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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Two party politics is still with us, except this time the two

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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,958
    Complacency from Thornberry
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,321
    Emily Thornberry - yet another person who hasn't read the deal and is pontificating endlessly while being completely wrong.

    It's her Colonelcy all over again.
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    StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    What on earth were those pollsters who were putting the LDs behind Labour thinking of?
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    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,992
    All over for Change UK surely. No councillors, no MEPs, no candidate in Peterborough.
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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,389

    It has to be Gove now, I think, as my preferred candidate

    I came to that realisation earlier on this afternoon.
    Last week, me:

    "Just topped up on Gove btw @ 12.5. The more I see it the more he is one of the few chameleon types who could pull off being either leave or remain."
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    TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,388
    ALDE on the rise across Europe

    Beating LIDL quite comfortably
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,133
    > @Byronic said:
    > > @RobinWiggs said:
    > > It has to be Gove now, I think, as my preferred candidate
    > >
    > > I came to that realisation earlier on this afternoon.
    > >
    > > Me three.<
    >
    > +++++++
    >
    > Likewise. But I fear Boris will win.

    After this result, of course Boris will win.
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    What was BritainElects forecast?
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,322

    > @Black_Rook said:

    > London:

    >

    > Animal Welfare Party: 25,232

    > Change UK: 117,635

    > Conservatives: 177,964

    > Greens: 278,957

    > Labour: 536,810

    > Lib Dems: 608,725

    > Brexit Party: 400,257

    > UKEUP: 18,806

    > Ukip: 46,497

    > Women's Equality Party: 23,766

    >

    > Seats:

    >

    > 3 LDs

    > 2 Lab

    > 2 Brexit

    > 1 Green

    >

    > **ENDS**



    Who predicted over a million LibDem votes in London ?

    LD, green and CUK have more or less a million between them
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    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    SNP are utterly smashing this.
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    TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,388
    > @TOPPING said:
    > It has to be Gove now, I think, as my preferred candidate
    >
    > I came to that realisation earlier on this afternoon.
    >
    > Last week, me:
    >
    > "Just topped up on Gove btw @ 12.5. The more I see it the more he is one of the few chameleon types who could pull off being either leave or remain."

    I don't know if he'll win! Just a personal preference.

    In my heart I would prefer Hunt but horses for courses, and this course needs someone who backed Leave
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,133
    > @AndyJS said:
    > What was BritainElects forecast?

    Wrong!
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    ByronicByronic Posts: 3,578
    > @AndyJS said:
    > What was BritainElects forecast?<

    ++++

    They haven't mentioned it recently. lol.
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    Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 4,604
    > @TOPPING said:
    > It has to be Gove now, I think, as my preferred candidate
    >
    > I came to that realisation earlier on this afternoon.
    >
    > Last week, me:
    >
    > "Just topped up on Gove btw @ 12.5. The more I see it the more he is one of the few chameleon types who could pull off being either leave or remain."

    The message from this election is that sitting on the fence on Brexit is electoral suicide.
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,097
    Current UK voteshares Brexit Party 31% LDs 21% Lab 15% Greens 12% Cons 9%
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    TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,388
    "Turnout across all 28 member states, including the UK, has risen to 50.5%, the European parliament has announced.

    This is 8 points higher than in 2014."

    Has Britain saved Europe???
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    another_richardanother_richard Posts: 25,103
    > @IanB2 said:
    > > @Black_Rook said:
    >
    > > London:
    >
    > >
    >
    > > Animal Welfare Party: 25,232
    >
    > > Change UK: 117,635
    >
    > > Conservatives: 177,964
    >
    > > Greens: 278,957
    >
    > > Labour: 536,810
    >
    > > Lib Dems: 608,725
    >
    > > Brexit Party: 400,257
    >
    > > UKEUP: 18,806
    >
    > > Ukip: 46,497
    >
    > > Women's Equality Party: 23,766
    >
    > >
    >
    > > Seats:
    >
    > >
    >
    > > 3 LDs
    >
    > > 2 Lab
    >
    > > 2 Brexit
    >
    > > 1 Green
    >
    > >
    >
    > > **ENDS**
    >
    >
    >
    > Who predicted over a million LibDem votes in London ?
    >
    > LD, green and CUK have more or less a million between them

    But that wasn't the prediction was it.
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    dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786
    > @dixiedean said:
    > All over for Change UK surely. No councillors, no MEPs, no candidate in Peterborough.

