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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » GE2015 Day Minus 1 – the latest polling/betting round-up

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    simmonitesimmonite Posts: 13
    PeterC said:

    Patrick said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Good afternoon.

    Interesting to see Cable on manoeuvres, arguing strongly against a 2017 EU referendum (and hence, implicitly, against a Con/LD coalition).

    Thought for the day:

    Would the LibDems be won round to a 2017 referendum if the EU were not the only question on the ballot paper? One question for the right of the coalition ("Do you want to leave the EU?") and one for the left?

    STV on the same ballot paper?

    Exactly.

    And I suspect Cameron would like it as a way of confusing the Out campaign.
    I think Clegg would be up for an EU referendum if push came to shove. He'd be gambling, almost certainly correctly, that we'd vote to stay in. UKIP are afraid of the 2017 referendum - they know we'd vote the wrong way and knacker their USP for at least a decade.
    If I were a UKIP supporter I would be looking at the SNP and be very enthusiastic about losing a 2017 EU referendum. If OUT gets one-third of the vote and UKIP can get that third of the vote to rally around their party in the way the 45% are rallying around the SNP then they would be well on to winning the next general election.
    The success of the SNP in rallying the 45% is to do with the emotive power of nationalism and the dream of independence. I doubt that EU membership has comparable connotations - it's a much more pragmatic issue I would have thought.

    It's also a protest / Nota / anti-austerity vote
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    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Convergence of opinion polls: the opinion polls for the Scottish referendum converged very closely on 48:52. The actual result was 45:55.

    A similar divergence of the actual polling result from the current convergence around Con 34 Lab 33 could result in Con 37 Lab 30 or Lab 36 Con 31. In either case, an overall majority would be in the offing.

    I don't see the polling in this election as any more reliable than it was in the Scottish referendum.
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    Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    edited May 2015
    I still don't think Labour will be stupid enough to try to go into government if they get less seats than the Tories. Whatever the constitutional rights and wrongs, the public sees it clear-cut as the party who gets most seats has "won" (according to Ashcroft's focus groups, even many Labour voters think that). Miliband might want to, but I'm hopeful the rest of the MPs will know the future of the party is more important than his personal ambition to be PM. It's in their long-term interests to (a) not be accused of a "coup", and (b) let a Tory minority government stagger on unable to actually do anything Toryish, and prepare for the next imminent election.
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    dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,294

    On Vince Cable, has there been any polling done in his seat? As far as I was aware, Twickenham was not one of the danger seats for the LDs.

    See http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2015-31712045

    There was an ICM *Gold Standard* poll which put the Tories on 34% and LD on 32%.
    I'll ready POVCWAS for Friday morning.
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    AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    Opinium: what are the diffs from last time. Given the difference between pollsters, I don't know whether to view that as good/bad/indifferent/boring.
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,481
    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,129
    Miss Jones, thanks for that (and welcome back).
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,010

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Is that tomorrow or today? Or is Ipsos MORI tomorrow?
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    blakmorerjblakmorerj Posts: 22

    On Vince Cable, has there been any polling done in his seat? As far as I was aware, Twickenham was not one of the danger seats for the LDs.

    See http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2015-31712045

    There was an ICM *Gold Standard* poll which put the Tories on 34% and LD on 32%.
    So there's only been one poll. How long ago was it?
    Sorry should of said. April 14'. So a long time ago. But I would say the fact Cam was there yesterday, and Clegg a few days ago, and the fact we have heard very little of Vince- shows it is very close!
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    ChameleonChameleon Posts: 4,146
    antifrank said:

    Convergence of opinion polls: the opinion polls for the Scottish referendum converged very closely on 48:52. The actual result was 45:55.

    A similar divergence of the actual polling result from the current convergence around Con 34 Lab 33 could result in Con 37 Lab 30 or Lab 36 Con 31. In either case, an overall majority would be in the offing.

    I don't see the polling in this election as any more reliable than it was in the Scottish referendum.

    37-30 would be good, that's a decent OM for the Tories this time around.
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    SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,713
    I'm not sure the polls are saying anything useful anymore. MOE is such that it's that which means if EICIPM or if Cameron stays...
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    dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Is that tomorrow or today? Or is Ipsos MORI tomorrow?
    The only polls tomorrow are MORI and Ashcroft
    This is ICM
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    chestnut said:

    Scott_P said:

    New?

    @JGForsyth: Another very close poll: Tories 35%, Labour 34% with @OpiniumResearch Ukip on 12%, Lib Dems on 8% and Greens on 6%

    Yes, final poll.

    http://ourinsight.opinium.co.uk/survey-results/political-polling-4th-may-2015
    Labour must be thanking their lucky stars for the enduring strength and power of their brand, otherwise they well and truly would be stuffed.
    I assume you're being sarcastic!

    Labour is in a great position because it spent 13 years expanding relentlessly the tentacles of the state so millions now have a vested interest in putting it into power.

    Though it hasn't helped much in Scotland, although of course it is now the SNP doling it out, and being rewarded at the ballot box accordingly.
    I really am not. On the PM and economic competence figures, the Conservatives should be walking this. But they've spent the last 5 years allowing others to paint their prejudices onto them, and being complacent with their natural supporters.

