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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Darroch shows he’s a true diplomat and resigns

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  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    IanB2 said:

    So we have the first PM Bozo fiasco before he has even got the job...

    Will he actually survive long enough to get the job, those who have laced Johnson May get a surprise win when he has to fall on his sword.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,153
    AndyJS said:

    Scott_P said:
    The problem isn't Kim Darroch or Boris Johnson, the problem is the person who leaked the information.
    Indeed.

    Once Darroch's words were leaked his position was untennable. Boris knew this (Hunt knew this too but wanted to play games at Boris's expense)

    The real story here is who leaked and why? Will we ever know...
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,593
    Charles said:

    Scott_P said:
    It really isn’t a humiliation

    The simple fact is there is a jerk in the White House

    But if he refuses to work with our ambassador that’s something we need to adjust to.

    Adjusting is not the same thing as prostrating.

  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    edited July 2019
    OllyT said:


    Perhaps we should freeze out the US Ambassador following the comments he has made quite publicly about our Prime Minister and the Mayor of London.

    If you can't see that we are just giving in to an overgrown baby and bully to boot then you are entirely missing the point. This is a glimpse of our future after Brexit with Johnson playing Trump's poodle. Any trade deal will be what Trump decides it will be and if we argue he'll throw another tantrum

    That's what we did in the war with JFK's dad who was replaced as US Ambassador because he forecast Nazi victory.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    India 71 for 5.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,677
    I feel like the country is at the end of a human centipede where Trump and Boris form the first two segments. Boris is gobbling shit from Trump's slack old arse and the UK is doing the same to Boris.

    I might get some t-shirts made and start selling merch.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    AndyJS said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Waiting for Trump's next round of Tweets. :D

    It would be nice if Twitter could be shut down for a few months to give everyone a rest.
    Yep.

    Funnily though, when it was first launched hardly anyone could work out what use it would be or why it would work as a service.
    I’m still struggling to see a positive use for it
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,427
    Dura_Ace said:

    I feel like the country is at the end of a human centipede where Trump and Boris form the first two segments. Boris is gobbling shit from Trump's slack old arse and the UK is doing the same to Boris.

    I might get some t-shirts made and start selling merch.

    Shut up and take my money.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,153
    edited July 2019
    IanB2 said:

    Alan Duncan on BBCPL now - “angry with Johnson”

    “Respect [in parliament] for Boris has taken a real nosedive today”

    Hunky Dunky is playing to the gallary as usual.

    Does Team Hunt really think any of this will actually make any difference to Boris becoming Con leader and PM two weeks today?
  • surbiton19surbiton19 Posts: 1,469
    India......skidding !
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,401

    OllyT said:


    Perhaps we should freeze out the US Ambassador following the comments he has made quite publicly about our Prime Minister and the Mayor of London.

    If you can't see that we are just giving in to an overgrown baby and bully to boot then you are entirely missing the point. This is a glimpse of our future after Brexit with Johnson playing Trump's poodle. Any trade deal will be what Trump decides it will be and if we argue he'll throw another tantrum

    That's what we did in the war with JFK's dad who was replaced as US Ambassador because he forecast Nazi victory.
    We are not in a war. At least not yet, but I'm sure when Trump starts throwing the bombs around Boris will be right beside him.

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,267

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,451
  • TrèsDifficileTrèsDifficile Posts: 1,729
    Pant's down! 71/5
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,267
    Right decision by Darroch and Boris can ensure the right successor is appointed
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,153
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,401
    Will the First Division union take some action?
  • JonathanDJonathanD Posts: 2,400

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    At some point fairly soon, 150 Tory MPs, 150 Labour MPs and 20 assorted LDs and Independents need to man up and put country before party.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    It must be quite difficult to get two Es at A Level.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    What's striking is just how many Conservatives are being forthright in their criticism of Boris Johnson on this. If he can't command loyalty now, he's going to find that he has volunteered to lie down on a bed of nails.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,427
    HYUFD said:

    Right decision by Darroch and Boris can ensure the right successor is appointed

    Don’t worry; May and Hunt will pick the successor!
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,147
    Hmmm - I had believed he made the decision on the basis of an acceptance of reality and regardless of the views of any of his political masters. It reflects less well on him if he was swayed by BJ's lack of clear support. Resignation was the right course of action regardless of the comments or lack of them of any politicians.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    The problem with the way Seamus wants Jezza to approach PMQs is that it is all about raising an issue that will give them a few seconds of vid for campaigning social media.

