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The German election thread – politicalbetting.com

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  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 64,663
    Leon said:

    The rise of the far right in one chart



    That shows them going backwards in 2021, so how can we know what will happen in 2029?

    World events moving very swiftly.

  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 72,822
    eek said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @eucopresident
    I have decided to convene a special European Council on 6 March.

    We are living a defining moment for Ukraine and European security.

    In my consultations with European leaders, I’ve heard a shared commitment to meet those challenges at EU level: strengthening European Defence and contributing decisively to peace on our continent and long-term security of Ukraine.

    I will continue to work together with
    @vonderleyen
    and all Member States to be ready to take decisions on 6 March.

    #EUCO

    https://x.com/eucopresident/status/1893707647565881651

    @mariatad

    He didn’t waste a minute - quite literally 18:01 - head of the European Council calls extraordinary summit of European leaders to discuss Ukraine and defense. EU can’t move without Berlin - incentive for action.

    https://x.com/mariatad/status/1893717845692846443

    Doesn't make any difference Hungary will veto anything that looks like a anti-Moscow decision..
    The ghosts of Horthy, Hitler and Mussolini must be laughing.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 23,769
    Update at 18:55 German time/17:55 GMT

    SPD 16.2%
    CDU/CSU 28.9%
    Green 13.0%
    FDP 4.9%
    AFD 19.9%
    Left 8.5%
    BSW 4.8%
    Others 3.8%

    Source https://www.tagesschau.de/wahl/archiv/2025-02-23-BT-DE/index-content.shtml
    Manually typed, so apologies for any errors

  • RattersRatters Posts: 1,243
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Outgoing Chancellor Scholz calls the result 'a bitter election result for the SPD' while still thanking party workers for their efforts

    He was effing useless and will not be missed.

    Th SPD will be looking a new leader
    Germany the second G7 nation to shift from a left liberal government to a right of centre government in 6 months after the US and both Biden and Scholz were one term heads of government.

    Not encouraging for Sir Keir, he will be hoping Albanese can scrape home in Australia and the Liberals and NDP further close the gap in Canada
    The trend in 2024 (and now 2025) was for every incumbent party to lose their election, whether or the left or the right.

    I think it's too early to say if voters will have the same sentiment in 2028/2029. Quite possible but I don't think this vote tells us much in that regard.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,141
    If the CDU/CSU head down towards 28% it will weaken their bargaining position.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 44,295
    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    rcs1000 said:

    CDU/CSU 29%
    AfD 19.5%
    SPD 16%
    Greens 13.5%
    The Left 8.5%
    FDP 4.9%
    BSW 4.7%

    Phewy

    That’s extremely close to the 5% threshold for the bottom 2.
    Isn’t this pretty much exactly as predicted by the polls?

    Germany is nicely fulfilling its orderly and predictable stereotype even in a time of disorderly and unpredictable flux. Bravo
    Yep. The shockwaves are more of a stiff breeze. Can you get the cork back in or is it one of those that expands after it's popped?
    I’m having a glass of decent Riesling to celebrate the worst result for the German centre left in about ninety centuries

    Labour will suffer the same in ‘28
    Sweet spot conditions for the far right and they've undershot. So I'd stick to one glass if I were you.

    Labour in 2028? They are favourites to win again and I agree with that. But 4 years is a long long time. Esp at our age.
  • HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    And yet the centre left - for so long dominant in Germany - have fallen BEHIND the Far Right

    Because this was all being predicted by the polls it seems shrug-worthy. It is not. It is seismic
    The Uniparty have won the election.
    Yes in UK context it is like a hung parliament with the Tories winning most seats at the next general election, Reform second and Labour third but Kemi then doing a deal with a humiliated Starmer anyway to keep Farage out of power.

    Though to be fair the AfD have some far right elements Reform don't yet
    Except that Germany has already had three CDU/CSU + SDP govts this century and the UK has had 0 Con/Lab govts since WW2.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 23,769
    viewcode said:

    Update at 18:55 German time/17:55 GMT

    SPD 16.2%
    CDU/CSU 28.9%
    Green 13.0%
    FDP 4.9%
    AFD 19.9%
    Left 8.5%
    BSW 4.8%
    Others 3.8%

    Source https://www.tagesschau.de/wahl/archiv/2025-02-23-BT-DE/charts/index-content/chart_1845701.shtml
    Manually typed, so apologies for any errors

    Update at 18:55 German time/17:55 GMT Seat projection

    SPD 118
    CDU/CSU 210
    Greens 94
    AfD 145
    Left 62
    SSW 1

    630 seats, so 315ish needed for a majority

    Source https://www.tagesschau.de/wahl/archiv/2025-02-23-BT-DE/charts/index-content/chart_1845705.shtml
    Manually typed, so apologies for any errors
  • LeonLeon Posts: 58,881

    Leon said:

    The AfD is doubling its vote every five years or so. Ergo they will be the German government by the end of the decade

    And 200% by the end of the next decade?
    Wir kann aber hoffnung
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,234
    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    Leon said:

    The AfD is doubling its vote every five years or so. Ergo they will be the German government by the end of the decade

    They would need to overtake the CDU as the main party of the right though which is unlikely while they are led by the more conservative Merz. SPD probably already squeezed down to near their core
    I was half joking. But only half

    I do believe most western governments will end up with versions of Trump/Milei/Bukele, albeit adapted to local circumstances
    I think Trump and Milei will be one term wonders (or second one term wonders in Trump's case), elsewhere the nationalist right can only get into power with the centre right in a coalition as is now the case in Italy, Israel, New Zealand and Sweden and the Netherlands and maybe the case in Spain and the UK next time.

    For the moment for historical reasons the main parties have a firewall to keep the AfD out
  • TimSTimS Posts: 14,439

    Leon said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    And yet the centre left - for so long dominant in Germany - have fallen BEHIND the Far Right

    Because this was all being predicted by the polls it seems shrug-worthy. It is not. It is seismic
    The Uniparty have won the election.
    In German terms the Greens really belong in the centre left too. I’d say they fit the niche that the Lib Dems plus the rural NIMBY greens have in Britain. Plus a touch of idiocy on nuclear power just to pep things up a bit.

    I would cross reference as follows:

    CDU/CSU: @Big_G_NorthWales and @MarqueeMark plus blue wall former Tory Lib Dems plus some Blairites
    SPD: @OnlyLivingBoy, some Blairites plus a chunk of Lib Dems
    Green: @SandyRentool, UK rural Green Party plus some soft left and the greener Lib Dems
    Linke: @NickPalmer , the nicer Corbynites, and the NUS
    BSW: @bigjohnowls plus some of our Saturday visitors
    AfD: Reform plus a bit of EDL
    FDP: @BartholomewRoberts
  • kamskikamski Posts: 6,155

    kamski said:

    A bit of a shite electoral system where the make up of the government depends on whether a fringe party achieved 4.9% or 5% of the vote.

    And a combined vote total of 45% resulting in an absolute majority of seats ain't PR as far as I'm concerned.

    But still better than FPTP, mind!

    Which system is better?
    d'Hondt with minimum 8 member constituencies and candidate order determined by party primaries.
    But one of your complaints was

    "a combined vote total of 45% resulting in an absolute majority of seats ain't PR as far as I'm concerned."

    Your system could easily have the same problem, or worse.
  • Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The AfD is doubling its vote every five years or so. Ergo they will be the German government by the end of the decade

    And 200% by the end of the next decade?
    Wir kann aber hoffnung
    Koenen, Dummkopf.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 4,325
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The AfD is doubling its vote every five years or so. Ergo they will be the German government by the end of the decade

    And 200% by the end of the next decade?
    Wir kann aber hoffnung
    Auf schones Wetter kann man sich nie verlassen
  • LeonLeon Posts: 58,881
    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    rcs1000 said:

    CDU/CSU 29%
    AfD 19.5%
    SPD 16%
    Greens 13.5%
    The Left 8.5%
    FDP 4.9%
    BSW 4.7%

    Phewy

    That’s extremely close to the 5% threshold for the bottom 2.
    Isn’t this pretty much exactly as predicted by the polls?

    Germany is nicely fulfilling its orderly and predictable stereotype even in a time of disorderly and unpredictable flux. Bravo
    Yep. The shockwaves are more of a stiff breeze. Can you get the cork back in or is it one of those that expands after it's popped?
    I’m having a glass of decent Riesling to celebrate the worst result for the German centre left in about ninety centuries

    Labour will suffer the same in ‘28
    Sweet spot conditions for the far right and they've undershot. So I'd stick to one glass if I were you.

