it doesn't matter what official DUP policy is, or what is in any agreement. Every stupid quote, every daft past policy, every odd association will be all over the news for weeks and weeks.
Seriously, hooking up with the DUP is going to go down as a worse mistake than calling the election in the first place.
They are the racist uncle who hates poofs that ruins Christmas for you every year
As opposed to the antisemites, Hococaust deniers with 'friends' who hang gays sat across the floor of the Commons wearing red rosettes?
Ireland is just more socially conservative than England, and most of their social policy is devolved anyway. All the DUP seem to be saying is that they'll vote with the Queen's Speech and the Budget if there's some infrastructure cash and favourable tax policy heading across the Irish Sea. Sounds reasonable to me, given the alternative.
The DUP are cute hoors, who'll sell their votes to the Tories. They're not going to ban Christmas and maypoles.
The stank of their homophobia and religious backwardness will be hard to wash off.
The DUP have just won a stonking victory in Northern Ireland. They're fully entitled to participate in our political life. Northern Ireland is simply a much more religious place than most of the rest of the UK. but, they're realists. They're not going to impose hardline Protestantism on the rest of us.
A lot of people are going to learn for the first time that young women are being prosecuted by the state for having abortions NI.
I'm waiting for the first question to May on it.
NI has been out of site and out of mind for 20 years - not anymore.
Most Northern Irish politicians are hostile to abortion. It's a devolved matter.
I don't think you get it. It's now a UK matter. Everything the DUP now does reflects on the Cons as they are working with them. The denial of evolution, the Ulster Resistance, everything.
Imagine if you will Labour had formed a coalition/agreement with Sinn Fein. That is what is happening now.
The DUP aren't anti-British, and they aren't terrorists. Most English people think Northern Irish prods are a bit odd, but they aren't afraid of them.
Seriously, hooking up with the DUP is going to go down as a worse mistake than calling the election in the first place.
They are the racist uncle who hates poofs that ruins Christmas for you every year
As opposed to the antisemites, Hococaust deniers with 'friends' who hang gays sat across the floor of the Commons wearing red rosettes?
Ireland is just more socially conservative than England, and most of their social policy is devolved anyway. All the DUP seem to be saying is that they'll vote with the Queen's Speech and the Budget if there's some infrastructure cash and favourable tax policy heading across the Irish Sea. Sounds reasonable to me, given the alternative.
The DUP are cute hoors, who'll sell their votes to the Tories. They're not going to ban Christmas and maypoles.
The stank of their homophobia and religious backwardness will be hard to wash off.
The DUP have just won a stonking victory in Northern Ireland. They're fully entitled to participate in our political life. Northern Ireland is simply a much more religious place than most of the rest of the UK. but, they're realists. They're not going to impose hardline Protestantism on the rest of us.
No they won't, but half of what they say and believe in will spook the horses in the UK.
So Harold..tell me everything they believe then?
From what I remember they are anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage and have a number of creationists in their senior membership. Shall I do some googling?
They need to bin grammars and free school expansion, channel the money into the mainstream schools. Look at a bursary for nurses and midwives again, look at a bursary for uni students on low income to encourage the attainment gap to close.
No reason they cannot do both, I would certainly restore the bursary for nurses and midwives and put more money into education across the board but no reason we cannot have a few more grammars and free schools and academies too. Beyond personalities the Tories need move beyond a diet of austerity and Brexit
Going in with the DUP wipes out a lot of hard work moving the Tory image forwards out of the 1970's, it also leaves with beholden to a minority interest party. They should have just publicly offered the keys to Corbyn etc, binned May and consolidated their very high vote count and share. Now they are wobbling along, wounded and aimless.
Strategically they should go into opposition to the rainbow. They aren't that clever.
They want to hold onto power even though they are a vacuum of ideas currently.
Which will cost them heavily and not even in the medium term. They are trapped and on a hiding to nothing. There is no way they can make this situation work. It's amusing.
I wonder if fox hunting will make it to the queens speech...titter.....
Seriously the queens speech will have the vision of a dead parrot, inspire as much as a dead parrot, and be as useful as a dead parrot....
May has Brexit and sod all else and she's screwed that one up....I almost feel sorry for her...
None of the granny punching policies, no fox hunting, no energy cap. QS = my government will exit the EU.
Unfortunately she will almost certainly include measures limiting civil liberties under the guise of fighting terrorism and even more unfortunately most of the House will support it for fear of being declared soft on terrorism.
She's going to have to walk a very thin line with that. Deporting foreigners is fine, but anything that looks like internment, ID cards or changing the burden of proof is going to find more than a handful of rebels.
She can't play politics with human rights laws given her dire position, which is only a good thing.
They need to bin grammars and free school expansion, channel the money into the mainstream schools. Look at a bursary for nurses and midwives again, look at a bursary for uni students on low income to encourage the attainment gap to close.
No reason they cannot do both, I would certainly restore the bursary for nurses and midwives and put more money into education across the board but no reason we cannot have a few more grammars and free schools and academies too. Beyond personalities the Tories need move beyond a diet of austerity and Brexit
Was thinking this was probably the number 1 priority
That would actually be a sensible idea from the DUP, afterall why should NI athletes be ignored from the team name of the country they represent?
It is Great Britain & Northern Ireland, its just shortened to TeamGB..and for those not good enough they can have a chance of being part of Team Ireland.
Seriously, hooking up with the DUP is going to go down as a worse mistake than calling the election in the first place.
They are the racist uncle who hates poofs that ruins Christmas for you every year
As opposed to the antisemites, Hococaust deniers with 'friends' who hang gays sat across the floor of the Commons wearing red rosettes?
Ireland is just more socially conservative than England, and most of their social policy is devolved anyway. All the DUP seem to be saying is that they'll vote with the Queen's Speech and the Budget if there's some infrastructure cash and favourable tax policy heading across the Irish Sea. Sounds reasonable to me, given the alternative.
The DUP are cute hoors, who'll sell their votes to the Tories. They're not going to ban Christmas and maypoles.
The stank of their homophobia and religious backwardness will be hard to wash off.
The DUP have just won a stonking victory in Northern Ireland. They're fully entitled to participate in our political life. Northern Ireland is simply a much more religious place than most of the rest of the UK. but, they're realists. They're not going to impose hardline Protestantism on the rest of us.
A lot of people are going to learn for the first time that young women are being prosecuted by the state for having abortions NI.
I'm waiting for the first question to May on it.
NI has been out of site and out of mind for 20 years - not anymore.
Most Northern Irish politicians are hostile to abortion. It's a devolved matter.
