Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. Sign in or register to get started.

Meanwhile, in the Treasury… – politicalbetting.com

12345679»

Comments

  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,951
    Heathener said:

    I'll be even more radical: I'm not totally convinced Boris will run.

    Why? Because Sunak is ahead and he knows it. That may well increase as momentum for a sensible choice builds.

    Boris HATES losing and he will not want to be on the losing side against his own MPs.

    I reckon he may wait until after the tories lose the next election, pocketing his £150k a speech along the way, and then ride to the rescue when the party is truly down and out.

    I may be wrong. It has been known ;):smiley:

    Remind me about how the Russians declined to invade Ukraine.

    He's home and almost hosed

    Starmer must be very worried about being caught in the pincer movement played out on here this evening. First we had the 'splits in the Labour Party' hopefuls as Corbyn, Pidcock and their mates take their bats home and stand as independents. Then we had our very own true and pure socialist vowing to prove his point by voting for real levelling-up with Boris.

    It goes to show how flimsy Labour's 39 point poll lead is; once these anti-Starmer forces get their act together, we'll be miles behind. Or not, as the case may be.

    Labour have to be favourites for 24 but who do they fear most, Sunak or Johnson, or maybe the markets who clearly will determine the policies of the government for years to come

    I expect a substantial windfall tax (some say 40bn) will be announced by Hunt now the hapless Truss has been removed, which should close the gap and even provide room for inflation rises on pensions and benefits
    The biggest problem BigG is not the electability of the Conservative Party in 2025 (in my opinion Sunak calms the nation and saves the party) but if Johnson wins chaos ensues.

    Nonetheless he is a lucky General so perhaps a Johnson/ Ukraine victory over Putin will help out or China invading Taiwan leads him into a Third World War, which allows him to lead a unity War Cabinet for years, even decades. God help us!

    We used to call him an unflushable t*rd prior to the Chris Pincher event. Just look inside the bowl again.
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,484
    edited October 2022
    MaxPB said:

    Something that needs to be taken into account - thousands of those mad older members have old style memberships, or at least they did when I was last making calls to get renewals. They don't have email addresses and won't be eligible to vote. I don't know how many of them there are but it will be a big number, potentially game changing for Rishi who struggled with the racist old fools last time.

    Thanks. You've expressed something there that some of us on the left suspect but daren't say - that there's a bit of residual racism in the Tory Party that could harm Sunak's chances - because we'd be shouted down with "no there isn't" and "what about Corbyn?". Much better coming from you.
  • MaxPB said:

    Something that needs to be taken into account - thousands of those mad older members have old style memberships, or at least they did when I was last making calls to get renewals. They don't have email addresses and won't be eligible to vote. I don't know how many of them there are but it will be a big number, potentially game changing for Rishi who struggled with the racist old fools last time.

    The whole online vote in a few days thing sounds technically possible, but asking for trouble.

    Best of all will be if it becomes unnecessary, which is clearly the plan. Though that may need Boris Johnson's ego to be locked away in a safe, which sounds like a good idea but awfully difficult.

    (If the final MP round were 240-120, the loser would have to back out, wouldn't they? But what about 200-160? 190-170?)
    I cannot see Johnson backing out - even if he gets 105 to 250 for Sunak!
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064

    MaxPB said:

    @TheScreamingEagles wonder whether you've got an estimate of ineligible members, I think it's going to be a huge number actually. Just messaged some other people and they also think it could swing the result to Rishi.

    What make 'em ineligible. Failure to cough up dues? Neglecting to tip cap to local squire?
    No email address associated to the account and eligibility has been locked in aiui.
  • pingping Posts: 3,805
    edited October 2022
    Just listened to Any Questions, with Sir John Curtice.

    With respect, he doesn’t suit the format.

    He’s great, obviously, but give him his own 15 or 30 minute analysis slot, please, BBC.

    Keep any questions for active politicians / grandees / radical thinkers etc, who can opine on a broad range of political topics.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064

    MaxPB said:

    Something that needs to be taken into account - thousands of those mad older members have old style memberships, or at least they did when I was last making calls to get renewals. They don't have email addresses and won't be eligible to vote. I don't know how many of them there are but it will be a big number, potentially game changing for Rishi who struggled with the racist old fools last time.

    Thanks. You've expressed something there that some us on the left suspect but daren't say - that there's a bit of residual racism in the Tory Party - because we'd be shouted down with "no there isn't" and "what about Corbyn?". Much better coming from you.
    I think there's an element of racism among those older members. It's basically an exercise of waiting for them to die off and those racist attitudes to die with them over the next decade.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064
    I do wonder whether Rishi winning in a tight online only vote will see Boris have his own Trump moment claiming that the vote was fixed against him.
  • Heathener said:

    I'll be even more radical: I'm not totally convinced Boris will run.

