After being ripped to shreds by the First Minister, Kezia had a good go at Ruth, who was subdued throughout the whole session. I almost felt sorry for Ruth. Almost.
Looking at the Sunday Times/Panelbase poll the big thing that jumps out is that although it is tight with a headline figure of 52/48 ABC1s are more likely ot vote Yes than C2DEs which is an inversion of the IndyRef (both demographics are a Yes vote)
Sunday was years ago. Catch up! Scotland wants to be on the CANZUK express!
The pledge dropping re the ECHR is awful. How can she possibly have changed her mind in this space of time?
TBF - as I understand it - the issue isn't the ECHR (which we have existed happily with for 50+ years) but the incorporation of the ECHR into the ECJ's remit and some of the decisions that the ECJ has been making.
On leaving the EU, the ECJ's view no longer applies - we go back to being able to ignore the ECHR if we see fit (I think)
Hence, why spend the political capital taking down something that will resolve itself in 2 years anyway
Yes it was the charter of fundamental rights that was incorporated into Lisbon that causes all of the issues. We are free to ignore Strasbourg's decisions if it is incompatible with UK law, we can't do that for ECJ decision. It is massive judicial overreach by the EU. We have no need to leave the ECHR now.
But until we leave the EU we are still under the ECHR and ECJ.
Yes, but we're leaving the EU so no need to bother leaving the ECHR and damaging our international reputation for nothing. The ECJ and the charter were much more egregious than the ECHR has ever been. If May reforms the HRA a bit and we define better what constitutes a "family life" in the UK then we should be okay.
@PolhomeEditor: And still it goes on. Rob Marris has just resigned as Shadow Treasury Minister. Anyone keeping count?
Funny ... but also tragic.
One of the two major parties is destroying itself in plain sight.
It has no choice.
It has to keep doing this until Corbyn resigns. There is no other way.
He has to soon, surely? I don't care how stubborn he is, how much of a mandate he has, or even whether he really is a sleeper agent - at the moment the Labour Party is not being of much use to anyone, not the left or right of the party
hezza going postal about boris.... hated hearing every word...
Hezza is just awful - he can't resist getting very rude and personal. I've had more than enough of him already.
Heseltine was the Boris of his day, perhaps it's bringing all the bad memories back!
Heseltine actually achieved things. There should be statues to him built in Docklands and elsewhere.
Boris has two outstanding attributes: he can write and speak well, and he can play the fool. There's no heft to him, no substance. He's SeanT with a political career.
Not sure you can accuse him of having no heft.
Who? BoJo?
You can. very easily. Just look at the way he handled the referendum, yet along the aftermath.
After being ripped to shreds by the First Minister, Kezia had a good go at Ruth, who was subdued throughout the whole session. I almost felt sorry for Ruth. Almost.
As I recall it was the people of the UK who precipitated this 'disaster',unless suddenly everyone who voted out is a conservative, in which case well don the Tories for getting 35% or whatever in Scotland.
Looking at the Sunday Times/Panelbase poll the big thing that jumps out is that although it is tight with a headline figure of 52/48 ABC1s are more likely ot vote Yes than C2DEs which is an inversion of the IndyRef (both demographics are a Yes vote)
Sunday was years ago. Catch up! Scotland wants to be on the CANZUK express!
Why bother with silly acronyms when there is the perfectly cromulent Oceania to use instead?
@PolhomeEditor: And still it goes on. Rob Marris has just resigned as Shadow Treasury Minister. Anyone keeping count?
Funny ... but also tragic.
One of the two major parties is destroying itself in plain sight.
It has no choice.
It has to keep doing this until Corbyn resigns. There is no other way.
He has to soon, surely? I don't care how stubborn he is, how much of a mandate he has, or even whether he really is a sleeper agent - at the moment the Labour Party is not being of much use to anyone, not the left or right of the party
OK, genuine question: who will Cameron and Osborne support? It should be May, surely? I'm possibly overthinking this .
Gove at present or Crabb. May ruled out the emergency budget and that makes Osborne look a fool.
Osborne made Osborne look like a fool.
Osbourne kicked it to the Autumn on Monday. At which point you can use the Autumn statement to announce cuts and emergency tax increases in 2017/18.. - So you don't need a budget to do what you need.
