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  • Options
    macisbackmacisback Posts: 382
    MJW said:

    One point I'd like to make is that those people who claim the Tories are doomed are forgetting the Tories were genuinely miles ahead at the locals. If they can lose support that quickly, they can get it back.

    But not without a swift about turn, I accept that.

    They were performing a high-wire act to channel the left over Brexit euphoria from June last year. Now that's gone it will not come back.
    Other problem is they've completely lost the sense that they're the only sensible dependable game in town. That helped them get over the line in 2015 and looked likely to deliver a thumping win in 2017. Now, no Tory will be taken seriously when they argue a Labour govt will lead to chaos as the Tories have done so by losing not one but two electoral gambles designed for party political advantage. A reputation of sober stability won't come back for a very long time - if ever. Look at what the financial crisis and what it did to Labour's economic credibility - and that on the whole, wasn't unnecessarily self-inflicted.
    The financial crisis effected the lives of most people, it hit hard in employment and in people's wallet. The last few years have been stable so the sensible, dependable is still usable. If inflation/interest rates shoot up in coming years that is when the Conservatives will in serious trouble. If the economy remains stable Brexit or not they will stay fairly solid. They could do with sorting the current boundaries for certain, a huge handicap.
  • Options
    PongPong Posts: 4,693
    edited June 2017

    Pong said:

    Danny565 said:

    According to theTimes, Labour did indeed narrowly win the women's vote.

    Won by 5pts I think?
    That's not narrow - that's substantial.

    I wonder how it compares to previous elections? Has the gender split ever been more pronounced?
    The Tories won the women's vote by 4% in 2015.
    Thanks

    More evidence for my gender stereotype theory of TM's unpopularity.

    TM really turns off young and middle aged women.

    I don't think it's just tory branding/policy/leadership - I think a bit of it is personal.

    She's the manipulative mother-in-law.
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    Did GO not say about 10 months ago that he was going to plot the downfall of (or possibly it was get revenge upon) his enemies?

    Fast worker.
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,079

    Boo, David Liddington the new Justice Secretary.

    TSE should become the new Tory Viceroy of PB.
    Only Viceroy. Why not Roy?
    I was thinking of the "vice" :lol:
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 59,414
    Ishmael_Z said:

    Did GO not say about 10 months ago that he was going to plot the downfall of (or possibly it was get revenge upon) his enemies?

    Fast worker.

    As in all Shakespearean tragedies, the protagonist's personal flaws bring destruction upon themselves.
  • Options
    BigIanBigIan Posts: 198
    edited June 2017
    Scott_P said:

    @BrianSpanner1: I foresee Jeremy Corbyn doing a cult tour of the UK, as Sturgeon did.

    They never see beyond the peak of the bell curve.

    They should look out for the bell end.
  • Options
    Bobajob_PBBobajob_PB Posts: 928

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 59,414
    So, this Gauke fellah. Is he in favour of a social care cap or not?
  • Options
    NormNorm Posts: 1,251
    May should give jobs to Heidi Allen and Sarah Woolaston as it might be better to have them in gov't than carping on the outside.
  • Options
    Bobajob_PBBobajob_PB Posts: 928
    GIN1138 said:

    Rumours swirling that Priti Patel either sacked or demoted

    Wonder whether Priti will launch a leadership bid tomorrow?
    Central plank of her bid bring back hanging?
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Pong said:

    Pong said:

    Danny565 said:

    According to theTimes, Labour did indeed narrowly win the women's vote.

    Won by 5pts I think?
    That's not narrow - that's substantial.

    I wonder how it compares to previous elections? Has the gender split ever been more pronounced?
    The Tories won the women's vote by 4% in 2015.
    Thanks

    More evidence for my gender stereotype theory of TM's unpopularity.

    TM really turns off young and middle aged women.

    I don't think it's just tory branding/policy/leadership - I think a bit of it is personal.

    She's the manipulative mother-in-law.
    May is like the Headmistress of a middle class girls school. Probably competent but stiff and old fashioned.

    Corbyn is like a Humanities lecturer at a crap Uni...
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,921
    edited June 2017
    Pong said:

    Pong said:

    Danny565 said:

    According to theTimes, Labour did indeed narrowly win the women's vote.

    Won by 5pts I think?
    That's not narrow - that's substantial.

    I wonder how it compares to previous elections? Has the gender split ever been more pronounced?
    The Tories won the women's vote by 4% in 2015.
    Thanks

    More evidence for my gender stereotype theory of TM's unpopularity.

    TM really turns off young and middle aged women.

    I don't think it's just tory branding/policy/leadership - I think a bit of it is personal.

    She's the manipulative mother-in-law.
    I was told a few years ago, you have to win the support of the overs 50 women.

    They called it the son/daughter-in-law test. Would you like this candidate as your son/daughter-in-law.

    She's clearly funked the test.

    Both Cameron and Blair passed that test.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 59,414
    isam said:

    Pong said:

    Pong said:

    Danny565 said:

    According to theTimes, Labour did indeed narrowly win the women's vote.

    Won by 5pts I think?
    That's not narrow - that's substantial.

    I wonder how it compares to previous elections? Has the gender split ever been more pronounced?
    The Tories won the women's vote by 4% in 2015.
    Thanks

    More evidence for my gender stereotype theory of TM's unpopularity.

    TM really turns off young and middle aged women.

    I don't think it's just tory branding/policy/leadership - I think a bit of it is personal.

    She's the manipulative mother-in-law.
    May is like the Headmistress of a middle class girls school. Probably competent but stiff and old fashioned.

    Corbyn is like a Humanities lecturer at a crap Uni...
    I think the "probably competent" thingy has been seen through now.

  • Options
    Bobajob_PBBobajob_PB Posts: 928
    Pong

    My mate just boiled it down to "women don't like May".

    Whether fair or not, dunno.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 41,118

    Pong said:

    Pong said:

    Danny565 said:

    According to theTimes, Labour did indeed narrowly win the women's vote.

    Won by 5pts I think?
    That's not narrow - that's substantial.

    I wonder how it compares to previous elections? Has the gender split ever been more pronounced?
    The Tories won the women's vote by 4% in 2015.
    Thanks

    More evidence for my gender stereotype theory of TM's unpopularity.

