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The “Crisis What Crisis” immersive theatrical experience – politicalbetting.com

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  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,752
    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    What have we done. I feel for the soldiers here. Lions led by Protozoa


    “Help! Taliban is coming. Taliban is coming.”

    Young Afghan woman outside a gate at #Kabul airport pleading for U.S. soldiers to let her, and other civilians, in.’

    https://twitter.com/frudbezhan/status/1428032250239668226?s=21

    The point must be coming when Biden rows back on leaving in his time scale

    Will be interesting what he says shortly
    There shouldn’t even be a bloody stupid time scale. Biden should have ripped up Trump’s moronic agreement, slowly started moving people out, kept bagram open just in case, put in MORE troops to aid a slow, thorough withdrawal. And right at the end you sabotage all weapons if you do have to get everyone out. Meanwhile start arming potential taliban adversaries

    And, also, fuck Pakistan. Frankly. This country is no friend of the West.
    I cannot understand why Pakistan has not been put under more pressure by the West. They have been arming the Taliban and giving them sanctuary. The Taliban don't have munitions factories. One has to assume they have got their weapons and materiel from Pakistan.
    I don’t get it either
    Pakistan is a nation founded expressly as an Islamic state and is nuclear capable.

    Do you feel lucky?
    We are not obliged to give them aid, or allow migration therefrom, for starters. It’s a hostile power
    Exactly what I said the other day. They are not our friends.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,233
    Just watched Highlander for the first time.

    Very cheesy film but worth it for the Sean Connery cameo, and the Queen soundtrack - which is superb.


    Did they ever write a bad song?
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    What have we done. I feel for the soldiers here. Lions led by Protozoa


    “Help! Taliban is coming. Taliban is coming.”

    Young Afghan woman outside a gate at #Kabul airport pleading for U.S. soldiers to let her, and other civilians, in.’

    https://twitter.com/frudbezhan/status/1428032250239668226?s=21

    The point must be coming when Biden rows back on leaving in his time scale

    Will be interesting what he says shortly
    There shouldn’t even be a bloody stupid time scale. Biden should have ripped up Trump’s moronic agreement, slowly started moving people out, kept bagram open just in case, put in MORE troops to aid a slow, thorough withdrawal. And right at the end you sabotage all weapons if you do have to get everyone out. Meanwhile start arming potential taliban adversaries

    And, also, fuck Pakistan. Frankly. This country is no friend of the West.
    I cannot understand why Pakistan has not been put under more pressure by the West. They have been arming the Taliban and giving them sanctuary. The Taliban don't have munitions factories. One has to assume they have got their weapons and materiel from Pakistan.
    I don’t get it either
    Pakistan is a nation founded expressly as an Islamic state and is nuclear capable.

    Do you feel lucky?
    We are not obliged to give them aid, or allow migration therefrom, for starters. It’s a hostile power
    Exactly what I said the other day. They are not our friends.
    They invented the "Taliban" and researched the name to find the best one.....
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,024
    edited August 2021

    Marjorie Taylor Greene in Iowa:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNdjqx6vKy4

    I wonder if she's planning a Presidential run :wink:

    I would pay to see that

    Edit to add: there aren't many people that Harris would beat. But Ms Greene is one of them.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    edited August 2021
    A welcome reminder - in the face of considerable 'breakthrough infection' anxiety - that SARSCoV2 is transitioning into endemicicity. Those numbers are remarkable, even more so if we remind ourselves that fewer than 10% of people in the UK have no antibodies to SARSCoV2 yet......


    A friendly reminder that in England COVID-19 is still spreading mainly among immune naive people:

    ENGLAND cases in July:
    - 98.6% never previously infected
    - 78.1% were unvaccinated


    https://twitter.com/BallouxFrancois/status/1428803009711157257?s=20
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,838
    Leon said:

    Omnium said:

    Leon said:

    Another terrible aspect of that presser. This is the biggest US foreign policy humiliation in many years

    Biden was late, he was there for about 20 minutes, he took 5 pre-planned questions, then fled

    He is not serving American democracy, apart from anything else. Even Trump was more up-front than this

    He can never come back from this.

    Edit: Others might, but my view of Biden is that he can't.
    How can we know? Who knows how this is all being seen in the american heartlands and Trump/Biden swing counties?
    Quite true. We can’t. But Biden looks defeated emotionally and psychologically. It all looks painful. He’s a seriously old man. Whatever happens this will now haunt him (and it could get still worse). I can’t see him running again - so to that extent he probably cannot come back from this
    I did wonder if that’s why he’s claimed it’s his decision and his decision alone.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,752

    Just watched Highlander for the first time.

    Very cheesy film but worth it for the Sean Connery cameo, and the Queen soundtrack - which is superb.


    Did they ever write a bad song?

    Is that a serious question, obviously not.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,548
    edited August 2021
    rcs1000 said:

    Marjorie Taylor Greene in Iowa:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNdjqx6vKy4

    I wonder if she's planning a Presidential run :wink:

    I would pay to see that

    Edit to add: there aren't many people that Harris would beat. But Ms Greene is one of them.
    She might be feeling the threat of Lauren Boebart, who has 50% more followers on twatter.
  • Breaking

    This changes the narrative


    Alex Wickham
    @alexwickham
    ·
    14m

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    Alberto Nardelli
    @AlbertoNardelli

    · 14m

    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy https://bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-08-20/biden-assured-allies-in-june-u-s-would-ensure-kabul-s-stability

    Show this thread
    Alex Wickham

    @alexwickham
    ·
    12m
    Goes some way to explaining why UK/EU are so angry with Biden and why other Nato countries were caught short
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,874
    Fishing said:

    justin124 said:

    Fishing said:

    Jim Callaghan - the classic "in office but not in power" PM, at any rate before John Major and TM.

    Still at least he paved the way for Margaret Thatcher. Although I still remember the candles my parents kept for several years afterwards in case the Winter of Discontent was repeated.

    I do not recall candles being needed during the Winter of Discontent - the miners, electricity power workers etc were not involved in the industrial chaos which then engulfed the country. Power cuts and the associated need for candles belonged to the 3-Day Week of the 1973/74 Winter - and before that the first Miners Strike in early 1972.In the Winter of 1970/71 there had also been power cuts when Frank Chappell's power workers took industrial action. All of that happened under Ted Heath's Government - not Callaghan.
    That is of course true - but I imagine my father's reasoning was that it wasn't predictable which sectors would be hit by widespread industrial discontent in the future, and while the dead going unburied or Ford workers coming out wouldn't affect him directly in the short term, electricity certainly would.

    I wonder whether he still had them during the Miner's Strike?
    I remember the rotad power cuts vividly. I can't remember which year, 71 or 72. We had candles etc because the power cuts used to last 4hours. Thinking back there must have been a lot of house fires.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    President Joe Biden told key allies in June that he would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan to ensure they could continue to operate in the capital following the main U.S. withdrawal, a vow made before the Taliban’s rapid final push across the country, according to a British diplomatic memo seen by Bloomberg.

    Biden promised U.K. Prime Minister Boris Johnson and other leaders at the Group of Seven summit in Cornwall, England, that “critical U.S. enablers” would remain in place to keep Kabul safe following the drawdown of NATO forces, the note said. British officials determined the U.S. would provide enough personnel to ensure that the U.K. embassy in Kabul could continue operating.


    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-08-20/biden-assured-allies-in-june-u-s-would-ensure-kabul-s-stability
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,233
    rcs1000 said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    So the Taliban are setting women on fire for cooking food wrong, and exporting young women in coffins to neighbouring countries to be used as sex slaves. But that’s ok, because


    ‘US Government Demands Taliban Respect Women And Girls In Strongly Worded Statement‘

    https://twitter.com/dailycaller/status/1428418574998245376?s=21

    Jesus. Are you not on your plane yet?
    You fly internetless?

    Muy retro!
    @Leon is flying Athens to London. I didn't think BA had Internet on its European flights yet, but I could be completely wrong.

    (Of course, Starlink will provide Internet to pretty much all the world's airlines in a couple of years.)
    I don't think the passenger experience of flying BA is any better these days than flying Easyjet or Ryanair, and in some respects it's worse.

