Swinson got monstered in particular, that was brutal. Didn't even do anything much to deserve it (and that's coming from someone who strongly values respecting the referendum result).
Interesting from Jonathan Freedland n the guardian
He is all over the place trying to convince himself and others there is a way to a Labour government (clue he will need Plaid and the SNP even on a good day).
But tucked away is this little bit of information
" I’m told that at one focus group in a northern Labour seat this week, the party’s free broadband offer was “laughed out of the room”."
Interesting from Jonathan Freedland n the guardian
He is all over the place trying to convince himself and others there is a way to a Labour government (clue he will need Plaid and the SNP even on a good day).
But tucked away is this little bit of information
" I’m told that at one focus group in a northern Labour seat this week, the party’s free broadband offer was “laughed out of the room”."
oh and this
Charalambous was also sent away with a flea in his ear by several Jewish families, one all but pushing him off the premises, loudly telling him it was “disgusting” that he could work for “someone like that”, referring to Corbyn. There are perhaps 1,500 Jews in Enfield Southgate.
Didn't they get the memo about his anti racist credentials?
Swinson got monstered in particular, that was brutal. Didn't even do anything much to deserve it (and that's coming from someone who strongly values respecting the referendum result).
It's the horrible badly drawn cartoon long sleeve smocks she wears, they make it impossible not to disagree with everything she says and does
Swinson got monstered in particular, that was brutal. Didn't even do anything much to deserve it (and that's coming from someone who strongly values respecting the referendum result).
One day, maybe soon, we’ll all stop being aware we’re living through the next Tim Shipman book.
Interesting from Jonathan Freedland n the guardian
He is all over the place trying to convince himself and others there is a way to a Labour government (clue he will need Plaid and the SNP even on a good day).
But tucked away is this little bit of information
" I’m told that at one focus group in a northern Labour seat this week, the party’s free broadband offer was “laughed out of the room”."
“State internet”. What could people see wrong in that🥴?. I mean there’s 100% approval in Pyongyang.
Car crash for Bozo. All the leaders got some hostile questioning, but he really cannot handle it. He is so needy, that he cannot bear not being liked. It is why he tells different audiences different things.
I think you are prejeudiced and half your hospital staff were in the audience
Swinson got monstered in particular, that was brutal. Didn't even do anything much to deserve it (and that's coming from someone who strongly values respecting the referendum result).
It's the horrible badly drawn cartoon long sleeve smocks she wears, they make it impossible not to disagree with everything she says and does
I thought Corbyns answer on Brexit is fair . Surely that’s the only way you don’t piss off half the country .
Yes - by pissing off both halves.
I suspect a large part of Labours problem is they promised leavers they would respect the referendum result in 2017 when they had no intention of doing so. That lie is coming back to bite them hard.
This is why it's not going to be a replay of 2017.
Bozo of the debate award goes to the lefty corbynite who chose to bring up Corbyn's approach to anti Semitism in his attack on Swinson thereby giving her the opportunity to give Corbyn a further kicking on it . You could almost hear the palms hitting the faces among the Labour camp back stage
This crowd are brutal , shame for Bozo he’s on last . More people will be watching .
Many will have turned over for Corrie but he is doing very well anyway
This is desperate spin , he started off okay and has gone downhill ever since .
It is not desperate spin, the only desperate spin is coming from leftwingers desperately trying and failing to undermine Boris
Indeed. And none of then citing specifics.
What did he say about longest waiting lists worst ever A&E numbers worst ever cancer numbers that he was asked.
Fook All
He is putting in more money and will have more money to put in further still when we get Brexit done
And the only party who can put money into anything Is one nation conservatives like he is because the others will wreck the economy. And he can’t be accountable for anything that’s gone on before his 100 days, he was Mayor for much of last 9 years of austerity, achieving things in London on a trump scale of greatness.
It’s a hell of a hard sell, but the Labour Brexit position is the best on offer.
