Will the PB Tories finally admit that TMay is crap? She is politically hapless, dull, wooden and very uninspiring. David Cameron is in a different league to her.
I've been pointing this out since last July.
And yet she is on course to get a far bigger majority than Cameron ever achieved. The man who so politically inept he managed to force himself into a position where he had to resign entirely because of his own failings.
And after he explicitly promised that he wouldn't.
He's an honourable man, he knew if he lost the referendum, he should quit.
Only the terminally stupid don't realise if he had said 'I'll quit if I lose the referendum' it might have encouraged non Tories to vote Leave to topple Cameron.
Cf the Indyref.
I don't know which definition of 'honourable' extends to 'deliberately lying'. He could always have maintained a 'diplomatic silence'. Besides, if only the 'terminally stupid' didn't know he would resign then what was the point of lying...?
The large amount of terminally stupid Labour and Lib Dem voters?
It is now clear that May is useless. Even Corbyn looks good compared to her. He must be thanking his lucky stars.
This is borne out by the leadership ratings, no doubt?
I would like to see the ratings next week.
My mum is the ultimate barometer of Middle Britain, and a voting, politically aware pensioner too
She was quite a fan of TMay; I've just spoken to her about the Coal Snatching Dementia Taxer, for the first time since the manifesto - and she called TMay "that silly woman".
This is grim for the Tories.
On the upside, my mum also said We can't have that Corbyn winning. She will still vote Tory.
If Labour had a decent leader they would be looking at a big overall majority.
Corbyn stays on, hands over to a successor of his choosing in 2019/2020. The Conservatives, now ten years into government, begin tearing themselves apart over issues such as the dementia tax or good old fashioned sleaze. Labour sweep into power in 2022 on a repeat of their hard left 2017 manifesto but with a more charismatic leader.
2027 and we're Venezuela.
Pass the smelling salts, because I'm coming over all faint at the possibility.
Will the PB Tories finally admit that TMay is crap? She is politically hapless, dull, wooden and very uninspiring. David Cameron is in a different league to her.
I've been pointing this out since last July.
And yet she is on course to get a far bigger majority than Cameron ever achieved. The man who so politically inept he managed to force himself into a position where he had to resign entirely because of his own failings.
And after he explicitly promised that he wouldn't.
He's an honourable man, he knew if he lost the referendum, he should quit.
Only the terminally stupid don't realise if he had said 'I'll quit if I lose the referendum' it might have encouraged non Tories to vote Leave to topple Cameron.
Cf the Indyref.
I don't know which definition of 'honourable' extends to 'deliberately lying'. He could always have maintained a 'diplomatic silence'. Besides, if only the 'terminally stupid' didn't know he would resign then what was the point of lying...?
The large amount of terminally stupid Labour and Lib Dem voters?
Would they be "Deplorables"?
Chortle. Lots or terminally stupid Tory voters too. And policymakers too apparently.
The way things are going I might have to stay up on election night after all.
Face it Tories, May isn't very good and she has bolloxed up her manifesto.
I'm not saying she won't win with a healthy majority, but she doesn't deserve it.
So manifesto's have to be crowd pleaser's rather than addressing the difficult problems of the day
The Labour manifesto included policies that will hit Tory voters.
The Conservative manifesto included policies that will hit Tory voters.
That's the difference.
Not sure if you were being ironic or not but there is indeed a difference. The Tories appear to be willing to hit their own supporters because it is the right thing to do to put the necessary changes in place. Labour just want to hit the Tory supporters because they are Tories and because they (Labour) are envious little shits fighting what they perceive as some strange class warfare.
Watching Labour try and attack a policy which takes from the rich and gives to the average man would be hillarious if the subject wasn't so damn serious.
Labour "attacking" is basically intended to keep the issue alive.
Theresa May has launched a North Korean missile. It has been launched but we do not where it will hit !
But in their own manifesto, they said (to paraphrase):
1. Let's kick the can a little more. 2. Let's be adults about this difficult subject.
Now what we see is:
1. Let's just have the State pay for it. 2. #DEMENTIATAX OMG EEVIL BABYEATERS!!!!!!
The reality is that:
1. This will cost roughly 5p on income tax across all rates - they're not saying anything about this, just trying to add it to the other £60 something billion in uncosted expentidure in the Labour manifesto. 2. What happened to being adults about this difficult subject?
The Tory proposal might not be perfect, but let's all engage with the discussion to look at how it might be improved, rather than the screaming hysteria we've seen from certain quarters so far.
It is now clear that May is useless. Even Corbyn looks good compared to her. He must be thanking his lucky stars.
This is borne out by the leadership ratings, no doubt?
I would like to see the ratings next week.
My mum is the ultimate barometer of Middle Britain, and a voting, politically aware pensioner too
She was quite a fan of TMay; I've just spoken to her about the Coal Snatching Dementia Taxer, for the first time since the manifesto - and she called TMay "that silly woman".
This is grim for the Tories.
On the upside, my mum also said We can't have that Corbyn winning. She will still vote Tory.
If Labour had a decent leader they would be looking at a big overall majority.
It is now clear that May is useless. Even Corbyn looks good compared to her. He must be thanking his lucky stars.
This is borne out by the leadership ratings, no doubt?
I would like to see the ratings next week.
My mum is the ultimate barometer of Middle Britain, and a voting, politically aware pensioner too
She was quite a fan of TMay; I've just spoken to her about the Coal Snatching Dementia Taxer, for the first time since the manifesto - and she called TMay "that silly woman".
This is grim for the Tories.
On the upside, my mum also said We can't have that Corbyn winning. She will still vote Tory.
If Labour had a decent leader they would be looking at a big overall majority.
May can comfortably retrieve the situation by showing she isn't cloth eared and upping the threshold.
Interestingly, most of the resentment I'm seeing, reading and hearing is along the lines of 'I've (my mum, my dad) worked all my life and I get penalised.....while the wasteful, scrounger, feckless etc will all get it for nothing'.
So, it really isn't very good news for Labour. It's a matter of tweaking for the Tories.
It is now clear that May is useless. Even Corbyn looks good compared to her. He must be thanking his lucky stars.
She was still better than her opponents though. Leadsome, Gove, Boris, Crabb, and Fox were all terrible candidates for the Conservative leadership/Prime Minster.
Gove would have been fine as PM.
I think if he had made the final two, I probably would have voted for him (Sorry JohnO)
Gove is a walking ideologue and yet another one who worships Blair.
Gove would have been a disaster. He an even more worse example of the dangers of the journalist-politician than Boris Johnson. Ken Clarke's assessment of him in the clip where he called May a 'bloody difficult woman' was absolutely devastating.
