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Merry Christmas: rising Covid cases, No Deal Brexit, recession and maybe lockdown – politicalbetting

SystemSystem Posts: 12,126
edited December 2020 in General
imageMerry Christmas: rising Covid cases, No Deal Brexit, recession and maybe lockdown – politicalbetting.com

This is the end. Not the real end, of course. There is no real end; just the start of another chapter. But as far as Brexit goes, that’s it: no more can-kicking, no more transition periods, no more rule-taking. Out.

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 8,163
    edited December 2020
    1st to escape the previous thread.

    I wonder if this one will be any more sane?
  • And I thought I was the PB relentless pessimist.
  • Later peeps!
  • Smart and insightful Remainers will realise that the UK publicly saying it will police enforcement of its waters in the event of No Deal is the best chance there is of getting a Deal.

    I can only conclude from what I've seen on here today that there aren't that many of them, or they're staying quiet.

    I can't comprehend the focus on fishing by either side, I really cannot.

    Fishing accounts for 0.1% of the UK's GDP and this is the hill to die on?

    I know I work in the Banking & Financial Services sector but a bit more focus on that during any deal may have been more of a priority. Heck even manufacturing.
    Sadly that is the same argument that says that it is worth sacrificing one person (against their will) to save 100. It is not an argument I can support.
    Mr Spock would like to have a few words with you.

    But nobody is going die if we maintain the status quo or worse regarding fishing.
    Nobody will die by just letting Trump continue to be President despite the votes either.

    But elections have consequences. America voted for Biden - Britain voted to take back control.

    Don't be a Trumpist: Respect democracy.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,050
    edited December 2020
    Scott_xP said:
    I expect the christmas present delays will be where the so far more hidden first-world problems turn to day-to-day fury, anticipating the much more serious problems to come.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,575
    Sobering but fair summary David.

    GIven most of us can see that a shitstorm is coming, why can't the government?
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,690
    https://www.ft.com/content/0c7c2597-4afd-4ade-bc19-02c3bbc53daf

    Here’s some good news to make the gloomy and doomy more cheerful. Much ado about nothing really.

    “Brexit has failed to deliver a big hit to financial services employment in London, Financial Times research has shown, with international banks maintaining most of their staff since the vote to leave the EU and big asset managers hiring in the UK capital.

    Initial warnings that tens of thousands of jobs would leave the City as a result of the 2016 Brexit vote have been drastically scaled back. An FT survey of 24 large international banks and asset managers found that the majority had increased their London headcount over the past five years.”
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154
    Scott_xP said:
    Typical French, screwing everything up even before we’ve left.

    (I just say that to get he xenophobia quotient of the thread out of the way early, so we can get back to serious matters.)
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,575
    Any news on how the vaccination programme is progressing?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154

    Sobering but fair summary David.

    GIven most of us can see that a shitstorm is coming, why can't the government?

    Wrong question. As with Covid and the disaster that has been school management in the last five weeks, the question is not ‘why can’t they see it?’ it's ‘why don’t they care?’
  • Smart and insightful Remainers will realise that the UK publicly saying it will police enforcement of its waters in the event of No Deal is the best chance there is of getting a Deal.

    I can only conclude from what I've seen on here today that there aren't that many of them, or they're staying quiet.

    I can't comprehend the focus on fishing by either side, I really cannot.

    Fishing accounts for 0.1% of the UK's GDP and this is the hill to die on?

    I know I work in the Banking & Financial Services sector but a bit more focus on that during any deal may have been more of a priority. Heck even manufacturing.
    Sadly that is the same argument that says that it is worth sacrificing one person (against their will) to save 100. It is not an argument I can support.
    Mr Spock would like to have a few words with you.

    But nobody is going die if we maintain the status quo or worse regarding fishing.
    Nobody will die by just letting Trump continue to be President despite the votes either.

    But elections have consequences. America voted for Biden - Britain voted to take back control.

    Don't be a Trumpist: Respect democracy.
    Have you missed Trump's handling of Covid-19?

    Of course people will die if Trump is allowed to remain President.

    I hereby appoint you "Captain Shit Analogies'.

    Now I'm working this weekend because of Brexit, so if anyone outdoes you, you'll have to let me know so I can award your crown to someone else.
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556
    The worst peacetime conditions for any Government in a century and their polling is still quite strong. Maybe, just maybe, the obsessions of a certain class of fault-finders are not shared quite as universally as they imagine?
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,050
    edited December 2020

    The worst peacetime conditions for any Government in a century and their polling is still quite strong. Maybe, just maybe, the obsessions of a certain class of fault-finders are not shared quite as universally as they imagine?

    Come back to me in the new year. My PB call centre wlll be open extra hours to help customers deal with any problems arising from the new system.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,306

    Sobering but fair summary David.

    GIven most of us can see that a shitstorm is coming, why can't the government?

    When you're the rabbit in the headlights, seeing is insufficient.
  • Smart and insightful Remainers will realise that the UK publicly saying it will police enforcement of its waters in the event of No Deal is the best chance there is of getting a Deal.

    I can only conclude from what I've seen on here today that there aren't that many of them, or they're staying quiet.

    I can't comprehend the focus on fishing by either side, I really cannot.

    Fishing accounts for 0.1% of the UK's GDP and this is the hill to die on?

    I know I work in the Banking & Financial Services sector but a bit more focus on that during any deal may have been more of a priority. Heck even manufacturing.
    Sadly that is the same argument that says that it is worth sacrificing one person (against their will) to save 100. It is not an argument I can support.
    Mr Spock would like to have a few words with you.