    My big mistake is that I assumed the Labour poll ratings would catch up (or, more accurately, catch down) with the poor PM and economic competence figures. They haven't because the Labour brand is still strong enough for voters to pick them on values. Or strong enough to hold them enough seats to 'win', if you like.
    I think the big problem is that governments rarely gain in popularity. Swings generally go against the government from one election to the next, not the other way around.
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    This doesn't count then?

    @MSmithsonPB: A hint of what ICM is likely to be. CEO @martinboon says he thinks final polls will "be in same territory"
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    blakmorerjblakmorerj Posts: 22

    On Vince Cable, has there been any polling done in his seat? As far as I was aware, Twickenham was not one of the danger seats for the LDs.

    See http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2015-31712045

    There was an ICM *Gold Standard* poll which put the Tories on 34% and LD on 32%.
    So there's only been one poll. How long ago was it?
    Sorry should of said. April 14'. So a long time ago. But I would say the fact Cam was there yesterday, and Clegg a few days ago, and the fact we have heard very little of Vince- shows it is very close!
    Though the April 14' poll had Ukip on 5% and Lab on 23%. Over the last 13 months the Cons have had little to squeeze from Ukip, and the LD's will have had much to squeeze from Labour (especially as Vince, despite being a Minister, is considered *one of them*).
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,481

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Is that tomorrow or today? Or is Ipsos MORI tomorrow?
    ICM today Ipsos Mori in the morning.
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 57,074
    What is this abuse targeted at female Tory MPs all about? It seems nastier than any other:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/general-election-2015/11585511/Vandals-flood-Conservative-MPs-garden-with-1300-litres-of-oil.html
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    PeterCPeterC Posts: 1,274
    edited May 2015
    Danny565 said:

    I still don't think Labour will be stupid enough to try to go into government if they get less seats than the Tories. Whatever the constitutional rights and wrongs, the public sees it clear-cut as the party who gets most seats has "won" (according to Ashcroft's focus groups, even many Labour voters think that). Miliband might want to, but I'm hopeful the rest of the MPs will know the future of the party is more important than his personal ambition to be PM. It's in their long-term interests to (a) not be accused of a "coup", and (b) let a Tory minority government stagger on unable to actually do anything Toryish, and prepare for the next imminent election.

    How individual MPs (of all parties) might behave at variance with their whips would also come into play. I would not be surprised to see several go mysteriously AWOL for some votes.

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    kle4kle4 Posts: 93,358

    SeanT said:

    Neil said:

    SeanT said:

    watford30 said:

    SeanT said:

    "“Get out, you fucking Jew,” he shouts. I am being throttled as around ten Asian men surround me." The UK elex, 2015.

    http://www.politico.eu/article/galloway-bradford-elections-uk-ge2015/

    From Nats brownshirting around Glasgow to lefties writing "Tory Whore" on Tory cars to the anti-Semitic thuggery of Respect, something quite sad has happened to UK politics, and its happened quite suddenly.

    You neglected to mention the Kipper who wants to 'put a bullet between the eyes' of his opponent.
    Yep, them too. Our politics has become coarser and nastier, tinged with race-baiting, race hatred and ugly Nationalism. It's not pretty.

    I reckon it began with Labour demonising Tories - baby eaters. That brought the discourse of hatred into British politics. And now it has spread. If you dehumanise the enemy it is OK to abuse him, or even assault him, as Hitler knew well.
    Somehow I knew you'd manage to pin the blame on lefties.


    Actually I think the Tories must take some blame as well. Thatcher describing striking miners as "the enemy within" was a low point for the Tory party.

    However it is pretty much undeniable that the relentless discourse of dehumanising hatred mainly comes from the Left, directed at Tories for decades now - evil bankers, baby eaters, posh scum destroying the NHS etc etc. Nye Bevan called Tories "vermin" back in the 40s.

    As long as this rhetoric was restricted to a few loopier lefties it was OK, but it has infected mainstream Labour discourse, and has - as I say - now spread far and wide to other parties. Indeed it is being turned ON Labour by the Nats.

    It needs to stop.
    It is the end of days, SeanT calls for more civility, and less insults in the world!

    (I do agree with you though)
    Too many insults just dilutes the quality. I'm in favour of high quality insults myself.

    On the polls, I wish there was another way to describe them than being very close when Con lead by 1 or something - yes it is true, but it also means the actual result is probably not that close, as that is nailed on EICIPM territory, and maybe describing them as close explains why some people don't seem to realise a 1-2 Tory lead is no guarantee of anything really.
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Any idea what time we can expect it? Surely we don't need to wait until tomorrow's paper is released tonight?
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    Labour Most Seats weakening on Betfair from 5.2 this morning to 5.4 currently.
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    OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 9,143
    edited May 2015

    Compared to 2010

    Lab +3
    Con -1
    Plaid +2
    UKIP +10
    LD -12
    Green +1.5

    tessyC said:

    Exciting final Welsh poll...

    Labour 39% (-1%)
    Conservative 25% (-1%)
    Plaid Cymru 13% (+1%)
    UKIP 12% (-1%)
    Liberal Democrats 8% (+2%)
    Greens 2% (-2%)

    http://www.itv.com/news/wales/update/2015-05-06/poll-shows-welsh-labour-lead-still-14/

    Earth shattering.......

    On the face of it seems weird UKIP picking up the Lib Dem vote....I presume something more complex is going on than that.
    I presume that, broadly speaking, all parties are losing votes to UKIP and gaining votes from the Lib Dems, with the two effects mostly cancelling out except for UKIP and the Lib Dems.

