No more sodding discussion of Tim Farron and gay sex and it's a sin. I have the bloody Pet Shop Boys song earwormed in my head. I'm an Always On My Mind man.
You will look back upon this comment with a sense of shame.
Farron sounds like he is in a right royal pickle over this gay shagging lark. Putting me off voting Liberal, truth be told. But May is also God Squad, I understand. Has anyone asked her whether she considers gay sex the work of Lord Beelzebub?
I woulDK)
!
Rubbish. Several tons of crap spouted by the bible is ignored at Christians' convenience. It is demonstrably possible to be religious and oppose much of the shite that surrounds it.
To give Michael Gove (a christian) some credit (never thought I would say that!) - he had no problem saying straight away that gay sex was not a sin. Farron messed up here.
He said it for political advantage, in terms of the religious definition of sin he was wrong
How can he be 'wrong'?line to beat their children are defying the 'good' book.
Technically if you spoil your children too much you are also being sinful, yes
That is not what the bible says! Spare the rod, spoil the child. If you don't beat your children you will spoil them! Do you hold that view? Does May? Does Farron?
Please provide the Book, Chapter and Verse of the Bible that says. "Spare the rod, spoil the child"
Wiki says direct quote is:
He that spareth his rod hateth his son: but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes.
Proverbs 13:24
13:20 He that walketh with wise men shall be wise: but a companion of fools shall be destroyed.
I think this was what OGH was getting at earlier with educated remainers and non-educated Tories.
Hopefully Taramasalata is not affected in a similar way. It might trigger a double dip recession.
Taking you entirely seriously (it is no laughing matter) I fear it may already have happened - Taramasalata seems much harder to get hold of thesedays.
No more sodding discussion of Tim Farron and gay sex and it's a sin. I have the bloody Pet Shop Boys song earwormed in my head. I'm an Always On My Mind man.
You will look back upon this comment with a sense of shame.
Farron sounds like he is in a right royal pickle over this gay shagging lark. Putting me off voting Liberal, truth be told. But May is also God Squad, I understand. Has anyone asked her whether she considers gay sex the work of Lord Beelzebub?
I would be very interested in her answer, given the struggles Farron has had with it (and I know one Tory-considering-LD who has been put off by his answers to date, so what they'd do if May said the same things IDK)
!
Rubbish. Several tons of crap spouted by the bible is ignored at Christians' convenience. It is demonstrably possible to be religious and oppose much of the shite that surrounds it.
To give Michael Gove (a christian) some credit (never thought I would say that!) - he had no problem saying straight away that gay sex was not a sin. Farron messed up here.
He said it for political advantage, in terms of the religious definition of sin he was wrong
How can he be 'wrong'?line to beat their children are defying the 'good' book.
Technically if you spoil your children too much you are also being sinful, yes
That is not what the bible says! Spare the rod, spoil the child. If you don't beat your children you will spoil them! Do you hold that view? Does May? Does Farron?
Please provide the Book, Chapter and Verse of the Bible that says. "Spare the rod, spoil the child"
Wiki says direct quote is:
He that spareth his rod hateth his son: but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes.
Proverbs 13:24
So your original claim up-thread that the Bible says, " If you don't beat your children you will spoil them!" was in fact complete bollocks
Farron sounds like he is in a right royal pickle over this gay shagging lark. Putting me off voting Liberal, truth be told. But May is also God Squad, I understand. Has anyone asked her whether she considers gay sex the work of Lord Beelzebub?
I would be very interested in her answer, given the struggles Farron has had with it (and I know one Tory-considering-LD who has been put off by his answers to date, so what they'd do if May said the same things IDK)
Go Green maybe but this is all ridiculous, gay marriage is legal and both Farron and May voted for it but as they are both practising Christians they cannot contradict Biblical teaching that any sex outside heterosexual marriage is a sin but then lots of things are sins that does not mean they are all going to be made illegal!
Rubbish. Several tons of crap spouted by the bible is ignored at Christians' convenience. It is demonstrably possible to be religious and oppose much of the shite that surrounds it.
To give Michael Gove (a christian) some credit (never thought I would say that!) - he had no problem saying straight away that gay sex was not a sin. Farron messed up here.
Surely Christians believe that all extramarital sex is sinful?
They do, Gove was just putting politics before religion
You do not speak for all Christians!
If you asked the Pope he would give a different view and if I was taking the view of the Pope or Michael Gove as representative of Christians it would be the former
I am no Catholic, so do not expect me to either defend or speak for the pope, but the Catholic Church has never prized Biblical literalism. Catholic teachings are based on Church tradition via the Apostolic line. Indeed for centuries Popes exterminated people for wanting to study the Bible in their own language. They were afraid that if ordinary people could read it for themselves and form their own opinions on Jesus's teachings that the Catholic Church would lose power.
Whether ordinary people or the priesthood reading the Bible none of them can deny it states sexual activity should only take place in a heterosexual marriage
James Anthony (NHS nurse, Unison activist) Daren Hale (Hull Council Deputy Leader) Emma Hardy (former teacher now NUT officer; Hull West & Hessle CLP woman officer) Sarah Hayward (Camden Council Leader) Josh Newlove (former East Riding Cllr, Project Manager at Policy Networ, assistant to Lord Liddle) David Prescott Sam Tarry (Barking Cllr)
David Prescott ta, the outright nepotism might just work against Labour.
@HYUFD - If a gay couple are married, is it still a sin for them to have sex?
