If I hadn’t been depressed about the country’s future before this thread .......
Things have rarely looked so bad. In peacetime anyway.
Pfft. Let's keep some perspective. One of the wealthiest, most respected countries in the world might become a little bit less wealthy. The End.
Hardly the stuff of Greek tragedy.
Hope you’re right. Trouble is the b*stards like Cameron and Osborne who got us into this mess will come out smelling of roses.
IT’s tas the old song says “It’s the rich wot makes the trouble/It’s the poor wot gets the blame"
I'm not omniscient, so of course I could be wrong. But I'm always interested in unpicking what people are worrying about. Pick a number. Worst case, how much smaller do you think the economy might be in, say, 3 years? Ignoring all the experts, what's your thought? In percent?
One has to try to unpick what people are *really* worried about.
At heart, I think it's the fact that we aren't moving to world without Borders.
If I hadn’t been depressed about the country’s future before this thread .......
Things have rarely looked so bad. In peacetime anyway.
Pfft. Let's keep some perspective. One of the wealthiest, most respected countries in the world might become a little bit less wealthy. The End.
Hardly the stuff of Greek tragedy.
Hope you’re right. Trouble is the b*stards like Cameron and Osborne who got us into this mess will come out smelling of roses.
IT’s tas the old song says “It’s the rich wot makes the trouble/It’s the poor wot gets the blame"
I'm not omniscient, so of course I could be wrong. But I'm always interested in unpicking what people are worrying about. Pick a number. Worst case, how much smaller do you think the economy might be in, say, 3 years? Ignoring all the experts, what's your thought? In percent?
It’s not just the economy. It’s the political situation. I fear we’re going to have some rather unpleasant characters at the top of politics over the next few years.
You are confusing "unpleasant characters" with "people you don't like".
If I hadn’t been depressed about the country’s future before this thread .......
Things have rarely looked so bad. In peacetime anyway.
Pfft. Let's keep some perspective. One of the wealthiest, most respected countries in the world might become a little bit less wealthy. The End.
Hardly the stuff of Greek tragedy.
Hope you’re right. Trouble is the b*stards like Cameron and Osborne who got us into this mess will come out smelling of roses.
IT’s tas the old song says “It’s the rich wot makes the trouble/It’s the poor wot gets the blame"
I'm not omniscient, so of course I could be wrong. But I'm always interested in unpicking what people are worrying about. Pick a number. Worst case, how much smaller do you think the economy might be in, say, 3 years? Ignoring all the experts, what's your thought? In percent?
It’s not just the economy. It’s the political situation. I fear we’re going to have some rather unpleasant characters at the top of politics over the next few years.
You are confusing "unpleasant characters" with "people you don't like".
No, it’s the intolerance which seems to be creeping in.
If I hadn’t been depressed about the country’s future before this thread .......
Things have rarely looked so bad. In peacetime anyway.
Pfft. Let's keep some perspective. One of the wealthiest, most respected countries in the world might become a little bit less wealthy. The End.
Hardly the stuff of Greek tragedy.
Hope you’re right. Trouble is the b*stards like Cameron and Osborne who got us into this mess will come out smelling of roses.
IT’s tas the old song says “It’s the rich wot makes the trouble/It’s the poor wot gets the blame"
I'm not omniscient, so of course I could be wrong. But I'm always interested in unpicking what people are worrying about. Pick a number. Worst case, how much smaller do you think the economy might be in, say, 3 years? Ignoring all the experts, what's your thought? In percent?
It’s not just the economy. It’s the political situation. I fear we’re going to have some rather unpleasant characters at the top of politics over the next few years.
You are confusing "unpleasant characters" with "people you don't like".
No, it’s the intolerance which seems to be creeping in.
I think I can fairly say that my levels of intolerance haven't changed much over the years.
If I hadn’t been depressed about the country’s future before this thread .......
Things have rarely looked so bad. In peacetime anyway.
Pfft. Let's keep some perspective. One of the wealthiest, most respected countries in the world might become a little bit less wealthy. The End.
Hardly the stuff of Greek tragedy.
That's what's so odd. People talk about modest changes in GDP as if they amounted to some form of calamity.
It's even less significant than that. For the most part, they are talking about slowing down of the growth of GDP, rather than recession. People don't normally fear losing what they don't yet have, so something else is at play to produce all these Chicken Littles.
I have to say that the hacks are losing their touch. I haven't once seen the Gramsci quote trotted out:
"The crisis consists precisely in the fact that the old is dying and the new cannot be born; in this interregnum a great variety of morbid symptoms appear."