    But nobody is going die if we maintain the status quo or worse regarding fishing.
    Nobody will die by just letting Trump continue to be President despite the votes either.

    But elections have consequences. America voted for Biden - Britain voted to take back control.

    Don't be a Trumpist: Respect democracy.
    Have you missed Trump's handling of Covid-19?

    Of course people will die if Trump is allowed to remain President.

    I hereby appoint you "Captain Shit Analogies'.

    Now I'm working this weekend because of Brexit, so if anyone outdoes you, you'll have to let me know so I can award your crown to someone else.
    Nah, that goes to @Gallowgate yesterday who thought trade deal negotiations were like buying a sausage from Aldi.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,297
    edited December 2020
    moonshine said:

    https://www.ft.com/content/0c7c2597-4afd-4ade-bc19-02c3bbc53daf

    Here’s some good news to make the gloomy and doomy more cheerful. Much ado about nothing really.

    “Brexit has failed to deliver a big hit to financial services employment in London, Financial Times research has shown, with international banks maintaining most of their staff since the vote to leave the EU and big asset managers hiring in the UK capital.

    Initial warnings that tens of thousands of jobs would leave the City as a result of the 2016 Brexit vote have been drastically scaled back. An FT survey of 24 large international banks and asset managers found that the majority had increased their London headcount over the past five years.”

    Yet.

    In the meantime over £1.8 trillion pounds worth of assets have been moved from the UK to the EU by the financial services sector down to Brexit.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,340
    Lost in a Roman wilderness of pain.
    And all the children are insane.
    All the children are insane.
    Waiting for the Summer rain.
  • Hooray, just had a tweet reply liked by Gyles Brandreth!
    I hope that makes up for repeated waves of Covid, No Deal Brexits and more lockdowns.
  • Scott_xP said:
    Exporting traffic jams to France is an unexpected bonus.
  • ydoethur said:

    Sobering but fair summary David.

    GIven most of us can see that a shitstorm is coming, why can't the government?

    Wrong question. As with Covid and the disaster that has been school management in the last five weeks, the question is not ‘why can’t they see it?’ it's ‘why don’t they care?’
    In the case of schools, it's reached the Colonel Nicholson in the final reel of "Bridge Over The River Kwai" level of madness. Schools have been kept open at huge cost, so must remain open, no matter what.

    The last outbreak of bonkersness like this was TMay's Brexit Deal.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,418

    Smart and insightful Remainers will realise that the UK publicly saying it will police enforcement of its waters in the event of No Deal is the best chance there is of getting a Deal.

    I can only conclude from what I've seen on here today that there aren't that many of them, or they're staying quiet.

    I can't comprehend the focus on fishing by either side, I really cannot.

    Fishing accounts for 0.1% of the UK's GDP and this is the hill to die on?

    I know I work in the Banking & Financial Services sector but a bit more focus on that during any deal may have been more of a priority. Heck even manufacturing.
    Sadly that is the same argument that says that it is worth sacrificing one person (against their will) to save 100. It is not an argument I can support.
    Mr Spock would like to have a few words with you.

    But nobody is going die if we maintain the status quo or worse regarding fishing.
    Nobody will die by just letting Trump continue to be President despite the votes either.

    But elections have consequences. America voted for Biden - Britain voted to take back control.

    Don't be a Trumpist: Respect democracy.
    Have you missed Trump's handling of Covid-19?

    Of course people will die if Trump is allowed to remain President.

    I hereby appoint you "Captain Shit Analogies'.

    Now I'm working this weekend because of Brexit, so if anyone outdoes you, you'll have to let me know so I can award your crown to someone else.
    Nah, that goes to @Gallowgate yesterday who thought trade deal negotiations were like buying a sausage from Aldi.
    Still missing the point I see.
  • murali_smurali_s Posts: 3,067
    As I said from day one, Brexit is a calamity and Brexiteers are thick ignorant xenophobic dreamers.

    Four years on and "nothing has changed".
  • dixiedean said:

    Lost in a Roman wilderness of pain.
    And all the children are insane.
    All the children are insane.
    Waiting for the Summer rain.

    The West is the best!
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,473

    Any news on how the vaccination programme is progressing?

    The anaphylaxis reactions* have slowed things a bit locally. It means that patients have to linger for 15 minutes post injection, and there has to be full resuscitation facilities. It means that decentralised distribution is a bit of a problem. The parts of the country where vaccination is happening in hospitals seem to be doing better.

    *prior history of severe allergy excluded subjects from the trials. There is always a difference between trial and general public populations.
  • I had my flu jab earlier today at our GP surgery.

    Very efficient operation.

    I was in and out with the nurse in under two minutes.

    Then I had my vaccination. Boom, boom.

    I had mine a couple of weeks ago. Same thing. Very efficient indeed.
  • 1st to escape the previous thread.

    I wonder if this one will be any more sane?

    Oh I am hurt. I thought I was being particularly sane and lovely today.:)
  • The worst peacetime conditions for any Government in a century and their polling is still quite strong. Maybe, just maybe, the obsessions of a certain class of fault-finders are not shared quite as universally as they imagine?

    I think one problem Labour have is people like their Shadow Education Secretary

    She fell into a massive trap yesterday spouting off against the Empire, Falklands War and demanding the curriculum be "decolonised".

    This will have been heard loud and clear in the Red Wall and will have set Starmer even further back.
  • Smart and insightful Remainers will realise that the UK publicly saying it will police enforcement of its waters in the event of No Deal is the best chance there is of getting a Deal.

    I can only conclude from what I've seen on here today that there aren't that many of them, or they're staying quiet.

