Leave need to hit hard on the immigration message for the final push.
Osborne mustn't be allowed to create the narrative on economics for the final stretch. Totally ignore him if need be and keep bringing the discussion back to immigration. A cross-party press conference to kick off campaigning again would be a good idea, with Boris/Stuart/Hoey/Gove fronting it and talking about "taking control" of our borders.
Leave need to hit hard on the immigration message for the final push.
Osborne mustn't be allowed to create the narrative on economics for the final stretch. Totally ignore him if need be and keep bringing the discussion back to immigration. A cross-party press conference to kick off campaigning again would be a good idea, with Boris/Stuart/Hoey/Gove fronting it and talking about "taking control" of our borders.
Hit on it hard.
hopefully with 'that' poster behind them on every occasion
Remain need to address the immigrant issue over the next few days. Of course, they can never reassure the racists, but most people would be reassured by Cameron promising to solve the problems people associate with immigration. 1,000,000 for young people; flats and studios, not executive mansions. Abolish student fees for nurses, real training schemes and real apprenticeships. He'll have to dump Osbourne to do it, but greater love.....
And then young people from around the EU come to Britain for your flats and apprenticeships.
Leave need to hit hard on the immigration message for the final push.
Osborne mustn't be allowed to create the narrative on economics for the final stretch. Totally ignore him if need be and keep bringing the discussion back to immigration. A cross-party press conference to kick off campaigning again would be a good idea, with Boris/Stuart/Hoey/Gove fronting it and talking about "taking control" of our borders.
Hit on it hard.
They have been hitting hard on immigration - a xenophobic and dog-whistling campaign that appeals to many peoples' guts. Very effective but leaves a disgusting taste in the mouth...
"Leaving the EU would make Britain as insignificant as the island of Guernsey, France's economy minister Emmanuel Macron has said.
In an interview with Le Monde, Mr Macron said: "Leaving the EU would mean the 'Guernseyfication' of the UK, which would then be a little country on the world scale. It would isolate itself and become a trading post and arbitration place at Europe's border."
The French minister added that European Council would have to send "a very firm message and timetable" to the UK on the consequences of leaving the EU."
Leave need to hit hard on the immigration message for the final push.
Osborne mustn't be allowed to create the narrative on economics for the final stretch. Totally ignore him if need be and keep bringing the discussion back to immigration. A cross-party press conference to kick off campaigning again would be a good idea, with Boris/Stuart/Hoey/Gove fronting it and talking about "taking control" of our borders.
Hit on it hard.
hopefully with 'that' poster behind them on every occasion
No need. Keep it simple with the TAKE CONTROL background.
Link it to three points: Living standards, uncertainty (Turkey) and Control.
Britain Elects @britainelects 7m7 minutes ago Two #EUref polls tonight: Opinium for the Observer and YouGov for the Times. 4 retweets 10 likes Britain Elects @britainelects 3m3 minutes ago Understand that one of them was likely to have been conducted from Thursday to Friday
I first read that as "Britain Ejects" and thought it was a new LEAVE site.
Remain need to address the immigrant issue over the next few days. Of course, they can never reassure the racists, but most people would be reassured by Cameron promising to solve the problems people associate with immigration. 1,000,000 for young people; flats and studios, not executive mansions. Abolish student fees for nurses, real training schemes and real apprenticeships. He'll have to dump Osbourne to do it, but greater love.....
Leave need to hit hard on the immigration message for the final push.
Osborne mustn't be allowed to create the narrative on economics for the final stretch. Totally ignore him if need be and keep bringing the discussion back to immigration. A cross-party press conference to kick off campaigning again would be a good idea, with Boris/Stuart/Hoey/Gove fronting it and talking about "taking control" of our borders.
Hit on it hard.
They have been hitting hard on immigration - a xenophobic and dig-whistling campaign that appeals to many peoples' guts. Very effective but leaves a disgusting taste in the mouth...
Just say to the British people The French Govt view us as a little island, a Guernsey, they tell us if we dare to vote LEAVE then they will punish us... So go on, meet the challenge, send the French and others the right message and dare to Vote LEAVE.
"Leaving the EU would make Britain as insignificant as the island of Guernsey, France's economy minister Emmanuel Macron has said.
In an interview with Le Monde, Mr Macron said: "Leaving the EU would mean the 'Guernseyfication' of the UK, which would then be a little country on the world scale. It would isolate itself and become a trading post and arbitration place at Europe's border."
The French minister added that European Council would have to send "a very firm message and timetable" to the UK on the consequences of leaving the EU."
What's wrong with being Guernsey - rich, peaceful, low taxes, few social problems, minds its own business, no warmongering.
Then again I imagine that sounds horrible to power mad, meddling politicians.
Remain need to address the immigrant issue over the next few days. Of course, they can never reassure the racists, but most people would be reassured by Cameron promising to solve the problems people associate with immigration. 1,000,000 for young people; flats and studios, not executive mansions. Abolish student fees for nurses, real training schemes and real apprenticeships. He'll have to dump Osbourne to do it, but greater love.....
It doesn't matter what they say now no one believes anything they utter.
Leave need to hit hard on the immigration message for the final push.
Osborne mustn't be allowed to create the narrative on economics for the final stretch. Totally ignore him if need be and keep bringing the discussion back to immigration. A cross-party press conference to kick off campaigning again would be a good idea, with Boris/Stuart/Hoey/Gove fronting it and talking about "taking control" of our borders.
Hit on it hard.
hopefully with 'that' poster behind them on every occasion
No need. Keep it simple with the TAKE CONTROL background.
Link it to three points: Living standards, uncertainty (Turkey) and Control.
There was someone from remain saying that the "take back control" meme was racist, and suggested it led to the anger people like the killer feel. Complete nonsense ofcourse but it won't stop them trying to build this narrative of brexiter= xenophobe.
Remain need to address the immigrant issue over the next few days. Of course, they can never reassure the racists, but most people would be reassured by Cameron promising to solve the problems people associate with immigration. 1,000,000 for young people; flats and studios, not executive mansions. Abolish student fees for nurses, real training schemes and real apprenticeships. He'll have to dump Osbourne to do it, but greater love.....
It doesn't matter what they say now no one believes anything they utter.
Well there are technically a tiny % of the voters that still trust Cameron although over 80% do not. As for Osborne the % is apparently an asterisk with just 2% regarding him as a brilliant natural strategic Leader, although some online responses from his staff and family may have rigged that result...
Leave need to hit hard on the immigration message for the final push.
Osborne mustn't be allowed to create the narrative on economics for the final stretch. Totally ignore him if need be and keep bringing the discussion back to immigration. A cross-party press conference to kick off campaigning again would be a good idea, with Boris/Stuart/Hoey/Gove fronting it and talking about "taking control" of our borders.
