It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
Well that's Mr Blair for you. On the other hand I dont see your big demos for Uighirs, Christians in Pakistan, whites in Zimbabwe etc. I suppose it might be different if they were countries run by jews.
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
In South Africa, there was an obvious good guy, and an obvious bad guy.
Despite what Roger and the Corbynistas think, Israel doesn't fill the role of obvious bad guy, nor do the Palestinians fill the role of obvious good guy.
Yeah, less good in the policing of blue chip vs individuals in the first place though. Regulators need to be tougher when obvious, unfair and persistent shenanigans are deployed.
The biggest hole in flight compensation regulation is the question of whether it’s the airline’s fault. I suspect that as soon as there’s a sniff of, say, industrial action by French ATC, they also move crew from those flights to the ones with a less good excuse. The former get even worse delays than they should have, but no one can prove it.
O/T The Mauritshuis in The Hague must surely be the finest art gallery in the world. A perfect gem.
No, absurd
It only has Dutch golden age art, really. Which js amazing but rather limiting…
It is one of the finest SMALL museums in the world
Its focus is a big plus imo. Too many art galleries try to cover far too much, and do it poorly.
I may be biased by my love of the Dutch Golden Age, of course.
Well, that's a great PB question.
What are the best *small* art galleries in the world?
The requirement being that you can see all the exhibits in an hour.
I would nominate the Hammer in Los Angeles, with an honourable mention for the Santa Barbara Museum of Art.
The Gulbenkian then. Confine yourself to the paintings, and you could do that.
No. Absurd American bias
The Courtauld beats all of those
Says you.
That's from their Chinese porcelain collection, btw.
Elsewhere in the building ..masterpieces by western European artists such as Domenico Ghirlandaio, Rubens, Rembrandt, Rodin, Carpeaux, Houdon, Renoir, Dierick Bouts, Vittore Carpaccio, Cima da Conegliano, Van Dyck, Corot, Degas, Nattier, George Romney, Stefan Lochner, Maurice-Quentin de La Tour, Édouard Manet, Henri Fantin-Latour, Claude Monet, Jean-François Millet, Sir Edward Burne-Jones, Thomas Gainsborough, Joseph Mallord William Turner, Jean-Honoré Fragonard, Giovanni Battista Moroni, Frans Hals, Ruisdael, Boucher, Largillière, Andrea della Robbia, Pisanello, Jean-Baptiste Pigalle, Antonio Rossellino, André-Charles Boulle ,Charles Cressent, Oeben, Riesener, Antoine-Sébastien Durand, Charles Spire, Jean Deforges, François-Thomas Germain...
Are you thinking of the modern art building next door, Leon ?
Well for a start I would dispute that the Gulbenkian is small, which is what we were arguing about? The best small museum?
It is a splendid museum but it is fairly massive IIRC
Whereas the Courtauld is small but exquisitely formed and has three of the most famous paintings in the entire world
The Bar at the Folies Bergere - Manet
Self Portrait with Bandaged Ear - Van Gogh
Adam and Eve - Cranach
And you can whizz through the rest in an hour or two
The Wallace Collection is rather nice. It's free and, when I've been there, not too busy either. Not claiming its the best in the world, or even in London, but it's well worth a visit. And it has The Laughing Cavalier and A Dance to the Music of Time which ain't bad.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
In South Africa, there was an obvious good guy, and an obvious bad guy.
Despite what Roger and the Corbynistas think, Israel doesn't fill the role of obvious bad guy, nor do the Palestinians fill the role of obvious good guy.
Yup. The talk of a “ceasefire” is a good example. In most conflicts when we say “ceasefire” we mean both sides. In this case, people seem to mean unilateral from Israel, and for Israel to just sit there and take continued rocket strikes during it, because it is the baddie and it deserves it.
O/T The Mauritshuis in The Hague must surely be the finest art gallery in the world. A perfect gem.
No, absurd
It only has Dutch golden age art, really. Which js amazing but rather limiting…
It is one of the finest SMALL museums in the world
Its focus is a big plus imo. Too many art galleries try to cover far too much, and do it poorly.
I may be biased by my love of the Dutch Golden Age, of course.
Well, that's a great PB question.
What are the best *small* art galleries in the world?
The requirement being that you can see all the exhibits in an hour.
I would nominate the Hammer in Los Angeles, with an honourable mention for the Santa Barbara Museum of Art.
The Gulbenkian then. Confine yourself to the paintings, and you could do that.
No. Absurd American bias
The Courtauld beats all of those
Says you.
That's from their Chinese porcelain collection, btw.
Elsewhere in the building ..masterpieces by western European artists such as Domenico Ghirlandaio, Rubens, Rembrandt, Rodin, Carpeaux, Houdon, Renoir, Dierick Bouts, Vittore Carpaccio, Cima da Conegliano, Van Dyck, Corot, Degas, Nattier, George Romney, Stefan Lochner, Maurice-Quentin de La Tour, Édouard Manet, Henri Fantin-Latour, Claude Monet, Jean-François Millet, Sir Edward Burne-Jones, Thomas Gainsborough, Joseph Mallord William Turner, Jean-Honoré Fragonard, Giovanni Battista Moroni, Frans Hals, Ruisdael, Boucher, Largillière, Andrea della Robbia, Pisanello, Jean-Baptiste Pigalle, Antonio Rossellino, André-Charles Boulle ,Charles Cressent, Oeben, Riesener, Antoine-Sébastien Durand, Charles Spire, Jean Deforges, François-Thomas Germain...
Are you thinking of the modern art building next door, Leon ?
Well for a start I would dispute that the Gulbenkian is small, which is what we were arguing about? The best small museum?
It is a splendid museum but it is fairly massive IIRC
Whereas the Courtauld is small but exquisitely formed and has three of the most famous paintings in the entire world
The Bar at the Folies Bergere - Manet
Self Portrait with Bandaged Ear - Van Gogh
Adam and Eve - Cranach
And you can whizz through the rest in an hour or two
The Courtauld is absolutely magnificent, and would definitely be a part of any great small museums list.
Courtauld is quite unbeatable in the small but world class category. Not in the same league at all, but small and surprising: Pallant House, Chichester; Fairfax House, York. Small and still feels like a provincial museum from the 1930s: Senhouse, Maryport. Worth seeing but not worth going to see.
Hidden in plain sight in unprepossessing setting and world class quality: The medieval stained glass in All Saints, North Street, York. Just staggering.
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
In South Africa, there was an obvious good guy, and an obvious bad guy.
Despite what Roger and the Corbynistas think, Israel doesn't fill the role of obvious bad guy, nor do the Palestinians fill the role of obvious good guy.
Though there were quite a few on the right who persuaded themselves otherwise.
O/T The Mauritshuis in The Hague must surely be the finest art gallery in the world. A perfect gem.
No, absurd
It only has Dutch golden age art, really. Which js amazing but rather limiting…
It is one of the finest SMALL museums in the world
Its focus is a big plus imo. Too many art galleries try to cover far too much, and do it poorly.
I may be biased by my love of the Dutch Golden Age, of course.
Well, that's a great PB question.
What are the best *small* art galleries in the world?
The requirement being that you can see all the exhibits in an hour.
I would nominate the Hammer in Los Angeles, with an honourable mention for the Santa Barbara Museum of Art.
The Gulbenkian then. Confine yourself to the paintings, and you could do that.
No. Absurd American bias
The Courtauld beats all of those
Says you.
That's from their Chinese porcelain collection, btw.
Elsewhere in the building ..masterpieces by western European artists such as Domenico Ghirlandaio, Rubens, Rembrandt, Rodin, Carpeaux, Houdon, Renoir, Dierick Bouts, Vittore Carpaccio, Cima da Conegliano, Van Dyck, Corot, Degas, Nattier, George Romney, Stefan Lochner, Maurice-Quentin de La Tour, Édouard Manet, Henri Fantin-Latour, Claude Monet, Jean-François Millet, Sir Edward Burne-Jones, Thomas Gainsborough, Joseph Mallord William Turner, Jean-Honoré Fragonard, Giovanni Battista Moroni, Frans Hals, Ruisdael, Boucher, Largillière, Andrea della Robbia, Pisanello, Jean-Baptiste Pigalle, Antonio Rossellino, André-Charles Boulle ,Charles Cressent, Oeben, Riesener, Antoine-Sébastien Durand, Charles Spire, Jean Deforges, François-Thomas Germain...
Are you thinking of the modern art building next door, Leon ?
Well for a start I would dispute that the Gulbenkian is small, which is what we were arguing about? The best small museum?
It is a splendid museum but it is fairly massive IIRC
Whereas the Courtauld is small but exquisitely formed and has three of the most famous paintings in the entire world
The Bar at the Folies Bergere - Manet
Self Portrait with Bandaged Ear - Van Gogh
Adam and Eve - Cranach
And you can whizz through the rest in an hour or two
The Wallace Collection is rather nice. It's free and, when I've been there, not too busy either. Not claiming its the best in the world, or even in London, but it's well worth a visit. And it has The Laughing Cavalier and A Dance to the Music of Time which ain't bad.
The fan museum in Greenwich is rather nice and very tiny.
O/T The Mauritshuis in The Hague must surely be the finest art gallery in the world. A perfect gem.
