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For 78-year-old Biden not being Trump is no longer enough – politicalbetting.com

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  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,745
    IshmaelZ said:

    "Very credible reporting of imminent attack (at Kabul airport)" - R4 - James Heappey, Armed Forces Minister.

    There is an ongoing and high threat of terrorist attack. Do not travel to Kabul Hamid Karzai International Airport. If you are in the area of the airport, move away to a safe location and await further advice.

    https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/afghanistan

    Shit.

    Now I can't sleep for thinking about those doggies and pussies.
    You can't sleep for worrying about pussy?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,046

    Exclusive: Ministers are preparing to overhaul the EU GDPR rules and replace with new British data privacy laws

    Oliver Dowden says will spell end to 'pointless' cookie requests and red tape for biz

    But diverging threatens to spark fresh row with EU


    https://twitter.com/HarryYorke1/status/1430649157312819207?s=20

    Whilst the EU GDPR laws are Fucking Stupid, our repeal of them is unlikely to be the start of the great spyware era. For all the major players how much faff is it to rewrite your code and permissions just for us?

    Are we doing this because we think we should, or because the likes of Dowden think we need another battle with the evil power?
    For most developers, pretty easy. They’ll have a geo-locate script that sorts users into EU and non-EU based on IP address. All they need to do is move UK into non-EU. In fact, the geo-locate provider probably does it for them, so no effort at all.
  • IshmaelZ said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
    If anyone's suffering a labour shortage they can always try paying better wages to attract staff.

    The minimum wage is supposed to be an absolute minimum not a maximum.
    Quite. And yet they have to supply the supermarkets. Who are about as moveable as that container ship in the Suez Canal.
    The market is pretty efficient.

    If the supermarkets require stock they will pay what they need to do so, so the price will go up.

    Or if they're outcompeted by other nations and importing it is cheaper then that's what we should do.

    Either way, let the free market sort it out.

    If supermarkets are inefficient then that's their problem they need to sort out, we don't need to change our laws to handle companies inefficiencies.
    Yes.

    And there will be people who lose out from this - and that will be painful, and that sucks. But ultimately, one needs to let the market decide. Otherwise, we will end up with swapping a modern economy for one favoured industries get government support by the back door.
    No.

    I mean, yes, but I don't know any evidence that supermarkets are bloated behemoths which deserve to go to the free market wall. They operate on tight margins. Sure you can tighten them further, but the continued existence of tesco in the face of lidl shows that the market doesn't necessarily want them tightened further. Philip thinks all market solutions are good solutions, but the solution here is that he pays higher prices in a continuing to exist tesco or lidl. Not clear why he is cheering that.
    Most of the major supermarkets are bloated and inefficient. The reason why outfits like Tesco have taken an axe to thinks like the fish counter (and checkout operators and people to restock the shelves) is because people cost money and they have too many of them.

    Compare and contrast with the Aldi, Lidl, Home Bargains etc operating model where you have fewer products and fewer staff in stores supplied by fewer depots. Tesco et al cannot cut their prices as demanded by Philip because there isn't the fat in their operation to be cut. The only way that could happen would be for one of them to physically restructure their operation into Lidl. But as Aldi and Lidl are everywhere and people still shop in Tesco, Sainsburys etc it shows that the market will not support a "let the market rip" transformation of all supermarkets into low cost operations. Punters don't want to shop there.

    Frankly there is the other divide which few want to point to. The PLCs are generally the retailers drowning in costs and the need to generate Good News for the city every quarter. The retailers who are efficient and not full of bloat are privately owned. Isn't it supposed to be the other way round, that the rigours of the free market ensure that PLCs are as lean as can be?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040

    Exclusive: Ministers are preparing to overhaul the EU GDPR rules and replace with new British data privacy laws

    Oliver Dowden says will spell end to 'pointless' cookie requests and red tape for biz

    But diverging threatens to spark fresh row with EU


    https://twitter.com/HarryYorke1/status/1430649157312819207?s=20

    Whilst the EU GDPR laws are Fucking Stupid, our repeal of them is unlikely to be the start of the great spyware era. For all the major players how much faff is it to rewrite your code and permissions just for us?

    Are we doing this because we think we should, or because the likes of Dowden think we need another battle with the evil power?
    It's a fair question. I had no problem in highlighting GDPR as a classic example of the EU at its worst: generating additional and pointless paperwork, reducing competitiveness internationally, achieving the square root of f all in terms of actually protecting people and generally making things more inefficient and costly. But having got this mess to the point where we all waste time ticking boxes allowing cookies and retention of personal data several time a day is it really worth trying to produce something useful? And do we have any confidence that they will?
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,049
    MattW said:

    MattW said:

    rcs1000 said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
    If anyone's suffering a labour shortage they can always try paying better wages to attract staff.

    The minimum wage is supposed to be an absolute minimum not a maximum.
    Quite. And yet they have to supply the supermarkets. Who are about as moveable as that container ship in the Suez Canal.
    The market is pretty efficient.

    If the supermarkets require stock they will pay what they need to do so, so the price will go up.

    Or if they're outcompeted by other nations and importing it is cheaper then that's what we should do.

    Either way, let the free market sort it out.

    If supermarkets are inefficient then that's their problem they need to sort out, we don't need to change our laws to handle companies inefficiencies.
    And the free market says, the price goes up. Which is actually not ideal for the people who shop in the supermarkets, is it? i.e. you and me?

    Mind you, we also don't need to change our laws to handle wannabe house buyers' inefficiencies, do we? If there's a shortage of houses, the market will sort it by pushing prices up. An equilibrium will be arrived at. Sorted.
    Absolutely we should have a free market in housing, just like we should have a free market in food.

    If there's a shortage of housing then companies will act to build new ones until the demand is satiated. Sorted.

    Let the market and free acting individuals determine what they find a better use of land: agriculture, residential or A N Other purpose. No need for the state to regulate or interfere.
    Housing needs to be more free market, but we also have to recognise that building (whether houses or chemical plants or football stadiums) results in negative (and positive) externalities.

    If I build a 400 home housing development on the edge of your village, you will find that the roads will suddenly become jammed and the schools full. Likewise, if I build a chemical refinery next door to your house, you may suddenly find your street very smelly.
    A 400 home development is unlikely to suddenly jam up all the roads, since besides not generating huge traffic it will include a transport assessment by the local Highways Authority as a routine part of the planning process, and if it will result in too much congestion the PP would be refused, or suitably mitigated.

    The applicant will have to spend many thousands on a suitable study.

    I've done it, though for sonething slightly smaller.

    Ditto schools - if there is no capacity they will have to pay for necessary extra school places to the tune of hundreds of thousands or millions, and the education authority will make provision. Education is - beside affforable housing - often the largest chunk of a Section 106 agreement.
    What planning permission? Surely the assumption was that in creating a completely free market, this would have been abolished. Unless I've missed the point.
    I interpreted it as not quite that pure a proposal.
    Welcome to Philip's world.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,178

    Good morning everyone. 13.2degC and cloudy again. Lovely afternoon yesterday, sitting in a friends garden, drinking wine.
    .

    Hopefully he didn’t mind too much, when he got home and found you there?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,046

    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Sandpit said:

    Cases in Australia and New Zealand are still going up:

    Australia: +1,098
    New Zealand: +68

    Sad to see, but the containment strategy has now clearly failed. They need to get everyone vaccinated yesterday, and people need to stay at home until it’s done.
    We don't see many stories about it, but the same is true in China. They have major Delta issues across the country, and they are also far from fully vaccinated.
    And their vaccines don't work very well. Which is a bit surprising given that they designed the virus in the first place.
    Although, the last time I discussed this with my son, he was still saying he had to have been jabbed with a Chinese vaccine before any (business) trip to China.I think, too that UK doesn't accept vaccination with Chinese vaccine as conferring immunity.
    Which means FOUR vaccinations for somewhat wants to visit both China and Britain/Europe.
    Mr S, from the sandpit, may have further and better info, of course
    There’s two Chinese vaccines, Sinoparm and Sinovac. The former is pretty good, the latter is pretty rubbish but just passed the WHO’s threshold for approval.

    We are doing booster doses out here, six months after the second dose, and are using Pfizer on those who had two Sinopharm doses previously.

    The biggest issue is travel requirements, I know of people getting two Pfizer doses now, because many countries won’t accept Sinopharm.

    More annoying still is countries like the UK not accepting foreign-administered vaccines for quarantine purposes. Someone travelling from UAE to UK is exempt from quarantine if they had their Pfizer vaccines in the UK, but have to quarantine themselves for 10 days if they had their Pfizer vaccines in UAE.
  • mwadams said:

    Exclusive: Ministers are preparing to overhaul the EU GDPR rules and replace with new British data privacy laws

    Oliver Dowden says will spell end to 'pointless' cookie requests and red tape for biz

    But diverging threatens to spark fresh row with EU


    https://twitter.com/HarryYorke1/status/1430649157312819207?s=20

    Hard to see the upside – even if GDPR is a PITA, it is a trans-European PITA. And "allowing data to be used more flexibly" does not sound like the government will be increasing our protection.
    And if you want to do any business with the EU you have to comply anyway. C.f. the US alignment with EU/GDPR requirements. It's a total lack of understanding of the practicalities of international trade.

    Let's hope they don't accidentally create *different* requirements which means we all end up having to meet two sets of regulation.
    We also have the insanity that the UK state has two separate customs zones inside it. I assume that websites which operate in NI will have to remain compliant with EU regulations? Which means that "UK" websites in GB will also have to remain compliant unless they create separate GB and NI operations.

    On the latter it may come to that. Its already cost prohibitive to sell products across borders (as in GB website sell and ship to a German consumer). In a few months the grace period for NI ends and it becomes cost prohibitive for a GB company to ship and sell to a Norniron consumer. So yes, separate websites if its a shop...

    Isn't "after Brexit you won't be able to order online from British companies" what Boris told the DUP conference?
  • AlistairMAlistairM Posts: 2,005

    IshmaelZ said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
    If anyone's suffering a labour shortage they can always try paying better wages to attract staff.

    The minimum wage is supposed to be an absolute minimum not a maximum.
    Quite. And yet they have to supply the supermarkets. Who are about as moveable as that container ship in the Suez Canal.
    The market is pretty efficient.

    If the supermarkets require stock they will pay what they need to do so, so the price will go up.

    Or if they're outcompeted by other nations and importing it is cheaper then that's what we should do.

    Either way, let the free market sort it out.

    If supermarkets are inefficient then that's their problem they need to sort out, we don't need to change our laws to handle companies inefficiencies.
    Yes.

    And there will be people who lose out from this - and that will be painful, and that sucks. But ultimately, one needs to let the market decide. Otherwise, we will end up with swapping a modern economy for one favoured industries get government support by the back door.
    No.

    I mean, yes, but I don't know any evidence that supermarkets are bloated behemoths which deserve to go to the free market wall. They operate on tight margins. Sure you can tighten them further, but the continued existence of tesco in the face of lidl shows that the market doesn't necessarily want them tightened further. Philip thinks all market solutions are good solutions, but the solution here is that he pays higher prices in a continuing to exist tesco or lidl. Not clear why he is cheering that.
    Most of the major supermarkets are bloated and inefficient. The reason why outfits like Tesco have taken an axe to thinks like the fish counter (and checkout operators and people to restock the shelves) is because people cost money and they have too many of them.

    Compare and contrast with the Aldi, Lidl, Home Bargains etc operating model where you have fewer products and fewer staff in stores supplied by fewer depots. Tesco et al cannot cut their prices as demanded by Philip because there isn't the fat in their operation to be cut. The only way that could happen would be for one of them to physically restructure their operation into Lidl. But as Aldi and Lidl are everywhere and people still shop in Tesco, Sainsburys etc it shows that the market will not support a "let the market rip" transformation of all supermarkets into low cost operations. Punters don't want to shop there.

    Frankly there is the other divide which few want to point to. The PLCs are generally the retailers drowning in costs and the need to generate Good News for the city every quarter. The retailers who are efficient and not full of bloat are privately owned. Isn't it supposed to be the other way round, that the rigours of the free market ensure that PLCs are as lean as can be?
    I can't face shopping in big supermarkets again. The amount of time it takes to walk around them is too much. If I go to Aldi I only have 5 aisles to do and can be in and out quickly even with a big family shop.