    Labour in 2028? They are favourites to win again and I agree with that. But 4 years is a long long time. Esp at our age.
    As boring as ever. Stick to golf
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 23,769
    AFD creeping up, SPD and Green creeping down, but single figures and decimal points, nothing dramatic. AfD might crack 20% but it's not going to change much. AfD/BSW might crack 5% (which is the threshold) which would make a difference.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 58,881

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The AfD is doubling its vote every five years or so. Ergo they will be the German government by the end of the decade

    And 200% by the end of the next decade?
    Wir kann aber hoffnung
    Koenen, Dummkopf.
    LEONDAMUS hat ein gigantisch SCHWANZMEISTER, ja wohl, es ist der größte Bratwurst von das ganze Welt, ACHTUNG!!
  • sarissasarissa Posts: 2,069
    edited February 23
    Scott_xP said:

    Trumpski invited the Superb Owl Champion Philadelphia Eagles to the Whitehouse

    Once again they told him to fuck off :)

    To wit, he invited them to woo?
    EDIT beaten to I see
  • Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The AfD is doubling its vote every five years or so. Ergo they will be the German government by the end of the decade

    And 200% by the end of the next decade?
    Wir kann aber hoffnung
    Koenen, Dummkopf.
    LEONDAMUS hat ein gigantisch SCHWANZMEISTER, ja wohl, es ist der größte Bratwurst von das ganze Welt, ACHTUNG!!
    Yeah, well we only got his word for that...
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 11,313
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The AfD is doubling its vote every five years or so. Ergo they will be the German government by the end of the decade

    And 200% by the end of the next decade?
    Wir kann aber hoffnung
    Koenen, Dummkopf.
    LEONDAMUS hat ein gigantisch SCHWANZMEISTER, ja wohl, es ist der größte Bratwurst von das ganze Welt, ACHTUNG!!
    For the poster below that studied Latin at school rather than German. 'Biggus Dickus'
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 72,822
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The AfD is doubling its vote every five years or so. Ergo they will be the German government by the end of the decade

    And 200% by the end of the next decade?
    Wir kann aber hoffnung
    Koenen, Dummkopf.
    LEONDAMUS hat ein gigantisch SCHWANZMEISTER, ja wohl, es ist der größte Bratwurst von das ganze Welt, ACHTUNG!!
    Is that a feeble attempt at the funniest joke in the world?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 72,822
    Omnium said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The AfD is doubling its vote every five years or so. Ergo they will be the German government by the end of the decade

    And 200% by the end of the next decade?
    Wir kann aber hoffnung
    Koenen, Dummkopf.
    LEONDAMUS hat ein gigantisch SCHWANZMEISTER, ja wohl, es ist der größte Bratwurst von das ganze Welt, ACHTUNG!!
    For the poster below that studied Latin at school rather than German. 'Biggus Dickus'
    More of a Sillius Soddus.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 58,881
    Tomorrow I have to write about China for the Knapper’s Gazette

    No idea what to say. I might say that young Chinese women have surprisingly big hooters - which they do - but I’m not sure I can maintain that level of sophisticated political analysis over 1200 words

    Ideas welcome
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 4,325
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The AfD is doubling its vote every five years or so. Ergo they will be the German government by the end of the decade

    And 200% by the end of the next decade?
    Wir kann aber hoffnung
    Koenen, Dummkopf.
    LEONDAMUS hat ein gigantisch SCHWANZMEISTER, ja wohl, es ist der größte Bratwurst von das ganze Welt, ACHTUNG!!
    sie sind ein schwein sticker, mein liebschen
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 11,313
    ydoethur said:

    Omnium said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The AfD is doubling its vote every five years or so. Ergo they will be the German government by the end of the decade

    And 200% by the end of the next decade?
    Wir kann aber hoffnung
    Koenen, Dummkopf.
    LEONDAMUS hat ein gigantisch SCHWANZMEISTER, ja wohl, es ist der größte Bratwurst von das ganze Welt, ACHTUNG!!
    For the poster below that studied Latin at school rather than German. 'Biggus Dickus'
    More of a Sillius Soddus.
    Still, one cross each.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 53,461
    kamski said:



    Always better to look at the distribution maps, than raw, nationwide percentages.

    why? the nationwide percentages of the party vote are what count.
    Because a sectional party has a fundamental limit on its success - it’s section.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 6,001
    Leon said:

    Tomorrow I have to write about China for the Knapper’s Gazette

    No idea what to say. I might say that young Chinese women have surprisingly big hooters - which they do - but I’m not sure I can maintain that level of sophisticated political analysis over 1200 words

    Ideas welcome

    How about an article about why they named it after the stuff you make plates and cups out of.

    Why didn’t they call it “Gold” - is it a sign of a built-in Chinese modesty or was it an early sign that the Chinese recognised that the ordinary cheaper items would be their route to global trade dominance.

    I, for one, would like to know.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 23,769
    Leon said:

    Tomorrow I have to write about China for the Knapper’s Gazette

    No idea what to say. I might say that young Chinese women have surprisingly big hooters - which they do - but I’m not sure I can maintain that level of sophisticated political analysis over 1200 words

    Ideas welcome

    @Leon, try Zeihan on China: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL6zWQZTGKO4bsLwepXQSer8WJA5fWkTVo
  • kamskikamski Posts: 6,155

    kamski said:



    Always better to look at the distribution maps, than raw, nationwide percentages.

    why? the nationwide percentages of the party vote are what count.
    Because a sectional party has a fundamental limit on its success - it’s section.

    But that map doesn't tell you very much about how parties are doing in different areas, it only shows the predicted biggest party in each constituency.

    And which parties do you mean based on that map? The SPD?

  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 72,822
    boulay said:

    Leon said:

    Tomorrow I have to write about China for the Knapper’s Gazette

    No idea what to say. I might say that young Chinese women have surprisingly big hooters - which they do - but I’m not sure I can maintain that level of sophisticated political analysis over 1200 words

    Ideas welcome

    How about an article about why they named it after the stuff you make plates and cups out of.

    Why didn’t they call it “Gold” - is it a sign of a built-in Chinese modesty or was it an early sign that the Chinese recognised that the ordinary cheaper items would be their route to global trade dominance.

    I, for one, would like to know.
    But in that sort of poor slinging match, we would come off worst.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,141
    First-time voters:

    https://x.com/wahlen_de/status/1893722905793499287

    LINKE: 27% (+19)
    AfD: 19% (+13)
    Union: 14% (+4)
    SPD: 13% (-2)
    GRÜNE: 11% (-12)
    BSW: 6% (NEU)
    FDP: 5% (-18)
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 9,328



    Always better to look at the distribution maps, than raw, nationwide percentages.

    Reunification worked then.
    The cultural differences that emerged after just 40 years or so of separation under different systems are surprisingly striking and long lasting. Now imagine trying to reunify the Koreas!
    About 30 years ago I read a paper which demonstrated a high correlation between British regional accents and the pre-Roman tribal hunting grounds…
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,558
    kamski said:

    kamski said:

    A bit of a shite electoral system where the make up of the government depends on whether a fringe party achieved 4.9% or 5% of the vote.

    And a combined vote total of 45% resulting in an absolute majority of seats ain't PR as far as I'm concerned.

    But still better than FPTP, mind!

    Which system is better?
    d'Hondt with minimum 8 member constituencies and candidate order determined by party primaries.
    But one of your complaints was

    "a combined vote total of 45% resulting in an absolute majority of seats ain't PR as far as I'm concerned."

    Your system could easily have the same problem, or worse.
    But I am not advocating a national PR system, just multi-member local PR.

    If we had a fully proportional national list system, I would be comfortable with that, but I am aware that some people value local representation, hence my compromise of constituencies big enough that the result can be fairly represented by who gets elected.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 44,295
    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    rcs1000 said:

    CDU/CSU 29%
    AfD 19.5%
    SPD 16%
    Greens 13.5%
    The Left 8.5%
    FDP 4.9%
    BSW 4.7%

    Phewy

    That’s extremely close to the 5% threshold for the bottom 2.
    Isn’t this pretty much exactly as predicted by the polls?

    Germany is nicely fulfilling its orderly and predictable stereotype even in a time of disorderly and unpredictable flux. Bravo
    Yep. The shockwaves are more of a stiff breeze. Can you get the cork back in or is it one of those that expands after it's popped?
    I’m having a glass of decent Riesling to celebrate the worst result for the German centre left in about ninety centuries

    Labour will suffer the same in ‘28
    Sweet spot conditions for the far right and they've undershot. So I'd stick to one glass if I were you.

    Labour in 2028? They are favourites to win again and I agree with that. But 4 years is a long long time. Esp at our age.
    As boring as ever. Stick to golf
    Says the Big Yawn whose every word I can predict.
  • kamskikamski Posts: 6,155
    boulay said:

    Leon said:

    Tomorrow I have to write about China for the Knapper’s Gazette

    No idea what to say. I might say that young Chinese women have surprisingly big hooters - which they do - but I’m not sure I can maintain that level of sophisticated political analysis over 1200 words

    Ideas welcome

    How about an article about why they named it after the stuff you make plates and cups out of.

    Why didn’t they call it “Gold” - is it a sign of a built-in Chinese modesty or was it an early sign that the Chinese recognised that the ordinary cheaper items would be their route to global trade dominance.

