"No man's land" is surprisingly crowded these days. A good one in six are undecided on keeping the monarchy. On my side of the lines, we've got about a quarter of the population.
Surprised? Me too. Seems like there's a problem with those voices of republicans getting heard despite our numbers growing.
.
Really? That sounds a bit dramatic to me, I've never noticed republicans having difficulty getting heard in any context.
Perhaps it's just a perception bias. I was surprised to find that there's as much support as there is for a republic. I thought, much like Casino_Royale, that numbers were small.
Same here. I'm surprised by how much Republican sentiment there is. And once we get post QE2 I'd think it would only grow.
There are 4 categories of people, I'd say.
1. Monarchists. 2. Not fussed but would vote to keep if asked. 3. Not fussed but would vote to scrap if asked. 4. Republicans.
ATM spread approx 25/35/15/25.
So, as per usual, it's about moving that middle ground. If lots of 2s become 3s the pressure will build for a Referendum.
Because you can't just keep ignoring the people.
5. Republicans, who wouldn't want to change it whilst Liz is around.
My own position is I think it works, more or less, and I'm content with that, and I defend the system but try not to be weird about it.
Me, I think the system is weird and try not to defend it :-) I've got less strongly opinionated on it over the years, though -- if I was offered a vote (unlikely!) I'd vote for a republic, but in practice the system as it stands does, as you say, more or less work, and there are bigger and more important fish to fry. (Not that I'm actually out there working on any political causes to really make peoples' lives better, but I'm pretty sure there are dozens of them that would come before 'reform the monarchy' on my hypothetical todo list.)
Good morning from Old Tbilisi, and a happy Jubilee to everyone, monarchist, anarchist, Fascist, communist….. even republican
To veer slightly off topic, I recall there were some people on here dismissing the Stade de France story as “a scuffle at a football game, will be forgotten in two days”. i said that was not the case, it is indeed not the case. From the Spectator
“The shambles at the Stade de France on Saturday night took a sinister turn on Wednesday as allegations emerged of incidents of sexual assault committed against supporters by gangs of local youths.
“What unfolded outside France’s national stadium on Saturday evening as Liverpool and Real Madrid met inside in the final of the Champions League has dominated the news in France ever since. Most of the criticism for what is seen as a national humiliation is directed at Gérald Darmanin, the Minister of the Interior, who since Saturday evening has insisted that Liverpool supporters were predominantly to blame for the trouble. On Wednesday he received the indirect support of his boss, Emmanuel Macron, via his official spokeswoman, Olivia Grégoire, who assured reporters the president is ‘totally’ behind his beleaguered minister.”
There's rugby and kickball internationals at the SdF, so a complete coin toss which was going on last Saturday, no?
No.
Hooligans gonna hooligan, Paris police gonna do what they do best, and life being the harsh struggle against unfair odds, rounded off by a cheap funeral, that it is, Liverpool fans no matter how saintly gonna have the sins of their fathers visited upon them.
Your normal lazy, low-watt, misinformed take on what is now a huge story - in France
You’re also wrong about the footie/rugby thing. It turns out there have been similar problems at Stade de France at rugby matches too. They have just never been reported as they have been on a smaller scale, and rugby is less salient than soccer
Huge story in France that the banlieus are bandit country? I should get a job at Le Monde, I could have told them that 25 years ago
It's pretty unfortunate because it brings to the fore issues France/Macron would rather just ignore. Juxtaposed with what should have been a French triumph.
Echoes of the 2011 riots?
Exactly. it’s a big story by itself - thousands of people attacked, dozens of children molested, etc etc - but it throws uncomfortable light on an even bigger story, which Macron is desperate not to talk about
Remember that the Interior Minister’s FIRST version of events was that the problems all came from “thousands of British fans trying to get in without tickets and violating stewards”
A complete load of astonishing bollocks from beginning to end.
He also tried to support this ludicrous version of events by saying “most of the people arrested are English”.
However since then French journalists have dug into the truth and revealed that most people arrested are “Algerian, Moroccan, Tunisian” etc.
His response to this, last night, when it was pointed out at a press conference? “It is nauseous [ie racist] to talk about the nationality of suspects”. Even tho he was quite happy to call them “English” when it suited him. Incroyable
It looks like his career is going to be truncated, he will be the sacrificial lamb to propitiate the angry gods. However Macron won’t sack him immediately because, elections
Yeah it's fucking carnage out there though. Have a guess before looking at the death and injury count over the last 4 years in gilets jaunes carry ons
and hugely ironically, when I was googling for dangers in Paris generally, I find (Nov 2015)
Three explosions occurred near the country's national sports stadium, the Stade de France, in the suburb of Saint-Denis, resulting in four deaths, including the three suicide bombers.[66] The explosions happened at 21:16, 21:19,[note 1] and 21:53.[67] At the time, the stadium was hosting an international friendly football match between France and Germany, which President Hollande was attending.[68][69] The suicide bombers arrived slightly late for the game, and eyewitness reports indicated they did not have tickets, resulting in them being turned away by security guards several times.[65]
The first explosion near the stadium occurred about 20 minutes after the start of the game.[68][69] The first bomber was prevented from entering the stadium again after a security guard patted him down and found the explosive vest.[70] A few seconds after being turned away, he detonated the vest outside the security gate, killing himself and a bystander.[65][71] Investigators later surmised that the first suicide bomber had planned to detonate his vest within the stadium, triggering the crowd's panicked exit onto the streets where two other bombers were lying in wait.[72] Three minutes after the first bombing, the second bomber blew himself up outside another security gate.[note 1][65] Another 23 minutes after that, the third bomber's vest detonated near the stadium. According to some reports, the location of the third explosion was at a McDonald's restaurant, where over 50 people were injured, seven seriously;[65][70][73] others state the bomb detonated some distance away from any discernible target.[74]
The irony being, nobody has commented on the precedent/parallel because NOBODY REMEMBERED IT. And it's a lot more memorable than last weekend's nonsense
Yes, some of the problems seem to come from the Stade de France changing its crowd management policies, after the terror attacks. Eg there are few if any reports of crowd difficulties before the big attacks of 2015, they all date from after then, when the authorities got paranoid about the wrong people getting in
And of course you’re right that is a bigger story than last weekend, but last weekend is still pretty bloody serious. 1000s of people robbed, attacked and traumatised, and dozens if not hundreds of sexual assaults - with police officers saying they have never witnessed anything on this scale
It looks like the French now have a toxic cocktail of near-impossible crowd management problems in the face of terrorism, and all of this with a stadium surrounded by Islamist migrants, and on top of that they now have the threat of constant Cologne style mass robbery and sexual molestation
This is a French paper speculating that the mess might cost Macron “fifty deputies”
“It will end up costing us 50 deputies like the social VAT of Borloo”, fears a senior officer of the macronie. Darmanin in the middle of the fire lopinion.fr/politique/stad… by @LVigogne@mdeprieck Drawing @MonsieurKak”
Personally, I would not go to the Stade de France to watch anything, not now. And I would have been happy to do so, before, because I was oblivious, like all of us
They really should not have built that stadium in Paris 93
Yet. Has been noted before. Stratford wasn't ritzy when we built ours there. It was a dump in the 90's.
When I was living in London in the period around 2000, 3 bed semis in decent streets in Stratford for £70k or so were one hot tip from the London Property Guide.
I reckon Catford might be the next gentrification target. I went out for a drink and a meal with a mate there last night. It's really quite ropey but has excellent transport links into central London with two train stations side by side. There's a bizarrely good and cheap Italian restaurant there too - two pizzas, two deserts and a nice bottle of Primitivo for a bit over £50. Catford is the new Peckham - you heard it here first.
No tube station. Areas that don't have tube or overground struggle to gentrify. It's only when the overground was properly revamped that the eastern bit of London where I grew up really started to gentrify. Before that it was a no go area and my parents couldn't leave fast enough when my dad got his chartership and a good job.
Catford is 30 mins to London Bridge by overground, and has more parkland over the last 10-15 years. Also decent for cycling afaics.
It's on a potential Bakerloo Line Extension. Currently on hold whilst TFL finances climb out of the black hole.
"No man's land" is surprisingly crowded these days. A good one in six are undecided on keeping the monarchy. On my side of the lines, we've got about a quarter of the population.
Surprised? Me too. Seems like there's a problem with those voices of republicans getting heard despite our numbers growing.
.
Really? That sounds a bit dramatic to me, I've never noticed republicans having difficulty getting heard in any context.
Perhaps it's just a perception bias. I was surprised to find that there's as much support as there is for a republic. I thought, much like Casino_Royale, that numbers were small.
Same here. I'm surprised by how much Republican sentiment there is. And once we get post QE2 I'd think it would only grow.
There are 4 categories of people, I'd say.
1. Monarchists. 2. Not fussed but would vote to keep if asked. 3. Not fussed but would vote to scrap if asked. 4. Republicans.
ATM spread approx 25/35/15/25.
So, as per usual, it's about moving that middle ground. If lots of 2s become 3s the pressure will build for a Referendum.
"No man's land" is surprisingly crowded these days. A good one in six are undecided on keeping the monarchy. On my side of the lines, we've got about a quarter of the population.
Surprised? Me too. Seems like there's a problem with those voices of republicans getting heard despite our numbers growing.
.
Really? That sounds a bit dramatic to me, I've never noticed republicans having difficulty getting heard in any context.
Perhaps it's just a perception bias. I was surprised to find that there's as much support as there is for a republic. I thought, much like Casino_Royale, that numbers were small.
Same here. I'm surprised by how much Republican sentiment there is. And once we get post QE2 I'd think it would only grow.
There are 4 categories of people, I'd say.
1. Monarchists. 2. Not fussed but would vote to keep if asked. 3. Not fussed but would vote to scrap if asked. 4. Republicans.
ATM spread approx 25/35/15/25.
So, as per usual, it's about moving that middle ground. If lots of 2s become 3s the pressure will build for a Referendum.
Because you can't just keep ignoring the people.
We have had far too many referendums recently, we are a government of parliamentary democracy not direct democracy.
Though obviously there would never be a referendum on the monarchy under a Tory government, if it happened it would be under a Labour government, though even Starmer has said he now backs a reformed monarchy having replaced the republican Corbyn.
Note in Australia it is only the arrival of a Labor government that has put a republic on the agenda again but even there opinion is divided and any referendum will probably have to wait for a second term, if Labor is re elected. In 1999 of course Australians voted 55% to keep the monarchy
I’m afraid the endearing ineptitude of that makes me more of a monarchist
Republicans always get their timing, tone and arguments wrong. Always wrong.
They will try again at the next coronation, and lose then too.
They will always lose.
Yep
The genius of a monarchy is its predictably human unpredictability. So it has inherent drama, like a soap opera, and we are all addicted, even when it takes a dark turn
So you get periods when it’s awful, ugh, Prince Andrew is a fiddler, yuk, and the Queen is nearly dead, oh no, and then suddenly you get a birth or a birthday or a wedding and then Yay, look, the Mall is lovely in the sun! - it reminds me of having a baby which is exactly like Brexit, no, it’s like bringing up a baby - you have periods when it is all nappies and what the F and then you get the first smile or the first word and happiness is unconfined
Except for the churlish, joyless republicans, but then I suspect they get a secret surly joy out of being churlish and joyless, so it’s all good
Joyless my arse , you slaver over a bunch of grifters, crooked, sexual deviants , ne'er do wells etc. A pox on your Royals.
See, you enjoyed writing that. QED
LOOK. Even the Georgians are celebrating your majestic English Queen 👑👑🥂🥂
Are you staying in a shanty town?
Pretty much, yes
Old Tbilisi is a fantastic ensemble of brilliantly preserved-yet-falling-down early 19th century quasi-Persian houses, which closely resemble Tudor London before the fire, complete with intricate balconies, men singing in string vests, and trees growing through roofs. Think downtown Palermo without the Mafia, or Naples without the Camorra
However it won't be like this for long. At its core it has now been gentrified, there are blocks of beautifully restored houses now turned into pricey boutique hotels, wine bars, etc. Georgia has experienced an amazing tourist boom these last ten years (and it is right now full of Russian emigres fleeing Putin)
I give it ten years before the entire city turns into Prague or Barcelona of the Caucasus, all chic Airbnbs and 5 star hotels, and the locals are priced out completely
Have to say, whatever you think of the monarchy, however cynical you are or down on Britain the Trooping of the Colour is bloody magnificent as a spectacle.
It knocks those big presidential parades such as Red Dquare and the French Bastille parade into a cocked hat - there’s something Victorian about it still so a gentle bit of time travel.
It’s almost, hopefully not being too wanky, a demonstration of an iron fist in a velvet glove by the military rather than the in your face bombast of other parades where they drive the tanks etc etc.
OTOH the horses sort of got outdated in September 1939. And it's not as if the MoD had had the sense to keep some old Churchill tanks for parades. They do those things better in Burma.
A visiting friend, from Iceland, commented that the combination of antique uniforms with modern rifles was an interesting touch.
Most other countries have parade units that carry parade weapons.
I was surprised they didn't keep some SMLEs or No 4s for that, especially as the new SA80 forced some changes to drill. Though apparently even changing to the SLR needed some changes to the drill.
Meanwhile. It is silent out there. Literally no one around. No kids playing. No lawns mowed. No traffic. No pedestrians. Beautiful sunshine. Where's everyone gone?
Watching Trooping the Colour?
Test Match. England bowling. NZ 1-0 AToW.
Yay! 1-1. c Bairstow b Anderson. What idiot left Anderson out of the last tour?
It never made much sense. Of all the issues we had in the Ashes, Anderson's bowling was not one of them, he had not suddenly become crap. Yes, we need a plan for who could take his place eventually, but if he's still the best we've got in that role you don't swap him out prematurely.
Good morning from Old Tbilisi, and a happy Jubilee to everyone, monarchist, anarchist, Fascist, communist….. even republican
To veer slightly off topic, I recall there were some people on here dismissing the Stade de France story as “a scuffle at a football game, will be forgotten in two days”. i said that was not the case, it is indeed not the case. From the Spectator
“The shambles at the Stade de France on Saturday night took a sinister turn on Wednesday as allegations emerged of incidents of sexual assault committed against supporters by gangs of local youths.
“What unfolded outside France’s national stadium on Saturday evening as Liverpool and Real Madrid met inside in the final of the Champions League has dominated the news in France ever since. Most of the criticism for what is seen as a national humiliation is directed at Gérald Darmanin, the Minister of the Interior, who since Saturday evening has insisted that Liverpool supporters were predominantly to blame for the trouble. On Wednesday he received the indirect support of his boss, Emmanuel Macron, via his official spokeswoman, Olivia Grégoire, who assured reporters the president is ‘totally’ behind his beleaguered minister.”
There's rugby and kickball internationals at the SdF, so a complete coin toss which was going on last Saturday, no?
No.
