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    JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    I'm wondering how many totally cringeworthy and behind the sofa moments we'll have to endure from Jezza.

    Keep him away from trains, bacon sarnies, stone masons, Dianne Abbott, the PLP and 40 million voters and he might, just might, avoid falling behind the SNP ....

    Con GAIN Bolsover ....
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    isamisam Posts: 40,930

    Corker of a match in Madrid.

    Vidal's just been sent off for winning the ball! Shocking decision
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    Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256
    MTimT said:

    Scott_P said:

    Has Corbyn had a bang to the head? Is he intellectually sub-normal in some way?

    @paulwaugh: PLP debating how party should vote on May motion. I've been told several Lab MPs will abstain tmrw (cos same as voting against)

    @paulwaugh: Corbyn tells MPs: we have to support May dissolution motion cos anything else is supporting a Tory govt. "Simple as that"

    He really must be a Tory mole. Or the most stupid MP at Westminster (sorry Pete)

    For once, Corbyn is right. You cannot possibly say a Tory Government is a wicked thing, crushing the poor and disabled under foot, then vote against a General Election. It may well be that it is a personal tragedy and a disaster for his party. But the response he gave was the only one open to him.
    You are Jeremy Corbyn and I claim my £5
    Ha! I think he's a disaster... I just don't see, here, what he can possibly do. The Fixed Terms Parliament Act was primarily to enable, where a coalition breaks down, an alternative Government to be formed without the outgoing PM preventing that.

    For an opposition to a majority Government to say, as SeanT says, "let the baby eating continue until we've got our sh1t together" is ludicrous. Where I depart from Sean is that I don't think it's only because Corbyn is aggressive in his anti Tory rhetoric... same would have been the case in 2008 say had Act been in place then and Tories called upon by new PM Brown.
    Put another way, what use is a political party that is unwilling to face the voters?
    Timing is everything...
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    kle4 said:

    SeanT said:

    Agreed. He was trapped by his - and his party's - inflamed rhetoric. "The Tories eat babies! - but we want the baby eating to continue while we are having an internal debate about reselections"

    Not very sellable. Labour have no choice but to agree to an election.

    What? Since when did being consistent become an attribute of Corbynism? Surely the whole cult depends on not questioning anything the glorious leader says no matter how barking it is? History exists only for rewriting!!!
    Its meant to be an attribute of Corbyn, who's appeal boils down to being 'different' from other politicians, and utterly consistent in his principles.
    Well then, he would have been better keeping the govt on a small majority where he might stand a chance of defeating them as opposed to trying to defeat them on 50 or 60+ majorities were they can simply pass any policy they like whilst Labour stand by watching helplessly.

    The man's a fool.
    Sure... he'd prefer for there NOT to be an election. That's totally different from voting against there being one when the motion is pit before Parliament.

    Again, you just can't say the Government is killing the poor and sick, then say they ought to do it for three more years. It's an offer you can't refuse, however much you'd love to.
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    isam said:

    Corker of a match in Madrid.

    Vidal's just been sent off for winning the ball! Shocking decision
    He's had an eventful tie, missed a penalty, scored a goal, and got sent off, for winning the ball.
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    another_richardanother_richard Posts: 25,091
    Entering controversial areas.

    But considering this is a betting site.

    We could do with the return of someone with a good prediction record.

    No, not StuartTruth.

    I mean RodCrosby.
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    JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    Wot No Nick Palmer today .....
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    edited April 2017

    Again, you just can't say the Government is killing the poor and sick, then say they ought to do it for three more years. It's an offer you can't refuse, however much you'd love to.

    You can (once again) quote the PM's own words.

    "No election during Brexit"

    All they have to do is abstain. That would leave Tezza up a certain creek without a certain mandate...
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    calumcalum Posts: 3,046

    calum said:

    murali_s said:

    I see sky is also pushing this voter fatigue meme...Despite their own polling saying no.

    It's like the bbc and sky London liberal elite are out of touch with the public...

    Is there any civilised life outside the M25?
    Edinburgh?
    Only in Morningside !
    I stayed in Morningside in the early sixties
    I stayed there in early 80s - I used to see the Proclaimers in Morrisons (Safeways back then) - not sure if this enhances or diminishes the areas civilised credentials !!
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    another_richardanother_richard Posts: 25,091
    BTW does anyone know if there are foreign equivalents of PB ?

    Do punters in Poland discuss UK constituency bets ?

    Or anoraks in Austria obsess about May and Corbyn's poll ratings ?

    Or are we unique ?
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,125

    kle4 said:

    SeanT said:

    Agreed. He was trapped by his - and his party's - inflamed rhetoric. "The Tories eat babies! - but we want the baby eating to continue while we are having an internal debate about reselections"

    Not very sellable. Labour have no choice but to agree to an election.

    What? Since when did being consistent become an attribute of Corbynism? Surely the whole cult depends on not questioning anything the glorious leader says no matter how barking it is? History exists only for rewriting!!!
    Its meant to be an attribute of Corbyn, who's appeal boils down to being 'different' from other politicians, and utterly consistent in his principles.
    Well then, he would have been better keeping the govt on a small majority where he might stand a chance of defeating them as opposed to trying to defeat them on 50 or 60+ majorities were they can simply pass any policy they like whilst Labour stand by watching helplessly.

    The man's a fool.
    Sure... he'd prefer for there NOT to be an election. That's totally different from voting against there being one when the motion is pit before Parliament.

    Again, you just can't say the Government is killing the poor and sick, then say they ought to do it for three more years. It's an offer you can't refuse, however much you'd love to.
    As some of us pointed out when, thread after thread, we were told the FTPA made an early election impossible.....
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    calumcalum Posts: 3,046
    AnneJGP said:

    calum said:

    On a lighter note I've been reading up on witch trials in central Scotland - which it turns out was the witch hunting capital of Europe - you were 4 times more likely to be accused of being a witch in this area than the European average:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Witch_trials_in_early_modern_Scotland

    "Reading up on" sounds so much more .... um .... active than "reading about" - what are you planning to do with your research, if I might ask?

    There's a few local alleged witch trial sites - so I thought I'd take a look into the background !!
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    If Labour abstained, TMay would have to have a vote of no confidence in her own Government.

    He (well, a competent leader) could sell that as the Government agreeing with him that they eat babies, and they would vote to stop themselves
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,472
    edited April 2017
    SeanT said:

    Entering controversial areas.