Yes, technically divorcees, homosexuals, bisexuals, adulterers and the unmarried who have sex are all committing sins unless they are in their first heterosexual marriage
James Anthony (NHS nurse, Unison activist) Daren Hale (Hull Council Deputy Leader) Emma Hardy (former teacher now NUT officer; Hull West & Hessle CLP woman officer) Sarah Hayward (Camden Council Leader) Josh Newlove (former East Riding Cllr, Project Manager at Policy Networ, assistant to Lord Liddle) David Prescott Sam Tarry (Barking Cllr)
See what I mean? Nobody with a normal CV. A process designed to select nutters.
James Anthony (NHS nurse, Unison activist) Daren Hale (Hull Council Deputy Leader) Emma Hardy (former teacher now NUT officer; Hull West & Hessle CLP woman officer) Sarah Hayward (Camden Council Leader) Josh Newlove (former East Riding Cllr, Project Manager at Policy Networ, assistant to Lord Liddle) David Prescott Sam Tarry (Barking Cllr)
David Prescott ta, the outright nepotism might just work against Labour.
I hope so, now I'm on at 66/1! But the Red Princes have won some areas before.
James Anthony (NHS nurse, Unison activist) Daren Hale (Hull Council Deputy Leader) Emma Hardy (former teacher now NUT officer; Hull West & Hessle CLP woman officer) Sarah Hayward (Camden Council Leader) Josh Newlove (former East Riding Cllr, Project Manager at Policy Networ, assistant to Lord Liddle) David Prescott Sam Tarry (Barking Cllr)
David Prescott ta, the outright nepotism might just work against Labour.
He's already failed in his attempt to succeed his dad in Hull East.
Farron sounds like he is in a right royal pickle over this gay shagging lark. Putting me off voting Liberal, truth be told. But May is also God Squad, I understand. Has anyone asked her whether she considers gay sex the work of Lord Beelzebub?
Theresa May as Home Secretary, introduced and passed legislation that made it possible for gay people to get married.
I think that's what you should judge her on.
Yes, I judge her on that of course. I also judge her on her values. Does she consider gay sex a sin? That to me is a fair question.
Of course she does, her father was an Anglican vicar, that does not mean she thinks it should be illegal as her vote for gay marriage proves. All of us sin at one time or another, that does not mean you deny what you did was a sin if you are religious
Are religious beliefs passed down intact via the male line?
It seems that under 60% of self-identifying Christians believe in the Resurrection http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-39153121; if they are prepared to jettison that there's no saying what remains - why would they necessarily believe in sin? So there is no "of course" about it.
I have to say my world view is being shaken to its foundations. I thought it was a given that LDs were dull but inoffensive, and finding them hanging out "No gays or Jews" signs comes as something of a surprise.
You may or may not believe in the literal view of the Resurrection but you cannot change the definition of what the Resurrection is, just as you may or may not abstain from different sins, that does not stop them being sins
The Bible is itself a bit contradictory over the nature of the Resurrection*, and it has been the subject of theological debate for 2 thousand years. You need to be less dogmatic in your assertions.
*Thomas knew Jesus very well, but failed to recognise him. The Apostles who met a man on the road to Emmaus failed to recognise him as Jesus too. It seems as if the resurected Jesus was very different in appearance from his pre crucifixion body. I think this ambiguity is deliberate. Was this a physical reanimation, or a spiritual rebirth, visible in other people?
James Anthony (NHS nurse, Unison activist) Daren Hale (Hull Council Deputy Leader) Emma Hardy (former teacher now NUT officer; Hull West & Hessle CLP woman officer) Sarah Hayward (Camden Council Leader) Josh Newlove (former East Riding Cllr, Project Manager at Policy Networ, assistant to Lord Liddle) David Prescott Sam Tarry (Barking Cllr)
See what I mean? Nobody with a normal CV. A process designed to select nutters.
The last chap even self describes as a barking councillor. What hope is there?
James Anthony (NHS nurse, Unison activist) Daren Hale (Hull Council Deputy Leader) Emma Hardy (former teacher now NUT officer; Hull West & Hessle CLP woman officer) Sarah Hayward (Camden Council Leader) Josh Newlove (former East Riding Cllr, Project Manager at Policy Networ, assistant to Lord Liddle) David Prescott Sam Tarry (Barking Cllr)
David Prescott ta, the outright nepotism might just work against Labour.
I love the way he's the only one without any explanatory brackets!
James Anthony (NHS nurse, Unison activist) Daren Hale (Hull Council Deputy Leader) Emma Hardy (former teacher now NUT officer; Hull West & Hessle CLP woman officer) Sarah Hayward (Camden Council Leader) Josh Newlove (former East Riding Cllr, Project Manager at Policy Networ, assistant to Lord Liddle) David Prescott Sam Tarry (Barking Cllr)
David Prescott ta, the outright nepotism might just work against Labour.
I love the way he's the only one without any explanatory brackets!
Soon fixed...
David Prescott - political comedian (best known as writer of John prescotts tweets)
Farron sounds like he is in a right royal pickle over this gay shagging lark. Putting me off voting Liberal, truth be told. But May is also God Squad, I understand. Has anyone asked her whether she considers gay sex the work of Lord Beelzebub?
I would be very interested in her answer, given the struggles Farron has had with it (and I know one Tory-considering-LD who has been put off by his answers to date, so what they'd do if May said the same things IDK)
Go Green maybe but this is all ridiculous, gay marriage is legal and both Farron and May voted for it but as they are both practising Christians they cannot contradict Biblical teaching that any sex outside heterosexual marriage is a sin but then lots of things are sins that does not mean they are all going to be made illegal!
Rubbish. Several tons of crap spouted by the bible is ignored at Christians' convenience. It is demonstrably possible to be religious and oppose much of the shite that surrounds it.
