Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. Sign in or register to get started.

For 78-year-old Biden not being Trump is no longer enough – politicalbetting.com

2456

Comments

  • Andy_JS said:

    The problem isn't being 78 per se. There are lots of people that age who are still as sharp as ever.

    By coincidence, England India were all out for 78 today.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720

    Paging @Foxy


    "A-level result parties fuel 'astonishing' Covid surge in historic market town in Leicester, health chiefs warn"

    Mail

    This is the story:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9925601/amp/Student-level-result-parties-blamed-astonishing-Covid-boom-Leicestershire-district.html?__twitter_impression=true

    Though Market Harborough isn't particularly bad, except in this age group. Leicester itself is 25th now in the country overall.

    I am down on the IoW for the week though.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Andy_JS said:

    The problem isn't being 78 per se. There are lots of people that age who are still as sharp as ever.

    By coincidence, England India were all out for 78 today.
    There's a lot of strategy in test cricket which you just don't understand, Sunil. England have fallen straight into India's trap.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,914
    FF43 said:

    Joe Biden's problem has nothing to do with his age. He seems remarkably clear sighted in his determination to get out of Afghanistan. The problem is poor intelligence and planning, which he is taking the hit for. Nevertheless if people perceive age to be an issue, it is a problem for him.

    He is about 8 percentage points more popular than Trump was at this point of his presidency. In fact he is still more popular than Trump was at any point - but we need to bear in mind the Republicans get a big bias from the electoral system.

    29% for the next Democratic nomination looks value to me, but I am hopeless at reading American politics.

    It is remarkable how quickly the prestige of the US slid down the toilet through the presidency of Trump. They've had lots of suspect presidents including a father and son and almost a husband and wife but Trump is the first one to have turned the whole country into a laughing stock . I agree you can't blame Biden. No American President is going to be treated with much respect because any system that can throw up Trump isn't to be taken seriously

  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,839
    Charles said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Business leaders call for relaxation of post-Brexit visa rules as predictions over exodus of EU workers in low paid jobs realised. Worst supply chain crisis since 70s say industry chiefs https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/aug/25/business-leaders-call-for-relaxation-of-post-brexit-visa-rules?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Pay your staff more. Invest in technology to improve productivity
    Easier said than done in many of these sectors. Many veg and especially fruit farmers are forced to rely on cheap imported labour to bring in the harvest for good reasons. It's typically uneconomic for British workers to take on these kinds of low-paid seasonal jobs, nobody has invented machinery to replace them, and if farmers put up the wages enough to attract the UK workforce then they'll be forced to pass the costs on to the supermarkets - which won't pay them, and will try to source all their produce from abroad instead.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,398
    DougSeal said:

    TOPPING said:

    Mask wearing on the tube is dropping I would say.

    Yesterday I took the two lines into town just after rush hour and home again at the tail end, with most seats taken but only one or two standing for the most part, I'd say the vast majority were wearing masks, and mostly but not always covering mouth and nose.

    My observation on this topic - District Line (spacious walk through carriages, lots of space) mask wearing 80%+. Central Line (ancient crowded trains, standing room only) 50% masks tops. Dropping in both cases though.
    It seems to me like a very mixed picture. I noticed today that mask wearing in the supermarket was on the increase, but on the train it seems to be on the decrease. My theory is that people take their masks with them and basically make judgements on whether or not to wear a mask based on what other people are doing. That, if I am honest, is what I do.

    One woman on the train seemed to have a mild panic attack seeing the lack of mask wearing. A guy I know who is a singer in a punk band continues to go to gigs wearing a mask, the only person in the room doing so, he says he is hoping for a new lockdown but is still playing a gig next week with his band. This just seems like evidence of a kind of a mass psychotic episode.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,002
    UK government set to radically scale back HS2 eastern route https://on.ft.com/3ko424y
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486
    TOPPING said:

    Mask wearing on the tube is dropping I would say.

    Indeed. It’s been too warm down there recently and people have opted to drop the masks.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,999
    edited August 2021

    Demolition job on Labour "holding the government to account" on Afghanistan:

    Yesterday, Matt Chorley said shadow foreign secretary Lisa Nandy had never mentioned Afghanistan in the House of Commons until last week.

    He now admits he got it wrong... it's actually a lot worse than that.

    @MattChorley


    https://twitter.com/TimesRadio/status/1430473447210115076?s=20

    ‘Lisa Nandy had never mentioned Afghanistan in the House of Commons until last week.’

    I’m sure PB can empathise.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486
    Foxy said:

    Paging @Foxy


    "A-level result parties fuel 'astonishing' Covid surge in historic market town in Leicester, health chiefs warn"

    Mail

    This is the story:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9925601/amp/Student-level-result-parties-blamed-astonishing-Covid-boom-Leicestershire-district.html?__twitter_impression=true

    Though Market Harborough isn't particularly bad, except in this age group. Leicester itself is 25th now in the country overall.

    I am down on the IoW for the week though.
    Leicestershire seems to have been a mega covidian hotspot since this saga began. It’s absolutely bizarre.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,149
    kinabalu said:

    kle4 said:

    On the Unite 'surprise':


    "Ms Graham said she has 'simple beliefs' that trade unions exist to fight bad employers and the way to do that is to build the strength of the union at the workplace first.

    She said: I have built Unite through the organising department, at the workplace, across industries, fighting bad bosses."

    D Mail

    Union bosses will to some degree have to get involved in national politics, but some of the recent ones give the impression theyd much rather be politicians than it just being part of the job.
    I don't want to see Labour detach from the unions. The union link keeps them grounded and in touch with their roots. Labour without the unions would be like the kid who leaves his blue collar town for a top uni and doesn't go home for Christmas.
    As an outsider I don't see that Labour need to detach from the unions per se, it's part of their identity albeit merely being a union mouthpiece is no good either. But if you get to a position where senior MPs seem like they'd rather be union leaders and union leaders want to be leader of the opposition, well, things get confused.

    The unions need to meet the party halfway, not act as though their job is to be hyper vigilant over every element of labour party policy and leadership.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    darkage said:

    DougSeal said:

    TOPPING said:

    Mask wearing on the tube is dropping I would say.

    Yesterday I took the two lines into town just after rush hour and home again at the tail end, with most seats taken but only one or two standing for the most part, I'd say the vast majority were wearing masks, and mostly but not always covering mouth and nose.

    My observation on this topic - District Line (spacious walk through carriages, lots of space) mask wearing 80%+. Central Line (ancient crowded trains, standing room only) 50% masks tops. Dropping in both cases though.
    It seems to me like a very mixed picture. I noticed today that mask wearing in the supermarket was on the increase, but on the train it seems to be on the decrease. My theory is that people take their masks with them and basically make judgements on whether or not to wear a mask based on what other people are doing. That, if I am honest, is what I do.

    One woman on the train seemed to have a mild panic attack seeing the lack of mask wearing. A guy I know who is a singer in a punk band continues to go to gigs wearing a mask, the only person in the room doing so, he says he is hoping for a new lockdown but is still playing a gig next week with his band. This just seems like evidence of a kind of a mass psychotic episode.
    Who the hell hopes for a lockdown?
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,468
    darkage said:

    DougSeal said:

    TOPPING said:

    Mask wearing on the tube is dropping I would say.

    Yesterday I took the two lines into town just after rush hour and home again at the tail end, with most seats taken but only one or two standing for the most part, I'd say the vast majority were wearing masks, and mostly but not always covering mouth and nose.

    My observation on this topic - District Line (spacious walk through carriages, lots of space) mask wearing 80%+. Central Line (ancient crowded trains, standing room only) 50% masks tops. Dropping in both cases though.
    It seems to me like a very mixed picture. I noticed today that mask wearing in the supermarket was on the increase, but on the train it seems to be on the decrease. My theory is that people take their masks with them and basically make judgements on whether or not to wear a mask based on what other people are doing. That, if I am honest, is what I do.

