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Truss dominates Sunak in the polling except the key one? – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 8,489
edited July 31 in General
Truss dominates Sunak in the polling except the key one? – politicalbetting.com

Tory members think both candidates performed well in last night's leadership debate, but more say so of Truss than SunakTrussDid well: 78%Did badly: 21%SunakDid well: 65%Did badly: 34%https://t.co/UHictqetge pic.twitter.com/qmLqXMH0YT

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 15,680
    edited July 26
    Betfair next prime minister
    1.27 Liz Truss 79%
    4.8 Rishi Sunak 21%

    Next Conservative leader
    1.26 Liz Truss 79%
    4.7 Rishi Sunak 21%
  • So a third of Tory voters in the Red Wall think Keir would be a better PM than Truss? Is this historically high or not? Anyone got anything to compare it to?
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 19,448
    Ashes
  • At this moment, which of the following individuals do Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the United Kingdom? (25-26 July)

    Liz Truss 38%
    Rishi Sunak 33%
    Don't Know 29%

    Keir Starmer 44%
    Rishi Sunak 29%
    Don't Know 27%

    Keir Starmer 40%
    Liz Truss 35%
    Don't Know 25%
  • Which of the following individuals do Conservative Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the United Kingdom? (25-26 July)

    Liz Truss 47%
    Rishi Sunak 34%
    Don't Know 20%

    Rishi Sunak 48%
    Keir Starmer 33%
    Don't Know 27%

    Liz Truss 54%
    Keir Starmer 27%
    Don't Know 20%
  • @wooliedyed perhaps Truss should risk a GE? Before the economic headwinds get too bad?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 41,395
    (FPT)Interesting thread discussing evidence on the early cases of the pandemic in Wuhan.

    https://twitter.com/MichaelWorobey/status/1551949557205938176
    Our preprints on the origin of SARS-CoV-2 have now been peer reviewed and published as a pair of Research Articles by @ScienceMagazine

    Well worth a read for those still interested.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 23,402
    Dare I click on the link in the header? :neutral:
  • El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 3,034
    edited July 26
    Good headline, @TheScreamingEagles . If I didn’t know better I’d think an experienced sub had written it.
  • A large swing in the Red Wall, the new Tory either needs to find a way to keep those gains or go big on winning the Lib Dem targets again
  • tlg86 said:

    Dare I click on the link in the header? :neutral:

    It is safe
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 4,185

    So a third of Tory voters in the Red Wall think Keir would be a better PM than Truss? Is this historically high or not? Anyone got anything to compare it to?

    Not sure but looking at the figures against VI, it also means an awful lot of Labour voters dont think Starmer would be a better PM either.....
    I'd suggest the figures are a little skewed because Rishi ravers dont want Liz and vice versa. It will settle once election completed
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 102,795
    tlg86 said:

    Dare I click on the link in the header? :neutral:

    Yes.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 102,795

    Good headline, @TheScreamingEagles . If I didn’t know better I’d think an experienced sub had written it.

    I have form, the weekend after Mrs May announced her snap election.

    It seems every day new record breaking polls come out implying that the Tories are going win a stonking landslide on June the 8th, whilst Jeremy Corbyn and Labour would suffer less punishment if they booked 400 dominatrices concurrently that night and chose ‘mower’ as their safe word.

    https://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2017/04/23/why-a-1997-style-landslide-or-even-a-1983-style-landslide-might-not-happen-but-maybe-a-2005-style-majority-of-66-will/
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 4,185
    edited July 26

    @wooliedyed perhaps Truss should risk a GE? Before the economic headwinds get too bad?