    This is rather similar to the Bergeron-Findeison process.
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,481
    I can't believe Martin Boon won't give me an advance sight of the ICM before the Guardian.

    Well I tried.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 93,358


    Just think. In 48 hours we will all be on here, telling each other why the result was exactly what we had thought all along.

    Never fear - some of us have been so unequivocal in one direcrtion if we are proven wrong even the most complex of mental gymnastics wouldn't allow for that.

    Maybe I should cover myself though - I'm putting the chance of a Tory government back up to 5%.
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,010
    edited May 2015

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Is that tomorrow or today? Or is Ipsos MORI tomorrow?
    The only polls tomorrow are MORI and Ashcroft
    This is ICM

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Is that tomorrow or today? Or is Ipsos MORI tomorrow?
    ICM today Ipsos Mori in the morning.
    Thanks, guys!

    So we're still waiting on?

    Panelbase today
    ICM today

    Ipsos MORI tomorrow
    Ashcroft tomorrow
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    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 40,954

    Neil said:

    Pulpstar said:

    dr_spyn said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I can't remember an election where all THREE party leaders have looked as vulnerable to post election manouvrings.

    273-272-24 should be a corker for knife watchers.

    Will Bennett and Farage survive as well? The changes at the top could be across the board.
    I don't really see any "triggers" for Bennett - 3rd place or lower in all of Norwich South, Sheffield Central, Bristol West and losing Pavilion perhaps.
    The members, in their wisdom, re-elected Bennett (to be fair to the members she was unopposed) last September. We are stuck with, I mean, we will enjoy the benefit of her leadership until September 2016 when I predict she will stand down.

    Greens ought to merge the E&W and Scot parties and put Patrick H in charge. 10 times better than Nat.
    There does not seem much chance of that - Mr Harvie and the Scottish Greens are pro-indy (which could turn out to be critical in the Holyrood election next year, given the electoral system).

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    Tony_MTony_M Posts: 70
    stodge said:

    So the Conservatives have spent £70 million turning a small lead into a "small lead" ?

    And they lecture Labour on economic mismanagement....

    One big difference; it's their money they're spunking - not ours.

    They spend their money as they see fit. They appear, in general, to be far more frugal with our money than Labour ever are.
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,481
    Scott_P said:

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    This doesn't count then?

    @MSmithsonPB: A hint of what ICM is likely to be. CEO @martinboon says he thinks final polls will "be in same territory"
    is a few days old quote
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    dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Is that tomorrow or today? Or is Ipsos MORI tomorrow?
    The only polls tomorrow are MORI and Ashcroft
    This is ICM

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Is that tomorrow or today? Or is Ipsos MORI tomorrow?
    ICM today Ipsos Mori in the morning.
    Thanks, guys!

    So we're still waiting on?

    Panelbase today
    ICM today

    Ipsos MORI tomorrow
    Ashcroft tomorrow
    There's another ComRes and Populus and a YouGov and poss a BMG
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    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820

    What is this abuse targeted at female Tory MPs all about? It seems nastier than any other:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/general-election-2015/11585511/Vandals-flood-Conservative-MPs-garden-with-1300-litres-of-oil.html

    That must be the worst example of apparently political criminal intimidation in mainland Britain for donkey's years. The environmental damage will be horrendous, it will take many tens of thousands of pounds to clear up.
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    stodgestodge Posts: 13,116

    That Cable has come out so publicly to speak out against a 2017 EU In-Out referendum, is telling - just how many LDs has Clegg agreed his redlines with exactly? He'll need senior colleagues on his side at the very least - and I don't just mean Alexander and Laws, either.

    I think it's a dangerous development and illustrates how things could go very wrong very wrong very quickly for the LDs on Friday.

    In 2010, there was reticence about going into Coalition with the Conservatives but those who would have preferred to work with Labour had not only a weak hand but were not helped by Labour's antics.

    Now, the situation is very different. We've had the Coalition 1.0 Experience and it's not been pleasant though proponents will argue it has enabled some key aspects of LD policy to be successfully enacted even though the flip side has been having to support areas of CON policy with which elements in the party were profoundly uncomfortable.

    The Coalition provided stable Government at a much needed time backed by a solid majority. It now seems likely that majority will disappear. Between those eager to "finish the job" and those who say "never again" are the majority who need reassurance that Coalition 2.0 will and would be a better experience for the Party.

    Vince is trying to play the anti-Coalition hand in response to Nick's attempts to bounce the Party into Coalition 2.0. It's a worrying sign and I really think the LDs could potentially be in a serious place in the next few weeks.

  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,481

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Is that tomorrow or today? Or is Ipsos MORI tomorrow?
    The only polls tomorrow are MORI and Ashcroft
    This is ICM

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Is that tomorrow or today? Or is Ipsos MORI tomorrow?
    ICM today Ipsos Mori in the morning.
    Thanks, guys!

    So we're still waiting on?

    Panelbase today
    ICM today

    Ipsos MORI tomorrow
    Ashcroft tomorrow
    Populus tomorrow I think.
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    Chameleon said:

    antifrank said:

    Convergence of opinion polls: the opinion polls for the Scottish referendum converged very closely on 48:52. The actual result was 45:55.

