No, they don't. They want the decision of the first vote changed. They've just assumed that having another referendum is the best way to do it but would quite happily settle for parliament overturning the result themselves.
Yep. If parliament cannot deliver any version of Leave they should revoke article 50 so that we stay in. Preferably accompanied by an apology for including an undeliverable option in the 2016 referendum. That is the correct course of action if we are to remain.
It's also one thing publicly saying you're doing something, and then following through in private, as the ERG knows, and May's bunch may be about to find out.
Those that bang on about the "will-o-the-people" are the same ones that are terrified that it is not tested again now that the plebs have got hold of a better understanding of the implications of their lunacy
Even the so-called "People's Vote" mob don't actually want another referendum.
Er, yes we do!
You do. Some of your cohorts want only to reverse brexit. They see a vote as the way to do that, but an actual second referendum supporter wants the vote to settle things whatever it's outcome. ,Even if they prefer one over the other they want the people to decide, not just see it as a way to get what they want
Maybe so.
I think the referendum needs to be overturned by a further referendum, or of course confirmed.
This is absolutely the dumbest response possible. The analogy he is attempting to draw fails because the result of the 2016 leadership election was implemented.
Not news, is it? If you didn't signal your support you'd have to resign - and why do that when she might be gone this evening?
This.
Plus the support of the Cabinet is what, half the number of those who have sent in letters.
This vote is not about the support of Cabinet members. It's whether the Hon. Member for Peasedown on the Wolds wants her leading the Party into a potentially imminent election.
It'll be embarrassing for Tory MPs if say 250 of them issue public statements of support for Mrs May and then she only gets 150 votes at the contest tonight. They're probably hoping that no-one keeps a running list of endorsements, which is all the more reason for someone to do so.
Judging by the outpouring of May support by Tory MPs the country is stuck with her for another 12 months.
As its a secret ballot I don't think the public pronouncements of support are worth the paper they're not written on...
My guess is that she does win but only narrowly. She'll try to cling on by her fingertips like El Gord but early next week the Cabinet will tell her times up.
The general consensus at the moment on twitter is that she'll win big
BUT - how are we meant to know? There was always going to be a coordinated effort by the whips, but also- the vote is a secret ballot. So surely it's not wise to be totting up declarations of support for May when we'll have no idea...
Rather than a list of the MPs tweeting their support, I'd like to see a list of the MPs keeping quiet.
Forget the MPs, what does Philip May think? Denis was pivotal in persuading Margaret Thatcher to throw in the towel, according to at least some reports.
These figures don't look particularly good to me for Theresa May. Not all public declarations of confidence will be followed through on and silence, the longer it goes on, the more ominous it looks.
These figures don't look particularly good to me for Theresa May. Not all public declarations of confidence will be followed through on and silence, the longer it goes on, the more ominous it looks.
Check the number of ministers saying they "support" Theresa May against those - far fewer- who day they will vote for her. This might seem to over analyse, but politicians choose their words carefully. The second statement would be a lie if they do vote against, while "support" can mean what you want it to mean. Ditto "Now is not the time for a divisive leadership election". It doesn't mean they won't vote against May in that divisive election.
The general consensus at the moment on twitter is that she'll win big
BUT - how are we meant to know? There was always going to be a coordinated effort by the whips, but also- the vote is a secret ballot. So surely it's not wise to be totting up declarations of support for May when we'll have no idea...
It's definitely a betting opportunity. I think she'll win, narrowly, but the 3/1 you can get on Betfair Exchange right now on her losing looks tempting.
What people say in public and what people say in private are two different things, plus May's strategy is clear now - run down the clock (and potentially run the economy into the ground) until we grasp at the last minute for her deal. That gives remainers and ERG-ers a solid reason to depose her now.
Not to mention the fact she's an absolute liability if she leads the Tories into an election in 2019. If it were done when 'tis done, then 'twere well it were done quickly...
Why not reply to the substance of the tweet rather than shooting the messenger.
He only ever is a messenger.....