Hit on it hard.
hopefully with 'that' poster behind them on every occasion
No need. Keep it simple with the TAKE CONTROL background.
Link it to three points: Living standards, uncertainty (Turkey) and Control.
There was someone from remain saying that the "take back control" meme was racist, and suggested it led to the anger people like the killer feel. Complete nonsense ofcourse but it won't stop them trying to build this narrative of brexiter= xenophobe.
"If you want a vision of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever."
One chance to change that future. Everyone knows it.
Leave need to hit hard on the immigration message for the final push.
Osborne mustn't be allowed to create the narrative on economics for the final stretch. Totally ignore him if need be and keep bringing the discussion back to immigration. A cross-party press conference to kick off campaigning again would be a good idea, with Boris/Stuart/Hoey/Gove fronting it and talking about "taking control" of our borders.
Hit on it hard.
hopefully with 'that' poster behind them on every occasion
No need. Keep it simple with the TAKE CONTROL background.
Link it to three points: Living standards, uncertainty (Turkey) and Control.
There was someone from remain saying that the "take back control" meme was racist, and suggested it led to the anger people like the killer feel. Complete nonsense ofcourse but it won't stop them trying to build this narrative of brexiter= xenophobe.
Oh I do hope they keep going with that line. It has done them absolutely no good so far. They're simply preaching to the converted. Why is the Remain campaign so off point? I really don't understand it.
Remain need to address the immigrant issue over the next few days. Of course, they can never reassure the racists, but most people would be reassured by Cameron promising to solve the problems people associate with immigration. 1,000,000 for young people; flats and studios, not executive mansions. Abolish student fees for nurses, real training schemes and real apprenticeships. He'll have to dump Osbourne to do it, but greater love.....
And then young people from around the EU come to Britain for your flats and apprenticeships.
Don't be an idiot. Public housing involves local authority waiting lists; of course some immigrants might benefit, but only if they had lived here and paid taxes for an average of 8-10 years.
Leave need to hit hard on the immigration message for the final push.
Osborne mustn't be allowed to create the narrative on economics for the final stretch. Totally ignore him if need be and keep bringing the discussion back to immigration. A cross-party press conference to kick off campaigning again would be a good idea, with Boris/Stuart/Hoey/Gove fronting it and talking about "taking control" of our borders.
Hit on it hard.
They have been hitting hard on immigration - a xenophobic and dog-whistling campaign that appeals to many peoples' guts. Very effective but leaves a disgusting taste in the mouth...
Leave's scaremongering about Turkey has been untruthful and dishonest.
Remain need to address the immigrant issue over the next few days. Of course, they can never reassure the racists, but most people would be reassured by Cameron promising to solve the problems people associate with immigration. 1,000,000 for young people; flats and studios, not executive mansions. Abolish student fees for nurses, real training schemes and real apprenticeships. He'll have to dump Osbourne to do it, but greater love.....
It doesn't matter what they say now no one believes anything they utter.
Well there are technically a tiny % of the voters that still trust Cameron although over 80% do not. As for Osborne the % is apparently an asterisk with just 2% regarding him as a brilliant natural strategic Leader, although some online responses from his staff and family may have rigged that result...
The osbo result is definitely rigged, no way is he that popular. I wonder if the punishment budget, was a shit or bust move from Osbourne. In the manner of an FA cup match when you are two nil down with two minutes to go. So you throw everyone forward, doesn't matter if you concede another, you are fucked anyway.
Remain need to address the immigrant issue over the next few days. Of course, they can never reassure the racists, but most people would be reassured by Cameron promising to solve the problems people associate with immigration. 1,000,000 for young people; flats and studios, not executive mansions. Abolish student fees for nurses, real training schemes and real apprenticeships. He'll have to dump Osbourne to do it, but greater love.....
And then young people from around the EU come to Britain for your flats and apprenticeships.
Don't be an idiot. Public housing involves local authority waiting lists; of course some immigrants might benefit, but only if they had lived here and paid taxes for an average of 8-10 years.
Dear lord.
People are getting hundreds a week off the state to live in London at taxpayer expense providing they work 16 hours a week.
Leave need to hit hard on the immigration message for the final push.
Osborne mustn't be allowed to create the narrative on economics for the final stretch. Totally ignore him if need be and keep bringing the discussion back to immigration. A cross-party press conference to kick off campaigning again would be a good idea, with Boris/Stuart/Hoey/Gove fronting it and talking about "taking control" of our borders.
Hit on it hard.
hopefully with 'that' poster behind them on every occasion
No need. Keep it simple with the TAKE CONTROL background.
Link it to three points: Living standards, uncertainty (Turkey) and Control.
There was someone from remain saying that the "take back control" meme was racist, and suggested it led to the anger people like the killer feel. Complete nonsense ofcourse but it won't stop them trying to build this narrative of brexiter= xenophobe.
Oh I do hope they keep going with that line. It has done them absolutely no good so far. They're simply preaching to the converted. Why is the Remain campaign so off point? I really don't understand it.
Remain need to address the immigrant issue over the next few days. Of course, they can never reassure the racists, but most people would be reassured by Cameron promising to solve the problems people associate with immigration. 1,000,000 for young people; flats and studios, not executive mansions. Abolish student fees for nurses, real training schemes and real apprenticeships. He'll have to dump Osbourne to do it, but greater love.....
This could be the basis of a Cameron "Vow": One thing I am hearing loud and clear in this campaign is that the benefits of the EU haven't spread evenly. I am going to spend my remaining time in office addressing this problem. More nurses training places, apprenticeships, in work benefits etc We'll do what it costs.
It gets the discussion off the evils of immigration and restates that the EU does have benefits.
How about a look at the referendum in Norway to join the EU in 1994? After a long period of heated debate, the "no" side won with 52.2 per cent of the vote, on a turnout of 88.6 per cent.
Andrew Neil said on air many weeks ago at the start of the campaign, that a type of project fear was run by the YES group backed by the main party of govt, the top companies, great and the good etc etc and the end result was the public mocking the claims and voting to stay out.
Leave need to hit hard on the immigration message for the final push.
Osborne mustn't be allowed to create the narrative on economics for the final stretch. Totally ignore him if need be and keep bringing the discussion back to immigration. A cross-party press conference to kick off campaigning again would be a good idea, with Boris/Stuart/Hoey/Gove fronting it and talking about "taking control" of our borders.
Hit on it hard.
The largely universal narrative on economics has been that there will be a significant, if short term, negative effect. Leave should be honest and say that to "take back control" will have a negative effect but is a price worth paying - if they believe that.
Ive got to say I feel quite dejected right now. Twenty years I have waited for Thursday.
These events wont change my vote - I suspect though it will put some off voting and cause others to vote to hold on to nurse.
Had it come before the postal votes it might have changed the result but I think the die is now cast.
What that murderer has done though or will have done is taken all the joy and fun out of what should have been a glorious day of celebration.