If a serial waste of space and anti-democrat like Clarke was against him that is another excellent reason to be in favour of Gove.
Is there any pro-EU politician you have a good word for?
If I had to sum up in two words why I believe the Tories will win this GE with a majority of at least 100 seats, I would say (i) Brexit and (ii) McDonnell.
75% of the electorate do not know who is McDonnell. Some might even confuse him with McGuiness.
It is now clear that May is useless. Even Corbyn looks good compared to her. He must be thanking his lucky stars.
She was still better than her opponents though. Leadsome, Gove, Boris, Crabb, and Fox were all terrible candidates for the Conservative leadership/Prime Minster.
Gove would have been fine as PM.
I think if he had made the final two, I probably would have voted for him (Sorry JohnO)
Agreed. As we discussed the other day he's somewhat wasted sitting on the back benches.
1350 likes on the Daily Mail site for this comment 200 disagree
The Daily Mail FFS
ottie, manchester, 21 hours ago I was going to vote for May but have to think long and hard now. I have no problem with giving up the winter fuel payment, but to take my house which me and my husband have worked dammed hard and did without for is theft. We thought our son who cannot afford a pension would benefit from our hard work May is giving no one an incentive to save and do well
If I had to sum up in two words why I believe the Tories will win this GE with a majority of at least 100 seats, I would say (i) Brexit and (ii) McDonnell.
75% of the electorate do not know who is McDonnell. Some might even confuse him with McGuiness.
It is now clear that May is useless. Even Corbyn looks good compared to her. He must be thanking his lucky stars.
She was still better than her opponents though. Leadsome, Gove, Boris, Crabb, and Fox were all terrible candidates for the Conservative leadership/Prime Minster.
Where is "I am a mother" Loathsome ? Is she still around ?
It is now clear that May is useless. Even Corbyn looks good compared to her. He must be thanking his lucky stars.
She was still better than her opponents though. Leadsome, Gove, Boris, Crabb, and Fox were all terrible candidates for the Conservative leadership/Prime Minster.
Gove would have been fine as PM.
I think if he had made the final two, I probably would have voted for him (Sorry JohnO)
Gove is a walking ideologue and yet another one who worships Blair.
Gove would have been a disaster. He an even more worse example of the dangers of the journalist-politician than Boris Johnson. Ken Clarke's assessment of him in the clip where he called May a 'bloody difficult woman' was absolutely devastating.
I'm going to look for that clip now.
I didn't rate Gove's time as Education Secretary at all.
If I had to sum up in two words why I believe the Tories will win this GE with a majority of at least 100 seats, I would say (i) Brexit and (ii) McDonnell.
No one is talking about Brexit any more (apart from Farron, and no one is listening to him), this is not the Brexit Election that May called.
"This is a Conservative Prime Minister sanctioning a socialist attack on private property ownership, singling out people who have bought property, from those who rented or had the benefit of housing allowances. If anything were an attack on independence, aspiration and thrift it is this."
If I had to sum up in two words why I believe the Tories will win this GE with a majority of at least 100 seats, I would say (i) Brexit and (ii) McDonnell.
75% of the electorate do not know who is McDonnell. Some might even confuse him with McGuiness.
It is now clear that May is useless. Even Corbyn looks good compared to her. He must be thanking his lucky stars.
She was still better than her opponents though. Leadsome, Gove, Boris, Crabb, and Fox were all terrible candidates for the Conservative leadership/Prime Minster.
Where is "I am a mother" Loathsome ? Is she still around ?
Newsnight ran a 'fluff' piece about a week ago 'trying to find her'. Apparently she was in Cornwall talking to farmers and fishermen (which makes perfect sense really).
It's gone from panic to unmitigated hysteria, so much so that PB Tories have now convinced themselves that Corbyn will become PM on June 9th and the nation is about to embrace socialism. And all this before any post manifesto polls have even been released.
I've never seen anything like this.
At least the Labour supporters are optimists, cheerful even when facing defeat. The Tories here..my God. They've run up the white flag at the first sign of resistance. Makes me ashamed to be a Tory supporter.
If I had to sum up in two words why I believe the Tories will win this GE with a majority of at least 100 seats, I would say (i) Brexit and (ii) McDonnell.
No one is talking about Brexit any more (apart from Farron, and no one is listening to him), this is not the Brexit Election that May called.
It's gone from panic to unmitigated hysteria, so much so that PB Tories have now convinced themselves that Corbyn will become PM on June 9th and the nation is about to embrace socialism. And all this before any post manifesto polls have even been released.
I've never seen anything like this.
At least the Labour supporters are optimists, cheerful even when facing defeat. The Tories here..my God. They've run up the white flag at the first sign of resistance. Makes me ashamed to be a Tory supporter.
You weren't here the night in September 2014 when a YouGov but Yes ahead in the Indyref?
One thing's for sure, Dementia Tax (note how the name has already stuck) is the mother of all stealth taxes. For God's sake, the last thing we need are yet more stealth taxes. If needs be increase the rate of income tax, incl the higher rate as was always the case before governments introduced all these smoke and mirror dishonest schemes which we're not supposed to notice, until we move house, die, etc, etc. Enough!
We should not be increasing income taxes so that some people can inherit more.
I would prefer to pay a premium of 5% in higher taxes over the course of my life than be in a situation where I lose my marbles, am forced into care, and the state takes everything, leaving my childen / grandchildren with a pittance between them after the state takes it all away for doubtless inefficient, over-expensive and padded out care subcontracted to private companies.
Heck, I would rather the government said "take out an insurance policy and pay for it yourself, if you don't you're on your own" than that. Though pooled risk through, say, an increase in NI levied on all seems far more measured and reasonable.
Your proposal would be OK if we were starting from scratch. The problem is all those who haven't paid the extra 5% higher tax and need care now or in the near future. OK so their taxes may well have been higher for other reasons, but that still leaves their care now to be funded by the younger age groups.
Life is a bit of a lottery in many respects. I was of the generation which had free university - but then I wasn't bright enough to benefit from that policy. Maybe I'll get dementia & maybe I won't. There are lots of young people who have no-one to leave them anything so why should my heirs benefit from what I'm able to leave them whilst those other poor sods are working to pay for my care?
Will the PB Tories finally admit that TMay is crap? She is politically hapless, dull, wooden and very uninspiring. David Cameron is in a different league to her.
I've been pointing this out since last July.
And yet she is on course to get a far bigger majority than Cameron ever achieved. The man who so politically inept he managed to force himself into a position where he had to resign entirely because of his own failings.
And after he explicitly promised that he wouldn't.