    If she gets a lead of anything over 5 points i would suggest going for it. She either gets 5 years to ride out the storm or is LOTO against a ridiculously weak Starmer multi party coalition/minority

    But its carrying the party/convincing them its the best chance
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 15,680
    URL for tonight's Sun/TalkTV debate at 6pm
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngb9770xx10
  • Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 3,863

    Which of the following individuals do Conservative Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the United Kingdom? (25-26 July)

    Liz Truss 47%
    Rishi Sunak 34%
    Don't Know 20%

    Rishi Sunak 48%
    Keir Starmer 33%
    Don't Know 27%

    Liz Truss 54%
    Keir Starmer 27%
    Don't Know 20%

    Starmer will be absolutely delighted with those numbers.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 19,448
    Nigelb said:

    (FPT)Interesting thread discussing evidence on the early cases of the pandemic in Wuhan.

    https://twitter.com/MichaelWorobey/status/1551949557205938176
    Our preprints on the origin of SARS-CoV-2 have now been peer reviewed and published as a pair of Research Articles by @ScienceMagazine

    Well worth a read for those still interested.

    He has changed his tune, this is him in March 2021

    That [seafood market in Wuhan] was definitely connected to a lot of the early cases, but it's now clear that the epidemic started well before that," said Canadian researcher Michael Worobey, professor and head of the University of Arizona's Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology.

    "Rather than being the source of early infections from animals to humans in that market, it was probably really a human-to-human amplifier of outbreak," Worobey told Quirks & Quarks host, Bob McDonald.

    Current thread says it started in the seafood market, no ifs or buts. Bit hard to take seriously.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 71,279
    edited July 26

    Which of the following individuals do Conservative Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the United Kingdom? (25-26 July)

    Liz Truss 47%
    Rishi Sunak 34%
    Don't Know 20%

    Rishi Sunak 48%
    Keir Starmer 33%
    Don't Know 27%

    Liz Truss 54%
    Keir Starmer 27%
    Don't Know 20%

    Starmer will be absolutely delighted with those numbers.
    Hold up this is 2019 CON voters.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 4,185

    @wooliedyed perhaps Truss should risk a GE? Before the economic headwinds get too bad?

    If she gets a lead of anything over 5 points i would suggest going for it. She either gets 5 years to ride out the storm or is LOTO against a ridiculously weak Starmer multi party coalition/minority

    But its carrying the party/convincing them its the best chance
    However im far from convinced she will get a 5 point lead outwith Opinium
  • DriverDriver Posts: 477

    So a third of Tory voters in the Red Wall think Keir would be a better PM than Truss? Is this historically high or not? Anyone got anything to compare it to?

    Is that based on current voting intention or 2019 vote?
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 22,808

    Which of the following individuals do Conservative Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the United Kingdom? (25-26 July)

    Liz Truss 47%
    Rishi Sunak 34%
    Don't Know 20%

    Rishi Sunak 48%
    Keir Starmer 33%
    Don't Know 27%

    Liz Truss 54%
    Keir Starmer 27%
    Don't Know 20%

    Is that Conservative 2019? Or Conservative now?
  • Pulpstar said:

    Which of the following individuals do Conservative Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the United Kingdom? (25-26 July)

    Liz Truss 47%
    Rishi Sunak 34%
    Don't Know 20%

    Rishi Sunak 48%
    Keir Starmer 33%
    Don't Know 27%

    Liz Truss 54%
    Keir Starmer 27%
    Don't Know 20%

    Starmer will be absolutely delighted with those numbers.
    Christ.
    Do note this is CONSERVATIVE voters, not all voters as I originally read it as. A third of Tory voters think Starmer would be a better PM than Truss.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 4,185
    dixiedean said:

    Which of the following individuals do Conservative Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the United Kingdom? (25-26 July)

    Liz Truss 47%
    Rishi Sunak 34%
    Don't Know 20%

    Rishi Sunak 48%
    Keir Starmer 33%
    Don't Know 27%

    Liz Truss 54%
    Keir Starmer 27%
    Don't Know 20%

    Is that Conservative 2019? Or Conservative now?
    For reference, mondays poll saw 15% 2019 Tory go Starmer over Truss but 13% 2019 Labour go Truss over Starner
  • Driver said:

    So a third of Tory voters in the Red Wall think Keir would be a better PM than Truss? Is this historically high or not? Anyone got anything to compare it to?