No, absurd
It only has Dutch golden age art, really. Which js amazing but rather limiting…
It is one of the finest SMALL museums in the world
Its focus is a big plus imo. Too many art galleries try to cover far too much, and do it poorly.
I may be biased by my love of the Dutch Golden Age, of course.
Well, that's a great PB question.
What are the best *small* art galleries in the world?
The requirement being that you can see all the exhibits in an hour.
I would nominate the Hammer in Los Angeles, with an honourable mention for the Santa Barbara Museum of Art.
The Gulbenkian then. Confine yourself to the paintings, and you could do that.
No. Absurd American bias
The Courtauld beats all of those
Says you.
That's from their Chinese porcelain collection, btw.
Elsewhere in the building ..masterpieces by western European artists such as Domenico Ghirlandaio, Rubens, Rembrandt, Rodin, Carpeaux, Houdon, Renoir, Dierick Bouts, Vittore Carpaccio, Cima da Conegliano, Van Dyck, Corot, Degas, Nattier, George Romney, Stefan Lochner, Maurice-Quentin de La Tour, Édouard Manet, Henri Fantin-Latour, Claude Monet, Jean-François Millet, Sir Edward Burne-Jones, Thomas Gainsborough, Joseph Mallord William Turner, Jean-Honoré Fragonard, Giovanni Battista Moroni, Frans Hals, Ruisdael, Boucher, Largillière, Andrea della Robbia, Pisanello, Jean-Baptiste Pigalle, Antonio Rossellino, André-Charles Boulle ,Charles Cressent, Oeben, Riesener, Antoine-Sébastien Durand, Charles Spire, Jean Deforges, François-Thomas Germain...
Are you thinking of the modern art building next door, Leon ?
Well for a start I would dispute that the Gulbenkian is small, which is what we were arguing about? The best small museum?
It is a splendid museum but it is fairly massive IIRC
Whereas the Courtauld is small but exquisitely formed and has three of the most famous paintings in the entire world
The Bar at the Folies Bergere - Manet
Self Portrait with Bandaged Ear - Van Gogh
Adam and Eve - Cranach
And you can whizz through the rest in an hour or two
The Wallace Collection is rather nice. It's free and, when I've been there, not too busy either. Not claiming its the best in the world, or even in London, but it's well worth a visit. And it has The Laughing Cavalier and A Dance to the Music of Time which ain't bad.
Yes it’s charming. London is blessed with quite a few places like that. The Dulwich picture gallery. Kenwood house. Hampton court has some fine paintings - the Mantegnas
Not world class art galleries but possessing a couple of world class paintings
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
I sat in the Anglican Cathedral in Cape Town one afternoon and had the whole place to myself. Its a victorian gothic.
It was one of the most spiritual moments Ive ever had.
O/T The Mauritshuis in The Hague must surely be the finest art gallery in the world. A perfect gem.
Musee D'Orsay for me, its about the only thing worth visiting in Paris.
I wouldn't say it is the only thing worth visiting but it is certainly the shining gem. I much prefer the Musee D'Orsay to the Louvre.
Ive been to Paris quite a lot and my son has just moved there. Last time I did the Sainte Chappelle ( overrated ) and Notre Dame. ND was really good as they had an exhibition on the restoration which was really well presented. The other thing I have been advised to see is the catacombs not sure if they will be as good as the hype.
I have yet to see the Sainte Chappelle (the lift has been broken every time we've tried - I mean, I am grateful and surprised there even is a lift but it would be nice for it to work). Having studied gothic architecture in an evening class, It really would like to see the example for myself.
When I went it was extremely busy, I wished I had looked at the guides to see if there was a slack time. If you can clear the tourists there's more to look at.
Go to the Musee Carnavalet.
Thanks, Ill do that, its a short walk from where my son lives.
You let him live in an EU City after contributing to our being black-balled!!
It's a fine gallery in a nice area. I'm sure you'll have been to the musee d'orsay but worth a visit every time you go. One of my favourites
I'll be interested to see how Boris manages a live programme of his own. He's certainly well known enough to bring in viewers, but not sure he has enough affable composure and professionalism to be an easy watch and keep people tuning in. Perhaps they'll give him a telegenic female copresenter to keep the show on the road and Boris in line. I think a better format for him would be one of those programmes where a university professor wanders around enthusing about Greek ruins. They're scripted and you can just have a good voice and interesting screen presence (that he has). Boris on the Acropolis.
O/T The Mauritshuis in The Hague must surely be the finest art gallery in the world. A perfect gem.
No, absurd
It only has Dutch golden age art, really. Which js amazing but rather limiting…
It is one of the finest SMALL museums in the world
Its focus is a big plus imo. Too many art galleries try to cover far too much, and do it poorly.
I may be biased by my love of the Dutch Golden Age, of course.
Well, that's a great PB question.
What are the best *small* art galleries in the world?
The requirement being that you can see all the exhibits in an hour.
I would nominate the Hammer in Los Angeles, with an honourable mention for the Santa Barbara Museum of Art.
The Gulbenkian then. Confine yourself to the paintings, and you could do that.
No. Absurd American bias
The Courtauld beats all of those
Says you.
That's from their Chinese porcelain collection, btw.
Elsewhere in the building ..masterpieces by western European artists such as Domenico Ghirlandaio, Rubens, Rembrandt, Rodin, Carpeaux, Houdon, Renoir, Dierick Bouts, Vittore Carpaccio, Cima da Conegliano, Van Dyck, Corot, Degas, Nattier, George Romney, Stefan Lochner, Maurice-Quentin de La Tour, Édouard Manet, Henri Fantin-Latour, Claude Monet, Jean-François Millet, Sir Edward Burne-Jones, Thomas Gainsborough, Joseph Mallord William Turner, Jean-Honoré Fragonard, Giovanni Battista Moroni, Frans Hals, Ruisdael, Boucher, Largillière, Andrea della Robbia, Pisanello, Jean-Baptiste Pigalle, Antonio Rossellino, André-Charles Boulle ,Charles Cressent, Oeben, Riesener, Antoine-Sébastien Durand, Charles Spire, Jean Deforges, François-Thomas Germain...
Are you thinking of the modern art building next door, Leon ?
Well for a start I would dispute that the Gulbenkian is small, which is what we were arguing about? The best small museum?
It is a splendid museum but it is fairly massive IIRC
Whereas the Courtauld is small but exquisitely formed and has three of the most famous paintings in the entire world
The Bar at the Folies Bergere - Manet
Self Portrait with Bandaged Ear - Van Gogh
Adam and Eve - Cranach
And you can whizz through the rest in an hour or two
The Wallace Collection is rather nice. It's free and, when I've been there, not too busy either. Not claiming its the best in the world, or even in London, but it's well worth a visit. And it has The Laughing Cavalier and A Dance to the Music of Time which ain't bad.
One of the good things about the Wallace is that it’s not just the paintings. The armour and furniture collection is very good and so it’s a good smallish museum to take younger people in where there are lots of interesting things that can pique their interest and develop a love for something rather than just paintings. A good intro in central London that isn’t too much for youngsters who might not get the full appreciation of the National for example.
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
In South Africa, there was an obvious good guy, and an obvious bad guy.
Despite what Roger and the Corbynistas think, Israel doesn't fill the role of obvious bad guy, nor do the Palestinians fill the role of obvious good guy.
Though there were quite a few on the right who persuaded themselves otherwise.
With the end of the Cold War, tolerance for South Africa's regime waned.
Yeah, less good in the policing of blue chip vs individuals in the first place though. Regulators need to be tougher when obvious, unfair and persistent shenanigans are deployed.
The biggest hole in flight compensation regulation is the question of whether it’s the airline’s fault. I suspect that as soon as there’s a sniff of, say, industrial action by French ATC, they also move crew from those flights to the ones with a less good excuse. The former get even worse delays than they should have, but no one can prove it.
United Airlines used to often cancel for bad weather, which also means no compensation.
O/T The Mauritshuis in The Hague must surely be the finest art gallery in the world. A perfect gem.
No, absurd
It only has Dutch golden age art, really. Which js amazing but rather limiting…
It is one of the finest SMALL museums in the world
Its focus is a big plus imo. Too many art galleries try to cover far too much, and do it poorly.
I may be biased by my love of the Dutch Golden Age, of course.
Well, that's a great PB question.
What are the best *small* art galleries in the world?
The requirement being that you can see all the exhibits in an hour.
I would nominate the Hammer in Los Angeles, with an honourable mention for the Santa Barbara Museum of Art.
The Gulbenkian then. Confine yourself to the paintings, and you could do that.
No. Absurd American bias
The Courtauld beats all of those
Says you.
That's from their Chinese porcelain collection, btw.
Elsewhere in the building ..masterpieces by western European artists such as Domenico Ghirlandaio, Rubens, Rembrandt, Rodin, Carpeaux, Houdon, Renoir, Dierick Bouts, Vittore Carpaccio, Cima da Conegliano, Van Dyck, Corot, Degas, Nattier, George Romney, Stefan Lochner, Maurice-Quentin de La Tour, Édouard Manet, Henri Fantin-Latour, Claude Monet, Jean-François Millet, Sir Edward Burne-Jones, Thomas Gainsborough, Joseph Mallord William Turner, Jean-Honoré Fragonard, Giovanni Battista Moroni, Frans Hals, Ruisdael, Boucher, Largillière, Andrea della Robbia, Pisanello, Jean-Baptiste Pigalle, Antonio Rossellino, André-Charles Boulle ,Charles Cressent, Oeben, Riesener, Antoine-Sébastien Durand, Charles Spire, Jean Deforges, François-Thomas Germain...