I don't think you get it. It's now a UK matter. Everything the DUP now does reflects on the Cons as they are working with them. The denial of evolution, the Ulster Resistance, everything.
Imagine if you will Labour had formed a coalition/agreement with Sinn Fein. That is what is happening now.
Np point having an agreement with Sinn Fein - they don't take their seats in parliament so don't have any votes.
Seriously, hooking up with the DUP is going to go down as a worse mistake than calling the election in the first place.
They are the racist uncle who hates poofs that ruins Christmas for you every year
As opposed to the antisemites, Hococaust deniers with 'friends' who hang gays sat across the floor of the Commons wearing red rosettes?
Ireland is just more socially conservative than England, and most of their social policy is devolved anyway. All the DUP seem to be saying is that they'll vote with the Queen's Speech and the Budget if there's some infrastructure cash and favourable tax policy heading across the Irish Sea. Sounds reasonable to me, given the alternative.
The DUP are cute hoors, who'll sell their votes to the Tories. They're not going to ban Christmas and maypoles.
The stank of their homophobia and religious backwardness will be hard to wash off.
The DUP have just won a stonking victory in Northern Ireland. They're fully entitled to participate in our political life. Northern Ireland is simply a much more religious place than most of the rest of the UK. but, they're realists. They're not going to impose hardline Protestantism on the rest of us.
No they won't, but half of what they say and believe in will spook the horses in the UK.
So Harold..tell me everything they believe then?
From what I remember they are anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage and have a number of creationists in their senior membership. Shall I do some googling?
Have you read the manifesto?
As I have already said, it doesn't matter what is in their manifesto. Which person in the UK reads the manifestos of the main parties, let alone a NI one. It's about what is going to be all over the news, in print, online and on TV.
Going in with the DUP wipes out a lot of hard work moving the Tory image forwards out of the 1970's, it also leaves with beholden to a minority interest party. They should have just publicly offered the keys to Corbyn etc, binned May and consolidated their very high vote count and share. Now they are wobbling along, wounded and aimless.
Strategically they should go into opposition to the rainbow. They aren't that clever.
They want to hold onto power even though they are a vacuum of ideas currently.
Which will cost them heavily and not even in the medium term. They are trapped and on a hiding to nothing. There is no way they can make this situation work. It's amusing.
I wonder if fox hunting will make it to the queens speech...titter.....
Seriously the queens speech will have the vision of a dead parrot, inspire as much as a dead parrot, and be as useful as a dead parrot....
May has Brexit and sod all else and she's screwed that one up....I almost feel sorry for her...
None of the granny punching policies, no fox hunting, no energy cap. QS = my government will exit the EU.
Unfortunately she will almost certainly include measures limiting civil liberties under the guise of fighting terrorism and even more unfortunately most of the House will support it for fear of being declared soft on terrorism.
She's going to have to walk a very thin line with that. Deporting foreigners is fine, but anything that looks like internment, ID cards or changing the burden of proof is going to find more than a handful of rebels.
She can't play politics with human rights laws given her dire position, which is only a good thing.
Her Brexit Secretary has a history of flouncing over it
Does anyone know why Sporting STILL haven't settled their GE Seats and Turnout % spread betting markets? Is it perhaps because one of the more remote Scottish Highland & Island constituencies has yet to finalise its numbers?
Kensington is the last seat to declare, they're still counting after they sent everyone home for a rest earlier. Declaration should be in the next hour or two, it's allegedly down to a handful of votes between Con and Lab.
Many thanks and to BJO also, I wasn't aware of this situation ..... bloody incredible that it's still dragging on.
The amount of derision being heaped on millennial virtue signalling Twitter users seems pretty rum given they just turned out and handed the kind of people who sneer at them a shellacing
Maybe less sneering and more listening is required.
This is incredible! I was talking with a mate earlier, who isn't really a political buff, and he was saying "Why is Corbyn giving it the big one? He lost! If Donald Trump phones up and asks to speak to the Prime Minister he gets Theresa May!!"
A shellacking when you don't win is a new one on me! And I reckon the first time voters who celebrated last night will wake up tmrw thinking "Hang on.. Corbyn isn't PM...."
Obviously this has been a very bad result for May and the Tories. But I think us political obsessives shouldn't assume that the general public will appreciate the nuance of what's happened. My mum was perplexed at why Jezza was so happy. I notice too that the Prince of Darkness wasn't exactly glowing in his assessment of Labour's position.
We are more or less where we were in 2010 except the Lib Dems wont prop the Tories up now
As I said earlier, I don't understand why Tezzie didn't ask the LibDems for a deal before lining up with the bowler hats.
The Lib Dems would've demanded a 2nd ref, no? If they didn't it's Tuition fees mkII
The LibDems it seems are going to have USP policies that are also red-line policies
This is an utter nonsense.
They will never ever be able to form a coalition with any other party ever. So it is either 325+ seats or no involvement with government whatsoever.
Seriously, hooking up with the DUP is going to go down as a worse mistake than calling the election in the first place.
They are the racist uncle who hates poofs that ruins Christmas for you every year
As opposed to the antisemites, Hococaust deniers with 'friends' who hang gays sat across the floor of the Commons wearing red rosettes?
Ireland is just more socially conservative than England, and most of their social policy is devolved anyway. All the DUP seem to be saying is that they'll vote with the Queen's Speech and the Budget if there's some infrastructure cash and favourable tax policy heading across the Irish Sea. Sounds reasonable to me, given the alternative.
The DUP are cute hoors, who'll sell their votes to the Tories. They're not going to ban Christmas and maypoles.
The stank of their homophobia and religious backwardness will be hard to wash off.
The DUP have just won a stonking victory in Northern Ireland. They're fully entitled to participate in our political life. Northern Ireland is simply a much more religious place than most of the rest of the UK. but, they're realists. They're not going to impose hardline Protestantism on the rest of us.
A lot of people are going to learn for the first time that young women are being prosecuted by the state for having abortions NI.
I'm waiting for the first question to May on it.
NI has been out of site and out of mind for 20 years - not anymore.
Most Northern Irish politicians are hostile to abortion. It's a devolved matter.
I don't think you get it. It's now a UK matter. Everything the DUP now does reflects on the Cons as they are working with them. The denial of evolution, the Ulster Resistance, everything.
Imagine if you will Labour had formed a coalition/agreement with Sinn Fein. That is what is happening now.
The DUP aren't anti-British, and they aren't terrorists. Most English people think Northern Irish prods are a bit odd, but they aren't afraid of them.
I posted last night that I couldn't wait for the ignoramus level comments from the snowflakes once the DUP got involved.
Right on cue, and as predictable as they are as people.
