I can't believe that traingate has made headline national news, on the telly and in the papers.
It's about a seat. On the train.
I can only conclude Britain is a safe and secure country, and there's nothing much going on at the moment.
a) You're right, not much is happening domestically b) It involves a celebrity tycoon in a spat with a wildly popular/hated political figure, good for headlines c) It's funny
I agree it's funny. And also somehow reassuring that we worry about such trivia.
There will be other countries around the world totally baffled right now as to why this is even an issue. Let alone a national headline grabbing one.
Janan GaneshVerified account @JananGanesh You can do analysis of Corbyn and his "movement" (I have done it) but the essence of the whole thing is that they are just thick as pigshit.
"Mulholland Drive leads the pack in list of 21st century's top films BBC Culture poll of 177 film critics around the world puts David Lynch’s 2001 surrealist masterpiece in top spot"
Janan GaneshVerified account @JananGanesh You can do analysis of Corbyn and his "movement" (I have done it) but the essence of the whole thing is that they are just thick as pigshit.
I can't believe that traingate has made headline national news, on the telly and in the papers.
It's about a seat. On the train.
I can only conclude Britain is a safe and secure country, and there's nothing much going on at the moment.
a) You're right, not much is happening domestically b) It involves a celebrity tycoon in a spat with a wildly popular/hated political figure, good for headlines c) It's funny
I agree it's funny. And also somehow reassuring that we worry about such trivia.
There will be other countries around the world totally baffled right now as to why this is even an issue. Let alone a national headline grabbing one.
After discovering irrefutable proof some of them refer to the same sort of thing as Cucumber Time, I think they might understand it.
Janan GaneshVerified account @JananGanesh You can do analysis of Corbyn and his "movement" (I have done it) but the essence of the whole thing is that they are just thick as pigshit.
That's just the sort of thing people say when they are fighting their own instinct to join the mass movement. You'll win him over yet.
Also hearing of some shock news coming from the Vatican regarding the Pope.....
Bear in mind that if this kind of gap polling keeps appearing then short of a Clinton calamity the energy will just drain from Trumps campaign and there will be no competitiveness, never mind winning.
LOL....the Maomentum women even trying to spin the video when shown to her in person. I guess she managed to avoid claiming it was a Zionist conspiracy.
Quite apart from all the blatant lying and deceit involved in this story, one would have thought that there would have been someone around in the Labour leader's team to have the not too demanding nous to have arranged a reserved seat for him and indeed for his entourage. It's the sort of very basic thing, very basic people such as you and I undertake every time we travel long distances on a train. Didn't this occur to anyone?
My own hunch is that they bought open return tickets, and missed the train they had reservations for.
Advance tickets you mean.
No open returns I mean.
Open returns come with reservations? I thought you were kicked off trains if you don't travel on the train you have reservations for?
An open return lets you travel back within one calendar month of your original departure, you can make reservations at the time of the original booking, or by 6pm on the day of your return.
Even if you miss your reservation, you're still allowed to travel back on a later (or earlier) train, within one calendar month of your original departure.
Bloody hell! No need to OUT-SAD me, man!
I only ever reserved seats when buying advance tickets online. Last year a couple of times I was able to travel from Euston to Coventry for only £9 one-way on Virgin.
I'm someone who buys an open (first class) return at least once a month for work, because I don't know how long I'll be in London for.
Well la-di-bloody-da
Worse part of my week is when I have to catch the Manchester to Dore train on the Northern Service or the East Midlands Trains service, they have no first class section. THE HORROR, THE HORROR.
Thank Allah for Trans Pennine Express.
If you asked me, if I had to choose between going on a train without a first class section or go to Guantanamo Bay, I'd probably choose the latter
First Class = Snob Class Business = Spiv Class (planes only) Economy/Standard = Steerage
I have been to Chester, Manchester Piccadilly, Stockport, Sheffield, Worksop and Lincoln, so my next few priorities will be to do Chester to Stockport, Manchester/Stockport to Sheffield, Sheffield to Lincoln via Worksop.
Quite apart from all the blatant lying and deceit involved in this story, one would have thought that there would have been someone around in the Labour leader's team to have the not too demanding nous to have arranged a reserved seat for him and indeed for his entourage. It's the sort of very basic thing, very basic people such as you and I undertake every time we travel long distances on a train. Didn't this occur to anyone?
My own hunch is that they bought open return tickets, and missed the train they had reservations for.
Advance tickets you mean.
No open returns I mean.
Open returns come with reservations? I thought you were kicked off trains if you don't travel on the train you have reservations for?
An open return lets you travel back within one calendar month of your original departure, you can make reservations at the time of the original booking, or by 6pm on the day of your return.
Even if you miss your reservation, you're still allowed to travel back on a later (or earlier) train, within one calendar month of your original departure.
Bloody hell! No need to OUT-SAD me, man!
I only ever reserved seats when buying advance tickets online. Last year a couple of times I was able to travel from Euston to Coventry for only £9 one-way on Virgin.
I'm someone who buys an open (first class) return at least once a month for work, because I don't know how long I'll be in London for.
Well la-di-bloody-da
Worse part of my week is when I have to catch the Manchester to Dore train on the Northern Service or the East Midlands Trains service, they have no first class section. THE HORROR, THE HORROR.
Thank Allah for Trans Pennine Express.
If you asked me, if I had to choose between going on a train without a first class section or go to Guantanamo Bay, I'd probably choose the latter
First Class = Snob Class Business = Spiv Class (planes only) Economy/Standard = Steerage
I have been to Chester, Manchester Piccadilly, Stockport, Sheffield, Worksop and Lincoln, so my next few priorities will be to do Chester to Stockport, Manchester/Stockport to Sheffield, Sheffield to Lincoln via Worksop.
LOL....the Maomentum women even trying to spin the video when shown to her in person. I guess she managed to avoid claiming it was a Zionist conspiracy.
Perhaps Ken Livingstone would have something valuable to say on the subject of trains...
Quite apart from all the blatant lying and deceit involved in this story, one would have thought that there would have been someone around in the Labour leader's team to have the not too demanding nous to have arranged a reserved seat for him and indeed for his entourage. It's the sort of very basic thing, very basic people such as you and I undertake every time we travel long distances on a train. Didn't this occur to anyone?
My own hunch is that they bought open return tickets, and missed the train they had reservations for.
Advance tickets you mean.
No open returns I mean.
