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WH2020: Key state turnout as percentage of votes cast – politicalbetting.com

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  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,421
    Mortimer said:

    ydoethur said:

    MikeL said:

    What is happening re housing market?

    Are house moves being stopped?

    Including actual physical move of furniture?

    How’s Mr Pioneers going to manage?
    It’s going to cause me some fairly significant headaches as well given the new extension isn’t finished yet. It should be finished this week (it’s outdoor work and anyway, I’m not in during the day) but it’s going to be a right bugger getting the furniture in if I can’t use a removal firm.
    Obviously don't know the rules, but given 'travel for work' will apparently be allowed, I don't see why removals would be stopped....
    Mixing inside private houses will not be.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,364
    UK hospitals

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  • Jonathan said:

    Jonathan said:

    Mortimer said:

    Mortimer said:

    I suspect the delay is because they're agonising over exactly how to sell it without it seeming like a victory for Starmer. I don't imagine the delay is anything to do with reflecting on what's best for the national interest.

    Wonder if it's a resignation standoff, actually.

    Unlikely. From the clip of Steve Baker they just played on Sky even he seemed to understand that a lockdown had become necessary so no chance a Cabinet Minister will kill their career by appearing irresponsible over this.
    The first senior minister to go over this will likely be next PM.

    My feeling is Boris might survive until the spring, but only, like Mrs May, to make sure he absorbs all the flack that is coming his way. Politically, IMO his career is over.
    Hope springs eternal. I suspect he has a bit more damage up his sleeve yet. Would be good to get rid before he forces a cold, hard Brexit on us on top of all of this.
    Boris will be in place on the 1st January 2021 but not sure how far into 2021 he will last
    Hanging around to deliver one further insult to the UK.
    To you yes but the country did vote to leave the EU
  • Foxy said:

    IanB2 said:

    Bozo is completely shit at doing the hard graft of politics.

    He’d have learned more from eight years as a Borough councillor than being dropped straight into London mayor and evading any scrutiny thereafter.
    TMay and John Major both had stints as Councillor on their CV; are there any other PMs?

    And although neither ended as a raging success, in terms of keeping on keeping on through horrible circumstances that weren't really their fault, they both had a certain something.

    It's the risk with Rishi, he's been in politics for about 30 minutes and we've not seen what he's like when his back is really against the wall. (Dishing out cash in a crisis is traumatic, but in a different way).
    Attlee was mayor of Stepney.
    Ta. Similar mould really- the grownup in the room, which was their burden and strength.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,364
    edited October 2020
    UK Deaths

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  • AramintaMoonbeamQCAramintaMoonbeamQC Posts: 3,855
    edited October 2020
    ydoethur said:

    tlg86 said:

    Mortimer said:

    I suspect the delay is because they're agonising over exactly how to sell it without it seeming like a victory for Starmer. I don't imagine the delay is anything to do with reflecting on what's best for the national interest.

    Wonder if it's a resignation standoff, actually.

    Unlikely. From the clip of Steve Baker they just played on Sky even he seemed to understand that a lockdown had become necessary so no chance a Cabinet Minister will kill their career by appearing irresponsible over this.
    What about the guy who called Sir Keir Starmer 'Captain Hindsight' a few weeks ago?
    What was Starmer actually calling for? Did he want schools to be shut?
    For half term
    My understanding was he wanted a two-week half term break. Which would have made an enormous amount of sense on a very large number of levels.
    Yes, so Boris didn’t do it. Pillock.
  • isam said:

    isam said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Our leaders should admit they’re totally lost

    Britain isn’t suffering from lockdown fatigue, it has just lost faith in the cocksure claims of politicians and scientists

    Matthew Parris" (£)

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/comment/our-leaders-should-admit-theyre-totally-lost-gtpjzkr9p

    Nothing will happen until somebody new springs up to challenge the tories and labour.

    The only candidate right now is Farage and he has his head so far up Trump's backside he has no conception of what is going on
    https://twitter.com/brexitparty_uk/status/1314236764857524231?s=20
    They seem quite on the ball with marketing, hopefully once Farage has descended, as you say, he will stand up for the decent sized minority who aren't in favour of lockdowns.

    https://twitter.com/brexitparty_uk/status/1322221435306332160?s=20
    I suspect we'll see a Tory MP defect to TBP soon enough - a maverick malcontent in the Reckless, Carswell mould. Many have always adored Nigel and Boris just didn't cut it as a Farage clone in the end.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    Presumably this will put a stop to all the

    Masterful! Just watched BBC1

    The Channels have cleared their schedules since 16.00.

    They have to fill the air with something.

    Who can they get?

    Government critics, that's who....