    Is that based on current voting intention or 2019 vote?
    Dunno, trying to find out
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 41,257

    Driver said:

    So a third of Tory voters in the Red Wall think Keir would be a better PM than Truss? Is this historically high or not? Anyone got anything to compare it to?

    Is that based on current voting intention or 2019 vote?
    Dunno, trying to find out
    Redfield usually breaks it down by 2019 vote.

    https://redfieldandwiltonstrategies.com/latest-red-wall-voting-intention-12-13-june-2022/
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 102,795
    The person behind Labour's social media team has got some game.






    https://twitter.com/UKLabour/status/1551933291338547206
  • The person behind Labour's social media team has got some game.






    https://twitter.com/UKLabour/status/1551933291338547206

    They called themselves Tory Debate Watch yesterday!
  • CorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorseBattery Posts: 21,334
    edited July 26

    Driver said:

    So a third of Tory voters in the Red Wall think Keir would be a better PM than Truss? Is this historically high or not? Anyone got anything to compare it to?

    Is that based on current voting intention or 2019 vote?
    Dunno, trying to find out
    Redfield usually breaks it down by 2019 vote.

    https://redfieldandwiltonstrategies.com/latest-red-wall-voting-intention-12-13-june-2022/
    So if that is the assumption, a third of 2019 Tory voters think Keir Starmer would be a better PM than Truss.

    (in the Red Wall)
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 41,257

    The person behind Labour's social media team has got some game.

    I assumed yesterday that the opening shot was showing two holograms, but I've seen it suggested that it was actually a live shot of them. Does anyone know the answer?
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 4,185
    edited July 26

    Pulpstar said:

    Which of the following individuals do Conservative Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the United Kingdom? (25-26 July)

    Liz Truss 47%
    Rishi Sunak 34%
    Don't Know 20%

    Rishi Sunak 48%
    Keir Starmer 33%
    Don't Know 27%

    Liz Truss 54%
    Keir Starmer 27%
    Don't Know 20%

    Starmer will be absolutely delighted with those numbers.
    Christ.
    Do note this is CONSERVATIVE voters, not all voters as I originally read it as. A third of Tory voters think Starmer would be a better PM than Truss.
    But do also remember we are in a leadership battle. Rishi backers are predisposed and programmed to vote not Truss and Truss backers the same re Rishi. The key issue for them right now is the leadership not the next GE
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 46,146

    Betfair next prime minister
    1.27 Liz Truss 79%
    4.8 Rishi Sunak 21%

    Next Conservative leader
    1.26 Liz Truss 79%
    4.7 Rishi Sunak 21%

    Rishi has taken so long a walk in the last 24 hours he's practically at John O'Groats.
  • Pulpstar said:

    Which of the following individuals do Conservative Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the United Kingdom? (25-26 July)

    Liz Truss 47%
    Rishi Sunak 34%
    Don't Know 20%

    Rishi Sunak 48%
    Keir Starmer 33%
    Don't Know 27%

    Liz Truss 54%
    Keir Starmer 27%
    Don't Know 20%

    Starmer will be absolutely delighted with those numbers.
    Christ.
    Do note this is CONSERVATIVE voters, not all voters as I originally read it as. A third of Tory voters think Starmer would be a better PM than Truss.
    But do also remember we are in a leadership battle. Rishi backers are predispo andsed programmed to vote not Truss and Truss backers the same re Rishi. The key issue for them right now is the leadership not the next GE
    Yes indeedy - one to study over the next few months.

    If Truss starts behind though, it's not going to go well if the economy goes in the toilet.
  • https://twitter.com/BestForBritain/status/1551943885424939008

    Liz Truss says she will legislate to deny workers the right to strike, despite unions warning that this would lead to an all out general strike.