    Most of the aisles at a big Tesco are filled with a much wider range of products that 99% of the time I do not need. No wonder it is harder for them to keep them stocked. I was at Aldi a couple of days ago and the only gap was in some varieties of chicken. Everything else well stocked.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    IshmaelZ said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
    If anyone's suffering a labour shortage they can always try paying better wages to attract staff.

    The minimum wage is supposed to be an absolute minimum not a maximum.
    Quite. And yet they have to supply the supermarkets. Who are about as moveable as that container ship in the Suez Canal.
    The market is pretty efficient.

    If the supermarkets require stock they will pay what they need to do so, so the price will go up.

    Or if they're outcompeted by other nations and importing it is cheaper then that's what we should do.

    Either way, let the free market sort it out.

    If supermarkets are inefficient then that's their problem they need to sort out, we don't need to change our laws to handle companies inefficiencies.
    Yes.

    And there will be people who lose out from this - and that will be painful, and that sucks. But ultimately, one needs to let the market decide. Otherwise, we will end up with swapping a modern economy for one favoured industries get government support by the back door.
    No.

    I mean, yes, but I don't know any evidence that supermarkets are bloated behemoths which deserve to go to the free market wall. They operate on tight margins. Sure you can tighten them further, but the continued existence of tesco in the face of lidl shows that the market doesn't necessarily want them tightened further. Philip thinks all market solutions are good solutions, but the solution here is that he pays higher prices in a continuing to exist tesco or lidl. Not clear why he is cheering that.
    Most of the major supermarkets are bloated and inefficient. The reason why outfits like Tesco have taken an axe to thinks like the fish counter (and checkout operators and people to restock the shelves) is because people cost money and they have too many of them.

    Compare and contrast with the Aldi, Lidl, Home Bargains etc operating model where you have fewer products and fewer staff in stores supplied by fewer depots. Tesco et al cannot cut their prices as demanded by Philip because there isn't the fat in their operation to be cut. The only way that could happen would be for one of them to physically restructure their operation into Lidl. But as Aldi and Lidl are everywhere and people still shop in Tesco, Sainsburys etc it shows that the market will not support a "let the market rip" transformation of all supermarkets into low cost operations. Punters don't want to shop there.

    Frankly there is the other divide which few want to point to. The PLCs are generally the retailers drowning in costs and the need to generate Good News for the city every quarter. The retailers who are efficient and not full of bloat are privately owned. Isn't it supposed to be the other way round, that the rigours of the free market ensure that PLCs are as lean as can be?
    Surely either they are bloated and inefficient, or there isn't the fat in their operation to be cut? They survive because people are prepared to pay more for a better shopping experience - and Lidl etc really do suck as a shopping experience.
  • Sandpit said:

    Exclusive: Ministers are preparing to overhaul the EU GDPR rules and replace with new British data privacy laws

    Oliver Dowden says will spell end to 'pointless' cookie requests and red tape for biz

    But diverging threatens to spark fresh row with EU


    https://twitter.com/HarryYorke1/status/1430649157312819207?s=20

    Whilst the EU GDPR laws are Fucking Stupid, our repeal of them is unlikely to be the start of the great spyware era. For all the major players how much faff is it to rewrite your code and permissions just for us?

    Are we doing this because we think we should, or because the likes of Dowden think we need another battle with the evil power?
    For most developers, pretty easy. They’ll have a geo-locate script that sorts users into EU and non-EU based on IP address. All they need to do is move UK into non-EU. In fact, the geo-locate provider probably does it for them, so no effort at all.
    We'll all just need to have separate GB and NI versions issued for the different regulations.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Sandpit said:

    Exclusive: Ministers are preparing to overhaul the EU GDPR rules and replace with new British data privacy laws

    Oliver Dowden says will spell end to 'pointless' cookie requests and red tape for biz

    But diverging threatens to spark fresh row with EU


    https://twitter.com/HarryYorke1/status/1430649157312819207?s=20

    Whilst the EU GDPR laws are Fucking Stupid, our repeal of them is unlikely to be the start of the great spyware era. For all the major players how much faff is it to rewrite your code and permissions just for us?

    Are we doing this because we think we should, or because the likes of Dowden think we need another battle with the evil power?
    For most developers, pretty easy. They’ll have a geo-locate script that sorts users into EU and non-EU based on IP address. All they need to do is move UK into non-EU. In fact, the geo-locate provider probably does it for them, so no effort at all.
    We'll all just need to have separate GB and NI versions issued for the different regulations.
    Actually, given the choice, I'd happily pay eu roaming charges in exchange for being liberated from those Accept Cookies dialogues.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,745
    IanB2 said:

    Good morning everyone. 13.2degC and cloudy again. Lovely afternoon yesterday, sitting in a friends garden, drinking wine.
    .

    Hopefully he didn’t mind too much, when he got home and found you there?
    It was her, actually, and she was an excellent hostess to the other five of us. u3a Group meetings are usually very friendly and cheerful, especially when wine is involved.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    AlistairM said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
    If anyone's suffering a labour shortage they can always try paying better wages to attract staff.

    The minimum wage is supposed to be an absolute minimum not a maximum.
    Quite. And yet they have to supply the supermarkets. Who are about as moveable as that container ship in the Suez Canal.
    The market is pretty efficient.

    If the supermarkets require stock they will pay what they need to do so, so the price will go up.

    Or if they're outcompeted by other nations and importing it is cheaper then that's what we should do.

    Either way, let the free market sort it out.

    If supermarkets are inefficient then that's their problem they need to sort out, we don't need to change our laws to handle companies inefficiencies.
    Yes.

    And there will be people who lose out from this - and that will be painful, and that sucks. But ultimately, one needs to let the market decide. Otherwise, we will end up with swapping a modern economy for one favoured industries get government support by the back door.
    No.

    I mean, yes, but I don't know any evidence that supermarkets are bloated behemoths which deserve to go to the free market wall. They operate on tight margins. Sure you can tighten them further, but the continued existence of tesco in the face of lidl shows that the market doesn't necessarily want them tightened further. Philip thinks all market solutions are good solutions, but the solution here is that he pays higher prices in a continuing to exist tesco or lidl. Not clear why he is cheering that.
    Most of the major supermarkets are bloated and inefficient. The reason why outfits like Tesco have taken an axe to thinks like the fish counter (and checkout operators and people to restock the shelves) is because people cost money and they have too many of them.

    Compare and contrast with the Aldi, Lidl, Home Bargains etc operating model where you have fewer products and fewer staff in stores supplied by fewer depots. Tesco et al cannot cut their prices as demanded by Philip because there isn't the fat in their operation to be cut. The only way that could happen would be for one of them to physically restructure their operation into Lidl. But as Aldi and Lidl are everywhere and people still shop in Tesco, Sainsburys etc it shows that the market will not support a "let the market rip" transformation of all supermarkets into low cost operations. Punters don't want to shop there.

    Frankly there is the other divide which few want to point to. The PLCs are generally the retailers drowning in costs and the need to generate Good News for the city every quarter. The retailers who are efficient and not full of bloat are privately owned. Isn't it supposed to be the other way round, that the rigours of the free market ensure that PLCs are as lean as can be?
    I can't face shopping in big supermarkets again. The amount of time it takes to walk around them is too much. If I go to Aldi I only have 5 aisles to do and can be in and out quickly even with a big family shop.

    Most of the aisles at a big Tesco are filled with a much wider range of products that 99% of the time I do not need. No wonder it is harder for them to keep them stocked. I was at Aldi a couple of days ago and the only gap was in some varieties of chicken. Everything else well stocked.
    Quickly? QUICKLY? The queueing experience in lidl takes me back to the 1970s.
  • AlistairMAlistairM Posts: 2,005
    IshmaelZ said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
    If anyone's suffering a labour shortage they can always try paying better wages to attract staff.

    The minimum wage is supposed to be an absolute minimum not a maximum.
    Quite. And yet they have to supply the supermarkets. Who are about as moveable as that container ship in the Suez Canal.
    The market is pretty efficient.

    If the supermarkets require stock they will pay what they need to do so, so the price will go up.

    Or if they're outcompeted by other nations and importing it is cheaper then that's what we should do.

    Either way, let the free market sort it out.

    If supermarkets are inefficient then that's their problem they need to sort out, we don't need to change our laws to handle companies inefficiencies.
    Yes.

    And there will be people who lose out from this - and that will be painful, and that sucks. But ultimately, one needs to let the market decide. Otherwise, we will end up with swapping a modern economy for one favoured industries get government support by the back door.
    No.

    I mean, yes, but I don't know any evidence that supermarkets are bloated behemoths which deserve to go to the free market wall. They operate on tight margins. Sure you can tighten them further, but the continued existence of tesco in the face of lidl shows that the market doesn't necessarily want them tightened further. Philip thinks all market solutions are good solutions, but the solution here is that he pays higher prices in a continuing to exist tesco or lidl. Not clear why he is cheering that.
    Most of the major supermarkets are bloated and inefficient. The reason why outfits like Tesco have taken an axe to thinks like the fish counter (and checkout operators and people to restock the shelves) is because people cost money and they have too many of them.

    Compare and contrast with the Aldi, Lidl, Home Bargains etc operating model where you have fewer products and fewer staff in stores supplied by fewer depots. Tesco et al cannot cut their prices as demanded by Philip because there isn't the fat in their operation to be cut. The only way that could happen would be for one of them to physically restructure their operation into Lidl. But as Aldi and Lidl are everywhere and people still shop in Tesco, Sainsburys etc it shows that the market will not support a "let the market rip" transformation of all supermarkets into low cost operations. Punters don't want to shop there.

    Frankly there is the other divide which few want to point to. The PLCs are generally the retailers drowning in costs and the need to generate Good News for the city every quarter. The retailers who are efficient and not full of bloat are privately owned. Isn't it supposed to be the other way round, that the rigours of the free market ensure that PLCs are as lean as can be?
    Surely either they are bloated and inefficient, or there isn't the fat in their operation to be cut? They survive because people are prepared to pay more for a better shopping experience - and Lidl etc really do suck as a shopping experience.
    Personally with the exception of Waitrose and M&S I think Aldi/Lidl have a better experience than the big supermarkets. Mainly because there is no experience at any of them and therefore the faster you can be in and out then the better experience it is!
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,946
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:
    It may well end up being India who we need alongside us to revitalise western values of freedom and democracy if the US under Biden and indeed much of the rest of the world is giving up the fight and plunging into self absorbed trashing of its own culture and heritage.

    The West has abandoned the West. We are fucked
    More the left, particularly in the US, has abandoned the West.

    They will not be in power forever, there will be a conservative counter reaction in due course, maybe a liberal one too.

    JFK once inspired the world with these words on freedom, Biden has abandoned the fight but a future President will fight it again

    'Let every nation know, whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose any foe to assure the survival and the success of liberty.'
    https://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/kennedy.asp
    The left is not in power now. The blue team's been running the show for more than a decade. Oh look, something bad's happening. Let's blame "the left".
    In the US the left are in power and the US is the most powerful western nation still by far but unwilling to stand up to China, Russia and jihadi Islam and for western values instead of trashing them.

    The Democrats control the Presidency and Congress and it is the woke left in the Democratic Party driving the agenda of hatred of western heritage and culture and Biden at the top leading US retreat from the world
    "In the US the left are in power"

    I am not defending Biden's Afghan retreat, but that is a patently false statement.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    AlistairM said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
    If anyone's suffering a labour shortage they can always try paying better wages to attract staff.

    The minimum wage is supposed to be an absolute minimum not a maximum.
    Quite. And yet they have to supply the supermarkets. Who are about as moveable as that container ship in the Suez Canal.
    The market is pretty efficient.

    If the supermarkets require stock they will pay what they need to do so, so the price will go up.

    Or if they're outcompeted by other nations and importing it is cheaper then that's what we should do.

    Either way, let the free market sort it out.