He's an honourable man, he knew if he lost the referendum, he should quit.
Only the terminally stupid don't realise if he had said 'I'll quit if I lose the referendum' it might have encouraged non Tories to vote Leave to topple Cameron.
Cf the Indyref.
Some of us did vote Leave for the added benefit of getting rid of Cameron. 'Let's wipe the smile off their faces', remember?
Problem is, you overshot your target and wiped the smiles off Gove and Johnson, too:
If I had to sum up in two words why I believe the Tories will win this GE with a majority of at least 100 seats, I would say (i) Brexit and (ii) McDonnell.
75% of the electorate do not know who is McDonnell. Some might even confuse him with McGuiness.
including Corbyn!
Are you saying only 25% know who Corbyn is ? I wish it was true.
When it comes to keeping confidential things under wraps, I've become something of a cynic in my passing years. I've come to believe in what my erstwhile boss would remind me of countless times with that warm Jewish grin of his: "Peter, there's no such thing as a secret, somebody always knows and somebody always tells." Judging by the solidity across the betting markets tonight, my guess is that it will be very much a case of as you were in terms of the Tories' lead over Labour. Of course, I could be wrong.
It is now clear that May is useless. Even Corbyn looks good compared to her. He must be thanking his lucky stars.
She was still better than her opponents though. Leadsome, Gove, Boris, Crabb, and Fox were all terrible candidates for the Conservative leadership/Prime Minster.
Gove would have been fine as PM.
I think if he had made the final two, I probably would have voted for him (Sorry JohnO)
Gove is a walking ideologue and yet another one who worships Blair.
Gove would have been a disaster. He an even more worse example of the dangers of the journalist-politician than Boris Johnson. Ken Clarke's assessment of him in the clip where he called May a 'bloody difficult woman' was absolutely devastating.
I'm going to look for that clip now.
I didn't rate Gove's time as Education Secretary at all.
It's gone from panic to unmitigated hysteria, so much so that PB Tories have now convinced themselves that Corbyn will become PM on June 9th and the nation is about to embrace socialism. And all this before any post manifesto polls have even been released.
I've never seen anything like this.
At least the Labour supporters are optimists, cheerful even when facing defeat. The Tories here..my God. They've run up the white flag at the first sign of resistance. Makes me ashamed to be a Tory supporter.
If I had to sum up in two words why I believe the Tories will win this GE with a majority of at least 100 seats, I would say (i) Brexit and (ii) McDonnell.
75% of the electorate do not know who is McDonnell. Some might even confuse him with McGuiness.
They all know who Corbyn and Diane Abbott are.
May is testing various theories of how outrageous she can be and still manage a comfortable majority over the Marx Brothers.
It is now clear that May is useless. Even Corbyn looks good compared to her. He must be thanking his lucky stars.
She was still better than her opponents though. Leadsome, Gove, Boris, Crabb, and Fox were all terrible candidates for the Conservative leadership/Prime Minster.
Gove would have been fine as PM.
I think if he had made the final two, I probably would have voted for him (Sorry JohnO)
Gove is a walking ideologue and yet another one who worships Blair.
Gove would have been a disaster. He an even more worse example of the dangers of the journalist-politician than Boris Johnson. Ken Clarke's assessment of him in the clip where he called May a 'bloody difficult woman' was absolutely devastating.
I'm going to look for that clip now.
I didn't rate Gove's time as Education Secretary at all.
Quite. Didn't he get moved as he was costing the Tories votes from parents?
Will the PB Tories finally admit that TMay is crap? She is politically hapless, dull, wooden and very uninspiring. David Cameron is in a different league to her.
I've been pointing this out since last July.
And yet she is on course to get a far bigger majority than Cameron ever achieved. The man who so politically inept he managed to force himself into a position where he had to resign entirely because of his own failings.
And after he explicitly promised that he wouldn't.
He's an honourable man, he knew if he lost the referendum, he should quit.
Only the terminally stupid don't realise if he had said 'I'll quit if I lose the referendum' it might have encouraged non Tories to vote Leave to topple Cameron.
Cf the Indyref.
Some of us did vote Leave for the added benefit of getting rid of Cameron. 'Let's wipe the smile off their faces', remember?
The biggest blow (some of) Labour has landed on the Tories in umpteen years.....
If I had to sum up in two words why I believe the Tories will win this GE with a majority of at least 100 seats, I would say (i) Brexit and (ii) McDonnell.
No one is talking about Brexit any more (apart from Farron, and no one is listening to him), this is not the Brexit Election that May called.
The lack of preparation is showing.
Or McIRA
Its all about
Pound Shop Thatcher House Snatcher
It is looking like 3 own goals so far. The other side hasn't scored once.
It is now clear that May is useless. Even Corbyn looks good compared to her. He must be thanking his lucky stars.
This is borne out by the leadership ratings, no doubt?
I would like to see the ratings next week.
My mum is the ultimate barometer of Middle Britain, and a voting, politically aware pensioner too
She was quite a fan of TMay; I've just spoken to her about the Coal Snatching Dementia Taxer, for the first time since the manifesto - and she called TMay "that silly woman".
This is grim for the Tories.
On the upside, my mum also said We can't have that Corbyn winning. She will still vote Tory.
If Labour had a decent leader they would be looking at a big overall majority.
Corbyn stays on, hands over to a successor of his choosing in 2019/2020. The Conservatives, now ten years into government, begin tearing themselves apart over issues such as the dementia tax or good old fashioned sleaze. Labour sweep into power in 2022 on a repeat of their hard left 2017 manifesto but with a more charismatic leader.
2027 and we're Venezuela.
Pass the smelling salts, because I'm coming over all faint at the possibility.
Theresa May, how did you let this happen?
A Corbyn-esque Labour party in power - a British Chavez in number 10 - would be the one thing that would make me regret my Brexit vote. Apocalyptic.
I think you said something very eloquent the other day about Labour needing to exterminate the rats in their own basement before they spread to the entire street, the thing is, long term, when we look back on this in 30 years, this election was never going to be about Brexit, it was really about either kicking the hard left out of power for all time and showing them there was no place for their views in British politics, or inviting them to the top table and one day allowing them to take over.
I fear if Theresa May secures a weak majority of 50 or so it will be the latter.
Even if Corbynism is defeated next month and again in 2022, she's already shifted the Overton window uncomfortably to the left.
If I had to sum up in two words why I believe the Tories will win this GE with a majority of at least 100 seats, I would say (i) Brexit and (ii) McDonnell.
75% of the electorate do not know who is McDonnell. Some might even confuse him with McGuiness.
including Corbyn!