Open returns come with reservations? I thought you were kicked off trains if you don't travel on the train you have reservations for?
An open return lets you travel back within one calendar month of your original departure, you can make reservations at the time of the original booking, or by 6pm on the day of your return.
Even if you miss your reservation, you're still allowed to travel back on a later (or earlier) train, within one calendar month of your original departure.
Bloody hell! No need to OUT-SAD me, man!
I only ever reserved seats when buying advance tickets online. Last year a couple of times I was able to travel from Euston to Coventry for only £9 one-way on Virgin.
I'm someone who buys an open (first class) return at least once a month for work, because I don't know how long I'll be in London for.
Well la-di-bloody-da
Worse part of my week is when I have to catch the Manchester to Dore train on the Northern Service or the East Midlands Trains service, they have no first class section. THE HORROR, THE HORROR.
Thank Allah for Trans Pennine Express.
If you asked me, if I had to choose between going on a train without a first class section or go to Guantanamo Bay, I'd probably choose the latter
First Class = Snob Class Business = Spiv Class (planes only) Economy/Standard = Steerage
I have been to Chester, Manchester Piccadilly, Stockport, Sheffield, Worksop and Lincoln, so my next few priorities will be to do Chester to Stockport, Manchester/Stockport to Sheffield, Sheffield to Lincoln via Worksop.
Let me know when you're planning to visit Manchester/Sheffield and we can meet up and I'll show you the sights
I've often been on trains where on the face of it there is no seat with people standing and sitting on floors. It is not unusual to discover that there are in fact half empty (non-first class) carriages at the extremity of the train but people can't be bothered to go looking for them, and ultimately are prepared to put up with the incovenience for an hour. That's hardly the fault of the train operator.
It would be good if they had indicators like in modern carparks to tell you how many empty seats there are in each carriage. It would also provide very useful data for train operators.
Not quite sure how they'd do that though. It's a bit easier when you have cars going through barriers to give a foolproof method of determining the numbers in the carpark. And i've never seen one that tells you precisely where the spaces are, as opposed to the contention that they must exist.
My local mall car park has a light and sensor above each space, light is green when the space is empty and red when it's occupied. Display at the end of each lane indicate how many free spaces are in that lane. Works really well but probably costs a few quid.
For first-class on my commute you pay for your first-class ticket by putting your starting point and destination into your phone, then swipe the phone on a sensor above the seat, which turns on a little light next to the sensor. That way the ticket inspector - who for the ultimate genteel experience is disguised as a lady selling snacks and drinks - just has to walk through and see if there are any people in seats without the light on.
They don't use this to show people which seats are available, but presumably it wouldn't be very hard.
The latest spin is that he sat on the floor because he wanted to sit with his wife. Who he then proceeded to ignore by tucking in to a copy of Private Eye and the Guardian...
The latest spin is that he sat on the floor because he wanted to sit with his wife. Who he then proceeded to ignore by tucking in to a copy of Private Eye and the Guardian...
So the spin is that he made his wife sit on the floor when there were plenty of seats available?
The latest spin is that he sat on the floor because he wanted to sit with his wife. Who he then proceeded to ignore by tucking in to a copy of Private Eye and the Guardian...
So the spin is that he made his wife sit on the floor when there were plenty of seats available?
A man on £130k p.a. can afford to put his hand in his pocket and pay for an upgrade without troubling the public purse. If he was actually bothered, that is.
The latest spin is that he sat on the floor because he wanted to sit with his wife. Who he then proceeded to ignore by tucking in to a copy of Private Eye and the Guardian...
The latest spin is that he sat on the floor because he wanted to sit with his wife. Who he then proceeded to ignore by tucking in to a copy of Private Eye and the Guardian...
So the spin is that he made his wife sit on the floor when there were plenty of seats available?
A man on £130k p.a. can afford to put his hand in his pocket and pay for an upgrade without troubling the public purse. If he was actually bothered, that is.
He covered that in the original soundbite. He was showing solidarity with those who can't afford the upgrade.
The latest spin is that he sat on the floor because he wanted to sit with his wife. Who he then proceeded to ignore by tucking in to a copy of Private Eye and the Guardian...
So the spin is that he made his wife sit on the floor when there were plenty of seats available?
A man on £130k p.a. can afford to put his hand in his pocket and pay for an upgrade without troubling the public purse. If he was actually bothered, that is.
Apparently he was even offered a free upgrade and he refused! Evil Private sector bastards. The spin that he didn't want to accept an offer that smacked of 'special treatment' doesn't really hold much water when we hear that another family was offered the upgrade instead!
The latest spin is that he sat on the floor because he wanted to sit with his wife. Who he then proceeded to ignore by tucking in to a copy of Private Eye and the Guardian...
So the spin is that he made his wife sit on the floor when there were plenty of seats available?
A man on £130k p.a. can afford to put his hand in his pocket and pay for an upgrade without troubling the public purse. If he was actually bothered, that is.
He covered that in the original soundbite. He was showing solidarity with those who can't afford the upgrade.
Showing solidarity by taking up space in the vestibule others could have used? The right thing to do would have been to pay for it to get out of the way.
The latest spin is that he sat on the floor because he wanted to sit with his wife. Who he then proceeded to ignore by tucking in to a copy of Private Eye and the Guardian...
So the spin is that he made his wife sit on the floor when there were plenty of seats available?
A man on £130k p.a. can afford to put his hand in his pocket and pay for an upgrade without troubling the public purse. If he was actually bothered, that is.
He covered that in the original soundbite. He was showing solidarity with those who can't afford the upgrade.
Showing solidarity by taking up space in the vestibule others could have used? The right thing to do would have been to pay for it to get out of the way.
Well, that wouldn't get hits on youtube, would it?
The latest spin is that he sat on the floor because he wanted to sit with his wife. Who he then proceeded to ignore by tucking in to a copy of Private Eye and the Guardian...
So the spin is that he made his wife sit on the floor when there were plenty of seats available?
A man on £130k p.a. can afford to put his hand in his pocket and pay for an upgrade without troubling the public purse. If he was actually bothered, that is.
His point was unclear - it wasn't clear whether he didn't want to pay for it (because he is paid using public money) or he didn't want to pay (and thus reclaim the money on expenses)
Given that he was on his way to do Labour Party business IIRC, then surely the Labour Party would be picking up the tab...
The latest spin is that he sat on the floor because he wanted to sit with his wife. Who he then proceeded to ignore by tucking in to a copy of Private Eye and the Guardian...