    I'd love to see how Truss plans to force workers, to work against their will. Also, what that might be called. ~AA

    So Liz is against basic democratic rights then? Should we not be allowed to strike?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 46,146
    On thread header topic, I see what you did there.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 19,448

    The person behind Labour's social media team has got some game.






    https://twitter.com/UKLabour/status/1551933291338547206

    Very good

    Sunak's a shouty little Tory boy.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 4,185

    Pulpstar said:

    Which of the following individuals do Conservative Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the United Kingdom? (25-26 July)

    Liz Truss 47%
    Rishi Sunak 34%
    Don't Know 20%

    Rishi Sunak 48%
    Keir Starmer 33%
    Don't Know 27%

    Liz Truss 54%
    Keir Starmer 27%
    Don't Know 20%

    Starmer will be absolutely delighted with those numbers.
    Christ.
    Do note this is CONSERVATIVE voters, not all voters as I originally read it as. A third of Tory voters think Starmer would be a better PM than Truss.
    But do also remember we are in a leadership battle. Rishi backers are predispo andsed programmed to vote not Truss and Truss backers the same re Rishi. The key issue for them right now is the leadership not the next GE
    Yes indeedy - one to study over the next few months.

    If Truss starts behind though, it's not going to go well if the economy goes in the toilet.
    She will likely surge to start as the Tories recoalesce and 'new thing' voters. She'll get a limited honeymoon to either use or bed down for the run in to late 2024
  • Pulpstar said:

    Which of the following individuals do Conservative Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the United Kingdom? (25-26 July)

    Liz Truss 47%
    Rishi Sunak 34%
    Don't Know 20%

    Rishi Sunak 48%
    Keir Starmer 33%
    Don't Know 27%

    Liz Truss 54%
    Keir Starmer 27%
    Don't Know 20%

    Starmer will be absolutely delighted with those numbers.
    Christ.
    Do note this is CONSERVATIVE voters, not all voters as I originally read it as. A third of Tory voters think Starmer would be a better PM than Truss.
    But do also remember we are in a leadership battle. Rishi backers are predispo andsed programmed to vote not Truss and Truss backers the same re Rishi. The key issue for them right now is the leadership not the next GE
    Yes indeedy - one to study over the next few months.

    If Truss starts behind though, it's not going to go well if the economy goes in the toilet.
    She will likely surge to start as the Tories recoalesce and 'new thing' voters. She'll get a limited honeymoon to either use or bed down for the run in to late 2024
    So we will see if she's Gordo or Johnson.

    The economy is not making me confident about her chances of success
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 71,279
    Listened to TalkRadio on the way home, which is as close to ConMember radio as you'll get. Just wall to wall presenters and phone ins negative on Rishi.
    Not only is he behind he also has all the forces against him.
  • Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 3,863
    edited July 26

    So a third of Tory voters in the Red Wall think Keir would be a better PM than Truss? Is this historically high or not? Anyone got anything to compare it to?

    Deleted - using out of date figures.
  • eekeek Posts: 20,284

    Guido Fawkes
    @GuidoFawkes
    ·
    9m
    Hearing Team Rishi is wobbling and considering announcing some immediate multi-billion tax cuts... fancy that! Seems like they will be affordable after all now he's trailing badly.
  • Hopefully we will get hypothetical polling with these leaders on VI vs Labour.

    That was what got Johnson the job.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 4,185

    Driver said:

    So a third of Tory voters in the Red Wall think Keir would be a better PM than Truss? Is this historically high or not? Anyone got anything to compare it to?

    Is that based on current voting intention or 2019 vote?
    Dunno, trying to find out
    Redfield usually breaks it down by 2019 vote.

    https://redfieldandwiltonstrategies.com/latest-red-wall-voting-intention-12-13-june-2022/
    So if that is the assumption, a third of 2019 Tory voters think Keir Starmer would be a better PM than Truss.