Are you thinking of the modern art building next door, Leon ?
Well for a start I would dispute that the Gulbenkian is small, which is what we were arguing about? The best small museum?
It is a splendid museum but it is fairly massive IIRC
Whereas the Courtauld is small but exquisitely formed and has three of the most famous paintings in the entire world
The Bar at the Folies Bergere - Manet
Self Portrait with Bandaged Ear - Van Gogh
Adam and Eve - Cranach
And you can whizz through the rest in an hour or two
The Wallace Collection is rather nice. It's free and, when I've been there, not too busy either. Not claiming its the best in the world, or even in London, but it's well worth a visit. And it has The Laughing Cavalier and A Dance to the Music of Time which ain't bad.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
Relative lack of Catholic Tat? Seville always gave me a degree of spiritual indigestion.
O/T The Mauritshuis in The Hague must surely be the finest art gallery in the world. A perfect gem.
Musee D'Orsay for me, its about the only thing worth visiting in Paris.
I wouldn't say it is the only thing worth visiting but it is certainly the shining gem. I much prefer the Musee D'Orsay to the Louvre.
Ive been to Paris quite a lot and my son has just moved there. Last time I did the Sainte Chappelle ( overrated ) and Notre Dame. ND was really good as they had an exhibition on the restoration which was really well presented. The other thing I have been advised to see is the catacombs not sure if they will be as good as the hype.
I have yet to see the Sainte Chappelle (the lift has been broken every time we've tried - I mean, I am grateful and surprised there even is a lift but it would be nice for it to work). Having studied gothic architecture in an evening class, It really would like to see the example for myself.
When I went it was extremely busy, I wished I had looked at the guides to see if there was a slack time. If you can clear the tourists there's more to look at.
Go to the Musee Carnavalet.
Thanks, Ill do that, its a short walk from where my son lives.
You let him live in an EU City after contributing to our being black-balled!!
It's a fine gallery in a nice area. I'm sure you'll have been to the musee d'orsay but worth a visit every time you go. One of my favourites
He's getting married next year to a francaise. But his Irish Passport lets him stroll about.
Karen Pollock in the Holocaust Education Trust's October newsletter is uncharacteristically downbeat:
Since I wrote to you about the horrific massacre in Israel (you can read our statement again here), antisemitism in the UK has increased to exponential levels and many are feeling a heightened sense of anxiety as events continue to unfold. Our work to educate about the Holocaust and contemporary antisemitism could not be more important.
We know lots of people, including many in the Jewish community are feeling troubled and unsure due to current events.
I passed one of the local Jewish schools today and can report that... it is half term.
On topic, I don't think this will hurt Starmer for the election. Most Britons sympathise with both sides equally, and the Tories favour the Israelis more clearly than Labour. A few Corbynites and other anti-semites might be put off by Starmer, but it ain't going to shift much votes.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
Relative lack of Catholic Tat? Seville always gave me a degree of spiritual indigestion.
Yes, that’s definitely part of it. Controversial take: Catholicism ruins a lot of great Catholic cathedrals
In France it is often the revolution that is to blame. It swept away so much - it scraped away the patina of smoke and time and worship which makes a great moving cathedral
Weirdly, Hagia Sophia DOES have that buzz despite being a museum for a century and now a mosque
Ditto the orthodox churches of Greece. Some of them are seriously intense. Esp the monasteries of Mount athos. Omg
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
I found exactly the same. I love English Gothic cathedrals (no slight against any other UK countries as haven’t been to any of their cathedrals), their scale and general beauty and the settings are usually wonderful with the cathedral closes.
I’ve always been a bit disappointed with the continental equivalents and I have put it down to, counterintuitively, the plainness of the interiors of the English ones. It’s like seeing a skeleton of a blue whale rather than a scale model of it with skin. The bones and the intricacy of construction are there in all their glory and not hidden by a riot of coloured columns and paintings.
I think if the Parthenon was complete it would be a more beautiful object in its stripped back, weathered current look rather than a riot of colour.
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
In South Africa, there was an obvious good guy, and an obvious bad guy.
Despite what Roger and the Corbynistas think, Israel doesn't fill the role of obvious bad guy, nor do the Palestinians fill the role of obvious good guy.
Yup. The talk of a “ceasefire” is a good example. In most conflicts when we say “ceasefire” we mean both sides. In this case, people seem to mean unilateral from Israel, and for Israel to just sit there and take continued rocket strikes during it, because it is the baddie and it deserves it.
What makes you say most people want a unilateral ceasefire?
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
Relative lack of Catholic Tat? Seville always gave me a degree of spiritual indigestion.
I think that’s it. Anglicanism is high church enough to be mystical and not too domestic, but subtle and austere enough not to be tacky.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
Relative lack of Catholic Tat? Seville always gave me a degree of spiritual indigestion.
Yes, that’s definitely part of it. Controversial take: Catholicism ruins a lot of great Catholic cathedrals
In France it is often the revolution that is to blame. It swept away so much - it scraped away the patina of smoke and time and worship which makes a great moving cathedral
Weirdly, Hagia Sophia DOES have that buzz despite being a museum for a century and now a mosque
Ditto the orthodox churches of Greece. Some of them are seriously intense. Esp the monasteries of Mount athos. Omg
OTOH, the Church of St. Blaise in Dubrovnik, and Certosa San Martino in Naples are stunningly beautiful. Perhaps Baroque architecture and art works best on the scale of a church or chapel, but is OTT in a Cathedral.
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
In South Africa, there was an obvious good guy, and an obvious bad guy.
Despite what Roger and the Corbynistas think, Israel doesn't fill the role of obvious bad guy, nor do the Palestinians fill the role of obvious good guy.
Yup. The talk of a “ceasefire” is a good example. In most conflicts when we say “ceasefire” we mean both sides. In this case, people seem to mean unilateral from Israel, and for Israel to just sit there and take continued rocket strikes during it, because it is the baddie and it deserves it.
What makes you say most people want a unilateral ceasefire?
To be fair that is exactly what people are asking for when they say they want a ceasefire. They may think they want something that encompases both sides but that is never going to happen. In reality they are just asking for Israel to stop bombing Gaza.
O/T The Mauritshuis in The Hague must surely be the finest art gallery in the world. A perfect gem.
No, absurd
It only has Dutch golden age art, really. Which js amazing but rather limiting…
It is one of the finest SMALL museums in the world
Its focus is a big plus imo. Too many art galleries try to cover far too much, and do it poorly.
I may be biased by my love of the Dutch Golden Age, of course.
Well, that's a great PB question.
What are the best *small* art galleries in the world?
The requirement being that you can see all the exhibits in an hour.
I would nominate the Hammer in Los Angeles, with an honourable mention for the Santa Barbara Museum of Art.
The Gulbenkian then. Confine yourself to the paintings, and you could do that.
No. Absurd American bias
The Courtauld beats all of those
Says you.
That's from their Chinese porcelain collection, btw.
Elsewhere in the building ..masterpieces by western European artists such as Domenico Ghirlandaio, Rubens, Rembrandt, Rodin, Carpeaux, Houdon, Renoir, Dierick Bouts, Vittore Carpaccio, Cima da Conegliano, Van Dyck, Corot, Degas, Nattier, George Romney, Stefan Lochner, Maurice-Quentin de La Tour, Édouard Manet, Henri Fantin-Latour, Claude Monet, Jean-François Millet, Sir Edward Burne-Jones, Thomas Gainsborough, Joseph Mallord William Turner, Jean-Honoré Fragonard, Giovanni Battista Moroni, Frans Hals, Ruisdael, Boucher, Largillière, Andrea della Robbia, Pisanello, Jean-Baptiste Pigalle, Antonio Rossellino, André-Charles Boulle ,Charles Cressent, Oeben, Riesener, Antoine-Sébastien Durand, Charles Spire, Jean Deforges, François-Thomas Germain...
Are you thinking of the modern art building next door, Leon ?
Well for a start I would dispute that the Gulbenkian is small, which is what we were arguing about? The best small museum?
It is a splendid museum but it is fairly massive IIRC
Whereas the Courtauld is small but exquisitely formed and has three of the most famous paintings in the entire world
The Bar at the Folies Bergere - Manet
Self Portrait with Bandaged Ear - Van Gogh
Adam and Eve - Cranach
And you can whizz through the rest in an hour or two
The Wallace Collection is rather nice. It's free and, when I've been there, not too busy either. Not claiming its the best in the world, or even in London, but it's well worth a visit. And it has The Laughing Cavalier and A Dance to the Music of Time which ain't bad.
Yes it’s charming. London is blessed with quite a few places like that. The Dulwich picture gallery. Kenwood house. Hampton court has some fine paintings - the Mantegnas
Not world class art galleries but possessing a couple of world class paintings
Def agree about Kenwood. Took the bus to Hampstead for a walk around the heath and its environs. Chanced across Kenwood and was amazed at its contents. Apparently whoever left it to the nation, or whatever, made it a condition that access should be free. As its so out of the way it isn't mobbed out which it would surely be if it was near the centre of town. Lovely local people vounteering as guides there as well - part of the charm.
