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The Lib Dems could win a seat from 4th – politicalbetting.com

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  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,948
    edited May 24

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Anyone can read about WW2. This "distant in time" thing doesn't wash for me.
  • MonksfieldMonksfield Posts: 2,808
    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope
    ** Exclusive **
    Boris Johnson ally David Frost has been banned from standing as Tory candidate in the general election, I understand.
    Lord Frost was told yesterday that he cannot apply for any of the 93 vacant seats where the party is yet to nominate a candidate for the July 4 general election, according to his friends.
    Frost is a low tax Tory who was one of the architects of former Prime Minister Boris Johnson's Brexit deal.
    He was described as "the great Frost" by Johnson for his work on the deal.

    This has had me scratching my head for ages. If he wanted to be an MP, why did he take a life peerage. He really is thick as mince.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,514

    ToryJim said:

    Another Tory flees the battlefield. Greg Clark standing down. Just how many disgusteds are there in his seat?

    Thats about 75 of them now and oddly they wont let David Frost stand.
    Ah yes, the man who said leaving the Single Market would be a disaster and then negotiated a deal which he now thinks is rubbish.
    Maybe he should join Labour, the party headed by the bloke who supported Jezza and then said he didnt agree with anything he previously campaigned on,
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 11,468
    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Anyone can read about WW2. This "distant in time" thing doesn't wash for me.
    Anyone can read about ancient Rome too. Just because you can read about it, doesn't stop it feeling distant in time.
  • GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,860
    While we know a GE precipitates a lot of MPs standing down voluntarily, I'd be interested in seeing some numbers on the rate of this prior to a change in government. IIRC 2010 saw a lot, as did 97. There does seem to be more than usual this time.

    Of course, correlation/causation applies but still.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,514
    Scott_xP said:

    ToryJim said:

    Another Tory flees the battlefield. Greg Clark standing down. Just how many disgusteds are there in his seat?

    Thats about 75 of them now and oddly they wont let David Frost stand.
    Forsty the NoMan is free to stand as soon as he resigns from the gravy train HoL, which he hasn't done...
    Scott well done !

    Thats two of your own tweets in a day. Keep them coming.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,240
    ToryJim said:

    Looks like Craig Mackinley is to stand down. It was probably inevitable when you return to work after a life threatening illness and the first thing your boss does is tell you you’re going to have to reapply for your job.

    I think a kindness. Mackinnley would certainly lose his seat, although they can't admit it. This way it removes any obligation on him for a gruelling campaign for no purpose, when he should be rehabilitating.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,963

    Andy_JS said:

    ToryJim said:

    Another Tory flees the battlefield. Greg Clark standing down. Just how many disgusteds are there in his seat?

    Will Boris be tempted?
    Its probably about the only chance they've got.
    Yes, Boris should Bruce Ismay himself onto a seat. Last second. Then the remaining weeks of the campaign can be all about HIM which is only fitting for the world king and people's PM.
    Missed you earlier this morning as Mrs B dragged me out shopping.

    Though we often disagree can I wish you the best of luck in the coming campaign and hope you get elected.
    Very kind of you.

    Had no idea you believed in miracles!
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,972
    Taz said:

    Sandpit said:

    Andy_JS said:

    More tears at the PO inquiry.

    Oh no, how awful this whole process must be for Mrs Vennells…

    F**k off you bitch, you’re looking at serious prison time.
    Hold on, as we learnt from Rogerdamus the other day, she is the real victim here.

    Show some sympathy.
    Funnily enough I've just received a reply from Ch4 News. As you'll remember my complaint was that Alex Thompson had gone too far by lifting her umbrella as she was leaving the tribuneral and despite her being clearly upset showed no compassion whatsoever. So for your interest.........

    "Thank you for contacting Channel 4 Viewer Enquiries regarding Channel 4 News.

    In response to your comments regarding the interview by Alex Thompson, Channel 4 news have responded with the following: We have requested interviews with all the key Post Office Executives to ask questions about their knowledge of the scandal that unfolded. All the executives have been elusive or refused to be held to account publicly. Channel 4 News has been at the forefront of revealing the high level knowledge of miscarriages of justice. It is a matter of the highest public interest to hear from Post Office executives as to why sub postmasters were still being sent to prison when there was senior management knowledge that the Horizon system had computer bugs and there may have been miscarriages of justice. This remains a matter of the highest public interest.

    Thank you again for taking the time to contact us. We appreciate all feedback from our viewers; complimentary or otherwise. "
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,682

    ToryJim said:

    ToryJim said:

    Another Tory flees the battlefield. Greg Clark standing down. Just how many disgusteds are there in his seat?

    Thats about 75 of them now and oddly they wont let David Frost stand.
    Well nobody has an absolute right to stand for a political party. He can pick any seat he likes and stand as an independent and see what happens.
    Of course, but the rate they are losing MPs and not replacing them with anyone with experience looks like bad party management.
    Agai worth repeating what I mentioned yesterday. In 2010 Labour had 100 MPs stand down out of 349 at the point the election was called. So 29%ish

    The Tories currently look to be having around 80 odd stand down out of 346 - so around 23%. This is not unusual churn after so long in power.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,514

    ToryJim said:

    ToryJim said:

    Another Tory flees the battlefield. Greg Clark standing down. Just how many disgusteds are there in his seat?

    Thats about 75 of them now and oddly they wont let David Frost stand.
    Well nobody has an absolute right to stand for a political party. He can pick any seat he likes and stand as an independent and see what happens.
    Of course, but the rate they are losing MPs and not replacing them with anyone with experience looks like bad party management.
    Agai worth repeating what I mentioned yesterday. In 2010 Labour had 100 MPs stand down out of 349 at the point the election was called. So 29%ish

    The Tories currently look to be having around 80 odd stand down out of 346 - so around 23%. This is not unusual churn after so long in power.
    Id go with that and suspect there will be more to come. Rats and sinking ships comes to mind.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,898
    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Anyone can read about WW2. This "distant in time" thing doesn't wash for me.
    Anyone can read about anything. Do the Punic Wars loom large in the public consciousness?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,568
    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Anyone can read about WW2. This "distant in time" thing doesn't wash for me.
    No, these things do fade. Young Germans - under 30 - have zero guilt about the war. I’ve noticed it (and I don’t blame them)

    It’s a human universal. At some point even the greatest atrocity becomes a quaint or eye raising passage in history books. Some fade away very quickly - the Armenian genocide. Some last much longer like WW2, Nazism and the Holocaust - but they too are now losing emotional force, even in
    Germany itself

    I read a tweet the other day about young people knowing F all about Anne Frank, for instance
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,390
    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Anyone can read about WW2. This "distant in time" thing doesn't wash for me.
    1945 was 79 years ago.
  • Will the government help deliver Casement Park? Here’s some of what I put to the PM
    @RishiSunak
    who insisted there will be “significant contribution” from the government… but no clarity on how much or crucially, when

    https://x.com/BBCJayneMcC/status/1793968165908799590

    The MayBot returns?
  • ToryJim said:

    Another Tory flees the battlefield. Greg Clark standing down. Just how many disgusteds are there in his seat?