    TM really turns off young and middle aged women.

    I don't think it's just tory branding/policy/leadership - I think a bit of it is personal.

    She's the manipulative mother-in-law.
    I was told a few years ago, you have to win the support of the overs 50 women.

    They called it the son/daughter-in-law test. Would you like this candidate as your son/daughter-in-law.

    She's clearly funked the test.

    Both Cameron and Blair passed that test.
    Does that apply when the candidate is a 60 year old woman??!
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,411

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    Do you think that you might be a bit of a bigot?
  • Options
    JohnOJohnO Posts: 4,228
    isam said:

    Pong said:

    Pong said:

    Danny565 said:

    According to theTimes, Labour did indeed narrowly win the women's vote.

    Won by 5pts I think?
    That's not narrow - that's substantial.

    I wonder how it compares to previous elections? Has the gender split ever been more pronounced?
    The Tories won the women's vote by 4% in 2015.
    Thanks

    More evidence for my gender stereotype theory of TM's unpopularity.

    TM really turns off young and middle aged women.

    I don't think it's just tory branding/policy/leadership - I think a bit of it is personal.

    She's the manipulative mother-in-law.
    May is like the Headmistress of a middle class girls school. Probably competent but stiff and old fashioned.

    As depicted in every edition of Private Eye.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 59,414

    Pong said:

    Pong said:

    Danny565 said:

    According to theTimes, Labour did indeed narrowly win the women's vote.

    Won by 5pts I think?
    That's not narrow - that's substantial.

    I wonder how it compares to previous elections? Has the gender split ever been more pronounced?
    The Tories won the women's vote by 4% in 2015.
    Thanks

    More evidence for my gender stereotype theory of TM's unpopularity.

    TM really turns off young and middle aged women.

    I don't think it's just tory branding/policy/leadership - I think a bit of it is personal.

    She's the manipulative mother-in-law.
    I was told a few years ago, you have to win the support of the overs 50 women.

    They called it the son/daughter-in-law test. Would you like this candidate as your son/daughter-in-law.

    She's clearly funked the test.

    Both Cameron and Blair passed that test.
    Or was it the Dementia Tax? Older women are more aware of the awful consequences of this illness I suspect than older men.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 64,598

    Boo, David Liddington the new Justice Secretary.

    Poor sod. Who would want it?
    Gove, he was going to be the greatest force for Justice and rehabilitation in this country until Theresa May sacked him.
    Given this administration is likely to last a matter of months, does it matter ?

    But I agree, this seems to be the one cabinet job at which Gove would have excelled (in sharp contrast to Education). He might also have made a not awful Foreign Secretary.
  • Options
    MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699
    macisback said:

    MJW said:

    One point I'd like to make is that those people who claim the Tories are doomed are forgetting the Tories were genuinely miles ahead at the locals. If they can lose support that quickly, they can get it back.

    But not without a swift about turn, I accept that.

    They were performing a high-wire act to channel the left over Brexit euphoria from June last year. Now that's gone it will not come back.
    Other problem is they've completely lost the sense that they're the only sensible dependable game in town. That helped them get over the line in 2015 and looked likely to deliver a thumping win in 2017. Now, no Tory will be taken seriously when they argue a Labour govt will lead to chaos as the Tories have done so by losing not one but two electoral gambles designed for party political advantage. A reputation of sober stability won't come back for a very long time - if ever. Look at what the financial crisis and what it did to Labour's economic credibility - and that on the whole, wasn't unnecessarily self-inflicted.
    The financial crisis effected the lives of most people, it hit hard in employment and in people's wallet. The last few years have been stable so the sensible, dependable is still usable. If inflation/interest rates shoot up in coming years that is when the Conservatives will in serious trouble. If the economy remains stable Brexit or not they will stay fairly solid. They could do with sorting the current boundaries for certain, a huge handicap.
    I don't believe that with current results , that the new boundaries will be very helpful at all to the Conservatives but we will have to see what the revised boundary proposals are when they are published .
  • Options
    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    What party do most muslims vote for and which party has a jewish problem ?
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,079

    GIN1138 said:

    Rumours swirling that Priti Patel either sacked or demoted

    Wonder whether Priti will launch a leadership bid tomorrow?
    Central plank of her bid bring back hanging?
    Parliament is certainly "hung" :lol:
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,160
    Mr. Borough, more importantly, there's disproportionately more old women than men, so even if they feel equally about it, that's a skew of female voters against the Conservatives.
  • Options
    glwglw Posts: 9,600
    Pong said:

    Thanks

    More evidence for my gender stereotype theory of TM's unpopularity.

    TM really turns off young and middle aged women.

    I don't think it's just tory branding/policy/leadership - I think a bit of it is personal.

    She's the manipulative mother-in-law.

    I think that a fair number of women are against May because she is not a mother. I personally do not giving a damn whether someone has kids, but I've seen it mentioned quite a bit, and mostly from it seems to come from women. I'm also fairly sure that being religious is net negative as well.

    It's kind of weird that for all our modern civil rights and endless equalities legislation that there still are these very deep seated prejudices about a person's private life.

    Of course it's even worse in the US where you had better be a God fearing Christian if you have a hope of being elected to high office.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,921

    Pong said:

    Pong said:

    Danny565 said:

    According to theTimes, Labour did indeed narrowly win the women's vote.

    Won by 5pts I think?
    That's not narrow - that's substantial.

    I wonder how it compares to previous elections? Has the gender split ever been more pronounced?
    The Tories won the women's vote by 4% in 2015.
    Thanks

    More evidence for my gender stereotype theory of TM's unpopularity.

    TM really turns off young and middle aged women.

    I don't think it's just tory branding/policy/leadership - I think a bit of it is personal.

    She's the manipulative mother-in-law.
    I was told a few years ago, you have to win the support of the overs 50 women.

    They called it the son/daughter-in-law test. Would you like this candidate as your son/daughter-in-law.

    She's clearly funked the test.