On topic, I don't think this will hurt Starmer for the election. Most Britons sympathise with both sides equally, and the Tories favour the Israelis more clearly than Labour. A few Corbynites and other anti-semites might be put off by Starmer, but it ain't going to shift much votes.
Well it's hard not to see how Labour aren't associated with the Palestinians. It will probably shift some votes the other way . But over all I agree it wont impact much this time round, the fun will probably be the next election after that.
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
In South Africa, there was an obvious good guy, and an obvious bad guy.
Despite what Roger and the Corbynistas think, Israel doesn't fill the role of obvious bad guy, nor do the Palestinians fill the role of obvious good guy.
Yup. The talk of a “ceasefire” is a good example. In most conflicts when we say “ceasefire” we mean both sides. In this case, people seem to mean unilateral from Israel, and for Israel to just sit there and take continued rocket strikes during it, because it is the baddie and it deserves it.
What makes you say most people want a unilateral ceasefire?
Because I assume no one is silly enough to entertain the thought that Hamas would respect one.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
I found exactly the same. I love English Gothic cathedrals (no slight against any other UK countries as haven’t been to any of their cathedrals), their scale and general beauty and the settings are usually wonderful with the cathedral closes.
I’ve always been a bit disappointed with the continental equivalents and I have put it down to, counterintuitively, the plainness of the interiors of the English ones. It’s like seeing a skeleton of a blue whale rather than a scale model of it with skin. The bones and the intricacy of construction are there in all their glory and not hidden by a riot of coloured columns and paintings.
I think if the Parthenon was complete it would be a more beautiful object in its stripped back, weathered current look rather than a riot of colour.
It’s not just England
Kirkwall Cathedral in the Orkneys is AMAZING. Absolutely spiritual - and beautiful - and strange
Irish churches are notably disappointing - with some rare medieval exceptions - Kilfenora in the Burren is wild
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
In South Africa, there was an obvious good guy, and an obvious bad guy.
Despite what Roger and the Corbynistas think, Israel doesn't fill the role of obvious bad guy, nor do the Palestinians fill the role of obvious good guy.
Yup. The talk of a “ceasefire” is a good example. In most conflicts when we say “ceasefire” we mean both sides. In this case, people seem to mean unilateral from Israel, and for Israel to just sit there and take continued rocket strikes during it, because it is the baddie and it deserves it.
What makes you say most people want a unilateral ceasefire?
To be fair that is exactly what people are asking for when they say they want a ceasefire. They may think they want something that encompases both sides but that is never going to happen. In reality they are just asking for Israel to stop bombing Gaza.
I haven't called for one, mostly because as an anonymous doctor 3000 miles away I think neither Hamas nor the IDF are likely to listen to my call, but clearly ceasefires are bilateral.
Pakistan are often the most fun cricket team to watch because they're so erratic. Rubbish one moment, brilliant the next. And they've always been like that.
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
Does ending apartheid equate to abolishing the state of Israel in this case?
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
In South Africa, there was an obvious good guy, and an obvious bad guy.
Despite what Roger and the Corbynistas think, Israel doesn't fill the role of obvious bad guy, nor do the Palestinians fill the role of obvious good guy.
Yup. The talk of a “ceasefire” is a good example. In most conflicts when we say “ceasefire” we mean both sides. In this case, people seem to mean unilateral from Israel, and for Israel to just sit there and take continued rocket strikes during it, because it is the baddie and it deserves it.
What makes you say most people want a unilateral ceasefire?
To be fair that is exactly what people are asking for when they say they want a ceasefire. They may think they want something that encompases both sides but that is never going to happen. In reality they are just asking for Israel to stop bombing Gaza.
I haven't called for one, mostly because as an anonymous doctor 3000 miles away I think neither Hamas nor the IDF are likely to listen to my call, but clearly ceasefires are bilateral.
Yeah, pb.com gets quite weird at the start of a war. Or when there is not a war on at all to be fair.
For some posters everything has to be said as if we were the PM addressing the nation rather than nerds talking amongst ourselves.
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
Does ending apartheid equate to abolishing the state of Israel in this case?
One can deplore how the Israelis have treated the Palestinians on the West Bank, without wishing their destruction.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
In South Africa, there was an obvious good guy, and an obvious bad guy.
Despite what Roger and the Corbynistas think, Israel doesn't fill the role of obvious bad guy, nor do the Palestinians fill the role of obvious good guy.
Yup. The talk of a “ceasefire” is a good example. In most conflicts when we say “ceasefire” we mean both sides. In this case, people seem to mean unilateral from Israel, and for Israel to just sit there and take continued rocket strikes during it, because it is the baddie and it deserves it.
What makes you say most people want a unilateral ceasefire?
Because I assume no one is silly enough to entertain the thought that Hamas would respect one.
The 2008 Hamas-Israel ceasefire was reasonably well observed by both sides, though Hamas had to force Islamic Jihad to ceasefire. It was brought to an end by the Israelis mounting a ground incursion.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
Relative lack of Catholic Tat? Seville always gave me a degree of spiritual indigestion.
Yes, that’s definitely part of it. Controversial take: Catholicism ruins a lot of great Catholic cathedrals
In France it is often the revolution that is to blame. It swept away so much - it scraped away the patina of smoke and time and worship which makes a great moving cathedral
Weirdly, Hagia Sophia DOES have that buzz despite being a museum for a century and now a mosque
Ditto the orthodox churches of Greece. Some of them are seriously intense. Esp the monasteries of Mount athos. Omg
OTOH, the Church of St. Blaise in Dubrovnik, and Certosa San Martino in Naples are stunningly beautiful. Perhaps Baroque architecture and art works best on the scale of a church or chapel, but is OTT in a Cathedral.
Yes you could well be right. See my prior remark about St Paul’s. Wren did some brilliant churches but scaled up to cathedral size all you get is the grandiosity and not the godliness
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Agree about St Paul's. Utterly dead. The great stuff is round the corner. In the square mile of the City are 39 or so CoE churches, nearly all very good, some great, bursting with atmosphere. St Mary Abchurch, St Magnus Martyr, St James Garlickhithe, St Stephen Walbrook, St Barts Smithfield and loads more.
O/T The Mauritshuis in The Hague must surely be the finest art gallery in the world. A perfect gem.
Musee D'Orsay for me, its about the only thing worth visiting in Paris.
I wouldn't say it is the only thing worth visiting but it is certainly the shining gem. I much prefer the Musee D'Orsay to the Louvre.
Ive been to Paris quite a lot and my son has just moved there. Last time I did the Sainte Chappelle ( overrated ) and Notre Dame. ND was really good as they had an exhibition on the restoration which was really well presented. The other thing I have been advised to see is the catacombs not sure if they will be as good as the hype.
I have yet to see the Sainte Chappelle (the lift has been broken every time we've tried - I mean, I am grateful and surprised there even is a lift but it would be nice for it to work). Having studied gothic architecture in an evening class, It really would like to see the example for myself.
When I went it was extremely busy, I wished I had looked at the guides to see if there was a slack time. If you can clear the tourists there's more to look at.
Go to the Musee Carnavalet.
Thanks, Ill do that, its a short walk from where my son lives.
You let him live in an EU City after contributing to our being black-balled!!
It's a fine gallery in a nice area. I'm sure you'll have been to the musee d'orsay but worth a visit every time you go. One of my favourites
He's getting married next year to a francaise. But his Irish Passport lets him stroll about.
He couldn't lend it to me could he? Irish passports are like gold dust. Lucky boy. I bet he was livid with you.
It's funny to think there was a time when English passports were just as valued. My ex went to live in Beausoleil and after overstaying her 90 days by several months can't come back because she fears they wont let her back again
O/T The Mauritshuis in The Hague must surely be the finest art gallery in the world. A perfect gem.
Musee D'Orsay for me, its about the only thing worth visiting in Paris.
I wouldn't say it is the only thing worth visiting but it is certainly the shining gem. I much prefer the Musee D'Orsay to the Louvre.
Ive been to Paris quite a lot and my son has just moved there. Last time I did the Sainte Chappelle ( overrated ) and Notre Dame. ND was really good as they had an exhibition on the restoration which was really well presented. The other thing I have been advised to see is the catacombs not sure if they will be as good as the hype.
I have yet to see the Sainte Chappelle (the lift has been broken every time we've tried - I mean, I am grateful and surprised there even is a lift but it would be nice for it to work). Having studied gothic architecture in an evening class, It really would like to see the example for myself.
When I went it was extremely busy, I wished I had looked at the guides to see if there was a slack time. If you can clear the tourists there's more to look at.
Go to the Musee Carnavalet.
Thanks, Ill do that, its a short walk from where my son lives.
You let him live in an EU City after contributing to our being black-balled!!
It's a fine gallery in a nice area. I'm sure you'll have been to the musee d'orsay but worth a visit every time you go. One of my favourites
He's getting married next year to a francaise. But his Irish Passport lets him stroll about.
He couldn't lend it to me could he? Irish passports are like gold dust. Lucky boy. I bet he was livid with you.
It's funny to think there was a time when English passports were just as valued. My ex went to live in Beausoleil and after overstaying her 90 days by several months can't come back because she fears they wont let her back again
You’ve got a 2nd home in Villefranche sur Mer. Where you spend much time (and good luck to you, it’s a lovely part of the world) - surely you have claimed French rights of residency?