I know the outline of the Nigel Dodds list of what the DUP are after and ts not that contentious.
Will they demand that May join the Association of Loyal Orangewomen?
Or denouncing the Pope as the antichrist....
Or banning song from churches.....
The DUP are miserable, dour, proddies....a veritable blast from the past....Theresa will be fine with them after all....
Who many people in Northern Ireland have willing voted for. If you slander the DUP, you slander their voters. If that's your intention, that's your prerogative, but if it isn't, I'm pointing out that's what your doing.
All that raw red meat Theresa May dangled in front of her headbangers....fox hunting, a hard Brexit, grammar schools, privatising health, ripping up the Human Rights act....the only thing she can offer that shower are soggy bits of old lettuce....
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
I posted last night that I couldn't wait for the ignoramus level comments from the snowflakes once the DUP got involved.
Right on cue, and as predictable as they are as people.
I know the outline of the Nigel Dodds list of what the DUP are after and ts not that contentious.
Will they demand that May join the Association of Loyal Orangewomen?
Or denouncing the Pope as the antichrist....
Or banning song from churches.....
The DUP are miserable, dour, proddies....a veritable blast from the past....Theresa will be fine with them after all....
Who many people in Northern Ireland have willing voted for. If you slander the DUP, you slander their voters. If that's your intention, that's your prerogative, but if it isn't, I'm pointing out that's what your doing.
I struggle to believe that the Northern Irish are the happiest people in Britain when you look at their politicians...
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
Her replacement shouldn't be from the cabinet. There's more talent on the back benches.
Labour needed to avoid a 3 goal defeat to stay up, Tories needed to win by 3 to be champions, and it finished 2-0 Tories. I'll leave it open!
Pondering the progressive coalition if there were one, you'd have Labour wanting rid of the Royal Family, the SNP wanting to break up the UK and the Lib Dems wanting another EU ref!
Seriously, hooking up with the DUP is going to go down as a worse mistake than calling the election in the first place.
They are the racist uncle who hates poofs that ruins Christmas for you every year
As opposed to the antisemites, Hococaust deniers with 'friends' who hang gays sat across the floor of the Commons wearing red rosettes?
Ireland is just more socially conservative than England, and most of their social policy is devolved anyway. All the DUP seem to be saying is that they'll vote with the Queen's Speech and the Budget if there's some infrastructure cash and favourable tax policy heading across the Irish Sea. Sounds reasonable to me, given the alternative.
The DUP are cute hoors, who'll sell their votes to the Tories. They're not going to ban Christmas and maypoles.
The stank of their homophobia and religious backwardness will be hard to wash off.
The DUP have just won a stonking victory in Northern Ireland. They're fully entitled to participate in our political life. Northern Ireland is simply a much more religious place than most of the rest of the UK. but, they're realists. They're not going to impose hardline Protestantism on the rest of us.
No they won't, but half of what they say and believe in will spook the horses in the UK.
So Harold..tell me everything they believe then?
From what I remember they are anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage and have a number of creationists in their senior membership. Shall I do some googling?
Have you read the manifesto?
As I have already said, it doesn't matter what is in their manifesto. Which person in the UK reads the manifestos of the main parties, let alone a NI one. It's about what is going to be all over the news, in print, online and on TV.
Those who want to get over it will, those who don't won't. It'll be a hold over until the next election, thats it.
Does anyone know why Sporting STILL haven't settled their GE Seats and Turnout % spread betting markets? Is it perhaps because one of the more remote Scottish Highland & Island constituencies has yet to finalise its numbers?
Kensington is the last seat to declare, they're still counting after they sent everyone home for a rest earlier. Declaration should be in the next hour or two, it's allegedly down to a handful of votes between Con and Lab.
Many thanks and to BJO also, I wasn't aware of this situation ..... bloody incredible that it's still dragging on.
The count staff were, I understand, literally falling asleep at the end of the second recount. Not how you want them to start the third...
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
Her replacement shouldn't be from the cabinet. There's more talent on the back benches.
One should hope so...the front bench is hardly full of Ronaldos and Messis
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
There's nothing the Tories can do or say to win over the young. They are Jezza's now.
The only thing that will change this is when Jezza gets power and they see the true horror of what a hard left, marxist government looks like.
Seriously, hooking up with the DUP is going to go down as a worse mistake than calling the election in the first place.
They are the racist uncle who hates poofs that ruins Christmas for you every year
As opposed to the antisemites, Hococaust deniers with 'friends' who hang gays sat across the floor of the Commons wearing red rosettes?
Ireland is just more socially conservative than England, and most of their social policy is devolved anyway. All the DUP seem to be saying is that they'll vote with the Queen's Speech and the Budget if there's some infrastructure cash and favourable tax policy heading across the Irish Sea. Sounds reasonable to me, given the alternative.
The DUP are cute hoors, who'll sell their votes to the Tories. They're not going to ban Christmas and maypoles.
The stank of their homophobia and religious backwardness will be hard to wash off.
The DUP have just won a stonking victory in Northern Ireland. They're fully entitled to participate in our political life. Northern Ireland is simply a much more religious place than most of the rest of the UK. but, they're realists. They're not going to impose hardline Protestantism on the rest of us.
A lot of people are going to learn for the first time that young women are being prosecuted by the state for having abortions NI.
I'm waiting for the first question to May on it.
NI has been out of site and out of mind for 20 years - not anymore.
Most Northern Irish politicians are hostile to abortion. It's a devolved matter.
I don't think you get it. It's now a UK matter. Everything the DUP now does reflects on the Cons as they are working with them. The denial of evolution, the Ulster Resistance, everything.
Imagine if you will Labour had formed a coalition/agreement with Sinn Fein. That is what is happening now.
The DUP aren't anti-British, and they aren't terrorists. Most English people think Northern Irish prods are a bit odd, but they aren't afraid of them.
Mrs May is desperate to retoxify the Tory brand isn't she?
The D U fucking P.
We've done a deal with the party of Sammy 'The gays are poofs and perverts' Wilson.
Trust me in 2015 English voters weren't keen on sending their money to Scotland, they won't be happy about sending English money to Northern Ireland.
What has Northern Ireland ever done for England except brought terrorism to the mainland ?
Mrs May needs to be deposed before she fatally damages the Tories, if she already hasn't.
The Conservatives are not called the Conservative and Unionist Party for nothing, we are a United Kingdom of 4 nations and the largest party in one of those nations has as much right to get some influence on legislation as the SNP would have done had Corbyn been able to form a majority with them. The fact the Tories made by far and away their biggest gains in Scotland last night only confirms the fantasy of some rightwingers that an independent England freed of its Celtic cousins and Ulster would have a permanent Tory majority is precisely that
Unionists and Conservatives are natural allies.