    Why? Because Sunak is ahead and he knows it. That may well increase as momentum for a sensible choice builds.

    Boris HATES losing and he will not want to be on the losing side against his own MPs.

    I reckon he may wait until after the tories lose the next election, pocketing his £150k a speech along the way, and then ride to the rescue when the party is truly down and out.

    I may be wrong. It has been known ;):smiley:

    Remind me about how the Russians declined to invade Ukraine.

    He's home and almost hosed

    Starmer must be very worried about being caught in the pincer movement played out on here this evening. First we had the 'splits in the Labour Party' hopefuls as Corbyn, Pidcock and their mates take their bats home and stand as independents. Then we had our very own true and pure socialist vowing to prove his point by voting for real levelling-up with Boris.

    It goes to show how flimsy Labour's 39 point poll lead is; once these anti-Starmer forces get their act together, we'll be miles behind. Or not, as the case may be.

    Labour have to be favourites for 24 but who do they fear most, Sunak or Johnson, or maybe the markets who clearly will determine the policies of the government for years to come

    I expect a substantial windfall tax (some say 40bn) will be announced by Hunt now the hapless Truss has been removed, which should close the gap and even provide room for inflation rises on pensions and benefits
    The biggest problem BigG is not the electability of the Conservative Party in 2025 (in my opinion Sunak calms the nation and saves the party) but if Johnson wins chaos ensues.

    Nonetheless he is a lucky General so perhaps a Johnson/ Ukraine victory over Putin will help out or China invading Taiwan leads him into a Third World War, which allows him to lead a unity War Cabinet for years, even decades. God help us!

    We used to call him an unflushable t*rd prior to the Chris Pincher event. Just look inside the bowl again.
    I simply cannot accept that Johnson is the answer and hope and pray the mps and members keep him away from PM
  • Could a legal challenge emerge from party members who have no online facilities? Perhaps local associations can come up with some arrangements for such people - making party offices available etc or encouraging other members to help out with the online voting process.
  • pingping Posts: 3,805
    edited October 2022
    MaxPB said:

    I do wonder whether Rishi winning in a tight online only vote will see Boris have his own Trump moment claiming that the vote was fixed against him.

    Yep.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 11,560
    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Something that needs to be taken into account - thousands of those mad older members have old style memberships, or at least they did when I was last making calls to get renewals. They don't have email addresses and won't be eligible to vote. I don't know how many of them there are but it will be a big number, potentially game changing for Rishi who struggled with the racist old fools last time.

    Thanks. You've expressed something there that some us on the left suspect but daren't say - that there's a bit of residual racism in the Tory Party - because we'd be shouted down with "no there isn't" and "what about Corbyn?". Much better coming from you.
    I think there's an element of racism among those older members. It's basically an exercise of waiting for them to die off and those racist attitudes to die with them over the next decade.
    To be replaced by a modern new Conservative brand of xenophobia, led by Suella Braverman, where foreigners are hated not for the colour of their skin but just for being foreign.

  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040
    One of my favourite quotes from Boris is “My friends as I have discovered myself there are no disasters, only opportunities. And indeed, opportunities for fresh disasters”.

    I find the fact any significant part of the Tory party is willing to sign up for that a tad troubling.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,485
    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    @TheScreamingEagles wonder whether you've got an estimate of ineligible members, I think it's going to be a huge number actually. Just messaged some other people and they also think it could swing the result to Rishi.

    What make 'em ineligible. Failure to cough up dues? Neglecting to tip cap to local squire?
    No email address associated to the account and eligibility has been locked in aiui.
    How does that constitute a vote of members then?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,951
    dixiedean said:

    Will Bozo keep Hunt as CofE?
    If he doesn't the markets could finish him this time round.

    For a giggle, he'll go JRM. The markets will go bonkers!
  • dixiedean said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    @TheScreamingEagles wonder whether you've got an estimate of ineligible members, I think it's going to be a huge number actually. Just messaged some other people and they also think it could swing the result to Rishi.

    What make 'em ineligible. Failure to cough up dues? Neglecting to tip cap to local squire?
    No email address associated to the account and eligibility has been locked in aiui.
    How does that constitute a vote of members then?
    Because The 22 is judge, jury and court of appeal?
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,779

    Could a legal challenge emerge from party members who have no online facilities? Perhaps local associations can come up with some arrangements for such people - making party offices available etc or encouraging other members to help out with the online voting process.

