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Normal politics will resume after the funeral – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 8,489
edited September 15 in General
imageNormal politics will resume after the funeral – politicalbetting.com

The death of the Queen yesterday is a massive moment in just about all of our lives and it is going to dominate everything until after the funeral.

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 104,912
    King Charles to address the nation at 6pm
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-62847191
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 104,912
    Truss I thought handled the events of yesterday well. They obviously will dominate buy she combined paying tribute to our lost Queen with welcoming our new King.

    Luckily for her she also got her plans for an energy bill cap in before the news broke
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 36,642
    Before that for other things.

    fpt

    Although the deed is done (ie everything's cancelled) CIII should include in his speech this evening an entreaty that everyone should go out and get on with their normal lives and enjoy their friends, family, etc as it would be far better for everyone and a more fitting tribute to his mother than to be deprived of their chosen activities for a reason no one can yet put their finger on.

  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 31,973
    As I said earlier, HMQ's passing seemed to effect me far less than the passing of Phillip did.

    But I was listening to the radio on the way back from an appointment, and had to pull over as I started uncontrollably blubbing. Odd.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    I don't think it overshadows Truss because as PM she is so front and centre.

    This really shines a spotlight on how the constitution works. Harman's speech was very enlightening.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 1,819
    TOPPING said:

    Before that for other things.

    fpt

    Although the deed is done (ie everything's cancelled) CIII should include in his speech this evening an entreaty that everyone should go out and get on with their normal lives and enjoy their friends, family, etc as it would be far better for everyone and a more fitting tribute to his mother than to be deprived of their chosen activities for a reason no one can yet put their finger on.

    Will CIII PO become the new republican motto and if so will the Empire strike back?
  • MISTYMISTY Posts: 1,594
    HYUFD said:

    Truss I thought handled the events of yesterday well. They obviously will dominate buy she combined paying tribute to our lost Queen with welcoming our new King.

    Luckily for her she also got her plans for an energy bill cap in before the news broke

    Plus the restart of fracking.

    I think the tories are going to need to be very careful about how they sell that one though.

    British voters these days want cheap gas without fracking near them, just as they want great public services with low taxes, lots of new property but no development where they live, low government debt but lots of spending, and free speech but censorship of opinions they disagree with.

  • londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 2,002
    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Truss I thought handled the events of yesterday well. They obviously will dominate buy she combined paying tribute to our lost Queen with welcoming our new King.

    Luckily for her she also got her plans for an energy bill cap in before the news broke

    Plus the restart of fracking.

    I think the tories are going to need to be very careful about how they sell that one though.

    British voters these days want cheap gas without fracking near them, just as they want great public services with low taxes, lots of new property but no development where they live, low government debt but lots of spending, and free speech but censorship of opinions they disagree with.

    I suspect the fracking will quietly disappear...
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 24,282
    I take it Charles III is now nailed on? Has it been made official?
    To change to George or Arthur or Louise at this juncture would be ludicrous. Everyone's calling him it now.
    PS. The weather was better under the Queen.
  • MISTYMISTY Posts: 1,594

    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Truss I thought handled the events of yesterday well. They obviously will dominate buy she combined paying tribute to our lost Queen with welcoming our new King.

    Luckily for her she also got her plans for an energy bill cap in before the news broke

    Plus the restart of fracking.

    I think the tories are going to need to be very careful about how they sell that one though.

    British voters these days want cheap gas without fracking near them, just as they want great public services with low taxes, lots of new property but no development where they live, low government debt but lots of spending, and free speech but censorship of opinions they disagree with.

    I suspect the fracking will quietly disappear...
    Protecting everybody from the vagaries of the gas market seems odd for a government that wants fracking, to be sure.

  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 42,739
    dixiedean said:

    I take it Charles III is now nailed on? Has it been made official?
    To change to George or Arthur or Louise at this juncture would be ludicrous. Everyone's calling him it now.
    PS. The weather was better under the Queen.

    Yes
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 36,642

    As I said earlier, HMQ's passing seemed to effect me far less than the passing of Phillip did.

    But I was listening to the radio on the way back from an appointment, and had to pull over as I started uncontrollably blubbing. Odd.

    Yes - for me Philip was more "end of an era"-ish. The Queen, sadly, was only an inevitability after their collective invincibility had been punctured.

    Haven't blubbed yet for either but I did shed a tear for that German tourist who will be much missed.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 1,819
    dixiedean said:

    I take it Charles III is now nailed on? Has it been made official?
    To change to George or Arthur or Louise at this juncture would be ludicrous. Everyone's calling him it now.
    PS. The weather was better under the Queen.

    Read a brief news story yesterday re people taking their Canadian nationality oaths yesterday morning (Canadian time) and there was a bit of confusion and delay as they had to check if they pledged their allegiance to Charles III or something else.

    I guess the Palace needed to know and be prepared in advance what he was going to call himself for such circumstances.
  • Brazilian-built Embraer jet, G-LEGC.

    https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/g-legc/
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 24,282
    So. Rugby Union and League goes ahead tomorrow.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 81,234
    HYUFD said:

    King Charles to address the nation at 6pm
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-62847191

    In a shocking twist, in order to improve the nations finances Charles announced an auction for royal sponsorship. He would henceforth be known as The Burger King, inviting those in mourning to 'have it, your way'.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 104,912
    edited September 9
    Of course after the funeral we then have King Charles' coronation to prepare for which will not be for several months.