    Theyll beg the Lib Dems for some stardust. Looks like theyll get 4% nationally, a useful adjunct to the LD vote, some sort of Alliance arrangement but heavily skewed to LDs
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    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    AndyJS said:

    What on earth were those pollsters who were putting the LDs behind Labour thinking of?

    I'm looking at the polling wiki page and shaking my head.
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Squeaky bum time for me — BRX currently on 31% and I need 29.99%.
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    WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 8,503
    edited May 2019
    > @AndyJS said:
    > What on earth were those pollsters who were putting the LDs behind Labour thinking of?

    I think the online compaign and organisation of young, last-minute previously unregistered voters, might have swung it. Not confirned to vote till the last minute.
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    StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    Latest prognosis European Parliament:
    EPP 178 (-38)
    S&D 152 (-35)
    ALDE 108 (+39)
    G/EFA 69 (+15)
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,457
    > @Pulpstar said:
    > Complacency from Thornberry

    She's London. To be expected.
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    > @TheWhiteRabbit said:
    > "Turnout across all 28 member states, including the UK, has risen to 50.5%, the European parliament has announced.
    >
    > This is 8 points higher than in 2014."
    >
    > Has Britain saved Europe???

    We made the whole thing a lot more interesting, with Brexit.
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    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,736
    > @HYUFD said:
    > Current UK voteshares Brexit Party 31% LDs 21% Lab 15% Greens 12% Cons 9%

    Just re-posting my projection from Friday while it still looks quite good:

    BP 29%
    LD 21%
    Lab 18%
    Green 12%
    Con 8%
    UKIP 4%
    CUK 3%
    NATs 5%

    :lol:
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,898

    "Turnout across all 28 member states, including the UK, has risen to 50.5%, the European parliament has announced.



    This is 8 points higher than in 2014."



    Has Britain saved Europe???

    Oh the irony.

    But always good to see people turning out to vote.
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
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    brendan16brendan16 Posts: 2,315
    edited May 2019
    > @AndyJS said:
    > Squeaky bum time for me — BRX currently on 31% and I need 29.99%.

    Does that figure include the whole of London where they only got 18%? If so surely the BXP will end up much higher when Wales and the remaining English regions come in?
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    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 18,917

    ALDE on the rise across Europe



    Beating LIDL quite comfortably

    :)
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,898

    > @TOPPING said:

    > It has to be Gove now, I think, as my preferred candidate

    >

    > I came to that realisation earlier on this afternoon.

    >

    > Last week, me:

    >

    > "Just topped up on Gove btw @ 12.5. The more I see it the more he is one of the few chameleon types who could pull off being either leave or remain."



    The message from this election is that sitting on the fence on Brexit is electoral suicide.

    Yes, and unfortunately 'doing a deal' is now seen as sitting on the fence.
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    oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,831
    > @dyedwoolie said:
    > > @dixiedean said:
    > > All over for Change UK surely. No councillors, no MEPs, no candidate in Peterborough.
    >
    > Theyll beg the Lib Dems for some stardust. Looks like theyll get 4% nationally, a useful adjunct to the LD vote, some sort of Alliance arrangement but heavily skewed to LDs

    There is zero point to CHUK - they don't stand for anything distinctive. There is no reason to vote for them. The new LD leader will be well advised just to smile, nod and move on to something that really matters.
  • Options
    another_richardanother_richard Posts: 25,103
    > @dyedwoolie said:
    > > @dixiedean said:
    > > All over for Change UK surely. No councillors, no MEPs, no candidate in Peterborough.
    >
    > Theyll beg the Lib Dems for some stardust. Looks like theyll get 4% nationally, a useful adjunct to the LD vote, some sort of Alliance arrangement but heavily skewed to LDs

    The splitters vote was NOTA - it wont transfer.
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    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,736
    > @TheWhiteRabbit said:
    > "Turnout across all 28 member states, including the UK, has risen to 50.5%, the European parliament has announced.
    >
    > This is 8 points higher than in 2014."
    >
    > Has Britain saved Europe???

    Er no... we've dragged turnout down to close to 50%
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,534
    NEW THREAD
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    StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    > @Scott_P said:
    > https://twitter.com/nickeardleybbc/status/1132771345056587781

    I don’t usually touch the water of life, but...
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    RobinWiggsRobinWiggs Posts: 621

    > @Byronic said:

    > > @RobinWiggs said:

    > > It has to be Gove now, I think, as my preferred candidate

    > >

    > > I came to that realisation earlier on this afternoon.