    But considering this is a betting site.

    We could do with the return of someone with a good prediction record.

    No, not StuartTruth.

    I mean RodCrosby.

    If Rod Crosby would agree to foreswear the discussion of certain subjects, I think we should welcome him back. He's a bit of a mensch.

    However, 1. I'm not sure he'd agree, and 2. It ain't my site
    I will ask OGH.

    He did test Mike's patience about repeatedly talking about you know what despite being asked nicely on several occasions not to do so.
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    JohnOJohnO Posts: 4,215

    Pong said:

    Is Clegg sticking around then?

    If so, I'm guessing he'll win Sheffield Hallam at a canter.

    Yup and yup.

    I might even vote for him this time.
    And get yourself expelled from the Conservatives?
    Tactical vote to stop a Corbyn government.

    I will need JohnO's permission before I do.
    Hmmmm. Much pondering/
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    Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256

    kle4 said:

    SeanT said:

    Agreed. He was trapped by his - and his party's - inflamed rhetoric. "The Tories eat babies! - but we want the baby eating to continue while we are having an internal debate about reselections"

    Not very sellable. Labour have no choice but to agree to an election.

    What? Since when did being consistent become an attribute of Corbynism? Surely the whole cult depends on not questioning anything the glorious leader says no matter how barking it is? History exists only for rewriting!!!
    Its meant to be an attribute of Corbyn, who's appeal boils down to being 'different' from other politicians, and utterly consistent in his principles.
    Well then, he would have been better keeping the govt on a small majority where he might stand a chance of defeating them as opposed to trying to defeat them on 50 or 60+ majorities were they can simply pass any policy they like whilst Labour stand by watching helplessly.

    The man's a fool.
    Sure... he'd prefer for there NOT to be an election. That's totally different from voting against there being one when the motion is pit before Parliament.

    Again, you just can't say the Government is killing the poor and sick, then say they ought to do it for three more years. It's an offer you can't refuse, however much you'd love to.
    He could also say "If the Tories WANT an election, it is my job to oppose that and say NO"
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,311
    edited April 2017
    On June 8th I realise I have booked to go and see Rosencrantz and Gildenstern are dead. A meditation on mortality so perhaps appropriate after all, that said.

    The luvvies, however, might be in shock by the curtain call.
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    dyingswandyingswan Posts: 189
    The PLP decided tonight that the Labour Party slogan in GE 2017 will be-
    51 Days To Save The NHS(Northern Heartland Seats). Jezza had argued for Make Venezuela Great Again.
  • Options
    JohnO said:

    Pong said:

    Is Clegg sticking around then?

    If so, I'm guessing he'll win Sheffield Hallam at a canter.

    Yup and yup.

    I might even vote for him this time.
    And get yourself expelled from the Conservatives?
    Tactical vote to stop a Corbyn government.

    I will need JohnO's permission before I do.
    Hmmmm. Much pondering/
    How about I move to Broxtowe and voted for Anna Soubry, would that be more acceptable?

    I'm also registered to vote in Manchester Central, I could vote Tory there..
  • Options
    Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256
    dyingswan said:

    The PLP decided tonight that the Labour Party slogan in GE 2017 will be-
    51 Days To Save The NHS(Northern Heartland Seats). Jezza had argued for Make Venezuela Great Again.

    I wish I could believe that you made those up, however, given Corbyn's record to date ....... :D:D
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,125
    TOPPING said:

    On June 8th I realise I have booked to go and see Rosencrantz and Gildenstern are dead. A meditation on mortality so perhaps appropriate after all, that said.

    The luvvies, however, might be in shock by the curtain call.

    It's being screened at your local cinema on Thursday.....
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    HaroldOHaroldO Posts: 1,185
    Scott_P said:

    If Labour abstained, TMay would have to have a vote of no confidence in her own Government.

    He (well, a competent leader) could sell that as the Government agreeing with him that they eat babies, and they would vote to stop themselves

    Yes, because parliamentary technicalities are easy to manifest in short soundbites to the public.
  • Options
    JohnOJohnO Posts: 4,215

    JohnO said:

    Pong said:

    Is Clegg sticking around then?

    If so, I'm guessing he'll win Sheffield Hallam at a canter.

    Yup and yup.

    I might even vote for him this time.
    And get yourself expelled from the Conservatives?
    Tactical vote to stop a Corbyn government.

    I will need JohnO's permission before I do.
    Hmmmm. Much pondering/
    How about I move to Broxtowe and voted for Anna Soubry, would that be more acceptable?

    I'm also registered to vote in Manchester Central, I could vote Tory there..
    That would be ideal. You have plenary authority.
  • Options
    HaroldOHaroldO Posts: 1,185
    TOPPING said:

    On June 8th I realise I have booked to go and see Rosencrantz and Gildenstern are dead. A meditation on mortality so perhaps appropriate after all, that said.

    The luvvies, however, might be in shock by the curtain call.

    This provincial type is seeing it in the cinema thursday.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,311

    kle4 said:

    SeanT said:

    Agreed. He was trapped by his - and his party's - inflamed rhetoric. "The Tories eat babies! - but we want the baby eating to continue while we are having an internal debate about reselections"

    Not very sellable. Labour have no choice but to agree to an election.

    What? Since when did being consistent become an attribute of Corbynism? Surely the whole cult depends on not questioning anything the glorious leader says no matter how barking it is? History exists only for rewriting!!!
    Its meant to be an attribute of Corbyn, who's appeal boils down to being 'different' from other politicians, and utterly consistent in his principles.
    Well then, he would have been better keeping the govt on a small majority where he might stand a chance of defeating them as opposed to trying to defeat them on 50 or 60+ majorities were they can simply pass any policy they like whilst Labour stand by watching helplessly.

    The man's a fool.
    Sure... he'd prefer for there NOT to be an election. That's totally different from voting against there being one when the motion is pit before Parliament.

    Again, you just can't say the Government is killing the poor and sick, then say they ought to do it for three more years. It's an offer you can't refuse, however much you'd love to.
    He could also say "If the Tories WANT an election, it is my job to oppose that and say NO"
    As has been rehearsed on here many times, it is impossible for an opposition to refuse the opportunity for a GE. There is simply no credible line to take against it.
  • Options
    JackWJackW Posts: 14,787

    BTW does anyone know if there are foreign equivalents of PB ?

    Do punters in Poland discuss UK constituency bets ?