Rather than a VE day type celebration it is now going to be a November 11th type commemoration.
I take your point, but life's never perfect. If we vote Leave on thursday, I'll be smiling for a week.
Victory is now almost inevitable I think Leave will win by about 5%. But this is just the first battle in a long war, the first thing they will try is to put us into the EFTA where we still have to pay money to the EU and will still be expected to accept freedom of movement where almost anybody from Europe can come and live here whether we want or need them or not. Toast the victory on Friday but bear in mind, things will get worse before they get better.
Remain need to address the immigrant issue over the next few days. Of course, they can never reassure the racists, but most people would be reassured by Cameron promising to solve the problems people associate with immigration. 1,000,000 for young people; flats and studios, not executive mansions. Abolish student fees for nurses, real training schemes and real apprenticeships. He'll have to dump Osbourne to do it, but greater love.....
And then young people from around the EU come to Britain for your flats and apprenticeships.
Don't be an idiot. Public housing involves local authority waiting lists; of course some immigrants might benefit, but only if they had lived here and paid taxes for an average of 8-10 years.
Dear lord.
People are getting hundreds a week off the state to live in London at taxpayer expense providing they work 16 hours a week.
Also if people come here with children and claim JSA they can get a house. Smh.
Remain need to address the immigrant issue over the next few days. Of course, they can never reassure the racists, but most people would be reassured by Cameron promising to solve the problems people associate with immigration. 1,000,000 for young people; flats and studios, not executive mansions. Abolish student fees for nurses, real training schemes and real apprenticeships. He'll have to dump Osbourne to do it, but greater love.....
And then young people from around the EU come to Britain for your flats and apprenticeships.
Don't be an idiot. Public housing involves local authority waiting lists; of course some immigrants might benefit, but only if they had lived here and paid taxes for an average of 8-10 years.
I think you've just shown how naïve you are.
In fact it wouldn't be only from the EU that young people would come for your flats and apprenticeships but from all around the world. And who would blame them - if you're a young person in a third world shithole you would have nothing to lose and potentially a great future to gain.
And when they are here what would you do - let them sleep in the street perhaps ? No, we'd then be told than we have a responsibility and so on and so on and so on.
Leave need to hit hard on the immigration message for the final push.
Osborne mustn't be allowed to create the narrative on economics for the final stretch. Totally ignore him if need be and keep bringing the discussion back to immigration. A cross-party press conference to kick off campaigning again would be a good idea, with Boris/Stuart/Hoey/Gove fronting it and talking about "taking control" of our borders.
Hit on it hard.
The largely universal narrative on economics has been that there will be a significant, if short term, negative effect. Leave should be honest and say that to "take back control" will have a negative effect but is a price worth paying - if they believe that.
The universal narrative on joining the Euro was that if we did not join we would be isolated, on the fringes of Europe and an economic backwater. All complete tripe.
This country will prosper because we're good at what we do. We're a great nation.
Remain need to address the immigrant issue over the next few days. Of course, they can never reassure the racists, but most people would be reassured by Cameron promising to solve the problems people associate with immigration. 1,000,000 for young people; flats and studios, not executive mansions. Abolish student fees for nurses, real training schemes and real apprenticeships. He'll have to dump Osbourne to do it, but greater love.....
This could be the basis of a Cameron "Vow": One thing I am hearing loud and clear in this campaign is that the benefits of the EU haven't spread evenly. I am going to spend my remaining time in office addressing this problem. More nurses training places, apprenticeships, in work benefits etc We'll do what it costs.
It gets the discussion off the evils of immigration and restates that the EU does have benefits.
The problem is e.u migrants are just as entitled to all those things as everyone else.
Why is the Remain campaign so off point? I really don't understand it.
It's mostly run by people who benefit from the EU who barely even know people who don't.
I watched/listened to both Lexit and Brexit YouTube movies this morning in full. Whatever the difference in tone/production values, both made the Leave case very well for their target audiences.
If you haven't watched Brexit the Movie, it's entertaining and well done. I learned a few things too.
Remain need to address the immigrant issue over the next few days. Of course, they can never reassure the racists, but most people would be reassured by Cameron promising to solve the problems people associate with immigration. 1,000,000 for young people; flats and studios, not executive mansions. Abolish student fees for nurses, real training schemes and real apprenticeships. He'll have to dump Osbourne to do it, but greater love.....
And then young people from around the EU come to Britain for your flats and apprenticeships.
Don't be an idiot. Public housing involves local authority waiting lists; of course some immigrants might benefit, but only if they had lived here and paid taxes for an average of 8-10 years.
Dear lord.
People are getting hundreds a week off the state to live in London at taxpayer expense providing they work 16 hours a week.
Leave need to hit hard on the immigration message for the final push.
Osborne mustn't be allowed to create the narrative on economics for the final stretch. Totally ignore him if need be and keep bringing the discussion back to immigration. A cross-party press conference to kick off campaigning again would be a good idea, with Boris/Stuart/Hoey/Gove fronting it and talking about "taking control" of our borders.
Hit on it hard.
The largely universal narrative on economics has been that there will be a significant, if short term, negative effect. Leave should be honest and say that to "take back control" will have a negative effect but is a price worth paying - if they believe that.
The universal narrative on joining the Euro was that if we did not join we would be isolated, on the fringes of Europe and an economic backwater. All complete tripe.
This country will prosper because we're good at what we do. We're a great nation.
Leave need to hit hard on the immigration message for the final push.
Osborne mustn't be allowed to create the narrative on economics for the final stretch. Totally ignore him if need be and keep bringing the discussion back to immigration. A cross-party press conference to kick off campaigning again would be a good idea, with Boris/Stuart/Hoey/Gove fronting it and talking about "taking control" of our borders.
Hit on it hard.
They have been hitting hard on immigration - a xenophobic and dog-whistling campaign that appeals to many peoples' guts. Very effective but leaves a disgusting taste in the mouth...
Leave's scaremongering about Turkey has been untruthful and dishonest.
Cameron refuses to say he would veto Turkey joining. He wants Turkey in the EU.
Remain need to address the immigrant issue over the next few days. Of course, they can never reassure the racists, but most people would be reassured by Cameron promising to solve the problems people associate with immigration. 1,000,000 for young people; flats and studios, not executive mansions. Abolish student fees for nurses, real training schemes and real apprenticeships. He'll have to dump Osbourne to do it, but greater love.....
It doesn't matter what they say now no one believes anything they utter.
Well there are technically a tiny % of the voters that still trust Cameron although over 80% do not. As for Osborne the % is apparently an asterisk with just 2% regarding him as a brilliant natural strategic Leader, although some online responses from his staff and family may have rigged that result...
The osbo result is definitely rigged, no way is he that popular. I wonder if the punishment budget, was a shit or bust move from Osbourne. In the manner of an FA cup match when you are two nil down with two minutes to go. So you throw everyone forward, doesn't matter if you concede another, you are fucked anyway.