    I, for one, would like to know.
    You do realise it isn't called China in Chinese?
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 9,738
    What would happen if 21 parties all got 4.8% of the vote?
  • boulayboulay Posts: 6,001
    kamski said:

    boulay said:

    Leon said:

    Tomorrow I have to write about China for the Knapper’s Gazette

    No idea what to say. I might say that young Chinese women have surprisingly big hooters - which they do - but I’m not sure I can maintain that level of sophisticated political analysis over 1200 words

    Ideas welcome

    How about an article about why they named it after the stuff you make plates and cups out of.

    Why didn’t they call it “Gold” - is it a sign of a built-in Chinese modesty or was it an early sign that the Chinese recognised that the ordinary cheaper items would be their route to global trade dominance.

    I, for one, would like to know.
    You do realise it isn't called China in Chinese?
    Wait, what? Next you will be telling me that they named the material “China” after the country and not the other way round
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 44,295
    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    And yet the centre left - for so long dominant in Germany - have fallen BEHIND the Far Right

    Because this was all being predicted by the polls it seems shrug-worthy. It is not. It is seismic
    The Uniparty have won the election.
    In German terms the Greens really belong in the centre left too. I’d say they fit the niche that the Lib Dems plus the rural NIMBY greens have in Britain. Plus a touch of idiocy on nuclear power just to pep things up a bit.

    I would cross reference as follows:

    CDU/CSU: @Big_G_NorthWales and @MarqueeMark plus blue wall former Tory Lib Dems plus some Blairites
    SPD: @OnlyLivingBoy, some Blairites plus a chunk of Lib Dems
    Green: @SandyRentool, UK rural Green Party plus some soft left and the greener Lib Dems
    Linke: @NickPalmer , the nicer Corbynites, and the NUS
    BSW: @bigjohnowls plus some of our Saturday visitors
    AfD: Reform plus a bit of EDL
    FDP: @BartholomewRoberts
    No PBers for the AfD? Hmm, not sure about that.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,047
    Andy_JS said:

    nico67 said:

    The AFDs weakest demographic according to Statista is over 60s so one would think that once postal votes get included that might reduce their total .

    But good news for the AfD at future elections.
    The far left and the far right both seem to do rather well in Germany, both at c.20% or so.
  • Jim_MillerJim_Miller Posts: 3,204
    Some good news from the US: (Off topic, but I thought those of you who wish the US well will like it.)
    The annual Mexico/US celebration in Laredo, Texas came off as it has every year but one, since 1898:
    "LAREDO, Texas — George Washington started his annual procession to the border just after dawn Saturday, a coterie of children in colonial dress alongside him under the oaks of the red-brick Plaza de San Augustín.

    Together they walked toward one of the international bridges that connect the United States and Mexico here, the music of a fife and drum band echoing on the quiet morning streets. Past the cathedral, the American Legion post, the Republic of the Rio Grande Museum.

    Finally the founding father and his entourage arrived, coming midspan to greet his counterpart — Miguel Hidalgo y Costilla, the father of Mexican independence. Youngsters from both sides hugged. The crowd cheered."
    source$: https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2025/02/22/laredo-george-washington-bridge-ceremony-mexico/

    Yes, that's right, Mexicans and Americans were gathering to celebrate George Washington's brithday. (The bridge is named the "Juárez-Lincoln International Bridge", in honor of two men who worked to restore Mexican independence after Napoleon III installed a Hapsburg ruler there.)
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 75,197

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    Blinkered view

    AfD + BSW+Linke is 33%.

    So a third of Germans are voting for the extremes.

    Politically something is going wrong.
    A third of the US is hardcore MAGA.
    Seems to be a thing.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 4,325
    Eabhal said:

    What would happen if 21 parties all got 4.8% of the vote?

    There is also the 3 seat rule, whereby 3 direct election seats mean no 5% bar for them.
  • kamskikamski Posts: 6,155

    kamski said:

    kamski said:

    A bit of a shite electoral system where the make up of the government depends on whether a fringe party achieved 4.9% or 5% of the vote.

    And a combined vote total of 45% resulting in an absolute majority of seats ain't PR as far as I'm concerned.

    But still better than FPTP, mind!

    Which system is better?
    d'Hondt with minimum 8 member constituencies and candidate order determined by party primaries.
    But one of your complaints was

    "a combined vote total of 45% resulting in an absolute majority of seats ain't PR as far as I'm concerned."

    Your system could easily have the same problem, or worse.
    But I am not advocating a national PR system, just multi-member local PR.

    If we had a fully proportional national list system, I would be comfortable with that, but I am aware that some people value local representation, hence my compromise of constituencies big enough that the result can be fairly represented by who gets elected.
    Fine. But you can't really complain about the lack of total proportionality in PR system with a 5% hurdle, if your preferred system also isn't totally proportional. Indeed it has a higher local hurdle.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 23,769
    viewcode said:

    Leon said:

    Tomorrow I have to write about China for the Knapper’s Gazette

    No idea what to say. I might say that young Chinese women have surprisingly big hooters - which they do - but I’m not sure I can maintain that level of sophisticated political analysis over 1200 words

    Ideas welcome

    @Leon, try Zeihan on China: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL6zWQZTGKO4bsLwepXQSer8WJA5fWkTVo
    Asianometry is good but the videos are very long and dense, so you will not probably assimilate it in time
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,141
    CDU/CSU down to 28.4% on the ZDF projection with FDP and BSW possibly making the cut.

    https://www.zdf.de/nachrichten
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,047

    If the CDU/CSU head down towards 28% it will weaken their bargaining position.

    It'd have been nice if they'd topped 30%, psychologically.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 44,871
    kinabalu said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    And yet the centre left - for so long dominant in Germany - have fallen BEHIND the Far Right

    Because this was all being predicted by the polls it seems shrug-worthy. It is not. It is seismic
    The Uniparty have won the election.
    In German terms the Greens really belong in the centre left too. I’d say they fit the niche that the Lib Dems plus the rural NIMBY greens have in Britain. Plus a touch of idiocy on nuclear power just to pep things up a bit.

    I would cross reference as follows:

    CDU/CSU: @Big_G_NorthWales and @MarqueeMark plus blue wall former Tory Lib Dems plus some Blairites
    SPD: @OnlyLivingBoy, some Blairites plus a chunk of Lib Dems
    Green: @SandyRentool, UK rural Green Party plus some soft left and the greener Lib Dems
    Linke: @NickPalmer , the nicer Corbynites, and the NUS
    BSW: @bigjohnowls plus some of our Saturday visitors
    AfD: Reform plus a bit of EDL
    FDP: @BartholomewRoberts
    No PBers for the AfD? Hmm, not sure about that.
    @Leon, @williamglenn and @Sandpit would be for AfD IMV.

    I might be being unfair on one of them in that...
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,047

    First-time voters:

    https://x.com/wahlen_de/status/1893722905793499287

    LINKE: 27% (+19)
    AfD: 19% (+13)
    Union: 14% (+4)
    SPD: 13% (-2)
    GRÜNE: 11% (-12)
    BSW: 6% (NEU)
    FDP: 5% (-18)

    So, over 50% of first time voters for nutcase parties.

    Great.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,047
    Leon said:

    Tomorrow I have to write about China for the Knapper’s Gazette

    No idea what to say. I might say that young Chinese women have surprisingly big hooters - which they do - but I’m not sure I can maintain that level of sophisticated political analysis over 1200 words

    Ideas welcome

    Er, do they?

    I only ever slept with one Chinese woman, and she didn't; I can't recall ever noticing any other Chinese women being obviously mammorific.

    Han feet and hands can be a bit odd, though. Boney.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 44,295
    Leon said:

    Tomorrow I have to write about China for the Knapper’s Gazette

    No idea what to say. I might say that young Chinese women have surprisingly big hooters - which they do - but I’m not sure I can maintain that level of sophisticated political analysis over 1200 words

    Ideas welcome

    Big subject!

    Is somebody off sick?
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 23,769
    viewcode said:

    viewcode said:

    Leon said:

    Tomorrow I have to write about China for the Knapper’s Gazette

    No idea what to say. I might say that young Chinese women have surprisingly big hooters - which they do - but I’m not sure I can maintain that level of sophisticated political analysis over 1200 words

    Ideas welcome

    @Leon, try Zeihan on China: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL6zWQZTGKO4bsLwepXQSer8WJA5fWkTVo
    Asianometry is good but the videos are very long and dense, so you will not probably assimilate it in time
    Viewcode
    Good evening CoPilot. I have an acquaintance who needs a brief analysis of China's politics in 2025. He is an arts graduate who can understand reasonably complex English. Can you recommend a useful briefing paper, article or video for him?

    CoPilot
    Good evening! Here are a few resources that provide a comprehensive analysis of China's politics in 2025: These resources should provide a solid understanding of the current political climate in China. If you need more information or have any other questions, feel free to ask!

    Viewcode
    Thank you CoPilot. You have been very useful
  • TimSTimS Posts: 14,439
    kinabalu said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    And yet the centre left - for so long dominant in Germany - have fallen BEHIND the Far Right

    Because this was all being predicted by the polls it seems shrug-worthy. It is not. It is seismic
    The Uniparty have won the election.
    In German terms the Greens really belong in the centre left too. I’d say they fit the niche that the Lib Dems plus the rural NIMBY greens have in Britain. Plus a touch of idiocy on nuclear power just to pep things up a bit.

