This doesn't quite match the Brexiteer rhetoric this morning
European Union leaders sense that Theresa May will surrender to their divorce demands rather than walk away in a “no deal” scenario leading to a disorderly Brexit.
EU officials and diplomats have received private assurances and noted that the prime minister has dropped a pledge, made in January, that “no deal is better than a bad deal for Britain”.
It is exactly what the Brexiteers have said all along. The EU are fools and unless they relent in early negotiations we will be lead out by TM with the backing of the Nation. We will not be disrespected by anyone
That makes us sound like a stroppy teenager, going around saying ''spect'.
And if you don't want people to disrespect you, it's a good idea not to disrespect them yourself.
The disrespect is coming from the EU
Using terms like 'The EU are fools' is hardly respectful, even if you feel it's true.
Only when the EU stop threatening the UK will they regain respect.
This doesn't quite match the Brexiteer rhetoric this morning
European Union leaders sense that Theresa May will surrender to their divorce demands rather than walk away in a “no deal” scenario leading to a disorderly Brexit.
EU officials and diplomats have received private assurances and noted that the prime minister has dropped a pledge, made in January, that “no deal is better than a bad deal for Britain”.
It is exactly what the Brexiteers have said all along. The EU are fools and unless they relent in early negotiations we will be lead out by TM with the backing of the Nation. We will not be disrespected by anyone
That makes us sound like a stroppy teenager, going around saying ''spect'.
And if you don't want people to disrespect you, it's a good idea not to disrespect them yourself.
Being polite but firm is usually the best strategy in negotiations. If people make ridiculous demands, then you just tell them there's no deal.
That's right. But to be fair, we're not seeing the negotiations: we'r getting the public views, mostly talking to domestic audiences.
Don't forget many leavers have publicly stated they want the EU to end. That's the sort of stupid talk they're reacting to.
I don't think any of us see the SNP falling below 40 seats, at worst, which is a hefty margin of victory.
Dropping from 56 to 40 is not really a victory though.
Nicola and Ruth visit a casino. Nicola has 56 chips, Ruth has 1.
When they leave, Nicola has 45 chips, and Ruth has 10, some of which used to be Nicola's
Only one of them was a winner...
Not too bright are you Scott, in football or rugby 45-10 is same result as 56-1 , the one with the low number is a LOSER. IT IS FIRST PAST THE POST. Surely you do not need that expained in simple terms for numpties. You can bleat all you like but trying to pretend Black is white is pretty stupid even for you.
Meanwhile... several key home players are now no longer available for selection ... and the return fixture won't be so clear cut.. they could even lose...
Not too bright are you Scott, in football or rugby 45-10 is same result as 56-1 , the one with the low number is a LOSER. IT IS FIRST PAST THE POST. Surely you do not need that expained in simple terms for numpties. You can bleat all you like but trying to pretend Black is white is pretty stupid even for you.
On the morning after, if the result is 45-10, Ruth will be smiling and Nicola will look like she is chewing a nettle.
Mind you, Nicola always looks like that
Old bulldog chops never smiles, she is either scowling or has an inane fake grin. You really do live in La La land, your crush is giving me a good laugh though.
This doesn't quite match the Brexiteer rhetoric this morning
European Union leaders sense that Theresa May will surrender to their divorce demands rather than walk away in a “no deal” scenario leading to a disorderly Brexit.
EU officials and diplomats have received private assurances and noted that the prime minister has dropped a pledge, made in January, that “no deal is better than a bad deal for Britain”.
It is exactly what the Brexiteers have said all along. The EU are fools and unless they relent in early negotiations we will be lead out by TM with the backing of the Nation. We will not be disrespected by anyone
That makes us sound like a stroppy teenager, going around saying ''spect'.
And if you don't want people to disrespect you, it's a good idea not to disrespect them yourself.
Being polite but firm is usually the best strategy in negotiations. If people make ridiculous demands, then you just tell them there's no deal.
That's right. But to be fair, we're not seeing the negotiations: we'r getting the public views, mostly talking to domestic audiences.
Don't forget many leavers have publicly stated they want the EU to end. That's the sort of stupid talk they're reacting to.
TM has always said how much she wants a close relationship with the EU, a policy I fully endorse but their language at present is virtually hostile.
Anyway I must get on with my jobs today and hope the temperature will dial down from both sides
Can somebody explain something to me? If free movement of labour is such a massive benefit. Why doesn't the EU want to punish us by removing it from us?
They want us to be the employer of last resort, for unemployed Europeans.
No remainers with a serious answer?
The EU doesn't want to punish us.
We have decided to leave and sacrifice freedom of movement.
FoM benefits us and the EU so not surprising they aren't thrilled about this.
Just because ending FoM is popular in the UK doesn't mean it will be beneficial.
We haven't sacrificed free movement. It's being imposed on us as part of any deal. Why?
I'm confused. I thought we were the ones wanting to end freedom of movement? So how is it being imposed on us?
The EU claim no deal will be made without maintaining free movement. You are following this aren't you?
And as one Tory MSP told me, a good SNP result is also a good result for Tories. Because if Labour is crushed on May 4, the Tories become the last line of defence for the Union. That means the General Election becomes even more polarised, and voters who oppose a second referendum get funnelled into the blue column. Labour, meanwhile, would probably turn inward and start squabbling over Ms Dugdale’s future.
Yes, that suits the SNP, said the MSP, but it also brings new people to the Tories, and the Tories don’t need to win the election to stymie a referendum, they just need to burst the SNP’s bubble and paint Ms Sturgeon as a leader on the slide. Then it’s on to the 2021 Holyrood election and a reprise of the slogan that put the SNP into power in 2007 – time for change.
This doesn't quite match the Brexiteer rhetoric this morning
European Union leaders sense that Theresa May will surrender to their divorce demands rather than walk away in a “no deal” scenario leading to a disorderly Brexit.
EU officials and diplomats have received private assurances and noted that the prime minister has dropped a pledge, made in January, that “no deal is better than a bad deal for Britain”.
Mistake. They need to know she might walk away for the UK to get the best deal.
She might still. It's not necessarily a mistake to try lower the temperature when both sides seem to have been backing themselves into corners, well before the negotiations even start. I think that anyone who pretends to know the likely outcome at this point - good or bad - is indulging in self delusion.
Not too bright are you Scott, in football or rugby 45-10 is same result as 56-1 , the one with the low number is a LOSER. IT IS FIRST PAST THE POST. Surely you do not need that expained in simple terms for numpties. You can bleat all you like but trying to pretend Black is white is pretty stupid even for you.
On the morning after, if the result is 45-10, Ruth will be smiling and Nicola will look like she is chewing a nettle.
Mind you, Nicola always looks like that
Your crush on the bulldog is endearing and gives me a good laugh
This doesn't quite match the Brexiteer rhetoric this morning
European Union leaders sense that Theresa May will surrender to their divorce demands rather than walk away in a “no deal” scenario leading to a disorderly Brexit.
EU officials and diplomats have received private assurances and noted that the prime minister has dropped a pledge, made in January, that “no deal is better than a bad deal for Britain”.
It is exactly what the Brexiteers have said all along. The EU are fools and unless they relent in early negotiations we will be lead out by TM with the backing of the Nation. We will not be disrespected by anyone
I hope the negotiations are being done by sensible rational people rather than hotheads driven by emotional crap like this.