And plenty of Scottish Conservatives are in the Orange Order.
The amount of derision being heaped on millennial virtue signalling Twitter users seems pretty rum given they just turned out and handed the kind of people who sneer at them a shellacing
Maybe less sneering and more listening is required.
The amount of derision being heaped on millennial virtue signalling Twitter users seems pretty rum given they just turned out and handed the kind of people who sneer at them a shellacing
Maybe less sneering and more listening is required.
This is incredible! I was talking with a mate earlier, who isn't really a political buff, and he was saying "Why is Corbyn giving it the big one? He lost! If Donald Trump phones up and asks to speak to the Prime Minister he gets Theresa May!!"
A shellacking when you don't win is a new one on me! And I reckon the first time voters who celebrated last night will wake up tmrw thinking "Hang on.. Corbyn isn't PM...."
Obviously this has been a very bad result for May and the Tories. But I think us political obsessives shouldn't assume that the general public will appreciate the nuance of what's happened. My mum was perplexed at why Jezza was so happy. I notice too that the Prince of Darkness wasn't exactly glowing in his assessment of Labour's position.
We are more or less where we were in 2010 except the Lib Dems wont prop the Tories up now
As I said earlier, I don't understand why Tezzie didn't ask the LibDems for a deal before lining up with the bowler hats.
LibDems would've wanted a 2nd ref !
And stv without a referendum Kendal as city of culture, free mint cake paid for by the state, cable as chancellor to sto Him challenging him as leader (although i think he will go next week) as a afterthought drop A 50. Whilst I think that would be brilliant, credit to the original author, there is only about 3m others would agree
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
Her replacement shouldn't be from the cabinet. There's more talent on the back benches.
Lots of wheeling and dealing is going to be needed, so I think it will be someone experienced (though that doesn't rule out ex-ministers forced out by the May Purge, for example, so could still be outside the current cabinet). Moreover, they need to command respect within the party, so surely someone senior who's shown safe hands before.
But the flip side, and what I would love to see, is for the Tories to announce someone fresh-faced and mould-breaking, so the replacement is seen as a statement of positive intent and not a retreat. Kwasi Kwarteng perhaps?
The amount of derision being heaped on millennial virtue signalling Twitter users seems pretty rum given they just turned out and handed the kind of people who sneer at them a shellacing
Maybe less sneering and more listening is required.
This is incredible! I was talking with a mate earlier, who isn't really a political buff, and he was saying "Why is Corbyn giving it the big one? He lost! If Donald Trump phones up and asks to speak to the Prime Minister he gets Theresa May!!"
A shellacking when you don't win is a new one on me! And I reckon the first time voters who celebrated last night will wake up tmrw thinking "Hang on.. Corbyn isn't PM...."
Obviously this has been a very bad result for May and the Tories. But I think us political obsessives shouldn't assume that the general public will appreciate the nuance of what's happened. My mum was perplexed at why Jezza was so happy. I notice too that the Prince of Darkness wasn't exactly glowing in his assessment of Labour's position.
We are more or less where we were in 2010 except the Lib Dems wont prop the Tories up now
As I said earlier, I don't understand why Tezzie didn't ask the LibDems for a deal before lining up with the bowler hats.
The LDs aren't going anywhere near the Tories given what happened to them after 2010-15. That's why.
Truthfully, I can't think of any unpleasant groups who he's been associating with since becoming leader, let alone urging them to join a potenil Government. Who did you have in mind?
"STW - though I think he resigned from them when he became leader. They are an unpleasant group and I have noted on this board my objections to their stance, shared by Corbyn in relation to, for instance, the IS genocide of the Yazidis.
Paul Eisner. Raed Salah. The Holocaust denying Palestinian group he travelled with to see President Assad. Not nice people. And not 40 years ago either.
At best he is naive. Or just turns a blind eye. Or adopts a "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" approach.
But, really, Nick: are you really happy that your leader has no qualms about associating with people who are Holocaust deniers? Does it not give you the slightest pang? Not even the slightest uncomfortable feeling?
This is the Labour party, for God's sake, of whom one of your former leaders said: "The party is a moral crusade or it is nothing."
What is moral about associating with Holocaust deniers? If even the most junior Tory MP did that the shrieks of outrage from the Left would be heard from here to the moon. Why is it OK for your leader?
For the record I did not say he was inviting them to government."
Nick setting up a straw man, who'd have thought it.
I was wrong about almost everything last night. I thought the only place that the Tories would struggle to meet expectations was Scotland. I was convinced the exit poll was wrong and still wanted to bet on a Con Maj, but luckily was drunk and fell asleep before I could!
Quite an astonishing election; I'm surprised that May got about 100k more votes than Blair in 97, but even more amazed that Corbyn got 1.5m more than Cameron in 2015.
Well done to all those that managed to make money betting on this madness!
Funny that the party so keen to caricature Farron's equivacations about gay sex, are so keen to jump into bed with those who make no equivacation on the subject at all!
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
There's nothing the Tories can do or say to win over the young. They are Jezza's now.
The only thing that will change this is when Jezza gets power and they see the true horror of what a hard left, marxist government looks like.
Abandon that demographic altogether and they're stuffed. They won't win a majority amongst them, or even a plurality, but they need to get back in amongst the pack. Right now even many adults only voted Tory to keep our Corbyn - we're living in a world of a postponed Labour landslide under a patriotic Corbynite and doing nothing won't help them.
There again I work in the public sector and the Tories have been telling me I'm scum for years. I'm losing the will to care about wider issues, hold my nose, and consider them. So it's not just the young they have an issue with.
I posted last night that I couldn't wait for the ignoramus level comments from the snowflakes once the DUP got involved.
Right on cue, and as predictable as they are as people.
I know the outline of the Nigel Dodds list of what the DUP are after and ts not that contentious.
Will they demand that May join the Association of Loyal Orangewomen?
Or denouncing the Pope as the antichrist....
Or banning song from churches.....
The DUP are miserable, dour, proddies....a veritable blast from the past....Theresa will be fine with them after all....
Who many people in Northern Ireland have willing voted for. If you slander the DUP, you slander their voters. If that's your intention, that's your prerogative, but if it isn't, I'm pointing out that's what your doing.
And Sinn Fein were also voted for by lots of voters but apparently they are beyond the pale. The double standards here is incredible.
I'm quite uncomfortable with the way a lot of people on my social media (London) talk about the DUP. Most of these people have never been to Northern Ireland, knew nothing of Northern Irish politics until today and yet are acting like the Conservatives are going into coalition with a third world junta rather than the most popular democratically elected party in a part of the United Kingdom. Presumably they see the Northern Irish as slightly less human than themselves.