And probably fall. Were the Tories in opposition, she might be a runner (though even there, I think she'd look over-promoted); in government, where she'd be PM from day 1, it's surely too much to ask. MPs must know that.
Looking at the Sunday Times/Panelbase poll the big thing that jumps out is that although it is tight with a headline figure of 52/48 ABC1s are more likely ot vote Yes than C2DEs which is an inversion of the IndyRef (both demographics are a Yes vote).
I think ABC1's were 60/40 in favour of No last time out.
Not exactly great for Yes if its only 52/48. Once some of the shock and anger unwinds, plus we start talking about our next move which is probably not going to look a lit different to today, it won't take a big swing to No for Sturgeon to back down.
Johnson's Olympian removal of himself from the squalid Tory rat race is chillingly masterful.
His problem is that opportunities do not generally come along too often. This was his time, his opportunity. He had lined it up for years, as can be seen bu his dual-rolling as MoL and MP.
His next opportunity will come at the next election - probably 2020, and probably only if the Conservatives lose. And by then there will be other, younger, fresher candidates from the 2010 / 15 intakes hungry for the job.
And probably fall. Were the Tories in opposition, she might be a runner (though even there, I think she'd look over-promoted); in government, where she'd be PM from day 1, it's surely too much to ask. MPs must know that.
She's got a super CV.
"EXPERIENCE: Councillor, South Oxfordshire District Council 2003-2007. Contested Knowsley South constituency in 2005. Treasury Select Committee 2010-14. Economic Secretary to the Treasury from April 2014-May 2015. Minister of State for Energy at the Department of Energy and Climate Change May 2015 to present
OTHER EXPERIENCE: Barclays de Zoete Wedd (BZW) 1993-1997, Managing Director of De Putron Fund Management (DPFM) 1997-1999. Chief Investment Officer at Invesco Perpetual from 1999-2009."
After being ripped to shreds by the First Minister, Kezia had a good go at Ruth, who was subdued throughout the whole session. I almost felt sorry for Ruth. Almost.
As I recall it was the people of the UK who precipitated this 'disaster',unless suddenly everyone who voted out is a conservative, in which case well don the Tories for getting 35% or whatever in Scotland.
That's how it has played out though. Of course the Tories won't get the backing of all 38%. But in the minds of voters they are the ones who have endangered the UK - against the basic premise of their own sole policy.
Even Willie Rennie is using Ruth as a punch bag now. She is politically compromised, holed below the waterline with no where to hide. She is the Scottish face of this entire debacle.
Eagle may delay leader bid 'to give Corbyn time to quit': Former shadow minister Angela Eagle looks set to la...
LOL
Knows she'll get thrashed. Maybe I'll ask Anthony Joshua to give up his Heavyweight title belt so I can win a match against him too.
I cannot understand the Labour leadership betting- why is McDonnell out to 14's? Emily Thornberry was 6-1 yesterday but she has moved out a wee tad today- to 360-1 no less. That still looks short to me.
My man Clive Lewis is also on 14's and represents the other left contender.
Clearly, the Labour party are completely clueless about the next step....both left and right.
The pledge dropping re the ECHR is awful. How can she possibly have changed her mind in this space of time?
TBF - as I understand it - the issue isn't the ECHR (which we have existed happily with for 50+ years) but the incorporation of the ECHR into the ECJ's remit and some of the decisions that the ECJ has been making.
On leaving the EU, the ECJ's view no longer applies - we go back to being able to ignore the ECHR if we see fit (I think)
Hence, why spend the political capital taking down something that will resolve itself in 2 years anyway
Yes it was the charter of fundamental rights that was incorporated into Lisbon that causes all of the issues. We are free to ignore Strasbourg's decisions if it is incompatible with UK law, we can't do that for ECJ decision. It is massive judicial overreach by the EU. We have no need to leave the ECHR now.
AFAIK the ECHR was incorporated into English law in 2000. One can enforce it in any county court, the bottom rung of the judicial system. Presumably if we leave, the CFR lapses, the ECJ becomes irrelevant and the Human Rights Act remains. Seems OK to me.