    One woman on the train seemed to have a mild panic attack seeing the lack of mask wearing. A guy I know who is a singer in a punk band continues to go to gigs wearing a mask, the only person in the room doing so, he says he is hoping for a new lockdown but is still playing a gig next week with his band. This just seems like evidence of a kind of a mass psychotic episode.
    We are back to pretty much 100% mask wearing in supermarkets, and proof of vaccination in restaurants in Montgomery Co, Maryland.
  • londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 3,639
    Scott_xP said:

    UK government set to radically scale back HS2 eastern route https://on.ft.com/3ko424y

    Best to cancel HS2 altogether what a waste of money.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720

    Foxy said:

    Paging @Foxy


    "A-level result parties fuel 'astonishing' Covid surge in historic market town in Leicester, health chiefs warn"

    Mail

    This is the story:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9925601/amp/Student-level-result-parties-blamed-astonishing-Covid-boom-Leicestershire-district.html?__twitter_impression=true

    Though Market Harborough isn't particularly bad, except in this age group. Leicester itself is 25th now in the country overall.

    I am down on the IoW for the week though.
    Leicestershire seems to have been a mega covidian hotspot since this saga began. It’s absolutely bizarre.
    Not really. Harborough and some of the other ares have often been below the national average. It is the City and immediate suburbs that have been higher.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486
    Probably been already said but England were fantastic at Headingley today. I have no idea what got into India - Jimmy was the only bowler who was really swinging the ball. Long way to go in this series yet.
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,468
    IshmaelZ said:
    And the guy himself has made a living out of recreating that photo on major anniversaries of the album's release.

    It is about time these abusive litigations are punished severely.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118

    Demolition job on Labour "holding the government to account" on Afghanistan:

    Yesterday, Matt Chorley said shadow foreign secretary Lisa Nandy had never mentioned Afghanistan in the House of Commons until last week.

    He now admits he got it wrong... it's actually a lot worse than that.

    @MattChorley


    https://twitter.com/TimesRadio/status/1430473447210115076?s=20

    Haha brilliant!

    They’ve hardly ever mentioned it!

    Nandy not at all, Healey twice, in passing, Sir Keir not one question at PMQs… and now, after the event, it’s all full on faux outrageux about the lack of planning!!!

    Great stuff
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,775

    Demolition job on Labour "holding the government to account" on Afghanistan:

    Yesterday, Matt Chorley said shadow foreign secretary Lisa Nandy had never mentioned Afghanistan in the House of Commons until last week.

    He now admits he got it wrong... it's actually a lot worse than that.

    @MattChorley


    https://twitter.com/TimesRadio/status/1430473447210115076?s=20

    ‘Lisa Nandy had never mentioned Afghanistan in the House of Commons until last week.’

    I’m sure PB can empathise.
    Good for her. What was there to say?

    What is there now to say?


  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,839

    TOPPING said:

    Mask wearing on the tube is dropping I would say.

    Indeed. It’s been too warm down there recently and people have opted to drop the masks.
    Much of the Tube is an oven, even in midwinter. One more good reason to avoid going into London under normal circumstances.
    Scott_xP said:

    UK government set to radically scale back HS2 eastern route https://on.ft.com/3ko424y

    There are reasonable questions to be asked about how many hundreds of billions of pounds should be spent on HS2. There are so many other potential priorities and only a finite amount of cash available. To govern is to choose, etc.
  • londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 3,639

    Probably been already said but England were fantastic at Headingley today. I have no idea what got into India - Jimmy was the only bowler who was really swinging the ball. Long way to go in this series yet.

    Long way to go in this game. We need to press home the advantage get 300+. If we do that then we win the game. Very good for us today wasn't expecting that 👍
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,149
    edited August 2021

    Demolition job on Labour "holding the government to account" on Afghanistan:

    Yesterday, Matt Chorley said shadow foreign secretary Lisa Nandy had never mentioned Afghanistan in the House of Commons until last week.

    He now admits he got it wrong... it's actually a lot worse than that.

    @MattChorley


    https://twitter.com/TimesRadio/status/1430473447210115076?s=20

    ‘Lisa Nandy had never mentioned Afghanistan in the House of Commons until last week.’

    I’m sure PB can empathise.
    There is no problem holding politicians to a higher level of expectation than we hold ourselves to, especially when they either hold power over us, want to hold power over us, or are making specific claims about their personal political effectiveness or exercise of power/scrutiny of power.

    I prefer not to even think about Afghanistan if I can help it, since it's a complete bloody mess. Raab, and to a lesser extent Nandy, have far less excuse and can be given short shrift if they puff up their efforts regarding it. His taking his eye off the ball is more critical, but if she has not actually been bringing it up she can be criticised as well if giving the impression she had.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486
    DougSeal said:

    darkage said:

    DougSeal said:

    TOPPING said:

    Mask wearing on the tube is dropping I would say.

    Yesterday I took the two lines into town just after rush hour and home again at the tail end, with most seats taken but only one or two standing for the most part, I'd say the vast majority were wearing masks, and mostly but not always covering mouth and nose.

    My observation on this topic - District Line (spacious walk through carriages, lots of space) mask wearing 80%+. Central Line (ancient crowded trains, standing room only) 50% masks tops. Dropping in both cases though.
    It seems to me like a very mixed picture. I noticed today that mask wearing in the supermarket was on the increase, but on the train it seems to be on the decrease. My theory is that people take their masks with them and basically make judgements on whether or not to wear a mask based on what other people are doing. That, if I am honest, is what I do.

    One woman on the train seemed to have a mild panic attack seeing the lack of mask wearing. A guy I know who is a singer in a punk band continues to go to gigs wearing a mask, the only person in the room doing so, he says he is hoping for a new lockdown but is still playing a gig next week with his band. This just seems like evidence of a kind of a mass psychotic episode.
    Who the hell hopes for a lockdown?
    You’d be surprised…
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    Fascinating London Underground fact. When it first opened people went down into the Tube to cool off. The temperature of the surrounding clay was only about 14C but 150 years of heat absorption has risen that to 19c-25C and as a result it’s a sweltering nightmare.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    pigeon said:

    Charles said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Business leaders call for relaxation of post-Brexit visa rules as predictions over exodus of EU workers in low paid jobs realised. Worst supply chain crisis since 70s say industry chiefs https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/aug/25/business-leaders-call-for-relaxation-of-post-brexit-visa-rules?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Pay your staff more. Invest in technology to improve productivity
    Easier said than done in many of these sectors. Many veg and especially fruit farmers are forced to rely on cheap imported labour to bring in the harvest for good reasons. It's typically uneconomic for British workers to take on these kinds of low-paid seasonal jobs, nobody has invented machinery to replace them, and if farmers put up the wages enough to attract the UK workforce then they'll be forced to pass the costs on to the supermarkets - which won't pay them, and will try to source all their produce from abroad instead.
    They do have the technology - Dexter Paine over at Paine Schwartz has one in his portfolio IIRC

    More to the point they have a scheme for temporary visas for agricultural workers
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,149
    edited August 2021
    isam said:

    Demolition job on Labour "holding the government to account" on Afghanistan:

    Yesterday, Matt Chorley said shadow foreign secretary Lisa Nandy had never mentioned Afghanistan in the House of Commons until last week.

    He now admits he got it wrong... it's actually a lot worse than that.

    @MattChorley


    https://twitter.com/TimesRadio/status/1430473447210115076?s=20

    Haha brilliant!

    They’ve hardly ever mentioned it!

    Nandy not at all, Healey twice, in passing, Sir Keir not one question at PMQs… and now, after the event, it’s all full on faux outrageux about the lack of planning!!!

    Great stuff
    It need not be faux outrage, it would still be on the government to plan things properly even if no one was holding their feet to the fire about it. Scrutiny helps deliver better policy but it is not a requirement, and outrage can be had if it was not done well. But opposition also cannot retroactively invent their own earlier interest if it was not there, assuming Chorley is correct.
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,839
    DougSeal said:

    darkage said:

    DougSeal said:

    TOPPING said:

    Mask wearing on the tube is dropping I would say.

    Yesterday I took the two lines into town just after rush hour and home again at the tail end, with most seats taken but only one or two standing for the most part, I'd say the vast majority were wearing masks, and mostly but not always covering mouth and nose.