Grammasci carries a lot of the intellecuual blame for the current situation. His followers have done immense damage to the social fabric of society by categorising people as oppressors or oppressed depending on one aspect of a person such as their race when in fact we are all individuals not herds of people that all think the same way because of our colour or class.
Weirdly, in London, tonight, on a blithe sunny evening full of happy young people, there is absolutely no sense of ANYTHING happening, let alone an epochal crisis.
Primrose Hill was full of chi-chi picnickers, Camden is full of sexy student boozers. Foreigners abound, without being beaten to a pulp
I can't work out whether this is some kind of Phoney War period, when we await our inevitable doom, and the hell of a ten year Depression - or the whole thing has been overdone. We will stay in the single market. Prosperity will continue. We'll get back some sovereignty. But not enough. But it will do.
Hm.
I'm not going to say "crisis what crisis".
But I've never predicted an economic crisis over Brexit, and I don't see one occuring.
Weirdly, in London, tonight, on a blithe sunny evening full of happy young people, there is absolutely no sense of ANYTHING happening, let alone an epochal crisis.
Primrose Hill was full of chi-chi picnickers, Camden is full of sexy student boozers. Foreigners abound, without being beaten to a pulp
I can't work out whether this is some kind of Phoney War period, when we await our inevitable doom, and the hell of a ten year Depression - or the whole thing has been overdone. We will stay in the single market. Prosperity will continue. We'll get back some sovereignty. But not enough. But it will do.
Hm.
I'm not going to say "crisis what crisis".
But I've never predicted an economic crisis over Brexit, and I don't see one occuring.
Yep. Just avoid the local liberal club where they are all hyperventilating into their ethically sourced beer in terror and as they sit wailing in their sustainable wickerwork chairs.
Weirdly, in London, tonight, on a blithe sunny evening full of happy young people, there is absolutely no sense of ANYTHING happening, let alone an epochal crisis.
Primrose Hill was full of chi-chi picnickers, Camden is full of sexy student boozers. Foreigners abound, without being beaten to a pulp
I can't work out whether this is some kind of Phoney War period, when we await our inevitable doom, and the hell of a ten year Depression - or the whole thing has been overdone. We will stay in the single market. Prosperity will continue. We'll get back some sovereignty. But not enough. But it will do.
Hm.
I think it is more London, it will still be effectively 'the capital' of Europe (not Brussels) and a global city whatever happens and of course it voted Remain. Ironically if the country suffers a significant recession it will be provincial industrial and market towns which are hit hardest ie the areas which tended to vote Leave
My biggest fear is that parties coalesce around the sort of differences that the referendum showed. It doesn't do America any favours and to divide society in that way would cause many problems down the line, I feel.
Quite. Mr Thrak, my point is what would happen if a party set out to, throw off the this identity politics rubbish that has so polluted our own political discourse (and was inherited from the USA) and went to work on the things that united the Welsh Valleys, the inner cities the rural shires, the ABC1s and the C2DEs?
I reckon that party would clean up.
Isn't that just Identity politics dressed in a Union Jack?
No, Dr. Sox, it is a thought, a question if you like, about what would happen if a party gave up on identity politics and tried to get elected and then govern for the benefit of all rather than just their self-perceived client groups.
The way I see it is;
The ABC1 kipper-leaning tories and the WWC C2DE kipper-leaning labourites are both fighting for the bit of the pie that they believe the foreigners are currently getting. After 4 years of a May/Leadsome government sharing the spoils of the brexit bonanza - the elderly ABC1 tory/kipper client vote will get most of this extra share of the pie - at the expense of everyone else.
That in itself will cause resentment in the WWC C2DE kipper-leaning labourites, but the big problem is when (as likely) the pie itself shrinks over that time - relative to what it would have been if we'd stayed in the EU - and relative to peoples expectations of the pie continuing to expand.
That's the tension which will undermine the kipper/leave electoral coalition going forward.
Mr. Pong, I think you maybe concentrating too much on money and looking at too short a timescale. Have a look at one nation conservatism a la Disraeli. That wasn't a sort of Labour-lite as we understand to today, but the forging of interests between the newly enfranchised "oiks" and those that had the dosh already.
If you are interested in this set of ideas then you might like to listen to David Starkey in 2011
If I hadn’t been depressed about the country’s future before this thread .......
Things have rarely looked so bad. In peacetime anyway.