To give Michael Gove (a christian) some credit (never thought I would say that!) - he had no problem saying straight away that gay sex was not a sin. Farron messed up here.
Surely Christians believe that all extramarital sex is sinful?
They do, Gove was just putting politics before religion
You do not speak for all Christians!
If you asked the Pope he would give a different view and if I was taking the view of the Pope or Michael Gove as representative of Christians it would be the former
I am no Catholic, so do not expect me to either defend or speak for the pope, but the Catholic Church has never prized Biblical literalism. Catholic teachings are based on Church tradition via the Apostolic line. Indeed for centuries Popes exterminated people for wanting to study the Bible in their own language. They were afraid that if ordinary people could read it for themselves and form their own opinions on Jesus's teachings that the Catholic Church would lose power.
Whether ordinary people or the priesthood reading the Bible none of them can deny it states sexual activity should only take place in a heterosexual marriage
Farron sounds like he is in a right royal pickle over this gay shagging lark. Putting me off voting Liberal, truth be told. But May is also God Squad, I understand. Has anyone asked her whether she considers gay sex the work of Lord Beelzebub?
Theresa May as Home Secretary, introduced and passed legislation that made it possible for gay people to get married.
I think that's what you should judge her on.
Yes, I judge her on that of course. I also judge her on her values. Does she consider gay sex a sin? That to me is a fair question.
Of course she does, her father was an Anglican vicar, that does not mean she thinks it should be illegal as her vote for gay marriage proves. All of us sin at one time or another, that does not mean you deny what you did was a sin if you are religious
Are religious beliefs passed down intact via the male line?
It seems that under 60% of self-identifying Christians believe in the Resurrection http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-39153121; if they are prepared to jettison that there's no saying what remains - why would they necessarily believe in sin? So there is no "of course" about it.
I have to say my world view is being shaken to its foundations. I thought it was a given that LDs were dull but inoffensive, and finding them hanging out "No gays or Jews" signs comes as something of a surprise.
You may or may not believe in the literal view of the Resurrection but you cannot change the definition of what the Resurrection is, just as you may or may not abstain from different sins, that does not stop them being sins
The Bible is itself a bit contradictory over the nature of the Resurrection*, and it has been the subject of theological debate for 2 thousand years. You need to be less dogmatic in your assertions.
*Thomas knew Jesus very well, but failed to recognise him. The Apostles who met a man on the road to Emmaus failed to recognise him as Jesus too. It seems as if the resurected Jesus was very different in appearance from his pre crucifixion body. I think this ambiguity is deliberate. Was this a physical reanimation, or a spiritual rebirth, visible in other people?
'They fail to recognise him until he breaks bread and gives thanks, and he then vanishes. The two go at once to Jerusalem where they find the disciples exclaiming over Jesus' appearance to Peter. As they tell their story Jesus appears to them all. They are afraid, but he invites them to touch his body, eats with them, and explains the prophecies which are fulfilled in him.'[Luke 24]
Andrew George,LD, has announced he is standing again in St. Ives - PP have promptly moved him to the favourite at 4/6. Dan Rogerson (Cornwall North) and Stephen Gilbert (St. Austell & Newquay) are also standing again - they weren't exactly stars but neither are the current Tory MPs for those seats (Scott Mann and Steve Double) both of whom have made pratts of themselves recently. PP at 5/1. Sir Nick Harvey is also standing again in North Devon - PP at 3/1.
Personally, I am more optimistic for LD success in the SW than the polls would suggest. There is a widespread feeling that the Tories are taking the region for granted again - David Cameron's promise of rail and road improvements after the Dawlish debacle simply haven't happened. Even the normally pro-Tory 'Western Morning News' had a pop last week, arguing for LD MPs in the region to give it an independent voice and hold the the government to account. Ironically, the projected Tory landslide with no prospect of a Labour government will tempt some liberal Conservatives to do just that. The 2015 election expense investigation may also blow up in the middle of the campaign.
Devon and Cornwall are very much part of 'Leaverstan' , apart from the 'Remainia' enclaves of Exeter and the South Hams, but I think we have moved on, at least in part, from the EU referendum. Most folk have accepted the result, and the usual issues are coming back into play again. The LDs are reverting to their traditional 'Anybody but Tory' role in the SW, particulary now that UKIP is collapsing. Memories of the Coalition and tuition fees are also fading.
Ah no, the descriptions are mine because I thought some of the names were not familiar. A couple of them were not familiar to me either and I had to google them.
On topic: if the results are anything like predicted above then the only thing the Tories will be worrying about is their voters staying at home come June 8th, thinking it's a done deal - although that much said, there's no particular reason to suppose that your average Labour voter will be mad keen to turn out under any circumstances, and turnout demographics heavily favour the Blues. Oldies are much more likely to go down to the polling station regardless of the circumstances.
I have also been undertaking a bit of an exercise in geekery, and have built a spreadsheet to study what Ukip defections could do for the Tories in their target seats and most marginal defences. As you might expect, the results are ugly for Labour: take the previous election results and apply a uniform swing of 50% of Ukip voters from Ukip to Con across the board, and 36 opposition seats - the great majority of them Labour - fall immediately to the Tories before any other movements between the parties begin to be taken into account.
Ukip defections could also help to move a lot more Tory target seats from safe to marginal, and from marginal to highly marginal, whilst moving Conservative-held seats in the opposite direction and making the Government's defence of its own territory substantially easier. Again, move 50% of 2015 Ukip votes into the Tory column, and only two of their seats - Croydon Central and Dumfriesshire - are held with majorities of less than 5%.
All of this, of course, is before you even start running down Labour's vote, and sharing out perhaps another 1.5m or more of their voters between the Conservatives and the Liberal Democrats. Where might it end?