    If supermarkets are inefficient then that's their problem they need to sort out, we don't need to change our laws to handle companies inefficiencies.
    Yes.

    And there will be people who lose out from this - and that will be painful, and that sucks. But ultimately, one needs to let the market decide. Otherwise, we will end up with swapping a modern economy for one favoured industries get government support by the back door.
    No.

    I mean, yes, but I don't know any evidence that supermarkets are bloated behemoths which deserve to go to the free market wall. They operate on tight margins. Sure you can tighten them further, but the continued existence of tesco in the face of lidl shows that the market doesn't necessarily want them tightened further. Philip thinks all market solutions are good solutions, but the solution here is that he pays higher prices in a continuing to exist tesco or lidl. Not clear why he is cheering that.
    Most of the major supermarkets are bloated and inefficient. The reason why outfits like Tesco have taken an axe to thinks like the fish counter (and checkout operators and people to restock the shelves) is because people cost money and they have too many of them.

    Compare and contrast with the Aldi, Lidl, Home Bargains etc operating model where you have fewer products and fewer staff in stores supplied by fewer depots. Tesco et al cannot cut their prices as demanded by Philip because there isn't the fat in their operation to be cut. The only way that could happen would be for one of them to physically restructure their operation into Lidl. But as Aldi and Lidl are everywhere and people still shop in Tesco, Sainsburys etc it shows that the market will not support a "let the market rip" transformation of all supermarkets into low cost operations. Punters don't want to shop there.

    Frankly there is the other divide which few want to point to. The PLCs are generally the retailers drowning in costs and the need to generate Good News for the city every quarter. The retailers who are efficient and not full of bloat are privately owned. Isn't it supposed to be the other way round, that the rigours of the free market ensure that PLCs are as lean as can be?
    Surely either they are bloated and inefficient, or there isn't the fat in their operation to be cut? They survive because people are prepared to pay more for a better shopping experience - and Lidl etc really do suck as a shopping experience.
    Personally with the exception of Waitrose and M&S I think Aldi/Lidl have a better experience than the big supermarkets. Mainly because there is no experience at any of them and therefore the faster you can be in and out then the better experience it is!
    See above - it's the queueing.
  • AlistairM said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
    If anyone's suffering a labour shortage they can always try paying better wages to attract staff.

    The minimum wage is supposed to be an absolute minimum not a maximum.
    Quite. And yet they have to supply the supermarkets. Who are about as moveable as that container ship in the Suez Canal.
    The market is pretty efficient.

    If the supermarkets require stock they will pay what they need to do so, so the price will go up.

    Or if they're outcompeted by other nations and importing it is cheaper then that's what we should do.

    Either way, let the free market sort it out.

    If supermarkets are inefficient then that's their problem they need to sort out, we don't need to change our laws to handle companies inefficiencies.
    Yes.

    And there will be people who lose out from this - and that will be painful, and that sucks. But ultimately, one needs to let the market decide. Otherwise, we will end up with swapping a modern economy for one favoured industries get government support by the back door.
    No.

    I mean, yes, but I don't know any evidence that supermarkets are bloated behemoths which deserve to go to the free market wall. They operate on tight margins. Sure you can tighten them further, but the continued existence of tesco in the face of lidl shows that the market doesn't necessarily want them tightened further. Philip thinks all market solutions are good solutions, but the solution here is that he pays higher prices in a continuing to exist tesco or lidl. Not clear why he is cheering that.
    Most of the major supermarkets are bloated and inefficient. The reason why outfits like Tesco have taken an axe to thinks like the fish counter (and checkout operators and people to restock the shelves) is because people cost money and they have too many of them.

    Compare and contrast with the Aldi, Lidl, Home Bargains etc operating model where you have fewer products and fewer staff in stores supplied by fewer depots. Tesco et al cannot cut their prices as demanded by Philip because there isn't the fat in their operation to be cut. The only way that could happen would be for one of them to physically restructure their operation into Lidl. But as Aldi and Lidl are everywhere and people still shop in Tesco, Sainsburys etc it shows that the market will not support a "let the market rip" transformation of all supermarkets into low cost operations. Punters don't want to shop there.

    Frankly there is the other divide which few want to point to. The PLCs are generally the retailers drowning in costs and the need to generate Good News for the city every quarter. The retailers who are efficient and not full of bloat are privately owned. Isn't it supposed to be the other way round, that the rigours of the free market ensure that PLCs are as lean as can be?
    I can't face shopping in big supermarkets again. The amount of time it takes to walk around them is too much. If I go to Aldi I only have 5 aisles to do and can be in and out quickly even with a big family shop.

    Most of the aisles at a big Tesco are filled with a much wider range of products that 99% of the time I do not need. No wonder it is harder for them to keep them stocked. I was at Aldi a couple of days ago and the only gap was in some varieties of chicken. Everything else well stocked.
    I'm a long-standing advocate of Aldi & Lidl - controversial when you are sales management in a market leading supplier. Their model is right long term and not needing 13 varieties of Hummus is an example of why. The problem is that everyone makes money offering punters additional hummus goodness. So the wheel goes round and CCO's at major supermarkets stand on stage and berate the audience of manufacturer reps for their crime of trading with the "discounters".

    Chunks of my industry is close to a protection racket. We all know it. But when you offer consumers the option to reduce their options they hate it. Tesco have trialled stripping a store back to be stocked like an Aldi. Cut bog roll choices down to a handful which are stocked in each to merch pallets on the floor. Sales drop because supermarket shoppers don't want that.

    So back to Philip's let the market decide strategy. All that will happen is huge food price inflation. Like <30%. As millions are broke as fuck as it is this will absolutely mean starvation despite rcs denying it. We haven't seen an explosion in people using food banks because they are too lazy to shop. Its because they are broke, hungry and desperate.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Rescuing cats and dogs from Kabul is laughable. Using donations to rescue animals whilst people go unrescued is sickening.

    Actually, truly evil, under a veneer of mawkish loveliness.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040
    AlistairM said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
    If anyone's suffering a labour shortage they can always try paying better wages to attract staff.

    The minimum wage is supposed to be an absolute minimum not a maximum.
    Quite. And yet they have to supply the supermarkets. Who are about as moveable as that container ship in the Suez Canal.
    The market is pretty efficient.

    If the supermarkets require stock they will pay what they need to do so, so the price will go up.

    Or if they're outcompeted by other nations and importing it is cheaper then that's what we should do.

    Either way, let the free market sort it out.

    If supermarkets are inefficient then that's their problem they need to sort out, we don't need to change our laws to handle companies inefficiencies.
    Yes.

    And there will be people who lose out from this - and that will be painful, and that sucks. But ultimately, one needs to let the market decide. Otherwise, we will end up with swapping a modern economy for one favoured industries get government support by the back door.
    No.

    I mean, yes, but I don't know any evidence that supermarkets are bloated behemoths which deserve to go to the free market wall. They operate on tight margins. Sure you can tighten them further, but the continued existence of tesco in the face of lidl shows that the market doesn't necessarily want them tightened further. Philip thinks all market solutions are good solutions, but the solution here is that he pays higher prices in a continuing to exist tesco or lidl. Not clear why he is cheering that.
    Most of the major supermarkets are bloated and inefficient. The reason why outfits like Tesco have taken an axe to thinks like the fish counter (and checkout operators and people to restock the shelves) is because people cost money and they have too many of them.

    Compare and contrast with the Aldi, Lidl, Home Bargains etc operating model where you have fewer products and fewer staff in stores supplied by fewer depots. Tesco et al cannot cut their prices as demanded by Philip because there isn't the fat in their operation to be cut. The only way that could happen would be for one of them to physically restructure their operation into Lidl. But as Aldi and Lidl are everywhere and people still shop in Tesco, Sainsburys etc it shows that the market will not support a "let the market rip" transformation of all supermarkets into low cost operations. Punters don't want to shop there.

    Frankly there is the other divide which few want to point to. The PLCs are generally the retailers drowning in costs and the need to generate Good News for the city every quarter. The retailers who are efficient and not full of bloat are privately owned. Isn't it supposed to be the other way round, that the rigours of the free market ensure that PLCs are as lean as can be?
    I can't face shopping in big supermarkets again. The amount of time it takes to walk around them is too much. If I go to Aldi I only have 5 aisles to do and can be in and out quickly even with a big family shop.

    Most of the aisles at a big Tesco are filled with a much wider range of products that 99% of the time I do not need. No wonder it is harder for them to keep them stocked. I was at Aldi a couple of days ago and the only gap was in some varieties of chicken. Everything else well stocked.
    I cannot remember a time when there were not stocking issues at our local Tesco Extra store. Long before Brexit it was almost unheard of to come back with everything that was on the shopping list, no doubt for the reasons you have indicated. It didn't matter, you either waited a few days or bought an alternative.

    The situation has not noticeably changed for me. There have been some more gaps on things like salad and some freezer products such as our favourite ice lollies but the shop remains pretty well as stocked as it ever was. I have found their restrictions on their deli counter and fish counter introduced to reduce costs as @RochdalePioneers pointed out more annoying in terms of getting what I want.

    Why @Scott_P thinks this requires the posting of the same dramatic headlines multiple times a day rather escapes me.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,093

    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Sandpit said:

    Cases in Australia and New Zealand are still going up:

    Australia: +1,098
    New Zealand: +68

    Sad to see, but the containment strategy has now clearly failed. They need to get everyone vaccinated yesterday, and people need to stay at home until it’s done.
    We don't see many stories about it, but the same is true in China. They have major Delta issues across the country, and they are also far from fully vaccinated.
    And their vaccines don't work very well. Which is a bit surprising given that they designed the virus in the first place.
    Although, the last time I discussed this with my son, he was still saying he had to have been jabbed with a Chinese vaccine before any (business) trip to China.I think, too that UK doesn't accept vaccination with Chinese vaccine as conferring immunity.
    Which means FOUR vaccinations for somewhat wants to visit both China and Britain/Europe.
    Mr S, from the sandpit, may have further and better info, of course
    I was discussing the last night with a friend who used to go to China on business fairly regularly. Long story short, he isn't going to go any more. If there are any problems in China which require an actual visit by a westerner, they will simply close the China office down.
    China appears to have made the calculation that it simply doesn't need westerners any more.
    Personally - and as someone who has never been to China - the place has become a lot less enticing over the last couple of years as its more, er, North Korean aspects have become more apparent. I don't know how fair this is but you certainly couldn't persuade me to visit the place now.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118

    Lowest levels of car production for any July since 1956, UK industry reports

    UK carmakers made 53,400 vehicles in July, a 37.6% drop when compared with the same month in 2020, according to data from the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders (SMMT)

    Jaguar Land Rover and Nissan, the two largest manufacturers in the UK, have both previously been forced to cut production because of shortages.

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/aug/26/lowest-levels-of-car-production-for-any-july-since-1956-uk-industry-reports

    Beautiful selective quoting
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,745

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:
    It may well end up being India who we need alongside us to revitalise western values of freedom and democracy if the US under Biden and indeed much of the rest of the world is giving up the fight and plunging into self absorbed trashing of its own culture and heritage.

    The West has abandoned the West. We are fucked
    More the left, particularly in the US, has abandoned the West.

    They will not be in power forever, there will be a conservative counter reaction in due course, maybe a liberal one too.

    JFK once inspired the world with these words on freedom, Biden has abandoned the fight but a future President will fight it again

    'Let every nation know, whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose any foe to assure the survival and the success of liberty.'
    https://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/kennedy.asp
    The left is not in power now. The blue team's been running the show for more than a decade. Oh look, something bad's happening. Let's blame "the left".
    In the US the left are in power and the US is the most powerful western nation still by far but unwilling to stand up to China, Russia and jihadi Islam and for western values instead of trashing them.

    The Democrats control the Presidency and Congress and it is the woke left in the Democratic Party driving the agenda of hatred of western heritage and culture and Biden at the top leading US retreat from the world
    "In the US the left are in power"

    I am not defending Biden's Afghan retreat, but that is a patently false statement.
    I THINK he means relatively, in US terms. Although in what world the Dems demonstrate 'hatred of western heritage' I can't imagine.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,791
    rcs1000 said:

    JLR has been losing market share. And just in time inventory is still adjusting to Brexit.