    Lol.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,137
    56% of Tory members want Trump to win the US presidential election, 22.5% want Biden to win according to a new ConHome survey

    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2020/10/our-survey-more-than-half-of-tory-members-want-trump-to-win-next-week.html
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    HYUFD said:

    56% of Tory members want Trump to win the US presidential election, 22.5% want Biden to win according to a new ConHome survey

    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2020/10/our-survey-more-than-half-of-tory-members-want-trump-to-win-next-week.html

    In touch with the country then.
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,468
    edited October 2020
    US Election: PA

    Interesting that it is 2 GOP counties that have had problems getting mail-in ballots to voters in time, and that it is mostly GOP counties that are delaying the count of mail-in ballots until Wednesday.

    Meanwhile, Philly has received back 325,000 of the 400,000 mail-in ballots it sent out, none have been challenged, and they will start counting them at 07:00am on Election Day. Looks like we'll have a very significant Dem lead in the vote early on, and then the question is 'will Trump be able to claw it back?'

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/10/31/politics/deadline-philadelphia-pennsylvania-mail-in-challenge/index.html
  • rkrkrk said:



    BTW does everyone on PB agree that Starmer was right and displayed characteristic foresight in calling for the policy the government is now following, albeit too late?

    Lol - you've been on here long enough to know better!
    And Boris is not following Starmer's 14 day circuit breaker, this is for a full 28 days not advocated by him
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,127
    ydoethur said:

    Mortimer said:

    ydoethur said:

    MikeL said:

    What is happening re housing market?

    Are house moves being stopped?

    Including actual physical move of furniture?

    How’s Mr Pioneers going to manage?
    It’s going to cause me some fairly significant headaches as well given the new extension isn’t finished yet. It should be finished this week (it’s outdoor work and anyway, I’m not in during the day) but it’s going to be a right bugger getting the furniture in if I can’t use a removal firm.
    Obviously don't know the rules, but given 'travel for work' will apparently be allowed, I don't see why removals would be stopped....
    Mixing inside private houses will not be.
    Do you mix with your removal firm? I don't. I think there were exemptions for professionals on house calls in the spring, weren't there?
  • Roy_G_BivRoy_G_Biv Posts: 998
    Boris Johnson: a farce wrapped in a mockery inside a sham. Get him out.
  • rkrkrk said:



    BTW does everyone on PB agree that Starmer was right and displayed characteristic foresight in calling for the policy the government is now following, albeit too late?

    Lol - you've been on here long enough to know better!
    And Boris is not following Starmer's 14 day circuit breaker, this is for a full 28 days not advocated by him
    If he had listened to Starmer it wouldn't have now needed a 28 day circuit breaker.

    As usual, Boris Johnson has left it far too late.
  • MikeL said:

    What is happening re housing market?

    Are house moves being stopped?

    Including actual physical move of furniture?

    How’s Mr Pioneers going to manage?
    Pah. Still awaiting the completion of the new Home Report from our vendors...
  • alex_ said:

    HYUFD said:

    56% of Tory members want Trump to win the US presidential election, 22.5% want Biden to win according to a new ConHome survey

    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2020/10/our-survey-more-than-half-of-tory-members-want-trump-to-win-next-week.html

    In touch with the country then.
    This member does not under any circumstances
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 8,298
    As an aside - David Herdson's statement on 17th Oct that:
    " [Starmer's call for a brief Lockdown II does show him distancing himself from the government and as far as that goes, it’s true (although it’s also the wrong call both because case numbers are levelling off and because it’s delusional to think that it will have any meaningful impact in just a fortnight). "

    Is an uncharacteristically poor misjudgement. Since then daily cases are up 40-50%....
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    MaxPB said:

    They've already fucked with Little Mix the Search, so if they delay Strictly too they are completely dead to me.
    BTW does everyone on PB agree that Starmer was right and displayed characteristic foresight in calling for the policy the government is now following, albeit too late?
    No, they're both wrong.
    Mortimer said:

    They've already fucked with Little Mix the Search, so if they delay Strictly too they are completely dead to me.
    BTW does everyone on PB agree that Starmer was right and displayed characteristic foresight in calling for the policy the government is now following, albeit too late?
    Nope - both Starmer and the govt are wrong.
    Nige is your only hope!
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    Mortimer said:

    ydoethur said:

    Mortimer said:

    ydoethur said:

    MikeL said:

    What is happening re housing market?

    Are house moves being stopped?

    Including actual physical move of furniture?

    How’s Mr Pioneers going to manage?
    It’s going to cause me some fairly significant headaches as well given the new extension isn’t finished yet. It should be finished this week (it’s outdoor work and anyway, I’m not in during the day) but it’s going to be a right bugger getting the furniture in if I can’t use a removal firm.
    Obviously don't know the rules, but given 'travel for work' will apparently be allowed, I don't see why removals would be stopped....
    Mixing inside private houses will not be.
    Do you mix with your removal firm? I don't. I think there were exemptions for professionals on house calls in the spring, weren't there?
    Moving house was explicitly allowed in the spring. They can't force people into homelessness.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,381
    tlg86 said:

    Mortimer said:

    I suspect the delay is because they're agonising over exactly how to sell it without it seeming like a victory for Starmer. I don't imagine the delay is anything to do with reflecting on what's best for the national interest.