    Both Cameron and Blair passed that test.
    Or was it the Dementia Tax? Older women are more aware of the awful consequences of this illness I suspect than older men.
    Both, I went to the debate in Cambridge, I was told one of the focus groups had Mrs May as the annoying daughter in law who when she first visits her in laws is secretly wondering what the value of the house is, so she knows what the inheritance she'll be getting in a few years.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 24,425

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
  • Options
    DanSmithDanSmith Posts: 1,215
    Is May in control of this reshuffle ?
  • Options
    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,521

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    What party do most muslims vote for and which party has a jewish problem ?
    The difference in Hendon and Golders Green was not as noticeable as I thought it might be, but it is there:

    https://1drv.ms/x/s!Av4jQcUMVtBph3c7a-fVOp0nwzpl
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 41,118

    isam said:

    Pong said:

    Pong said:

    Danny565 said:

    According to theTimes, Labour did indeed narrowly win the women's vote.

    Won by 5pts I think?
    That's not narrow - that's substantial.

    I wonder how it compares to previous elections? Has the gender split ever been more pronounced?
    The Tories won the women's vote by 4% in 2015.
    Thanks

    More evidence for my gender stereotype theory of TM's unpopularity.

    TM really turns off young and middle aged women.

    I don't think it's just tory branding/policy/leadership - I think a bit of it is personal.

    She's the manipulative mother-in-law.
    May is like the Headmistress of a middle class girls school. Probably competent but stiff and old fashioned.

    Corbyn is like a Humanities lecturer at a crap Uni...
    I think the "probably competent" thingy has been seen through now.

    I think she would have been competent if she had just got on with the job, but she clearly isn't showbiz enough in the modern world of campaigning.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 41,118
    JohnO said:

    isam said:

    Pong said:

    Pong said:

    Danny565 said:

    According to theTimes, Labour did indeed narrowly win the women's vote.

    Won by 5pts I think?
    That's not narrow - that's substantial.

    I wonder how it compares to previous elections? Has the gender split ever been more pronounced?
    The Tories won the women's vote by 4% in 2015.
    Thanks

    More evidence for my gender stereotype theory of TM's unpopularity.

    TM really turns off young and middle aged women.

    I don't think it's just tory branding/policy/leadership - I think a bit of it is personal.

    She's the manipulative mother-in-law.
    May is like the Headmistress of a middle class girls school. Probably competent but stiff and old fashioned.

    As depicted in every edition of Private Eye.
    Oh really? Great minds think alike! Or maybe my mind is subliminally influenced by Private Eye
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 59,414
    DanSmith said:

    Is May in control of this reshuffle ?

    QTWTAIN
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,921
    Nigelb said:

    Boo, David Liddington the new Justice Secretary.

    Poor sod. Who would want it?
    Gove, he was going to be the greatest force for Justice and rehabilitation in this country until Theresa May sacked him.
    Given this administration is likely to last a matter of months, does it matter ?

    But I agree, this seems to be the one cabinet job at which Gove would have excelled (in sharp contrast to Education). He might also have made a not awful Foreign Secretary.
    He'd have made an excellent Chancellor.

    Had Remain won last year, it is very likely that he would have become Chancellor before 2020
  • Options
    EPGEPG Posts: 6,390
    Loyalist-backed Con-DUP government is being urged to prioritise allowing Orange marches down Catholic roads. Because it's their "culture".
    https://twitter.com/Portadownlol1/status/873638779910840320
  • Options
    Bobajob_PBBobajob_PB Posts: 928

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    They are pro welfare but also think that gay people are an abomination. Toxic.
  • Options
    jonny83jonny83 Posts: 1,262
    DanSmith said:

    Is May in control of this reshuffle ?

    Her and Damian Green are close so I don't know does that indicate she has some control? Begs asking the question why she didn't have him in that role before?
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 59,414

    macisback said:

    MJW said:

    One point I'd like to make is that those people who claim the Tories are doomed are forgetting the Tories were genuinely miles ahead at the locals. If they can lose support that quickly, they can get it back.

    But not without a swift about turn, I accept that.

    They were performing a high-wire act to channel the left over Brexit euphoria from June last year. Now that's gone it will not come back.
    Other problem is they've completely lost the sense that they're the only sensible dependable game in town. That helped them get over the line in 2015 and looked likely to deliver a thumping win in 2017. Now, no Tory will be taken seriously when they argue a Labour govt will lead to chaos as the Tories have done so by losing not one but two electoral gambles designed for party political advantage. A reputation of sober stability won't come back for a very long time - if ever. Look at what the financial crisis and what it did to Labour's economic credibility - and that on the whole, wasn't unnecessarily self-inflicted.
    The financial crisis effected the lives of most people, it hit hard in employment and in people's wallet. The last few years have been stable so the sensible, dependable is still usable. If inflation/interest rates shoot up in coming years that is when the Conservatives will in serious trouble. If the economy remains stable Brexit or not they will stay fairly solid. They could do with sorting the current boundaries for certain, a huge handicap.
    I don't believe that with current results , that the new boundaries will be very helpful at all to the Conservatives but we will have to see what the revised boundary proposals are when they are published .
    She'll not get a reduction to 600 past her party now imho.
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,079

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    Now that can't possibly be true Alan! We've been reliably told the DUP are even more evilly baby-eating than the Tories!!
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981

    Ok, so Priti Patel coming to Downing Street, so not sacked.

    Principle doesn't apply to GO's last visit to Downing Street.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 24,425
    Sean_F said:

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    Do you think that you might be a bit of a bigot?
    no BaJ quite happily dismisses the views of 80+% of the world's population but that's ok
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,921
    Jeremy Hunt stays at Health
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,079

    but also think that gay people are an abomination. Toxic.