Pfft. Let's keep some perspective. One of the wealthiest, most respected countries in the world might become a little bit less wealthy. The End.
Hardly the stuff of Greek tragedy.
Hope you’re right. Trouble is the b*stards like Cameron and Osborne who got us into this mess will come out smelling of roses.
IT’s tas the old song says “It’s the rich wot makes the trouble/It’s the poor wot gets the blame"
I'm not omniscient, so of course I could be wrong. But I'm always interested in unpicking what people are worrying about. Pick a number. Worst case, how much smaller do you think the economy might be in, say, 3 years? Ignoring all the experts, what's your thought? In percent?
It’s not just the economy. It’s the political situation. I fear we’re going to have some rather unpleasant characters at the top of politics over the next few years.
You are confusing "unpleasant characters" with "people you don't like".
No, it’s the intolerance which seems to be creeping in.
I've seen a lot of intolerance lately, I agree.
It's primarily coming from those who can't comprehend how the nation is stupid and/or racist enough to vote leave and refuses to tolerate that there could be sane and positive reasons we did so.
It's a fucking beautiful evening here in London. One of those perfect, dulcet summer twilights, which goes on for ever.......
We will survive.
Admit it, you've had a little drink
Half a bottle of Oddero Barolo, 2011, and one very large Plymouth gin and Fevertree tonic.
My mood may be elevated by the news that today I abruptly made $50,000, on an unexpected US deal (which is of course worth $7,500 more than it was three weeks ago, heh).
But it ain't just that. I don't detect GLOOM. It doesn't feel like impending recession, let alone impending Depression. But I am in a London bubble, perhaps.....
If I hadn’t been depressed about the country’s future before this thread .......
Things have rarely looked so bad. In peacetime anyway.
Pfft. Let's keep some perspective. One of the wealthiest, most respected countries in the world might become a little bit less wealthy. The End.
Hardly the stuff of Greek tragedy.
Hope you’re right. Trouble is the b*stards like Cameron and Osborne who got us into this mess will come out smelling of roses.
IT’s tas the old song says “It’s the rich wot makes the trouble/It’s the poor wot gets the blame"
I'm not omniscient, so of course I could be wrong. But I'm always interested in unpicking what people are worrying about. Pick a number. Worst case, how much smaller do you think the economy might be in, say, 3 years? Ignoring all the experts, what's your thought? In percent?
It’s not just the economy. It’s the political situation. I fear we’re going to have some rather unpleasant characters at the top of politics over the next few years.
You are confusing "unpleasant characters" with "people you don't like".
No, it’s the intolerance which seems to be creeping in.
Creeping in where, Mr. Cole? Have you actually noticed any more intolerance or is your opinion formed from what you are reading?
I confess the worst I have heard is from a taxi driver in Weymouth the weekend before last who expressed the view that he hoped the UK's fishing industry would pick up, "after we get our waters back".
If I hadn’t been depressed about the country’s future before this thread .......
Things have rarely looked so bad. In peacetime anyway.
Pfft. Let's keep some perspective. One of the wealthiest, most respected countries in the world might become a little bit less wealthy. The End.
Hardly the stuff of Greek tragedy.
Hope you’re right. Trouble is the b*stards like Cameron and Osborne who got us into this mess will come out smelling of roses.
IT’s tas the old song says “It’s the rich wot makes the trouble/It’s the poor wot gets the blame"
I'm not omniscient, so of course I could be wrong. But I'm always interested in unpicking what people are worrying about. Pick a number. Worst case, how much smaller do you think the economy might be in, say, 3 years? Ignoring all the experts, what's your thought? In percent?
It’s not just the economy. It’s the political situation. I fear we’re going to have some rather unpleasant characters at the top of politics over the next few years.
You are confusing "unpleasant characters" with "people you don't like".
No, it’s the intolerance which seems to be creeping in.
Creeping in where, Mr. Cole? Have you actually noticed any more intolerance or is your opinion formed from what you are reading?
I confess the worst I have heard is from a taxi driver in Weymouth the weekend before last who expressed the view that he hoped the UK's fishing industry would pick up, "after we get our waters back".
The police quote an uptick of 42% in hate crimes (peaking on the 24/25th). So, some tosspots have used EUref as an excuse to vent their unlovely spleen. It's been predominately verbal, but it's still unpleasant.
The news came as it emerged that the Tory party’s membership has swelled in size since David Cameron quit, with 10,000 new members joining in the four days after his resignation.