Are you saying only 25% know who Corbyn is ? I wish it was true.
No....it was a bad joke that Corbyn thinks Mcdonnell is Martin McGuiness.
1350 likes on the Daily Mail site for this comment 200 disagree
The Daily Mail FFS
ottie, manchester, 21 hours ago I was going to vote for May but have to think long and hard now. I have no problem with giving up the winter fuel payment, but to take my house which me and my husband have worked dammed hard and did without for is theft. We thought our son who cannot afford a pension would benefit from our hard work May is giving no one an incentive to save and do well
I would make it 1351 if I went in there. It's all show biz.
One thing's for sure, Dementia Tax (note how the name has already stuck) is the mother of all stealth taxes. For God's sake, the last thing we need are yet more stealth taxes. If needs be increase the rate of income tax, incl the higher rate as was always the case before governments introduced all these smoke and mirror dishonest schemes which we're not supposed to notice, until we move house, die, etc, etc. Enough!
We should not be increasing income taxes so that some people can inherit more.
I would prefer to pay a premium of 5% in higher taxes over the course of my life than be in a situation where I lose my marbles, am forced into care, and the state takes everything, leaving my childen / grandchildren with a pittance between them after the state takes it all away for doubtless inefficient, over-expensive and padded out care subcontracted to private companies.
Heck, I would rather the government said "take out an insurance policy and pay for it yourself, if you don't you're on your own" than that. Though pooled risk through, say, an increase in NI levied on all seems far more measured and reasonable.
Your proposal would be OK if we were starting from scratch. The problem is all those who haven't paid the extra 5% higher tax and need care now or in the near future. OK so their taxes may well have been higher for other reasons, but that still leaves their care now to be funded by the younger age groups.
Life is a bit of a lottery in many respects. I was of the generation which had free university - but then I wasn't bright enough to benefit from that policy. Maybe I'll get dementia & maybe I won't. There are lots of young people who have no-one to leave them anything so why should my heirs benefit from what I'm able to leave them whilst those other poor sods are working to pay for my care?
Good evening, everyone.
My main reaction to this is that I hope elective euthanasia takes off in the next 20 years or so.
It is now clear that May is useless. Even Corbyn looks good compared to her. He must be thanking his lucky stars.
She was still better than her opponents though. Leadsome, Gove, Boris, Crabb, and Fox were all terrible candidates for the Conservative leadership/Prime Minster.
Where is "I am a mother" Loathsome ? Is she still around ?
She's disappeared totally from public view. I think there's even been speculation that it's a sign that her days in the cabinet are numbered.
@midwinter Yep. He was VERY unpopular as Education Secretary.
@williamglenn I literally had just viewed it on YouTube before I came back here and was going to post it. His summary of Gove and Boris was so on point - and hilarious!
Another big problem with the optics of a controversial policy like this when May is about to start financial negotiations with the EU is that it will look to people as if she is making a grab for their housing equity in order to pay the divorce bill. Given the demographics of the Leave vote, perhaps that's correct.
One thing's for sure, Dementia Tax (note how the name has already stuck) is the mother of all stealth taxes. For God's sake, the last thing we need are yet more stealth taxes. If needs be increase the rate of income tax, incl the higher rate as was always the case before governments introduced all these smoke and mirror dishonest schemes which we're not supposed to notice, until we move house, die, etc, etc. Enough!
We should not be increasing income taxes so that some people can inherit more.
I would prefer to pay a premium of 5% in higher taxes over the course of my life than be in a situation where I lose my marbles, am forced into care, and the state takes everything, leaving my childen / grandchildren with a pittance between them after the state takes it all away for doubtless inefficient, over-expensive and padded out care subcontracted to private companies.
Heck, I would rather the government said "take out an insurance policy and pay for it yourself, if you don't you're on your own" than that. Though pooled risk through, say, an increase in NI levied on all seems far more measured and reasonable.
Your proposal would be OK if we were starting from scratch. The problem is all those who haven't paid the extra 5% higher tax and need care now or in the near future. OK so their taxes may well have been higher for other reasons, but that still leaves their care now to be funded by the younger age groups.
Life is a bit of a lottery in many respects. I was of the generation which had free university - but then I wasn't bright enough to benefit from that policy. Maybe I'll get dementia & maybe I won't. There are lots of young people who have no-one to leave them anything so why should my heirs benefit from what I'm able to leave them whilst those other poor sods are working to pay for my care?
Good evening, everyone.
Is that "Good evening hello" or "Good evening goodbye"?
I'm uncomfortable with the idea that a family with a demented elder has somehow lost the lottery of life while the rest of us breathe a sigh of relief. On the other hand, the manifesto policy will incentivise families to look after their grannies themselves rather than dumping them in a home at the state's expense. On balance I'll go with the latter argument, but it may be politically toxic to express it in black and white.
When it comes to keeping confidential things under wraps, I've become something of a cynic in my passing years. I've come to believe in what my erstwhile boss would remind me of countless times with that warm Jewish grin of his: "Peter, there's no such thing as a secret, somebody always knows and somebody always tells." Judging by the solidity across the betting markets tonight, my guess is that it will be very much a case of as you were in terms of the Tories' lead over Labour. Of course, I could be wrong.
These are the same betting markets that were offering 1/10 on a Remain win, an hour before Leave won?
Different altogether - in the case of the referendum, we are talking about sealed ballot boxes, where the result only became known in real time as the votes were counted. With polls, an increasing number of individuals have been made aware of price sensitive information as the polling numbers have been collated over a number of hours this afternoon and this evening.
When it comes to keeping confidential things under wraps, I've become something of a cynic in my passing years. I've come to believe in what my erstwhile boss would remind me of countless times with that warm Jewish grin of his: "Peter, there's no such thing as a secret, somebody always knows and somebody always tells." Judging by the solidity across the betting markets tonight, my guess is that it will be very much a case of as you were in terms of the Tories' lead over Labour. Of course, I could be wrong.
These are the same betting markets that were offering 1/10 on a Remain win, an hour before Leave won?
Leave were 14/1 at 22.30 on June 23rd.
Mostly because Farage and Gove said they thought Remain had won.
When it comes to keeping confidential things under wraps, I've become something of a cynic in my passing years. I've come to believe in what my erstwhile boss would remind me of countless times with that warm Jewish grin of his: "Peter, there's no such thing as a secret, somebody always knows and somebody always tells." Judging by the solidity across the betting markets tonight, my guess is that it will be very much a case of as you were in terms of the Tories' lead over Labour. Of course, I could be wrong.