    Only after that will normal politics fully return
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 81,234
    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Truss I thought handled the events of yesterday well. They obviously will dominate buy she combined paying tribute to our lost Queen with welcoming our new King.

    Luckily for her she also got her plans for an energy bill cap in before the news broke

    Plus the restart of fracking.

    I think the tories are going to need to be very careful about how they sell that one though.

    British voters these days want cheap gas without fracking near them, just as they want great public services with low taxes, lots of new property but no development where they live, low government debt but lots of spending, and free speech but censorship of opinions they disagree with.

    I think little or no fracking will happen, but it was symbolic of 'we need to reprioritise'
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 36,642
    edited September 9
    There is also the danger of people thinking now that the Queen is gone we are truly in a modern, efficient, technology-driven era.

    And then they apply for a passport. Or drive a car whilst black. Or....or....
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 15,162
    Good to see that the rugby (both codes) and (probably?) cricket are going ahead tomorrow. Sense at last.

    Football going to look a little bit odd.
  • dixiedean said:

    So. Rugby Union and League goes ahead tomorrow.

    LOL that's amusing, its the inverse of what happened last time. :grin:
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 42,932
    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:

    King Charles to address the nation at 6pm
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-62847191

    In a shocking twist, in order to improve the nations finances Charles announced an auction for royal sponsorship. He would henceforth be known as The Burger King, inviting those in mourning to 'have it, your way'.
    "Have you bought your Royal Appointment yet?"
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 42,739
    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Truss I thought handled the events of yesterday well. They obviously will dominate buy she combined paying tribute to our lost Queen with welcoming our new King.

    Luckily for her she also got her plans for an energy bill cap in before the news broke

    Plus the restart of fracking.

    I think the tories are going to need to be very careful about how they sell that one though.

    British voters these days want cheap gas without fracking near them, just as they want great public services with low taxes, lots of new property but no development where they live, low government debt but lots of spending, and free speech but censorship of opinions they disagree with.

    Bringing the two topics together, the reason is that the Crown retains the mineral rights beneath all of our properties (whereas in the US, you buy land, you own the minerals below as well). If HMQ has left her country-wide mineral rights to landowners in her will, then suddenly lots of people will become very keen on fracking near them!
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 15,162
    dixiedean said:

    I take it Charles III is now nailed on? Has it been made official?
    To change to George or Arthur or Louise at this juncture would be ludicrous. Everyone's calling him it now.
    PS. The weather was better under the Queen.

    The regnal name thing was always grade a bollocks propagated by the PB Royal Botherers. I hope no one took it seriously?
  • DriverDriver Posts: 2,030
    dixiedean said:

    I take it Charles III is now nailed on? Has it been made official?
    To change to George or Arthur or Louise at this juncture would be ludicrous. Everyone's calling him it now.
    PS. The weather was better under the Queen.

    Louise would be surprising, to be fair...
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 81,234
    edited September 9
    Ghedebrav said:

    When politics does return, I hope the tenor of the last PMQs remains. One lesson of the Queen's death that I hope our leaders take is that as a nation the last thing we need is further division.

    I don't mind some division. Politics is about divided ideas competing. And some passion in that division is ok, its bracing.

    But a little more civility, a little more attempt at discussion and debate, would improve political skills, discourse and development.
  • DriverDriver Posts: 2,030

    dixiedean said:

    So. Rugby Union and League goes ahead tomorrow.

    LOL that's amusing, its the inverse of what happened last time. :grin:
    Ice hockey also going ahead, which (as predicted) has produced some loud protests from people on a forum I'm in.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 24,282

    dixiedean said:

    So. Rugby Union and League goes ahead tomorrow.

    LOL that's amusing, its the inverse of what happened last time. :grin:
    AFL and NRL playoffs in Australia took place as normal today and will over the weekend.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 42,739
    So Charles gets flags flown back at the top of masts for just an hour, tomorrow.
  • GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 566

    Good to see that the rugby (both codes) and (probably?) cricket are going ahead tomorrow. Sense at last.

    Football going to look a little bit odd.

    All grass roots matches cancelled too, everything under the FA umbrella - including my son's under 10s game this Sunday. TBH it was an 8am start so I'm not moaning.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 81,234
    dixiedean said:

    So. Rugby Union and League goes ahead tomorrow.

    But but people are being forced by the crown!
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 104,912

    Good to see that the rugby (both codes) and (probably?) cricket are going ahead tomorrow. Sense at last.

    Football going to look a little bit odd.

    The football season should not begin until October anyway
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 36,642
    edited September 9
    I am genuinely interested in why a particular activity not going ahead is appropriate (or it going ahead inappropriate).

    ETA: is it "respect" but how is not doing an activity a mark of respect. Genuinely interested.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 31,973
    TOPPING said:

    As I said earlier, HMQ's passing seemed to effect me far less than the passing of Phillip did.

    But I was listening to the radio on the way back from an appointment, and had to pull over as I started uncontrollably blubbing. Odd.

    Yes - for me Philip was more "end of an era"-ish. The Queen, sadly, was only an inevitability after their collective invincibility had been punctured.

    Haven't blubbed yet for either but I did shed a tear for that German tourist who will be much missed.
    Which German tourist?