    I would cross reference as follows:

    CDU/CSU: @Big_G_NorthWales and @MarqueeMark plus blue wall former Tory Lib Dems plus some Blairites
    SPD: @OnlyLivingBoy, some Blairites plus a chunk of Lib Dems
    Green: @SandyRentool, UK rural Green Party plus some soft left and the greener Lib Dems
    Linke: @NickPalmer , the nicer Corbynites, and the NUS
    BSW: @bigjohnowls plus some of our Saturday visitors
    AfD: Reform plus a bit of EDL
    FDP: @BartholomewRoberts
    No PBers for the AfD? Hmm, not sure about that.
    I would like to think none of this forum are really neo nazis. Which is what the AfD are. Of an order of magnitude nastier than Reform or RN.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,047
    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    And yet the centre left - for so long dominant in Germany - have fallen BEHIND the Far Right

    Because this was all being predicted by the polls it seems shrug-worthy. It is not. It is seismic
    The Uniparty have won the election.
    In German terms the Greens really belong in the centre left too. I’d say they fit the niche that the Lib Dems plus the rural NIMBY greens have in Britain. Plus a touch of idiocy on nuclear power just to pep things up a bit.

    I would cross reference as follows:

    CDU/CSU: @Big_G_NorthWales and @MarqueeMark plus blue wall former Tory Lib Dems plus some Blairites
    SPD: @OnlyLivingBoy, some Blairites plus a chunk of Lib Dems
    Green: @SandyRentool, UK rural Green Party plus some soft left and the greener Lib Dems
    Linke: @NickPalmer , the nicer Corbynites, and the NUS
    BSW: @bigjohnowls plus some of our Saturday visitors
    AfD: Reform plus a bit of EDL
    FDP: @BartholomewRoberts
    I don't know where I'd fit into that as a Shire Tory that is fairly right-wing.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 4,325
    boulay said:

    kamski said:

    boulay said:

    Leon said:

    Tomorrow I have to write about China for the Knapper’s Gazette

    No idea what to say. I might say that young Chinese women have surprisingly big hooters - which they do - but I’m not sure I can maintain that level of sophisticated political analysis over 1200 words

    Ideas welcome

    How about an article about why they named it after the stuff you make plates and cups out of.

    Why didn’t they call it “Gold” - is it a sign of a built-in Chinese modesty or was it an early sign that the Chinese recognised that the ordinary cheaper items would be their route to global trade dominance.

    I, for one, would like to know.
    You do realise it isn't called China in Chinese?
    Wait, what? Next you will be telling me that they named the material “China” after the country and not the other way round
    China the crockery is named after China Clay, a constituent. China Clay is named after Gaoling, where the first clay was mined. It's where Kaolin is named from.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,047
    TimS said:

    kinabalu said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    And yet the centre left - for so long dominant in Germany - have fallen BEHIND the Far Right

    Because this was all being predicted by the polls it seems shrug-worthy. It is not. It is seismic
    The Uniparty have won the election.
    In German terms the Greens really belong in the centre left too. I’d say they fit the niche that the Lib Dems plus the rural NIMBY greens have in Britain. Plus a touch of idiocy on nuclear power just to pep things up a bit.

    I would cross reference as follows:

    CDU/CSU: @Big_G_NorthWales and @MarqueeMark plus blue wall former Tory Lib Dems plus some Blairites
    SPD: @OnlyLivingBoy, some Blairites plus a chunk of Lib Dems
    Green: @SandyRentool, UK rural Green Party plus some soft left and the greener Lib Dems
    Linke: @NickPalmer , the nicer Corbynites, and the NUS
    BSW: @bigjohnowls plus some of our Saturday visitors
    AfD: Reform plus a bit of EDL
    FDP: @BartholomewRoberts
    No PBers for the AfD? Hmm, not sure about that.
    I would like to think none of this forum are really neo nazis. Which is what the AfD are. Of an order of magnitude nastier than Reform or RN.
    I lose track. There was a time when they were economically eurosceptic and just wanted the Deutschmark.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,816
    Andy_JS said:

    I wonder why the Left suddenly picked up support at the end of the campaign.

    Andy_JS said:

    I wonder why the Left suddenly picked up support at the end of the campaign.

    No one else for anti government leftists to vote for
    Eabhal said:

    What would happen if 21 parties all got 4.8% of the vote?

    You also get to keep your share if you win 3+ seats (of 299) on FPTP.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 44,295

    kinabalu said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    And yet the centre left - for so long dominant in Germany - have fallen BEHIND the Far Right

    Because this was all being predicted by the polls it seems shrug-worthy. It is not. It is seismic
    The Uniparty have won the election.
    In German terms the Greens really belong in the centre left too. I’d say they fit the niche that the Lib Dems plus the rural NIMBY greens have in Britain. Plus a touch of idiocy on nuclear power just to pep things up a bit.

    I would cross reference as follows:

    CDU/CSU: @Big_G_NorthWales and @MarqueeMark plus blue wall former Tory Lib Dems plus some Blairites
    SPD: @OnlyLivingBoy, some Blairites plus a chunk of Lib Dems
    Green: @SandyRentool, UK rural Green Party plus some soft left and the greener Lib Dems
    Linke: @NickPalmer , the nicer Corbynites, and the NUS
    BSW: @bigjohnowls plus some of our Saturday visitors
    AfD: Reform plus a bit of EDL
    FDP: @BartholomewRoberts
    No PBers for the AfD? Hmm, not sure about that.
    @Leon, @williamglenn and @Sandpit would be for AfD IMV.

    I might be being unfair on one of them in that...
    For sure the first two. Probably not the other one though.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 44,871
    If reparations are in order, and given Trump's 'negotiations' position:

    I want $5 trillion from the USA for our help in Afghanistan and Iraq after *they* were attacked.
    I want $50 trillion from Russia for our help in WW2 - given that they were on the side on the Nazi's for two years, when we fought alone.

    Seems fair.
  • TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    And yet the centre left - for so long dominant in Germany - have fallen BEHIND the Far Right

    Because this was all being predicted by the polls it seems shrug-worthy. It is not. It is seismic
    The Uniparty have won the election.
    In German terms the Greens really belong in the centre left too. I’d say they fit the niche that the Lib Dems plus the rural NIMBY greens have in Britain. Plus a touch of idiocy on nuclear power just to pep things up a bit.

    I would cross reference as follows:

    CDU/CSU: @Big_G_NorthWales and @MarqueeMark plus blue wall former Tory Lib Dems plus some Blairites
    SPD: @OnlyLivingBoy, some Blairites plus a chunk of Lib Dems
    Green: @SandyRentool, UK rural Green Party plus some soft left and the greener Lib Dems
    Linke: @NickPalmer , the nicer Corbynites, and the NUS
    BSW: @bigjohnowls plus some of our Saturday visitors
    AfD: Reform plus a bit of EDL
    FDP: @BartholomewRoberts
    I don't know where I'd fit into that as a Shire Tory that is fairly right-wing.
    CSU rather than CDU, perhaps? It's an odd quirk in the German setup, to be sure.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 4,325
    TimS said:

    kinabalu said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    And yet the centre left - for so long dominant in Germany - have fallen BEHIND the Far Right

    Because this was all being predicted by the polls it seems shrug-worthy. It is not. It is seismic
    The Uniparty have won the election.
    In German terms the Greens really belong in the centre left too. I’d say they fit the niche that the Lib Dems plus the rural NIMBY greens have in Britain. Plus a touch of idiocy on nuclear power just to pep things up a bit.

    I would cross reference as follows:

    CDU/CSU: @Big_G_NorthWales and @MarqueeMark plus blue wall former Tory Lib Dems plus some Blairites
    SPD: @OnlyLivingBoy, some Blairites plus a chunk of Lib Dems
    Green: @SandyRentool, UK rural Green Party plus some soft left and the greener Lib Dems
    Linke: @NickPalmer , the nicer Corbynites, and the NUS
    BSW: @bigjohnowls plus some of our Saturday visitors
    AfD: Reform plus a bit of EDL
    FDP: @BartholomewRoberts
    No PBers for the AfD? Hmm, not sure about that.
    I would like to think none of this forum are really neo nazis. Which is what the AfD are. Of an order of magnitude nastier than Reform or RN.
    The navy isn't that bad nowadays I think.

    :smiley:
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,558
    kamski said:

    kamski said:

    kamski said:

    A bit of a shite electoral system where the make up of the government depends on whether a fringe party achieved 4.9% or 5% of the vote.

    And a combined vote total of 45% resulting in an absolute majority of seats ain't PR as far as I'm concerned.

    But still better than FPTP, mind!

    Which system is better?
    d'Hondt with minimum 8 member constituencies and candidate order determined by party primaries.
    But one of your complaints was

    "a combined vote total of 45% resulting in an absolute majority of seats ain't PR as far as I'm concerned."

    Your system could easily have the same problem, or worse.
    But I am not advocating a national PR system, just multi-member local PR.