    Many Labour voters also think that way?
  • Options
    Bobajob_PBBobajob_PB Posts: 928
    EPG said:

    Loyalist-backed Con-DUP government is being urged to prioritise allowing Orange marches down Catholic roads. Because it's their "culture".
    https://twitter.com/Portadownlol1/status/873638779910840320

    LOL = LOL
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,411
    tlg86 said:

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    What party do most muslims vote for and which party has a jewish problem ?
    The difference in Hendon and Golders Green was not as noticeable as I thought it might be, but it is there:

    https://1drv.ms/x/s!Av4jQcUMVtBph3c7a-fVOp0nwzpl
    North London's Jews ensured that 3, perhaps 4, seats were held by the Conservatives (Hindus in Harrow East must also have supported the Tories).
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 24,425

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    Now that can't possibly be true Alan! We've been reliably told the DUP are even more evilly baby-eating than the Tories!!
    as I have pointed out yesterday if NI had normal politics it would vote majority Labour
  • Options
    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 21,191

    GIN1138 said:

    Rumours swirling that Priti Patel either sacked or demoted

    Wonder whether Priti will launch a leadership bid tomorrow?
    Central plank of her bid bring back hanging?
    LOL well obviously Priti wouldn't actually get anywhere but the point is it will only take one stalking horse to have a go and the whole thing will collapse for Mrs May as others throw their hats in the ring.

    Anybody she sacks this afternoon could potentially end her career tomorrow. Must be a tough position to be in...
  • Options
    jonny83jonny83 Posts: 1,262

    Jeremy Hunt stays at Health

    He's like a limpet, will he be ever moved? lol
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 24,425

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    They are pro welfare but also think that gay people are an abomination. Toxic.
    so do many muslims explain to me the difference
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,411

    macisback said:

    MJW said:

    One point I'd like to make is that those people who claim the Tories are doomed are forgetting the Tories were genuinely miles ahead at the locals. If they can lose support that quickly, they can get it back.

    But not without a swift about turn, I accept that.

    They were performing a high-wire act to channel the left over Brexit euphoria from June last year. Now that's gone it will not come back.
    Other problem is they've completely lost the sense that they're the only sensible dependable game in town. That helped them get over the line in 2015 and looked likely to deliver a thumping win in 2017. Now, no Tory will be taken seriously when they argue a Labour govt will lead to chaos as the Tories have done so by losing not one but two electoral gambles designed for party political advantage. A reputation of sober stability won't come back for a very long time - if ever. Look at what the financial crisis and what it did to Labour's economic credibility - and that on the whole, wasn't unnecessarily self-inflicted.
    The financial crisis effected the lives of most people, it hit hard in employment and in people's wallet. The last few years have been stable so the sensible, dependable is still usable. If inflation/interest rates shoot up in coming years that is when the Conservatives will in serious trouble. If the economy remains stable Brexit or not they will stay fairly solid. They could do with sorting the current boundaries for certain, a huge handicap.
    I don't believe that with current results , that the new boundaries will be very helpful at all to the Conservatives but we will have to see what the revised boundary proposals are when they are published .
    She'll not get a reduction to 600 past her party now imho.
    She won't get it past the DUP.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,921

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    Now that can't possibly be true Alan! We've been reliably told the DUP are even more evilly baby-eating than the Tories!!
    as I have pointed out yesterday if NI had normal politics it would vote majority Labour
    So I was right, we should give the six counties to the Republic.
  • Options
    GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071

    macisback said:

    MJW said:

    One point I'd like to make is that those people who claim the Tories are doomed are forgetting the Tories were genuinely miles ahead at the locals. If they can lose support that quickly, they can get it back.

    But not without a swift about turn, I accept that.

    They were performing a high-wire act to channel the left over Brexit euphoria from June last year. Now that's gone it will not come back.
    Other problem is they've completely lost the sense that they're the only sensible dependable game in town. That helped them get over the line in 2015 and looked likely to deliver a thumping win in 2017. Now, no Tory will be taken seriously when they argue a Labour govt will lead to chaos as the Tories have done so by losing not one but two electoral gambles designed for party political advantage. A reputation of sober stability won't come back for a very long time - if ever. Look at what the financial crisis and what it did to Labour's economic credibility - and that on the whole, wasn't unnecessarily self-inflicted.
    The financial crisis effected the lives of most people, it hit hard in employment and in people's wallet. The last few years have been stable so the sensible, dependable is still usable. If inflation/interest rates shoot up in coming years that is when the Conservatives will in serious trouble. If the economy remains stable Brexit or not they will stay fairly solid. They could do with sorting the current boundaries for certain, a huge handicap.
    I don't believe that with current results , that the new boundaries will be very helpful at all to the Conservatives but we will have to see what the revised boundary proposals are when they are published .
    She'll not get a reduction to 600 past her party now imho.
    Might be easier now rather than harder?

    Fewer (current) MPs to find alternative seats or jobs for after the trimming?

    One of the (few) inconveniences of a big majority might have been buying off a larger number of turkeys voting for Christmas.
  • Options
    DM_AndyDM_Andy Posts: 986
    viewcode said:
    It would be pure pedantry to point out that without that vote the SNP would have won by 1 vote but still won.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 24,425

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    Now that can't possibly be true Alan! We've been reliably told the DUP are even more evilly baby-eating than the Tories!!
    as I have pointed out yesterday if NI had normal politics it would vote majority Labour
    So I was right, we should give the six counties to the Republic.
    the Republic is more right wing than SE England

    maybe just send all the pakistanis from mainland England there and they can all be happy

    Id advise you buy a house on the North Coast
  • Options
    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 21,191
    DanSmith said:

    Is May in control of this reshuffle ?

    No.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 118,281

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    Now that can't possibly be true Alan! We've been reliably told the DUP are even more evilly baby-eating than the Tories!!
    as I have pointed out yesterday if NI had normal politics it would vote majority Labour
    No, the DUP are more populist UKIP than Labour
  • Options
    GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    Now that can't possibly be true Alan! We've been reliably told the DUP are even more evilly baby-eating than the Tories!!
    as I have pointed out yesterday if NI had normal politics it would vote majority Labour
    So I was right, we should give the six counties to the Republic.
    There are a couple of you on here who are little too enthusiastic about randomly giving bits of the country away.

    Should residents of Kent start learning French just in case?
  • Options
    Bobajob_PBBobajob_PB Posts: 928
    GIN1138 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Rumours swirling that Priti Patel either sacked or demoted

    Wonder whether Priti will launch a leadership bid tomorrow?
    Central plank of her bid bring back hanging?
    LOL well obviously Priti wouldn't actually get anywhere but the point is it will only take one stalking horse to have a go and the whole thing will collapse for Mrs May as others throw their hats in the ring.