It might well be but it doesnt give the extremer remainers the clarity they might like - however they seem prepared to just ignore that, rather than back the unequivocal remainers, and it allows labour leavers to pretend it will happen. Can they keep up the recovery? Per RobD we're at the stage labour really closed the gap last time
This crowd are brutal , shame for Bozo he’s on last . More people will be watching .
Many will have turned over for Corrie but he is doing very well anyway
This is desperate spin , he started off okay and has gone downhill ever since .
It is not desperate spin, the only desperate spin is coming from leftwingers desperately trying and failing to undermine Boris
Indeed. And none of then citing specifics.
What did he say about longest waiting lists worst ever A&E numbers worst ever cancer numbers that he was asked.
Fook All
He is putting in more money and will have more money to put in further still when we get Brexit done
And the only party who can put money into anything Is one nation conservatives like he is because the others will wreck the economy. And he can’t be accountable for anything that’s gone on before his 100 days, he was Mayor for much of last 9 years of austerity, achieving things in London on a trump scale of greatness.
As he made clear, Boris is the most charismatic and effective campaigning Tory leader of my lifetime, even better than Thatcher, though he will not match her legacy, few can.
This crowd are brutal , shame for Bozo he’s on last . More people will be watching .
Many will have turned over for Corrie but he is doing very well anyway
This is desperate spin , he started off okay and has gone downhill ever since .
It is not desperate spin, the only desperate spin is coming from leftwingers desperately trying and failing to undermine Boris
Indeed. And none of then citing specifics.
What did he say about longest waiting lists worst ever A&E numbers worst ever cancer numbers that he was asked.
Fook All
He is putting in more money and will have more money to put in further still when we get Brexit done
9 years of cuts whilst top rate taxpayers have a bonanza.
Real Change is needed.
But why the ridiculous nationalization and retrograde labour laws which detract from solving real problems putting RM in public ownership is of no benefit to anyone, BR was a disaster and a return to secondary picketing and imposing collective bargaining on business sectors is crazy. If you want to help those who need help why waste time and money on such stupid objectives that are of no benefit to anybody but Len and his mates.
I forgot it was on and watched RU Pauls Drag Race UK Final on catch up. Vivienne was a worthy winner.
In fairness I thought the one with the blonde wig “sashayed away” pretty well at the end. Didn't fall off the podium like that Edwina in 2015. Or am I confusing channels?😉
It's the first UK contest so maybe the falling Edwina was on the US show.
I forgot it was on and watched RU Pauls Drag Race UK Final on catch up. Vivienne was a worthy winner.
In fairness I thought the one with the blonde wig “sashayed away” pretty well at the end. Didn't fall off the podium like that Edwina in 2015. Or am I confusing channels?😉
It's the first UK contest so maybe the falling Edwina was on the US show.
I can see why Boris's enemies hate him so much. There seems to be a mountain of ammunition against him for many reasons, some legitimate, some not, but however he responds, he is utterly compelling in a way that none of the other politicians can reproduce. And therein lies Labour's problem with those millions of leave voters who are going to exact a bloody revenge against them. They'll hold their nose and vote for Boris in a way that millions of Tory remainers will not vote for Corbyn.
I think viewers will have some sympathy for Swinson . Given the barrage against her I think she handled it as best she could .
I think she did best of what I saw, considering the very left wing audience.
Yes. Speaking as someone who wishes the LibDems no luck at all in this election, she was ambushed by a much more hostile audience than the others. At some stage the broadcasters are going to have to be reminded that election programmes should be there to help voters decide, not as “entertainment” where we all hope someone is “caught out”.
This crowd are brutal , shame for Bozo he’s on last . More people will be watching .
Many will have turned over for Corrie but he is doing very well anyway
This is desperate spin , he started off okay and has gone downhill ever since .
It is not desperate spin, the only desperate spin is coming from leftwingers desperately trying and failing to undermine Boris
Indeed. And none of then citing specifics.
What did he say about longest waiting lists worst ever A&E numbers worst ever cancer numbers that he was asked.
Fook All
He is putting in more money and will have more money to put in further still when we get Brexit done
And the only party who can put money into anything Is one nation conservatives like he is because the others will wreck the economy. And he can’t be accountable for anything that’s gone on before his 100 days, he was Mayor for much of last 9 years of austerity, achieving things in London on a trump scale of greatness.