    Thats about 75 of them now and oddly they wont let David Frost stand.
    Ah yes, the man who said leaving the Single Market would be a disaster and then negotiated a deal which he now thinks is rubbish.
    Maybe he should join Labour, the party headed by the bloke who supported Jezza and then said he didnt agree with anything he previously campaigned on,
    Tony Blair supported Michael Foot!
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,514

    Andy_JS said:

    ToryJim said:

    Another Tory flees the battlefield. Greg Clark standing down. Just how many disgusteds are there in his seat?

    Will Boris be tempted?
    Its probably about the only chance they've got.
    Yes, Boris should Bruce Ismay himself onto a seat. Last second. Then the remaining weeks of the campaign can be all about HIM which is only fitting for the world king and people's PM.
    Missed you earlier this morning as Mrs B dragged me out shopping.

    Though we often disagree can I wish you the best of luck in the coming campaign and hope you get elected.
    Very kind of you.

    Had no idea you believed in miracles!
    Well if nothing else RP it keeps us in touch with politics. People like myself can play armchair generals but you have at least got off your butt and gone full in. That merits a degree of respect.

  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,514

    ToryJim said:

    Another Tory flees the battlefield. Greg Clark standing down. Just how many disgusteds are there in his seat?

    Thats about 75 of them now and oddly they wont let David Frost stand.
    Ah yes, the man who said leaving the Single Market would be a disaster and then negotiated a deal which he now thinks is rubbish.
    Maybe he should join Labour, the party headed by the bloke who supported Jezza and then said he didnt agree with anything he previously campaigned on,
    Tony Blair supported Michael Foot!
    Just goes to show you cant trust politicians
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,146

    Regarding yesterdays IDF library burning photo. Seems there will be an investigation.

    Translation from Israeli newspaper:

    "A photo of an IDF soldier inside Al-Aqsa University in Gaza City, with books burning behind him, was published in recent hours on networks around the world and caused a stir. Originally, we note, the photo was published without blurring the soldier's face - and it seems that it was originally distributed by the soldiers. A similar case, of burning a Koran book, also happened yesterday in Rafah.

    The IDF stated that "this is a serious incident that is not consistent with the values ​​of the IDF and its orders. For the incident, an investigation was opened by the investigating military police, at the end of which the findings will be forwarded to the military attorney's office for examination"

    https://www.ynet.co.il/news/article/hjvhngcmc

    Don't worry I won't be posting on Gaza again.

    verified IDF book burning

    Disappointing, got the impression from several posters and tweeters that this pic was unlikely to be real.

    Is this the most moral army in the world version of this meme?


  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,099

    ToryJim said:

    ToryJim said:

    Another Tory flees the battlefield. Greg Clark standing down. Just how many disgusteds are there in his seat?

    Thats about 75 of them now and oddly they wont let David Frost stand.
    Well nobody has an absolute right to stand for a political party. He can pick any seat he likes and stand as an independent and see what happens.
    Of course, but the rate they are losing MPs and not replacing them with anyone with experience looks like bad party management.
    Agai worth repeating what I mentioned yesterday. In 2010 Labour had 100 MPs stand down out of 349 at the point the election was called. So 29%ish

    The Tories currently look to be having around 80 odd stand down out of 346 - so around 23%. This is not unusual churn after so long in power.

    @EmporersNewC

    Apparently 'making our own laws' isn't as an appealing proposition to some sitting MPs as they thought it would be.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,948
    "On Friday, Dame Victoria Sharp, sitting with Lord Justice Holroyde, said they had refused the appeal request.

    The reason for the decision was not made public."

    https://news.sky.com/story/lucy-letby-denied-permission-to-appeal-against-convictions-for-murdering-seven-babies-13141830
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,514
    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Anyone can read about WW2. This "distant in time" thing doesn't wash for me.
    No, these things do fade. Young Germans - under 30 - have zero guilt about the war. I’ve noticed it (and I don’t blame them)

    It’s a human universal. At some point even the greatest atrocity becomes a quaint or eye raising passage in history books. Some fade away very quickly - the Armenian genocide. Some last much longer like WW2, Nazism and the Holocaust - but they too are now losing emotional force, even in
    Germany itself

    I read a tweet the other day about young people knowing F all about Anne Frank, for instance
    Yes theyve given up on war guilt. Ive had them crack Auschwitz jokes and not worry in the slightest.
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 5,352
    edited May 24
    Ghedebrav said:

    While we know a GE precipitates a lot of MPs standing down voluntarily, I'd be interested in seeing some numbers on the rate of this prior to a change in government. IIRC 2010 saw a lot, as did 97. There does seem to be more than usual this time.

    Of course, correlation/causation applies but
    still.

    For how long will we be getting these
    announcements?

    Candidate papers need to be in by Friday 7th
    June, so not sure how long Labour / Conservatives have given their MPs to announce (Labour do also have this to some extent, I note Holly Lynch standing down in Halifax, I'm sure a trickle of announcements in other places).

    For the Green party, I note the deadline for standing aside is 5th July, at least for Sian Berry.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,624
    Andy_JS said:

    theakes said:

    Just going back to the title of the thread, YouGov constituency polling in April said the following:
    Exmouth Cons 34, L:abour 31, Lib Dems 6 Reform 19
    Honiton: Cons 36, Labour 24, Lib Dem 16 Reform 16

    Betting on Lib Dems seems a waste of time?

    Was this an MRP study? Not sure it can properly account for local factors wrt LD support.
    MRP != local polling
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,948
    edited May 24
    "Vladimir Putin ready to 'freeze' war in Ukraine with ceasefire recognising recent Russian gains, sources say

    Putin reportedly views recent gains in the war as enough to sell a victory to the Russian people, saving him from making unpopular decisions like spending more money and mobilising more people."

    https://news.sky.com/story/vladimir-putin-ready-to-freeze-war-in-ukraine-with-ceasefire-recognising-recent-russian-gains-sources-say-13142402
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,146
    edited May 24
    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Anyone can read about WW2. This "distant in time" thing doesn't wash for me.
    No, these things do fade. Young Germans - under 30 - have zero guilt about the war. I’ve noticed it (and I don’t blame them)

    It’s a human universal. At some point even the greatest atrocity becomes a quaint or eye raising passage in history books. Some fade away very quickly - the Armenian genocide. Some last much longer like WW2, Nazism and the Holocaust - but they too are now losing emotional force, even in
    Germany itself

    I read a tweet the other day about young people knowing F all about Anne Frank, for instance
    Yet the German government seems obsessed about causing no offence to Israel, more so than any other European government afaIcs. I can’t think that isn’t connected to Holocaust guilt.
  • El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 4,240

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope
    ** Exclusive **
    Boris Johnson ally David Frost has been banned from standing as Tory candidate in the general election, I understand.
    Lord Frost was told yesterday that he cannot apply for any of the 93 vacant seats where the party is yet to nominate a candidate for the July 4 general election, according to his friends.
    Frost is a low tax Tory who was one of the architects of former Prime Minister Boris Johnson's Brexit deal.
    He was described as "the great Frost" by Johnson for his work on the deal.