    Anybody she sacks this afternoon could potentially end her career tomorrow. Must be a tough position to be in...
    It is a farce. May should just resign. It really is a horror show, played out before our eyes. Arlene Foster's puppet. No surrender!!
  • Options
    macisbackmacisback Posts: 382

    macisback said:

    MJW said:

    One point I'd like to make is that those people who claim the Tories are doomed are forgetting the Tories were genuinely miles ahead at the locals. If they can lose support that quickly, they can get it back.

    But not without a swift about turn, I accept that.

    They were performing a high-wire act to channel the left over Brexit euphoria from June last year. Now that's gone it will not come back.
    Other problem is they've completely lost the sense that they're the only sensible dependable game in town. That helped them get over the line in 2015 and looked likely to deliver a thumping win in 2017. Now, no Tory will be taken seriously when they argue a Labour govt will lead to chaos as the Tories have done so by losing not one but two electoral gambles designed for party political advantage. A reputation of sober stability won't come back for a very long time - if ever. Look at what the financial crisis and what it did to Labour's economic credibility - and that on the whole, wasn't unnecessarily self-inflicted.
    The financial crisis effected the lives of most people, it hit hard in employment and in people's wallet. The last few years have been stable so the sensible, dependable is still usable. If inflation/interest rates shoot up in coming years that is when the Conservatives will in serious trouble. If the economy remains stable Brexit or not they will stay fairly solid. They could do with sorting the current boundaries for certain, a huge handicap.
    I don't believe that with current results , that the new boundaries will be very helpful at all to the Conservatives but we will have to see what the revised boundary proposals are when they are published .
    They couldn't be any worse surely, in my seat Derby North the two most Derby Conservative wards were chopped off and allocated to rural seats, even though inside the City boundary. It was a great effort to take it in 2015 for the Conservatives.
  • Options
    PClippPClipp Posts: 2,138
    Chris said:

    Mr. Atia2, cite the hypocrisy.
    I don't approve of the DUP deal. I'd prefer a Con-Lib Dem deal. Unfortunately, Farron has decided the purpose of being elected is to oppose the government rather than to try and govern the country, and he's ruled out such a deal.

    Sadly, for the Lib Dems, being elected is a purpose in itself.
    Where did you get that idea, Chris? You are just repeating the usual Tory smears, I`m afraid.

    A deal with the Lib Dems might have been possible, Mr Dancer. But if the Tories had wanted that, they ought to have treated the Lib Dems more fairy, both in their time in government and in the subsequent election. The trouble is that the Tories are totally arrogant, and never think ahead.

    Likewise the Labour Party, who are now calling on all the smaller parties to fall into line and support them, without conceding anything at all. The Labour Party did nothing at all to help pass progressive measures in the Coalition years, not even when those policies had been in their own manifesto in the previous election. Short-sighted and arrogant.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 24,425
    HYUFD said:

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    Now that can't possibly be true Alan! We've been reliably told the DUP are even more evilly baby-eating than the Tories!!
    as I have pointed out yesterday if NI had normal politics it would vote majority Labour
    No, the DUP are more populist UKIP than Labour
    certainly

    theyre like the 2 in 3 voters in N England who Labour welcomed back last week
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,921
    GeoffM said:

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    Now that can't possibly be true Alan! We've been reliably told the DUP are even more evilly baby-eating than the Tories!!
    as I have pointed out yesterday if NI had normal politics it would vote majority Labour
    So I was right, we should give the six counties to the Republic.
    There are a couple of you on here who are little too enthusiastic about randomly giving bits of the country away.

    Should residents of Kent start learning French just in case?
    The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. For the greater good and all that jazz.
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,411
    edited June 2017
    GeoffM said:

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    Now that can't possibly be true Alan! We've been reliably told the DUP are even more evilly baby-eating than the Tories!!
    as I have pointed out yesterday if NI had normal politics it would vote majority Labour
    So I was right, we should give the six counties to the Republic.
    There are a couple of you on here who are little too enthusiastic about randomly giving bits of the country away.

    Should residents of Kent start learning French just in case?
    Some people would happily get rid of everything apart from posh parts of London and Home Counties.
  • Options
    GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 24,425

    GIN1138 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Rumours swirling that Priti Patel either sacked or demoted

    Wonder whether Priti will launch a leadership bid tomorrow?
    Central plank of her bid bring back hanging?
    LOL well obviously Priti wouldn't actually get anywhere but the point is it will only take one stalking horse to have a go and the whole thing will collapse for Mrs May as others throw their hats in the ring.

    Anybody she sacks this afternoon could potentially end her career tomorrow. Must be a tough position to be in...
    It is a farce. May should just resign. It really is a horror show, played out before our eyes. Arlene Foster's puppet. No surrender!!
    and yet despite your bleating Labour fails to offer ordinary voters in NI a non sectarian alternative

    how do you explain that ?
  • Options
    Bobajob_PBBobajob_PB Posts: 928

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    Now that can't possibly be true Alan! We've been reliably told the DUP are even more evilly baby-eating than the Tories!!
    as I have pointed out yesterday if NI had normal politics it would vote majority Labour
    And if my aunt had a willy she'd be my uncle etc etc. As it is, it offered a choice of terrorists and raging sectarian homophobes.
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,079

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    Now that can't possibly be true Alan! We've been reliably told the DUP are even more evilly baby-eating than the Tories!!
    as I have pointed out yesterday if NI had normal politics it would vote majority Labour
    So I was right, we should give the six counties to the Republic.
    TSE channels Corbyn! :lol:
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 24,425

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    Now that can't possibly be true Alan! We've been reliably told the DUP are even more evilly baby-eating than the Tories!!
    as I have pointed out yesterday if NI had normal politics it would vote majority Labour
    And if my aunt had a willy she'd be my uncle etc etc. As it is, it offered a choice of terrorists and raging sectarian homophobes.
    Labour refused to set up candidates in the election

    if youre complaining about the outcome maybe you should offer people an alternative
  • Options
    MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699
    macisback said:

    macisback said:

    MJW said:

    One point I'd like to make is that those people who claim the Tories are doomed are forgetting the Tories were genuinely miles ahead at the locals. If they can lose support that quickly, they can get it back.

