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Normal politics will resume after the funeral – politicalbetting.com

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  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,650
    IshmaelZ said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    ohnotnow said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    On the question of what time the Queen died I believe it would have been shortly before Liz Truss was told in the commons and I believe the note did affirm the Queen had died.

    I expect as part of London Bridge planning that the PM would be informed almost straight away and before the media

    The PM is informed by the Queens Private Secretary on a secure line and is the first person outside the family/immediate household and doctors informed. The commons note would have said she is gravely ill and London Bridge was likely. There are no circumstances in which Nadhim Zahawi knew before the PM.
    She was told at 4.30, just moments before the other commonwealth leaders were informed
    Are you sure? Lots of what we thought we knew is wrong. The Guardian piece was very certai she would come down by train, it now seems she is flying. "Secure lines" are ancient history, voice over 4G is always encrypted so all sorts of new protocols can be envisaged. They must have told Zahawi something pretty close to the truth, to persuade him to go into the chamber and nobble Truss.
    Its very rigid protocol. Truss didnt leave the chamber, shes not going to just carry on if London Bridge has fallen.
    And we have been told she, and the heads of commonwealth realms were informed at 4.30 pm BST.
    Most likely without wanting to sound ghoulish is there was an event such a sudden stroke or similar around lunchtime that left HM unconscious and the doctors were aware it was likely unsurvivable. I don’t think Truss was informed in the chamber that HM had died, though suspect she was told that it was likely imminent.
    Yes, i think she was told basically HMQ gravely ill, London Bridge imminent
    How can you tell? What piece of circumstantial evidence exists for the "gravely ill" hypothesis and rules out the "dead" hypothesis?
    I certainly got the impression from watching Angela Rayner's face when she was handed the note for Keir that it was a "Oh, that's terribly sad to hear" rather than, what I'd expect, to be a more "Oh sh*t, holy hell" if it was saying "she's dead".

    Maybe she truly didn't give much of a monkeys - but it really had that look about it.
    Not what happened. She got a note to her, went out presumably to speak to someone on phone or in person, re entered. So the big reveal was not in the note, it was in the conversation.
    And after this they all then tweeted hoping for HMQs recovery?!
    You will find it a very good practice always to verify your sources

    The whole country will be deeply concerned by the news from Buckingham Palace this lunchtime.

    My thoughts - and the thoughts of people across our United Kingdom - are with Her Majesty The Queen and her family at this time.

    https://twitter.com/trussliz/status/1567839967203794944

    The absence of any such "hope" is a smoking gun. Your thoughts can always be with someone who is dead.
    https://twitter.com/Keir_Starmer/status/1567843603929616384?t=-EyTUPhVzhfFAYxHBVivaQ&s=19

    Along with the rest of the country, I am deeply worried by the news from Buckingham Palace this afternoon.

    My thoughts are with Her Majesty The Queen and her family at this time, and I join everyone across the United Kingdom in hoping for her recovery.
    Yes. he is not as bright as Liz. But the whole thing is a fiction because the news from Buckingham Palace this afternoon which was available to the the rest of the country to be deeply worried by, is limited to

    "Following further evaluation this morning, The Queen’s doctors are concerned for Her Majesty’s health and have recommended she remain under medical supervision.

    The Queen remains comfortable and at Balmoral."

    and we know for certain that he had received more recent and more worrying information than that.
    If they had been told she was dead, Starmer would not have tweeted that and Rayner wouldnt have retweeted it.
    However, it fits with 'HMQ gravely ill, London Bridge likely'.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    kle4 said:

    BBC live update

    In his speech King Charles III comments on his youngest son - the Duke of Sussex - and his wife.

    "I express my love for Prince Harry and Meghan as they continue to build their lives overseas."


    He didn't say Prince Harry and Meghan, he said Harry and Meghan. If you're going to put it in quotes get it right BBC, unless you are doing a joke quote.

    and younger son.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 15,154

    dodrade said:

    Perfectly judged by Charles. Excellent.

    A popular theory/wish among anti-royalists has been that the Queen's popularity was largely personal and would not be inherited by Charles, I think they will be sorely disappointed.
    Eh? From where I'm standing, it was the pro-royalists who didn't like Charles, and as a result were frequently agitating for skipping a generation.
    To which the traditional anti-monarchist response was, 'That's not how YOUR stupid system works!
    My theory was that republicans went for Charles because HMQ was untouchable.

    Plus tribes amongst Royal Family - Diana supporters etc,

    He'll be just fine imo.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    HYUFD said:

    Good address by King Charles. Paid tribute to his mother and also looked ahead to his new role. Interesting too he has now decided to give up his charity work in terms of his personal involvement, not surprising given his new duties.

    William as expected created the new Prince of Wales and a greeting for Harry and Meghan too

    "give up his charity work" is code for "no more carrier bags full of dollars from the Gulf."
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 2,656

    dodrade said:

    Perfectly judged by Charles. Excellent.

    A popular theory/wish among anti-royalists has been that the Queen's popularity was largely personal and would not be inherited by Charles, I think they will be sorely disappointed.
    God Save The King.
    That’s the secret weapon of a monarchy. There’s no time to think about it. The Queen is dead. God Save the King. And he just did his job perfectly.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 32,978

    kinabalu said:

    Driver said:

    William is made Prince of Wales.

    What about sword on bonce at a big Welsh castle?

    Until I see that, he isn't.
    Caernarfon hopefully
    Yep - but needs to learn the language first. So it might not be for a while.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 56,756
    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    Good address by King Charles. Paid tribute to his mother and also looked ahead to his new role. Interesting too he has now decided to give up his charity work in terms of his personal involvement, not surprising given his new duties.

    William as expected created the new Prince of Wales and a greeting for Harry and Meghan too

    "give up his charity work" is code for "no more carrier bags full of dollars from the Gulf."
    From now on, good honest British pounds with his face on them.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 8,604

    I doubt in Liz Truss's wildest imagination could she ever have expected to deliver that reading, just 3 days after becoming Prime Minister.

    My wife has just said she is really growing into her role.

    She can tell that after 72 hours?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 82,567

    dodrade said:

    Perfectly judged by Charles. Excellent.

    A popular theory/wish among anti-royalists has been that the Queen's popularity was largely personal and would not be inherited by Charles, I think they will be sorely disappointed.
    Eh? From where I'm standing, it was the pro-royalists who didn't like Charles, and as a result were frequently agitating for skipping a generation.
    To which the traditional anti-monarchist response was, 'That's not how YOUR stupid system works!
    Bit of a mix to be honest. Monarchists who said that are pretty silly, but it's not like no Republicans have been presuming Charles will be an opporunity.