    Never mind if not the big major news story of the day.

    Is it a problem?

    Big issue of the day he will be able to answer question separately.

    Buses or social media clip he can do in PMQ

    No one normal cares what is talked about at PMQ
  • surbiton19surbiton19 Posts: 1,469
    GIN1138 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Alan Duncan on BBCPL now - “angry with Johnson”

    “Respect [in parliament] for Boris has taken a real nosedive today”

    Hunky Dunky is playing to the gallary as usual.

    Does Team Hunt actually think any of this will actually make any difference to Boris becoming Con leader and PM two weeks today?
    No, of course, not. But Blobby must know the consequences of his Trump ar**licking !
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,451
    edited July 2019
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 62,749
    edited July 2019
    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?
    Your set response to a fellow conservative who criticise Boris is beyond contempt
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,267
    IanB2 said:

    Alan Duncan on BBCPL now - “angry with Johnson”

    “Respect [in parliament] for Boris has taken a real nosedive today”

    “Just being a supplicant like this seems to be a Boris attitude”

    “Instead of a fresh start with a clean slate in a mood of national confidence, Boris now looks rather tawdry”

    Alan Duncan is a key Hunt backer and has always been anti Boris
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,451
    AndyJS said:

    It must be quite difficult to get two Es at A Level.
    Justin will be along in a mo to tell us how 'ard A-Levels were back in the day and now that is like 3 As.....The fact he went to one of the back state schools in the country of course is irrelevant.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774
    edited July 2019

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Yes, an experienced politician (and former FS FFS) should have realised that the right thing to do was to back our ambassador in public, even if behind the scenes he is being advised to step down. He also ought to have the foresight to see that if and when the guy is forced to go (as seemed at least a strong possibility as soon as the story broke) it would be better to avoid looking like you are to blame for bringing him down.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,153

    What's striking is just how many Conservatives are being forthright in their criticism of Boris Johnson on this. If he can't command loyalty now, he's going to find that he has volunteered to lie down on a bed of nails.

    It's all pointing to an Autumn election and a new House of Common being needed.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,357
    I've seen little comment on the role that May has had in forcing Darroch's resignation. But as soon as she said that she didn't agree with some of his assessments, she was effectively destroying her faith in him to do the job.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,147
    Scott_P said:
    One hopes that these sources are not civil servants failing to display impartiality!
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Why do her doctors and advisers keep allowing her to stand outside in the summer heat for these ceremonies.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,267
    OllyT said:


    Scott_P said:
    This is an absolute disgrace.

    I hope all Tory members who are merrily voting for Boris can live with themselves.
    His tenure was ending soon anyway and Trunp had already frozen him out.

    Whoever leaked should be in jail but realistically the moment this was published he was doomed. He should have fallen on his sword days ago.
    Perhaps we should freeze out the US Ambassador following the comments he has made quite publicly about our Prime Minister and the Mayor of London.

    If you can't see that we are just giving in to an overgrown baby and bully to boot then you are entirely missing the point. This is a glimpse of our future after Brexit with Johnson playing Trump's poodle. Any trade deal will be what Trump decides it will be and if we argue he'll throw another tantrum
    What has Woody Johnson said negative about May or Khan? Nothing, he has been a model of diplomacy and a savvy ex businessman
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513
    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?
    Would it be unreasonable to label you a diehard Johnsonite ?
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774
    We had better get used to the taste of chemical chicken and rubbery cheese...
  • JonathanDJonathanD Posts: 2,400

    What's striking is just how many Conservatives are being forthright in their criticism of Boris Johnson on this. If he can't command loyalty now, he's going to find that he has volunteered to lie down on a bed of nails.

    New PM's usually arrive in office with a Commons majority and a degree of goodwill.

    Boris will have no majority and roughly 1/3 of his MPs actively despise him. Couldn't happen to a nicer bloke 🤨☕️

    — General Boles (@GeneralBoles) July 10, 2019
  • surbiton19surbiton19 Posts: 1,469
    A quick trade deal can only mean one thing: TOTAL SURRENDER. I was not aware that is what "take back control" meant.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    HYUFD said:

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?