And probably fall. Were the Tories in opposition, she might be a runner (though even there, I think she'd look over-promoted); in government, where she'd be PM from day 1, it's surely too much to ask. MPs must know that.
Would the MPs dare risk presenting us with the fait accompli of May v Fox?
hezza going postal about boris.... hated hearing every word...
Hezza is just awful - he can't resist getting very rude and personal. I've had more than enough of him already.
Heseltine was the Boris of his day, perhaps it's bringing all the bad memories back!
Heseltine actually achieved things. There should be statues to him built in Docklands and elsewhere.
Boris has two outstanding attributes: he can write and speak well, and he can play the fool. There's no heft to him, no substance. He's SeanT with a political career.
Not sure you can accuse him of having no heft.
Who? BoJo?
You can. very easily. Just look at the way he handled the referendum, yet along the aftermath.
Unless that was meant as a dig at me?
No it was meant as a dig at Boris's stature.
Sensitive much?
A little at the moment, yes.
Then again, you have in the past as well, Putin-supporter.
May seems to be picking up MPs very steadily - her total on Con Home is rising every few minutes.
In contrast, Crabb is totally static - he has the same number as last night.
The others are obviously only just getting started - but notable that Fox hasn't picked up anyone since last night either - and I think he is actually down by 2.
Looking at the Sunday Times/Panelbase poll the big thing that jumps out is that although it is tight with a headline figure of 52/48 ABC1s are more likely ot vote Yes than C2DEs which is an inversion of the IndyRef (both demographics are a Yes vote)
Sunday was years ago. Catch up! Scotland wants to be on the CANZUK express!
Why bother with silly acronyms when there is the perfectly cromulent Oceania to use instead?
Oceania would work better in the new Union song if it was a ballad. But Canzuk! is an upbeat call to arms. It'll be fab.
Eagle may delay leader bid 'to give Corbyn time to quit': Former shadow minister Angela Eagle looks set to la...
LOL
Knows she'll get thrashed. Maybe I'll ask Anthony Joshua to give up his Heavyweight title belt so I can win a match against him too.
I cannot understand the Labour leadership betting- why is McDonnell out to 14's? Emily Thornberry was 6-1 yesterday but she has moved out a wee tad today- to 360-1 no less. That still looks short to me.
My man Clive Lewis is also on 14's and represents the other left contender.
Clearly, the Labour party are completely clueless about the next step....both left and right.
The market is a portmanteau of at least 3 scenarios:
1) A direct challenge to Corbyn 2) A Corbyn resignation and a "normal" election 3) Corbyn's successor in a "Labour" Party reduced to 40 MPs as the rest break away
hezza going postal about boris.... hated hearing every word...
Hezza is just awful - he can't resist getting very rude and personal. I've had more than enough of him already.
Heseltine was the Boris of his day, perhaps it's bringing all the bad memories back!
Heseltine actually achieved things. There should be statues to him built in Docklands and elsewhere.
Boris has two outstanding attributes: he can write and speak well, and he can play the fool. There's no heft to him, no substance. He's SeanT with a political career.
Not sure you can accuse him of having no heft.
Who? BoJo?
You can. very easily. Just look at the way he handled the referendum, yet along the aftermath.
Unless that was meant as a dig at me?
No it was meant as a dig at Boris's stature.
Sensitive much?
A little at the moment, yes.
Then again, you have in the past as well, Putin-supporter.
I shall say 'can be accused' next time. Hope you feel better soon.
Eagle may delay leader bid 'to give Corbyn time to quit': Former shadow minister Angela Eagle looks set to la...
LOL
Knows she'll get thrashed. Maybe I'll ask Anthony Joshua to give up his Heavyweight title belt so I can win a match against him too.
I cannot understand the Labour leadership betting- why is McDonnell out to 14's? Emily Thornberry was 6-1 yesterday but she has moved out a wee tad today- to 360-1 no less. That still looks short to me.
My man Clive Lewis is also on 14's and represents the other left contender.
Clearly, the Labour party are completely clueless about the next step....both left and right.