    Which he will. He may never be more popular than he will be this weekend. But even if he remains well liked, several places will sever ties since if they don't at this moment when will they.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 55,355
    edited September 2022
    DougSeal said:

    I doubt in Liz Truss's wildest imagination could she ever have expected to deliver that reading, just 3 days after becoming Prime Minister.

    My wife has just said she is really growing into her role.

    She can tell that after 72 hours?
    Yes

    I would qualify that by saying she is not into politics
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 56,756
    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Driver said:

    William is made Prince of Wales.

    What about sword on bonce at a big Welsh castle?

    Until I see that, he isn't.
    Caernarfon hopefully
    Yep - but needs to learn the language first. So it might not be for a while.
    Wasn't an issue for Edward of Carnarvon, later Edward II. He couldn't speak a word of the language.

    Nor English, nor French, for the matter of that.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 8,604

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Perfectly judged by Charles. Excellent.

    We talk about a new incumbency bounce for PMs.

    I wonder if we will get one for Charles now he's King?
    Perhaps I can offer a key difference. Charles is following in the footsteps of a legend. Truss is following in Johnson's footsteps.
    Oh, he's a legend all right.

    Just as Mordred is.
    Liz Truss smashing Romans. Johnson must be spitting feathers. The Queen trolled him to the end. What an awesome lady!
    Is the PM assaulting some Italian tourists? What’s going on?
  • biggles said:

    dodrade said:

    Perfectly judged by Charles. Excellent.

    A popular theory/wish among anti-royalists has been that the Queen's popularity was largely personal and would not be inherited by Charles, I think they will be sorely disappointed.
    God Save The King.
    That’s the secret weapon of a monarchy. There’s no time to think about it. The Queen is dead. God Save the King. And he just did his job perfectly.
    We're going to be ok.

    Britain is an ancient and strong nation that still matters, and has a very important and positive role to play in the future development of humanity going forwards.

    Long live the King.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 32,978
    TOPPING said:

    Great speech delivered extremely well. I won't be the only one impressed and I've long been a fan.

    All those "skip a generation" types can fuck off.

    Better than Amol Rajan?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 56,756
    edited September 2022

    I doubt in Liz Truss's wildest imagination could she ever have expected to deliver that reading, just 3 days after becoming Prime Minister.

    My wife has just said she is really growing into her role.

    Well, you have been married to her for a very long time!
    Indeed - 60 years in 2024 with congratulations from the new King
    'New?' Are you suggesting this 'lifetime' Charles just pledged might be rather shorter than expected?
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,650

    I doubt in Liz Truss's wildest imagination could she ever have expected to deliver that reading, just 3 days after becoming Prime Minister.

    My wife has just said she is really growing into her role.

    According to Beth Rigby, SKS delivered the greatest speech since the Gettysburg address in parliament
    She went on a bizarre fangirling spree
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 56,756
    Stanford in G.

    Rather nice, but I must admit I prefer the version in A.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 82,567
    According to an admittedly patch wikipedia list Charles's personal net worth was almost that of the Queen, so I guess he'll nearly double depending how things are apportioned.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 32,978
    biggles said:

    kinabalu said:

    Driver said:

    William is made Prince of Wales.

    What about sword on bonce at a big Welsh castle?

    Until I see that, he isn't.
    I wondered about that bit. Presumably they will do the investiture stuff next year around his Coronation.
    Not sure they'll do one. Might choose to scale down that sort of thing.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 37,054
    kinabalu said:

    TOPPING said:

    Great speech delivered extremely well. I won't be the only one impressed and I've long been a fan.

    All those "skip a generation" types can fuck off.

    Better than Amol Rajan?
    I also like Evan on PM.
  • pingping Posts: 3,297
    edited September 2022
    Stupid decision by the BoE to delay their rates meeting.

    It’s;

    A) Their Job. Do it.
    B ) Expected and anticipated by the markets and those they have a duty to serve, the British people. Delaying it at short notice doesn’t inspire confidence.
    C) During a very important period where significant, perhaps unprecedented rate changes are on the table.
    D) Going ahead as scheduled is not going to offend anyone.

    The world doesn’t stop when the monarch dies. Neither should the BoE. I recon this was decision was made long ago, with the assumption that QE would die during a period of market calm.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 8,142
    Leon said:

    I’m surprised if no in Britain cares - as @cookie claims/says - because out here in Portugal they talk about it a lot. As soon as they hear you are British, they trot out a Queen anecdote and frown or sigh or look sad, and they WANT to discuss how it makes them feel. Generally that is: moved and a bit melancholy - “she’s been there all my life” etc

    it feels like one of those universal moments. Not a total shock like 9/11 but nonetheless a shared experience, certainly for anyone over about 45, from what I’ve seen

    I wouldn't claim no one cares. Clealry lots of people do. But from my limited sample size, no one in the outside world particularly wants to talk about it. Maybe they are genuinely indifferent. Maybe it's too big a subject for small talk. Maybe other things are more important to them. Maybe it's just a small sample size.
    I can imagine foreigners talking about it more though.
  • ydoethur said:

    I doubt in Liz Truss's wildest imagination could she ever have expected to deliver that reading, just 3 days after becoming Prime Minister.

    My wife has just said she is really growing into her role.

    Well, you have been married to her for a very long time!
    Indeed - 60 years in 2024 with congratulations from the new King
    'New?' Are you suggesting this 'lifetime' Charles just pledged might be rather shorter than expected?
    I really value your wise words and have deleted new

    Thank you
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 56,756
    kle4 said:

    According to an admittedly patch wikipedia list Charles's personal net worth was almost that of the Queen, so I guess he'll nearly double depending how things are apportioned.

    I doubt it. Most of that would be the Duchy of Cornwall which now becomes William's.
  • I doubt in Liz Truss's wildest imagination could she ever have expected to deliver that reading, just 3 days after becoming Prime Minister.

    My wife has just said she is really growing into her role.

    According to Beth Rigby, SKS delivered the greatest speech since the Gettysburg address in parliament
    She went on a bizarre fangirling spree
    Hardly surprising
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 56,756

    ydoethur said:

    I doubt in Liz Truss's wildest imagination could she ever have expected to deliver that reading, just 3 days after becoming Prime Minister.

    My wife has just said she is really growing into her role.

    Well, you have been married to her for a very long time!
    Indeed - 60 years in 2024 with congratulations from the new King
    'New?' Are you suggesting this 'lifetime' Charles just pledged might be rather shorter than expected?
    I really value your wise words and have deleted new

    Thank you
    If that was a touch of sarcasm it was well deserved! :smile:

    Anyway, I have to go. Enjoy the rest of the service.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,650
    edited September 2022
    ping said:

    Stupid decision by the BoE to delay their rates meeting.