    My observation on this topic - District Line (spacious walk through carriages, lots of space) mask wearing 80%+. Central Line (ancient crowded trains, standing room only) 50% masks tops. Dropping in both cases though.
    It seems to me like a very mixed picture. I noticed today that mask wearing in the supermarket was on the increase, but on the train it seems to be on the decrease. My theory is that people take their masks with them and basically make judgements on whether or not to wear a mask based on what other people are doing. That, if I am honest, is what I do.

    One woman on the train seemed to have a mild panic attack seeing the lack of mask wearing. A guy I know who is a singer in a punk band continues to go to gigs wearing a mask, the only person in the room doing so, he says he is hoping for a new lockdown but is still playing a gig next week with his band. This just seems like evidence of a kind of a mass psychotic episode.
    Who the hell hopes for a lockdown?
    *Extreme introverts
    *Sociopaths
    *Members of ISAGE
    *Amazon executives
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    kle4 said:

    Demolition job on Labour "holding the government to account" on Afghanistan:

    Yesterday, Matt Chorley said shadow foreign secretary Lisa Nandy had never mentioned Afghanistan in the House of Commons until last week.

    He now admits he got it wrong... it's actually a lot worse than that.

    @MattChorley


    https://twitter.com/TimesRadio/status/1430473447210115076?s=20

    ‘Lisa Nandy had never mentioned Afghanistan in the House of Commons until last week.’

    I’m sure PB can empathise.
    There is no problem holding politicians to a higher level of expectation than we hold ourselves to, especially when they either hold power over us, want to hold power over us, or are making specific claims about their personal political effectiveness or exercise of power/scrutiny of power.

    I prefer not to even think about Afghanistan if I can help it, since it's a complete bloody mess. Raab, and to a lesser extent Nandy, have far less excuse and can be given short shrift if they puff up their efforts regarding it. His taking his eye off the ball is more critical, but if she has not actually been bringing it up she can be criticised as well if giving the impression she had.
    Listen to the Times Radio clip - she pretended on QT the government were dodging scrutiny in on Afghanistan, yet Labour never pressed them on it, never ranked any urgent questions, Sir Keir never mentioned it at PMQs, zilcho, nada… she was lying
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486
    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Paging @Foxy


    "A-level result parties fuel 'astonishing' Covid surge in historic market town in Leicester, health chiefs warn"

    Mail

    This is the story:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9925601/amp/Student-level-result-parties-blamed-astonishing-Covid-boom-Leicestershire-district.html?__twitter_impression=true

    Though Market Harborough isn't particularly bad, except in this age group. Leicester itself is 25th now in the country overall.

    I am down on the IoW for the week though.
    Leicestershire seems to have been a mega covidian hotspot since this saga began. It’s absolutely bizarre.
    Not really. Harborough and some of the other ares have often been below the national average. It is the City and immediate suburbs that have been higher.
    Leicestershire includes Leicester! It seems to have been a mega hotspot since this whole thing kicked off for some reason.
  • TomsToms Posts: 2,478
    Hysteria rules. OK?
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    IshmaelZ said:
    He is asking for $150k from each of 17 CO-respondents. It’s all about the money
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited August 2021
    ping said:

    Incredible tip from @isam

    I didn’t get on it myself, sadly

    Thanks. One more needed. Should really be weighed in, he’s missed a couple of sitters
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,729
    isam said:

    pigeon said:

    Scott_xP said:

    GIN1138 said:

    I had my first "supply chain" issue today when I couldn't buy Bisto gravy granules at the CO! :open_mouth:

    The lads will be along shortly to explain why you're wrong.

    You must have imagined it...
    PB Herd = see no empty shelves, hear no empty shelves, say no empty shelves, ra ra ra, god save Mrs Sachsen Coborg und Gotha.
    In fairness, empty shelves can only be reported from personal experience (as distinct from rumours circulating in newspapers) if there are empty shelves for one to experience in the first place.

    So far I've encountered a minor poultry shortage, and my favourite brand of cereal snack bar-type things for work is apparently out of stock until an estimated delivery date of September 1st. Slightly irritating, but it's not exactly a return to the dark days of the March 2020 panic buying phenomenon.
    I can’t help it if the only empty shelves I’ve seen in Upminster/Hornchurch are sparkling water in Waitrose. Maybe we’ve just been lucky

    Maybe the Stones song of the today is ‘You can’t Always Get What You Want’!
    Everyone has had experience of tesco or similar order not completely fulfilled or an item replaced by something similar if you agree to that .

    We have had problems with orange flavoured hot cross buns from waitrose... but will survive it.

  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,149
    Charles said:

    IshmaelZ said:
    He is asking for $150k from each of 17 CO-respondents. It’s all about the money
    On the face of it it looks like absolute nonsense with a dash of utter hysteria, but perhaps there's an actual legal point in there somewhere.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,775
    DougSeal said:

    Fascinating London Underground fact. When it first opened people went down into the Tube to cool off. The temperature of the surrounding clay was only about 14C but 150 years of heat absorption has risen that to 19c-25C and as a result it’s a sweltering nightmare.

    I doubt the ambient temperature of the clay is 19-25. Sorry. Do you have any evidence that this is the case?

    I somewhat doubt the 14 too. Seems far too hot.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,421
    edited August 2021
    Scott_xP said:

    UK government set to radically scale back HS2 eastern route https://on.ft.com/3ko424y

    Never trust the FT on anything to do with HS2. They’ve been the most vicious rampers of the false £106 billion figure and are now parroting the equally wrong £40 billion figure.

    This is largely because they hate money being spent on anything other than their client groups.

    They also again repeat the tired old canard that more money is needed on ‘local lines,’ not understanding that until HS2 is actually built there is no connecting capacity for local lines to be improved with.

    Cannock is a classic example. £90 million was spent upgrading our railway to 75mph and electrifying it, so we could have through services to London (in the face of heavy opposition from lunatics like Fabricant and Williamson who ran a misinformation and smear campaign that even Joe Rukin would blush at). But unfortunately due to heavy congestion on the WCML the London service proved totally unworkable. So despite the fact that it was pretty popular - the times I took it it was always full - it’s had to be abandoned.

    Similarly there is no hope of a new trans-Pennine route without HS2, as there will be nowhere for the trains to go without new tracks and stations, or reopening the Ivanhoe line from Leicester to Derby.

    Unfortunately Hs2’s many critics choose to ignore this, usually for their own entirely selfish reasons.

    So if their lies and hysteria prevail we will continue to have a rail network that is basically a lash up.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486

    Probably been already said but England were fantastic at Headingley today. I have no idea what got into India - Jimmy was the only bowler who was really swinging the ball. Long way to go in this series yet.

    Long way to go in this game. We need to press home the advantage get 300+. If we do that then we win the game. Very good for us today wasn't expecting that 👍
    I’d want 400 from here TBH. Don’t fancy batting fourth at Headingley. Praying that Hameed makes a ton - that would be just fantastic.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    kle4 said:

    Charles said:

    IshmaelZ said:
    He is asking for $150k from each of 17 CO-respondents. It’s all about the money
    On the face of it it looks like absolute nonsense with a dash of utter hysteria, but perhaps there's an actual legal point in there somewhere.
    His Dad was a mate of the photographer.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    IanB2 said:

    Biden is an awful President who should never have won a primary let alone an election.

    Still infinitely better than Trump. But the Democrats need to think hard on the primaries for 2024 or the GOP really will have an easy ride then (so long as they don't choose Trump again).

    He was elected because he had no fatal negatives, not because he had any striking positives.

    Given that it wasn’t a total walkover, that was probably the right choice.

    Like the Tories who put a clown in Downing Street solely to beat Corbyn and see Brexit done, there’s a price for having such narrow horizons.
    It is a bit off, if parties are beginning to go for leaders because they will win elections, rather than because they have much to say about their plans. (If BoJo were to GoGo mid term, his successor would be the third PM in a row chosen by MPs not the general public.)

    But, let's be optimistic. Suppose Biden's plan is to do the things that need doing but can't do because they're thinking about reelection. Or their Veep is. What else should be in the bucket list?
    The 3.5 Trillion reconciliation bill is all the buckets.