    Or anoraks in Austria obsess about May and Corbyn's poll ratings ?

    Or are we unique ?

    I seem to recall in the dinosaur age of PB (when only old fossils, including moi, were on site) we had an Oz poster who linked to their site.
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    BTW does anyone know if there are foreign equivalents of PB ?

    Do punters in Poland discuss UK constituency bets ?

    Or anoraks in Austria obsess about May and Corbyn's poll ratings ?

    Or are we unique ?

    Unique, I chatted to one journalist from America, and we're one of the few countries that has such open, liberal, and legel betting markets.

    We get a lot of traffic from America when we do a thread on Trump getting impeached.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,929

    JohnO said:

    Pong said:

    Is Clegg sticking around then?

    If so, I'm guessing he'll win Sheffield Hallam at a canter.

    Yup and yup.

    I might even vote for him this time.
    And get yourself expelled from the Conservatives?
    Tactical vote to stop a Corbyn government.

    I will need JohnO's permission before I do.
    Hmmmm. Much pondering/
    How about I move to Broxtowe and voted for Anna Soubry, would that be more acceptable?

    I'm also registered to vote in Manchester Central, I could vote Tory there..
    Up for some delivery round Dore ?
  • Options
    JohnO said:

    JohnO said:

    Pong said:

    Is Clegg sticking around then?

    If so, I'm guessing he'll win Sheffield Hallam at a canter.

    Yup and yup.

    I might even vote for him this time.
    And get yourself expelled from the Conservatives?
    Tactical vote to stop a Corbyn government.

    I will need JohnO's permission before I do.
    Hmmmm. Much pondering/
    How about I move to Broxtowe and voted for Anna Soubry, would that be more acceptable?

    I'm also registered to vote in Manchester Central, I could vote Tory there..
    That would be ideal. You have plenary authority.
    Superb.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,311

    TOPPING said:

    On June 8th I realise I have booked to go and see Rosencrantz and Gildenstern are dead. A meditation on mortality so perhaps appropriate after all, that said.

    The luvvies, however, might be in shock by the curtain call.

    It's being screened at your local cinema on Thursday.....
    Yes I saw that it's being shown. All booked though and it's a night up West.
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    TOPPING said:

    There is simply no credible line to take against it.

    Was it a credible line when Tezza said "No GE before Brexit"?

    If she could say it last week, Jezza could say it this week.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,779
    SeanT said:

    Exactly. This election surely means a Soft-ISH Brexit.

    UKIP need that message to be heard loud and clear.
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    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901
    Is someone trying to get Ken Livingstone back on the site?
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    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    TOPPING said:

    kle4 said:

    SeanT said:

    Agreed. He was trapped by his - and his party's - inflamed rhetoric. "The Tories eat babies! - but we want the baby eating to continue while we are having an internal debate about reselections"

    Not very sellable. Labour have no choice but to agree to an election.

    What? Since when did being consistent become an attribute of Corbynism? Surely the whole cult depends on not questioning anything the glorious leader says no matter how barking it is? History exists only for rewriting!!!
    Its meant to be an attribute of Corbyn, who's appeal boils down to being 'different' from other politicians, and utterly consistent in his principles.
    Well then, he would have been better keeping the govt on a small majority where he might stand a chance of defeating them as opposed to trying to defeat them on 50 or 60+ majorities were they can simply pass any policy they like whilst Labour stand by watching helplessly.

    The man's a fool.
    Sure... he'd prefer for there NOT to be an election. That's totally different from voting against there being one when the motion is pit before Parliament.

    Again, you just can't say the Government is killing the poor and sick, then say they ought to do it for three more years. It's an offer you can't refuse, however much you'd love to.
    He could also say "If the Tories WANT an election, it is my job to oppose that and say NO"
    As has been rehearsed on here many times, it is impossible for an opposition to refuse the opportunity for a GE. There is simply no credible line to take against it.
    You are right but how was the FTPA ever supposed to work?
  • Options
    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Just checking out the markets on Ladbrokes and perusing my 2015 GE bets.

    The odds I got on Scottish constituencies in Jan 2015 were just nuts

    Gordon 1/7
    Coatbridge 3/1
    Dundee West 2/5 !!!
    Kilmarnock Evens

    Even the bets I put on in March were still and nuts odds (SNP -Ayrshire Central - Evens). Don't think we will see those kind of odds this time round
  • Options
    Pulpstar said:

    JohnO said:

    Pong said:

    Is Clegg sticking around then?

    If so, I'm guessing he'll win Sheffield Hallam at a canter.

    Yup and yup.

    I might even vote for him this time.
    And get yourself expelled from the Conservatives?
    Tactical vote to stop a Corbyn government.

    I will need JohnO's permission before I do.
    Hmmmm. Much pondering/
    How about I move to Broxtowe and voted for Anna Soubry, would that be more acceptable?

    I'm also registered to vote in Manchester Central, I could vote Tory there..
    Up for some delivery round Dore ?
    No, Sheffield is obsessed with trees at the moment, and the cutting of them by the council.

    I'm not sure I could cope.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,311
    Scott_P said:

    TOPPING said:

    There is simply no credible line to take against it.

    Was it a credible line when Tezza said "No GE before Brexit"?

    If she could say it last week, Jezza could say it this week.
    It's the official opposition whose sole purpose is to dethrone the government.

    Now of course it's Jezza we're talking about but even still.
  • Options
    Scott_P said:

    Again, you just can't say the Government is killing the poor and sick, then say they ought to do it for three more years. It's an offer you can't refuse, however much you'd love to.

    You can (once again) quote the PM's own words.

    "No election during Brexit"

    All they have to do is abstain. That would leave Tezza up a certain creek without a certain mandate...
    Either she says, "Okay, but you can never say I failed to offer the public a choice... I did, and you denied it to them. And I will raise that failure EVERY time you criticise my policies... that you had the chance and bottled it".

    Or she repeals the FTPA and says, "Sadly, I had no choice as little Jeremy was running scared and wanted to deny the nation their democratic right."
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    JohnOJohnO Posts: 4,215
    SeanT said:

    Exactly. This election surely means a Soft-ISH Brexit. I don't understand why Remainers are so gloomy (apart from those who are adamant eu-Federalists, or those who seriously thought the vote could be reversed)

    I deployed precisely that argument to an irascible remainer this afternoon (who will likely vote for us - I mean me - in the May 4th locals but unlikely to do the same in June): she was far from convinced.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,311
    edited April 2017

    TOPPING said:

    kle4 said:

    SeanT said:

    Agreed. He was trapped by his - and his party's - inflamed rhetoric. "The Tories eat babies! - but we want the baby eating to continue while we are having an internal debate about reselections"

    Not very sellable. Labour have no choice but to agree to an election.