    I can't comprehend the focus on fishing by either side, I really cannot.

    Fishing accounts for 0.1% of the UK's GDP and this is the hill to die on?

    I know I work in the Banking & Financial Services sector but a bit more focus on that during any deal may have been more of a priority. Heck even manufacturing.
    Sadly that is the same argument that says that it is worth sacrificing one person (against their will) to save 100. It is not an argument I can support.
    Mr Spock would like to have a few words with you.

    But nobody is going die if we maintain the status quo or worse regarding fishing.
    Nobody will die by just letting Trump continue to be President despite the votes either.

    But elections have consequences. America voted for Biden - Britain voted to take back control.

    Don't be a Trumpist: Respect democracy.
    Have you missed Trump's handling of Covid-19?

    Of course people will die if Trump is allowed to remain President.

    I hereby appoint you "Captain Shit Analogies'.

    Now I'm working this weekend because of Brexit, so if anyone outdoes you, you'll have to let me know so I can award your crown to someone else.
    Nah, that goes to @Gallowgate yesterday who thought trade deal negotiations were like buying a sausage from Aldi.
    Still missing the point I see.
    I tend to miss shit points, yeah.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,695
    @Casino_Royale FPT re your reply to my post

    I must admit I wasn't just referring to the Govt but also the press, which of course the Govt doesn't have control over, so we may not be discussing quite the same thing, but:

    a) We don't have to announce we are going to enforce rules. That is taken as read. That is the point of a rule. It might be we don't enforce a rule, but that shouldn't be assumed unless announced, which I can recall on a couple of occasions eg French requirement to carry a breathalyzer.

    b) Threatening to send gun boats isn't just announcing a rule.
  • Sobering but fair summary David.

    GIven most of us can see that a shitstorm is coming, why can't the government?

    Ey up Ben. Not seen you around for a long time (though that may be as much to do with my erratic attendance as yours).

    Hope all is well
  • Scott_xP said:
    Exporting traffic jams to France is an unexpected bonus.
    Is this the innovative jam exports of which Liam Fox spoke?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,297
    edited December 2020
    So Twitter has stopped people from replying to Trump's tweets that contain bullshit about the election.

    Trump and the MAGAs are going to lose their shit.
  • Foxy said:

    Any news on how the vaccination programme is progressing?

    The anaphylaxis reactions* have slowed things a bit locally. It means that patients have to linger for 15 minutes post injection, and there has to be full resuscitation facilities. It means that decentralised distribution is a bit of a problem. The parts of the country where vaccination is happening in hospitals seem to be doing better.

    *prior history of severe allergy excluded subjects from the trials. There is always a difference between trial and general public populations.
    Are there any stats being published? I'm surprised it hasn't made its way onto the COVID dashboard.

    Pleased to see my 80 year old mum is having hers today (in Herts). She only turned 80 last week and I thought she might end up being put in Priority 3 due to old data, so they are on the ball there.
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556

    The worst peacetime conditions for any Government in a century and their polling is still quite strong. Maybe, just maybe, the obsessions of a certain class of fault-finders are not shared quite as universally as they imagine?

    I think one problem Labour have is people like their Shadow Education Secretary

    She fell into a massive trap yesterday spouting off against the Empire, Falklands War and demanding the curriculum be "decolonised".

    This will have been heard loud and clear in the Red Wall and will have set Starmer even further back.
    I liked the way she deigned to allow - even though she was a founding member of Labour Against Private Schools - that abolition would 'not be a priority' under a Labour Government.

    It takes some talent to lose both the Red and the Blue Wall at the same time.
  • So Twitter has stopped people from replying to Trump's tweets that contain bullshit about the election.

    Trump and the MAGAs are going to lose their shit.

    Had a brief look on Parler last night.
    Shit already lost and sprayed all over the room.
  • kjh said:

    @Casino_Royale FPT re your reply to my post

    I must admit I wasn't just referring to the Govt but also the press, which of course the Govt doesn't have control over, so we may not be discussing quite the same thing, but:

    a) We don't have to announce we are going to enforce rules. That is taken as read. That is the point of a rule. It might be we don't enforce a rule, but that shouldn't be assumed unless announced, which I can recall on a couple of occasions eg French requirement to carry a breathalyzer.

    b) Threatening to send gun boats isn't just announcing a rule.

    Don't be too taken in by headlines in the Express or Mail (which go dramatic to sell papers, because it works) the detail was simply how the RN would police the waters.

    They're not proposing to fire on anyone. At worse they'd pull up against a boat, impound it and take it back to Harwich.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,050
    edited December 2020
    IIRC, though, they did that on a couple of Trump fraud claim tweets on the Saturday immediately after the election, too.
  • Anyway, afternoon chores beckon.

    Play nicely everyone.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,639

    I had my flu jab earlier today at our GP surgery.

    Very efficient operation.

    I was in and out with the nurse in under two minutes.

    Then I had my vaccination. Boom, boom.

    Was he handsome?
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,575
    Foxy said:

    Any news on how the vaccination programme is progressing?

    The anaphylaxis reactions* have slowed things a bit locally. It means that patients have to linger for 15 minutes post injection, and there has to be full resuscitation facilities. It means that decentralised distribution is a bit of a problem. The parts of the country where vaccination is happening in hospitals seem to be doing better.

    *prior history of severe allergy excluded subjects from the trials. There is always a difference between trial and general public populations.
    Thanks
  • Scott_xP said:
    er... That's Danish.

