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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Labour reduce the Tory lead to 23% with YouGov in the most inc

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    KentRisingKentRising Posts: 2,850
    edited April 2017

    Freggles said:

    HYUFD said:

    Corbyn promises to create 4 new Bank Holidays on the patron saint day of each home nation, St George's Day, St Andrew's Day, St Patrick's Day and St David's Day, first sensible policy from Labour of the campaign

    http://www.itv.com/news/2017-04-22/labour-seeks-to-create-four-new-bank-holidays-corbyn-announces/

    Actually a good idea!
    Not the best weather though - November, March x 2 and April
    Yeah, and England's on the 23rd April - when Easter can be as late as that and there's already two bank holidays in May.
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    frpenkridgefrpenkridge Posts: 670
    2072 and 2074 were interviewed. Is there something significant about 2000 and seventy something?
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    ChelyabinskChelyabinsk Posts: 488
    Can I voice my support for a bank holiday on Trafalgar Day (21 October)?
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    surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    kyf_100 said:

    surbiton said:

    kyf_100 said:

    nielh said:

    kyf_100 said:

    I have been quietly and consistently buying Labour < 150 seats on Betfair around the 3.5 mark this week.

    I seriously think this will be a wipeout.

    Does anyone think Labour's polling will get better between now and election day?

    I agree that it will be a wipeout and the way things look now, labour are effectively finished.

    But on a constituency level Labour can certainly still win in the following circumstances:
    - Pro european MP in a strong remain area (eg peter Kyle, Ben Bradshaw etc)
    - Where they have a popular, longstanding, local MP with a significant personal vote.
    - Where there is a significant muslim block vote.
    - Most of London.

    May can of course still trip up big time. Corbyn could be superseded. lots of things can happen.

    I dont see any of these bets as good value given the uncertainty about this election.





    I think 3.5 is value, but it's a hunch - I smell collapse in the air, brought on more by voter apathy among core Labour voters than a huge switch.

    I've been building up a quiet position on Labour < 150 at circa 3.5, but the bulk of my betting is on Con seats over 370.5, where the 1.96 on Betfair earlier today seemed to me fantastic value.
    The one point no one has mentioned [ as far as I can see ]; how is the Tory vote spread ? Piling up votes in Tory areas would not do much good.

    Whilst they will pick up many seats, I don't think UNS is appropriate. Regarding Moray, I don't think Robertson will lose.

    Will the Park Ranger reappear ? As a Tory, I mean.
    I don't have the exact stats to hand but I believe someone posted on here yesterday that the swing from Lab to Con in Labour Leave seats is about 3x that of safe Con seats. Definitely DYOR as I can't find the relevant post, but it looks like Labour Leave seats will swing heavily to Conservative. Again, it's a hunch, but I think that 'Nice Mrs May' will do very well with Essex Man and small-c conservative C2DE voters in the north. That to me points to an extinction-level event for Labour.

    I'm also an optimist for the Lib Dems and I think they will poll a bit higher than most on here suspect, at the higher end of 20 - 30 seats. There is a lot of remainer anger out there and I think the organised Lib Dem PR machine will really capitalise on it as Labour sink further and further into disarray. The next six weeks will not be kind on Labour, they are divided, demoralised, and have no effective campaign machine. Things will get a lot worse for them from here.
    Echoes of 1983. But no one personally hated Foot.
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    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    Freggles said:

    HYUFD said:

    Corbyn promises to create 4 new Bank Holidays on the patron saint day of each home nation, St George's Day, St Andrew's Day, St Patrick's Day and St David's Day, first sensible policy from Labour of the campaign

    http://www.itv.com/news/2017-04-22/labour-seeks-to-create-four-new-bank-holidays-corbyn-announces/

    Actually a good idea!
    Bonkers, the dates are wrong. We would have fixed BHs in March, March, April, May, and May, in addition to the 2 floating Easter ones, and is there a more miserable date in the year than 30 November?
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    RobinWiggsRobinWiggs Posts: 621
    spudgfsh said:

    as I said earlier, this election will break the labour party it's difficult to see who cobbles together a credible left wing party alternative afterwards. the union funding will ensure that it is within the 'labour' brand

    If party political funding still legislation allows union funding in the future...
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    AnneJGPAnneJGP Posts: 2,869
    Chameleon said:

    I really want May to use this freedom she has to stop the generational inequality which is widening to an astonishing gap. The old have the triple-lock pensions, bus passes and housing while the young pay a higher rate of tax (5%+) for the same level of earnings, can't get on the housing ladder and hence struggle to build equity, so therefore can chuck away tens of thousands of pounds a year on rent, never to be seen again.

    Yes. Mr Blair won a massive majority and could have done so many things that the Conservatives could never do.

    Let's hope that Mrs May makes the most of whatever opportunities she's going to have.
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    glwglw Posts: 9,574

    really Labour MPs should just oust Corbyn now - say they will all vote for Jarvis as pM if they win not Corbyn.