    It’s;

    A) Their Job. Do it.
    B ) Expected and anticipated by the markets and those they have a duty to serve, the British people. Delaying it at short notice doesn’t inspire confidence.
    C) Going ahead as scheduled is not going to offend anyone.

    The world doesn’t stop when the monarchy does. Neither should the BoE.

    I suspect they are hoping for deets in the energy CoL intervention and more on how it might impact inflation to 'guide' them
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 23,356
    Sandpit said:

    Wow, what an astonishing speech. How he managed to keep himself composed for that, when nearly everyone watching him was reaching for the tissues.

    It was an excellent speech. Beautifully judged and delivered.

    Who are the people in St Paul's? Members of the public or invited guests?
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 4,200
    edited September 2022
    biggles said:

    dodrade said:

    Perfectly judged by Charles. Excellent.

    A popular theory/wish among anti-royalists has been that the Queen's popularity was largely personal and would not be inherited by Charles, I think they will be sorely disappointed.
    God Save The King.
    That’s the secret weapon of a monarchy. There’s no time to think about it. The Queen is dead. God Save the King. And he just did his job perfectly.
    I have said that for years when people have said to me that the monarchy would end with QEII. The constitutional apparatus accepts the change so quickly, and people are swept along with it, that it becomes much harder to advocate for change.

    The machinery of state springs into gear. New king new coins new stamps. Services and ceremonies routed in over 1000 years of tradition. Coronation planning. The novelty of the old immediately giving way to the new, but paradoxically with a feeling of timeless continuity.


  • ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    I doubt in Liz Truss's wildest imagination could she ever have expected to deliver that reading, just 3 days after becoming Prime Minister.

    My wife has just said she is really growing into her role.

    Well, you have been married to her for a very long time!
    Indeed - 60 years in 2024 with congratulations from the new King
    'New?' Are you suggesting this 'lifetime' Charles just pledged might be rather shorter than expected?
    I really value your wise words and have deleted new

    Thank you
    If that was a touch of sarcasm it was well deserved! :smile:

    Anyway, I have to go. Enjoy the rest of the service.
    No - absolutely not - you were so correct
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 32,978
    edited September 2022

    kinabalu said:

    Perfectly judged by Charles. Excellent.

    Almost too good. You think, "ok cool, what's the big deal, we move on."
    Which is the job. Stability, continuity and reassurance.

    He's done good.

    And note the significance of what he's pledged: lifelong service just like The Queen.

    That's a huge vow, and a very serious one.
    Yes that's the slight conflict I seek to highlight. Queen very very special vs Charles slots in and BAU. There is a necessary doublethink there.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 1,909
    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    Good address by King Charles. Paid tribute to his mother and also looked ahead to his new role. Interesting too he has now decided to give up his charity work in terms of his personal involvement, not surprising given his new duties.

    William as expected created the new Prince of Wales and a greeting for Harry and Meghan too

    "give up his charity work" is code for "no more carrier bags full of dollars from the Gulf."
    Luckily in a couple of years time when he tries to pay in a bag of large pound notes in the bank and they ask him for ID he will be able to raise an eyebrow and hold up the note by his face. So not all bad.
  • Cyclefree said:

    Sandpit said:

    Wow, what an astonishing speech. How he managed to keep himself composed for that, when nearly everyone watching him was reaching for the tissues.

    It was an excellent speech. Beautifully judged and delivered.

    Who are the people in St Paul's? Members of the public or invited guests?
    Members of the public

    A lovely service
  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,637
    Well King Charles brought me close to blubbing. He never did that as Prince

    Well played
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,650

    I doubt in Liz Truss's wildest imagination could she ever have expected to deliver that reading, just 3 days after becoming Prime Minister.

    My wife has just said she is really growing into her role.

    According to Beth Rigby, SKS delivered the greatest speech since the Gettysburg address in parliament
    She went on a bizarre fangirling spree
    Hardly surprising
    Tbf it was good but it was hardly a tour de force
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    kinabalu said:

    biggles said:

    kinabalu said:

    Driver said:

    William is made Prince of Wales.

    What about sword on bonce at a big Welsh castle?

    Until I see that, he isn't.
    I wondered about that bit. Presumably they will do the investiture stuff next year around his Coronation.
    Not sure they'll do one. Might choose to scale down that sort of thing.
    Yes. Sorry to share my own lived truth with our many and valued Welsh members, but faced with the choice between going to Wales and not going to Wales, I have always found the decision a comparatively easy one.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,637
    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    I’m surprised if no in Britain cares - as @cookie claims/says - because out here in Portugal they talk about it a lot. As soon as they hear you are British, they trot out a Queen anecdote and frown or sigh or look sad, and they WANT to discuss how it makes them feel. Generally that is: moved and a bit melancholy - “she’s been there all my life” etc

    it feels like one of those universal moments. Not a total shock like 9/11 but nonetheless a shared experience, certainly for anyone over about 45, from what I’ve seen

    I wouldn't claim no one cares. Clealry lots of people do. But from my limited sample size, no one in the outside world particularly wants to talk about it. Maybe they are genuinely indifferent. Maybe it's too big a subject for small talk. Maybe other things are more important to them. Maybe it's just a small sample size.
    I can imagine foreigners talking about it more though.
    My guess is that it is too big and touchy a subject for many to dwell on in person. You might offend someone else by being too sad or too indifferent. So avoid it

    Also it’s “death”. Quite depressing


    Certainly my UK WhatsApp groups are full of chat and emotion. A lot of people feeling it. But that’s very different to emoting one to one
  • DynamoDynamo Posts: 651

    I doubt in Liz Truss's wildest imagination could she ever have expected to deliver that reading, just 3 days after becoming Prime Minister.

    My wife has just said she is really growing into her role.

    According to Beth Rigby, SKS delivered the greatest speech since the Gettysburg address in parliament
    She went on a bizarre fangirling spree
    Brilliant.

    The greatest speech since the Gettyburg address, in honour of one of the greatest leaders the world has ever known.

    I want more!

    When this vomit-inducing bubble bursts...
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 42,503

    Sandpit said:

    Nigelb said:

    Blimey.
    https://mobile.twitter.com/CalibreObscura/status/1568282616373059586
    Amazing video of a Russian T-72 fleeing Ukrainian troops, discarding men and then crashing into a tree.

    Videos out of Ukraine yesterday and today, have cheered me up no end at a sad time. :smile:
    Some years back I knew a chap who did corporate event days of tank driving - actually Abbotts, striped out.