    A similar divergence of the actual polling result from the current convergence around Con 34 Lab 33 could result in Con 37 Lab 30 or Lab 36 Con 31. In either case, an overall majority would be in the offing.

    I don't see the polling in this election as any more reliable than it was in the Scottish referendum.

    37-30 would be good, that's a decent OM for the Tories this time around.
    37/30 would be an epic result. Unlikely but epic.
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Is that tomorrow or today? Or is Ipsos MORI tomorrow?
    The only polls tomorrow are MORI and Ashcroft
    This is ICM

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Is that tomorrow or today? Or is Ipsos MORI tomorrow?
    ICM today Ipsos Mori in the morning.
    Thanks, guys!

    So we're still waiting on?

    Panelbase today
    ICM today

    Ipsos MORI tomorrow
    Ashcroft tomorrow
    There's another ComRes and Populus and a YouGov and poss a BMG
    Did we not get the final ComRes earlier today?

  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 93,358

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    No need to boo - their reluctancve to offer teasing and hints is clearly the biggest tease and hint of all; it must be a massively interesting one.
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    ChameleonChameleon Posts: 4,146
    Tony_M said:

    stodge said:

    So the Conservatives have spent £70 million turning a small lead into a "small lead" ?

    And they lecture Labour on economic mismanagement....

    One big difference; it's their money they're spunking - not ours.

    They spend their money as they see fit. They appear, in general, to be far more frugal with our money than Labour ever are.
    *cough* £30,000 paperweight *cough*
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,010

    I can't believe Martin Boon won't give me an advance sight of the ICM before the Guardian.

    Well I tried.

    Back in August when I first started ELBOW, I tried asking him how exactly the spiral of silence is calculated but he didn't reply to my email :(
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,481

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Any idea what time we can expect it? Surely we don't need to wait until tomorrow's paper is released tonight?
    I think we might have to wait until this evening.

    Normally Martin Boon and the Guardian's Tom Clark usually give a hint.

    But they are like Trappist Monks today.
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    LennonLennon Posts: 1,753
    Pro_Rata said:

    Lennon said:

    Sandpit said:

    Taking a coffee break between a zillion phone calls, so an anecdote for amusement. Chap on my list of people who told canvassers they "liked Palmer but not Labour" said he'd always voted Tory, but, well, at age 60 he'd never, ever done anything *radical*, so just this once he'd vote Labour and see how he felt.

    Eat your heart out, SeanT - some people know how to live exciting lives.

    One of the 389 down! Good luck to you tomorrow, sounds like you could be in with a chance in a very close race!
    Do we have any other Parliamentary candidates on here?
    Yes - but minor party (Pirate), so not sure it counts (and I post somewhat infrequently...)
    You will be pleased to know that Pirate even have your own colour on this battleground board, ahead of Respect, no less!

    http://www.repubblica.it/static/speciale/2015/elezioni/regno_unito_gran_bretagna/confronto.html
    :-) Thanks for that - great spot!
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    Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    edited May 2015
    PeterC said:

    Danny565 said:

    I still don't think Labour will be stupid enough to try to go into government if they get less seats than the Tories. Whatever the constitutional rights and wrongs, the public sees it clear-cut as the party who gets most seats has "won" (according to Ashcroft's focus groups, even many Labour voters think that). Miliband might want to, but I'm hopeful the rest of the MPs will know the future of the party is more important than his personal ambition to be PM. It's in their long-term interests to (a) not be accused of a "coup", and (b) let a Tory minority government stagger on unable to actually do anything Toryish, and prepare for the next imminent election.

    How individual MPs (of all parties) might behave at variance with their whips would also come into play. I would not be surprised to see several go mysteriously AWOL for some votes.

    True in theory, but I really don't think many Labour MPs are going to be breaking the whip to vote for Tory spending cuts. While the "Blairite" relics still have disproportionate influence in the media, there are very few of them actually left in the Commons. The only thing where you could see a big Labour rebellion siding with the Tories is on a European referendum, IMO.

    Actually, you could make an argument that a Tory super-minority government is exactly what the country wants: Cameron still "in charge" and attending all the international summits, but in terms of actual policies the Tories are forced to be much less extreme.
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    BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 8,087
    Pulpstar said:

    Barnesian said:

    SNP has moved down slightly on SPIN. And LDs have moved up a bit. Given the latest polls, I think LDs are going to surprise on the upside. I now have them at 30.

    What, with 8 and 9% ?!
    I have the LDs on 9.4%. But in most constituencies they are on only 2-4%. They have collapsed completely. In the following 30, I have them ahead - some of them are very marginal.

    Bath
    Berwick (Ash)
    Brecon
    Birming Yard (Ash)
    Cambridge
    Carshalt
    Ceredig
    Cheadle
    Chelten
    Colches
    Cornwal North
    Devon
    Eastbou
    Eastleig
    Hazel G
    Kingsto
    Leeds N
    Lewes
    Norfolk
    Orkney
    Sheffiel Hallam
    Southp
    St Ives
    Sutton & Cheam
    Taunton
    Thornb
    Torbay
    Twicken
    Westm
    Yeovil
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    LucyJonesLucyJones Posts: 651

    Miss Jones, thanks for that (and welcome back).

    Thank you. I have been lurking quite a lot recently, hoping to gain some wise insights into the likely election result. But nobody really has a clue, do they?