If only there were some website where all these so-called "tweets" were collated, perhaps giving people the ability to subscribe to the ones they want to see.
Mr. Meeks, I'm feeling fairly comfortable with the 3 on 100-149 and 3 on 150-199 voting against May I backed earlier.
If 86 are overtly against here that suggests it'll top 100. Well, to me anyway.
If those reported public numbers are roughly right I'd expect Theresa May to get something like 125 votes. A lot of those public professions of loyalty will be public only.
These figures don't look particularly good to me for Theresa May. Not all public declarations of confidence will be followed through on and silence, the longer it goes on, the more ominous it looks.
Now 172 confidence, 81 no confidence. I think sh'e got this.
Mr. Meeks, I'm feeling fairly comfortable with the 3 on 100-149 and 3 on 150-199 voting against May I backed earlier.
If 86 are overtly against here that suggests it'll top 100. Well, to me anyway.
If those reported public numbers are roughly right I'd expect Theresa May to get something like 125 votes. A lot of those public professions of loyalty will be public only.
Well we all know most likely Gove's support is public only !
These figures don't look particularly good to me for Theresa May. Not all public declarations of confidence will be followed through on and silence, the longer it goes on, the more ominous it looks.
Now 172 confidence, 81 no confidence. I think sh'e got this.
Mr. Meeks, I'm feeling fairly comfortable with the 3 on 100-149 and 3 on 150-199 voting against May I backed earlier.
If 86 are overtly against here that suggests it'll top 100. Well, to me anyway.
If those reported public numbers are roughly right I'd expect Theresa May to get something like 125 votes. A lot of those public professions of loyalty will be public only.
I disagree. This is a vote to hand the tory party over to the ERG, which only has 70-80 members??
That sounds like the sort of thing idiots expecting to lose would say.
If May doesn't win by enough, she'll still be fatally wounded. Her entire schtick is to try to credibly claim there's a public route to her deal getting through Parliament. If 80+ of her party say WE WANT YOU GONE, then even her dimwit chief whip should be able to realise those numbers don't add up.
That sounds like the sort of thing idiots expecting to lose would say.
If May doesn't win by enough, she'll still be fatally wounded. Her entire schtick is to try to credibly claim there's a public route to her deal getting through Parliament. If 80+ of her party say WE WANT YOU GONE, then even her dimwit chief whip should be able to realise those numbers don't add up.
Whatever happens it;ll she do a heck of a lot better than Corbyn did in his VONC... and he stayed on.
That sounds like the sort of thing idiots expecting to lose would say.
If May doesn't win by enough, she'll still be fatally wounded. Her entire schtick is to try to credibly claim there's a public route to her deal getting through Parliament. If 80+ of her party say WE WANT YOU GONE, then even her dimwit chief whip should be able to realise those numbers don't add up.
As one Tory MP said on R5 : "stamina isn't strategy".
The Number 10 spin last time was that it was May vs ERG. May's supporters need the spectre of the headbangers, even if it is most likely the next leader will be a Cabinet minister, and probably in a coronation.
IMO the number voting in favour of No Confidence will between 100 and 165 which obviously doesn't get us very far, a bit like the BBC's 1987 election exit poll which said the Tory majority would be between 20 and 100.
She will be politically undead for a year if the Tories fail to depose her now. Complete unbridled power !
The complete unbridled power of wasting another six weeks indulging in futile displacement activity until 21st Jan.
This is a nice test of the "she has a Cunning Sneaky Plan" theory vs the "she has Absolutely No Idea What She's Doing" hypothesis. On CSP Theory she needed to get the leadership spill done so she can do the vote and pivot. Per ANIWSD she'll just keep stalling until January 21st and hope something lucky happens.
I was at a children's birthday party yesterday afternoon, and I listened to three other dads talk about this mess. I'm in a fairly strongly remain/Conservative area, but one of them (at least) is a Lib Dem.
All three expressed support for May, even if through gritted teeth. One said he thought she was the best option, and all three seemed to support the deal.