    He said the the joy of watching what people would do was only tempered by the knowledge that he would have to fire up his Centurion recovery vehicle to drag the vehicle out of the woods/ditch/etc

    EDIT: Watching the video again - something wrong with the driver (injured? dead?), the rest of the crew bails out?
    I’ve done one of those corporate days. The ‘tank’ was an old thing, can’t remember exactly what it was, but remember the controls were very weird. You have one foot-operated throttle and two hand-operated brakes, one for each track, which are used differentially to steer the thing. More difficult than it looks, especially when you get some speed up!
  • FlannerFlanner Posts: 359
    TOPPING said:

    Great speech delivered extremely well. I won't be the only one impressed and I've long been a fan.

    All those "skip a generation" types can fuck off.

    I've never been a fan of Charles - but his speech struck all the right notes (Meghan: listen and learn) and was delivered with dignity and presence (Liz T: ditto). Less sure about his repeating his mother's silly 1947 commitment not to abdicate. There's now a real risk William won't be able to take over for another quarter-century.

    Otherwise a start as surprisingly accomplished as Liz T's Monday acceptance speech was astonishingly awful.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Perfectly judged by Charles. Excellent.

    Almost too good. You think, "ok cool, what's the big deal, we move on."
    Which is the job. Stability, continuity and reassurance.

    He's done good.

    And note the significance of what he's pledged: lifelong service just like The Queen.

    That's a huge vow, and a very serious one.
    Yes that's the slight conflict I seek to highlight. Queen very very special vs Charles slots in and BAU. There is a necessary doublethink there.
    Trouble is the better Charles looks, the more I end up thinking that Baldy is a bit of a pudding and getting a free pass on the back of his wife's looks.
  • Flanner said:

    TOPPING said:

    Great speech delivered extremely well. I won't be the only one impressed and I've long been a fan.

    All those "skip a generation" types can fuck off.

    I've never been a fan of Charles - but his speech struck all the right notes (Meghan: listen and learn) and was delivered with dignity and presence (Liz T: ditto). Less sure about his repeating his mother's silly 1947 commitment not to abdicate. There's now a real risk William won't be able to take over for another quarter-century.

    Otherwise a start as surprisingly accomplished as Liz T's Monday acceptance speech was astonishingly awful.
    Gosh that was only Monday.

    Feels about 3 years ago.

  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Nigelb said:

    Blimey.
    https://mobile.twitter.com/CalibreObscura/status/1568282616373059586
    Amazing video of a Russian T-72 fleeing Ukrainian troops, discarding men and then crashing into a tree.

    Videos out of Ukraine yesterday and today, have cheered me up no end at a sad time. :smile:
    Some years back I knew a chap who did corporate event days of tank driving - actually Abbotts, striped out.

    He said the the joy of watching what people would do was only tempered by the knowledge that he would have to fire up his Centurion recovery vehicle to drag the vehicle out of the woods/ditch/etc

    EDIT: Watching the video again - something wrong with the driver (injured? dead?), the rest of the crew bails out?
    I’ve done one of those corporate days. The ‘tank’ was an old thing, can’t remember exactly what it was, but remember the controls were very weird. You have one foot-operated throttle and two hand-operated brakes, one for each track, which are used differentially to steer the thing. More difficult than it looks, especially when you get some speed up!
    Speed is actually the key to track steering. Doesn't work without.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 15,154
    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Driver said:

    William is made Prince of Wales.

    What about sword on bonce at a big Welsh castle?

    Until I see that, he isn't.
    Caernarfon hopefully
    Yep - but needs to learn the language first. So it might not be for a while.
    Prince Charles made him learn Welsh - said he thought it was quite important for a future Prince of Wales.

    I'm not qualified to say whether it is just 'read out a speech' or conversations.

    Didn't the couple live on Ynys Môn when they were first married for a couple of years, and he was a Helicopter Search an Rescue pilot?

    Not a very good example:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLzkP_x6EFE
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 32,978
    IshmaelZ said:

    kinabalu said:

    biggles said:

    kinabalu said:

    Driver said:

    William is made Prince of Wales.

    What about sword on bonce at a big Welsh castle?

    Until I see that, he isn't.
    I wondered about that bit. Presumably they will do the investiture stuff next year around his Coronation.
    Not sure they'll do one. Might choose to scale down that sort of thing.
    Yes. Sorry to share my own lived truth with our many and valued Welsh members, but faced with the choice between going to Wales and not going to Wales, I have always found the decision a comparatively easy one.
    I'll let BigG take that one!
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 20,052
    Leon said:

    I’m surprised if no in Britain cares - as @cookie claims/says - because out here in Portugal they talk about it a lot. As soon as they hear you are British, they trot out a Queen anecdote and frown or sigh or look sad, and they WANT to discuss how it makes them feel. Generally that is: moved and a bit melancholy - “she’s been there all my life” etc

    it feels like one of those universal moments. Not a total shock like 9/11 but nonetheless a shared experience, certainly for anyone over about 45, from what I’ve seen

    It's uncontroversial news about a popular Briton, so a natural subject to bring up if you're meeting someone British, in the same way as we might commiserate with an American and offer some thoughts if President Biden died.. But do you think the Portugese discuss her among themselves? Nice if they did, but I'd be a bit surprised.
  • MattW said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Driver said:

    William is made Prince of Wales.

    What about sword on bonce at a big Welsh castle?

    Until I see that, he isn't.
    Caernarfon hopefully
    Yep - but needs to learn the language first. So it might not be for a while.
    Prince Charles made him learn Welsh - said he thought it was quite important for a future Prince of Wales.

    I'm not qualified to say whether it is just 'read out a speech' or conversations.

    Didn't the couple live on Ynys Môn when they were first married for a couple of years, and he was a Helicopter Search an Rescue pilot?

    Not a very good example:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLzkP_x6EFE
    Yes - he was at RAF Valley
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 42,503
    edited September 2022
    Cyclefree said:

    Sandpit said:

    Wow, what an astonishing speech. How he managed to keep himself composed for that, when nearly everyone watching him was reaching for the tissues.

    It was an excellent speech. Beautifully judged and delivered.

    Who are the people in St Paul's? Members of the public or invited guests?
    They’re all public, apart from the politicians. Waited outside all day, according to the intro at the start of the service.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,650
    Liz Truss has gone past the Earl of Baths 2 day attempt to form a government in 1746. I suspect she has accomplished several times more than him in history inches in the same period!
  • biggles said:

    dodrade said:

    Perfectly judged by Charles. Excellent.