    A couple of days my 9-year-old daughter heard something about "polls" on the radio and asked what they were. "Well, to try and work out the result of the election, they ask lots of people who they are going to vote for, and then they try to work out what the result will be". Daughter thought for a moment before asking: "But why don't they just wait for the election and then they'll know who's won?". .
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    dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Is that tomorrow or today? Or is Ipsos MORI tomorrow?
    The only polls tomorrow are MORI and Ashcroft
    This is ICM

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Is that tomorrow or today? Or is Ipsos MORI tomorrow?
    ICM today Ipsos Mori in the morning.
    Thanks, guys!

    So we're still waiting on?

    Panelbase today
    ICM today

    Ipsos MORI tomorrow
    Ashcroft tomorrow
    There's another ComRes and Populus and a YouGov and poss a BMG
    Did we not get the final ComRes earlier today?

    That was last night. I think but am not sure another is due
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,157

    What is this abuse targeted at female Tory MPs all about? It seems nastier than any other:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/general-election-2015/11585511/Vandals-flood-Conservative-MPs-garden-with-1300-litres-of-oil.html

    That must be the worst example of apparently political criminal intimidation in mainland Britain for donkey's years. The environmental damage will be horrendous, it will take many tens of thousands of pounds to clear up.
    That's just awful. Even worse that her parents have been targetted too. I hope the idiots that did this are found and face the full force of the law.
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    ChameleonChameleon Posts: 4,146

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Any idea what time we can expect it? Surely we don't need to wait until tomorrow's paper is released tonight?
    I think we might have to wait until this evening.

    Normally Martin Boon and the Guardian's Tom Clark usually give a hint.

    But they are like Trappist Monks today.
    Sizeable lead for someone?
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,010

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Is that tomorrow or today? Or is Ipsos MORI tomorrow?
    The only polls tomorrow are MORI and Ashcroft
    This is ICM

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Is that tomorrow or today? Or is Ipsos MORI tomorrow?
    ICM today Ipsos Mori in the morning.
    Thanks, guys!

    So we're still waiting on?

    Panelbase today
    ICM today

    Ipsos MORI tomorrow
    Ashcroft tomorrow
    There's another ComRes and Populus and a YouGov and poss a BMG
    Did we not get the final ComRes earlier today?

    Yep, Daily Mail, though first came out at 10pm last night.
  • Options
    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,397
    Opinium's internals actually appear to be another tie, tweaked by a 1% difference in certainty to vote (an implausible 87% vs 86% - that really IS a difference in online polling IMO: patience to do polls=greater likehood to vote).

  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,481
    @patrickwintour: Labour: Clegg looks like he is preparing to surrender party position on EU and pave the way for a renewed Coalition with the Conservatives
  • Options
    chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Is that tomorrow or today? Or is Ipsos MORI tomorrow?
    The only polls tomorrow are MORI and Ashcroft
    This is ICM

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Is that tomorrow or today? Or is Ipsos MORI tomorrow?
    ICM today Ipsos Mori in the morning.
    Thanks, guys!

    So we're still waiting on?

    Panelbase today
    ICM today

    Ipsos MORI tomorrow
    Ashcroft tomorrow
    Didn't Survation threaten to regale us with daily polls as well?
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Danny565 said:

    PeterC said:

    Danny565 said:

    I still don't think Labour will be stupid enough to try to go into government if they get less seats than the Tories. Whatever the constitutional rights and wrongs, the public sees it clear-cut as the party who gets most seats has "won" (according to Ashcroft's focus groups, even many Labour voters think that). Miliband might want to, but I'm hopeful the rest of the MPs will know the future of the party is more important than his personal ambition to be PM. It's in their long-term interests to (a) not be accused of a "coup", and (b) let a Tory minority government stagger on unable to actually do anything Toryish, and prepare for the next imminent election.

    How individual MPs (of all parties) might behave at variance with their whips would also come into play. I would not be surprised to see several go mysteriously AWOL for some votes.

    True in theory, but I really don't think many Labour MPs are going to be breaking the whip to vote for Tory spending cuts. While the "Blairite" relics still have disproportionate influence in the media, there are very few of them actually left in the Commons. The only thing where you could see a big Labour rebellion siding with the Tories is on a European referendum, IMO.

    Actually, you could make an argument that a Tory super-minority government is exactly what the country wants: Cameron still "in charge" and attending all the international summits, but in terms of actual policies the Tories are forced to be much less extreme.
    They won't need to vote against the whip, just not turn up to vote for some reason. A few missed trains perhaps?

    Though I agree its unlikely.
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    PeterCPeterC Posts: 1,274
    Danny565 said:

    PeterC said:

    Danny565 said:

    I still don't think Labour will be stupid enough to try to go into government if they get less seats than the Tories. Whatever the constitutional rights and wrongs, the public sees it clear-cut as the party who gets most seats has "won" (according to Ashcroft's focus groups, even many Labour voters think that). Miliband might want to, but I'm hopeful the rest of the MPs will know the future of the party is more important than his personal ambition to be PM. It's in their long-term interests to (a) not be accused of a "coup", and (b) let a Tory minority government stagger on unable to actually do anything Toryish, and prepare for the next imminent election.

    How individual MPs (of all parties) might behave at variance with their whips would also come into play. I would not be surprised to see several go mysteriously AWOL for some votes.