Yes you are right, it was a shit or bust move from Osborne and the geniuses around him probably said that at 2% he could not go any lower. Well they were probably wrong and are heading for a 0.00001% (4) support from the Osborne household at number 11
Leave need to hit hard on the immigration message for the final push.
Osborne mustn't be allowed to create the narrative on economics for the final stretch. Totally ignore him if need be and keep bringing the discussion back to immigration. A cross-party press conference to kick off campaigning again would be a good idea, with Boris/Stuart/Hoey/Gove fronting it and talking about "taking control" of our borders.
Hit on it hard.
The largely universal narrative on economics has been that there will be a significant, if short term, negative effect. Leave should be honest and say that to "take back control" will have a negative effect but is a price worth paying - if they believe that.
The IMF are calling it as 1.9% growth this year, -0.8% next, 1.1% the following year. They have a number of scenarios that you can have a look at.
I'm prepared to take their word for this year and next. I don't believe anyone knows what will happen after that - Brexit will be lost in a mush of all the other stresses and strains that the global economy is subject to.
Sadly, I understand that as a professional economist, it's generally frowned upon to shrug your shoulders and say "Sorry, haven't a scoobies."
How about a look at the referendum in Norway to join the EU in 1994? After a long period of heated debate, the "no" side won with 52.2 per cent of the vote, on a turnout of 88.6 per cent.
Andrew Neil said on air many weeks ago at the start of the campaign, that a type of project fear was run by the YES group backed by the main party of govt, the top companies, great and the good etc etc and the end result was the public mocking the claims and voting to stay out.
Remain need to address the immigrant issue over the next few days. Of course, they can never reassure the racists, but most people would be reassured by Cameron promising to solve the problems people associate with immigration. 1,000,000 for young people; flats and studios, not executive mansions. Abolish student fees for nurses, real training schemes and real apprenticeships. He'll have to dump Osbourne to do it, but greater love.....
And then young people from around the EU come to Britain for your flats and apprenticeships.
Don't be an idiot. Public housing involves local authority waiting lists; of course some immigrants might benefit, but only if they had lived here and paid taxes for an average of 8-10 years.
Dear lord.
People are getting hundreds a week off the state to live in London at taxpayer expense providing they work 16 hours a week.
Also if people come here with children and claim JSA they can get a house. Smh.
People have to pass a residence test which is basically a three month wait.
Once they do this they are treated as though they were UK citizens unless they are specifically prohibited from having access to public money because of their entry status/visa.
Europeans are treated as Britons. Those with families are entitled to full range of benefits that a UK passport holder gets for 16 hours work.
Leavers in the City don't tend to air their views as a rule. There are a lot more of us than people think, but the Remain side knows this which is why Canary Wharf and the Square Mile have both been blanketed by Remain.
How about a look at the referendum in Norway to join the EU in 1994? After a long period of heated debate, the "no" side won with 52.2 per cent of the vote, on a turnout of 88.6 per cent.
Andrew Neil said on air many weeks ago at the start of the campaign, that a type of project fear was run by the YES group backed by the main party of govt, the top companies, great and the good etc etc and the end result was the public mocking the claims and voting to stay out.
Leavers in the City don't tend to air their views as a rule. There are a lot more of us than people think, but the Remain side knows this which is why Canary Wharf and the Square Mile have both been blanketed by Remain.
Interesting "As Bernard Connolly, former European Commission economist and author of The Rotten Heart of Europe, has written: “there are three things the EU does not like about Anglo-Saxon financial markets, they are Anglo-Saxon, they are financial and they are markets!”"
Why is the Remain campaign so off point? I really don't understand it.
It's mostly run by people who benefit from the EU who barely even know people who don't.
The remain campaign has Osbournes dabs all over it. Thats a recipe for disaster.
Yes, one wonders if Sir Lynton refused to run the In campaign because he doesn't support our EU membership. Osborne is running a 2010 core vote plus Guardianistas strategy, it may not be enough.
"Leaving the EU would make Britain as insignificant as the island of Guernsey, France's economy minister Emmanuel Macron has said.
In an interview with Le Monde, Mr Macron said: "Leaving the EU would mean the 'Guernseyfication' of the UK, which would then be a little country on the world scale. It would isolate itself and become a trading post and arbitration place at Europe's border."
The French minister added that European Council would have to send "a very firm message and timetable" to the UK on the consequences of leaving the EU."
The French want us to leave, De Gaulle vetoed UK entry and an EU without the UK would shift towards the southern European nations and away from the north, leading to a more isolated Germany and a relatively more powerful France
How about a look at the referendum in Norway to join the EU in 1994? After a long period of heated debate, the "no" side won with 52.2 per cent of the vote, on a turnout of 88.6 per cent.
Andrew Neil said on air many weeks ago at the start of the campaign, that a type of project fear was run by the YES group backed by the main party of govt, the top companies, great and the good etc etc and the end result was the public mocking the claims and voting to stay out.
Leave need to hit hard on the immigration message for the final push.
Osborne mustn't be allowed to create the narrative on economics for the final stretch. Totally ignore him if need be and keep bringing the discussion back to immigration. A cross-party press conference to kick off campaigning again would be a good idea, with Boris/Stuart/Hoey/Gove fronting it and talking about "taking control" of our borders.
Hit on it hard.
They have been hitting hard on immigration - a xenophobic and dog-whistling campaign that appeals to many peoples' guts. Very effective but leaves a disgusting taste in the mouth...
Leave's scaremongering about Turkey has been untruthful and dishonest.
Cameron refuses to say he would veto Turkey joining. He wants Turkey in the EU.
The Turkey embassy cables leaked last week to the STimes blew the bottom out of Cameron's credibility.
He's been caught lying too many times, as has Osborne - few still believe them.
I guess Mr Macron comments represent a long standing belief in the French government, nothing to do with the referendum. I saw 20 or more years ago a BBC interview with an American in New York. The man made the statement - if you cosy up to rich people they will look after you and you will become rich too. Mr Macron has the same opinion about Germany.
"Leaving the EU would make Britain as insignificant as the island of Guernsey, France's economy minister Emmanuel Macron has said.
In an interview with Le Monde, Mr Macron said: "Leaving the EU would mean the 'Guernseyfication' of the UK, which would then be a little country on the world scale. It would isolate itself and become a trading post and arbitration place at Europe's border."
The French minister added that European Council would have to send "a very firm message and timetable" to the UK on the consequences of leaving the EU."
The French want us to leave, De Gaulle vetoed UK entry and an EU without the UK would shift towards the southern European nations and away from the north, leading to a more isolated Germany and a relatively more powerful France
Remain need to address the immigrant issue over the next few days. Of course, they can never reassure the racists, but most people would be reassured by Cameron promising to solve the problems people associate with immigration. 1,000,000 for young people; flats and studios, not executive mansions. Abolish student fees for nurses, real training schemes and real apprenticeships. He'll have to dump Osbourne to do it, but greater love.....