    I have never said that I would vote LibDem purely because Boris becomes leader. It's crashing us out with No Deal which is my absolute, non-negotiable red line, to which now needs to be added proroguing parliament.

    As for whether Boris will be bothered by how I vote - why should he be? I've only met him once and he won't remember.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,677
    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?
    It hasn't even started yet and it's already like reading Invitation to a Beheading while doing ketamine.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 62,749
    Nigelb said:

    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?
    Would it be unreasonable to label you a diehard Johnsonite ?
    Dazzled by the fake Messiah
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    GIN1138 said:

    What's striking is just how many Conservatives are being forthright in their criticism of Boris Johnson on this. If he can't command loyalty now, he's going to find that he has volunteered to lie down on a bed of nails.

    It's all pointing to an Autumn election and a new House of Common being needed.
    It's not that easy. Boris Johnson may find himself trapped in a gilded cage.

  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,451
    IanB2 said:

    We had better get used to the taste of chemical chicken and rubbery cheese...

    You aren't forced to buy either and rubbery cheese has been a staple in UK supermarkets for decades.
  • surbiton19surbiton19 Posts: 1,469
    India last 5 overs: 7/1. Ouch !
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Scott_P said:
    Why does anyone give a damn what she thinks on any subject?
    Why does anyone give a damn what any of us think?
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,320

    A quick trade deal can only mean one thing: TOTAL SURRENDER. I was not aware that is what "take back control" meant.
    Trade deals are also not negotiated by ambassadors.
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 6,772
    edited July 2019

    Surely game was up when Trump chose to freeze him out? An Ambassador who is frozen out is not much of an Ambassador.

    It shouldn't have been leaked and we should investigate and punish whoever did it, but our diplomatic corps need to realise leaks are quite probable in the internet age. Shouldn't be, but are. Pandora's Box can't be closed.
    Quite. There’s lots to dislike about Boris and I said last night that I thought his comments disloyal, but an ambassador whose confidential thoughts have been exposed is no longer a good ambassador. It would have been very difficult to see how he would have been able to stay in post, no matter the flag waving from some politicians.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 21,793
    Dura_Ace said:

    viewcode said:

    Scott_P said:

    Whoever failed to ensure communication between the Ambassador and HMG were not secure and encrypted should also be facing serious questions.

    They were secure and encrypted.

    Then they are distributed to lots of people within HMG, one of whom gave them to a "journalist"
    My headcanon says that GCHQ decrypted them, handed them to the NSA, who gave them to Trump, who gave them to Farage/Boris, who leaked them to the press via Oakeshott... :)
    That's pretty much how we got the Americans into WW1.
    Indeed. I actually own a copy of "Codebreakers" by James Wyllie so I should have remembered that, but I didn't. Thank you for the reminder.
  • OllyTOllyT Posts: 5,006
    GIN1138 said:

    LOL! Love how everyone is trying to make this about Boris.

    Desperate, desperate, desperate.

    Perhaps because his lack of support is the reason the Ambassador has given for quitting. Sometimes it's best to not defend the indefensible.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,593
    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?

    Richard is a patriot. You support a football team.

  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774
    HYUFD said:

    IanB2 said:

    Alan Duncan on BBCPL now - “angry with Johnson”

    “Respect [in parliament] for Boris has taken a real nosedive today”

    “Just being a supplicant like this seems to be a Boris attitude”

    “Instead of a fresh start with a clean slate in a mood of national confidence, Boris now looks rather tawdry”

    Alan Duncan is a key Hunt backer and has always been anti Boris
    Funny that so many people who worked for or with Boris end up feeling like that.

    Alastair Burt, another FO minister, saying similar things in more measured tones on BBC
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Charles said:

    Scott_P said:
    It really isn’t a humiliation

    The simple fact is there is a jerk in the White House

    But if he refuses to work with our ambassador that’s something we need to adjust to.

    Adjusting is not the same thing as prostrating.

    Sacking would have been prostrating

    Darroch wasn’t sacked.

    Boris doesn’t come out of this well though (although it doesn’t change my view of him)
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774

    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?

    Richard is a patriot. You support a football team.