    JLR look a bit fucked. Coventry, we have a problem. The end of platform sharing between the J and the LR obviously means Tata want to dispose of one of the brands They are subscale for the transition to BEV and are casting around for a technology partner to realise their strategy of making Jaguar a super-premium EV only brand.

    That's also the strategy of a few other brands (Bentley, Cadillac, Maserati) who will probably do it better.

    I expect Johnson will give them money if they threaten to close a plant.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    DavidL said:

    Why @Scott_P thinks this requires the posting of the same dramatic headlines multiple times a day rather escapes me.

    They are not the same headlines. Maybe if you payed attention you would understand.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,046

    Rescuing cats and dogs from Kabul is laughable. Using donations to rescue animals whilst people go unrescued is sickening.

    The Taliban have access to BBC News. They’ll be well aware of this story, and know there’s a great chance to make an example of someone without having to kill any Western people.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,253

    Exclusive: Ministers are preparing to overhaul the EU GDPR rules and replace with new British data privacy laws

    Oliver Dowden says will spell end to 'pointless' cookie requests and red tape for biz

    But diverging threatens to spark fresh row with EU


    https://twitter.com/HarryYorke1/status/1430649157312819207?s=20

    Hard to see the upside – even if GDPR is a PITA, it is a trans-European PITA. And "allowing data to be used more flexibly" does not sound like the government will be increasing our protection.
    Getting rid of the cookie cutter nonsense would be a benefit for Brexit all by itself. It's a completely stupid and infuriating PITA that literally serves no purpose whatsoever.

    Deregulation or smarter regulations shouldn't be solely about increasing our protection it's not a simple linear scale where more protection is always a good thing with no downside at all.
    Surely this just means most companies will need to comply with two standards rather than one. If WIgan-based ACME plc has European customers, it will still need to comply with GDPR, aiui.
    No this isn't the case. It means the UK loses its data adequacy agreement with the EU and that means UK-based companies can't easily process data that relates to EU individuals. eg any kind of transaction data. This would cover for example, Sky wanting to understand and leverage the viewing patterns of customers in its German and Italian subsidiaries, the customer data of an online retailer.

    GDPR isn't in general a stupid piece of legislation. It aims to tackle a real privacy problem, but is of somewhat limited effectiveness. If you get rid of it, you are not really tackling that problem at all, which is why the EU is fussy about it.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156

    Rescuing cats and dogs from Kabul is laughable. Using donations to rescue animals whilst people go unrescued is sickening.

    They’ve given in to terrierism.
    It is sad that Afghans are being hounded out of the country.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,093
    Has this been discussed? NHS draws up plans to vaccinate 12-15 year olds from the first week of September. New report expected to be published imminently on the safety and efficacy of vaccines for that cohort.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/08/25/nhs-draws-plans-vaccinate-12-year-olds/

    Somewhat self-interestedly, I wonder why they start at age 12, rather than at the start of senior school, 11.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Test
  • AlistairMAlistairM Posts: 2,005
    IshmaelZ said:

    AlistairM said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
    If anyone's suffering a labour shortage they can always try paying better wages to attract staff.

    The minimum wage is supposed to be an absolute minimum not a maximum.
    Quite. And yet they have to supply the supermarkets. Who are about as moveable as that container ship in the Suez Canal.
    The market is pretty efficient.

    If the supermarkets require stock they will pay what they need to do so, so the price will go up.

    Or if they're outcompeted by other nations and importing it is cheaper then that's what we should do.

    Either way, let the free market sort it out.

    If supermarkets are inefficient then that's their problem they need to sort out, we don't need to change our laws to handle companies inefficiencies.
    Yes.

    And there will be people who lose out from this - and that will be painful, and that sucks. But ultimately, one needs to let the market decide. Otherwise, we will end up with swapping a modern economy for one favoured industries get government support by the back door.
    No.

    I mean, yes, but I don't know any evidence that supermarkets are bloated behemoths which deserve to go to the free market wall. They operate on tight margins. Sure you can tighten them further, but the continued existence of tesco in the face of lidl shows that the market doesn't necessarily want them tightened further. Philip thinks all market solutions are good solutions, but the solution here is that he pays higher prices in a continuing to exist tesco or lidl. Not clear why he is cheering that.
    Most of the major supermarkets are bloated and inefficient. The reason why outfits like Tesco have taken an axe to thinks like the fish counter (and checkout operators and people to restock the shelves) is because people cost money and they have too many of them.

    Compare and contrast with the Aldi, Lidl, Home Bargains etc operating model where you have fewer products and fewer staff in stores supplied by fewer depots. Tesco et al cannot cut their prices as demanded by Philip because there isn't the fat in their operation to be cut. The only way that could happen would be for one of them to physically restructure their operation into Lidl. But as Aldi and Lidl are everywhere and people still shop in Tesco, Sainsburys etc it shows that the market will not support a "let the market rip" transformation of all supermarkets into low cost operations. Punters don't want to shop there.

    Frankly there is the other divide which few want to point to. The PLCs are generally the retailers drowning in costs and the need to generate Good News for the city every quarter. The retailers who are efficient and not full of bloat are privately owned. Isn't it supposed to be the other way round, that the rigours of the free market ensure that PLCs are as lean as can be?
    I can't face shopping in big supermarkets again. The amount of time it takes to walk around them is too much. If I go to Aldi I only have 5 aisles to do and can be in and out quickly even with a big family shop.

    Most of the aisles at a big Tesco are filled with a much wider range of products that 99% of the time I do not need. No wonder it is harder for them to keep them stocked. I was at Aldi a couple of days ago and the only gap was in some varieties of chicken. Everything else well stocked.
    Quickly? QUICKLY? The queueing experience in lidl takes me back to the 1970s.
    I rarely wait at the queue in Aldi. It could be because I have to unload shopping for a family of 5 onto the conveyor belt which takes just as long as any waiting. I wish they would do self scan but can't see that they will ever as they would lose money to theft.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,046
    IshmaelZ said:

    Test

    Yep, second day today. England surprisingly dominant yesterday.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830


    I'm a long-standing advocate of Aldi & Lidl - controversial when you are sales management in a market leading supplier. Their model is right long term and not needing 13 varieties of Hummus is an example of why. The problem is that everyone makes money offering punters additional hummus goodness. So the wheel goes round and CCO's at major supermarkets stand on stage and berate the audience of manufacturer reps for their crime of trading with the "discounters".

    Chunks of my industry is close to a protection racket. We all know it. But when you offer consumers the option to reduce their options they hate it. Tesco have trialled stripping a store back to be stocked like an Aldi. Cut bog roll choices down to a handful which are stocked in each to merch pallets on the floor. Sales drop because supermarket shoppers don't want that.

    So back to Philip's let the market decide strategy. All that will happen is huge food price inflation. Like 30%. As millions are broke as fuck as it is this will absolutely mean starvation despite rcs denying it. We haven't seen an explosion in people using food banks because they are too lazy to shop. Its because they are broke, hungry and desperate.

    What the customers want, is what they want. You sound like that gag about the government dissolving the electorate.

    It was life changing for me when tesco closed the fish counter and you can't get soused anchovies any longer.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064
    Cookie said:

    Has this been discussed? NHS draws up plans to vaccinate 12-15 year olds from the first week of September. New report expected to be published imminently on the safety and efficacy of vaccines for that cohort.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/08/25/nhs-draws-plans-vaccinate-12-year-olds/

    Somewhat self-interestedly, I wonder why they start at age 12, rather than at the start of senior school, 11.

    Pfizer haven't had it approved for 11 year olds. That trial is still on going.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040
    Scott_xP said:

    DavidL said:

    Why @Scott_P thinks this requires the posting of the same dramatic headlines multiple times a day rather escapes me.

    They are not the same headlines. Maybe if you payed attention you would understand.
    So you haven't been posting headlines about the shortage of lorry drivers for the best part of a month? Without ever acknowledging that the major problem has been the lack of HGV testing during the pandemic? Just as the low car production is being caused by a lack of chips from the far east and has nothing to do with our trading relationship with the EU?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,046
    Cookie said:

    Has this been discussed? NHS draws up plans to vaccinate 12-15 year olds from the first week of September. New report expected to be published imminently on the safety and efficacy of vaccines for that cohort.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/08/25/nhs-draws-plans-vaccinate-12-year-olds/

    Somewhat self-interestedly, I wonder why they start at age 12, rather than at the start of senior school, 11.

    12 was the cutoff for the Pfizer trials, which AIUI were done in the States.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    IshmaelZ said:


    I'm a long-standing advocate of Aldi & Lidl - controversial when you are sales management in a market leading supplier. Their model is right long term and not needing 13 varieties of Hummus is an example of why. The problem is that everyone makes money offering punters additional hummus goodness. So the wheel goes round and CCO's at major supermarkets stand on stage and berate the audience of manufacturer reps for their crime of trading with the "discounters".

    Chunks of my industry is close to a protection racket. We all know it. But when you offer consumers the option to reduce their options they hate it. Tesco have trialled stripping a store back to be stocked like an Aldi. Cut bog roll choices down to a handful which are stocked in each to merch pallets on the floor. Sales drop because supermarket shoppers don't want that.

    So back to Philip's let the market decide strategy. All that will happen is huge food price inflation. Like 30%. As millions are broke as fuck as it is this will absolutely mean starvation despite rcs denying it. We haven't seen an explosion in people using food banks because they are too lazy to shop. Its because they are broke, hungry and desperate.

    What the customers want, is what they want. You sound like that gag about the government dissolving the electorate.

    It was life changing for me when tesco closed the fish counter and you can't get soused anchovies any longer.
    Edit you had a less than before 30% which was preventing me from replying (and should have been a greater than anyway)
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040
    Sandpit said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Test

    Yep, second day today. England surprisingly dominant yesterday.
    Their batting line up today looks more like the one day team with Malan, Bairstow, Buttler, Ali and Curran. I would like to think that they could put the foot down a bit and score at a decent clip, even at the cost of wickets, to build a really substantial lead.
  • AlistairMAlistairM Posts: 2,005
    Cookie said:

    Has this been discussed? NHS draws up plans to vaccinate 12-15 year olds from the first week of September. New report expected to be published imminently on the safety and efficacy of vaccines for that cohort.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/08/25/nhs-draws-plans-vaccinate-12-year-olds/

    Somewhat self-interestedly, I wonder why they start at age 12, rather than at the start of senior school, 11.

    I support this but do hope they prioritise boosters for the elderly. Hopefully we have stockpiled enough to make both achievable. We need to crack on with both ASAP.
  • swing_voterswing_voter Posts: 1,464
    Sandpit said:

    Rescuing cats and dogs from Kabul is laughable. Using donations to rescue animals whilst people go unrescued is sickening.

    The Taliban have access to BBC News. They’ll be well aware of this story, and know there’s a great chance to make an example of someone without having to kill any Western people.
    and God forbid if the PM's wife gets wind of those puppies......
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,533

    Rescuing cats and dogs from Kabul is laughable. Using donations to rescue animals whilst people go unrescued is sickening.

    They’ve given in to terrierism.
    The rescue efforts gone to the dogs...

    Trying to rescue people is like trying to herd cats...

    This policy has set the cat amongst the (non-Afghan) pigeons ...
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    Brexit, obvs:

    Because a nationwide security of supply for beer, but also for other beverages such as water, lemonade or juice, has long ceased to be a matter of course in this country.

    The reason: a massive and steadily worsening shortage of drivers. The Federal Association of Freight Transport, Logistics and Disposal (BGL) and the Federal Association of Freight Forwarding and Logistics (DSLV) have jointly calculated that between 45,000 and 60,000 professional drivers are currently lacking in Germany.


    https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article231761025/Drohender-Versorgungskollaps-Es-fehlen-bis-zu-60-000-Lkw-Fahrer.html
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,253
    FF43 said:

    Exclusive: Ministers are preparing to overhaul the EU GDPR rules and replace with new British data privacy laws

    Oliver Dowden says will spell end to 'pointless' cookie requests and red tape for biz

    But diverging threatens to spark fresh row with EU


    https://twitter.com/HarryYorke1/status/1430649157312819207?s=20

    Hard to see the upside – even if GDPR is a PITA, it is a trans-European PITA. And "allowing data to be used more flexibly" does not sound like the government will be increasing our protection.
    Getting rid of the cookie cutter nonsense would be a benefit for Brexit all by itself. It's a completely stupid and infuriating PITA that literally serves no purpose whatsoever.