And then young people from around the EU come to Britain for your flats and apprenticeships.
Don't be an idiot. Public housing involves local authority waiting lists; of course some immigrants might benefit, but only if they had lived here and paid taxes for an average of 8-10 years.
Dear lord.
People are getting hundreds a week off the state to live in London at taxpayer expense providing they work 16 hours a week.
Also if people come here with children and claim JSA they can get a house. Smh.
People have to pass a residence test which is basically a three month wait.
Once they do this they are treated as though they were UK citizens unless they are specifically prohibited from having access to public money because of their entry status/visa.
Europeans are treated as Britons. Those with families are entitled to full range of benefits that a UK passport holder gets for 16 hours work.
They don't have to work 16 hours to get a house as long as they are claiming JSA and are "vulnerable" I.e have children and have waited 3 months- even if they went back home in the meantime they can get a house. At least that's what Hounslow council did on the channel 5 documentary....... Anyway the point is there are no real limits, apart from the three month wait which many from ex- soviet countries will do .
Why is the Remain campaign so off point? I really don't understand it.
It's mostly run by people who benefit from the EU who barely even know people who don't.
The remain campaign has Osbournes dabs all over it. Thats a recipe for disaster.
Yes, one wonders if Sir Lynton refused to run the In campaign because he doesn't support our EU membership. Osborne is running a 2010 core vote plus Guardianistas strategy, it may not be enough.
Why is the Remain campaign so off point? I really don't understand it.
It's mostly run by people who benefit from the EU who barely even know people who don't.
The remain campaign has Osbournes dabs all over it. Thats a recipe for disaster.
Yes, one wonders if Sir Lynton refused to run the In campaign because he doesn't support our EU membership. Osborne is running a 2010 core vote plus Guardianistas strategy, it may not be enough.
Its the strategy Osborne expected to be running in 2010 - middle class metropolitans plus Conservative loyalists.
In the general elections the middle class leftists despised the Conservatives and they had to rely on working class votes to win.
The working class votes have now been written off as unnecessary.
Leave need to hit hard on the immigration message for the final push.
Osborne mustn't be allowed to create the narrative on economics for the final stretch. Totally ignore him if need be and keep bringing the discussion back to immigration. A cross-party press conference to kick off campaigning again would be a good idea, with Boris/Stuart/Hoey/Gove fronting it and talking about "taking control" of our borders.
Hit on it hard.
They have been hitting hard on immigration - a xenophobic and dog-whistling campaign that appeals to many peoples' guts. Very effective but leaves a disgusting taste in the mouth...
Leave's scaremongering about Turkey has been untruthful and dishonest.
Cameron refuses to say he would veto Turkey joining. He wants Turkey in the EU.
The Turkey embassy cables leaked last week to the STimes blew the bottom out of Cameron's credibility.
He's been caught lying too many times, as has Osborne - few still believe them.
It is quite extraordinary the mess their Turkish position is in. That does not guarantee a win to LEAVE, but it does pile on the reasons why voters do not trust the pair. A lack of joined up policy planning.
How about a look at the referendum in Norway to join the EU in 1994? After a long period of heated debate, the "no" side won with 52.2 per cent of the vote, on a turnout of 88.6 per cent.
Andrew Neil said on air many weeks ago at the start of the campaign, that a type of project fear was run by the YES group backed by the main party of govt, the top companies, great and the good etc etc and the end result was the public mocking the claims and voting to stay out.
Perhaps more salient would be the Ireland 2008 referendum (aka Lisbon I). My longstanding prediction of LEAVE55/REMAIN45 took some inspiration from that.
"Leaving the EU would make Britain as insignificant as the island of Guernsey, France's economy minister Emmanuel Macron has said.
In an interview with Le Monde, Mr Macron said: "Leaving the EU would mean the 'Guernseyfication' of the UK, which would then be a little country on the world scale. It would isolate itself and become a trading post and arbitration place at Europe's border."
The French minister added that European Council would have to send "a very firm message and timetable" to the UK on the consequences of leaving the EU."
The French want us to leave, De Gaulle vetoed UK entry and an EU without the UK would shift towards the southern European nations and away from the north, leading to a more isolated Germany and a relatively more powerful France
If so they should be nice and just say good bye, "will of the people etc".
Why is the Remain campaign so off point? I really don't understand it.
It's mostly run by people who benefit from the EU who barely even know people who don't.
The remain campaign has Osbournes dabs all over it. Thats a recipe for disaster.
The Turkey narrative for leave is just so obvious, I really don't understand how remain failed to have well worked out response. So sloppy.
It's one of those difficult things to refute, as Turkey is officially going through the accession process. It's a thing. You can recite the mantra (as I've done) of Erdogan, Cyprus, France, Germany etc as being the reasons why it's not going to happen. However, the official position of HMG is that it supports Turkish accession to the EU.
I think the Leave leaflet is wholly disingenuous. But it's still hard to refute.
I'm with Mr Tyndall; both campaigns have been poor (Remain being worse by a country mile though), and I'm not even talking about Farage's odious efforts on the sidelines.
Leavers in the City don't tend to air their views as a rule. There are a lot more of us than people think, but the Remain side knows this which is why Canary Wharf and the Square Mile have both been blanketed by Remain.
Business for Britain and City for Britain have been very active from about 2 years ago
chestnut - it isn't really true - if you lose a job in Doncaster you won't get housing benefit if you try for a job in London and need a room - but you will if you come from the EU. In fact Doncastor council will claim your home there is your main residence and you will continue paying full council tax even if you never live there again. If you are unlucky the Doncaster home will be classed as a holiday home.
I briefly listened to BBC1 this morning. Four discussing the EU Referendum and a microcosm of the problem.
The Leaver saying you don't listen to the people with concerns about Leave, you just label them racists and shut down the conversation. The Remainers cutting in and patiently explaining that immigrants pay for themselves so there's no need for a conversation.
The Leaver responding with something along the lines of "There's pressure on schools and the NHS - do you actually use state schools and the NHS? "
The Remainers interrupting as if they were talking to an idiot - "The immigrants pay more than they take out so there's no problem."
To be fair, the French Remainer did once say "Well, spend more then." The other Remainer just sneered. But the Frenchman was totally bemused by the suggestion that anyone would not approve of open borders. "It's part of the deal."
Everyone talking and no one listening.
The clever and the smart thinking that even discussing immigration concerns with racists is demeaning. So they don't. That's the way to win minds.
"Leaving the EU would make Britain as insignificant as the island of Guernsey, France's economy minister Emmanuel Macron has said.