Hooligans gonna hooligan, Paris police gonna do what they do best, and life being the harsh struggle against unfair odds, rounded off by a cheap funeral, that it is, Liverpool fans no matter how saintly gonna have the sins of their fathers visited upon them.
Your normal lazy, low-watt, misinformed take on what is now a huge story - in France
You’re also wrong about the footie/rugby thing. It turns out there have been similar problems at Stade de France at rugby matches too. They have just never been reported as they have been on a smaller scale, and rugby is less salient than soccer
Huge story in France that the banlieus are bandit country? I should get a job at Le Monde, I could have told them that 25 years ago
It's pretty unfortunate because it brings to the fore issues France/Macron would rather just ignore. Juxtaposed with what should have been a French triumph.
Echoes of the 2011 riots?
Exactly. it’s a big story by itself - thousands of people attacked, dozens of children molested, etc etc - but it throws uncomfortable light on an even bigger story, which Macron is desperate not to talk about
Remember that the Interior Minister’s FIRST version of events was that the problems all came from “thousands of British fans trying to get in without tickets and violating stewards”
A complete load of astonishing bollocks from beginning to end.
He also tried to support this ludicrous version of events by saying “most of the people arrested are English”.
However since then French journalists have dug into the truth and revealed that most people arrested are “Algerian, Moroccan, Tunisian” etc.
His response to this, last night, when it was pointed out at a press conference? “It is nauseous [ie racist] to talk about the nationality of suspects”. Even tho he was quite happy to call them “English” when it suited him. Incroyable
It looks like his career is going to be truncated, he will be the sacrificial lamb to propitiate the angry gods. However Macron won’t sack him immediately because, elections
Yeah it's fucking carnage out there though. Have a guess before looking at the death and injury count over the last 4 years in gilets jaunes carry ons
and hugely ironically, when I was googling for dangers in Paris generally, I find (Nov 2015)
Three explosions occurred near the country's national sports stadium, the Stade de France, in the suburb of Saint-Denis, resulting in four deaths, including the three suicide bombers.[66] The explosions happened at 21:16, 21:19,[note 1] and 21:53.[67] At the time, the stadium was hosting an international friendly football match between France and Germany, which President Hollande was attending.[68][69] The suicide bombers arrived slightly late for the game, and eyewitness reports indicated they did not have tickets, resulting in them being turned away by security guards several times.[65]
The first explosion near the stadium occurred about 20 minutes after the start of the game.[68][69] The first bomber was prevented from entering the stadium again after a security guard patted him down and found the explosive vest.[70] A few seconds after being turned away, he detonated the vest outside the security gate, killing himself and a bystander.[65][71] Investigators later surmised that the first suicide bomber had planned to detonate his vest within the stadium, triggering the crowd's panicked exit onto the streets where two other bombers were lying in wait.[72] Three minutes after the first bombing, the second bomber blew himself up outside another security gate.[note 1][65] Another 23 minutes after that, the third bomber's vest detonated near the stadium. According to some reports, the location of the third explosion was at a McDonald's restaurant, where over 50 people were injured, seven seriously;[65][70][73] others state the bomb detonated some distance away from any discernible target.[74]
The irony being, nobody has commented on the precedent/parallel because NOBODY REMEMBERED IT. And it's a lot more memorable than last weekend's nonsense
Yes, some of the problems seem to come from the Stade de France changing its crowd management policies, after the terror attacks. Eg there are few if any reports of crowd difficulties before the big attacks of 2015, they all date from after then, when the authorities got paranoid about the wrong people getting in
And of course you’re right that is a bigger story than last weekend, but last weekend is still pretty bloody serious. 1000s of people robbed, attacked and traumatised, and dozens if not hundreds of sexual assaults - with police officers saying they have never witnessed anything on this scale
It looks like the French now have a toxic cocktail of near-impossible crowd management problems in the face of terrorism, and all of this with a stadium surrounded by Islamist migrants, and on top of that they now have the threat of constant Cologne style mass robbery and sexual molestation
This is a French paper speculating that the mess might cost Macron “fifty deputies”
“It will end up costing us 50 deputies like the social VAT of Borloo”, fears a senior officer of the macronie. Darmanin in the middle of the fire lopinion.fr/politique/stad… by @LVigogne@mdeprieck Drawing @MonsieurKak”
Personally, I would not go to the Stade de France to watch anything, not now. And I would have been happy to do so, before, because I was oblivious, like all of us
They really should not have built that stadium in Paris 93
Yet. Has been noted before. Stratford wasn't ritzy when we built ours there. It was a dump in the 90's.
When I was living in London in the period around 2000, 3 bed semis in decent streets in Stratford for £70k or so were one hot tip from the London Property Guide.
I reckon Catford might be the next gentrification target. I went out for a drink and a meal with a mate there last night. It's really quite ropey but has excellent transport links into central London with two train stations side by side. There's a bizarrely good and cheap Italian restaurant there too - two pizzas, two deserts and a nice bottle of Primitivo for a bit over £50. Catford is the new Peckham - you heard it here first.
Meanwhile. It is silent out there. Literally no one around. No kids playing. No lawns mowed. No traffic. No pedestrians. Beautiful sunshine. Where's everyone gone?
Watching Trooping the Colour?
Test Match. England bowling. NZ 1-0 AToW.
Yay! 1-1. c Bairstow b Anderson. What idiot left Anderson out of the last tour?
It never made much sense. Of all the issues we had in the Ashes, Anderson's bowling was not one of the, he had not suddenly become crap. Yes, we need a plan for who could take his place eventually, but if he's still the best we've got in that role you don't swap him out prematurely.
It made sense if you assume Root thought their experience and skill was overshadowing his captaincy and putting it under threat.
It made no sense if you looked at performances on the field, which demonstrated the reason his captaincy was under threat was his batsmen weren't scoring runs.
Good morning from Old Tbilisi, and a happy Jubilee to everyone, monarchist, anarchist, Fascist, communist….. even republican
To veer slightly off topic, I recall there were some people on here dismissing the Stade de France story as “a scuffle at a football game, will be forgotten in two days”. i said that was not the case, it is indeed not the case. From the Spectator
“The shambles at the Stade de France on Saturday night took a sinister turn on Wednesday as allegations emerged of incidents of sexual assault committed against supporters by gangs of local youths.
“What unfolded outside France’s national stadium on Saturday evening as Liverpool and Real Madrid met inside in the final of the Champions League has dominated the news in France ever since. Most of the criticism for what is seen as a national humiliation is directed at Gérald Darmanin, the Minister of the Interior, who since Saturday evening has insisted that Liverpool supporters were predominantly to blame for the trouble. On Wednesday he received the indirect support of his boss, Emmanuel Macron, via his official spokeswoman, Olivia Grégoire, who assured reporters the president is ‘totally’ behind his beleaguered minister.”
There's rugby and kickball internationals at the SdF, so a complete coin toss which was going on last Saturday, no?
No.
Hooligans gonna hooligan, Paris police gonna do what they do best, and life being the harsh struggle against unfair odds, rounded off by a cheap funeral, that it is, Liverpool fans no matter how saintly gonna have the sins of their fathers visited upon them.
Your normal lazy, low-watt, misinformed take on what is now a huge story - in France
You’re also wrong about the footie/rugby thing. It turns out there have been similar problems at Stade de France at rugby matches too. They have just never been reported as they have been on a smaller scale, and rugby is less salient than soccer
Huge story in France that the banlieus are bandit country? I should get a job at Le Monde, I could have told them that 25 years ago
It's pretty unfortunate because it brings to the fore issues France/Macron would rather just ignore. Juxtaposed with what should have been a French triumph.
Echoes of the 2011 riots?
Exactly. it’s a big story by itself - thousands of people attacked, dozens of children molested, etc etc - but it throws uncomfortable light on an even bigger story, which Macron is desperate not to talk about
Remember that the Interior Minister’s FIRST version of events was that the problems all came from “thousands of British fans trying to get in without tickets and violating stewards”
A complete load of astonishing bollocks from beginning to end.
He also tried to support this ludicrous version of events by saying “most of the people arrested are English”.
However since then French journalists have dug into the truth and revealed that most people arrested are “Algerian, Moroccan, Tunisian” etc.
His response to this, last night, when it was pointed out at a press conference? “It is nauseous [ie racist] to talk about the nationality of suspects”. Even tho he was quite happy to call them “English” when it suited him. Incroyable
It looks like his career is going to be truncated, he will be the sacrificial lamb to propitiate the angry gods. However Macron won’t sack him immediately because, elections
Yeah it's fucking carnage out there though. Have a guess before looking at the death and injury count over the last 4 years in gilets jaunes carry ons
and hugely ironically, when I was googling for dangers in Paris generally, I find (Nov 2015)
Three explosions occurred near the country's national sports stadium, the Stade de France, in the suburb of Saint-Denis, resulting in four deaths, including the three suicide bombers.[66] The explosions happened at 21:16, 21:19,[note 1] and 21:53.[67] At the time, the stadium was hosting an international friendly football match between France and Germany, which President Hollande was attending.[68][69] The suicide bombers arrived slightly late for the game, and eyewitness reports indicated they did not have tickets, resulting in them being turned away by security guards several times.[65]
The first explosion near the stadium occurred about 20 minutes after the start of the game.[68][69] The first bomber was prevented from entering the stadium again after a security guard patted him down and found the explosive vest.[70] A few seconds after being turned away, he detonated the vest outside the security gate, killing himself and a bystander.[65][71] Investigators later surmised that the first suicide bomber had planned to detonate his vest within the stadium, triggering the crowd's panicked exit onto the streets where two other bombers were lying in wait.[72] Three minutes after the first bombing, the second bomber blew himself up outside another security gate.[note 1][65] Another 23 minutes after that, the third bomber's vest detonated near the stadium. According to some reports, the location of the third explosion was at a McDonald's restaurant, where over 50 people were injured, seven seriously;[65][70][73] others state the bomb detonated some distance away from any discernible target.[74]
The irony being, nobody has commented on the precedent/parallel because NOBODY REMEMBERED IT. And it's a lot more memorable than last weekend's nonsense
Yes, some of the problems seem to come from the Stade de France changing its crowd management policies, after the terror attacks. Eg there are few if any reports of crowd difficulties before the big attacks of 2015, they all date from after then, when the authorities got paranoid about the wrong people getting in
And of course you’re right that is a bigger story than last weekend, but last weekend is still pretty bloody serious. 1000s of people robbed, attacked and traumatised, and dozens if not hundreds of sexual assaults - with police officers saying they have never witnessed anything on this scale
It looks like the French now have a toxic cocktail of near-impossible crowd management problems in the face of terrorism, and all of this with a stadium surrounded by Islamist migrants, and on top of that they now have the threat of constant Cologne style mass robbery and sexual molestation
This is a French paper speculating that the mess might cost Macron “fifty deputies”
“It will end up costing us 50 deputies like the social VAT of Borloo”, fears a senior officer of the macronie. Darmanin in the middle of the fire lopinion.fr/politique/stad… by @LVigogne@mdeprieck Drawing @MonsieurKak”
Personally, I would not go to the Stade de France to watch anything, not now. And I would have been happy to do so, before, because I was oblivious, like all of us
They really should not have built that stadium in Paris 93
Yet. Has been noted before. Stratford wasn't ritzy when we built ours there. It was a dump in the 90's.
When I was living in London in the period around 2000, 3 bed semis in decent streets in Stratford for £70k or so were one hot tip from the London Property Guide.
I reckon Catford might be the next gentrification target. I went out for a drink and a meal with a mate there last night. It's really quite ropey but has excellent transport links into central London with two train stations side by side. There's a bizarrely good and cheap Italian restaurant there too - two pizzas, two deserts and a nice bottle of Primitivo for a bit over £50. Catford is the new Peckham - you heard it here first.
£50 is cheap for that food and drink?
The pizzas must be the size of a traction engine's rear wheel.
Meanwhile. It is silent out there. Literally no one around. No kids playing. No lawns mowed. No traffic. No pedestrians. Beautiful sunshine. Where's everyone gone?
Watching Trooping the Colour?
Test Match. England bowling. NZ 1-0 AToW.
Yay! 1-1. c Bairstow b Anderson. What idiot left Anderson out of the last tour?
It never made much sense. Of all the issues we had in the Ashes, Anderson's bowling was not one of the, he had not suddenly become crap. Yes, we need a plan for who could take his place eventually, but if he's still the best we've got in that role you don't swap him out prematurely.
Batting was the problem so they dropped the best opening bowling partnership in history. Typical of Roots inept captaincy run
Good morning from Old Tbilisi, and a happy Jubilee to everyone, monarchist, anarchist, Fascist, communist….. even republican
To veer slightly off topic, I recall there were some people on here dismissing the Stade de France story as “a scuffle at a football game, will be forgotten in two days”. i said that was not the case, it is indeed not the case. From the Spectator
“The shambles at the Stade de France on Saturday night took a sinister turn on Wednesday as allegations emerged of incidents of sexual assault committed against supporters by gangs of local youths.
“What unfolded outside France’s national stadium on Saturday evening as Liverpool and Real Madrid met inside in the final of the Champions League has dominated the news in France ever since. Most of the criticism for what is seen as a national humiliation is directed at Gérald Darmanin, the Minister of the Interior, who since Saturday evening has insisted that Liverpool supporters were predominantly to blame for the trouble. On Wednesday he received the indirect support of his boss, Emmanuel Macron, via his official spokeswoman, Olivia Grégoire, who assured reporters the president is ‘totally’ behind his beleaguered minister.”
There's rugby and kickball internationals at the SdF, so a complete coin toss which was going on last Saturday, no?
No.
Hooligans gonna hooligan, Paris police gonna do what they do best, and life being the harsh struggle against unfair odds, rounded off by a cheap funeral, that it is, Liverpool fans no matter how saintly gonna have the sins of their fathers visited upon them.
Your normal lazy, low-watt, misinformed take on what is now a huge story - in France
You’re also wrong about the footie/rugby thing. It turns out there have been similar problems at Stade de France at rugby matches too. They have just never been reported as they have been on a smaller scale, and rugby is less salient than soccer
Huge story in France that the banlieus are bandit country? I should get a job at Le Monde, I could have told them that 25 years ago
It's pretty unfortunate because it brings to the fore issues France/Macron would rather just ignore. Juxtaposed with what should have been a French triumph.
Echoes of the 2011 riots?
Exactly. it’s a big story by itself - thousands of people attacked, dozens of children molested, etc etc - but it throws uncomfortable light on an even bigger story, which Macron is desperate not to talk about
Remember that the Interior Minister’s FIRST version of events was that the problems all came from “thousands of British fans trying to get in without tickets and violating stewards”
A complete load of astonishing bollocks from beginning to end.
He also tried to support this ludicrous version of events by saying “most of the people arrested are English”.
However since then French journalists have dug into the truth and revealed that most people arrested are “Algerian, Moroccan, Tunisian” etc.