    When they have purged the most sensible people, HY’s name will rise to the top of the list; the stain of having voted Remain cannot be expunged from his record however zealous he tries to be after the event.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    edited July 2019
    viewcode said:

    Indeed. I actually own a copy of "Codebreakers" by James Wyllie so I should have remembered that, but I didn't. Thank you for the reminder.

    I went to the launch of the new 'Top Secret' exhibition (which is about GCHQ) at the Science Museum last night. I strongly recommend it. There are some fascinating exhibits and it is well presented.

    https://www.sciencemuseum.org.uk/see-and-do/top-secret
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Charles said:

    Sacking would have been prostrating

    Darroch wasn’t sacked.

    Is that pinhead big enough for you?

    Of course he was sacked
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    edited July 2019

    Don’t worry; May and Hunt will pick the successor!

    Bit like the Dems trying to get that SC vacancy filled before Obama left. I hope they manage it but I doubt they will. I think it will be left for Johnson. I predict somebody suitably rancid who will fit in over there in Trumpton.

    Richard Tice?
  • OllyTOllyT Posts: 5,006
    Charles said:

    Scott_P said:
    It really isn’t a humiliation

    The simple fact is there is a jerk in the White House

    But if he refuses to work with our ambassador that’s something we need to adjust to.
    Do you think we should refuse to work with the US Ambassador after the insults Trump has levelled at the Prime Minister and the Mayor of London or is this just a one way street where we just roll over every time the man-child has a twitter tantrum?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,267

    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?

    Richard is a patriot. You support a football team.

    Richard is now a LD whose main priority is refusing to implement the Brexit vote the majority voted for.

  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,451
    Scott_P said:

    Charles said:

    Sacking would have been prostrating

    Darroch wasn’t sacked.

    Is that pinhead big enough for you?

    Of course he was sacked
    So we should blame May?
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,898
    GIN1138 said:

    AndyJS said:

    Scott_P said:
    The problem isn't Kim Darroch or Boris Johnson, the problem is the person who leaked the information.
    Indeed.

    Once Darroch's words were leaked his position was untennable. Boris knew this (Hunt knew this too but wanted to play games at Boris's expense)

    The real story here is who leaked and why? Will we ever know...
    I hope so. Surely they will be charged with something - under the Official Secrets Act?
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?
    Your set response to a fellow conservative who criticise Boris is beyond contempt
    It’s like he’s modelled his view of how politics works on the house of cards
  • OllyTOllyT Posts: 5,006
    IanB2 said:

    So we have the first PM Bozo fiasco before he has even got the job...

    At least this didn't result in someone ending up in an Iranian prison
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395

    India last 5 overs: 7/1. Ouch !

    The weather conditions are perfect for New Zealand and their style of cricket.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774
    Charles said:

    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?
    Your set response to a fellow conservative who criticise Boris is beyond contempt
    It’s like he’s modelled his view of how politics works on the house of cards
    It must be a cutthroat world amid the diehard councillors of Epping parish.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,320
    HYUFD said:

    Richard is now a LD whose main priority is refusing to implement the Brexit vote the majority voted for.

    Which Tory leadership candidates would you classify as Lib Dems on the same basis? Michael Gove?
  • MangoMango Posts: 1,017

    A quick trade deal can only mean one thing: TOTAL SURRENDER. I was not aware that is what "take back control" meant.
    Then clearly you weren't concentrating on who was saying it. And paying for it.
  • justin124justin124 Posts: 11,527

    AndyJS said:

    It must be quite difficult to get two Es at A Level.
    Justin will be along in a mo to tell us how 'ard A-Levels were back in the day and now that is like 3 As.....The fact he went to one of the back state schools in the country of course is irrelevant.
    I don't go that far - though it would be comparable to 2 Cs today. Until the system of relative marking was abandoned at the end of the 1980s , 30% of A level students failed to achieve the minimum E grade pass - nowadays that only applies to 2.5%
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    So we should blame May?

    He was sacked by Trump
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,267
    edited July 2019

    HYUFD said:

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?

    I have never said that I would vote LibDem purely because Boris becomes leader. It's crashing us out with No Deal which is my absolute, non-negotiable red line, to which now needs to be added proroguing parliament.