In an interview with Le Monde, Mr Macron said: "Leaving the EU would mean the 'Guernseyfication' of the UK, which would then be a little country on the world scale. It would isolate itself and become a trading post and arbitration place at Europe's border."
The French minister added that European Council would have to send "a very firm message and timetable" to the UK on the consequences of leaving the EU."
The French want us to leave, De Gaulle vetoed UK entry and an EU without the UK would shift towards the southern European nations and away from the north, leading to a more isolated Germany and a relatively more powerful France
If we're painting with broad strokes, Germany needs the UK. France absolutely does not. We're Cinderella to their Ugly Sister . It would be quite the coup de main for them if the UK left. It's probably the only thing that makes me pause for thought.
"Leaving the EU would make Britain as insignificant as the island of Guernsey, France's economy minister Emmanuel Macron has said.
In an interview with Le Monde, Mr Macron said: "Leaving the EU would mean the 'Guernseyfication' of the UK, which would then be a little country on the world scale. It would isolate itself and become a trading post and arbitration place at Europe's border."
The French minister added that European Council would have to send "a very firm message and timetable" to the UK on the consequences of leaving the EU."
The French want us to leave, De Gaulle vetoed UK entry and an EU without the UK would shift towards the southern European nations and away from the north, leading to a more isolated Germany and a relatively more powerful France
If so they should be nice and just say good bye, "will of the people etc".
They want us out but they would try and screw us too, a weak UK and an isolated Germany is France's ideal foreign policy position in Europe, that was why France was at its most powerful under Louis XIV when England was in the midst of a civil war and its aftermath and Germany was split up into isolated states
Why is the Remain campaign so off point? I really don't understand it.
It's mostly run by people who benefit from the EU who barely even know people who don't.
The remain campaign has Osbournes dabs all over it. Thats a recipe for disaster.
The Turkey narrative for leave is just so obvious, I really don't understand how remain failed to have well worked out response. So sloppy.
It's one of those difficult things to refute, as Turkey is officially going through the accession process. It's a thing. You can recite the mantra (as I've done) of Erdogan, Cyprus, France, Germany etc as being the reasons why it's not going to happen. However, the official position of HMG is that it supports Turkish accession to the EU.
I think the Leave leaflet is wholly disingenuous. But it's still hard to refute.
I'm with Mr Tyndall; both campaigns have been poor (Remain being worse by a country mile though), and I'm not even talking about Farage's odious efforts on the sidelines.
The Turkey line from leave is not totally disegenuos, Erdogan could drop dead tommorow and a centrist secular government be elected weeks later. Then its really on.
If we're painting with broad strokes, Germany needs the UK. France absolutely does not. We're Cinderella to their Ugly Sister . It would be quite the coup de main for them if the UK left. It's probably the only thing that makes me pause for thought.
Germany wants us to remain because we provide balance, France wants us to leave because we provide balance. And the EU as a whole worries about an unraveling, even if they won't be too sad to see the troublemakers leave.
Why is the Remain campaign so off point? I really don't understand it.
It's mostly run by people who benefit from the EU who barely even know people who don't.
The remain campaign has Osbournes dabs all over it. Thats a recipe for disaster.
The Turkey narrative for leave is just so obvious, I really don't understand how remain failed to have well worked out response. So sloppy.
It's one of those difficult things to refute, as Turkey is officially going through the accession process. It's a thing. You can recite the mantra (as I've done) of Erdogan, Cyprus, France, Germany etc as being the reasons why it's not going to happen. However, the official position of HMG is that it supports Turkish accession to the EU.
I think the Leave leaflet is wholly disingenuous. But it's still hard to refute.
I'm with Mr Tyndall; both campaigns have been poor (Remain being worse by a country mile though), and I'm not even talking about Farage's odious efforts on the sidelines.
The screen shots of the British Embassy website in Turkey says it's working on Turkish accession. It's impossible to deny it. And then we get leaked cables talking of basically hushing it up until after the 23rd.
It's toxic. It's like denying you want a divorce after you've been caught leaving the lawyer's office.
Why is the Remain campaign so off point? I really don't understand it.
It's mostly run by people who benefit from the EU who barely even know people who don't.
The remain campaign has Osbournes dabs all over it. Thats a recipe for disaster.
The Turkey narrative for leave is just so obvious, I really don't understand how remain failed to have well worked out response. So sloppy.
It's one of those difficult things to refute, as Turkey is officially going through the accession process. It's a thing. You can recite the mantra (as I've done) of Erdogan, Cyprus, France, Germany etc as being the reasons why it's not going to happen. However, the official position of HMG is that it supports Turkish accession to the EU.
I think the Leave leaflet is wholly disingenuous. But it's still hard to refute.
I'm with Mr Tyndall; both campaigns have been poor (Remain being worse by a country mile though), and I'm not even talking about Farage's odious efforts on the sidelines.
The Turkey line from leave is not totally disegenuos, Erdogan could drop dead tommorow and a centrist secular government be elected weeks later. Then its really on.
But isn't it the case that the very things that make Turkey unattractive to many people as a member of the EU are also the very things that prevent them from joining? There is no reason in principle why any country should not join an organisation. It is the things we don't like bout Turkey that prevent them from joining and they can only join if those things go away.
Remain need to address the immigrant issue over the next few days. Of course, they can never reassure the racists, but most people would be reassured by Cameron promising to solve the problems people associate with immigration. 1,000,000 for young people; flats and studios, not executive mansions. Abolish student fees for nurses, real training schemes and real apprenticeships. He'll have to dump Osbourne to do it, but greater love.....
This could be the basis of a Cameron "Vow": One thing I am hearing loud and clear in this campaign is that the benefits of the EU haven't spread evenly. I am going to spend my remaining time in office addressing this problem. More nurses training places, apprenticeships, in work benefits etc We'll do what it costs.
It gets the discussion off the evils of immigration and restates that the EU does have benefits.
The problem is e.u migrants are just as entitled to all those things as everyone else.
The Leave argument assumes is zero sum. If there's a fixed account of wealth, the fewer people sharing in it the more each person gets. According to polls, most people believe the EU benefits the economy but they don't see the benefits themselves. This argument is about fairness and it sets Remain apart from the unreconstructed capitalists that make up most of the Leave team.
They don't have a lot of time to get this argument out though.
chestnut - it isn't really true - if you lose a job in Doncaster you won't get housing benefit if you try for a job in London and need a room - but you will if you come from the EU. In fact Doncastor council will claim your home there is your main residence and you will continue paying full council tax even if you never live there again. If you are unlucky the Doncaster home will be classed as a holiday home.
They will he made himself intentionally homeless. Same with E.U migrants but they normally come with children so u can't just put them on the streets.Leaving the e.u won't completely change that but we will have a points based system.
The people from eastern Europe are very poor and I would do the same but resources are always limited whereas E.U migration isn't.