    What? Since when did being consistent become an attribute of Corbynism? Surely the whole cult depends on not questioning anything the glorious leader says no matter how barking it is? History exists only for rewriting!!!
    Its meant to be an attribute of Corbyn, who's appeal boils down to being 'different' from other politicians, and utterly consistent in his principles.
    Well then, he would have been better keeping the govt on a small majority where he might stand a chance of defeating them as opposed to trying to defeat them on 50 or 60+ majorities were they can simply pass any policy they like whilst Labour stand by watching helplessly.

    The man's a fool.
    Sure... he'd prefer for there NOT to be an election. That's totally different from voting against there being one when the motion is pit before Parliament.

    Again, you just can't say the Government is killing the poor and sick, then say they ought to do it for three more years. It's an offer you can't refuse, however much you'd love to.
    He could also say "If the Tories WANT an election, it is my job to oppose that and say NO"
    As has been rehearsed on here many times, it is impossible for an opposition to refuse the opportunity for a GE. There is simply no credible line to take against it.
    You are right but how was the FTPA ever supposed to work?
    As we have seen, it evidently never was. It was a free option for the government.

    It of course had meaning when the government was a coalition.
  • Options

    TOPPING said:

    kle4 said:

    SeanT said:

    Agreed. He was trapped by his - and his party's - inflamed rhetoric. "The Tories eat babies! - but we want the baby eating to continue while we are having an internal debate about reselections"

    Not very sellable. Labour have no choice but to agree to an election.

    What? Since when did being consistent become an attribute of Corbynism? Surely the whole cult depends on not questioning anything the glorious leader says no matter how barking it is? History exists only for rewriting!!!
    Its meant to be an attribute of Corbyn, who's appeal boils down to being 'different' from other politicians, and utterly consistent in his principles.
    Well then, he would have been better keeping the govt on a small majority where he might stand a chance of defeating them as opposed to trying to defeat them on 50 or 60+ majorities were they can simply pass any policy they like whilst Labour stand by watching helplessly.

    The man's a fool.
    Sure... he'd prefer for there NOT to be an election. That's totally different from voting against there being one when the motion is pit before Parliament.

    Again, you just can't say the Government is killing the poor and sick, then say they ought to do it for three more years. It's an offer you can't refuse, however much you'd love to.
    He could also say "If the Tories WANT an election, it is my job to oppose that and say NO"
    As has been rehearsed on here many times, it is impossible for an opposition to refuse the opportunity for a GE. There is simply no credible line to take against it.
    You are right but how was the FTPA ever supposed to work?
    The FPTA was a brilliant idea, except it had one eensy teensy weensy flaw, it never prepared for the possibility of a majority government between 2010 and 2020.
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    edited April 2017

    Either she says, "Okay, but you can never say I failed to offer the public a choice... I did, and you denied it to them. And I will raise that failure EVERY time you criticise my policies... that you had the chance and bottled it".

    Unless the reason she is cutting and running now is before any number of chickens come home to roost. In which case all he has to do is wait her out.
  • Options
    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901
    Sigh
  • Options
    Hills have a market on the size of the Tory Majority:

    >100 seats ....... 2.10

    <100 seats (or no maj) ..... 1.67

    They limited me to £15
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,125
    TOPPING said:

    TOPPING said:

    On June 8th I realise I have booked to go and see Rosencrantz and Gildenstern are dead. A meditation on mortality so perhaps appropriate after all, that said.

    The luvvies, however, might be in shock by the curtain call.

    It's being screened at your local cinema on Thursday.....
    Yes I saw that it's being shown. All booked though and it's a night up West.
    Fair enough - I'll let you know what I thought.....
  • Options
    Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256
    TOPPING said:

    On June 8th I realise I have booked to go and see Rosencrantz and Gildenstern are dead. A meditation on mortality so perhaps appropriate after all, that said.

    The luvvies, however, might be in shock by the curtain call.

    Please note that there is a variation to the original programme. Due to the election, the play will now be replaced with "Corbyn and Labour are dead"

  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,779
    I'm disappointed - I was hoping the twitter reaction to John Woodcock saying he was standing again but could not countenance JC being PM would be filled with nothing but outraged bile, but there's a fair amount of praise and respect in there too.
  • Options
    Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256

    TOPPING said:

    kle4 said:

    SeanT said:

    Agreed. He was trapped by his - and his party's - inflamed rhetoric. "The Tories eat babies! - but we want the baby eating to continue while we are having an internal debate about reselections"

    Not very sellable. Labour have no choice but to agree to an election.

    What? Since when did being consistent become an attribute of Corbynism? Surely the whole cult depends on not questioning anything the glorious leader says no matter how barking it is? History exists only for rewriting!!!
    Its meant to be an attribute of Corbyn, who's appeal boils down to being 'different' from other politicians, and utterly consistent in his principles.
    Well then, he would have been better keeping the govt on a small majority where he might stand a chance of defeating them as opposed to trying to defeat them on 50 or 60+ majorities were they can simply pass any policy they like whilst Labour stand by watching helplessly.

    The man's a fool.
    Sure... he'd prefer for there NOT to be an election. That's totally different from voting against there being one when the motion is pit before Parliament.

    Again, you just can't say the Government is killing the poor and sick, then say they ought to do it for three more years. It's an offer you can't refuse, however much you'd love to.
    He could also say "If the Tories WANT an election, it is my job to oppose that and say NO"
    As has been rehearsed on here many times, it is impossible for an opposition to refuse the opportunity for a GE. There is simply no credible line to take against it.
    You are right but how was the FTPA ever supposed to work?
    The FPTA was a brilliant idea, except it had one eensy teensy weensy flaw, it never prepared for the possibility of a majority government between 2010 and 2020.
    What we need in this country is a form of AV!
  • Options
    AnneJGPAnneJGP Posts: 2,869
    calum said:

    AnneJGP said:

    calum said:

    On a lighter note I've been reading up on witch trials in central Scotland - which it turns out was the witch hunting capital of Europe - you were 4 times more likely to be accused of being a witch in this area than the European average:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Witch_trials_in_early_modern_Scotland

    "Reading up on" sounds so much more .... um .... active than "reading about" - what are you planning to do with your research, if I might ask?