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Yes, we'll count Kings.
Some other good ones Lichfield St David's Gloucester Winchester York Norwich Rochester is rather good - I prefer it to Canterbury which I found rather underwhelming too.
If we're counting King's I feel we should also mention: Tewkesbury Abbey
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Agree about St Paul's. Utterly dead. The great stuff is round the corner. In the square mile of the City are 39 or so CoE churches, nearly all very good, some great, bursting with atmosphere. St Mary Abchurch, St Magnus Martyr, St James Garlickhithe, St Stephen Walbrook, St Barts Smithfield and loads more.
St bartholonew is phenomenal. Christ church Spitalfields is wrenchingly good. I prayed on the morning of the last day of my Old Bailey rape trial at St Sepulchre without Newgate, as have many many people before me, for many centuries - the church of Newgate jail
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
Does ending apartheid equate to abolishing the state of Israel in this case?
One can deplore how the Israelis have treated the Palestinians on the West Bank, without wishing their destruction.
But the question is what abolishing 'apartheid' means in practice.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Clifton Taylor considered Lincoln to be numero uno. And, as I recall, it is truly magnificent. And it has the imp.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Maybe there should be a new rule saying you can't visit a foreign country unless you've visited at least 5 British cathedrals first.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Clifton Taylor considered Lincoln to be numero uno. And, as I recall, it is truly magnificent. And it has the imp.
It's the setting as well as the Cathedral. Like Salisbury and Norwich rolled into one stuck on top of a ginormous hill rising out of a massive plain.
It's absolutely exceptional. What Cathedral in the world can rival that? Ely would come closest in England but it isn't close.
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
Well that's Mr Blair for you. On the other hand I dont see your big demos for Uighirs, Christians in Pakistan, whites in Zimbabwe etc. I suppose it might be different if they were countries run by jews.
It was Bush and the neocons with Blair puppying along. All opposed by the Left. Compared to that sort of thing I think the selective demo'ing of various people is rather a 2nd order issue.
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
Does ending apartheid equate to abolishing the state of Israel in this case?
There are still White people living in South Africa.
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
In South Africa, there was an obvious good guy, and an obvious bad guy.
Despite what Roger and the Corbynistas think, Israel doesn't fill the role of obvious bad guy, nor do the Palestinians fill the role of obvious good guy.
Yup. The talk of a “ceasefire” is a good example. In most conflicts when we say “ceasefire” we mean both sides. In this case, people seem to mean unilateral from Israel, and for Israel to just sit there and take continued rocket strikes during it, because it is the baddie and it deserves it.
What makes you say most people want a unilateral ceasefire?
Because I assume no one is silly enough to entertain the thought that Hamas would respect one.
If Hamas won't respect a ceasefire then Israel surely have nothing to lose by calling a ceasefire knowing Hamas will break it anyway. An easy propaganda victory. But Israel doesn't want a ceasefire.
O/T The Mauritshuis in The Hague must surely be the finest art gallery in the world. A perfect gem.
Musee D'Orsay for me, its about the only thing worth visiting in Paris.
I wouldn't say it is the only thing worth visiting but it is certainly the shining gem. I much prefer the Musee D'Orsay to the Louvre.
Ive been to Paris quite a lot and my son has just moved there. Last time I did the Sainte Chappelle ( overrated ) and Notre Dame. ND was really good as they had an exhibition on the restoration which was really well presented. The other thing I have been advised to see is the catacombs not sure if they will be as good as the hype.
I have yet to see the Sainte Chappelle (the lift has been broken every time we've tried - I mean, I am grateful and surprised there even is a lift but it would be nice for it to work). Having studied gothic architecture in an evening class, It really would like to see the example for myself.
When I went it was extremely busy, I wished I had looked at the guides to see if there was a slack time. If you can clear the tourists there's more to look at.
Go to the Musee Carnavalet.
Thanks, Ill do that, its a short walk from where my son lives.
You let him live in an EU City after contributing to our being black-balled!!
It's a fine gallery in a nice area. I'm sure you'll have been to the musee d'orsay but worth a visit every time you go. One of my favourites
He's getting married next year to a francaise. But his Irish Passport lets him stroll about.
He couldn't lend it to me could he? Irish passports are like gold dust. Lucky boy. I bet he was livid with you.
It's funny to think there was a time when English passports were just as valued. My ex went to live in Beausoleil and after overstaying her 90 days by several months can't come back because she fears they wont let her back again
I have a french guy lives across the street from me who has exactly the same problem.
On the other hand since you now have time on your hands could I suggest "On va tout peter"
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Clifton Taylor considered Lincoln to be numero uno. And, as I recall, it is truly magnificent. And it has the imp.
It's the setting as well as the Cathedral. Like Salisbury and Norwich rolled into one stuck on top of a ginormous hill rising out of a massive plain.
It's absolutely exceptional. What Cathedral in the world can rival that? Ely would come closest in England but it isn't close.
Plus, it's a magnificent building.
Just imagine what Ely Cathedral must have looked like before the fens were drained. On its island amid the waters.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Yes, we'll count Kings.
Some other good ones Lichfield St David's Gloucester Winchester York Norwich Rochester is rather good - I prefer it to Canterbury which I found rather underwhelming too.
If we're counting King's I feel we should also mention: Tewkesbury Abbey
Ooh. One I’ve missed! I’ve never been to Lichfield! Seems like I must
Agree Winchester. Outside not so impressive but that astonishing nave makes up for it. The cloisters at Gloucester are sublime
I love Tewkesbury too. Malmesbury and Shrewsbury are likewise resonant
One of THE most amazingly spiritual spaces in the whole world is St John’s chapel inside the white tower of the Tower of London. I believe English kings and queens are meant to do vigils there prior to coronation
O/T The Mauritshuis in The Hague must surely be the finest art gallery in the world. A perfect gem.
Musee D'Orsay for me, its about the only thing worth visiting in Paris.
I wouldn't say it is the only thing worth visiting but it is certainly the shining gem. I much prefer the Musee D'Orsay to the Louvre.
Ive been to Paris quite a lot and my son has just moved there. Last time I did the Sainte Chappelle ( overrated ) and Notre Dame. ND was really good as they had an exhibition on the restoration which was really well presented. The other thing I have been advised to see is the catacombs not sure if they will be as good as the hype.
I have yet to see the Sainte Chappelle (the lift has been broken every time we've tried - I mean, I am grateful and surprised there even is a lift but it would be nice for it to work). Having studied gothic architecture in an evening class, It really would like to see the example for myself.
When I went it was extremely busy, I wished I had looked at the guides to see if there was a slack time. If you can clear the tourists there's more to look at.
Go to the Musee Carnavalet.
Thanks, Ill do that, its a short walk from where my son lives.
You let him live in an EU City after contributing to our being black-balled!!
It's a fine gallery in a nice area. I'm sure you'll have been to the musee d'orsay but worth a visit every time you go. One of my favourites
He's getting married next year to a francaise. But his Irish Passport lets him stroll about.
He couldn't lend it to me could he? Irish passports are like gold dust. Lucky boy. I bet he was livid with you.
It's funny to think there was a time when English passports were just as valued. My ex went to live in Beausoleil and after overstaying her 90 days by several months can't come back because she fears they wont let her back again
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
Well that's Mr Blair for you. On the other hand I dont see your big demos for Uighirs, Christians in Pakistan, whites in Zimbabwe etc. I suppose it might be different if they were countries run by jews.
It was Bush and the neocons with Blair puppying along. All opposed by the Left. Compared to that sort of thing I think the selective demo'ing of various people is rather a 2nd order issue.
Maybe we should just sort our own shit out first. Theres enough of it.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Yes, we'll count Kings.
Some other good ones Lichfield St David's Gloucester Winchester York Norwich Rochester is rather good - I prefer it to Canterbury which I found rather underwhelming too.
If we're counting King's I feel we should also mention: Tewkesbury Abbey
Ooh. One I’ve missed! I’ve never been to Lichfield! Seems like I must
Agree Winchester. Outside not so impressive but that astonishing nave makes up for it. The cloisters at Gloucester are sublime
I love Tewkesbury too. Malmesbury and Shrewsbury are likewise resonant
One of THE most amazingly spiritual spaces in the whole world is St John’s chapel inside the white tower of the Tower of London. I believe English kings and queens are meant to do vigils there prior to coronation
Lichfield is less than two hours from London by train and is an extremely rare more or less unspoilt Georgian city.
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
In South Africa, there was an obvious good guy, and an obvious bad guy.
Despite what Roger and the Corbynistas think, Israel doesn't fill the role of obvious bad guy, nor do the Palestinians fill the role of obvious good guy.
Yup. The talk of a “ceasefire” is a good example. In most conflicts when we say “ceasefire” we mean both sides. In this case, people seem to mean unilateral from Israel, and for Israel to just sit there and take continued rocket strikes during it, because it is the baddie and it deserves it.
What makes you say most people want a unilateral ceasefire?
Because I assume no one is silly enough to entertain the thought that Hamas would respect one.
If Hamas won't respect a ceasefire then Israel surely have nothing to lose by calling a ceasefire knowing Hamas will break it anyway. An easy propaganda victory. But Israel doesn't want a ceasefire.