Because social media is 99% value-signalers who are obsessed with the gays? Sod stable government etc, as long as every single person in politics has the exact same belief system as them.....
I think you'll find the Prime Minister threw away stable government with her grubby and calculating attempt to manipulate the electorate through an unnecessary trip to the polls.
She didn't try to manipulate anyone. She saw an opportunity and took it.
Thing is, as has been endlessly rehearsed on here, all she did was see the opportunity plus assume that it would remain whatever she did or didn't do. That was her flaw.
She saw the opportunity and completely blew it. She cost a number of colleagues their seats, destroyed any prospect of implementing any program beyond Brexit, and massively weakened her room for negotiation over Brexit, while creating huge uncertainty over what might happen next. And destroyed whatever personal brand she might have with large swathes of the electorate - including many who reluctantly voted for her.
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
There's nothing the Tories can do or say to win over the young. They are Jezza's now.
The only thing that will change this is when Jezza gets power and they see the true horror of what a hard left, marxist government looks like.
Abandon that demographic altogether and they're stuffed. They won't win a majority amongst them, or even a plurality, but they need to get back in amongst the pack. Right now even many adults only voted Tory to keep our Corbyn - we're living in a world of a postponed Labour landslide under a patriotic Corbynite and doing nothing won't help them.
There again I work in the public sector and the Tories have been telling me I'm scum for years. I'm losing the will to care about wider issues, hold my nose, and consider them. So it's not just the young they have an issue with.
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
There's nothing the Tories can do or say to win over the young. They are Jezza's now.
The only thing that will change this is when Jezza gets power and they see the true horror of what a hard left, marxist government looks like.
That's why Corbyn should be handed power as a minority, he'll be just like Trump and find it harder than it actually looks. All those years on the backbenches and campaigning for fringe issues are great but ain't the real thing. Once all the sectional groups within the current Labour party (arch remainers in London, red Ukippers in the north, students, public sector workers) will all be wanting their slice and how is he going to please them all when some of them want things directly opposed to others within the big tent?
Maybe just maybe we will see political parties start looking to the future to form their policies, take an lnterst in what younger people want and stop pandering to the oldies. On the other hand some bright spark will propose raising the voting age because these young people don't know what they are on about, look they don't vote Tory so they must be deranged. Well if they don't wake up and smell the coffee and start producing forward looking policies they are toast.
Mrs May is desperate to retoxify the Tory brand isn't she?
The D U fucking P.
We've done a deal with the party of Sammy 'The gays are poofs and perverts' Wilson.
Trust me in 2015 English voters weren't keen on sending their money to Scotland, they won't be happy about sending English money to Northern Ireland.
What has Northern Ireland ever done for England except brought terrorism to the mainland ?
Mrs May needs to be deposed before she fatally damages the Tories, if she already hasn't.
The Conservatives are not called the Conservative and Unionist Party for nothing, we are a United Kingdom of 4 nations and the largest party in one of those nations has as much right to get some influence on legislation as the SNP would have done had Corbyn been able to form a majority with them. The fact the Tories made by far and away their biggest gains in Scotland last night only confirms the fantasy of some rightwingers that an independent England freed of its Celtic cousins and Ulster would have a permanent Tory majority is precisely that
Unionists and Conservatives are natural allies.
And plenty of Scottish Conservatives are in the Orange Order.
Yes, one positive out of this election is that with 13 Tory seats in Scotland now, 8 Tory seats in Wales and a likely pact for government with the NI Unionists the idea that the Tories are and should be only an English party can be put to bed, the Tories suffered a bigger swing against them in England than any other home nation
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
Bluntly, she can't afford to.
Her party has loaded austerity onto the young for the last 7 years and it's now baked into the books. It's why reversing her anti-young policies like tuition fees are so incredibly expensive that they're represented as a *magic money tree* fantasy by rightwingers.
The tories found their magic money tree (for the triple lock etc) after the financial crisis *by* squeezing the young until their pips squeeked.
She can say nice things to the young, but she has no other option but to rob them in order to bribe their grandparents.
Funny that the party so keen to caricature Farron's equivacations about gay sex, are so keen to jump into bed with those who make no equivacation on the subject at all!
I've always defended Farron's right to express his religious beliefs.
Was thinking this was probably the number 1 priority
That would actually be a sensible idea from the DUP, afterall why should NI athletes be ignored from the team name of the country they represent?
It is Great Britain & Northern Ireland, its just shortened to TeamGB..and for those not good enough they can have a chance of being part of Team Ireland.
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
There's nothing the Tories can do or say to win over the young. They are Jezza's now.
The only thing that will change this is when Jezza gets power and they see the true horror of what a hard left, marxist government looks like.
Start engaging with them would be a start,start something like knocking a couple of grand off the uni fee's,will cost the government money though ;-)
And trust might take form in another leader who could connect with them like Davidson.
I posted last night that I couldn't wait for the ignoramus level comments from the snowflakes once the DUP got involved.
Right on cue, and as predictable as they are as people.
I know the outline of the Nigel Dodds list of what the DUP are after and ts not that contentious.
Will they demand that May join the Association of Loyal Orangewomen?
Or denouncing the Pope as the antichrist....
Or banning song from churches.....
The DUP are miserable, dour, proddies....a veritable blast from the past....Theresa will be fine with them after all....
Who many people in Northern Ireland have willing voted for. If you slander the DUP, you slander their voters. If that's your intention, that's your prerogative, but if it isn't, I'm pointing out that's what your doing.
And Sinn Fein were also voted for by lots of voters but apparently they are beyond the pale. The double standards here is incredible.
Sinn Fein are our enemies. The DUP are our allies.
Funny that the party so keen to caricature Farron's equivacations about gay sex, are so keen to jump into bed with those who make no equivacation on the subject at all!
equivocation; equivacation would be a riding holiday. And it compounds the offence rather than mitigating it.
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
There's nothing the Tories can do or say to win over the young. They are Jezza's now.
The only thing that will change this is when Jezza gets power and they see the true horror of what a hard left, marxist government looks like.
Abandon that demographic altogether and they're stuffed. They won't win a majority amongst them, or even a plurality, but they need to get back in amongst the pack. Right now even many adults only voted Tory to keep our Corbyn - we're living in a world of a postponed Labour landslide under a patriotic Corbynite and doing nothing won't help them.
That's what's got to happen I think.
A Corbyn/ite majority government (whether it's a landslide or not) followed by bankruptcy and the lights going out (literally) as the reality of a Marxist government bites.
