politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Mrs May’s extraordinary ratings honeymoon ended with the manif
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Even better is an informed understanding of how to prevent terrorism.bigjohnowls said:An informed understanding of the causes of terrorism is an essential part of an effective response.
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There IS a case for scaling back our "interventions" but this has pretty much happened anyway.
But Jezza would go further whatever he says. There are literally no circumstances where he would commit British troops to war. Ever.
Even if the British realm itself was about to be invaded by another country he would still be unable to go to war which he has been very honest about over the past 40 years to be fair.
Other than this, I can see the merits in Corbyn actually... But the one thing that holds me back for voting for him is that I just don't think the country would be secure with him.
It's a dilemma....0 -
I disagree with your first point, but agree with the second one.MarkSenior said:
It has now got to the stage that the sort of personal attacks on Corbyn et al that you want will be counter productive . To retrieve the position the Conservatives need to send out positive messages for people to vote for them but this seems beyond Mrs W and W .Jason said:If the Tories cannot demolish Corbyn, McDonnell and Abbott over matters of security and defence, then quite simply, they do not deserve to form the next government.
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Bugger, bugger, bugger.
The next Ipsos MORI poll will be on election day.0 -
The "Leave" campaign was portrayed as "amateurish" and "non existent" by many sage experts on here right up until the exit poll.ThreeQuidder said:
The 2015 campaign was portrayed as a disaster at the time, too...GIN1138 said:Back in the 1987 general election campaign there were quite a few polls with the Con lead down to between 4-7%.
http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/voting-intention-1983-1987
Kinnock was generally perceived to have had a good campaign and Thatcher a poor campaign.
We know what the result was in the end though...0 -
The Irish situation lent itself to a peace deal. The spread of global quasi-fascist Wahabism, enabled by Weak & Wobbly May's paymasters in Riyadh, does not. It just entails isolating the Gulf states from global influence and stopping assistance of jihadis abroad.TGOHF said:
So he's changed his policy since his time supporting the IRA ?JWisemann said:
Jermey Corbyn is not suggesting a peace deal. He is suggesting we stop actively assisting them and helping them abroad.0 -
He's not a total pacifist. It's only Western countries, and particular the UK, that he doesn't want to take military action.kjohnw said:
Corbyn is a terrorist sympathiser who is a total pacifistbigjohnowls said:An informed understanding of the causes of terrorism is an essential part of an effective response.
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They've really cut back their polls this election haven't they?TheScreamingEagles said:Bugger, bugger, bugger.
The next Ipsos MORI poll will be on election day.0 -
Shall I put you down as a maybe!!kjohnw said:
Corbyn is a terrorist sympathiser who is a total pacifist who will not take decisive action when required to protect our way of life, who will not defend this country and will let Russia and China veto any war we ought to take part in. His free uncosted sweeties for all bribe will bankrupt the UK and make us the laughing stock of the world. He is the most dangerous politician and is a clear and present danger to the security of the UK. If he gets his hands anywhere near the levers of power we are all screwed, and the damage to the UK will be permanent. I fear for my childrens future if Labour winbigjohnowls said:An informed understanding of the causes of terrorism is an essential part of an effective response.
Do you feel safer now than in 2010?0 -
Weak and wobbly
Bibbly Bobbly0 -
Yesterday Yougov showed almost equal numbers moving from Con to Lab and vice versa and Lib Dem to Lab and vice versa . The only significant moves were UKIP to Con and a smaller Con to Lib Dem move all since 2015MarqueeMark said:
But are they? Isn't it more that Labour are hoovering up the LibDems and Greens and Commies and Don't Usually Vote, and the Tories are losing votes to Don't Knows?David_Evershed said:
So why are the polls showing a big move from Conservative to Labour?YBarddCwsc said:
They won’t. They might have a hissy fit like SeanT.David_Evershed said:Why would Conservative supporters switch to Labour because of the manifesto Social Care policy when Labour would make inheritance tax far worse for them?
There is a point (I would suggest already reached) at which Labour cannot make further progress without getting Tories to switch to them. And they will be a much harder nut to crack.0 -
Actually that's a good speech by Jeremy Corbyn. A good take on supporting those that aim to keep us safe. I don't think I go along with his linkage between terrorism and our foreign policy, but he has a point that military operations have consequences, so you need to think carefully about them. Corbyn's instinct is to disengage, but the same instinct is driving Brexit. A lot of people go along with it.0
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Has MI6 chief Alex Younger condemned his predecessor Richard Dearlove's statement that the current level of terrorism in Britain is "manageable" "indefinitely" and really not much of a problem as it stands?Cyclefree said:If you seriously believe that Labour under Corbyn will provide more resources to fight terror, you must be absolutely deluded. Corbyn has consistently opposed all legislation aimed at fighting terror, his Shadow Chancellor has called for the intelligence services to be shut down, as has his Shadow Home Secretary. The idea that they will provide more resources or take the steps needed to deal with the terrorist threat is for the birds.
For that matter, has Alex Younger or any previous head of MI6 ever had a word to say that is the tiniest bit critical of the British government's decades-long fawning to Salafist headchoppers in the Gulf in return for signatures on multibillion pound weapons deals?
Corbyn completely outclasses May in the seriousness and sense with which he addresses the terrorism problem. He deserves to be prime minister more than any other major party leader for more than 30 years.
The Tory response to Manchester has been absolute sh**. Had they actually put soldiers into shopping centres and sporting events, I would have supported that. Instead, they grandstand and put more soldiers outside Buckingham Palace which was already protected by the army anyway. Their lapdog press doesn't even ask who ran the security at the Manchester Arena and how such events might be made more secure in future. And they have the gall to say a vote for the rabid foxhunting xenophobic right-wing nasties is a vote for "security".
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Talk me through the times Corbyn interacted with the Unionist side in the conflict...JWisemann said:
The Irish situation lent itself to a peace deal. The spread of global quasi-fascist Wahabism, enabled by Weak & Wobbly May's paymasters in Riyadh, does not. It just entails isolating the Gulf states from global influence and stopping assistance of jihadis abroad.TGOHF said:
So he's changed his policy since his time supporting the IRA ?JWisemann said:
Jermey Corbyn is not suggesting a peace deal. He is suggesting we stop actively assisting them and helping them abroad.
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You mean the exit poll?TheScreamingEagles said:Bugger, bugger, bugger.
The next Ipsos MORI poll will be on election day.
Good. Bouncy MORI is not good for PBers' blood pressure.0 -
Would you feel safer under Corbyn and Abbott? Would Westminster & Manchester have happened if they were in power? I suspect No and Yes are your answers.bigjohnowls said:
Shall I put you down as a maybe!!kjohnw said:
Corbyn is a terrorist sympathiser who is a total pacifist who will not take decisive action when required to protect our way of life, who will not defend this country and will let Russia and China veto any war we ought to take part in. His free uncosted sweeties for all bribe will bankrupt the UK and make us the laughing stock of the world. He is the most dangerous politician and is a clear and present danger to the security of the UK. If he gets his hands anywhere near the levers of power we are all screwed, and the damage to the UK will be permanent. I fear for my childrens future if Labour winbigjohnowls said:An informed understanding of the causes of terrorism is an essential part of an effective response.