So the spin is that he made his wife sit on the floor when there were plenty of seats available?
A man on £130k p.a. can afford to put his hand in his pocket and pay for an upgrade without troubling the public purse. If he was actually bothered, that is.
His point was unclear - it wasn't clear whether he didn't want to pay for it (because he is paid using public money) or he didn't want to pay (and thus reclaim the money on expenses)
Given that he was on his way to do Labour Party business IIRC, then surely the Labour Party would be picking up the tab...
There was an amusing exchange between two MPs on twitter with one showering Jeremy with praise for not using expenses to pay for an upgrade, solidarity and all that, and the other replying that he was on Labour party business, so if he'd claimed it on expenses he's break the law, so grow up.
Smith calls Corbyn a lunatic. Corbyn behaves like a lunatic. I try and be reasonable and non-partisan, but enough is enough. Labour think the man who won them three elections is a liability and an epithet.
They are beyond redemption. Incoherent mediocrities with nothing to offer other than harking back to their 70-year old accomplishments. Anti-semites, misogynists and crazies. What a sad end for a great political movement.
The latest spin is that he sat on the floor because he wanted to sit with his wife. Who he then proceeded to ignore by tucking in to a copy of Private Eye and the Guardian...
So the spin is that he made his wife sit on the floor when there were plenty of seats available?
A man on £130k p.a. can afford to put his hand in his pocket and pay for an upgrade without troubling the public purse. If he was actually bothered, that is.
His point was unclear - it wasn't clear whether he didn't want to pay for it (because he is paid using public money) or he didn't want to pay (and thus reclaim the money on expenses)
Given that he was on his way to do Labour Party business IIRC, then surely the Labour Party would be picking up the tab...
Isn't the point that this is political tokenism which will resonate with some, be risible and sneerworthy to others, and be meh to the majority? From a distance, it does seem a storm in a teacup.
Smith calls Corbyn a lunatic. Corbyn behaves like a lunatic. I try and be reasonable and non-partisan, but enough is enough. Labour think the man who won them three elections is a liability and an epithet.
They are beyond redemption. Incoherent mediocrities with nothing to offer other than harking back to their 70-year old accomplishments. Anti-semites, misogynists and crazies. What a sad end for a great political movement.
It's not the end. They'll take millions of votes even like this, which provides a platform for recovery even if it will take awhile.
Quite apart from all the blatant lying and deceit involved in this story, one would have thought that there would have been someone around in the Labour leader's team to have the not too demanding nous to have arranged a reserved seat for him and indeed for his entourage. It's the sort of very basic thing, very basic people such as you and I undertake every time we travel long distances on a train. Didn't this occur to anyone?
My own hunch is that they bought open return tickets, and missed the train they had reservations for.
Advance tickets you mean.
No open returns I mean.
Open returns come with reservations? I thought you were kicked off trains if you don't travel on the train you have reservations for?
An open return lets you travel back within one calendar month of your original departure, you can make reservations at the time of the original booking, or by 6pm on the day of your return.
Even if you miss your reservation, you're still allowed to travel back on a later (or earlier) train, within one calendar month of your original departure.
Bloody hell! No need to OUT-SAD me, man!
I only ever reserved seats when buying advance tickets online. Last year a couple of times I was able to travel from Euston to Coventry for only £9 one-way on Virgin.
I'm someone who buys an open (first class) return at least once a month for work, because I don't know how long I'll be in London for.
Well la-di-bloody-da
Worse part of my week is when I have to catch the Manchester to Dore train on the Northern Service or the East Midlands Trains service, they have no first class section. THE HORROR, THE HORROR.
Thank Allah for Trans Pennine Express.
If you asked me, if I had to choose between going on a train without a first class section or go to Guantanamo Bay, I'd probably choose the latter
First Class = Snob Class Business = Spiv Class (planes only) Economy/Standard = Steerage
I have been to Chester, Manchester Piccadilly, Stockport, Sheffield, Worksop and Lincoln, so my next few priorities will be to do Chester to Stockport, Manchester/Stockport to Sheffield, Sheffield to Lincoln via Worksop.
Skip Kings Cross to Newcastle though. You cannot get a seat.
Quite apart from all the blatant lying and deceit involved in this story, one would have thought that there would have been someone around in the Labour leader's team to have the not too demanding nous to have arranged a reserved seat for him and indeed for his entourage. It's the sort of very basic thing, very basic people such as you and I undertake every time we travel long distances on a train. Didn't this occur to anyone?
My own hunch is that they bought open return tickets, and missed the train they had reservations for.
Advance tickets you mean.
No open returns I mean.
Open returns come with reservations? I thought you were kicked off trains if you don't travel on the train you have reservations for?
An open return lets you travel back within one calendar month of your original departure, you can make reservations at the time of the original booking, or by 6pm on the day of your return.
Even if you miss your reservation, you're still allowed to travel back on a later (or earlier) train, within one calendar month of your original departure.
Bloody hell! No need to OUT-SAD me, man!
I'm someone who buys an open (first class) return at least once a month for work, because I don't know how long I'll be in London for.
Well la-di-bloody-da
Worse part of my week is when I have to catch the Manchester to Dore train on the Northern Service or the East Midlands Trains service, they have no first class section. THE HORROR, THE HORROR.
Thank Allah for Trans Pennine Express.
If you asked me, if I had to choose between going on a train without a first class section or go to Guantanamo Bay, I'd probably choose the latter
First Class = Snob Class Business = Spiv Class (planes only) Economy/Standard = Steerage
I have been to Chester, Manchester Piccadilly, Stockport, Sheffield, Worksop and Lincoln, so my next few priorities will be to do Chester to Stockport, Manchester/Stockport to Sheffield, Sheffield to Lincoln via Worksop.
Skip Kings Cross to Newcastle though. You cannot get a seat.
Or can you? Dun dun dun. Stay tuned for next week's thrilling installment.
Quite apart from all the blatant lying and deceit involved in this story, one would have thought that there would have been someone around in the Labour leader's team to have the not too dy basic people such as you and I undertake every time we travel long distances on a train. Didn't this occur to anyone?
My own hunch is that they bought open return tickets, and missed the train they had reservations for.
Advance tickets you mean.
No open returns I mean.
Open returns come with reservations? I thought you were kicked off trains if you don't travel on the train you have reservations for?