    Should be simple enough. Voting could be done on a trust system.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,485
    MaxPB said:

    I do wonder whether Rishi winning in a tight online only vote will see Boris have his own Trump moment claiming that the vote was fixed against him.

    Well.
    He would have a point, wouldn't he?
    The Tory Party has specifically made it illegal for Trade Unions to vote in this way, for precisely these reasons.
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,929
    DavidL said:

    One of my favourite quotes from Boris is “My friends as I have discovered myself there are no disasters, only opportunities. And indeed, opportunities for fresh disasters”.

    I find the fact any significant part of the Tory party is willing to sign up for that a tad troubling.

    Seems to be borrowing from Churchill:

    'Success is going from one disaster to another without any loss of enthusiasm.'
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    Ahead of 9pm, our list of public declared backers for each candidates is as follows:

    Rishi Sunak on 88 MPs
    Boris Johnson on 51 MPs
    Penny Mordaunt on 22 MPs

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/who-s-backing-whom-boris-leads-the-way
  • AlistairMAlistairM Posts: 2,005
    DavidL said:

    One of my favourite quotes from Boris is “My friends as I have discovered myself there are no disasters, only opportunities. And indeed, opportunities for fresh disasters”.

    I find the fact any significant part of the Tory party is willing to sign up for that a tad troubling.

    Spot on. This is a perfect opportunity for a fresh disaster.
  • According to the Independent:

    The former Tory leader (Boris.....Johnson) told trade minister Sir James Duddridge “we are going to do this”, despite standing down just six weeks ago after being ousted by his own cabinet following a series of scandals.

    Sir James said Mr Johnson will land back in the UK on Saturday. The Tory MP said: “I’ve been in contact with the boss via WhatsApp. He’s going to fly back. He said, ‘I’m flying back, Dudders. We are going to do this. I’m up for it’.”
  • What proportion of Tory members have email addresses and are comfortable using tech? Probably a very high proportion but I wonder, is there a chance that making it online-only could skew the voter base, i.e. elderly members might be less likely to vote than they would have been if pencil and paper had been an option?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,951

    Starmer must be very worried about being caught in the pincer movement played out on here this evening. First we had the 'splits in the Labour Party' hopefuls as Corbyn, Pidcock and their mates take their bats home and stand as independents. Then we had our very own true and pure socialist vowing to prove his point by voting for real levelling-up with Boris.

    It goes to show how flimsy Labour's 39 point poll lead is; once these anti-Starmer forces get their act together, we'll be miles behind. Or not, as the case may be.

    Labour have to be favourites for 24 but who do they fear most, Sunak or Johnson, or maybe the markets who clearly will determine the policies of the government for years to come

    I expect a substantial windfall tax (some say 40bn) will be announced by Hunt now the hapless Truss has been removed, which should close the gap and even provide room for inflation rises on pensions and benefits
    Who's going to be CoE on 31 October? There's a danger the balm that Hunt's appointment poured over the markets could evaporate long before then.
    It would very foolish for whoever wins to remove Hunt at this most critical of times
    Hunt might remove himself if Johnson wins.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 8,481

    HYUFD said:

    Boris will make the ballot
    Boris will be defeated by Sunak
    Boris will win the membership final vote
    The party splits asunder. General Election.

    Pass the popcorn 🍿

    If they both are the only candidates in the last 2
    Sunak and Johnson likely do a deal, especially if Sunak wins the MPs ballot.

    Johnson gets Home or Foreign Secretary with Sunak PM. If Sunak loses the next general election Johnson then in prime position to be Leader of the Opposition if he holds his seat
    Surely Ambassador to Ukraine is Bozo's destiny?
    Nah he wouldn’t like the paperwork of being a diplomat.

    Make him the UK’s Ukrainian Tsar instead

  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 8,481
    rcs1000 said:

    Carnyx said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Well it was all getting a bit boring

    “America's military must be ready to respond to a potential Chinese invasion of Taiwan that could come before the end of this year, the head of the US Navy has said”


    https://twitter.com/telegraphworld/status/1583421386059501568?s=61&t=VWkh91lnXkOw5HdH7eJFRQ

    If you want peace, prepare for war.

    If Ukraine had been having yearly parades of hundreds of tanks, zillions of goose stepping troops and some nice mobile nuclear rockets, anyone think that Putin would have tried it on?
    I think we should also acknowledge a great failure in diplomacy and policy by NATO. Had America moved a squadron of F14s into Kiev in December 2021 and made clear it would not stand for any incursion, there would almost certainly not have been one. Instead there was all that equivalent bollocks about where on the scale any invasion sat.