Do you feel safer now than in 2010?0 -
This headline is helpful for Mrs May, it will firm up Tory waverers.
https://twitter.com/George_Osborne/status/8680565913246556160 -
And yet despite what you say I was far more loyal to the Coalition Government than most Conservatives who post on here .david_herdson said:
Mark is an anti-Tory. It doesn't matter what you're for so much as what you're against. That's the problem with ending up in government as the Lib Dems did: you have no choice but to be 'for' something, and the public will then hold you to account on it, whether you try to distance yourself or not. Hence the migration of those for whom politics is a matter of protest migrating from the Lib Dems and finding homes in places as diverse as UKIP or with Corbyn.David_Evershed said:
I thought you were Lib Dem not a Corbynista?MarkSenior said:
Strong and Stable Corbyn backing the police and security services against Mrs Weak and Wobblys cuts .SeanT said:
But the numbers DO match the anecdotal evidence. Everyone hated that Manifesto and TMay made herself look like a weak & wobbly idiot. Polling shows this, canvassers report it, I'm hearing it from friends and familyGarethoftheVale2 said:
Just to point out I'm not a PB Tory. I'm looking for a reason why the numbers might not match the anecdotal evidence.SeanT said:
Christ. Now the Tories are borrowing the Corbynites' tin-foil-hats.GarethoftheVale2 said:I'm not very convinced by this You Gov.
One thing that is nagging away is that Momentum asked their members a while back to sign up to survey panels. Could YouGov have been infiltrated? You'd need thousands of people to sign up but not impossible...
Will be interesting to see if phone polls show any different.
Desperate times, indeed.0 -
No, there'll be a VI poll for The StandardThreeQuidder said:
You mean the exit poll?TheScreamingEagles said:Bugger, bugger, bugger.
The next Ipsos MORI poll will be on election day.
Good. Bouncy MORI is not good for PBers' blood pressure.0 -
I'm still agog to hear about "our establishment's money-making plans for the region."JWisemann said:
The Irish situation lent itself to a peace deal. The spread of global quasi-fascist Wahabism, enabled by Weak & Wobbly May's paymasters in Riyadh, does not. It just entails isolating the Gulf states from global influence and stopping assistance of jihadis abroad.TGOHF said:
So he's changed his policy since his time supporting the IRA ?JWisemann said:
Jermey Corbyn is not suggesting a peace deal. He is suggesting we stop actively assisting them and helping them abroad.
More generally: if I've understood properly, Corbyn's views on military intervention would require us to exit NATO. Would that be correct?0 -
Published on election day? Is that usual?TheScreamingEagles said:
No, there'll be a VI poll for The StandardThreeQuidder said:
You mean the exit poll?TheScreamingEagles said:Bugger, bugger, bugger.
The next Ipsos MORI poll will be on election day.
Good. Bouncy MORI is not good for PBers' blood pressure.0 -
No, MORI will have a poll for ES on the morning of election... And then the exit poll on election night.ThreeQuidder said:
You mean the exit poll?TheScreamingEagles said:Bugger, bugger, bugger.
The next Ipsos MORI poll will be on election day.
Good. Bouncy MORI is not good for PBers' blood pressure.0 -
Yes and yes.ThreeQuidder said:
Published on election day? Is that usual?TheScreamingEagles said:
No, there'll be a VI poll for The StandardThreeQuidder said:
You mean the exit poll?TheScreamingEagles said:Bugger, bugger, bugger.
The next Ipsos MORI poll will be on election day.
Good. Bouncy MORI is not good for PBers' blood pressure.0 -
He means "the Jews", of course.Alice_Aforethought said:
I'm still agog to hear about "our establishment's money-making plans for the region."JWisemann said:
The Irish situation lent itself to a peace deal. The spread of global quasi-fascist Wahabism, enabled by Weak & Wobbly May's paymasters in Riyadh, does not. It just entails isolating the Gulf states from global influence and stopping assistance of jihadis abroad.TGOHF said:
So he's changed his policy since his time supporting the IRA ?JWisemann said:
Jermey Corbyn is not suggesting a peace deal. He is suggesting we stop actively assisting them and helping them abroad.0 -
What were the odds for Brexit when the polls closed at 10 pm on 23rd June 2016?0
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Ah, I see George Osborne has found his inner Tory once more.TheScreamingEagles said:This headline is helpful for Mrs May, it will firm up Tory waverers.
https://twitter.com/George_Osborne/status/8680565913246556160 -
"Disengage" is one thing but there are absolutely no circumstances where he would ever commit troops to war...FF43 said:Actually that's a good speech by Jeremy Corbyn. A good take on supporting those that aim to keep us safe. I don't think I go along with his linkage between terrorism and our foreign policy, but he has a point that military operations have consequences, so you need to think carefully about them. Corbyn's instinct is to disengage, but the same instinct is driving Brexit. A lot of people go along with it.
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They always publish one on election morningThreeQuidder said:
Published on election day? Is that usual?TheScreamingEagles said:
No, there'll be a VI poll for The StandardThreeQuidder said:
You mean the exit poll?TheScreamingEagles said:Bugger, bugger, bugger.
The next Ipsos MORI poll will be on election day.
Good. Bouncy MORI is not good for PBers' blood pressure.0 -
Is that because their inheritance will be so much lower under the proposed social care rules?MarkSenior said:
And I fear for my grand childrens future if Mrs W and W and the Conservatives win .kjohnw said:
Corbyn is a terrorist sympathiser who is a total pacifist who will not take decisive action when required to protect our way of life, who will not defend this country and will let Russia and China veto any war we ought to take part in. His free uncosted sweeties for all bribe will bankrupt the UK and make us the laughing stock of the world. He is the most dangerous politician and is a clear and present danger to the security of the UK. If he gets his hands anywhere near the levers of power we are all screwed, and the damage to the UK will be permanent. I fear for my childrens future if Labour winbigjohnowls said:An informed understanding of the causes of terrorism is an essential part of an effective response.
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I don't think so. There were 4000 UKIP votes last time round and there's no UKIP candidate this time. Labour can hold all its own voters from 2015 and still lose comprehensively.rural_voter said:
They only need the existing number of votes to keep Chester Labour.TudorRose said:
I'd have thought Labour votes in Chester would be very useful.rural_voter said:
I'd happily bet - given odds of sufficient value - that at 7.00 h on 9 June I wake up to a Tory majority greater than now. Maybe some strange seat gains and losses, admittedly, making the loss of Gower in 2015 look normal.bobajobPB said:
I am no fan of Corbyn (as many here will know!!) but he has certainly completely out campaigned May, who has proved herself to be utterly inept in the crucible of a general election. Where we differ is that I still think the Tories will win big. That said, I also thought Clinton and Remain would win. In both those cases, however, I backed the opposite outcome as a value longshot. Labour now at least have come into view as a value longshot, from being completely out of the game two weeks ago.Bob__Sykes said:So. Two weeks today. Corbyn's latest rallying speech to the comrades - from the podium in Downing Street.