    That said BA's pilots are bloody good -apart from one incident it hasn't had a single fatality in almost 50 years of operating, and coming back down on the ground in one piece is my primary concern when flying.
  • A welcome reminder - in the face of considerable 'breakthrough infection' anxiety - that SARSCoV2 is transitioning into endemicicity. Those numbers are remarkable, even more so if we remind ourselves that fewer than 10% of people in the UK have no antibodies to SARSCoV2 yet......


    A friendly reminder that in England COVID-19 is still spreading mainly among immune naive people:

    ENGLAND cases in July:
    - 98.6% never previously infected
    - 78.1% were unvaccinated


    https://twitter.com/BallouxFrancois/status/1428803009711157257?s=20

    Seems like we just need to burn through the anti-vaxxers.

    There's going to be plenty of missing footballers this season.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,233
    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    In Germany if the Union are largest party it would likely still be a Union and SPD coalition with the Greens or FDP added on.

    In Canada, Liberal leakage to the 3rd placed NDP would benefit the 2nd placed Conservatives most under Canadian FPTP of course given the NDP are still 6% behind the Conservatives but the Conservatives now only 2% behind the Liberals.

    It looks like Trudeau will scrape home as largest party but fail to get the majority he wanted

    We've discussed Germany at length and I don't disagree but the gap between the Union and SPD has closed and is closing. It's not inconceivable the SPD could top the poll for the first time since 2002.

    As for Canada, there's a lot going on under the figures I think. There would be a swing from Conservative to NDP as well on these numbers. The NDP were 18 points behind the Conservatives in 2019 - Counsel has the gap at seven so that's a 5.5% swing which is not inconsiderable.

    The question is how the votes will shape up in Ontario, Quebec and British Columbia. There's no point the Conservatives piling up votes in Alberta and Saskatchewan if they miss marginals in those other three provinces.
    Canadian Conservatives are weird. They manage to be rather wet and Trumpy at the same time.

    Meanwhile, you have a Woke idiot leading a Wokey centre-Left Blairite party, and then a radical Left Corbynite style party.

    Not exactly an inspiring choice.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,890
    edited August 2021
    It’s a shite tabloid parable in the making.
    Get well soon but stop being a twat.

    https://twitter.com/marcusjdl/status/1428778597062483974?s=21
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,290

    A welcome reminder - in the face of considerable 'breakthrough infection' anxiety - that SARSCoV2 is transitioning into endemicicity. Those numbers are remarkable, even more so if we remind ourselves that fewer than 10% of people in the UK have no antibodies to SARSCoV2 yet......


    A friendly reminder that in England COVID-19 is still spreading mainly among immune naive people:

    ENGLAND cases in July:
    - 98.6% never previously infected
    - 78.1% were unvaccinated


    https://twitter.com/BallouxFrancois/status/1428803009711157257?s=20

    Seems like we just need to burn through the anti-vaxxers.

    There's going to be plenty of missing footballers this season.
    In a grim way, each day of 30,000 new cases is a ‘good’ thing, it’s 30,000 fewer who are still to get Covid or get jabbed. I believe this is part of the plan tbh. I note that the powers that be seem very relaxed about cases now, as they should be.
  • ChameleonChameleon Posts: 4,264
    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,989

    Just watched Highlander for the first time.

    Very cheesy film but worth it for the Sean Connery cameo, and the Queen soundtrack - which is superb.


    Did they ever write a bad song?

    My friend would go into paroxysms of irritation whenever "Friends Will Be Friends" played, but I like it. I'm in the "no bad Queen song" camp.

    What I love about Highlander is that in a film about immortal Scottish clansmen, Sean Connery - who famously couldn't do any other accent to save himself - is for some reason playing a guy called Ramirez. In the Highlands. Of Scotland.
    I didn't much enjoy Highlander, but it's worth watching some of the many comedic reviews of the later films (not merely the legendary Highlander II), as the series seems almost indescribably bad.
  • It’s a shite tabloid parable in the making.
    Get well soon but stop being a twat.

    https://twitter.com/marcusjdl/status/1428778597062483974?s=21

    Given that we're talking about Queen songs then:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVIbCvfkO3E

    might soon be appropriate.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,379

    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    In Germany if the Union are largest party it would likely still be a Union and SPD coalition with the Greens or FDP added on.

    In Canada, Liberal leakage to the 3rd placed NDP would benefit the 2nd placed Conservatives most under Canadian FPTP of course given the NDP are still 6% behind the Conservatives but the Conservatives now only 2% behind the Liberals.

    It looks like Trudeau will scrape home as largest party but fail to get the majority he wanted

    We've discussed Germany at length and I don't disagree but the gap between the Union and SPD has closed and is closing. It's not inconceivable the SPD could top the poll for the first time since 2002.

    As for Canada, there's a lot going on under the figures I think. There would be a swing from Conservative to NDP as well on these numbers. The NDP were 18 points behind the Conservatives in 2019 - Counsel has the gap at seven so that's a 5.5% swing which is not inconsiderable.

    The question is how the votes will shape up in Ontario, Quebec and British Columbia. There's no point the Conservatives piling up votes in Alberta and Saskatchewan if they miss marginals in those other three provinces.
    Canadian Conservatives are weird. They manage to be rather wet and Trumpy at the same time.

    Meanwhile, you have a Woke idiot leading a Wokey centre-Left Blairite party, and then a radical Left Corbynite style party.

    Not exactly an inspiring choice.
    Who exactly are the radical Left Corbynites in Canada?
    And Trudeau resembles Cameron rather than Blair to me.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 62,921
    edited August 2021
    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    This is shocking and really needs the press to go to town on how Biden betrayed the UK, France, Germany and Nato allies

    And by the way explains why none of these countries expected the immediate collapse of Kabul

    Time for this forum to utterly condemn Biden
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited August 2021

    President Joe Biden told key allies in June that he would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan to ensure they could continue to operate in the capital following the main U.S. withdrawal, a vow made before the Taliban’s rapid final push across the country, according to a British diplomatic memo seen by Bloomberg.

    Biden promised U.K. Prime Minister Boris Johnson and other leaders at the Group of Seven summit in Cornwall, England, that “critical U.S. enablers” would remain in place to keep Kabul safe following the drawdown of NATO forces, the note said. British officials determined the U.S. would provide enough personnel to ensure that the U.K. embassy in Kabul could continue operating.


    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-08-20/biden-assured-allies-in-june-u-s-would-ensure-kabul-s-stability

    “Let’s bomb RustBelt!”


  • Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    Utter betrayal
  • A welcome reminder - in the face of considerable 'breakthrough infection' anxiety - that SARSCoV2 is transitioning into endemicicity. Those numbers are remarkable, even more so if we remind ourselves that fewer than 10% of people in the UK have no antibodies to SARSCoV2 yet......


    A friendly reminder that in England COVID-19 is still spreading mainly among immune naive people:

    ENGLAND cases in July:
    - 98.6% never previously infected
    - 78.1% were unvaccinated


    https://twitter.com/BallouxFrancois/status/1428803009711157257?s=20

    Seems like we just need to burn through the anti-vaxxers.

    There's going to be plenty of missing footballers this season.
    In a grim way, each day of 30,000 new cases is a ‘good’ thing, it’s 30,000 fewer who are still to get Covid or get jabbed. I believe this is part of the plan tbh. I note that the powers that be seem very relaxed about cases now, as they should be.
    No point trying to delay it either, better now than during winter.

    And given the reduction in symptomatic infection from vaccination the total number of infections each day is likely to be several times the reported number.
  • Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    This is shocking and really needs the press to go to town on how Biden betrayed the UK, France, Germany and Nato allies

    And by the way explains why none of these countries expected the immediate collapse of Kabul

    Time for this forum to utterly condemn Biden
    Its possible that Biden didn't know what he was promising or forgot afterwards.

    I wonder if Blinkin knew.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,989
    So, whose SPAD will have done the leaking I wonder?
  • kle4 said:

    So, whose SPAD will have done the leaking I wonder?

    Does it matter

    It is sensational and at the same time shocking
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,233

    Just watched Highlander for the first time.

    Very cheesy film but worth it for the Sean Connery cameo, and the Queen soundtrack - which is superb.