    If we had a fully proportional national list system, I would be comfortable with that, but I am aware that some people value local representation, hence my compromise of constituencies big enough that the result can be fairly represented by who gets elected.
    Fine. But you can't really complain about the lack of total proportionality in PR system with a 5% hurdle, if your preferred system also isn't totally proportional. Indeed it has a higher local hurdle.
    The hurdle distorts what aims to be a nationally fully proportional system.

    While I can understand why the hurdle is there, to keep cranks and extremists out of parliament, it doesn't exactly work when such parties get 20% of the vote, and a relatively mainstream party ends up being excluded.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 9,328

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    But add in the Commies and they are close to 30% (die linke)
  • @MoonRabbit I believe it was you that had a theory that Liverpool's second half of the season was going to be much tougher than the first half due to the away fixtures remaining - which didn't make any sense to me as already by that stage Arsenal were the only viable rival and their second half meeting is at Anfield.

    With 11 point lead (albeit Arsenal have a game in hand and 11 remaining games I wonder if you still stand by that theory? Especially since interestingly the remaining fixtures not only include hosting Arsenal at Anfield, but 7 of Liverpool's 11 remaining fixtures are at Anfield.

    Of course its still "only February" but we're actually only 2 fixtures away from April now.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 14,439

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    And yet the centre left - for so long dominant in Germany - have fallen BEHIND the Far Right

    Because this was all being predicted by the polls it seems shrug-worthy. It is not. It is seismic
    The Uniparty have won the election.
    In German terms the Greens really belong in the centre left too. I’d say they fit the niche that the Lib Dems plus the rural NIMBY greens have in Britain. Plus a touch of idiocy on nuclear power just to pep things up a bit.

    I would cross reference as follows:

    CDU/CSU: @Big_G_NorthWales and @MarqueeMark plus blue wall former Tory Lib Dems plus some Blairites
    SPD: @OnlyLivingBoy, some Blairites plus a chunk of Lib Dems
    Green: @SandyRentool, UK rural Green Party plus some soft left and the greener Lib Dems
    Linke: @NickPalmer , the nicer Corbynites, and the NUS
    BSW: @bigjohnowls plus some of our Saturday visitors
    AfD: Reform plus a bit of EDL
    FDP: @BartholomewRoberts
    I don't know where I'd fit into that as a Shire Tory that is fairly right-wing.
    A Merzite CDUer.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,047

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    And yet the centre left - for so long dominant in Germany - have fallen BEHIND the Far Right

    Because this was all being predicted by the polls it seems shrug-worthy. It is not. It is seismic
    The Uniparty have won the election.
    In German terms the Greens really belong in the centre left too. I’d say they fit the niche that the Lib Dems plus the rural NIMBY greens have in Britain. Plus a touch of idiocy on nuclear power just to pep things up a bit.

    I would cross reference as follows:

    CDU/CSU: @Big_G_NorthWales and @MarqueeMark plus blue wall former Tory Lib Dems plus some Blairites
    SPD: @OnlyLivingBoy, some Blairites plus a chunk of Lib Dems
    Green: @SandyRentool, UK rural Green Party plus some soft left and the greener Lib Dems
    Linke: @NickPalmer , the nicer Corbynites, and the NUS
    BSW: @bigjohnowls plus some of our Saturday visitors
    AfD: Reform plus a bit of EDL
    FDP: @BartholomewRoberts
    I don't know where I'd fit into that as a Shire Tory that is fairly right-wing.
    CSU rather than CDU, perhaps? It's an odd quirk in the German setup, to be sure.
    Yeah, probably - although I'm not Catholic if it's chiefly about that.

    That said, I'm also not German.
  • kinabalu said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    And yet the centre left - for so long dominant in Germany - have fallen BEHIND the Far Right

    Because this was all being predicted by the polls it seems shrug-worthy. It is not. It is seismic
    The Uniparty have won the election.
    In German terms the Greens really belong in the centre left too. I’d say they fit the niche that the Lib Dems plus the rural NIMBY greens have in Britain. Plus a touch of idiocy on nuclear power just to pep things up a bit.

    I would cross reference as follows:

    CDU/CSU: @Big_G_NorthWales and @MarqueeMark plus blue wall former Tory Lib Dems plus some Blairites
    SPD: @OnlyLivingBoy, some Blairites plus a chunk of Lib Dems
    Green: @SandyRentool, UK rural Green Party plus some soft left and the greener Lib Dems
    Linke: @NickPalmer , the nicer Corbynites, and the NUS
    BSW: @bigjohnowls plus some of our Saturday visitors
    AfD: Reform plus a bit of EDL
    FDP: @BartholomewRoberts
    No PBers for the AfD? Hmm, not sure about that.
    @Leon
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,642

    kamski said:

    kamski said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    It's too early to say precisely. The ZDF exit poll has them on 20.0%.
    No, they have them on 20%
    Actually 19.8%
    apologise, they have now published to 1 decimal place.

    :smiley:
    so the fdp and bsw could be polling 4.95, which may be splitting herrs, but is crucial in this case.
    Well given there's a 0.9% difference in the exit polls for the Greens, I don't think we need to worry about such precision at this point!
    normally I would agree, but in this case 4.95% means 0 seats, and 5.00% means 32 seats, which can have a bearing on the coalition numbers
    There is also an exemption from the 5% rule for parties that do particularly well in 3 constituencies, as I recall. Not sure that's relevant here for the FDP or BSW, though.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 44,295
    TimS said:

    kinabalu said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    And yet the centre left - for so long dominant in Germany - have fallen BEHIND the Far Right

    Because this was all being predicted by the polls it seems shrug-worthy. It is not. It is seismic
    The Uniparty have won the election.
    In German terms the Greens really belong in the centre left too. I’d say they fit the niche that the Lib Dems plus the rural NIMBY greens have in Britain. Plus a touch of idiocy on nuclear power just to pep things up a bit.

    I would cross reference as follows:

    CDU/CSU: @Big_G_NorthWales and @MarqueeMark plus blue wall former Tory Lib Dems plus some Blairites
    SPD: @OnlyLivingBoy, some Blairites plus a chunk of Lib Dems
    Green: @SandyRentool, UK rural Green Party plus some soft left and the greener Lib Dems
    Linke: @NickPalmer , the nicer Corbynites, and the NUS
    BSW: @bigjohnowls plus some of our Saturday visitors
    AfD: Reform plus a bit of EDL
    FDP: @BartholomewRoberts
    No PBers for the AfD? Hmm, not sure about that.
    I would like to think none of this forum are really neo nazis. Which is what the AfD are. Of an order of magnitude nastier than Reform or RN.
    Well Leon and Glenners were rooting for them in this election. Guess it could be for 'sophisticated' reasons.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,398
    edited February 23
    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    And yet the centre left - for so long dominant in Germany - have fallen BEHIND the Far Right

    Because this was all being predicted by the polls it seems shrug-worthy. It is not. It is seismic
    The Uniparty have won the election.
    In German terms the Greens really belong in the centre left too. I’d say they fit the niche that the Lib Dems plus the rural NIMBY greens have in Britain. Plus a touch of idiocy on nuclear power just to pep things up a bit.

    I would cross reference as follows:

    CDU/CSU: @Big_G_NorthWales and @MarqueeMark plus blue wall former Tory Lib Dems plus some Blairites
    SPD: @OnlyLivingBoy, some Blairites plus a chunk of Lib Dems
    Green: @SandyRentool, UK rural Green Party plus some soft left and the greener Lib Dems
    Linke: @NickPalmer , the nicer Corbynites, and the NUS
    BSW: @bigjohnowls plus some of our Saturday visitors
    AfD: Reform plus a bit of EDL
    FDP: @BartholomewRoberts
    The FDP are fanatically pro-EU, even by Germany's neurotic standards, which I think isn't really how I'd describe Bartholomew, although he can of course contradict me if I've misunderstood his positions. Basically, like many Krauts, they think that economic wisdom involves dumping German exports on other European countries, and damn the consequences for economic instability or financial solvency there.

    But I doubt he, or very many other posters on here, strive for a European federal state as the FDP does.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,234
    Fox news reports 'Former world leader explains why 'people are envious of what's happening in the US' (world leader in question is Liz Truss)

    https://www.foxnews.com/
  • Leon said:

    Tomorrow I have to write about China for the Knapper’s Gazette

    No idea what to say. I might say that young Chinese women have surprisingly big hooters - which they do - but I’m not sure I can maintain that level of sophisticated political analysis over 1200 words

    Ideas welcome

    Er, do they?

    I only ever slept with one Chinese woman, and she didn't; I can't recall ever noticing any other Chinese women being obviously mammorific.

    Han feet and hands can be a bit odd, though. Boney.
    The Chinese women Leon has encountered may be a niche subsection.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,831
    Belatedly and off topic, the Sunday Rawnsley:

    While a fusillade of blistering Trump attacks have been launched against other countries – among them places as various as Canada, Denmark, Mexico and Panama – the UK has so far avoided being whacked.