    There was a wonderful anecdote on R5L earlier. A nine-year old German girl from Munich visited London a few decades ago, and was rather taken by Buckingham Palace. when she got home, she wrote to the Queen, saying how she loved the palace and wished they could meet sometime. A few weeks later, she got a big parcel from Buckingham Palace containing a load of stuff, including a teach-yourself-English book and souvenirs. When the girl was 14, she moved to London and has lived there ever since.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 30,006
    This is rather well done -

    https://www.greatriverrace.org.uk

    For those who don't know - it's not really a "racing" race. More of an endurance thing. So turning it into a memorial procession will not throw away all of the hard work people have put in preparing.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 10,416
    Somebody has done a drawing of Stacey's mental mum out of EastEnders in that photo.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 36,642
    HYUFD said:

    Good to see that the rugby (both codes) and (probably?) cricket are going ahead tomorrow. Sense at last.

    Football going to look a little bit odd.

    The football season should not begin until October anyway
    And the FA Cup should mark the end of the season. O Tempora. O Mores.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 41,859

    Brazilian-built Embraer jet, G-LEGC.

    https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/g-legc/

    Surprisingly a private hire, rather than the Royal Flight jets we’ve seen in the past few days.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 36,642

    TOPPING said:

    As I said earlier, HMQ's passing seemed to effect me far less than the passing of Phillip did.

    But I was listening to the radio on the way back from an appointment, and had to pull over as I started uncontrollably blubbing. Odd.

    Yes - for me Philip was more "end of an era"-ish. The Queen, sadly, was only an inevitability after their collective invincibility had been punctured.

    Haven't blubbed yet for either but I did shed a tear for that German tourist who will be much missed.
    Which German tourist?

    There was a wonderful anecdote on R5L earlier. A nine-year old German girl from Munich visited London a few decades ago, and was rather taken by Buckingham Palace. when she got home, she wrote to the Queen, saying how she loved the palace and wished they could meet sometime. A few weeks later, she got a big parcel from Buckingham Palace containing a load of stuff, including a teach-yourself-English book and souvenirs. When the girl was 14, she moved to London and has lived there ever since.
    The German tourist that (in his dreams) @Leon gave a good seeing to to.
  • eekeek Posts: 21,769

    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Truss I thought handled the events of yesterday well. They obviously will dominate buy she combined paying tribute to our lost Queen with welcoming our new King.

    Luckily for her she also got her plans for an energy bill cap in before the news broke

    Plus the restart of fracking.

    I think the tories are going to need to be very careful about how they sell that one though.

    British voters these days want cheap gas without fracking near them, just as they want great public services with low taxes, lots of new property but no development where they live, low government debt but lots of spending, and free speech but censorship of opinions they disagree with.

    I suspect the fracking will quietly disappear...
    It's a look like we are doing something policy - even though our geology doesn't really support it.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 15,162
    Ghedebrav said:

    Good to see that the rugby (both codes) and (probably?) cricket are going ahead tomorrow. Sense at last.

    Football going to look a little bit odd.

    All grass roots matches cancelled too, everything under the FA umbrella - including my son's under 10s game this Sunday. TBH it was an 8am start so I'm not moaning.
    Really? That is beyond ridiculous

  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 36,642

    TOPPING said:

    As I said earlier, HMQ's passing seemed to effect me far less than the passing of Phillip did.

    But I was listening to the radio on the way back from an appointment, and had to pull over as I started uncontrollably blubbing. Odd.

    Yes - for me Philip was more "end of an era"-ish. The Queen, sadly, was only an inevitability after their collective invincibility had been punctured.

    Haven't blubbed yet for either but I did shed a tear for that German tourist who will be much missed.
    Which German tourist?

    There was a wonderful anecdote on R5L earlier. A nine-year old German girl from Munich visited London a few decades ago, and was rather taken by Buckingham Palace. when she got home, she wrote to the Queen, saying how she loved the palace and wished they could meet sometime. A few weeks later, she got a big parcel from Buckingham Palace containing a load of stuff, including a teach-yourself-English book and souvenirs. When the girl was 14, she moved to London and has lived there ever since.
    An on the ball equerry. The Queen might not have known anything about it. But great story.
  • theakestheakes Posts: 675
    Is Charles 111 demonstrating something, driving down the M40, on the outside lane with traffic on the two inside lanes NOT being held back.
    If so good for him.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 3,744
    IanB2 said:

    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Truss I thought handled the events of yesterday well. They obviously will dominate buy she combined paying tribute to our lost Queen with welcoming our new King.

    Luckily for her she also got her plans for an energy bill cap in before the news broke

    Plus the restart of fracking.

    I think the tories are going to need to be very careful about how they sell that one though.

    British voters these days want cheap gas without fracking near them, just as they want great public services with low taxes, lots of new property but no development where they live, low government debt but lots of spending, and free speech but censorship of opinions they disagree with.

    Bringing the two topics together, the reason is that the Crown retains the mineral rights beneath all of our properties (whereas in the US, you buy land, you own the minerals below as well). If HMQ has left her country-wide mineral rights to landowners in her will, then suddenly lots of people will become very keen on fracking near them!
    Same I imagine if people got a share in new houses sold for the first time near them.

    It's about the one thing I can see solving the housing crisis.
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 2,756

    Good to see that the rugby (both codes) and (probably?) cricket are going ahead tomorrow. Sense at last.