Scottish politics and a ludicrous picture of Ruth Davidson as another second-rate Thatcher to start my Saturday...
On other thoughts, 20 years ago, we were on the cusp of another landslide and it was one which, although widely expected, surprised many by its size and scale.
The national swing from Conservative to Labour was 10% and many sites followed that UNS but of course punters aren't looking at those and in 2017 at those that won't.
There will be seats where the Lab-Con swing is much higher than the UNS - we can call them the Crosby seats (not after Sir Lynton) but after the constituency which was delivered to Labour on an 18% swing in 1997. There will also be seats where the Lab-Con swing won't be as great as the UNS.
So what are we looking for ? Clearly, given the implosion seats with a large UKIP vote are ones where the increase in the Conservative vote share might accentuate the UNS from Labour to the Conservatives as the Conservatives will benefit from falls in both the Labour and UKIP shares.
As an example, in a seat with low residual UKIP share we might see vote share changes like:
CON +8 Lab -6 LD +4 UKIP -5
Whereas in a seat with a larger UKIP vote base the changes might be:
CON +15 Lab -6 LD +4 UKIP -12
Thus seat A has a Lab-Con swing of 7% while in seat B the swing is 10.5% and you start to see the profile of the landslide.
At the moment the UKIP vote appears to be heading in one direction though smaller elements will doubtless go elsewhere. Churn is what it is but it will be fascinating to see how close the Conservative vote share rise mirrors the UKIP vote share fall.
This doesn't quite match the Brexiteer rhetoric this morning
European Union leaders sense that Theresa May will surrender to their divorce demands rather than walk away in a “no deal” scenario leading to a disorderly Brexit.
EU officials and diplomats have received private assurances and noted that the prime minister has dropped a pledge, made in January, that “no deal is better than a bad deal for Britain”.
It is exactly what the Brexiteers have said all along. The EU are fools and unless they relent in early negotiations we will be lead out by TM with the backing of the Nation. We will not be disrespected by anyone
That makes us sound like a stroppy teenager, going around saying ''spect'.
And if you don't want people to disrespect you, it's a good idea not to disrespect them yourself.
The disrespect is coming from the EU
Using terms like 'The EU are fools' is hardly respectful, even if you feel it's true.
Only when the EU stop threatening the UK will they regain respect.
The more febrile of us are threatening them as well. It works both ways.
I don't think any of us see the SNP falling below 40 seats, at worst, which is a hefty margin of victory.
Dropping from 56 to 40 is not really a victory though.
Nicola and Ruth visit a casino. Nicola has 56 chips, Ruth has 1.
When they leave, Nicola has 45 chips, and Ruth has 10, some of which used to be Nicola's
Only one of them was a winner...
Not too bright are you Scott, in football or rugby 45-10 is same result as 56-1 , the one with the low number is a LOSER. IT IS FIRST PAST THE POST. Surely you do not need that expained in simple terms for numpties. You can bleat all you like but trying to pretend Black is white is pretty stupid even for you.
Meanwhile... several key home players are now no longer available for selection ... and the return fixture won't be so clear cut.. they could even lose...
Brexit was premised on some seriously false assumptions, which will need to unwind at some point so we can move on. The question I suppose is whether we crash and burn first. My guess is that Theresa May will face the reality. She won't want to be responsible for that crash and burn and she will be under pressure from various parties not to go there. She will therefore sign up to the EU programme with a lot of protest. I can't be certain of course, but I think and hope that is what will happen.
Scottish politics and a ludicrous picture of Ruth Davidson as another second-rate Thatcher to start my Saturday...
On other thoughts, 20 years ago, we were on the cusp of another landslide and it was one which, although widely expected, surprised many by its size and scale.
The national swing from Conservative to Labour was 10% and many sites followed that UNS but of course punters aren't looking at those and in 2017 at those that won't.
There will be seats where the Lab-Con swing is much higher than the UNS - we can call them the Crosby seats (not after Sir Lynton) but after the constituency which was delivered to Labour on an 18% swing in 1997. There will also be seats where the Lab-Con swing won't be as great as the UNS.
So what are we looking for ? Clearly, given the implosion seats with a large UKIP vote are ones where the increase in the Conservative vote share might accentuate the UNS from Labour to the Conservatives as the Conservatives will benefit from falls in both the Labour and UKIP shares.
As an example, in a seat with low residual UKIP share we might see vote share changes like:
CON +8 Lab -6 LD +4 UKIP -5
Whereas in a seat with a larger UKIP vote base the changes might be:
CON +15 Lab -6 LD +4 UKIP -12
Thus seat A has a Lab-Con swing of 7% while in seat B the swing is 10.5% and you start to see the profile of the landslide.
At the moment the UKIP vote appears to be heading in one direction though smaller elements will doubtless go elsewhere. Churn is what it is but it will be fascinating to see how close the Conservative vote share rise mirrors the UKIP vote share fall.
The interesting seats to watch will be those historically Labour seats where the Labour vote share in 2015 was lower than the combined Conservative/UKIP share. The seats in Stoke, Grimsby, Heywood & Middleton etc.
This doesn't quite match the Brexiteer rhetoric this morning
European Union leaders sense that Theresa May will surrender to their divorce demands rather than walk away in a “no deal” scenario leading to a disorderly Brexit.
EU officials and diplomats have received private assurances and noted that the prime minister has dropped a pledge, made in January, that “no deal is better than a bad deal for Britain”.
It is exactly what the Brexiteers have said all along. The EU are fools and unless they relent in early negotiations we will be lead out by TM with the backing of the Nation. We will not be disrespected by anyone
The coming humiliation will be bitter and painful for some, but it cannot be avoided. That's why Cameron was so quick to leave the stage.
The humiliation will not be the UK's. If we walk away it will fracture the EU member states and cause a massive crisis for them
That's the delusional thinking that Merkel was talking about. If we walk away without a deal it'd be somewhat problematic for them and disastrous for us. The belief that we're essential to their happiness is simply narcissism elevated to a national position.
Mr. Palmer, a good deal is better than none, but if you enter negotiations with the position that a deal must be reached at all costs, then it will be.
Quite clearly those who are prepared to die in the ditch for the Blessed Theresa have already deciding what ever deal we get from the A50 negotiations will be a personal triumph for Mrs May and if there is no deal that will also be a triumph for Mrs May.
Okay...
I imagine if there is no deal they will organise National Backturning Day on the day we leave the EU when at noon all loyal supporters of the Prime Minister will stop and dramatically turn to face north west away from Europe in a final proud sign of national defiance.
Wonderful...
The rest of us will be trying to make sense of the coalition of chaos that the failed negotiations will have unleashed.
Yes, it's all posturing for internal consumption, May's problem will be to sell the aspects of the deal she won't like but has had to accept in order to get the bits of the deal she will like (the bits she and the Conservatives will ensure we hear about rather than the former about which they'll try to keep quiet).
Can somebody explain something to me? If free movement of labour is such a massive benefit. Why doesn't the EU want to punish us by removing it from us?
They want us to be the employer of last resort, for unemployed Europeans.
No remainers with a serious answer?
The EU doesn't want to punish us.
We have decided to leave and sacrifice freedom of movement.
FoM benefits us and the EU so not surprising they aren't thrilled about this.
Just because ending FoM is popular in the UK doesn't mean it will be beneficial.
We haven't sacrificed free movement. It's being imposed on us as part of any deal. Why?