    > >

    > > Me three.<

    >

    > +++++++

    >

    > Likewise. But I fear Boris will win.



    After this result, of course Boris will win.

    Which is the wrong message to take. The No-dealers are topping out at around a third of the vote, maybe a couple more if you add in UKIP and a few tories.

    There is no route to victory from there. If Brexit is to be saved, it needs a neat pivot quickly. But the headbangers can’t count.

    It’s over.
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    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,350
    Heidi Allen making herself look even more ridiculous. Quite an achievement.
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,107
    > @Scott_P said:
    > https://twitter.com/nickeardleybbc/status/1132771345056587781

    Could it force them to reinvent themselves as a non-unionist party?
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    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820


    The message from this election is that sitting on the fence on Brexit is electoral suicide.

    Not exactly, the clear message is that you don't want to be the the party currently or prospectively left with the problem.
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    Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 30,969
    > @dyedwoolie said:
    > > @dixiedean said:
    > > All over for Change UK surely. No councillors, no MEPs, no candidate in Peterborough.
    >
    > Theyll beg the Lib Dems for some stardust. Looks like theyll get 4% nationally, a useful adjunct to the LD vote, some sort of Alliance arrangement but heavily skewed to LDs

    Heidi Allen on the BBC is hilarious. Got absolutely trounced and got no seats but apparently it is a really good result because they have some really good 'energy'.
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    El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 3,870
    ydoethur said:

    Elected in East



    Richard Tice Brexit

    Michael Heaver Brexit

    June Mummery Brexit



    Barbara Gibson LD

    Lucy Nethsingha LD



    Catherine Rowett Green



    Geoffrey Van Orden Con

    @ydoethur , I trust you recognise the Gloucestershire organist connection there?
    Andrew Nethsingha's wife?
    Indeed! AN is at St John's these days (as, of course, was the most famous Gloucestershire organist of all, Herbert Howells).
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,362
    viewcode said:

    Nigelb said:
    If you sit on the fence long enough, the voters will come along, pull on each leg, and turn into a "Saw" remake.... :(
    "Hello, Viewcode. I want to play a game."

    "Turnout across all 28 member states, including the UK, has risen to 50.5%, the European parliament has announced.



    This is 8 points higher than in 2014."



    Has Britain saved Europe???

    Damn! Ruins the thread I was writing!!!
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    Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905
    > @williamglenn said:
    > > @Scott_P said:
    > > https://twitter.com/nickeardleybbc/status/1132771345056587781
    >
    > Could it force them to reinvent themselves as a non-unionist party?

    If they're going to do that then they might as well disband. Members can pick the SNP or the Greens and join them instead.
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,322

    > @AndyJS said:

    > What on earth were those pollsters who were putting the LDs behind Labour thinking of?



    I think the online compaign and organisation of young, last-minute previously unregistered voters, might have swung it. Not confirned to vote till the last minute.

    The significant turnout jumps in university seats suggests younger voters are a lot of the story tonight.

    Meanwhile Heidi on the BBC talking about working with the LDs
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,898

    > @TheWhiteRabbit said:

    > "Turnout across all 28 member states, including the UK, has risen to 50.5%, the European parliament has announced.

    >

    > This is 8 points higher than in 2014."

    >

    > Has Britain saved Europe???



    Er no... we've dragged turnout down to close to 50%

    I thought the point might have been the Brexit issue, which has certainly sparked pro-EU sentiment in this country, may have to some degree encouraged more people to actually turnout and show their own backing for the institution this time around.

    Nothing would be so simple of course, but I didn't think the point was our turnout was higher than others, but that the awfulness of how Brexit has gone is making people want to vote more in other places, in advertently.

    Although turnout doesn't really count if there is compulsory voting.
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    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,272
    40% vote share for Brexit/Conservative alliance. 15%...15% for Labour- that is just pathetic. Do you still want a GE Jeremy- you have killed the Labour Party!
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited May 2019
    I think the SE and SW regions could be just slightly disappointing for the Brexit Party compared to the Eastern region because the Greens and CUK could be a bit higher in those two regions. Also the SE is very slowly becoming more like London than it used to be.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,898

    > @dyedwoolie said:

    > > @dixiedean said:

    > > All over for Change UK surely. No councillors, no MEPs, no candidate in Peterborough.