    As for whether Boris will be bothered by how I vote - why should he be? I've only met him once and he won't remember.
    Given most Tory voters and Leave voters in every poll prefer No Deal to Revoke on a forced choice by definition that means you are no longer a Tory if you are so adamant against No Deal in all circumstances.

    Boris voted for the Withdrawal Agreement at MV3 and still wants a Deal with the EU (rempving the temporary Customs Union for GB) but if the Commons refuses to vote for one then No Deal it has to be even if diehard Remainers have a tantrum
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,890
    AndyJS said:

    India last 5 overs: 7/1. Ouch !

    The weather conditions are perfect for New Zealand and their style of cricket.
    They're the opposite to England, great on tricky wickets and terrible on roads.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 62,749
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?

    Richard is a patriot. You support a football team.

    Richard is now a LD whose main priority is refusing to implement the Brexit vote the majority voted for.

    No he is not.

    It is you who have become indoctrinated by Boris and lost your sense of reason
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,267

    HYUFD said:

    Richard is now a LD whose main priority is refusing to implement the Brexit vote the majority voted for.

    Which Tory leadership candidates would you classify as Lib Dems on the same basis? Michael Gove?
    Rory Stewart certainly and Dominic Grieve and Philip Lee and Justine Greening too on the backbenches
  • El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 4,238

    HYUFD said:

    Right decision by Darroch and Boris can ensure the right successor is appointed

    Don’t worry; May and Hunt will pick the successor!
    Olly Robbins.
  • The_TaxmanThe_Taxman Posts: 2,979
    GIN1138 said:

    What's striking is just how many Conservatives are being forthright in their criticism of Boris Johnson on this. If he can't command loyalty now, he's going to find that he has volunteered to lie down on a bed of nails.

    It's all pointing to an Autumn election and a new House of Common being needed.
    Boris let slip in the debate about the "fortcoming election", which sounds imminent not 2022 imo! So you might get an autumn election but i would not bank on Boris doing any better than May in 2017. I will not vote Tory whilst Boris is leader, the LD will get my vote!
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,401
    OllyT said:

    IanB2 said:

    So we have the first PM Bozo fiasco before he has even got the job...

    At least this didn't result in someone ending up in an Iranian prison
    Although someone should be in a UK prison.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Scott_P said:

    Charles said:

    Sacking would have been prostrating

    Darroch wasn’t sacked.

    Is that pinhead big enough for you?

    Of course he was sacked
    No, he wasn’t. His position was untenable since the first moment that Trump made an issue of the leaks.

    He was smart enough to realise that.

    I wouldn’t be surprised to see him recognised in the honours list in January. Plus some sinecures somewhere over the next 12 months
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?

    Richard is a patriot. You support a football team.

    Richard is now a LD whose main priority is refusing to implement the Brexit vote the majority voted for.

    If “LD” has risen to the insult of choice amongst diehard Tories, the party must be making real progress toward breaking the two party system! The Corbynite equivalent is still to call party colleagues a “Tory”.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    IanB2 said:

    When they have purged the most sensible people, HY’s name will rise to the top of the list; the stain of having voted Remain cannot be expunged from his record however zealous he tries to be after the event.

    Voted Remain? I would not have guessed that, I must say.

    2016 Remainer morphs into a 2019 Andrea Jenkyns in trousers - what an intrepid and remarkable journey!
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,267

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?

    Richard is a patriot. You support a football team.

    Richard is now a LD whose main priority is refusing to implement the Brexit vote the majority voted for.

    No he is not.

    It is you who have become indoctrinated by Boris and lost your sense of reason
    Richard Navabi has said in his own words he would vote LD rather than a Tory Party implementing No Deal as a last resort to ensure Brexit as he said below
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    OllyT said:

    Charles said:

    Scott_P said:
    It really isn’t a humiliation

    The simple fact is there is a jerk in the White House

    But if he refuses to work with our ambassador that’s something we need to adjust to.
    Do you think we should refuse to work with the US Ambassador after the insults Trump has levelled at the Prime Minister and the Mayor of London or is this just a one way street where we just roll over every time the man-child has a twitter tantrum?
    If Darroch hadn’t resigned I would have not invited Woody to the fun stuff but carried on working with him.