I'm confused. I thought we were the ones wanting to end freedom of movement? So how is it being imposed on us?
The EU claim no deal will be made without maintaining free movement. You are following this aren't you?
Cecilia Maelstrom of the EU was absolutely adamant that there will be a deal, and of course there will be.
It's more a question of what's in it, what isn't and when and how it's reached.
Where the EU seem especially silly is in their claim that the UK cannot have a better or equivalent situation because that is premised on the notion that the only thing in the world that is of value is the EU.
Our rejection of that view has yet to sink in with them.
LOL, next you will be telling the shouty bulldog is a great speaker. You Tories cannot suffer that SNP speak with gravitas and presence whilst your moingrel whines and slavers shouting like a fishwife.
What is betting on May meeting a real member of the public in Scotland today , 1000 - 1.
This doesn't quite match the Brexiteer rhetoric this morning
European Union leaders sense that Theresa May will surrender to their divorce demands rather than walk away in a “no deal” scenario leading to a disorderly Brexit.
EU officials and diplomats have received private assurances and noted that the prime minister has dropped a pledge, made in January, that “no deal is better than a bad deal for Britain”.
It is exactly what the Brexiteers have said all along. The EU are fools and unless they relent in early negotiations we will be lead out by TM with the backing of the Nation. We will not be disrespected by anyone
The coming humiliation will be bitter and painful for some, but it cannot be avoided. That's why Cameron was so quick to leave the stage.
The humiliation will not be the UK's. If we walk away it will fracture the EU member states and cause a massive crisis for them
That's the delusional thinking that Merkel was talking about. If we walk away without a deal it'd be somewhat problematic for them and disastrous for us. The belief that we're essential to their happiness is simply narcissism elevated to a national position.
Nick - if you had seen the anger in the Sky studio from the paper reviewers and the presenters over this story you can see how the Country will turn solidly against the EU if they continue their hostile approach
LOL, next you will be telling the shouty bulldog is a great speaker. You Tories cannot suffer that SNP speak with gravitas and presence whilst your moingrel whines and slavers shouting like a fishwife.
What is betting on May meeting a real member of the public in Scotland today , 1000 - 1.
Scottish politics and a ludicrous picture of Ruth Davidson as another second-rate Thatcher to start my Saturday...
On other thoughts, 20 years ago, we were on the cusp of another landslide and it was one which, although widely expected, surprised many by its size and scale.
The national swing from Conservative to Labour was 10% and many sites followed that UNS but of course punters aren't looking at those and in 2017 at those that won't.
There will be seats where the Lab-Con swing is much higher than the UNS - we can call them the Crosby seats (not after Sir Lynton) but after the constituency which was delivered to Labour on an 18% swing in 1997. There will also be seats where the Lab-Con swing won't be as great as the UNS.
So what are we looking for ? Clearly, given the implosion seats with a large UKIP vote are ones where the increase in the Conservative vote share might accentuate the UNS from Labour to the Conservatives as the Conservatives will benefit from falls in both the Labour and UKIP shares.
As an example, in a seat with low residual UKIP share we might see vote share changes like:
CON +8 Lab -6 LD +4 UKIP -5
Whereas in a seat with a larger UKIP vote base the changes might be:
CON +15 Lab -6 LD +4 UKIP -12
Thus seat A has a Lab-Con swing of 7% while in seat B the swing is 10.5% and you start to see the profile of the landslide.
At the moment the UKIP vote appears to be heading in one direction though smaller elements will doubtless go elsewhere. Churn is what it is but it will be fascinating to see how close the Conservative vote share rise mirrors the UKIP vote share fall.
In 1997 the polls were predicting an even bigger Labour lead - ICM excepted - of circa 20% than the 13% margin which proved to be the outcome. On all other occasions since World War 2 massive leads in the polls have not fully materialised - ie - 2001 - 1997 - 1983 - 1966.. Some might add Oct 1974 to the list.
Can somebody explain something to me? If free movement of labour is such a massive benefit. Why doesn't the EU want to punish us by removing it from us?
They want us to be the employer of last resort, for unemployed Europeans.
No remainers with a serious answer?
The EU doesn't want to punish us.
We have decided to leave and sacrifice freedom of movement.
FoM benefits us and the EU so not surprising they aren't thrilled about this.
Just because ending FoM is popular in the UK doesn't mean it will be beneficial.
We haven't sacrificed free movement. It's being imposed on us as part of any deal. Why?
I'm confused. I thought we were the ones wanting to end freedom of movement? So how is it being imposed on us?
The EU claim no deal will be made without maintaining free movement. You are following this aren't you?
Still confused. Probably i have caused this confusion.
I think freedom of movement is going to end. It will end because that is what TM wants to happen. I don't know what you mean by 'no deal' - i think everyone accepts FoM is ending and now we are talking about what kind of deal is done with the UK as a third party country without FoM.
You originally asked why the EU doesn't want to punish us by removing FoM.
A) FoM benefits them too. B ) Their objective is not to punish us. Their objective is to make sure the EU does well.
Scottish politics and a ludicrous picture of Ruth Davidson as another second-rate Thatcher to start my Saturday...
On other thoughts, 20 years ago, we were on the cusp of another landslide and it was one which, although widely expected, surprised many by its size and scale.
The national swing from Conservative to Labour was 10% and many sites followed that UNS but of course punters aren't looking at those and in 2017 at those that won't.
There will be seats where the Lab-Con swing is much higher than the UNS - we can call them the Crosby seats (not after Sir Lynton) but after the constituency which was delivered to Labour on an 18% swing in 1997. There will also be seats where the Lab-Con swing won't be as great as the UNS.
So what are we looking for ? Clearly, given the implosion seats with a large UKIP vote are ones where the increase in the Conservative vote share might accentuate the UNS from Labour to the Conservatives as the Conservatives will benefit from falls in both the Labour and UKIP shares.
As an example, in a seat with low residual UKIP share we might see vote share changes like:
CON +8 Lab -6 LD +4 UKIP -5
Whereas in a seat with a larger UKIP vote base the changes might be:
CON +15 Lab -6 LD +4 UKIP -12
Thus seat A has a Lab-Con swing of 7% while in seat B the swing is 10.5% and you start to see the profile of the landslide.
At the moment the UKIP vote appears to be heading in one direction though smaller elements will doubtless go elsewhere. Churn is what it is but it will be fascinating to see how close the Conservative vote share rise mirrors the UKIP vote share fall.
In 1997 the polls were predicting an even bigger Labour lead - ICM excepted - of circa 20% than the 13% margin which proved to be the outcome. On all other occasions since World War 2 massive leads in the polls have not fully materialised - ie - 2001 - 1997 - 1983 - 1966.. Some might add Oct 1974 to the list.
I'd expect the actual result to show a Tory lead in the mid-teens.
LOL, next you will be telling the shouty bulldog is a great speaker. You Tories cannot suffer that SNP speak with gravitas and presence whilst your moingrel whines and slavers shouting like a fishwife.
What is betting on May meeting a real member of the public in Scotland today , 1000 - 1.
Will she even remember what Scotland's called?
According to the SNP? Nicola Sturgeon.
So few posts, so many repetitions of the barely informed, 'hilarious' tropes of the PB Yoonerati. I guess for fans of echo chambers, you just can't have too many echoes.
The EU will try to act like bullies because (1) they want the best deal they can get, (2) they think there's a possibility it might persuade the frit ones in the UK back down on leaving, and (3) because they want to dissuade any others from leaving.