The market is a portmanteau of at least 3 scenarios:
1) A direct challenge to Corbyn 2) A Corbyn resignation and a "normal" election 3) Corbyn's successor in a "Labour" Party reduced to 40 MPs as the rest break away
Indeed. Nicely unpacked. It's a fool's market because too many balls are in the air at once.
Eagle may delay leader bid 'to give Corbyn time to quit': Former shadow minister Angela Eagle looks set to la...
LOL
Knows she'll get thrashed. Maybe I'll ask Anthony Joshua to give up his Heavyweight title belt so I can win a match against him too.
Owen Smith looks more likely now, maybe even Clive Lewis.
Clive Lewis has charisma in spades, and just looks like he could be a winner, especially with a back story fighting in Afghanistan. If the next leader is a lefty, as is likely judging by the membership, at least let it be one who looks like he could win.
Civil servant suggests compromise that most could agree on: Article 50 not to be activated until Turkey given access to single market.
I was at an event yesterday with senior movers and shakers and they said the Civil Service would come up with a way to stop Article 50 being invoked. This is one such way.
Eagle may delay leader bid 'to give Corbyn time to quit': Former shadow minister Angela Eagle looks set to la...
LOL
Knows she'll get thrashed. Maybe I'll ask Anthony Joshua to give up his Heavyweight title belt so I can win a match against him too.
I cannot understand the Labour leadership betting- why is McDonnell out to 14's? Emily Thornberry was 6-1 yesterday but she has moved out a wee tad today- to 360-1 no less. That still looks short to me.
My man Clive Lewis is also on 14's and represents the other left contender.
Clearly, the Labour party are completely clueless about the next step....both left and right.
The market is a portmanteau of at least 3 scenarios:
1) A direct challenge to Corbyn 2) A Corbyn resignation and a "normal" election 3) Corbyn's successor in a "Labour" Party reduced to 40 MPs as the rest break away
Indeed. Nicely unpacked. It's a fool's market because too many balls are in the air at once.
They're the best markets! I've got 50+ on Smith, 65+ on Nandy and 55+ on McDonnell in the last few days as people have erroneously discounted one or more of the above scenarios.
hezza going postal about boris.... hated hearing every word...
Hezza is just awful - he can't resist getting very rude and personal. I've had more than enough of him already.
Heseltine was the Boris of his day, perhaps it's bringing all the bad memories back!
Heseltine actually achieved things. There should be statues to him built in Docklands and elsewhere.
Boris has two outstanding attributes: he can write and speak well, and he can play the fool. There's no heft to him, no substance. He's SeanT with a political career.
Not sure you can accuse him of having no heft.
Who? BoJo?
You can. very easily. Just look at the way he handled the referendum, yet along the aftermath.
Unless that was meant as a dig at me?
No it was meant as a dig at Boris's stature.
Sensitive much?
A little at the moment, yes.
Then again, you have in the past as well, Putin-supporter.
I shall say 'can be accused' next time. Hope you feel better soon.
Eagle may delay leader bid 'to give Corbyn time to quit': Former shadow minister Angela Eagle looks set to la...
LOL
Knows she'll get thrashed. Maybe I'll ask Anthony Joshua to give up his Heavyweight title belt so I can win a match against him too.
I cannot understand the Labour leadership betting- why is McDonnell out to 14's? Emily Thornberry was 6-1 yesterday but she has moved out a wee tad today- to 360-1 no less. That still looks short to me.
My man Clive Lewis is also on 14's and represents the other left contender.
Clearly, the Labour party are completely clueless about the next step....both left and right.
The market is a portmanteau of at least 3 scenarios:
1) A direct challenge to Corbyn 2) A Corbyn resignation and a "normal" election 3) Corbyn's successor in a "Labour" Party reduced to 40 MPs as the rest break away
Indeed. Nicely unpacked. It's a fool's market because too many balls are in the air at once.
They're the best markets! I've got 50+ on Smith, 65+ on Nandy and 55+ on McDonnell in the last few days as people have erroneously discounted one or more of the above scenarios.
Great odds. The Smith bet is especially good. Well done.
That could work. But I think we should have the dragon too.
I guess that would emphasise the link between Game of Thrones and UK politics.