    If passed it will secure Bidens place in the history books.
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,839
    Charles said:

    IshmaelZ said:
    He is asking for $150k from each of 17 CO-respondents. It’s all about the money
    Asking for a sum that most of them can probably afford, calculating that they might choose to pay to get rid of him (rather than risk racking up a larger amount in legal expenses.) Kerching! $2.5m. It might work...
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Fascinating London Underground fact. When it first opened people went down into the Tube to cool off. The temperature of the surrounding clay was only about 14C but 150 years of heat absorption has risen that to 19c-25C and as a result it’s a sweltering nightmare.

    I doubt the ambient temperature of the clay is 19-25. Sorry. Do you have any evidence that this is the case?

    I somewhat doubt the 14 too. Seems far too hot.
    http://www.operationsengineer.org.uk/article-images/23757/cooling.pdf
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,999
    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    Why did “cheerleaders” and “wee” make me think of @TSE
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,149
    edited August 2021
    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Fascinating London Underground fact. When it first opened people went down into the Tube to cool off. The temperature of the surrounding clay was only about 14C but 150 years of heat absorption has risen that to 19c-25C and as a result it’s a sweltering nightmare.

    I doubt the ambient temperature of the clay is 19-25. Sorry. Do you have any evidence that this is the case?

    I somewhat doubt the 14 too. Seems far too hot.
    From a wikipedia page on 'London Underground cooling' (god bless theinternet) that claim links to a 2007 document on rail engineering, although at a quick glance I couldn't see that specific claim.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_Underground_cooling
    http://www.operationsengineer.org.uk/article-images/23757/cooling.pdf
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,707
    pigeon said:

    DougSeal said:

    darkage said:

    DougSeal said:

    TOPPING said:

    Mask wearing on the tube is dropping I would say.

    Yesterday I took the two lines into town just after rush hour and home again at the tail end, with most seats taken but only one or two standing for the most part, I'd say the vast majority were wearing masks, and mostly but not always covering mouth and nose.

    My observation on this topic - District Line (spacious walk through carriages, lots of space) mask wearing 80%+. Central Line (ancient crowded trains, standing room only) 50% masks tops. Dropping in both cases though.
    It seems to me like a very mixed picture. I noticed today that mask wearing in the supermarket was on the increase, but on the train it seems to be on the decrease. My theory is that people take their masks with them and basically make judgements on whether or not to wear a mask based on what other people are doing. That, if I am honest, is what I do.

    One woman on the train seemed to have a mild panic attack seeing the lack of mask wearing. A guy I know who is a singer in a punk band continues to go to gigs wearing a mask, the only person in the room doing so, he says he is hoping for a new lockdown but is still playing a gig next week with his band. This just seems like evidence of a kind of a mass psychotic episode.
    Who the hell hopes for a lockdown?
    *Extreme introverts
    *Sociopaths
    *Members of ISAGE
    *Amazon executives
    *People who didn't go out and do anything before the pandemic but still think everyone else should be locked down too to protect them anyway
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,775
    DougSeal said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Fascinating London Underground fact. When it first opened people went down into the Tube to cool off. The temperature of the surrounding clay was only about 14C but 150 years of heat absorption has risen that to 19c-25C and as a result it’s a sweltering nightmare.

    I doubt the ambient temperature of the clay is 19-25. Sorry. Do you have any evidence that this is the case?

    I somewhat doubt the 14 too. Seems far too hot.
    http://www.operationsengineer.org.uk/article-images/23757/cooling.pdf
    Ok, but this isn't about the temperature of the clay.

    Someone will no doubt know but my guess would be that the surroundings of the tunnels are 5c or so.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,885
    edited August 2021

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    "Scottish Seafood Association chief Jimmy Buchan backed Brexit but now he thinks it’s an opportunity missed:

    ‘Obviously the landscape has changed. To me Brexit possibly did not deliver all that we wished for.’"

    "‘They need to allow us to take workers in without all the ridiculous red tape.’

    -Scot Burgess, Whitelink Seafoods."

    In other words - they want carte blanche to import even cheaper furriners.

    What do they have between their ears? Crab gills?
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Fascinating London Underground fact. When it first opened people went down into the Tube to cool off. The temperature of the surrounding clay was only about 14C but 150 years of heat absorption has risen that to 19c-25C and as a result it’s a sweltering nightmare.

    I doubt the ambient temperature of the clay is 19-25. Sorry. Do you have any evidence that this is the case?

    I somewhat doubt the 14 too. Seems far too hot.
    http://www.operationsengineer.org.uk/article-images/23757/cooling.pdf
    Ok, but this isn't about the temperature of the clay.

    Someone will no doubt know but my guess would be that the surroundings of the tunnels are 5c or so.
    “The nub of the problem is that the biggest heat sink is failing as the temperature behind the walls rises way back into the clay. It’s now sitting at between 5C and 11C above the natural ambient of 14C.”
  • pingping Posts: 3,805
    isam said:

    ping said:

    Incredible tip from @isam

    I didn’t get on it myself, sadly

    Thanks. One more needed. Should really be weighed in, he’s missed a couple of sitters
    Well done mate.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,421
    pigeon said:

    DougSeal said:

    darkage said:

    DougSeal said:

    TOPPING said:

    Mask wearing on the tube is dropping I would say.

    Yesterday I took the two lines into town just after rush hour and home again at the tail end, with most seats taken but only one or two standing for the most part, I'd say the vast majority were wearing masks, and mostly but not always covering mouth and nose.

    My observation on this topic - District Line (spacious walk through carriages, lots of space) mask wearing 80%+. Central Line (ancient crowded trains, standing room only) 50% masks tops. Dropping in both cases though.
    It seems to me like a very mixed picture. I noticed today that mask wearing in the supermarket was on the increase, but on the train it seems to be on the decrease. My theory is that people take their masks with them and basically make judgements on whether or not to wear a mask based on what other people are doing. That, if I am honest, is what I do.

    One woman on the train seemed to have a mild panic attack seeing the lack of mask wearing. A guy I know who is a singer in a punk band continues to go to gigs wearing a mask, the only person in the room doing so, he says he is hoping for a new lockdown but is still playing a gig next week with his band. This just seems like evidence of a kind of a mass psychotic episode.
    Who the hell hopes for a lockdown?
    *Extreme introverts
    *Sociopaths
    *Members of ISAGE
    *Amazon executives
    People who had boring jobs and enjoy being paid to watch Netflix
    People who hate commuting
    Doom merchants
    Antivaxxers
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,885

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    ping said:

    isam said:

    ping said:

    Incredible tip from @isam

    I didn’t get on it myself, sadly

    Thanks. One more needed. Should really be weighed in, he’s missed a couple of sitters
    Well done mate.
    Thanks. The perennial first thought when it copped - I should have had more on!

    Big chance he got subbed on the hour though, so it wasn’t a maximoso bet
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,250
    edited August 2021
    IshmaelZ said:

    Andy_JS said:

    The problem isn't being 78 per se. There are lots of people that age who are still as sharp as ever.

    By coincidence, England India were all out for 78 today.
    There's a lot of strategy in test cricket which you just don't understand, Sunil. England have fallen straight into India's trap.
    Lost the battle; winning the war. :wink:


  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,036

    Scott_xP said:

    UK government set to radically scale back HS2 eastern route https://on.ft.com/3ko424y

    Best to cancel HS2 altogether what a waste of money.
    I agree.

    However I can understand people wanting to get out of London in a hurry.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,766

    pigeon said:

    DougSeal said:

    darkage said:

    DougSeal said:

    TOPPING said:

    Mask wearing on the tube is dropping I would say.

    Yesterday I took the two lines into town just after rush hour and home again at the tail end, with most seats taken but only one or two standing for the most part, I'd say the vast majority were wearing masks, and mostly but not always covering mouth and nose.