    Wonder if it's a resignation standoff, actually.

    Unlikely. From the clip of Steve Baker they just played on Sky even he seemed to understand that a lockdown had become necessary so no chance a Cabinet Minister will kill their career by appearing irresponsible over this.
    What about the guy who called Sir Keir Starmer 'Captain Hindsight' a few weeks ago?
    What was Starmer actually calling for? Did he want schools to be shut?
    Similar to what we have in Wales.

    I am sure what Boris has in mind is a regional 4 tier system, not a national lockdown. This will be regionally focused and much better. It will not be a national lockdown but a targeted, focused regional lockdown where all the region's have been focused into tier 4.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,675

    rkrkrk said:



    BTW does everyone on PB agree that Starmer was right and displayed characteristic foresight in calling for the policy the government is now following, albeit too late?

    Lol - you've been on here long enough to know better!
    And Boris is not following Starmer's 14 day circuit breaker, this is for a full 28 days not advocated by him
    If he had listened to Starmer it wouldn't have now needed a 28 day circuit breaker.

    As usual, Boris Johnson has left it far too late.
    Quite. What is unforgivable is that he failed to learn from the experience in the Spring.

    We knew how this story plays out, but at the key moment Boris hesitated.
  • Masterful! Just watched BBC1

    The Channels have cleared their schedules since 16.00.

    They have to fill the air with something.

    Who can they get?

    Government critics, that's who....

    Poetic (or rather political) justice
  • Roy_G_Biv said:

    Boris Johnson: a farce wrapped in a mockery inside a sham. Get him out.

    That is upto his mps and I expect many are thinking very seriously about it
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,176

    rkrkrk said:



    BTW does everyone on PB agree that Starmer was right and displayed characteristic foresight in calling for the policy the government is now following, albeit too late?

    Lol - you've been on here long enough to know better!
    And Boris is not following Starmer's 14 day circuit breaker, this is for a full 28 days not advocated by him
    If he had listened to Starmer it wouldn't have now needed a 28 day circuit breaker.

    As usual, Boris Johnson has left it far too late.
    Wales offers us a glimpse of an alternative history.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518

    tlg86 said:

    Mortimer said:

    I suspect the delay is because they're agonising over exactly how to sell it without it seeming like a victory for Starmer. I don't imagine the delay is anything to do with reflecting on what's best for the national interest.

    Wonder if it's a resignation standoff, actually.

    Unlikely. From the clip of Steve Baker they just played on Sky even he seemed to understand that a lockdown had become necessary so no chance a Cabinet Minister will kill their career by appearing irresponsible over this.
    What about the guy who called Sir Keir Starmer 'Captain Hindsight' a few weeks ago?
    What was Starmer actually calling for? Did he want schools to be shut?
    Similar to what we have in Wales.

    I am sure what Boris has in mind is a regional 4 tier system, not a national lockdown. This will be regionally focused and much better. It will not be a national lockdown but a targeted, focused regional lockdown where all the region's have been focused into tier 4.
    I look forward to him announcing on December 2nd that some areas are allowed out for Christmas and some aren't...
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,714

    Foxy said:

    IanB2 said:

    Bozo is completely shit at doing the hard graft of politics.

    He’d have learned more from eight years as a Borough councillor than being dropped straight into London mayor and evading any scrutiny thereafter.
    TMay and John Major both had stints as Councillor on their CV; are there any other PMs?

    And although neither ended as a raging success, in terms of keeping on keeping on through horrible circumstances that weren't really their fault, they both had a certain something.

    It's the risk with Rishi, he's been in politics for about 30 minutes and we've not seen what he's like when his back is really against the wall. (Dishing out cash in a crisis is traumatic, but in a different way).
    Attlee was mayor of Stepney.
    Ta. Similar mould really- the grownup in the room, which was their burden and strength.
    Neville Chamberlain too.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,205
    TimT said:

    US Election: PA

    Interesting that it is 2 GOP counties that have had problems getting mail-in ballots to voters in time, and that it is mostly GOP counties that are delaying the count of mail-in ballots until Wednesday.

    Meanwhile, Philly has received back 325,000 of the 400,000 mail-in ballots it sent out, none have been challenged, and they will start counting them at 07:00am on Election Day. Looks like we'll have a very significant Dem lead in the vote early on, and then the question is 'will Trump be able to claw it back?'

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/10/31/politics/deadline-philadelphia-pennsylvania-mail-in-challenge/index.html

    The Democrat operation on mail in ballots seems impressive and organised (Maybe self organised ?) compared to republicans ballots around the great lakes and PA.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118

    They've already fucked with Little Mix the Search, so if they delay Strictly too they are completely dead to me.
    BTW does everyone on PB agree that Starmer was right and displayed characteristic foresight in calling for the policy the government is now following, albeit too late?
    He seems to have correctly predicted what clueless politicans in their little bubble would do, that's for sure
  • Mortimer said:

    ydoethur said:

    Mortimer said:

    ydoethur said:

    MikeL said:

    What is happening re housing market?