    But we should eat more herring, just about the best dietary source of vitamin D. We're about the only Northern European nation to have lost it from our diet.
  • So Twitter has stopped people from replying to Trump's tweets that contain bullshit about the election.

    Trump and the MAGAs are going to lose their shit.

    Had a brief look on Parler last night.
    Shit already lost and sprayed all over the room.
    I'm going to have to make intervention here.

    Please don't go on Parler ever again, that place will rot your brain.

    It's like Twitter for incel virgins and Trumpers but without the decorum of Twitter.
  • GaussianGaussian Posts: 831
    I hadn't realised quite how bad the numbers are in northern Kent, basically on the same level as south Wales. Only Kent was supposed to be in a lockdown whereas Wales wasn't, and relaxing to tier 3 won't help matters.
  • So Twitter has stopped people from replying to Trump's tweets that contain bullshit about the election.

    Trump and the MAGAs are going to lose their shit.

    Had a brief look on Parler last night.
    Shit already lost and sprayed all over the room.
    I'm going to have to make intervention here.

    Please don't go on Parler ever again, that place will rot your brain.

    It's like Twitter for incel virgins and Trumpers but without the decorum of Twitter.
    I shall dabble sparingly (as Frodo said when he took on the burden of The Ring).
  • So Twitter has stopped people from replying to Trump's tweets that contain bullshit about the election.

    Trump and the MAGAs are going to lose their shit.

    Had a brief look on Parler last night.
    Shit already lost and sprayed all over the room.
    I'm going to have to make intervention here.

    Please don't go on Parler ever again, that place will rot your brain.

    It's like Twitter for incel virgins and Trumpers but without the decorum of Twitter.
    I shall dabble sparingly (as Frodo said when he took on the burden of The Ring).
    This is the only good thing I'ver seen on Parler.

    https://twitter.com/BeffernieBlack/status/1337719891323969536
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,340

    dixiedean said:

    Lost in a Roman wilderness of pain.
    And all the children are insane.
    All the children are insane.
    Waiting for the Summer rain.

    The West is the best!
    Time to Ride the (No Deal) snake, baby.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,700

    So Twitter has stopped people from replying to Trump's tweets that contain bullshit about the election.

    Trump and the MAGAs are going to lose their shit.

    Had a brief look on Parler last night.
    Shit already lost and sprayed all over the room.
    I'm going to have to make intervention here.

    Please don't go on Parler ever again, that place will rot your brain.

    It's like Twitter for incel virgins and Trumpers but without the decorum of Twitter.
    I shall dabble sparingly (as Frodo said when he took on the burden of The Ring).
    This is the only good thing I'ver seen on Parler.

    https://twitter.com/BeffernieBlack/status/1337719891323969536
    Betrayed by whom?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,700

    Scott_xP said:
    er... That's Danish.

    But we should eat more herring, just about the best dietary source of vitamin D. We're about the only Northern European nation to have lost it from our diet.
    Had mackerel for breakfast yesterday. Have kippers regularly. Delicious.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,891

    I shall dabble sparingly (as Frodo said when he took on the burden of The Ring).

    I have just seen a thing on Twitter that is amazing

    People watch the LOTR films in order, and every time somebody on screen eats something, they eat along. Dozens of courses, all of them themed to the movies.

    It's remarkable
  • Covid: Christmas five-day relaxation period 'a mistake'

    Prof Bauld told BBC Breakfast that "from a public health perspective, I have to be perfectly honest, I think this is a mistake and I think people, even though we're permitted to do this, I think people have to think very carefully whether they can see loved ones outside or do it in a very, very modest way".

    She added there was "nothing to stop" governments reversing the rules, "but the problem is they've made that commitment to people across the UK, and that may affect trust in government if they roll back on that".

    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-55279371
  • LadyG said:

    moonshine said:

    https://www.ft.com/content/0c7c2597-4afd-4ade-bc19-02c3bbc53daf

    Here’s some good news to make the gloomy and doomy more cheerful. Much ado about nothing really.

    “Brexit has failed to deliver a big hit to financial services employment in London, Financial Times research has shown, with international banks maintaining most of their staff since the vote to leave the EU and big asset managers hiring in the UK capital.

    Initial warnings that tens of thousands of jobs would leave the City as a result of the 2016 Brexit vote have been drastically scaled back. An FT survey of 24 large international banks and asset managers found that the majority had increased their London headcount over the past five years.”

    Yet.

    In the meantime over £1.8 trillion pounds worth of assets have been moved from the UK to the EU by the financial services sector down to Brexit.
    We were told hundreds of thousands of City jobs would leave. They haven't.

    As you say, they might still go, but, equally, the City of London under its own UK regulations might actually grow, finding new markets - as it has done over the centuries. We don't know, but the second option is historically the likelier.

    The problem for Europe is that there is not one obvious alternative. Those that have left the City have all gone off in different directions, to cities which all have their own issues

    Paris: great city but French speaking, quite hostile, schools an issue, riots
    Amsterdam: bit small, bit dull
    Dublin: very small, rain
    Frankfurt: boring as fuck, German
    Luxembourg: small, boring as fuck, where even is it?

    Because of this splintering none of them will ever have the critical mass of lawyers, bankers, regulators, financiers, managers, that you get in English-speaking London, making it a world leading finance centre.


    Two years ago I was truly fearful for the City. Now I think, Deal or No Deal, it will endure and eventually thrive. That's what it does.
    I can think of an English speaking city that might not be a bad fit.
  • GaussianGaussian Posts: 831
    Foxy said:

    Any news on how the vaccination programme is progressing?