    Deterrence has a lower cost the earlier in the escalation process you do it. Something I wish would be explained to the Elons in US policy circles.

    Er, the US hasn't had any F-14s since 2006. You could have asked the Iranians very nicely, though.
    The way things are going for the Russian air force, I think it is highly likely that Iranian F-14s are the next thing to be thrown into the fight.
    More effective to fly them than throw them
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 53,003
    edited October 2022

    MaxPB said:

    Something that needs to be taken into account - thousands of those mad older members have old style memberships, or at least they did when I was last making calls to get renewals. They don't have email addresses and won't be eligible to vote. I don't know how many of them there are but it will be a big number, potentially game changing for Rishi who struggled with the racist old fools last time.

    The whole online vote in a few days thing sounds technically possible, but asking for trouble.

    Best of all will be if it becomes unnecessary, which is clearly the plan. Though that may need Boris Johnson's ego to be locked away in a safe, which sounds like a good idea but awfully difficult.

    (If the final MP round were 240-120, the loser would have to back out, wouldn't they? But what about 200-160? 190-170?)
    MPs votes should have been weighted as to half the vote, so if 240:120 the members would have to vote for Boris by more than 2:1.

    That would have consulted the members without it being a crap-shoot with the bat-shit crazy....
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,779
    Scott_xP said:

    Ahead of 9pm, our list of public declared backers for each candidates is as follows:

    Rishi Sunak on 88 MPs
    Boris Johnson on 51 MPs
    Penny Mordaunt on 22 MPs

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/who-s-backing-whom-boris-leads-the-way

    On a naive extrapolation from that, in order to reach 100 Johnson will need around 90% or more of MPs to nominate.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,422
    I'd be amazed if Nick Fletcher didn't back Boris judging by his twitter. He's asked the questions to troll people I think.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,792
    ….
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,422
    Pulpstar said:

    I'd be amazed if Nick Fletcher didn't back Boris judging by his twitter. He's asked the questions to troll people I think.

    Nick Fletcher MP
    @NickFletcherMP
    ·
    3h
    BORIS JOHNSON

    My inbox has been full of emails from my constituents urging me to persuade @BorisJohnson to replace our outgoing Prime Minister.

    I am genuinely interested to know what you think. 🧵1/2

    #Doncasterisgreat #2Down3ToGo https://pic.twitter.com/NkJzlnoGOV
    Replying to @NickFletcherMP and @BorisJohnson

    Could you use the comments below?

    However when you do comment below, can you also state 1) which way you voted in 2019 and 2) whether you are in my constituency?

    Thank you. #doncasterisgreat
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 53,003
    pancakes said:

    What proportion of Tory members have email addresses and are comfortable using tech? Probably a very high proportion but I wonder, is there a chance that making it online-only could skew the voter base, i.e. elderly members might be less likely to vote than they would have been if pencil and paper had been an option?

    It's OK, they can give me their votes - and I will vote the way they wish.

    Hur hur hur.....
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,143
    dixiedean said:

    MaxPB said:

    I do wonder whether Rishi winning in a tight online only vote will see Boris have his own Trump moment claiming that the vote was fixed against him.

    Well.
    He would have a point, wouldn't he?
    The Tory Party has specifically made it illegal for Trade Unions to vote in this way, for precisely these reasons.
    I'm sure Vlad will also be trying to hack in.

    Although probably not for Johnson given he is the toast of all Kyiv.

  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    “True Boris fans will have the courage to tell him to sit this one out.”

    Fascinating from Charles Moore

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/10/21/boris-remains-remarkable-politician-should-sit-one/
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 6,199

    Could a legal challenge emerge from party members who have no online facilities? Perhaps local associations can come up with some arrangements for such people - making party offices available etc or encouraging other members to help out with the online voting process.

    As a rule, the courts steer clear of interfering with membership clubs and their rules. Suspect the limit would be suing for your money back via small claims court (not that there would for £25).
  • Chris said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Ahead of 9pm, our list of public declared backers for each candidates is as follows:

    Rishi Sunak on 88 MPs
    Boris Johnson on 51 MPs
    Penny Mordaunt on 22 MPs

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/who-s-backing-whom-boris-leads-the-way

    On a naive extrapolation from that, in order to reach 100 Johnson will need around 90% or more of MPs to nominate.
    Not so surely. The totals listed amount to just 161 MPs - with a further 196 to declare. Johnson needs a further 49.
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,929
    Can anyone explain how Iran facing a domestic crisis at home can afford to be getting itself involved in a major European war?
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 11,560

    Can anyone explain how Iran facing a domestic crisis at home can afford to be getting itself involved in a major European war?