    What do they have to lose at this point?

    I doubt it's that simple, there would be all sorts of fights and perhaps even legal action.
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    GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071

    GeoffM said:

    kle4 said:

    ToryJim said:

    Scott_P said:
    Miller should she will get absolutely trounced and then maybe we'll be shot of her.
    You don't stand against the sitting PM because you think you'll win and it will shut you down. You do it to maintain profile.
    will she get her tits out next?
    Theresa or Gina?

    I've met Gina Miller and she's definitely fit [checks over shoulder for MrsM] oh yes.
    She sounds a nightmare.
    Oh yes, she loves herself with an intensity that is physically overwhelming when observed close up.
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    Can I voice my support for a bank holiday on Trafalgar Day (21 October)?

    We should have bank holidays on Trafalgar Day and 25th of October too.

    Plus the 18th of June as well.
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    YBarddCwscYBarddCwsc Posts: 7,172
    surbiton said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    There must come a time when we ask ourselves whether this is purely about Corbyn - when we say, OK, he is worse than Foot - but is he that much worse?

    The flight from Ukip to May suggests that she is primarily seen as capable of, and willing to, deliver Brexit. Remainers fucked up big time by losing the referendum through complacence and laziness, and they have compounded their mistake ever since by trolling the Leavers with court cases and sneering and general superior silliness, and this is the electorate's answer. T May is indeed a Gordon Brown lookalike in one respect, that she is a big clunking fist.

    I think that is where the greatest betrayal will be. May, quite cleverly, brought forward the election day, ably assisted by the stupidest man on earth, not just for the massive majority.

    The majority means that Hard Brexiters will actually have less say. She could then negotiate the divorce bill. Nothing will move until that is settled.

    She also effectively moves the next election to 2022 from 2020. So, if she pays £30bn, say as a divorce settlement, it would be old story.

    Actually, under the circumstances, the only sensible move.

    I don't think she brought the election forward to be more Hard Brexit. Plus other pledges can be junked, like, no tax increases, triple lock etc.
    A sensible post ! If Brexit is in 2019, then the losers (and there will always be losers) will be complaining loudly in 2020, which would have been a GE.

    Far better to Brexit, and then have another 3 years. Time enough for bungs to the losers, so they have shut up by the election.

    I am absolutely sure that was one of the main motivations, not all this rubbish about thirty dirty Tories and their election expenses.

    TM just needed a plausible excuse for the GE. Fools like Gina Miller & her ilk gave her one.
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    ReggieCideReggieCide Posts: 4,312
    Scott_P said:

    HYUFD said:

    Corbyn promises to create 4 new Bank Holidays on the patron saint day of each home nation, St George's Day, St Andrew's Day, St Patrick's Day and St David's Day, first sensible policy from Labour of the campaign

    http://www.itv.com/news/2017-04-22/labour-seeks-to-create-four-new-bank-holidays-corbyn-announces/

    A return to the 3 day week would mean 4 holidays every week!
    that surely has to be a vote winner
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    ToryJimToryJim Posts: 3,583
    So the Corbyn bank holiday proposal is interesting but three extra bank holidays in March and April would give us 7 bank holidays in 3 months. I think that's utter overkill.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,973
    MikeL said:


    Was Survation carried out any later than others which would provide at least some support for Mail on Sunday headline?

    Comparing polls from different pollsters is fraught with danger and really shouldn't be used to infer trends......or if done so accompanied by a massive caveat the Mail curiously appears to have failed to do.....
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395

    Betfair Sportsbook seem to have added a few more markets.

    If you're really long on the Tories in Scotland, Ayr, Carrick and Cumnock looks interesting at 14/1 (assuming the Tory lead continues to grow, and the SNP stalls) and the LDs and SCon odds look interesting in Argyll and Bute too.

    A good bet if the cashout option is available.
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    surbiton said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    There must come a time when we ask ourselves whether this is purely about Corbyn - when we say, OK, he is worse than Foot - but is he that much worse?

    The flight from Ukip to May suggests that she is primarily seen as capable of, and willing to, deliver Brexit. Remainers fucked up big time by losing the referendum through complacence and laziness, and they have compounded their mistake ever since by trolling the Leavers with court cases and sneering and general superior silliness, and this is the electorate's answer. T May is indeed a Gordon Brown lookalike in one respect, that she is a big clunking fist.

    I think that is where the greatest betrayal will be. May, quite cleverly, brought forward the election day, ably assisted by the stupidest man on earth, not just for the massive majority.

    The majority means that Hard Brexiters will actually have less say. She could then negotiate the divorce bill. Nothing will move until that is settled.

    She also effectively moves the next election to 2022 from 2020. So, if she pays £30bn, say as a divorce settlement, it would be old story.