    This sort of stuff has always happened but usually behind closed doors. More diplomatically if you like 😉

    Trump is the first to play it out on Twitter
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774

    GIN1138 said:

    What's striking is just how many Conservatives are being forthright in their criticism of Boris Johnson on this. If he can't command loyalty now, he's going to find that he has volunteered to lie down on a bed of nails.

    It's all pointing to an Autumn election and a new House of Common being needed.
    Boris let slip in the debate about the "fortcoming election", which sounds imminent not 2022 imo! So you might get an autumn election but i would not bank on Boris doing any better than May in 2017. I will not vote Tory whilst Boris is leader, the LD will get my vote!
    I’m not sure - he was answering a question about an election and one is always forthcoming. I don’t see Boris has the balls to put his job on the line so soon, and the Tory party is in no fit state to agree on a platform right now.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,401
    Charles said:

    Scott_P said:

    Charles said:

    Sacking would have been prostrating

    Darroch wasn’t sacked.

    Is that pinhead big enough for you?

    Of course he was sacked
    No, he wasn’t. His position was untenable since the first moment that Trump made an issue of the leaks.

    He was smart enough to realise that.

    I wouldn’t be surprised to see him recognised in the honours list in January. Plus some sinecures somewhere over the next 12 months
    The penalty for leaking the cables of a US ambassador will be very steep, I am assuming. They are looking at prison surely?

    Why would anyone (FO official/Spad etc) take such a risk?

    There must have been a mighty reward involved or some overbearing reason.

  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,427

    HYUFD said:

    Right decision by Darroch and Boris can ensure the right successor is appointed

    Don’t worry; May and Hunt will pick the successor!
    Olly Robbins.
    That would be fantastic. :D
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?

    Richard is a patriot. You support a football team.

    Richard is now a LD whose main priority is refusing to implement the Brexit vote the majority voted for.

    Stop this BS @HYUFD

    A prospective candidate should not be spending their time trying to chase voters away from the party
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,401
    IanB2 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    What's striking is just how many Conservatives are being forthright in their criticism of Boris Johnson on this. If he can't command loyalty now, he's going to find that he has volunteered to lie down on a bed of nails.

    It's all pointing to an Autumn election and a new House of Common being needed.
    Boris let slip in the debate about the "fortcoming election", which sounds imminent not 2022 imo! So you might get an autumn election but i would not bank on Boris doing any better than May in 2017. I will not vote Tory whilst Boris is leader, the LD will get my vote!
    I’m not sure - he was answering a question about an election and one is always forthcoming. I don’t see Boris has the balls to put his job on the line so soon, and the Tory party is in no fit state to agree on a platform right now.
    Boris will work day and night to avoid a GE. But it may well be out of his hands frankly.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    IanB2 said:

    Charles said:

    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?
    Your set response to a fellow conservative who criticise Boris is beyond contempt
    It’s like he’s modelled his view of how politics works on the house of cards
    It must be a cutthroat world amid the diehard councillors of Epping parish.
    😂

    When the stakes are small...
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,890
    edited July 2019
    AndyJS said:

    India 71 for 5.

    Do you bet on sports at all ?

    Some good observations here the last few days..
    AndyJS said:
    AndyJS said:

    This New Zealand innings could prove to be a lot cleverer than it looks.

  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 62,749
    IanB2 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?

    Richard is a patriot. You support a football team.

    Richard is now a LD whose main priority is refusing to implement the Brexit vote the majority voted for.

    If “LD” has risen to the insult of choice amongst diehard Tories, the party must be making real progress toward breaking the two party system! The Corbynite equivalent is still to call party colleagues a “Tory”.
    It is only Hyufd who has taken to labelling his fellow conservatives LD if they do not agree with his great hero Boris. He has also adopted a 'diehard' tag to remainers

    He has become an extreme ERG disiciple influenced by another hero of his IDS
  • OllyTOllyT Posts: 5,006

    OllyT said:


    Perhaps we should freeze out the US Ambassador following the comments he has made quite publicly about our Prime Minister and the Mayor of London.