Can you tell me what you are drinking I would like some
It’s a hell of a hard sell, but the Labour Brexit position is the best on offer.
It might well be but it doesnt give the extremer remainers the clarity they might like - however they seem prepared to just ignore that, rather than back the unequivocal remainers, and it allows labour leavers to pretend it will happen. Can they keep up the recovery? Per RobD we're at the stage labour really closed the gap last time
It’s an easy sell. Very straightforward. And only one that can unite the country rather than exploit its division.
Why a Labour negotiation? To set in law we will not have weaker workers rights, weaker consumer rights, weaker environmental rights. Boris deal does not do this, his deal simply says trust him on that. “Are we the people going to trust you on our rights Boris? No chance”.
Once there is a leave deal that can’t be hijacked by unscrupulous people, then it completes the democratic process by giving the people a say on that. What sort of democracy gives a blank check to negotiators and then takes whatever rubbish they come back with without a say on accepting that negotiation? ? What Boris will be talking against is the democracy underpinning industrial relations in this country his party insisted on. A vote to go and negotiate, and a say on the deal negotiated.
the problem you have Boris, the 2016 mandate did not say how to leave. Remain clear in 2016, remain on Cameron’s deal, leave was a blank check to government to politicians to negotiate any sort of bad deal, bad for the union, bad for workers, bad for consumers, bad for environment, you will then hail this great deal, aren’t we great too for making it, insist this has gone on long enough ,and push through that bad deal. No exercise in Democracy can give politicians a blank check without giving the people a final say. It’s just not full, well rounded democracy.
The serious crime you are being charged with Boris is seeking to exploit this passionate division, not end it.
I can see why Boris's enemies hate him so much. There seems to be a mountain of ammunition against him for many reasons, some legitimate, some not, but however he responds, he is utterly compelling in a way that none of the other politicians can reproduce. And therein lies Labour's problem with those millions of leave voters who are going to exact a bloody revenge against them. They'll hold their nose and vote for Boris in a way that millions of Tory remainers will not vote for Corbyn.
I think it's because when people look at Boris they see a flawed human being who won't judge them, whereas Corbyn is an even more flawed human being who will...
I can see why Boris's enemies hate him so much. There seems to be a mountain of ammunition against him for many reasons, some legitimate, some not, but however he responds, he is utterly compelling in a way that none of the other politicians can reproduce. And therein lies Labour's problem with those millions of leave voters who are going to exact a bloody revenge against them. They'll hold their nose and vote for Boris in a way that millions of Tory remainers will not vote for Corbyn.
Yes Leavers will vote positively for Boris, Remainers will not vote positively for Corbyn and on that performance not really for Swinson either
I can see why Boris's enemies hate him so much. There seems to be a mountain of ammunition against him for many reasons, some legitimate, some not, but however he responds, he is utterly compelling in a way that none of the other politicians can reproduce. And therein lies Labour's problem with those millions of leave voters who are going to exact a bloody revenge against them. They'll hold their nose and vote for Boris in a way that millions of Tory remainers will not vote for Corbyn.
Yes Leavers will vote positively for Boris, Remainers will not vote positively for Corbyn and on that performance not really for Swinson either
Swinsons performance was fine what did she do wrong? Every question was loaded against her and she defended well tell us what was wrong with her performance
I can see why Boris's enemies hate him so much. There seems to be a mountain of ammunition against him for many reasons, some legitimate, some not, but however he responds, he is utterly compelling in a way that none of the other politicians can reproduce. And therein lies Labour's problem with those millions of leave voters who are going to exact a bloody revenge against them. They'll hold their nose and vote for Boris in a way that millions of Tory remainers will not vote for Corbyn.
In a way that many Labour Leave voters were never going to vote for May.