It's going to happen. I just feel it in my bones. He's played a blinder in recent weeks, on any objective assessment Labour is completely owning this GE campaign. The Tories have been complacent and dull and offered nothing in a dogshit manifesto. They deserve to lose seats.
What an absolute effing disaster from the disaster of a party I have little option but to continue to support. In a thoroughly depressing week I am yet further depressed as this car crash continues to unfold.
Under FPTP, hasn't Labour's voting efficiency been falling? It's no good piling up more Labour votes in Chester, Exeter, Bath or Cheltenham if one loses them in Darlington or Bishop Auckland and 20 seats rather like them. A gain of 15-20 Labour seats and a few from the SNP gives her a majority of around 50.
I know they have a perilously low majority. But it's FPTP and winner takes all.0 -
I would quite like the Coalition back. I thought we were well governed between 2010 and 2015.MarkSenior said:
And yet despite what you say I was far more loyal to the Coalition Government than most Conservatives who post on here .david_herdson said:
Mark is an anti-Tory. It doesn't matter what you're for so much as what you're against. That's the problem with ending up in government as the Lib Dems did: you have no choice but to be 'for' something, and the public will then hold you to account on it, whether you try to distance yourself or not. Hence the migration of those for whom politics is a matter of protest migrating from the Lib Dems and finding homes in places as diverse as UKIP or with Corbyn.David_Evershed said:
I thought you were Lib Dem not a Corbynista?MarkSenior said:
Strong and Stable Corbyn backing the police and security services against Mrs Weak and Wobblys cuts .SeanT said:
But the numbers DO match the anecdotal evidence. Everyone hated that Manifesto and TMay made herself look like a weak & wobbly idiot. Polling shows this, canvassers report it, I'm hearing it from friends and familyGarethoftheVale2 said:
Just to point out I'm not a PB Tory. I'm looking for a reason why the numbers might not match the anecdotal evidence.SeanT said:
Christ. Now the Tories are borrowing the Corbynites' tin-foil-hats.GarethoftheVale2 said:I'm not very convinced by this You Gov.
One thing that is nagging away is that Momentum asked their members a while back to sign up to survey panels. Could YouGov have been infiltrated? You'd need thousands of people to sign up but not impossible...
Will be interesting to see if phone polls show any different.
Desperate times, indeed.0 -
Imagine that Gove had not stabled Boris, and that this election was now about PM Boris and Chancellor Gove.0
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So who are they doing private polling for, between now and then?TheScreamingEagles said:Bugger, bugger, bugger.
The next Ipsos MORI poll will be on election day.0 -
AndPulpstar said:
Ah, I see George Osborne has found his inner Tory once more.TheScreamingEagles said:This headline is helpful for Mrs May, it will firm up Tory waverers.
https://twitter.com/George_Osborne/status/868056591324655616
https://twitter.com/George_Osborne/status/8680571017001287690 -
Is your wobble slowly stabilising?SeanT said:There are really quite striking parallels between the Corbocharge and Brexit, Trump and Indyref.
In all three cases, the underdog came from way behind, on a surge of emotional support and populism, fired up by social media. In two cases, Trump and Brexit, the surge was big enough to edge them to victory....
However, I think the very closest parallel is Indyref. The deficit from the start was/is probably a bit too big to be overtaken, and there's a stubborn plurality of the electorate, on the other side, that simply will not be budged.
On this basis, the Corbocharge will slip back somewhat in the final days, and TMay will get her pretty miserable 30-70 seat majority.
Mebbes.
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Nomine facta discordant if soThreeQuidder said:
He means "the Jews", of course.Alice_Aforethought said:
I'm still agog to hear about "our establishment's money-making plans for the region."JWisemann said:
The Irish situation lent itself to a peace deal. The spread of global quasi-fascist Wahabism, enabled by Weak & Wobbly May's paymasters in Riyadh, does not. It just entails isolating the Gulf states from global influence and stopping assistance of jihadis abroad.TGOHF said:
So he's changed his policy since his time supporting the IRA ?JWisemann said:
Jermey Corbyn is not suggesting a peace deal. He is suggesting we stop actively assisting them and helping them abroad.0 -
I suspect those who like Corbyn think it would be "quite nice" if he got in - those who oppose are more in the "over my dead body" camp.....TheScreamingEagles said:This headline is helpful for Mrs May, it will firm up Tory waverers.
https://twitter.com/George_Osborne/status/868056591324655616
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Another take on 'war on terror is not working' is 'we are losing', unsure if that's a message that will meet approval.0
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Slipback is the new Swingback?SeanT said:There are really quite striking parallels between the Corbocharge and Brexit, Trump and Indyref.
In all three cases, the underdog came from way behind, on a surge of emotional support and populism, fired up by social media. In two cases, Trump and Brexit, the surge was big enough to edge them to victory....
However, I think the very closest parallel is Indyref. The deficit from the start was/is probably a bit too big to be overtaken, and there's a stubborn plurality of the electorate, on the other side, that simply will not be budged.
On this basis, the Corbocharge will slip back somewhat in the final days, and TMay will get her pretty miserable 30-70 seat majority.
Mebbes.0 -
Mr 43,
We're a target mainly because we're a western democracy. Belgium has been a target for the same reason too and I don't remember them being particularly active in bombing Syria. But hey also have a high Islamic population. Even if only 0.001% becomes radicalised, that's too many. And yes, I know that the vast majority have no time for IS.
I believe that the Muslim Brotherhood in the 1940s were outraged by the decadence of the USA then. Skirts only inches below the knee and women cavorting out on their own. I wonder what they think of modern life now?
If all else fails, you can blame the Reformation.0 -
For anyone with children/Grandchildren Schools face years of funding cuts if Tories win election, say IFS
For anyone who may need HealthCare the NHS is in for even tougher times if Tories win election, say IFS
For anyone who is Just about Managing prepare for more and more austerity if Tories win election, say IFS
For anyone with a house ...................0 -
In the case of Brexit, I'd suggest the weight of printed media played at least a great a role as social media. Happy to be proved wrong.SeanT said:There are really quite striking parallels between the Corbocharge and Brexit, Trump and Indyref.
In all three cases, the underdog came from way behind, on a surge of emotional support and populism, fired up by social media. In two cases, Trump and Brexit, the surge was big enough to edge them to victory....
However, I think the very closest parallel is Indyref. The deficit from the start was/is probably a bit too big to be overtaken, and there's a stubborn plurality of the electorate, on the other side, that simply will not be budged.