    Actually, under the circumstances, the only sensible move.

    I don't think she brought the election forward to be more Hard Brexit. Plus other pledges can be junked, like, no tax increases, triple lock etc.
    Actually I think you make a sensible argument and it certainly seems the way of travel
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    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981

    Can I voice my support for a bank holiday on Trafalgar Day (21 October)?

    I have always favoured 22 October which we could celebrate jointly as National Apologize to The French and Spanish for Trafalgar and for Hanging on to Gibraltar Day, and as being about the date of the festival of Diwali. This would in no way constitute Kipper-trolling.
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    AnneJGPAnneJGP Posts: 2,869
    kle4 said:

    kyf_100 said:

    I think 3.5 is value, but it's just a hunch - I smell total collapse in the air, brought on more by voter apathy among core Labour voters than a huge switch.

    Express headlines screaming "1 in 7 Labour voters will go Tory" for the next few weeks builds a perception of "permission" for others to join them without fear of being disloyal.

    And in apathy and it could become an ELE tipping point quite quickly.

    Is it conceivable that they come third in vote share - or below 20%?

    Conceivable? A lot more than 48 hours ago.

    I won't believe it until I'm losing money on the result.
    Well, Mr Corbyn's supporters have been calling some of Labour's most staunch supporters "Tories" for quite a while now, so that also has been sending its own message.
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    GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071

    Can I voice my support for a bank holiday on Trafalgar Day (21 October)?

    March 3st 2019 is article 50 Brexit day .... I suggest Freedom Day, or Liberation Day
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 92,578

    HYUFD said:

    Corbyn promises to create 4 new Bank Holidays on the patron saint day of each home nation, St George's Day, St Andrew's Day, St Patrick's Day and St David's Day, first sensible policy from Labour of the campaign

    http://www.itv.com/news/2017-04-22/labour-seeks-to-create-four-new-bank-holidays-corbyn-announces/

    So that is 7 bank holidays from the 1 March to the end of May ?

    what a stupid idea.
    Certainly if we are to have more, from any party, they need spacing out. They're too packed together already.
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    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,273

    Betfair Sportsbook seem to have added a few more markets.

    If you're really long on the Tories in Scotland, Ayr, Carrick and Cumnock looks interesting at 14/1 (assuming the Tory lead continues to grow, and the SNP stalls) and the LDs and SCon odds look interesting in Argyll and Bute too.

    I've taken the 5/4 on the Lib Dems for Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross.
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    BigRichBigRich Posts: 3,489
    HYUFD said:

    Corbyn promises to create 4 new Bank Holidays on the patron saint day of each home nation, St George's Day, St Andrew's Day, St Patrick's Day and St David's Day, first sensible policy from Labour of the campaign

    http://www.itv.com/news/2017-04-22/labour-seeks-to-create-four-new-bank-holidays-corbyn-announces/

    Will they all be UK wide Bank holidays, or just I there respective part of the UK?
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    surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549

    really Labour MPs should just oust Corbyn now - say they will all vote for Jarvis as pM if they win not Corbyn.

    What do they have to lose at this point?

    Party assets , brand name. The mother of all court battles are coming up.
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    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    kle4 said:

    hts://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/855901258867253248

    Plenty of Labour ideas people like.
    We all like the idea of free stuff and someone else paying

    Look at the Labour offering in total and we all pay
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,973
    BigRich said:

    HYUFD said:

    Corbyn promises to create 4 new Bank Holidays on the patron saint day of each home nation, St George's Day, St Andrew's Day, St Patrick's Day and St David's Day, first sensible policy from Labour of the campaign

    http://www.itv.com/news/2017-04-22/labour-seeks-to-create-four-new-bank-holidays-corbyn-announces/

    Will they all be UK wide Bank holidays, or just I there respective part of the UK?
    Imagine the whinge from the SNP when they get their bank holiday at the end of November.....chortle.....
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    surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Corbyn promises to create 4 new Bank Holidays on the patron saint day of each home nation, St George's Day, St Andrew's Day, St Patrick's Day and St David's Day, first sensible policy from Labour of the campaign

    http://www.itv.com/news/2017-04-22/labour-seeks-to-create-four-new-bank-holidays-corbyn-announces/

    So that is 7 bank holidays from the 1 March to the end of May ?

    what a stupid idea.
    Certainly if we are to have more, from any party, they need spacing out. They're too packed together already.
    I don't think even the Master Idiot is suggesting 4 bank holidays for everyone. On e in each country. Therefore, 4 bank holidays between March and May.
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,456
    Scott_P said:

    HYUFD said:

    Corbyn promises to create 4 new Bank Holidays on the patron saint day of each home nation, St George's Day, St Andrew's Day, St Patrick's Day and St David's Day, first sensible policy from Labour of the campaign

    http://www.itv.com/news/2017-04-22/labour-seeks-to-create-four-new-bank-holidays-corbyn-announces/

    A return to the 3 day week would mean 4 holidays every week!
    Well I did say it was a rare sensible policy, does not mean his other policies would not undermine it
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    Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905
    I'm just back from an evening out. Very good show.