    Did they ever write a bad song?

    My friend would go into paroxysms of irritation whenever "Friends Will Be Friends" played, but I like it. I'm in the "no bad Queen song" camp.

    What I love about Highlander is that in a film about immortal Scottish clansmen, Sean Connery - who famously couldn't do any other accent to save himself - is for some reason playing a guy called Ramirez. In the Highlands. Of Scotland.
    It's hilarious. Particularly when he asks what haggis is, and then says it sounds revolting.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,890
    I’m trying to wean myself of the wanky ‘annoying the right people’ PB meme, but for old time’s sake, girfuy you impotent, voter repellant twerps.

    https://twitter.com/darrengrimes_/status/1428803503191994370?s=21
  • ChameleonChameleon Posts: 4,264
    edited August 2021
    WRT Afghanistan, the Northern Alliance/ANA (the difference is largely academic) seem to have regrouped in decent numbers in the Panjshir valley, and now are pushing out towards Bagram alongside some of the Tajik communities just north of Panjshir rebelling and now have linked up with the (A)NA, so about 1/3rd of Baglan now is under (A)NA control.

    There's videos from even the Pashtun areas of Afghanistan showing some pretty ballsy acts of rebellion.

    It seems like it'll largely come down to the Taliban's elite units (i.e. Badri-313, not the vast majority of their forces, who are composed of people who will go with whoever they think will win, and people unused to fighting more than a day away from home) against the Afghan commandos. Credit to Rashid Khan for painting the Afghan Govt. colours on his cheeks today.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,989

    kle4 said:

    So, whose SPAD will have done the leaking I wonder?

    Does it matter

    It is sensational and at the same time shocking
    It matters in the fine details, and regarding why it was done. Be it No.10, Raab or some random official of their own initiative, sure, it's out there, but the motivation is still interesting, as no all of the examples have the same one.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    I'm revising my DeSantis is going to be okay prediction. Scenes like this are jaw dropping.

    https://abcnews.go.com/Health/sick-covid-patients-lie-floor-antibody-treatment-site/story?id=79551329
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,146
    I think Queen are overrated and very much overplayed on the radio.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,613

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    Utter betrayal
    'The Administration cannot continue to defend the indefensible: Civilian citizens and our Afghan partners should always leave first—then the military. We cannot abruptly abandon the people who helped us over the past 20 years and leave them to face the Taliban alone.'

    https://twitter.com/MittRomney/status/1428360298109423627?s=20
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,233
    dixiedean said:

    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    In Germany if the Union are largest party it would likely still be a Union and SPD coalition with the Greens or FDP added on.

    In Canada, Liberal leakage to the 3rd placed NDP would benefit the 2nd placed Conservatives most under Canadian FPTP of course given the NDP are still 6% behind the Conservatives but the Conservatives now only 2% behind the Liberals.

    It looks like Trudeau will scrape home as largest party but fail to get the majority he wanted

    We've discussed Germany at length and I don't disagree but the gap between the Union and SPD has closed and is closing. It's not inconceivable the SPD could top the poll for the first time since 2002.

    As for Canada, there's a lot going on under the figures I think. There would be a swing from Conservative to NDP as well on these numbers. The NDP were 18 points behind the Conservatives in 2019 - Counsel has the gap at seven so that's a 5.5% swing which is not inconsiderable.

    The question is how the votes will shape up in Ontario, Quebec and British Columbia. There's no point the Conservatives piling up votes in Alberta and Saskatchewan if they miss marginals in those other three provinces.
    Canadian Conservatives are weird. They manage to be rather wet and Trumpy at the same time.

    Meanwhile, you have a Woke idiot leading a Wokey centre-Left Blairite party, and then a radical Left Corbynite style party.

    Not exactly an inspiring choice.
    Who exactly are the radical Left Corbynites in Canada?
    And Trudeau resembles Cameron rather than Blair to me.
    God, no, he's not Cameron. Not in the slightest. This is a guy who corrects people saying "mankind" to "peoplekind" and says stuff like "shecession". He's an embarrassing Woke millennial twat.

    More like a far younger Nick Clegg but with the politics of Chukka Umunna.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,613
    edited August 2021
    dixiedean said:

    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    In Germany if the Union are largest party it would likely still be a Union and SPD coalition with the Greens or FDP added on.

    In Canada, Liberal leakage to the 3rd placed NDP would benefit the 2nd placed Conservatives most under Canadian FPTP of course given the NDP are still 6% behind the Conservatives but the Conservatives now only 2% behind the Liberals.

    It looks like Trudeau will scrape home as largest party but fail to get the majority he wanted

    We've discussed Germany at length and I don't disagree but the gap between the Union and SPD has closed and is closing. It's not inconceivable the SPD could top the poll for the first time since 2002.

    As for Canada, there's a lot going on under the figures I think. There would be a swing from Conservative to NDP as well on these numbers. The NDP were 18 points behind the Conservatives in 2019 - Counsel has the gap at seven so that's a 5.5% swing which is not inconsiderable.

    The question is how the votes will shape up in Ontario, Quebec and British Columbia. There's no point the Conservatives piling up votes in Alberta and Saskatchewan if they miss marginals in those other three provinces.
    Canadian Conservatives are weird. They manage to be rather wet and Trumpy at the same time.

    Meanwhile, you have a Woke idiot leading a Wokey centre-Left Blairite party, and then a radical Left Corbynite style party.

    Not exactly an inspiring choice.
    Who exactly are the radical Left Corbynites in Canada?
    And Trudeau resembles Cameron rather than Blair to me.
    I assume they would be the NDP.

    Trudeau is a combination of Cameron, Clegg, Blair, JFK and Macron (and if rumours are to be believed Fidel Castro)
  • kle4 said:

    I had heard of The Secret Barrister and the Secret Magistrate, but I had no idea it was a whole genre now

    Why are there so many ‘secret’ books?...

    First there was the “Secret Barrister”, whose mysterious social media avatar of a robed bunny rabbit propelled him/her first to the heights of legal Twitter and then to a multi-book deal. Hot on his/her heels came lid-lifting memoirs from the “Secret Doctor”, “Secret Civil Servant”, “Secret Magistrate” et al; now the genre welcomes a volume from the “Secret Head Teacher” (out on 19 August)...

    Through history, signing your name to your testimony was what gave it credibility. Enthusiasts of rhetoric call this the “ethos” appeal: your audience knows who you are and can trust you – or not – based on your public standing.

    Now, the opposite seems to hold. We are in an environment where anonymity is not the token of the fink, the weasel, the confidential informer and the nark, but of the brave speaker of truth to power... The suggestion is there are some truths that can only be spoken under a cloak of anonymity.


    https://www.gq-magazine.co.uk/culture/article/secret-book-authors?utm_source=pocket-newtab-global-en-GB

    I did like The Secret Barrister and Fake Law, though Justice on Trial by Chris Daw was good and shows it doesn't need to be anonymous. Secret Magistrate sounds interesting.

    The Secret Footballer probably came first. A then-current Premier League player writing in the Guardian. Now up to five books.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Secret_Footballer
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,989
    I see Pakistan openers did an England in the cricket - top three out 1,1,0.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,613
    edited August 2021

    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    In Germany if the Union are largest party it would likely still be a Union and SPD coalition with the Greens or FDP added on.

    In Canada, Liberal leakage to the 3rd placed NDP would benefit the 2nd placed Conservatives most under Canadian FPTP of course given the NDP are still 6% behind the Conservatives but the Conservatives now only 2% behind the Liberals.

    It looks like Trudeau will scrape home as largest party but fail to get the majority he wanted

    We've discussed Germany at length and I don't disagree but the gap between the Union and SPD has closed and is closing. It's not inconceivable the SPD could top the poll for the first time since 2002.

    As for Canada, there's a lot going on under the figures I think. There would be a swing from Conservative to NDP as well on these numbers. The NDP were 18 points behind the Conservatives in 2019 - Counsel has the gap at seven so that's a 5.5% swing which is not inconsiderable.

    The question is how the votes will shape up in Ontario, Quebec and British Columbia. There's no point the Conservatives piling up votes in Alberta and Saskatchewan if they miss marginals in those other three provinces.
    Canadian Conservatives are weird. They manage to be rather wet and Trumpy at the same time.