On this basis, the Corbocharge will slip back somewhat in the final days, and TMay will get her pretty miserable 30-70 seat majority.
Mebbes.0 -
Yeah. The first bomb in ten years and we are giving up. How many bombs have we dropped on them and they are still fighting?dyedwoolie said:Another take on 'war know terror is not working' is 'we are losing', unsure if that's a message that will meet approval.
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There are a great many problems with the Saudi leadership. However, the idea that the world would be a better place without them given the only plausible replacements seems to ignore the experiences across the rest of the Middle East when states have lost established regimes, that you're otherwise happy to point out.Cyan said:
Has MI6 chief Alex Younger condemned his predecessor Richard Dearlove's statement that the current level of terrorism in Britain is "manageable" "indefinitely" and really not much of a problem as it stands?Cyclefree said:If you seriously believe that Labour under Corbyn will provide more resources to fight terror, you must be absolutely deluded. Corbyn has consistently opposed all legislation aimed at fighting terror, his Shadow Chancellor has called for the intelligence services to be shut down, as has his Shadow Home Secretary. The idea that they will provide more resources or take the steps needed to deal with the terrorist threat is for the birds.
For that matter, has Alex Younger or any previous head of MI6 ever had a word to say that is the tiniest bit critical of the British government's decades-long fawning to Salafist headchoppers in the Gulf in return for signatures on multibillion pound weapons deals?
Corbyn completely outclasses May in the seriousness and sense with which he addresses the terrorism problem. He deserves to be prime minister more than any other major party leader for more than 30 years.
The Tory response to Manchester has been absolute sh**. Had they actually put soldiers into shopping centres and sporting events, I would have supported that. Instead, they grandstand and put more soldiers outside Buckingham Palace which was already protected by the army anyway. Their lapdog press doesn't even ask who ran the security at the Manchester Arena and how such events might be made more secure in future. And they have the gall to say a vote for the rabid foxhunting xenophobic right-wing nasties is a vote for "security".0 -
No comment on what they say about Labour's plans?bigjohnowls said:For anyone with children/Grandchildren Schools face years of funding cuts if Tories win election, say IFS
For anyone who may need HealthCare the NHS is in for even tougher times if Tories win election, say IFS
For anyone who is Just about Managing prepare for more and more austerity if Tories win election, say IFS
For anyone with a house ...................
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As i posted the other day I sorted out their inheritance 12 years ago .David_Evershed said:
Is that because their inheritance will be so much lower under the proposed social care rules?MarkSenior said:
And I fear for my grand childrens future if Mrs W and W and the Conservatives win .kjohnw said:
Corbyn is a terrorist sympathiser who is a total pacifist who will not take decisive action when required to protect our way of life, who will not defend this country and will let Russia and China veto any war we ought to take part in. His free uncosted sweeties for all bribe will bankrupt the UK and make us the laughing stock of the world. He is the most dangerous politician and is a clear and present danger to the security of the UK. If he gets his hands anywhere near the levers of power we are all screwed, and the damage to the UK will be permanent. I fear for my childrens future if Labour winbigjohnowls said:An informed understanding of the causes of terrorism is an essential part of an effective response.
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Mophead calls election after a year of embarrassing everyone as PM, saying he wants a bigger majority? How popular he'd be in the 1922 committeeVerulamius said:Imagine that Gove had not stabled Boris, and that this election was now about PM Boris and Chancellor Gove.
Cue the biggest Labour majority ever?
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We were told UKIP were not just Tories on Holiday, that they were taking as many Labour votes. In fact were were told that UKIP would be a real danger to Labour.TudorRose said:
I don't think so. There were 4000 UKIP votes last time round and there's no UKIP candidate this time. Labour can hold all its own voters from 2015 and still lose comprehensively.rural_voter said:
They only need the existing number of votes to keep Chester Labour.TudorRose said:
I'd have thought Labour votes in Chester would be very useful.rural_voter said:
I'd happily bet - given odds of sufficient value - that at 7.00 h on 9 June I wake up to a Tory majority greater than now. Maybe some strange seat gains and losses, admittedly, making the loss of Gower in 2015 look normal.bobajobPB said:
I am no fan of Corbyn (as many here will know!!) but he has certainly completely out campaigned May, who has proved herself to be utterly inept in the crucible of a general election. Where we differ is that I still think the Tories will win big. That said, I also thought Clinton and Remain would win. In both those cases, however, I backed the opposite outcome as a value longshot. Labour now at least have come into view as a value longshot, from being completely out of the game two weeks ago.Bob__Sykes said:So. Two weeks today. Corbyn's latest rallying speech to the comrades - from the podium in Downing Street.
It's going to happen. I just feel it in my bones. He's played a blinder in recent weeks, on any objective assessment Labour is completely owning this GE campaign. The Tories have been complacent and dull and offered nothing in a dogshit manifesto. They deserve to lose seats.
What an absolute effing disaster from the disaster of a party I have little option but to continue to support. In a thoroughly depressing week I am yet further depressed as this car crash continues to unfold.
Under FPTP, hasn't Labour's voting efficiency been falling? It's no good piling up more Labour votes in Chester, Exeter, Bath or Cheltenham if one loses them in Darlington or Bishop Auckland and 20 seats rather like them. A gain of 15-20 Labour seats and a few from the SNP gives her a majority of around 50.
I know they have a perilously low majority. But it's FPTP and winner takes all.
Now UKIP have self destructed, it seems everyone thinks ALL their votes are going to the Tories, surely it's only a percentage.0 -
I never knew estate planning was so rife on the left. There's hope for you yet.MarkSenior said:
As i posted the other day I sorted out their inheritance 12 years ago .David_Evershed said:
Is that because their inheritance will be so much lower under the proposed social care rules?MarkSenior said:
And I fear for my grand childrens future if Mrs W and W and the Conservatives win .kjohnw said:
Corbyn is a terrorist sympathiser who is a total pacifist who will not take decisive action when required to protect our way of life, who will not defend this country and will let Russia and China veto any war we ought to take part in. His free uncosted sweeties for all bribe will bankrupt the UK and make us the laughing stock of the world. He is the most dangerous politician and is a clear and present danger to the security of the UK. If he gets his hands anywhere near the levers of power we are all screwed, and the damage to the UK will be permanent. I fear for my childrens future if Labour winbigjohnowls said:An informed understanding of the causes of terrorism is an essential part of an effective response.
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I'd expect the anti Corbynite MSM will attack Corbyn for emboldening the terrorists.
'You're changing our foreign policy, you're winning'0 -
He should know from the Referendum that Project Fear doesn't work.....TheScreamingEagles said:
AndPulpstar said:
Ah, I see George Osborne has found his inner Tory once more.TheScreamingEagles said:This headline is helpful for Mrs May, it will firm up Tory waverers.
https://twitter.com/George_Osborne/status/868056591324655616
https://twitter.com/George_Osborne/status/8680571017001287690 -
Next phone poll, due when ?0
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Quite niceCarlottaVance said:
I suspect those who like Corbyn think it would be "quite nice" if he got in - those who oppose are more in the "over my dead body" camp.....TheScreamingEagles said:This headline is helpful for Mrs May, it will firm up Tory waverers.
https://twitter.com/George_Osborne/status/868056591324655616
I would be running down the street shouting.