Chaos isn't a pit. Chaos is a ladder. Many who try to climb it fail and never get to try again. The fall breaks them. And some are given a chance to climb, but they refuse. They cling to the realm or the gods or love. Illusions. Only the ladder is real. The climb is all there is.
Eagle may delay leader bid 'to give Corbyn time to quit': Former shadow minister Angela Eagle looks set to la...
LOL
Knows she'll get thrashed. Maybe I'll ask Anthony Joshua to give up his Heavyweight title belt so I can win a match against him too.
Owen Smith looks more likely now, maybe even Clive Lewis.
I've had money on Clive Lewis for months, he's more charismatic than Corbyn and would get the support form the Momentum left. He is ruthless with no principles, it's all just an act.
OK, genuine question: who will Cameron and Osborne support? It should be May, surely? I'm possibly overthinking this .
Gove at present or Crabb. May ruled out the emergency budget and that makes Osborne look a fool.
Osborne made Osborne look like a fool.
Osbourne kicked it to the Autumn on Monday. At which point you can use the Autumn statement to announce cuts and emergency tax increases in 2017/18.. - So you don't need a budget to do what you need.
Indeed - and i distinctly heard May confirm it this morning.
Eagle may delay leader bid 'to give Corbyn time to quit': Former shadow minister Angela Eagle looks set to la...
LOL
Knows she'll get thrashed. Maybe I'll ask Anthony Joshua to give up his Heavyweight title belt so I can win a match against him too.
I cannot understand the Labour leadership betting- why is McDonnell out to 14's? Emily Thornberry was 6-1 yesterday but she has moved out a wee tad today- to 360-1 no less. That still looks short to me.
My man Clive Lewis is also on 14's and represents the other left contender.
Clearly, the Labour party are completely clueless about the next step....both left and right.
The market is a portmanteau of at least 3 scenarios:
1) A direct challenge to Corbyn 2) A Corbyn resignation and a "normal" election 3) Corbyn's successor in a "Labour" Party reduced to 40 MPs as the rest break away
Indeed. Nicely unpacked. It's a fool's market because too many balls are in the air at once.
They're the best markets! I've got 50+ on Smith, 65+ on Nandy and 55+ on McDonnell in the last few days as people have erroneously discounted one or more of the above scenarios.
From a standing start in 2 days I'm £150 green on every possible candidate... Given that I cleared my betfair account down to £50 I'm rather happy with that..
Eagle may delay leader bid 'to give Corbyn time to quit': Former shadow minister Angela Eagle looks set to la...
LOL
Knows she'll get thrashed. Maybe I'll ask Anthony Joshua to give up his Heavyweight title belt so I can win a match against him too.
Owen Smith looks more likely now, maybe even Clive Lewis.
Clive Lewis has charisma in spades, and just looks like he could be a winner, especially with a back story fighting in Afghanistan. If the next leader is a lefty, as is likely judging by the membership, at least let it be one who looks like he could win.
I think Lewis from the Left is a good candidate and I have no idea why the bunker hasn't struck a deal with the PLP by now whereby they would guarantee him enough nominations if Corbyn stood down.
That, to me, is the best compromise to break the deadlock.
That could work. But I think we should have the dragon too.
How about the red crosses of St Andrew and St George on a white background but top left quadrant all white with the Welsh dragon in red centred in that quadrant?
That could work. But I think we should have the dragon too.
I guess that would emphasise the link between Game of Thrones and UK politics.
Chaos isn't a pit. Chaos is a ladder. Many who try to climb it fail and never get to try again. The fall breaks them. And some are given a chance to climb, but they refuse. They cling to the realm or the gods or love. Illusions. Only the ladder is real. The climb is all there is.
And Crabb even looks a bit like Littlefinger too, so it is a good omen for him.
After being ripped to shreds by the First Minister, Kezia had a good go at Ruth, who was subdued throughout the whole session. I almost felt sorry for Ruth. Almost.
There's no doubt Brexit has hugely damaged Davidson and the Conservative cause in Scotland generally, even though some other people voted Leave. It is her colleagues in London that are doing the separation. It's the inverse of the SNP paradox (why are you so keen on the EU if you want to get out of the UK?). In the case of the Tories: why are you so keen on the British Union if you want to destroy the European one?
