That would seem fairly likely. Erdogan has been accusing Gulen of running a 'shadow state' (whatever that is) for a long time. He's also been trying to repair relations with Russia recently, possibly because he knew his card was marked with the US and was trying not to be totally friendless?
Its rumoured to be both military and paramilitary police forces. If its airforce, army and navy genuinely unified and onboard, good luck trying to stop it.
Only reports, however, are in Ankara, clearly important but by no means could that work alone and claim success.
Update, apparently the armed forces chief of staff has been detained by troops involved in the coup.
Internet access has been restricted, question is by whom but if you want to avoid mobilising the public, its good to cut down public forums.
Having had to spend the last two years building our own rural broadband network, fibre-to-the-home, delighted that Ed Vaizey has paid the price for BDUK fiasco...
B4rn?
Indeed... Gigabit broadband, unlimited, £30 per month... community funded, community built
You have to remember that Erdogan has purged the senior generals at least once (I think its twice but don't my googlefu is failing me) to replace them with ones loyal to him.. As such the senior generals are not that supported
Do you know what happened to the previous set(s) of generals?
You have to remember that Erdogan has purged the senior generals at least once (I think its twice but don't my googlefu is failing me) to replace them with ones loyal to him.. As such the senior generals are not that supported
More than that. The Erdogan place-generals are possibly more important for the coup to control than Erdogan himself.
Is it wrong to ask if there is a market up on whether the coup succeeds?
Having had to spend the last two years building our own rural broadband network, fibre-to-the-home, delighted that Ed Vaizey has paid the price for BDUK fiasco...
B4rn?
Indeed... Gigabit broadband, unlimited, £30 per month... community funded, community built
I'm working over in Preston during the week at the moment. It's awfully impressive...
So Dave was right, Brexit would lead to wars, coups, and instability in Europe
A coup is ( yet another ) major step away from Accession. Another Leave lie shown for what it was.
I know you are frustrated but it's unfair to accuse the Leavers of lying because they didn't anticipate a coup in Turkey
That is true, although false impressions created about how soon Turkey might join - usually based of diplomatic pronouncements that of course were optimistic - was one of the bolder untruths of the Leave campaign. The immigration angle was strong enough regardless, I don't know why they even bothered.
The reason it was so effective is that Turkish accession is in hand. The UK officially supports accession, and the EU just recently began another round of talks.
The fact that every man + dog knows they haven't got a hope in hell of actually joining doesn't necessarily carry as much weight as we might think. It's Euro fudge caught in the act and to its detriment.
I was furious with Vote Leave for using it, far more than Farage's daft poster.
*edit* Why did they bother? Muslims, mate, millions of 'em. Pure, ugly dog whistling.
This site is so much better for Breaking News than the actual news.
No joke, a by-election in my area yesterday, declared 1 mile from where I sit, and I still read the result here before I was texted by someone who had been at the count.
I agree, but a coup by radical islamists is very much the last thing the americans would want. Though Obama did support the muslim brotherhood in Egypt.
So Dave was right, Brexit would lead to wars, coups, and instability in Europe
This is actually one of those times that Brexit may have triggered it. Without the UK there is no ally within the EU to push for pro-Turkey policies. The military may have moved to remove Erdogan given his moves away from secularism.
You have to remember that Erdogan has purged the senior generals at least once (I think its twice but don't my googlefu is failing me) to replace them with ones loyal to him.. As such the senior generals are not that supported
Do you know what happened to the previous set(s) of generals?
I agree, but a coup by radical islamists is very much the last thing the americans would want. Though Obama did support the muslim brotherhood in Egypt.
The Turkish military are not radical Islamists.
They are secularists and their coup is to stop Erdogan (who is an Islamist) taking Turkey away from its secular foundations under Ataturk.
Having had to spend the last two years building our own rural broadband network, fibre-to-the-home, delighted that Ed Vaizey has paid the price for BDUK fiasco...
Yes, the House of Lords recommended in 2012 a public-funded universal fibre to the home network ASAP to benefit UK PLC (I forget if they meant renationalising Openreach or doing it some other way). Little has happened outside cities. I get the same speed as in 2005, about 6 Mb and many people get less.
Rural businesses including farmers are forced to use online government forms, like VAT, but sometimes can't get broadband speeds, only dial up.
On topic, as Emperor Kahless said Destroying an Empire to win a war is no victory. And ending a battle to save an Empire is no defeat , I do wonder if the Conservative and UNIONIST Party will decide destroying the UK is too high a price for Brexit
It remains possible. Interesting that May's first official visit as PM was to Bute House. I wonder how many Brexiteers on here would consider a UK split it a price worth paying?
May was summoned, she did not do the summoning. The balance of power has been fairly clear for quite some time.
May capitulated to Nicola today.
Absolute rubbish - she and Nicola were acting as grown ups unlike yourself
Oh, has May contested Nicola's statement about her capitulation?
May has not. So we know which way the wind blew. May capitulated, although it still won't be enough to stop the UK being dissolved.