    But not without a swift about turn, I accept that.

    They were performing a high-wire act to channel the left over Brexit euphoria from June last year. Now that's gone it will not come back.
    Other problem is they've completely lost the sense that they're the only sensible dependable game in town. That helped them get over the line in 2015 and looked likely to deliver a thumping win in 2017. Now, no Tory will be taken seriously when they argue a Labour govt will lead to chaos as the Tories have done so by losing not one but two electoral gambles designed for party political advantage. A reputation of sober stability won't come back for a very long time - if ever. Look at what the financial crisis and what it did to Labour's economic credibility - and that on the whole, wasn't unnecessarily self-inflicted.
    The financial crisis effected the lives of most people, it hit hard in employment and in people's wallet. The last few years have been stable so the sensible, dependable is still usable. If inflation/interest rates shoot up in coming years that is when the Conservatives will in serious trouble. If the economy remains stable Brexit or not they will stay fairly solid. They could do with sorting the current boundaries for certain, a huge handicap.
    I don't believe that with current results , that the new boundaries will be very helpful at all to the Conservatives but we will have to see what the revised boundary proposals are when they are published .
    They couldn't be any worse surely, in my seat Derby North the two most Derby Conservative wards were chopped off and allocated to rural seats, even though inside the City boundary. It was a great effort to take it in 2015 for the Conservatives.
    The Conservatives got 318 seats for 43% of the vote 7.4 seats per %
    Labour got 263 seats for 40% of the vote 6.6 seats per %

    If ( a big if ) the new boundaries are a bit fairer then the Conservatives will suffer fractionally as the current boundaries are now slightly favourable to them
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,079

    GIN1138 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Rumours swirling that Priti Patel either sacked or demoted

    Wonder whether Priti will launch a leadership bid tomorrow?
    Central plank of her bid bring back hanging?
    LOL well obviously Priti wouldn't actually get anywhere but the point is it will only take one stalking horse to have a go and the whole thing will collapse for Mrs May as others throw their hats in the ring.

    Anybody she sacks this afternoon could potentially end her career tomorrow. Must be a tough position to be in...
    It is a farce. May should just resign. It really is a horror show, played out before our eyes. Arlene Foster's puppet. No surrender!!
    328 seats :)

    Coalition of Chaos = 315 :lol:
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,079

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    Now that can't possibly be true Alan! We've been reliably told the DUP are even more evilly baby-eating than the Tories!!
    as I have pointed out yesterday if NI had normal politics it would vote majority Labour
    And if my aunt had a willy she'd be my uncle etc etc. As it is, it offered a choice of terrorists and raging sectarian homophobes.
    Why doesn't your party stand candidates in NI?
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,921

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    Now that can't possibly be true Alan! We've been reliably told the DUP are even more evilly baby-eating than the Tories!!
    as I have pointed out yesterday if NI had normal politics it would vote majority Labour
    So I was right, we should give the six counties to the Republic.
    the Republic is more right wing than SE England

    maybe just send all the pakistanis from mainland England there and they can all be happy

    Id advise you buy a house on the North Coast
    I've been to Donegal.
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,079

    GeoffM said:

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    Now that can't possibly be true Alan! We've been reliably told the DUP are even more evilly baby-eating than the Tories!!
    as I have pointed out yesterday if NI had normal politics it would vote majority Labour
    So I was right, we should give the six counties to the Republic.
    There are a couple of you on here who are little too enthusiastic about randomly giving bits of the country away.

    Should residents of Kent start learning French just in case?
    The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. For the greater good and all that jazz.
    See? TSE channels Spock Corbyn yet again! :lol:
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,282

    EPG said:

    Loyalist-backed Con-DUP government is being urged to prioritise allowing Orange marches down Catholic roads. Because it's their "culture".
    https://twitter.com/Portadownlol1/status/873638779910840320

    LOL = LOL
    Loyal Orange lodge.
  • Options
    Bobajob_PBBobajob_PB Posts: 928

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    They are pro welfare but also think that gay people are an abomination. Toxic.
    so do many muslims explain to me the difference
    There is no difference.
  • Options
    Andy_CookeAndy_Cooke Posts: 4,863
    Ironically, after commenting that the Lib Dem score was the most impossible to get right in advance, I got that one spot on.

    rcs1000 said:

    So...
    based largely on the issues with sampling and reported turnout (and tending towards the ICM side of things) and adding in a healthy chunk of uncertainty in Lib Dem target seats (and defences), plus a few other completely subjective best guesses and gut feels, I think the final seat tallies will be (low-most likely-high; note that "most likely" is NOT the centre of the range because a lot of these are skewed one way or the other):

    Con: 363-380-388
    Lab: 183-190-201
    SNP: 38-45-48
    LD: 6-12-23
    PC: 3-3-5
    Grn: 0-1-2

    More bullish on the LDs than I would be but, otherwise, very credible.
    I feel similarly to you. But the caveat I have is based around the Scottish elections last year, where the SNP increased their vote, the LDs slipped to just 5% of the list vote, and yet doubled their FPTP constituencies.

    I remember in the run up, there was much discussion about whether they would win *any* seats in Scotland.

    Last year saw substantive tactical voting for the LDs in Scotland. Could we see similar this year at Westminster? If we did, it would likely hand half a dozen seats in Remainia to them. Is it likely? No. I reckon 10-11 is the most likely seat count, and 6-9 is more likely than 12-15. But it is possible.
    I did umm and ah between 11 and 12 for the LDs for my "most likely" number and possibly skewed it towards 12 simply because of a tendency pressing away from one end.
    It was because I felt the data from the polls would be far less useful for the LD seat share and went to seat-by-seat analysis based on demographics, voting history, and effort expended in them instead. Which seems to be pretty similar to what the YouGov model tried to do for every seat, with some success.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 24,425

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    Now that can't possibly be true Alan! We've been reliably told the DUP are even more evilly baby-eating than the Tories!!
    as I have pointed out yesterday if NI had normal politics it would vote majority Labour
    And if my aunt had a willy she'd be my uncle etc etc. As it is, it offered a choice of terrorists and raging sectarian homophobes.
    Why doesn't your party stand candidates in NI?
    his party only exists in NI because trade unionists were about to slam them for racist discrimination agaisnt people from NI if they were denied representation
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 24,425

    Alan

    Nope. Anyone who thinks that is a bigot. I don't care who they are.