His response to this, last night, when it was pointed out at a press conference? “It is nauseous [ie racist] to talk about the nationality of suspects”. Even tho he was quite happy to call them “English” when it suited him. Incroyable
It looks like his career is going to be truncated, he will be the sacrificial lamb to propitiate the angry gods. However Macron won’t sack him immediately because, elections
Yeah it's fucking carnage out there though. Have a guess before looking at the death and injury count over the last 4 years in gilets jaunes carry ons
and hugely ironically, when I was googling for dangers in Paris generally, I find (Nov 2015)
Three explosions occurred near the country's national sports stadium, the Stade de France, in the suburb of Saint-Denis, resulting in four deaths, including the three suicide bombers.[66] The explosions happened at 21:16, 21:19,[note 1] and 21:53.[67] At the time, the stadium was hosting an international friendly football match between France and Germany, which President Hollande was attending.[68][69] The suicide bombers arrived slightly late for the game, and eyewitness reports indicated they did not have tickets, resulting in them being turned away by security guards several times.[65]
The first explosion near the stadium occurred about 20 minutes after the start of the game.[68][69] The first bomber was prevented from entering the stadium again after a security guard patted him down and found the explosive vest.[70] A few seconds after being turned away, he detonated the vest outside the security gate, killing himself and a bystander.[65][71] Investigators later surmised that the first suicide bomber had planned to detonate his vest within the stadium, triggering the crowd's panicked exit onto the streets where two other bombers were lying in wait.[72] Three minutes after the first bombing, the second bomber blew himself up outside another security gate.[note 1][65] Another 23 minutes after that, the third bomber's vest detonated near the stadium. According to some reports, the location of the third explosion was at a McDonald's restaurant, where over 50 people were injured, seven seriously;[65][70][73] others state the bomb detonated some distance away from any discernible target.[74]
The irony being, nobody has commented on the precedent/parallel because NOBODY REMEMBERED IT. And it's a lot more memorable than last weekend's nonsense
Yes, some of the problems seem to come from the Stade de France changing its crowd management policies, after the terror attacks. Eg there are few if any reports of crowd difficulties before the big attacks of 2015, they all date from after then, when the authorities got paranoid about the wrong people getting in
And of course you’re right that is a bigger story than last weekend, but last weekend is still pretty bloody serious. 1000s of people robbed, attacked and traumatised, and dozens if not hundreds of sexual assaults - with police officers saying they have never witnessed anything on this scale
It looks like the French now have a toxic cocktail of near-impossible crowd management problems in the face of terrorism, and all of this with a stadium surrounded by Islamist migrants, and on top of that they now have the threat of constant Cologne style mass robbery and sexual molestation
This is a French paper speculating that the mess might cost Macron “fifty deputies”
“It will end up costing us 50 deputies like the social VAT of Borloo”, fears a senior officer of the macronie. Darmanin in the middle of the fire lopinion.fr/politique/stad… by @LVigogne@mdeprieck Drawing @MonsieurKak”
Personally, I would not go to the Stade de France to watch anything, not now. And I would have been happy to do so, before, because I was oblivious, like all of us
They really should not have built that stadium in Paris 93
Yet. Has been noted before. Stratford wasn't ritzy when we built ours there. It was a dump in the 90's.
When I was living in London in the period around 2000, 3 bed semis in decent streets in Stratford for £70k or so were one hot tip from the London Property Guide.
I reckon Catford might be the next gentrification target. I went out for a drink and a meal with a mate there last night. It's really quite ropey but has excellent transport links into central London with two train stations side by side. There's a bizarrely good and cheap Italian restaurant there too - two pizzas, two deserts and a nice bottle of Primitivo for a bit over £50. Catford is the new Peckham - you heard it here first.
No tube station. Areas that don't have tube or overground struggle to gentrify. It's only when the overground was properly revamped that the eastern bit of London where I grew up really started to gentrify. Before that it was a no go area and my parents couldn't leave fast enough when my dad got his chartership and a good job.
Which is strange. As we are assured the north of England doesn't need better public transport infrastructure to "level up". I wonder why?
It's just a function of pushing up rental and housing prices. What used to cost £600pcm for a 1 bed has become more like £1500pcm so it locks out social tenants entirely and you get under 40s who earn in the higher rate tax bracket who in turn bring with them hipster bars and cafes and other services they like.
So on the one hand, yes it becomes a nicer area but on the other you're pricing out people who have lived there for years and replacing them wholesale with people who can afford the rent.
If I was going to pick areas for gentrification it would be Tottenham. N17 is a shithole but it's got the Victoria line, the new stadium and there's a lot of private money pouring into the area.
Have to say, whatever you think of the monarchy, however cynical you are or down on Britain the Trooping of the Colour is bloody magnificent as a spectacle.
It knocks those big presidential parades such as Red Dquare and the French Bastille parade into a cocked hat - there’s something Victorian about it still so a gentle bit of time travel.
It’s almost, hopefully not being too wanky, a demonstration of an iron fist in a velvet glove by the military rather than the in your face bombast of other parades where they drive the tanks etc etc.
OTOH the horses sort of got outdated in September 1939. And it's not as if the MoD had had the sense to keep some old Churchill tanks for parades. They do those things better in Burma.
A visiting friend, from Iceland, commented that the combination of antique uniforms with modern rifles was an interesting touch.
Most other countries have parade units that carry parade weapons.
I was surprised they didn't keep some SMLEs or No 4s for that, especially as the new SA80 forced some changes to drill. Though apparently even changing to the SLR needed some changes to the drill.
When the SA-8x came in, there was an attempt to keep SLR, IIRC, because a bullpup is rubbish for most drill movements.
The decision to use the standard military rifle for parades was deliberate.
Good morning from Old Tbilisi, and a happy Jubilee to everyone, monarchist, anarchist, Fascist, communist….. even republican
To veer slightly off topic, I recall there were some people on here dismissing the Stade de France story as “a scuffle at a football game, will be forgotten in two days”. i said that was not the case, it is indeed not the case. From the Spectator
“The shambles at the Stade de France on Saturday night took a sinister turn on Wednesday as allegations emerged of incidents of sexual assault committed against supporters by gangs of local youths.
“What unfolded outside France’s national stadium on Saturday evening as Liverpool and Real Madrid met inside in the final of the Champions League has dominated the news in France ever since. Most of the criticism for what is seen as a national humiliation is directed at Gérald Darmanin, the Minister of the Interior, who since Saturday evening has insisted that Liverpool supporters were predominantly to blame for the trouble. On Wednesday he received the indirect support of his boss, Emmanuel Macron, via his official spokeswoman, Olivia Grégoire, who assured reporters the president is ‘totally’ behind his beleaguered minister.”
There's rugby and kickball internationals at the SdF, so a complete coin toss which was going on last Saturday, no?
No.
Hooligans gonna hooligan, Paris police gonna do what they do best, and life being the harsh struggle against unfair odds, rounded off by a cheap funeral, that it is, Liverpool fans no matter how saintly gonna have the sins of their fathers visited upon them.
Your normal lazy, low-watt, misinformed take on what is now a huge story - in France
You’re also wrong about the footie/rugby thing. It turns out there have been similar problems at Stade de France at rugby matches too. They have just never been reported as they have been on a smaller scale, and rugby is less salient than soccer
Huge story in France that the banlieus are bandit country? I should get a job at Le Monde, I could have told them that 25 years ago
It's pretty unfortunate because it brings to the fore issues France/Macron would rather just ignore. Juxtaposed with what should have been a French triumph.
Echoes of the 2011 riots?
Exactly. it’s a big story by itself - thousands of people attacked, dozens of children molested, etc etc - but it throws uncomfortable light on an even bigger story, which Macron is desperate not to talk about
Remember that the Interior Minister’s FIRST version of events was that the problems all came from “thousands of British fans trying to get in without tickets and violating stewards”
A complete load of astonishing bollocks from beginning to end.
He also tried to support this ludicrous version of events by saying “most of the people arrested are English”.
However since then French journalists have dug into the truth and revealed that most people arrested are “Algerian, Moroccan, Tunisian” etc.
His response to this, last night, when it was pointed out at a press conference? “It is nauseous [ie racist] to talk about the nationality of suspects”. Even tho he was quite happy to call them “English” when it suited him. Incroyable
It looks like his career is going to be truncated, he will be the sacrificial lamb to propitiate the angry gods. However Macron won’t sack him immediately because, elections
Yeah it's fucking carnage out there though. Have a guess before looking at the death and injury count over the last 4 years in gilets jaunes carry ons
and hugely ironically, when I was googling for dangers in Paris generally, I find (Nov 2015)
Three explosions occurred near the country's national sports stadium, the Stade de France, in the suburb of Saint-Denis, resulting in four deaths, including the three suicide bombers.[66] The explosions happened at 21:16, 21:19,[note 1] and 21:53.[67] At the time, the stadium was hosting an international friendly football match between France and Germany, which President Hollande was attending.[68][69] The suicide bombers arrived slightly late for the game, and eyewitness reports indicated they did not have tickets, resulting in them being turned away by security guards several times.[65]
The first explosion near the stadium occurred about 20 minutes after the start of the game.[68][69] The first bomber was prevented from entering the stadium again after a security guard patted him down and found the explosive vest.[70] A few seconds after being turned away, he detonated the vest outside the security gate, killing himself and a bystander.[65][71] Investigators later surmised that the first suicide bomber had planned to detonate his vest within the stadium, triggering the crowd's panicked exit onto the streets where two other bombers were lying in wait.[72] Three minutes after the first bombing, the second bomber blew himself up outside another security gate.[note 1][65] Another 23 minutes after that, the third bomber's vest detonated near the stadium. According to some reports, the location of the third explosion was at a McDonald's restaurant, where over 50 people were injured, seven seriously;[65][70][73] others state the bomb detonated some distance away from any discernible target.[74]
The irony being, nobody has commented on the precedent/parallel because NOBODY REMEMBERED IT. And it's a lot more memorable than last weekend's nonsense
Yes, some of the problems seem to come from the Stade de France changing its crowd management policies, after the terror attacks. Eg there are few if any reports of crowd difficulties before the big attacks of 2015, they all date from after then, when the authorities got paranoid about the wrong people getting in
And of course you’re right that is a bigger story than last weekend, but last weekend is still pretty bloody serious. 1000s of people robbed, attacked and traumatised, and dozens if not hundreds of sexual assaults - with police officers saying they have never witnessed anything on this scale
It looks like the French now have a toxic cocktail of near-impossible crowd management problems in the face of terrorism, and all of this with a stadium surrounded by Islamist migrants, and on top of that they now have the threat of constant Cologne style mass robbery and sexual molestation
This is a French paper speculating that the mess might cost Macron “fifty deputies”
“It will end up costing us 50 deputies like the social VAT of Borloo”, fears a senior officer of the macronie. Darmanin in the middle of the fire lopinion.fr/politique/stad… by @LVigogne@mdeprieck Drawing @MonsieurKak”
Personally, I would not go to the Stade de France to watch anything, not now. And I would have been happy to do so, before, because I was oblivious, like all of us
They really should not have built that stadium in Paris 93
Yet. Has been noted before. Stratford wasn't ritzy when we built ours there. It was a dump in the 90's.
When I was living in London in the period around 2000, 3 bed semis in decent streets in Stratford for £70k or so were one hot tip from the London Property Guide.
I reckon Catford might be the next gentrification target. I went out for a drink and a meal with a mate there last night. It's really quite ropey but has excellent transport links into central London with two train stations side by side. There's a bizarrely good and cheap Italian restaurant there too - two pizzas, two deserts and a nice bottle of Primitivo for a bit over £50. Catford is the new Peckham - you heard it here first.
£50 is cheap for that food and drink?
Very, two pizzas, two deserts and a nice bottle of wine would be £60-70 where I live, the wine would come in at £30 alone.
Meanwhile. It is silent out there. Literally no one around. No kids playing. No lawns mowed. No traffic. No pedestrians. Beautiful sunshine. Where's everyone gone?
Watching Trooping the Colour?
Test Match. England bowling. NZ 1-0 AToW.
Yay! 1-1. c Bairstow b Anderson. What idiot left Anderson out of the last tour?
It never made much sense. Of all the issues we had in the Ashes, Anderson's bowling was not one of the, he had not suddenly become crap. Yes, we need a plan for who could take his place eventually, but if he's still the best we've got in that role you don't swap him out prematurely.
Batting was the problem so they dropped the best opening bowling partnership in history. Typical of Roots inept captaincy run
What is the crowd like? The ECB was panicking about unsold tickets a few days ago.
Turkish airlines (is it still “Turkish” - ed.?) has a video after the safety demo and before every film promoting the new name…
So should we start parroting the new pronunciation or bury our head in the sands like an ostrich?
I think people will go for a British fudge - we will probably end up spelling it the way they want (albeit without the umlaut) but still mangling the pronounciation.
And that only because the new spelling is not that different, it's not like we refer to Hungary as (looks up wikipedia) Magyarország.
Have to say, whatever you think of the monarchy, however cynical you are or down on Britain the Trooping of the Colour is bloody magnificent as a spectacle.
It knocks those big presidential parades such as Red Dquare and the French Bastille parade into a cocked hat - there’s something Victorian about it still so a gentle bit of time travel.
It’s almost, hopefully not being too wanky, a demonstration of an iron fist in a velvet glove by the military rather than the in your face bombast of other parades where they drive the tanks etc etc.
Hear hear.
It also shows the absolute professionalism of the British Army and the extremely high-calibre of its people.
It's a hugely impressive organisation.
They should be digging in on the Estonian border, not poncing about in London.
Have to say, whatever you think of the monarchy, however cynical you are or down on Britain the Trooping of the Colour is bloody magnificent as a spectacle.
It knocks those big presidential parades such as Red Dquare and the French Bastille parade into a cocked hat - there’s something Victorian about it still so a gentle bit of time travel.
It’s almost, hopefully not being too wanky, a demonstration of an iron fist in a velvet glove by the military rather than the in your face bombast of other parades where they drive the tanks etc etc.
Hear hear.
It also shows the absolute professionalism of the British Army and the extremely high-calibre of its people.
It's a hugely impressive organisation.
They should be digging in on the Estonian border, not poncing about in London.
Turkish airlines (is it still “Turkish” - ed.?) has a video after the safety demo and before every film promoting the new name…
So should we start parroting the new pronunciation or bury our head in the sands like an ostrich?
I think people will go for a British fudge - we will probably end up spelling it the way they want (albeit without the umlaut) but still mangling the pronounciation.
And that only because the new spelling is not that different, it's not like we refer to Hungary as (looks up wikipedia) Magyarország.
The Prince of Wales, Princess Anne and the Duke of Cambridge arrive on the horseguards parade ground as Trooping the Colour gets under way, the first official event of the Queen's Platinum Jubilee Central Weekend
Have to say, whatever you think of the monarchy, however cynical you are or down on Britain the Trooping of the Colour is bloody magnificent as a spectacle.