I can see why Boris's enemies hate him so much. There seems to be a mountain of ammunition against him for many reasons, some legitimate, some not, but however he responds, he is utterly compelling in a way that none of the other politicians can reproduce. And therein lies Labour's problem with those millions of leave voters who are going to exact a bloody revenge against them. They'll hold their nose and vote for Boris in a way that millions of Tory remainers will not vote for Corbyn.
Yes Leavers will vote positively for Boris, Remainers will not vote positively for Corbyn and on that performance not really for Swinson either
Listening to the 9.30 radio news. Main headline is Corbyn staying neutral on Brexit, together with confirmation that Lib Dems would revoke, cons would GBD and Scot Nats favour independence feom the UK. Not sure if this represents a PR win for anyone or not.
I think viewers will have some sympathy for Swinson . Given the barrage against her I think she handled it as best she could .
I think she did best of what I saw, considering the very left wing audience.
Yes. Speaking as someone who wishes the LibDems no luck at all in this election, she was ambushed by a much more hostile audience than the others. At some stage the broadcasters are going to have to be reminded that election programmes should be there to help voters decide, not as “entertainment” where we all hope someone is “caught out”.
Agree with this. The 'gotcha' moment is the only thing the media are interested in. Now don't be too surprised when the politicians stop doing these debates, because honestly, the risk far outstrips the reward.
Listening to the 9.30 radio news. Main headline is Corbyn staying neutral on Brexit, together with confirmation that Lib Dems would revoke, cons would GBD and Scot Nats favour independence feom the UK. Not sure if this represents a PR win for anyone or not.
3 out of 4 have got their preferred message out.
1 of the 4's preferred message has shot them in the foot but c'est la vie.
Listening to the 9.30 radio news. Main headline is Corbyn staying neutral on Brexit, together with confirmation that Lib Dems would revoke, cons would GBD and Scot Nats favour independence feom the UK. Not sure if this represents a PR win for anyone or not.
Listening to the 9.30 radio news. Main headline is Corbyn staying neutral on Brexit, together with confirmation that Lib Dems would revoke, cons would GBD and Scot Nats favour independence feom the UK. Not sure if this represents a PR win for anyone or not.
Corbyn's got an opinion on everything including the finearies of Bolivian politics - yet he's "neutral" on the biggest issue to face this country since the war.
This crowd are brutal , shame for Bozo he’s on last . More people will be watching .
Many will have turned over for Corrie but he is doing very well anyway
This is desperate spin , he started off okay and has gone downhill ever since .
It is not desperate spin, the only desperate spin is coming from leftwingers desperately trying and failing to undermine Boris
Indeed. And none of then citing specifics.
What did he say about longest waiting lists worst ever A&E numbers worst ever cancer numbers that he was asked.
Fook All
He is putting in more money and will have more money to put in further still when we get Brexit done
And the only party who can put money into anything Is one nation conservatives like he is because the others will wreck the economy. And he can’t be accountable for anything that’s gone on before his 100 days, he was Mayor for much of last 9 years of austerity, achieving things in London on a trump scale of greatness.
Can you tell me what you are drinking I would like some
That’s the notes I took. That’s actually how he answered the questions. There was very much a touch of trump about that.
Also the number of times he says one nation. His ERG government are the one nation wing of the conservatives? Are we sure Cummings hasn’t put micro chips in their heads to ensure they are on message?
Far too often the answer is “but what is labour’s brexit policy, they don’t know themselves” when the question and obvious answer isnt anything close to that.
Swinson got monstered in particular, that was brutal. Didn't even do anything much to deserve it (and that's coming from someone who strongly values respecting the referendum result).
It's the horrible badly drawn cartoon long sleeve smocks she wears, they make it impossible not to disagree with everything she says and does
I think viewers will have some sympathy for Swinson . Given the barrage against her I think she handled it as best she could .
I think she did best of what I saw, considering the very left wing audience.
Yes. Speaking as someone who wishes the LibDems no luck at all in this election, she was ambushed by a much more hostile audience than the others. At some stage the broadcasters are going to have to be reminded that election programmes should be there to help voters decide, not as “entertainment” where we all hope someone is “caught out”.