    True in theory, but I really don't think many Labour MPs are going to be breaking the whip to vote for Tory spending cuts. While the "Blairite" relics still have disproportionate influence in the media, there are very few of them actually left in the Commons. The only thing where you could see a big Labour rebellion siding with the Tories is on a European referendum, IMO.

    Actually, you could make an argument that a Tory super-minority government is exactly what the country wants: Cameron still "in charge" and attending all the international summits, but in terms of actual policies the Tories are forced to be much less extreme.
    Mmm .. novel idea. But US administrations are frequently "super-minority", I suppose.

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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,010
    Chameleon said:

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Any idea what time we can expect it? Surely we don't need to wait until tomorrow's paper is released tonight?
    I think we might have to wait until this evening.

    Normally Martin Boon and the Guardian's Tom Clark usually give a hint.

    But they are like Trappist Monks today.
    Sizeable lead for someone?
    Phone poll would point to Tories?

    https://twitter.com/Sunil_P2/status/594835246866157570
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 41,118
    What is it about the conservatives that makes the racist homophobe Kerry Smith endorse them?

    The Enquirer (@Enquirernews)
    06/05/2015 15:04
    Parliamentary candidate Kerry Smith urges voters to choose Conservatives: theenquirer.co.uk/parliamentary
  • Options
    dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,294

    What is this abuse targeted at female Tory MPs all about? It seems nastier than any other:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/general-election-2015/11585511/Vandals-flood-Conservative-MPs-garden-with-1300-litres-of-oil.html

    That must be the worst example of apparently political criminal intimidation in mainland Britain for donkey's years. The environmental damage will be horrendous, it will take many tens of thousands of pounds to clear up.
    Not sure that A and S police have had much success arresting 'anarchist' outrages in last 2 years- someone torched their firearms training base, and so far no trial.
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    Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    LucyJones said:

    Miss Jones, thanks for that (and welcome back).

    Thank you. I have been lurking quite a lot recently, hoping to gain some wise insights into the likely election result. But nobody really has a clue, do they?

    A couple of days my 9-year-old daughter heard something about "polls" on the radio and asked what they were. "Well, to try and work out the result of the election, they ask lots of people who they are going to vote for, and then they try to work out what the result will be". Daughter thought for a moment before asking: "But why don't they just wait for the election and then they'll know who's won?". .
    Clearly your daughter has not had her pocket money on the SNP. You should work on that.
  • Options
    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    Chameleon said:

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Any idea what time we can expect it? Surely we don't need to wait until tomorrow's paper is released tonight?
    I think we might have to wait until this evening.

    Normally Martin Boon and the Guardian's Tom Clark usually give a hint.

    But they are like Trappist Monks today.
    Sizeable lead for someone?
    Phone poll would point to Tories?

    https://twitter.com/Sunil_P2/status/594835246866157570
    When will we get a final Elbow with May's results? Tomorrow morning after Ipsos?
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,129
    Miss Jones, your daughter sounds like a clever girl :)
  • Options
    dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786
    I think we can all agree a graphic similar to the 1997 landslide engulfing Tories would be most amusing for the Scottish results tomorrow night
  • Options
    Just back from another round of leafleting. Still interesting to see how many people who said they didn't vote last time will this time according to the polls, lets see if they turn up tomorrow. If they do EDM will be PM
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    stodgestodge Posts: 13,116
    Do all these polls make today Omnihypermegapolling Day ?
  • Options
    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    stodge said:

    Do all these polls make today Omnihypermegapolling Day ?

    With an ominimegaarse?
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    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820
    edited May 2015
    Of course, if Labour have any sense then in a hung parliament where Lab + SNP don't have a majority but neither does Con+LD, they'll let Cameron remain in government for a few months, picking up unpopularity, and use the time as a window of opportunity to ditch Ed and choose someone vaguely credible, and also to start repairing SLAB

    Ed won't go of his own accord, of course - his misplaced self-belief is too strong - so I expect in that scenario he'd try to become PM in a minority government propped up by the SNP and others - a recipe for utter disaster both for the country and for Labour.

    The only silver lining which I can see in the current situation is that there is a chance that UKIP will do sufficiently badly to focus the minds of the centre-right on the need for discipline and unity. Maybe.
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    dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786
    Not the final Ashcroft. Read your site more often and you'd know that! Lol
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    ChameleonChameleon Posts: 4,146
    edited May 2015

    Chameleon said:

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Any idea what time we can expect it? Surely we don't need to wait until tomorrow's paper is released tonight?
    I think we might have to wait until this evening.

    Normally Martin Boon and the Guardian's Tom Clark usually give a hint.

    But they are like Trappist Monks today.
    Sizeable lead for someone?
    Phone poll would point to Tories?

    twitter.com/Sunil_P2/status/594835246866157570
    Hopefully whatever it is it will be interesting (5-7% lead for someone would be fun) :D
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    OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 9,143
    I thought we were getting another Ashcroft and Populus tomorrow morning?
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    Bond_James_BondBond_James_Bond Posts: 1,939
    edited May 2015
    Sandpit said:

    Sean_F said:

    Plato said:
    Plato said:
    Not for the first time with the Guardian, it's hard to tell if this is a parody or not.
    It isn't:

    "The first woman to be raped in space has probably already been born."
    Really..? Where do they get this drivel, and why the hell do they publish it?
    Well, Lambert was raped in Alien by the titular creature, and that was IIRC set in about 2059. The actress was about 29 / 30 when it was made in 1978 so if that timeline proves accurate the Graun is not far wrong. Lambert will be born in about 10, 15 years.