    Been catching up on these numbers. Extraordinary. And we've still not had the headline figures from that Panelbase in Scotland, either: rumoured to show the Tories up above 30%. To say nothing of the latest Welsh Barometer poll coming up on Monday, which looks like it might have the Conservatives overtaking Labour as the largest party.

    Strange times indeed.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,973
    surbiton said:

    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Corbyn promises to create 4 new Bank Holidays on the patron saint day of each home nation, St George's Day, St Andrew's Day, St Patrick's Day and St David's Day, first sensible policy from Labour of the campaign

    http://www.itv.com/news/2017-04-22/labour-seeks-to-create-four-new-bank-holidays-corbyn-announces/

    So that is 7 bank holidays from the 1 March to the end of May ?

    what a stupid idea.
    Certainly if we are to have more, from any party, they need spacing out. They're too packed together already.
    I don't think even the Master Idiot is suggesting 4 bank holidays for everyone. On e in each country. Therefore, 4 bank holidays between March and May.
    St Andrew's day? November 30......
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    Dr Eoin has spoken:

    Labour are uniting behind Jeremy

    to stab him or push him off a cliff
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    CyanCyan Posts: 1,262
    edited April 2017
    La Libre in Belgium has published a poll since the French ban came into effect. I don't think this is voodoo: they're keeping quiet about the pollster for legal reasons.

    Le Pen 26%
    Fillon 22%
    Macron 21%
    Mélenchon 17%
    Hamon 7%

    The Tribune de Genève in Switzerland will also be publishing one, or already has.

    And look at these two hypothetical R2 polls by Odoxa:

    20 Apr (before Paris attack): Fillon 59%, Le Pen 41%;
    21 Apr (after Paris attack): Fillon 54%, Le Pen 46%.
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    Trigger warning for PB innocents. The morning thread talks about, inter alia, shags, and dominatrices.
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    KentRisingKentRising Posts: 2,850
    edited April 2017
    Can't we just have one, UK-wide June bank holiday for the monarch's official birthday?

    June - nice weather, and not in May where there are already two holidays.

    Australia has a public holiday on the second Monday in June for the monarch's official birthday.
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    JPJ2JPJ2 Posts: 378
    Peak Tory in Scotland already-blink and you will miss it.

    Still an overwhelmingly victory for the SNP even on these figures and
    attempts by the Tories to quote their heavy defeat by the SNP as somehow justification for delaying
    a referendum will not convince the 70 per cent or so who have not voted Tory.

    Delay by the Tories against the wishes of Holyrood and in the face of demographic
    changes just makes the end of the Union even more certain.
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    surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    GeoffM said:

    Can I voice my support for a bank holiday on Trafalgar Day (21 October)?

    March 3st 2019 is article 50 Brexit day .... I suggest Freedom Day, or Liberation Day
    "March 3st 2019" ? Brexit means the death of the English language.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 92,578
    Ishmael_Z said:

    Can I voice my support for a bank holiday on Trafalgar Day (21 October)?

    I have always favoured 22 October which we could celebrate jointly as National Apologize to The French and Spanish for Trafalgar and for Hanging on to Gibraltar Day, and as being about the date of the festival of Diwali. This would in no way constitute Kipper-trolling.
    I wanted the date of the Scottish Referendum results to be Union day in celebration, but as I'm still nervy about long term prospects that's probably not a good idea.
    AnneJGP said:

    kle4 said:

    kyf_100 said:

    I think 3.5 is value, but it's just a hunch - I smell total collapse in the air, brought on more by voter apathy among core Labour voters than a huge switch.

    Express headlines screaming "1 in 7 Labour voters will go Tory" for the next few weeks builds a perception of "permission" for others to join them without fear of being disloyal.

    And in apathy and it could become an ELE tipping point quite quickly.

    Is it conceivable that they come third in vote share - or below 20%?

    Conceivable? A lot more than 48 hours ago.

    I won't believe it until I'm losing money on the result.
    Well, Mr Corbyn's supporters have been calling some of Labour's most staunch supporters "Tories" for quite a while now, so that also has been sending its own message.
    As is apparent I always tend to the optimistic prediction when it comes to Labour, but I have been wondering for a long time what those Cobynistas would do if everyone they accused of being a Tory stopped and thought, well, if they think I am, maybe it wouldn't be so bad?

    A sea change can occur, where support for a party edges up so high suddenly it becomes acceptable as an option to people who would never have considered them before, and they surge massively. It happened with the SNP. Can it happen with others? Yes. Will it? Probably not, but if it did we'd no longer be surprised.
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    GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    Ishmael_Z said:

    Can I voice my support for a bank holiday on Trafalgar Day (21 October)?