An open return lets you travel back within one calendar month of your original departure, you can make reservations at the time of the original booking, or by 6pm on the day of your return.
Even if you miss your reservation, you're still allowed to travel back on a later (or earlier) train, within one calendar month of your original departure.
Bloody hell! No need to OUT-SAD me, man!
I only ever reserved seats when buying advance tickets online. Last year a couple of times I was able to travel from Euston to Coventry for only £9 one-way on Virgin.
I'm someone who buys an open (first class) return at least once a month for work, because I don't know how long I'll be in London for.
Well la-di-bloody-da
Worse part of my week is when I have to catch the Manchester to Dore train on the Northern Service or the East Midlands Trains service, they have no first class section. THE HORROR, THE HORROR.
Thank Allah for Trans Pennine Express.
If you asked me, if I had to choose between going on a train without a first class section or go to Guantanamo Bay, I'd probably choose the latter
First Class = Snob Class Business = Spiv Class (planes only) Economy/Standard = Steerage
I have been to Chester, Manchester Piccadilly, Stockport, Sheffield, Worksop and Lincoln, so my next few priorities will be to do Chester to Stockport, Manchester/Stockport to Sheffield, Sheffield to Lincoln via Worksop.
Skip Kings Cross to Newcastle though. You cannot get a seat.
Too late - I did King's Cross to Leeds in 2010, and Doncaster to Leuchars in 2012
I took a train laughably called "the Acropolis Express" from Venice to Athens in 1983 while interrailing.
We were alright until we got to the Yugoslavian border, where we had to change carriage as our one was going to Bulgaria. The Greek carriages were ram packed so we had to stand in the corridor. The train became filled with Yugoslav conscripts on leave for the weekend, and clearly had spent their soap money on beer. We had misread the timetable and realised at midnight that the train took 36 hours rather than 12 to reach its destination. We had no food and no Yugoslav money, so stood in the corridor with heads out the window smoking and feeling a light spray of mist from the toilets up the train. The Guard kicked anyone awake who lay down in the corridor and tried to sleep. We finally got seats at Thessalonika after 24 hours of standing.
It was all much more enjoyable knowing that we were travelling on a nationalised railway in a Communist country, and despite it all managed to pull some Dutch students. Happy days!
Anywho, I'm a Trident supporter, who in last year's leadership contest didn't vote for Corbyn (or even give him second preference come to that).
I just cast my vote for Corbyn this time.
Is this because you have been persuaded by the Corbyn leadership style and policies or because Smith is too bad to vote for?
A few reasons...
1. Although I generally haven't disagreed with anything Smith has said in the contest, I'm not sure I trust that he (or, probably more to the point, the MPs who'll be surrounding him) will stick to everything he's said. I'm happy to compromise on quite a few issues, and on some issues I actively agree with the Labour 'moderates' much more than I do with Corbyn (e.g. Trident, Israel) but things like welfare are a red line for me (i.e. no abstaining on welfare cuts ever again).
2. I genuinely now think that the Labour 'establishment' don't actually have a clue how to appeal to the public any more than Corbyn does. Corbyn ain't going to win the election, but I do genuinely think there's more chance that he would limit the damage than a 'moderate' MP would - as a comparison between Labour's unspectacular-but-OK results in the May local elections, compared to the complete disaster of the Remain campaign, shows.
3. A smaller point, but the MPs have generally acted appallingly in the past few months, and a Smith victory would essentially be rewarding them for bad behaviour (and, more to the point, would encourage them to keep throwing tantrums and destabilising the party whenever something they don't like happens, since they'd remember they got what they wanted the last time they tried it).
As someone who actually held the record for travelling the most miles in a year on BR in the early 80s I have little sympathy for JC. "Everyone" knows you check the seat reservation labels to see if a seat will be occupied for all or part of your proposed journey and then you sit in it until asked to move!
I once had to sit on the corridor floor of an overnight sleeper train between Birmingham and Carlisle when all the seating was taken but did I moan about it? Well actually I did because when I woke up to see where I was I realised the train was passing Morecambe Bay when I only had a ticket to Preston! I was allowed to return on the first train south before you ask but I expect on today's railways that courtesy might not apply.
Anywho, I'm a Trident supporter, who in last year's leadership contest didn't vote for Corbyn (or even give him second preference come to that).
I just cast my vote for Corbyn this time.
Is this because you have been persuaded by the Corbyn leadership style and policies or because Smith is too bad to vote for?
A few reasons...
1. Although I generally haven't disagreed with anything Smith has said in the contest, I'm not sure I trust that he (or, probably more to the point, the MPs who'll be surrounding him) will stick to everything he's said. I'm happy to compromise on quite a few issues, and on some issues I actively agree with the Labour 'moderates' much more than I do with Corbyn (e.g. Trident, Israel) but things like welfare are a red line for me (i.e. no abstaining on welfare cuts ever again).
2. I genuinely now think that the Labour 'establishment' don't actually have a clue how to appeal to the public any more than Corbyn does. Corbyn ain't going to win the election, but I do genuinely think there's more chance that he would limit the damage than a 'moderate' MP would - as a comparison between Labour's unspectacular-but-OK results in the May local elections, compared to the complete disaster of the Remain campaign, shows.
3. A smaller point, but the MPs have generally acted appallingly in the past few months, and a Smith victory would essentially be rewarding them for bad behaviour (and, more to the point, would encourage them to keep throwing tantrums and destabilising the party whenever something they don't like happens, since they'd remember they got what they wanted the last time they tried it).
Corbyn hasn't a clue how to reach beyond his core. Not only that. He doesn't want to. He only appears popular because he is super serving his cheerleaders.
He is a dead end for Labour. You have made a mistake.
More than half the people outside the government who met with Hillary Clinton while she was secretary of state gave money — either personally or through companies or groups — to the Clinton Foundation. It's an extraordinary proportion indicating her possible ethics challenges if elected president.
At least 85 of 154 people from private interests who met or had phone conversations scheduled with Clinton while she led the State Department donated to her family charity or pledged commitments to its international programs, according to a review of State Department calendars released so far to The Associated Press. Combined, the 85 donors contributed as much as $156 million. At least 40 donated more than $100,000 each, and 20 gave more than $1 million.
With the Olympics ending, I wondered where my entertainment might come from....I forgot that Corbyn media management normally results in a f##k up a day.
Anywho, I'm a Trident supporter, who in last year's leadership contest didn't vote for Corbyn (or even give him second preference come to that).