    There's a few local alleged witch trial sites - so I thought I'd take a look into the background !!
    That's a relief - it sounded a bit as though witch trials were about to become the Next Big Thing again.
  • Options
    another_richardanother_richard Posts: 25,091

    Hills have a market on the size of the Tory Majority:

    >100 seats ....... 2.10

    <100 seats (or no maj) ..... 1.67

    They limited me to £15</p>

    Which way did you bet if I may ask ?
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,311
    It's why Sturgeon is also mistaken and impotently frothing.

    The govt and in particular TMay has been accused of lacking a mandate, they are giving the country the opportunity to given them one. Or to give it to someone else.

    It is rarely a wrong move and never an egregious one, to give the people the vote.
  • Options
    SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    Is The Labour party meeting still going on, and are they still shouting at each other?
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,311

    TOPPING said:

    TOPPING said:

    On June 8th I realise I have booked to go and see Rosencrantz and Gildenstern are dead. A meditation on mortality so perhaps appropriate after all, that said.

    The luvvies, however, might be in shock by the curtain call.

    It's being screened at your local cinema on Thursday.....
    Yes I saw that it's being shown. All booked though and it's a night up West.
    Fair enough - I'll let you know what I thought.....
    Please do.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,311

    TOPPING said:

    On June 8th I realise I have booked to go and see Rosencrantz and Gildenstern are dead. A meditation on mortality so perhaps appropriate after all, that said.

    The luvvies, however, might be in shock by the curtain call.

    Please note that there is a variation to the original programme. Due to the election, the play will now be replaced with "Corbyn and Labour are dead"

    "The Sun rises in the East"?
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    Scott_P said:
    Nah, Mike and Robert have spent literally thousands of pounds on the PB server, that's why it didn't crash on GE 2015 night, or EUREf night, or when Trump won.
  • Options
    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Sky News poll finds 68% support early election. Not sure which company.
  • Options
    DadgeDadge Posts: 2,038
    I'm a remainer but I'm not gloomy because of the effect of the election on Brexit. That seems like a red herring to me - I don't believe that the election will have much of an impact on Brexit at all. (It is a convenient excuse for May to call the election though.) I'm gloomy for the old-fashioned reason that I don't want a Tory govt with a large majority and a free hand to push through its policies. I sincerely hope that the opposition parties won't get distracted by Brexit too much during the campaign, since (apart of course from about 5% of the electorate who will vote LibDem because of it) Brexit won't move many votes, and other things are much more important than the Brexit smokescreen.
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,125

    TOPPING said:

    kle4 said:

    SeanT said:

    Agreed. He was trapped by his - and his party's - inflamed rhetoric. "The Tories eat babies! - but we want the baby eating to continue while we are having an internal debate about reselections"

    Not very sellable. Labour have no choice but to agree to an election.

    What? Since when did being consistent become an attribute of Corbynism? Surely the whole cult depends on not questioning anything the glorious leader says no matter how barking it is? History exists only for rewriting!!!
    Its meant to be an attribute of Corbyn, who's appeal boils down to being 'different' from other politicians, and utterly consistent in his principles.
    Well then, he would have been better keeping the govt on a small majority where he might stand a chance of defeating them as opposed to trying to defeat them on 50 or 60+ majorities were they can simply pass any policy they like whilst Labour stand by watching helplessly.

    The man's a fool.
    Sure... he'd prefer for there NOT to be an election. That's totally different from voting against there being one when the motion is pit before Parliament.

    Again, you just can't say the Government is killing the poor and sick, then say they ought to do it for three more years. It's an offer you can't refuse, however much you'd love to.
    He could also say "If the Tories WANT an election, it is my job to oppose that and say NO"
    As has been rehearsed on here many times, it is impossible for an opposition to refuse the opportunity for a GE. There is simply no credible line to take against it.
    You are right but how was the FTPA ever supposed to work?
    The FPTA was a brilliant idea, except it had one eensy teensy weensy flaw, it never prepared for the possibility of a majority government between 2010 and 2020.
    And if it hadn't been for those pesky toffs, we'd have got away with it.....
  • Options

    kle4 said:

    SeanT said:

    Agreed. He was trapped by his - and his party's - inflamed rhetoric. "The Tories eat babies! - but we want the baby eating to continue while we are having an internal debate about reselections"

    Not very sellable. Labour have no choice but to agree to an election.

    What? Since when did being consistent become an attribute of Corbynism? Surely the whole cult depends on not questioning anything the glorious leader says no matter how barking it is? History exists only for rewriting!!!
    Its meant to be an attribute of Corbyn, who's appeal boils down to being 'different' from other politicians, and utterly consistent in his principles.
    Well then, he would have been better keeping the govt on a small majority where he might stand a chance of defeating them as opposed to trying to defeat them on 50 or 60+ majorities were they can simply pass any policy they like whilst Labour stand by watching helplessly.

    The man's a fool.
    Sure... he'd prefer for there NOT to be an election. That's totally different from voting against there being one when the motion is pit before Parliament.

    Again, you just can't say the Government is killing the poor and sick, then say they ought to do it for three more years. It's an offer you can't refuse, however much you'd love to.
    He could also say "If the Tories WANT an election, it is my job to oppose that and say NO"
    It's the Opposition's job to REPLACE the Government, not to oppose the only possible event that can allow them to replace the Government!

    I know Corbyn is a ludicrous chap in so many ways, but even he couldn't pull that line off.
  • Options
    PongPong Posts: 4,693
    edited April 2017
    SeanT said:

    Exactly. This election surely means a Soft-ISH Brexit. I don't understand why Remainers are so gloomy (apart from those who are adamant eu-Federalists, or those who seriously thought the vote could be reversed)

    The manifesto will be fascinating. We'll find out where the balance of power lies in government. I expect the brexit stuff will still be fluffy and vague, but on domestic policy there could be some real meat.

    TM will finally have an ideology.

    £350m/NHS (probably on fudged figures)?

    I'll go;

    1/2 Yes
    2/1 No
  • Options
    Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256
    TOPPING said:

    As has been rehearsed on here many times, it is impossible for an opposition to refuse the opportunity for a GE. There is simply no credible line to take against it.