    My observation on this topic - District Line (spacious walk through carriages, lots of space) mask wearing 80%+. Central Line (ancient crowded trains, standing room only) 50% masks tops. Dropping in both cases though.
    It seems to me like a very mixed picture. I noticed today that mask wearing in the supermarket was on the increase, but on the train it seems to be on the decrease. My theory is that people take their masks with them and basically make judgements on whether or not to wear a mask based on what other people are doing. That, if I am honest, is what I do.

    One woman on the train seemed to have a mild panic attack seeing the lack of mask wearing. A guy I know who is a singer in a punk band continues to go to gigs wearing a mask, the only person in the room doing so, he says he is hoping for a new lockdown but is still playing a gig next week with his band. This just seems like evidence of a kind of a mass psychotic episode.
    Who the hell hopes for a lockdown?
    *Extreme introverts
    *Sociopaths
    *Members of ISAGE
    *Amazon executives
    *People who didn't go out and do anything before the pandemic but still think everyone else should be locked down too to protect them anyway
    "This just seems like evidence of a kind of a mass psychotic episode."

    I know what you mean, but I don't think it is accurate. Some people are scared. Still. Very scared. And who can blame them after 18 months of media and government screaming 'crisis' and 'death' all the time? So, they may not be able to balance the actual level of risk now with their fears but I don't think that is psychotic.

    If we are going down the road of mental health labels, then maybe OCD seems a better match?
  • Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,885
    DougSeal said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Fascinating London Underground fact. When it first opened people went down into the Tube to cool off. The temperature of the surrounding clay was only about 14C but 150 years of heat absorption has risen that to 19c-25C and as a result it’s a sweltering nightmare.

    I doubt the ambient temperature of the clay is 19-25. Sorry. Do you have any evidence that this is the case?

    I somewhat doubt the 14 too. Seems far too hot.
    http://www.operationsengineer.org.uk/article-images/23757/cooling.pdf
    Ok, but this isn't about the temperature of the clay.

    Someone will no doubt know but my guess would be that the surroundings of the tunnels are 5c or so.
    “The nub of the problem is that the biggest heat sink is failing as the temperature behind the walls rises way back into the clay. It’s now sitting at between 5C and 11C above the natural ambient of 14C.”
    Well, in that case going on the underground (unless in one of the air con trains, and it must be dumping its heat into the tunnels and platforms anyway) is even more of The Pubic louse inside a sumo wrestler's mawashi Experience than ever before.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,885

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,775
    DougSeal said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Fascinating London Underground fact. When it first opened people went down into the Tube to cool off. The temperature of the surrounding clay was only about 14C but 150 years of heat absorption has risen that to 19c-25C and as a result it’s a sweltering nightmare.

    I doubt the ambient temperature of the clay is 19-25. Sorry. Do you have any evidence that this is the case?

    I somewhat doubt the 14 too. Seems far too hot.
    http://www.operationsengineer.org.uk/article-images/23757/cooling.pdf
    Ok, but this isn't about the temperature of the clay.

    Someone will no doubt know but my guess would be that the surroundings of the tunnels are 5c or so.
    “The nub of the problem is that the biggest heat sink is failing as the temperature behind the walls rises way back into the clay. It’s now sitting at between 5C and 11C above the natural ambient of 14C.”
    It's just not the case that 5m (say) below the ground the ambient temperature is 14c. (At least I think it isn't - Am looking online to find some evidence).
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,149
    Carnyx said:

    DougSeal said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Fascinating London Underground fact. When it first opened people went down into the Tube to cool off. The temperature of the surrounding clay was only about 14C but 150 years of heat absorption has risen that to 19c-25C and as a result it’s a sweltering nightmare.

    I doubt the ambient temperature of the clay is 19-25. Sorry. Do you have any evidence that this is the case?

    I somewhat doubt the 14 too. Seems far too hot.
    http://www.operationsengineer.org.uk/article-images/23757/cooling.pdf
    Ok, but this isn't about the temperature of the clay.

    Someone will no doubt know but my guess would be that the surroundings of the tunnels are 5c or so.
    “The nub of the problem is that the biggest heat sink is failing as the temperature behind the walls rises way back into the clay. It’s now sitting at between 5C and 11C above the natural ambient of 14C.”
    Well, in that case going on the underground (unless in one of the air con trains, and it must be dumping its heat into the tunnels and platforms anyway) is even more of The Pubic louse inside a sumo wrestler's mawashi Experience than ever before.
    Such vivid imagery. I'll never look at it the same way again. Unfortunately.
  • Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
    If anyone's suffering a labour shortage they can always try paying better wages to attract staff.

    The minimum wage is supposed to be an absolute minimum not a maximum.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,885

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
    If anyone's suffering a labour shortage they can always try paying better wages to attract staff.

    The minimum wage is supposed to be an absolute minimum not a maximum.
    Quite. And yet they have to supply the supermarkets. Who are about as moveable as that container ship in the Suez Canal.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    edited August 2021
    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
    If anyone's suffering a labour shortage they can always try paying better wages to attract staff.

    The minimum wage is supposed to be an absolute minimum not a maximum.
    Quite. And yet they have to supply the supermarkets. Who are about as moveable as that container ship in the Suez Canal.
    The market is pretty efficient.

    If the supermarkets require stock they will pay what they need to do so, so the price will go up.

    Or if they're outcompeted by other nations and importing it is cheaper then that's what we should do.

    Either way, let the free market sort it out.

    If supermarkets are inefficient then that's their problem they need to sort out, we don't need to change our laws to handle companies inefficiencies.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486

    Scott_xP said:

    UK government set to radically scale back HS2 eastern route https://on.ft.com/3ko424y

    Best to cancel HS2 altogether what a waste of money.
    I agree.

    However I can understand people wanting to get out of London in a hurry.
    I’ve been loving going back into town since I came back from holidays in the wilds. No need to scrabble about or drive for a good place to eat down here. Had more good meals in the few days since I have been back than in weeks in the wilds.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,885
    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Fascinating London Underground fact. When it first opened people went down into the Tube to cool off. The temperature of the surrounding clay was only about 14C but 150 years of heat absorption has risen that to 19c-25C and as a result it’s a sweltering nightmare.

    I doubt the ambient temperature of the clay is 19-25. Sorry. Do you have any evidence that this is the case?

    I somewhat doubt the 14 too. Seems far too hot.
    http://www.operationsengineer.org.uk/article-images/23757/cooling.pdf
    Ok, but this isn't about the temperature of the clay.

    Someone will no doubt know but my guess would be that the surroundings of the tunnels are 5c or so.
    “The nub of the problem is that the biggest heat sink is failing as the temperature behind the walls rises way back into the clay. It’s now sitting at between 5C and 11C above the natural ambient of 14C.”
    It's just not the case that 5m (say) below the ground the ambient temperature is 14c. (At least I think it isn't - Am looking online to find some evidence).
    Why shouldn't it be? It's been London for rather a long time - lots of tarmac, lots of insolation, lots of sweaty yuppies, etc. And see this.

    http://nora.nerc.ac.uk/id/eprint/512282/1/Submitted (again) to QJEGH endSept 2015.pdf
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,218
    DougSeal said:

    Fascinating London Underground fact. When it first opened people went down into the Tube to cool off. The temperature of the surrounding clay was only about 14C but 150 years of heat absorption has risen that to 19c-25C and as a result it’s a sweltering nightmare.

    Really?

    I ask because if you go down a coal mine, it gets warmer the deeper you go.

  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    Yet another one with a poor understanding of the consequences of voting for the face eating leopards party.

  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    isam said:

    kle4 said:

    Demolition job on Labour "holding the government to account" on Afghanistan:

    Yesterday, Matt Chorley said shadow foreign secretary Lisa Nandy had never mentioned Afghanistan in the House of Commons until last week.

    He now admits he got it wrong... it's actually a lot worse than that.

    @MattChorley


    https://twitter.com/TimesRadio/status/1430473447210115076?s=20

    ‘Lisa Nandy had never mentioned Afghanistan in the House of Commons until last week.’

    I’m sure PB can empathise.
    There is no problem holding politicians to a higher level of expectation than we hold ourselves to, especially when they either hold power over us, want to hold power over us, or are making specific claims about their personal political effectiveness or exercise of power/scrutiny of power.