    Deregulation or smarter regulations shouldn't be solely about increasing our protection it's not a simple linear scale where more protection is always a good thing with no downside at all.
    Surely this just means most companies will need to comply with two standards rather than one. If WIgan-based ACME plc has European customers, it will still need to comply with GDPR, aiui.
    No this isn't the case. It means the UK loses its data adequacy agreement with the EU and that means UK-based companies can't easily process data that relates to EU individuals. eg any kind of transaction data. This would cover for example, Sky wanting to understand and leverage the viewing patterns of customers in its German and Italian subsidiaries, the customer data of an online retailer.

    GDPR isn't in general a stupid piece of legislation. It aims to tackle a real privacy problem, but is of somewhat limited effectiveness. If you get rid of it, you are not really tackling that problem at all, which is why the EU is fussy about it.
    Should add an extra bit. The risk for UK companies from doing GDPR wrong is that they get sued. The data adequacy agreement gives them protection.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,046

    Sandpit said:

    Rescuing cats and dogs from Kabul is laughable. Using donations to rescue animals whilst people go unrescued is sickening.

    The Taliban have access to BBC News. They’ll be well aware of this story, and know there’s a great chance to make an example of someone without having to kill any Western people.
    and God forbid if the PM's wife gets wind of those puppies......
    Which is exactly why the animals won’t be getting through. The Western people will be allowed through if they wish, or they can stay with the animals - their choice.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,093
    IshmaelZ said:


    I'm a long-standing advocate of Aldi & Lidl - controversial when you are sales management in a market leading supplier. Their model is right long term and not needing 13 varieties of Hummus is an example of why. The problem is that everyone makes money offering punters additional hummus goodness. So the wheel goes round and CCO's at major supermarkets stand on stage and berate the audience of manufacturer reps for their crime of trading with the "discounters".

    Chunks of my industry is close to a protection racket. We all know it. But when you offer consumers the option to reduce their options they hate it. Tesco have trialled stripping a store back to be stocked like an Aldi. Cut bog roll choices down to a handful which are stocked in each to merch pallets on the floor. Sales drop because supermarket shoppers don't want that.

    So back to Philip's let the market decide strategy. All that will happen is huge food price inflation. Like 30%. As millions are broke as fuck as it is this will absolutely mean starvation despite rcs denying it. We haven't seen an explosion in people using food banks because they are too lazy to shop. Its because they are broke, hungry and desperate.

    What the customers want, is what they want. You sound like that gag about the government dissolving the electorate.

    It was life changing for me when tesco closed the fish counter and you can't get soused anchovies any longer.
    Yes, and while I agree with Rochdale that what the customer wants is massive amounts of choice, I'm fairly sure this isn't immutable, and if it results in them not being able to afford their food they will change their preferences.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,533

    Brexit, obvs:

    Because a nationwide security of supply for beer, but also for other beverages such as water, lemonade or juice, has long ceased to be a matter of course in this country.

    The reason: a massive and steadily worsening shortage of drivers. The Federal Association of Freight Transport, Logistics and Disposal (BGL) and the Federal Association of Freight Forwarding and Logistics (DSLV) have jointly calculated that between 45,000 and 60,000 professional drivers are currently lacking in Germany.


    https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article231761025/Drohender-Versorgungskollaps-Es-fehlen-bis-zu-60-000-Lkw-Fahrer.html

    But SeanT was telling us that no-one should train as a lorry driver, as the autonomous car revolution was about to make them all redundant ...

    (To be fair to him, he predicted 'in ten years'; which still gives him a couple of years for it to happen.)
    (Hint: it won't.)
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Rescuing cats and dogs from Kabul is laughable. Using donations to rescue animals whilst people go unrescued is sickening.

    They’ve given in to terrierism.
    The rescue efforts gone to the dogs...

    Trying to rescue people is like trying to herd cats...

    This policy has set the cat amongst the (non-Afghan) pigeons ...
    I am too angry to joke about it. Lovely cats and doggies vs nasty dirty brown people.

    If this guy gets flown home and his animals don't he will be getting "how can you sleep at night, murderer?" hate mail for the rest of his life, and serve him right.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    A couple of Greens will become ministers but their actual function will be as human shields and co-conspirators, there to split the blame for decisions over which they will enjoy minimal, if any, influence and to shore up the SNP’s left flank. Nationalists impatient with Sturgeon’s failure to deliver Indyref2 or with her government’s Blair-esque triangulation will no longer have an alternative party to defect to. The Greens will be implicated in every compromise and every delay to the agenda of the pro-independence left, and the blame will fall heavier on them because these voters already factor in the SNP’s faint-hearted managerialism.

    The Greens have not signed up to a cooperation agreement, they’ve entered into a one-sided suicide pact.


    https://stephendaisley.substack.com/p/coalition-of-stasis
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,046

    Brexit, obvs:

    Because a nationwide security of supply for beer, but also for other beverages such as water, lemonade or juice, has long ceased to be a matter of course in this country.

    The reason: a massive and steadily worsening shortage of drivers. The Federal Association of Freight Transport, Logistics and Disposal (BGL) and the Federal Association of Freight Forwarding and Logistics (DSLV) have jointly calculated that between 45,000 and 60,000 professional drivers are currently lacking in Germany.


    https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article231761025/Drohender-Versorgungskollaps-Es-fehlen-bis-zu-60-000-Lkw-Fahrer.html

    But SeanT was telling us that no-one should train as a lorry driver, as the autonomous car revolution was about to make them all redundant ...

    (To be fair to him, he predicted 'in ten years'; which still gives him a couple of years for it to happen.)
    (Hint: it won't.)
    Are the LGV training and testing centres back open yet?

    Is it not correct that there are already corporation tax write offs in place for companies who invest in training and development, or who take on apprentices? Companies can start promoting their existing drivers into bigger vehicles, and taking on unemployed youngsters to drive the smaller vans.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040

    A couple of Greens will become ministers but their actual function will be as human shields and co-conspirators, there to split the blame for decisions over which they will enjoy minimal, if any, influence and to shore up the SNP’s left flank. Nationalists impatient with Sturgeon’s failure to deliver Indyref2 or with her government’s Blair-esque triangulation will no longer have an alternative party to defect to. The Greens will be implicated in every compromise and every delay to the agenda of the pro-independence left, and the blame will fall heavier on them because these voters already factor in the SNP’s faint-hearted managerialism.

    The Greens have not signed up to a cooperation agreement, they’ve entered into a one-sided suicide pact.


    https://stephendaisley.substack.com/p/coalition-of-stasis

    Well, we can hope.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,533
    A minor story, but one that needs dealing with:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58334745

    It's a classic religious versus secular situation, and one where I hope secularism wins.

    Since the amendment was drafted in the HoL, it's a good example of how the Lords still fulfil a useful role.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,830
    Dura_Ace said:

    rcs1000 said:

    JLR has been losing market share. And just in time inventory is still adjusting to Brexit.

    JLR look a bit fucked. Coventry, we have a problem. The end of platform sharing between the J and the LR obviously means Tata want to dispose of one of the brands They are subscale for the transition to BEV and are casting around for a technology partner to realise their strategy of making Jaguar a super-premium EV only brand.

    That's also the strategy of a few other brands (Bentley, Cadillac, Maserati) who will probably do it better.

    I expect Johnson will give them money if they threaten to close a plant.
    Cannock have a much bigger problem, given our largest employer is the JLR Diesel engine plant.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,830
    Cookie said:

    Has this been discussed? NHS draws up plans to vaccinate 12-15 year olds from the first week of September. New report expected to be published imminently on the safety and efficacy of vaccines for that cohort.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/08/25/nhs-draws-plans-vaccinate-12-year-olds/

    Somewhat self-interestedly, I wonder why they start at age 12, rather than at the start of senior school, 11.

    Called it...
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,700
    DavidL said:

    Sandpit said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Test

    Yep, second day today. England surprisingly dominant yesterday.
    Their batting line up today looks more like the one day team with Malan, Bairstow, Buttler, Ali and Curran. I would like to think that they could put the foot down a bit and score at a decent clip, even at the cost of wickets, to build a really substantial lead.
    Likely cloud cover for the next two days. Should swing more. I think a 200 run lead (so 180 runs for the last 10 wickets) and bowl them out for an innings win is possible.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040

    A minor story, but one that needs dealing with:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58334745

    It's a classic religious versus secular situation, and one where I hope secularism wins.

    Since the amendment was drafted in the HoL, it's a good example of how the Lords still fulfil a useful role.

    But she is divorced according to the secular law and is free to marry again. It is her religious beliefs and willingness to comply with a religion that allows this sort of nonsense that has trapped her. The decision to comply with that is a personal choice.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,138
    ydoethur said:

    Cookie said:

    Has this been discussed? NHS draws up plans to vaccinate 12-15 year olds from the first week of September. New report expected to be published imminently on the safety and efficacy of vaccines for that cohort.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/08/25/nhs-draws-plans-vaccinate-12-year-olds/

    Somewhat self-interestedly, I wonder why they start at age 12, rather than at the start of senior school, 11.

    Called it...
    "I wonder why they start at age 12"?

    Is this is to do with the legal stuff around the Gillick ruling on parental input?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,830
    DavidL said:

    A couple of Greens will become ministers but their actual function will be as human shields and co-conspirators, there to split the blame for decisions over which they will enjoy minimal, if any, influence and to shore up the SNP’s left flank. Nationalists impatient with Sturgeon’s failure to deliver Indyref2 or with her government’s Blair-esque triangulation will no longer have an alternative party to defect to. The Greens will be implicated in every compromise and every delay to the agenda of the pro-independence left, and the blame will fall heavier on them because these voters already factor in the SNP’s faint-hearted managerialism.

    The Greens have not signed up to a cooperation agreement, they’ve entered into a one-sided suicide pact.


    https://stephendaisley.substack.com/p/coalition-of-stasis

    Well, we can hope.
    I would have thought it would be suboptimal from your point of view at least if it only killed the Greens. Surely you should hope it takes down the SNP as well?
  • DavidL said:

    AlistairM said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
    If anyone's suffering a labour shortage they can always try paying better wages to attract staff.

    The minimum wage is supposed to be an absolute minimum not a maximum.
    Quite. And yet they have to supply the supermarkets. Who are about as moveable as that container ship in the Suez Canal.
    The market is pretty efficient.

    If the supermarkets require stock they will pay what they need to do so, so the price will go up.

    Or if they're outcompeted by other nations and importing it is cheaper then that's what we should do.

    Either way, let the free market sort it out.

    If supermarkets are inefficient then that's their problem they need to sort out, we don't need to change our laws to handle companies inefficiencies.
    Yes.

    And there will be people who lose out from this - and that will be painful, and that sucks. But ultimately, one needs to let the market decide. Otherwise, we will end up with swapping a modern economy for one favoured industries get government support by the back door.
    No.

    I mean, yes, but I don't know any evidence that supermarkets are bloated behemoths which deserve to go to the free market wall. They operate on tight margins. Sure you can tighten them further, but the continued existence of tesco in the face of lidl shows that the market doesn't necessarily want them tightened further. Philip thinks all market solutions are good solutions, but the solution here is that he pays higher prices in a continuing to exist tesco or lidl. Not clear why he is cheering that.
    Most of the major supermarkets are bloated and inefficient. The reason why outfits like Tesco have taken an axe to thinks like the fish counter (and checkout operators and people to restock the shelves) is because people cost money and they have too many of them.