How do think we should respond to this bullying? And do you think your thoughts are in tune with the British public?
LOL, next you will be telling the shouty bulldog is a great speaker. You Tories cannot suffer that SNP speak with gravitas and presence whilst your moingrel whines and slavers shouting like a fishwife.
What is betting on May meeting a real member of the public in Scotland today , 1000 - 1.
Will she even remember what Scotland's called?
According to the SNP? Nicola Sturgeon.
So few posts, so many repetitions of the barely informed, 'hilarious' tropes of the PB Yoonerati. I guess for fans of echo chambers, you just can't have too many echoes.
....that's it? Some ad hom with "Yoon" thrown in, you are shit at this banter lark.
LOL, next you will be telling the shouty bulldog is a great speaker. You Tories cannot suffer that SNP speak with gravitas and presence whilst your moingrel whines and slavers shouting like a fishwife.
What is betting on May meeting a real member of the public in Scotland today , 1000 - 1.
Will she even remember what Scotland's called?
According to the SNP? Nicola Sturgeon.
So few posts, so many repetitions of the barely informed, 'hilarious' tropes of the PB Yoonerati. I guess for fans of echo chambers, you just can't have too many echoes.
....that's it? Some ad hom with "Yoon" thrown in, you are shit at this banter lark.
I'm very fair minded, folk get precisely the response they deserve.
Scottish politics and a ludicrous picture of Ruth Davidson as another second-rate Thatcher to start my Saturday...
On other thoughts, 20 years ago, we were on the cusp of another landslide and it was one which, although widely expected, surprised many by its size and scale.
The national swing from Conservative to Labour was 10% and many sites followed that UNS but of course punters aren't looking at those and in 2017 at those that won't.
There will be seats where the Lab-Con swing is much higher than the UNS - we can call them the Crosby seats (not after Sir Lynton) but after the constituency which was delivered to Labour on an 18% swing in 1997. There will also be seats where the Lab-Con swing won't be as great as the UNS.
So what are we looking for ? Clearly, given the implosion seats with a large UKIP vote are ones where the increase in the Conservative vote share might accentuate the UNS from Labour to the Conservatives as the Conservatives will benefit from falls in both the Labour and UKIP shares.
As an example, in a seat with low residual UKIP share we might see vote share changes like:
CON +8 Lab -6 LD +4 UKIP -5
Whereas in a seat with a larger UKIP vote base the changes might be:
CON +15 Lab -6 LD +4 UKIP -12
Thus seat A has a Lab-Con swing of 7% while in seat B the swing is 10.5% and you start to see the profile of the landslide.
At the moment the UKIP vote appears to be heading in one direction though smaller elements will doubtless go elsewhere. Churn is what it is but it will be fascinating to see how close the Conservative vote share rise mirrors the UKIP vote share fall.
In 1997 the polls were predicting an even bigger Labour lead - ICM excepted - of circa 20% than the 13% margin which proved to be the outcome. On all other occasions since World War 2 massive leads in the polls have not fully materialised - ie - 2001 - 1997 - 1983 - 1966.. Some might add Oct 1974 to the list.
I'd expect the actual result to show a Tory lead in the mid-teens.
Agree. Something like 42-25 in the end, which in practice means a majority around the 100 mark.
The 24 point leads just don't feel quite right, as much as I'd love to see an utter landslide. That all said, we still have six weeks of Jeremy Corbyn to go - today's story is that he's friends with Phil Shiner and the scumbag soldier-chasing lawyers.
I guess for fans of echo chambers, you just can't have too many echoes.
From the party that forbids dissent, that's hilarious
Self awareness - never a Nat strong suit.....you get one guess which party leader accused the PM of putting the interests of her party ahead of those of the country....
The EU will try to act like bullies because (1) they want the best deal they can get, (2) they think there's a possibility it might persuade the frit ones in the UK back down on leaving, and (3) because they want to dissuade any others from leaving.
How do think we should respond to this bullying? And do you think your thoughts are in tune with the British public?
They hold all the cards, it is UK that is peering in the window wishing it was inside. pay up and you can get in , seems very reasonable to me, pity Toris cannot bring themselves to tell the peasants the truth. Will be trouble ahead when the dopes realise the Tories have scammed them for another 5 years and then sold them down the river. Much weeping in petite Bretagne then I think.
The EU will try to act like bullies because (1) they want the best deal they can get, (2) they think there's a possibility it might persuade the frit ones in the UK back down on leaving, and (3) because they want to dissuade any others from leaving.
How do think we should respond to this bullying? And do you think your thoughts are in tune with the British public?
I think the EU have got the message on 2).
I think the dilemma for TM is that the short term politically popular option of storming out is also likely to be very bad for the UK. I hope she recognises that.
Still confused. Probably i have caused this confusion.
I think freedom of movement is going to end. It will end because that is what TM wants to happen. I don't know what you mean by 'no deal' - i think everyone accepts FoM is ending and now we are talking about what kind of deal is done with the UK as a third party country without FoM.
You originally asked why the EU doesn't want to punish us by removing FoM.
A) FoM benefits them too. B ) Their objective is not to punish us. Their objective is to make sure the EU does well.
Is that clear?
There are two arrangements to agree. The final arrangement that the UK government wants to be a Canada style FTA with no FoM; the transition agreement that comes into force when we Brexit on our before 29 March 2019, where the UK government accepts there may be a degree of FoM. The UK government wanted the FTA to be basically sorted before Brexit.
The EU have stated they will only discuss subsequent arrangements in outline before Brexit and the will be negotiated at their own pace afterwards. At this point they are of secondary importance to the transition arrangements because if we don't agree these by 29 march 2019 we go over the cliff edge.
LOL, next you will be telling the shouty bulldog is a great speaker. You Tories cannot suffer that SNP speak with gravitas and presence whilst your moingrel whines and slavers shouting like a fishwife.
What is betting on May meeting a real member of the public in Scotland today , 1000 - 1.
Will she even remember what Scotland's called?
According to the SNP? Nicola Sturgeon.
So few posts, so many repetitions of the barely informed, 'hilarious' tropes of the PB Yoonerati. I guess for fans of echo chambers, you just can't have too many echoes.
....that's it? Some ad hom with "Yoon" thrown in, you are shit at this banter lark.
I'm very fair minded, folk get precisely the response they deserve.
"I am rubber, you are glue" would have been a more substantial retort there. Jesus Christ, either grow a thicker skin or just plain come into the real world where polticians are not scared cows. I don't see you decrying Malc's semi-literate bawlings each day, yet suddenly someone makes one mocking comment and you get the vapours.
I guess for fans of echo chambers, you just can't have too many echoes.
From the party that forbids dissent, that's hilarious
Self awareness - never a Nat strong suit.....you get one guess which party leader accused the PM of putting the interests of her party ahead of those of the country....
I think the Unionist vote has, in general, become much more transferable and amorphous in dual response to the dominance of the SNP and the decline of the monolithic labour vote. As such the Tories (as the current flag bearers) might expect to benefit from votes once impossible for them. The problem remains that there are three main unionist parties and one main nationalist party so any surge would rely on a completely finalised and sophisticated transferable unionist vote rather than the fledgling one we currently have. It will restrict progress imo to 2-6 Tory gains and a couple of possible Lib ones. The SNP/nationalist vote would need to be sub 40 for anything more dramatic than that I'd say.