    I prefer not to even think about Afghanistan if I can help it, since it's a complete bloody mess. Raab, and to a lesser extent Nandy, have far less excuse and can be given short shrift if they puff up their efforts regarding it. His taking his eye off the ball is more critical, but if she has not actually been bringing it up she can be criticised as well if giving the impression she had.
    Listen to the Times Radio clip - she pretended on QT the government were dodging scrutiny in on Afghanistan, yet Labour never pressed them on it, never ranked any urgent questions, Sir Keir never mentioned it at PMQs, zilcho, nada… she was lying
    The most questions from Labour on Afghanistan?

    The Shadow Railways Minister
  • Levelling up by making HS2 pointless, yes the same old Tories!
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,680

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    Very problematic for Boris. Surely even he won't be stupid enough to implement the panic measure recommended by the PB Brexit Tories of artificial wage hikes. But if he loosens immigration controls that will kill the raison d'être for Brexit stone dead and Farage will be polling at 50%. Tricky.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,885

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
    If anyone's suffering a labour shortage they can always try paying better wages to attract staff.

    The minimum wage is supposed to be an absolute minimum not a maximum.
    Quite. And yet they have to supply the supermarkets. Who are about as moveable as that container ship in the Suez Canal.
    The market is pretty efficient.

    If the supermarkets require stock they will pay what they need to do so, so the price will go up.

    Or if they're outcompeted by other nations and importing it is cheaper then that's what we should do.

    Either way, let the free market sort it out.

    If supermarkets are inefficient then that's their problem they need to sort out, we don't need to change our laws to handle companies inefficiencies.
    Okay, you want to lose entire industries and our entire stretegic food security on the altar on the god Brexit?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,250
    kle4 said:

    Charles said:

    IshmaelZ said:
    He is asking for $150k from each of 17 CO-respondents. It’s all about the money
    On the face of it it looks like absolute nonsense with a dash of utter hysteria, but perhaps there's an actual legal point in there somewhere.
    US claims like this are a game of poker, as we know.

    Shades of Virginia Giuffre.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,775
    Carnyx said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Fascinating London Underground fact. When it first opened people went down into the Tube to cool off. The temperature of the surrounding clay was only about 14C but 150 years of heat absorption has risen that to 19c-25C and as a result it’s a sweltering nightmare.

    I doubt the ambient temperature of the clay is 19-25. Sorry. Do you have any evidence that this is the case?

    I somewhat doubt the 14 too. Seems far too hot.
    http://www.operationsengineer.org.uk/article-images/23757/cooling.pdf
    Ok, but this isn't about the temperature of the clay.

    Someone will no doubt know but my guess would be that the surroundings of the tunnels are 5c or so.
    “The nub of the problem is that the biggest heat sink is failing as the temperature behind the walls rises way back into the clay. It’s now sitting at between 5C and 11C above the natural ambient of 14C.”
    It's just not the case that 5m (say) below the ground the ambient temperature is 14c. (At least I think it isn't - Am looking online to find some evidence).
    Why shouldn't it be? It's been London for rather a long time - lots of tarmac, lots of insolation, lots of sweaty yuppies, etc. And see this.

    http://nora.nerc.ac.uk/id/eprint/512282/1/Submitted (again) to QJEGH endSept 2015.pdf
    In part because it's freezing cold in the winter on the first, or near to first, tube.

    Mainly though I just think that it isn't, and evidence one way or another seems to be tricky to find.
  • Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
    If anyone's suffering a labour shortage they can always try paying better wages to attract staff.

    The minimum wage is supposed to be an absolute minimum not a maximum.
    Quite. And yet they have to supply the supermarkets. Who are about as moveable as that container ship in the Suez Canal.
    The market is pretty efficient.

    If the supermarkets require stock they will pay what they need to do so, so the price will go up.

    Or if they're outcompeted by other nations and importing it is cheaper then that's what we should do.

    Either way, let the free market sort it out.

    If supermarkets are inefficient then that's their problem they need to sort out, we don't need to change our laws to handle companies inefficiencies.
    Okay, you want to lose entire industries and our entire stretegic food security on the altar on the god Brexit?
    No, on the altar of a free market.

    The fish will still be in the water, the land will still be available. If companies are completely inefficient and go out of business because they can't operate competitively then let them fail and if anyone else can do so let them do it instead.

    I've always advocated a free market in food and an abolition of subsidies and tariffs.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486

    pigeon said:

    DougSeal said:

    darkage said:

    DougSeal said:

    TOPPING said:

    Mask wearing on the tube is dropping I would say.

    Yesterday I took the two lines into town just after rush hour and home again at the tail end, with most seats taken but only one or two standing for the most part, I'd say the vast majority were wearing masks, and mostly but not always covering mouth and nose.

    My observation on this topic - District Line (spacious walk through carriages, lots of space) mask wearing 80%+. Central Line (ancient crowded trains, standing room only) 50% masks tops. Dropping in both cases though.
    It seems to me like a very mixed picture. I noticed today that mask wearing in the supermarket was on the increase, but on the train it seems to be on the decrease. My theory is that people take their masks with them and basically make judgements on whether or not to wear a mask based on what other people are doing. That, if I am honest, is what I do.

    One woman on the train seemed to have a mild panic attack seeing the lack of mask wearing. A guy I know who is a singer in a punk band continues to go to gigs wearing a mask, the only person in the room doing so, he says he is hoping for a new lockdown but is still playing a gig next week with his band. This just seems like evidence of a kind of a mass psychotic episode.
    Who the hell hopes for a lockdown?
    *Extreme introverts
    *Sociopaths
    *Members of ISAGE
    *Amazon executives
    *People who didn't go out and do anything before the pandemic but still think everyone else should be locked down too to protect them anyway
    "This just seems like evidence of a kind of a mass psychotic episode."

    I know what you mean, but I don't think it is accurate. Some people are scared. Still. Very scared. And who can blame them after 18 months of media and government screaming 'crisis' and 'death' all the time? So, they may not be able to balance the actual level of risk now with their fears but I don't think that is psychotic.

    If we are going down the road of mental health labels, then maybe OCD seems a better match?
    I read an article recently that said that the average Australian now overestimates their risk of death from covid by 16x. I hope that’s not true, but given my experience here I’m not entirely confident it’s false.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,695
    edited August 2021
    GIN1138 said:

    pigeon said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Business leaders call for relaxation of post-Brexit visa rules as predictions over exodus of EU workers in low paid jobs realised. Worst supply chain crisis since 70s say industry chiefs https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/aug/25/business-leaders-call-for-relaxation-of-post-brexit-visa-rules?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    I had my first "supply chain" issue today when I couldn't buy Bisto gravy granules at the CO! :open_mouth:
    Shortage of diced chicken in convenient-sized packets in Tesco.

    It's devastating, but somehow I shall survive.
    Thankfully there's always an alternative. As I couldn't get Bisto Gravy Granules I brought Maxwell Bleedin' House instead... ;)
    deleted
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,225
    isam said:

    Demolition job on Labour "holding the government to account" on Afghanistan:

    Yesterday, Matt Chorley said shadow foreign secretary Lisa Nandy had never mentioned Afghanistan in the House of Commons until last week.

    He now admits he got it wrong... it's actually a lot worse than that.

    @MattChorley


    https://twitter.com/TimesRadio/status/1430473447210115076?s=20

    Haha brilliant!

    They’ve hardly ever mentioned it!

    Nandy not at all, Healey twice, in passing, Sir Keir not one question at PMQs… and now, after the event, it’s all full on faux outrageux about the lack of planning!!!

    Great stuff
    The entire political class - with the notable and honourable exception of the HoL foreign affairs select committee - completely forgot about Afghanistan over the last year.
    The government have rather less excuse than Labour, though, since pertinent questions were asked of ministers, and ignored.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,885
    Omnium said:

    Carnyx said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Fascinating London Underground fact. When it first opened people went down into the Tube to cool off. The temperature of the surrounding clay was only about 14C but 150 years of heat absorption has risen that to 19c-25C and as a result it’s a sweltering nightmare.

    I doubt the ambient temperature of the clay is 19-25. Sorry. Do you have any evidence that this is the case?