It knocks those big presidential parades such as Red Dquare and the French Bastille parade into a cocked hat - there’s something Victorian about it still so a gentle bit of time travel.
It’s almost, hopefully not being too wanky, a demonstration of an iron fist in a velvet glove by the military rather than the in your face bombast of other parades where they drive the tanks etc etc.
OTOH the horses sort of got outdated in September 1939. And it's not as if the MoD had had the sense to keep some old Churchill tanks for parades. They do those things better in Burma.
A visiting friend, from Iceland, commented that the combination of antique uniforms with modern rifles was an interesting touch.
Most other countries have parade units that carry parade weapons.
I was surprised they didn't keep some SMLEs or No 4s for that, especially as the new SA80 forced some changes to drill. Though apparently even changing to the SLR needed some changes to the drill.
When the SA-8x came in, there was an attempt to keep SLR, IIRC, because a bullpup is rubbish for most drill movements.
The decision to use the standard military rifle for parades was deliberate.
It’s not a bad very visible reminder to people that these guys are real fighting soldiers. A lot of people don’t realise that and just think they are display teams! Sort of “Red Arrows” on foot…..
So, the Jube is here and the weather playing ball. Turns out the road next to us is having a 'street party'. Found this out just yesterday. I was pretty mortified at first but I guess no harm. Might show my face briefly.
Why are you mortified?
Should I, as an atheist, be upset that the Seventh Day Adventist church round the corner uses impromptu food bank they run outside their church as a proselytizing operation?
Or should I smile at them?
Fremdscham is a real thing. I feel embarrassed about other people sitting under the bunting eating off QEII china. The likes of Casino_Royale feel embarrassed about people like me expressing republican sympathies on This Of All Days (or ever).
Probably everybody of every political persuasion without exception would cringe at the state of Tim Farron's Twitter today.
There's something about this whole monarchy thing that really sets people up to just find the other side not just wrong but also very, very strange.
Not embarrassed I just found it extremely rude.
Queen Elizabeth has been on the throne for over 70 years and given outstanding service to our nation.
Whatever your views on the monarchy you could at least show her a bit of respect and some grace.
There was nothing wrong with globalisation per se. The problem is with globalisation that relies so heavily on exports from countries in unstable regions like Ukraine.
"No man's land" is surprisingly crowded these days. A good one in six are undecided on keeping the monarchy. On my side of the lines, we've got about a quarter of the population.
Surprised? Me too. Seems like there's a problem with those voices of republicans getting heard despite our numbers growing.
.
Really? That sounds a bit dramatic to me, I've never noticed republicans having difficulty getting heard in any context.
Perhaps it's just a perception bias. I was surprised to find that there's as much support as there is for a republic. I thought, much like Casino_Royale, that numbers were small.
Same here. I'm surprised by how much Republican sentiment there is. And once we get post QE2 I'd think it would only grow.
There are 4 categories of people, I'd say.
1. Monarchists. 2. Not fussed but would vote to keep if asked. 3. Not fussed but would vote to scrap if asked. 4. Republicans.
ATM spread approx 25/35/15/25.
So, as per usual, it's about moving that middle ground. If lots of 2s become 3s the pressure will build for a Referendum.
Because you can't just keep ignoring the people.
Shame the people keep ignoring you.
Republicanism is growing. But that's fine you are still in the majority; you have your laurels and you can probably rest for a while. We'll wake you up if anything happens.
Obviously there's a chance republicanism will continue to grow and, one day, become the majority opinion, but it is a bit odd to crow about it as if it is an inevitability when it is still well below monarchical support. Sure, some monarchy support may be softer than people imagine, but this is a bit like the 'your supporters are old and will die out' as an argument that people always trot out about the Tories.
"No man's land" is surprisingly crowded these days. A good one in six are undecided on keeping the monarchy. On my side of the lines, we've got about a quarter of the population.
Surprised? Me too. Seems like there's a problem with those voices of republicans getting heard despite our numbers growing.
.
Really? That sounds a bit dramatic to me, I've never noticed republicans having difficulty getting heard in any context.
Perhaps it's just a perception bias. I was surprised to find that there's as much support as there is for a republic. I thought, much like Casino_Royale, that numbers were small.
Same here. I'm surprised by how much Republican sentiment there is. And once we get post QE2 I'd think it would only grow.
There are 4 categories of people, I'd say.
1. Monarchists. 2. Not fussed but would vote to keep if asked. 3. Not fussed but would vote to scrap if asked. 4. Republicans.
ATM spread approx 25/35/15/25.
So, as per usual, it's about moving that middle ground. If lots of 2s become 3s the pressure will build for a Referendum.
Because you can't just keep ignoring the people.
Shame the people keep ignoring you.
Republicanism is growing. But that's fine you are still in the majority; you have your laurels and you can probably rest for a while. We'll wake you up if anything happens.
Good morning from Old Tbilisi, and a happy Jubilee to everyone, monarchist, anarchist, Fascist, communist….. even republican
To veer slightly off topic, I recall there were some people on here dismissing the Stade de France story as “a scuffle at a football game, will be forgotten in two days”. i said that was not the case, it is indeed not the case. From the Spectator
“The shambles at the Stade de France on Saturday night took a sinister turn on Wednesday as allegations emerged of incidents of sexual assault committed against supporters by gangs of local youths.
“What unfolded outside France’s national stadium on Saturday evening as Liverpool and Real Madrid met inside in the final of the Champions League has dominated the news in France ever since. Most of the criticism for what is seen as a national humiliation is directed at Gérald Darmanin, the Minister of the Interior, who since Saturday evening has insisted that Liverpool supporters were predominantly to blame for the trouble. On Wednesday he received the indirect support of his boss, Emmanuel Macron, via his official spokeswoman, Olivia Grégoire, who assured reporters the president is ‘totally’ behind his beleaguered minister.”
There's rugby and kickball internationals at the SdF, so a complete coin toss which was going on last Saturday, no?
No.
Hooligans gonna hooligan, Paris police gonna do what they do best, and life being the harsh struggle against unfair odds, rounded off by a cheap funeral, that it is, Liverpool fans no matter how saintly gonna have the sins of their fathers visited upon them.
Your normal lazy, low-watt, misinformed take on what is now a huge story - in France
You’re also wrong about the footie/rugby thing. It turns out there have been similar problems at Stade de France at rugby matches too. They have just never been reported as they have been on a smaller scale, and rugby is less salient than soccer
Huge story in France that the banlieus are bandit country? I should get a job at Le Monde, I could have told them that 25 years ago
It's pretty unfortunate because it brings to the fore issues France/Macron would rather just ignore. Juxtaposed with what should have been a French triumph.
Echoes of the 2011 riots?
Exactly. it’s a big story by itself - thousands of people attacked, dozens of children molested, etc etc - but it throws uncomfortable light on an even bigger story, which Macron is desperate not to talk about
Remember that the Interior Minister’s FIRST version of events was that the problems all came from “thousands of British fans trying to get in without tickets and violating stewards”
A complete load of astonishing bollocks from beginning to end.
He also tried to support this ludicrous version of events by saying “most of the people arrested are English”.
However since then French journalists have dug into the truth and revealed that most people arrested are “Algerian, Moroccan, Tunisian” etc.
His response to this, last night, when it was pointed out at a press conference? “It is nauseous [ie racist] to talk about the nationality of suspects”. Even tho he was quite happy to call them “English” when it suited him. Incroyable
It looks like his career is going to be truncated, he will be the sacrificial lamb to propitiate the angry gods. However Macron won’t sack him immediately because, elections
Yeah it's fucking carnage out there though. Have a guess before looking at the death and injury count over the last 4 years in gilets jaunes carry ons
and hugely ironically, when I was googling for dangers in Paris generally, I find (Nov 2015)
Three explosions occurred near the country's national sports stadium, the Stade de France, in the suburb of Saint-Denis, resulting in four deaths, including the three suicide bombers.[66] The explosions happened at 21:16, 21:19,[note 1] and 21:53.[67] At the time, the stadium was hosting an international friendly football match between France and Germany, which President Hollande was attending.[68][69] The suicide bombers arrived slightly late for the game, and eyewitness reports indicated they did not have tickets, resulting in them being turned away by security guards several times.[65]
The first explosion near the stadium occurred about 20 minutes after the start of the game.[68][69] The first bomber was prevented from entering the stadium again after a security guard patted him down and found the explosive vest.[70] A few seconds after being turned away, he detonated the vest outside the security gate, killing himself and a bystander.[65][71] Investigators later surmised that the first suicide bomber had planned to detonate his vest within the stadium, triggering the crowd's panicked exit onto the streets where two other bombers were lying in wait.[72] Three minutes after the first bombing, the second bomber blew himself up outside another security gate.[note 1][65] Another 23 minutes after that, the third bomber's vest detonated near the stadium. According to some reports, the location of the third explosion was at a McDonald's restaurant, where over 50 people were injured, seven seriously;[65][70][73] others state the bomb detonated some distance away from any discernible target.[74]
The irony being, nobody has commented on the precedent/parallel because NOBODY REMEMBERED IT. And it's a lot more memorable than last weekend's nonsense
Yes, some of the problems seem to come from the Stade de France changing its crowd management policies, after the terror attacks. Eg there are few if any reports of crowd difficulties before the big attacks of 2015, they all date from after then, when the authorities got paranoid about the wrong people getting in
And of course you’re right that is a bigger story than last weekend, but last weekend is still pretty bloody serious. 1000s of people robbed, attacked and traumatised, and dozens if not hundreds of sexual assaults - with police officers saying they have never witnessed anything on this scale
It looks like the French now have a toxic cocktail of near-impossible crowd management problems in the face of terrorism, and all of this with a stadium surrounded by Islamist migrants, and on top of that they now have the threat of constant Cologne style mass robbery and sexual molestation
This is a French paper speculating that the mess might cost Macron “fifty deputies”
“It will end up costing us 50 deputies like the social VAT of Borloo”, fears a senior officer of the macronie. Darmanin in the middle of the fire lopinion.fr/politique/stad… by @LVigogne@mdeprieck Drawing @MonsieurKak”
Personally, I would not go to the Stade de France to watch anything, not now. And I would have been happy to do so, before, because I was oblivious, like all of us
They really should not have built that stadium in Paris 93
Yet. Has been noted before. Stratford wasn't ritzy when we built ours there. It was a dump in the 90's.
When I was living in London in the period around 2000, 3 bed semis in decent streets in Stratford for £70k or so were one hot tip from the London Property Guide.
I reckon Catford might be the next gentrification target. I went out for a drink and a meal with a mate there last night. It's really quite ropey but has excellent transport links into central London with two train stations side by side. There's a bizarrely good and cheap Italian restaurant there too - two pizzas, two deserts and a nice bottle of Primitivo for a bit over £50. Catford is the new Peckham - you heard it here first.
£50 is cheap for that food and drink?
Very, two pizzas, two deserts and a nice bottle of wine would be £60-70 where I live, the wine would come in at £30 alone.
Last night in Leeds main, pud and two pints set me back £30 including tip. In a pub.
Good morning from Old Tbilisi, and a happy Jubilee to everyone, monarchist, anarchist, Fascist, communist….. even republican
To veer slightly off topic, I recall there were some people on here dismissing the Stade de France story as “a scuffle at a football game, will be forgotten in two days”. i said that was not the case, it is indeed not the case. From the Spectator
“The shambles at the Stade de France on Saturday night took a sinister turn on Wednesday as allegations emerged of incidents of sexual assault committed against supporters by gangs of local youths.
“What unfolded outside France’s national stadium on Saturday evening as Liverpool and Real Madrid met inside in the final of the Champions League has dominated the news in France ever since. Most of the criticism for what is seen as a national humiliation is directed at Gérald Darmanin, the Minister of the Interior, who since Saturday evening has insisted that Liverpool supporters were predominantly to blame for the trouble. On Wednesday he received the indirect support of his boss, Emmanuel Macron, via his official spokeswoman, Olivia Grégoire, who assured reporters the president is ‘totally’ behind his beleaguered minister.”
There's rugby and kickball internationals at the SdF, so a complete coin toss which was going on last Saturday, no?
No.
Hooligans gonna hooligan, Paris police gonna do what they do best, and life being the harsh struggle against unfair odds, rounded off by a cheap funeral, that it is, Liverpool fans no matter how saintly gonna have the sins of their fathers visited upon them.
Your normal lazy, low-watt, misinformed take on what is now a huge story - in France
You’re also wrong about the footie/rugby thing. It turns out there have been similar problems at Stade de France at rugby matches too. They have just never been reported as they have been on a smaller scale, and rugby is less salient than soccer
Huge story in France that the banlieus are bandit country? I should get a job at Le Monde, I could have told them that 25 years ago
It's pretty unfortunate because it brings to the fore issues France/Macron would rather just ignore. Juxtaposed with what should have been a French triumph.
Echoes of the 2011 riots?
Exactly. it’s a big story by itself - thousands of people attacked, dozens of children molested, etc etc - but it throws uncomfortable light on an even bigger story, which Macron is desperate not to talk about
Remember that the Interior Minister’s FIRST version of events was that the problems all came from “thousands of British fans trying to get in without tickets and violating stewards”
A complete load of astonishing bollocks from beginning to end.
He also tried to support this ludicrous version of events by saying “most of the people arrested are English”.
However since then French journalists have dug into the truth and revealed that most people arrested are “Algerian, Moroccan, Tunisian” etc.