    I'd rather have no religion at all to be honest, it clearly doesn't help people live and let live.

    so nope you cant explain it or nope your not happy with the votes of muslims ?
    If you are a bigot or whatever shade or religious excuse then go vote UKIP or DUP, those are the parties for you.
    you forgot to add Labour since lots of antisemites get a hearing.and that doesnt appear to concern you.

    or maybe you could just stop spouting crap and look at voting records

    "When the opposition get to decide the topic between debated, the DUP’s voting record is generally left-leaning and aligned with the Labour party"

    https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/06/10/our-friends-in-the-north-the-dup-and-the-tories-arent-ideologically-close/
    They are pro welfare but also think that gay people are an abomination. Toxic.
    so do many muslims explain to me the difference
    There is no difference.
    and yet youre quite happy to accept some of the worst discrimination in the UK when its right in your midst
  • Options
    CD13CD13 Posts: 6,355
    Mr Brooke.

    Mr Job's having a go at the transgender now. The man's a bigot.

    In answer to your unanswered question. Muslims are good bigots because they vote Labour.

    I've no problem with anyone having an opinion and if they want to hate gays, they can (Muslims and DUPers both). As long as I'm not forced to agree.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 24,425
    CD13 said:

    Mr Brooke.

    Mr Job's having a go at the transgender now. The man's a bigot.

    In answer to your unanswered question. Muslims are good bigots because they vote Labour.

    I've no problem with anyone having an opinion and if they want to hate gays, they can (Muslims and DUPers both). As long as I'm not forced to agree.

    BaJ is simply intolerant

  • Options
    Bobajob_PBBobajob_PB Posts: 928
    Pulpstar said:

    EPG said:

    Loyalist-backed Con-DUP government is being urged to prioritise allowing Orange marches down Catholic roads. Because it's their "culture".
    https://twitter.com/Portadownlol1/status/873638779910840320

    LOL = LOL
    Loyal Orange lodge.
    Indeed, as I was saying. Loyal Orange Lodge = LOL.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 24,425

    Pulpstar said:

    EPG said:

    Loyalist-backed Con-DUP government is being urged to prioritise allowing Orange marches down Catholic roads. Because it's their "culture".
    https://twitter.com/Portadownlol1/status/873638779910840320

    LOL = LOL
    Loyal Orange lodge.
    Indeed, as I was saying. Loyal Orange Lodge = LOL.
    the Ornge Lodge had a black Leader in 1994

    has Labour had one ?
  • Options
    CD13CD13 Posts: 6,355
    Mr Brooke,

    "BaJ is simply intolerant."

    Spot on. But I forgive him.
  • Options
    EPGEPG Posts: 6,390

    Pulpstar said:

    EPG said:

    Loyalist-backed Con-DUP government is being urged to prioritise allowing Orange marches down Catholic roads. Because it's their "culture".
    https://twitter.com/Portadownlol1/status/873638779910840320

    LOL = LOL
    Loyal Orange lodge.
    Indeed, as I was saying. Loyal Orange Lodge = LOL.
    You're not allowed point it out because calling gays abominations is part of their culture

    They are safe-spacer snowflakes
  • Options
    MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699

    Ironically, after commenting that the Lib Dem score was the most impossible to get right in advance, I got that one spot on.

    rcs1000 said:

    So...
    based largely on the issues with sampling and reported turnout (and tending towards the ICM side of things) and adding in a healthy chunk of uncertainty in Lib Dem target seats (and defences), plus a few other completely subjective best guesses and gut feels, I think the final seat tallies will be (low-most likely-high; note that "most likely" is NOT the centre of the range because a lot of these are skewed one way or the other):

    Con: 363-380-388
    Lab: 183-190-201
    SNP: 38-45-48
    LD: 6-12-23
    PC: 3-3-5
    Grn: 0-1-2

    More bullish on the LDs than I would be but, otherwise, very credible.
    I feel similarly to you. But the caveat I have is based around the Scottish elections last year, where the SNP increased their vote, the LDs slipped to just 5% of the list vote, and yet doubled their FPTP constituencies.

    I remember in the run up, there was much discussion about whether they would win *any* seats in Scotland.

    Last year saw substantive tactical voting for the LDs in Scotland. Could we see similar this year at Westminster? If we did, it would likely hand half a dozen seats in Remainia to them. Is it likely? No. I reckon 10-11 is the most likely seat count, and 6-9 is more likely than 12-15. But it is possible.
    I did umm and ah between 11 and 12 for the LDs for my "most likely" number and possibly skewed it towards 12 simply because of a tendency pressing away from one end.
    It was because I felt the data from the polls would be far less useful for the LD seat share and went to seat-by-seat analysis based on demographics, voting history, and effort expended in them instead. Which seems to be pretty similar to what the YouGov model tried to do for every seat, with some success.
    I got the Lib Dem figure exactly correct too at 12 but really it is luck , 500 odd extra votes and they would have had 16 .
  • Options
    Bobajob_PBBobajob_PB Posts: 928

    CD13 said:

    Mr Brooke.

    Mr Job's having a go at the transgender now. The man's a bigot.

    In answer to your unanswered question. Muslims are good bigots because they vote Labour.

    I've no problem with anyone having an opinion and if they want to hate gays, they can (Muslims and DUPers both). As long as I'm not forced to agree.

    BaJ is simply intolerant

    Have a lie down.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 24,425
    CD13 said:

    Mr Brooke,

    "BaJ is simply intolerant."

    Spot on. But I forgive him.

    one can do little else

    however if his aunt had a willy I suspect she wouldnt think with it
  • Options
    Bobajob_PBBobajob_PB Posts: 928
    CD13 said:

    Mr Brooke,

    "BaJ is simply intolerant."