    Not having Truss as PM probably helps…
  • paulyork64paulyork64 Posts: 2,507
    Heathener said:

    I'll be even more radical: I'm not totally convinced Boris will run.

    Why? Because Sunak is ahead and he knows it. That may well increase as momentum for a sensible choice builds.

    Boris HATES losing and he will not want to be on the losing side against his own MPs.

    I reckon he may wait until after the tories lose the next election, pocketing his £150k a speech along the way, and then ride to the rescue when the party is truly down and out.

    I may be wrong. It has been known ;):smiley:

    He's not likely to win his seat at the next election.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 53,003
    Farooq said:

    I want all of them to fall short of 100 nominations

    Only three declared candidates so far. The way Mordaunt is struggling there will be no more.

    Which means a lot of Did Note Vote. In the current circumstances, that is a terrible dereliction of duty.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    ...
  • El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 4,240
    pancakes said:

    What proportion of Tory members have email addresses and are comfortable using tech? Probably a very high proportion but I wonder, is there a chance that making it online-only could skew the voter base, i.e. elderly members might be less likely to vote than they would have been if pencil and paper had been an option?

    Because the one thing that could make this even more of a clusterfuck is a Trump-style “stolen election” narrative…
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    NEW: On Boris Johnson Conservative MP @AaronBell4NUL tells me “I don’t see how it’s feasible for him to bring the stability we need when he’s still under investigation by the Privileges Committee for misleading Parliament…I hope someone is pointing that out to him, frankly.” https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/status/1583503751411027968
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,981
    edited October 2022
    "Return of Boris Johnson could destroy Tory party, warns William Hague

    Bringing back former PM ’worst idea I have heard in 46 years’ (£)

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/johnson-rishi-sunak-penny-mordaunt-tory-leadership-general-election-follow-live-rvr79nm20
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,143

    Heathener said:

    I'll be even more radical: I'm not totally convinced Boris will run.

    Why? Because Sunak is ahead and he knows it. That may well increase as momentum for a sensible choice builds.

    Boris HATES losing and he will not want to be on the losing side against his own MPs.

    I reckon he may wait until after the tories lose the next election, pocketing his £150k a speech along the way, and then ride to the rescue when the party is truly down and out.

    I may be wrong. It has been known ;):smiley:

    He's not likely to win his seat at the next election.
    Detail.

    He wont be in Uxbridge in 2024.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 53,003
    edited October 2022
    Chris said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Ahead of 9pm, our list of public declared backers for each candidates is as follows:

    Rishi Sunak on 88 MPs
    Boris Johnson on 51 MPs
    Penny Mordaunt on 22 MPs

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/who-s-backing-whom-boris-leads-the-way

    On a naive extrapolation from that, in order to reach 100 Johnson will need around 90% or more of MPs to nominate.
    Boris voters are not exactly backwards at coming forwards. Of those undeclared, I suspect there are very few reluctant "Oh, alright then...." backers left.

    Far more Mordaunt backers wondering if they can stick with their gal or have to go to Rishi.
  • MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Something that needs to be taken into account - thousands of those mad older members have old style memberships, or at least they did when I was last making calls to get renewals. They don't have email addresses and won't be eligible to vote. I don't know how many of them there are but it will be a big number, potentially game changing for Rishi who struggled with the racist old fools last time.

    Thanks. You've expressed something there that some us on the left suspect but daren't say - that there's a bit of residual racism in the Tory Party - because we'd be shouted down with "no there isn't" and "what about Corbyn?". Much better coming from you.
    I think there's an element of racism among those older members. It's basically an exercise of waiting for them to die off and those racist attitudes to die with them over the next decade.
    To be replaced by a modern new Conservative brand of xenophobia, led by Suella Braverman, where foreigners are hated not for the colour of their skin but just for being foreign.

    It is interesting part of the American experience, that one wave of immigrants, is often comprised of grandmothers and grandfathers of a wave of nativists.

    Descendants of immigrants are famously proud of the achievements, experiences, sacrifices of their ancestors. At same time, many readily assume, that today's newcomers are NOT as worthy, deserving, etc., etc. of respect let alone entry into OUR country as our kinfolk.

    Reckon that many would have QUITE the shock IF only they could take a time machine, and witness their own great-whatever-grandparents coming off the boat at Ellis Island or Castle Garden.