    Are house moves being stopped?

    Including actual physical move of furniture?

    How’s Mr Pioneers going to manage?
    It’s going to cause me some fairly significant headaches as well given the new extension isn’t finished yet. It should be finished this week (it’s outdoor work and anyway, I’m not in during the day) but it’s going to be a right bugger getting the furniture in if I can’t use a removal firm.
    Obviously don't know the rules, but given 'travel for work' will apparently be allowed, I don't see why removals would be stopped....
    Mixing inside private houses will not be.
    Do you mix with your removal firm? I don't. I think there were exemptions for professionals on house calls in the spring, weren't there?
    Our carpet fitters were told they could not enter our house to fit a new carpet during Wales fire breaker
  • LadyGLadyG Posts: 2,221
    A tragic advert on Sky, during the rugby half time, for all your lovely local businesses: restaurants, pubs, quirky shops.

    And all about to close down for many weeks, perhaps forever
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,100
    edited October 2020

    rkrkrk said:



    BTW does everyone on PB agree that Starmer was right and displayed characteristic foresight in calling for the policy the government is now following, albeit too late?

    Lol - you've been on here long enough to know better!
    And Boris is not following Starmer's 14 day circuit breaker, this is for a full 28 days not advocated by him
    If he had listened to Starmer it wouldn't have now needed a 28 day circuit breaker.

    As usual, Boris Johnson has left it far too late.
    Yes we would. But now we will probably end up with 2 months.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,376

    Sean_F said:

    Mortimer said:

    I suspect the delay is because they're agonising over exactly how to sell it without it seeming like a victory for Starmer. I don't imagine the delay is anything to do with reflecting on what's best for the national interest.

    Wonder if it's a resignation standoff, actually.

    Were I a minister, I think I would find it impossible to defend this.
    How would I look Cyclefree's daughter in the eye? People like her do the right thing and get crapped on.
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,468
    edited October 2020
    rcs1000 said:

    I'm rather enjoying Watch Dogs: Legion.


    Just started watching the first season of Legion. Not one for the wife - the plot is too complex and non-linear for someone who sleeps through at least 50% of each show. But I am enjoying it.

    Ah! Googled Watch Dogs: Legion. See the two are totally unrelated.
  • rkrkrk said:



    BTW does everyone on PB agree that Starmer was right and displayed characteristic foresight in calling for the policy the government is now following, albeit too late?

    Lol - you've been on here long enough to know better!
    And Boris is not following Starmer's 14 day circuit breaker, this is for a full 28 days not advocated by him
    If he had listened to Starmer it wouldn't have now needed a 28 day circuit breaker.

    As usual, Boris Johnson has left it far too late.
    That is very far from certain
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,100
    edited October 2020
    I think the BBC are slightly overdoing it...

    The year Marcus Rashford 'changed the country'

    https://www.bbc.com/sport/av/football/54754642
  • I have received many kind messages in the last few days and I have decided to return. I will be posting in a reduced manner for the foreseeable future.
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,127

    Mortimer said:

    ydoethur said:

    Mortimer said:

    ydoethur said:

    MikeL said:

    What is happening re housing market?

    Are house moves being stopped?

    Including actual physical move of furniture?

    How’s Mr Pioneers going to manage?
    It’s going to cause me some fairly significant headaches as well given the new extension isn’t finished yet. It should be finished this week (it’s outdoor work and anyway, I’m not in during the day) but it’s going to be a right bugger getting the furniture in if I can’t use a removal firm.
    Obviously don't know the rules, but given 'travel for work' will apparently be allowed, I don't see why removals would be stopped....
    Mixing inside private houses will not be.
    Do you mix with your removal firm? I don't. I think there were exemptions for professionals on house calls in the spring, weren't there?
    Our carpet fitters were told they could not enter our house to fit a new carpet during Wales fire breaker
    Wales couldn't have designed a more anti-business policy if they tried, could they.


  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,376
    rkrkrk said:



    BTW does everyone on PB agree that Starmer was right and displayed characteristic foresight in calling for the policy the government is now following, albeit too late?

    Lol - you've been on here long enough to know better!
    I think that both Starmer and the government are wrong.
  • Roy_G_Biv said:

    Boris Johnson: a farce wrapped in a mockery inside a sham. Get him out.

    That is upto his mps and I expect many are thinking very seriously about it
    Wonder how many letters are lodged with the 1922 Committee?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,421
    alex_ said:

    Mortimer said:

    ydoethur said:

    Mortimer said:

    ydoethur said:

    MikeL said:

    What is happening re housing market?

    Are house moves being stopped?

    Including actual physical move of furniture?