Oh, ok, but at this point all we are saying is “wouldn’t it be nice if there was peace, “which everyone agrees with.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
I am looking forward to a day from hell tomorrow. An early start then 2 longish flights home with the family, and I’ve just come down with a very violent bout of diarrhoea of the sort that drains you physically and gives a constant nausea just short of the cathartic moment of vomiting (so far).
At least it’s not on wizzair, but Turkish with its world class food offering is going to be wasted on me.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Yes, we'll count Kings.
Some other good ones Lichfield St David's Gloucester Winchester York Norwich Rochester is rather good - I prefer it to Canterbury which I found rather underwhelming too.
If we're counting King's I feel we should also mention: Tewkesbury Abbey
Ooh. One I’ve missed! I’ve never been to Lichfield! Seems like I must
Agree Winchester. Outside not so impressive but that astonishing nave makes up for it. The cloisters at Gloucester are sublime
I love Tewkesbury too. Malmesbury and Shrewsbury are likewise resonant
One of THE most amazingly spiritual spaces in the whole world is St John’s chapel inside the white tower of the Tower of London. I believe English kings and queens are meant to do vigils there prior to coronation
On the rest of your comment - perhaps we should add Hexham, Beverley and St Mary Redcliffe in Bristol?
O/T The Mauritshuis in The Hague must surely be the finest art gallery in the world. A perfect gem.
Musee D'Orsay for me, its about the only thing worth visiting in Paris.
I wouldn't say it is the only thing worth visiting but it is certainly the shining gem. I much prefer the Musee D'Orsay to the Louvre.
Ive been to Paris quite a lot and my son has just moved there. Last time I did the Sainte Chappelle ( overrated ) and Notre Dame. ND was really good as they had an exhibition on the restoration which was really well presented. The other thing I have been advised to see is the catacombs not sure if they will be as good as the hype.
I have yet to see the Sainte Chappelle (the lift has been broken every time we've tried - I mean, I am grateful and surprised there even is a lift but it would be nice for it to work). Having studied gothic architecture in an evening class, It really would like to see the example for myself.
When I went it was extremely busy, I wished I had looked at the guides to see if there was a slack time. If you can clear the tourists there's more to look at.
Go to the Musee Carnavalet.
Thanks, Ill do that, its a short walk from where my son lives.
You let him live in an EU City after contributing to our being black-balled!!
It's a fine gallery in a nice area. I'm sure you'll have been to the musee d'orsay but worth a visit every time you go. One of my favourites
He's getting married next year to a francaise. But his Irish Passport lets him stroll about.
He couldn't lend it to me could he? Irish passports are like gold dust. Lucky boy. I bet he was livid with you.
It's funny to think there was a time when English passports were just as valued. My ex went to live in Beausoleil and after overstaying her 90 days by several months can't come back because she fears they wont let her back again
You’ve got a 2nd home in Villefranche sur Mer. Where you spend much time (and good luck to you, it’s a lovely part of the world) - surely you have claimed French rights of residency?
The second home makes no difference. As for the rest it's complicated. Ironically Monaco is easier,
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Yes, we'll count Kings.
Some other good ones Lichfield St David's Gloucester Winchester York Norwich Rochester is rather good - I prefer it to Canterbury which I found rather underwhelming too.
If we're counting King's I feel we should also mention: Tewkesbury Abbey
Ooh. One I’ve missed! I’ve never been to Lichfield! Seems like I must
Agree Winchester. Outside not so impressive but that astonishing nave makes up for it. The cloisters at Gloucester are sublime
I love Tewkesbury too. Malmesbury and Shrewsbury are likewise resonant
One of THE most amazingly spiritual spaces in the whole world is St John’s chapel inside the white tower of the Tower of London. I believe English kings and queens are meant to do vigils there prior to coronation
Lichfield is less than two hours from London by train and is an extremely rare more or less unspoilt Georgian city.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Clifton Taylor considered Lincoln to be numero uno. And, as I recall, it is truly magnificent. And it has the imp.
It's the setting as well as the Cathedral. Like Salisbury and Norwich rolled into one stuck on top of a ginormous hill rising out of a massive plain.
It's absolutely exceptional. What Cathedral in the world can rival that? Ely would come closest in England but it isn't close.
Plus, it's a magnificent building.
Yes if held at gunpoint I’d have to go for either Lincoln or Durham
And in the end it might be Lincoln
This should be done to every British schoolchild aged about 16. They should be held at gunpoint and forced to choose the best English cathedral. And if they say something stupid like “I hate cathedrals!” Or “I’ve no idea” or “er, Paris” then they are thrown into the Thames at Gallions Reach
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Yes, we'll count Kings.
Some other good ones Lichfield St David's Gloucester Winchester York Norwich Rochester is rather good - I prefer it to Canterbury which I found rather underwhelming too.
If we're counting King's I feel we should also mention: Tewkesbury Abbey
Ooh. One I’ve missed! I’ve never been to Lichfield! Seems like I must
Agree Winchester. Outside not so impressive but that astonishing nave makes up for it. The cloisters at Gloucester are sublime
I love Tewkesbury too. Malmesbury and Shrewsbury are likewise resonant
One of THE most amazingly spiritual spaces in the whole world is St John’s chapel inside the white tower of the Tower of London. I believe English kings and queens are meant to do vigils there prior to coronation
Winchester isn’t “pretty” from the outside but it’s an absolutely imposing monster. It’s like a Springbok forward compared to the elegant French winger that is Ely or Salisbury.
The thing I love about it is the fact that the transepts stayed Romanesque so you can see the change of styles in one place and see the beauty but the different effects of both on light and space by moving a few feet one way or another.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Clifton Taylor considered Lincoln to be numero uno. And, as I recall, it is truly magnificent. And it has the imp.
It's the setting as well as the Cathedral. Like Salisbury and Norwich rolled into one stuck on top of a ginormous hill rising out of a massive plain.
It's absolutely exceptional. What Cathedral in the world can rival that? Ely would come closest in England but it isn't close.
Plus, it's a magnificent building.
Yes if held at gunpoint I’d have to go for either Lincoln or Durham
And in the end it might be Lincoln
This should be done to every British schoolchild aged about 16. They should be held at gunpoint and forced to choose the best English cathedral. And if they say something stupid like “I hate cathedrals!” Or “I’ve no idea” or “er, Paris” then they are thrown into the Thames at Gallions Reach
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Clifton Taylor considered Lincoln to be numero uno. And, as I recall, it is truly magnificent. And it has the imp.
It's the setting as well as the Cathedral. Like Salisbury and Norwich rolled into one stuck on top of a ginormous hill rising out of a massive plain.
It's absolutely exceptional. What Cathedral in the world can rival that? Ely would come closest in England but it isn't close.
Plus, it's a magnificent building.
Just imagine what Ely Cathedral must have looked like before the fens were drained. On its island amid the waters.
You can still get that floating effect on a cold misty day - which are not unknown in the fenlands - the cathedral rises above the grey oceanic swirl
Feel bad for Pakistan, the match was decided by the umpire's decision on the final lbw appeal. Not that the decision was wrong but the umpire could have gone either way there
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
Does ending apartheid equate to abolishing the state of Israel in this case?
I wouldn't have thought so. Although I was more referencing the SA original version of it in my comment. But no, surely a nation doesn't have to oppress part of its population to be viable. It might seem impossible now but eventually there'll be a resolution whereby there's an Israel and a Palestine, both of them free from the river to the sea. Although not literally. That was a turn of phrase I put in because it sounds good and it rhymes.
What do you think about all this anyway? I like your trappy questions but sometimes thirst for more.
O/T The Mauritshuis in The Hague must surely be the finest art gallery in the world. A perfect gem.
Musee D'Orsay for me, its about the only thing worth visiting in Paris.
I wouldn't say it is the only thing worth visiting but it is certainly the shining gem. I much prefer the Musee D'Orsay to the Louvre.
Ive been to Paris quite a lot and my son has just moved there. Last time I did the Sainte Chappelle ( overrated ) and Notre Dame. ND was really good as they had an exhibition on the restoration which was really well presented. The other thing I have been advised to see is the catacombs not sure if they will be as good as the hype.
I have yet to see the Sainte Chappelle (the lift has been broken every time we've tried - I mean, I am grateful and surprised there even is a lift but it would be nice for it to work). Having studied gothic architecture in an evening class, It really would like to see the example for myself.
When I went it was extremely busy, I wished I had looked at the guides to see if there was a slack time. If you can clear the tourists there's more to look at.
Go to the Musee Carnavalet.
Thanks, Ill do that, its a short walk from where my son lives.
You let him live in an EU City after contributing to our being black-balled!!
It's a fine gallery in a nice area. I'm sure you'll have been to the musee d'orsay but worth a visit every time you go. One of my favourites
He's getting married next year to a francaise. But his Irish Passport lets him stroll about.
He couldn't lend it to me could he? Irish passports are like gold dust. Lucky boy. I bet he was livid with you.
It's funny to think there was a time when English passports were just as valued. My ex went to live in Beausoleil and after overstaying her 90 days by several months can't come back because she fears they wont let her back again
You’ve got a 2nd home in Villefranche sur Mer. Where you spend much time (and good luck to you, it’s a lovely part of the world) - surely you have claimed French rights of residency?