    Football going to look a little bit odd.

    Yes. I wonder if the FA haven't been able to ask Prince William, or whether he's proffered an opinion and they don't want to go against it?

    The St Leger is now on for Sunday, so it looks like horse racing will resume.
  • TOPPING said:

    I am genuinely interested in why a particular activity not going ahead is appropriate (or it going ahead inappropriate).

    There is no appropriate, or inappropriate, either decision is fine.

    For many people the Queen was emotionally like a Grandmother. Our kids saw the news with us and said unprompted that they were sad the Queen died and that it reminded them of the death of [my] Nanna recently. Again this morning they were talking about it.

    What people do after a death is up to them, people react differently. Some people like to postpone things, others don't. The FA have made their choice, that's their responsibility and their right to do so. Other sports have made their choice, again that's their responsibility and their right.

    So long as nobody is mandating others can't do what they want to do, there's not an issue. If anyone wants to play football this weekend they can, it just won't be under the banner of the FA if they do.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 3,744
    Driver said:

    dixiedean said:

    I take it Charles III is now nailed on? Has it been made official?
    To change to George or Arthur or Louise at this juncture would be ludicrous. Everyone's calling him it now.
    PS. The weather was better under the Queen.

    Louise would be surprising, to be fair...
    If he styled himself King Arthur, would he be Arthur I or Arthur II in England?
  • HYUFD said:

    Of course after the funeral we then have King Charles' coronation to prepare for which will not be for several months.

    Only after that will normal politics fully return

    As if the country can wait that long. Your lot already wasted the summer, now you want to waste the autumn?
  • kjhkjh Posts: 7,871
    Driver said:

    dixiedean said:

    I take it Charles III is now nailed on? Has it been made official?
    To change to George or Arthur or Louise at this juncture would be ludicrous. Everyone's calling him it now.
    PS. The weather was better under the Queen.

    Louise would be surprising, to be fair...
    Would be fun though, particularly if he declared he would like to be addressed as Queen Louise. Leon would have kittens.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,533

    As I said earlier, HMQ's passing seemed to effect me far less than the passing of Phillip did.

    But I was listening to the radio on the way back from an appointment, and had to pull over as I started uncontrollably blubbing. Odd.

    This will affect many many people like the death of a parent or a much loved grandparent

    Even if you are an ardent republican or you live in Italy or Argentina and expect to be unbothered you might well be bothered. Because she was such an enormous figure, and a source of stability for hundreds of millions around the globe. Whatever was wrong with the world, whatever horrors unfolded, the Queen was in her Palace. With her corgis. That never changed and has never changed for as long as nearly all of us have lived

    Now gone.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 41,859
    Fishing said:

    IanB2 said:

    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Truss I thought handled the events of yesterday well. They obviously will dominate buy she combined paying tribute to our lost Queen with welcoming our new King.

    Luckily for her she also got her plans for an energy bill cap in before the news broke

    Plus the restart of fracking.

    I think the tories are going to need to be very careful about how they sell that one though.

    British voters these days want cheap gas without fracking near them, just as they want great public services with low taxes, lots of new property but no development where they live, low government debt but lots of spending, and free speech but censorship of opinions they disagree with.

    Bringing the two topics together, the reason is that the Crown retains the mineral rights beneath all of our properties (whereas in the US, you buy land, you own the minerals below as well). If HMQ has left her country-wide mineral rights to landowners in her will, then suddenly lots of people will become very keen on fracking near them!
    Same I imagine if people got a share in new houses sold for the first time near them.

    It's about the one thing I can see solving the housing crisis.
    That was my idea from a couple of days ago. Make more taxes local, including mineral extraction taxes, and local authorities less dependent on central funding. That way the incentives are to build more houses and to extract more minerals. Give everyone a cheque instead of a council tax bill, and watch the level of support for housebuilding and fracking change.
  • AlistairMAlistairM Posts: 1,519
    Ghedebrav said:

    Good to see that the rugby (both codes) and (probably?) cricket are going ahead tomorrow. Sense at last.

    Football going to look a little bit odd.

    All grass roots matches cancelled too, everything under the FA umbrella - including my son's under 10s game this Sunday. TBH it was an 8am start so I'm not moaning.
    My 9yo son is going to be gutted. At the moment Saturday training is still on but would not be surprised if that is next to go. Not sure how you pay your respects to the Queen by cancelling everything. Surely getting everyone together and having a silence or applause would show this far more!


    This one is just extremely odd. We're showing respect by not telling you the weather!
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 27,910

    HYUFD said:

    Of course after the funeral we then have King Charles' coronation to prepare for which will not be for several months.

    Only after that will normal politics fully return

    As if the country can wait that long. Your lot already wasted the summer, now you want to waste the autumn?
    And winter and spring.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 104,912

    HYUFD said:

    Of course after the funeral we then have King Charles' coronation to prepare for which will not be for several months.