James Anthony (NHS nurse, Unison activist) Daren Hale (Hull Council Deputy Leader) Emma Hardy (former teacher now NUT officer; Hull West & Hessle CLP woman officer) Sarah Hayward (Camden Council Leader) Josh Newlove (former East Riding Cllr, Project Manager at Policy Networ, assistant to Lord Liddle) David Prescott Sam Tarry (Barking Cllr)
David Prescott ta, the outright nepotism might just work against Labour.
I love the way he's the only one without any explanatory brackets!
Soon fixed...
David Prescott - political comedian (best known as writer of John prescotts tweets)
Andrew George,LD, has announced he is standing again in St. Ives - PP have promptly moved him to the favourite at 4/6. Dan Rogerson (Cornwall North) and Stephen Gilbert (St. Austell & Newquay) are also standing again - they weren't exactly stars but neither are the current Tory MPs for those seats (Scott Mann and Steve Double) both of whom have made pratts of themselves recently. PP at 5/1. Sir Nick Harvey is also standing again in North Devon - PP at 3/1.
Personally, I am more optimistic for LD success in the SW than the polls would suggest. There is a widespread feeling that the Tories are taking the region for granted again - David Cameron's promise of rail and road improvements after the Dawlish debacle simply haven't happened. Even the normally pro-Tory 'Western Morning News' had a pop last week, arguing for LD MPs in the region to give it an independent voice and hold the the government to account. Ironically, the projected Tory landslide with no prospect of a Labour government will tempt some liberal Conservatives to do just that. The 2015 election expense investigation may also blow up in the middle of the campaign.
Devon and Cornwall are very much part of 'Leaverstan' , apart from the 'Remainia' enclaves of Exeter and the South Hams, but I think we have moved on, at least in part, from the EU referendum. Most folk have accepted the result, and the usual issues are coming back into play again. The LDs are reverting to their traditional 'Anybody but Tory' role in the SW, particulary now that UKIP is collapsing. Memories of the Coalition and tuition fees are also fading.
Good luck to them* - they've got a tough task there. What did the Tory MPs do to make prats of themselves?
*Damn, again that cannot be right, 'people like me' are out to get the LDs, what's going on?
Given that members won't get a vote, there are games and alliances being forged to get their preferred candidates selected in these few winnable vacant Labour seats.
Basically Corbyn would get Sam Tarry in Hull West and he's pushing Kary Clark in Leigh (against Burnham's wishes ...and that explains the unusual open letter to the NEC by Bunrham in favour of the local Cllr) Watson would get Stephanie Peacock in Barnsley East and Ellie Reeves in Lewisham West And the Blairites would get Kendall's aide Mark Ferguson in Blaydon.
Farron sounds like he is in a right royal pickle over this gay shagging lark. Putting me off voting Liberal, truth be told. But May is also God Squad, I understand. Has anyone asked her whether she considers gay sex the work of Lord Beelzebub?
I would be very interested in her answer, given the struggles Farron has had with it (and I know one Tory-considering-LD who has been put off by his answers to date, so what they'd do if May said the same things IDK)
Go Green maybe but this is all ridiculous, gay marriage is legal and both Farron and May voted for it but as they are both practising Christians they cannot contradict Biblical teaching that any sex outside heterosexual marriage is a sin but then lots of things are sins that does not mean they are all going to be made illegal!
Rubbish. Several tons of crap spouted by the bible is ignored at Christians' convenience. It is demonstrably possible to be religious and oppose much of the shite that surrounds it.
To give Michael Gove (a christian) some credit (never thought I would say that!) - he had no problem saying straight away that gay sex was not a sin. Farron messed up here.
Surely Christians believe that all extramarital sex is sinful?
They do, Gove was just putting politics before religion
You do not speak for all Christians!
If you asked the Pope he would give a different view and if I was taking the view of the Pope or Michael Gove as representative of Christians it would be the former
I am no Catholic, so do not expect me to either defend or speak for the pope, but the Catholic Church
Whether ordinary people or the priesthood reading the Bible none of them can deny it states sexual activity should only take place in a heterosexual marriage
They can and frequently do.
Hebrews 13:4 Marriage should be honored by all, and the marriage bed kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral.
1 Corinthians 6:18 Run from sexual sin! No other sin so clearly affects the body as this one does. For sexual immorality is a sin against your own body.
Farron sounds like he is in a right royal pickle over this gay shagging lark. Putting me off voting Liberal, truth be told. But May is also God Squad, I understand. Has anyone asked her whether she considers gay sex the work of Lord Beelzebub?
I would be very interested in her answer, given the struggles Farron has had with it (and I know one Tory-considering-LD who has been put off by his answers to date, so what they'd do if May said the same things IDK)
Go Green maybe but this is all ridiculous, gay marriage is legal and both Farron and May voted for it but as they are both practising Christians they cannot contradict Biblical teaching that any sex outside heterosexual marriage is a sin but then lots of things are sins that does not mean they are all going to be made illegal!
Rubbish. Several tons of crap spouted by the bible is ignored at Christians' convenience. It is demonstrably possible to be religious and oppose much of the shite that surrounds it.
Does it matter, in any way? This is a trivial issue.
It sort of is, granted. Yet when considering whether to vote for someone, you also look at values. Considering gay sex sinful is not only nuts, it is also inhumane.