    How’s Mr Pioneers going to manage?
    It’s going to cause me some fairly significant headaches as well given the new extension isn’t finished yet. It should be finished this week (it’s outdoor work and anyway, I’m not in during the day) but it’s going to be a right bugger getting the furniture in if I can’t use a removal firm.
    Obviously don't know the rules, but given 'travel for work' will apparently be allowed, I don't see why removals would be stopped....
    Mixing inside private houses will not be.
    Do you mix with your removal firm? I don't. I think there were exemptions for professionals on house calls in the spring, weren't there?
    Moving house was explicitly allowed in the spring. They can't force people into homelessness.
    So RP would be OK. But what about moving items within a house, which is what I would need? I could move some of it myself, but not all of it.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118

    isam said:

    isam said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Our leaders should admit they’re totally lost

    Britain isn’t suffering from lockdown fatigue, it has just lost faith in the cocksure claims of politicians and scientists

    Matthew Parris" (£)

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/comment/our-leaders-should-admit-theyre-totally-lost-gtpjzkr9p

    Nothing will happen until somebody new springs up to challenge the tories and labour.

    The only candidate right now is Farage and he has his head so far up Trump's backside he has no conception of what is going on
    https://twitter.com/brexitparty_uk/status/1314236764857524231?s=20
    They seem quite on the ball with marketing, hopefully once Farage has descended, as you say, he will stand up for the decent sized minority who aren't in favour of lockdowns.

    https://twitter.com/brexitparty_uk/status/1322221435306332160?s=20
    I suspect we'll see a Tory MP defect to TBP soon enough - a maverick malcontent in the Reckless, Carswell mould. Many have always adored Nigel and Boris just didn't cut it as a Farage clone in the end.
    Steve Baker hopefully
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    1) Keep a solid base at all times
    2) respect the teep - I remember the very first time I delivered one and my partner staggered backwards heavily. I said "Are you taking the piss?" Then he delivered one and I staggered back just as much.
  • Mal557Mal557 Posts: 662
    HYUFD said:

    56% of Tory members want Trump to win the US presidential election, 22.5% want Biden to win according to a new ConHome survey

    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2020/10/our-survey-more-than-half-of-tory-members-want-trump-to-win-next-week.html

    Good job its not them voting for him then :)
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,773
    RIP James Bond
  • rural_voterrural_voter Posts: 2,038
    MaxPB said:

    LadyG said:

    I take this guy's point - he's quite cogent - however if lockdowns are so utterly useless and damaging, why are they being enforced by: Germany, France, Holland, Belgium, Spain, Australia, Czechia, Iran, and previously in China, Singapore, etc?
    Lockdowns are useful in buying time to organise. We have proven we can't or won't do that so there's no point. Asian countries used them to buy time, we're using the to stop infections.
    Unless the aim is to stop the NHS being overwhelmed, and 1,000s more dying, lockdowns will raise total deaths.

    F*** knows why most countries reversed the past 100 years of public health policy. This policy was to a) allow the healthy to live normal lives and b) isolate the sick.

    People like me are just asking for a reversion to this approach. Similarly those who signed the Great Barrington Declaration.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    I don't see how Johnson can announce a month long shut-down without a new package for businesses to go with it. But presumably there isn't one. And now being countrywide it will be on an order of magnitude in expense terms than the previous one in place.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,036
    HYUFD said:

    56% of Tory members want Trump to win the US presidential election, 22.5% want Biden to win according to a new ConHome survey

    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2020/10/our-survey-more-than-half-of-tory-members-want-trump-to-win-next-week.html

    Shows how different the members are to Conservative voters.

    Of course, the same is true of our side.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,100
    edited October 2020
    Alistair said:

    1) Keep a solid base at all times
    2) respect the teep - I remember the very first time I delivered one and my partner staggered backwards heavily. I said "Are you taking the piss?" Then he delivered one and I staggered back just as much.
    This guy (Scott Adkins) is in a lot of movies, but is legit martial artist....

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Ulnfy76VHg
  • LadyGLadyG Posts: 2,221
    edited October 2020

    rkrkrk said:



    BTW does everyone on PB agree that Starmer was right and displayed characteristic foresight in calling for the policy the government is now following, albeit too late?

    Lol - you've been on here long enough to know better!
    And Boris is not following Starmer's 14 day circuit breaker, this is for a full 28 days not advocated by him
    If he had listened to Starmer it wouldn't have now needed a 28 day circuit breaker.

    As usual, Boris Johnson has left it far too late.
    This is total bollocks. There is no clear evidence anywhere in the world that two week circuit breakers work. Indeed, all the evidence points the other way. Lots of countries try a two week lockdown, and then it gets extended, and extended.