    Compare and contrast with the Aldi, Lidl, Home Bargains etc operating model where you have fewer products and fewer staff in stores supplied by fewer depots. Tesco et al cannot cut their prices as demanded by Philip because there isn't the fat in their operation to be cut. The only way that could happen would be for one of them to physically restructure their operation into Lidl. But as Aldi and Lidl are everywhere and people still shop in Tesco, Sainsburys etc it shows that the market will not support a "let the market rip" transformation of all supermarkets into low cost operations. Punters don't want to shop there.

    Frankly there is the other divide which few want to point to. The PLCs are generally the retailers drowning in costs and the need to generate Good News for the city every quarter. The retailers who are efficient and not full of bloat are privately owned. Isn't it supposed to be the other way round, that the rigours of the free market ensure that PLCs are as lean as can be?
    I can't face shopping in big supermarkets again. The amount of time it takes to walk around them is too much. If I go to Aldi I only have 5 aisles to do and can be in and out quickly even with a big family shop.

    Most of the aisles at a big Tesco are filled with a much wider range of products that 99% of the time I do not need. No wonder it is harder for them to keep them stocked. I was at Aldi a couple of days ago and the only gap was in some varieties of chicken. Everything else well stocked.
    I cannot remember a time when there were not stocking issues at our local Tesco Extra store. Long before Brexit it was almost unheard of to come back with everything that was on the shopping list, no doubt for the reasons you have indicated. It didn't matter, you either waited a few days or bought an alternative.

    The situation has not noticeably changed for me. There have been some more gaps on things like salad and some freezer products such as our favourite ice lollies but the shop remains pretty well as stocked as it ever was. I have found their restrictions on their deli counter and fish counter introduced to reduce costs as @RochdalePioneers pointed out more annoying in terms of getting what I want.

    Why @Scott_P thinks this requires the posting of the same dramatic headlines multiple times a day rather escapes me.
    Doesn't need to be posted multiple times a day. But what we have now is not what we have had. It is significantly worse, it is going to get a lot worse even than this, there is no solution and only more downside risks.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,138
    Prince over the water on R4 at moment.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,830

    ydoethur said:

    Cookie said:

    Has this been discussed? NHS draws up plans to vaccinate 12-15 year olds from the first week of September. New report expected to be published imminently on the safety and efficacy of vaccines for that cohort.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/08/25/nhs-draws-plans-vaccinate-12-year-olds/

    Somewhat self-interestedly, I wonder why they start at age 12, rather than at the start of senior school, 11.

    Called it...
    "I wonder why they start at age 12"?

    Is this is to do with the legal stuff around the Gillick ruling on parental input?
    @MaxPB has already answered this.

    In practice I am assuming they would vaccinate Year 8 upwards.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,046

    DavidL said:

    Sandpit said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Test

    Yep, second day today. England surprisingly dominant yesterday.
    Their batting line up today looks more like the one day team with Malan, Bairstow, Buttler, Ali and Curran. I would like to think that they could put the foot down a bit and score at a decent clip, even at the cost of wickets, to build a really substantial lead.
    Likely cloud cover for the next two days. Should swing more. I think a 200 run lead (so 180 runs for the last 10 wickets) and bowl them out for an innings win is possible.
    Could be a two-day Test, which will really annoy the ECB and 30,000ish ticket holders for the weekend.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156

    A minor story, but one that needs dealing with:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58334745

    It's a classic religious versus secular situation, and one where I hope secularism wins.

    Since the amendment was drafted in the HoL, it's a good example of how the Lords still fulfil a useful role.

    When they talk of "religious divorce" presumably that means her legal divorce was much quicker?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040
    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    A couple of Greens will become ministers but their actual function will be as human shields and co-conspirators, there to split the blame for decisions over which they will enjoy minimal, if any, influence and to shore up the SNP’s left flank. Nationalists impatient with Sturgeon’s failure to deliver Indyref2 or with her government’s Blair-esque triangulation will no longer have an alternative party to defect to. The Greens will be implicated in every compromise and every delay to the agenda of the pro-independence left, and the blame will fall heavier on them because these voters already factor in the SNP’s faint-hearted managerialism.

    The Greens have not signed up to a cooperation agreement, they’ve entered into a one-sided suicide pact.


    https://stephendaisley.substack.com/p/coalition-of-stasis

    Well, we can hope.
    I would have thought it would be suboptimal from your point of view at least if it only killed the Greens. Surely you should hope it takes down the SNP as well?
    I suspect that in rUk you are not particularly troubled with the profound level of misery that Patrick Harvie can induce by opening his mouth and opining on any subject. Yes, I am hopeful that this will damage the SNP for the reasons I set out the other day but getting rid of the Greens would be a definite bonus.
  • Brexit, obvs:

    Because a nationwide security of supply for beer, but also for other beverages such as water, lemonade or juice, has long ceased to be a matter of course in this country.

    The reason: a massive and steadily worsening shortage of drivers. The Federal Association of Freight Transport, Logistics and Disposal (BGL) and the Federal Association of Freight Forwarding and Logistics (DSLV) have jointly calculated that between 45,000 and 60,000 professional drivers are currently lacking in Germany.


    https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article231761025/Drohender-Versorgungskollaps-Es-fehlen-bis-zu-60-000-Lkw-Fahrer.html

    Hardly. The issues in the UK are not unique and haven't been claimed as such. Our issues are *worse* because of Brexit.

    An easy partial fix. Drop the most punitive restrictions on EU drivers working in the UK. Not ones based here, ones who drive a loaded truck in from France, work they way up and down the country making multiple stops then return with a different full load.

    Our ban on cabotage makes it not economical for hauliers and their drivers to serve the UK (which is why so many have either stopped or are changing impossible prices) and means we are short of vehicles and drivers.

    Allow the logistics network to function again and our problem is then comparable with Germany instead of twice as bad. We will still need to fix the lack of new drivers being trained but at least we won't be facing the Christmas peak being chaos.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,207
    IshmaelZ said:

    Rescuing cats and dogs from Kabul is laughable. Using donations to rescue animals whilst people go unrescued is sickening.

    They’ve given in to terrierism.
    The rescue efforts gone to the dogs...

    Trying to rescue people is like trying to herd cats...

    This policy has set the cat amongst the (non-Afghan) pigeons ...
    I am too angry to joke about it. Lovely cats and doggies vs nasty dirty brown people.

    If this guy gets flown home and his animals don't he will be getting "how can you sleep at night, murderer?" hate mail for the rest of his life, and serve him right.
    I don't think that right. He wants to bring out both his animals and his "nasty dirty brown people".

    We will be back at the point where asylum seeking Afghans should be left to drown soon enough.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040
    Sandpit said:

    DavidL said:

    Sandpit said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Test

    Yep, second day today. England surprisingly dominant yesterday.
    Their batting line up today looks more like the one day team with Malan, Bairstow, Buttler, Ali and Curran. I would like to think that they could put the foot down a bit and score at a decent clip, even at the cost of wickets, to build a really substantial lead.
    Likely cloud cover for the next two days. Should swing more. I think a 200 run lead (so 180 runs for the last 10 wickets) and bowl them out for an innings win is possible.
    Could be a two-day Test, which will really annoy the ECB and 30,000ish ticket holders for the weekend.
    Sandpit said:

    DavidL said:

    Sandpit said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Test

    Yep, second day today. England surprisingly dominant yesterday.
    Their batting line up today looks more like the one day team with Malan, Bairstow, Buttler, Ali and Curran. I would like to think that they could put the foot down a bit and score at a decent clip, even at the cost of wickets, to build a really substantial lead.
    Likely cloud cover for the next two days. Should swing more. I think a 200 run lead (so 180 runs for the last 10 wickets) and bowl them out for an innings win is possible.
    Could be a two-day Test, which will really annoy the ECB and 30,000ish ticket holders for the weekend.
    More likely 4 days I think but I wouldn't be expecting any play on Sunday..
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,533
    DavidL said:

    A minor story, but one that needs dealing with:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58334745

    It's a classic religious versus secular situation, and one where I hope secularism wins.

    Since the amendment was drafted in the HoL, it's a good example of how the Lords still fulfil a useful role.

    But she is divorced according to the secular law and is free to marry again. It is her religious beliefs and willingness to comply with a religion that allows this sort of nonsense that has trapped her. The decision to comply with that is a personal choice.
    It's not just pressure from her: there might well be pressure from within her community as well.

    I see abuse of the get by some men an archetype of where religion conflicts with secularism. It needs to stop, and this law change seems a reasonable way to do it.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,138
    AlistairM said:

    Cookie said:

    Has this been discussed? NHS draws up plans to vaccinate 12-15 year olds from the first week of September. New report expected to be published imminently on the safety and efficacy of vaccines for that cohort.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/08/25/nhs-draws-plans-vaccinate-12-year-olds/

    Somewhat self-interestedly, I wonder why they start at age 12, rather than at the start of senior school, 11.

    I support this but do hope they prioritise boosters for the elderly. Hopefully we have stockpiled enough to make both achievable. We need to crack on with both ASAP.
    12 year olds can't take AZ and iirc we have buckets of that left over, so plenty for the boosters for 60+ year olds
  • A couple of Greens will become ministers but their actual function will be as human shields and co-conspirators, there to split the blame for decisions over which they will enjoy minimal, if any, influence and to shore up the SNP’s left flank. Nationalists impatient with Sturgeon’s failure to deliver Indyref2 or with her government’s Blair-esque triangulation will no longer have an alternative party to defect to. The Greens will be implicated in every compromise and every delay to the agenda of the pro-independence left, and the blame will fall heavier on them because these voters already factor in the SNP’s faint-hearted managerialism.

    The Greens have not signed up to a cooperation agreement, they’ve entered into a one-sided suicide pact.


    https://stephendaisley.substack.com/p/coalition-of-stasis

    They can still defect to Alba. Handy Alex has that lovely burnside garden suitable for a party garden party. He just needs members to join so he can hand them his juicy sausage.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,830
    DavidL said:

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    A couple of Greens will become ministers but their actual function will be as human shields and co-conspirators, there to split the blame for decisions over which they will enjoy minimal, if any, influence and to shore up the SNP’s left flank. Nationalists impatient with Sturgeon’s failure to deliver Indyref2 or with her government’s Blair-esque triangulation will no longer have an alternative party to defect to. The Greens will be implicated in every compromise and every delay to the agenda of the pro-independence left, and the blame will fall heavier on them because these voters already factor in the SNP’s faint-hearted managerialism.

    The Greens have not signed up to a cooperation agreement, they’ve entered into a one-sided suicide pact.


    https://stephendaisley.substack.com/p/coalition-of-stasis

    Well, we can hope.
    I would have thought it would be suboptimal from your point of view at least if it only killed the Greens. Surely you should hope it takes down the SNP as well?
    I suspect that in rUk you are not particularly troubled with the profound level of misery that Patrick Harvie can induce by opening his mouth and opining on any subject. Yes, I am hopeful that this will damage the SNP for the reasons I set out the other day but getting rid of the Greens would be a definite bonus.
    I suspect most people in the UK outside Scotland have never even heard of him.

    Is he one of those useful idiots for the oil and road lobby who opposes all developments to improve things and therefore causes far more pollution?
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216

    Brexit, obvs:

    Because a nationwide security of supply for beer, but also for other beverages such as water, lemonade or juice, has long ceased to be a matter of course in this country.

    The reason: a massive and steadily worsening shortage of drivers. The Federal Association of Freight Transport, Logistics and Disposal (BGL) and the Federal Association of Freight Forwarding and Logistics (DSLV) have jointly calculated that between 45,000 and 60,000 professional drivers are currently lacking in Germany.


    https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article231761025/Drohender-Versorgungskollaps-Es-fehlen-bis-zu-60-000-Lkw-Fahrer.html

    An easy partial fix. Drop the most punitive restrictions on EU drivers working in the UK.
    The EU which already has a driver shortage? In what sense are they "punitive"? Aren't they the same for others and Brits wanting to work in the EU?

  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040

    DavidL said:

    A minor story, but one that needs dealing with:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58334745

    It's a classic religious versus secular situation, and one where I hope secularism wins.

    Since the amendment was drafted in the HoL, it's a good example of how the Lords still fulfil a useful role.