You are talking nonsense and at least in Theresa May and Nicola Sturgeon there are two people who will have an adult conversation - and before you rant again I am married to a Highlander who is proud to be a Scot and British and rejects the SNP
Horrible and chaotic though such events can be, I have a strange interest in seeing how the headlines change, from subtle to extreme. A few minutes ago the BBC main page had a story about Turkey PM decrying 'illegal action' or something along those lines, now it's army group 'takes control of turkey'.
Would we have a coup in the event Corbyn got in charge ?
Thinking out loud.
Since he would presumably have had to win a democratic election somehow to become one, I don't see how - he wouldn't have hidden his plans, so what could he propose that would spark the British into a coup?
Am watching Sky, tuned in to BBC a few times in the last minutes. First time they were covering Nice, now the Weather. Why isn't this all over their coverage?
That would seem fairly likely. Erdogan has been accusing Gulen of running a 'shadow state' (whatever that is) for a long time. He's also been trying to repair relations with Russia recently, possibly because he knew his card was marked with the US and was trying not to be totally friendless?
Couldn't have happened to a nicer fellow.
We need to stop getting involved in Islamic countries internal politics, will we never learn?
Turkey about to join EU? Utter bollx from Leave. Now exposed in a terrible way
A secular military coup probably moves them a step closer tbh.
Only in abstract, in a '15 years rather than 20 way' surely? A coup would be the Turkish military saying its people cannot be trusted, again, not to vote for a dangerous islamist. If the military regime was in place for awhile, how many 'free' elections returning good secularists would assure the EU everything would not kick up all over again with a new Erdogan?
It's funny, after the last three weeks, I figured maybe tonight I could kick back, enjoy a few beers, play some Total War and just relax.
Damn stupid world. Stop happening already and let people chillax.
Can the world just stop now? It's not big and it's not clever.
I just sat down to watch a film FFS.
Everything is at boiling point. Even when I sit down to watch the Tour de France (which is my equivalent to wasting a day watching cricket), there's bouncy castles falling on riders and crowds forcing riders to run up mountains.
Am watching Sky, tuned in to BBC a few times in the last minutes. First time they were covering Nice, now the Weather. Why isn't this all over their coverage?
Obviously can't cope with two big stories at the same time.
Am watching Sky, tuned in to BBC a few times in the last minutes. First time they were covering Nice, now the Weather. Why isn't this all over their coverage?
Turkey about to join EU? Utter bollx from Leave. Now exposed in a terrible way
A secular military coup probably moves them a step closer tbh.
Crap. If this had happened during our own EU vote campaign the whole idea that Turkey was "about to join" would have been blown out of the water.
Again, a coup that removes the Islamist president and leadership moves Turkey one step closer to EU membership in reality, though in the very near term the EU will condemn it but once the AKP are outlawed and the constitution is reset it makes Turkey more compatible with the EU.
Lead story on BBC10 oclock News now is Nice....... "holiday makers caught up in chaos in Nice".... after 2 mins of headlines they finally mention Turkey.
Spoke to a guy yesterday who had just got back from a holiday in Turkey and had a really good time. I don't think I'll be taking up his recommendation to head out there though.
Turkey about to join EU? Utter bollx from Leave. Now exposed in a terrible way
A secular military coup probably moves them a step closer tbh.
Only in abstract, in a '15 years rather than 20 way' surely? A coup would be the Turkish military saying its people cannot be trusted, again, not to vote for a dangerous islamist. If the military regime was in place for awhile, how many 'free' elections returning good secularists would assure the EU everything would not kick up all over again with a new Erdogan?
I'd say 10 years up from "never" if this is a secular coup.
Am watching Sky, tuned in to BBC a few times in the last minutes. First time they were covering Nice, now the Weather. Why isn't this all over their coverage?
Lawyers are arguing whether to call this a military coup or the ‘so called military coup’ ?
Am watching Sky, tuned in to BBC a few times in the last minutes. First time they were covering Nice, now the Weather. Why isn't this all over their coverage?
Lawyers are arguing whether to call this a military coup or the ‘so called military coup’ ?
Am watching Sky, tuned in to BBC a few times in the last minutes. First time they were covering Nice, now the Weather. Why isn't this all over their coverage?
Turkey about to join EU? Utter bollx from Leave. Now exposed in a terrible way
A secular military coup probably moves them a step closer tbh.
Crap. If this had happened during our own EU vote campaign the whole idea that Turkey was "about to join" would have been blown out of the water.
That shows how very little you understand about Turkish Politics...
I'm talking about UK politics. Nobody would have believed Turkey was about the join the EU if it was in the middle of a coup.
It's still unlikely, I said it as well. Though if this a secular coup it is probably more likely. I'd venture that Brexit may have been one of the triggers.
That would seem fairly likely. Erdogan has been accusing Gulen of running a 'shadow state' (whatever that is) for a long time. He's also been trying to repair relations with Russia recently, possibly because he knew his card was marked with the US and was trying not to be totally friendless?