    Here, see Israel: they had a supposed short sharp two week lockdown. It got massively extended. It did not work

    https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-israel-marks-two-weeks-of-lockdown-with-record-cases-and-a-covid-czar-on-his-way-out-1.9201517
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,176
    I have to say, I thought by now the economic consequences would be starting to felt beyond those who have had their line of work ended by the restrictions. But I was wrong. Perhaps the government should just print a load more money and put us in lockdown until the new year.
  • Mal557Mal557 Posts: 662

    Roy_G_Biv said:

    Boris Johnson: a farce wrapped in a mockery inside a sham. Get him out.

    That is upto his mps and I expect many are thinking very seriously about it
    Wonder how many letters are lodged with the 1922 Committee?
    39 ?
  • Mortimer said:

    Mortimer said:

    ydoethur said:

    Mortimer said:

    ydoethur said:

    MikeL said:

    What is happening re housing market?

    Are house moves being stopped?

    Including actual physical move of furniture?

    How’s Mr Pioneers going to manage?
    It’s going to cause me some fairly significant headaches as well given the new extension isn’t finished yet. It should be finished this week (it’s outdoor work and anyway, I’m not in during the day) but it’s going to be a right bugger getting the furniture in if I can’t use a removal firm.
    Obviously don't know the rules, but given 'travel for work' will apparently be allowed, I don't see why removals would be stopped....
    Mixing inside private houses will not be.
    Do you mix with your removal firm? I don't. I think there were exemptions for professionals on house calls in the spring, weren't there?
    Our carpet fitters were told they could not enter our house to fit a new carpet during Wales fire breaker
    Wales couldn't have designed a more anti-business policy if they tried, could they.


    Agreed
  • Mal557Mal557 Posts: 662
    Cummings the culprit? Has a ring to it
  • So Boris is announcing a lockdown on a day when new infections are lower than they were a week ago and when the positive tests ratio has fallen to 6%.

    Well at least its a different approach to what other European countries have done - I doubt he realises that though.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,100
    edited October 2020

    Mortimer said:

    Mortimer said:

    ydoethur said:

    Mortimer said:

    ydoethur said:

    MikeL said:

    What is happening re housing market?

    Are house moves being stopped?

    Including actual physical move of furniture?

    How’s Mr Pioneers going to manage?
    It’s going to cause me some fairly significant headaches as well given the new extension isn’t finished yet. It should be finished this week (it’s outdoor work and anyway, I’m not in during the day) but it’s going to be a right bugger getting the furniture in if I can’t use a removal firm.
    Obviously don't know the rules, but given 'travel for work' will apparently be allowed, I don't see why removals would be stopped....
    Mixing inside private houses will not be.
    Do you mix with your removal firm? I don't. I think there were exemptions for professionals on house calls in the spring, weren't there?
    Our carpet fitters were told they could not enter our house to fit a new carpet during Wales fire breaker
    Wales couldn't have designed a more anti-business policy if they tried, could they.


    Agreed
    I disagree, its very pro business, if you only consider Amazon....Jeff should be sending Drakeford a big Christmas present.
  • Mal557Mal557 Posts: 662

    I have received many kind messages in the last few days and I have decided to return. I will be posting in a reduced manner for the foreseeable future.

    Welcome back
  • alex_ said:

    I don't see how Johnson can announce a month long shut-down without a new package for businesses to go with it. But presumably there isn't one. And now being countrywide it will be on an order of magnitude in expense terms than the previous one in place.

    To be honest a similar temporary package should follow for the 28 days
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Sean_F said:

    rkrkrk said:



    BTW does everyone on PB agree that Starmer was right and displayed characteristic foresight in calling for the policy the government is now following, albeit too late?

    Lol - you've been on here long enough to know better!
    I think that both Starmer and the government are wrong.
    Some MP's will try and vote it down, but 95% of them belong to parties who wont consider any option bar lockdown
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,176

    So Boris is announcing a lockdown on a day when new infections are lower than they were a week ago and when the positive tests ratio has fallen to 6%.

    Well at least its a different approach to what other European countries have done - I doubt he realises that though.

    If the concern is that the headline figures are disguising more concerning trends, then they need to say so.
  • tlg86 said:

    I have to say, I thought by now the economic consequences would be starting to felt beyond those who have had their line of work ended by the restrictions. But I was wrong. Perhaps the government should just print a load more money and put us in lockdown until the new year.

    Well tomorrow's when the economic pain starts with the end of the furlough scheme.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    tlg86 said:

    So Boris is announcing a lockdown on a day when new infections are lower than they were a week ago and when the positive tests ratio has fallen to 6%.

    Well at least its a different approach to what other European countries have done - I doubt he realises that though.

    If the concern is that the headline figures are disguising more concerning trends, then they need to say so.
    Why continue to both publishing headline figures if it's all so misleading.
  • Mal557Mal557 Posts: 662
    Just a taster of what will happen if Trump loses sadly.
  • rpjsrpjs Posts: 3,787
    11.30pm tonight GMT should see the release of Ann Selzer’s final poll of the presidential race in Iowa. She has a very good track record for polling her state. If it shows Biden ahead, Trump is done.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,176

    tlg86 said:

    I have to say, I thought by now the economic consequences would be starting to felt beyond those who have had their line of work ended by the restrictions. But I was wrong. Perhaps the government should just print a load more money and put us in lockdown until the new year.