Thanks for that info Plato, had been expecting to see a large membership bounce after EU Referendum result and Cameron standing down. But these returning/new members won't have a vote in this contest, and I suspect that will benefit Theresa May far more than Leadsom as a result.
Weirdly, in London, tonight, on a blithe sunny evening full of happy young people, there is absolutely no sense of ANYTHING happening, let alone an epochal crisis.
Primrose Hill was full of chi-chi picnickers, Camden is full of sexy student boozers. Foreigners abound, without being beaten to a pulp
I can't work out whether this is some kind of Phoney War period, when we await our inevitable doom, and the hell of a ten year Depression - or the whole thing has been overdone. We will stay in the single market. Prosperity will continue. We'll get back some sovereignty. But not enough. But it will do.
Hm.
Cos a lot of Londoners don't think we're leaving the EU. The rude awakening is yet to come.
European voters reject 'generous' post Brexit deal with UK. Britons believe they should be offered a generous deal by 53% to 29%, the Swedes are opposed 36% to 43%, the Finns 30% to 50%, the Germans 27% to 53% and the French 27% to 53%. Only the Danes and Norwegians favour generous terms for the UK by 51% to 33% and 43% to 30% reflecting their status outside the eurozone and EU. Most EU nations want a free trade deal only with free movement, in the UK by contrast 43% want a free trade deal even without free movement, 32% a free trade deal with free movement and 6% no free trade deal at all.
In most countries questioned a clear majority questioned thought that the UK leaving would be bad for the EU except in France where 35% thought it made no difference and the number thinking it would be good for the EU, 22%, was almost as many as the 28% who thought it would be bad.
If I hadn’t been depressed about the country’s future before this thread .......
Things have rarely looked so bad. In peacetime anyway.
Pfft. Let's keep some perspective. One of the wealthiest, most respected countries in the world might become a little bit less wealthy. The End.
Hardly the stuff of Greek tragedy.
Hope you’re right. Trouble is the b*stards like Cameron and Osborne who got us into this mess will come out smelling of roses.
IT’s tas the old song says “It’s the rich wot makes the trouble/It’s the poor wot gets the blame"
I'm not omniscient, so of course I could be wrong. But I'm always interested in unpicking what people are worrying about. Pick a number. Worst case, how much smaller do you think the economy might be in, say, 3 years? Ignoring all the experts, what's your thought? In percent?
It’s not just the economy. It’s the political situation. I fear we’re going to have some rather unpleasant characters at the top of politics over the next few years.
You are confusing "unpleasant characters" with "people you don't like".
No, it’s the intolerance which seems to be creeping in.
Creeping in where, Mr. Cole? Have you actually noticed any more intolerance or is your opinion formed from what you are reading?
I confess the worst I have heard is from a taxi driver in Weymouth the weekend before last who expressed the view that he hoped the UK's fishing industry would pick up, "after we get our waters back".
The police quote an uptick of 42% in hate crimes (peaking on the 24/25th). So, some tosspots have used EUref as an excuse to vent their unlovely spleen. It's been predominately verbal, but it's still unpleasant.
That is a completely meaningless statistic, Mr. M. I am surprised that you, of all people, should have used it.
If I hadn’t been depressed about the country’s future before this thread .......
Things have rarely looked so bad. In peacetime anyway.
Pfft. Let's keep some perspective. One of the wealthiest, most respected countries in the world might become a little bit less wealthy. The End.
Hardly the stuff of Greek tragedy.
Hope you’re right. Trouble is the b*stards like Cameron and Osborne who got us into this mess will come out smelling of roses.
IT’s tas the old song says “It’s the rich wot makes the trouble/It’s the poor wot gets the blame"
I'm not omniscient, so of course I could be wrong. But I'm always interested in unpicking what people are worrying about. Pick a number. Worst case, how much smaller do you think the economy might be in, say, 3 years? Ignoring all the experts, what's your thought? In percent?
It’s not just the economy. It’s the political situation. I fear we’re going to have some rather unpleasant characters at the top of politics over the next few years.
You are confusing "unpleasant characters" with "people you don't like".
No, it’s the intolerance which seems to be creeping in.
Creeping in where, Mr. Cole? Have you actually noticed any more intolerance or is your opinion formed from what you are reading?
I confess the worst I have heard is from a taxi driver in Weymouth the weekend before last who expressed the view that he hoped the UK's fishing industry would pick up, "after we get our waters back".