    Meanwhile, you have a Woke idiot leading a Wokey centre-Left Blairite party, and then a radical Left Corbynite style party.

    Not exactly an inspiring choice.
    That is because the current Canadian Conservative Party is a product of the 2003 merger between the wet Progressive Conservatives, based in Quebec and the Atlantic states and metropolitan Ontario and the UKIP like Canadian Alliance based in more rural Ontario and the West
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,233
    On Britain being able to "hold the line" by itself - no-one would love that to be true more than myself, but we couldn't hold just half of one province - Helmand - with 10,000 troops before the 2010 SDSR and the large cuts that subsequently befell the army.

    As @Sean_F said I think you'd be looking at 1947 as the last time we could have pulled off an operation like that in that part of the world solo, and we didn't exactly have a stellar record in Afghanistan even before then.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,233
    HYUFD said:

    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    In Germany if the Union are largest party it would likely still be a Union and SPD coalition with the Greens or FDP added on.

    In Canada, Liberal leakage to the 3rd placed NDP would benefit the 2nd placed Conservatives most under Canadian FPTP of course given the NDP are still 6% behind the Conservatives but the Conservatives now only 2% behind the Liberals.

    It looks like Trudeau will scrape home as largest party but fail to get the majority he wanted

    We've discussed Germany at length and I don't disagree but the gap between the Union and SPD has closed and is closing. It's not inconceivable the SPD could top the poll for the first time since 2002.

    As for Canada, there's a lot going on under the figures I think. There would be a swing from Conservative to NDP as well on these numbers. The NDP were 18 points behind the Conservatives in 2019 - Counsel has the gap at seven so that's a 5.5% swing which is not inconsiderable.

    The question is how the votes will shape up in Ontario, Quebec and British Columbia. There's no point the Conservatives piling up votes in Alberta and Saskatchewan if they miss marginals in those other three provinces.
    Canadian Conservatives are weird. They manage to be rather wet and Trumpy at the same time.

    Meanwhile, you have a Woke idiot leading a Wokey centre-Left Blairite party, and then a radical Left Corbynite style party.

    Not exactly an inspiring choice.
    That is because the current Canadian Conservative Party is a product of the 2003 merger between the wet Progressive Conservatives, based in Quebec and the Atlantic states and the UKIP like Canadian Alliance based in Ontario and the West
    Yes, I think there's a lot of truth in that.
  • DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    What have we done. I feel for the soldiers here. Lions led by Protozoa


    “Help! Taliban is coming. Taliban is coming.”

    Young Afghan woman outside a gate at #Kabul airport pleading for U.S. soldiers to let her, and other civilians, in.’

    https://twitter.com/frudbezhan/status/1428032250239668226?s=21

    The point must be coming when Biden rows back on leaving in his time scale

    Will be interesting what he says shortly
    There shouldn’t even be a bloody stupid time scale. Biden should have ripped up Trump’s moronic agreement, slowly started moving people out, kept bagram open just in case, put in MORE troops to aid a slow, thorough withdrawal. And right at the end you sabotage all weapons if you do have to get everyone out. Meanwhile start arming potential taliban adversaries

    And, also, fuck Pakistan. Frankly. This country is no friend of the West.
    I cannot understand why Pakistan has not been put under more pressure by the West. They have been arming the Taliban and giving them sanctuary. The Taliban don't have munitions factories. One has to assume they have got their weapons and materiel from Pakistan.
    I don’t get it either
    Pakistan is a nation founded expressly as an Islamic state and is nuclear capable.

    Do you feel lucky?
    We are not obliged to give them aid, or allow migration therefrom, for starters. It’s a hostile power
    Exactly what I said the other day. They are not our friends.
    They invented the "Taliban" and researched the name to find the best one.....
    Yeah but in collaboration with the CIA because the mujahideen were fighting the Soviets. And of course, in the cold war, Pakistan was closer to us whereas India was seen as pro-Soviet.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    Covid seems to be going very hard after the anti vaxx people. Weird.
  • kle4 said:

    kle4 said:

    So, whose SPAD will have done the leaking I wonder?

    Does it matter

    It is sensational and at the same time shocking
    It matters in the fine details, and regarding why it was done. Be it No.10, Raab or some random official of their own initiative, sure, it's out there, but the motivation is still interesting, as no all of the examples have the same one.
    And, even assuming that something like this is true (which is pretty likely), leaking stuff like this isn't what Special Allies Do For Special Allies.
  • ChameleonChameleon Posts: 4,264

    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    What have we done. I feel for the soldiers here. Lions led by Protozoa


    “Help! Taliban is coming. Taliban is coming.”

    Young Afghan woman outside a gate at #Kabul airport pleading for U.S. soldiers to let her, and other civilians, in.’

    https://twitter.com/frudbezhan/status/1428032250239668226?s=21

    The point must be coming when Biden rows back on leaving in his time scale

    Will be interesting what he says shortly
    There shouldn’t even be a bloody stupid time scale. Biden should have ripped up Trump’s moronic agreement, slowly started moving people out, kept bagram open just in case, put in MORE troops to aid a slow, thorough withdrawal. And right at the end you sabotage all weapons if you do have to get everyone out. Meanwhile start arming potential taliban adversaries

    And, also, fuck Pakistan. Frankly. This country is no friend of the West.
    I cannot understand why Pakistan has not been put under more pressure by the West. They have been arming the Taliban and giving them sanctuary. The Taliban don't have munitions factories. One has to assume they have got their weapons and materiel from Pakistan.
    I don’t get it either
    Pakistan is a nation founded expressly as an Islamic state and is nuclear capable.

    Do you feel lucky?
    We are not obliged to give them aid, or allow migration therefrom, for starters. It’s a hostile power
    Exactly what I said the other day. They are not our friends.
    They invented the "Taliban" and researched the name to find the best one.....
    Yeah but in collaboration with the CIA because the mujahideen were fighting the Soviets. And of course, in the cold war, Pakistan was closer to us whereas India was seen as pro-Soviet.
    That's a pretty bad history meme tbf. When the Mujahideen were fighting the soviets the pre-cursors to the Taliban were cowering over the border in Pakistan getting indoctrinated.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,727

    Omnium said:

    justin124 said:

    Fishing said:

    Jim Callaghan - the classic "in office but not in power" PM, at any rate before John Major and TM.

    Still at least he paved the way for Margaret Thatcher. Although I still remember the candles my parents kept for several years afterwards in case the Winter of Discontent was repeated.

    I do not recall candles being needed during the Winter of Discontent - the miners, electricity power workers etc were not involved in the industrial chaos which then engulfed the country. Power cuts and the associated need for candles belonged to the 3-Day Week of the 1973/74 Winter - and before that the first Miners Strike in early 1972.In the Winter of 1970/71 there had also been power cuts when Frank Chappell's power workers took industrial action. All of that happened under Ted Heath's Government - not Callaghan.
    Candles. I still recall the smell of burnt hair if you leant too close.

    Power cuts were always caused by Labour and the Unions. Trash on the streets was always caused by Labour and the Unions. Nothing good has ever come from Labour and the Unions.
    I have voted Tory for most of my adult life, but to state "Nothing good has ever come from Labour and the Unions" suggests you are either so far right you should be wearing jackboots, or you are ignorant of history or perhaps both.
    You may have a small point :)
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    This is shocking and really needs the press to go to town on how Biden betrayed the UK, France, Germany and Nato allies

    And by the way explains why none of these countries expected the immediate collapse of Kabul

    Time for this forum to utterly condemn Biden
    “But, but…he’s not Trump!!!”

    I told this forum last year that Biden would be an absolute disaster and, while Trump had huge faults, given the world where we are, he was the better choice in a two horse race.

    I hope you Biden Fanboys are happy tonight.
  • ChameleonChameleon Posts: 4,264

    kle4 said:

    I had heard of The Secret Barrister and the Secret Magistrate, but I had no idea it was a whole genre now

    Why are there so many ‘secret’ books?...