    >

    > Theyll beg the Lib Dems for some stardust. Looks like theyll get 4% nationally, a useful adjunct to the LD vote, some sort of Alliance arrangement but heavily skewed to LDs



    There is zero point to CHUK - they don't stand for anything distinctive. There is no reason to vote for them. The new LD leader will be well advised just to smile, nod and move on to something that really matters.

    11 MPs to boost their numbers though.
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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    Labour fearing to be down to 1 seat in NW
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,321

    ydoethur said:

    Elected in East



    Richard Tice Brexit

    Michael Heaver Brexit

    June Mummery Brexit



    Barbara Gibson LD

    Lucy Nethsingha LD



    Catherine Rowett Green



    Geoffrey Van Orden Con

    @ydoethur , I trust you recognise the Gloucestershire organist connection there?
    Andrew Nethsingha's wife?
    Indeed! AN is at St John's these days (as, of course, was the most famous Gloucestershire organist of all, Herbert Howells).
    Seems a bit harsh on S S Wesley.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,898
    AndyJS said:
    Percentage wise they might only be 3 off for the Tories, but in seats, wow.
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    brendan16brendan16 Posts: 2,315
    > @Scott_P said:
    > https://twitter.com/REWearmouth/status/1132771890777473032
    >
    >
    >
    > https://twitter.com/BBCPropaganda/status/1132770382199623680

    People forget Thornberry’s seat used to be a marginal - in 2005 she only beat the LDs by less than 500 votes.
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    WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 8,503
    edited May 2019
    > @RobinWiggs said:
    > > @Byronic said:
    >
    > > > @RobinWiggs said:
    >
    > > > It has to be Gove now, I think, as my preferred candidate
    >
    > > >
    >
    > > > I came to that realisation earlier on this afternoon.
    >
    > > >
    >
    > > > Me three.<
    >
    > >
    >
    > > +++++++
    >
    > >
    >
    > > Likewise. But I fear Boris will win.
    >
    >
    >
    > After this result, of course Boris will win.
    >
    > Which is the wrong message to take. The No-dealers are topping out at around a third of the vote, maybe a couple more if you add in UKIP and a few tories.
    >
    > There is no route to victory from there. If Brexit is to be saved, it needs a neat pivot quickly. But the headbangers can’t count.
    >
    > It’s over.

    Yup ; as I mentioned a few months ago the hardcore Brexit vote never seems to top out at beyond what was the core tory vote - about 33 % at the most, and late 20s on a bad day. It's not enough.
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,322
    AndyJS said:

    What was BritainElects forecast?

    Wrong
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    isamisam Posts: 40,960

    To think the grief Mike got for tipping the Lib Dems to beat the Brexit Party in London.

    Did he?
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Hang on — Betfair uses UK shares not GB ones, which means we can probably take about 1% off the shares we're seeing at the moment.
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    RobinWiggsRobinWiggs Posts: 621

    > @RobinWiggs said:

    > > @Byronic said:

    >

    > > > @RobinWiggs said:

    >

    > > > It has to be Gove now, I think, as my preferred candidate

    >

    > > >

    >

    > > > I came to that realisation earlier on this afternoon.

    >

    > > >

    >

    > > > Me three.<

    >

    > >

    >

    > > +++++++

    >

    > >

    >

    > > Likewise. But I fear Boris will win.

    >

    >

    >

    > After this result, of course Boris will win.

    >

    > Which is the wrong message to take. The No-dealers are topping out at around a third of the vote, maybe a couple more if you add in UKIP and a few tories.

    >

    > There is no route to victory from there. If Brexit is to be saved, it needs a neat pivot quickly. But the headbangers can’t count.

    >

    > It’s over.



    Yup, as I mentioned a few months ago the hardcore Brexit vote never seems to top out at beyond what was the core tory vote - about 33 % at the most, and late 20s on a bad day. It's not enough.

    Curtice just said the same on the Beeb. He’s obviously reading PBC tonight.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,898
    Scott_P said:
    Yep. Sucks to be them I guess, but you cannot straddle this line forever - they've tried, and it looked like it was working for a long time, but it didn't in the end.
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Looks like an embarrassment for Survation. Their latest poll was:

    Brexit 31%
    Lab 23%
    Con 14%
    LD 12%
    Green 7%
    ChangeUK 4%
    UKIP 3%
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    anothernickanothernick Posts: 3,578
    > @RobinWiggs said:
    > > @Byronic said:
    >
    > > > @RobinWiggs said:
    >
    > > > It has to be Gove now, I think, as my preferred candidate
    >
    > > >
    >
    > > > I came to that realisation earlier on this afternoon.
    >
    > > >
    >
    > > > Me three.<
    >
    > >
    >
    > > +++++++
    >
    > >
    >
    > > Likewise. But I fear Boris will win.
    >
    >
    >
    > After this result, of course Boris will win.
    >
    > Which is the wrong message to take. The No-dealers are topping out at around a third of the vote, maybe a couple more if you add in UKIP and a few tories.
    >
    > There is no route to victory from there. If Brexit is to be saved, it needs a neat pivot quickly. But the headbangers can’t count.
    >
    > It’s over.