Another big problem with the optics of a controversial policy like this when May is about to start financial negotiations with the EU is that it will look to people as if she is making a grab for their housing equity in order to pay the divorce bill. Given the demographics of the Leave vote, perhaps that's correct.
Has anyone actually made that link apart from you?
When it comes to keeping confidential things under wraps, I've become something of a cynic in my passing years. I've come to believe in what my erstwhile boss would remind me of countless times with that warm Jewish grin of his: "Peter, there's no such thing as a secret, somebody always knows and somebody always tells." Judging by the solidity across the betting markets tonight, my guess is that it will be very much a case of as you were in terms of the Tories' lead over Labour. Of course, I could be wrong.
It's gone from panic to unmitigated hysteria, so much so that PB Tories have now convinced themselves that Corbyn will become PM on June 9th and the nation is about to embrace socialism. And all this before any post manifesto polls have even been released.
I've never seen anything like this.
At least the Labour supporters are optimists, cheerful even when facing defeat. The Tories here..my God. They've run up the white flag at the first sign of resistance. Makes me ashamed to be a Tory supporter.
I don't think anyone is seriously suggesting Corbyn will become PM. I am certainly not (except if I am being sarcastic, or satirising my own tendency to hyperbole). The very worst possible outcome would be a hung parliament, with a Tory plurality, I think.
But that would be politically disastrous for TMay. Indeed if she fails to increase her majority, or only gains a handful of seats, I think she is damaged goods, and will not be around for long. Which is pretty dangerous and destabilising for a country facing the huge task of Brexit.
I just don't get how in the space of a few days we've gone from eye watering landslides to now possible hung parliaments. This is BEFORE the post mainfesto polls have even been released.
The Corbynistas must be pissing themselves with laughter, because I know I would be if this was Labour in the midst of a nervous breakdown.
Beware the moral of the self-fulfilling prophecy. If you want bad things to happen enough, they probably will.
One thing's for sure, Dementia Tax (note how the name has already stuck) is the mother of all stealth taxes. For God's sake, the last thing we need are yet more stealth taxes. If needs be increase the rate of income tax, incl the higher rate as was always the case before governments introduced all these smoke and mirror dishonest schemes which we're not supposed to notice, until we move house, die, etc, etc. Enough!
We should not be increasing income taxes so that some people can inherit more.
I would prefer to pay a premium of 5% in higher taxes over the course of my life than be in a situation where I lose my marbles, am forced into care, and the state takes everything, leaving my childen / grandchildren with a pittance between them after the state takes it all away for doubtless inefficient, over-expensive and padded out care subcontracted to private companies.
Heck, I would rather the government said "take out an insurance policy and pay for it yourself, if you don't you're on your own" than that. Though pooled risk through, say, an increase in NI levied on all seems far more measured and reasonable.
Your proposal would be OK if we were starting from scratch. The problem is all those who haven't paid the extra 5% higher tax and need care now or in the near future. OK so their taxes may well have been higher for other reasons, but that still leaves their care now to be funded by the younger age groups.
Life is a bit of a lottery in many respects. I was of the generation which had free university - but then I wasn't bright enough to benefit from that policy. Maybe I'll get dementia & maybe I won't. There are lots of young people who have no-one to leave them anything so why should my heirs benefit from what I'm able to leave them whilst those other poor sods are working to pay for my care?
Good evening, everyone.
By that same logic, why shouldn't I spend every penny I have on cocaine and hookers before brain rot sets in, then assume the state will provide for me? You save to give your children a better life than you had, that's an incredibly conservative point of view. The dementia tax is the exact opposite of that.
Life may be a bit of a lottery but singling out those who have already lost life's lottery by contracting dementia and stripping their assets seems needlessly cruel.
Why are so many people describing this proposed approach to Social Care as "statism"? By definition it is the complete opposite of statism, surely. In fact the only bit about it that is "statist" is the one bit that people don't mind - ie. having a floor below which people can't have their assets assessed to pay for Social care.
Another big problem with the optics of a controversial policy like this when May is about to start financial negotiations with the EU is that it will look to people as if she is making a grab for their housing equity in order to pay the divorce bill. Given the demographics of the Leave vote, perhaps that's correct.
Has anyone actually made that link apart from you?
Will the PB Tories finally admit that TMay is crap? She is politically hapless, dull, wooden and very uninspiring. David Cameron is in a different league to her.
I've been pointing this out since last July.
And yet she is on course to get a far bigger majority than Cameron ever achieved. The man who so politically inept he managed to force himself into a position where he had to resign entirely because of his own failings.
David Cameron plucked his EU referendum out of thin air as a stick with which to beat Ukip at the general election, with no regard whatsoever for the potential consequences. Having wholly unexpectedly won a tiny majority, he was then forced to call a referendum that he didn't want, because he transparently obviously didn't want to leave the EU. And then he somehow contrived to lose said referendum, despite the fact that he had the whole Government save for a few resigning ministers, most of his own MPs and virtually all of the Opposition's, and most of the business and academic establishment of the nation on his side - with little more than Nigel Farage and Boris Johnson lined up to oppose him.
His failure changed the course of British history, in the polar opposite direction to which he intended it should go, and led promptly to his own defenestration and his replacement with somebody variously described as "the most left-wing Conservative leader in four decades" and "the first post-Thatcherite Prime Minister."
He was tactically agile, but as a strategist he was arguably the greatest failure out of all of our leading political figures since at least 1945. And that includes both Michael Foot and Jeremy Corbyn.
Will the PB Tories finally admit that TMay is crap? She is politically hapless, dull, wooden and very uninspiring. David Cameron is in a different league to her.
I've been pointing this out since last July.
And yet she is on course to get a far bigger majority than Cameron ever achieved. The man who so politically inept he managed to force himself into a position where he had to resign entirely because of his own failings.
And after he explicitly promised that he wouldn't.
He's an honourable man, he knew if he lost the referendum, he should quit.
Only the terminally stupid don't realise if he had said 'I'll quit if I lose the referendum' it might have encouraged non Tories to vote Leave to topple Cameron.
Cf the Indyref.
Some of us did vote Leave for the added benefit of getting rid of Cameron. 'Let's wipe the smile off their faces', remember?
The biggest blow (some of) Labour has landed on the Tories in umpteen years.....
In fairness MM, I think Cameron landed it on himself. Everyone knew we'd probably achieve precious little in the EU negotiations, but what we needed was for Cameron to tell us simply that was the case instead of pretending that everything was fine and dandy and we should now vote to remain with enthusiasm. Too many of us from all political persuasions knew we'd been sold a pup.
The optics for the Property Care Tax are terrible. I just don't understand why they put that level of detail in a manifesto. Absolute nuts.