    Nobody sentient in Number 10, the Foreign Office or the Ministry of Defence is relaxed now. Not after what has been unleashed over the past 10 days. As a doctrine, “Don’t poke the beast” only worked for so long as the beast chose not to bite off your leg regardless. One question accompanying the prime minister across the Atlantic is how “ballsy” he is prepared to be when he is up close and personal with the US president. Should Trump repeat his smears about Ukraine, the prime minister will have a choice to make. If he responds meekly or mutely, it will be at the great risk of looking pathetically pusillanimous. If he calls it out as a calumny, it will be at the serious peril of making himself the target of the fiery wrath of this thin-skinned and vindictive US president.

    I’m told that the prime minister will contend to the president that leaving Europe insecure will undermine the strategic position of the US because it will embolden aggressive moves by China and strengthen Beijing’s ties with Moscow, exactly the opposite of what Washington wants. Sir Keir will also make the case that Europe is now heeding Trump on taking more responsibility for its own security.

    Diplomats reckon that there is one approach with the greatest potential to have traction on this occupant of the Oval Office. That is to appeal to his ego and self-interest with the warning that a dirty carve-up of Ukraine on the Kremlin’s terms will project Putin as the apex predator and leave the US president looking like a weak dupe. Kim Darroch, a former UK ambassador to the US, suggests: “If I were Starmer, I would say to Trump that this is your chance for your place in history, the man who brought peace and ended this war. But it has to be a fair deal. If it’s a bad deal, you are not going to get that praise, you are going to get a load of criticism and that will be your record in the history books.”

    Vanity is one of the more reliable traits of Donald Trump. Leaning into his narcissism may be undignified, but it may also be essential if Sir Keir is to come home from Washington with anything that he can call a success.



  • HYUFD said:

    Outgoing Chancellor Scholz calls the result 'a bitter election result for the SPD' while still thanking party workers for their efforts

    He was effing useless and will not be missed.

    Th SPD will be looking a new leader
    Scholz was still better than Merkel and Schroeder.

    Or rather not as bad.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 4,325

    kamski said:

    kamski said:

    kamski said:

    A bit of a shite electoral system where the make up of the government depends on whether a fringe party achieved 4.9% or 5% of the vote.

    And a combined vote total of 45% resulting in an absolute majority of seats ain't PR as far as I'm concerned.

    But still better than FPTP, mind!

    Which system is better?
    d'Hondt with minimum 8 member constituencies and candidate order determined by party primaries.
    But one of your complaints was

    "a combined vote total of 45% resulting in an absolute majority of seats ain't PR as far as I'm concerned."

    Your system could easily have the same problem, or worse.
    But I am not advocating a national PR system, just multi-member local PR.

    If we had a fully proportional national list system, I would be comfortable with that, but I am aware that some people value local representation, hence my compromise of constituencies big enough that the result can be fairly represented by who gets elected.
    Fine. But you can't really complain about the lack of total proportionality in PR system with a 5% hurdle, if your preferred system also isn't totally proportional. Indeed it has a higher local hurdle.
    The hurdle distorts what aims to be a nationally fully proportional system.

    While I can understand why the hurdle is there, to keep cranks and extremists out of parliament, it doesn't exactly work when such parties get 20% of the vote, and a relatively mainstream party ends up being excluded.
    It's the numbers really. The FDP never concentrates their vote. They are nowhere near winning a direct seat, whereas the AFD, Linke and Greens all concentrate in some seats. This means the 5% rule is not as stressful for them.

    A bit like why the Libdems did well last year, they concentrated a lot of their vote.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,141
    IanB2 said:

    I’m told that the prime minister will contend to the president that leaving Europe insecure will undermine the strategic position of the US because it will embolden aggressive moves by China and strengthen Beijing’s ties with Moscow, exactly the opposite of what Washington wants. Sir Keir will also make the case that Europe is now heeding Trump on taking more responsibility for its own security.

    The problem is that this comes across as patronising. It's not as though this position isn't well-represented within the internal policy debate in the US.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,558
    I'd certainly be more comfortable voting for the German Greens than the outfit we have over here.

    With Scholtz's weak position over Ukraine, I'd probably vote Green ahead of SPD.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 9,328

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    It's too early to say precisely. The ZDF exit poll has them on 20.0%.
    No, they have them on 20%
    No

    image
    I think that’s a mistake by whoever created the graphic.

    I know it’s Germany and all that, but each party ending up with 0.0 or 0.5 is just too neat to be plausible

  • kamskikamski Posts: 6,155
    edited February 23

    First-time voters:

    https://x.com/wahlen_de/status/1893722905793499287

    LINKE: 27% (+19)
    AfD: 19% (+13)
    Union: 14% (+4)
    SPD: 13% (-2)
    GRÜNE: 11% (-12)
    BSW: 6% (NEU)
    FDP: 5% (-18)

    So, over 50% of first time voters for nutcase parties.

    Great.
    Because most young people get their information from social media. And they even think it's more honest than "mainstream" media.

    I would block twitter for a start, it's just shitty propaganda from a psycho foreign power-mad oligarch. Wouldn't be losing anything of value.
  • IanB2 said:

    Belatedly and off topic, the Sunday Rawnsley:

    While a fusillade of blistering Trump attacks have been launched against other countries – among them places as various as Canada, Denmark, Mexico and Panama – the UK has so far avoided being whacked.

    Nobody sentient in Number 10, the Foreign Office or the Ministry of Defence is relaxed now. Not after what has been unleashed over the past 10 days. As a doctrine, “Don’t poke the beast” only worked for so long as the beast chose not to bite off your leg regardless. One question accompanying the prime minister across the Atlantic is how “ballsy” he is prepared to be when he is up close and personal with the US president. Should Trump repeat his smears about Ukraine, the prime minister will have a choice to make. If he responds meekly or mutely, it will be at the great risk of looking pathetically pusillanimous. If he calls it out as a calumny, it will be at the serious peril of making himself the target of the fiery wrath of this thin-skinned and vindictive US president.

    I’m told that the prime minister will contend to the president that leaving Europe insecure will undermine the strategic position of the US because it will embolden aggressive moves by China and strengthen Beijing’s ties with Moscow, exactly the opposite of what Washington wants. Sir Keir will also make the case that Europe is now heeding Trump on taking more responsibility for its own security.

    Diplomats reckon that there is one approach with the greatest potential to have traction on this occupant of the Oval Office. That is to appeal to his ego and self-interest with the warning that a dirty carve-up of Ukraine on the Kremlin’s terms will project Putin as the apex predator and leave the US president looking like a weak dupe. Kim Darroch, a former UK ambassador to the US, suggests: “If I were Starmer, I would say to Trump that this is your chance for your place in history, the man who brought peace and ended this war. But it has to be a fair deal. If it’s a bad deal, you are not going to get that praise, you are going to get a load of criticism and that will be your record in the history books.”

    Vanity is one of the more reliable traits of Donald Trump. Leaning into his narcissism may be undignified, but it may also be essential if Sir Keir is to come home from Washington with anything that he can call a success.



    Tell Trump that Moscow needs to give$1tr damages to Ukraine.

    50% of which will then be remitted to the USA.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 14,439
    Fishing said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    And yet the centre left - for so long dominant in Germany - have fallen BEHIND the Far Right

    Because this was all being predicted by the polls it seems shrug-worthy. It is not. It is seismic
    The Uniparty have won the election.
    In German terms the Greens really belong in the centre left too. I’d say they fit the niche that the Lib Dems plus the rural NIMBY greens have in Britain. Plus a touch of idiocy on nuclear power just to pep things up a bit.

    I would cross reference as follows:

    CDU/CSU: @Big_G_NorthWales and @MarqueeMark plus blue wall former Tory Lib Dems plus some Blairites
    SPD: @OnlyLivingBoy, some Blairites plus a chunk of Lib Dems
    Green: @SandyRentool, UK rural Green Party plus some soft left and the greener Lib Dems
    Linke: @NickPalmer , the nicer Corbynites, and the NUS
    BSW: @bigjohnowls plus some of our Saturday visitors
    AfD: Reform plus a bit of EDL
    FDP: @BartholomewRoberts
    The FDP are fanatically pro-EU, even by Germany's neurotic standards, which I think isn't really how I'd describe Bartholomew, although he can of course contradict me if I've misunderstood his positions. Basically, like many Krauts, they think that economic wisdom involves dumping German exports on other European countries, and damn the consequences for economic instability or financial solvency there.

    But I doubt he, or very many other posters on here, strive for a European federal state as the FDP does.
    A pro-EU Barty bobs.