Agree with this. The 'gotcha' moment is the only thing the media are interested in. Now don't be too surprised when the politicians stop doing these debates, because honestly, the risk far outstrips the reward.
Refusing to do the debate with Corbyn suddenly turning up for it was May's 'gotcha' moment.
Hopefully no leader would be so moronic as to fail to turn up to them again in the future.
I can see why Boris's enemies hate him so much. There seems to be a mountain of ammunition against him for many reasons, some legitimate, some not, but however he responds, he is utterly compelling in a way that none of the other politicians can reproduce. And therein lies Labour's problem with those millions of leave voters who are going to exact a bloody revenge against them. They'll hold their nose and vote for Boris in a way that millions of Tory remainers will not vote for Corbyn.
Yes Leavers will vote positively for Boris, Remainers will not vote positively for Corbyn and on that performance not really for Swinson either
Tory Remainers will vote to stop Corbyn.
If you’re a Tory remainer watching that I don’t think you’re going to want to be helping Corbyn out in any way. Though the reality is I don’t think today’s show will have changed many minds.
I can see why Boris's enemies hate him so much. There seems to be a mountain of ammunition against him for many reasons, some legitimate, some not, but however he responds, he is utterly compelling in a way that none of the other politicians can reproduce. And therein lies Labour's problem with those millions of leave voters who are going to exact a bloody revenge against them. They'll hold their nose and vote for Boris in a way that millions of Tory remainers will not vote for Corbyn.
Yes Leavers will vote positively for Boris, Remainers will not vote positively for Corbyn and on that performance not really for Swinson either
I'd agree. My Tory MP is a people vote remainer but I'm moving from not voting to voting for him to stop the other two. Latest LD leaflet (number 8) is all about who will stand up to Corbyn. I suspect that means the fight is on for second place.
I can see why Boris's enemies hate him so much. There seems to be a mountain of ammunition against him for many reasons, some legitimate, some not, but however he responds, he is utterly compelling in a way that none of the other politicians can reproduce. And therein lies Labour's problem with those millions of leave voters who are going to exact a bloody revenge against them. They'll hold their nose and vote for Boris in a way that millions of Tory remainers will not vote for Corbyn.
I think it's because when people look at Boris they see a flawed human being who won't judge them, whereas Corbyn is an even more flawed human being who will...
I don’t mind my leaders getting pissed now and again and falling over, or having an active sex life, or generally being human with flaws. It’s better than some monk like fanatical loon.
But beyond that the question is for all their faults: is this person on my side? I might disagree with their way of going about being on my side and disagree about loads of stuff but I won’t lie awake at night worrying. Blair, even hopeless Brown, were in that group. So is Hillary Benn et al, so in fairness is Jo Swinson with whom I agree about just about nothing, but, Corbyn, et al? Christ I hope they are removed from our public life forthwith never to be seen again. Now.
Swinson got monstered in particular, that was brutal. Didn't even do anything much to deserve it (and that's coming from someone who strongly values respecting the referendum result).
It's the horrible badly drawn cartoon long sleeve smocks she wears, they make it impossible not to disagree with everything she says and does
I can see why Boris's enemies hate him so much. There seems to be a mountain of ammunition against him for many reasons, some legitimate, some not, but however he responds, he is utterly compelling in a way that none of the other politicians can reproduce. And therein lies Labour's problem with those millions of leave voters who are going to exact a bloody revenge against them. They'll hold their nose and vote for Boris in a way that millions of Tory remainers will not vote for Corbyn.
I think it's because when people look at Boris they see a flawed human being who won't judge them, whereas Corbyn is an even more flawed human being who will...
EVERY single question to johnson is about trust accompanied by cheers from the audience. Doesn't that say something?
That the audience hates Boris?
No. That that they think he's a proven liar
The 2 are not mutually exclusive. They clearly hated him with every fibre of their being. Look at the scruffy kid in the front who refused to listen to Fiona Bruce, listen to the folk who booed him before he had even spoken a word or look at the guy at the end who clearly has some less than friendly words with Boris as he heads off stage. It’s just kinder, gentler, politics.
Comments
Seems fair.