LOL, next you will be telling the shouty bulldog is a great speaker. You Tories cannot suffer that SNP speak with gravitas and presence whilst your moingrel whines and slavers shouting like a fishwife.
What is betting on May meeting a real member of the public in Scotland today , 1000 - 1.
Will she even remember what Scotland's called?
According to the SNP? Nicola Sturgeon.
So few posts, so many repetitions of the barely informed, 'hilarious' tropes of the PB Yoonerati. I guess for fans of echo chambers, you just can't have too many echoes.
....that's it? Some ad hom with "Yoon" thrown in, you are shit at this banter lark.
I'm very fair minded, folk get precisely the response they deserve.
"I am rubber, you are glue" would have been a more substantial retort there. Jesus Christ, either grow a thicker skin or just plain come into the real world where polticians are not scared cows. I don't see you decrying Malc's semi-literate bawlings each day, yet suddenly someone makes one mocking comment and you get the vapours.
You seem a little distraught. Grow a thicker skin, or something.
LOL, next you will be telling the shouty bulldog is a great speaker. You Tories cannot suffer that SNP speak with gravitas and presence whilst your moingrel whines and slavers shouting like a fishwife.
What is betting on May meeting a real member of the public in Scotland today , 1000 - 1.
Will she even remember what Scotland's called?
According to the SNP? Nicola Sturgeon.
So few posts, so many repetitions of the barely informed, 'hilarious' tropes of the PB Yoonerati. I guess for fans of echo chambers, you just can't have too many echoes.
....that's it? Some ad hom with "Yoon" thrown in, you are shit at this banter lark.
I'm very fair minded, folk get precisely the response they deserve.
"I am rubber, you are glue" would have been a more substantial retort there. Jesus Christ, either grow a thicker skin or just plain come into the real world where polticians are not scared cows. I don't see you decrying Malc's semi-literate bawlings each day, yet suddenly someone makes one mocking comment and you get the vapours.
OOOOOOH we have an expert among us, and it claims to be literate and intelligent. You half witted cretin you would not recognise banter if it hit you on your pompous upturned Tory snout. Away and get a life, "politicians are not sacred cows" only a fannny could come out with something so juvenile and pathetic.
The EU will try to act like bullies because (1) they want the best deal they can get, (2) they think there's a possibility it might persuade the frit ones in the UK back down on leaving, and (3) because they want to dissuade any others from leaving.
How do think we should respond to this bullying? And do you think your thoughts are in tune with the British public?
They hold all the cards, it is UK that is peering in the window wishing it was inside. pay up and you can get in , seems very reasonable to me, pity Toris cannot bring themselves to tell the peasants the truth. Will be trouble ahead when the dopes realise the Tories have scammed them for another 5 years and then sold them down the river. Much weeping in petite Bretagne then I think.
Not quite the argument you use when it comes to Scotland negotiating independence......
Scottish politics and a ludicrous picture of Ruth Davidson as another second-rate Thatcher to start my Saturday...
On other thoughts, 20 years ago, we were on the cusp of another landslide and it was one which, although widely expected, surprised many by its size and scale.
The national swing from Conservative to Labour was 10% and many sites followed that UNS but of course punters aren't looking at those and in 2017 at those that won't.
There will be seats where the Lab-Con swing is much higher than the UNS - we can call them the Crosby seats (not after Sir Lynton) but after the constituency which was delivered to Labour on an 18% swing in 1997. There will also be seats where the Lab-Con swing won't be as great as the UNS.
So what are we looking for ? Clearly, given the implosion seats with a large UKIP vote are ones where the increase in the Conservative vote share might accentuate the UNS from Labour to the Conservatives as the Conservatives will benefit from falls in both the Labour and UKIP shares.
As an example, in a seat with low residual UKIP share we might see vote share changes like:
CON +8 Lab -6 LD +4 UKIP -5
Whereas in a seat with a larger UKIP vote base the changes might be:
CON +15 Lab -6 LD +4 UKIP -12
Thus seat A has a Lab-Con swing of 7% while in seat B the swing is 10.5% and you start to see the profile of the landslide.
At the moment the UKIP vote appears to be heading in one direction though smaller elements will doubtless go elsewhere. Churn is what it is but it will be fascinating to see how close the Conservative vote share rise mirrors the UKIP vote share fall.
In 1997 the polls were predicting an even bigger Labour lead - ICM excepted - of circa 20% than the 13% margin which proved to be the outcome. On all other occasions since World War 2 massive leads in the polls have not fully materialised - ie - 2001 - 1997 - 1983 - 1966.. Some might add Oct 1974 to the list.
Regardless of which party is in the lead or which party is in office the polls almost without exception since WWII have overestimated Labour and underestimated the Tories. 2001, 1997, 1966 and Oct 1974 all fit that pattern. As did 2015 and many others.
I genuinely wish you well with your independence attempt even if I'd be sorry to lose you.
Hasn't the UK been trying to bully Scotland? And would you give in and grovel for forgiveness if they did?
CD13 , thank you kindly. Not at all, but it is frightening prospect that we are being led by the nose by the current bunch of absolute losers. These clowns will only do what is good for them , our futures are of little concern , it will be self interest all the way. They should at least come clean. I really do not see EU bullying anyone , they are merely stating the obvious, why would they bend over backwards to help UK and endanger the whole EU. UK chose to leave the club and cannot expect to get the benefits of membership. Why anybody cannot see that I am amazed. As in real life we will pay far more as a visitor than as a club member, it is very simple.
LOL, next you will be telling the shouty bulldog is a great speaker. You Tories cannot suffer that SNP speak with gravitas and presence whilst your moingrel whines and slavers shouting like a fishwife.
What is betting on May meeting a real member of the public in Scotland today , 1000 - 1.
Will she even remember what Scotland's called?
According to the SNP? Nicola Sturgeon.
So few posts, so many repetitions of the barely informed, 'hilarious' tropes of the PB Yoonerati. I guess for fans of echo chambers, you just can't have too many echoes.
....that's it? Some ad hom with "Yoon" thrown in, you are shit at this banter lark.
I'm very fair minded, folk get precisely the response they deserve.
"I am rubber, you are glue" would have been a more substantial retort there. Jesus Christ, either grow a thicker skin or just plain come into the real world where polticians are not scared cows. I don't see you decrying Malc's semi-literate bawlings each day, yet suddenly someone makes one mocking comment and you get the vapours.
OOOOOOH we have an expert among us, and it claims to be literate and intelligent. You half witted cretin you would not recognise banter if it hit you on your pompous upturned Tory snout. Away and get a life, "politicians are not sacred cows" only a fannny could come out with something so juvenile and pathetic.
Haha, apologies for disturbing your little Buckfast soaked morning by daring to comment on Saint Nicola and her happy band of droning backslappers. It appears there is nothing worse than pointing out that politicians aren't perfect, apart from when you are allowed to....because you've decided and that's enough. Perhaps we should just allow you to post spittle covered post all morning about how great the SNP is, how you invented summertime and anyone that opposes such utter horseshit is an evil Tory that will come into your house and eat your babies. But allowing a semi-literate simpleton to rampage across a web board would make it no better than the comment pages of the Daily Mail.
The EU will try to act like bullies because (1) they want the best deal they can get, (2) they think there's a possibility it might persuade the frit ones in the UK back down on leaving, and (3) because they want to dissuade any others from leaving.
How do think we should respond to this bullying? And do you think your thoughts are in tune with the British public?