    First there was the “Secret Barrister”, whose mysterious social media avatar of a robed bunny rabbit propelled him/her first to the heights of legal Twitter and then to a multi-book deal. Hot on his/her heels came lid-lifting memoirs from the “Secret Doctor”, “Secret Civil Servant”, “Secret Magistrate” et al; now the genre welcomes a volume from the “Secret Head Teacher” (out on 19 August)...

    Through history, signing your name to your testimony was what gave it credibility. Enthusiasts of rhetoric call this the “ethos” appeal: your audience knows who you are and can trust you – or not – based on your public standing.

    Now, the opposite seems to hold. We are in an environment where anonymity is not the token of the fink, the weasel, the confidential informer and the nark, but of the brave speaker of truth to power... The suggestion is there are some truths that can only be spoken under a cloak of anonymity.


    https://www.gq-magazine.co.uk/culture/article/secret-book-authors?utm_source=pocket-newtab-global-en-GB

    I did like The Secret Barrister and Fake Law, though Justice on Trial by Chris Daw was good and shows it doesn't need to be anonymous. Secret Magistrate sounds interesting.

    The Secret Footballer probably came first. A then-current Premier League player writing in the Guardian. Now up to five books.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Secret_Footballer
    As a Reading fan having Dave Kitson reveal all the going-ons that took us from the brink of Europe to relegation in a season was eye-opening. Which reveals the big issue with the 'secret' genre, all the juicy gossip is rarely best devoured anonymised.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,752
    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    He's a useless fucker so he is.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,989

    kle4 said:

    kle4 said:

    So, whose SPAD will have done the leaking I wonder?

    Does it matter

    It is sensational and at the same time shocking
    It matters in the fine details, and regarding why it was done. Be it No.10, Raab or some random official of their own initiative, sure, it's out there, but the motivation is still interesting, as no all of the examples have the same one.
    And, even assuming that something like this is true (which is pretty likely), leaking stuff like this isn't what Special Allies Do For Special Allies.
    Which ties into the motivation angle of course. I'd presume the Americans will be a bit cheesed off, and was this a deliberate UK leak to tell them we are cheesed off too, was it a personal move by someone to defflect from their own issues, or was it an angry official doing what they felt right etc.
  • NorthofStokeNorthofStoke Posts: 1,758
    Biden will resign or be removed on medical grounds soon I suspect.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,290
    DougSeal said:

    Covid seems to be going very hard after the anti vaxx people. Weird.

    I’d guess there are many reasons why someone might be anti-vax or specifically anti Covid-vax but if they were hoping to use the vaccinated sheep as their shield they’ve got it badly wrong. The ones who think they will just shrug it off might get a shock...
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207

    Biden will resign or be removed on medical grounds soon I suspect.

    He should never have been President and neither should Trump.

    What a shit show
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578
    DavidL said:

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    He's a useless fucker so he is.
    Sorry David, you wanted Biden, you and your ilk own it
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,989
    MrEd said:

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    This is shocking and really needs the press to go to town on how Biden betrayed the UK, France, Germany and Nato allies

    And by the way explains why none of these countries expected the immediate collapse of Kabul

    Time for this forum to utterly condemn Biden
    “But, but…he’s not Trump!!!”

    I told this forum last year that Biden would be an absolute disaster and, while Trump had huge faults, given the world where we are, he was the better choice in a two horse race.

    I hope you Biden Fanboys are happy tonight.
    I don't know why you seem to think the only option in disagreement to you is Biden fanboy. Biden or Trump fanboy are not the only option, nor even that they must be equal in horribleness.

    Since you took the view that Biden had huge faults but you consider he was the better choice in a two horse race, and presumably still do despite Jan 6th and all the rest, why is it unreasonable someone might look at recent events and still decide Biden was the better choice, particular with the information at that time?

    Can people not undertake the same process of weughing things up as you have, reach a different conclusion, and not be a fanboy?
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    MrEd said:

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    This is shocking and really needs the press to go to town on how Biden betrayed the UK, France, Germany and Nato allies

    And by the way explains why none of these countries expected the immediate collapse of Kabul

    Time for this forum to utterly condemn Biden
    “But, but…he’s not Trump!!!”

    I told this forum last year that Biden would be an absolute disaster and, while Trump had huge faults, given the world where we are, he was the better choice in a two horse race.

    I hope you Biden Fanboys are happy tonight.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/08/20/biden-always-unfit-president-left-wing-media-cheerleaders-didnt2/
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578

    Biden will resign or be removed on medical grounds soon I suspect.

    Removed.

    Why do you think Pelosi mentioned this last year?

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/pelosi-unveils-25th-amendment-bid-questions-trumps-fitness-donald-trump-congress-washington-president-white-house-b913095.html?amp

    I think there is a question to be asked here whether Pelosi et al were preparing the ground here for Biden to be removed at some point

  • kle4 said:

    kle4 said:

    So, whose SPAD will have done the leaking I wonder?

    Does it matter

    It is sensational and at the same time shocking
    It matters in the fine details, and regarding why it was done. Be it No.10, Raab or some random official of their own initiative, sure, it's out there, but the motivation is still interesting, as no all of the examples have the same one.
    And, even assuming that something like this is true (which is pretty likely), leaking stuff like this isn't what Special Allies Do For Special Allies.
    Are you suggesting that this should have been concealed from public knowledge when Biden has clearly betrayed his allies
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,737

    Biden will resign or be removed on medical grounds soon I suspect.

    Off for his retirement with his own ice cream machine and a variety of children’s wigs to sniff before his nap.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,444

    Biden will resign or be removed on medical grounds soon I suspect.

    I said this might happen a few days ago.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,379
    HYUFD said:

    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    In Germany if the Union are largest party it would likely still be a Union and SPD coalition with the Greens or FDP added on.

    In Canada, Liberal leakage to the 3rd placed NDP would benefit the 2nd placed Conservatives most under Canadian FPTP of course given the NDP are still 6% behind the Conservatives but the Conservatives now only 2% behind the Liberals.

    It looks like Trudeau will scrape home as largest party but fail to get the majority he wanted

    We've discussed Germany at length and I don't disagree but the gap between the Union and SPD has closed and is closing. It's not inconceivable the SPD could top the poll for the first time since 2002.

    As for Canada, there's a lot going on under the figures I think. There would be a swing from Conservative to NDP as well on these numbers. The NDP were 18 points behind the Conservatives in 2019 - Counsel has the gap at seven so that's a 5.5% swing which is not inconsiderable.

    The question is how the votes will shape up in Ontario, Quebec and British Columbia. There's no point the Conservatives piling up votes in Alberta and Saskatchewan if they miss marginals in those other three provinces.
    Canadian Conservatives are weird. They manage to be rather wet and Trumpy at the same time.

    Meanwhile, you have a Woke idiot leading a Wokey centre-Left Blairite party, and then a radical Left Corbynite style party.

    Not exactly an inspiring choice.
    That is because the current Canadian Conservative Party is a product of the 2003 merger between the wet Progressive Conservatives, based in Quebec and the Atlantic states and metropolitan Ontario and the UKIP like Canadian Alliance based in more rural Ontario and the West
    Which tension will likely keep them out of power for four more years.
  • MrEd said:

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    This is shocking and really needs the press to go to town on how Biden betrayed the UK, France, Germany and Nato allies

    And by the way explains why none of these countries expected the immediate collapse of Kabul

    Time for this forum to utterly condemn Biden
    “But, but…he’s not Trump!!!”

    I told this forum last year that Biden would be an absolute disaster and, while Trump had huge faults, given the world where we are, he was the better choice in a two horse race.

    I hope you Biden Fanboys are happy tonight.
    I have not been a fanboy of Biden or Trump but Biden carries the can for this
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    https://twitter.com/AndrewDesiderio/status/1428796629872746501

    NEW: Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin in a briefing call with House lawmakers just now said Americans have been beaten by the Taliban in Kabul, according to multiple people on the call. Austin called it “unacceptable.”
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,566
    MrEd said:

    DavidL said:

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    He's a useless fucker so he is.
    Sorry David, you wanted Biden, you and your ilk own it
    Yes, I wanted Biden. Proud to say so.

    Because Trump winning a 2nd term would have been either the end of american democracy or a civil war or succession of several states.