The second home makes no difference. As for the rest it's complicated. Ironically Monaco is easier,
But I have friends in this situation. All you had to do was reside in villefranche for a year before Brexit then you got residency AIUI
Alternatively given that you are self employed you could get a digital nomad visa in say Spain or Portugal or just buy a bloody house in Malta or Cyprus and you get an EU passport
For rich people - eg you - this is not hard to work around
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Yes, we'll count Kings.
Some other good ones Lichfield St David's Gloucester Winchester York Norwich Rochester is rather good - I prefer it to Canterbury which I found rather underwhelming too.
If we're counting King's I feel we should also mention: Tewkesbury Abbey
Coventry is very poignant with the new one next to the bombed ruins . Also Leicester deserves a mention as it has Richard the Third in it!
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Yes, we'll count Kings.
Some other good ones Lichfield St David's Gloucester Winchester York Norwich Rochester is rather good - I prefer it to Canterbury which I found rather underwhelming too.
If we're counting King's I feel we should also mention: Tewkesbury Abbey
Ooh. One I’ve missed! I’ve never been to Lichfield! Seems like I must
Agree Winchester. Outside not so impressive but that astonishing nave makes up for it. The cloisters at Gloucester are sublime
I love Tewkesbury too. Malmesbury and Shrewsbury are likewise resonant
One of THE most amazingly spiritual spaces in the whole world is St John’s chapel inside the white tower of the Tower of London. I believe English kings and queens are meant to do vigils there prior to coronation
Lichfield is less than two hours from London by train and is an extremely rare more or less unspoilt Georgian city.
Plus it has the Cathedral.
It also has Michael Fabricant.
What's not to like?
Indeed. Especially if one is in need of a yellow mop to clean the nave
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Yes, we'll count Kings.
Some other good ones Lichfield St David's Gloucester Winchester York Norwich Rochester is rather good - I prefer it to Canterbury which I found rather underwhelming too.
If we're counting King's I feel we should also mention: Tewkesbury Abbey
Coventry is very poignant with the new one next to the bombed ruins . Also Leicester deserves a mention as it has Richard the Third in it!
Haven't we got enough people arguing about children being killed on this thread?
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
In South Africa, there was an obvious good guy, and an obvious bad guy.
Despite what Roger and the Corbynistas think, Israel doesn't fill the role of obvious bad guy, nor do the Palestinians fill the role of obvious good guy.
Yup. The talk of a “ceasefire” is a good example. In most conflicts when we say “ceasefire” we mean both sides. In this case, people seem to mean unilateral from Israel, and for Israel to just sit there and take continued rocket strikes during it, because it is the baddie and it deserves it.
What makes you say most people want a unilateral ceasefire?
To be fair that is exactly what people are asking for when they say they want a ceasefire. They may think they want something that encompases both sides but that is never going to happen. In reality they are just asking for Israel to stop bombing Gaza.
I haven't called for one, mostly because as an anonymous doctor 3000 miles away I think neither Hamas nor the IDF are likely to listen to my call, but clearly ceasefires are bilateral.
Yeah, pb.com gets quite weird at the start of a war. Or when there is not a war on at all to be fair.
For some posters everything has to be said as if we were the PM addressing the nation rather than nerds talking amongst ourselves.
Years ago I went to a fantastic performance of Antigone at the Greek theatre in Siracusa. It was June, the weather was gorgeous, we brought cushions and watched this wonderful drama.
Then as it was getting dark and Creon was wailing and rending his garments in the final scene - "Non ho nessuno. Non son' nessuno." (I have no-one. I am no-one) - the audience decided it was time for the play to end, applauded wildly and got up to pass the rest of the night in Siracusa's many excellent bars and restaurants.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Yes, we'll count Kings.
Some other good ones Lichfield St David's Gloucester Winchester York Norwich Rochester is rather good - I prefer it to Canterbury which I found rather underwhelming too.
If we're counting King's I feel we should also mention: Tewkesbury Abbey
Ooh. One I’ve missed! I’ve never been to Lichfield! Seems like I must
Agree Winchester. Outside not so impressive but that astonishing nave makes up for it. The cloisters at Gloucester are sublime
I love Tewkesbury too. Malmesbury and Shrewsbury are likewise resonant
One of THE most amazingly spiritual spaces in the whole world is St John’s chapel inside the white tower of the Tower of London. I believe English kings and queens are meant to do vigils there prior to coronation
Lichfield is less than two hours from London by train and is an extremely rare more or less unspoilt Georgian city.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Yes, we'll count Kings.
Some other good ones Lichfield St David's Gloucester Winchester York Norwich Rochester is rather good - I prefer it to Canterbury which I found rather underwhelming too.
If we're counting King's I feel we should also mention: Tewkesbury Abbey
Ooh. One I’ve missed! I’ve never been to Lichfield! Seems like I must
Agree Winchester. Outside not so impressive but that astonishing nave makes up for it. The cloisters at Gloucester are sublime
I love Tewkesbury too. Malmesbury and Shrewsbury are likewise resonant
One of THE most amazingly spiritual spaces in the whole world is St John’s chapel inside the white tower of the Tower of London. I believe English kings and queens are meant to do vigils there prior to coronation
Winchester isn’t “pretty” from the outside but it’s an absolutely imposing monster. It’s like a Springbok forward compared to the elegant French winger that is Ely or Salisbury.
The thing I love about it is the fact that the transepts stayed Romanesque so you can see the change of styles in one place and see the beauty but the different effects of both on light and space by moving a few feet one way or another.
Also has that amazing history. Jane Austen buried in the nave and those bone boxes containing king Cnut and various Anglo Saxon kings and queens
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Clifton Taylor considered Lincoln to be numero uno. And, as I recall, it is truly magnificent. And it has the imp.
It's the setting as well as the Cathedral. Like Salisbury and Norwich rolled into one stuck on top of a ginormous hill rising out of a massive plain.
It's absolutely exceptional. What Cathedral in the world can rival that? Ely would come closest in England but it isn't close.
Plus, it's a magnificent building.
Yes if held at gunpoint I’d have to go for either Lincoln or Durham
And in the end it might be Lincoln
This should be done to every British schoolchild aged about 16. They should be held at gunpoint and forced to choose the best English cathedral. And if they say something stupid like “I hate cathedrals!” Or “I’ve no idea” or “er, Paris” then they are thrown into the Thames at Gallions Reach
The view of Durham Cathedral from the railway station (or indeed a passing train) is something else.
BTW - St Magnus Cathedral in Kirkwall was, I seem to remember reading, built by the people responsible for Durham.
And, indeed, it's just like a mini-Durham.
Finest ecclesiastical building in Scotland. In fact, drop the "ecclesiastical".
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
In South Africa, there was an obvious good guy, and an obvious bad guy.
Despite what Roger and the Corbynistas think, Israel doesn't fill the role of obvious bad guy, nor do the Palestinians fill the role of obvious good guy.
On the one hand we have a civilised, modern democracy that respects human rights and has functioning courts of law.
On the other we have a fascist dictatorship, which deliberately murders children, rapes women, executes gays and hasn't held an election in nearly twenty years.
There's an obvious good guy and bad guy here, it just doesn't suit Roger's agenda.
O/T The Mauritshuis in The Hague must surely be the finest art gallery in the world. A perfect gem.
Musee D'Orsay for me, its about the only thing worth visiting in Paris.
I wouldn't say it is the only thing worth visiting but it is certainly the shining gem. I much prefer the Musee D'Orsay to the Louvre.
Ive been to Paris quite a lot and my son has just moved there. Last time I did the Sainte Chappelle ( overrated ) and Notre Dame. ND was really good as they had an exhibition on the restoration which was really well presented. The other thing I have been advised to see is the catacombs not sure if they will be as good as the hype.
I have yet to see the Sainte Chappelle (the lift has been broken every time we've tried - I mean, I am grateful and surprised there even is a lift but it would be nice for it to work). Having studied gothic architecture in an evening class, It really would like to see the example for myself.
When I went it was extremely busy, I wished I had looked at the guides to see if there was a slack time. If you can clear the tourists there's more to look at.
Go to the Musee Carnavalet.
Thanks, Ill do that, its a short walk from where my son lives.
You let him live in an EU City after contributing to our being black-balled!!
It's a fine gallery in a nice area. I'm sure you'll have been to the musee d'orsay but worth a visit every time you go. One of my favourites
He's getting married next year to a francaise. But his Irish Passport lets him stroll about.
He couldn't lend it to me could he? Irish passports are like gold dust. Lucky boy. I bet he was livid with you.
It's funny to think there was a time when English passports were just as valued. My ex went to live in Beausoleil and after overstaying her 90 days by several months can't come back because she fears they wont let her back again
You’ve got a 2nd home in Villefranche sur Mer. Where you spend much time (and good luck to you, it’s a lovely part of the world) - surely you have claimed French rights of residency?
The second home makes no difference. As for the rest it's complicated. Ironically Monaco is easier,
But I have friends in this situation. All you had to do was reside in villefranche for a year before Brexit then you got residency
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Yes, we'll count Kings.
Some other good ones Lichfield St David's Gloucester Winchester York Norwich Rochester is rather good - I prefer it to Canterbury which I found rather underwhelming too.