    Maybe not before, but now the FTPA gives an option. Simply do nothing. If May wants an election let her get it organised - it is her problem. Failing that there is Spring 2020 which is when the next one is due.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,779

    Scott_P said:
    Nah, Mike and Robert have spent literally thousands of pounds on the PB server, that's why it didn't crash on GE 2015 night, or EUREf night, or when Trump won.
    What would it take to crash it? Corbyn winning the election? Though I suppose the national grid my struggle with that one.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,930
    edited April 2017

    nielh said:

    Any markets on the total number of seats for the lib dems?

    Betfair Sportsbook ar offering 5/6 either side of 25.5 seats
    I saw on twitter talk of 9/4 over 20%.. doesn't seem right compared to that line

    EDIT 2/1 Betfred
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,311
    Dadge said:

    I'm a remainer but I'm not gloomy because of the effect of the election on Brexit. That seems like a red herring to me - I don't believe that the election will have much of an impact on Brexit at all. (It is a convenient excuse for May to call the election though.) I'm gloomy for the old-fashioned reason that I don't want a Tory govt with a large majority and a free hand to push through its policies. I sincerely hope that the opposition parties won't get distracted by Brexit too much during the campaign, since (apart of course from about 5% of the electorate who will vote LibDem because of it) Brexit won't move many votes, and other things are much more important than the Brexit smokescreen.

    A credible Lab leader could make a lot of ground with the NHS in its current state. Regardless of the debate about what the NHS should look like, it is always a potent Lab tool in a GE. A further tragedy for Lab that Jezza renders it null.
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,125
    TOPPING said:

    It's why Sturgeon is also mistaken and impotently frothing.

    The govt and in particular TMay has been accused of lacking a mandate, they are giving the country the opportunity to given them one. Or to give it to someone else.

    It is rarely a wrong move and never an egregious one, to give the people the vote.

    Except when the dumb fucks use it to leave the EU?
  • Options
    Where's Alastair Meeks when you need him to spot those early bird value bets on the GE?
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,283

    kle4 said:

    SeanT said:

    Agreed. He was trapped by his - and his party's - inflamed rhetoric. "The Tories eat babies! - but we want the baby eating to continue while we are having an internal debate about reselections"

    Not very sellable. Labour have no choice but to agree to an election.

    What? Since when did being consistent become an attribute of Corbynism? Surely the whole cult depends on not questioning anything the glorious leader says no matter how barking it is? History exists only for rewriting!!!
    Its meant to be an attribute of Corbyn, who's appeal boils down to being 'different' from other politicians, and utterly consistent in his principles.
    Well then, he would have been better keeping the govt on a small majority where he might stand a chance of defeating them as opposed to trying to defeat them on 50 or 60+ majorities were they can simply pass any policy they like whilst Labour stand by watching helplessly.

    The man's a fool.
    Sure... he'd prefer for there NOT to be an election. That's totally different from voting against there being one when the motion is pit before Parliament.

    Again, you just can't say the Government is killing the poor and sick, then say they ought to do it for three more years. It's an offer you can't refuse, however much you'd love to.
    He could also say "If the Tories WANT an election, it is my job to oppose that and say NO"
    It's the Opposition's job to REPLACE the Government, not to oppose the only possible event that can allow them to replace the Government!

    I know Corbyn is a ludicrous chap in so many ways, but even he couldn't pull that line off.
    Indeed. It would make the remaining three years of this parliament (even more of) an impossibility for him. Thrown back in his face over and over.
  • Options
    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Interesting that most of us are expecting some LD gains from the Tories when in the national opinion polls there's a swing from LD to Con.
  • Options
    DadgeDadge Posts: 2,038
    TOPPING said:

    kle4 said:

    SeanT said:

    Agreed. He was trapped by his - and his party's - inflamed rhetoric. "The Tories eat babies! - but we want the baby eating to continue while we are having an internal debate about reselections"

    Not very sellable. Labour have no choice but to agree to an election.

    What? Since when did being consistent become an attribute of Corbynism? Surely the whole cult depends on not questioning anything the glorious leader says no matter how barking it is? History exists only for rewriting!!!
    Its meant to be an attribute of Corbyn, who's appeal boils down to being 'different' from other politicians, and utterly consistent in his principles.
    Well then, he would have been better keeping the govt on a small majority where he might stand a chance of defeating them as opposed to trying to defeat them on 50 or 60+ majorities were they can simply pass any policy they like whilst Labour stand by watching helplessly.

    The man's a fool.
    Sure... he'd prefer for there NOT to be an election. That's totally different from voting against there being one when the motion is pit before Parliament.

    Again, you just can't say the Government is killing the poor and sick, then say they ought to do it for three more years. It's an offer you can't refuse, however much you'd love to.
    He could also say "If the Tories WANT an election, it is my job to oppose that and say NO"
    As has been rehearsed on here many times, it is impossible for an opposition to refuse the opportunity for a GE. There is simply no credible line to take against it.
    He does have the expenses scandal - he could say that he wants to wait till the cases are brought, so that they aren't swept under the carpet.
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981

    TOPPING said:

    kle4 said:

    SeanT said:

    Agreed. He was trapped by his - and his party's - inflamed rhetoric. "The Tories eat babies! - but we want the baby eating to continue while we are having an internal debate about reselections"

    Not very sellable. Labour have no choice but to agree to an election.

    What? Since when did being consistent become an attribute of Corbynism? Surely the whole cult depends on not questioning anything the glorious leader says no matter how barking it is? History exists only for rewriting!!!
    Its meant to be an attribute of Corbyn, who's appeal boils down to being 'different' from other politicians, and utterly consistent in his principles.
    Well then, he would have been better keeping the govt on a small majority where he might stand a chance of defeating them as opposed to trying to defeat them on 50 or 60+ majorities were they can simply pass any policy they like whilst Labour stand by watching helplessly.

    The man's a fool.
    Sure... he'd prefer for there NOT to be an election. That's totally different from voting against there being one when the motion is pit before Parliament.

    Again, you just can't say the Government is killing the poor and sick, then say they ought to do it for three more years. It's an offer you can't refuse, however much you'd love to.
    He could also say "If the Tories WANT an election, it is my job to oppose that and say NO"
    As has been rehearsed on here many times, it is impossible for an opposition to refuse the opportunity for a GE. There is simply no credible line to take against it.
    You are right but how was the FTPA ever supposed to work?
    The FPTA was a brilliant idea, except it had one eensy teensy weensy flaw, it never prepared for the possibility of a majority government between 2010 and 2020.
    A permanent solution to a temporary problem and an instance of GO being too clever by half.