    Well tomorrow's when the economic pain starts with the end of the furlough scheme.
    Curious how little attention that has received in the media. I guess that will be the next big argument.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868
    MikeL said:

    What is happening re housing market?

    Are house moves being stopped?

    Including actual physical move of furniture?

    People can’t sell out of London quick enough.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,773
    There is a lot to dislike about Steve Baker.

    In a week though where the arch-stupid has been self-impaled though I'll give him whatever space he needs.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118

    Baker's onboard.

    //twitter.com/SteveBakerHW/status/1322594804480565249
    //twitter.com/SteveBakerHW/status/1322595218298933252

    Bloody God Botherer
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,468
    Mal557 said:

    Just a taster of what will happen if Trump loses sadly.
    So, there are 20 vehicles in a Trump convoy. What am I missing? What is the big issue?
  • I have received many kind messages in the last few days and I have decided to return. I will be posting in a reduced manner for the foreseeable future.

    Don't get upset by anything you think unkind.

    People sometimes lose their temper or write things which read differently to what they thought.

    But that's part of PB - if we have to behave as at a vicarage tea party the discussions will lose much of their value.

    Its good to have you back.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,468
    Am I right in thinking that support bubbles will go? Being able to see my girlfriend is the only thing that has been keeping me sane. :s
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,868
    I have to say the government cynically using the "protect the NHS" line to cover up its own failures in setting up a proper testing system and being able to track down contacts rapidly is something that needs serious media attention. They are using the NHS as a protective shield for their own incompetence and cronyism and people are cheering them on as they do it.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    TimT said:

    Mal557 said:

    Just a taster of what will happen if Trump loses sadly.
    So, there are 20 vehicles in a Trump convoy. What am I missing? What is the big issue?
    Read the rest of the tweet thread. They were armed and waiting to ambush the Biden/Harris campaign bus and tried to drive it off the road. The bus tour had to be cancelled.
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,468
    TimT said:

    Mal557 said:

    Just a taster of what will happen if Trump loses sadly.
    So, there are 20 vehicles in a Trump convoy. What am I missing? What is the big issue?
    OK, You need to click through to the twitter thread. Intimidation. Plain and simple
  • Mal557 said:

    Just a taster of what will happen if Trump loses sadly.
    When he loses
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,425
    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    I have to say, I thought by now the economic consequences would be starting to felt beyond those who have had their line of work ended by the restrictions. But I was wrong. Perhaps the government should just print a load more money and put us in lockdown until the new year.

    Well tomorrow's when the economic pain starts with the end of the furlough scheme.
    Curious how little attention that has received in the media. I guess that will be the next big argument.
    Not sure. I think we could face a week of arguments over whether this is a new lockdown, a circuit breaker, tier 4, national measures, etc. Seems to be the sort of argument the media like to have.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,468
    Great craic from Sleepy Joe
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868

    So Boris is announcing a lockdown on a day when new infections are lower than they were a week ago and when the positive tests ratio has fallen to 6%.

    Well at least its a different approach to what other European countries have done - I doubt he realises that though.

    Whatever role Bozo is playing in all this, leader it ain't.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,858
    alex_ said:

    I don't see how Johnson can announce a month long shut-down without a new package for businesses to go with it. But presumably there isn't one. And now being countrywide it will be on an order of magnitude in expense terms than the previous one in place.

    The furlough scheme ends today. Does it start again tomorrow?

    I am not sure. The sums involved are staggering. I am a director of a company with just over 100 staff. The company, and associated bodies, have received nearly £500k in furlough payments. Our average wages are pretty high but jeez, the country simply can’t keep that up.
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 3,080
    Mal557 said:

    Just a taster of what will happen if Trump loses sadly.
    I think Biden is indeed ahead, BUT I think that several million postals will be disallowed, voter suppression in key areas will be significant and Trump may well claim an unlikely and illegal victory and try to hang on.

    That would be a total nightmare scenario for punters, and for the USA and it is a non-trivial chance.

    It is also one reason why I have a bet on that Donald Trump faces both indictment and incarceration upon his removal from office,
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,425
    TimT said:

    Mal557 said:

    Just a taster of what will happen if Trump loses sadly.
    So, there are 20 vehicles in a Trump convoy. What am I missing? What is the big issue?
    Read the thread. They were waiting for a Biden campaign bus, attempted to force it off the road, managed to stop the rest of the day's campaigning. Police wouldn't intervene to stop them.
  • Roy_G_BivRoy_G_Biv Posts: 998
    MaxPB said:

    I have to say the government cynically using the "protect the NHS" line to cover up its own failures in setting up a proper testing system and being able to track down contacts rapidly is something that needs serious media attention. They are using the NHS as a protective shield for their own incompetence and cronyism and people are cheering them on as they do it.