    This has had me scratching my head for ages. If he wanted to be an MP, why did he take a life peerage. He really is thick as mince.
    50% fat mince, to be precise.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,534
    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Anyone can read about WW2. This "distant in time" thing doesn't wash for me.
    No, these things do fade. Young Germans - under 30 - have zero guilt about the war. I’ve noticed it (and I don’t blame them)

    It’s a human universal. At some point even the greatest atrocity becomes a quaint or eye raising passage in history books. Some fade away very quickly - the Armenian genocide. Some last much longer like WW2, Nazism and the Holocaust - but they too are now losing emotional force, even in
    Germany itself

    I read a tweet the other day about young people knowing F all about Anne Frank, for instance
    I’m probably part of the last age cohort who grew up thinking of WWII as part of a common experience, rather than as history.

    To be really disturbed by the Nazis, I think you have to think yourself into the mindset of a Nazi. I could see myself as Major Trapp, hating the vile task of carrying out mass killings, but thinking it my patriotic duty.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,109
    edited May 24

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Anyone can read about WW2. This "distant in time" thing doesn't wash for me.
    No, these things do fade. Young Germans - under 30 - have zero guilt about the war. I’ve noticed it (and I don’t blame them)

    It’s a human universal. At some point even the greatest atrocity becomes a quaint or eye raising passage in history books. Some fade away very quickly - the Armenian genocide. Some last much longer like WW2, Nazism and the Holocaust - but they too are now losing emotional force, even in
    Germany itself

    I read a tweet the other day about young people knowing F all about Anne Frank, for instance
    Yet the German government seems obsessed about causing no offence to Israel, more so than any other European government afaIcs. I can’t think that isn’t connected to Holocaust guilt.
    Engrained systemic policy.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,457
    Andy_JS said:

    "Vladimir Putin ready to 'freeze' war in Ukraine with ceasefire recognising recent Russian gains, sources say

    Putin reportedly views recent gains in the war as enough to sell a victory to the Russian people, saving him from making unpopular decisions like spending more money and mobilising more people."

    https://news.sky.com/story/vladimir-putin-ready-to-freeze-war-in-ukraine-with-ceasefire-recognising-recent-russian-gains-sources-say-13142402

    Until he's ready to unfreeze it. why should we trust him?

    The thing is, they've made very minor 'gains' over the recent months at terrible cost. It would have been easier for him to 'propose' this at the beginning of the year.
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 4,721
    Andy_JS said:

    "Vladimir Putin ready to 'freeze' war in Ukraine with ceasefire recognising recent Russian gains, sources say

    Putin reportedly views recent gains in the war as enough to sell a victory to the Russian people, saving him from making unpopular decisions like spending more money and mobilising more people."

    https://news.sky.com/story/vladimir-putin-ready-to-freeze-war-in-ukraine-with-ceasefire-recognising-recent-russian-gains-sources-say-13142402

    Has he got some secret polling that says Biden is going to win?

    He must be worried about the US kit finally arriving.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,099
    @PickardJE
    to sum up:

    - Figen Murray, the mother of Manchester Arena bombing victim Martyn Hett, walked 200 miles to London to meet Rishi Sunak in Downing St

    - the prime minister promised her he would introduce Martyn’s Law to Parliament before summer recess

    (but could not guarantee the legislation would be passed before the next election)

    - he already knew he was about to a general election, meaning this was impossible

    - she now says: “We shook hands and he looked me straight me in the eyes...he could have maybe handled it slightly differently. I feel a bit misled rather than lied to”


    This story is in the Telegraph, which prompts this question

    @rafaelbehr

    I had wondered how ultrapartisan Tory press would play campaign that their side likely to lose. Wild Starmer-bashing anyway taken as read, but I maybe underpriced gleeful amplification of hapless Sunak, he's-a-loser narrative, make him fall guy for the whole legacy.
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 3,124
    edited May 24
    Farooq said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Anyone can read about WW2. This "distant in time" thing doesn't wash for me.
    Anyone can read about ancient Rome too. Just because you can read about it, doesn't stop it feeling distant in time.
    Fun fact: George III was born closer to the time that the Roman Empire existed, than to today.
    You need to define your terms.

    The Classical Empire fell in the West in AD 476 when Romulus Agustulus was overthrown by Odacer. The Byzantine Empire, which spoke Greek, not Latin and was a radical change from Classical Rome, even though it claimed continuity, fell with the fall of Constantinople in 1453. Meanwhile the Holy Roman Empire, which claimed descent from the Western Empire, despite being founded in AD 800 by Frankish barbarians, did not formally dissolve until 1806. So George III, who lived from 1738 until 1820, that is 204 years from our own time, either lived 1262 years from the fall of the Western Empire, or he lived 286 years after the fall of Constantinople (so still lived closer to our own time), or he was actually contemporary with the Holy Roman Empire.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,214
    I saw this. Quite funny. It may well already have been posted of course.



    That’s my one image for the day.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,417
    Roger said:

    Taz said:

    Sandpit said:

    Andy_JS said:

    More tears at the PO inquiry.

    Oh no, how awful this whole process must be for Mrs Vennells…

    F**k off you bitch, you’re looking at serious prison time.
    Hold on, as we learnt from Rogerdamus the other day, she is the real victim here.

    Show some sympathy.
    Funnily enough I've just received a reply from Ch4 News. As you'll remember my complaint was that Alex Thompson had gone too far by lifting her umbrella as she was leaving the tribuneral and despite her being clearly upset showed no compassion whatsoever. So for your interest.........

    "Thank you for contacting Channel 4 Viewer Enquiries regarding Channel 4 News.