    I have always favoured 22 October which we could celebrate jointly as National Apologize to The French and Spanish for Trafalgar and for Hanging on to Gibraltar Day, and as being about the date of the festival of Diwali. This would in no way constitute Kipper-trolling.
    10th September is already National Shove It Up Your Arse You Dago Bastards, We're British Day here in Gibraltar.

    Or National Day as we call it because it's shorter.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gibraltar_National_Day

    A couple of pictures of the annual party
    https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5715/21111418279_e88aa7b72b_c.jpg

    http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-oUwNBGJMFIw/Uj9cL7ZN6vI/AAAAAAAABvA/UWABuoJ-D4I/s1600/casemates+view+on+national+day.jpg
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,456
    Cyan said:

    La Libre in Belgium has published a poll since the French ban came into effect. I don't think this is voodoo: they're keeping quiet about the pollster for legal reasons.

    Le Pen 26%
    Fillon 22%
    Macron 21%
    Mélenchon 17%
    Hamon 7%

    If true that would be a political earthquake, a Le Pen v Fillon runoff and possibly even President Le Pen but of course still a big if
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,769

    Trigger warning for PB innocents. The morning thread talks about, inter alia, shags, and dominatrices.

    Guest Thread by Natalie Rowe?
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    Trigger warning for PB innocents. The morning thread talks about, inter alia, shags, and dominatrices.

    Guest Thread by Natalie Rowe?
    Written by yours truly.
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    surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    Cyan said:

    La Libre in Belgium has published a poll since the French ban came into effect. I don't think this is voodoo: they're keeping quiet about the pollster for legal reasons.

    Le Pen 26%
    Fillon 22%
    Macron 21%
    Mélenchon 17%
    Hamon 7%

    The Tribune de Genève in Switzerland will also be publishing one, or already has.

    That is terrible !
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 92,578
    edited April 2017
    Scott_P said:

    Dr Eoin has spoken:

    Labour are uniting behind Jeremy

    Ahahahahahahahaha.

    I'm all for the most positive spin on things, and in a way I wish Labour a certain level of success because I don't want a huge Tory majority, but clearly they are not uniting, that's what people like Eoin have been complaining about for so long.

    He must be a spoof.
    JPJ2 said:

    Peak Tory in Scotland already-blink and you will miss it.

    Still an overwhelmingly victory for the SNP even on these figures and
    attempts by the Tories to quote their heavy defeat by the SNP as somehow justification for delaying
    a referendum will not convince the 70 per cent or so who have not voted Tory.

    Delay by the Tories against the wishes of Holyrood and in the face of demographic
    changes just makes the end of the Union even more certain.

    Surely something is either certain, or it isn't? Can something become more certain?

    For what its worth I don't think delaying the referendum can be justified either, but if unionist parties get more than 50%, its a better argument than is currently there for delaying it.
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    NotThatNickNotThatNick Posts: 16
    edited April 2017
    Doesn't Scotland already get St Andrew's Day so will only get three extra days to England and Wales' four? He really given up north of the border hasn't he
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,973

    Trigger warning for PB innocents. The morning thread talks about, inter alia, shags, and dominatrices.

    LOUISE!!!!!!
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,456
    BigRich said:

    HYUFD said:

    Corbyn promises to create 4 new Bank Holidays on the patron saint day of each home nation, St George's Day, St Andrew's Day, St Patrick's Day and St David's Day, first sensible policy from Labour of the campaign

    http://www.itv.com/news/2017-04-22/labour-seeks-to-create-four-new-bank-holidays-corbyn-announces/

    Will they all be UK wide Bank holidays, or just I there respective part of the UK?
    UK wide apparently
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    SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    Every one point and laugh at the idiot, he’s even more crackers than the last general election.
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,504
    Cyan said:

    La Libre in Belgium has published a poll since the French ban came into effect. I don't think this is voodoo: they're keeping quiet about the pollster for legal reasons.

    Le Pen 26%
    Fillon 22%
    Macron 21%
    Mélenchon 17%
    Hamon 7%

    The Tribune de Genève in Switzerland will also be publishing one, or already has.

    It's apparently polling from 'one of the candidate's teams'. Who would benefit from a poll like this?
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    Trigger warning for PB innocents. The morning thread talks about, inter alia, shags, and dominatrices.

    LOUISE!!!!!!
    Actually I do mention a specific safe word.
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    MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,343
    Surely even Corbyn isn't proposing four more National Bank Holidays?

    ie Each would only be a Bank Holiday in the relevant nation - so everyone only gets one more day?
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,769
    edited April 2017
    What's the key times tomorrow we know about results of Round 1?
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,769
    edited April 2017
    MikeL said:

    Surely even Corbyn isn't proposing four more National Bank Holidays?

    ie Each would only be a Bank Holiday in the relevant nation - so everyone only gets one more day?