    Only after that will normal politics fully return

    As if the country can wait that long. Your lot already wasted the summer, now you want to waste the autumn?
    The most important role of the Tory party is to support the Crown and its transition between monarchs. In any case Truss has already announced her cost of living price cap
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 24,282
    Cricket will go ahead.
    All RL as planned.
    RU postponed tonight. Will go ahead Saturday and Sunday.
    Bristol v Bath moved to Saturday from tonight.
    Cos Bristol City don't need the ground!
  • Given who Spurs were due to play I can only applaud the FA for its decision.
  • AlistairMAlistairM Posts: 1,519
    Cycling still generally going ahead. Play the anthem, black armbands etc. for respect. Seems more sensible to me.

    https://www.britishcycling.org.uk/about/article/20220909-about-bc-news-Guidance-for-the-period-of-National-Mourning-0
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 6,547
    edited September 9
    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    Good to see that the rugby (both codes) and (probably?) cricket are going ahead tomorrow. Sense at last.

    Football going to look a little bit odd.

    The football season should not begin until October anyway
    And the FA Cup should mark the end of the season. O Tempora. O Mores.
    Speaking of O tempora O mores, can we put a stop to Test Matches in September?

    A series of five Tests, finishing in August, in a season including the visitors having a leisurely tour of the more agreeable county grounds sounds a decent way of spending the summer.

  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 2,756
    AlistairM said:

    Ghedebrav said:

    Good to see that the rugby (both codes) and (probably?) cricket are going ahead tomorrow. Sense at last.

    Football going to look a little bit odd.

    All grass roots matches cancelled too, everything under the FA umbrella - including my son's under 10s game this Sunday. TBH it was an 8am start so I'm not moaning.
    My 9yo son is going to be gutted. At the moment Saturday training is still on but would not be surprised if that is next to go. Not sure how you pay your respects to the Queen by cancelling everything. Surely getting everyone together and having a silence or applause would show this far more!


    This one is just extremely odd. We're showing respect by not telling you the weather!
    I'm sure they'll tell us the weather, just without the social media chit chat.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 30,006
    Sandpit said:

    Fishing said:

    IanB2 said:

    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Truss I thought handled the events of yesterday well. They obviously will dominate buy she combined paying tribute to our lost Queen with welcoming our new King.

    Luckily for her she also got her plans for an energy bill cap in before the news broke

    Plus the restart of fracking.

    I think the tories are going to need to be very careful about how they sell that one though.

    British voters these days want cheap gas without fracking near them, just as they want great public services with low taxes, lots of new property but no development where they live, low government debt but lots of spending, and free speech but censorship of opinions they disagree with.

    Bringing the two topics together, the reason is that the Crown retains the mineral rights beneath all of our properties (whereas in the US, you buy land, you own the minerals below as well). If HMQ has left her country-wide mineral rights to landowners in her will, then suddenly lots of people will become very keen on fracking near them!
    Same I imagine if people got a share in new houses sold for the first time near them.

    It's about the one thing I can see solving the housing crisis.
    That was my idea from a couple of days ago. Make more taxes local, including mineral extraction taxes, and local authorities less dependent on central funding. That way the incentives are to build more houses and to extract more minerals. Give everyone a cheque instead of a council tax bill, and watch the level of support for housebuilding and fracking change.
    I suggested this once to a planner. He suggested that if a property developer tried that (my suggestion was a payment to local residents as part of the planning application) they would be liable for prosecution for bribery.

    Any legal eagles want to comment?
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 27,910
    kle4 said:

    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Truss I thought handled the events of yesterday well. They obviously will dominate buy she combined paying tribute to our lost Queen with welcoming our new King.

    Luckily for her she also got her plans for an energy bill cap in before the news broke

    Plus the restart of fracking.

    I think the tories are going to need to be very careful about how they sell that one though.

    British voters these days want cheap gas without fracking near them, just as they want great public services with low taxes, lots of new property but no development where they live, low government debt but lots of spending, and free speech but censorship of opinions they disagree with.

    I think little or no fracking will happen, but it was symbolic of 'we need to reprioritise'
    Just an excuse to wreck the planning system for other reasons. Lots of lucrative donations to the Party.
  • pm215pm215 Posts: 515


    What people do after a death is up to them, people react differently. Some people like to postpone things, others don't. The FA have made their choice, that's their responsibility and their right to do so. Other sports have made their choice, again that's their responsibility and their right.

    For individuals I am in full agreement. I think where I perhaps part company from you is when it comes to large organisations and companies, where to me at least wide-ranging cancellations/postponements/royal-related-tv-programming-for-days has a whiff of being "because we think people will criticise" rather than being a genuine reaction driven by how the decision-makers themselves truly feel one way or the other. I have no desire to critique *peoples*' reactions, but I do think feedback to large *organisations* can be warranted if they seem to be going overboard (or, for that matter, underboard) -- because I think they are fundamentally trying to do "what they think the general public would want" rather than only acting on their personal feelings, and therefore feedback about what the public in fact do or don't want is useful to them.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 27,910
    MISTY said:

    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Truss I thought handled the events of yesterday well. They obviously will dominate buy she combined paying tribute to our lost Queen with welcoming our new King.

    Luckily for her she also got her plans for an energy bill cap in before the news broke

    Plus the restart of fracking.

    I think the tories are going to need to be very careful about how they sell that one though.

    British voters these days want cheap gas without fracking near them, just as they want great public services with low taxes, lots of new property but no development where they live, low government debt but lots of spending, and free speech but censorship of opinions they disagree with.

    I suspect the fracking will quietly disappear...
    Protecting everybody from the vagaries of the gas market seems odd for a government that wants fracking, to be sure.