Why is it inhumane? Is he proposing to arrest anybody who has gay sex and parade them around the streets with a placard? Of course not, however that does not change the fact it is a sin just as anybody who has sex before heterosexual marriage has committed a sin or anybody who has committed adultery has committed a sin, you may not be religious and disagree with that which is fine but that does not change the definition of what is a sin in religious terms even if the sinful act is legal
No you are conflating what the bible says with what he believes. The question was not whether the bible considers gay sex a sin (clearly it does). The question was whether he considers it a sin (he does not, as it transpires). Most Christians pick and choose from the bible - quite reasonably. Otherwise they would all beat their children with God on their side.
He does think it is a sin, he changed his position because of political pressure and yes some Christians do still smack their children too
What about touching the skin of an animal on the Sabbath?
Given that members won't get a vote, there are games and alliances being forged to get their preferred candidates selected in these few winnable vacant Labour seats.
Basically Corbyn would get Sam Tarry in Hull West and he's pushing Kary Clark in Leigh (against Burnham's wishes ...and that explains the unusual open letter to the NEC by Bunrham in favour of the local Cllr) Watson would get Stephanie Peacock in Barnsley East and Ellie Reeves in Lewisham West And the Blairites would get Kendall's aide Mark Ferguson in Blaydon.
Let's see what the final outcome will be....
The patronage system that fucked up the Labour intakes in 2005, 2010 and 2015 is still in fashion then....
Hebrews 13:4 Marriage should be honored by all, and the marriage bed kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral.
1 Corinthians 6:18 Run from sexual sin! No other sin so clearly affects the body as this one does. For sexual immorality is a sin against your own body.
God knocked up a woman without her consent or without marrying her,
He's the last fucking person to lecture anyone about sexual morality.
You'd be forgiven for thinking he is. Farron only gets on the telly to hop from one foot to another over gay sex.....
Dear god - Isn't there something about "hate the sin, love the sinner"
As long as he doesn't discriminate against people does it actually matter?
Some people will only be satisfied if Farron says he loves being buggered.
I just wanted him to answer the question! He has now, thankfully. He'd been improving his airtime in the months before the GE, it'll be interesting to see how much he can still get outside of this single issue now.
Hebrews 13:4 Marriage should be honored by all, and the marriage bed kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral.
1 Corinthians 6:18 Run from sexual sin! No other sin so clearly affects the body as this one does. For sexual immorality is a sin against your own body.
God knocked up a woman without her consent or without marrying her,
He's the last fucking person to lecture anyone about sexual morality.
Farron sounds like he is in a right royal pickle over this gay shagging lark. Putting me off voting Liberal, truth be told. But May is also God Squad, I understand. Has anyone asked her whether she considers gay sex the work of Lord Beelzebub?
I would be very interested in her answer, given the struggles Farron has had with it (and I know one Tory-considering-LD who has been put off by his answers to date, so what they'd do if May said the same things IDK)
Go Green maybe but this is all
Rubbish. Several tons of crap spouted by the bible is ignored at Christians' convenience. It is demonstrably possible to be religious and oppose much of the shite that surrounds it.
To give Michael Gove (a christian) some credit (never thought I would say that!) - he had no problem saying straight away that gay sex was not a sin. Farron messed up here.
Surely Christians believe that all extramarital sex is sinful?
They do, Gove was just putting politics before religion
You do not speak for all Christians!
If you asked the Pope he would give a different view and if I was taking the view of the Pope or Michael Gove as representative of Christians it would be the former
I am no Catholic, so do not expect me to either defend or speak for the pope, but the Catholic Church
Whether ordinary people or the priesthood reading the Bible none of them can deny it states sexual activity should only take place in a heterosexual marriage
They can and frequently do.
Hebrews 13:4 Marriage should be honored by all, and the marriage bed kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral.
1 Corinthians 6:18 Run from sexual sin! No other sin so clearly affects the body as this one does. For sexual immorality is a sin against your own body.
Neither quote mentions homosexuality.
In much of the Bible the relationship between man and God is allegorically described as a marriage. The condemnation of adultery should be understood in this context as a lack of religious fidelity.
Hebrews 13:4 Marriage should be honored by all, and the marriage bed kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral.
1 Corinthians 6:18 Run from sexual sin! No other sin so clearly affects the body as this one does. For sexual immorality is a sin against your own body.
God knocked up a woman without her consent or without marrying her,
He's the last fucking person to lecture anyone about sexual morality.
Farron sounds like he is in a right royal pickle over this gay shagging lark. Putting me off voting Liberal, truth be told. But May is also God Squad, I understand. Has anyone asked her whether she considers gay sex the work of Lord Beelzebub?
I would be very interested in her answer, given the struggles Farron has had with it (and I know one Tory-considering-LD who has been put off by his answers to date, so what they'd do if May said the same things IDK)
Go Green maybe but this is all
Rubbish. Several tons of crap spouted by the bible is ignored at Christians' convenience. It is demonstrably possible to be religious and oppose much of the shite that surrounds it.
To give Michael Gove (a christian) some credit (never thought I would say that!) - he had no problem saying straight away that gay sex was not a sin. Farron messed up here.
Surely Christians believe that all extramarital sex is sinful?
They do, Gove was just putting politics before religion
You do not speak for all Christians!
If you asked the Pope he would give a different view and if I was taking the view of the Pope or Michael Gove as representative of Christians it would be the former
I am no Catholic, so do not expect me to either defend or speak for the pope, but the Catholic Church
Whether ordinary people or the priesthood reading the Bible none of them can deny it states sexual activity should only take place in a heterosexual marriage
They can and frequently do.
Hebrews 13:4 Marriage should be honored by all, and the marriage bed kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral.
1 Corinthians 6:18 Run from sexual sin! No other sin so clearly affects the body as this one does. For sexual immorality is a sin against your own body.
Neither quote mentions homosexuality.