    Who knows....

    Labour’s election manifesto is being drawn up by an aide who once called for all banks to be nationalised and Britain to have a three-day week, it can be revealed.

    He has previously suggested companies should be banned from sacking people and workers should be given powers to take over their businesses.

    Mr Fisher has also backed abolishing the City of London and ending tax havens in the Channel Islands and the Cayman Islands.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/04/22/man-behind-jeremy-corbyns-election-manifesto-bring-three-day/
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    RobDRobD Posts: 59,109
    JPJ2 said:

    Peak Tory in Scotland already-blink and you will miss it.

    Still an overwhelmingly victory for the SNP even on these figures and
    attempts by the Tories to quote their heavy defeat by the SNP as somehow justification for delaying
    a referendum will not convince the 70 per cent or so who have not voted Tory.

    Delay by the Tories against the wishes of Holyrood and in the face of demographic
    changes just makes the end of the Union even more certain.

    I just knew it was Good For Yes!!
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    JonathanDJonathanD Posts: 2,400

    What's the key times tomorrow we know about results of Round 1?

    7pm ish UK time when the exit polls start to come in.
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    Survation sample size on their Scotland poll is 163. Colour me unconvinced.
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    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,675
    Of all the really weird things tonight that Sunday Mail front page is surely the weirdest. What on earth were they thinking?

    Labour must be getting seriously close to genuine panic. At least they would be if they were even vaguely rational.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,973
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,456
    JPJ2 said:

    Peak Tory in Scotland already-blink and you will miss it.

    Still an overwhelmingly victory for the SNP even on these figures and
    attempts by the Tories to quote their heavy defeat by the SNP as somehow justification for delaying
    a referendum will not convince the 70 per cent or so who have not voted Tory.

    Delay by the Tories against the wishes of Holyrood and in the face of demographic
    changes just makes the end of the Union even more certain.

    The SNP losing 10-12 seats, most probably the leader of the SNP at Westminster losing his seat and the unionist parties combined on 55% would be a rebuff to the SNP whichever way you try and spin it and May would easily be able to ignore Sturgeon's indyref2 demands for the rest of the Parliament
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    BigRichBigRich Posts: 3,489

    spudgfsh said:

    as I said earlier, this election will break the labour party it's difficult to see who cobbles together a credible left wing party alternative afterwards. the union funding will ensure that it is within the 'labour' brand

    If party political funding still legislation allows union funding in the future...
    I'v mentioned this hear before without it getting the attention I think it dissevers, with the passage of the Trade Union Act 2016, which came in to affect last month. The money going to the Union Political funds is going to go down, probably very dramatically down. as the opt-out system is progressively replaced with an opt-in.

    If you take the number of Union members who bothered to vote in the Lab leadership election as a guide for how many would chose to opt-in then union funding goes down form an average of £19 million a year to about 1 million. that's a big drop.
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,769

    Well, there's one approach:

    twitter.com/binbones28/status/855896107238526976

    Do you get to see more if you promise to vote for him?
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    Survation sample size on their Scotland poll is 163. Colour me unconvinced.

    There's two Survation polls I'm led to believe.

    One UK wide, and a second Scotland specific one
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    MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699
    RobD said:

    surbiton said:

    RobD said:

    MikeL said:

    Do we have dates for tonight's polls?

    Was Survation carried out any later than others which would provide at least some support for Mail on Sunday headline?

    Survation interviewed 2,072 UK adults aged 18+ between 21st - 22nd April 2017. Survation is a member of the British Polling Council and abides by its rules.

    ComRes - Methodology Note: ComRes interviewed 2,074 GB adults online between 19th and 20th April 2017. Data were weighted to be demographically representative of all adults and by past vote recall. Voting intention figures are calculated using the ComRes Voter Turnout Model. ComRes is a member of the British Polling Council and abides by its rules. Full data at www.comresglobal.com

    YouGov - Thurs/Fri

    Opinium - 19th-20th April
    Do you have a link to the yougov poll?
    Is Survation an "old fashioned" poll ? I mean not online. Could this be why it is different ?
    Survation was online.
    Survation is online . The differences are in fact quite amazing as it seems the panels are pretty much the same . TSE seems to be a member and took part in all of them !!!! Perhaps he gave different answers to each one .
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    FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,098

    Cyan said:

    La Libre in Belgium has published a poll since the French ban came into effect. I don't think this is voodoo: they're keeping quiet about the pollster for legal reasons.

    Le Pen 26%
    Fillon 22%
    Macron 21%
    Mélenchon 17%
    Hamon 7%

    The Tribune de Genève in Switzerland will also be publishing one, or already has.

    It's apparently polling from 'one of the candidate's teams'. Who would benefit from a poll like this?
    Hard to say. Maybe Macron trying to get people away from Melenchon.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 92,578
    Isn't that how Putin does it?