    This is of course the difficulty with cross referencing. I don’t know what I’d be in Germany. I’d probably float between CDU, SDP, FDP and Grune. I know I’d be a Macroniste in France and Democrat in the US but beyond that it’s hard to translate.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 23,769
    viewcode said:

    viewcode said:

    Exit poll percentages

    SPD 16% (-9.7)
    CDU/CSU 29% (+4.9)
    Green 13.5% (-1.2)
    FDP 4.9% (-6.5)
    AFD 19.5% (+9.1)
    Left 8.5% (+3.6)
    BSW 4.7 (+4.7)
    Others 3.9% (-4.8)

    Source https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoS6ifYUFeA
    Manually typed, so apologies for any errors

    Update at 18:55 German time/17:55 GMT

    SPD 16.2%
    CDU/CSU 28.9%
    Green 13.0%
    FDP 4.9%
    AFD 19.9%
    Left 8.5%
    BSW 4.8%
    Others 3.8%

    Source https://www.tagesschau.de/wahl/archiv/2025-02-23-BT-DE/charts/index-content/chart_1845701.shtml
    Manually typed, so apologies for any errors

    Update at 19:28 German time/18:28 GMT

    SPD 16.2%
    CDU/CSU 28.8%
    Green 12.7%
    FDP 4.9%
    AFD 20.2%
    Left 8.5%
    BSW 4.8%
    Others 3.9%

    Source https://www.tagesschau.de/wahl/archiv/2025-02-23-BT-DE/charts/index-content/chart_1846232.shtml
    Manually typed, so apologies for any errors
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,141

    HYUFD said:

    Outgoing Chancellor Scholz calls the result 'a bitter election result for the SPD' while still thanking party workers for their efforts

    He was effing useless and will not be missed.

    Th SPD will be looking a new leader
    Scholz was still better than Merkel and Schroeder.

    Or rather not as bad.
    One thing about Merkel is that she did come down decisively on one side once she shifted her position on something, so it's possible she would have been more effective in making the Zeitenwende happen than Scholz was.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 44,871
    Leon said:

    Tomorrow I have to write about China for the Knapper’s Gazette

    No idea what to say. I might say that young Chinese women have surprisingly big hooters - which they do - but I’m not sure I can maintain that level of sophisticated political analysis over 1200 words

    Ideas welcome

    I can give you a little anecdote, oddly addressing your 'surprisingly big hooters' anecdote.

    We had an engineer come over from HK. He had travelled extensively in Asia (China, Japan, Korea, etc), but never been to Europe. When he joined our company, he came over for a fortnight's indoctrination.

    A colleague took him into London for the first weekend. Being from HK, the engineer knew English, but not perfectly. On the Monday, I asked him how he had found London.

    He said: "Your women, they are so..." and then he put his hands up to his chest and made 'large' motions. After we had stopped laughing, we managed to work out he meant "provocatively dressed'. In other words, they showed cleavage.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 4,325
    TimS said:

    Fishing said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    And yet the centre left - for so long dominant in Germany - have fallen BEHIND the Far Right

    Because this was all being predicted by the polls it seems shrug-worthy. It is not. It is seismic
    The Uniparty have won the election.
    In German terms the Greens really belong in the centre left too. I’d say they fit the niche that the Lib Dems plus the rural NIMBY greens have in Britain. Plus a touch of idiocy on nuclear power just to pep things up a bit.

    I would cross reference as follows:

    CDU/CSU: @Big_G_NorthWales and @MarqueeMark plus blue wall former Tory Lib Dems plus some Blairites
    SPD: @OnlyLivingBoy, some Blairites plus a chunk of Lib Dems
    Green: @SandyRentool, UK rural Green Party plus some soft left and the greener Lib Dems
    Linke: @NickPalmer , the nicer Corbynites, and the NUS
    BSW: @bigjohnowls plus some of our Saturday visitors
    AfD: Reform plus a bit of EDL
    FDP: @BartholomewRoberts
    The FDP are fanatically pro-EU, even by Germany's neurotic standards, which I think isn't really how I'd describe Bartholomew, although he can of course contradict me if I've misunderstood his positions. Basically, like many Krauts, they think that economic wisdom involves dumping German exports on other European countries, and damn the consequences for economic instability or financial solvency there.

    But I doubt he, or very many other posters on here, strive for a European federal state as the FDP does.
    A pro-EU Barty bobs.

    This is of course the difficulty with cross referencing. I don’t know what I’d be in Germany. I’d probably float between CDU, SDP, FDP and Grune. I know I’d be a Macroniste in France and Democrat in the US but beyond that it’s hard to translate.
    I think I would have to go Green as the FDP in Germany is nothing like today's Libdems.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,831


    Leon said:

    Tomorrow I have to write about China for the Knapper’s Gazette

    No idea what to say. I might say that young Chinese women have surprisingly big hooters - which they do - but I’m not sure I can maintain that level of sophisticated political analysis over 1200 words

    Ideas welcome

    Er, do they?

    I only ever slept with one Chinese woman, and she didn't; I can't recall ever noticing any other Chinese women being obviously mammorific.

    Han feet and hands can be a bit odd, though. Boney.
    The Chinese women Leon has encountered may be a niche subsection.
    Leon really shouldn’t go using a part of his own anatomy as the measuring stick.
  • dunhamdunham Posts: 9
    IanB2 said:

    Belatedly and off topic, the Sunday Rawnsley:

    While a fusillade of blistering Trump attacks have been launched against other countries – among them places as various as Canada, Denmark, Mexico and Panama – the UK has so far avoided being whacked.

    Nobody sentient in Number 10, the Foreign Office or the Ministry of Defence is relaxed now. Not after what has been unleashed over the past 10 days. As a doctrine, “Don’t poke the beast” only worked for so long as the beast chose not to bite off your leg regardless. One question accompanying the prime minister across the Atlantic is how “ballsy” he is prepared to be when he is up close and personal with the US president. Should Trump repeat his smears about Ukraine, the prime minister will have a choice to make. If he responds meekly or mutely, it will be at the great risk of looking pathetically pusillanimous. If he calls it out as a calumny, it will be at the serious peril of making himself the target of the fiery wrath of this thin-skinned and vindictive US president.

    I’m told that the prime minister will contend to the president that leaving Europe insecure will undermine the strategic position of the US because it will embolden aggressive moves by China and strengthen Beijing’s ties with Moscow, exactly the opposite of what Washington wants. Sir Keir will also make the case that Europe is now heeding Trump on taking more responsibility for its own security.

    Diplomats reckon that there is one approach with the greatest potential to have traction on this occupant of the Oval Office. That is to appeal to his ego and self-interest with the warning that a dirty carve-up of Ukraine on the Kremlin’s terms will project Putin as the apex predator and leave the US president looking like a weak dupe. Kim Darroch, a former UK ambassador to the US, suggests: “If I were Starmer, I would say to Trump that this is your chance for your place in history, the man who brought peace and ended this war. But it has to be a fair deal. If it’s a bad deal, you are not going to get that praise, you are going to get a load of criticism and that will be your record in the history books.”

    Vanity is one of the more reliable traits of Donald Trump. Leaning into his narcissism may be undignified, but it may also be essential if Sir Keir is to come home from Washington with anything that he can call a success.



    If possible, it would be desirable for Starmer to educate Trump that VAT in the UK is a form of sales tax on all goods, whatever their origin, not a tariff just on imported goods, so does not discriminate against imports from the USA.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 4,325
    kamski said:

    First-time voters:

    https://x.com/wahlen_de/status/1893722905793499287

    LINKE: 27% (+19)
    AfD: 19% (+13)
    Union: 14% (+4)
    SPD: 13% (-2)
    GRÜNE: 11% (-12)
    BSW: 6% (NEU)
    FDP: 5% (-18)

    So, over 50% of first time voters for nutcase parties.

    Great.
    Because most young people get their information from social media. And they even think it's more honest than "mainstream" media.

    I would block twitter for a start, it's just shitty propaganda from a psycho foreign power-mad oligarch. Wouldn't be losing anything of value.
    ditto.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,047
    kamski said:

    First-time voters:

    https://x.com/wahlen_de/status/1893722905793499287

    LINKE: 27% (+19)
    AfD: 19% (+13)
    Union: 14% (+4)
    SPD: 13% (-2)
    GRÜNE: 11% (-12)
    BSW: 6% (NEU)
    FDP: 5% (-18)

    So, over 50% of first time voters for nutcase parties.

    Great.
    Because most young people get their information from social media. And they even think it's more honest than "mainstream" media.

    I would block twitter for a start, it's just shitty propaganda from a psycho foreign power-mad oligarch. Wouldn't be losing anything of value.
    Social media needs to be heavily regulated.

    And, no, it will never be.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 44,295
    Nigelb said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    Blinkered view

    AfD + BSW+Linke is 33%.

    So a third of Germans are voting for the extremes.

    Politically something is going wrong.
    A third of the US is hardcore MAGA.
    Seems to be a thing.
    And about a half of the one third are in the gutter. That 15% crops up with genuine far right sentiment in poll after poll. Any populist party that can add a big slice of the general protest vote to that is in business.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,961

    First-time voters:

    https://x.com/wahlen_de/status/1893722905793499287

    LINKE: 27% (+19)
    AfD: 19% (+13)
    Union: 14% (+4)
    SPD: 13% (-2)
    GRÜNE: 11% (-12)
    BSW: 6% (NEU)
    FDP: 5% (-18)

    So KPD v NSDAP rerun to come?
    Tomorrow not belonging to the yokels on those numbers.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 9,328
    Leon said:

    The AfD is doubling its vote every five years or so. Ergo they will be the German government by the end of the decade

    Their share is far higher in the east and they have little traction in the west. Their ceiling is lower than you might hope
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 23,769
    viewcode said:

    viewcode said:

    Seat projection

    SPD 116
    CDU/CSU 211
    Greens 98
    AfD 142
    Left 62
    SSW 1

    630 seats, so 315ish needed for a majority

    SPD+Green+Left = 276 so won't work
    CDU/CSU + Green = 309 might work
    CDU/CSU+AfD = 353 so will work, but um...
    CDU/CSU+SPD = 327, which will work but be hysterical

    So there y'go. Musk bought another election. Bad Musk.