Comments
https://twitter.com/ScoPoliticsNews/status/748523070021902336
After being ripped to shreds by the First Minister, Kezia had a good go at Ruth, who was subdued throughout the whole session. I almost felt sorry for Ruth. Almost.
Ha ha ha ha ha ha
Sensitive much?
https://twitter.com/HuffPostUKCom/status/748517808384970754
Leadsom 5.9
LOL
Knows she'll get thrashed. Maybe I'll ask Anthony Joshua to give up his Heavyweight title belt so I can win a match against him too.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/30/13-year-old-israeli-girl-stabbed-to-death-in-her-bedroom/
His next opportunity will come at the next election - probably 2020, and probably only if the Conservatives lose. And by then there will be other, younger, fresher candidates from the 2010 / 15 intakes hungry for the job.
This was Boris's time. And he's lost.
"EXPERIENCE: Councillor, South Oxfordshire District Council 2003-2007. Contested Knowsley South constituency in 2005. Treasury Select Committee 2010-14. Economic Secretary to the Treasury from April 2014-May 2015. Minister of State for Energy at the Department of Energy and Climate Change May 2015 to present
OTHER EXPERIENCE: Barclays de Zoete Wedd (BZW) 1993-1997, Managing Director of De Putron Fund Management (DPFM) 1997-1999. Chief Investment Officer at Invesco Perpetual from 1999-2009."
http://iaindale.com/posts/2016/06/29/conservative-leadership-runners-riders-andrea-leadsom
Ah never mind!
Even Willie Rennie is using Ruth as a punch bag now. She is politically compromised, holed below the waterline with no where to hide. She is the Scottish face of this entire debacle.
Boris = Clodius Albinus.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/30/angela-eagle-to-launch-labour-leadership-bid-in-battle-for-the-s/
You Brexit you bought it.
My man Clive Lewis is also on 14's and represents the other left contender.
Clearly, the Labour party are completely clueless about the next step....both left and right.
Stephen Bush
Civil servant suggests compromise that most could agree on: Article 50 not to be activated until Turkey given access to single market.
Go for Gove!
Then again, you have in the past as well, Putin-supporter.
In contrast, Crabb is totally static - he has the same number as last night.
The others are obviously only just getting started - but notable that Fox hasn't picked up anyone since last night either - and I think he is actually down by 2.
May 69
Crabb 21
Gove 11
Leadsom 7
Fox 6
http://www.conservativehome.com/parliament/2016/06/whos-backing-who-our-running-list-of-mps-supporting-each-leadership-candidate.html
http://s29.postimg.org/lv7b06wt3/uk_wales.jpg
1) A direct challenge to Corbyn
2) A Corbyn resignation and a "normal" election
3) Corbyn's successor in a "Labour" Party reduced to 40 MPs as the rest break away
We won't be changing flag, even in the unlikely event of Scotland voting to leave.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2016/06/30/how_not_to_win_pennsylvania_131058.html
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/06/donald-trump-pennsylvania-224966
The new trading area could be called: Not the European Union, or NEU for short.
Pronounced 'new' of course.
I was at an event yesterday with senior movers and shakers and they said the Civil Service would come up with a way to stop Article 50 being invoked. This is one such way.
Who wouldn't be unhappy with that ?
Chaos isn't a pit.
Chaos is a ladder.
Many who try to climb it fail and never get to try again.
The fall breaks them.
And some are given a chance to climb, but they refuse.
They cling to the realm or the gods or love.
Illusions.
Only the ladder is real.
The climb is all there is.
http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/why-im-on-the-brink-of-burning-my-israeli-passport-9600165.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3579492/Netanyahu-rebukes-Israeli-general-Holocaust-speech.html
I think Lewis from the Left is a good candidate and I have no idea why the bunker hasn't struck a deal with the PLP by now whereby they would guarantee him enough nominations if Corbyn stood down.
That, to me, is the best compromise to break the deadlock.
"Not yet."
Extraordinary times.
Israel-gate means Corbyn is eventually done for anyway – the Israeli Labor party comment makes it more likely that the UK party could suspend him.
https://twitter.com/tzipi_livni/status/748529062075842560