    You mean, encouraging p[eople to invest in dodgy and futile projects?
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 24,282
    Thinking of an afternoon nap.
    Not sure whether that would be respectful or disrespectful?
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,660

    Good to see that the rugby (both codes) and (probably?) cricket are going ahead tomorrow. Sense at last.

    Not in Scotland.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 27,910

    AlistairM said:

    Ghedebrav said:

    Good to see that the rugby (both codes) and (probably?) cricket are going ahead tomorrow. Sense at last.

    Football going to look a little bit odd.

    All grass roots matches cancelled too, everything under the FA umbrella - including my son's under 10s game this Sunday. TBH it was an 8am start so I'm not moaning.
    My 9yo son is going to be gutted. At the moment Saturday training is still on but would not be surprised if that is next to go. Not sure how you pay your respects to the Queen by cancelling everything. Surely getting everyone together and having a silence or applause would show this far more!


    This one is just extremely odd. We're showing respect by not telling you the weather!
    I'm sure they'll tell us the weather, just without the social media chit chat.
    Also the longer disquisitions/blogs on how jetstreams work and the Frost Fairs on the Thames.
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 2,148
    edited September 9
    From thread header “ This is so massive a moment that it is going to totally overshadow the first week of LizT.”
    This could be a good thing. A clean break from the Johnson days and a completely new start for Truss.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 27,910

    From thread header “ This is so massive a moment that it is going to totally overshadow the first week of LizT.”
    This could be a good think. A clean break from the Johnson days and a completely new start for Truss.

    Johnson? Whohe? Not LBJ, surely?
  • HYUFD said:

    Of course after the funeral we then have King Charles' coronation to prepare for which will not be for several months.

    Only after that will normal politics fully return

    As if the country can wait that long. Your lot already wasted the summer, now you want to waste the autumn?
    Once we have had the funeral normal service will be resumed. It doesn't take the Government nor the Tory party to spend a fraction of its time on arrangements for the coronation. Much of it is planned out already and most of the rest of it can be done without the interference of politicians.

    If Truss or any of her ministers try to use the Coronation as an excuse for delaying decision making or getting on with running the country then they deserve to be hounded from office.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 72,708
    Does this lot affect the timing of the NI cut so drags a bit more revenue for the government by drag ?
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 27,910
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Of course after the funeral we then have King Charles' coronation to prepare for which will not be for several months.

    Only after that will normal politics fully return

    As if the country can wait that long. Your lot already wasted the summer, now you want to waste the autumn?
    The most important role of the Tory party is to support the Crown and its transition between monarchs. In any case Truss has already announced her cost of living price cap
    "The most important role of the Tory party is to support the Crown and its transition between monarchs."

    Nonsense. Its most important role is to retain power and enrich its members and donors. You'll be thrown out for pinko stuff like that.
  • dixiedean said:

    Thinking of an afternoon nap.
    Not sure whether that would be respectful or disrespectful?

    Depends on if you snore or dribble.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 44,990
    Michigan ballot initiative to enshrine abortion rights in the constitution will go ahead (after the elections board tried to remove it for 'incorrect spacing' between words).

    https://www.courts.michigan.gov/4a5828/siteassets/case-documents/briefs/msc/2022-2023/164760/164760-2022-09-08-or.pdf
    ...Seven hundred fifty three thousand and seven hundred fifty nine Michiganders signed this proposal—more than have ever signed any proposal in Michigan’s history. The challengers have not produced a single signer who claims to have been confused by the limited-spacing sections in the full text portion of the proposal. Yet two members of the Board of State Canvassers would prevent the people of Michigan from voting on the proposal because they believe that the decreased spacing makes the text no longer “[t]he full text.” That is, even though there is no dispute that every word appears and appears legibly and in the correct order, and there is no evidence that anyone was confused about the text, two members of the Board of State Canvassers with the power to do so would keep the petition from the voters for what they purport to be a technical violation of the statute. They would disenfranchise millions of Michiganders not because they believe the many thousands of Michiganders who signed the proposal were confused by it, but because they think they have identified a technicality that allows them to do so, a game of gotcha gone very bad....
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,533
    Out of respect for the Queen, before my pingado and medronho I am also having a vinho branco


  • londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 2,002
    Pulpstar said:

    Does this lot affect the timing of the NI cut so drags a bit more revenue for the government by drag ?

    I think - but don't know - that it won't change until April 2023 in any case as NI changes take time to implement due to logistics of changing payroll systems etc.

    I may be wrong, we will find out 21 Sept
  • GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 566
    dixiedean said:

    Ghedebrav said:

    Good to see that the rugby (both codes) and (probably?) cricket are going ahead tomorrow. Sense at last.

    Football going to look a little bit odd.

    All grass roots matches cancelled too, everything under the FA umbrella - including my son's under 10s game this Sunday. TBH it was an 8am start so I'm not moaning.
    Really? That is beyond ridiculous

    Indeed.
    8 f****** am?!
    My words exactly.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 7,765
    dixiedean said:

    Ghedebrav said:

    Good to see that the rugby (both codes) and (probably?) cricket are going ahead tomorrow. Sense at last.

    Football going to look a little bit odd.