If we're counting King's I feel we should also mention: Tewkesbury Abbey
Ooh. One I’ve missed! I’ve never been to Lichfield! Seems like I must
Agree Winchester. Outside not so impressive but that astonishing nave makes up for it. The cloisters at Gloucester are sublime
I love Tewkesbury too. Malmesbury and Shrewsbury are likewise resonant
One of THE most amazingly spiritual spaces in the whole world is St John’s chapel inside the white tower of the Tower of London. I believe English kings and queens are meant to do vigils there prior to coronation
Winchester isn’t “pretty” from the outside but it’s an absolutely imposing monster. It’s like a Springbok forward compared to the elegant French winger that is Ely or Salisbury.
The thing I love about it is the fact that the transepts stayed Romanesque so you can see the change of styles in one place and see the beauty but the different effects of both on light and space by moving a few feet one way or another.
Also has that amazing history. Jane Austen buried in the nave and those bone boxes containing king Cnut and various Anglo Saxon kings and queens
The Anthony Gormley sculpture, Sound II, in the crypt is special, if you catch it at the right level of flood it appears to be standing on the water.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
A nice retirement hobby is visiting England's cathedrals. So far I've only managed Ripon which is hardly the most celebrated - barely rates a mention in the Alec Clifton Taylor guide - but while small is "perfectly formed". The west front has rather spendid Early English lancet windows, and it possesses an Anglo-Saxon crypt. Worth a look.
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
My faves are the obvious ones
Ely Wells Lincoln Durham Salisbury King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?) Guildford (lol) Truro (too modern) And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
Was in Durham a couple of weeks ago:
Beautiful photos. You captured it. That imposing monumental quality. Don’t know anywhere else like it
It will possibly have blown over by then but there are few issues in British and European politics as visceral as apartheid. And since South Africa this is seen (certainly on the left) as the next great injustice.
I'm sure Starmer will water down his intemperate comments but if he doesn't there will be a backlash. A lot will depend what happens in the next few months. Blair was able to lose his support in a short time with a wrong decision on Iraq and so could Starmer over Palestine
I'm always fascinated by the way the british Left decides it can willy nilly tell other people how to run their countries . Its just imperialism by other means.
But as imperialisms go I'd say campaigning against apartheid beats invading Iraq.
In South Africa, there was an obvious good guy, and an obvious bad guy.
Despite what Roger and the Corbynistas think, Israel doesn't fill the role of obvious bad guy, nor do the Palestinians fill the role of obvious good guy.
Yup. The talk of a “ceasefire” is a good example. In most conflicts when we say “ceasefire” we mean both sides. In this case, people seem to mean unilateral from Israel, and for Israel to just sit there and take continued rocket strikes during it, because it is the baddie and it deserves it.
What makes you say most people want a unilateral ceasefire?
Because I assume no one is silly enough to entertain the thought that Hamas would respect one.
If Hamas won't respect a ceasefire then Israel surely have nothing to lose by calling a ceasefire knowing Hamas will break it anyway. An easy propaganda victory. But Israel doesn't want a ceasefire.
What a perverted logic. Hamas started the fight, and Israel haven't got in their retaliation yet.
So your logic is that Israel should just have a ceasefire giving Hamas an opportunity to strike them with no recourse? How does that make any sense whatsoever?
Israel should have a ceasefire once Hamas have been destroyed.
The BBC wittering on about Boris joining GB News on the 6pm bulletin is really weird. Is that news worthy? Really? Just ignore GB News chaps unless or until Boris says or does something newsworthy. If anything they were almost advertising it.
Comments
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/live/cricket/66858553
Despite what Roger and the Corbynistas think, Israel doesn't fill the role of obvious bad guy, nor do the Palestinians fill the role of obvious good guy.
British churches and cathedrals - if old enough - are generally the most numinous, mystical and spiritual inside
I have no idea why this is. But if you go in a great British cathedral (generally gothic - but there are exceptions like Durham) you get an oooooh spine tingling quality that is all too often absent elsewhere
Eg I’ve just been in Siracusa’s cathedral - which is half built out of a Doric Greek temple ffs - yet it didn’t particularly move me. I find the same in Spanish French German cathedrals. Most but not all Italian cathedrals
And this is despite the fact Britain is a much less religious culture
Maybe it is the northern light? The accretion of time without revolutions? The patina?
You DO get the same buzz in some Eastern European and Russian cathedrals - they can be intense
Hidden in plain sight in unprepossessing setting and world class quality: The medieval stained glass in All Saints, North Street, York. Just staggering.
Not world class art galleries but possessing a couple of world class paintings
It was one of the most spiritual moments Ive ever had.
It's a fine gallery in a nice area. I'm sure you'll have been to the musee d'orsay but worth a visit every time you go. One of my favourites
Oh,just remembered, visited Newcastle-upon-Tyne cathedral too. A promoted parish church but still good value. A tremendous Jacobean monument for instance. Oh, and take the Metro to the central station. The walk to the cathedral is a delight.
In France it is often the revolution that is to blame. It swept away so much - it scraped away the patina of smoke and time and worship which makes a great moving cathedral
Weirdly, Hagia Sophia DOES have that buzz despite being a museum for a century and now a mosque
Ditto the orthodox churches of Greece. Some of them are seriously intense. Esp the monasteries of Mount athos. Omg
I’ve always been a bit disappointed with the continental equivalents and I have put it down to, counterintuitively, the plainness of the interiors of the English ones. It’s like seeing a skeleton of a blue whale rather than a scale model of it with skin. The bones and the intricacy of construction are there in all their glory and not hidden by a riot of coloured columns and paintings.
I think if the Parthenon was complete it would be a more beautiful object in its stripped back, weathered current look rather than a riot of colour.
https://www.justgiving.com/crowdfunding/Clapham-Franks
Kirkwall Cathedral in the Orkneys is AMAZING. Absolutely spiritual - and beautiful - and strange
Irish churches are notably disappointing - with some rare medieval exceptions - Kilfenora in the Burren is wild
I assume it would be very difficult for them to do so by surprise though.
Yes.
For some posters everything has to be said as if we were the PM addressing the nation rather than nerds talking amongst ourselves.
Ely
Wells
Lincoln
Durham
Salisbury
King’s College Cambridge if it counts?
Disappointing
Canterbury (too much going on?)
Guildford (lol)
Truro (too modern)
And - controversial take here - St Paul’s London. I love its noble exterior rising over the city but inside it has zero atmos
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_Israel–Hamas_ceasefire
It's funny to think there was a time when English passports were just as valued. My ex went to live in Beausoleil and after overstaying her 90 days by several months can't come back because she fears they wont let her back again
Some other good ones
Lichfield
St David's
Gloucester
Winchester
York
Norwich
Rochester is rather good - I prefer it to Canterbury which I found rather underwhelming too.
If we're counting King's I feel we should also mention:
Tewkesbury Abbey
It's absolutely exceptional. What Cathedral in the world can rival that? Ely would come closest in England but it isn't close.
Plus, it's a magnificent building.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/24550931/israel-invasion-of-gaza-hamas-terror-massacre/?utm_medium=browser_notifications&utm_source=pushly&utm_campaign=GB-pushly
On the other hand since you now have time on your hands could I suggest "On va tout peter"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blow_It_to_Bits
It's a docufilm set in a factory in the arse end of France. I used to run it and it's the only film where I know all the cast
It won the Palme D'Or.
That was some cricket match.
And something weird happened.
South Africa couldn't go through with the choke.
Agree Winchester. Outside not so impressive but that astonishing nave makes up for it. The cloisters at Gloucester are sublime
I love Tewkesbury too. Malmesbury and Shrewsbury are likewise resonant
One of THE most amazingly spiritual spaces in the whole world is St John’s chapel inside the white tower of the Tower of London. I believe English kings and queens are meant to do vigils there prior to coronation
Plus it has the Cathedral.
Definitely well worth a visit.
At least it’s not on wizzair, but Turkish with its world class food offering is going to be wasted on me.
What's not to like?
And in the end it might be Lincoln
This should be done to every British schoolchild aged about 16. They should be held at gunpoint and forced to choose the best English cathedral. And if they say something stupid like “I hate cathedrals!” Or “I’ve no idea” or “er, Paris” then they are thrown into the Thames at Gallions Reach
The thing I love about it is the fact that the transepts stayed Romanesque so you can see the change of styles in one place and see the beauty but the different effects of both on light and space by moving a few feet one way or another.
What do you think about all this anyway? I like your trappy questions but sometimes thirst for more.
Alternatively given that you are self employed you could get a digital nomad visa in say Spain or Portugal or just buy a bloody house in Malta or Cyprus and you get an EU passport
For rich people - eg you - this is not hard to work around
Then as it was getting dark and Creon was wailing and rending his garments in the final scene - "Non ho nessuno. Non son' nessuno." (I have no-one. I am no-one) - the audience decided it was time for the play to end, applauded wildly and got up to pass the rest of the night in Siracusa's many excellent bars and restaurants.
BTW - St Magnus Cathedral in Kirkwall was, I seem to remember reading, built by the people responsible for Durham.
And, indeed, it's just like a mini-Durham.
Finest ecclesiastical building in Scotland. In fact, drop the "ecclesiastical".
On the other we have a fascist dictatorship, which deliberately murders children, rapes women, executes gays and hasn't held an election in nearly twenty years.
There's an obvious good guy and bad guy here, it just doesn't suit Roger's agenda.
So your logic is that Israel should just have a ceasefire giving Hamas an opportunity to strike them with no recourse? How does that make any sense whatsoever?
Israel should have a ceasefire once Hamas have been destroyed.