    One major sign of assimilation. And think, perhaps, that Braverman, Patel and similar UK non-White politicos are personifying and representing something similar?
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,398
    I am not sure we can assume that conservative members without email addresses are a) racists and b) certain to vote for Boris Johnson.
  • Heathener said:

    I'll be even more radical: I'm not totally convinced Boris will run.

    Why? Because Sunak is ahead and he knows it. That may well increase as momentum for a sensible choice builds.

    Boris HATES losing and he will not want to be on the losing side against his own MPs.

    I reckon he may wait until after the tories lose the next election, pocketing his £150k a speech along the way, and then ride to the rescue when the party is truly down and out.

    I may be wrong. It has been known ;):smiley:

    He's not likely to win his seat at the next election.
    Detail.

    He wont be in Uxbridge in 2024.
    There are rumours he has been sniffing round the Reigate seat, where Blunt is standing down
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,485

    Can anyone explain how Iran facing a domestic crisis at home can afford to be getting itself involved in a major European war?

    Isn't a war the go to plan for collapsing regimes?
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 53,003
    Scott_xP said:

    NEW: On Boris Johnson Conservative MP @AaronBell4NUL tells me “I don’t see how it’s feasible for him to bring the stability we need when he’s still under investigation by the Privileges Committee for misleading Parliament…I hope someone is pointing that out to him, frankly.” https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/status/1583503751411027968

    I hope someone is pointing it out to the whole Parliamentary Party.

    (My system is currently playing Mama Don't by JJ Cale. What a cracking track!)
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064
    darkage said:

    I am not sure we can assume that conservative members without email addresses are a) racists and b) certain to vote for Boris Johnson.

    I have met and spoken to many of these types having been a Tory member for 11 out of the last 12 years.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,792
    Scott_xP said:

    NEW: On Boris Johnson Conservative MP @AaronBell4NUL tells me “I don’t see how it’s feasible for him to bring the stability we need when he’s still under investigation by the Privileges Committee for misleading Parliament…I hope someone is pointing that out to him, frankly.” https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/status/1583503751411027968



    Weasel words from Bell/Price.

    Should just have said: “Piss off Boris, you fucking has-been helmet”
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 53,003

    Heathener said:

    I'll be even more radical: I'm not totally convinced Boris will run.

    Why? Because Sunak is ahead and he knows it. That may well increase as momentum for a sensible choice builds.

    Boris HATES losing and he will not want to be on the losing side against his own MPs.

    I reckon he may wait until after the tories lose the next election, pocketing his £150k a speech along the way, and then ride to the rescue when the party is truly down and out.

    I may be wrong. It has been known ;):smiley:

    He's not likely to win his seat at the next election.
    Detail.

    He wont be in Uxbridge in 2024.
    There are rumours he has been sniffing round the Reigate seat, where Blunt is standing down
    Boris...seat...sniffing....

    Just no!
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,807
    Scott_xP said:

    Ahead of 9pm, our list of public declared backers for each candidates is as follows:

    Rishi Sunak on 88 MPs
    Boris Johnson on 51 MPs
    Penny Mordaunt on 22 MPs

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/who-s-backing-whom-boris-leads-the-way

    That Speccie article is hilarious:

    "We will have a new prime minister within a week. Boris Johnson leads the way. Read the full list of who’s backing whom below.

    Rishi Sunak (88)...
    Boris Johnson (50)..."


    Boris Johnson 'Winning here!'
  • GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,860
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I'd be amazed if Nick Fletcher didn't back Boris judging by his twitter. He's asked the questions to troll people I think.

    Nick Fletcher MP
    @NickFletcherMP
    ·
    3h
    BORIS JOHNSON

    My inbox has been full of emails from my constituents urging me to persuade @BorisJohnson to replace our outgoing Prime Minister.

    I am genuinely interested to know what you think. 🧵1/2

    #Doncasterisgreat #2Down3ToGo https://pic.twitter.com/NkJzlnoGOV
    Replying to @NickFletcherMP and @BorisJohnson

    Could you use the comments below?

    However when you do comment below, can you also state 1) which way you voted in 2019 and 2) whether you are in my constituency?

    Thank you. #doncasterisgreat
    Bozza is probably his only hope of keeping Don Valley (funnily enough the constituency I grew up in, though I've never cast a vote there - I'd moved away by the time I was eligible to vote in my first GE; his office is a few doors down from the house I grew up in).
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,951

    Heathener said:

    I'll be even more radical: I'm not totally convinced Boris will run.

    Why? Because Sunak is ahead and he knows it. That may well increase as momentum for a sensible choice builds.

    Boris HATES losing and he will not want to be on the losing side against his own MPs.