    It comes to something when lefties start bellyaching about stuff that has not happened but would be, y'know, bad in a very real sense if it did happen.

  • Options
    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    Pulpstar said:

    Some of the commentors are thick as bricks:

    "What about the SNP? Will they be prepared to swear allegiance to the Crown? I'm using a the Crown as a metonymic construct there."

    Someone better tell Stuie and Angus.

    I can'd find a youtube of it but Rosanna Cunningham quite famously and very visible held her fingers crossed during the Oath.
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    dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786

    I thought we were getting another Ashcroft and Populus tomorrow morning?
    Ashcroft certainly and another Populus is due afaik
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,010
    LucyJones said:

    Miss Jones, thanks for that (and welcome back).

    Thank you. I have been lurking quite a lot recently, hoping to gain some wise insights into the likely election result. But nobody really has a clue, do they?

    A couple of days my 9-year-old daughter heard something about "polls" on the radio and asked what they were. "Well, to try and work out the result of the election, they ask lots of people who they are going to vote for, and then they try to work out what the result will be". Daughter thought for a moment before asking: "But why don't they just wait for the election and then they'll know who's won?". .
    But opinion polls are fun... trust me...
  • Options
    ChameleonChameleon Posts: 4,146
    edited May 2015

    I thought we were getting another Ashcroft and Populus tomorrow morning?
    Ashcroft certainly and another Populus is due afaik
    Ashcroft is going for a 3,000 size poll as well isn't he?
  • Options
    dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786
    Chameleon said:

    I thought we were getting another Ashcroft and Populus tomorrow morning?
    Ashcroft certainly and another Populus is due afaik
    Ashcroft is going for a 3,000 size poll as well isn't he?
    Yes, 3000 sample out first thing tomoz

  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 77,800
    edited May 2015
    Chameleon said:

    Chameleon said:

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Any idea what time we can expect it? Surely we don't need to wait until tomorrow's paper is released tonight?
    I think we might have to wait until this evening.

    Normally Martin Boon and the Guardian's Tom Clark usually give a hint.

    But they are like Trappist Monks today.
    Sizeable lead for someone?
    Phone poll would point to Tories?

    twitter.com/Sunil_P2/status/594835246866157570
    Hopefully whatever it is it will be interesting (5-7% lead for someone would be fun) :D
    It is quite interesting when you see that graphic.

    The phone polls show what I guess would be described as "swing-back"...Tories from -4 to +2 in past 6 months. It is a very clear consistent movement back to the Tories

    This movement has been totally overshadowed by the fact online polls basically shown only the tiniest of "swing-back" if any.

    Who is right, if either, will be really interesting to see.
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    isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited May 2015
    Labour candidate thinks awful racist homophobe independent candidate that endorsed the conservatives is joining the conservatives

    BasildonYA (@BasildonYA)
    06/05/2015 14:24
    Mike Le Surf said he was unsurprised by the move and said he believed Kerry Smith was planning to join the Conservative group.
  • Options
    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    isam said:

    Labour candidate thinks awful racist homophobe independent candidate that endorsed the conservatives is joining the conservatives

    BasildonYA (@BasildonYA)
    06/05/2015 14:24
    Mike Le Surf said he was unsurprised by the move and said he believed Kerry Smith was planning to join the Conservative group.

    Hopefully someone would turnaround and say thanks but no thanks.
  • Options

    Just back from another round of leafleting. Still interesting to see how many people who said they didn't vote last time will this time according to the polls, lets see if they turn up tomorrow. If they do EDM will be PM

    If you are leafleting, how do you know which way they voted last time?
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    watford30watford30 Posts: 3,474
    edited May 2015
    In less than 24 hours, thousands of Russell Brand's disciples could be turning up at polling stations, only to discover that they're unable to vote.
  • Options
    chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    I'm struck by just how often the esteemed members of this website seem to be called to fill in internet polls. It seems wildly disproportionate to the general population.
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    TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Populus/BMG/Opinium/TNS in - not a single Lab lead ?

  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,010

    Chameleon said:

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    Any idea what time we can expect it? Surely we don't need to wait until tomorrow's paper is released tonight?
    I think we might have to wait until this evening.

    Normally Martin Boon and the Guardian's Tom Clark usually give a hint.

    But they are like Trappist Monks today.
    Sizeable lead for someone?
    Phone poll would point to Tories?

    https://twitter.com/Sunil_P2/status/594835246866157570
    When will we get a final Elbow with May's results? Tomorrow morning after Ipsos?
    Yes, hopefully before my meeting at work around 2.45 :)

    And then I have to rush from the Midlands to Ilford to vote - yes, I know a postal ballot would have saved the trip!
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,157
    edited May 2015
    30 million turnout poll expected tommorow I hear.

    Alot of self selection bias mind, and a strict turnout filter.
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    dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786

    isam said:

    Labour candidate thinks awful racist homophobe independent candidate that endorsed the conservatives is joining the conservatives

    BasildonYA (@BasildonYA)
    06/05/2015 14:24
    Mike Le Surf said he was unsurprised by the move and said he believed Kerry Smith was planning to join the Conservative group.