    Indeed it is. I'd say the chance of Brexit actually happening is now below 20%.
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,322
    Alastair Campbell finally comes out as a LD voter
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    FF43FF43 Posts: 15,762
    Swing from Tories to Remain parties, although I assume that's differential turnout rather than voters changing their minds.
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    > @AndreaParma_82 said:
    > Labour fearing to be down to 1 seat in NW

    Amazing if true.
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    nico67nico67 Posts: 4,502
    Wake up Labour .

    You heard it from the polling expert.

    Labour are under more danger from the Lib Dems than the Brexit Party .

    Caroline Flint and the rest of the Labour MPs in denial need to wake up !
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,322
    LD+PC+Grn+CUK well clear of BXP+UKIP in Wales despite all the BXP MEPs
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,322
    Greens beat Cons in W Mids.
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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    Elected in Wales

    Nathan Gills (Brexit)
    James Wells (Brexit)
    Jill Evans (Plaid)
    Jacqueline Jones (Labour)
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,322
    Tories scrape the last seat in W Mids
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    brendan16brendan16 Posts: 2,315
    edited May 2019
    nico67 said:

    Wake up Labour .



    You heard it from the polling expert.



    Labour are under more danger from the Lib Dems than the Brexit Party .



    Caroline Flint and the rest of the Labour MPs in denial need to wake up !

    Perhaps not so much in her seat in Doncaster - or we have just seen Bolsover?

    Labour can’t get a majority based on Islington and inner London.
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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    West Midlands

    3 Brexit (Rupert Lowe, Martin Daubney, Andrew Kerr)
    1 Lab (Neena Gill)
    1 LD (Phil Bennion)
    1 Green (Ellie Chowns)
    1 Con (Anthea McIntyre)

    Sion Simon unseated
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    not_on_firenot_on_fire Posts: 4,341
    The Brexit Party Vote seems to be roughly 75% UKIP and the other 25% from Lab and Con. Most of the Tory losses from 2014 seem to be Lib Dem, not Brexit
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    eekeek Posts: 25,009
    So change UK has cost the Lib Dem's 2 seats...
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    rural_voterrural_voter Posts: 2,038
    Dan Hannan interviewed on Sky wants a GE. I think he means that he wants Labour to shovel the Brexshit and therefore destroy itself.

    He may also lose his EU seat so if that happens will he stand in the UK?

    No change really in the W.Mids, except that Tories and Lab lose to Green and L.Dem.
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    maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,391
    > @eek said:
    > So change UK has cost the Lib Dem's 2 seats...

    are you reallocating UKIP in this fantasy result?
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    _Anazina__Anazina_ Posts: 1,810
    Magid Magid

    What a name!
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    eekeek Posts: 25,009
    > @maaarsh said:
    > > @eek said:
    > > So change UK has cost the Lib Dem's 2 seats...
    >
    > are you reallocating UKIP in this fantasy result?

    Nope just looking at who would have won the 3rd and 4th seat if the CUK votes were added to the Lib Dems votes in the North East and Wales..

    In both cases the Lib Dems would have picked up the other Brexit seat.
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    maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,391
    > @eek said:
    > > @maaarsh said:
    > > > @eek said:
    > > > So change UK has cost the Lib Dem's 2 seats...
    > >
    > > are you reallocating UKIP in this fantasy result?
    >
    > Nope just looking at who would have won the 3rd and 4th seat if the CUK votes were added to the Lib Dems votes in the North East and Wales..
    >
    > In both cases the Lib Dems would have picked up the other Brexit seat.

    Have you ever heard about saucing geese and ganders?
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,758
    How many different parties are now in with a chance of winning the largest number of seats in the next general election ?
    More than two, I think
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    ah009ah009 Posts: 436
    > @_Anazina_ said:
    > Magid Magid
    >
    > What a name!

    He's a lovely guy
This discussion has been closed.