    All grass roots matches cancelled too, everything under the FA umbrella - including my son's under 10s game this Sunday. TBH it was an 8am start so I'm not moaning.
    Really? That is beyond ridiculous

    Indeed.
    8 f****** am?!
    Yes, I posted something similar on the previous thread. My 11 year old daughter's football has also been cancelled.
    It's a new team. They aren't even playing other teams yet; they're just training.
    I cannot imagine any of the players, or the coaches, want to cancel it.
    Can this really be what the queen would have wanted? Can this really be what Charles would want?
  • AlistairMAlistairM Posts: 1,519
    jonny83 said:

    Great move by Charles to get out and see the public before going into Buckingham Palace

    Looks like he is going to every single person he possibly can. Honestly a brilliant idea to do this.
  • MISTYMISTY Posts: 1,594
    edited September 9
    Carnyx said:

    MISTY said:

    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Truss I thought handled the events of yesterday well. They obviously will dominate buy she combined paying tribute to our lost Queen with welcoming our new King.

    Luckily for her she also got her plans for an energy bill cap in before the news broke

    Plus the restart of fracking.

    I think the tories are going to need to be very careful about how they sell that one though.

    British voters these days want cheap gas without fracking near them, just as they want great public services with low taxes, lots of new property but no development where they live, low government debt but lots of spending, and free speech but censorship of opinions they disagree with.

    I suspect the fracking will quietly disappear...
    Protecting everybody from the vagaries of the gas market seems odd for a government that wants fracking, to be sure.

    You mean, encouraging p[eople to invest in dodgy and futile projects?
    Private companies drilling for oil and gas don't know what they are doing?

    Surprising then, that they are making such vast sums of money that some want windfall taxes on those profits.



  • pm215 said:


    What people do after a death is up to them, people react differently. Some people like to postpone things, others don't. The FA have made their choice, that's their responsibility and their right to do so. Other sports have made their choice, again that's their responsibility and their right.

    For individuals I am in full agreement. I think where I perhaps part company from you is when it comes to large organisations and companies, where to me at least wide-ranging cancellations/postponements/royal-related-tv-programming-for-days has a whiff of being "because we think people will criticise" rather than being a genuine reaction driven by how the decision-makers themselves truly feel one way or the other. I have no desire to critique *peoples*' reactions, but I do think feedback to large *organisations* can be warranted if they seem to be going overboard (or, for that matter, underboard) -- because I think they are fundamentally trying to do "what they think the general public would want" rather than only acting on their personal feelings, and therefore feedback about what the public in fact do or don't want is useful to them.
    Wouldn't it be worse if they were only doing it based on their own personal views?

    I suspect that the idea of the country carrying on as normal as if nothing had happened other than an old lady dying - for all it might please the republicans - would rightly upset a huge number of people.

    For the last 30 years I have run two large events/trade shows a year which have several thousand people attending them. We have always had a reserve of at least one event's worth of costs in place in case of an unforeseen event which prevents us going ahead. We could imagine many scenarios that might cause this to happen but the most obvious one was the Queen dying. We never imagined that we would go ahead with an event if the Queen had died just a few days before.
  • GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 566
    Re. corgis - surely they should be given as a token of friendship to the nobles of the faerie realm.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 7,765
    Apparently as a mark of respect Dave isn't showing any adverts.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 27,910
    MISTY said:

    Carnyx said:

    MISTY said:

    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Truss I thought handled the events of yesterday well. They obviously will dominate buy she combined paying tribute to our lost Queen with welcoming our new King.

    Luckily for her she also got her plans for an energy bill cap in before the news broke

    Plus the restart of fracking.

    I think the tories are going to need to be very careful about how they sell that one though.

    British voters these days want cheap gas without fracking near them, just as they want great public services with low taxes, lots of new property but no development where they live, low government debt but lots of spending, and free speech but censorship of opinions they disagree with.

    I suspect the fracking will quietly disappear...
    Protecting everybody from the vagaries of the gas market seems odd for a government that wants fracking, to be sure.

    You mean, encouraging p[eople to invest in dodgy and futile projects?
    Private companies drilling for oil and gas don't know what they are doing?

    Surprising then, that they are making such vast sums of money.

    You're confusing US geology with the very different geology of the UK. And you missed the PBer who lost all his shirt* on fracking in the UK.

    *Hopefully not his own one, but a doll's size one. But still didn't get much of his money back.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 24,282
    Cookie said:

    dixiedean said:

    Ghedebrav said:

    Good to see that the rugby (both codes) and (probably?) cricket are going ahead tomorrow. Sense at last.

    Football going to look a little bit odd.

    All grass roots matches cancelled too, everything under the FA umbrella - including my son's under 10s game this Sunday. TBH it was an 8am start so I'm not moaning.
    Really? That is beyond ridiculous

    Indeed.
    8 f****** am?!
    Yes, I posted something similar on the previous thread. My 11 year old daughter's football has also been cancelled.
    It's a new team. They aren't even playing other teams yet; they're just training.
    I cannot imagine any of the players, or the coaches, want to cancel it.
    Can this really be what the queen would have wanted? Can this really be what Charles would want?
    Has training been cancelled by order of the FA?
    Seems impossible to enforce.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 30,006
    Carnyx said:

    MISTY said:

    Carnyx said:

    MISTY said:

    MISTY said:

    HYUFD said:

    Truss I thought handled the events of yesterday well. They obviously will dominate buy she combined paying tribute to our lost Queen with welcoming our new King.

    Luckily for her she also got her plans for an energy bill cap in before the news broke

    Plus the restart of fracking.