Unfortunately aint going to happen TMICIPM
LAB peaked with last nights YG its all SWINGBACK from here0 -
yesbigjohnowls said:
Shall I put you down as a maybe!!kjohnw said:
Corbyn is a terrorist sympathiser who is a total pacifist who will not take decisive action when required to protect our way of life, who will not defend this country and will let Russia and China veto any war we ought to take part in. His free uncosted sweeties for all bribe will bankrupt the UK and make us the laughing stock of the world. He is the most dangerous politician and is a clear and present danger to the security of the UK. If he gets his hands anywhere near the levers of power we are all screwed, and the damage to the UK will be permanent. I fear for my childrens future if Labour winbigjohnowls said:An informed understanding of the causes of terrorism is an essential part of an effective response.
Do you feel safer now than in 2010?0 -
It is only a percentage albeit a larger percentage .logical_song said:
We were told UKIP were not just Tories on Holiday, that they were taking as many Labour votes. In fact were were told that UKIP would be a real danger to Labour.TudorRose said:
I don't think so. There were 4000 UKIP votes last time round and there's no UKIP candidate this time. Labour can hold all its own voters from 2015 and still lose comprehensively.rural_voter said:
They only need the existing number of votes to keep Chester Labour.TudorRose said:
I'd have thought Labour votes in Chester would be very useful.rural_voter said:
I'd happily bet - given odds of sufficient value - that at 7.00 h on 9 June I wake up to a Tory majority greater than now. Maybe some strange seat gains and losses, admittedly, making the loss of Gower in 2015 look normal.bobajobPB said:
I am no fan of Corbyn (as many here will know!!) but he has certainly completely out campaigned May, who has proved herself to be utterly inept in the crucible of a general election. Where we differ is that I still think the Tories will win big. That said, I also thought Clinton and Remain would win. In both those cases, however, I backed the opposite outcome as a value longshot. Labour now at least have come into view as a value longshot, from being completely out of the game two weeks ago.Bob__Sykes said:So. Two weeks today. Corbyn's latest rallying speech to the comrades - from the podium in Downing Street.
It's going to happen. I just feel it in my bones. He's played a blinder in recent weeks, on any objective assessment Labour is completely owning this GE campaign. The Tories have been complacent and dull and offered nothing in a dogshit manifesto. They deserve to lose seats.
What an absolute effing disaster from the disaster of a party I have little option but to continue to support. In a thoroughly depressing week I am yet further depressed as this car crash continues to unfold.
Under FPTP, hasn't Labour's voting efficiency been falling? It's no good piling up more Labour votes in Chester, Exeter, Bath or Cheltenham if one loses them in Darlington or Bishop Auckland and 20 seats rather like them. A gain of 15-20 Labour seats and a few from the SNP gives her a majority of around 50.
I know they have a perilously low majority. But it's FPTP and winner takes all.
Now UKIP have self destructed, it seems everyone thinks ALL their votes are going to the Tories, surely it's only a percentage.0 -
Good question for Corbyn from Andrew Neil tonight.Alice_Aforethought said:
I'm still agog to hear about "our establishment's money-making plans for the region."JWisemann said:
The Irish situation lent itself to a peace deal. The spread of global quasi-fascist Wahabism, enabled by Weak & Wobbly May's paymasters in Riyadh, does not. It just entails isolating the Gulf states from global influence and stopping assistance of jihadis abroad.TGOHF said:
So he's changed his policy since his time supporting the IRA ?JWisemann said:
Jermey Corbyn is not suggesting a peace deal. He is suggesting we stop actively assisting them and helping them abroad.
More generally: if I've understood properly, Corbyn's views on military intervention would require us to exit NATO. Would that be correct?0 -
Polling shows it's a large percentage.logical_song said:
We were told UKIP were not just Tories on Holiday, that they were taking as many Labour votes. In fact were were told that UKIP would be a real danger to Labour.TudorRose said:
I don't think so. There were 4000 UKIP votes last time round and there's no UKIP candidate this time. Labour can hold all its own voters from 2015 and still lose comprehensively.rural_voter said:
They only need the existing number of votes to keep Chester Labour.TudorRose said:
I'd have thought Labour votes in Chester would be very useful.rural_voter said:
I'd happily bet - given odds of sufficient value - that at 7.00 h on 9 June I wake up to a Tory majority greater than now. Maybe some strange seat gains and losses, admittedly, making the loss of Gower in 2015 look normal.bobajobPB said:
I am no fan of Corbyn (as many here will know!!) but he has certainly completely out campaigned May, who has proved herself to be utterly inept in the crucible of a general election. Where we differ is that I still think the Tories will win big. That said, I also thought Clinton and Remain would win. In both those cases, however, I backed the opposite outcome as a value longshot. Labour now at least have come into view as a value longshot, from being completely out of the game two weeks ago.Bob__Sykes said:So. Two weeks today. Corbyn's latest rallying speech to the comrades - from the podium in Downing Street.
It's going to happen. I just feel it in my bones. He's played a blinder in recent weeks, on any objective assessment Labour is completely owning this GE campaign. The Tories have been complacent and dull and offered nothing in a dogshit manifesto. They deserve to lose seats.
What an absolute effing disaster from the disaster of a party I have little option but to continue to support. In a thoroughly depressing week I am yet further depressed as this car crash continues to unfold.
Under FPTP, hasn't Labour's voting efficiency been falling? It's no good piling up more Labour votes in Chester, Exeter, Bath or Cheltenham if one loses them in Darlington or Bishop Auckland and 20 seats rather like them. A gain of 15-20 Labour seats and a few from the SNP gives her a majority of around 50.
I know they have a perilously low majority. But it's FPTP and winner takes all.
Now UKIP have self destructed, it seems everyone thinks ALL their votes are going to the Tories, surely it's only a percentage.
0 -
How was canvassing, @bigjohnowls?0
-
Probably Survation, probably early next week.WhisperingOracle said:Next phone poll, due when ?
0 -
All the Sunday polls are online?TheScreamingEagles said:
Probably Survation, probably early next week.WhisperingOracle said:Next phone poll, due when ?
0 -
Even the Independent seems to be putting the boot into Corbyn to help the Tories, using the headline "Jeremy Corbyn 'justifies' terrorism by linking UK foreign policy to terror attacks, claims Tory security minister".dyedwoolie said:I'd expect the anti Corbynite MSM will attack Corbyn for emboldening the terrorists.
'You're changing our foreign policy, you're winning'0 -
Thanks.TheScreamingEagles said:
Probably Survation, probably early next week.WhisperingOracle said:Next phone poll, due when ?