    In response to your comments regarding the interview by Alex Thompson, Channel 4 news have responded with the following: We have requested interviews with all the key Post Office Executives to ask questions about their knowledge of the scandal that unfolded. All the executives have been elusive or refused to be held to account publicly. Channel 4 News has been at the forefront of revealing the high level knowledge of miscarriages of justice. It is a matter of the highest public interest to hear from Post Office executives as to why sub postmasters were still being sent to prison when there was senior management knowledge that the Horizon system had computer bugs and there may have been miscarriages of justice. This remains a matter of the highest public interest.

    Thank you again for taking the time to contact us. We appreciate all feedback from our viewers; complimentary or otherwise. "
    There should be some sort of inquiry imo.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,099
    TimS said:

    I saw this. Quite funny. It may well already have been posted of course.

    It was posted earlier, so sadly you have wasted your image
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,214
    Scott_xP said:

    TimS said:

    I saw this. Quite funny. It may well already have been posted of course.

    It was posted earlier, so sadly you have wasted your image
    Luckily I’m not travelling today with a dog or on a journalistic assignment.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,177

    Andy_JS said:

    "Vladimir Putin ready to 'freeze' war in Ukraine with ceasefire recognising recent Russian gains, sources say

    Putin reportedly views recent gains in the war as enough to sell a victory to the Russian people, saving him from making unpopular decisions like spending more money and mobilising more people."

    https://news.sky.com/story/vladimir-putin-ready-to-freeze-war-in-ukraine-with-ceasefire-recognising-recent-russian-gains-sources-say-13142402

    Until he's ready to unfreeze it. why should we trust him?

    The thing is, they've made very minor 'gains' over the recent months at terrible cost. It would have been easier for him to 'propose' this at the beginning of the year.
    More to the point, a 'freeze' with the Russian army in artillery range of Ukraine's second largest city is going to be less stable than the 'freeze' in the Donbas, where regular fighting continued for over half a decade before the current full scale invasion in 2022.
  • sarissasarissa Posts: 2,000
    GIN1138 said:

    Claudia Webbe running as an indy in Leicester East

    Is she the MP who threatened an acid attack against her love rival?
    Careful - on appeal the judge found that Webbe had not "made a threat to throw acid over" the alleged victim.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,951
    Scott_xP said:

    @PickardJE
    to sum up:

    - Figen Murray, the mother of Manchester Arena bombing victim Martyn Hett, walked 200 miles to London to meet Rishi Sunak in Downing St

    - the prime minister promised her he would introduce Martyn’s Law to Parliament before summer recess

    (but could not guarantee the legislation would be passed before the next election)

    - he already knew he was about to a general election, meaning this was impossible

    - she now says: “We shook hands and he looked me straight me in the eyes...he could have maybe handled it slightly differently. I feel a bit misled rather than lied to”


    This story is in the Telegraph, which prompts this question

    @rafaelbehr

    I had wondered how ultrapartisan Tory press would play campaign that their side likely to lose. Wild Starmer-bashing anyway taken as read, but I maybe underpriced gleeful amplification of hapless Sunak, he's-a-loser narrative, make him fall guy for the whole legacy.

    Interesting. There is already some evidence from that Conhome article that this kind of thinking is already taking root.

    The question is whether they frame Sunak as too right wing or too left wing. If the former, they have a chance in 2029.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,177

    Andy_JS said:

    "Vladimir Putin ready to 'freeze' war in Ukraine with ceasefire recognising recent Russian gains, sources say

    Putin reportedly views recent gains in the war as enough to sell a victory to the Russian people, saving him from making unpopular decisions like spending more money and mobilising more people."

    https://news.sky.com/story/vladimir-putin-ready-to-freeze-war-in-ukraine-with-ceasefire-recognising-recent-russian-gains-sources-say-13142402

    Has he got some secret polling that says Biden is going to win?

    He must be worried about the US kit finally arriving.
    Or it's just reculer pour mieux sauter.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,948
    edited May 24
    "Diane Abbott MP
    @HackneyAbbott

    Just heard @Keir_Starmer on @BBCr4today claiming that the decision about whether to let @HackneyAbbott back into @UKLabour has “nothing to with him” It has EVERYTHING to do with him"

    https://x.com/HackneyAbbott/status/1793931847191457818
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,898
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Also, how about reducing the insane levels of immigration? Young people are noticing

    I'd quite like to avoid the point where these views become widespread
    It might help or it might not. Young people are generally more positive on immigration than older people, and more tolerant in areas of high immigration than in areas of low immigration. I'm not convinced that London is swarming with young white men who are violently opposed to multiculturalism - they all speak with a Jamaican accent for a start. But my kids aren't white so I'm not an expert on young white people and their cultural practices.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,390
    edited May 24
    Andy_JS said:

    "Vladimir Putin ready to 'freeze' war in Ukraine with ceasefire recognising recent Russian gains, sources say

    Putin reportedly views recent gains in the war as enough to sell a victory to the Russian people, saving him from making unpopular decisions like spending more money and mobilising more people."

    https://news.sky.com/story/vladimir-putin-ready-to-freeze-war-in-ukraine-with-ceasefire-recognising-recent-russian-gains-sources-say-13142402

    The Russians are brutal realists and use words accordingly: not as a mean to communicate information, but as tools to achieve a goal. If Putin says he wants peace, that doesn't mean he wants peace, it means he wants you to behave as if he does.

    A specific example of this were treaty negotiations about protecting food ships early in the 2022-present war. It was discussed and signed, the books were bound and a drinks reception was held. And the next day the Russians broke it and carried on as before.

    He'll stop fighting when he's stopped. Until then it's at best a pause.

    [Edit. It's almost as if somebody wrote an article about why he won't stop: https://www1.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2022/05/02/why-ukraine-was-particularly-vulnerable/ ]
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,948
    This is sad.

    "The Gherkin transformed London’s skyline – but now is set to disappear from view
    It started a building boom in the heart of the City – but is now increasingly being crowded out"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/05/24/gherkin-london-skyline-disappearing-view-architecture-city/
  • FeersumEnjineeyaFeersumEnjineeya Posts: 4,489
    edited May 24

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Anyone can read about WW2. This "distant in time" thing doesn't wash for me.
    No, these things do fade. Young Germans - under 30 - have zero guilt about the war. I’ve noticed it (and I don’t blame them)

    It’s a human universal. At some point even the greatest atrocity becomes a quaint or eye raising passage in history books. Some fade away very quickly - the Armenian genocide. Some last much longer like WW2, Nazism and the Holocaust - but they too are now losing emotional force, even in
    Germany itself

    I read a tweet the other day about young people knowing F all about Anne Frank, for instance
    Yet the German government seems obsessed about causing no offence to Israel, more so than any other European government afaIcs. I can’t think that isn’t connected to Holocaust guilt.
    They finally managed to get over one taboo from the last war - that of being seen as enemies of Russia. Perhaps they'll eventually realise that criticism of Israel also doesn't have to remain a taboo subject.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,514
    Andy_JS said:

    "Diane Abbott MP
    @HackneyAbbott

    Just heard @Keir_Starmer on @BBCr4today claiming that the decision about whether to let @HackneyAbbott back into @UKLabour has “nothing to with him” It has EVERYTHING to do with him"

    https://x.com/HackneyAbbott/status/1793931847191457818

    She needs to go it alone Starmer will just knife her.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,624
    viewcode said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Vladimir Putin ready to 'freeze' war in Ukraine with ceasefire recognising recent Russian gains, sources say

    Putin reportedly views recent gains in the war as enough to sell a victory to the Russian people, saving him from making unpopular decisions like spending more money and mobilising more people."

    https://news.sky.com/story/vladimir-putin-ready-to-freeze-war-in-ukraine-with-ceasefire-recognising-recent-russian-gains-sources-say-13142402

    The Russians are brutal realists and use words accordingly: not as a mean to communicate information, but as tools to achieve a goal. If Putin says he wants peace, that doesn't mean he wants peace, it means he wants you to behave as if he does.

    A specific example of this were treaty negotiations about protecting food ships early in the 2022-present war. It was discussed and signed, the books were bound and a drinks reception was held. And the next day the Russians broke it and carried on as before.

    He'll stop fighting when he's stopped. Until then it's at best a pause.

    [Edit. It's almost as if somebody wrote an article about why he won't stop: https://www1.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2022/05/02/why-ukraine-was-particularly-vulnerable/ ]
    And, of course, that is how Trump operates too. Words are just something he uses to get you to do what he wants.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,099
    Richi's press team hate him, don't they...

    @skydavidblevins

    In a bid to move on from the drenching in Downing Street, the PM's comms team brings him to the site where they built Titanic. Mmm...

    @JamesMcCarthy97

    On a visit to the Titanic Quarter today, I asked the Prime Minister if he is captaining a sinking ship going into this election

    @BelfastLive
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,282
    edited May 24

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Surely lesson number one is not to recreate the conditions of the Weimar republic.
  • sbjme19sbjme19 Posts: 194
    Farooq said:

    Farooq said:

    boulay said:

    algarkirk said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @benrileysmith

    Keir Starmer twists the knife on Rishi Sunak’s rain-sodden election speech.

    “The image of a man who says ‘I’m the only one with a plan’ standing in the rain without an umbrella is, to put it politely, pretty farcical.”

    I think he’s nailed it though, hasn’t he?
    You had to feel sorry for him. Well, I did, anyway.

    But where are his Spads? Surely one of them would have thought to provide an umbrella, and do something about that noxious narcissist playing music to drown out the PM.
    Is there much worse for a PM than people starting to feel sorry for them?
    Confession time, None. I've always quite liked him, and have occasionally stuck up for him here, although I can he doesn't seem to be very good at politics, which is a bit of a handicap if you are in his position.
    He's the Tory's Ed Miliband. Decent, impossible to hate, very good in the right job, leaden footed, wooden in delivery, slightly anxious to please, unspontaneous, nowhere close to being PM material, when watching him perform always slightly anxious that your toes will curl - as all ten toes did in the rain on Wednesday.
    I very genuinely liked the Rishi Sunak I chatted to on one of CalMac's few functional ferries in 2020. Have said so repeatedly. He seemed like a genuine guy planted in reality.

    Whatever happened to him and why did they replace him with the current model?
    I guess that when you become CofTE and PM you are surrounded by a huge team of SPADS, civil servants, representations from CCHQ all telling you “let us take care of x and y as you have lots of other things to do and you need to present a face to the public of being in charge”.

    This then stops you actually being you as you have been assured by all and sundry that you need to behave a certain way but also your actual abilities are not being used because all the competing pillars are pushing or blocking because they want different results.

    You have to be a certain character to rise above that and it probably requires a spell as opposition leader or a long period in politics to get there which Sunak didn’t have. He was likely ten years and two crises early to use any ability he has.
    Far too many twenty and thirty somethings with no experience outside politics and media being listened to by PMs these days ahead of their cabinet colleagues, not to mention their predecessors who are viewed as dinosaurs rather than wise counsellors.
    One of Sunak's main problems was timing. He could have been a better PM at the head of a Conservative Party that hadn't been purged by Boris.

    I keep saying, Boris Johnson is the root of all this. The Conservative Party 2024 is the product of his energetic sociopathy. Nothing but vines and ivy grows there any more. He reduced the party to a sort of drunken pageantry, an elaborate chaos with a nasty streak.

    Someone like Sunak could have taken over from a defeated Cameron in 2015 and in 2024 be nearing the end of his first term as PM, with a strong chance of re-election. Instead, he rides a party stampeding uncontrollably to a cliff edge.
    Covid derailed everything political in 2020, it seems to be completely forgoten. Without Covid we could be in a completely different political position.
    Boris started his shenanigans before the virus emerged from that wet market. We would have lurched from disaster to embarrassing disaster anyway. Covid changed the nature of them, that's all.
    I wouldn't say covid was forgotten. Every Tory politician I've heard since the election was announced refers to it as an explanation or excuse.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,951
    Scott_xP said:

    Richi's press team hate him, don't they...

    @skydavidblevins

    In a bid to move on from the drenching in Downing Street, the PM's comms team brings him to the site where they built Titanic. Mmm...

    @JamesMcCarthy97

    On a visit to the Titanic Quarter today, I asked the Prime Minister if he is captaining a sinking ship going into this election

    @BelfastLive

    Going for the key marginals in... Belfast.

    (I'm all for GB politicians heading over to NI but it's not exactly the most focussed campaign yet)
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,624
    Farooq said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Anyone can read about WW2. This "distant in time" thing doesn't wash for me.
    Anyone can read about ancient Rome too. Just because you can read about it, doesn't stop it feeling distant in time.
    Fun fact: George III was born closer to the time that the Roman Empire existed, than to today.
    Depends on your definition of Roman Empire.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,951
    Farooq said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Richi's press team hate him, don't they...

    @skydavidblevins

    In a bid to move on from the drenching in Downing Street, the PM's comms team brings him to the site where they built Titanic. Mmm...

    @JamesMcCarthy97

    On a visit to the Titanic Quarter today, I asked the Prime Minister if he is captaining a sinking ship going into this election

    @BelfastLive

    Tomorrow, Aberfan :neutral:
    Followed by a HS2 construction site
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,282

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Also, how about reducing the insane levels of immigration? Young people are noticing

    I'd quite like to avoid the point where these views become widespread
    It might help or it might not. Young people are generally more positive on immigration than older people, and more tolerant in areas of high immigration than in areas of low immigration. I'm not convinced that London is swarming with young white men who are violently opposed to multiculturalism - they all speak with a Jamaican accent for a start. But my kids aren't white so I'm not an expert on young white people and their cultural practices.
    Young people are overwhelmingly the ones who pay the price for mass immigration, in a literal sense, in the form of competition for housing and suppression of wages.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,624

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Surely lesson number one is not to recreate the conditions of the Weimar republic.
    Sexual deviancy?