    It just seems so out of character for Boris Johnson
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,487
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,357

    "no choice" on national extreme lockdown says rent-a-zero-covid-zealot from Scotland.

    Of course there's a choice. That's what the Cabinet are supposed to decide.

    If the government had followed the advice of Prof Devi Sridhar in the summer we would not be in this mess.
    For the nutjobs the fact that she is from Scotland means she must be ignored as crazy and stupid
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,410

    Scott_xP said:
    A U-turn, U -turn.
    630.

    Perhaps we will have tier 6.5 instead of tier 4.0?
    Let's follow the lead of the Goombay Dance Band - and have Seven Tiers......
    Hopefully not Sting
    "There is a Seventh Wave..."
  • tlg86 said:

    So Boris is announcing a lockdown on a day when new infections are lower than they were a week ago and when the positive tests ratio has fallen to 6%.

    Well at least its a different approach to what other European countries have done - I doubt he realises that though.

    If the concern is that the headline figures are disguising more concerning trends, then they need to say so.
    They would have to back that up with more than blather.
  • JACK_WJACK_W Posts: 682
    National - Angus Reid Institute - Rated B+ - 2231 LV - 23/28 Oct

    Biden 53 .. Trump 48

    http://angusreid.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/2020.10.29_USVote-2020.pdf

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,137
    edited October 2020

    HYUFD said:

    56% of Tory members want Trump to win the US presidential election, 22.5% want Biden to win according to a new ConHome survey

    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2020/10/our-survey-more-than-half-of-tory-members-want-trump-to-win-next-week.html

    Shows how different the members are to Conservative voters.

    Of course, the same is true of our side.
    True though in 2016 they preferred Hillary by 46% to 17% for Trump so I suspect Biden's response to the internal markets bill and Trump's approach to Brexit has swung them to him this time, I was one of the minority who voted for Biden in this instance (but I still think Trump can win the EC)

    https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2016/12/under-half-of-tory-members-are-pleased-at-trumps-win.html
  • kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 4,951

    Am I right in thinking that support bubbles will go? Being able to see my girlfriend is the only thing that has been keeping me sane. :s

    I can get behind mask wearing and two metre distancing and even the pubs closing. But I'm genuinely struggling to understand why anyone would obey diktats like these during lockdown 2.
  • YBarddCwscYBarddCwsc Posts: 7,172

    I don't think a debate in the HoC is important. It will be the usual teejus political point-scoring.

    Almost all the MPs are not numerate enough to understand any modelling, except that done with Playdough.

    What I do think is really important is that all the data and all the modelling codes that are being used to make the forward predictions are placed in their entirety in the public domain. Has/will that be done?

    That way, the codes & analysis can be pulled apart and put together again by other scientists. And we will be able to get confidence in whether their results are trustworthy enough.
  • JACK_W said:

    National - Angus Reid Institute - Rated B+ - 2231 LV - 23/28 Oct

    Biden 53 .. Trump 48

    http://angusreid.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/2020.10.29_USVote-2020.pdf

    Typo, Jack. It's 53/45.
  • Mal557Mal557 Posts: 662
    Cicero said:

    Mal557 said:

    Just a taster of what will happen if Trump loses sadly.
    I think Biden is indeed ahead, BUT I think that several million postals will be disallowed, voter suppression in key areas will be significant and Trump may well claim an unlikely and illegal victory and try to hang on.

    That would be a total nightmare scenario for punters, and for the USA and it is a non-trivial chance.

    It is also one reason why I have a bet on that Donald Trump faces both indictment and incarceration upon his removal from office,
    You can see how this is going to pan out, Trump will be at the WH election night and on day voting will quite possibly show him ahead in enough swing states to 'declare' victory. For most of his devoted , that is enough and any votes that come in after, regardless of their legailty, will be fraudulent in Trump and their eyes.

    My hope is that Biden wins in FL as if he does it will be that much harder for Trump to try to dispute the result. Sadly my feeling is he will win FL just and this will drag on for days and weeks. It really has all the signs of being a nightmare indeed
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,487

    rkrkrk said:



    BTW does everyone on PB agree that Starmer was right and displayed characteristic foresight in calling for the policy the government is now following, albeit too late?

    Lol - you've been on here long enough to know better!
    And Boris is not following Starmer's 14 day circuit breaker, this is for a full 28 days not advocated by him
    Foresight hindsight sminesight both sides have been trying to blame the other and play political games with this.

    I hold no candle for Boris but the Government has to balance difficult economic and social considerations with scientific advice.

    They've been trying to contain the virus using the most limited and targeted approach possible and I believe the tiers were and are rational.

    If there was a failing it was allowing the gaping hole on foreign travel - the equivalent of leakage from hospitals into care homes in March and April.
This discussion has been closed.