They hold all the cards, it is UK that is peering in the window wishing it was inside. pay up and you can get in , seems very reasonable to me, pity Toris cannot bring themselves to tell the peasants the truth. Will be trouble ahead when the dopes realise the Tories have scammed them for another 5 years and then sold them down the river. Much weeping in petite Bretagne then I think.
We wish we were inside so much that we've just chosen to leave. Explain that one again please?
And how do you reconcile that with your wishing to end the union with England?
The EU will try to act like bullies because (1) they want the best deal they can get, (2) they think there's a possibility it might persuade the frit ones in the UK back down on leaving, and (3) because they want to dissuade any others from leaving.
How do think we should respond to this bullying? And do you think your thoughts are in tune with the British public?
They hold all the cards, it is UK that is peering in the window wishing it was inside. pay up and you can get in , seems very reasonable to me, pity Toris cannot bring themselves to tell the peasants the truth. Will be trouble ahead when the dopes realise the Tories have scammed them for another 5 years and then sold them down the river. Much weeping in petite Bretagne then I think.
Not quite the argument you use when it comes to Scotland negotiating independence......
We are inside being held hostage and being beaten up, and want to get out, one day the police will do something about it. Completely opposite of EU position
LOL, next you will be telling the shouty bulldog is a great speaker. You Tories cannot suffer that SNP speak with gravitas and presence whilst your moingrel whines and slavers shouting like a fishwife.
What is betting on May meeting a real member of the public in Scotland today , 1000 - 1.
Will she even remember what Scotland's called?
According to the SNP? Nicola Sturgeon.
So few posts, so many repetitions of the barely informed, 'hilarious' tropes of the PB Yoonerati. I guess for fans of echo chambers, you just can't have too many echoes.
....that's it? Some ad hom with "Yoon" thrown in, you are shit at this banter lark.
I'm very fair minded, folk get precisely the response they deserve.
"I am rubber, you are glue" would have been a more substantial retort there. Jesus Christ, either grow a thicker skin or just plain come into the real world where polticians are not scared cows. I don't see you decrying Malc's semi-literate bawlings each day, yet suddenly someone makes one mocking comment and you get the vapours.
You seem a little distraught. Grow a thicker skin, or something.
What's a scared cow btw?
Haha, so you go off on one about my comment and I have to grow a thick skin? Blimey, I can see where Saint Nic gets her U turn lessons from and it's surprisingly not Philip Hammond.
I'd agree that gravity has finally caught up with Sturgeon/SNP. That said, I think gravity will catch up with SCON a lot quicker than 10 years, particularly once we get into the likely global recession overlaid with the realities of Brexit. A SNP stuck at the low 40%s would quickly revive as SLAB are dead in the water.
I'd agree that gravity has finally caught up with Sturgeon/SNP. That said, I think gravity will catch up with SCON a lot quicker than 10 years, particularly once we get into the likely global recession kicks in overlaid with the realities of Brexit. A SNP stuck at the low 40%s would quickly revive as SLAB are dead in the water.
We are due a recession, which could mince the Tory vote in a lot of areas.
The EU will try to act like bullies because (1) they want the best deal they can get, (2) they think there's a possibility it might persuade the frit ones in the UK back down on leaving, and (3) because they want to dissuade any others from leaving.
How do think we should respond to this bullying? And do you think your thoughts are in tune with the British public?
They hold all the cards, it is UK that is peering in the window wishing it was inside. pay up and you can get in , seems very reasonable to me, pity Toris cannot bring themselves to tell the peasants the truth. Will be trouble ahead when the dopes realise the Tories have scammed them for another 5 years and then sold them down the river. Much weeping in petite Bretagne then I think.
We wish we were inside so much that we've just chosen to leave. Explain that one again please?
And how do you reconcile that with your wishing to end the union with England?
First one , big jessie huff and now reality looms and it is a case of "WTF have I done".
Second one is simple, we are in an unequal union and getting shafted , we should get out , how could anyone expect to get fairness when it is 88% to 12% , why would the 88% do things to suit the 12%, so we get the policies for teh 88% which don't suit us and have to suck it up.
Speaking of recessions, we have had a long period of low to medium growth which must come to an end at some point (I hate saying this, unemployment is a horrible thing and I have luckily so far avoided it). That, plus a bad Brexit, could really, really be bloody awful for this country.
I'd agree that gravity has finally caught up with Sturgeon/SNP. That said, I think gravity will catch up with SCON a lot quicker than 10 years, particularly once we get into the likely global recession overlaid with the realities of Brexit. A SNP stuck at the low 40%s would quickly revive as SLAB are dead in the water.
I will not be surprised if Labour manages to creep up to 22% on June 8th - same share as in Holyrood last year. If that happens - and the SNP drop to circa 40% - some of the Labour losses to SNP in 2015 may be reversible.
....that's it? Some ad hom with "Yoon" thrown in, you are shit at this banter lark.
I'm very fair minded, folk get precisely the response they deserve.
"I am rubber, you are glue" would have been a more substantial retort there. Jesus Christ, either grow a thicker skin or just plain come into the real world where polticians are not scared cows. I don't see you decrying Malc's semi-literate bawlings each day, yet suddenly someone makes one mocking comment and you get the vapours.
OOOOOOH we have an expert among us, and it claims to be literate and intelligent. You half witted cretin you would not recognise banter if it hit you on your pompous upturned Tory snout. Away and get a life, "politicians are not sacred cows" only a fannny could come out with something so juvenile and pathetic.
Haha, apologies for disturbing your little Buckfast soaked morning by daring to comment on Saint Nicola and her happy band of droning backslappers. It appears there is nothing worse than pointing out that politicians aren't perfect, apart from when you are allowed to....because you've decided and that's enough. Perhaps we should just allow you to post spittle covered post all morning about how great the SNP is, how you invented summertime and anyone that opposes such utter horseshit is an evil Tory that will come into your house and eat your babies. But allowing a semi-literate simpleton to rampage across a web board would make it no better than the comment pages of the Daily Mail.
Oh Dear , intelligent part ruled out quickly and literate fast behind it. We now see a slavering sad Little Englander, spouting cliches. LOL do you realise it is hard workers like me that pay your JSA so you can lie in your bed and think up juvenile rubbish like that.
it is frightening prospect that we are being led by the nose by the current bunch of absolute losers. These clowns will only do what is good for them , our futures are of little concern , it will be self interest all the way. They should at least come clean.
The EU will try to act like bullies because (1) they want the best deal they can get, (2) they think there's a possibility it might persuade the frit ones in the UK back down on leaving, and (3) because they want to dissuade any others from leaving.
How do think we should respond to this bullying? And do you think your thoughts are in tune with the British public?
They hold all the cards, it is UK that is peering in the window wishing it was inside. pay up and you can get in , seems very reasonable to me, pity Toris cannot bring themselves to tell the peasants the truth. Will be trouble ahead when the dopes realise the Tories have scammed them for another 5 years and then sold them down the river. Much weeping in petite Bretagne then I think.
We wish we were inside so much that we've just chosen to leave. Explain that one again please?
And how do you reconcile that with your wishing to end the union with England?
First one , big jessie huff and now reality looms and it is a case of "WTF have I done".
Second one is simple, we are in an unequal union and getting shafted , we should get out , how could anyone expect to get fairness when it is 88% to 12% , why would the 88% do things to suit the 12%, so we get the policies for teh 88% which don't suit us and have to suck it up.