His response to this, last night, when it was pointed out at a press conference? “It is nauseous [ie racist] to talk about the nationality of suspects”. Even tho he was quite happy to call them “English” when it suited him. Incroyable
It looks like his career is going to be truncated, he will be the sacrificial lamb to propitiate the angry gods. However Macron won’t sack him immediately because, elections
Yeah it's fucking carnage out there though. Have a guess before looking at the death and injury count over the last 4 years in gilets jaunes carry ons
and hugely ironically, when I was googling for dangers in Paris generally, I find (Nov 2015)
Three explosions occurred near the country's national sports stadium, the Stade de France, in the suburb of Saint-Denis, resulting in four deaths, including the three suicide bombers.[66] The explosions happened at 21:16, 21:19,[note 1] and 21:53.[67] At the time, the stadium was hosting an international friendly football match between France and Germany, which President Hollande was attending.[68][69] The suicide bombers arrived slightly late for the game, and eyewitness reports indicated they did not have tickets, resulting in them being turned away by security guards several times.[65]
The first explosion near the stadium occurred about 20 minutes after the start of the game.[68][69] The first bomber was prevented from entering the stadium again after a security guard patted him down and found the explosive vest.[70] A few seconds after being turned away, he detonated the vest outside the security gate, killing himself and a bystander.[65][71] Investigators later surmised that the first suicide bomber had planned to detonate his vest within the stadium, triggering the crowd's panicked exit onto the streets where two other bombers were lying in wait.[72] Three minutes after the first bombing, the second bomber blew himself up outside another security gate.[note 1][65] Another 23 minutes after that, the third bomber's vest detonated near the stadium. According to some reports, the location of the third explosion was at a McDonald's restaurant, where over 50 people were injured, seven seriously;[65][70][73] others state the bomb detonated some distance away from any discernible target.[74]
The irony being, nobody has commented on the precedent/parallel because NOBODY REMEMBERED IT. And it's a lot more memorable than last weekend's nonsense
Yes, some of the problems seem to come from the Stade de France changing its crowd management policies, after the terror attacks. Eg there are few if any reports of crowd difficulties before the big attacks of 2015, they all date from after then, when the authorities got paranoid about the wrong people getting in
And of course you’re right that is a bigger story than last weekend, but last weekend is still pretty bloody serious. 1000s of people robbed, attacked and traumatised, and dozens if not hundreds of sexual assaults - with police officers saying they have never witnessed anything on this scale
It looks like the French now have a toxic cocktail of near-impossible crowd management problems in the face of terrorism, and all of this with a stadium surrounded by Islamist migrants, and on top of that they now have the threat of constant Cologne style mass robbery and sexual molestation
This is a French paper speculating that the mess might cost Macron “fifty deputies”
“It will end up costing us 50 deputies like the social VAT of Borloo”, fears a senior officer of the macronie. Darmanin in the middle of the fire lopinion.fr/politique/stad… by @LVigogne@mdeprieck Drawing @MonsieurKak”
Personally, I would not go to the Stade de France to watch anything, not now. And I would have been happy to do so, before, because I was oblivious, like all of us
They really should not have built that stadium in Paris 93
Yet. Has been noted before. Stratford wasn't ritzy when we built ours there. It was a dump in the 90's.
When I was living in London in the period around 2000, 3 bed semis in decent streets in Stratford for £70k or so were one hot tip from the London Property Guide.
I reckon Catford might be the next gentrification target. I went out for a drink and a meal with a mate there last night. It's really quite ropey but has excellent transport links into central London with two train stations side by side. There's a bizarrely good and cheap Italian restaurant there too - two pizzas, two deserts and a nice bottle of Primitivo for a bit over £50. Catford is the new Peckham - you heard it here first.
No tube station. Areas that don't have tube or overground struggle to gentrify. It's only when the overground was properly revamped that the eastern bit of London where I grew up really started to gentrify. Before that it was a no go area and my parents couldn't leave fast enough when my dad got his chartership and a good job.
Which is strange. As we are assured the north of England doesn't need better public transport infrastructure to "level up". I wonder why?
It's just a function of pushing up rental and housing prices. What used to cost £600pcm for a 1 bed has become more like £1500pcm so it locks out social tenants entirely and you get under 40s who earn in the higher rate tax bracket who in turn bring with them hipster bars and cafes and other services they like.
So on the one hand, yes it becomes a nicer area but on the other you're pricing out people who have lived there for years and replacing them wholesale with people who can afford the rent.
If I was going to pick areas for gentrification it would be Tottenham. N17 is a shithole but it's got the Victoria line, the new stadium and there's a lot of private money pouring into the area.
I used to live in Tottenham. 2 mins walk from Bruce Grove overground. It was hugely convenient. Had stuff going on, and was massively cheap. I also never saw any bother. It's got a really poor reputation. But I liked it.
Meanwhile. It is silent out there. Literally no one around. No kids playing. No lawns mowed. No traffic. No pedestrians. Beautiful sunshine. Where's everyone gone?
Watching Trooping the Colour?
Test Match. England bowling. NZ 1-0 AToW.
Yay! 1-1. c Bairstow b Anderson. What idiot left Anderson out of the last tour?
Trooping of the colour at Buckingham Palace and Anderson and Broad in tandem at Lords. There is not much wrong with the world today.
There was nothing wrong with globalisation per se. The problem is with globalisation that relies so heavily on exports from countries in unstable regions like Ukraine.
Good morning from Old Tbilisi, and a happy Jubilee to everyone, monarchist, anarchist, Fascist, communist….. even republican
To veer slightly off topic, I recall there were some people on here dismissing the Stade de France story as “a scuffle at a football game, will be forgotten in two days”. i said that was not the case, it is indeed not the case. From the Spectator
“The shambles at the Stade de France on Saturday night took a sinister turn on Wednesday as allegations emerged of incidents of sexual assault committed against supporters by gangs of local youths.
“What unfolded outside France’s national stadium on Saturday evening as Liverpool and Real Madrid met inside in the final of the Champions League has dominated the news in France ever since. Most of the criticism for what is seen as a national humiliation is directed at Gérald Darmanin, the Minister of the Interior, who since Saturday evening has insisted that Liverpool supporters were predominantly to blame for the trouble. On Wednesday he received the indirect support of his boss, Emmanuel Macron, via his official spokeswoman, Olivia Grégoire, who assured reporters the president is ‘totally’ behind his beleaguered minister.”
There's rugby and kickball internationals at the SdF, so a complete coin toss which was going on last Saturday, no?
No.
Hooligans gonna hooligan, Paris police gonna do what they do best, and life being the harsh struggle against unfair odds, rounded off by a cheap funeral, that it is, Liverpool fans no matter how saintly gonna have the sins of their fathers visited upon them.
Your normal lazy, low-watt, misinformed take on what is now a huge story - in France
You’re also wrong about the footie/rugby thing. It turns out there have been similar problems at Stade de France at rugby matches too. They have just never been reported as they have been on a smaller scale, and rugby is less salient than soccer
Huge story in France that the banlieus are bandit country? I should get a job at Le Monde, I could have told them that 25 years ago
It's pretty unfortunate because it brings to the fore issues France/Macron would rather just ignore. Juxtaposed with what should have been a French triumph.
Echoes of the 2011 riots?
Exactly. it’s a big story by itself - thousands of people attacked, dozens of children molested, etc etc - but it throws uncomfortable light on an even bigger story, which Macron is desperate not to talk about
Remember that the Interior Minister’s FIRST version of events was that the problems all came from “thousands of British fans trying to get in without tickets and violating stewards”
A complete load of astonishing bollocks from beginning to end.
He also tried to support this ludicrous version of events by saying “most of the people arrested are English”.
However since then French journalists have dug into the truth and revealed that most people arrested are “Algerian, Moroccan, Tunisian” etc.
His response to this, last night, when it was pointed out at a press conference? “It is nauseous [ie racist] to talk about the nationality of suspects”. Even tho he was quite happy to call them “English” when it suited him. Incroyable
It looks like his career is going to be truncated, he will be the sacrificial lamb to propitiate the angry gods. However Macron won’t sack him immediately because, elections
Yeah it's fucking carnage out there though. Have a guess before looking at the death and injury count over the last 4 years in gilets jaunes carry ons
and hugely ironically, when I was googling for dangers in Paris generally, I find (Nov 2015)
Three explosions occurred near the country's national sports stadium, the Stade de France, in the suburb of Saint-Denis, resulting in four deaths, including the three suicide bombers.[66] The explosions happened at 21:16, 21:19,[note 1] and 21:53.[67] At the time, the stadium was hosting an international friendly football match between France and Germany, which President Hollande was attending.[68][69] The suicide bombers arrived slightly late for the game, and eyewitness reports indicated they did not have tickets, resulting in them being turned away by security guards several times.[65]
The first explosion near the stadium occurred about 20 minutes after the start of the game.[68][69] The first bomber was prevented from entering the stadium again after a security guard patted him down and found the explosive vest.[70] A few seconds after being turned away, he detonated the vest outside the security gate, killing himself and a bystander.[65][71] Investigators later surmised that the first suicide bomber had planned to detonate his vest within the stadium, triggering the crowd's panicked exit onto the streets where two other bombers were lying in wait.[72] Three minutes after the first bombing, the second bomber blew himself up outside another security gate.[note 1][65] Another 23 minutes after that, the third bomber's vest detonated near the stadium. According to some reports, the location of the third explosion was at a McDonald's restaurant, where over 50 people were injured, seven seriously;[65][70][73] others state the bomb detonated some distance away from any discernible target.[74]
The irony being, nobody has commented on the precedent/parallel because NOBODY REMEMBERED IT. And it's a lot more memorable than last weekend's nonsense
Yes, some of the problems seem to come from the Stade de France changing its crowd management policies, after the terror attacks. Eg there are few if any reports of crowd difficulties before the big attacks of 2015, they all date from after then, when the authorities got paranoid about the wrong people getting in
And of course you’re right that is a bigger story than last weekend, but last weekend is still pretty bloody serious. 1000s of people robbed, attacked and traumatised, and dozens if not hundreds of sexual assaults - with police officers saying they have never witnessed anything on this scale
It looks like the French now have a toxic cocktail of near-impossible crowd management problems in the face of terrorism, and all of this with a stadium surrounded by Islamist migrants, and on top of that they now have the threat of constant Cologne style mass robbery and sexual molestation
This is a French paper speculating that the mess might cost Macron “fifty deputies”
“It will end up costing us 50 deputies like the social VAT of Borloo”, fears a senior officer of the macronie. Darmanin in the middle of the fire lopinion.fr/politique/stad… by @LVigogne@mdeprieck Drawing @MonsieurKak”
Personally, I would not go to the Stade de France to watch anything, not now. And I would have been happy to do so, before, because I was oblivious, like all of us
They really should not have built that stadium in Paris 93
Yet. Has been noted before. Stratford wasn't ritzy when we built ours there. It was a dump in the 90's.
When I was living in London in the period around 2000, 3 bed semis in decent streets in Stratford for £70k or so were one hot tip from the London Property Guide.
I reckon Catford might be the next gentrification target. I went out for a drink and a meal with a mate there last night. It's really quite ropey but has excellent transport links into central London with two train stations side by side. There's a bizarrely good and cheap Italian restaurant there too - two pizzas, two deserts and a nice bottle of Primitivo for a bit over £50. Catford is the new Peckham - you heard it here first.
No tube station. Areas that don't have tube or overground struggle to gentrify. It's only when the overground was properly revamped that the eastern bit of London where I grew up really started to gentrify. Before that it was a no go area and my parents couldn't leave fast enough when my dad got his chartership and a good job.
Catford is 30 mins to London Bridge by overground, and has more parkland over the last 10-15 years. Also decent for cycling afaics.
It's on a potential Bakerloo Line Extension. Currently on hold whilst TFL finances climb out of the black hole.
30 mins to London Bridge isn't very good though, there's loads of areas with Thameslink stations which would be preferable if that's the bar. The other downside is that it's right next to the south circular so that's just a whole load of traffic and busy roads.
"No man's land" is surprisingly crowded these days. A good one in six are undecided on keeping the monarchy. On my side of the lines, we've got about a quarter of the population.
Surprised? Me too. Seems like there's a problem with those voices of republicans getting heard despite our numbers growing.
.
Really? That sounds a bit dramatic to me, I've never noticed republicans having difficulty getting heard in any context.
Perhaps it's just a perception bias. I was surprised to find that there's as much support as there is for a republic. I thought, much like Casino_Royale, that numbers were small.
Same here. I'm surprised by how much Republican sentiment there is. And once we get post QE2 I'd think it would only grow.
There are 4 categories of people, I'd say.
1. Monarchists. 2. Not fussed but would vote to keep if asked. 3. Not fussed but would vote to scrap if asked. 4. Republicans.
ATM spread approx 25/35/15/25.
So, as per usual, it's about moving that middle ground. If lots of 2s become 3s the pressure will build for a Referendum.
Because you can't just keep ignoring the people.
Shame the people keep ignoring you.
Republicanism is growing. But that's fine you are still in the majority; you have your laurels and you can probably rest for a while. We'll wake you up if anything happens.
It's been growing for the last ten years, for sure. But then, it has flourished before - eg when we actually chopped off the king's head, and had a republic. But then we went back to Royalty
The madness of King George was a good time for republicanism, also the invisible period of ageing Victoria, likewise the Abdication, but we've never got as close as Cromwellian times ever since
To put it differently, support for a Republic peaked at 20% in 1993 (then fell back). Must have been Diana times? Right now it is about 25%. So you've gained 5 points in 30 years. At this rate you can expect to get your republic in 150 years time?
Unless, of course, support for a republic falls back again. As it has done for the last four centuries
Turkish airlines (is it still “Turkish” - ed.?) has a video after the safety demo and before every film promoting the new name…
So should we start parroting the new pronunciation or bury our head in the sands like an ostrich?
I think people will go for a British fudge - we will probably end up spelling it the way they want (albeit without the umlaut) but still mangling the pronounciation.
And that only because the new spelling is not that different, it's not like we refer to Hungary as (looks up wikipedia) Magyarország.
Did you have to copy and paste that?
I would not sully my keyboard with a diacritical mark otherwise.
Have to say, whatever you think of the monarchy, however cynical you are or down on Britain the Trooping of the Colour is bloody magnificent as a spectacle.
It knocks those big presidential parades such as Red Dquare and the French Bastille parade into a cocked hat - there’s something Victorian about it still so a gentle bit of time travel.
It’s almost, hopefully not being too wanky, a demonstration of an iron fist in a velvet glove by the military rather than the in your face bombast of other parades where they drive the tanks etc etc.
Hear hear.
It also shows the absolute professionalism of the British Army and the extremely high-calibre of its people.
It's a hugely impressive organisation.
They should be digging in on the Estonian border, not poncing about in London.
I was wondering if this would be shown on Ukrainian TV.
Then again, they might think blokes on horses with swords may not be what they need.
For those of us on Netflix, I see Borgen is back! A glimpse of a healthier political world.
Stranger Things is back too, which is more my cup of tea. Great 80s soundtrack. Interesting that in the 80s the Russians were the bad guys, and they are again now in 2022.
Only on the first episode of S4 so haven’t discerned the Russian element yet, but one sour tweeter was bemoaning ST’s conflation of the term Soviet Union with Russia, and the ahistorical ignorance this implies. Wouldn’t surprise me if similar confusion happened then; how Red Dawn approached it might settle the issue but not a film I’ve seen as it happens.
I’m afraid the endearing ineptitude of that makes me more of a monarchist
Republicans always get their timing, tone and arguments wrong. Always wrong.
They will try again at the next coronation, and lose then too.
They will always lose.
I believe in taking my thoughts straight to the enemy's stronghold, not just sniping opportunistically when the bootlickers are lost in the forest of trying explain away Andrew's sweaty, wandering hands.
This republican stands by his principles in any weather.
Yes.
You're the guy who charges straight at the machine gun nest across 400 yards of no man's land in full view, in the middle of the day, dressed in bright orange whilst carrying a pompous placard and an unloaded antique pistol.
We feel so sorry for you we don't even shoot you.
We just laugh at you as you flounder in the mud half-day across and wait for you to go home again.
"No man's land" is surprisingly crowded these days. A good one in six are undecided on keeping the monarchy. On my side of the lines, we've got about a quarter of the population.
Surprised? Me too. Seems like there's a problem with those voices of republicans getting heard despite our numbers growing.