It might even be a good idea - but it looks terrible.
The one asset the average Conservative voter has is their home. Threaten that, and they'll wonder why they vote Conservative.
Presumably they've put that detail in to get it through the Lords.
I agree that the one thing people have is their homes, but isn't that kind of the point? It's their rainy day fund.
The bigger worry is that we're still relying upon house prices going up. And in the future the number of people who can fund their own care through their house will be going down.
The problem with this care proposal is that it is being perceived as inheritance tax.
Yep, that's exactly how my parents see it. My mum was calling it a 'con', and saying that it gave people no motivation to work hard and save.
People are completely irrational about the equity in their houses. It's possibly an even bigger national psychosis than the idea that leaving the EU is a good idea.
My father said on the phone he is not voting because of it.He is a conservative and when he worked was a house builder.As a child we moved house each year to avoid capital gains tax as it was our residence.I wonder if it will effect turnout for some.
Hmm. If the polling hit is as bad as the mood music suggests, they will have to backtrack.
As chestnut says, fine-tune the sums. Make it £200k. Vary the WFA by climate, I dunno.
it will make the Tories appear seriously clueless, and spineless, but that's better than looking mean, vindictive and grasping, and also better than potentially losing a majority.
But, the polls, the polls. We'll know soon enough. And some people thought this election was boring. My mum has given me hope that the hit might not be so bad: Corbyn is still poison.
As I've said before, the huge fall out for this policy will be post-election, rather than during it.
I'll be shocked if the Tory lead goes down significantly. I think voters will vote Tory and then blow a fuse over the policy when it's being introduced like they did with Cameron's welfare changes.
He was tactically agile, but as a strategist he was arguably the greatest failure out of all of our leading political figures since at least 1945. And that includes both Michael Foot and Jeremy Corbyn.
He wasn't even that tactically agile. Once Gove and Johnson came out for Leave he should have been more ruthless and sanctioned a much more personal campaign against them.
As I've said before, the huge fall out for this policy will be post-election, rather than during it.
I'll be shocked if the Tory lead goes down significantly. I think voters will vote Tory and then blow a fuse over the policy when it's being introduced like they did with Cameron's welfare changes.
Which is exactly why they've put it in the manifesto. Sometimes the right thing to do isn't the popular thing to do, by being honest up front they're hoping to avoid massive problems with it later.
To be fair to them both, that photo was taken about ten minutes after Cameron's resignation.
Yep. If they had been smiling Scott n paste would still have been posting it. The only difference would be a claim they were celebrating Cameron's downfall. People like Scott have never been interested in facts, just smears.
As I've said before, the huge fall out for this policy will be post-election, rather than during it.
I'll be shocked if the Tory lead goes down significantly. I think voters will vote Tory and then blow a fuse over the policy when it's being introduced like they did with Cameron's welfare changes.
I really don't get this. Do you not understand that it's a softening of the current position?
Why are so many people describing this proposed approach to Social Care as "statism"? By definition it is the complete opposite of statism, surely. In fact the only bit about it that is "statist" is the one bit that people don't mind - ie. having a floor below which people can't have their assets assessed to pay for Social care.
The welfare state is seen as a Chinese Buffet. If you've paid in, you'll take your share, whether or not you need it.
As I've said before, the huge fall out for this policy will be post-election, rather than during it.
I'll be shocked if the Tory lead goes down significantly. I think voters will vote Tory and then blow a fuse over the policy when it's being introduced like they did with Cameron's welfare changes.
I agree .I remember people talking about the community charge poll tax in the 1987 election campaign .It did not hit home until it was introduced in England in ,1990 no one seemed to care in conservative England when the Scots tasted it first.
As I've said before, the huge fall out for this policy will be post-election, rather than during it.
I'll be shocked if the Tory lead goes down significantly. I think voters will vote Tory and then blow a fuse over the policy when it's being introduced like they did with Cameron's welfare changes.
Which is exactly why they've put it in the manifesto. Sometimes the right thing to do isn't the popular thing to do, by being honest up front they're hoping to avoid massive problems with it later.
Bollocks. It's just a massive, massive error.
Will you still say that if it doesn't affect the polling?
It is now clear that May is useless. Even Corbyn looks good compared to her. He must be thanking his lucky stars.
This is borne out by the leadership ratings, no doubt?
I would like to see the ratings next week.
My mum is the ultimate barometer of Middle Britain, and a voting, politically aware pensioner too
She was quite a fan of TMay; I've just spoken to her about the Coal Snatching Dementia Taxer, for the first time since the manifesto - and she called TMay "that silly woman".
This is grim for the Tories.
On the upside, my mum also said We can't have that Corbyn winning. She will still vote Tory.
If Labour had a decent leader they would be looking at a big overall majority.
If Labour had a decent leader there wouldn't be an election...
The problem with this care proposal is that it is being perceived as inheritance tax.
Got it in one.
Nah, the problem with it is thatit is a shit policy. I rather pay higher National Insurance then this.
Being shit never prevented people liking a policy. The Triple Lock is a shit policy, people are still crying about it potentially being taken away.
They only have to elect Labour to keep it.
I agree with the removal of the Triple Lock
I could be persuaded that WFA is too generous.
To limit the latter to only 10% of Pensioners in receipt of pension credit guaranteed is a bit harsh though.
The Pound Shop Thatcher House Snatcher policy is just WRONG WRONG WRONG.
Why should my parents be subsidised by people on average incomes?
why should people from humbler backgrounds, whose only asset is likely to be their home, see it whittled away to nothing while their more feckless peers get given care for free?
As I've said before, the huge fall out for this policy will be post-election, rather than during it.
I'll be shocked if the Tory lead goes down significantly. I think voters will vote Tory and then blow a fuse over the policy when it's being introduced like they did with Cameron's welfare changes.
I really don't get this. Do you not understand that it's a softening of the current position?
I dislike the current position and this policy. Several on here do, and have explained why and what alternatives they'd prefer (pooling risk, National Social Care service).
As I've said before, the huge fall out for this policy will be post-election, rather than during it.
I'll be shocked if the Tory lead goes down significantly. I think voters will vote Tory and then blow a fuse over the policy when it's being introduced like they did with Cameron's welfare changes.
Which is exactly why they've put it in the manifesto. Sometimes the right thing to do isn't the popular thing to do, by being honest up front they're hoping to avoid massive problems with it later.
Bollocks. It's just a massive, massive error.
Calm down Sean, it will all be fine. Even your Mum said she's still voting for Theresa.