Why is the Remain campaign so off point? I really don't understand it.
It's mostly run by people who benefit from the EU who barely even know people who don't.
The remain campaign has Osbournes dabs all over it. Thats a recipe for disaster.
The Turkey narrative for leave is just so obvious, I really don't understand how remain failed to have well worked out response. So sloppy.
It's one of those difficult things to refute, as Turkey is officially going through the accession process. It's a thing. You can recite the mantra (as I've done) of Erdogan, Cyprus, France, Germany etc as being the reasons why it's not going to happen. However, the official position of HMG is that it supports Turkish accession to the EU.
I think the Leave leaflet is wholly disingenuous. But it's still hard to refute.
I'm with Mr Tyndall; both campaigns have been poor (Remain being worse by a country mile though), and I'm not even talking about Farage's odious efforts on the sidelines.
The Turkey line from leave is not totally disegenuos, Erdogan could drop dead tommorow and a centrist secular government be elected weeks later. Then its really on.
I think Turkey will join one day - as I wrote yesterday, it makes strategic sense (it is a NATO member after all).
Even under your scenario, it would take a long time. Cyprus is a tiddler & debtor to boot so it'll do as it's told. France and Germany? Not so much. There's also the small matter of the accession criteria themselves.
If we're taking a forty year horizon for this referendum, I think it's a minor concern. I still think it'll be 15-20 years at the fastest. I may be wrong, it has been known .
The clever and the smart thinking that even discussing immigration concerns with racists is demeaning. So they don't. That's the way to win minds.
Edit: And lose referenda
Unfortunately I agree with this. I have said repeatedly that REMAIN's approach of stacking experts and ignoring people's concerns (migration, NHS et al) was methodologically flawed.
Why is the Remain campaign so off point? I really don't understand it.
It's mostly run by people who benefit from the EU who barely even know people who don't.
The remain campaign has Osbournes dabs all over it. Thats a recipe for disaster.
The Turkey narrative for leave is just so obvious, I really don't understand how remain failed to have well worked out response. So sloppy.
It's one of those difficult things to refute, as Turkey is officially going through the accession process. It's a thing. You can recite the mantra (as I've done) of Erdogan, Cyprus, France, Germany etc as being the reasons why it's not going to happen. However, the official position of HMG is that it supports Turkish accession to the EU.
I think the Leave leaflet is wholly disingenuous. But it's still hard to refute.
I'm with Mr Tyndall; both campaigns have been poor (Remain being worse by a country mile though), and I'm not even talking about Farage's odious efforts on the sidelines.
I think it might be better if Cameron had said not in our lifetimes instead of the ridiculous "year 3000" people are not stupid.
Leavers in the City don't tend to air their views as a rule. There are a lot more of us than people think, but the Remain side knows this which is why Canary Wharf and the Square Mile have both been blanketed by Remain.
Interesting. This does tie in with a conversation I had with someone earlier in the week.
Why is the Remain campaign so off point? I really don't understand it.
It's mostly run by people who benefit from the EU who barely even know people who don't.
The remain campaign has Osbournes dabs all over it. Thats a recipe for disaster.
Yes, one wonders if Sir Lynton refused to run the In campaign because he doesn't support our EU membership. Osborne is running a 2010 core vote plus Guardianistas strategy, it may not be enough.
Its the strategy Osborne expected to be running in 2010 - middle class metropolitans plus Conservative loyalists.
In the general elections the middle class leftists despised the Conservatives and they had to rely on working class votes to win.
The working class votes have now been written off as unnecessary.
Exactly look at Ealing central and Hempstead vs. Southampton.
I briefly listened to BBC1 this morning. Four discussing the EU Referendum and a microcosm of the problem.
The Leaver saying you don't listen to the people with concerns about Leave, you just label them racists and shut down the conversation. The Remainers cutting in and patiently explaining that immigrants pay for themselves so there's no need for a conversation.
The Leaver responding with something along the lines of "There's pressure on schools and the NHS - do you actually use state schools and the NHS? "
The Remainers interrupting as if they were talking to an idiot - "The immigrants pay more than they take out so there's no problem."
To be fair, the French Remainer did once say "Well, spend more then." The other Remainer just sneered. But the Frenchman was totally bemused by the suggestion that anyone would not approve of open borders. "It's part of the deal."
Everyone talking and no one listening.
The clever and the smart thinking that even discussing immigration concerns with racists is demeaning. So they don't. That's the way to win minds.
Edit: And lose referenda
.
Leavers are so inured to insults, we shrug them off with a 'there you go again'. How many shy Leavers/Remainers are out there? Who knows. The peer group pressure is enormous.
The clever and the smart thinking that even discussing immigration concerns with racists is demeaning. So they don't. That's the way to win minds.
Edit: And lose referenda
Unfortunately I agree with this. I have said repeatedly that REMAIN's approach of stacking experts and ignoring people's concerns (migration, NHS et al) was methodologically flawed.
I'd make every member of Remain's team watch John Mann's videos. Then they would know what to do.
It's a bit like recessions. No one welcomes them, but they're very personal. I've been badly affected by two, oblivious to two others. Economics is irrelevant.
It's no good telling someone GDP per capita is boosted by immigration if they can't get a doctor's appointment, their kids are struggling at school because the teachers are having to deal with a lot of other kids with English as a 2nd language, when every job is at minimum wage because labour is so plentiful and they see others leapfrog the social housing queues and get easy access to welfare.
Obviously Johnson thinks he's won - he's pitching as being loyal so Remainers can come together under a Leaver leader, knowing Cameron will announce himself when he goes, and he doesn't have to call on the man to go. It also subtly criticises Cameron with the talk of being confident of getting three figures to sign the letter, knowing that that does not sound great, since one would hope a leader with 330 MPs could get at least 100 to sign it.
Why is the Remain campaign so off point? I really don't understand it.
It's mostly run by people who benefit from the EU who barely even know people who don't.
The remain campaign has Osbournes dabs all over it. Thats a recipe for disaster.
The Turkey narrative for leave is just so obvious, I really don't understand how remain failed to have well worked out response. So sloppy.
It's one of those difficult things to refute, as Turkey is officially going through the accession process. It's a thing. You can recite the mantra (as I've done) of Erdogan, Cyprus, France, Germany etc as being the reasons why it's not going to happen. However, the official position of HMG is that it supports Turkish accession to the EU.
I think the Leave leaflet is wholly disingenuous. But it's still hard to refute.
I'm with Mr Tyndall; both campaigns have been poor (Remain being worse by a country mile though), and I'm not even talking about Farage's odious efforts on the sidelines.
The Turkey line from leave is not totally disegenuos, Erdogan could drop dead tommorow and a centrist secular government be elected weeks later. Then its really on.
I think Turkey will join one day - as I wrote yesterday, it makes strategic sense (it is a NATO member after all).