    But she is divorced according to the secular law and is free to marry again. It is her religious beliefs and willingness to comply with a religion that allows this sort of nonsense that has trapped her. The decision to comply with that is a personal choice.
    It's not just pressure from her: there might well be pressure from within her community as well.

    I see abuse of the get by some men an archetype of where religion conflicts with secularism. It needs to stop, and this law change seems a reasonable way to do it.
    Of course it is an abuse by a patriarchal structure but it was in the hands of the patriarchal structure to change this themselves. The secular law already gave freedom to those that wanted it. I am not sure if the law change will have an effect. It only will if the patriarchal structure is willing to recognise and accept it.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,995

    Prince over the water on R4 at moment.

    Andrew has freely gone to face justice in the US?
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    edited August 2021
    Foxy said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Rescuing cats and dogs from Kabul is laughable. Using donations to rescue animals whilst people go unrescued is sickening.

    They’ve given in to terrierism.
    The rescue efforts gone to the dogs...

    Trying to rescue people is like trying to herd cats...

    This policy has set the cat amongst the (non-Afghan) pigeons ...
    I am too angry to joke about it. Lovely cats and doggies vs nasty dirty brown people.

    If this guy gets flown home and his animals don't he will be getting "how can you sleep at night, murderer?" hate mail for the rest of his life, and serve him right.
    I don't think that right. He wants to bring out both his animals and his "nasty dirty brown people".

    We will be back at the point where asylum seeking Afghans should be left to drown soon enough.
    I don't say that is his mindset, only that of his supporters.

    Conditions which are survivable by cats and dogs are survivable by humans, so he is prioritising animals over additional people who could be carried, and also wasting the incredibly precious time of the grown ups trying to deal with the crisis.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,830

    DavidL said:

    A minor story, but one that needs dealing with:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58334745

    It's a classic religious versus secular situation, and one where I hope secularism wins.

    Since the amendment was drafted in the HoL, it's a good example of how the Lords still fulfil a useful role.

    But she is divorced according to the secular law and is free to marry again. It is her religious beliefs and willingness to comply with a religion that allows this sort of nonsense that has trapped her. The decision to comply with that is a personal choice.
    It's not just pressure from her: there might well be pressure from within her community as well.

    I see abuse of the get by some men an archetype of where religion conflicts with secularism. It needs to stop, and this law change seems a reasonable way to do it.
    I’m struggling to see how this particular change in the law would achieve that, given according to the men concerned (yes, I know, Mandy Rice Davies applies) that would make it impossible for them to grant a religious divorce.

    So even if they ended up in prison, you don’t resolve the ‘pressure within the community’ problem.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216

    Brexit, obvs:

    Because a nationwide security of supply for beer, but also for other beverages such as water, lemonade or juice, has long ceased to be a matter of course in this country.

    The reason: a massive and steadily worsening shortage of drivers. The Federal Association of Freight Transport, Logistics and Disposal (BGL) and the Federal Association of Freight Forwarding and Logistics (DSLV) have jointly calculated that between 45,000 and 60,000 professional drivers are currently lacking in Germany.


    https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article231761025/Drohender-Versorgungskollaps-Es-fehlen-bis-zu-60-000-Lkw-Fahrer.html

    Our ban on cabotage
    Didn't the UK want to continue extensive cabotage, but it was the EU which wanted it significantly limited?

    https://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=da8c67d3-6078-45c1-8627-6b365d19b750
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,049
    Foxy said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Rescuing cats and dogs from Kabul is laughable. Using donations to rescue animals whilst people go unrescued is sickening.

    They’ve given in to terrierism.
    The rescue efforts gone to the dogs...

    Trying to rescue people is like trying to herd cats...

    This policy has set the cat amongst the (non-Afghan) pigeons ...
    I am too angry to joke about it. Lovely cats and doggies vs nasty dirty brown people.

    If this guy gets flown home and his animals don't he will be getting "how can you sleep at night, murderer?" hate mail for the rest of his life, and serve him right.
    I don't think that right. He wants to bring out both his animals and his "nasty dirty brown people".

    We will be back at the point where asylum seeking Afghans should be left to drown soon enough.
    Fuck the animals. What about animals around the rest of the world? Shall we charter some A300s to get those out? Shall we do a dawn raid on the Chinese live animal markets? Have masai mara patrols to ensure the safety of all gazelles there?

    Just spending moments even thinking about animals, let alone dedicating any resource or effort whatsoever to them is a seriously messed up moral compass.

    Get to fuck. Leave the animals. The guy obviously has issues and those should to be addressed when he gets back to the UK.
  • Brexit, obvs:

    Because a nationwide security of supply for beer, but also for other beverages such as water, lemonade or juice, has long ceased to be a matter of course in this country.

    The reason: a massive and steadily worsening shortage of drivers. The Federal Association of Freight Transport, Logistics and Disposal (BGL) and the Federal Association of Freight Forwarding and Logistics (DSLV) have jointly calculated that between 45,000 and 60,000 professional drivers are currently lacking in Germany.


    https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article231761025/Drohender-Versorgungskollaps-Es-fehlen-bis-zu-60-000-Lkw-Fahrer.html

    Hardly. The issues in the UK are not unique and haven't been claimed as such. Our issues are *worse* because of Brexit.

    An easy partial fix. Drop the most punitive restrictions on EU drivers working in the UK. Not ones based here, ones who drive a loaded truck in from France, work they way up and down the country making multiple stops then return with a different full load.

    Our ban on cabotage makes it not economical for hauliers and their drivers to serve the UK (which is why so many have either stopped or are changing impossible prices) and means we are short of vehicles and drivers.

    Allow the logistics network to function again and our problem is then comparable with Germany instead of twice as bad. We will still need to fix the lack of new drivers being trained but at least we won't be facing the Christmas peak being chaos.
    That would be a rational free-market thing to do, analogous to importing goods that can't be made cheaply here.

    However, a lot of the votes for Brexit and Johnson were for Britain to use its new freedom to become more protectionist, not less. It's always an attractive electoral proposition, even though it tends to end up badly.

    (What nearly everyone really wants deep down is protectionism for their job and a free market for everyone else's. That's as true for teachers and doctors as for taxi drivers. It's not a good thing, but it is rational, and acknowledging the worst about ourselves is generally a good thing.)
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,533
    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    A minor story, but one that needs dealing with:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58334745

    It's a classic religious versus secular situation, and one where I hope secularism wins.

    Since the amendment was drafted in the HoL, it's a good example of how the Lords still fulfil a useful role.

    But she is divorced according to the secular law and is free to marry again. It is her religious beliefs and willingness to comply with a religion that allows this sort of nonsense that has trapped her. The decision to comply with that is a personal choice.
    It's not just pressure from her: there might well be pressure from within her community as well.

    I see abuse of the get by some men an archetype of where religion conflicts with secularism. It needs to stop, and this law change seems a reasonable way to do it.
    I’m struggling to see how this particular change in the law would achieve that, given according to the men concerned (yes, I know, Mandy Rice Davies applies) that would make it impossible for them to grant a religious divorce.

    So even if they ended up in prison, you don’t resolve the ‘pressure within the community’ problem.
    This article has more details:
    https://www.thejc.com/news/uk/jewish-courts-placing-themselves-on-the-side-of-domestic-abusers-says-furious-peer-1.518341
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,049

    Brexit, obvs:

    Because a nationwide security of supply for beer, but also for other beverages such as water, lemonade or juice, has long ceased to be a matter of course in this country.

    The reason: a massive and steadily worsening shortage of drivers. The Federal Association of Freight Transport, Logistics and Disposal (BGL) and the Federal Association of Freight Forwarding and Logistics (DSLV) have jointly calculated that between 45,000 and 60,000 professional drivers are currently lacking in Germany.


    https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article231761025/Drohender-Versorgungskollaps-Es-fehlen-bis-zu-60-000-Lkw-Fahrer.html

    Our ban on cabotage
    Didn't the UK want to continue extensive cabotage, but it was the EU which wanted it significantly limited?

    https://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=da8c67d3-6078-45c1-8627-6b365d19b750
    Not read the link but was that anything to do with our cakeism strategy?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040
    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    A couple of Greens will become ministers but their actual function will be as human shields and co-conspirators, there to split the blame for decisions over which they will enjoy minimal, if any, influence and to shore up the SNP’s left flank. Nationalists impatient with Sturgeon’s failure to deliver Indyref2 or with her government’s Blair-esque triangulation will no longer have an alternative party to defect to. The Greens will be implicated in every compromise and every delay to the agenda of the pro-independence left, and the blame will fall heavier on them because these voters already factor in the SNP’s faint-hearted managerialism.

    The Greens have not signed up to a cooperation agreement, they’ve entered into a one-sided suicide pact.


    https://stephendaisley.substack.com/p/coalition-of-stasis

    Well, we can hope.
    I would have thought it would be suboptimal from your point of view at least if it only killed the Greens. Surely you should hope it takes down the SNP as well?
    I suspect that in rUk you are not particularly troubled with the profound level of misery that Patrick Harvie can induce by opening his mouth and opining on any subject. Yes, I am hopeful that this will damage the SNP for the reasons I set out the other day but getting rid of the Greens would be a definite bonus.
    I suspect most people in the UK outside Scotland have never even heard of him.

    Is he one of those useful idiots for the oil and road lobby who opposes all developments to improve things and therefore causes far more pollution?
    Nothing like so coherent. He's pompous, arrogant, stupid and irrational but those minor defects to one side he is also a nasty piece of work.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,533
    And in other 'isn't nature nice and cuddly' news:

    A giant tortoise eats a baby bird.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/science-environment-58337369
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,046
    edited August 2021

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    A minor story, but one that needs dealing with:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58334745

    It's a classic religious versus secular situation, and one where I hope secularism wins.

    Since the amendment was drafted in the HoL, it's a good example of how the Lords still fulfil a useful role.

    But she is divorced according to the secular law and is free to marry again. It is her religious beliefs and willingness to comply with a religion that allows this sort of nonsense that has trapped her. The decision to comply with that is a personal choice.
    It's not just pressure from her: there might well be pressure from within her community as well.

    I see abuse of the get by some men an archetype of where religion conflicts with secularism. It needs to stop, and this law change seems a reasonable way to do it.
    I’m struggling to see how this particular change in the law would achieve that, given according to the men concerned (yes, I know, Mandy Rice Davies applies) that would make it impossible for them to grant a religious divorce.

    So even if they ended up in prison, you don’t resolve the ‘pressure within the community’ problem.
    This article has more details:
    https://www.thejc.com/news/uk/jewish-courts-placing-themselves-on-the-side-of-domestic-abusers-says-furious-peer-1.518341
    The problem is the existence of the Beth Din “court” in the first place. Same with Sharia “courts”.

    If you want to live in the UK, then only the rules of UK courts should apply.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,980
    Mr. Borough, any more detail on the R4 moment?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,830
    edited August 2021

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    A minor story, but one that needs dealing with:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58334745

    It's a classic religious versus secular situation, and one where I hope secularism wins.

    Since the amendment was drafted in the HoL, it's a good example of how the Lords still fulfil a useful role.

    But she is divorced according to the secular law and is free to marry again. It is her religious beliefs and willingness to comply with a religion that allows this sort of nonsense that has trapped her. The decision to comply with that is a personal choice.
    It's not just pressure from her: there might well be pressure from within her community as well.

    I see abuse of the get by some men an archetype of where religion conflicts with secularism. It needs to stop, and this law change seems a reasonable way to do it.
    I’m struggling to see how this particular change in the law would achieve that, given according to the men concerned (yes, I know, Mandy Rice Davies applies) that would make it impossible for them to grant a religious divorce.

    So even if they ended up in prison, you don’t resolve the ‘pressure within the community’ problem.
    This article has more details:
    https://www.thejc.com/news/uk/jewish-courts-placing-themselves-on-the-side-of-domestic-abusers-says-furious-peer-1.518341
    Yes, but it still doesn’t address the central point. The support is there, the law is there, the civil divorce is an option, it’s the issue that some are using religious courts for religious reasons that is the problem. And for all her anger, the Baroness doesn’t explain how her bill would reform that. Largely because on the facts as presented it wouldn’t. Abolishing the Beth Din court’s jurisdiction over divorce would be the solution.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,049

    And in other 'isn't nature nice and cuddly' news:

    A giant tortoise eats a baby bird.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/science-environment-58337369

    Crash out the QRF.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    What were they doing there in the first place?