So here I am. Yes, on This Of All Days. Just to remind the quiet 25% that they aren't alone. Have a lovely day.
Republicanism has been at 20% for at least 25 years.
Good morning from Old Tbilisi, and a happy Jubilee to everyone, monarchist, anarchist, Fascist, communist….. even republican
To veer slightly off topic, I recall there were some people on here dismissing the Stade de France story as “a scuffle at a football game, will be forgotten in two days”. i said that was not the case, it is indeed not the case. From the Spectator
“The shambles at the Stade de France on Saturday night took a sinister turn on Wednesday as allegations emerged of incidents of sexual assault committed against supporters by gangs of local youths.
“What unfolded outside France’s national stadium on Saturday evening as Liverpool and Real Madrid met inside in the final of the Champions League has dominated the news in France ever since. Most of the criticism for what is seen as a national humiliation is directed at Gérald Darmanin, the Minister of the Interior, who since Saturday evening has insisted that Liverpool supporters were predominantly to blame for the trouble. On Wednesday he received the indirect support of his boss, Emmanuel Macron, via his official spokeswoman, Olivia Grégoire, who assured reporters the president is ‘totally’ behind his beleaguered minister.”
There's rugby and kickball internationals at the SdF, so a complete coin toss which was going on last Saturday, no?
No.
Hooligans gonna hooligan, Paris police gonna do what they do best, and life being the harsh struggle against unfair odds, rounded off by a cheap funeral, that it is, Liverpool fans no matter how saintly gonna have the sins of their fathers visited upon them.
Your normal lazy, low-watt, misinformed take on what is now a huge story - in France
You’re also wrong about the footie/rugby thing. It turns out there have been similar problems at Stade de France at rugby matches too. They have just never been reported as they have been on a smaller scale, and rugby is less salient than soccer
Huge story in France that the banlieus are bandit country? I should get a job at Le Monde, I could have told them that 25 years ago
It's pretty unfortunate because it brings to the fore issues France/Macron would rather just ignore. Juxtaposed with what should have been a French triumph.
Echoes of the 2011 riots?
Exactly. it’s a big story by itself - thousands of people attacked, dozens of children molested, etc etc - but it throws uncomfortable light on an even bigger story, which Macron is desperate not to talk about
Remember that the Interior Minister’s FIRST version of events was that the problems all came from “thousands of British fans trying to get in without tickets and violating stewards”
A complete load of astonishing bollocks from beginning to end.
He also tried to support this ludicrous version of events by saying “most of the people arrested are English”.
However since then French journalists have dug into the truth and revealed that most people arrested are “Algerian, Moroccan, Tunisian” etc.
His response to this, last night, when it was pointed out at a press conference? “It is nauseous [ie racist] to talk about the nationality of suspects”. Even tho he was quite happy to call them “English” when it suited him. Incroyable
It looks like his career is going to be truncated, he will be the sacrificial lamb to propitiate the angry gods. However Macron won’t sack him immediately because, elections
Yeah it's fucking carnage out there though. Have a guess before looking at the death and injury count over the last 4 years in gilets jaunes carry ons
and hugely ironically, when I was googling for dangers in Paris generally, I find (Nov 2015)
Three explosions occurred near the country's national sports stadium, the Stade de France, in the suburb of Saint-Denis, resulting in four deaths, including the three suicide bombers.[66] The explosions happened at 21:16, 21:19,[note 1] and 21:53.[67] At the time, the stadium was hosting an international friendly football match between France and Germany, which President Hollande was attending.[68][69] The suicide bombers arrived slightly late for the game, and eyewitness reports indicated they did not have tickets, resulting in them being turned away by security guards several times.[65]
The first explosion near the stadium occurred about 20 minutes after the start of the game.[68][69] The first bomber was prevented from entering the stadium again after a security guard patted him down and found the explosive vest.[70] A few seconds after being turned away, he detonated the vest outside the security gate, killing himself and a bystander.[65][71] Investigators later surmised that the first suicide bomber had planned to detonate his vest within the stadium, triggering the crowd's panicked exit onto the streets where two other bombers were lying in wait.[72] Three minutes after the first bombing, the second bomber blew himself up outside another security gate.[note 1][65] Another 23 minutes after that, the third bomber's vest detonated near the stadium. According to some reports, the location of the third explosion was at a McDonald's restaurant, where over 50 people were injured, seven seriously;[65][70][73] others state the bomb detonated some distance away from any discernible target.[74]
The irony being, nobody has commented on the precedent/parallel because NOBODY REMEMBERED IT. And it's a lot more memorable than last weekend's nonsense
Yes, some of the problems seem to come from the Stade de France changing its crowd management policies, after the terror attacks. Eg there are few if any reports of crowd difficulties before the big attacks of 2015, they all date from after then, when the authorities got paranoid about the wrong people getting in
And of course you’re right that is a bigger story than last weekend, but last weekend is still pretty bloody serious. 1000s of people robbed, attacked and traumatised, and dozens if not hundreds of sexual assaults - with police officers saying they have never witnessed anything on this scale
It looks like the French now have a toxic cocktail of near-impossible crowd management problems in the face of terrorism, and all of this with a stadium surrounded by Islamist migrants, and on top of that they now have the threat of constant Cologne style mass robbery and sexual molestation
This is a French paper speculating that the mess might cost Macron “fifty deputies”
“It will end up costing us 50 deputies like the social VAT of Borloo”, fears a senior officer of the macronie. Darmanin in the middle of the fire lopinion.fr/politique/stad… by @LVigogne@mdeprieck Drawing @MonsieurKak”
Personally, I would not go to the Stade de France to watch anything, not now. And I would have been happy to do so, before, because I was oblivious, like all of us
They really should not have built that stadium in Paris 93
Yet. Has been noted before. Stratford wasn't ritzy when we built ours there. It was a dump in the 90's.
When I was living in London in the period around 2000, 3 bed semis in decent streets in Stratford for £70k or so were one hot tip from the London Property Guide.
I reckon Catford might be the next gentrification target. I went out for a drink and a meal with a mate there last night. It's really quite ropey but has excellent transport links into central London with two train stations side by side. There's a bizarrely good and cheap Italian restaurant there too - two pizzas, two deserts and a nice bottle of Primitivo for a bit over £50. Catford is the new Peckham - you heard it here first.
No tube station. Areas that don't have tube or overground struggle to gentrify. It's only when the overground was properly revamped that the eastern bit of London where I grew up really started to gentrify. Before that it was a no go area and my parents couldn't leave fast enough when my dad got his chartership and a good job.
Catford is 30 mins to London Bridge by overground, and has more parkland over the last 10-15 years. Also decent for cycling afaics.
It's on a potential Bakerloo Line Extension. Currently on hold whilst TFL finances climb out of the black hole.
30 mins to London Bridge isn't very good though, there's loads of areas with Thameslink stations which would be preferable if that's the bar. The other downside is that it's right next to the south circular so that's just a whole load of traffic and busy roads.
Catford gentrifies from spillover from both Dulwich and Greenwich rather than its transport links.
Meanwhile. It is silent out there. Literally no one around. No kids playing. No lawns mowed. No traffic. No pedestrians. Beautiful sunshine. Where's everyone gone?
Watching Trooping the Colour?
Test Match. England bowling. NZ 1-0 AToW.
Yay! 1-1. c Bairstow b Anderson. What idiot left Anderson out of the last tour?
It never made much sense. Of all the issues we had in the Ashes, Anderson's bowling was not one of the, he had not suddenly become crap. Yes, we need a plan for who could take his place eventually, but if he's still the best we've got in that role you don't swap him out prematurely.
Batting was the problem so they dropped the best opening bowling partnership in history. Typical of Roots inept captaincy run
What is the crowd like? The ECB was panicking about unsold tickets a few days ago.
Most of the unsold tickets were for Day 4, because of the lack of expectation that England would last that long.
They were only a couple of thousand short of sold out, for each of the first three days.
"No man's land" is surprisingly crowded these days. A good one in six are undecided on keeping the monarchy. On my side of the lines, we've got about a quarter of the population.
Surprised? Me too. Seems like there's a problem with those voices of republicans getting heard despite our numbers growing.
.
Really? That sounds a bit dramatic to me, I've never noticed republicans having difficulty getting heard in any context.
Perhaps it's just a perception bias. I was surprised to find that there's as much support as there is for a republic. I thought, much like Casino_Royale, that numbers were small.
Same here. I'm surprised by how much Republican sentiment there is. And once we get post QE2 I'd think it would only grow.
There are 4 categories of people, I'd say.
1. Monarchists. 2. Not fussed but would vote to keep if asked. 3. Not fussed but would vote to scrap if asked. 4. Republicans.
ATM spread approx 25/35/15/25.
So, as per usual, it's about moving that middle ground. If lots of 2s become 3s the pressure will build for a Referendum.
Because you can't just keep ignoring the people.
Shame the people keep ignoring you.
Republicanism is growing. But that's fine you are still in the majority; you have your laurels and you can probably rest for a while. We'll wake you up if anything happens.
It's been growing for the last ten years, for sure. But then, it has flourished before - eg when we actually chopped off the king's head, and had a republic. But then we went back to Royalty
The madness of King George was a good time for republicanism, also the invisible period of ageing Victoria, likewise the Abdication, but we've never got as close as Cromwellian times ever since
To put it differently, support for a Republic peaked at 20% in 1993 (then fell back). Must have been Diana times? Right now it is about 25%. So you've gained 5 points in 30 years. At this rate you can expect to get your republic in 150 years time?
Unless, of course, support for a republic falls back again. As it has done for the last four centuries
Harry & Meghan, Andrew, people not sure about Charles, Brexit probably pollutes it a little bit, Corbyn didn't help etc.
But, we know William is very popular and he'll effectively be a deputy King as soon as Charles takes the throne.
So, i think it will all settle down and it will be fine.
"No man's land" is surprisingly crowded these days. A good one in six are undecided on keeping the monarchy. On my side of the lines, we've got about a quarter of the population.
Surprised? Me too. Seems like there's a problem with those voices of republicans getting heard despite our numbers growing.
.
Really? That sounds a bit dramatic to me, I've never noticed republicans having difficulty getting heard in any context.
Perhaps it's just a perception bias. I was surprised to find that there's as much support as there is for a republic. I thought, much like Casino_Royale, that numbers were small.
Same here. I'm surprised by how much Republican sentiment there is. And once we get post QE2 I'd think it would only grow.
There are 4 categories of people, I'd say.
1. Monarchists. 2. Not fussed but would vote to keep if asked. 3. Not fussed but would vote to scrap if asked. 4. Republicans.
ATM spread approx 25/35/15/25.
So, as per usual, it's about moving that middle ground. If lots of 2s become 3s the pressure will build for a Referendum.
For those of us on Netflix, I see Borgen is back! A glimpse of a healthier political world.
Stranger Things is back too, which is more my cup of tea. Great 80s soundtrack. Interesting that in the 80s the Russians were the bad guys, and they are again now in 2022.
Only on the first episode of S4 so haven’t discerned the Russian element yet, but one sour tweeter was bemoaning ST’s conflation of the term Soviet Union with Russia, and the ahistorical ignorance this implies. Wouldn’t surprise me if similar confusion happened then; how Red Dawn approached it might settle the issue but not a film I’ve seen as it happens.
It was a very common conflation in our youth. Like Netherlands/Holland, and so on.
Have to say, whatever you think of the monarchy, however cynical you are or down on Britain the Trooping of the Colour is bloody magnificent as a spectacle.
It knocks those big presidential parades such as Red Dquare and the French Bastille parade into a cocked hat - there’s something Victorian about it still so a gentle bit of time travel.
It’s almost, hopefully not being too wanky, a demonstration of an iron fist in a velvet glove by the military rather than the in your face bombast of other parades where they drive the tanks etc etc.
OTOH the horses sort of got outdated in September 1939. And it's not as if the MoD had had the sense to keep some old Churchill tanks for parades. They do those things better in Burma.
A visiting friend, from Iceland, commented that the combination of antique uniforms with modern rifles was an interesting touch.
Most other countries have parade units that carry parade weapons.
I was surprised they didn't keep some SMLEs or No 4s for that, especially as the new SA80 forced some changes to drill. Though apparently even changing to the SLR needed some changes to the drill.
When the SA-8x came in, there was an attempt to keep SLR, IIRC, because a bullpup is rubbish for most drill movements.
The decision to use the standard military rifle for parades was deliberate.
It’s not a bad very visible reminder to people that these guys are real fighting soldiers. A lot of people don’t realise that and just think they are display teams! Sort of “Red Arrows” on foot…..
Just as the Red Arrows are actual military pilots, not just hired to be in the display.
"No man's land" is surprisingly crowded these days. A good one in six are undecided on keeping the monarchy. On my side of the lines, we've got about a quarter of the population.
Surprised? Me too. Seems like there's a problem with those voices of republicans getting heard despite our numbers growing.
.
Really? That sounds a bit dramatic to me, I've never noticed republicans having difficulty getting heard in any context.
Perhaps it's just a perception bias. I was surprised to find that there's as much support as there is for a republic. I thought, much like Casino_Royale, that numbers were small.
Same here. I'm surprised by how much Republican sentiment there is. And once we get post QE2 I'd think it would only grow.
There are 4 categories of people, I'd say.
1. Monarchists. 2. Not fussed but would vote to keep if asked. 3. Not fussed but would vote to scrap if asked. 4. Republicans.
ATM spread approx 25/35/15/25.
So, as per usual, it's about moving that middle ground. If lots of 2s become 3s the pressure will build for a Referendum.
Because you can't just keep ignoring the people.
I'd go 40/30/5/25
I'm 2 or 3. Haven't thought about which one. Cos, of course, nobody ever dreamt of asking little old me
Good morning from Old Tbilisi, and a happy Jubilee to everyone, monarchist, anarchist, Fascist, communist….. even republican
To veer slightly off topic, I recall there were some people on here dismissing the Stade de France story as “a scuffle at a football game, will be forgotten in two days”. i said that was not the case, it is indeed not the case. From the Spectator
“The shambles at the Stade de France on Saturday night took a sinister turn on Wednesday as allegations emerged of incidents of sexual assault committed against supporters by gangs of local youths.
“What unfolded outside France’s national stadium on Saturday evening as Liverpool and Real Madrid met inside in the final of the Champions League has dominated the news in France ever since. Most of the criticism for what is seen as a national humiliation is directed at Gérald Darmanin, the Minister of the Interior, who since Saturday evening has insisted that Liverpool supporters were predominantly to blame for the trouble. On Wednesday he received the indirect support of his boss, Emmanuel Macron, via his official spokeswoman, Olivia Grégoire, who assured reporters the president is ‘totally’ behind his beleaguered minister.”
There's rugby and kickball internationals at the SdF, so a complete coin toss which was going on last Saturday, no?
No.
Hooligans gonna hooligan, Paris police gonna do what they do best, and life being the harsh struggle against unfair odds, rounded off by a cheap funeral, that it is, Liverpool fans no matter how saintly gonna have the sins of their fathers visited upon them.