    Of course he gets his own songs too.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zk_VszbZa_s
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,973
    RobD said:

    JPJ2 said:

    Peak Tory in Scotland already-blink and you will miss it.

    Still an overwhelmingly victory for the SNP even on these figures and
    attempts by the Tories to quote their heavy defeat by the SNP as somehow justification for delaying
    a referendum will not convince the 70 per cent or so who have not voted Tory.

    Delay by the Tories against the wishes of Holyrood and in the face of demographic
    changes just makes the end of the Union even more certain.

    I just knew it was Good For Yes!!
    It's always Good for Yes! or A Victory for Eck Nicola
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    ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133
    This looks ripe for a complaint to IPSO...

    https://twitter.com/election_data/status/855903335936819200
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    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 21,039

    Trigger warning for PB innocents. The morning thread talks about, inter alia, shags, and dominatrices.

    Hope Jack W has stocked up on his "little blue pills" lol! :D
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    brokenwheelbrokenwheel Posts: 3,352
    edited April 2017

    Cyan said:

    La Libre in Belgium has published a poll since the French ban came into effect. I don't think this is voodoo: they're keeping quiet about the pollster for legal reasons.

    Le Pen 26%
    Fillon 22%
    Macron 21%
    Mélenchon 17%
    Hamon 7%

    The Tribune de Genève in Switzerland will also be publishing one, or already has.

    It's apparently polling from 'one of the candidate's teams'. Who would benefit from a poll like this?
    Presumably Macron.

    Le Pen looks a bit too high, however given we know Fillon's base will likely turn out while Macron's is untested there is reason to believe the order is not implausible.
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    RobDRobD Posts: 59,109

    This looks ripe for a complaint to IPSO...

    twitter.com/election_data/status/855903335936819200

    Not sure it is incorrect, the polls the data are from are clearly indicated.
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    CyanCyan Posts: 1,262
    edited April 2017
    HYUFD said:

    Cyan said:

    La Libre in Belgium has published a poll since the French ban came into effect. I don't think this is voodoo: they're keeping quiet about the pollster for legal reasons.

    Le Pen 26%
    Fillon 22%
    Macron 21%
    Mélenchon 17%
    Hamon 7%

    If true that would be a political earthquake, a Le Pen v Fillon runoff and possibly even President Le Pen but of course still a big if
    .
    According to the talk page of the French Wikipedia article about the polling, polls that have been or will be published after the ban started include

    Belgium
    Le Soir : link
    L'Echo : link
    La RTBF : link
    La Libre Belgique : link
    Switzerland
    Le Temps : link
    20 Minutes : link
    la Radio télévision suisse : link
    Canada
    La Société Radio-Canada : link
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    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,675

    Well, there's one approach:

    twitter.com/binbones28/status/855896107238526976

    Do you get to see more if you promise to vote for him?
    Nichons= boobs (I think). So a bit more, yes.
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited April 2017
    Bloody hell, the BBC paper review is reporting the Mail story on the Tory poll lead being slashed as if it might have some truth to it.
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    glwglw Posts: 9,574

    He has previously suggested companies should be banned from sacking people

    Now that is properly raving mad.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 92,578
    DavidL said:

    Of all the really weird things tonight that Sunday Mail front page is surely the weirdest. What on earth were they thinking?

    They're worried TMay might be so far ahead she can ignore them, and come to think she can actually raise some taxes without worrying about electoral impact for once, so time to remind her they are not her lapdogs and can still cause trouble.
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @rafaelbehr: @nickfaith82 When your big brand problem is 'couldn't run a whelk stall' not sure headline policy of 'stall closing 4 extra days' is wise positioning.
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    kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 4,154

    Cyan said:

    La Libre in Belgium has published a poll since the French ban came into effect. I don't think this is voodoo: they're keeping quiet about the pollster for legal reasons.

    Le Pen 26%
    Fillon 22%
    Macron 21%
    Mélenchon 17%
    Hamon 7%

    The Tribune de Genève in Switzerland will also be publishing one, or already has.

    It's apparently polling from 'one of the candidate's teams'. Who would benefit from a poll like this?
    Hard to say. Maybe Macron trying to get people away from Melenchon.
    The thing that's always worried me about this election is how reliable the pollsters are. I mean, I have a pretty good idea of UK pollsters and their house effects and whether they're likely to under or over-rate a party by a couple of points. France remains a mystery.

    Let's assume for a moment there is a "shy Le Pen" vote and it amounts to as much as 4% - that wouldn't be so far out considering the "shy Tory" and "shy Trump" effect we've seen the last couple of years. Private polling, stripped from the need for herding, may well be better at picking this up and 26% for Le Pen with a Le Pen / Fillon run off may not be inaccurate.