0 -
It is only a percentage - but it is a majority. And in Chester that should be enough. Labour will need votes from elsewhere to hold the seat.logical_song said:
We were told UKIP were not just Tories on Holiday, that they were taking as many Labour votes. In fact were were told that UKIP would be a real danger to Labour.TudorRose said:
I don't think so. There were 4000 UKIP votes last time round and there's no UKIP candidate this time. Labour can hold all its own voters from 2015 and still lose comprehensively.rural_voter said:
They only need the existing number of votes to keep Chester Labour.TudorRose said:
I'd have thought Labour votes in Chester would be very useful.rural_voter said:
I'd happily bet - given odds of sufficient value - that at 7.00 h on 9 June I wake up to a Tory majority greater than now. Maybe some strange seat gains and losses, admittedly, making the loss of Gower in 2015 look normal.bobajobPB said:
I am no fan of Corbyn (as many here will know!!) but he has certainly completely out campaigned May, who has proved herself to be utterly inept in the crucible of a general election. Where we differ is that I still think the Tories will win big. That said, I also thought Clinton and Remain would win. In both those cases, however, I backed the opposite outcome as a value longshot. Labour now at least have come into view as a value longshot, from being completely out of the game two weeks ago.Bob__Sykes said:So. Two weeks today. Corbyn's latest rallying speech to the comrades - from the podium in Downing Street.
It's going to happen. I just feel it in my bones. He's played a blinder in recent weeks, on any objective assessment Labour is completely owning this GE campaign. The Tories have been complacent and dull and offered nothing in a dogshit manifesto. They deserve to lose seats.
What an absolute effing disaster from the disaster of a party I have little option but to continue to support. In a thoroughly depressing week I am yet further depressed as this car crash continues to unfold.
Under FPTP, hasn't Labour's voting efficiency been falling? It's no good piling up more Labour votes in Chester, Exeter, Bath or Cheltenham if one loses them in Darlington or Bishop Auckland and 20 seats rather like them. A gain of 15-20 Labour seats and a few from the SNP gives her a majority of around 50.
I know they have a perilously low majority. But it's FPTP and winner takes all.
Now UKIP have self destructed, it seems everyone thinks ALL their votes are going to the Tories, surely it's only a percentage.0 -
I'd expect so.RobD said:
All the Sunday polls are online?TheScreamingEagles said:
Probably Survation, probably early next week.WhisperingOracle said:Next phone poll, due when ?
0 -
Tell that to the Jakarta policemen or Egyptian Copts......CD13 said:We're a target mainly because we're a western democracy..
0 -
Polling showed it was a large percentage!MarqueeMark said:
Polling shows it's a large percentage.logical_song said:
We were told UKIP were not just Tories on Holiday, that they were taking as many Labour votes. In fact were were told that UKIP would be a real danger to Labour.TudorRose said:
I don't think so. There were 4000 UKIP votes last time round and there's no UKIP candidate this time. Labour can hold all its own voters from 2015 and still lose comprehensively.rural_voter said:
They only need the existing number of votes to keep Chester Labour.TudorRose said:
I'd have thought Labour votes in Chester would be very useful.rural_voter said:
I'd happily bet - given odds of sufficient value - that at 7.00 h on 9 June I wake up to a Tory majority greater than now. Maybe some strange seat gains and losses, admittedly, making the loss of Gower in 2015 look normal.bobajobPB said:
I am no fan of Corbyn (as many here will know!!) but he has certainly completely out campaigned May, who has proved herself to be utterly inept in the crucible of a general election. Where we differ is that I still think the Tories will win big. That said, I also thought Clinton and Remain would win. In both those cases, however, I backed the opposite outcome as a value longshot. Labour now at least have come into view as a value longshot, from being completely out of the game two weeks ago.Bob__Sykes said:So. Two weeks today. Corbyn's latest rallying speech to the comrades - from the podium in Downing Street.
It's going to happen. I just feel it in my bones. He's played a blinder in recent weeks, on any objective assessment Labour is completely owning this GE campaign. The Tories have been complacent and dull and offered nothing in a dogshit manifesto. They deserve to lose seats.
What an absolute effing disaster from the disaster of a party I have little option but to continue to support. In a thoroughly depressing week I am yet further depressed as this car crash continues to unfold.
Under FPTP, hasn't Labour's voting efficiency been falling? It's no good piling up more Labour votes in Chester, Exeter, Bath or Cheltenham if one loses them in Darlington or Bishop Auckland and 20 seats rather like them. A gain of 15-20 Labour seats and a few from the SNP gives her a majority of around 50.
I know they have a perilously low majority. But it's FPTP and winner takes all.
Now UKIP have self destructed, it seems everyone thinks ALL their votes are going to the Tories, surely it's only a percentage.0 -
Farron accuses Corbyn of exploring Manchester by putting 'politics before people' after Corbyn's speech linking terrorism to foreign interventions. Corbyn has opposed strikes on ISIS as well as earlier wars in Afghanistan and the Middle East
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2017-400534270 -
And all probably include TSE in their sample LOLRobD said:
All the Sunday polls are online?TheScreamingEagles said:
Probably Survation, probably early next week.WhisperingOracle said:Next phone poll, due when ?
0 -
Yup, we voted Leave to take back control, because of German car manufacturers putting pressure on Frau Merkel we will be able to do what ever we want to.SeanT said:Has anyone worked out whether Labour's apparent desire to stay in the Single Market and Customs Union (their wording is slightly vague) is compatible with their desire to nationalise everything?
0 -
Someone on here predicted there would at some point in 7 weeks be both a Tory wobble and a Tory lead below 10%. It may even have been yourself. Both have now eventuated.SeanT said:There are really quite striking parallels between the Corbocharge and Brexit, Trump and Indyref.
In all three cases, the underdog came from way behind, on a surge of emotional support and populism, fired up by social media. In two cases, Trump and Brexit, the surge was big enough to edge them to victory....
However, I think the very closest parallel is Indyref. The deficit from the start was/is probably a bit too big to be overtaken, and there's a stubborn plurality of the electorate, on the other side, that simply will not be budged.
On this basis, the Corbocharge will slip back somewhat in the final days, and TMay will get her pretty miserable 30-70 seat majority.
Mebbes.
I don't buy a 30-seat majority. It will be 100-odd. Nobody who went into a campaign with a huge lead of 20-odd per cent has held onto it. They all actually ended up 12 to 14 points ahead ('83, '87, '97, '01). And neither has anyone ever blown a lead that large and ended up behind. And neither has a majority government been replaced by a majority opposition in decades.
May will win by 10 to 12 points - 46:34 or so I would guess. This perversely will keep Corbyn in post and with enhanced authority to screw the Labour Party up in perpetuity.
And he will have that authority. As Nick Palmer said downthread all Labour MPs care about is keeping their seats. They only hate Corbyn because they think he jeopardises their seats. If it looks like that's not so, they'll flock loyally to him after all even if he introduced a policy of killing the first born. So long as he increases Labour's vote share and they keep their seats, what's not to like?