Swinson got monstered in particular, that was brutal. Didn't even do anything much to deserve it (and that's coming from someone who strongly values respecting the referendum result).
He is all over the place trying to convince himself and others there is a way to a Labour government (clue he will need Plaid and the SNP even on a good day).
But tucked away is this little bit of information
" I’m told that at one focus group in a northern Labour seat this week, the party’s free broadband offer was “laughed out of the room”."
Charalambous was also sent away with a flea in his ear by several Jewish families, one all but pushing him off the premises, loudly telling him it was “disgusting” that he could work for “someone like that”, referring to Corbyn. There are perhaps 1,500 Jews in Enfield Southgate.
Didn't they get the memo about his anti racist credentials?
As PM the country will remain badly divided.
But no thanks
Sorry, I just couldn't resist.
Why should it be 25% each when Tories are on 40%+?
https://twitter.com/LabourRichard/status/1197969717622984705?s=20
If the Tories win it will be mainly due to Boris
Twice.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/11/22/jo-swinson-savaged-leavers-remainers-brexit-policy-question/
Twice.
In a Labour city.
Because that always works right.
I'm not saying that's a good omen, I'm just saying
Last one took 13 years and only relatively minorly wrecked it compared to the prior one that led to the Winter of Discontent.
Corbyn's would be wrecking on steroids.
It’s only chance was up against a no deal position by the Tories . I’m afraid the Lib Dems have badly misjudged this .
Are you pissed?
Why a Labour negotiation? To set in law we will not have weaker workers rights, weaker consumer rights, weaker environmental rights. Boris deal does not do this, his deal simply says trust him on that. “Are we the people going to trust you on our rights Boris? No chance”.
Once there is a leave deal that can’t be hijacked by unscrupulous people, then it completes the democratic process by giving the people a say on that. What sort of democracy gives a blank check to negotiators and then takes whatever rubbish they come back with without a say on accepting that negotiation? ? What Boris will be talking against is the democracy underpinning industrial relations in this country his party insisted on. A vote to go and negotiate, and a say on the deal negotiated.
the problem you have Boris, the 2016 mandate did not say how to leave. Remain clear in 2016, remain on Cameron’s deal, leave was a blank check to government to politicians to negotiate any sort of bad deal, bad for the union, bad for workers, bad for consumers, bad for environment, you will then hail this great deal, aren’t we great too for making it, insist this has gone on long enough ,and push through that bad deal. No exercise in Democracy can give politicians a blank check without giving the people a final say. It’s just not full, well rounded democracy.
The serious crime you are being charged with Boris is seeking to exploit this passionate division, not end it.
The fact is people believe he will deliver Brexit and that's why they'll vote for him.
He answered well and considering the audience remained composed and engaging. He was speaking to the country - not the shouty plants hired by Labour.
Sorry to say your car crash didn't happen - so maybe you need to get pissed a bit more to numb the pain of your disappointment maybe?
Jeremy has Stormzy and the schutzstaffel
I don't like one of their politics but they're a good leader for what they believe in.
But she was crap - Boris and team may be ruthless but they have got stuff done.
We don’t need an archbishop- we want a CEO.
The casting director had a mix up.
He has a way with the (white) working class.
He just does. Like it or not.
1 of the 4's preferred message has shot them in the foot but c'est la vie.
Says it all really.
Also the number of times he says one nation. His ERG government are the one nation wing of the conservatives? Are we sure Cummings hasn’t put micro chips in their heads to ensure they are on message?
Far too often the answer is “but what is labour’s brexit policy, they don’t know themselves” when the question and obvious answer isnt anything close to that.
Hopefully no leader would be so moronic as to fail to turn up to them again in the future.
But beyond that the question is for all their faults: is this person on my side? I might disagree with their way of going about being on my side and disagree about loads of stuff but I won’t lie awake at night worrying. Blair, even hopeless Brown, were in that group. So is Hillary Benn et al, so in fairness is Jo Swinson with whom I agree about just about nothing, but, Corbyn, et al? Christ I hope they are removed from our public life forthwith never to be seen again. Now.