    As was proved by his attempts to run a coup and claim he won the election.

  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,727
    edited August 2021
    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    justin124 said:

    Fishing said:

    Jim Callaghan - the classic "in office but not in power" PM, at any rate before John Major and TM.

    Still at least he paved the way for Margaret Thatcher. Although I still remember the candles my parents kept for several years afterwards in case the Winter of Discontent was repeated.

    I do not recall candles being needed during the Winter of Discontent - the miners, electricity power workers etc were not involved in the industrial chaos which then engulfed the country. Power cuts and the associated need for candles belonged to the 3-Day Week of the 1973/74 Winter - and before that the first Miners Strike in early 1972.In the Winter of 1970/71 there had also been power cuts when Frank Chappell's power workers took industrial action. All of that happened under Ted Heath's Government - not Callaghan.
    Candles. I still recall the smell of burnt hair if you leant too close.

    Power cuts were always caused by Labour and the Unions. Trash on the streets was always caused by Labour and the Unions. Nothing good has ever come from Labour and the Unions.
    I have voted Tory for most of my adult life, but to state "Nothing good has ever come from Labour and the Unions" suggests you are either so far right you should be wearing jackboots, or you are ignorant of history or perhaps both.
    You may have a small point :)
    And so what I should have said is 'since 1918'.

    I'm depressed to think that you regard anyone that disagrees with you as wearing jackboots. That suggests to me that you're biased in all sorts of bad ways. However I am most certainly ignorant as to much of history. You will be too.

    I do not know of a single good thing that Labour or the Unions have done since 1918.

    @Nigel_Foremain
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207

    MrEd said:

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    This is shocking and really needs the press to go to town on how Biden betrayed the UK, France, Germany and Nato allies

    And by the way explains why none of these countries expected the immediate collapse of Kabul

    Time for this forum to utterly condemn Biden
    “But, but…he’s not Trump!!!”

    I told this forum last year that Biden would be an absolute disaster and, while Trump had huge faults, given the world where we are, he was the better choice in a two horse race.

    I hope you Biden Fanboys are happy tonight.
    I have not been a fanboy of Biden or Trump but Biden carries the can for this
    Oh he does indeed
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,379

    dixiedean said:

    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    In Germany if the Union are largest party it would likely still be a Union and SPD coalition with the Greens or FDP added on.

    In Canada, Liberal leakage to the 3rd placed NDP would benefit the 2nd placed Conservatives most under Canadian FPTP of course given the NDP are still 6% behind the Conservatives but the Conservatives now only 2% behind the Liberals.

    It looks like Trudeau will scrape home as largest party but fail to get the majority he wanted

    We've discussed Germany at length and I don't disagree but the gap between the Union and SPD has closed and is closing. It's not inconceivable the SPD could top the poll for the first time since 2002.

    As for Canada, there's a lot going on under the figures I think. There would be a swing from Conservative to NDP as well on these numbers. The NDP were 18 points behind the Conservatives in 2019 - Counsel has the gap at seven so that's a 5.5% swing which is not inconsiderable.

    The question is how the votes will shape up in Ontario, Quebec and British Columbia. There's no point the Conservatives piling up votes in Alberta and Saskatchewan if they miss marginals in those other three provinces.
    Canadian Conservatives are weird. They manage to be rather wet and Trumpy at the same time.

    Meanwhile, you have a Woke idiot leading a Wokey centre-Left Blairite party, and then a radical Left Corbynite style party.

    Not exactly an inspiring choice.
    Who exactly are the radical Left Corbynites in Canada?
    And Trudeau resembles Cameron rather than Blair to me.
    God, no, he's not Cameron. Not in the slightest. This is a guy who corrects people saying "mankind" to "peoplekind" and says stuff like "shecession". He's an embarrassing Woke millennial twat.

    More like a far younger Nick Clegg but with the politics of Chukka Umunna.
    He puts a smiley, shiny face on the economic status quo. Which sometimes takes on a darker hue.
  • YBarddCwscYBarddCwsc Posts: 7,172

    Biden was pretty ineffectual at the height of his powers, about 20 years ago.

    He was a reasonable Veep. He should have left it there.

    But, he always wanted to be President.

    He now has unmistakable signs of early stage dementia.

    Poor old Joe Biden.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,351
    edited August 2021

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    This is shocking and really needs the press to go to town on how Biden betrayed the UK, France, Germany and Nato allies

    And by the way explains why none of these countries expected the immediate collapse of Kabul

    Time for this forum to utterly condemn Biden
    The misjudgement here is on the part of the allies as much as the US. Why keep a large embassy and support a large number of civilians in the face of an inevitable taliban victory? The deal between the taliban and the US had already been done. Its like people were all sunbathing on a gradually sinking ship, in denial of reality. The impression is of complete chaos everywhere.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    edited August 2021
    Andy_JS said:

    Biden will resign or be removed on medical grounds soon I suspect.

    I said this might happen a few days ago.
    I said he was unfit a while back ... and got told (by notables on here ) he was fine .....

    Still think that people?
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,835
    edited August 2021

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    This is shocking and really needs the press to go to town on how Biden betrayed the UK, France, Germany and Nato allies

    And by the way explains why none of these countries expected the immediate collapse of Kabul

    Time for this forum to utterly condemn Biden
    A wake up call to European leaders to look to their own defences and re-arm.

    Will they? Probably not.

    Britain certainly won't. Any limited funds the Treasury can muster will all be earmarked for paying heftier bribes to the elderly.
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578

    MrEd said:

    DavidL said:

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    He's a useless fucker so he is.
    Sorry David, you wanted Biden, you and your ilk own it
    Yes, I wanted Biden. Proud to say so.

    Because Trump winning a 2nd term would have been either the end of american democracy or a civil war or succession of several states.

    As was proved by his attempts to run a coup and claim he won the election.

    If Trump was running a coup, he did a piss poor imitation of one. My dog could have done better.

    And if you think the Democrats won’t try to subvert the democratic process to keep themselves in control, I have a bridge to sell you.

    I’ll throw a black / grey swan out there for 2022, namely the mid-terms will be delayed or (maybe more likely) there will be federal intervention that allows blanket voting without ID , plus the allowance of mass postal ballots. Covid will be cited as the reason but the real cause will be that Biden and the Democrats will be scared shitless of getting crushed.
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,737
    Floater said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Biden will resign or be removed on medical grounds soon I suspect.

    I said this might happen a few days ago.
    I said he was unfit a while back ... and got told (by notables on here ) he was fine .....

    Still think that people?
    At what point does Barack take his old friend for a walk and tell him the game is up? Not while there’s chaos at Kabul airport obvs. But they’ll want him out safely before the mid terms surely.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,613

    Biden will resign or be removed on medical grounds soon I suspect.

    Harris would be even worse
  • darkage said:

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    This is shocking and really needs the press to go to town on how Biden betrayed the UK, France, Germany and Nato allies

    And by the way explains why none of these countries expected the immediate collapse of Kabul

    Time for this forum to utterly condemn Biden
    The misjudgement here is on the part of the allies as much as the US. Why keep a large embassy and support a large number of civilian works in the face of an inevitable taliban victory? The deal between the taliban and the US had already been done. Its like people were all sunbathing on a gradually sinking ship, in denial of reality. The impression is of complete chaos everywhere.
    The allies were promised by Biden that security would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew so much that the UK thought it could maintain its embassy

    In all my 77 years I have never thought the US would so betray the UK and Nato, and the shock across the allies must be palpable
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,566
    Andy_JS said:

    Biden will resign or be removed on medical grounds soon I suspect.

    I said this might happen a few days ago.
    I don't think so.

    We will see in a few days.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,989
    edited August 2021

    kle4 said:

    kle4 said:

    So, whose SPAD will have done the leaking I wonder?

    Does it matter

    It is sensational and at the same time shocking
    It matters in the fine details, and regarding why it was done. Be it No.10, Raab or some random official of their own initiative, sure, it's out there, but the motivation is still interesting, as no all of the examples have the same one.
    And, even assuming that something like this is true (which is pretty likely), leaking stuff like this isn't what Special Allies Do For Special Allies.
    Are you suggesting that this should have been concealed from public knowledge when Biden has clearly betrayed his allies
    That seems a curious way of looking at it to me. Most diplomatic and top level governmental information is concealed from public knowledge as a matter of course, particularly the former I'd assume. I'd imagine there are innumerable tales of allies letting each other down or betraying each other in some way which only came to light decades later, in the interests of getting along. Most of the time there's probably little to be gained from exposing the nitty gritty of how international cooperation works, what the internal analysis of one thinks about the other or has been told by the other.