    Source https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoS6ifYUFeA
    Manually typed, so apologies for any errors

    Update at 18:55 German time/17:55 GMT Seat projection

    SPD 118
    CDU/CSU 210
    Greens 94
    AfD 145
    Left 62
    SSW 1

    630 seats, so 315ish needed for a majority

    Source https://www.tagesschau.de/wahl/archiv/2025-02-23-BT-DE/charts/index-content/chart_1845705.shtml
    Manually typed, so apologies for any errors
    Update at 19:28 German time/18:28 GMT

    SPD 118
    CDU/CSU 210
    Green 92
    AFD 147
    Left 62
    SSW 1

    630 seats, so 315ish needed for a majority

    Source https://www.tagesschau.de/wahl/archiv/2025-02-23-BT-DE/charts/index-content/chart_1846236.shtml
    Manually typed, so apologies for any errors

  • Fishing said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Thank fuck the AfD don't look like getting more than 20%.
    We can just about live with the neo-fascists being supported by only 1 in 5 voters.

    And yet the centre left - for so long dominant in Germany - have fallen BEHIND the Far Right

    Because this was all being predicted by the polls it seems shrug-worthy. It is not. It is seismic
    The Uniparty have won the election.
    In German terms the Greens really belong in the centre left too. I’d say they fit the niche that the Lib Dems plus the rural NIMBY greens have in Britain. Plus a touch of idiocy on nuclear power just to pep things up a bit.

    I would cross reference as follows:

    CDU/CSU: @Big_G_NorthWales and @MarqueeMark plus blue wall former Tory Lib Dems plus some Blairites
    SPD: @OnlyLivingBoy, some Blairites plus a chunk of Lib Dems
    Green: @SandyRentool, UK rural Green Party plus some soft left and the greener Lib Dems
    Linke: @NickPalmer , the nicer Corbynites, and the NUS
    BSW: @bigjohnowls plus some of our Saturday visitors
    AfD: Reform plus a bit of EDL
    FDP: @BartholomewRoberts
    The FDP are fanatically pro-EU, even by Germany's neurotic standards, which I think isn't really how I'd describe Bartholomew, although he can of course contradict me if I've misunderstood his positions. Basically, like many Krauts, they think that economic wisdom involves dumping German exports on other European countries, and damn the consequences for economic instability or financial solvency there.

    But I doubt he, or very many other posters on here, strive for a European federal state as the FDP does.
    From what I know of German parties (not much, admittedly) I would support the FDP if I were German.

    Germany's position in the EU isn't an issue like Britain's was. In addition my view of the EU is more nuanced than people think. I was pro EU until the referendum and only narrowly voted Leave, I could have voted Remain. But I'm passionately pro democracy more than anti EU.

    Having voted to Leave, we had to Leave in my eyes. That's been done now. Germany hasn't so voted, so it's not an issue there.

    Besides there is an integrity to believing in European federalism that I respect. If you want to have a federal state then argue that, if you don't, then don't hand the powers over but deny that's what you want.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 44,295
    dunham said:

    IanB2 said:

    Belatedly and off topic, the Sunday Rawnsley:

    While a fusillade of blistering Trump attacks have been launched against other countries – among them places as various as Canada, Denmark, Mexico and Panama – the UK has so far avoided being whacked.

    Nobody sentient in Number 10, the Foreign Office or the Ministry of Defence is relaxed now. Not after what has been unleashed over the past 10 days. As a doctrine, “Don’t poke the beast” only worked for so long as the beast chose not to bite off your leg regardless. One question accompanying the prime minister across the Atlantic is how “ballsy” he is prepared to be when he is up close and personal with the US president. Should Trump repeat his smears about Ukraine, the prime minister will have a choice to make. If he responds meekly or mutely, it will be at the great risk of looking pathetically pusillanimous. If he calls it out as a calumny, it will be at the serious peril of making himself the target of the fiery wrath of this thin-skinned and vindictive US president.

    I’m told that the prime minister will contend to the president that leaving Europe insecure will undermine the strategic position of the US because it will embolden aggressive moves by China and strengthen Beijing’s ties with Moscow, exactly the opposite of what Washington wants. Sir Keir will also make the case that Europe is now heeding Trump on taking more responsibility for its own security.

    Diplomats reckon that there is one approach with the greatest potential to have traction on this occupant of the Oval Office. That is to appeal to his ego and self-interest with the warning that a dirty carve-up of Ukraine on the Kremlin’s terms will project Putin as the apex predator and leave the US president looking like a weak dupe. Kim Darroch, a former UK ambassador to the US, suggests: “If I were Starmer, I would say to Trump that this is your chance for your place in history, the man who brought peace and ended this war. But it has to be a fair deal. If it’s a bad deal, you are not going to get that praise, you are going to get a load of criticism and that will be your record in the history books.”

    Vanity is one of the more reliable traits of Donald Trump. Leaning into his narcissism may be undignified, but it may also be essential if Sir Keir is to come home from Washington with anything that he can call a success.



    If possible, it would be desirable for Starmer to educate Trump that VAT in the UK is a form of sales tax on all goods, whatever their origin, not a tariff just on imported goods, so does not discriminate against imports from the USA.
    "Educate" Trump. Now there's a challenging assignment.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,234

    First-time voters:

    https://x.com/wahlen_de/status/1893722905793499287

    LINKE: 27% (+19)
    AfD: 19% (+13)
    Union: 14% (+4)
    SPD: 13% (-2)
    GRÜNE: 11% (-12)
    BSW: 6% (NEU)
    FDP: 5% (-18)

    So KPD v NSDAP rerun to come?
    Tomorrow not belonging to the yokels on those numbers.
    Young voters always vote more left than average and the far right tend to do better amongst young voters and voters of working age than pensioners, the latter have experience, are wary of extremes and have built up more capital
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 44,604
    IanB2 said:


    Leon said:

    Tomorrow I have to write about China for the Knapper’s Gazette

    No idea what to say. I might say that young Chinese women have surprisingly big hooters - which they do - but I’m not sure I can maintain that level of sophisticated political analysis over 1200 words

    Ideas welcome

    Er, do they?

    I only ever slept with one Chinese woman, and she didn't; I can't recall ever noticing any other Chinese women being obviously mammorific.

    Han feet and hands can be a bit odd, though. Boney.
    The Chinese women Leon has encountered may be a niche subsection.
    Leon really shouldn’t go using a part of his own anatomy as the measuring stick.
    Presumably it's rather more variable in length than the standard platinum-iridium bar they used to use (and that was bad enough - I know someone who knows about that sort of thing). So no.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 9,328

    That map in the header says a lot.

    The 34 years since reunification has (so far?) failed to erase the differences established during 45 years under Soviet rule.

    I think "failed to erase the differences" is perhaps the wrong way of looking at it. The way reunification was handled created new divisions all of its own.
    AIUI the young and ambitious headed west. Those left behind in the east (in both senses) saw their progress and felt
    embittered and voted to upset the apple cart. Originally Die Linke and increasingly AfD as those who remember the actual Nazis die off
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 53,988

    IanB2 said:

    I’m told that the prime minister will contend to the president that leaving Europe insecure will undermine the strategic position of the US because it will embolden aggressive moves by China and strengthen Beijing’s ties with Moscow, exactly the opposite of what Washington wants. Sir Keir will also make the case that Europe is now heeding Trump on taking more responsibility for its own security.

    The problem is that this comes across as patronising. It's not as though this position isn't well-represented within the internal policy debate in the US.
    Pretty much everything you say to Trump is going to be patronising.

    Either that or incredibly rude. Thems the choices.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,766
    .
    kamski said:

    boulay said:

    Leon said:

    Tomorrow I have to write about China for the Knapper’s Gazette

    No idea what to say. I might say that young Chinese women have surprisingly big hooters - which they do - but I’m not sure I can maintain that level of sophisticated political analysis over 1200 words

    Ideas welcome

    How about an article about why they named it after the stuff you make plates and cups out of.

    Why didn’t they call it “Gold” - is it a sign of a built-in Chinese modesty or was it an early sign that the Chinese recognised that the ordinary cheaper items would be their route to global trade dominance.

    I, for one, would like to know.
    You do realise it isn't called China in Chinese?
    The name China probably came indirectly from the Qin dynasty (the terracotta warriors man). The Mandarin (north Chinese) name for Chinese is Han, the next dynasty, while the same name in Cantonese is Tong, or Tang, a much later dynasty reflecting the later colonisation of south China.

    So arguably it was called China in Chinese at one point.
This discussion has been closed.