The police quote an uptick of 42% in hate crimes (peaking on the 24/25th). So, some tosspots have used EUref as an excuse to vent their unlovely spleen. It's been predominately verbal, but it's still unpleasant.
That is a completely meaningless statistic, Mr. M. I am surprised that you, of all people, should have used it.
I like to acknowledge that life isn't all kittens and rainbows post Brexit. We mustn't be Panglossian. I'm sorry if I've offended your sensibilities .
If I hadn’t been depressed about the country’s future before this thread .......
Things have rarely looked so bad. In peacetime anyway.
Pfft. Let's keep some perspective. One of the wealthiest, most respected countries in the world might become a little bit less wealthy. The End.
Hardly the stuff of Greek tragedy.
That's what's so odd. People talk about modest changes in GDP as if they amounted to some form of calamity.
It's also entirely possible that outside the EU, and freed from some of its constraints, our GDP in time will be LARGER than it might have been inside the superstate.
No one can know. No one can possibly know. It is literally unknowable. It's like predicting the final premiership league table in the season of 2029 on the basis of present footballing trends.
I suppose - thinking of Chilcott - it is unknowable like the threat posed by Saddam's weapons of mass destruction were unknowable or that the invasion was certain to lead to a better Iraq.
Except we did know, once we challenged the assumptions behind those unknowable assertions.
Weirdly, in London, tonight, on a blithe sunny evening full of happy young people, there is absolutely no sense of ANYTHING happening, let alone an epochal crisis.
Primrose Hill was full of chi-chi picnickers, Camden is full of sexy student boozers. Foreigners abound, without being beaten to a pulp
I can't work out whether this is some kind of Phoney War period, when we await our inevitable doom, and the hell of a ten year Depression - or the whole thing has been overdone. We will stay in the single market. Prosperity will continue. We'll get back some sovereignty. But not enough. But it will do.
Hm.
A favourite Rusian proverb comes to mind:
"My house is burning down, I might as well warm my hands"
There is no point in being miserable, the turd is airborne, heading towards the fan, but enjoy the moments before it splatters!
It's a fucking beautiful evening here in London. One of those perfect, dulcet summer twilights, which goes on for ever.......
We will survive.
Admit it, you've had a little drink
Half a bottle of Oddero Barolo, 2011, and one very large Plymouth gin and Fevertree tonic.
My mood may be elevated by the news that today I abruptly made $50,000, on an unexpected US deal (which is of course worth $7,500 more than it was three weeks ago, heh).
But it ain't just that. I don't detect GLOOM. It doesn't feel like impending recession, let alone impending Depression. But I am in a London bubble, perhaps.....
You, sir, are a jammy git!
Nah, his new lady has probably given him a blow job. A couple of days ago Mr. T was posting here that the sky was about to fall in and economic collapse was just around the corner.
Mr T is a treasure of this site, but best not taken too seriously.
European voters reject 'generous' post Brexit deal with UK. Britons believe they should be offered a generous deal by 53% to 29%, the Swedes are opposed 36% to 43%, the Finns 30% to 50%, the Germans 27% to 53% and the French 27% to 53%. Only the Danes and Norwegians favour generous terms for the UK by 51% to 33% and 43% to 30% reflecting their status outside the eurozone and EU. Most EU nations want a free trade deal only with free movement, in the UK by contrast 43% want a free trade deal even without free movement, 32% a free trade deal with free movement and 6% no free trade deal at all.
In most countries questioned a clear majority questioned thought that the UK leaving would be bad for the EU except in France where 35% thought it made no difference and the number thinking it would be good for the EU, 22%, was almost as many as the 28% who thought it would be bad.
Weirdly, in London, tonight, on a blithe sunny evening full of happy young people, there is absolutely no sense of ANYTHING happening, let alone an epochal crisis.
Primrose Hill was full of chi-chi picnickers, Camden is full of sexy student boozers. Foreigners abound, without being beaten to a pulp
I can't work out whether this is some kind of Phoney War period, when we await our inevitable doom, and the hell of a ten year Depression - or the whole thing has been overdone. We will stay in the single market. Prosperity will continue. We'll get back some sovereignty. But not enough. But it will do.
Hm.
A favourite Rusian proverb comes to mind:
"My house is burning down, I might as well warm my hands"
There is no point in being miserable, the turd is airborne, heading towards the fan, but enjoy the moments before it splatters!
A favourite saying to a Russian
'I will absolutely tell Mr Putin he has to abide by international law.'