They say everything in life circular and it seems our fate is to relive the 70's (but with a far more extreme government than anything we saw under Wilson and Callaghan)
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
Bluntly, she can't afford to.
Her party has loaded austerity onto the young for the last 7 years and it's now baked into the books. It's why reversing her anti-young policies like tuition fees are so incredibly expensive that they're represented as a *magic money tree* fantasy by rightwingers.
The tories found their magic money tree (for the triple lock etc) after the financial crisis *by* squeezing the young until their pips squeeked.
She can say nice things to the young, but she has no other option but to rob them in order to bribe their grandparents.
Yup. And the biggest Tory betrayal? Houses.
Force the house builders to build some soddding houses, or start building themselves is what the government needs to do. Ban overseas oweneership would be a great start.
Funny that the party so keen to caricature Farron's equivacations about gay sex, are so keen to jump into bed with those who make no equivacation on the subject at all!
I've always defended Farron's right to express his religious beliefs.
And it's the Lib Dems, shorn of Orange Bookers, who have no interest in any coalition 2.
From what I remember they are anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage and have a number of creationists in their senior membership. Shall I do some googling?
Have you read the manifesto?
As I have already said, it doesn't matter what is in their manifesto. Which person in the UK reads the manifestos of the main parties, let alone a NI one. It's about what is going to be all over the news, in print, online and on TV.
Those who want to get over it will, those who don't won't. It'll be a hold over until the next election, thats it.
I'm sympathetic to your POV y0kel - the UK has for centuries been a very diverse place, with subtantial regional and national variations that seem to pass a lot of melting pot metropolitan types by, until they suddenly discover we have the Wrong Kind of Diversity.
But where I think that HaroldO and TSE are correct is that many of "those who don't want to get over it, and won't" are in one of the voting pool that the Tories will be fishing most depserately in the next election.
Trying to win back those high-income, high-education, working-age, urban types, who have been put off by Hard Brexit, fox-hunting, and May's old-fashioned anti-cosmopolitan "citizen of nowhere" jibes will be made harder by association with the DUP. It undoes Cameron's hard work detoxifying his party in this segment (primarily with gay marriage, but for a while his eco-husky phase too).
Mrs May is desperate to retoxify the Tory brand isn't she?
The D U fucking P.
We've done a deal with the party of Sammy 'The gays are poofs and perverts' Wilson.
Trust me in 2015 English voters weren't keen on sending their money to Scotland, they won't be happy about sending English money to Northern Ireland.
What has Northern Ireland ever done for England except brought terrorism to the mainland ?
Mrs May needs to be deposed before she fatally damages the Tories, if she already hasn't.
The Conservatives are not called the Conservative and Unionist Party for nothing, we are a United Kingdom of 4 nations and the largest party in one of those nations has as much right to get some influence on legislation as the SNP would have done had Corbyn been able to form a majority with them. The fact the Tories made by far and away their biggest gains in Scotland last night only confirms the fantasy of some rightwingers that an independent England freed of its Celtic cousins and Ulster would have a permanent Tory majority is precisely that
Unionists and Conservatives are natural allies.
And plenty of Scottish Conservatives are in the Orange Order.
Yes, one positive out of this election is that with 13 Tory seats in Scotland now, 8 Tory seats in Wales and a likely pact for government with the NI Unionists the idea that the Tories are and should be only an English party can be put to bed, the Tories suffered a bigger swing against them in England than any other home nation
The Tories have to be a UK nationalist party, not an English nationalist one.
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
There's nothing the Tories can do or say to win over the young. They are Jezza's now.
The only thing that will change this is when Jezza gets power and they see the true horror of what a hard left, marxist government looks like.
Abandon that demographic altogether and they're stuffed. They won't win a majority amongst them, or even a plurality, but they need to get back in amongst the pack. Right now even many adults only voted Tory to keep our Corbyn - we're living in a world of a postponed Labour landslide under a patriotic Corbynite and doing nothing won't help them.
There again I work in the public sector and the Tories have been telling me I'm scum for years. I'm losing the will to care about wider issues, hold my nose, and consider them. So it's not just the young they have an issue with.
That isn't true, se my earlier post given forward looking policies that can connect can knock labour out of the park. Does any party have the ability and vision I don't know but labour weren't offering a future if you look carefully. The "kids" aren't stupid but need to be given a better alternative which till now they haven't had ( obviously to the original poster rather than the secon)
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
There's nothing the Tories can do or say to win over the young. They are Jezza's now.
The only thing that will change this is when Jezza gets power and they see the true horror of what a hard left, marxist government looks like.
Abandon that demographic altogether and they're stuffed. They won't win a majority amongst them, or even a plurality, but they need to get back in amongst the pack. Right now even many adults only voted Tory to keep our Corbyn - we're living in a world of a postponed Labour landslide under a patriotic Corbynite and doing nothing won't help them.
That's what's got to happen I think.
A Corbyn/ite majority government (whether it's a landslide or not) followed by bankruptcy and the lights going out (literally) a the reality of Marxist government bites.
They say everything in life circular and it seems our fate is to relive the 70's (but with a far more extreme government than anything we saw under Wilson and Callaghan)
I am not certain that elements of the hard left infecting that party would relinquish power if they ever got it.
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
Bluntly, she can't afford to.
Her party has loaded austerity onto the young for the last 7 years and it's now baked into the books. It's why reversing her anti-young policies like tuition fees are so incredibly expensive that they're represented as a *magic money tree* fantasy by rightwingers.
The tories found their magic money tree (for the triple lock etc) after the financial crisis *by* squeezing the young until their pips squeeked.
She can say nice things to the young, but she has no other option but to rob them in order to bribe their grandparents.
That's the whole point of the tory party.
You know what's really robbing the young? Mammothly increasing the deficit or refuse g any austerity to cut it so that today's spending is paid for woth interest in perpetuity by the young.
Nobody has a legacy that has hurt the young more than Gordon Brown. Interest payments are already one of the highest expenditure items in the budget and would have increased massively if Corbyn, Abbott etc were in charge.
Mrs May is desperate to retoxify the Tory brand isn't she?
The D U fucking P.
We've done a deal with the party of Sammy 'The gays are poofs and perverts' Wilson.
Trust me in 2015 English voters weren't keen on sending their money to Scotland, they won't be happy about sending English money to Northern Ireland.
What has Northern Ireland ever done for England except brought terrorism to the mainland ?
Mrs May needs to be deposed before she fatally damages the Tories, if she already hasn't.