    A popular theory/wish among anti-royalists has been that the Queen's popularity was largely personal and would not be inherited by Charles, I think they will be sorely disappointed.
    God Save The King.
    That’s the secret weapon of a monarchy. There’s no time to think about it. The Queen is dead. God Save the King. And he just did his job perfectly.
    We're going to be ok.

    Britain is an ancient and strong nation that still matters, and has a very important and positive role to play in the future development of humanity going forwards.

    Long live the King.
    Apart from Nicholas Witchell wittering on, the thing that’s set my teeth on edge has been journalists pontificating about how this comes at a time of great uncertainty for the country with its imminent break up, the cost of living crisis etc etc (the worst was a France24 correspondent talking about “soaring suicides”).

    We’re a big, prosperous peaceful country with a functioning democracy that 95% of the planet would gratefully swap places with. Yes we face challenges - as all countries do - but we’ve just peacefully changed both head of state AND head of government in the space of a few days. As Adam Smith remarked to a panic prone student “there’s a lot of ruin in a nation”.
  • DougSeal said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    Perfectly judged by Charles. Excellent.

    We talk about a new incumbency bounce for PMs.

    I wonder if we will get one for Charles now he's King?
    Perhaps I can offer a key difference. Charles is following in the footsteps of a legend. Truss is following in Johnson's footsteps.
    Oh, he's a legend all right.

    Just as Mordred is.
    Liz Truss smashing Romans. Johnson must be spitting feathers. The Queen trolled him to the end. What an awesome lady!
    Is the PM assaulting some Italian tourists? What’s going on?
    The rituals at moments like this can seem odd.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 32,978
    Leon said:

    Well King Charles brought me close to blubbing. He never did that as Prince

    Well played

    That's because he never was Prince.
  • kinabalu said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    kinabalu said:

    biggles said:

    kinabalu said:

    Driver said:

    William is made Prince of Wales.

    What about sword on bonce at a big Welsh castle?

    Until I see that, he isn't.
    I wondered about that bit. Presumably they will do the investiture stuff next year around his Coronation.
    Not sure they'll do one. Might choose to scale down that sort of thing.
    Yes. Sorry to share my own lived truth with our many and valued Welsh members, but faced with the choice between going to Wales and not going to Wales, I have always found the decision a comparatively easy one.
    I'll let BigG take that one!
    With a gentle reminder that Wales is a beautiful country with a great welcome
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 82,567
    Amazing how people can have very mixed reactions. Relative of mine was commenting how they didn't mind the queen, but are not a royalist and don't see why we need a monarchy at all, that they live in great estates and palaces and do nothing so it is all pointless...yet they were still super mad about Camilla being queen, as an insult to Diana.
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 1,816
    Biden says he'll be attending the funeral.
  • Liz Truss has gone past the Earl of Baths 2 day attempt to form a government in 1746. I suspect she has accomplished several times more than him in history inches in the same period!

    As “first week in the office”‘s go, I think Liz has had a more interesting one than most.
  • DynamoDynamo Posts: 651
    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    Good address by King Charles. Paid tribute to his mother and also looked ahead to his new role. Interesting too he has now decided to give up his charity work in terms of his personal involvement, not surprising given his new duties.

    William as expected created the new Prince of Wales and a greeting for Harry and Meghan too

    "give up his charity work" is code for "no more carrier bags full of dollars from the Gulf."
    Did the Met ever conclude its investigation into "cash for honours" at the Prince's Foundation? Toothpaste Squeezer resigned as chief executive over that scandal.
  • kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Perfectly judged by Charles. Excellent.

    Almost too good. You think, "ok cool, what's the big deal, we move on."
    Which is the job. Stability, continuity and reassurance.

    He's done good.

    And note the significance of what he's pledged: lifelong service just like The Queen.

    That's a huge vow, and a very serious one.
    Yes that's the slight conflict I seek to highlight. Queen very very special vs Charles slots in and BAU. There is a necessary doublethink there.
    He can't replace HMQ. She was exceptional. We all know that.

    He can reassure us all and do the job to the best of his ability.

    What more can we ask of him? What more can we ask of anyone?
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,650
    edited September 2022

    Liz Truss has gone past the Earl of Baths 2 day attempt to form a government in 1746. I suspect she has accomplished several times more than him in history inches in the same period!

    As “first week in the office”‘s go, I think Liz has had a more interesting one than most.
    She equals the other 'failed administration' of Waldegrave tomorrow then its the long overhaul of Canning on Boxing Day!
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 42,503
    IshmaelZ said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Nigelb said:

    Blimey.
    https://mobile.twitter.com/CalibreObscura/status/1568282616373059586
    Amazing video of a Russian T-72 fleeing Ukrainian troops, discarding men and then crashing into a tree.

    Videos out of Ukraine yesterday and today, have cheered me up no end at a sad time. :smile:
    Some years back I knew a chap who did corporate event days of tank driving - actually Abbotts, striped out.

    He said the the joy of watching what people would do was only tempered by the knowledge that he would have to fire up his Centurion recovery vehicle to drag the vehicle out of the woods/ditch/etc

    EDIT: Watching the video again - something wrong with the driver (injured? dead?), the rest of the crew bails out?
    I’ve done one of those corporate days. The ‘tank’ was an old thing, can’t remember exactly what it was, but remember the controls were very weird. You have one foot-operated throttle and two hand-operated brakes, one for each track, which are used differentially to steer the thing. More difficult than it looks, especially when you get some speed up!
    Speed is actually the key to track steering. Doesn't work without.
    Yes, I could see that the speed was useful - but, like when learning to fly a plane, the difficult bit is getting mentally ahead of the vehicle, which takes seat time and concentration!
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Dynamo said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    Good address by King Charles. Paid tribute to his mother and also looked ahead to his new role. Interesting too he has now decided to give up his charity work in terms of his personal involvement, not surprising given his new duties.

    William as expected created the new Prince of Wales and a greeting for Harry and Meghan too

    "give up his charity work" is code for "no more carrier bags full of dollars from the Gulf."
    Did the Met ever conclude its investigation into "cash for honours" at the Prince's Foundation? Toothpaste Squeezer resigned as chief executive over that scandal.
    Any criminal investigation into Charles became a nullity at about lunch time yesterday. Errare non potest Rex.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 29,308

    I doubt in Liz Truss's wildest imagination could she ever have expected to deliver that reading, just 3 days after becoming Prime Minister.

    My wife has just said she is really growing into her role.

    Well, you have been married to her for a very long time!
    Indeed - 60 years in 2024 with congratulations from the King
    Must have one of the last Elizabeth ones! And my friends mother must have one of the last centenary ones!