Even under your scenario, it would take a long time. Cyprus is a tiddler & debtor to boot so it'll do as it's told. France and Germany? Not so much. There's also the small matter of the accession criteria themselves.
If we're taking a forty year horizon for this referendum, I think it's a minor concern. I still think it'll be 15-20 years at the fastest. I may be wrong, it has been known .
Comments
Osborne mustn't be allowed to create the narrative on economics for the final stretch. Totally ignore him if need be and keep bringing the discussion back to immigration. A cross-party press conference to kick off campaigning again would be a good idea, with Boris/Stuart/Hoey/Gove fronting it and talking about "taking control" of our borders.
Hit on it hard.
"Brexit 'would make Britain as insignificant as Guernsey'"
http://www.itv.com/news/update/2016-06-18/brexit-would-make-uk-as-insignificant-as-guernsey/
How not to win friends and influence people.
"Leaving the EU would make Britain as insignificant as the island of Guernsey, France's economy minister Emmanuel Macron has said.
In an interview with Le Monde, Mr Macron said: "Leaving the EU would mean the 'Guernseyfication' of the UK, which would then be a little country on the world scale. It would isolate itself and become a trading post and arbitration place at Europe's border."
The French minister added that European Council would have to send "a very firm message and timetable" to the UK on the consequences of leaving the EU."
Link it to three points: Living standards, uncertainty (Turkey) and Control.
These events wont change my vote - I suspect though it will put some off voting and cause others to vote to hold on to nurse.
Had it come before the postal votes it might have changed the result but I think the die is now cast.
What that murderer has done though or will have done is taken all the joy and fun out of what should have been a glorious day of celebration.
Rather than a VE day type celebration it is now going to be a November 11th type commemoration.
The French Govt view us as a little island, a Guernsey, they tell us if we dare to vote LEAVE then they will punish us... So go on, meet the challenge, send the French and others the right message and dare to Vote LEAVE.
http://www.cityam.com/243490/citys-secret-brexiteers-more-numerous-than-you
Then again I imagine that sounds horrible to power mad, meddling politicians.
Like @StrongerIn we've cancelled rallies & street stalls today. We will still be handing out leaflets locally. Campaign restarts tomorrow.
One chance to change that future. Everyone knows it.
That's what is at stake on Thursday.
I wonder if the punishment budget, was a shit or bust move from Osbourne. In the manner of an FA cup match when you are two nil down with two minutes to go. So you throw everyone forward, doesn't matter if you concede another, you are fucked anyway.
People are getting hundreds a week off the state to live in London at taxpayer expense providing they work 16 hours a week.
We'll do what it costs.
It gets the discussion off the evils of immigration and restates that the EU does have benefits.
How about a look at the referendum in Norway to join the EU in 1994? After a long period of heated debate, the "no" side won with 52.2 per cent of the vote, on a turnout of 88.6 per cent.
Andrew Neil said on air many weeks ago at the start of the campaign, that a type of project fear was run by the YES group backed by the main party of govt, the top companies, great and the good etc etc and the end result was the public mocking the claims and voting to stay out.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norwegian_European_Union_membership_referendum,_1994
Toast the victory on Friday but bear in mind, things will get worse before they get better.
In fact it wouldn't be only from the EU that young people would come for your flats and apprenticeships but from all around the world. And who would blame them - if you're a young person in a third world shithole you would have nothing to lose and potentially a great future to gain.
And when they are here what would you do - let them sleep in the street perhaps ? No, we'd then be told than we have a responsibility and so on and so on and so on.
"Resistance against the EU is futile"
This country will prosper because we're good at what we do. We're a great nation.
If you haven't watched Brexit the Movie, it's entertaining and well done. I learned a few things too.
There's plenty of nominal work being done.
Louise Mensch @LouiseMensch · 3m3 minutes ago
Yes, Remain want a million net immigrants a year or more #losttheplot
I'm prepared to take their word for this year and next. I don't believe anyone knows what will happen after that - Brexit will be lost in a mush of all the other stresses and strains that the global economy is subject to.
Sadly, I understand that as a professional economist, it's generally frowned upon to shrug your shoulders and say "Sorry, haven't a scoobies."
Once they do this they are treated as though they were UK citizens unless they are specifically prohibited from having access to public money because of their entry status/visa.
Europeans are treated as Britons. Those with families are entitled to full range of benefits that a UK passport holder gets for 16 hours work.
See Gillian Duffy.
Ho hum. Great win for England in the rugby. Fantastic to watch.
He's been caught lying too many times, as has Osborne - few still believe them.
In the general elections the middle class leftists despised the Conservatives and they had to rely on working class votes to win.
The working class votes have now been written off as unnecessary.
I think the Leave leaflet is wholly disingenuous. But it's still hard to refute.
I'm with Mr Tyndall; both campaigns have been poor (Remain being worse by a country mile though), and I'm not even talking about Farage's odious efforts on the sidelines.
The Leaver saying you don't listen to the people with concerns about Leave, you just label them racists and shut down the conversation. The Remainers cutting in and patiently explaining that immigrants pay for themselves so there's no need for a conversation.
The Leaver responding with something along the lines of "There's pressure on schools and the NHS - do you actually use state schools and the NHS? "
The Remainers interrupting as if they were talking to an idiot - "The immigrants pay more than they take out so there's no problem."
To be fair, the French Remainer did once say "Well, spend more then." The other Remainer just sneered. But the Frenchman was totally bemused by the suggestion that anyone would not approve of open borders. "It's part of the deal."
Everyone talking and no one listening.
The clever and the smart thinking that even discussing immigration concerns with racists is demeaning. So they don't. That's the way to win minds.
Edit: And lose referenda
.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/opinion/1302272/boris-johnson-backs-david-cameron-to-stay-on-as-pm-no-matter-who-wins-referendum/
Does he think he's lost the referendum?
It's toxic. It's like denying you want a divorce after you've been caught leaving the lawyer's office.
They don't have a lot of time to get this argument out though.
The people from eastern Europe are very poor and I would do the same but resources are always limited whereas E.U migration isn't.
Even under your scenario, it would take a long time. Cyprus is a tiddler & debtor to boot so it'll do as it's told. France and Germany? Not so much. There's also the small matter of the accession criteria themselves.
If we're taking a forty year horizon for this referendum, I think it's a minor concern. I still think it'll be 15-20 years at the fastest. I may be wrong, it has been known
It's a bit like recessions. No one welcomes them, but they're very personal. I've been badly affected by two, oblivious to two others. Economics is irrelevant.
It's no good telling someone GDP per capita is boosted by immigration if they can't get a doctor's appointment, their kids are struggling at school because the teachers are having to deal with a lot of other kids with English as a 2nd language, when every job is at minimum wage because labour is so plentiful and they see others leapfrog the social housing queues and get easy access to welfare.
It's two countries divided by a common language.