There's no way people are going to stand with a pencil in their hand and say "I can't vote for the party who want to reform social care, so I'm going to vote for the terrorist sympathising Marxist who thinks all property is theft instead"
In discussions last week the veracity of the polls were questioned, it being difficult to reconcile Corbyn-hatred with them. Does PB now think that this is not the case and that the polls are now correct?
It's gone from panic to unmitigated hysteria, so much so that PB Tories have now convinced themselves that Corbyn will become PM on June 9th and the nation is about to embrace socialism. And all this before any post manifesto polls have even been released.
I've never seen anything like this.
In many ways the PB forums are like one of those JezWeCan rallies, a spiral of self-referencing hysteria .... but downwards as well as up ;-)
Remember the title of this site is Political *Betting*. When I was younger I briefly worked as a trainee betting office manager for Ladbrokes in Plymouth and you see the same sort of twitchy over-reaction amongst habitual gamblers in betting offices as you see here.
Every stumble in a race is a sign of complete disaster or ultimate victory. Adrenaline spikes and crashes all over the place.
I've lurked here for years but I've never made the mistake of imagining that this is a place where accurate political predications are regularly made. Sit back and enjoy the rollercoaster ;-)
As I've said before, the huge fall out for this policy will be post-election, rather than during it.
I'll be shocked if the Tory lead goes down significantly. I think voters will vote Tory and then blow a fuse over the policy when it's being introduced like they did with Cameron's welfare changes.
I really don't get this. Do you not understand that it's a softening of the current position?
I dislike the current position and this policy. Several on here do, and have explained why and what alternatives they'd prefer (pooling risk, National Social Care service).
Isn't part of the problem that no one actually understands how it all works?
The £100k threshold means that risk is pooled below that level.
There are council tax surcharges that pool risk.
The issue is that people see homes being sold off and inheritances vanishing (even though that happens for people needing care in institutional establishments already).
It's all about settling on an amount rather than the principle in my view.
It is now clear that May is useless. Even Corbyn looks good compared to her. He must be thanking his lucky stars.
This is borne out by the leadership ratings, no doubt?
I would like to see the ratings next week.
My mum is the ultimate barometer of Middle Britain, and a voting, politically aware pensioner too
She was quite a fan of TMay; I've just spoken to her about the Coal Snatching Dementia Taxer, for the first time since the manifesto - and she called TMay "that silly woman".
This is grim for the Tories.
On the upside, my mum also said We can't have that Corbyn winning. She will still vote Tory.
If Labour had a decent leader they would be looking at a big overall majority.
Corbyn stays on, hands over to a successor of his choosing in 2019/2020. The Conservatives, now ten years into government, begin tearing themselves apart over issues such as the dementia tax or good old fashioned sleaze. Labour sweep into power in 2022 on a repeat of their hard left 2017 manifesto but with a more charismatic leader.
2027 and we're Venezuela.
Pass the smelling salts, because I'm coming over all faint at the possibility.
Theresa May, how did you let this happen?
Seriously, grow a pair. This Tory panic is getting fucking tedious. It happens every election at about three weeks out because the media are desperate for a story so they want the favourite to stumble.
Jeremy Corbyn addressed a 20,000 strong crowd tonight in Prenton Park tonight. Think they turned up to see Nuttall play!!
Theresa May plots to 'divert cash for starving children to fund military ops'
Mike Smithson @MSmithsonPB 38m38 minutes ago More Problem for CON is controversial social care policy comes just as postal ballot packs begin to arrive. Lots of votes cast in next few days
It's gone from panic to unmitigated hysteria, so much so that PB Tories have now convinced themselves that Corbyn will become PM on June 9th and the nation is about to embrace socialism. And all this before any post manifesto polls have even been released.
I've never seen anything like this.
In many ways the PB forums are like one of those JezWeCan rallies, a spiral of self-referencing hysteria .... but downwards as well as up ;-)
Remember the title of this site is Political *Betting*. When I was younger I briefly worked as a trainee betting office manager for Ladbrokes in Plymouth and you see the same sort of twitchy over-reaction amongst habitual gamblers in betting offices as you see here.
Every stumble in a race is a sign of complete disaster or ultimate victory. Adrenaline spikes and crashes all over the place.
I've lurked here for years but I've never made the mistake of imagining that this is a place where accurate political predications are regularly made. Sit back and enjoy the rollercoaster ;-)
WillS.
Well said WillS and congrats for speaking up at last!
I was one of the most determined Remainers on PB, I'm not a socially-conservative economically-spendthrift like May, and I loath foxhunting. But even I have to defend May on this. Chronic elderly illness is a big problem, we have an aging population which will age faster post-Brexit, and this is something that should be dealt with. All solutions have problems, so while I'm not qualified to tell which is best, she should at least be applauded for trying to deal with it.
The problem with this care proposal is that it is being perceived as inheritance tax.
Got it in one.
Nah, the problem with it is thatit is a shit policy. I rather pay higher National Insurance then this.
Being shit never prevented people liking a policy. The Triple Lock is a shit policy, people are still crying about it potentially being taken away.
They only have to elect Labour to keep it.
I agree with the removal of the Triple Lock
I could be persuaded that WFA is too generous.
To limit the latter to only 10% of Pensioners in receipt of pension credit guaranteed is a bit harsh though.
The Pound Shop Thatcher House Snatcher policy is just WRONG WRONG WRONG.
Why should my parents be subsidised by people on average incomes?
why should people from humbler backgrounds, whose only asset is likely to be their home, see it whittled away to nothing while their more feckless peers get given care for free?
Because the taxpayer can't afford to pay for everyone. And because we have a duty to those who can't look after themselves. Yes it creates a perverse incentive but the alternative (people on the street) is unacceptable in a decent society
Comments
2027 and we're Venezuela.
Pass the smelling salts, because I'm coming over all faint at the possibility.
Theresa May, how did you let this happen?
Congressman Ted Lieu
https://twitter.com/tedlieu/status/865772627469754368
What would he know?
1. Let's kick the can a little more.
2. Let's be adults about this difficult subject.
Now what we see is:
1. Let's just have the State pay for it.
2. #DEMENTIATAX OMG EEVIL BABYEATERS!!!!!!
The reality is that:
1. This will cost roughly 5p on income tax across all rates - they're not saying anything about this, just trying to add it to the other £60 something billion in uncosted expentidure in the Labour manifesto.
2. What happened to being adults about this difficult subject?
The Tory proposal might not be perfect, but let's all engage with the discussion to look at how it might be improved, rather than the screaming hysteria we've seen from certain quarters so far.
Interestingly, most of the resentment I'm seeing, reading and hearing is along the lines of 'I've (my mum, my dad) worked all my life and I get penalised.....while the wasteful, scrounger, feckless etc will all get it for nothing'.