    The anaphylaxis reactions* have slowed things a bit locally. It means that patients have to linger for 15 minutes post injection, and there has to be full resuscitation facilities. It means that decentralised distribution is a bit of a problem. The parts of the country where vaccination is happening in hospitals seem to be doing better.

    *prior history of severe allergy excluded subjects from the trials. There is always a difference between trial and general public populations.
    Isn't that cheating in the trials?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154
    Scott_xP said:

    I shall dabble sparingly (as Frodo said when he took on the burden of The Ring).

    I have just seen a thing on Twitter that is amazing

    People watch the LOTR films in order, and every time somebody on screen eats something, they eat along. Dozens of courses, all of them themed to the movies.

    It's remarkable
    Do they also smoke every time someone lights up?

    If so, lung and bowel cancer INCOMING...
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,473
    LadyG said:

    moonshine said:

    https://www.ft.com/content/0c7c2597-4afd-4ade-bc19-02c3bbc53daf

    Here’s some good news to make the gloomy and doomy more cheerful. Much ado about nothing really.

    “Brexit has failed to deliver a big hit to financial services employment in London, Financial Times research has shown, with international banks maintaining most of their staff since the vote to leave the EU and big asset managers hiring in the UK capital.

    Initial warnings that tens of thousands of jobs would leave the City as a result of the 2016 Brexit vote have been drastically scaled back. An FT survey of 24 large international banks and asset managers found that the majority had increased their London headcount over the past five years.”

    Yet.

    In the meantime over £1.8 trillion pounds worth of assets have been moved from the UK to the EU by the financial services sector down to Brexit.
    We were told hundreds of thousands of City jobs would leave. They haven't.

    As you say, they might still go, but, equally, the City of London under its own UK regulations might actually grow, finding new markets - as it has done over the centuries. We don't know, but the second option is historically the likelier.

    The problem for Europe is that there is not one obvious alternative. Those that have left the City have all gone off in different directions, to cities which all have their own issues

    Paris: great city but French speaking, quite hostile, schools an issue, riots
    Amsterdam: bit small, bit dull
    Dublin: very small, rain
    Frankfurt: boring as fuck, German
    Luxembourg: small, boring as fuck, where even is it?

    Because of this splintering none of them will ever have the critical mass of lawyers, bankers, regulators, financiers, managers, that you get in English-speaking London, making it a world leading finance centre.


    Two years ago I was truly fearful for the City. Now I think, Deal or No Deal, it will endure and eventually thrive. That's what it does.
    Yes, I think the metropolitan elites in financial services, and the cultural and artistic sectors will cope much better with Brexit than the industries of Leaverstan.

    I expect Brexit will significantly worsen the cultural gap between Remania and Leaverstan. Not least because Remania will care even less for Leaverstan.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,773
    LadyG said:

    moonshine said:

    https://www.ft.com/content/0c7c2597-4afd-4ade-bc19-02c3bbc53daf

    Here’s some good news to make the gloomy and doomy more cheerful. Much ado about nothing really.

    “Brexit has failed to deliver a big hit to financial services employment in London, Financial Times research has shown, with international banks maintaining most of their staff since the vote to leave the EU and big asset managers hiring in the UK capital.

    Initial warnings that tens of thousands of jobs would leave the City as a result of the 2016 Brexit vote have been drastically scaled back. An FT survey of 24 large international banks and asset managers found that the majority had increased their London headcount over the past five years.”

    Yet.

    In the meantime over £1.8 trillion pounds worth of assets have been moved from the UK to the EU by the financial services sector down to Brexit.
    We were told hundreds of thousands of City jobs would leave. They haven't.

    As you say, they might still go, but, equally, the City of London under its own UK regulations might actually grow, finding new markets - as it has done over the centuries. We don't know, but the second option is historically the likelier.

    The problem for Europe is that there is not one obvious alternative. Those that have left the City have all gone off in different directions, to cities which all have their own issues

    Paris: great city but French speaking, quite hostile, schools an issue, riots
    Amsterdam: bit small, bit dull
    Dublin: very small, rain
    Frankfurt: boring as fuck, German
    Luxembourg: small, boring as fuck, where even is it?

    Because of this splintering none of them will ever have the critical mass of lawyers, bankers, regulators, financiers, managers, that you get in English-speaking London, making it a world leading finance centre.


    Two years ago I was truly fearful for the City. Now I think, Deal or No Deal, it will endure and eventually thrive. That's what it does.
    Applying your views as a tourist and travel writer to various cities’ financial market prospects is hardly robust or reliable analysis, though, is it?

    Nor is citing historical precedent when our imminent departure from a free trade confederation directly to a position with no trade agreements at all with any of our principal neighbours is without historical precedent.
  • StockyStocky Posts: 10,113
    Man Utd 5.0 to beat Man City looks a bit big.
  • kjh said:

    @Casino_Royale FPT re your reply to my post

    I must admit I wasn't just referring to the Govt but also the press, which of course the Govt doesn't have control over, so we may not be discussing quite the same thing, but:

    a) We don't have to announce we are going to enforce rules. That is taken as read. That is the point of a rule. It might be we don't enforce a rule, but that shouldn't be assumed unless announced, which I can recall on a couple of occasions eg French requirement to carry a breathalyzer.

    b) Threatening to send gun boats isn't just announcing a rule.

    Don't be too taken in by headlines in the Express or Mail (which go dramatic to sell papers, because it works) the detail was simply how the RN would police the waters.