In much of the Bible the relationship between man and God is allegorically described as a marriage. The condemnation of adultery should be understood in this context as a lack of religious fidelity.
Could be understood, not should, surely? Each to their own (to a certain extent)
Hebrews 13:4 Marriage should be honored by all, and the marriage bed kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral.
1 Corinthians 6:18 Run from sexual sin! No other sin so clearly affects the body as this one does. For sexual immorality is a sin against your own body.
God knocked up a woman without her consent or without marrying her,
He's the last fucking person to lecture anyone about sexual morality.
I believe that was the immaculate conception!
Impregnating a woman without her consent is called in these parts.
Farron sounds like he is in a right royal pickle over this gay shagging lark. Putting me off voting Liberal, truth be told. But May is also God Squad, I understand. Has anyone asked her whether she considers gay sex the work of Lord Beelzebub?
I would be very interested in her answer, given the struggles Farron has had with it (and I know one Tory-considering-LD who has been put off by his answers to date, so what they'd do if May said the same things IDK)
Go Green maybe but this is all ridiculous, gay marriage is legal and both Farron and May voted for it but as they are both practising Christians they cannot contradict Biblical teaching that any sex outside heterosexual marriage is a sin but then lots of things are sins that does not mean they are all going to be made illegal!
Rubbish. Several tons of crap spouted by the bible is ignored at Christians' convenience. It is demonstrably possible to be religious and oppose much of the shite that surrounds it.
Does it matter, in any way? This is a trivial issue.
It sort of is, granted. Yet when considering whether to vote for someone, you also look at values. Considering gay sex sinful is not only nuts, it is also inhumane.
Why is it inhumane? Is he proposing to arrest anybody who has gay sex and parade them around the streets with a placard? Of course not, however that does not change the fact it is a sin just as anybody who has sex before heterosexual marriage has committed a sin or anybody who has committed adultery has committed a sin, you may not be religious and disagree with that which is fine but that does not change the definition of what is a sin in religious terms even if the sinful act is legal
No you are conflating what the bible says with what he believes. The question was not whether the bible considers gay sex a sin (clearly it does). The question was whether he considers it a sin (he does not, as it transpires). Most Christians pick and choose from the bible - quite reasonably. Otherwise they would all beat their children with God on their side.
He does think it is a sin, he changed his position because of political pressure and yes some Christians do still smack their children too
What about touching the skin of an animal on the Sabbath?
That is more Judaism than Christianity but certainly some Orthodox Jews avoid that too
Hebrews 13:4 Marriage should be honored by all, and the marriage bed kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral.
1 Corinthians 6:18 Run from sexual sin! No other sin so clearly affects the body as this one does. For sexual immorality is a sin against your own body.
God knocked up a woman without her consent or without marrying her,
He's the last fucking person to lecture anyone about sexual morality.
I believe that was the immaculate conception!
Impregnating a woman without her consent is called in these parts.
Farron sounds like he is in a right royal pickle over this gay shagging lark. Putting me off voting Liberal, truth be told. But May is also God Squad, I understand. Has anyone asked her whether she considers gay sex the work of Lord Beelzebub?
I would be very interested in her answer, given the struggles Farron has had with it (and I know one Tory-considering-LD who has been put off by his answers to date, so what they'd do if May said the same things IDK)
Go Green maybe but this is all
Rubbish. Several tons of crap spouted by the bible is ignored at Christians' convenience. It is demonstrably possible to be religious and oppose much of the shite that surrounds it.
To give Michael Gove (a christian) some credit (never thought I would say that!) - he had no problem saying straight away that gay sex was not a sin. Farron messed up here.
Surely Christians believe that all extramarital sex is sinful?
They do, Gove was just putting politics before religion
You do not speak for all Christians!
former
I am no Catholic, so do not expect me to either defend or speak for the pope, but the Catholic Church
Whether ordinary people or the priesthood reading the Bible none of them can deny it states sexual activity should only take place in a heterosexual marriage
They can and frequently do.
.
Neither quote mentions homosexuality.
In much of the Bible the relationship between man and God is allegorically described as a marriage. The condemnation of adultery should be understood in this context as a lack of religious fidelity.
You shall not lie with a male as with a woman. It is an abomination. (NKJ, Leviticus 18:22)
Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God. (NIV, 1st Corinthians 6:9-11)
Hebrews 13:4 Marriage should be honored by all, and the marriage bed kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral.
1 Corinthians 6:18 Run from sexual sin! No other sin so clearly affects the body as this one does. For sexual immorality is a sin against your own body.
God knocked up a woman without her consent or without marrying her,
He's the last fucking person to lecture anyone about sexual morality.
I believe that was the immaculate conception!
The immaculate conception was of Mary by her parents, not of Jesus.
Farron sounds like he is in a right royal pickle over this gay shagging lark. Putting me off voting Liberal, truth be told. But May is also God Squad, I understand. Has anyone asked her whether she considers gay sex the work of Lord Beelzebub?
I would be very interested in her answer, given the struggles Farron has had with it (and I know one Tory-considering-LD who has been put off by his answers to date, so what they'd do if May said the same things IDK)
Go Green maybe but this is all ridiculous, gay marriage is legal and both Farron and May voted for it but as they are both practising Christians they cannot contradict Biblical teaching that any sex outside heterosexual marriage is a sin but then lots of things are sins that does not mean they are all going to be made illegal!
Rubbish. Several tons of crap spouted by the bible is ignored at Christians' convenience. It is demonstrably possible to be religious and oppose much of the shite that surrounds it.
Does it matter, in any way? This is a trivial issue.
It sort of is, granted. Yet when considering whether to vote for someone, you also look at values. Considering gay sex sinful is not only nuts, it is also inhumane.