And the choice being offered is to be 12% vs 88% in the UK or 1% vs 99% in the EU. What option is there for those who want a properly independent Scotland?
I'd agree that gravity has finally caught up with Sturgeon/SNP. That said, I think gravity will catch up with SCON a lot quicker than 10 years, particularly once we get into the likely global recession overlaid with the realities of Brexit. A SNP stuck at the low 40%s would quickly revive as SLAB are dead in the water.
Amazing after 10 years in government that they are still in the 40's and leading by a country mile. Speaks volumes about the opposition.
The EU will try to act like bullies because (1) they want the best deal they can get, (2) they think there's a possibility it might persuade the frit ones in the UK back down on leaving, and (3) because they want to dissuade any others from leaving.
How do think we should respond to this bullying? And do you think your thoughts are in tune with the British public?
They hold all the cards, it is UK that is peering in the window wishing it was inside. pay up and you can get in , seems very reasonable to me, pity Toris cannot bring themselves to tell the peasants the truth. Will be trouble ahead when the dopes realise the Tories have scammed them for another 5 years and then sold them down the river. Much weeping in petite Bretagne then I think.
We wish we were inside so much that we've just chosen to leave. Explain that one again please?
And how do you reconcile that with your wishing to end the union with England?
First one , big jessie huff and now reality looms and it is a case of "WTF have I done".
Second one is simple, we are in an unequal union and getting shafted , we should get out , how could anyone expect to get fairness when it is 88% to 12% , why would the 88% do things to suit the 12%, so we get the policies for teh 88% which don't suit us and have to suck it up.
And the choice being offered is to be 12% vs 88% in the UK or 1% vs 99% in the EU. What option is there for those who want a properly independent Scotland?
So you think Germany , France , Italy etc are not independent countries.
it is frightening prospect that we are being led by the nose by the current bunch of absolute losers. These clowns will only do what is good for them , our futures are of little concern , it will be self interest all the way. They should at least come clean.
I thought you liked the SNP?
I like independence, SNP are currently the only Scottish political party in Scotland so I have no option but to "like" them.
The EU will try to act like bullies because (1) they want the best deal they can get, (2) they think there's a possibility it might persuade the frit ones in the UK back down on leaving, and (3) because they want to dissuade any others from leaving.
How do think we should respond to this bullying? And do you think your thoughts are in tune with the British public?
They hold all the cards, it is UK that is peering in the window wishing it was inside. pay up and you can get in , seems very reasonable to me, pity Toris cannot bring themselves to tell the peasants the truth. Will be trouble ahead when the dopes realise the Tories have scammed them for another 5 years and then sold them down the river. Much weeping in petite Bretagne then I think.
Not quite the argument you use when it comes to Scotland negotiating independence......
We are inside being held hostage and being beaten up, and want to get out, one day the police will do something about it. Completely opposite of EU position
You know, this discussion could be amusing if it wasn’t so boring! Just occasionally there’s some well crafted invective from one or other of the protagonists, but otherwise it seems to be 'tu quoque’.
Bit like the election in fact. oddly perhaps, the Scottish play comes to mind: 'Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, Signifying nothing.'
it is frightening prospect that we are being led by the nose by the current bunch of absolute losers. These clowns will only do what is good for them , our futures are of little concern , it will be self interest all the way. They should at least come clean.
I thought you liked the SNP?
I like independence, SNP are currently the only Scottish political party in Scotland so I have no option but to "like" them.
You know, this discussion could be amusing if it wasn’t so boring! Just occasionally there’s some well crafted invective from one or other of the protagonists, but otherwise it seems to be 'tu quoque’.
Bit like the election in fact. oddly perhaps, the Scottish play comes to mind: 'Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, Signifying nothing.'
It's like one of those WWI battles that results in stalemate.
The EU will try to act like bullies because (1) they want the best deal they can get, (2) they think there's a possibility it might persuade the frit ones in the UK back down on leaving, and (3) because they want to dissuade any others from leaving.
How do think we should respond to this bullying? And do you think your thoughts are in tune with the British public?
1 and 3 certainly. They are not interested in 2. "Bully" is an emotive term. This is business. The EU are apparently playing a strong hand well. We're definitely playing a weak hand badly. The EU will want a deal. No deal is a failure for them as well being very bad for us.
All this was entirely predictable back at the time of the referendum. I had several discussions about it.
Oh Dear , intelligent part ruled out quickly and literate fast behind it. We now see a slavering sad Little Englander, spouting cliches. LOL do you realise it is hard workers like me that pay your JSA so you can lie in your bed and think up juvenile rubbish like that.
I have to say, you manage to post comments on another posters intelligence whilst coming out with that lot blimey. And with all the extra spaces too. And it's hard workers like me that put food into those little boxes in supermarkets so you can pick it up at a food bank and scoff it on park bench.
Spouting cliches? I wouldn't be surprised at you wearing full tweed at your keyboard, drinking Irn-Bru and cursing Newton for having written about the mechanics of gravity because some good honest Scot would have got there first if he hadn't been held back. You are an archetypal nationalist, overtly positive about where you come from for no other reason than you come from there.
Am I a patriot of the UK? Yes. Am I a nationalist? No, never have been. I prefer Polish food and scenery, Welsh cider and rugby, and NZ cities.
The EU will try to act like bullies because (1) they want the best deal they can get, (2) they think there's a possibility it might persuade the frit ones in the UK back down on leaving, and (3) because they want to dissuade any others from leaving.
How do think we should respond to this bullying? And do you think your thoughts are in tune with the British public?
They hold all the cards, it is UK that is peering in the window wishing it was inside. pay up and you can get in , seems very reasonable to me, pity Toris cannot bring themselves to tell the peasants the truth. Will be trouble ahead when the dopes realise the Tories have scammed them for another 5 years and then sold them down the river. Much weeping in petite Bretagne then I think.
We wish we were inside so much that we've just chosen to leave. Explain that one again please?
And how do you reconcile that with your wishing to end the union with England?
First one , big jessie huff and now reality looms and it is a case of "WTF have I done".
Second one is simple, we are in an unequal union and getting shafted , we should get out , how could anyone expect to get fairness when it is 88% to 12% , why would the 88% do things to suit the 12%, so we get the policies for teh 88% which don't suit us and have to suck it up.
And the choice being offered is to be 12% vs 88% in the UK or 1% vs 99% in the EU. What option is there for those who want a properly independent Scotland?
So you think Germany , France , Italy etc are not independent countries.
Germany yes, France and Italy no. Scotland would be one tiny voice in 28 even more impotent than Blair's government which had the power of being the second largest economy in the EU. Scotland will be told to jump and Nicola would have to say "how high, master?". I support Scottish independence, but what's the point of replacing Westminster with Brussels? Bring it all home to Edinburgh.
You know, this discussion could be amusing if it wasn’t so boring! Just occasionally there’s some well crafted invective from one or other of the protagonists, but otherwise it seems to be 'tu quoque’.
Bit like the election in fact. oddly perhaps, the Scottish play comes to mind: 'Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, Signifying nothing.'
OKC, it is indeed boring , what do you expect when Tories are in government , they cannot avoid crowing and denigrating the opposition. Not an edifying sight for sure, what else can you do but poke sticks at their stupid thin hides.
Is it just me or my browser, but didn't you use to be able to embed an actual tweet in a post, rather than just display a http link? This was automatic I thought.