I just cast my vote for Corbyn this time.
Is this because you have been persuaded by the Corbyn leadership style and policies or because Smith is too bad to vote for?
A few reasons...
1. Although I generally haven't disagreed with anything Smith has said in the contest, I'm not sure I trust that he (or, probably more to the point, the MPs who'll be surrounding him) will stick to everything he's said. I'm happy to compromise on quite a few issues, and on some issues I actively agree with the Labour 'moderates' much more than I do with Corbyn (e.g. Trident, Israel) but things like welfare are a red line for me (i.e. no abstaining on welfare cuts ever again).
2. I genuinely now think that the Labour 'establishment' don't actually have a clue how to appeal to the public any more than Corbyn does. Corbyn ain't going to win the election, but I do genuinely think there's more chance that he would limit the damage than a 'moderate' MP would - as a comparison between Labour's unspectacular-but-OK results in the May local elections, compared to the complete disaster of the Remain campaign, shows.
3. A smaller point, but the MPs have generally acted appallingly in the past few months, and a Smith victory would essentially be rewarding them for bad behaviour (and, more to the point, would encourage them to keep throwing tantrums and destabilising the party whenever something they don't like happens, since they'd remember they got what they wanted the last time they tried it).
Remain won 48% in June, Labour won 31% in May. You also confirm Labour lack the killer instinct, Tory MPs toppled IDS after 2 years, while it seems Labour MPs are unable to get anywhere near killing off Corbyn
Anywho, I'm a Trident supporter, who in last year's leadership contest didn't vote for Corbyn (or even give him second preference come to that).
I just cast my vote for Corbyn this time.
Is this because you have been persuaded by the Corbyn leadership style and policies or because Smith is too bad to vote for?
A few reasons...
1. Although I generally haven't disagreed with anything Smith has said in the contest, I'm not sure I trust that he (or, probably more to the point, the MPs who'll be surrounding him) will stick to everything he's said. I'm happy to compromise on quite a few issues, and on some issues I actively agree with the Labour 'moderates' much more than I do with Corbyn (e.g. Trident, Israel) but things like welfare are a red line for me (i.e. no abstaining on welfare cuts ever again).
2. I genuinely now think that the Labour 'establishment' don't actually have a clue how to appeal to the public any more than Corbyn does. Corbyn ain't going to win the election, but I do genuinely think there's more chance that he would limit the damage than a 'moderate' MP would - as a comparison between Labour's unspectacular-but-OK results in the May local elections, compared to the complete disaster of the Remain campaign, shows.
3. A smaller point, but the MPs have generally acted appallingly in the past few months, and a Smith victory would essentially be rewarding them for bad behaviour (and, more to the point, would encourage them to keep throwing tantrums and destabilising the party whenever something they don't like happens, since they'd remember they got what they wanted the last time they tried it).
Pretty much agreed on all three points. I don't think the train story will damage him either - like the collar button thing, it's an example of how the media go bonkers over trivia if they think someone is vulnerable.
But the more fundamental point, implicit in your number 2, is that we really badly need a new social democrat narrative. At present, it's basically "We aren't the Tories or Corbyn". It's not enough. It hasn't been enough since around 2008. And it's a problem not only affecting British social democrats but similarly-inclined people in Germany, France, Italy and in some ways (if you accept the Clintons as American social democrats, which they sort of are) the US.
Anywho, I'm a Trident supporter, who in last year's leadership contest didn't vote for Corbyn (or even give him second preference come to that).
I just cast my vote for Corbyn this time.
Is this because you have been persuaded by the Corbyn leadership style and policies or because Smith is too bad to vote for?
A few reasons...
1. Although I generally haven't disagreed with anything Smith has said in the contest, I'm not sure I trust that he (or, probably more to the point, the MPs who'll be surrounding him) will stick to everything he's said. I'm happy to compromise on quite a few issues, and on some issues I actively agree with the Labour 'moderates' much more than I do with Corbyn (e.g. Trident, Israel) but things like welfare are a red line for me (i.e. no abstaining on welfare cuts ever again).
2. I genuinely now think that the Labour 'establishment' don't actually have a clue how to appeal to the public any more than Corbyn does. Corbyn ain't going to win the election, but I do genuinely think there's more chance that he would limit the damage than a 'moderate' MP would - as a comparison between Labour's unspectacular-but-OK results in the May local elections, compared to the complete disaster of the Remain campaign, shows.
3. A smaller point, but the MPs have generally acted appallingly in the past few months, and a Smith victory would essentially be rewarding them for bad behaviour (and, more to the point, would encourage them to keep throwing tantrums and destabilising the party whenever something they don't like happens, since they'd remember they got what they wanted the last time they tried it).
Remain won 48% in June, Labour won 31% in May
On the other hand, Remain came second, while Labour came (narrowly) first in May. And in particular they did much better in currently Labour-held seats than Remain did.
Anywho, I'm a Trident supporter, who in last year's leadership contest didn't vote for Corbyn (or even give him second preference come to that).
I just cast my vote for Corbyn this time.
Is this because you have been persuaded by the Corbyn leadership style and policies or because Smith is too bad to vote for?
A few reasons...
1. Although I generally haven't disagreed with anything Smith has said in the contest, I'm not sure I trust that he (or, probably more to the point, the MPs who'll be surrounding him) will stick to everything he's said. I'm happy to compromise on quite a few issues, and on some issues I actively agree with the Labour 'moderates' much more than I do with Corbyn (e.g. Trident, Israel) but things like welfare are a red line for me (i.e. no abstaining on welfare cuts ever again).
2. I genuinely now think that the Labour 'establishment' don't actually have a clue how to appeal to the public any more than Corbyn does. Corbyn ain't going to win the election, but I do genuinely think there's more chance that he would limit the damage than a 'moderate' MP would - as a comparison between Labour's unspectacular-but-OK results in the May local elections, compared to the complete disaster of the Remain campaign, shows.
3. A smaller point, but the MPs have generally acted appallingly in the past few months, and a Smith victory would essentially be rewarding them for bad behaviour (and, more to the point, would encourage them to keep throwing tantrums and destabilising the party whenever something they don't like happens, since they'd remember they got what they wanted the last time they tried it).
Remain won 48% in June, Labour won 31% in May
On the other hand, Remain came second, while Labour came (narrowly) first in May. And in particular they did much better in currently Labour-held seats than Remain did.