Couldn't have happened to a nicer fellow.
We need to stop getting involved in Islamic countries internal politics, will we never learn?
Turkey is a secular country and a strategically vital NATO member. I doubt we've had anything to do with this. Don't forget the Turkish armed forces would beat the shit out of any other NATO country, with the possible exception of the US.
How does NATO fit into all this? Can Article 5 only be invoked against attacks by an external power or could a government use it against a coup attempt?
Having had to spend the last two years building our own rural broadband network, fibre-to-the-home, delighted that Ed Vaizey has paid the price for BDUK fiasco...
Yes, the House of Lords recommended in 2012 a public-funded universal fibre to the home network ASAP to benefit UK PLC (I forget if they meant renationalising Openreach or doing it some other way). Little has happened outside cities. I get the same speed as in 2005, about 6 Mb and many people get less.
Rural businesses including farmers are forced to use online government forms, like VAT, but sometimes can't get broadband speeds, only dial up.
£1.4bn given to BT to sweat their aging copper assets in marginally uncommercial suburbs and larger villages whilst failing to solve rural access... an utter farce... Ed Vaizey has always been charming and enthusiastic but has been utterly played by BT...
How does NATO fit into all this? Can Article 5 only be invoked against attacks by an external power or could a government use it against a coup attempt?
Am watching Sky, tuned in to BBC a few times in the last minutes. First time they were covering Nice, now the Weather. Why isn't this all over their coverage?
Obviously can't cope with two big stories at the same time.
The BBC and ITV only cover stories in first part where they can get the main presenter there to present from. Having invested in the air tickets and hotel rooms then Nice has to be the first story.
That would seem fairly likely. Erdogan has been accusing Gulen of running a 'shadow state' (whatever that is) for a long time. He's also been trying to repair relations with Russia recently, possibly because he knew his card was marked with the US and was trying not to be totally friendless?
Couldn't have happened to a nicer fellow.
We need to stop getting involved in Islamic countries internal politics, will we never learn?
Turkey is a secular country and a strategically vital NATO member. I doubt we've had anything to do with this. Don't forget the Turkish armed forces would beat the shit out of any other NATO country, with the possible exception of the US.
There are significant reasons to think France and/or Russia may be involved.
Horrible and chaotic though such events can be, I have a strange interest in seeing how the headlines change, from subtle to extreme. A few minutes ago the BBC main page had a story about Turkey PM decrying 'illegal action' or something along those lines, now it's army group 'takes control of turkey'.
To be fair to the beeb it seems everyone is choosing their words carefully.
How does NATO fit into all this? Can Article 5 only be invoked against attacks by an external power or could a government use it against a coup attempt?
Article 5 doesn't guarantee anything. Even so, it doesn't apply in this case. Greece and Turkey have both had coups before (as NATO members).
Comments
Keep Calm and Pokeman GOOOOOOOOO
Couldn't have happened to a nicer fellow.
Only reports, however, are in Ankara, clearly important but by no means could that work alone and claim success.
Update, apparently the armed forces chief of staff has been detained by troops involved in the coup.
Internet access has been restricted, question is by whom but if you want to avoid mobilising the public, its good to cut down public forums.
Is it wrong to ask if there is a market up on whether the coup succeeds?
The fact that every man + dog knows they haven't got a hope in hell of actually joining doesn't necessarily carry as much weight as we might think. It's Euro fudge caught in the act and to its detriment.
I was furious with Vote Leave for using it, far more than Farage's daft poster.
*edit* Why did they bother? Muslims, mate, millions of 'em. Pure, ugly dog whistling.
Thinking out loud.
On reflection, that might turn me from resistance into supporter.
Looks like Boris no longer needs to worry about calling Erdogan a "goat wankerer".
Damn stupid world. Stop happening already and let people chillax.
Though Obama did support the muslim brotherhood in Egypt.
Why would we need one?
https://www.rt.com/news/erdogan-turkish-army-beheaded-799/
"How can you say that I'm too old,
when the angels have stolen my red shoes."
E. Costello
They are secularists and their coup is to stop Erdogan (who is an Islamist) taking Turkey away from its secular foundations under Ataturk.
Rural businesses including farmers are forced to use online government forms, like VAT, but sometimes can't get broadband speeds, only dial up.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harold_Wilson_conspiracy_theories#Alleged_1974_military_coup_plot
Something like to the right of UKIP, but not religious.
I just sat down to watch a film FFS.
"coming up at 1pm is the 1 o clock news"
WTF is going on at the BBC?
It's the military, secret services, oligarchs.
They are like the villains from X-Files, but real and not UFO related.
The whole world has gone insane.
No time line on this.
Meanwhile Sky straight into Turkey.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y60wDzZt8yg
Keeps buffering though ...
Also, I bet Joey Jones is well pissed. Only just got his sat down at his desk spinning for Osborne and I presume he will get the chop like his boss.