    Spot on. But I forgive him.

    Go to bed.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 24,425

    CD13 said:

    Mr Brooke,

    "BaJ is simply intolerant."

    Spot on. But I forgive him.

    Go to bed.
    we'll pray for you
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,160
    Mr. 83, a sci-fi storyline, the Matrix meets Conservatives:

    100 years in the future, the irresistible force meets the immovable object. George Osborne has taken every job in Britain, except one.

    Jeremy Hunt has been Health Secretary for over a century. But will his reign be ended by the all-consuming Osborne?
  • Options
    EPGEPG Posts: 6,390
    Paramilitary gangs shooting people dead, then helping elect MPs who keep May in power, is simply part of their culture

    Has to be celebrated as part of Britishness
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 24,425

    CD13 said:

    Mr Brooke.

    Mr Job's having a go at the transgender now. The man's a bigot.

    In answer to your unanswered question. Muslims are good bigots because they vote Labour.

    I've no problem with anyone having an opinion and if they want to hate gays, they can (Muslims and DUPers both). As long as I'm not forced to agree.

    BaJ is simply intolerant

    Have a lie down.
    I'd love to, but educating you is a full time job
  • Options
    JohnOJohnO Posts: 4,228

    Pulpstar said:

    EPG said:

    Loyalist-backed Con-DUP government is being urged to prioritise allowing Orange marches down Catholic roads. Because it's their "culture".
    https://twitter.com/Portadownlol1/status/873638779910840320

    LOL = LOL
    Loyal Orange lodge.
    Indeed, as I was saying. Loyal Orange Lodge = LOL.
    the Ornge Lodge had a black Leader in 1994

    has Labour had one ?
    And his deputy had a tan?
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,921
    Alistair said:
    They didn't appear because they are still celebrating.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 24,425
    EPG said:

    Paramilitary gangs shooting people dead, then helping elect MPs who keep May in power, is simply part of their culture

    Has to be celebrated as part of Britishness

    Sinn Fein presumably
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 24,425
    JohnO said:

    Pulpstar said:

    EPG said:

    Loyalist-backed Con-DUP government is being urged to prioritise allowing Orange marches down Catholic roads. Because it's their "culture".
    https://twitter.com/Portadownlol1/status/873638779910840320

    LOL = LOL
    Loyal Orange lodge.
    Indeed, as I was saying. Loyal Orange Lodge = LOL.
    the Ornge Lodge had a black Leader in 1994

    has Labour had one ?
    And his deputy had a tan?
    lol
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,160
    Mr. Cooke, I'm damned glad the Lib Dems got 12 because I'd backed them to be over 11.5 seats (to offset being pretty green if they were under 10). 10 or 11 seats would've been poor for me.
  • Options
    Andy_CookeAndy_Cooke Posts: 4,863

    Ironically, after commenting that the Lib Dem score was the most impossible to get right in advance, I got that one spot on.

    rcs1000 said:

    So...
    based largely on the issues with sampling and reported turnout (and tending towards the ICM side of things) and adding in a healthy chunk of uncertainty in Lib Dem target seats (and defences), plus a few other completely subjective best guesses and gut feels, I think the final seat tallies will be (low-most likely-high; note that "most likely" is NOT the centre of the range because a lot of these are skewed one way or the other):

    Con: 363-380-388
    Lab: 183-190-201
    SNP: 38-45-48
    LD: 6-12-23
    PC: 3-3-5
    Grn: 0-1-2

    More bullish on the LDs than I would be but, otherwise, very credible.
    I feel similarly to you. But the caveat I have is based around the Scottish elections last year, where the SNP increased their vote, the LDs slipped to just 5% of the list vote, and yet doubled their FPTP constituencies.

    I remember in the run up, there was much discussion about whether they would win *any* seats in Scotland.

    Last year saw substantive tactical voting for the LDs in Scotland. Could we see similar this year at Westminster? If we did, it would likely hand half a dozen seats in Remainia to them. Is it likely? No. I reckon 10-11 is the most likely seat count, and 6-9 is more likely than 12-15. But it is possible.
    I did umm and ah between 11 and 12 for the LDs for my "most likely" number and possibly skewed it towards 12 simply because of a tendency pressing away from one end.
    It was because I felt the data from the polls would be far less useful for the LD seat share and went to seat-by-seat analysis based on demographics, voting history, and effort expended in them instead. Which seems to be pretty similar to what the YouGov model tried to do for every seat, with some success.
    I got the Lib Dem figure exactly correct too at 12 but really it is luck , 500 odd extra votes and they would have had 16 .
    Yeah.
    I did insist on giving a range for that reason. A slightly higher Tory or Labour tide could have seen further reversals and squeeze beyond what the polls indicated, and slightly better luck or lower Tory or Labour tide could have seen a better outcome.
    To be honest, it was higher than I expected right on the eve of the poll.
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 26,138
    According to a few posts on here the DUP are OK and its all about the numbers. So what?

    Well here's a history lesson:

    The Ulster Resistance Movement was set up by Sammy Wilson, Ian Paisley Snr., Peter Robinson and Ivan Foster. They can be seen wearing their red berets all over the internet!

    The group colluded with the UVF, UDA and RHC (Red Hand Commando) to procure arms. In June 1987 the UVF stole £300,000 from a branch of the Northern Bank at Portadown. This money was given to Libya in exchange for 206x Vz.58 assault rifles, 94x Browning 9mm hand guns, 4x RPG Rocket Launchers and 62x warheads, 450 X RGD-5 grenades and 30,00 rounds of ammunition.

    Nice guys?

    Yes Corbyn's and Abbott's justification of the IRA is outrageous, but the connections these guys had to many unsavoury people are almost equally as distasteful.

    For Mrs May to justify her plan by calling her party the Conservative and Unionist Party in this context was disingenuous too. The DUP are not the UUP and although David Trimble liked to put on an orange sash he was seen as a fairly decent guy by most people.

    Campbell and Powell who were both key players in the facilitation of the Good Friday Agreement have both said this is BAD! Enda Kenny says it is BAD!

    The conclusion must also be in both the short and longer term this is BAD for the Conservatives too!
This discussion has been closed.