Labour had one of the worst local election performances for an opposition party in years, Corbyn did far worse in voteshare than Ed Miliband, Michael Howard, William Hague etc all of whom hardly stormed to victory at the subsequent general election. Actually Remain did even better than Labour in seats in inner London, Cambridge and many other university cities
Anywho, I'm a Trident supporter, who in last year's leadership contest didn't vote for Corbyn (or even give him second preference come to that).
I just cast my vote for Corbyn this time.
Is this because you have been persuaded by the Corbyn leadership style and policies or because Smith is too bad to vote for?
A few reasons...
1. Although I generally haven't disagreed with anything Smith has said in the contest, I'm not sure I trust that he (or, probably more to the point, the MPs who'll be surrounding him) will stick to everything he's said. I'm happy to compromise on quite a few issues, and on some issues I actively agree with the Labour 'moderates' much more than I do with Corbyn (e.g. Trident, Israel) but things like welfare are a red line for me (i.e. no abstaining on welfare cuts ever again).
2. I genuinely now think that the Labour 'establishment' don't actually have a clue how to appeal to the public any more than Corbyn does. Corbyn ain't going to win the election, but I do genuinely think there's more chance that he would limit the damage than a 'moderate' MP would - as a comparison between Labour's unspectacular-but-OK results in the May local elections, compared to the complete disaster of the Remain campaign, shows.
3. A smaller point, but the MPs have generally acted appallingly in the past few months, and a Smith victory would essentially be rewarding them for bad behaviour (and, more to the point, would encourage them to keep throwing tantrums and destabilising the party whenever something they don't like happens, since they'd remember they got what they wanted the last time they tried it).
Pretty much agreed on all three points. I don't think the train story will damage him either - like the collar button thing, it's an example of how the media go bonkers over trivia if they think someone is vulnerable.
But the more fundamental point, implicit in your number 2, is that we really badly need a new social democrat narrative. At present, it's basically "We aren't the Tories or Corbyn". It's not enough. It hasn't been enough since around 2008. And it's a problem not only affecting British social democrats but similarly-inclined people in Germany, France, Italy and in some ways (if you accept the Clintons as American social democrats, which they sort of are) the US.
That takes hard work and fresh thinking. In both cases Corbyn is not the way.
Oh dear......when the UK Treasury cites them they're overblown claims
"People have got the savvy to see through of some of the overblown claims… We only have to look at the Scottish independence referendum to know that kind of fear-based campaigning starts to insult people’s intelligence and can start to have a negative effect"
But when Nicola recycles them they show the:
“profound and long-lasting impact on the public finances and the wider economic and societal wellbeing of both Scotland and the UK as a whole”.
Anywho, I'm a Trident supporter, who in last year's leadership contest didn't vote for Corbyn (or even give him second preference come to that).
I just cast my vote for Corbyn this time.
Is this because you have been persuaded by the Corbyn leadership style and policies or because Smith is too bad to vote for?
A few reasons...
1. Although I generally haven't disagreed with anything Smith has said in the contest, I'm not sure I trust that he (or, probably more to the point, the MPs who'll be surrounding him) will stick to everything he's said. I'm happy to compromise on quite a few issues, and on some issues I actively agree with the Labour 'moderates' much more than I do with Corbyn (e.g. Trident, Israel) but things like welfare are a red line for me (i.e. no abstaining on welfare cuts ever again).
2. I genuinely now think that the Labour 'establishment' don't actually have a clue how to appeal to the public any more than Corbyn does. Corbyn ain't going to win the election, but I do genuinely think there's more chance that he would limit the damage than a 'moderate' MP would - as a comparison between Labour's unspectacular-but-OK results in the May local elections, compared to the complete disaster of the Remain campaign, shows.
3. A smaller point, but the MPs have generally acted appallingly in the past few months, and a Smith victory would essentially be rewarding them for bad behaviour (and, more to the point, would encourage them to keep throwing tantrums and destabilising the party whenever something they don't like happens, since they'd remember they got what they wanted the last time they tried it).
Pretty much agreed on all three points. I don't think the train story will damage him either - like the collar button thing, it's an example of how the media go bonkers over trivia if they think someone is vulnerable.
But the more fundamental point, implicit in your number 2, is that we really badly need a new social democrat narrative. At present, it's basically "We aren't the Tories or Corbyn". It's not enough. It hasn't been enough since around 2008. And it's a problem not only affecting British social democrats but similarly-inclined people in Germany, France, Italy and in some ways (if you accept the Clintons as American social democrats, which they sort of are) the US.
Though not Canada where a charismatic, moderate social democratic leader last year won a landslide victory, the centre left are also in power in Italy too, again under a charismatic, young social democrat. Corbyn is trying to be Tsipras in a nation without the mass unemployment and without the charisma or telegenic looks
"Mulholland Drive leads the pack in list of 21st century's top films BBC Culture poll of 177 film critics around the world puts David Lynch’s 2001 surrealist masterpiece in top spot"
The one group of people not to listen to when selecting great movies is movie critics. They'll collectively jump on anything different or unique enough, even if it is crap, and call it excellent. They're also even more prone to groupthink than normal people.
Mulholland Drive? Never watched it. Hear it's good from people whose views I trust, though when I see 'surreal' as a descriptor that's usually an indication you're about to see pretentious artsy bollocks.
Has a very good lesbian sex scene in it. Very enjoyable and arty.
I may be shallow.... but you had me at "lesbian sex scene" *g*
Cut Paul Routledge in half and you would read 'Labour' like a stick of Blackpool rock... bloody hell, you lose Paul Routledge, you lose Labour voters, full stop.
"Mulholland Drive leads the pack in list of 21st century's top films BBC Culture poll of 177 film critics around the world puts David Lynch’s 2001 surrealist masterpiece in top spot"
The one group of people not to listen to when selecting great movies is movie critics. They'll collectively jump on anything different or unique enough, even if it is crap, and call it excellent. They're also even more prone to groupthink than normal people.
Mulholland Drive? Never watched it. Hear it's good from people whose views I trust, though when I see 'surreal' as a descriptor that's usually an indication you're about to see pretentious artsy bollocks.
Has a very good lesbian sex scene in it. Very enjoyable and arty.
I may be shallow.... but you had me at "lesbian sex scene" *g*
Cut Paul Routledge in half and you would read 'Labour' like a stick of Blackpool rock... bloody hell, you lose Paul Routledge, you lose Labour voters, full stop.