    They're not proposing to fire on anyone. At worse they'd pull up against a boat, impound it and take it back to Harwich.
    The navy's plan when it last had to deal with les pêcheurs was to send in unarmed Royal Marines to take any action like seizing boats.
  • Scott_xP said:
    Clearly behind with the scare stories. We have already been assured that we won't be able to import anything from Norway because our ports will all be blocked with dead rotting sheep carcasses.
  • Scott_xP said:

    I shall dabble sparingly (as Frodo said when he took on the burden of The Ring).

    I have just seen a thing on Twitter that is amazing

    People watch the LOTR films in order, and every time somebody on screen eats something, they eat along. Dozens of courses, all of them themed to the movies.

    It's remarkable
    There is quite a lot of eating in LOTR when one thinks about it: lembas, Smeagol eating fissshes, hobbit breakfasts, Sam's rabbit stew etc. Can't rightly remember, was there an instance of orcs eating manflesh or was it just talked about? Might be difficult to theme that.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,473
    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    Lost in a Roman wilderness of pain.
    And all the children are insane.
    All the children are insane.
    Waiting for the Summer rain.

    The West is the best!
    Time to Ride the (No Deal) snake, baby.
    Father, I want to kill you, mother, I want to....
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,331

    dixiedean said:

    Lost in a Roman wilderness of pain.
    And all the children are insane.
    All the children are insane.
    Waiting for the Summer rain.

    The West is the best!
    It’s Apocalypse Now.
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,331

    dixiedean said:

    Lost in a Roman wilderness of pain.
    And all the children are insane.
    All the children are insane.
    Waiting for the Summer rain.

    The West is the best!
    It’s Apocalypse Now.
    Or as Brexiteers would have it: Can you picture what we’ll be? So limitless and free.
  • OllyTOllyT Posts: 5,006

    The worst peacetime conditions for any Government in a century and their polling is still quite strong. Maybe, just maybe, the obsessions of a certain class of fault-finders are not shared quite as universally as they imagine?

    70+ million still voted for Trump. Doesn't mean that anyone in their right mind believes he's right.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,473

    dixiedean said:

    Lost in a Roman wilderness of pain.
    And all the children are insane.
    All the children are insane.
    Waiting for the Summer rain.

    The West is the best!
    It’s Apocalypse Now.
    Or as Brexiteers would have it: Can you picture what we’ll be? So limitless and free.
    This is the end. My only friend, the end.
  • Covid: Christmas five-day relaxation period 'a mistake'

    Prof Bauld told BBC Breakfast that "from a public health perspective, I have to be perfectly honest, I think this is a mistake and I think people, even though we're permitted to do this, I think people have to think very carefully whether they can see loved ones outside or do it in a very, very modest way".

    She added there was "nothing to stop" governments reversing the rules, "but the problem is they've made that commitment to people across the UK, and that may affect trust in government if they roll back on that".

    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-55279371

    I'm beginning to suspect that it will make little difference - once covid is in the country it will steadily circulate.

    All governments can do is 'flatten the curve'.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,528
    Get in Max!

    Good for Lando as well in 4th.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,773
    edited December 2020
    MattW said:

    Scott_xP said:
    er... That's Danish.

    But we should eat more herring, just about the best dietary source of vitamin D. We're about the only Northern European nation to have lost it from our diet.
    Had mackerel for breakfast yesterday. Have kippers regularly. Delicious.
    The problem is that our catch - herring, mackerel, crab - is seen as a novelty, which Brits will at best try “for a change”, as we know here on the island where all manner of crab delights are on offer to visitors. But very few are prepared to build any of these into their regular weekly diet. Many don’t really eat fish at all; those that make their regular trip to the chippie want cod (mostly imported) or haddock (where we still rely on imports to meet demand).
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,340
    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    Lost in a Roman wilderness of pain.
    And all the children are insane.
    All the children are insane.
    Waiting for the Summer rain.

    The West is the best!
    Time to Ride the (No Deal) snake, baby.
    Father, I want to kill you, mother, I want to....
    The lorry queue is long.
    Seven miles.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 21,965

    LadyG said:

    moonshine said:

    https://www.ft.com/content/0c7c2597-4afd-4ade-bc19-02c3bbc53daf

    Here’s some good news to make the gloomy and doomy more cheerful. Much ado about nothing really.

    “Brexit has failed to deliver a big hit to financial services employment in London, Financial Times research has shown, with international banks maintaining most of their staff since the vote to leave the EU and big asset managers hiring in the UK capital.

    Initial warnings that tens of thousands of jobs would leave the City as a result of the 2016 Brexit vote have been drastically scaled back. An FT survey of 24 large international banks and asset managers found that the majority had increased their London headcount over the past five years.”

    Yet.

    In the meantime over £1.8 trillion pounds worth of assets have been moved from the UK to the EU by the financial services sector down to Brexit.
    We were told hundreds of thousands of City jobs would leave. They haven't.

    As you say, they might still go, but, equally, the City of London under its own UK regulations might actually grow, finding new markets - as it has done over the centuries. We don't know, but the second option is historically the likelier.

    The problem for Europe is that there is not one obvious alternative. Those that have left the City have all gone off in different directions, to cities which all have their own issues

    Paris: great city but French speaking, quite hostile, schools an issue, riots
    Amsterdam: bit small, bit dull
    Dublin: very small, rain
    Frankfurt: boring as fuck, German
    Luxembourg: small, boring as fuck, where even is it?

    Because of this splintering none of them will ever have the critical mass of lawyers, bankers, regulators, financiers, managers, that you get in English-speaking London, making it a world leading finance centre.