The Conservatives are not called the Conservative and Unionist Party for nothing, we are a United Kingdom of 4 nations and the largest party in one of those nations has as much right to get some influence on legislation as the SNP would have done had Corbyn been able to form a majority with them. The fact the Tories made by far and away their biggest gains in Scotland last night only confirms the fantasy of some rightwingers that an independent England freed of its Celtic cousins and Ulster would have a permanent Tory majority is precisely that
Unionists and Conservatives are natural allies.
And plenty of Scottish Conservatives are in the Orange Order.
Yes, one positive out of this election is that with 13 Tory seats in Scotland now, 8 Tory seats in Wales and a likely pact for government with the NI Unionists the idea that the Tories are and should be only an English party can be put to bed, the Tories suffered a bigger swing against them in England than any other home nation
The Tories have to be a UK nationalist party, not an English nationalist one.
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
Bluntly, she can't afford to.
Her party has loaded austerity onto the young for the last 7 years and it's now baked into the books. It's why reversing her anti-young policies like tuition fees are so incredibly expensive that they're represented as a *magic money tree* fantasy by rightwingers.
The tories found their magic money tree (for the triple lock etc) after the financial crisis *by* squeezing the young until their pips squeeked.
She can say nice things to the young, but she has no other option but to rob them in order to bribe their grandparents.
That's the whole point of the tory party.
You know what's really robbing the young? Mammothly increasing the deficit or refuse g any austerity to cut it so that today's spending is paid for woth interest in perpetuity by the young.
Nobody has a legacy that has hurt the young more than Gordon Brown. Interest payments are already one of the highest expenditure items in the budget and would have increased massively if Corbyn, Abbott etc were in charge.
That's the thing isn't it - look at interest payments now in a relatively benign environment - imagine what would happen as tax revenues fell and borrowing soared under a far left spending splurge.
Even under "austerity" conditions we are still borrowing money by the lorry load and one day another bad recession will come along.
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
Bluntly, she can't afford to.
Her party has loaded austerity onto the young for the last 7 years and it's now baked into the books. It's why reversing her anti-young policies like tuition fees are so incredibly expensive that they're represented as a *magic money tree* fantasy by rightwingers.
The tories found their magic money tree (for the triple lock etc) after the financial crisis *by* squeezing the young until their pips squeeked.
She can say nice things to the young, but she has no other option but to rob them in order to bribe their grandparents.
Yup. And the biggest Tory betrayal? Houses.
Force the house builders to build some soddding houses, or start building themselves is what the government needs to do. Ban overseas oweneership would be a great start.
Fix the housing market. People become Conservative once they become homeowners. Giving the 20 - 35 year old age bracket the chance to become homeowners without inheritance would go a long way to making inroads with this demographic.
Once you have an asset that's yours, a patch of grass, a few bricks to call your own, suddenly socialism looks a lot less appealing, when you realise people are more interested in taking it away from you than in giving you something taken from someone else.
See also the dementia tax. When you mess with people's homes, they stop being Tories.
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
There's nothing the Tories can do or say to win over the young. They are Jezza's now.
The only thing that will change this is when Jezza gets power and they see the true horror of what a hard left, marxist government looks like.
Abandon that demographic altogether and they're stuffed. They won't win a majority amongst them, or even a plurality, but they need to get back in amongst the pack. Right now even many adults only voted Tory to keep our Corbyn - we're living in a world of a postponed Labour landslide under a patriotic Corbynite and doing nothing won't help them.
That's what's got to happen I think.
A Corbyn/ite majority government (whether it's a landslide or not) followed by bankruptcy and the lights going out (literally) a the reality of Marxist government bites.
They say everything in life circular and it seems our fate is to relive the 70's (but with a far more extreme government than anything we saw under Wilson and Callaghan)
I am not certain that elements of the hard left infecting that party would relinquish power if they ever got it.
Well there was talk in the 70's of a coup being needed... But in the end democracy sorted it out.
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
There's nothing the Tories can do or say to win over the young. They are Jezza's now.
The only thing that will change this is when Jezza gets power and they see the true horror of what a hard left, marxist government looks like.
Abandon that demographic altogether and they're stuffed. They won't win a majority amongst them, or even a plurality, but they need to get back in amongst the pack. Right now even many adults only voted Tory to keep our Corbyn - we're living in a world of a postponed Labour landslide under a patriotic Corbynite and doing nothing won't help them.
There again I work in the public sector and the Tories have been telling me I'm scum for years. I'm losing the will to care about wider issues, hold my nose, and consider them. So it's not just the young they have an issue with.
Where do they do this?
I'm most curious
Come on, not one conservative politician in the last seven years has made any effort to think about the morale of the public sector. Spiteful stuff like cutting holiday allowances and TCs was paired with (at times) necessary pay restrictions in the name of "modernisation" and has done precisely the opposite. Any Tory near a microphone speaks about further reform, but without any effort to reach or to the large chunk of e.g. the civil service that actively wants to modernise and hates some of the old fashioned nonsense.
It's also in the lexicon - such as referring to the private sector as the "productive" part of the economy. Activists on fora like this one assuming the public sector is a Labour block vote is also the sort of statement that quickly becomes a self fulfilling prophecy.
If you don't feel like someone wants your vote, eventually you stop worrying about the argument for any of their policies in any other areas.
Theresa has now given credibility to the hard left with that bumbling, stumbling campaign.
Bravo madam - you have fucked us all over royally.
Where the hell do we go from here?
Have someone with vision take over?
But maybe it isn't possible. Labour 97-10 basically: increased number of students and costs, increased immigration, attacked private pensions, created a house price bubble, sucked more people into state handouts, and massively ran up the debt and deficit.
They created all the problems we are still working through, but no-one wants to take the medicine. So when Jezza pops up and says: "have an ice-cream instead", it appeals.
The PM (or one of the grown ups in her cabinet) need to be addressing the young directly. They voted, she has ignored them, and potentially little will change. Myths will build. She needs to be humble and open, and in listening mode. She needs a young friendly policy now.
Or her replacement does.
Bluntly, she can't afford to.
Her party has loaded austerity onto the young for the last 7 years and it's now baked into the books. It's why reversing her anti-young policies like tuition fees are so incredibly expensive that they're represented as a *magic money tree* fantasy by rightwingers.
The tories found their magic money tree (for the triple lock etc) after the financial crisis *by* squeezing the young until their pips squeeked.
She can say nice things to the young, but she has no other option but to rob them in order to bribe their grandparents.
That's the whole point of the tory party.
You know what's really robbing the young? Mammothly increasing the deficit or refuse g any austerity to cut it so that today's spending is paid for woth interest in perpetuity by the young.