  • kinabalu said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    kinabalu said:

    biggles said:

    kinabalu said:

    Driver said:

    William is made Prince of Wales.

    What about sword on bonce at a big Welsh castle?

    Until I see that, he isn't.
    I wondered about that bit. Presumably they will do the investiture stuff next year around his Coronation.
    Not sure they'll do one. Might choose to scale down that sort of thing.
    Yes. Sorry to share my own lived truth with our many and valued Welsh members, but faced with the choice between going to Wales and not going to Wales, I have always found the decision a comparatively easy one.
    I'll let BigG take that one!
    With a gentle reminder that Wales is a beautiful country with a great welcome
    "Put the car away; when life fails
    What's the good of going to Wales?
    Here am I, here are you:
    But what does it mean? What are we going to do?"

  • Cyclefree said:

    The bagpipes are a lovely touch.

    As someone remarked over one of the Platinum Jubilee events, when the late Queen was involved “nothing happens by accident”.
  • kle4 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Why was Kemi Badenoch overlooked for education secretary?
    Neil Davenport"

    https://www.spiked-online.com/2022/09/09/why-was-kemi-badenoch-overlooked-for-education-secretary/

    One might argue that being given Trade, which made Truss's reputation (fairly or not), would be far from being overlooked.
    Given that Education is one of the departments about to suffer from a severe case of No Money, it's a bullet dodged. (In the same way, I'm surprised that Coffey, who is meant to be a mate, has been given the bullet labelled Health.)

    Besides, if KB had been EdSec, she'd end up having to admit that half her "woke teachers" claims were tosh and the other half were insoluble.
  • DynamoDynamo Posts: 651
    edited September 2022
    kle4 said:

    Amazing how people can have very mixed reactions. Relative of mine was commenting how they didn't mind the queen, but are not a royalist and don't see why we need a monarchy at all, that they live in great estates and palaces and do nothing so it is all pointless...yet they were still super mad about Camilla being queen, as an insult to Diana.

    It's possible she'll be called the queen consort in the media, which is absolutely not normal at all even if it's the official title. E.g. the woman who was later called the "Queen Mother" was called "the queen" when her husband got his a*** on the throne after the 1936 abdication, and her mother-in-law Mary was called "the queen" too when she was in a similar position. If Camilla is routinely called "the Queen Consort" that will probably have more to do with her husband not wanting her to upstage him, than anything to do with Diana, except insofar as he used to feel Diana was upstaging him too.
  • Leon said:

    I’m surprised if no in Britain cares - as @cookie claims/says - because out here in Portugal they talk about it a lot. As soon as they hear you are British, they trot out a Queen anecdote and frown or sigh or look sad, and they WANT to discuss how it makes them feel. Generally that is: moved and a bit melancholy - “she’s been there all my life” etc

    it feels like one of those universal moments. Not a total shock like 9/11 but nonetheless a shared experience, certainly for anyone over about 45, from what I’ve seen

    It's uncontroversial news about a popular Briton, so a natural subject to bring up if you're meeting someone British, in the same way as we might commiserate with an American and offer some thoughts if President Biden died.. But do you think the Portugese discuss her among themselves? Nice if they did, but I'd be a bit surprised.
    I think they would be, yes, definitely. This is the passing of arguably the most famous person in the world, whom almost everyone in the world has heard of for as long as most people in the world have been alive.

    Just as if the President of the United States died then I think we'd in this country be talking about it, even if no Americans were present. And not just us politics geeks either.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 42,503
    CatMan said:

    Biden says he'll be attending the funeral.

    The funeral is likely to be the largest gathering of Heads of State in decades. I reckon at least half the world’s leaders will be there, over 100.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,110
    Dynamo said:

    kle4 said:

    Amazing how people can have very mixed reactions. Relative of mine was commenting how they didn't mind the queen, but are not a royalist and don't see why we need a monarchy at all, that they live in great estates and palaces and do nothing so it is all pointless...yet they were still super mad about Camilla being queen, as an insult to Diana.

    It's possible she'll be called the queen consort in the media, which is absolutely not normal at all even if it's the official title. E.g. the woman who was called the "Queen Mother" was called "the queen" when her husband got his a*** on the throne after the 1936 abdication, and her mother-in-law Mary was called "the queen" too when she was in a similar position. If Camilla is routinely called "the Queen Consort" that will probably have more to do with her husband not wanting her to upstage him, than anything to do with Diana, except insofar as he used to feel Diana was upstaging him too.
    I think it's formulated like this at the moment to avoid confusion. I doubt it's got anything to do with Charles' ego.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 32,978
    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    I’m surprised if no in Britain cares - as @cookie claims/says - because out here in Portugal they talk about it a lot. As soon as they hear you are British, they trot out a Queen anecdote and frown or sigh or look sad, and they WANT to discuss how it makes them feel. Generally that is: moved and a bit melancholy - “she’s been there all my life” etc

    it feels like one of those universal moments. Not a total shock like 9/11 but nonetheless a shared experience, certainly for anyone over about 45, from what I’ve seen

    I wouldn't claim no one cares. Clealry lots of people do. But from my limited sample size, no one in the outside world particularly wants to talk about it. Maybe they are genuinely indifferent. Maybe it's too big a subject for small talk. Maybe other things are more important to them. Maybe it's just a small sample size.
    I can imagine foreigners talking about it more though.
    I think it's just not a thing to particularly talk about face to face because there's not a great deal to say.
  • Leon said:

    I’m surprised if no in Britain cares - as @cookie claims/says - because out here in Portugal they talk about it a lot. As soon as they hear you are British, they trot out a Queen anecdote and frown or sigh or look sad, and they WANT to discuss how it makes them feel. Generally that is: moved and a bit melancholy - “she’s been there all my life” etc

    it feels like one of those universal moments. Not a total shock like 9/11 but nonetheless a shared experience, certainly for anyone over about 45, from what I’ve seen

    It's uncontroversial news about a popular Briton, so a natural subject to bring up if you're meeting someone British, in the same way as we might commiserate with an American and offer some thoughts if President Biden died.. But do you think the Portugese discuss her among themselves? Nice if they did, but I'd be a bit surprised.
    I'm just finishing a Portuguese holiday, and the TV screens here seem to be non-stop Queen Elizabeth.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 15,154

    biggles said:

    dodrade said:

    Perfectly judged by Charles. Excellent.

    A popular theory/wish among anti-royalists has been that the Queen's popularity was largely personal and would not be inherited by Charles, I think they will be sorely disappointed.
    God Save The King.
    That’s the secret weapon of a monarchy. There’s no time to think about it. The Queen is dead. God Save the King. And he just did his job perfectly.
    We're going to be ok.