    Two years ago I was truly fearful for the City. Now I think, Deal or No Deal, it will endure and eventually thrive. That's what it does.
    I can think of an English speaking city that might not be a bad fit.
    Auckland?
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,691

    Scott_xP said:
    Clearly behind with the scare stories. We have already been assured that we won't be able to import anything from Norway because our ports will all be blocked with dead rotting sheep carcasses.
    Those herrings are seriously nice. I've no idea what Gauke is on about.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,575
    Anyone know how best to post a link to Instagram?
  • FPT:
    F1: didn't offer a qualifying tip but the result does mean the pre-season bet on Norris betting Sainz (only evens, so not actually very good value) came off.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,773
    More Leave voters than Remainers have swung from the Tories to Labour since the last election, according to a major polling project that suggests Keir Starmer, the Labour leader, has made some early progress in bridging the Brexit divide.

    A large 7,000-strong poll, designed to examine the political changes that have taken place since Labour’s disastrous result, found that the party was showing signs of winning over some of those who backed the Tories last year.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947

    Covid: Christmas five-day relaxation period 'a mistake'

    Prof Bauld told BBC Breakfast that "from a public health perspective, I have to be perfectly honest, I think this is a mistake and I think people, even though we're permitted to do this, I think people have to think very carefully whether they can see loved ones outside or do it in a very, very modest way".

    She added there was "nothing to stop" governments reversing the rules, "but the problem is they've made that commitment to people across the UK, and that may affect trust in government if they roll back on that".

    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-55279371

    I'm beginning to suspect that it will make little difference - once covid is in the country it will steadily circulate.

    All governments can do is 'flatten the curve'.
    But "flattening the curve" IS making a difference. Keep a lid on the virus and prevent the NHS falling over until the vaccine is rolled out. That's the strategy and it's the only feasible one. There is no realistic option to eradicate it. Nobody thinks that's possible.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,639

    Scott_xP said:
    Clearly behind with the scare stories. We have already been assured that we won't be able to import anything from Norway because our ports will all be blocked with dead rotting sheep carcasses.
    That's actually Danish herring ...
  • Stocky said:

    Man Utd 5.0 to beat Man City looks a bit big.

    At Old Trafford too. Oh how the mighty have fallen.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,891

    There is quite a lot of eating in LOTR when one thinks about it: lembas, Smeagol eating fissshes, hobbit breakfasts, Sam's rabbit stew etc. Can't rightly remember, was there an instance of orcs eating manflesh or was it just talked about? Might be difficult to theme that.

    All of the above. They cooked rabbit stew. They assembled an orc/man out of spare ribs and sausages. Smoked trout.

    It's quite impressive
  • Scott_xP said:

    I shall dabble sparingly (as Frodo said when he took on the burden of The Ring).

    I have just seen a thing on Twitter that is amazing

    People watch the LOTR films in order, and every time somebody on screen eats something, they eat along. Dozens of courses, all of them themed to the movies.

    It's remarkable
    There is quite a lot of eating in LOTR when one thinks about it: lembas, Smeagol eating fissshes, hobbit breakfasts, Sam's rabbit stew etc. Can't rightly remember, was there an instance of orcs eating manflesh or was it just talked about? Might be difficult to theme that.
    Didn't the orcs eat an orc killed in a dispute ?

    It was the orcs which had captured Merry and Pippin.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,473

    dixiedean said:

    Lost in a Roman wilderness of pain.
    And all the children are insane.
    All the children are insane.
    Waiting for the Summer rain.

    The West is the best!
    It’s Apocalypse Now.
    Or as Brexiteers would have it: Can you picture what we’ll be? So limitless and free.
    Desperately in need of
    some strangers hand
    In a desperate land...
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,340
    Can you picture what will be?
    So limitless and free.
    Desperately in need of some stranger's hand.
    In a desperate land....

    It hurts to set you free.
    But you'll never follow me.
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,331
    Stocky said:

    Man Utd 5.0 to beat Man City looks a bit big.

    It does indeed! Still remember your tip from last season on Wolves 3 Citeh 2.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,639

    Scott_xP said:

    I shall dabble sparingly (as Frodo said when he took on the burden of The Ring).

    I have just seen a thing on Twitter that is amazing

    People watch the LOTR films in order, and every time somebody on screen eats something, they eat along. Dozens of courses, all of them themed to the movies.

    It's remarkable
    There is quite a lot of eating in LOTR when one thinks about it: lembas, Smeagol eating fissshes, hobbit breakfasts, Sam's rabbit stew etc. Can't rightly remember, was there an instance of orcs eating manflesh or was it just talked about? Might be difficult to theme that.
    Just buy some jelly babies. Or cold roast pork. Sorted.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,473
    Carnyx said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Clearly behind with the scare stories. We have already been assured that we won't be able to import anything from Norway because our ports will all be blocked with dead rotting sheep carcasses.
    That's actually Danish herring ...
    Or is it British herring fished by Danes?
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,639
    Omnium said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Clearly behind with the scare stories. We have already been assured that we won't be able to import anything from Norway because our ports will all be blocked with dead rotting sheep carcasses.
    Those herrings are seriously nice. I've no idea what Gauke is on about.
    I agree, but a certain conservative mentality - the classic Brexiter modality - really, really will nto touch them. Some years ago some older friends came round for dinner - pickled herring, M&S chicken pie, pud. Wouldn't look at the herring. Disaster easily averted - each got a one and a third portion of pie and I had four portions of herring for my starter and main.
  • GaussianGaussian Posts: 831
    Foxy said:

    Gaussian said:

    Foxy said:

    Any news on how the vaccination programme is progressing?