Thats just nasty - May was unable to have children
That is disgusting - my wife is absolutely furious and shows Leadsom has no class, judgement or sensitive to childless women. She is not fit to lead this Country with those comments
Thats just nasty - May was unable to have children
That is disgusting - my wife is absolutely furious and shows Leadsom has no class, judgement or sensitive to childless women. She is not fit to lead this Country with those comments
Thats just nasty - May was unable to have children
That is disgusting - my wife is absolutely furious and shows Leadsom has no class, judgement or sensitive to childless women. She is not fit to lead this Country with those comments
Is that the effective end to her campaign? After two days? How can anyone be so ineffably stupid?
Thats just nasty - May was unable to have children
That is disgusting - my wife is absolutely furious and shows Leadsom has no class, judgement or sensitive to childless women. She is not fit to lead this Country with those comments
It's appalling.
If she wins how long before 50 MPs march on Graham Brady and call a no confidence vote. Those words tonight have finished her off for me, and I was willing to give her a hearing.
I like to acknowledge that life isn't all kittens and rainbows post Brexit. We mustn't be Panglossian. I'm sorry if I've offended your sensibilities .
I am not sure that at my age I have any sensibilities to offend!
Seriously though, Mr M. what is the value in saying that over a couple of days a type of crime has increased by 42%.
Increased from when? How does that compare with other periods? In what type of locations did this "spike" if such it was occur? What type of volatility in crime in those places and at those times of day week are the statistical norm? And that is before we get into the very serious business of who decides what is a hate crime and on what basis.
So to be honest unless someone can come up with something meaningful then I will take the 42% increase and file it under S, for shit statistic.
If I hadn’t been depressed about the country’s future before this thread .......
Things have rarely looked so bad. In peacetime anyway.
Pfft. Let's keep some perspective. One of the wealthiest, most respected countries in the world might become a little bit less wealthy. The End.
Hardly the stuff of Greek tragedy.
That's what's so odd. People talk about modest changes in GDP as if they amounted to some form of calamity.
It's also entirely possible that outside the EU, and freed from some of its constraints, our GDP in time will be LARGER than it might have been inside the superstate.
No one can know. No one can possibly know. It is literally unknowable. It's like predicting the final premiership league table in the season of 2029 on the basis of present footballing trends.
I suppose - thinking of Chilcott - it is unknowable like the threat posed by Saddam's weapons of mass destruction were unknowable or that the invasion was certain to lead to a better Iraq.
Except we did know, once we challenged the assumptions behind those unknowable assertions.
No, its nonsense. Leaving a fairly stagnant trading bloc - a bloc which has positive and negative implications for the economy - is really not comparable to waging a unilateral war, in an unstable part of the world, with no plan for the aftermath.
It's the difference between a messy divorce and a prolonged vendetta with knives.
There could have been a good outcome for Iraq and Saddam's weapons could have been a threat. Likewise, we could be more successful disconnected from the EU. The point I am making is that there was and is no reason to believe these things to be the case once you get beyond the platitudes and test the assumptions behind them.
European voters reject 'generous' post Brexit deal with UK. Britons believe they should be offered a generous deal by 53% to 29%, the Swedes are opposed 36% to 43%, the Finns 30% to 50%, the Germans 27% to 53% and the French 27% to 53%. Only the Danes and Norwegians favour generous terms for the UK by 51% to 33% and 43% to 30% reflecting their status outside the eurozone and EU. Most EU nations want a free trade deal only with free movement, in the UK by contrast 43% want a free trade deal even without free movement, 32% a free trade deal with free movement and 6% no free trade deal at all.
In most countries questioned a clear majority questioned thought that the UK leaving would be bad for the EU except in France where 35% thought it made no difference and the number thinking it would be good for the EU, 22%, was almost as many as the 28% who thought it would be bad.
European voters reject 'generous' post Brexit deal with UK. Britons believe they should be offered a generous deal by 53% to 29%, the Swedes are opposed 36% to 43%, the Finns 30% to 50%, the Germans 27% to 53% and the French 27% to 53%. Only the Danes and Norwegians favour generous terms for the UK by 51% to 33% and 43% to 30% reflecting their status outside the eurozone and EU. Most EU nations want a free trade deal only with free movement, in the UK by contrast 43% want a free trade deal even without free movement, 32% a free trade deal with free movement and 6% no free trade deal at all.
In most countries questioned a clear majority questioned thought that the UK leaving would be bad for the EU except in France where 35% thought it made no difference and the number thinking it would be good for the EU, 22%, was almost as many as the 28% who thought it would be bad.