    Hopefully someone would turnaround and say thanks but no thanks.
    She won't join Lab for sure, they make the women folk sit separately and knit them red flags
  • Options
    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 21,122

    Boo

    @martinboon: No Twitter teasing, no red herrings, no hints. @ICMResearch @guardian poll will be with you when it's with you. Sorry @TSEofPB

    #ticktock

  • Options
    SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976

    @patrickwintour: Labour: Clegg looks like he is preparing to surrender party position on EU and pave the way for a renewed Coalition with the Conservatives

    Reverting back to their 2005 manifesto position will be justified as pragmatism, rather than a climb-down?
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 77,800
    The BBC’s poundshop Kilroy, Victoria Derbyshire, managed just 39,000 viewers last Thursday, rounded down to zero in the overnight ratings. It has averaged just 73,000 viewers so far.

    Couldn't happen to a nicer person...
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    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820
    Pulpstar said:

    30 million turnout poll expected tommorow I hear.

    Alot of self selection bias mind, and a strict turnout filter.

    Yes, and a lot of the respondents won't understand the question.
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 77,800
    edited May 2015
    watford30 said:

    In less than 24 hours, thousands of Russell Brand's disciples could be turning up at polling stations, only to discover that they're unable to vote.

    We demand a revolution.....While, Brand will probably demand a bigger profit share from his YouTube deal given all the traffic he will have driven with his well run PR stunt.
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    dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786

    Just back from another round of leafleting. Still interesting to see how many people who said they didn't vote last time will this time according to the polls, lets see if they turn up tomorrow. If they do EDM will be PM

    If you are leafleting, how do you know which way they voted last time?
    The same way phone canvassers hear one thing but their eyes told them another.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,157
    watford30 said:

    In less than 24 hours, thousands of Russell Brand's disciples could be turning up at polling stations, only to discover that they're unable to vote.

    That would be hilarious.
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    DanielDaniel Posts: 160
    Turnout predicted to be 69%.
  • Options
    PeterCPeterC Posts: 1,274
    Daniel said:

    Turnout predicted to be 69%.

    By whom?

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    TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Dair said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Some of the commentors are thick as bricks:

    "What about the SNP? Will they be prepared to swear allegiance to the Crown? I'm using a the Crown as a metonymic construct there."

    Someone better tell Stuie and Angus.

    I can'd find a youtube of it but Rosanna Cunningham quite famously and very visible held her fingers crossed during the Oath.
    Hates the crown - loves the half crown..
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    Ishmael_XIshmael_X Posts: 3,664
    chestnut said:

    I'm struck by just how often the esteemed members of this website seem to be called to fill in internet polls. It seems wildly disproportionate to the general population.

    Well, quite.

    It is most fortunate that the standards of political conduct in this country absolutely rule out any of the parties trying to stack the panels in their own favour. If there were as many activists from any one given party deliberately put on there as a matter of secret party policy, as there are PBers, the resulting polls would be as reliable as a chocolate crutch. Thank God we are British.
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    DanielDaniel Posts: 160
    PeterC said:

    Daniel said:

    Turnout predicted to be 69%.

    By whom?

    #GE2015: Voter turnout predicted to be 69% across Great Britain, with Scotland above the average at 71%. #mrx #polls http://t.co/PGopiSsQwG

    — TNS UK (@TNS_UK) May 6, 2015
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,010
    Pulpstar said:

    30 million turnout poll expected tommorow I hear.

    Alot of self selection bias mind, and a strict turnout filter.

    And it won't be conducted by phone or internet, though a fair proportion of people will have already been polled by a more ancient technology known as "the post" :)
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @stephenkb: The nightmare, now in graph form thanks to @NCPoliticsUK: http://t.co/9p5Ry1HqyT
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    PongPong Posts: 4,693
    edited May 2015
    antifrank said:

    Convergence of opinion polls: the opinion polls for the Scottish referendum converged very closely on 48:52. The actual result was 45:55.

    A similar divergence of the actual polling result from the current convergence around Con 34 Lab 33 could result in Con 37 Lab 30 or Lab 36 Con 31. In either case, an overall majority would be in the offing.

    I don't see the polling in this election as any more reliable than it was in the Scottish referendum.

    Its an interesting comparison.

    The referendum should have been quite a simple thing to poll - it was a case of measuring;

    Yes (and will vote)
    No (and will vote)
    Irrelevant (won't vote).

    The main problem (and the element of uncertainty) was that we didn't have any previous comparable indyrefs to calibrate ^ against.

    GE2015 is a much harder beast, with loads more variables. We have a huge amount of form though, with gazillions of previous polls and dozens of actual elections to use to calibrate against.

    If I had to put %ages on it, I'd guess there is a...

    90% chance the result will be within +-5% of the poll average for all the parties.

    50% chance the result will be within +-3% of the poll average for all the parties.
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    isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Telegraph Politics (@TelePolitics)
    06/05/2015 15:55
    #JeSuisEd: Ed Miliband supporters tweet messy food selfies tgr.ph/1Ighlel
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 57,074
    Pulpstar said:

    30 million turnout poll expected tommorow I hear.

    Alot of self selection bias mind, and a strict turnout filter.

    Canvassing anecdotes show they're all voting for Nick Palmer.
This discussion has been closed.