    I somewhat doubt the 14 too. Seems far too hot.
    http://www.operationsengineer.org.uk/article-images/23757/cooling.pdf
    Ok, but this isn't about the temperature of the clay.

    Someone will no doubt know but my guess would be that the surroundings of the tunnels are 5c or so.
    “The nub of the problem is that the biggest heat sink is failing as the temperature behind the walls rises way back into the clay. It’s now sitting at between 5C and 11C above the natural ambient of 14C.”
    It's just not the case that 5m (say) below the ground the ambient temperature is 14c. (At least I think it isn't - Am looking online to find some evidence).
    Why shouldn't it be? It's been London for rather a long time - lots of tarmac, lots of insolation, lots of sweaty yuppies, etc. And see this.

    http://nora.nerc.ac.uk/id/eprint/512282/1/Submitted (again) to QJEGH endSept 2015.pdf
    In part because it's freezing cold in the winter on the first, or near to first, tube.

    Mainly though I just think that it isn't, and evidence one way or another seems to be tricky to find.
    I think that is because they park the trains in the open overnight. Also (depending on where you are) many underground trains run in the open air at the further out legs - eg Northern Line through Cricklewood (I do know that from visiting the RAF Museum).
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,766
    ydoethur said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK government set to radically scale back HS2 eastern route https://on.ft.com/3ko424y

    Never trust the FT on anything to do with HS2. They’ve been the most vicious rampers of the false £106 billion figure and are now parroting the equally wrong £40 billion figure.

    This is largely because they hate money being spent on anything other than their client groups.

    They also again repeat the tired old canard that more money is needed on ‘local lines,’ not understanding that until HS2 is actually built there is no connecting capacity for local lines to be improved with.

    Cannock is a classic example. £90 million was spent upgrading our railway to 75mph and electrifying it, so we could have through services to London (in the face of heavy opposition from lunatics like Fabricant and Williamson who ran a misinformation and smear campaign that even Joe Rukin would blush at). But unfortunately due to heavy congestion on the WCML the London service proved totally unworkable. So despite the fact that it was pretty popular - the times I took it it was always full - it’s had to be abandoned.

    Similarly there is no hope of a new trans-Pennine route without HS2, as there will be nowhere for the trains to go without new tracks and stations, or reopening the Ivanhoe line from Leicester to Derby.

    Unfortunately Hs2’s many critics choose to ignore this, usually for their own entirely selfish reasons.

    So if their lies and hysteria prevail we will continue to have a rail network that is basically a lash up.
    Entirely off the top of my head after a glass or two of wine but I suspect that those who most rage against spending money investing in something like this actually had absolutely no qualms investing money in their new and rather large house extension or conservatory or home office which they will take twenty years to pay back.

  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,002
    Exclusive: Defence Secretary Ben Wallace says British evacuation efforts in Kabul have been 'diverted' by bid to rescue animals cared for by ex-Royal Marine Pen Farthing https://news.sky.com/story/exclusive-defence-secretary-ben-wallace-says-british-evacuation-efforts-in-kabul-have-been-diverted-by-bid-to-rescue-animals-cared-for-by-ex-royal-marine-pen-farthing-12390679
  • Exclusive: Defence Secretary Ben Wallace says British evacuation efforts in Kabul have been 'diverted' by bid to rescue animals cared for by ex-Royal Marine Pen Farthing

    https://news.sky.com/story/exclusive-defence-secretary-ben-wallace-says-british-evacuation-efforts-in-kabul-have-been-diverted-by-bid-to-rescue-animals-cared-for-by-ex-royal-marine-pen-farthing-12390679
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,036

    Scott_xP said:

    UK government set to radically scale back HS2 eastern route https://on.ft.com/3ko424y

    Best to cancel HS2 altogether what a waste of money.
    I agree.

    However I can understand people wanting to get out of London in a hurry.
    I’ve been loving going back into town since I came back from holidays in the wilds. No need to scrabble about or drive for a good place to eat down here. Had more good meals in the few days since I have been back than in weeks in the wilds.
    These "wilds". Zone 4?
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,680

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
    If anyone's suffering a labour shortage they can always try paying better wages to attract staff.

    The minimum wage is supposed to be an absolute minimum not a maximum.
    Quite. And yet they have to supply the supermarkets. Who are about as moveable as that container ship in the Suez Canal.
    The market is pretty efficient.

    If the supermarkets require stock they will pay what they need to do so, so the price will go up.

    Or if they're outcompeted by other nations and importing it is cheaper then that's what we should do.

    Either way, let the free market sort it out.

    If supermarkets are inefficient then that's their problem they need to sort out, we don't need to change our laws to handle companies inefficiencies.
    Okay, you want to lose entire industries and our entire stretegic food security on the altar on the god Brexit?
    No, on the altar of a free market.

    The fish will still be in the water, the land will still be available. If companies are completely inefficient and go out of business because they can't operate competitively then let them fail and if anyone else can do so let them do it instead.

    I've always advocated a free market in food and an abolition of subsidies and tariffs.
    The genius of Brexit is that it's rigged the market to the UK's disadvantage.
  • Scott_xP said:

    UK government set to radically scale back HS2 eastern route https://on.ft.com/3ko424y

    Best to cancel HS2 altogether what a waste of money.
    I agree.

    However I can understand people wanting to get out of London in a hurry.
    I’ve been loving going back into town since I came back from holidays in the wilds. No need to scrabble about or drive for a good place to eat down here. Had more good meals in the few days since I have been back than in weeks in the wilds.
    These "wilds". Zone 4?
    Zone 4 is OK :)
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720

    Exclusive: Defence Secretary Ben Wallace says British evacuation efforts in Kabul have been 'diverted' by bid to rescue animals cared for by ex-Royal Marine Pen Farthing

    https://news.sky.com/story/exclusive-defence-secretary-ben-wallace-says-british-evacuation-efforts-in-kabul-have-been-diverted-by-bid-to-rescue-animals-cared-for-by-ex-royal-marine-pen-farthing-12390679

    Yes but puppies and kittens are more popular than asylum seekers, nailed on.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    edited August 2021
    rcs1000 said:

    DougSeal said:

    Fascinating London Underground fact. When it first opened people went down into the Tube to cool off. The temperature of the surrounding clay was only about 14C but 150 years of heat absorption has risen that to 19c-25C and as a result it’s a sweltering nightmare.

    Really?

    I ask because if you go down a coal mine, it gets warmer the deeper you go.

    “When the Bakerloo line opened in 1906, for example, advertisements paraded the tube as the coolest place to be in the hot summer weather. Two years later, that campaign stopped as platform and train temperatures started to get uncomfortable.”

    http://www.operationsengineer.org.uk/article-images/23757/cooling.pdf
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    edited August 2021

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    And

    "Scot Burgess is the factory manager at Whitelink, a major Scottish seafood producer.

    Single biggest challenge? ‘Labour shortage.’

    Single biggest reason? ‘Brexit’."

    What would he know?
    Well indeed, if you listened to Remainers then we're supposed to be having mass unemployment right now thanks to Brexit.
    That comment of yours butters no parsnips - and certainly batters no haddock.
    If anyone's suffering a labour shortage they can always try paying better wages to attract staff.

    The minimum wage is supposed to be an absolute minimum not a maximum.
    Quite. And yet they have to supply the supermarkets. Who are about as moveable as that container ship in the Suez Canal.
    The market is pretty efficient.

    If the supermarkets require stock they will pay what they need to do so, so the price will go up.

    Or if they're outcompeted by other nations and importing it is cheaper then that's what we should do.

    Either way, let the free market sort it out.

    If supermarkets are inefficient then that's their problem they need to sort out, we don't need to change our laws to handle companies inefficiencies.
    And the free market says, the price goes up. Which is actually not ideal for the people who shop in the supermarkets, is it? i.e. you and me?

    Mind you, we also don't need to change our laws to handle wannabe house buyers' inefficiencies, do we? If there's a shortage of houses, the market will sort it by pushing prices up. An equilibrium will be arrived at. Sorted.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,250
    MattW said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Andy_JS said:

    The problem isn't being 78 per se. There are lots of people that age who are still as sharp as ever.