< I like to acknowledge that life isn't all kittens and rainbows post Brexit. We mustn't be Panglossian. I'm sorry if I've offended your sensibilities .
I am not sure that at my age I have any sensibilities to offend!
Seriously though, Mr M. what is the value in saying that over a couple of days a type of crime has increased by 42%.
Increased from when? How does that compare with other periods? In what type of locations did this "pike" if such it was occur? What type of volatility in crime in those places and at those times of day week are the statistical norm? And that is before we get into the very serious business of who decides what is a hate crime and on what basis.
So to be honest unless someone can come up with something meaningful then I will take the 42% increase and file it under S, for shit statistic.
Now I'm offended . I always check the baseline my dear sir! 63 reported crimes per week pre EUref, ~90 now. I appreciate that its pretty thin though - I don't have any more detail than that.
My view is that these things are generally under-reported and we're now in a period of heightened sensitivity.
Thats just nasty - May was unable to have children
That is disgusting - my wife is absolutely furious and shows Leadsom has no class, judgement or sensitive to childless women. She is not fit to lead this Country with those comments
She is not fit to be a councillor, never mind run the country
How do we know she was having a go at Theresa May? I can't believe she would be that insensitive.
She explicitly name checks May in the interview.
"Mrs May possibly has nieces, nephews, lots of people, but I have children who will have children who will directly be a part of what happens next".
The front page of the Times looks like a hatchet job, using selective quoting. I'm sure both ladies are used to bad press, but it looks like Leadsom is in for a very tough few weeks.
That is truly awful stuff. It's a sign of the sort of vindictiveness or spite that would make her unsuitable as a PM. I hope she gets absolutely buried in this ballot.
How do we know she was having a go at Theresa May? I can't believe she would be that insensitive.
She explicitly name checks May in the interview.
"Mrs May possibly has nieces, nephews, lots of people, but I have children who will have children who will directly be a part of what happens next".
The front page of the Times looks like a hatchet job, using selective quoting. I'm sure both ladies are used to bad press, but it looks like Leadsom is in for a very tough few weeks.
Don't be retarded, look at the quotes posted down thread. It's no hatchet job.
Unless you're going down the Corbynista route of quoting his own words is a smear
An ally of David Cameron has launched an astonishing attack on Theresa May - claiming she would damage Tory election prospects because she has no children.
How do we know she was having a go at Theresa May? I can't believe she would be that insensitive.
She explicitly name checks May in the interview.
"Mrs May possibly has nieces, nephews, lots of people, but I have children who will have children who will directly be a part of what happens next".
The front page of the Times looks like a hatchet job, using selective quoting. I'm sure both ladies are used to bad press, but it looks like Leadsom is in for a very tough few weeks.
How do we know she was having a go at Theresa May? I can't believe she would be that insensitive.
She explicitly name checks May in the interview.
"Mrs May possibly has nieces, nephews, lots of people, but I have children who will have children who will directly be a part of what happens next".
The front page of the Times looks like a hatchet job, using selective quoting. I'm sure both ladies are used to bad press, but it looks like Leadsom is in for a very tough few weeks.
Leadsom isn't used to any media coverage. Hardly anyone had heard of her before EURef.
How do we know she was having a go at Theresa May? I can't believe she would be that insensitive.
She explicitly name checks May in the interview.
"Mrs May possibly has nieces, nephews, lots of people, but I have children who will have children who will directly be a part of what happens next".
The front page of the Times looks like a hatchet job, using selective quoting. I'm sure both ladies are used to bad press, but it looks like Leadsom is in for a very tough few weeks.
Whoever selected that photo did not have her best interests at heart, either.
An ally of David Cameron has launched an astonishing attack on Theresa May - claiming she would damage Tory election prospects because she has no children.
That is truly awful stuff. It's a sign of the sort of vindictiveness or spite that would make her unsuitable as a PM. I hope she gets absolutely buried in this ballot.
Leadsom says May must be 'very sad' not to have children, I don't really see it as an explicit criticism, if a little stupid but more a focus on Leadsom's position as a mother.
How do we know she was having a go at Theresa May? I can't believe she would be that insensitive.
She explicitly name checks May in the interview.
"Mrs May possibly has nieces, nephews, lots of people, but I have children who will have children who will directly be a part of what happens next".
The front page of the Times looks like a hatchet job, using selective quoting. I'm sure both ladies are used to bad press, but it looks like Leadsom is in for a very tough few weeks.