    It's also a bugger of an acronym to get right, for some reason. Contrary to your post it is not the Fixed Perm Tarliament Act.
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    kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    Nah, Mike and Robert have spent literally thousands of pounds on the PB server, that's why it didn't crash on GE 2015 night, or EUREf night, or when Trump won.
    What would it take to crash it? Corbyn winning the election? Though I suppose the national grid my struggle with that one.
    A lot of traffic, I think if we can cope with GE2015, we can cope with anything,

    I think we got 1,200 comments in the hour after the exit poll came out.
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    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,205
    RobD said:

    Mr. Calum, fewer than half, I'd guess (I think it was around 12 constituencies that were being looked at).

    Mr. Eagles, maybe.

    But May can lay the blame at Cameron's door. And that doesn't alter the fact it's her or Corbyn.

    Hard to say how it'll play. Charges during the election campaign would be... interesting.

    A bit like the FBI and Clinton's emails?
    If charges are brought during the campaign, that will effectively close down discussion of the matter. Contempt of court laws.
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,125
    AnneJGP said:

    calum said:

    AnneJGP said:

    calum said:

    On a lighter note I've been reading up on witch trials in central Scotland - which it turns out was the witch hunting capital of Europe - you were 4 times more likely to be accused of being a witch in this area than the European average:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Witch_trials_in_early_modern_Scotland

    "Reading up on" sounds so much more .... um .... active than "reading about" - what are you planning to do with your research, if I might ask?

    There's a few local alleged witch trial sites - so I thought I'd take a look into the background !!
    That's a relief - it sounded a bit as though witch trials were about to become the Next Big Thing again.
    It might not be in the Manifesto, but....
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    TOPPING said:

    As has been rehearsed on here many times, it is impossible for an opposition to refuse the opportunity for a GE. There is simply no credible line to take against it.

    Maybe not before, but now the FTPA gives an option. Simply do nothing. If May wants an election let her get it organised - it is her problem. Failing that there is Spring 2020 which is when the next one is due.
    Calling a vote is organising one. More to the point standing at a lectern and announcing to the world's media that one is happening is organising one.

    If Labour were to vote against an election that had been announced and seek to perpetuate three more years of Tory majority rule instead then they could be polling single figures within a month.
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    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,822
    Are we getting something from You Gov tonight?
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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,311

    TOPPING said:

    As has been rehearsed on here many times, it is impossible for an opposition to refuse the opportunity for a GE. There is simply no credible line to take against it.

    Maybe not before, but now the FTPA gives an option. Simply do nothing. If May wants an election let her get it organised - it is her problem. Failing that there is Spring 2020 which is when the next one is due.
    Nah. The opposition is, or should be, the next government in waiting. It simply subverts the very essence of British politics, even with Jezza in charge of Lab, for an opposition to pass up the opportunity to oust the government.
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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,311
    kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    Nah, Mike and Robert have spent literally thousands of pounds on the PB server, that's why it didn't crash on GE 2015 night, or EUREf night, or when Trump won.
    What would it take to crash it? Corbyn winning the election? Though I suppose the national grid my struggle with that one.
    BA online ticketing machine?
  • Options
    FregglesFreggles Posts: 3,486
    Pong said:

    SeanT said:

    Exactly. This election surely means a Soft-ISH Brexit. I don't understand why Remainers are so gloomy (apart from those who are adamant eu-Federalists, or those who seriously thought the vote could be reversed)

    The manifesto will be fascinating. We'll find out where the balance of power lies in government. I expect the brexit stuff will still be fluffy and vague, but on domestic policy i'm expecting real meat.

    TM will finally have an ideology.

    £350m/NHS (probably on fudged figures)?

    I'll go;

    1/2 Yes
    2/1 No
    I think May will take the opportunity to scale back promises on spending like the NHS ring fence. Look at what Hammond said about having limited room to manoeuvre at Budget time.
  • Options
    Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256

    kle4 said:

    SeanT said:

    Agreed. He was trapped by his - and his party's - inflamed rhetoric. "The Tories eat babies! - but we want the baby eating to continue while we are having an internal debate about reselections"

    Not very sellable. Labour have no choice but to agree to an election.

    What? Since when did being consistent become an attribute of Corbynism? Surely the whole cult depends on not questioning anything the glorious leader says no matter how barking it is? History exists only for rewriting!!!
    Its meant to be an attribute of Corbyn, who's appeal boils down to being 'different' from other politicians, and utterly consistent in his principles.
    Well then, he would have been better keeping the govt on a small majority where he might stand a chance of defeating them as opposed to trying to defeat them on 50 or 60+ majorities were they can simply pass any policy they like whilst Labour stand by watching helplessly.

    The man's a fool.
    Sure... he'd prefer for there NOT to be an election. That's totally different from voting against there being one when the motion is pit before Parliament.

    Again, you just can't say the Government is killing the poor and sick, then say they ought to do it for three more years. It's an offer you can't refuse, however much you'd love to.
    He could also say "If the Tories WANT an election, it is my job to oppose that and say NO"
    It's the Opposition's job to REPLACE the Government, not to oppose the only possible event that can allow them to replace the Government!

    I know Corbyn is a ludicrous chap in so many ways, but even he couldn't pull that line off.
    Except this opposition is not going to be replacing the govt any time soon...
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,311
    edited April 2017

    TOPPING said:

    It's why Sturgeon is also mistaken and impotently frothing.

    The govt and in particular TMay has been accused of lacking a mandate, they are giving the country the opportunity to given them one. Or to give it to someone else.

    It is rarely a wrong move and never an egregious one, to give the people the vote.

    Except when the dumb fucks use it to leave the EU?
    The EU Ref was not a mistake, as was evidenced by the result.
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,869
    GIN1138 said:

    Are we getting something from You Gov tonight?

    Tonight YG TMICIPM
  • Options
    Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256
    IanB2 said:

    kle4 said:

    SeanT said:

    Agreed. He was trapped by his - and his party's - inflamed rhetoric. "The Tories eat babies! - but we want the baby eating to continue while we are having an internal debate about reselections"

    Not very sellable. Labour have no choice but to agree to an election.