    By coincidence, England India were all out for 78 today.
    There's a lot of strategy in test cricket which you just don't understand, Sunil. England have fallen straight into India's trap.
    Lost the battle; winning the war. :wink:


    Or, alternatively


  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,002

    The genius of Brexit is that it's rigged the market to the UK's disadvantage.

    The only Country in history to impose sanctions on itself...

    And still the fanbois cheer
  • Foxy said:

    Exclusive: Defence Secretary Ben Wallace says British evacuation efforts in Kabul have been 'diverted' by bid to rescue animals cared for by ex-Royal Marine Pen Farthing

    https://news.sky.com/story/exclusive-defence-secretary-ben-wallace-says-british-evacuation-efforts-in-kabul-have-been-diverted-by-bid-to-rescue-animals-cared-for-by-ex-royal-marine-pen-farthing-12390679

    Yes but puppies and kittens are more popular than asylum seekers, nailed on.
    Indeed, this the Katie Hopkins government.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,775
    Carnyx said:

    Omnium said:

    Carnyx said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Omnium said:

    DougSeal said:

    Fascinating London Underground fact. When it first opened people went down into the Tube to cool off. The temperature of the surrounding clay was only about 14C but 150 years of heat absorption has risen that to 19c-25C and as a result it’s a sweltering nightmare.

    I doubt the ambient temperature of the clay is 19-25. Sorry. Do you have any evidence that this is the case?

    I somewhat doubt the 14 too. Seems far too hot.
    http://www.operationsengineer.org.uk/article-images/23757/cooling.pdf
    Ok, but this isn't about the temperature of the clay.

    Someone will no doubt know but my guess would be that the surroundings of the tunnels are 5c or so.
    “The nub of the problem is that the biggest heat sink is failing as the temperature behind the walls rises way back into the clay. It’s now sitting at between 5C and 11C above the natural ambient of 14C.”
    It's just not the case that 5m (say) below the ground the ambient temperature is 14c. (At least I think it isn't - Am looking online to find some evidence).
    Why shouldn't it be? It's been London for rather a long time - lots of tarmac, lots of insolation, lots of sweaty yuppies, etc. And see this.

    http://nora.nerc.ac.uk/id/eprint/512282/1/Submitted (again) to QJEGH endSept 2015.pdf
    In part because it's freezing cold in the winter on the first, or near to first, tube.

    Mainly though I just think that it isn't, and evidence one way or another seems to be tricky to find.
    I think that is because they park the trains in the open overnight. Also (depending on where you are) many underground trains run in the open air at the further out legs - eg Northern Line through Cricklewood (I do know that from visiting the RAF Museum).
    That's certainly true. However before you get on the train in the winter it can be very cold on the station. I'm nearly 100% certain that I'm right, but I can't find anything to prove it. I'm fairly sure you don't believe the natural ambient temperature of 14c anyway.

    If I find anything I'll PM you.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,002
    I: Britain tells Afghans to forget the airport and go to border #TomorrowsPapersToday https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1430633922912825350/photo/1
  • Charles said:

    When even the cheerleaders are having a wee think to themselves.

    https://twitter.com/c4ciaran/status/1430578846894592016?s=21

    Why did “cheerleaders” and “wee” make me think of @TSE
    Ewww no!!!!

    To the wee bit anyway.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,413
    Charles said:

    Omnium said:

    ydoethur said:

    IanB2 said:

    ydoethur said:

    Biden is an awful President who should never have won a primary let alone an election.

    Still infinitely better than Trump. But the Democrats need to think hard on the primaries for 2024 or the GOP really will have an easy ride then (so long as they don't choose Trump again).

    Only Biden could have beaten Trump imho.

    That was his one last job.
    I think the problem (and I’ve said this before) come aback to the lack of profile among Democratic candidates. All three of Obama’s two Secretaries of State and vice-President were in their 60s/70s in 2016. There were simply no younger candidates forcing their way through. Of those three, apart from age, Kerry was already a failed candidate and Hilary Clinton was incredibly divisive. That left Biden carrying the torch. And he did it very well - he said all the right things - but he’s not showing what’s needed now to sort things out.

    Somewhere, a younger candidate in their fifties should have been brought forward, perhaps by Biden or Kerry resigning and being replaced by somebody younger, somebody being groomed for the succession. Bad oversight by Obama that he didn’t do it.
    It is striking how US voters are willing to tolerate candidates way beyond the age at which most European countries would look for someone with a bit more energy.

    I really don’t know whether the US clings onto some excessive respect for those with decades of experience, or whether the $-driven nature of US politics makes it difficult to get to the top of the greasy pole without decades of greasing the right palms and dispensing the right pork.
    Oldest PMs by age of departure from office

    Gladstone 84
    Palmerston 80
    Churchill 80
    Disraeli 75
    Lord John Russell 73
    Lord Salisbury 72
    Campbell Bannerman 71
    Neville Chamberlain 71
    The Duke of Portland 71
    Lord Aberdeen 71
    Earl Grey 70

    It is to my mind rather striking that only one of those was elected via a general election in the age of universal suffrage.

    Equally, of course, Palmerston probably would have won elections under any franchise even in his seventies.

    (And to be controversial, Chamberlain would easily have won an election in October 1938, although fortunately he had more sense than to call one.)
    You'd probably want to lop off about 5 years to their modern equivalents. Some of these were awful.
    No really awful ones. Russell and Campbell Bannermann weren’t great. Chamberlain had a lot of potential but was found wanting against a v tough test
    Campbell Bannerman wasn't great?
    For ahame.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486

    Scott_xP said:

    UK government set to radically scale back HS2 eastern route https://on.ft.com/3ko424y

    Best to cancel HS2 altogether what a waste of money.
    I agree.

    However I can understand people wanting to get out of London in a hurry.
    I’ve been loving going back into town since I came back from holidays in the wilds. No need to scrabble about or drive for a good place to eat down here. Had more good meals in the few days since I have been back than in weeks in the wilds.
    These "wilds". Zone 4?
    Nope.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Exclusive: Defence Secretary Ben Wallace says British evacuation efforts in Kabul have been 'diverted' by bid to rescue animals cared for by ex-Royal Marine Pen Farthing

    https://news.sky.com/story/exclusive-defence-secretary-ben-wallace-says-british-evacuation-efforts-in-kabul-have-been-diverted-by-bid-to-rescue-animals-cared-for-by-ex-royal-marine-pen-farthing-12390679

    I can tell by your posting that that you hate little fluffy kittens with big googoo eyes almost as much as you hate Great Ormond Street Hospital for children.

    Never mind the Afghans, think about the doggies.
  • IshmaelZ said:

    Exclusive: Defence Secretary Ben Wallace says British evacuation efforts in Kabul have been 'diverted' by bid to rescue animals cared for by ex-Royal Marine Pen Farthing

    https://news.sky.com/story/exclusive-defence-secretary-ben-wallace-says-british-evacuation-efforts-in-kabul-have-been-diverted-by-bid-to-rescue-animals-cared-for-by-ex-royal-marine-pen-farthing-12390679

    I can tell by your posting that that you hate little fluffy kittens with big googoo eyes almost as much as you hate Great Ormond Street Hospital for children.

    Never mind the Afghans, think about the doggies.
    Well as a cat owner....
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    IshmaelZ said:

    Exclusive: Defence Secretary Ben Wallace says British evacuation efforts in Kabul have been 'diverted' by bid to rescue animals cared for by ex-Royal Marine Pen Farthing

    https://news.sky.com/story/exclusive-defence-secretary-ben-wallace-says-british-evacuation-efforts-in-kabul-have-been-diverted-by-bid-to-rescue-animals-cared-for-by-ex-royal-marine-pen-farthing-12390679

    I can tell by your posting that that you hate little fluffy kittens with big googoo eyes almost as much as you hate Great Ormond Street Hospital for children.

    Never mind the Afghans, think about the doggies.
    Well as a cat owner....
    I think we also need to hear from the Afghan owners.
This discussion has been closed.