What result would a re-run of the confidence vote produce now? He'd win.0 -
https://twitter.com/jessicaelgot/status/868061973904334848
@jessicaelgot: Farron is being shown around by Colin Parry, father of 12 year old Tim who was killed in the IRA’s bombing of Warrington in March 1993.0 -
For anyone with money prepare for the country to go bankrupt under Corbyn the IFS also effectively said. The Tories will increase the NHS budgetbigjohnowls said:For anyone with children/Grandchildren Schools face years of funding cuts if Tories win election, say IFS
For anyone who may need HealthCare the NHS is in for even tougher times if Tories win election, say IFS
For anyone who is Just about Managing prepare for more and more austerity if Tories win election, say IFS
For anyone with a house ...................0 -
I agree. It's very difficult to understand why people would stand in the middle of a crowd enjoying themselves and deliberately aim to kill as many as possible of them.CD13 said:Mr 43,
We're a target mainly because we're a western democracy. Belgium has been a target for the same reason too and I don't remember them being particularly active in bombing Syria. But hey also have a high Islamic population. Even if only 0.001% becomes radicalised, that's too many. And yes, I know that the vast majority have no time for IS.
I believe that the Muslim Brotherhood in the 1940s were outraged by the decadence of the USA then. Skirts only inches below the knee and women cavorting out on their own. I wonder what they think of modern life now?
If all else fails, you can blame the Reformation.
Nevertheless Jeremy Corbyn has surprisingly delivered a good speech on the Manchester attack. Sympathetic, supportive and determined. You wouldn't expect him to shine on a security subject. Better than Theresa May's, although to be fair, she was in the middle of dealing with the attack and wouldn't have the luxury of time to think about what she was saying.0 -
Isn't one of the rules of Brexit that the UK gets to do whatever it likes?SeanT said:Has anyone worked out whether Labour's apparent desire to stay in the Single Market and Customs Union (their wording is slightly vague) is compatible with their desire to nationalise everything?
0 -
In what way are you safer?kjohnw said:
yesbigjohnowls said:
Shall I put you down as a maybe!!kjohnw said:
Corbyn is a terrorist sympathiser who is a total pacifist who will not take decisive action when required to protect our way of life, who will not defend this country and will let Russia and China veto any war we ought to take part in. His free uncosted sweeties for all bribe will bankrupt the UK and make us the laughing stock of the world. He is the most dangerous politician and is a clear and present danger to the security of the UK. If he gets his hands anywhere near the levers of power we are all screwed, and the damage to the UK will be permanent. I fear for my childrens future if Labour winbigjohnowls said:An informed understanding of the causes of terrorism is an essential part of an effective response.
Do you feel safer now than in 2010?
Fewer police. army,navy RAF all cut
Higher immigration NHS less able to respond emergency services cut
Libya war made it a terrorist haven.
I do not understand why you feel safer seems completely irrational to me
Can you explain?0 -
My office v worried about Corbyn winning, my colleague's husband will cry if he does !0
-
-
Mandy Rice-Davies possessed greater wisdom than the Tory security minister. A better point might have been that even if Corbyn is right, it's irrelevant because absent a time machine, we are where we are, and that in any case the terrorists are not distinguishing British from American or even Russian actions. But I'm not sure a blanket repudiation of Corbyn works because most voters will think there is at least a basis in truth there.Cyan said:
Even the Independent seems to be putting the boot into Corbyn to help the Tories, using the headline "Jeremy Corbyn 'justifies' terrorism by linking UK foreign policy to terror attacks, claims Tory security minister".dyedwoolie said:I'd expect the anti Corbynite MSM will attack Corbyn for emboldening the terrorists.
'You're changing our foreign policy, you're winning'0 -
7/7 happened before all that and it was worse.bigjohnowls said:
In what way are you safer?kjohnw said:
yesbigjohnowls said:
Shall I put you down as a maybe!!kjohnw said:
Corbyn is a terrorist sympathiser who is a total pacifist who will not take decisive action when required to protect our way of life, who will not defend this country and will let Russia and China veto any war we ought to take part in. His free uncosted sweeties for all bribe will bankrupt the UK and make us the laughing stock of the world. He is the most dangerous politician and is a clear and present danger to the security of the UK. If he gets his hands anywhere near the levers of power we are all screwed, and the damage to the UK will be permanent. I fear for my childrens future if Labour winbigjohnowls said:An informed understanding of the causes of terrorism is an essential part of an effective response.
Do you feel safer now than in 2010?
Fewer police. army,navy RAF all cut
Higher immigration NHS less able to respond emergency services cut
Libya war made it a terrorist haven.
I do not understand why you feel safer seems completely irrational to me
Can you explain?0 -
Where the f are senior Tories today? They should be dismantling Corbyn, he's saying we are losing the war on terror and at the same time we must change policy and even then attacks will still happen.,.... what he said is appalling in the extreme, he wants to blame US and tell us that we must still expect attacks but that we need to also give up trying to stand against terror.
He is grotesque.0 -
My firm will have a whip-round for a bunker if this continues.Pulpstar said:My office v worried about Corbyn winning, my colleague's husband will cry if he does !
We trade in market sentiment.0 -
Definitely. Trade deficit and all that. Believe in Britain.TheScreamingEagles said:
Yup, we voted Leave to take back control, because of German car manufacturers putting pressure on Frau Merkel we will be able to do what ever we want to.SeanT said:Has anyone worked out whether Labour's apparent desire to stay in the Single Market and Customs Union (their wording is slightly vague) is compatible with their desire to nationalise everything?
0 -
Immigration fell in figures yesterday, Corbyn will stop bombing ISIS and open the floodgatesbigjohnowls said:
In what way are you safer?kjohnw said:
yesbigjohnowls said:
Shall I put you down as a maybe!!kjohnw said:
Corbyn is a terrorist sympathiser who is a total pacifist who will not take decisive action when required to protect our way of life, who will not defend this country and will let Russia and China veto any war we ought to take part in. His free uncosted sweeties for all bribe will bankrupt the UK and make us the laughing stock of the world. He is the most dangerous politician and is a clear and present danger to the security of the UK. If he gets his hands anywhere near the levers of power we are all screwed, and the damage to the UK will be permanent. I fear for my childrens future if Labour winbigjohnowls said:An informed understanding of the causes of terrorism is an essential part of an effective response.
Do you feel safer now than in 2010?
Fewer police. army,navy RAF all cut
Higher immigration NHS less able to respond emergency services cut
Libya war made it a terrorist haven.
I do not understand why you feel safer seems completely irrational to me
Can you explain?0 -
The Conservative campaign is evidently too centralised. In order to attack Labour, the Conservatives apparently need Theresa May to sign off on the attack line. With her too busy at the G7, no one can say anything.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
Yes. Corbyn has brought this up.dyedwoolie said:Where the f are senior Tories today? They should be dismantling Corbyn, he's saying we are losing the war on terror and at the same time we must change policy and even then attacks will still happen.,.... what he said is appalling in the extreme, he wants to blame US and tell us that we must still expect attacks but that we need to also give up trying to stand against terror.