    What? Since when did being consistent become an attribute of Corbynism? Surely the whole cult depends on not questioning anything the glorious leader says no matter how barking it is? History exists only for rewriting!!!
    Its meant to be an attribute of Corbyn, who's appeal boils down to being 'different' from other politicians, and utterly consistent in his principles.
    Well then, he would have been better keeping the govt on a small majority where he might stand a chance of defeating them as opposed to trying to defeat them on 50 or 60+ majorities were they can simply pass any policy they like whilst Labour stand by watching helplessly.

    The man's a fool.
    Sure... he'd prefer for there NOT to be an election. That's totally different from voting against there being one when the motion is pit before Parliament.

    Again, you just can't say the Government is killing the poor and sick, then say they ought to do it for three more years. It's an offer you can't refuse, however much you'd love to.
    He could also say "If the Tories WANT an election, it is my job to oppose that and say NO"
    It's the Opposition's job to REPLACE the Government, not to oppose the only possible event that can allow them to replace the Government!

    I know Corbyn is a ludicrous chap in so many ways, but even he couldn't pull that line off.
    Indeed. It would make the remaining three years of this parliament (even more of) an impossibility for him. Thrown back in his face over and over.
    Politics is a rough game and Corbyn seems to have a thick enough hide.

  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    https://twitter.com/tnewtondunn/status/854437634088763392

    A clever Labour leader would do what at this point?
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    If this were Australia in 1983, Labour MPs would replace Corbyn with another leader in the next few days, with May unable to cancel the election.
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    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    edited April 2017
    AndyJS said:

    Sky News poll finds 68% support early election. Not sure which company.

    Should that give us pause? Surely a lot of that 68 per cent are people whose main reason for wanting an early election is to vote against the government. Otherwise, why bother?
  • Options
    Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,060
    TOPPING said:

    On June 8th I realise I have booked to go and see Rosencrantz and Gildenstern are dead. A meditation on mortality so perhaps appropriate after all, that said.

    The luvvies, however, might be in shock by the curtain call.

    I saw that over Easter: one of my all time favorite plays.

    "We're actors. We're the opposite of people."
  • Options
    peter_from_putneypeter_from_putney Posts: 6,875
    edited April 2017

    Hills have a market on the size of the Tory Majority:

    >100 seats ....... 2.10

    <100 seats (or no maj) ..... 1.67

    They limited me to £15</p>

    Which way did you bet if I may ask ?
    On the basis of Betfair Sportsbook pitching the Tories to win 345.5 seats, I went for a < 100 seat Tory Majority which equates to them winning < 375 seats, i.e up to 30 more than the Betfair fulcrum point.
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Jezza could say "There should be no election until the expenses scandal is resolved"

    https://twitter.com/huffpostuk/status/854436674893484032
  • Options
    not_on_firenot_on_fire Posts: 4,341
    We've talked a lot about potential LD gains from Con, but what about from Labour? From memory they lost approx 20 seats to Labour in 2015. Can some of these be won back?
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,311

    AndyJS said:

    Sky News poll finds 68% support early election. Not sure which company.

    Should that give us pause? Surely a lot of that 68 per cent are people whose main reason for wanting an early election is to vote against the government. Otherwise, why bother?
    For a 100 seat majority?
  • Options
    MonksfieldMonksfield Posts: 2,203
    HaroldO said:

    My facebook feed is already full of Tory hating posts, which it was at the last two general elections as well. Learn, you thick twats!

    Nice one @HaroldO, you moan about insults by insulting people!
  • Options
    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,822

    AndyJS said:

    Sky News poll finds 68% support early election. Not sure which company.

    Should that give us pause? Surely a lot of that 68 per cent are people whose main reason for wanting an early election is to vote against the government. Otherwise, why bother?
    To cement Brexit in place against the elite?
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,283

    TOPPING said:

    kle4 said:

    SeanT said:

    Agreed. He was trapped by his - and his party's - inflamed rhetoric. "The Tories eat babies! - but we want the baby eating to continue while we are having an internal debate about reselections"

    Not very sellable. Labour have no choice but to agree to an election.

    What? Since when did being consistent become an attribute of Corbynism? Surely the whole cult depends on not questioning anything the glorious leader says no matter how barking it is? History exists only for rewriting!!!
    Its meant to be an attribute of Corbyn, who's appeal boils down to being 'different' from other politicians, and utterly consistent in his principles.
    Well then, he would have been better keeping the govt on a small majority where he might stand a chance of defeating them as opposed to trying to defeat them on 50 or 60+ majorities were they can simply pass any policy they like whilst Labour stand by watching helplessly.

    The man's a fool.
    Sure... he'd prefer for there NOT to be an election. That's totally different from voting against there being one when the motion is pit before Parliament.

    Again, you just can't say the Government is killing the poor and sick, then say they ought to do it for three more years. It's an offer you can't refuse, however much you'd love to.
    He could also say "If the Tories WANT an election, it is my job to oppose that and say NO"
    As has been rehearsed on here many times, it is impossible for an opposition to refuse the opportunity for a GE. There is simply no credible line to take against it.
    You are right but how was the FTPA ever supposed to work?
    It gave Cameron an additional lever to use when his backbenchers came arguing for an early election. That Cameron was blufffing (as Tory and Labour votes would easily make 2/3rds) didn't matter too much, so long as it suited Cameron to stay in coalition. And of course back then the Tories weren't confident about winning outright from their position in government.
  • Options
    AnneJGPAnneJGP Posts: 2,869
    Dadge said:

    I'm a remainer but I'm not gloomy because of the effect of the election on Brexit. That seems like a red herring to me - I don't believe that the election will have much of an impact on Brexit at all. (It is a convenient excuse for May to call the election though.) I'm gloomy for the old-fashioned reason that I don't want a Tory govt with a large majority and a free hand to push through its policies. I sincerely hope that the opposition parties won't get distracted by Brexit too much during the campaign, since (apart of course from about 5% of the electorate who will vote LibDem because of it) Brexit won't move many votes, and other things are much more important than the Brexit smokescreen.

    Maybe Brexit will take up so much effort that there won't be much left to spare for other policies. It may not take much of MPs' time but I'd have thought most Departments & their civil servants would be up to their eyes in planning etc.
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    ChameleonChameleon Posts: 3,886

    AndyJS said:

    Sky News poll finds 68% support early election. Not sure which company.

    Should that give us pause? Surely a lot of that 68 per cent are people whose main reason for wanting an early election is to vote against the government. Otherwise, why bother?
    As one of the 68% who would have voted Tory/Brexit in 2015/16 and will vote LD (probably) there's got to be a few of us.
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