(Although as always when listening to such conversations, you have little idea how much agreement is real and just feigned to stop disagreements.)
The only number you can rely on today are those saying they won't vote for May.
Within those declaring they are "supporting" her will be a significant number of duplicitous bastards. Inside Cabinet too. Politics at its least edifying.
That sounds like the sort of thing idiots expecting to lose would say.
If May doesn't win by enough, she'll still be fatally wounded. Her entire schtick is to try to credibly claim there's a public route to her deal getting through Parliament. If 80+ of her party say WE WANT YOU GONE, then even her dimwit chief whip should be able to realise those numbers don't add up.
As one Tory MP said on R5 : "stamina isn't strategy".
Comments
"Chief whip now backing May
He was one of three cabinet ministers not to have tweeted their support.."
Does that imply he was counting before committing ?
I think the referendum needs to be overturned by a further referendum, or of course confirmed.
Double or quits is something people understand.
And then just run the clock down with her crappy deal that's never going to get through parliament.
So no deal with zero planning or remain without a referendum it is.
Baker, Blunt, Bone, Bradley, Bridgen, Cash, Caulfield, Clarke, Davies, Dorries, Duddridge, Francois, Fysh, Goldsmith, Green, Holloway, Hollobone, Jenkyns, Jones, Lewer, Morris, Murray, Paterson, Rees-Mogg, Robertson, Rowley, Smith, Vickers, Whittingdale.
Andrea Jenkyns
Owen Paterson
Bill Cash
JRM
Andrew Bridgen
Mark Francois
James Duddridge
I hope May squishes them.
I think they'd prefer to wait until the last minute to nuke the deal if there's a small chance it will get through parliament.
Plus the support of the Cabinet is what, half the number of those who have sent in letters.
This vote is not about the support of Cabinet members. It's whether the Hon. Member for Peasedown on the Wolds wants her leading the Party into a potentially imminent election.
Can't we have a Stalking Pussy?
My guess is that she does win but only narrowly. She'll try to cling on by her fingertips like El Gord but early next week the Cabinet will tell her times up.
The secret ballot v public declarations of support.
BUT - how are we meant to know? There was always going to be a coordinated effort by the whips, but also- the vote is a secret ballot. So surely it's not wise to be totting up declarations of support for May when we'll have no idea...
https://twitter.com/christopherhope/status/1072797975963947008
These figures don't look particularly good to me for Theresa May. Not all public declarations of confidence will be followed through on and silence, the longer it goes on, the more ominous it looks.
https://twitter.com/SiDedman/status/1072798590895050752
But if May said she wanted to get it out of the way fast, I think it would have been churlish of Brady to refuse.
Can't seriously imagine there's anybody left who hasn't made up their mind, surely?
If 86 are overtly against here that suggests it'll top 100. Well, to me anyway.
What people say in public and what people say in private are two different things, plus May's strategy is clear now - run down the clock (and potentially run the economy into the ground) until we grasp at the last minute for her deal. That gives remainers and ERG-ers a solid reason to depose her now.
Not to mention the fact she's an absolute liability if she leads the Tories into an election in 2019. If it were done when 'tis done, then 'twere well it were done quickly...
Complete unbridled power !
https://twitter.com/MattChorley/status/1072798491221614593
I think it'll be 115-202 or so...
This deal is the only deal.
I am getting on with the job of delivering Brexit.
I was at a children's birthday party yesterday afternoon, and I listened to three other dads talk about this mess. I'm in a fairly strongly remain/Conservative area, but one of them (at least) is a Lib Dem.
All three expressed support for May, even if through gritted teeth. One said he thought she was the best option, and all three seemed to support the deal.
(Although as always when listening to such conversations, you have little idea how much agreement is real and just feigned to stop disagreements.)
Within those declaring they are "supporting" her will be a significant number of duplicitous bastards. Inside Cabinet too. Politics at its least edifying.
He says he didn't submit a letter, and didn't want a contest. But could still vote against May.