Why is it inhumane? Is he proposing to arrest anybody who has gay sex and parade them around the streets with a placard? Of course not, however that does not change the fact it is a sin just as anybody who has sex before heterosexual marriage has committed a sin or anybody who has committed adultery has committed a sin, you may not be religious and disagree with that which is fine but that does not change the definition of what is a sin in religious terms even if the sinful act is legal
No you are conflating what the bible says with what he believes. The question was not whether the bible considers gay sex a sin (clearly it does). The question was whether he considers it a sin (he does not, as it transpires). Most Christians pick and choose from the bible - quite reasonably. Otherwise they would all beat their children with God on their side.
He does think it is a sin, he changed his position because of political pressure and yes some Christians do still smack their children too
What about touching the skin of an animal on the Sabbath?
That is more Judaism than Christianity but certainly some Orthodox Jews avoid that too
Hebrews 13:4 Marriage should be honored by all, and the marriage bed kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral.
1 Corinthians 6:18 Run from sexual sin! No other sin so clearly affects the body as this one does. For sexual immorality is a sin against your own body.
God knocked up a woman without her consent or without marrying her,
He's the last fucking person to lecture anyone about sexual morality.
I believe that was the immaculate conception!
The immaculate conception was of Mary by her parents, not of Jesus.
In Catholic theology both are immaculate, as I recall. Indeed Mary remained immaculate after the birth of Jesus. Apparently his (half) brothers were cousins.
Say what you like about God. When people start taking the mickey out of his Prophets because they are bald, he takes action!
2 Kings, Chapter 2 23 From there Elisha went up to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, some boys came out of the town and jeered at him. “Get out of here, baldy!” they said. “Get out of here, baldy!” 24 He turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the Lord. Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the boys.
Farron sounds like he is in a right royal pickle over this gay shagging lark. Putting me off voting Liberal, truth be told. But May is also God Squad, I understand. Has anyone asked her whether she considers gay sex the work of Lord Beelzebub?
I would be very interested in her answer, given the struggles Farron has had with it (and I know one Tory-considering-LD who has been put off by his answers to date, so what they'd do if May said the same things IDK)
Go Green maybe but this is all ridiculous, gay marriage is legal and both Farron and May voted for it but as they are both practising Christians they cannot contradict Biblical teaching that any sex outside heterosexual marriage is a sin but then lots of things are sins that does not mean they are all going to be made illegal!
Rubbish. Several tons of crap spouted by the bible is ignored at Christians' convenience. It is demonstrably possible to be religious and oppose much of the shite that surrounds it.
Does it matter, in any way? This is a trivial issue.
It sort of is, granted. Yet when considering whether to vote for someone, you also look at values. Considering gay sex sinful is not only nuts, it is also inhumane.
Why is it inhumane? Is he proposing to arrest anybody who has gay sex and parade them around the streets with a placard? Of course not, however that does not change the fact it is a sin just as anybody who has sex before heterosexual marriage has committed a sin or anybody who has committed adultery has committed a sin, you may not be religious and disagree with that which is fine but that does not change the definition of what is a sin in religious terms even if the sinful act is legal
No you are conflating what the bible says with what he .
He does think it is a sin, he changed his position because of political pressure and yes some Christians do still smack their children too
What about touching the skin of an animal on the Sabbath?
That is more Judaism than Christianity but certainly some Orthodox Jews avoid that too
It's in Leviticus!
There are still some very religious Christians who do barely anything on a Sunday just as Orthodox Jews do barely anything on a Saturday
Hebrews 13:4 Marriage should be honored by all, and the marriage bed kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral.
1 Corinthians 6:18 Run from sexual sin! No other sin so clearly affects the body as this one does. For sexual immorality is a sin against your own body.
God knocked up a woman without her consent or without marrying her,
He's the last fucking person to lecture anyone about sexual morality.
I believe that was the immaculate conception!
The immaculate conception was of Mary by her parents, not of Jesus.
It was the Immaculate Conception which enabled the Virgin Birth
Say what you like about God. When people start taking the mickey out of his Prophets because they are bald, he takes action!
2 Kings, Chapter 2 23 From there Elisha went up to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, some boys came out of the town and jeered at him. “Get out of here, baldy!” they said. “Get out of here, baldy!” 24 He turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the Lord. Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the boys.
Maybe the rest of the chapter provides more context for the moral lesson here?
Although, 42 boys (or more, since it doesn't say all of them were mauled) just came out of town to jeer at Elisha? Sounds to me like Bethel had a serious unemployment or lack of education problem depending on how old these boys were, and why so many had time to wander around jeering at people.
Given that the median age of the UK population as a whole is now just over 40 - and that, consequently, the median age of a voter can't be far off 50 - the Conservatives are at something of an advantage.
Say what you like about God. When people start taking the mickey out of his Prophets because they are bald, he takes action!
2 Kings, Chapter 2 23 From there Elisha went up to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, some boys came out of the town and jeered at him. “Get out of here, baldy!” they said. “Get out of here, baldy!” 24 He turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the Lord. Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the boys.
Might be a good idea for Paul Nuttall to attend church a bit more often before polling day!
You shall not lie with a male as with a woman. It is an abomination. (NKJ, Leviticus 18:22)
Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God. (NIV, 1st Corinthians 6:9-11)
Comments
That said I do like religious history (and the wars therein) and Jesus being proof of the existence of Zombies.
Clearly I am opposed to violence against children. Do you support it?
News to me.
Rotherham
Lab 8/13
Con 6/4
Wentworth & Dearne
Lab 1/200
Con 22/1
The Labour majority is smaller in Rotherham but the demographics for them are safer.
https://twitter.com/thetimes/status/856985676553867264
And to get various other Labour safe seats.