Your normal lazy, low-watt, misinformed take on what is now a huge story - in France
You’re also wrong about the footie/rugby thing. It turns out there have been similar problems at Stade de France at rugby matches too. They have just never been reported as they have been on a smaller scale, and rugby is less salient than soccer
Huge story in France that the banlieus are bandit country? I should get a job at Le Monde, I could have told them that 25 years ago
It's pretty unfortunate because it brings to the fore issues France/Macron would rather just ignore. Juxtaposed with what should have been a French triumph.
Echoes of the 2011 riots?
Exactly. it’s a big story by itself - thousands of people attacked, dozens of children molested, etc etc - but it throws uncomfortable light on an even bigger story, which Macron is desperate not to talk about
Remember that the Interior Minister’s FIRST version of events was that the problems all came from “thousands of British fans trying to get in without tickets and violating stewards”
A complete load of astonishing bollocks from beginning to end.
He also tried to support this ludicrous version of events by saying “most of the people arrested are English”.
However since then French journalists have dug into the truth and revealed that most people arrested are “Algerian, Moroccan, Tunisian” etc.
His response to this, last night, when it was pointed out at a press conference? “It is nauseous [ie racist] to talk about the nationality of suspects”. Even tho he was quite happy to call them “English” when it suited him. Incroyable
It looks like his career is going to be truncated, he will be the sacrificial lamb to propitiate the angry gods. However Macron won’t sack him immediately because, elections
Yeah it's fucking carnage out there though. Have a guess before looking at the death and injury count over the last 4 years in gilets jaunes carry ons
and hugely ironically, when I was googling for dangers in Paris generally, I find (Nov 2015)
Three explosions occurred near the country's national sports stadium, the Stade de France, in the suburb of Saint-Denis, resulting in four deaths, including the three suicide bombers.[66] The explosions happened at 21:16, 21:19,[note 1] and 21:53.[67] At the time, the stadium was hosting an international friendly football match between France and Germany, which President Hollande was attending.[68][69] The suicide bombers arrived slightly late for the game, and eyewitness reports indicated they did not have tickets, resulting in them being turned away by security guards several times.[65]
The first explosion near the stadium occurred about 20 minutes after the start of the game.[68][69] The first bomber was prevented from entering the stadium again after a security guard patted him down and found the explosive vest.[70] A few seconds after being turned away, he detonated the vest outside the security gate, killing himself and a bystander.[65][71] Investigators later surmised that the first suicide bomber had planned to detonate his vest within the stadium, triggering the crowd's panicked exit onto the streets where two other bombers were lying in wait.[72] Three minutes after the first bombing, the second bomber blew himself up outside another security gate.[note 1][65] Another 23 minutes after that, the third bomber's vest detonated near the stadium. According to some reports, the location of the third explosion was at a McDonald's restaurant, where over 50 people were injured, seven seriously;[65][70][73] others state the bomb detonated some distance away from any discernible target.[74]
The irony being, nobody has commented on the precedent/parallel because NOBODY REMEMBERED IT. And it's a lot more memorable than last weekend's nonsense
Yes, some of the problems seem to come from the Stade de France changing its crowd management policies, after the terror attacks. Eg there are few if any reports of crowd difficulties before the big attacks of 2015, they all date from after then, when the authorities got paranoid about the wrong people getting in
And of course you’re right that is a bigger story than last weekend, but last weekend is still pretty bloody serious. 1000s of people robbed, attacked and traumatised, and dozens if not hundreds of sexual assaults - with police officers saying they have never witnessed anything on this scale
It looks like the French now have a toxic cocktail of near-impossible crowd management problems in the face of terrorism, and all of this with a stadium surrounded by Islamist migrants, and on top of that they now have the threat of constant Cologne style mass robbery and sexual molestation
This is a French paper speculating that the mess might cost Macron “fifty deputies”
“It will end up costing us 50 deputies like the social VAT of Borloo”, fears a senior officer of the macronie. Darmanin in the middle of the fire lopinion.fr/politique/stad… by @LVigogne@mdeprieck Drawing @MonsieurKak”
Personally, I would not go to the Stade de France to watch anything, not now. And I would have been happy to do so, before, because I was oblivious, like all of us
They really should not have built that stadium in Paris 93
Yet. Has been noted before. Stratford wasn't ritzy when we built ours there. It was a dump in the 90's.
When I was living in London in the period around 2000, 3 bed semis in decent streets in Stratford for £70k or so were one hot tip from the London Property Guide.
I reckon Catford might be the next gentrification target. I went out for a drink and a meal with a mate there last night. It's really quite ropey but has excellent transport links into central London with two train stations side by side. There's a bizarrely good and cheap Italian restaurant there too - two pizzas, two deserts and a nice bottle of Primitivo for a bit over £50. Catford is the new Peckham - you heard it here first.
No tube station. Areas that don't have tube or overground struggle to gentrify. It's only when the overground was properly revamped that the eastern bit of London where I grew up really started to gentrify. Before that it was a no go area and my parents couldn't leave fast enough when my dad got his chartership and a good job.
Which is strange. As we are assured the north of England doesn't need better public transport infrastructure to "level up". I wonder why?
It's just a function of pushing up rental and housing prices. What used to cost £600pcm for a 1 bed has become more like £1500pcm so it locks out social tenants entirely and you get under 40s who earn in the higher rate tax bracket who in turn bring with them hipster bars and cafes and other services they like.
So on the one hand, yes it becomes a nicer area but on the other you're pricing out people who have lived there for years and replacing them wholesale with people who can afford the rent.
If I was going to pick areas for gentrification it would be Tottenham. N17 is a shithole but it's got the Victoria line, the new stadium and there's a lot of private money pouring into the area.
I used to live in Tottenham. 2 mins walk from Bruce Grove overground. It was hugely convenient. Had stuff going on, and was massively cheap. I also never saw any bother. It's got a really poor reputation. But I liked it.
Yeah I know a few friends who are looking to upsize from flats to houses are now looking at Tottenham. The value is great and it's not a long walk to Tottenham Hale. It's absolutely going to be gentrified in the next 3-4 years so I'd suggest to any Londoners looking for a zone 3 house to look at Tottenham.
So, the Jube is here and the weather playing ball. Turns out the road next to us is having a 'street party'. Found this out just yesterday. I was pretty mortified at first but I guess no harm. Might show my face briefly.
Why are you mortified?
Should I, as an atheist, be upset that the Seventh Day Adventist church round the corner uses impromptu food bank they run outside their church as a proselytizing operation?
Or should I smile at them?
But this is meant to be the very heart of North London metro left elitism - as reflected in house prices - so it's disappointing.
But as I say, I'll pop over for an hour or so. You have to do things you'd rather not sometimes. It's part of life.
The Royal Standard is a really beautiful flag. It should be compulsory to fly it outside every British home, and in the homes in our sundry possessions, protectorates and The White Dominions, at 4.20pm
Have to say, whatever you think of the monarchy, however cynical you are or down on Britain the Trooping of the Colour is bloody magnificent as a spectacle.
It knocks those big presidential parades such as Red Dquare and the French Bastille parade into a cocked hat - there’s something Victorian about it still so a gentle bit of time travel.
It’s almost, hopefully not being too wanky, a demonstration of an iron fist in a velvet glove by the military rather than the in your face bombast of other parades where they drive the tanks etc etc.
OTOH the horses sort of got outdated in September 1939. And it's not as if the MoD had had the sense to keep some old Churchill tanks for parades. They do those things better in Burma.
A visiting friend, from Iceland, commented that the combination of antique uniforms with modern rifles was an interesting touch.
Most other countries have parade units that carry parade weapons.
I was surprised they didn't keep some SMLEs or No 4s for that, especially as the new SA80 forced some changes to drill. Though apparently even changing to the SLR needed some changes to the drill.
When the SA-8x came in, there was an attempt to keep SLR, IIRC, because a bullpup is rubbish for most drill movements.
The decision to use the standard military rifle for parades was deliberate.
It’s not a bad very visible reminder to people that these guys are real fighting soldiers. A lot of people don’t realise that and just think they are display teams! Sort of “Red Arrows” on foot…..
Just as the Red Arrows are actual military pilots, not just hired to be in the display.
OTOH they are forming an increasing percentage of the shrinking pool of fast jet pilots, and doing it pretty full-time. That is not sustainable, especially as the Hawk is not a front line plane (though that saves on fuel). It's also pretty long in the tooth, a T.1 mark IIRC, so must be needing replacement in a few years?
The Royal Standard is a really beautiful flag. It should be compulsory to fly it outside every British home, and in the homes in our sundry possessions, protectorates and The White Dominions, at 4.20pm
The Royal Standard is a really beautiful flag. It should be compulsory to fly it outside every British home, and in the homes in our sundry possessions, protectorates and The White Dominions, at 4.20pm
'In' the homes, not strong enough - you need it outside to spot the deviants who have not displayed theirs as they should.
Actually that reminds me, I'd best stick my own out the window quick.
I’m afraid the endearing ineptitude of that makes me more of a monarchist
Republicans always get their timing, tone and arguments wrong. Always wrong.
They will try again at the next coronation, and lose then too.
They will always lose.
Yep
The genius of a monarchy is its predictably human unpredictability. So it has inherent drama, like a soap opera, and we are all addicted, even when it takes a dark turn
So you get periods when it’s awful, ugh, Prince Andrew is a fiddler, yuk, and the Queen is nearly dead, oh no, and then suddenly you get a birth or a birthday or a wedding and then Yay, look, the Mall is lovely in the sun! - it reminds me of having a baby which is exactly like Brexit, no, it’s like bringing up a baby - you have periods when it is all nappies and what the F and then you get the first smile or the first word and happiness is unconfined
Except for the churlish, joyless republicans, but then I suspect they get a secret surly joy out of being churlish and joyless, so it’s all good
Joyless my arse , you slaver over a bunch of grifters, crooked, sexual deviants , ne'er do wells etc. A pox on your Royals.
I knew they missed a trick in not naming one of Will's children a good Scottish monarch name like Alexander, David, or Malcolm, then you'd have been on side
Archie is pretty Scoddish. Machiavellian Meghan sees the big schism picture and is on it..
So, the Jube is here and the weather playing ball. Turns out the road next to us is having a 'street party'. Found this out just yesterday. I was pretty mortified at first but I guess no harm. Might show my face briefly.
Why are you mortified?
Should I, as an atheist, be upset that the Seventh Day Adventist church round the corner uses impromptu food bank they run outside their church as a proselytizing operation?
Or should I smile at them?
But this is meant to be the very heart of North London metro left elitism - as reflected in house prices - so it's disappointing.
But as I say, I'll pop over for an hour or so. You have to do things you'd rather not sometimes. It's part of life.
What's so funny about your posts is that they're not ironic.
The Royal Standard is a really beautiful flag. It should be compulsory to fly it outside every British home, and in the homes in our sundry possessions, protectorates and The White Dominions, at 4.20pm
It's personal to Queenie. You only get to fly iy when she comes to stay.
So, the Jube is here and the weather playing ball. Turns out the road next to us is having a 'street party'. Found this out just yesterday. I was pretty mortified at first but I guess no harm. Might show my face briefly.
Why are you mortified?
Should I, as an atheist, be upset that the Seventh Day Adventist church round the corner uses impromptu food bank they run outside their church as a proselytizing operation?
Or should I smile at them?
But this is meant to be the very heart of North London metro left elitism - as reflected in house prices - so it's disappointing.
But as I say, I'll pop over for an hour or so. You have to do things you'd rather not sometimes. It's part of life.
What's so funny about your posts is that they're not ironic.
TBF I think he is trolling us here. At least I hope he is
"No man's land" is surprisingly crowded these days. A good one in six are undecided on keeping the monarchy. On my side of the lines, we've got about a quarter of the population.
Surprised? Me too. Seems like there's a problem with those voices of republicans getting heard despite our numbers growing.
.
Really? That sounds a bit dramatic to me, I've never noticed republicans having difficulty getting heard in any context.
Perhaps it's just a perception bias. I was surprised to find that there's as much support as there is for a republic. I thought, much like Casino_Royale, that numbers were small.
Same here. I'm surprised by how much Republican sentiment there is. And once we get post QE2 I'd think it would only grow.
There are 4 categories of people, I'd say.
1. Monarchists. 2. Not fussed but would vote to keep if asked. 3. Not fussed but would vote to scrap if asked. 4. Republicans.
ATM spread approx 25/35/15/25.
So, as per usual, it's about moving that middle ground. If lots of 2s become 3s the pressure will build for a Referendum.
Because you can't just keep ignoring the people.
5. Republicans, who wouldn't want to change it whilst Liz is around.
Yes, I'd see people moving from a 3 to a 4 - or even straight from a 2 to a 4 - once this long reigning and much respected individual has departed.
"No man's land" is surprisingly crowded these days. A good one in six are undecided on keeping the monarchy. On my side of the lines, we've got about a quarter of the population.
Surprised? Me too. Seems like there's a problem with those voices of republicans getting heard despite our numbers growing.
.
Really? That sounds a bit dramatic to me, I've never noticed republicans having difficulty getting heard in any context.
Perhaps it's just a perception bias. I was surprised to find that there's as much support as there is for a republic. I thought, much like Casino_Royale, that numbers were small.
Same here. I'm surprised by how much Republican sentiment there is. And once we get post QE2 I'd think it would only grow.
There are 4 categories of people, I'd say.
1. Monarchists. 2. Not fussed but would vote to keep if asked. 3. Not fussed but would vote to scrap if asked. 4. Republicans.
ATM spread approx 25/35/15/25.
So, as per usual, it's about moving that middle ground. If lots of 2s become 3s the pressure will build for a Referendum.
Because you can't just keep ignoring the people.
I'm not a monarchist, but we are where we are and I see some benefits. Cruel to the family in many ways but if they want to stick with it hey ho.
Out of interest, assuming that you (like me) were opposed to the Brexit Referendum why would you be in favour of a referendum on this?
"No man's land" is surprisingly crowded these days. A good one in six are undecided on keeping the monarchy. On my side of the lines, we've got about a quarter of the population.
Surprised? Me too. Seems like there's a problem with those voices of republicans getting heard despite our numbers growing.
.
Really? That sounds a bit dramatic to me, I've never noticed republicans having difficulty getting heard in any context.
Perhaps it's just a perception bias. I was surprised to find that there's as much support as there is for a republic. I thought, much like Casino_Royale, that numbers were small.
Same here. I'm surprised by how much Republican sentiment there is. And once we get post QE2 I'd think it would only grow.
There are 4 categories of people, I'd say.
1. Monarchists. 2. Not fussed but would vote to keep if asked. 3. Not fussed but would vote to scrap if asked. 4. Republicans.
ATM spread approx 25/35/15/25.
So, as per usual, it's about moving that middle ground. If lots of 2s become 3s the pressure will build for a Referendum.