Leadsom isn't used to any media coverage. Hardly anyone had heard of her before EURef.
She'll have experienced standard anti-Tory articles as a MP I'm sure. But she seems to have been marked for some special treatment for the duration of this contest.
The Times used to be a proper newspaper.Just a nasty propaganda rag these days that will do anything to push its agenda. Wouldn't trust this story at all.
That is truly awful stuff. It's a sign of the sort of vindictiveness or spite that would make her unsuitable as a PM. I hope she gets absolutely buried in this ballot.
That looks extrement selective quoting by the Times, where does Leadsom ever criticise May for not having children, she said
Theresa May possibly has nieces, nephews, lots of people but I have children
Leadsom can't possibly have said that, can she? Who could have told her it would be a good idea? Just doesn't seem possible!
Occam's razor and all, but I can't imagine she's genuinely stupid on top of everything else.
The TV coverage I've seen as had a pretty clear pro-May/anti-Leadsom slant. I'm surprised all the press has gone May though. I had assumed they'd keep the Remain/Leave biases of the referendum.
That is truly awful stuff. It's a sign of the sort of vindictiveness or spite that would make her unsuitable as a PM. I hope she gets absolutely buried in this ballot.
That looks extrement selective quoting by the Times, where does Leadsom ever criticise May for not having children, she said
Theresa May possibly has nieces, nephews, lots of people but I have children
Comments
At heart, I think it's the fact that we aren't moving to world without Borders.
But I've never predicted an economic crisis over Brexit, and I don't see one occuring.
It's primarily coming from those who can't comprehend how the nation is stupid and/or racist enough to vote leave and refuses to tolerate that there could be sane and positive reasons we did so.
I confess the worst I have heard is from a taxi driver in Weymouth the weekend before last who expressed the view that he hoped the UK's fishing industry would pick up, "after we get our waters back".
Now the shortest priced-woman, in to 25 from 300...
In most countries questioned a clear majority questioned thought that the UK leaving would be bad for the EU except in France where 35% thought it made no difference and the number thinking it would be good for the EU, 22%, was almost as many as the 28% who thought it would be bad.
Most countries concerned would voted to Remain in the EU by a clear margin in any referendum, though in France Remain led by a relatively narrow 44% to 33% margin. The Norwegians though would vote to stay out by 70% to 14%
https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/rm136y08iq/Eurotrack_June_Results_WebsiteV1.pdf
Except we did know, once we challenged the assumptions behind those unknowable assertions.
"My house is burning down, I might as well warm my hands"
There is no point in being miserable, the turd is airborne, heading towards the fan, but enjoy the moments before it splatters!
Being a mother gives me edge on May — Leadsom
#tomorrowspaperstoday #bbcpapers https://t.co/w0ZW0b1jow
Mr T is a treasure of this site, but best not taken too seriously.
'I will absolutely tell Mr Putin he has to abide by international law.'
I'm not easily shocked but I am a bit shocked at that
Not any more - unfit for Office
"Mrs May possibly has nieces, nephews, lots of people, but I have children who will have children who will directly be a part of what happens next".
Seriously though, Mr M. what is the value in saying that over a couple of days a type of crime has increased by 42%.
Increased from when? How does that compare with other periods? In what type of locations did this "spike" if such it was occur? What type of volatility in crime in those places and at those times of day week are the statistical norm? And that is before we get into the very serious business of who decides what is a hate crime and on what basis.
So to be honest unless someone can come up with something meaningful then I will take the 42% increase and file it under S, for shit statistic.
What is it about family values Christian Conservatives and their libidos?
My view is that these things are generally under-reported and we're now in a period of heightened sensitivity.
Oh, and the second piece has a pun that even TSE would be proud of.
https://twitter.com/suttonnick/status/751519641864904706/photo/1
There is no way back - just apologise and GO
Unless you're going down the Corbynista route of quoting his own words is a smear
An ally of David Cameron has launched an astonishing attack on Theresa May - claiming she would damage Tory election prospects because she has no children.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/torys-astonishing-attack-theresa-may-3973626
Yvette Cooper was also accused of making political capital out of Liz Kendall's lack of children during the Labour leadership race.
Occam's razor and all, but I can't imagine she's genuinely stupid on top of everything else.
Just sayin'....
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/3265219.stm
That is why its founder broke bread with tax collectors and prostitutes and told the pharisees and goodly to shove off - and why they killed him.
She has to go before the weekend is out