    Hyperinflation?

    Capital in a pretty little spa town?
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,282
    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Surely lesson number one is not to recreate the conditions of the Weimar republic.
    Sexual deviancy?

    Hyperinflation?

    Capital in a pretty little spa town?
    A strict taboo against advocating proportional representation.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,948
    Does Starmer really want to win 450 seats?
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,898
    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Surely lesson number one is not to recreate the conditions of the Weimar republic.
    Sexual deviancy?

    Hyperinflation?

    Capital in a pretty little spa town?
    I blame the Kitkat club.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,736
    Private Healthcare entrepreneur picked by SKS Party to stand against Jezza.

    Sounds apt for the SKS Party to pick such a person.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,390
    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Surely lesson number one is not to recreate the conditions of the Weimar republic.
    Sexual deviancy?

    Hyperinflation?

    Capital in a pretty little spa town?
    Ah, I see you have been to Somerset :)
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 3,124
    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Meh... Chicken Licken stuff... Russian Astroturfing more like.

    My view: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wveW9Tw2JKE
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,861
    Farooq said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Anyone can read about WW2. This "distant in time" thing doesn't wash for me.
    Anyone can read about ancient Rome too. Just because you can read about it, doesn't stop it feeling distant in time.
    Fun fact: George III was born closer to the time that the Roman Empire existed, than to today.
    Lives are long. He lived into the lifetime of Dickens, who in turn lived into the lifetime of Hardy, who was alive when HM Queen Elizabeth was born in 1926.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,099
    Eabhal said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Richi's press team hate him, don't they...

    @skydavidblevins

    In a bid to move on from the drenching in Downing Street, the PM's comms team brings him to the site where they built Titanic. Mmm...

    @JamesMcCarthy97

    On a visit to the Titanic Quarter today, I asked the Prime Minister if he is captaining a sinking ship going into this election

    @BelfastLive

    Going for the key marginals in... Belfast.

    (I'm all for GB politicians heading over to NI but it's not exactly the most focussed campaign yet)
    @MatthewOToole2

    We all know the old clichés about trying to get to every voter possible on the campaign trail.

    Rishi Sunak could comfortably meet every single Tory voter in Northern Ireland (there were 254 at the Assembly election) in one room in a morning

    Can't fault that for efficiency.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,898

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Also, how about reducing the insane levels of immigration? Young people are noticing

    I'd quite like to avoid the point where these views become widespread
    It might help or it might not. Young people are generally more positive on immigration than older people, and more tolerant in areas of high immigration than in areas of low immigration. I'm not convinced that London is swarming with young white men who are violently opposed to multiculturalism - they all speak with a Jamaican accent for a start. But my kids aren't white so I'm not an expert on young white people and their cultural practices.
    Young people are overwhelmingly the ones who pay the price for mass immigration, in a literal sense, in the form of competition for housing and suppression of wages.
    Perhaps young people are more immune to easy scapegoating exercises than you give them credit for?
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,121
    rcs1000 said:

    Farooq said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Anyone can read about WW2. This "distant in time" thing doesn't wash for me.
    Anyone can read about ancient Rome too. Just because you can read about it, doesn't stop it feeling distant in time.
    Fun fact: George III was born closer to the time that the Roman Empire existed, than to today.
    Depends on your definition of Roman Empire.
    Finally collapsed in 1453.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,514
    Andy_JS said:

    Does Starmer really want to win 450 seats?

    Its a good question. What will he do with a large and bored cohort of MPs with nothing to do ? The HoC bar will be packed.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,376
    sarissa said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Claudia Webbe running as an indy in Leicester East

    Is she the MP who threatened an acid attack against her love rival?
    Careful - on appeal the judge found that Webbe had not "made a threat to throw acid over" the alleged victim.
    Thank you. Wasn't aware there has been an appeal 👍
  • FeersumEnjineeyaFeersumEnjineeya Posts: 4,489

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Also, how about reducing the insane levels of immigration? Young people are noticing

    I'd quite like to avoid the point where these views become widespread
    It might help or it might not. Young people are generally more positive on immigration than older people, and more tolerant in areas of high immigration than in areas of low immigration. I'm not convinced that London is swarming with young white men who are violently opposed to multiculturalism - they all speak with a Jamaican accent for a start. But my kids aren't white so I'm not an expert on young white people and their cultural practices.
    It's quite gratifying that my own (white) lad appears to be completely colour blind with regard to his friends. Those that I've met or seen seem to cover the entire spectrum of ethnicity. And my partner's daughter's two best friends from school days are black and of mixed Turkish/Scottish heritage. They both seem genuinely baffled by racism.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,376
    Andy_JS said:

    Does Starmer really want to win 450 seats?

    Why wouldn't he?
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 6,198
    edited May 24
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Also, how about reducing the insane levels of immigration? Young people are noticing

    I'd quite like to avoid the point where these views become widespread
    Another issue is that, separated from the history we all grew up with, and therefore viewed in isolation with the moral disgust for both, fascists have a lot more fun than communists.

    We saw a tiny bit of this in Brexit. Remain foolishly let Leave be the “Brexiteers” and linked them to boozing and parties. (Not for a second saying brexiteers are fascists - I voted Leave and don’t regret it).
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 6,198
    Farooq said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Richi's press team hate him, don't they...

    @skydavidblevins

    In a bid to move on from the drenching in Downing Street, the PM's comms team brings him to the site where they built Titanic. Mmm...

    @JamesMcCarthy97

    On a visit to the Titanic Quarter today, I asked the Prime Minister if he is captaining a sinking ship going into this election

    @BelfastLive

    Tomorrow, Aberfan :neutral:
    It’s a slippery slope.

    Sorry. I’m going to hell.
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 6,198
    GIN1138 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Does Starmer really want to win 450 seats?

    Why wouldn't he?
    Because he’d LIKE 650?
  • WildernessPt2WildernessPt2 Posts: 715
    sarissa said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Claudia Webbe running as an indy in Leicester East

    Is she the MP who threatened an acid attack against her love rival?
    Careful - on appeal the judge found that Webbe had not "made a threat to throw acid over" the alleged victim.
    Surely a judge could not make such a bold statement. They could claim there is no evidence that a threat was made.
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 3,124
    Scott_xP said:

    Richi's press team hate him, don't they...