Comments
Don't forget many leavers have publicly stated they want the EU to end. That's the sort of stupid talk they're reacting to.
Anyway I must get on with my jobs today and hope the temperature will dial down from both sides
Super efficient LED lighting puts out many more lumens per Watt than incandescent lamps.
Much, much brighter...
It's not necessarily a mistake to try lower the temperature when both sides seem to have been backing themselves into corners, well before the negotiations even start. I think that anyone who pretends to know the likely outcome at this point - good or bad - is indulging in self delusion.
Scottish politics and a ludicrous picture of Ruth Davidson as another second-rate Thatcher to start my Saturday...
On other thoughts, 20 years ago, we were on the cusp of another landslide and it was one which, although widely expected, surprised many by its size and scale.
The national swing from Conservative to Labour was 10% and many sites followed that UNS but of course punters aren't looking at those and in 2017 at those that won't.
There will be seats where the Lab-Con swing is much higher than the UNS - we can call them the Crosby seats (not after Sir Lynton) but after the constituency which was delivered to Labour on an 18% swing in 1997. There will also be seats where the Lab-Con swing won't be as great as the UNS.
So what are we looking for ? Clearly, given the implosion seats with a large UKIP vote are ones where the increase in the Conservative vote share might accentuate the UNS from Labour to the Conservatives as the Conservatives will benefit from falls in both the Labour and UKIP shares.
As an example, in a seat with low residual UKIP share we might see vote share changes like:
CON +8 Lab -6 LD +4 UKIP -5
Whereas in a seat with a larger UKIP vote base the changes might be:
CON +15 Lab -6 LD +4 UKIP -12
Thus seat A has a Lab-Con swing of 7% while in seat B the swing is 10.5% and you start to see the profile of the landslide.
At the moment the UKIP vote appears to be heading in one direction though smaller elements will doubtless go elsewhere. Churn is what it is but it will be fascinating to see how close the Conservative vote share rise mirrors the UKIP vote share fall.
Mr. Palmer, a good deal is better than none, but if you enter negotiations with the position that a deal must be reached at all costs, then it will be.
Okay...
I imagine if there is no deal they will organise National Backturning Day on the day we leave the EU when at noon all loyal supporters of the Prime Minister will stop and dramatically turn to face north west away from Europe in a final proud sign of national defiance.
Wonderful...
The rest of us will be trying to make sense of the coalition of chaos that the failed negotiations will have unleashed.
Yes, it's all posturing for internal consumption, May's problem will be to sell the aspects of the deal she won't like but has had to accept in order to get the bits of the deal she will like (the bits she and the Conservatives will ensure we hear about rather than the former about which they'll try to keep quiet).
It's more a question of what's in it, what isn't and when and how it's reached.
Where the EU seem especially silly is in their claim that the UK cannot have a better or equivalent situation because that is premised on the notion that the only thing in the world that is of value is the EU.
Our rejection of that view has yet to sink in with them.
I think freedom of movement is going to end. It will end because that is what TM wants to happen.
I don't know what you mean by 'no deal' - i think everyone accepts FoM is ending and now we are talking about what kind of deal is done with the UK as a third party country without FoM.
You originally asked why the EU doesn't want to punish us by removing FoM.
A) FoM benefits them too.
B ) Their objective is not to punish us. Their objective is to make sure the EU does well.
Is that clear?
So few posts, so many repetitions of the barely informed, 'hilarious' tropes of the PB Yoonerati.
I guess for fans of echo chambers, you just can't have too many echoes.
The EU will try to act like bullies because (1) they want the best deal they can get, (2) they think there's a possibility it might persuade the frit ones in the UK back down on leaving, and (3) because they want to dissuade any others from leaving.
How do think we should respond to this bullying? And do you think your thoughts are in tune with the British public?
Freedom after speech, on the other hand...
The 24 point leads just don't feel quite right, as much as I'd love to see an utter landslide. That all said, we still have six weeks of Jeremy Corbyn to go - today's story is that he's friends with Phil Shiner and the scumbag soldier-chasing lawyers.
Will be trouble ahead when the dopes realise the Tories have scammed them for another 5 years and then sold them down the river. Much weeping in petite Bretagne then I think.
I think the dilemma for TM is that the short term politically popular option of storming out is also likely to be very bad for the UK. I hope she recognises that.
The EU have stated they will only discuss subsequent arrangements in outline before Brexit and the will be negotiated at their own pace afterwards. At this point they are of secondary importance to the transition arrangements because if we don't agree these by 29 march 2019 we go over the cliff edge.
Jesus Christ, either grow a thicker skin or just plain come into the real world where polticians are not scared cows. I don't see you decrying Malc's semi-literate bawlings each day, yet suddenly someone makes one mocking comment and you get the vapours.
I genuinely wish you well with your independence attempt even if I'd be sorry to lose you.
Hasn't the UK been trying to bully Scotland? And would you give in and grovel for forgiveness if they did?
Grow a thicker skin, or something.
What's a scared cow btw?
http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/snp-mps-get-boost-from-gina-miller-fund-to-stop-hard-brexit-1-4432722
1983 was an exception to that rule.
I really do not see EU bullying anyone , they are merely stating the obvious, why would they bend over backwards to help UK and endanger the whole EU. UK chose to leave the club and cannot expect to get the benefits of membership. Why anybody cannot see that I am amazed. As in real life we will pay far more as a visitor than as a club member, it is very simple.
Perhaps we should just allow you to post spittle covered post all morning about how great the SNP is, how you invented summertime and anyone that opposes such utter horseshit is an evil Tory that will come into your house and eat your babies. But allowing a semi-literate simpleton to rampage across a web board would make it no better than the comment pages of the Daily Mail.
And how do you reconcile that with your wishing to end the union with England?
A scared cow is a daft misspelling of sacred heh.
I'd agree that gravity has finally caught up with Sturgeon/SNP. That said, I think gravity will catch up with SCON a lot quicker than 10 years, particularly once we get into the likely global recession overlaid with the realities of Brexit. A SNP stuck at the low 40%s would quickly revive as SLAB are dead in the water.
Will Force India or Williams top the midfield?
Will McLaren break down?
Second one is simple, we are in an unequal union and getting shafted , we should get out , how could anyone expect to get fairness when it is 88% to 12% , why would the 88% do things to suit the 12%, so we get the policies for teh 88% which don't suit us and have to suck it up.
YES 45, NO 55 -- LEAVE 52, REMAIN 48.
Well, they are complete opposites of each other.
LOL
Calm down dears it's only an election!
Which no-hope/super safe seat is Corbyn visiting today?
Bit like the election in fact. oddly perhaps, the Scottish play comes to mind: 'Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, Signifying nothing.'
https://twitter.com/jimwaterson/status/858250597107105792
Speculation remains about when, if ever, Nicola Sturgeon will make a campaign stop in Govanhill...
All this was entirely predictable back at the time of the referendum. I had several discussions about it.
Spouting cliches? I wouldn't be surprised at you wearing full tweed at your keyboard, drinking Irn-Bru and cursing Newton for having written about the mechanics of gravity because some good honest Scot would have got there first if he hadn't been held back. You are an archetypal nationalist, overtly positive about where you come from for no other reason than you come from there.
Am I a patriot of the UK? Yes. Am I a nationalist? No, never have been. I prefer Polish food and scenery, Welsh cider and rugby, and NZ cities.