Because you can't just keep ignoring the people.
It's doubtful that 40% would vote for a Republic atm.
So, the Jube is here and the weather playing ball. Turns out the road next to us is having a 'street party'. Found this out just yesterday. I was pretty mortified at first but I guess no harm. Might show my face briefly.
Why are you mortified?
Should I, as an atheist, be upset that the Seventh Day Adventist church round the corner uses impromptu food bank they run outside their church as a proselytizing operation?
Or should I smile at them?
But this is meant to be the very heart of North London metro left elitism - as reflected in house prices - so it's disappointing.
But as I say, I'll pop over for an hour or so. You have to do things you'd rather not sometimes. It's part of life.
What's so funny about your posts is that they're not ironic.
TBF I think he is trolling us here. At least I hope he is
"No man's land" is surprisingly crowded these days. A good one in six are undecided on keeping the monarchy. On my side of the lines, we've got about a quarter of the population.
Surprised? Me too. Seems like there's a problem with those voices of republicans getting heard despite our numbers growing.
.
Really? That sounds a bit dramatic to me, I've never noticed republicans having difficulty getting heard in any context.
Perhaps it's just a perception bias. I was surprised to find that there's as much support as there is for a republic. I thought, much like Casino_Royale, that numbers were small.
Same here. I'm surprised by how much Republican sentiment there is. And once we get post QE2 I'd think it would only grow.
There are 4 categories of people, I'd say.
1. Monarchists. 2. Not fussed but would vote to keep if asked. 3. Not fussed but would vote to scrap if asked. 4. Republicans.
ATM spread approx 25/35/15/25.
So, as per usual, it's about moving that middle ground. If lots of 2s become 3s the pressure will build for a Referendum.
Because you can't just keep ignoring the people.
Shame the people keep ignoring you.
Republicanism is growing. But that's fine you are still in the majority; you have your laurels and you can probably rest for a while. We'll wake you up if anything happens.
It's been growing for the last ten years, for sure. But then, it has flourished before - eg when we actually chopped off the king's head, and had a republic. But then we went back to Royalty
The madness of King George was a good time for republicanism, also the invisible period of ageing Victoria, likewise the Abdication, but we've never got as close as Cromwellian times ever since
To put it differently, support for a Republic peaked at 20% in 1993 (then fell back). Must have been Diana times? Right now it is about 25%. So you've gained 5 points in 30 years. At this rate you can expect to get your republic in 150 years time?
Unless, of course, support for a republic falls back again. As it has done for the last four centuries
Harry & Meghan, Andrew, people not sure about Charles, Brexit probably pollutes it a little bit, Corbyn didn't help etc.
But, we know William is very popular and he'll effectively be a deputy King as soon as Charles takes the throne.
So, i think it will all settle down and it will be fine.
Have to say, whatever you think of the monarchy, however cynical you are or down on Britain the Trooping of the Colour is bloody magnificent as a spectacle.
It knocks those big presidential parades such as Red Dquare and the French Bastille parade into a cocked hat - there’s something Victorian about it still so a gentle bit of time travel.
It’s almost, hopefully not being too wanky, a demonstration of an iron fist in a velvet glove by the military rather than the in your face bombast of other parades where they drive the tanks etc etc.
OTOH the horses sort of got outdated in September 1939. And it's not as if the MoD had had the sense to keep some old Churchill tanks for parades. They do those things better in Burma.
A visiting friend, from Iceland, commented that the combination of antique uniforms with modern rifles was an interesting touch.
Most other countries have parade units that carry parade weapons.
I was surprised they didn't keep some SMLEs or No 4s for that, especially as the new SA80 forced some changes to drill. Though apparently even changing to the SLR needed some changes to the drill.
When the SA-8x came in, there was an attempt to keep SLR, IIRC, because a bullpup is rubbish for most drill movements.
The decision to use the standard military rifle for parades was deliberate.
It’s not a bad very visible reminder to people that these guys are real fighting soldiers. A lot of people don’t realise that and just think they are display teams! Sort of “Red Arrows” on foot…..
Just as the Red Arrows are actual military pilots, not just hired to be in the display.
That's literally all they ever do. RAFAT has zero combat capability and isn't declared to NATO.
Have to say, whatever you think of the monarchy, however cynical you are or down on Britain the Trooping of the Colour is bloody magnificent as a spectacle.
It knocks those big presidential parades such as Red Dquare and the French Bastille parade into a cocked hat - there’s something Victorian about it still so a gentle bit of time travel.
It’s almost, hopefully not being too wanky, a demonstration of an iron fist in a velvet glove by the military rather than the in your face bombast of other parades where they drive the tanks etc etc.
OTOH the horses sort of got outdated in September 1939. And it's not as if the MoD had had the sense to keep some old Churchill tanks for parades. They do those things better in Burma.
A visiting friend, from Iceland, commented that the combination of antique uniforms with modern rifles was an interesting touch.
Most other countries have parade units that carry parade weapons.
I was surprised they didn't keep some SMLEs or No 4s for that, especially as the new SA80 forced some changes to drill. Though apparently even changing to the SLR needed some changes to the drill.
When the SA-8x came in, there was an attempt to keep SLR, IIRC, because a bullpup is rubbish for most drill movements.
The decision to use the standard military rifle for parades was deliberate.
It’s not a bad very visible reminder to people that these guys are real fighting soldiers. A lot of people don’t realise that and just think they are display teams! Sort of “Red Arrows” on foot…..
Just as the Red Arrows are actual military pilots, not just hired to be in the display.
OTOH they are forming an increasing percentage of the shrinking pool of fast jet pilots, and doing it pretty full-time. That is not sustainable, especially as the Hawk is not a front line plane (though that saves on fuel). It's also pretty long in the tooth, a T.1 mark IIRC, so must be needing replacement in a few years?
Yes, they get seconded to the display team from their regular squadron, usually for three years. They’ll go back if we get into a big war and need every trained pilot.
The Red Hawks are now very old as you say, the obsolete T1 model. BAe are supposedly delivering a new model soon to the training squadrons, so maybe they’ll upgrade RAFAT to the T2s currently in that role.
Have to say, whatever you think of the monarchy, however cynical you are or down on Britain the Trooping of the Colour is bloody magnificent as a spectacle.
It knocks those big presidential parades such as Red Dquare and the French Bastille parade into a cocked hat - there’s something Victorian about it still so a gentle bit of time travel.
It’s almost, hopefully not being too wanky, a demonstration of an iron fist in a velvet glove by the military rather than the in your face bombast of other parades where they drive the tanks etc etc.
OTOH the horses sort of got outdated in September 1939. And it's not as if the MoD had had the sense to keep some old Churchill tanks for parades. They do those things better in Burma.
A visiting friend, from Iceland, commented that the combination of antique uniforms with modern rifles was an interesting touch.
Most other countries have parade units that carry parade weapons.
I was surprised they didn't keep some SMLEs or No 4s for that, especially as the new SA80 forced some changes to drill. Though apparently even changing to the SLR needed some changes to the drill.
When the SA-8x came in, there was an attempt to keep SLR, IIRC, because a bullpup is rubbish for most drill movements.
The decision to use the standard military rifle for parades was deliberate.
It’s not a bad very visible reminder to people that these guys are real fighting soldiers. A lot of people don’t realise that and just think they are display teams! Sort of “Red Arrows” on foot…..
Just as the Red Arrows are actual military pilots, not just hired to be in the display.
OTOH they are forming an increasing percentage of the shrinking pool of fast jet pilots, and doing it pretty full-time. That is not sustainable, especially as the Hawk is not a front line plane (though that saves on fuel). It's also pretty long in the tooth, a T.1 mark IIRC, so must be needing replacement in a few years?
The Royal Standard is a really beautiful flag. It should be compulsory to fly it outside every British home, and in the homes in our sundry possessions, protectorates and The White Dominions, at 4.20pm
It's personal to Queenie. You only get to fly iy when she comes to stay.
Or on a RN ship. You can tell which one has HMtQ amongst the doezens at a Review of the Fleet as it is the only vessel with the RS.
Reminded of my dad's account of the Coronation Review of the Fleet at Spithead 1952. Hundreds of RN ships from aircraft carriers down ti the littlest. On his destroyer they were at attention for many hours, after spending days/weeks repainting, and then ordered to weigh anchor and proceed with all despatch to whatever political hot zone was most looming at the time, on the other side of the world. Didn't even get a run ashore at Pompey to wet the crown.
Have to say, whatever you think of the monarchy, however cynical you are or down on Britain the Trooping of the Colour is bloody magnificent as a spectacle.
It knocks those big presidential parades such as Red Dquare and the French Bastille parade into a cocked hat - there’s something Victorian about it still so a gentle bit of time travel.
It’s almost, hopefully not being too wanky, a demonstration of an iron fist in a velvet glove by the military rather than the in your face bombast of other parades where they drive the tanks etc etc.
OTOH the horses sort of got outdated in September 1939. And it's not as if the MoD had had the sense to keep some old Churchill tanks for parades. They do those things better in Burma.
A visiting friend, from Iceland, commented that the combination of antique uniforms with modern rifles was an interesting touch.
Most other countries have parade units that carry parade weapons.
I was surprised they didn't keep some SMLEs or No 4s for that, especially as the new SA80 forced some changes to drill. Though apparently even changing to the SLR needed some changes to the drill.
When the SA-8x came in, there was an attempt to keep SLR, IIRC, because a bullpup is rubbish for most drill movements.
The decision to use the standard military rifle for parades was deliberate.
It’s not a bad very visible reminder to people that these guys are real fighting soldiers. A lot of people don’t realise that and just think they are display teams! Sort of “Red Arrows” on foot…..
Just as the Red Arrows are actual military pilots, not just hired to be in the display.
OTOH they are forming an increasing percentage of the shrinking pool of fast jet pilots, and doing it pretty full-time. That is not sustainable, especially as the Hawk is not a front line plane (though that saves on fuel). It's also pretty long in the tooth, a T.1 mark IIRC, so must be needing replacement in a few years?
Do they not do hours in Typhoons just in case?
Perhaps more likely in the simulator, but yes, that woudl be wise - though not equivalent to being on a Typhoon squadron, admittedly.
Comments
I've got less strongly opinionated on it over the years, though -- if I was offered a vote (unlikely!) I'd vote for a republic, but in practice the system as it stands does, as you say, more or less work, and there are bigger and more important fish to fry. (Not that I'm actually out there working on any political causes to really make peoples' lives better, but I'm pretty sure there are dozens of them that would come before 'reform the monarchy' on my hypothetical todo list.)
Put him behind the stumps.
It's on a potential Bakerloo Line Extension. Currently on hold whilst TFL finances climb out of the black hole.
Though obviously there would never be a referendum on the monarchy under a Tory government, if it happened it would be under a Labour government, though even Starmer has said he now backs a reformed monarchy having replaced the republican Corbyn.
Note in Australia it is only the arrival of a Labor government that has put a republic on the agenda again but even there opinion is divided and any referendum will probably have to wait for a second term, if Labor is re elected. In 1999 of course Australians voted 55% to keep the monarchy
https://www.smh.com.au/national/no-sense-of-momentum-poll-finds-drop-in-support-for-australia-becoming-a-republic-20210125-p56wpe.html
Old Tbilisi is a fantastic ensemble of brilliantly preserved-yet-falling-down early 19th century quasi-Persian houses, which closely resemble Tudor London before the fire, complete with intricate balconies, men singing in string vests, and trees growing through roofs. Think downtown Palermo without the Mafia, or Naples without the Camorra
However it won't be like this for long. At its core it has now been gentrified, there are blocks of beautifully restored houses now turned into pricey boutique hotels, wine bars, etc. Georgia has experienced an amazing tourist boom these last ten years (and it is right now full of Russian emigres fleeing Putin)
I give it ten years before the entire city turns into Prague or Barcelona of the Caucasus, all chic Airbnbs and 5 star hotels, and the locals are priced out completely
Come now, if you wanna see it in its glory
It made no sense if you looked at performances on the field, which demonstrated the reason his captaincy was under threat was his batsmen weren't scoring runs.
So on the one hand, yes it becomes a nicer area but on the other you're pricing out people who have lived there for years and replacing them wholesale with people who can afford the rent.
If I was going to pick areas for gentrification it would be Tottenham. N17 is a shithole but it's got the Victoria line, the new stadium and there's a lot of private money pouring into the area.
https://edition.cnn.com/2022/06/02/asia/singapore-chicken-shortage-malaysia-export-ban-intl-hnk/index.html
The decision to use the standard military rifle for parades was deliberate.
And that only because the new spelling is not that different, it's not like we refer to Hungary as (looks up wikipedia) Magyarország.
Queen Elizabeth has been on the throne for over 70 years and given outstanding service to our nation.
Whatever your views on the monarchy you could at least show her a bit of respect and some grace.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republicanism_in_the_United_Kingdom#Opinion_polling
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/lifestyle/articles-reports/2022/06/01/platinum-jubilee-where-does-public-opinion-stand-m
It's got a really poor reputation. But I liked it.
The madness of King George was a good time for republicanism, also the invisible period of ageing Victoria, likewise the Abdication, but we've never got as close as Cromwellian times ever since
To put it differently, support for a Republic peaked at 20% in 1993 (then fell back). Must have been Diana times? Right now it is about 25%. So you've gained 5 points in 30 years. At this rate you can expect to get your republic in 150 years time?
Unless, of course, support for a republic falls back again. As it has done for the last four centuries
Then again, they might think blokes on horses with swords may not be what they need.
7/3.
They were only a couple of thousand short of sold out, for each of the first three days.
But, we know William is very popular and he'll effectively be a deputy King as soon as Charles takes the throne.
So, i think it will all settle down and it will be fine.
Very cute.
Cos, of course, nobody ever dreamt of asking little old me
But as I say, I'll pop over for an hour or so. You have to do things you'd rather not sometimes. It's part of life.
That’s a good start to the summer!
Anyway, I'm off now. Granddaughter One's birthday lunch . She and her Beloved have driven down from Yorkshire for the occasion.
https://twitter.com/RupertMyers/status/1532312031503831041
Actually that reminds me, I'd best stick my own out the window quick.
Machiavellian Meghan sees the big schism picture and is on it..
Out of interest, assuming that you (like me) were opposed to the Brexit Referendum why would you be in favour of a referendum on this?
That's not a bad first wicket in Tests...
The Red Hawks are now very old as you say, the obsolete T1 model. BAe are supposedly delivering a new model soon to the training squadrons, so maybe they’ll upgrade RAFAT to the T2s currently in that role.
Reminded of my dad's account of the Coronation Review of the Fleet at Spithead 1952. Hundreds of RN ships from aircraft carriers down ti the littlest. On his destroyer they were at attention for many hours, after spending days/weeks repainting, and then ordered to weigh anchor and proceed with all despatch to whatever political hot zone was most looming at the time, on the other side of the world. Didn't even get a run ashore at Pompey to wet the crown.