He is grotesque.
Fallon and co need to take the gloves off.0 -
Whereas Tory MPs? Oh wait, some of them have a private income or they use their time in Westminster to develop business contacts before moving on and up.Alice_Aforethought said:As Nick Palmer said downthread all Labour MPs care about is keeping their seats.
Ha! If it was clear that a Labour win would bankrupt the country, the banks would SUPPORT Labour. There are still some juicy assets here that creditors would love to seize. Some are even in state hands.HYUFD said:For anyone with money prepare for the country to go bankrupt under Corbyn the IFS also effectively said.
0 -
The IFS was pretty clear that the Labour and Tory manifestos are not worth the paper they are written on, which is what you would expect given the calibre of people in charge of both parties.HYUFD said:
For anyone with money prepare for the country to go bankrupt under Corbyn the IFS also effectively said. The Tories will increase the NHS budgetbigjohnowls said:For anyone with children/Grandchildren Schools face years of funding cuts if Tories win election, say IFS
For anyone who may need HealthCare the NHS is in for even tougher times if Tories win election, say IFS
For anyone who is Just about Managing prepare for more and more austerity if Tories win election, say IFS
For anyone with a house ...................
0 -
You think the country will go bankrupt? The IFS think there is a £9bn black hole in Labs manifesto dont they, chicken feed.HYUFD said:
For anyone with money prepare for the country to go bankrupt under Corbyn the IFS also effectively said. The Tories will increase the NHS budgetbigjohnowls said:For anyone with children/Grandchildren Schools face years of funding cuts if Tories win election, say IFS
For anyone who may need HealthCare the NHS is in for even tougher times if Tories win election, say IFS
For anyone who is Just about Managing prepare for more and more austerity if Tories win election, say IFS
For anyone with a house ...................
Which positive policies are attracting you to the Tories?0 -
Yet they sit on their hands and wait for mummy.Pulpstar said:
Yes. Corbyn has brought this up.dyedwoolie said:Where the f are senior Tories today? They should be dismantling Corbyn, he's saying we are losing the war on terror and at the same time we must change policy and even then attacks will still happen.,.... what he said is appalling in the extreme, he wants to blame US and tell us that we must still expect attacks but that we need to also give up trying to stand against terror.
He is grotesque.
Fallon and co need to take the gloves off.
Frankly they deserve to lose this. We don't deserve Corbyn though.0 -
She can't be that busy - she just sent me an email.AlastairMeeks said:
The Conservative campaign is evidently too centralised. In order to attack Labour, the Conservatives apparently need Theresa May to sign off on the attack line. With her too busy at the G7, no one can say anything.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
At a guess: because May is a vacillating, indecisive, but ruthless control freak, nobody's allowed to say anything unless it's cleared with her first.dyedwoolie said:Where the f are senior Tories today? They should be dismantling Corbyn, he's saying we are losing the war on terror and at the same time we must change policy and even then attacks will still happen.,.... what he said is appalling in the extreme, he wants to blame US and tell us that we must still expect attacks but that we need to also give up trying to stand against terror.
He is grotesque.
Senior Tories are therefore doing exactly what she wants. When it all goes horribly wrong, it can't be anybody's fault but hers.0 -
And so it was. But it's the old one about not having to outrun the tiger.TGOHF said:
The "Leave" campaign was portrayed as "amateurish" and "non existent" by many sage experts on here right up until the exit poll.ThreeQuidder said:
The 2015 campaign was portrayed as a disaster at the time, too...GIN1138 said:Back in the 1987 general election campaign there were quite a few polls with the Con lead down to between 4-7%.
http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/voting-intention-1983-1987
Kinnock was generally perceived to have had a good campaign and Thatcher a poor campaign.
We know what the result was in the end though...0 -
It helps if you think of it in terms of regaining sovereignty over our armed forces.Alice_Aforethought said:
More generally: if I've understood properly, Corbyn's views on military intervention would require us to exit NATO. Would that be correct?
0 -
Net migration fell; immigration didn't. From outside the EU - the bit we control - it went up.HYUFD said:
Immigration fell in figures yesterday, Corbyn will stop bombing ISIS and open the floodgatesbigjohnowls said:
In what way are you safer?kjohnw said:
yesbigjohnowls said:
Shall I put you down as a maybe!!kjohnw said:
Corbyn is a terrorist sympathiser who is a total pacifist who will not take decisive action when required to protect our way of life, who will not defend this country and will let Russia and China veto any war we ought to take part in. His free uncosted sweeties for all bribe will bankrupt the UK and make us the laughing stock of the world. He is the most dangerous politician and is a clear and present danger to the security of the UK. If he gets his hands anywhere near the levers of power we are all screwed, and the damage to the UK will be permanent. I fear for my childrens future if Labour winbigjohnowls said:An informed understanding of the causes of terrorism is an essential part of an effective response.
Do you feel safer now than in 2010?
Fewer police. army,navy RAF all cut
Higher immigration NHS less able to respond emergency services cut
Libya war made it a terrorist haven.
I do not understand why you feel safer seems completely irrational to me
Can you explain?
0 -
If , as Corbyn argues there is a direct correlation between involvement in foreign wars and jihadi terrorism can he or one of his supporters on here please remind us of the part played by Belgium and Sweden in war.0
-
What matters, to both sides, is the extent to which the Lab to LD and LD to Lab switchers live in different seats.MarkSenior said:
Yesterday Yougov showed almost equal numbers moving from Con to Lab and vice versa and Lib Dem to Lab and vice versa . The only significant moves were UKIP to Con and a smaller Con to Lib Dem move all since 2015MarqueeMark said:
But are they? Isn't it more that Labour are hoovering up the LibDems and Greens and Commies and Don't Usually Vote, and the Tories are losing votes to Don't Knows?David_Evershed said:
So why are the polls showing a big move from Conservative to Labour?YBarddCwsc said:
They won’t. They might have a hissy fit like SeanT.David_Evershed said:Why would Conservative supporters switch to Labour because of the manifesto Social Care policy when Labour would make inheritance tax far worse for them?
There is a point (I would suggest already reached) at which Labour cannot make further progress without getting Tories to switch to them. And they will be a much harder nut to crack.0 -
The last two weeks will see a lot of new dynamics - the snoozy "done deal " of an election with a comfortable majority, in a comfortably sunny, post-Brexit summer for Tory voters - suddenly reversed and made into an apparently more active struggle - plus the press exercising its familiar propagandising role, now made even easier in the wake of a national tragedy.Pulpstar said:My office v worried about Corbyn winning, my colleague's husband will cry if he does !
Result - Tory win of 30-40 seats ( at an average guess ) .0