    @skydavidblevins

    In a bid to move on from the drenching in Downing Street, the PM's comms team brings him to the site where they built Titanic. Mmm...

    @JamesMcCarthy97

    On a visit to the Titanic Quarter today, I asked the Prime Minister if he is captaining a sinking ship going into this election

    @BelfastLive

    The teenage SPADS are moronic. This is a campaign headed to meltdown.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,578

    ToryJim said:

    Another Tory flees the battlefield. Greg Clark standing down. Just how many disgusteds are there in his seat?

    Thats about 75 of them now and oddly they wont let David Frost stand.
    Sounds completely correct - he's an attention seeking primadonna troubkemaker with nothing special about him, and they'll get plenty of those standing without picking him as a certain one.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,736
    biggles said:

    Farooq said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Richi's press team hate him, don't they...

    @skydavidblevins

    In a bid to move on from the drenching in Downing Street, the PM's comms team brings him to the site where they built Titanic. Mmm...

    @JamesMcCarthy97

    On a visit to the Titanic Quarter today, I asked the Prime Minister if he is captaining a sinking ship going into this election

    @BelfastLive

    Tomorrow, Aberfan :neutral:
    It’s a slippery slope.

    Sorry. I’m going to hell.
    58 years ago and it's still too soon.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,948
    GIN1138 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Does Starmer really want to win 450 seats?

    Why wouldn't he?
    More potential rebels. Blair apparently wasn't happy about a 179 seat majority in 1997 for the same reason.
  • PJHPJH Posts: 689
    Andy_JS said:

    "Diane Abbott MP
    @HackneyAbbott

    Just heard @Keir_Starmer on @BBCr4today claiming that the decision about whether to let @HackneyAbbott back into @UKLabour has “nothing to with him” It has EVERYTHING to do with him"

    https://x.com/HackneyAbbott/status/1793931847191457818

    Haha, I'm sure that will help smooth things out!
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,099
    Cicero said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Richi's press team hate him, don't they...

    @skydavidblevins

    In a bid to move on from the drenching in Downing Street, the PM's comms team brings him to the site where they built Titanic. Mmm...

    @JamesMcCarthy97

    On a visit to the Titanic Quarter today, I asked the Prime Minister if he is captaining a sinking ship going into this election

    @BelfastLive

    The teenage SPADS are moronic. This is a campaign headed to meltdown.
    I am beginning to wonder if CCHQ hired Perfect Curve to run this campaign
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,736
    Andy_JS said:

    "Diane Abbott MP
    @HackneyAbbott

    Just heard @Keir_Starmer on @BBCr4today claiming that the decision about whether to let @HackneyAbbott back into @UKLabour has “nothing to with him” It has EVERYTHING to do with him"

    https://x.com/HackneyAbbott/status/1793931847191457818

    SKS is a compulsive liar (as we know)
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 3,124
    Farooq said:

    Cicero said:

    Farooq said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Anyone can read about WW2. This "distant in time" thing doesn't wash for me.
    Anyone can read about ancient Rome too. Just because you can read about it, doesn't stop it feeling distant in time.
    Fun fact: George III was born closer to the time that the Roman Empire existed, than to today.
    You need to define your terms.

    The Classical Empire fell in the West in AD 476 when Romulus Agustulus was overthrown by Odacer. The Byzantine Empire, which spoke Greek, not Latin and was a radical change from Classical Rome, even though it claimed continuity, fell with the fall of Constantinople in 1453. Meanwhile the Holy Roman Empire, which claimed descent from the Western Empire, despite being founded in AD 800 by Frankish barbarians, did not formally dissolve until 1806. So George III, who lived from 1738 until 1820, that is 204 years from our own time, either lived 1262 years from the fall of the Western Empire, or he lived 286 years after the fall of Constantinople (so still lived closer to our own time), or he was actually contemporary with the Holy Roman Empire.
    Oh, and one minor point, I did say "was born", not "lived". I was maximising the effect by choosing someone famous who was born just before the half way point.
    You did, I was just making the point that the Roman Empire with togas really was a long time ago. The Byzantine Empire was only Roman in name, and quite a lot of places called themselves heirs to the Romans, including the HRE and even definitively barbarian Muscovy.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,177
    Scott_xP said:

    Richi's press team hate him, don't they...

    @skydavidblevins

    In a bid to move on from the drenching in Downing Street, the PM's comms team brings him to the site where they built Titanic. Mmm...

    @JamesMcCarthy97

    On a visit to the Titanic Quarter today, I asked the Prime Minister if he is captaining a sinking ship going into this election

    @BelfastLive

    As he criss crosses the nation, perhaps next the Tay Bridge ?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,578
    Andy_JS said:

    Does Starmer really want to win 450 seats?

    Yes. The potential troubles associated with a massive majority in terms of party management or arrogant decision making are real, but he as with all leaders would be confident he could avoid that, and 450 would give him more options for action.

    For the same reason despite all their woes and need to refresh the Tory leadership at least would still rather win than lose as they will always think there's a chance they could handle it.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,282

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Also, how about reducing the insane levels of immigration? Young people are noticing

    I'd quite like to avoid the point where these views become widespread
    It might help or it might not. Young people are generally more positive on immigration than older people, and more tolerant in areas of high immigration than in areas of low immigration. I'm not convinced that London is swarming with young white men who are violently opposed to multiculturalism - they all speak with a Jamaican accent for a start. But my kids aren't white so I'm not an expert on young white people and their cultural practices.
    Young people are overwhelmingly the ones who pay the price for mass immigration, in a literal sense, in the form of competition for housing and suppression of wages.
    Perhaps young people are more immune to easy scapegoating exercises than you give them credit for?
    You mean scapegoating the Tories for our immigration policies?
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,099
    Nigelb said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Richi's press team hate him, don't they...

    @skydavidblevins

    In a bid to move on from the drenching in Downing Street, the PM's comms team brings him to the site where they built Titanic. Mmm...

    @JamesMcCarthy97

    On a visit to the Titanic Quarter today, I asked the Prime Minister if he is captaining a sinking ship going into this election

    @BelfastLive

    As he criss crosses the nation, perhaps next the Tay Bridge ?
    The airship hangars at Cardington
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,736
    Scott_xP said:

    Cicero said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Richi's press team hate him, don't they...

    @skydavidblevins

    In a bid to move on from the drenching in Downing Street, the PM's comms team brings him to the site where they built Titanic. Mmm...