    I think the tories are going to need to be very careful about how they sell that one though.

    British voters these days want cheap gas without fracking near them, just as they want great public services with low taxes, lots of new property but no development where they live, low government debt but lots of spending, and free speech but censorship of opinions they disagree with.

    I suspect the fracking will quietly disappear...
    Protecting everybody from the vagaries of the gas market seems odd for a government that wants fracking, to be sure.

    You mean, encouraging p[eople to invest in dodgy and futile projects?
    Private companies drilling for oil and gas don't know what they are doing?

    Surprising then, that they are making such vast sums of money.

    You're confusing US geology with the very different geology of the UK. And you missed the PBer who lost all his shirt* on fracking in the UK.

    *Hopefully not his own one, but a doll's size one. But still didn't get much of his money back.
    The issue is that people will convince themselves that they will make money - hence the long history of bankruptcy. And why it was invented.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 7,765
    dixiedean said:

    Cookie said:

    dixiedean said:

    Ghedebrav said:

    Good to see that the rugby (both codes) and (probably?) cricket are going ahead tomorrow. Sense at last.

    Football going to look a little bit odd.

    All grass roots matches cancelled too, everything under the FA umbrella - including my son's under 10s game this Sunday. TBH it was an 8am start so I'm not moaning.
    Really? That is beyond ridiculous

    Indeed.
    8 f****** am?!
    Yes, I posted something similar on the previous thread. My 11 year old daughter's football has also been cancelled.
    It's a new team. They aren't even playing other teams yet; they're just training.
    I cannot imagine any of the players, or the coaches, want to cancel it.
    Can this really be what the queen would have wanted? Can this really be what Charles would want?
    Has training been cancelled by order of the FA?
    Seems impossible to enforce.
    Anything which falls under the umbrella of the FA. And as it's an FA affiliated club...
    I'm sure it is impossible to enforce. Fucking daft nonetheless.

    Even my mother in law - who takes an interest in the royal family, watches royal weddings, etc - thinks things have gone way over the top.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 27,910

    pm215 said:


    What people do after a death is up to them, people react differently. Some people like to postpone things, others don't. The FA have made their choice, that's their responsibility and their right to do so. Other sports have made their choice, again that's their responsibility and their right.

    For individuals I am in full agreement. I think where I perhaps part company from you is when it comes to large organisations and companies, where to me at least wide-ranging cancellations/postponements/royal-related-tv-programming-for-days has a whiff of being "because we think people will criticise" rather than being a genuine reaction driven by how the decision-makers themselves truly feel one way or the other. I have no desire to critique *peoples*' reactions, but I do think feedback to large *organisations* can be warranted if they seem to be going overboard (or, for that matter, underboard) -- because I think they are fundamentally trying to do "what they think the general public would want" rather than only acting on their personal feelings, and therefore feedback about what the public in fact do or don't want is useful to them.
    Wouldn't it be worse if they were only doing it based on their own personal views?

    I suspect that the idea of the country carrying on as normal as if nothing had happened other than an old lady dying - for all it might please the republicans - would rightly upset a huge number of people.

    For the last 30 years I have run two large events/trade shows a year which have several thousand people attending them. We have always had a reserve of at least one event's worth of costs in place in case of an unforeseen event which prevents us going ahead. We could imagine many scenarios that might cause this to happen but the most obvious one was the Queen dying. We never imagined that we would go ahead with an event if the Queen had died just a few days before.
    Some of the discussions today have been very reminiscent of the arguments over the Victorian Sunday - why should the children/working classes/etc not be allowed to have enjoyment on their only day off, etc. etc. just to keep the spoilsports and moral panickers happy.

    On the other hand, sovereigns don't die every week, and, like spelling, grammar and punctuation, it's arguably better to err on the more conservative and old-fashioned side.

  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 41,859
    They say you only get one chance to make a first impression, well the new King and Queen have definitely made a good first impression.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,533
    The Ukrainian front is changing at breakneck speed


    “Pro-Russian mapmakers tracking the fighting around Kharkiv are showing a really significant problem for Russia unfolding rapidly.”

    https://twitter.com/eliothiggins/status/1568216432072073217?s=46&t=fqdL0K9NxkSTGjHlnCTk_A

    A Russian army in danger of encirclement? Or Ukrainian overstretch?
  • GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 566
    dixiedean said:

    Cookie said:

    dixiedean said:

    Ghedebrav said:

    Good to see that the rugby (both codes) and (probably?) cricket are going ahead tomorrow. Sense at last.

    Football going to look a little bit odd.

    All grass roots matches cancelled too, everything under the FA umbrella - including my son's under 10s game this Sunday. TBH it was an 8am start so I'm not moaning.
    Really? That is beyond ridiculous

    Indeed.
    8 f****** am?!
    Yes, I posted something similar on the previous thread. My 11 year old daughter's football has also been cancelled.
    It's a new team. They aren't even playing other teams yet; they're just training.
    I cannot imagine any of the players, or the coaches, want to cancel it.
    Can this really be what the queen would have wanted? Can this really be what Charles would want?
    Has training been cancelled by order of the FA?
    Seems impossible to enforce.
    It probably would be impossible, but the point is that member clubs are supposed to follow the FA's rules and generally that's what people do. It was probably the wrong decision to extend it down to grass roots, but there it is. A mistake.
This discussion has been closed.