    EL CAJON, Calif. — At least 24 students from the Cajon Valley Union School District in El Cajon and 16 parents are stranded in Afghanistan after taking a summer trip abroad.
    They are among thousands of individuals waiting to leave the country amid political unrest caused by the U.S. military pullout after 20 years of occupation. The U.S. government is accelerating efforts to rescue Americans as the Taliban takes over the country.


    https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-08-24/students-from-cajon-valley-school-district-stranded-in-afghanistan?utm_id=36108&sfmc_id=4509190
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    edited August 2021

    Lowest levels of car production for any July since 1956, UK industry reports

    UK carmakers made 53,400 vehicles in July, a 37.6% drop when compared with the same month in 2020, according to data from the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders (SMMT)

    Jaguar Land Rover and Nissan, the two largest manufacturers in the UK, have both previously been forced to cut production because of shortages.

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/aug/26/lowest-levels-of-car-production-for-any-july-since-1956-uk-industry-reports

    Its what happens when basicslly one factory in the whole world makes all the chips that every car relies on and all the manufacturers tell the factory they won't be needing any for a year and so the factory retools and starts making other things.

    Once they switched, not only do they have contracts to fulfill, but it also takes time to switch back.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,830

    And in other 'isn't nature nice and cuddly' news:

    A giant tortoise eats a baby bird.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/science-environment-58337369

    Not quite as bad as one poster’s slightly startling advocacy of bestiality.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,946

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:
    It may well end up being India who we need alongside us to revitalise western values of freedom and democracy if the US under Biden and indeed much of the rest of the world is giving up the fight and plunging into self absorbed trashing of its own culture and heritage.

    The West has abandoned the West. We are fucked
    More the left, particularly in the US, has abandoned the West.

    They will not be in power forever, there will be a conservative counter reaction in due course, maybe a liberal one too.

    JFK once inspired the world with these words on freedom, Biden has abandoned the fight but a future President will fight it again

    'Let every nation know, whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose any foe to assure the survival and the success of liberty.'
    https://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/kennedy.asp
    The left is not in power now. The blue team's been running the show for more than a decade. Oh look, something bad's happening. Let's blame "the left".
    In the US the left are in power and the US is the most powerful western nation still by far but unwilling to stand up to China, Russia and jihadi Islam and for western values instead of trashing them.

    The Democrats control the Presidency and Congress and it is the woke left in the Democratic Party driving the agenda of hatred of western heritage and culture and Biden at the top leading US retreat from the world
    "In the US the left are in power"

    I am not defending Biden's Afghan retreat, but that is a patently false statement.
    I THINK he means relatively, in US terms. Although in what world the Dems demonstrate 'hatred of western heritage' I can't imagine.
    I am not so sure. I suspect he works on a direct correlation between Corbyn Labour and the Dems and Cameron Conservatives and Trump's GOP
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156
    Sandpit said:

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    A minor story, but one that needs dealing with:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58334745

    It's a classic religious versus secular situation, and one where I hope secularism wins.

    Since the amendment was drafted in the HoL, it's a good example of how the Lords still fulfil a useful role.

    But she is divorced according to the secular law and is free to marry again. It is her religious beliefs and willingness to comply with a religion that allows this sort of nonsense that has trapped her. The decision to comply with that is a personal choice.
    It's not just pressure from her: there might well be pressure from within her community as well.

    I see abuse of the get by some men an archetype of where religion conflicts with secularism. It needs to stop, and this law change seems a reasonable way to do it.
    I’m struggling to see how this particular change in the law would achieve that, given according to the men concerned (yes, I know, Mandy Rice Davies applies) that would make it impossible for them to grant a religious divorce.

    So even if they ended up in prison, you don’t resolve the ‘pressure within the community’ problem.
    This article has more details:
    https://www.thejc.com/news/uk/jewish-courts-placing-themselves-on-the-side-of-domestic-abusers-says-furious-peer-1.518341
    The problem is the existence of the Beth Din “court” in the first place. Same with Sharia “courts”.

    If you want to live in the UK, then only the rules of UK courts should apply.
    Surely a ruling of a Sharia court in the UK does not apply legally?
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118

    Brexit, obvs:

    Because a nationwide security of supply for beer, but also for other beverages such as water, lemonade or juice, has long ceased to be a matter of course in this country.

    The reason: a massive and steadily worsening shortage of drivers. The Federal Association of Freight Transport, Logistics and Disposal (BGL) and the Federal Association of Freight Forwarding and Logistics (DSLV) have jointly calculated that between 45,000 and 60,000 professional drivers are currently lacking in Germany.


    https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article231761025/Drohender-Versorgungskollaps-Es-fehlen-bis-zu-60-000-Lkw-Fahrer.html

    Hardly. The issues in the UK are not unique and haven't been claimed as such. Our issues are *worse* because of Brexit.

    An easy partial fix. Drop the most punitive restrictions on EU drivers working in the UK. Not ones based here, ones who drive a loaded truck in from France, work they way up and down the country making multiple stops then return with a different full load.

    Our ban on cabotage makes it not economical for hauliers and their drivers to serve the UK (which is why so many have either stopped or are changing impossible prices) and means we are short of vehicles and drivers.

    Allow the logistics network to function again and our problem is then comparable with Germany instead of twice as bad. We will still need to fix the lack of new drivers being trained but at least we won't be facing the Christmas peak being chaos.
    That would be a rational free-market thing to do, analogous to importing goods that can't be made cheaply here.

    However, a lot of the votes for Brexit and Johnson were for Britain to use its new freedom to become more protectionist, not less. It's always an attractive electoral proposition, even though it tends to end up badly.

    (What nearly everyone really wants deep down is protectionism for their job and a free market for everyone else's. That's as true for teachers and doctors as for taxi drivers. It's not a good thing, but it is rational, and acknowledging the worst about ourselves is generally a good thing.)
    I definitely voted for protectionism, it was the only reason I voted Leave, and I’d say the majority of other leave voters agreed. The ‘freedom to make trade deals’ vote was the 1993 Leave vote, that would never have got a referendum in a million years.

    The protectionism should be for low paid jobs, and the free market for better paid jobs. I think Douglas Carswell, who was one of the ‘1993 freedom’ style leavers, suggested £25k as a cut off point
  • What were they doing there in the first place?

    EL CAJON, Calif. — At least 24 students from the Cajon Valley Union School District in El Cajon and 16 parents are stranded in Afghanistan after taking a summer trip abroad.
    They are among thousands of individuals waiting to leave the country amid political unrest caused by the U.S. military pullout after 20 years of occupation. The U.S. government is accelerating efforts to rescue Americans as the Taliban takes over the country.


    https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-08-24/students-from-cajon-valley-school-district-stranded-in-afghanistan?utm_id=36108&sfmc_id=4509190

    Afghan Americans.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,059

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:
    It may well end up being India who we need alongside us to revitalise western values of freedom and democracy if the US under Biden and indeed much of the rest of the world is giving up the fight and plunging into self absorbed trashing of its own culture and heritage.

    The West has abandoned the West. We are fucked
    More the left, particularly in the US, has abandoned the West.

    They will not be in power forever, there will be a conservative counter reaction in due course, maybe a liberal one too.

    JFK once inspired the world with these words on freedom, Biden has abandoned the fight but a future President will fight it again

    'Let every nation know, whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose any foe to assure the survival and the success of liberty.'
    https://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/kennedy.asp
    The left is not in power now. The blue team's been running the show for more than a decade. Oh look, something bad's happening. Let's blame "the left".
    In the US the left are in power and the US is the most powerful western nation still by far but unwilling to stand up to China, Russia and jihadi Islam and for western values instead of trashing them.

    The Democrats control the Presidency and Congress and it is the woke left in the Democratic Party driving the agenda of hatred of western heritage and culture and Biden at the top leading US retreat from the world
    "In the US the left are in power"

    I am not defending Biden's Afghan retreat, but that is a patently false statement.
    The tear down statutes movement, without even a plaque for context. The campaign to rewrite school and college curricula etc all started in the woke left in the US, a key voter base for the Democratic Party which now controls the White House and Congress
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,059
    edited August 2021

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:
    It may well end up being India who we need alongside us to revitalise western values of freedom and democracy if the US under Biden and indeed much of the rest of the world is giving up the fight and plunging into self absorbed trashing of its own culture and heritage.

    The West has abandoned the West. We are fucked
    More the left, particularly in the US, has abandoned the West.

    They will not be in power forever, there will be a conservative counter reaction in due course, maybe a liberal one too.

    JFK once inspired the world with these words on freedom, Biden has abandoned the fight but a future President will fight it again

    'Let every nation know, whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose any foe to assure the survival and the success of liberty.'
    https://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/kennedy.asp
    The left is not in power now. The blue team's been running the show for more than a decade. Oh look, something bad's happening. Let's blame "the left".
    In the US the left are in power and the US is the most powerful western nation still by far but unwilling to stand up to China, Russia and jihadi Islam and for western values instead of trashing them.

    The Democrats control the Presidency and Congress and it is the woke left in the Democratic Party driving the agenda of hatred of western heritage and culture and Biden at the top leading US retreat from the world
    "In the US the left are in power"

    I am not defending Biden's Afghan retreat, but that is a patently false statement.
    I THINK he means relatively, in US terms. Although in what world the Dems demonstrate 'hatred of western heritage' I can't imagine.
    I am not so sure. I suspect he works on a direct correlation between Corbyn Labour and the Dems and Cameron Conservatives and Trump's GOP
    In the US the Democrats are the leftwing party, the Republicans are the Tories sister party in the International Democrat Union.

    Boris has even reportedly said after the Afghan withdrawal 'we would have been better off with Trump'
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9916221/Blair-brands-Biden-imbecile-unnecessary-decision-quit-Afghanistan.html
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,046

    Sandpit said:

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    A minor story, but one that needs dealing with:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58334745

    It's a classic religious versus secular situation, and one where I hope secularism wins.

    Since the amendment was drafted in the HoL, it's a good example of how the Lords still fulfil a useful role.

    But she is divorced according to the secular law and is free to marry again. It is her religious beliefs and willingness to comply with a religion that allows this sort of nonsense that has trapped her. The decision to comply with that is a personal choice.
    It's not just pressure from her: there might well be pressure from within her community as well.

    I see abuse of the get by some men an archetype of where religion conflicts with secularism. It needs to stop, and this law change seems a reasonable way to do it.
    I’m struggling to see how this particular change in the law would achieve that, given according to the men concerned (yes, I know, Mandy Rice Davies applies) that would make it impossible for them to grant a religious divorce.

    So even if they ended up in prison, you don’t resolve the ‘pressure within the community’ problem.
    This article has more details:
    https://www.thejc.com/news/uk/jewish-courts-placing-themselves-on-the-side-of-domestic-abusers-says-furious-peer-1.518341
    The problem is the existence of the Beth Din “court” in the first place. Same with Sharia “courts”.

    If you want to live in the UK, then only the rules of UK courts should apply.
    Surely a ruling of a Sharia court in the UK does not apply legally?
    Legally no. Societally, very much so within such ‘communities’.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,059
    IshmaelZ said:

    Rescuing cats and dogs from Kabul is laughable. Using donations to rescue animals whilst people go unrescued is sickening.

    They’ve given in to terrierism.
    The rescue efforts gone to the dogs...

    Trying to rescue people is like trying to herd cats...

    This policy has set the cat amongst the (non-Afghan) pigeons ...
    I am too angry to joke about it. Lovely cats and doggies vs nasty dirty brown people.

    If this guy gets flown home and his animals don't he will be getting "how can you sleep at night, murderer?" hate mail for the rest of his life, and serve him right.
    Fly them all back, I am sure Carrie can find a home for the animals
This discussion has been closed.