    I am still greenest on Macron but I have topped up on Fillon just in case.
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    ToryJimToryJim Posts: 3,583
    Some people are smoking some heavy shit

    https://twitter.com/moboboandyking/status/855721784641019904
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    ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133
    RobD said:

    This looks ripe for a complaint to IPSO...

    twitter.com/election_data/status/855903335936819200

    Not sure it is incorrect, the polls the data are from are clearly indicated.
    The front page headline is grossly misleading, the chart is the proof that it is.
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    KentRisingKentRising Posts: 2,850
    ToryJim said:
    Presumably a spoof account.
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    RobDRobD Posts: 59,109
    ToryJim said:

    Some people are smoking some heavy shit

    twitter.com/moboboandyking/status/855721784641019904

    Does he know that Maidenhead is the second safest Tory seat in the country? He's deluded!
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 92,578

    This looks ripe for a complaint to IPSO...

    https://twitter.com/election_data/status/855903335936819200

    Might as well not even admit in the graphic they came from two different polls, its so misleading even with the labels.
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,769
    AndyJS said:

    Bloody hell, the BBC paper review is reporting the Mail story on the Tory poll lead being slashed as if it might have some truth to it.

    Failing Fake News BBC...
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    ToryJim said:
    Reminds of during the Cleggasm some Lib Dems were convinced they were going to win Witney.
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    RobDRobD Posts: 59,109
    AndyJS said:

    Bloody hell, the BBC paper review is reporting the Mail story on the Tory poll lead being slashed as if it might have some truth to it.

    Good! We don't want Corbyn being ousted now, do we?
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    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 21,039
    Is there an ICM coming out tonight or can we head off for some Zzzzzzzzzzzz...
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    ToryJimToryJim Posts: 3,583
    RobD said:

    This looks ripe for a complaint to IPSO...

    twitter.com/election_data/status/855903335936819200

    Not sure it is incorrect, the polls the data are from are clearly indicated.
    Comparing apples and oranges
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    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,273
    RobD said:

    AndyJS said:

    Bloody hell, the BBC paper review is reporting the Mail story on the Tory poll lead being slashed as if it might have some truth to it.

    Good! We don't want Corbyn being ousted now, do we?
    I'm thinking of voting Labour in the locals.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,973
    RobD said:

    This looks ripe for a complaint to IPSO...

    twitter.com/election_data/status/855903335936819200

    Not sure it is incorrect, the polls the data are from are clearly indicated.
    The implication that there is movement is unsupportable - if they were two sets of data points, that would be fine - but the inference a voter would draw - and the headline states is hat the Tory lead has halved - and there simply isn't any data to support that. What there is suggests the reverse is true.....
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    MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699
    edited April 2017
    ToryJim said:

    RobD said:

    This looks ripe for a complaint to IPSO...

    twitter.com/election_data/status/855903335936819200

    Not sure it is incorrect, the polls the data are from are clearly indicated.
    Comparing apples and oranges
    slightly unfair more like comparing Bramley cooking apples with Coxs Eating Apples
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    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,675
    kle4 said:

    DavidL said:

    Of all the really weird things tonight that Sunday Mail front page is surely the weirdest. What on earth were they thinking?

    They're worried TMay might be so far ahead she can ignore them, and come to think she can actually raise some taxes without worrying about electoral impact for once, so time to remind her they are not her lapdogs and can still cause trouble.
    It does seem that she is going, at one bound, to be free of all the slightly weird little pressure groups on the edges of the Tory party (and of reason for that matter). The problem is I am still not completely convinced she is completely free of these foibles herself.
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    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    Scott_P said:

    @rafaelbehr: @nickfaith82 When your big brand problem is 'couldn't run a whelk stall' not sure headline policy of 'stall closing 4 extra days' is wise positioning.

    LOL
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    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    glw said:

    He has previously suggested companies should be banned from sacking people

    Now that is properly raving mad.
    Or he is French.....
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,973
    To the many lacunae in 'Dr' Eoin's knowledge we can add 'margin of error':

    https://twitter.com/LabourEoin/status/855877452459122688
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    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,675
    tlg86 said:

    RobD said:

    AndyJS said:

    Bloody hell, the BBC paper review is reporting the Mail story on the Tory poll lead being slashed as if it might have some truth to it.

    Good! We don't want Corbyn being ousted now, do we?
    I'm thinking of voting Labour in the locals.
    In fairness, it might be your last chance.
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    KentRisingKentRising Posts: 2,850

    To the many lacunae in 'Dr' Eoin's knowledge we can add 'margin of error':

    https://twitter.com/LabourEoin/status/855877452459122688

    Yeah, and the Tories aren't that much more - if at all more - distrusted on the issue than Labour, if the polls are to be believed.
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    RobDRobD Posts: 59,109
    nunu said:

    twitter.com/MaxCRoser/status/855868745927053319

    You could also fit a straight line through that and say there is no correlation between belief in evolution and GDP.
This discussion has been closed.