    If you can't see that we are just giving in to an overgrown baby and bully to boot then you are entirely missing the point. This is a glimpse of our future after Brexit with Johnson playing Trump's poodle. Any trade deal will be what Trump decides it will be and if we argue he'll throw another tantrum

    That's what we did in the war with JFK's dad who was replaced as US Ambassador because he forecast Nazi victory.
    According to Wiki:-
    "
    Kennedy served as the United States Ambassador to the United Kingdom from 1938 until late 1940, when he annoyed Roosevelt by his pessimism about Britain's survival. During the Battle of Britain in November 1940, Kennedy publicly suggested that "Democracy is finished in England. It may be here [in the United States]".[2] Following this controversy, Kennedy resigned his position"

    There are key differences - Kennedy made his remarks publicly not privately to his own government and it sounds as though the pressure to quit came mainly from Roosevelt not the UK. In any event I think a war-time situation is significantly different.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Richard is now a LD whose main priority is refusing to implement the Brexit vote the majority voted for.

    Which Tory leadership candidates would you classify as Lib Dems on the same basis? Michael Gove?
    Rory Stewart certainly and Dominic Grieve and Philip Lee and Justine Greening too on the backbenches
    I would happily take all of those, although Dominic might struggle in the LibDems.

    But it would be nicer if you would let us pick?
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 62,749
    Charles said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?

    Richard is a patriot. You support a football team.

    Richard is now a LD whose main priority is refusing to implement the Brexit vote the majority voted for.

    Stop this BS @HYUFD

    A prospective candidate should not be spending their time trying to chase voters away from the party
    + 100 x 100
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,267
    Charles said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?

    Richard is a patriot. You support a football team.

    Richard is now a LD whose main priority is refusing to implement the Brexit vote the majority voted for.

    Stop this BS @HYUFD

    A prospective candidate should not be spending their time trying to chase voters away from the party
    Richard Navabi has already said he will vote LD if Boris does No Deal as a last resort to.implement Brexit, I did not open the way to leaving the party, he did
  • OllyTOllyT Posts: 5,006
    GIN1138 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Alan Duncan on BBCPL now - “angry with Johnson”

    “Respect [in parliament] for Boris has taken a real nosedive today”

    Hunky Dunky is playing to the gallary as usual.

    Does Team Hunt really think any of this will actually make any difference to Boris becoming Con leader and PM two weeks today?

    I think the leaderships settled - it's what happens next that really matters and this is not doing Johnson any favours.
  • BromBrom Posts: 3,760
    This is what the left have become. Scrawling weird connections walls like psychopaths. Cadwalladr has a lot to answer for.
  • El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 4,238

    IanB2 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?

    Richard is a patriot. You support a football team.

    Richard is now a LD whose main priority is refusing to implement the Brexit vote the majority voted for.

    If “LD” has risen to the insult of choice amongst diehard Tories, the party must be making real progress toward breaking the two party system! The Corbynite equivalent is still to call party colleagues a “Tory”.
    It is only Hyufd who has taken to labelling his fellow conservatives LD if they do not agree with his great hero Boris. He has also adopted a 'diehard' tag to remainers

    He has become an extreme ERG disiciple influenced by another hero of his IDS
    Not atypical. HYUFD is a telling barometer of the way the Conservative party is going.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,267
    Charles said:

    IanB2 said:

    Charles said:

    HYUFD said:

    It's probably fair to say that Sir Kim's position had become untenable even without Boris and others failing to give him the support he deserves and should have expected. However, I'm sure it's also the case that the timing - which makes it look as though a couple of tweets from Trump are enough to cause the UK to jump to attention and do whatever he says - is the fault of Boris Johnson.

    This affair, the brain-dead commitment to October 31st, and the quite extraordinary refusal to rule out treating parliament in the manner of Charles 1st, should be enough to dash any lingering hopes that Boris might not be quite as unsuitable to be PM as he seemed. Looks like he'll be even worse than one would have feared.

    Well as you will be voting LD if Boris wins anyway will he really be that bothered if you think his premiership is awful?
    Your set response to a fellow conservative who criticise Boris is beyond contempt
    It’s like he’s modelled his view of how politics works on the house of cards
    It must be a cutthroat world amid the diehard councillors of Epping parish.
    😂

    When the stakes are small...
    It is the grassroots imcluding me who campaign and canvass day in and day out and weekends in all weathers for the party and they now want a leader they believe in ie Boris.

    So be as patronising as you want Charles but without the grassroots the party would be nothing and nobody would get elected anyway
This discussion has been closed.