    I reckon he may wait until after the tories lose the next election, pocketing his £150k a speech along the way, and then ride to the rescue when the party is truly down and out.

    I may be wrong. It has been known ;):smiley:

    Remind me about how the Russians declined to invade Ukraine.

    He's home and almost hosed

    Starmer must be very worried about being caught in the pincer movement played out on here this evening. First we had the 'splits in the Labour Party' hopefuls as Corbyn, Pidcock and their mates take their bats home and stand as independents. Then we had our very own true and pure socialist vowing to prove his point by voting for real levelling-up with Boris.

    It goes to show how flimsy Labour's 39 point poll lead is; once these anti-Starmer forces get their act together, we'll be miles behind. Or not, as the case may be.

    Labour have to be favourites for 24 but who do they fear most, Sunak or Johnson, or maybe the markets who clearly will determine the policies of the government for years to come

    I expect a substantial windfall tax (some say 40bn) will be announced by Hunt now the hapless Truss has been removed, which should close the gap and even provide room for inflation rises on pensions and benefits
    The biggest problem BigG is not the electability of the Conservative Party in 2025 (in my opinion Sunak calms the nation and saves the party) but if Johnson wins chaos ensues.

    Nonetheless he is a lucky General so perhaps a Johnson/ Ukraine victory over Putin will help out or China invading Taiwan leads him into a Third World War, which allows him to lead a unity War Cabinet for years, even decades. God help us!

    We used to call him an unflushable t*rd prior to the Chris Pincher event. Just look inside the bowl again.
    I simply cannot accept that Johnson is the answer and hope and pray the mps and members keep him away from PM
    It really does make one feel quite sick thinking of the damage Johnson could inflict over 2, 7 or 12 years.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 53,003

    I was a bit surprised to see Alok Sharma coming out in support of Boris. For some reason, I thought he was at the sensible end of Tory MPs.

    Shows how little I know.

    With just a 4k majority, he still has naff all chance of keeping his Reading West seat whoever he votes for.
    But Brady's in decent position for a chicken run. Though gonna be plenty of chickens, enough to fill bunch of KFC Big Buckets.

    But not enough semi-safe roosts for the demand.
    There's going to be a lot of interest in that one last safe seat. Hah!
  • NEW THREAD

  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 5,355
    Sunak really needs to be Quorn commentator pig of this contest, mellifluously looking into the Tory parties members' eyes and going "Forget about the alternative, Patricia"
  • MJWMJW Posts: 1,748
    dixiedean said:

    MaxPB said:

    I do wonder whether Rishi winning in a tight online only vote will see Boris have his own Trump moment claiming that the vote was fixed against him.

    Well.
    He would have a point, wouldn't he?
    The Tory Party has specifically made it illegal for Trade Unions to vote in this way, for precisely these reasons.
    Well, it's more that they want to make it more awkward for them to win a strike ballot. Less down to irregularities, more down to perceiving it as too easy to get a 'Yes' when you can drop everyone considering it an email and they can do so in two seconds.
  • Have now been working (in between posting!) for long enough, am heading off to take a nap AND watch "Forge of Fire" which is great US "reality" TV show featuring winner-take-all contests of blacksmiths.

    Judged by expert panel of iron-mongers and martial-artists on the performance of the knives, swords, spears, cleavers, lances, axes and other implements of destruction they are tasked with forging and fashioning under the clock.

    Do NOT try this at home without expert training and adult supervision!

    Buzz words & phrases: quenching, welding, hammering, "you're blade will kill!"
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,674
    MaxPB said:

    Tory MPs should really, really think back to Labour MPs in 2015 putting Corbyn on the ballot so that Labour members could have their say. It was a disaster for Labour. If Tory MPs do the same here and give Boris enough pity votes to get him on the ballot paper they will regret it.

    They have a duty to the nation and the economy to make Rishi PM on Monday afternoon and not let Boris or Penny get to 100 or more votes.

    I was talking about "the window" the other day. For a couple of decades it was safe to put the Corbynite on the Labour ballots for e.g. NEC, leader, etc as a virtue signal. But the leadership failed to notice what had happened after the Miliband rule changes.

    The Tories are in much the same position now, but I don't think there is anyone with the clarity to see through the fractures to a solution.
  • darkage said:

    I am not sure we can assume that conservative members without email addresses are a) racists and b) certain to vote for Boris Johnson.

    But we can assume an age skew.
  • NEW THREAD
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,674

    Scott_xP said:

    NEW: On Boris Johnson Conservative MP @AaronBell4NUL tells me “I don’t see how it’s feasible for him to bring the stability we need when he’s still under investigation by the Privileges Committee for misleading Parliament…I hope someone is pointing that out to him, frankly.” https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/status/1583503751411027968

    I hope someone is pointing it out to the whole Parliamentary Party.