Nobody has a legacy that has hurt the young more than Gordon Brown. Interest payments are already one of the highest expenditure items in the budget and would have increased massively if Corbyn, Abbott etc were in charge.
Indeed. I'm coming to the conclusion that in 2010 we should have had actual austerity like they had in Ireland - 15% in cash terms off all benefits, pensions and public salaries.
Osborne did a good job to balance spending and taxes to hold GDP just positive for a few years, but the people have now decided that they've put up with sensible for long enough and we should just open the spending taps again - despite the £50bn annual deficit.
All that will save our kids now is some decent inflation and interest rates up a couple of points.
Mrs May is desperate to retoxify the Tory brand isn't she?
The D U fucking P.
We've done a deal with the party of Sammy 'The gays are poofs and perverts' Wilson.
Trust me in 2015 English voters weren't keen on sending their money to Scotland, they won't be happy about sending English money to Northern Ireland.
What has Northern Ireland ever done for England except brought terrorism to the mainland ?
Mrs May needs to be deposed before she fatally damages the Tories, if she already hasn't.
mhh - Imagine if someone rewrote that second to last paragraph to refer to another group
Not very classy TSE, not at all
Lol, I think you be missing the point.
Whilst I'm giving Ruth the main plaudits here, thanks v much Alistair for the Borders tips!
My only regret was losing so much money on Hilary that I could not take all the bookies money on those seats. Dumfries and Galloway was particularly enriching.
Comments
Somebody please intervene and quickly. This is hideous.
https://www.facebook.com/SashbashFMRadio/
It's about what is going to be all over the news, in print, online and on TV.
Paging @AndyJS
Or banning song from churches.....
The DUP are miserable, dour, proddies....a veritable blast from the past....Theresa will be fine with them after all....
This is an utter nonsense.
They will never ever be able to form a coalition with any other party ever. So it is either 325+ seats or no involvement with government whatsoever.
Wow those coalition scars run deep.
Or her replacement does.
Labour needed to avoid a 3 goal defeat to stay up, Tories needed to win by 3 to be champions, and it finished 2-0 Tories. I'll leave it open!
Pondering the progressive coalition if there were one, you'd have Labour wanting rid of the Royal Family, the SNP wanting to break up the UK and the Lib Dems wanting another EU ref!
Bunch of Pleb(iscite)s?
The only thing that will change this is when Jezza gets power and they see the true horror of what a hard left, marxist government looks like.
https://twitter.com/LoyalistTattoos/status/605330422373957632
And plenty of Scottish Conservatives are in the Orange Order.
But like last time, lay Boris like one of his many mistresses
Him challenging him as leader (although i think he will go next week) as a afterthought drop A 50. Whilst I think that would be brilliant, credit to the original author, there is only about 3m others would agree
Not very classy TSE, not at all
But the flip side, and what I would love to see, is for the Tories to announce someone fresh-faced and mould-breaking, so the replacement is seen as a statement of positive intent and not a retreat. Kwasi Kwarteng perhaps?
Just to remind ourselves about Corbyn
https://order-order.com/2017/06/08/100-times-jeremy-corbyn-sided-terrorists/
You do realise there's some people in the country who think terrorism on the mainland is a new thing.
Quite an astonishing election; I'm surprised that May got about 100k more votes than Blair in 97, but even more amazed that Corbyn got 1.5m more than Cameron in 2015.
Well done to all those that managed to make money betting on this madness!
There again I work in the public sector and the Tories have been telling me I'm scum for years. I'm losing the will to care about wider issues, hold my nose, and consider them. So it's not just the young they have an issue with.
Feck, no matter how bad things are now they would be far,far worse under them.
I'm most curious
Her party has loaded austerity onto the young for the last 7 years and it's now baked into the books. It's why reversing her anti-young policies like tuition fees are so incredibly expensive that they're represented as a *magic money tree* fantasy by rightwingers.
The tories found their magic money tree (for the triple lock etc) after the financial crisis *by* squeezing the young until their pips squeeked.
She can say nice things to the young, but she has no other option but to rob them in order to bribe their grandparents.
That's the whole point of the tory party.
How do you propose to get to 326?
My jaw is slowly returning from the floor. Hope you all enjoyed PB's results night.
And trust might take form in another leader who could connect with them like Davidson.
A Corbyn/ite majority government (whether it's a landslide or not) followed by bankruptcy and the lights going out (literally) as the reality of a Marxist government bites.
They say everything in life circular and it seems our fate is to relive the 70's (but with a far more extreme government than anything we saw under Wilson and Callaghan)
Force the house builders to build some soddding houses, or start building themselves is what the government needs to do. Ban overseas oweneership would be a great start.
But where I think that HaroldO and TSE are correct is that many of "those who don't want to get over it, and won't" are in one of the voting pool that the Tories will be fishing most depserately in the next election.
Trying to win back those high-income, high-education, working-age, urban types, who have been put off by Hard Brexit, fox-hunting, and May's old-fashioned anti-cosmopolitan "citizen of nowhere" jibes will be made harder by association with the DUP. It undoes Cameron's hard work detoxifying his party in this segment (primarily with gay marriage, but for a while his eco-husky phase too).
Bravo madam - you have fucked us all over royally.
Where the hell do we go from here?
Nobody has a legacy that has hurt the young more than Gordon Brown. Interest payments are already one of the highest expenditure items in the budget and would have increased massively if Corbyn, Abbott etc were in charge.
Even under "austerity" conditions we are still borrowing money by the lorry load and one day another bad recession will come along.
Once you have an asset that's yours, a patch of grass, a few bricks to call your own, suddenly socialism looks a lot less appealing, when you realise people are more interested in taking it away from you than in giving you something taken from someone else.
See also the dementia tax. When you mess with people's homes, they stop being Tories.
It will do so again...
It's also in the lexicon - such as referring to the private sector as the "productive" part of the economy. Activists on fora like this one assuming the public sector is a Labour block vote is also the sort of statement that quickly becomes a self fulfilling prophecy.
If you don't feel like someone wants your vote, eventually you stop worrying about the argument for any of their policies in any other areas.
Have someone with vision take over?
But maybe it isn't possible. Labour 97-10 basically: increased number of students and costs, increased immigration, attacked private pensions, created a house price bubble, sucked more people into state handouts, and massively ran up the debt and deficit.
They created all the problems we are still working through, but no-one wants to take the medicine. So when Jezza pops up and says: "have an ice-cream instead", it appeals.
Osborne did a good job to balance spending and taxes to hold GDP just positive for a few years, but the people have now decided that they've put up with sensible for long enough and we should just open the spending taps again - despite the £50bn annual deficit.
All that will save our kids now is some decent inflation and interest rates up a couple of points.