    Britain is an ancient and strong nation that still matters, and has a very important and positive role to play in the future development of humanity going forwards.

    Long live the King.
    Apart from Nicholas Witchell wittering on, the thing that’s set my teeth on edge has been journalists pontificating about how this comes at a time of great uncertainty for the country with its imminent break up, the cost of living crisis etc etc (the worst was a France24 correspondent talking about “soaring suicides”).

    We’re a big, prosperous peaceful country with a functioning democracy that 95% of the planet would gratefully swap places with. Yes we face challenges - as all countries do - but we’ve just peacefully changed both head of state AND head of government in the space of a few days. As Adam Smith remarked to a panic prone student “there’s a lot of ruin in a nation”.
    There was on there talking about our 'collapsing economy' the other day before recent events.

    Quite enjoyed that he was called Douglas Herbert.

    Anyhoo - need to go shopping before all the shops close for mourning.
  • I doubt in Liz Truss's wildest imagination could she ever have expected to deliver that reading, just 3 days after becoming Prime Minister.

    My wife has just said she is really growing into her role.

    Well, you have been married to her for a very long time!
    Indeed - 60 years in 2024 with congratulations from the King
    Must have one of the last Elizabeth ones! And my friends mother must have one of the last centenary ones!

    My wife is helping organise a birthday party for someone who turns 100 on Monday. They already have the card from the Queen, which is a little odd but they're organised months in advance.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,650

    biggles said:

    dodrade said:

    Perfectly judged by Charles. Excellent.

    A popular theory/wish among anti-royalists has been that the Queen's popularity was largely personal and would not be inherited by Charles, I think they will be sorely disappointed.
    God Save The King.
    That’s the secret weapon of a monarchy. There’s no time to think about it. The Queen is dead. God Save the King. And he just did his job perfectly.
    We're going to be ok.

    Britain is an ancient and strong nation that still matters, and has a very important and positive role to play in the future development of humanity going forwards.

    Long live the King.
    Apart from Nicholas Witchell wittering on, the thing that’s set my teeth on edge has been journalists pontificating about how this comes at a time of great uncertainty for the country with its imminent break up, the cost of living crisis etc etc (the worst was a France24 correspondent talking about “soaring suicides”).

    We’re a big, prosperous peaceful country with a functioning democracy that 95% of the planet would gratefully swap places with. Yes we face challenges - as all countries do - but we’ve just peacefully changed both head of state AND head of government in the space of a few days. As Adam Smith remarked to a panic prone student “there’s a lot of ruin in a nation”.
    Exactly.

    I heard an American say precisely this. We seem more stable to them than they are for this very reason.

    The whole point of Britain is that it's as stable stoic, solid, fair and reliable as fuck.

    That's basically what being British is.
    Perhaps much of the emotional turmoil and anxiety is the fear that without our 70 year rock and glue does it all start to fall apart?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 42,503
    edited September 2022
    God Save The King, sung for the first time.
  • Leon said:

    I’m surprised if no in Britain cares - as @cookie claims/says - because out here in Portugal they talk about it a lot. As soon as they hear you are British, they trot out a Queen anecdote and frown or sigh or look sad, and they WANT to discuss how it makes them feel. Generally that is: moved and a bit melancholy - “she’s been there all my life” etc

    it feels like one of those universal moments. Not a total shock like 9/11 but nonetheless a shared experience, certainly for anyone over about 45, from what I’ve seen

    It's uncontroversial news about a popular Briton, so a natural subject to bring up if you're meeting someone British, in the same way as we might commiserate with an American and offer some thoughts if President Biden died.. But do you think the Portugese discuss her among themselves? Nice if they did, but I'd be a bit surprised.
    I'm just finishing a Portuguese holiday, and the TV screens here seem to be non-stop Queen Elizabeth.
    You know who else has been in Portugal this week?

    Tell us you didn't spend yesterday doing a long walk...
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 82,567

    I doubt in Liz Truss's wildest imagination could she ever have expected to deliver that reading, just 3 days after becoming Prime Minister.

    My wife has just said she is really growing into her role.

    Well, you have been married to her for a very long time!
    Indeed - 60 years in 2024 with congratulations from the King
    Must have one of the last Elizabeth ones! And my friends mother must have one of the last centenary ones!

    My wife is helping organise a birthday party for someone who turns 100 on Monday. They already have the card from the Queen, which is a little odd but they're organised months in advance.
    Still serving even in death, what a trooper!
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 1,816
    Sandpit said:

    CatMan said:

    Biden says he'll be attending the funeral.

    The funeral is likely to be the largest gathering of Heads of State in decades. I reckon at least half the world’s leaders will be there, over 100.
    Do you think it's possible Zelensky could go? Or is that just not possible (for obvious reasons)?
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,110

    Leon said:

    I’m surprised if no in Britain cares - as @cookie claims/says - because out here in Portugal they talk about it a lot. As soon as they hear you are British, they trot out a Queen anecdote and frown or sigh or look sad, and they WANT to discuss how it makes them feel. Generally that is: moved and a bit melancholy - “she’s been there all my life” etc

    it feels like one of those universal moments. Not a total shock like 9/11 but nonetheless a shared experience, certainly for anyone over about 45, from what I’ve seen

    It's uncontroversial news about a popular Briton, so a natural subject to bring up if you're meeting someone British, in the same way as we might commiserate with an American and offer some thoughts if President Biden died.. But do you think the Portugese discuss her among themselves? Nice if they did, but I'd be a bit surprised.
    I'm just finishing a Portuguese holiday, and the TV screens here seem to be non-stop Queen Elizabeth.
    You know who else has been in Portugal this week?

    Tell us you didn't spend yesterday doing a long walk...
    Someone's got to keep an eye on him at all times.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 6,778
    Liz Truss's first week has still a few days to run, and she has most of her first volume of memoirs already.

    Saturday: Joint China Russia nuclear attack on London and Edinburgh
    Sunday: Martians invade and occupy Westminster and all defence installations
    Monday: Asteroid heading for Birmingham in 8 hours.

    And that's the week done.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,110
    algarkirk said:

    Liz Truss's first week has still a few days to run, and she has most of her first volume of memoirs already.

    Saturday: Joint China Russia nuclear attack on London and Edinburgh
    Sunday: Martians invade and occupy Westminster and all defence installations
    Monday: Asteroid heading for Birmingham in 8 hours.

    And that's the week done.