He's more useless than Will Straw.
*Thomas knew Jesus very well, but failed to recognise him. The Apostles who met a man on the road to Emmaus failed to recognise him as Jesus too. It seems as if the resurected Jesus was very different in appearance from his pre crucifixion body. I think this ambiguity is deliberate. Was this a physical reanimation, or a spiritual rebirth, visible in other people?
Wife: I hate to disturb you at work
Soon fixed...
David Prescott - political comedian (best known as writer of John prescotts tweets)
Jeremy Corbyn
Tom Watson
Glenis Willmott
Andy Kerr
Ann Black
Diana Holland
Jim Kennedy
Mary Turner
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/scottish-lib-dem-leader-willie-10269350
Andrew George,LD, has announced he is standing again in St. Ives - PP have promptly moved him to the favourite at 4/6. Dan Rogerson (Cornwall North) and Stephen Gilbert (St. Austell & Newquay) are also standing again - they weren't exactly stars but neither are the current Tory MPs for those seats (Scott Mann and Steve Double) both of whom have made pratts of themselves recently. PP at 5/1. Sir Nick Harvey is also standing again in North Devon - PP at 3/1.
Personally, I am more optimistic for LD success in the SW than the polls would suggest. There is a widespread feeling that the Tories are taking the region for granted again - David Cameron's promise of rail and road improvements after the Dawlish debacle simply haven't happened. Even the normally pro-Tory 'Western Morning News' had a pop last week, arguing for LD MPs in the region to give it an independent voice and hold the the government to account. Ironically, the projected Tory landslide with no prospect of a Labour government will tempt some liberal Conservatives to do just that. The 2015 election expense investigation may also blow up in the middle of the campaign.
Devon and Cornwall are very much part of 'Leaverstan' , apart from the 'Remainia' enclaves of Exeter and the South Hams, but I think we have moved on, at least in part, from the EU referendum. Most folk have accepted the result, and the usual issues are coming back into play again. The LDs are reverting to their traditional 'Anybody but Tory' role in the SW, particulary now that UKIP is collapsing. Memories of the Coalition and tuition fees are also fading.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/comment/tories-need-to-change-their-election-strategy-fjf6ggf68
I have also been undertaking a bit of an exercise in geekery, and have built a spreadsheet to study what Ukip defections could do for the Tories in their target seats and most marginal defences. As you might expect, the results are ugly for Labour: take the previous election results and apply a uniform swing of 50% of Ukip voters from Ukip to Con across the board, and 36 opposition seats - the great majority of them Labour - fall immediately to the Tories before any other movements between the parties begin to be taken into account.
Ukip defections could also help to move a lot more Tory target seats from safe to marginal, and from marginal to highly marginal, whilst moving Conservative-held seats in the opposite direction and making the Government's defence of its own territory substantially easier. Again, move 50% of 2015 Ukip votes into the Tory column, and only two of their seats - Croydon Central and Dumfriesshire - are held with majorities of less than 5%.
All of this, of course, is before you even start running down Labour's vote, and sharing out perhaps another 1.5m or more of their voters between the Conservatives and the Liberal Democrats. Where might it end?
*Damn, again that cannot be right, 'people like me' are out to get the LDs, what's going on?
As long as he doesn't discriminate against people does it actually matter?
See here
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/jeremy-corbyn-trade-unions-safe-vacant-labour-seats-carve-up-deal-tom-watson_uk_58ffb9dce4b0073d3e7a21c5?5pg
Basically
Corbyn would get Sam Tarry in Hull West and he's pushing Kary Clark in Leigh (against Burnham's wishes ...and that explains the unusual open letter to the NEC by Bunrham in favour of the local Cllr)
Watson would get Stephanie Peacock in Barnsley East and Ellie Reeves in Lewisham West
And the Blairites would get Kendall's aide Mark Ferguson in Blaydon.
Let's see what the final outcome will be....
Marriage should be honored by all, and the marriage bed kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral.
1 Corinthians 6:18
Run from sexual sin! No other sin so clearly affects the body as this one does. For sexual immorality is a sin against your own body.
He's the last fucking person to lecture anyone about sexual morality.
Ellie Reeves in Lewisham West is the only one that makes some sense. She's a member of Lewisham Deptford CLP
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/04/25/labour-has-become-irrelevant-just-brexit-presents-huge-opportunity/
(Possibly £)
Is that a bigger move percentage wise than Hull West ?
In much of the Bible the relationship between man and God is allegorically described as a marriage. The condemnation of adultery should be understood in this context as a lack of religious fidelity.
Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God. (NIV, 1st Corinthians 6:9-11)
Hope they don't do that with the general election!
Next up - is 3 really the magic number :-)
#firstworldproblem
Not that I believe Catholic theology.
"describe the worst oral sex you ever had"
"Fantastic"
I know, I know - but it made me laugh at the time.
2 Kings, Chapter 2
23 From there Elisha went up to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, some boys came out of the town and jeered at him. “Get out of here, baldy!” they said. “Get out of here, baldy!”
24 He turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the Lord. Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the boys.
http://election.pressassociation.com/Declaration_times/all_2017_by_time.php
Although, 42 boys (or more, since it doesn't say all of them were mauled) just came out of town to jeer at Elisha? Sounds to me like Bethel had a serious unemployment or lack of education problem depending on how old these boys were, and why so many had time to wander around jeering at people.
Makes complete sense.
Given that the median age of the UK population as a whole is now just over 40 - and that, consequently, the median age of a voter can't be far off 50 - the Conservatives are at something of an advantage.