    The anaphylaxis reactions* have slowed things a bit locally. It means that patients have to linger for 15 minutes post injection, and there has to be full resuscitation facilities. It means that decentralised distribution is a bit of a problem. The parts of the country where vaccination is happening in hospitals seem to be doing better.

    *prior history of severe allergy excluded subjects from the trials. There is always a difference between trial and general public populations.
    Isn't that cheating in the trials?
    No, it is routine for pharmaceutical trials to exclude people with history of allergies, with severe medical conditions, pregnant and nursing mothers, children, the very elderly etc.

    Those issues are addressed in phase IV post release surveillance.

    Is that because the incidence is too low to get useful numbers during the trials? Ethically, trialling it on the general population seems worse than on volunteers, and the likelihood of allergic reactions would be useful to know before rollout.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,575
    edited December 2020
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,331
    edited December 2020
    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    Lost in a Roman wilderness of pain.
    And all the children are insane.
    All the children are insane.
    Waiting for the Summer rain.

    The West is the best!
    It’s Apocalypse Now.
    Or as Brexiteers would have it: Can you picture what we’ll be? So limitless and free.
    Desperately in need of
    some strangers hand
    In a desperate land...
    I actually think the first two Doors albums are so perfect that the four white blokes, keyboard, vocals, lead and bass guitar should have been retired. No-one was very going to improve on what they’d done.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,200
    Can you imagine the reaction in the UK if France said it was sending in its navy to stop UK fishermen .

    Leavers never look at things from the other point of view . Why antagonize matters when there’s still a chance of a deal unless that is the plan all along was no deal .

    The EU have shown huge restraint in not reacting to the constant barrage of idiocy and showboating from this pathetic government .

    The UK is now a global laughing stock thanks to Bozo and his lapdog cabinet .
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,575
    Foxy said:

    Carnyx said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Clearly behind with the scare stories. We have already been assured that we won't be able to import anything from Norway because our ports will all be blocked with dead rotting sheep carcasses.
    That's actually Danish herring ...
    Or is it British herring fished by Danes?
    Depends. Is it red?
  • LadyG said:

    moonshine said:

    https://www.ft.com/content/0c7c2597-4afd-4ade-bc19-02c3bbc53daf

    Here’s some good news to make the gloomy and doomy more cheerful. Much ado about nothing really.

    “Brexit has failed to deliver a big hit to financial services employment in London, Financial Times research has shown, with international banks maintaining most of their staff since the vote to leave the EU and big asset managers hiring in the UK capital.

    Initial warnings that tens of thousands of jobs would leave the City as a result of the 2016 Brexit vote have been drastically scaled back. An FT survey of 24 large international banks and asset managers found that the majority had increased their London headcount over the past five years.”

    Yet.

    In the meantime over £1.8 trillion pounds worth of assets have been moved from the UK to the EU by the financial services sector down to Brexit.
    We were told hundreds of thousands of City jobs would leave. They haven't.

    As you say, they might still go, but, equally, the City of London under its own UK regulations might actually grow, finding new markets - as it has done over the centuries. We don't know, but the second option is historically the likelier.

    The problem for Europe is that there is not one obvious alternative. Those that have left the City have all gone off in different directions, to cities which all have their own issues

    Paris: great city but French speaking, quite hostile, schools an issue, riots
    Amsterdam: bit small, bit dull
    Dublin: very small, rain
    Frankfurt: boring as fuck, German
    Luxembourg: small, boring as fuck, where even is it?

    Because of this splintering none of them will ever have the critical mass of lawyers, bankers, regulators, financiers, managers, that you get in English-speaking London, making it a world leading finance centre.


    Two years ago I was truly fearful for the City. Now I think, Deal or No Deal, it will endure and eventually thrive. That's what it does.
    I can think of an English speaking city that might not be a bad fit.
    Auckland?
    Bishop Auckland?
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,639
    Foxy said:

    Carnyx said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Clearly behind with the scare stories. We have already been assured that we won't be able to import anything from Norway because our ports will all be blocked with dead rotting sheep carcasses.
    That's actually Danish herring ...
    Or is it British herring fished by Danes?
    I have no idea, but there is quite a bit in the Baltic. However, this mob does very nice pickled herring. Of course it might be from Scowegian waters ...

    http://orkneyfoodcompany.co.uk/
  • Covid: Christmas five-day relaxation period 'a mistake'

    Prof Bauld told BBC Breakfast that "from a public health perspective, I have to be perfectly honest, I think this is a mistake and I think people, even though we're permitted to do this, I think people have to think very carefully whether they can see loved ones outside or do it in a very, very modest way".

    She added there was "nothing to stop" governments reversing the rules, "but the problem is they've made that commitment to people across the UK, and that may affect trust in government if they roll back on that".

    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-55279371

    I'm beginning to suspect that it will make little difference - once covid is in the country it will steadily circulate.

    All governments can do is 'flatten the curve'.
    The underlying problem is that many people are 'bored' with covid, others think that vaccination has solved things and others think that the second 'lockdown' has solved things.

    Plus the young now know they are not at risk.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,473

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    Lost in a Roman wilderness of pain.
    And all the children are insane.
    All the children are insane.
    Waiting for the Summer rain.

    The West is the best!
    It’s Apocalypse Now.
    Or as Brexiteers would have it: Can you picture what we’ll be? So limitless and free.
    Desperately in need of
    some strangers hand
    In a desperate land...
    I actually think the first two Doors albums are so perfect that the four white blokes, keyboard, vocals, lead and bass guitar should have been rietired. No-one was very going to improve on what they’d done.
    Morrison Hotel and LA Woman are superb too.

This discussion has been closed.