    So, 24 hours to save the NHS?
  • Leon said:

    I’m surprised if no in Britain cares - as @cookie claims/says - because out here in Portugal they talk about it a lot. As soon as they hear you are British, they trot out a Queen anecdote and frown or sigh or look sad, and they WANT to discuss how it makes them feel. Generally that is: moved and a bit melancholy - “she’s been there all my life” etc

    it feels like one of those universal moments. Not a total shock like 9/11 but nonetheless a shared experience, certainly for anyone over about 45, from what I’ve seen

    It's uncontroversial news about a popular Briton, so a natural subject to bring up if you're meeting someone British, in the same way as we might commiserate with an American and offer some thoughts if President Biden died.. But do you think the Portugese discuss her among themselves? Nice if they did, but I'd be a bit surprised.
    I'm just finishing a Portuguese holiday, and the TV screens here seem to be non-stop Queen Elizabeth.
    You know who else has been in Portugal this week?

    Tell us you didn't spend yesterday doing a long walk...
    I did...
  • ChrisChris Posts: 9,073
    kinabalu said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    I’m surprised if no in Britain cares - as @cookie claims/says - because out here in Portugal they talk about it a lot. As soon as they hear you are British, they trot out a Queen anecdote and frown or sigh or look sad, and they WANT to discuss how it makes them feel. Generally that is: moved and a bit melancholy - “she’s been there all my life” etc

    it feels like one of those universal moments. Not a total shock like 9/11 but nonetheless a shared experience, certainly for anyone over about 45, from what I’ve seen

    I wouldn't claim no one cares. Clealry lots of people do. But from my limited sample size, no one in the outside world particularly wants to talk about it. Maybe they are genuinely indifferent. Maybe it's too big a subject for small talk. Maybe other things are more important to them. Maybe it's just a small sample size.
    I can imagine foreigners talking about it more though.
    I think it's just not a thing to particularly talk about face to face because there's not a great deal to say.
    The BBC tried to have a live conversation about it yesterday and ended up talking about the weather.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 82,567
    OK, I did genuinely in my head mess up the 'Send him victorious' line as 'send her'. Repetition has an effect.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 6,778
    Is Liz Truss a lucky general? She is going to spend her first month or so effectively immune from impactful criticism, by pure act of god.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 19,093
    IshmaelZ said:

    kinabalu said:

    biggles said:

    kinabalu said:

    Driver said:

    William is made Prince of Wales.

    What about sword on bonce at a big Welsh castle?

    Until I see that, he isn't.
    I wondered about that bit. Presumably they will do the investiture stuff next year around his Coronation.
    Not sure they'll do one. Might choose to scale down that sort of thing.
    Yes. Sorry to share my own lived truth with our many and valued Welsh members, but faced with the choice between going to Wales and not going to Wales, I have always found the decision a comparatively easy one.
    Who invited you here anyway?
  • IshmaelZ said:

    kinabalu said:

    biggles said:

    kinabalu said:

    Driver said:

    William is made Prince of Wales.

    What about sword on bonce at a big Welsh castle?

    Until I see that, he isn't.
    I wondered about that bit. Presumably they will do the investiture stuff next year around his Coronation.
    Not sure they'll do one. Might choose to scale down that sort of thing.
    Yes. Sorry to share my own lived truth with our many and valued Welsh members, but faced with the choice between going to Wales and not going to Wales, I have always found the decision a comparatively easy one.
    Who invited you here anyway?
    I did and if he wants to come and enjoy out wonderful country
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    RobD said:

    Dynamo said:

    kle4 said:

    Amazing how people can have very mixed reactions. Relative of mine was commenting how they didn't mind the queen, but are not a royalist and don't see why we need a monarchy at all, that they live in great estates and palaces and do nothing so it is all pointless...yet they were still super mad about Camilla being queen, as an insult to Diana.

    It's possible she'll be called the queen consort in the media, which is absolutely not normal at all even if it's the official title. E.g. the woman who was called the "Queen Mother" was called "the queen" when her husband got his a*** on the throne after the 1936 abdication, and her mother-in-law Mary was called "the queen" too when she was in a similar position. If Camilla is routinely called "the Queen Consort" that will probably have more to do with her husband not wanting her to upstage him, than anything to do with Diana, except insofar as he used to feel Diana was upstaging him too.
    I think it's formulated like this at the moment to avoid confusion. I doubt it's got anything to do with Charles' ego.
    It is wariness over Di. there's an unexploded Diana bomb which now probably isn't going to go off, but there were times when that really wasn't foreseeable. Camilla has been Princess of Wales for 17 years but it was felt better to gloss over the fact, and this is more of the same. Dynamo is clearly too young to have heard if Di unless he did her for O levels.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 82,567
    Turns out there's more than one verse to God Save the King - apparently verse 3 is the first one to actually expect something from the King, not just us wishing them well in their endeavours, as they are supposed to defend our laws.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    IshmaelZ said:

    kinabalu said:

    biggles said:

    kinabalu said:

    Driver said:

    William is made Prince of Wales.

    What about sword on bonce at a big Welsh castle?

    Until I see that, he isn't.
    I wondered about that bit. Presumably they will do the investiture stuff next year around his Coronation.
    Not sure they'll do one. Might choose to scale down that sort of thing.
    Yes. Sorry to share my own lived truth with our many and valued Welsh members, but faced with the choice between going to Wales and not going to Wales, I have always found the decision a comparatively easy one.
    Who invited you here anyway?
    I went to a horrible prep school in a horrible part of Shropshire and my parents used to come and take me out on Sundays for picnic lunches in North Wales where it rained. All the time.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,110
    kle4 said:

    Turns out there's more than one verse to God Save the King - apparently verse 3 is the first one to actually expect something from the King, not just us wishing them well in their endeavours, as they are supposed to defend our laws.

    "May", so it's optional. ;)
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 37,054
    edited September 2022

    Leon said:

    I’m surprised if no in Britain cares - as @cookie claims/says - because out here in Portugal they talk about it a lot. As soon as they hear you are British, they trot out a Queen anecdote and frown or sigh or look sad, and they WANT to discuss how it makes them feel. Generally that is: moved and a bit melancholy - “she’s been there all my life” etc

    it feels like one of those universal moments. Not a total shock like 9/11 but nonetheless a shared experience, certainly for anyone over about 45, from what I’ve seen

    It's uncontroversial news about a popular Briton, so a natural subject to bring up if you're meeting someone British, in the same way as we might commiserate with an American and offer some thoughts if President Biden died.. But do you think the Portugese discuss her among themselves? Nice if they did, but I'd be a bit surprised.
    I'm just finishing a Portuguese holiday, and the TV screens here seem to be non-stop Queen Elizabeth.
    No they aren't. Queen Elizabeth is Queen Elizabeth II's mother.
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