Anywho, I'm a Trident supporter, who in last year's leadership contest didn't vote for Corbyn (or even give him second preference come to that).
I just cast my vote for Corbyn this time.
Is this because you have been persuaded by the Corbyn leadership style and policies or because Smith is too bad to vote for?
A few reasons...
1. Although I generally haven't disagreed with anything Smith has said in the contest, I'm not sure I trust that he (or, probably more to the point, the MPs who'll be surrounding him) will stick to everything he's said. I'm happy to compromise on quite a few issues, and on some issues I actively agree with the Labour 'moderates' much more than I do with Corbyn (e.g. Trident, Israel) but things like welfare are a red line for me (i.e. no abstaining on welfare cuts ever again).
2. I genuinely now think that the Labour 'establishment' don't actually have a clue how to appeal to the public any more than Corbyn does. Corbyn ain't going to win the election, but I do genuinely think there's more chance that he would limit the damage than a 'moderate' MP would - as a comparison between Labour's unspectacular-but-OK results in the May local elections, compared to the complete disaster of the Remain campaign, shows.
3. A smaller point, but the MPs have generally acted appallingly in the past few months, and a Smith victory would essentially be rewarding them for bad behaviour (and, more to the point, would encourage them to keep throwing tantrums and destabilising the party whenever something they don't like happens, since they'd remember they got what they wanted the last time they tried it).
Remain won 48% in June, Labour won 31% in May
On the other hand, Remain came second, while Labour came (narrowly) first in May. And in particular they did much better in currently Labour-held seats than Remain did.
Labour had one of the worst local election performances for an opposition party in years, Corbyn did far worse in voteshare than Ed Miliband, Michael Howard, William Hague etc all of whom hardly stormed to victory at the subsequent general election. Actually Remain did even better than Labour in seats in inner London, Cambridge and many other university cities
Actually, Corbyn did better than Miliband or Hague - they both lost to the governing party in their first set of local elections, whereas Corbyn (narrowly) won.
And yes, Remain did do better than Corbyn's Labour in inner London and Cambridge and the like, but Labour don't need to be racking up even bigger majorities in those places.
Cut Paul Routledge in half and you would read 'Labour' like a stick of Blackpool rock... bloody hell, you lose Paul Routledge, you lose Labour voters, full stop.
I'm not talking about the paper, I'm talking about its political editor who is the acme of middle England Labour... his is the heart beat of English Labour.
Anywho, I'm a Trident supporter, who in last year's leadership contest didn't vote for Corbyn (or even give him second preference come to that).
I just cast my vote for Corbyn this time.
Is this because you have been persuaded by the Corbyn leadership style and policies or because Smith is too bad to vote for?
A few reasons...
1. Although I generally haven't disagreed with anything Smith has said in the contest, I'm not sure I trust that he (or, probably more to the point, the MPs who'll be surrounding him) will stick to everything he's said. I'm happy to compromise on quite a few issues, and on some issues I actively agree with the Labour 'moderates' much more than I do with Corbyn (e.g. Trident, Israel) but things like welfare are a red line for me (i.e. no abstaining on welfare cuts ever again).
2. I genuinely now think that the Labour 'establishment' don't actually have a clue how to appeal to the public any more than Corbyn does. Corbyn ain't going to win the election, but I do genuinely think there's more chance that he would limit the damage than a 'moderate' MP would - as a comparison between Labour's unspectacular-but-OK results in the May local elections, compared to the complete disaster of the Remain campaign, shows.
3. A smaller p
Remain won 48% in June, Labour won 31% in May
On the other hand, Remain came second, while Labour came (narrowly) first in May. And in particular they did much better in currently Labour-held seats than Remain did.
Labour had one of the worst local election performances for an opposition party in years, Corbyn did far worse in voteshare than Ed Miliband, Michael Howard, William Hague etc all of whom hardly stormed to victory at the subsequent general election. Actually Remain did even better than Labour in seats in inner London, Cambridge and many other university cities
Actually, Corbyn did better than Miliband or Hague - they both lost to the governing party in their first set of local elections, whereas Corbyn (narrowly) won.
And yes, Remain did do better than Corbyn's Labour in inner London and Cambridge and the like, but Labour don't need to be racking up even bigger majorities in those places.
Ed Miliband won 37% in 2011, Michael Howard got 37% in 2004, even IDS won 34% in 2002 and came top, all did better than Corbyn in voteshare, Hague did not do that well in 1998 but most of the local elections then were in London which leans Labour. Given Corbyn's pro immigration line he is hardly going to win back the white working class from UKIP either
Cut Paul Routledge in half and you would read 'Labour' like a stick of Blackpool rock... bloody hell, you lose Paul Routledge, you lose Labour voters, full stop.
I'm not talking about the paper, I'm talking about its political editor who is the acme of middle England Labour... his is the heart beat of English Labour.
'I shall vote for Owen Smith, not because I really expect him to win but to protest against the deification of Jezza C.
Comrade Corbyn is a leaf-dry, talentless Worzel Gummidge who immured himself in a cave of political correctness for decades until he was dragged blinking into the sunshine last summer.
And the light hasn’t been very kind to him. Ever since he failed to mumble the national anthem in St Paul’s, it has been a sorry story of cruel exposure to reality.
His performance at Prime Minister’s Questions – the acid test of political oomph – is an embarrassment. And to call his Euro gig lacklustre is greatly to exaggerate its brightness. I never expected much from the Islington apostle but his leadership fell woefully below expectation.'
Too late - I did King's Cross to Leeds in 2010, and Doncaster to Leuchars in 2012
Sunil, have you done the Bunk Line between Cholsey and Wallingford in Oxfordshire? I think it may be within 50 miles of London....
No I haven't though I have spied it from the train towards Didcot, branching away to the North. I'm prioritising the National Rail network and trams, but I have done Epping Ongar (I volunteered there 2012-13), Romney, Hythe & Dymchurch, Bluebell, and the Severn Valley. Oh and a very long time ago the Mid Hants, and also Snowdon.
Comments
There will be other countries around the world totally baffled right now as to why this is even an issue. Let alone a national headline grabbing one.
Janan GaneshVerified account
@JananGanesh
You can do analysis of Corbyn and his "movement" (I have done it) but the essence of the whole thing is that they are just thick as pigshit.
Both are better than the purity sects eschewing all but betting, or those monster who claim AV is but a late comer to true PBism.