    (My system is currently playing Mama Don't by JJ Cale. What a cracking track!)
    Not enough JJ Cale in the zeitgeist.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,485
    MJW said:

    dixiedean said:

    MaxPB said:

    I do wonder whether Rishi winning in a tight online only vote will see Boris have his own Trump moment claiming that the vote was fixed against him.

    Well.
    He would have a point, wouldn't he?
    The Tory Party has specifically made it illegal for Trade Unions to vote in this way, for precisely these reasons.
    Well, it's more that they want to make it more awkward for them to win a strike ballot. Less down to irregularities, more down to perceiving it as too easy to get a 'Yes' when you can drop everyone considering it an email and they can do so in two seconds.
    Indeed.
    So why is it OK for the Tory Party?
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 4,733
    edited October 2022
    Ghedebrav said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I'd be amazed if Nick Fletcher didn't back Boris judging by his twitter. He's asked the questions to troll people I think.

    Nick Fletcher MP
    @NickFletcherMP
    ·
    3h
    BORIS JOHNSON

    My inbox has been full of emails from my constituents urging me to persuade @BorisJohnson to replace our outgoing Prime Minister.

    I am genuinely interested to know what you think. 🧵1/2

    #Doncasterisgreat #2Down3ToGo https://pic.twitter.com/NkJzlnoGOV
    Replying to @NickFletcherMP and @BorisJohnson

    Could you use the comments below?

    However when you do comment below, can you also state 1) which way you voted in 2019 and 2) whether you are in my constituency?

    Thank you. #doncasterisgreat
    Bozza is probably his only hope of keeping Don Valley (funnily enough the constituency I grew up in, though I've never cast a vote there - I'd moved away by the time I was eligible to vote in my first GE; his office is a few doors down from the house I grew up in).
    If you've got a spare million or two the castle is currently up for sale...

    I doubt most would recognise that area as looking like their image of "Doncaster".

    Whilst I agree that the constituency is not obviously Tory (particularly the mining villages), like parts of the East Midlands the demographics have been changing and there is an awful lot of new build housing. Depending on what happens with the airport I don't think it will ever go back to being rock solid red wall.
  • paulyork64paulyork64 Posts: 2,507

    Heathener said:

    I'll be even more radical: I'm not totally convinced Boris will run.

    Why? Because Sunak is ahead and he knows it. That may well increase as momentum for a sensible choice builds.

    Boris HATES losing and he will not want to be on the losing side against his own MPs.

    I reckon he may wait until after the tories lose the next election, pocketing his £150k a speech along the way, and then ride to the rescue when the party is truly down and out.

    I may be wrong. It has been known ;):smiley:

    He's not likely to win his seat at the next election.
    Detail.

    He wont be in Uxbridge in 2024.
    If he's not leader I don't think he gets to pick his seat.
  • paulyork64paulyork64 Posts: 2,507
    New thread
  • rcs1000 said:

    Carnyx said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Well it was all getting a bit boring

    “America's military must be ready to respond to a potential Chinese invasion of Taiwan that could come before the end of this year, the head of the US Navy has said”


    https://twitter.com/telegraphworld/status/1583421386059501568?s=61&t=VWkh91lnXkOw5HdH7eJFRQ

    If you want peace, prepare for war.

    If Ukraine had been having yearly parades of hundreds of tanks, zillions of goose stepping troops and some nice mobile nuclear rockets, anyone think that Putin would have tried it on?
    I think we should also acknowledge a great failure in diplomacy and policy by NATO. Had America moved a squadron of F14s into Kiev in December 2021 and made clear it would not stand for any incursion, there would almost certainly not have been one. Instead there was all that equivalent bollocks about where on the scale any invasion sat.

    Deterrence has a lower cost the earlier in the escalation process you do it. Something I wish would be explained to the Elons in US policy circles.

    Er, the US hasn't had any F-14s since 2006. You could have asked the Iranians very nicely, though.
    The way things are going for the Russian air force, I think it is highly likely that Iranian F-14s are the next thing to be thrown into the fight.
    More effective to fly them than throw them
    Depends if they have enough fuel.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 8,481
    dixiedean said:

    Can anyone explain how Iran facing a domestic crisis at home can afford to be getting itself involved in a major European war?

    Isn't a war the go to plan for collapsing regimes?
    Don’t give the government any ideas!
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,606
    Test
This discussion has been closed.