    @JamesMcCarthy97

    On a visit to the Titanic Quarter today, I asked the Prime Minister if he is captaining a sinking ship going into this election

    @BelfastLive

    The teenage SPADS are moronic. This is a campaign headed to meltdown.
    I am beginning to wonder if CCHQ hired Perfect Curve to run this campaign
    SKS has hired a former Israeli spy but their stuff is much better quality than CCHQ amateur rubbish.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,909

    Andy_JS said:

    "Vladimir Putin ready to 'freeze' war in Ukraine with ceasefire recognising recent Russian gains, sources say

    Putin reportedly views recent gains in the war as enough to sell a victory to the Russian people, saving him from making unpopular decisions like spending more money and mobilising more people."

    https://news.sky.com/story/vladimir-putin-ready-to-freeze-war-in-ukraine-with-ceasefire-recognising-recent-russian-gains-sources-say-13142402

    Until he's ready to unfreeze it. why should we trust him?

    The thing is, they've made very minor 'gains' over the recent months at terrible cost. It would have been easier for him to 'propose' this at the beginning of the year.
    I think this is most likely simply a ruse to persuade European leaders that they don't need to spend the money increasing armaments production, and encourage them to wait and see.

    If it's genuine then it's a sign of the weakness of the Russian position, and that they don't believe the propaganda that Ukraine is on the verge of collapse. So we shouldn't either.
  • AlsoLeiAlsoLei Posts: 1,500
    Andy_JS said:

    Labour candidate in Islington North is councillor Praful Nargrund.

    https://democracy.islington.gov.uk/mgUserInfo.aspx?UID=469

    He was fairly clearly the leadership's preferred choice, so his selection became inevitable when the NEC stepped in - Moema might have run him close if it had gone to a ballot.

    He's been taking a bit of stick throughout the process for not engaging with local or social media. Probably wise of him, given that there's an element within the CLP and more broadly in the constituency that wanted to see him trip up.

    I don't think a Corbyn win is inevitable here - but Nargund will need to run a strong campaign if he's to get ahead. Some of the CLP will inevitably walk out in disgust and will actively campaign for Corbyn, but the bigger worry is over the number who might simply sit on their hands this time round.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,578

    Private Healthcare entrepreneur picked by SKS Party to stand against Jezza.

    Sounds apt for the SKS Party to pick such a person.

    I for one want Jezza to win. It'd be hilarious for a start.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,099
    I suspect this might come up in one of the debates Nutsack is so desperate to have...

    @PickardJE
    Labour source:

    “If Rishi Sunak lied to a grieving mother then he’ll lie to anyone. Why would anyone believe a word he says?”
  • agingjb2agingjb2 Posts: 114
    400? 500? After an extreme, and unlikely, result, the opposition would, in effect, be a group of 100 Labour backbenchers outnumbering any and all of the other parties.

    But that is, or could be, the effect of FPTP.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,624

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Also, how about reducing the insane levels of immigration? Young people are noticing

    I'd quite like to avoid the point where these views become widespread
    It might help or it might not. Young people are generally more positive on immigration than older people, and more tolerant in areas of high immigration than in areas of low immigration. I'm not convinced that London is swarming with young white men who are violently opposed to multiculturalism - they all speak with a Jamaican accent for a start. But my kids aren't white so I'm not an expert on young white people and their cultural practices.
    Young people are overwhelmingly the ones who pay the price for mass immigration, in a literal sense, in the form of competition for housing and suppression of wages.
    Sure: but young people are also by far the most likely to have friends who are from different countries, and they are the ones who will pay the most for an unbalanced population pyramid.

    So, it's swings and roundabouts.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,578
    edited May 24
    sarissa said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Claudia Webbe running as an indy in Leicester East

    Is she the MP who threatened an acid attack against her love rival?
    Careful - on appeal the judge found that Webbe had not "made a threat to throw acid over" the alleged victim.
    Still harassed her though so an actual not alleged victim?
  • GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,860
    Hahaha, Rishi actually went to the Titanic quarter today.

    After the rain on Wednesday, the Partridgian 'see the match?' cringe yesterday, I wonder what tomorrow's gaffe will be?

    It's like the 'stop hitting yourself' bullying technique, except there is no bully. He's just hitting himself.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,099
    @BestForBritain

    UTTERLY ASTONISHING by Sunak.

    He's "disappointed" smoking ban won't become law, but says this is "evidence of the type of Prime Minister" that he is.

    What? The type that fails to actually deliver even his own modest personal legacy? I think everyone knows by now, poppet. ~AA

    https://x.com/BestForBritain/status/1793998472624132403
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,948
    More on this.

    "Alex Wickham
    @alexwickham

    Both Labour sources and some Tories are saying this is the most jaw-dropping moment of the week: the claim that Sunak misled a grieving mother about introducing legislation in her son’s name. ‘Psychotic’ says a Labour source. ‘Staggering’ says a Tory…"

    https://x.com/alexwickham/status/1793944909893792085
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,514
    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    We were talking yesterday about the far right radicalisation of young white Euro-Americans

    Some more evidence, perhaps. ALLEGEDLY this xenophobic song has become a cult hit amongst young white Germans, see here:

    https://x.com/maisumcarneiro/status/1793967533818773632

    How widespread is this? Dunno. But it is certainly surprising to see apparently affluent white Germans openly doing Hitler moustache-and-salute moves while dancing

    Young people are increasingly distant from WW2. Growing up, the war was an ever present reference point in my life, as it had shaped my grandparents' lives, and hung over my parents'. For my kids it's ancient history, like the Boer war was for me. As memories of the war fade I think a lot of the taboos around the far right are fading with them. Perhaps we have to relearn the lessons of where this kind of politics leads.
    Also, how about reducing the insane levels of immigration? Young people are noticing

    I'd quite like to avoid the point where these views become widespread
    It might help or it might not. Young people are generally more positive on immigration than older people, and more tolerant in areas of high immigration than in areas of low immigration. I'm not convinced that London is swarming with young white men who are violently opposed to multiculturalism - they all speak with a Jamaican accent for a start. But my kids aren't white so I'm not an expert on young white people and their cultural practices.
    Young people are overwhelmingly the ones who pay the price for mass immigration, in a literal sense, in the form of competition for housing and suppression of wages.
    Sure: but young people are also by far the most likely to have friends who are from different countries, and they are the ones who will pay the most for an unbalanced population pyramid.

    So, it's swings and roundabouts.
    So which is bigger the swing or the roundabout ?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,507

    ICJ orders Israel to halt Rafah offensive in Gaza
    The court rules that Israel must immediately halt its military offensive and other actions in Rafah, citing the "immediate risk" to the Palestinian people.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,704
    I see we now have a Reform candidate in Witham, opposing Dame Priti Patel. I wonder how much damage he’ll do!
    Two Labour posters displayed in Witham yesterday. Admittedly outside the Labour Hall. No Tory posters that I’ve seen to date.
This discussion has been closed.