    So it's not really a matter of should it have been made public, particularly in this way (rather than, perhaps, 'briefings' from 'unnamed sources' in government), but what the reaction to it on both sides will be, hence the why being interesting.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    moonshine said:

    Floater said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Biden will resign or be removed on medical grounds soon I suspect.

    I said this might happen a few days ago.
    I said he was unfit a while back ... and got told (by notables on here ) he was fine .....

    Still think that people?
    At what point does Barack take his old friend for a walk and tell him the game is up? Not while there’s chaos at Kabul airport obvs. But they’ll want him out safely before the mid terms surely.
    When people talk about him running next time ..... come on, very little chance
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,566
    MrEd said:

    MrEd said:

    DavidL said:

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    He's a useless fucker so he is.
    Sorry David, you wanted Biden, you and your ilk own it
    Yes, I wanted Biden. Proud to say so.

    Because Trump winning a 2nd term would have been either the end of american democracy or a civil war or succession of several states.

    As was proved by his attempts to run a coup and claim he won the election.

    If Trump was running a coup, he did a piss poor imitation of one. My dog could have done better.

    And if you think the Democrats won’t try to subvert the democratic process to keep themselves in control, I have a bridge to sell you.

    I’ll throw a black / grey swan out there for 2022, namely the mid-terms will be delayed or (maybe more likely) there will be federal intervention that allows blanket voting without ID , plus the allowance of mass postal ballots. Covid will be cited as the reason but the real cause will be that Biden and the Democrats will be scared shitless of getting crushed.
    What's wrong with postal ballots? UK uses them more and more each year.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,518
    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    In Germany if the Union are largest party it would likely still be a Union and SPD coalition with the Greens or FDP added on.

    In Canada, Liberal leakage to the 3rd placed NDP would benefit the 2nd placed Conservatives most under Canadian FPTP of course given the NDP are still 6% behind the Conservatives but the Conservatives now only 2% behind the Liberals.

    It looks like Trudeau will scrape home as largest party but fail to get the majority he wanted

    We've discussed Germany at length and I don't disagree but the gap between the Union and SPD has closed and is closing. It's not inconceivable the SPD could top the poll for the first time since 2002.

    As for Canada, there's a lot going on under the figures I think. There would be a swing from Conservative to NDP as well on these numbers. The NDP were 18 points behind the Conservatives in 2019 - Counsel has the gap at seven so that's a 5.5% swing which is not inconsiderable.

    The question is how the votes will shape up in Ontario, Quebec and British Columbia. There's no point the Conservatives piling up votes in Alberta and Saskatchewan if they miss marginals in those other three provinces.
    Canadian Conservatives are weird. They manage to be rather wet and Trumpy at the same time.

    Meanwhile, you have a Woke idiot leading a Wokey centre-Left Blairite party, and then a radical Left Corbynite style party.

    Not exactly an inspiring choice.
    Who exactly are the radical Left Corbynites in Canada?
    And Trudeau resembles Cameron rather than Blair to me.
    I assume they would be the NDP.

    Trudeau is a combination of Cameron, Clegg, Blair, JFK and Macron (and if rumours are to be believed Fidel Castro)
    I know very little about Canada, but left-wing friends tell me the NDP is at the social democrat/centrist end of the spectrum, and not proper socialists at all. These things tend to be in the eye of the beholder, but what are their key policies?
  • HYUFD said:

    Biden will resign or be removed on medical grounds soon I suspect.

    Harris would be even worse
    Nobody could be worse than what Biden has done to his allies over Afghanistan
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    edited August 2021
    MrEd said:

    DavidL said:

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    He's a useless fucker so he is.
    Sorry David, you wanted Biden, you and your ilk own it
    You're like @contrarian who is forever trying to get a "They laughed then/they're not laughing now" narrative off the ground and failing catastrophically. I can promise you, we are still laughing at you so hard we are in danger of fouling ourselves.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,233
    edited August 2021

    MrEd said:

    MrEd said:

    DavidL said:

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    He's a useless fucker so he is.
    Sorry David, you wanted Biden, you and your ilk own it
    Yes, I wanted Biden. Proud to say so.

    Because Trump winning a 2nd term would have been either the end of american democracy or a civil war or succession of several states.

    As was proved by his attempts to run a coup and claim he won the election.

    If Trump was running a coup, he did a piss poor imitation of one. My dog could have done better.

    And if you think the Democrats won’t try to subvert the democratic process to keep themselves in control, I have a bridge to sell you.

    I’ll throw a black / grey swan out there for 2022, namely the mid-terms will be delayed or (maybe more likely) there will be federal intervention that allows blanket voting without ID , plus the allowance of mass postal ballots. Covid will be cited as the reason but the real cause will be that Biden and the Democrats will be scared shitless of getting crushed.
    What's wrong with postal ballots? UK uses them more and more each year.
    It provides the wrong sort of voter a means of voting without standing in a queue without water for 14 hours on election day..

    Which is the GOP's preferred voting method for none supporting areas...
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146

    Just watched Highlander for the first time.

    Very cheesy film but worth it for the Sean Connery cameo, and the Queen soundtrack - which is superb.

    Did they ever write a bad song?

    Yes.

    Every great songwriter has written lots of poor material.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,989

    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    In Germany if the Union are largest party it would likely still be a Union and SPD coalition with the Greens or FDP added on.

    In Canada, Liberal leakage to the 3rd placed NDP would benefit the 2nd placed Conservatives most under Canadian FPTP of course given the NDP are still 6% behind the Conservatives but the Conservatives now only 2% behind the Liberals.

    It looks like Trudeau will scrape home as largest party but fail to get the majority he wanted

    We've discussed Germany at length and I don't disagree but the gap between the Union and SPD has closed and is closing. It's not inconceivable the SPD could top the poll for the first time since 2002.

    As for Canada, there's a lot going on under the figures I think. There would be a swing from Conservative to NDP as well on these numbers. The NDP were 18 points behind the Conservatives in 2019 - Counsel has the gap at seven so that's a 5.5% swing which is not inconsiderable.

    The question is how the votes will shape up in Ontario, Quebec and British Columbia. There's no point the Conservatives piling up votes in Alberta and Saskatchewan if they miss marginals in those other three provinces.
    Canadian Conservatives are weird. They manage to be rather wet and Trumpy at the same time.

    Meanwhile, you have a Woke idiot leading a Wokey centre-Left Blairite party, and then a radical Left Corbynite style party.

    Not exactly an inspiring choice.
    Who exactly are the radical Left Corbynites in Canada?
    And Trudeau resembles Cameron rather than Blair to me.
    I assume they would be the NDP.

    Trudeau is a combination of Cameron, Clegg, Blair, JFK and Macron (and if rumours are to be believed Fidel Castro)
    I know very little about Canada, but left-wing friends tell me the NDP is at the social democrat/centrist end of the spectrum, and not proper socialists at all.
    This is actually one reason I also get wary of people being too gung ho about supporting or opposing political parties in other countries (though we hear so much about the american ones it is too tempting to resist much of the time). Conservative or socialist parties of one country don't necessarily align that well with their counterparts in another country, even if they have some kind of formal interactions assuming they align. It's just far too easy to assume similarities, and while some basic assumptions might work, it cannot be taken too far.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Just watched Highlander for the first time.

    Very cheesy film but worth it for the Sean Connery cameo, and the Queen soundtrack - which is superb.

    Did they ever write a bad song?

    Yes.

    Every great songwriter has written lots of poor material.
    Dylan?
  • QuincelQuincel Posts: 4,042
    edited August 2021
    MrEd said:

    MrEd said:

    DavidL said:

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    He's a useless fucker so he is.
    Sorry David, you wanted Biden, you and your ilk own it
    Yes, I wanted Biden. Proud to say so.