*Erant is Latin for Train...look it was best I could come up with
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jw-fHLssmsI
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silly_season#Other_names That's just the sort of thing people say when they are fighting their own instinct to join the mass movement. You'll win him over yet.
https://twitter.com/mrmarkmillar/status/768190467859152898
http://www.welt.de/satire/article157797261/Hamster-in-Deutschland-komplett-ausverkauft.html
http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2016-election/trump-faces-hurdle-minority-voters-clinton-maintains-lead-poll-shows-n636061
https://twitter.com/tompeck/status/768200189240807425
You are allowed to think these things - but never utter them in any place that might have recording equipment in it.
Smith has a lot to learn about thinking before speaking.
Sounds like OJ has decided Corbyn is going to win.
Collective bargaining?! Do me a flavour.
Makes you proud to be a Tory....
Talking like this only makes him look unpleasant - some may say desperate...
Business = Spiv Class (planes only)
Economy/Standard = Steerage
I have been to Chester, Manchester Piccadilly, Stockport, Sheffield, Worksop and Lincoln, so my next few priorities will be to do Chester to Stockport, Manchester/Stockport to Sheffield, Sheffield to Lincoln via Worksop.
They don't use this to show people which seats are available, but presumably it wouldn't be very hard.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/aug/23/jeremy-corbyn-virgin-trains-disputes-claim-over-lack-of-seats
The latest spin is that he sat on the floor because he wanted to sit with his wife. Who he then proceeded to ignore by tucking in to a copy of Private Eye and the Guardian...
Very Ron Burgundy
Given that he was on his way to do Labour Party business IIRC, then surely the Labour Party would be picking up the tab...
They are beyond redemption. Incoherent mediocrities with nothing to offer other than harking back to their 70-year old accomplishments. Anti-semites, misogynists and crazies. What a sad end for a great political movement.
Night all.
I just cast my vote for Corbyn this time.
I took a train laughably called "the Acropolis Express" from Venice to Athens in 1983 while interrailing.
We were alright until we got to the Yugoslavian border, where we had to change carriage as our one was going to Bulgaria. The Greek carriages were ram packed so we had to stand in the corridor. The train became filled with Yugoslav conscripts on leave for the weekend, and clearly had spent their soap money on beer. We had misread the timetable and realised at midnight that the train took 36 hours rather than 12 to reach its destination. We had no food and no Yugoslav money, so stood in the corridor with heads out the window smoking and feeling a light spray of mist from the toilets up the train. The Guard kicked anyone awake who lay down in the corridor and tried to sleep. We finally got seats at Thessalonika after 24 hours of standing.
It was all much more enjoyable knowing that we were travelling on a nationalised railway in a Communist country, and despite it all managed to pull some Dutch students. Happy days!
1. Although I generally haven't disagreed with anything Smith has said in the contest, I'm not sure I trust that he (or, probably more to the point, the MPs who'll be surrounding him) will stick to everything he's said. I'm happy to compromise on quite a few issues, and on some issues I actively agree with the Labour 'moderates' much more than I do with Corbyn (e.g. Trident, Israel) but things like welfare are a red line for me (i.e. no abstaining on welfare cuts ever again).
2. I genuinely now think that the Labour 'establishment' don't actually have a clue how to appeal to the public any more than Corbyn does. Corbyn ain't going to win the election, but I do genuinely think there's more chance that he would limit the damage than a 'moderate' MP would - as a comparison between Labour's unspectacular-but-OK results in the May local elections, compared to the complete disaster of the Remain campaign, shows.
3. A smaller point, but the MPs have generally acted appallingly in the past few months, and a Smith victory would essentially be rewarding them for bad behaviour (and, more to the point, would encourage them to keep throwing tantrums and destabilising the party whenever something they don't like happens, since they'd remember they got what they wanted the last time they tried it).
I once had to sit on the corridor floor of an overnight sleeper train between Birmingham and Carlisle when all the seating was taken but did I moan about it? Well actually I did because when I woke up to see where I was I realised the train was passing Morecambe Bay when I only had a ticket to Preston! I was allowed to return on the first train south before you ask but I expect on today's railways that courtesy might not apply.
He is a dead end for Labour. You have made a mistake.
Oh dear.
Trump is going to make hay with this stuff in the debates.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/08/23/belgium-offers-olive-branch-on-brexit-calls-for-north-sea-union/
But the more fundamental point, implicit in your number 2, is that we really badly need a new social democrat narrative. At present, it's basically "We aren't the Tories or Corbyn". It's not enough. It hasn't been enough since around 2008. And it's a problem not only affecting British social democrats but similarly-inclined people in Germany, France, Italy and in some ways (if you accept the Clintons as American social democrats, which they sort of are) the US.
Daily Mail
The Sun
The Telegraph
Daily Mirror
Corbyn’s foolish feat has shown up his own ineptitude, not the profiteering disgrace of Britain’s privatised rail system.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/paul-routledge-jeremy-corbyns-ram-8691428
"People have got the savvy to see through of some of the overblown claims… We only have to look at the Scottish independence referendum to know that kind of fear-based campaigning starts to insult people’s intelligence and can start to have a negative effect"
But when Nicola recycles them they show the:
“profound and long-lasting impact on the public finances and the wider economic and societal wellbeing of both Scotland and the UK as a whole”.
https://whytepaper.wordpress.com/2016/08/23/spinning-squirrels/
Now why would the Scottish Government be trying to distract from the GERS figures published today?
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/jeremy-corbyn-risks-goal-owen-8508466
And yes, Remain did do better than Corbyn's Labour in inner London and Cambridge and the like, but Labour don't need to be racking up even bigger majorities in those places.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/vote-owen-smith-not-scarecrow-8584512
'I shall vote for Owen Smith, not because I really expect him to win but to protest against the deification of Jezza C.
Comrade Corbyn is a leaf-dry, talentless Worzel Gummidge who immured himself in a cave
of political correctness for decades until he was dragged blinking into the sunshine last summer.
And the light hasn’t been very kind to him. Ever since he failed to mumble the national anthem in St Paul’s, it has been a sorry story of cruel exposure to reality.
His performance at Prime Minister’s Questions – the acid test of political oomph – is an embarrassment. And to call his Euro gig lacklustre is greatly to exaggerate its brightness. I never expected much from the Islington apostle but his leadership fell woefully below expectation.'
LOL.
I was watching the interview with Louis Theroux about his research in Scientology. There were a number of similarities to Corbynism.