So, it really isn't very good news for Labour. It's a matter of tweaking for the Tories.
The Daily Mail FFS
ottie, manchester, 21 hours ago
I was going to vote for May but have to think long and hard now. I have no problem with giving up the winter fuel payment, but to take my house which me and my husband have worked dammed hard and did without for is theft. We thought our son who cannot afford a pension would benefit from our hard work May is giving no one an incentive to save and do well
I didn't rate Gove's time as Education Secretary at all.
The lack of preparation is showing.
7 years of Tory Cuts!!
I've never seen anything like this.
At least the Labour supporters are optimists, cheerful even when facing defeat. The Tories here..my God. They've run up the white flag at the first sign of resistance. Makes me ashamed to be a Tory supporter.
Its all about
Pound Shop Thatcher House Snatcher
Oh that was gloriously funny.
Life is a bit of a lottery in many respects. I was of the generation which had free university - but then I wasn't bright enough to benefit from that policy. Maybe I'll get dementia & maybe I won't. There are lots of young people who have no-one to leave them anything so why should my heirs benefit from what I'm able to leave them whilst those other poor sods are working to pay for my care?
Good evening, everyone.
http://www.politico.eu/article/a-very-british-betrayal-michael-gove-boris-johnson/
I've come to believe in what my erstwhile boss would remind me of countless times with that warm Jewish grin of his: "Peter, there's no such thing as a secret, somebody always knows and somebody always tells."
Judging by the solidity across the betting markets tonight, my guess is that it will be very much a case of as you were in terms of the Tories' lead over Labour.
Of course, I could be wrong.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ogqAK1x_NLQ
May is testing various theories of how outrageous she can be and still manage a comfortable majority over the Marx Brothers.
I fear if Theresa May secures a weak majority of 50 or so it will be the latter.
Even if Corbynism is defeated next month and again in 2022, she's already shifted the Overton window uncomfortably to the left.
She's disappeared totally from public view. I think there's even been speculation that it's a sign that her days in the cabinet are numbered.
@midwinter Yep. He was VERY unpopular as Education Secretary.
@williamglenn I literally had just viewed it on YouTube before I came back here and was going to post it. His summary of Gove and Boris was so on point - and hilarious!
I'm uncomfortable with the idea that a family with a demented elder has somehow lost the lottery of life while the rest of us breathe a sigh of relief. On the other hand, the manifesto policy will incentivise families to look after their grannies themselves rather than dumping them in a home at the state's expense. On balance I'll go with the latter argument, but it may be politically toxic to express it in black and white.
With polls, an increasing number of individuals have been made aware of price sensitive information as the polling numbers have been collated over a number of hours this afternoon and this evening.
Mostly because Farage and Gove said they thought Remain had won.
https://www.betfair.com/exchange/politics/event/28051210/market?marketId=1.119040708
Have since I closed my position.
The Corbynistas must be pissing themselves with laughter, because I know I would be if this was Labour in the midst of a nervous breakdown.
Beware the moral of the self-fulfilling prophecy. If you want bad things to happen enough, they probably will.
Life may be a bit of a lottery but singling out those who have already lost life's lottery by contracting dementia and stripping their assets seems needlessly cruel.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZAc8JooS3MY
https://twitter.com/BrianSpanner1/status/746488316510482433
The optics for the Property Care Tax are terrible. I just don't understand why they put that level of detail in a manifesto. Absolute nuts.
It might even be a good idea - but it looks terrible.
The one asset the average Conservative voter has is their home. Threaten that, and they'll wonder why they vote Conservative.
https://twitter.com/MSmithsonPB/status/866017402986926084
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpSo1aciPqU
One of the many tragedies of Brexit is he didn't get to finish his work.
His failure changed the course of British history, in the polar opposite direction to which he intended it should go, and led promptly to his own defenestration and his replacement with somebody variously described as "the most left-wing Conservative leader in four decades" and "the first post-Thatcherite Prime Minister."
He was tactically agile, but as a strategist he was arguably the greatest failure out of all of our leading political figures since at least 1945. And that includes both Michael Foot and Jeremy Corbyn.
I agree that the one thing people have is their homes, but isn't that kind of the point? It's their rainy day fund.
The bigger worry is that we're still relying upon house prices going up. And in the future the number of people who can fund their own care through their house will be going down.
I'm surrounded by friends who are City fans.
City fans are convinced they are going to screw up tomorrow and hand a champions league place to Arsenal.
All the Liverpool fans think Liverpool fans think they are going screw up tomorrow and hand a champions league place to Arsenal.
I'll be shocked if the Tory lead goes down significantly. I think voters will vote Tory and then blow a fuse over the policy when it's being introduced like they did with Cameron's welfare changes.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2017-39986835
NEW THREAD
There's no way people are going to stand with a pencil in their hand and say "I can't vote for the party who want to reform social care, so I'm going to vote for the terrorist sympathising Marxist who thinks all property is theft instead"
In discussions last week the veracity of the polls were questioned, it being difficult to reconcile Corbyn-hatred with them. Does PB now think that this is not the case and that the polls are now correct?
Remember the title of this site is Political *Betting*. When I was younger I briefly worked as a trainee betting office manager for Ladbrokes in Plymouth and you see the same sort of twitchy over-reaction amongst habitual gamblers in betting offices as you see here.
Every stumble in a race is a sign of complete disaster or ultimate victory. Adrenaline spikes and crashes all over the place.
I've lurked here for years but I've never made the mistake of imagining that this is a place where accurate political predications are regularly made. Sit back and enjoy the rollercoaster ;-)
WillS.
The £100k threshold means that risk is pooled below that level.
There are council tax surcharges that pool risk.
The issue is that people see homes being sold off and inheritances vanishing (even though that happens for people needing care in institutional establishments already).
It's all about settling on an amount rather than the principle in my view.
Theresa May plots to 'divert cash for starving children to fund military ops'
Mike Smithson @MSmithsonPB 38m38 minutes ago
More
Problem for CON is controversial social care policy comes just as postal ballot packs begin to arrive. Lots of votes cast in next few days
I was one of the most determined Remainers on PB, I'm not a socially-conservative economically-spendthrift like May, and I loath foxhunting. But even I have to defend May on this. Chronic elderly illness is a big problem, we have an aging population which will age faster post-Brexit, and this is something that should be dealt with. All solutions have problems, so while I'm not qualified to tell which is best, she should at least be applauded for trying to deal with it.
I wonder if he repeatedly yelled at the audience ..... "Well alright, well alright, well alright!"