    Because Trump winning a 2nd term would have been either the end of american democracy or a civil war or succession of several states.

    As was proved by his attempts to run a coup and claim he won the election.

    If Trump was running a coup, he did a piss poor imitation of one. My dog could have done better.

    And if you think the Democrats won’t try to subvert the democratic process to keep themselves in control, I have a bridge to sell you.

    I’ll throw a black / grey swan out there for 2022, namely the mid-terms will be delayed or (maybe more likely) there will be federal intervention that allows blanket voting without ID , plus the allowance of mass postal ballots. Covid will be cited as the reason but the real cause will be that Biden and the Democrats will be scared shitless of getting crushed.
    How much do you want to bet that the mid terms will not be delayed and nor will a federal law be passed allowing voting without ID in all states? Because I think this is almost impossible to happen. Either would require GOP support in the Senate to break the filibuster and that ain't happening.
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578

    MrEd said:

    MrEd said:

    DavidL said:

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    He's a useless fucker so he is.
    Sorry David, you wanted Biden, you and your ilk own it
    Yes, I wanted Biden. Proud to say so.

    Because Trump winning a 2nd term would have been either the end of american democracy or a civil war or succession of several states.

    As was proved by his attempts to run a coup and claim he won the election.

    If Trump was running a coup, he did a piss poor imitation of one. My dog could have done better.

    And if you think the Democrats won’t try to subvert the democratic process to keep themselves in control, I have a bridge to sell you.

    I’ll throw a black / grey swan out there for 2022, namely the mid-terms will be delayed or (maybe more likely) there will be federal intervention that allows blanket voting without ID , plus the allowance of mass postal ballots. Covid will be cited as the reason but the real cause will be that Biden and the Democrats will be scared shitless of getting crushed.
    What's wrong with postal ballots? UK uses them more and more each year.
    Because in the US, the potential for fraud is much higher. The U.K. has very tight rules - sometimes violated but generally kept in place - about what you can do with postal ballots. In the States, as happens in eg California, you get activists collecting ballots. Jeez, I wonder what happens there?
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    HYUFD said:

    Biden will resign or be removed on medical grounds soon I suspect.

    Harris would be even worse
    Yep, quite the shit show ....
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,989
    edited August 2021

    MrEd said:

    MrEd said:

    DavidL said:

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    He's a useless fucker so he is.
    Sorry David, you wanted Biden, you and your ilk own it
    Yes, I wanted Biden. Proud to say so.

    Because Trump winning a 2nd term would have been either the end of american democracy or a civil war or succession of several states.

    As was proved by his attempts to run a coup and claim he won the election.

    If Trump was running a coup, he did a piss poor imitation of one. My dog could have done better.

    And if you think the Democrats won’t try to subvert the democratic process to keep themselves in control, I have a bridge to sell you.

    I’ll throw a black / grey swan out there for 2022, namely the mid-terms will be delayed or (maybe more likely) there will be federal intervention that allows blanket voting without ID , plus the allowance of mass postal ballots. Covid will be cited as the reason but the real cause will be that Biden and the Democrats will be scared shitless of getting crushed.
    What's wrong with postal ballots? UK uses them more and more each year.
    The american rule of accepting ones that come in so long as they were posted on election day is pretty annoying for those of us who want the counts done quicker, but it was a rule (at least in some states I think) and could hardly be challenged halfway throught the process.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,989
    pigeon said:

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    This is shocking and really needs the press to go to town on how Biden betrayed the UK, France, Germany and Nato allies

    And by the way explains why none of these countries expected the immediate collapse of Kabul

    Time for this forum to utterly condemn Biden
    A wake up call to European leaders to look to their own defences and re-arm.

    Will they? Probably not.

    Britain certainly won't. Any limited funds the Treasury can muster will all be earmarked for paying heftier bribes to the elderly.
    Don't be so glum, some middled aged red wallers might get some too.
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578
    Floater said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Biden will resign or be removed on medical grounds soon I suspect.

    I said this might happen a few days ago.
    I said he was unfit a while back ... and got told (by notables on here ) he was fine .....

    Still think that people?
    I don’t, but I said that in 2020
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,989
    DavidL said:

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    He's a useless fucker so he is.
    That level of concision must serve you well in court.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,444
    HYUFD said:

    Biden will resign or be removed on medical grounds soon I suspect.

    Harris would be even worse
    We don't really know what she would be like, she's a bit of an unknown quantity.
  • TresTres Posts: 2,689
    MrEd said:

    MrEd said:

    DavidL said:

    Chameleon said:

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1428805059870068740
    https://twitter.com/AlbertoNardelli/status/1428804909449846797

    Huge story… leaked memo shows Biden promised Boris Johnson and G7 leaders in June that the US would maintain enough of a security presence in Afghanistan that they would keep Kabul safe — then failed to keep that commitment


    NEW: Biden assured key allies in June that US security enablers would remain in place in Afghanistan as NATO troops withdrew, so much so that U.K. thought it could maintain its Kabul embassy

    Is this worse for US-Ally relationships than everything under Trump combined? Horrendous abdication of responsibility.

    He's a useless fucker so he is.
    Sorry David, you wanted Biden, you and your ilk own it
    Yes, I wanted Biden. Proud to say so.

    Because Trump winning a 2nd term would have been either the end of american democracy or a civil war or succession of several states.

    As was proved by his attempts to run a coup and claim he won the election.

    If Trump was running a coup, he did a piss poor imitation of one. My dog could have done better.

    And if you think the Democrats won’t try to subvert the democratic process to keep themselves in control, I have a bridge to sell you.

    I’ll throw a black / grey swan out there for 2022, namely the mid-terms will be delayed or (maybe more likely) there will be federal intervention that allows blanket voting without ID , plus the allowance of mass postal ballots. Covid will be cited as the reason but the real cause will be that Biden and the Democrats will be scared shitless of getting crushed.
    Why are you so afraid of black people voting?
  • QuincelQuincel Posts: 4,042

    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    In Germany if the Union are largest party it would likely still be a Union and SPD coalition with the Greens or FDP added on.

    In Canada, Liberal leakage to the 3rd placed NDP would benefit the 2nd placed Conservatives most under Canadian FPTP of course given the NDP are still 6% behind the Conservatives but the Conservatives now only 2% behind the Liberals.

    It looks like Trudeau will scrape home as largest party but fail to get the majority he wanted

    We've discussed Germany at length and I don't disagree but the gap between the Union and SPD has closed and is closing. It's not inconceivable the SPD could top the poll for the first time since 2002.

    As for Canada, there's a lot going on under the figures I think. There would be a swing from Conservative to NDP as well on these numbers. The NDP were 18 points behind the Conservatives in 2019 - Counsel has the gap at seven so that's a 5.5% swing which is not inconsiderable.

    The question is how the votes will shape up in Ontario, Quebec and British Columbia. There's no point the Conservatives piling up votes in Alberta and Saskatchewan if they miss marginals in those other three provinces.
    Canadian Conservatives are weird. They manage to be rather wet and Trumpy at the same time.

    Meanwhile, you have a Woke idiot leading a Wokey centre-Left Blairite party, and then a radical Left Corbynite style party.

    Not exactly an inspiring choice.
    Who exactly are the radical Left Corbynites in Canada?
    And Trudeau resembles Cameron rather than Blair to me.
    I assume they would be the NDP.

    Trudeau is a combination of Cameron, Clegg, Blair, JFK and Macron (and if rumours are to be believed Fidel Castro)
    I know very little about Canada, but left-wing friends tell me the NDP is at the social democrat/centrist end of the spectrum, and not proper socialists at all. These things tend to be in the eye of the beholder, but what are their key policies?
    I don't know for myself, but their Wiki page says they are social democrats and to the left of the Liberals. I was reading it a couple of days ago and it didn't make them sound 'hard left' by our standards.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,613
    edited August 2021
    Andy_JS said:

    HYUFD said:

    Biden will resign or be removed on medical grounds soon I suspect.

    Harris would be even worse
    We don't really know what she would be like, she's a bit of an unknown quantity.
    She is left of Biden and even more woke, we know that.

    She also makes Hillary look like a good people person judging by accounts of her dealings with staff
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