    (in the Red Wall)
    It is 2019 voters. For comparison, 16% of 2019 Labour voters prefer Truss to SKS
    So better for Starmer but reflective too of the change in VI from 2019 to now
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 4,821
    edited July 26

    The person behind Labour's social media team has got some game.






    https://twitter.com/UKLabour/status/1551933291338547206

    Brilliant use of Chris Mason's "FFS" right at the end; a perfect summary.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 41,257

    Pulpstar said:

    Which of the following individuals do Conservative Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the United Kingdom? (25-26 July)

    Liz Truss 47%
    Rishi Sunak 34%
    Don't Know 20%

    Rishi Sunak 48%
    Keir Starmer 33%
    Don't Know 27%

    Liz Truss 54%
    Keir Starmer 27%
    Don't Know 20%

    Starmer will be absolutely delighted with those numbers.
    Christ.
    Do note this is CONSERVATIVE voters, not all voters as I originally read it as. A third of Tory voters think Starmer would be a better PM than Truss.
    But do also remember we are in a leadership battle. Rishi backers are predispo andsed programmed to vote not Truss and Truss backers the same re Rishi. The key issue for them right now is the leadership not the next GE
    Yes indeedy - one to study over the next few months.

    If Truss starts behind though, it's not going to go well if the economy goes in the toilet.
    She will likely surge to start as the Tories recoalesce and 'new thing' voters. She'll get a limited honeymoon to either use or bed down for the run in to late 2024
    So we will see if she's Gordo or Johnson.

    The economy is not making me confident about her chances of success
    Attlee faced a much more difficult economic situation.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 4,185

    Pulpstar said:

    Which of the following individuals do Conservative Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the United Kingdom? (25-26 July)

    Liz Truss 47%
    Rishi Sunak 34%
    Don't Know 20%

    Rishi Sunak 48%
    Keir Starmer 33%
    Don't Know 27%

    Liz Truss 54%
    Keir Starmer 27%
    Don't Know 20%

    Starmer will be absolutely delighted with those numbers.
    Christ.
    Do note this is CONSERVATIVE voters, not all voters as I originally read it as. A third of Tory voters think Starmer would be a better PM than Truss.
    But do also remember we are in a leadership battle. Rishi backers are predispo andsed programmed to vote not Truss and Truss backers the same re Rishi. The key issue for them right now is the leadership not the next GE
    Yes indeedy - one to study over the next few months.

    If Truss starts behind though, it's not going to go well if the economy goes in the toilet.
    She will likely surge to start as the Tories recoalesce and 'new thing' voters. She'll get a limited honeymoon to either use or bed down for the run in to late 2024
    So we will see if she's Gordo or Johnson.

    The economy is not making me confident about her chances of success
    She will need the assistance of not inconsiderable smoke and mirrors
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 41,257
    eek said:


    Guido Fawkes
    @GuidoFawkes

    Hearing Team Rishi is wobbling and considering announcing some immediate multi-billion tax cuts... fancy that! Seems like they will be affordable after all now he's trailing badly.

    That would surely destroy his credibility after last night's performance.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 15,680
    Pulpstar said:

    Listened to TalkRadio on the way home, which is as close to ConMember radio as you'll get. Just wall to wall presenters and phone ins negative on Rishi.
    Not only is he behind he also has all the forces against him.

    Truss to cancel Rishi's planned rise in Corporation Tax you say?
  • Pulpstar said:

    Which of the following individuals do Conservative Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the United Kingdom? (25-26 July)

    Liz Truss 47%
    Rishi Sunak 34%
    Don't Know 20%

    Rishi Sunak 48%
    Keir Starmer 33%
    Don't Know 27%

    Liz Truss 54%
    Keir Starmer 27%
    Don't Know 20%

    Starmer will be absolutely delighted with those numbers.
    Christ.
    Do note this is CONSERVATIVE voters, not all voters as I originally read it as. A third of Tory voters think Starmer would be a better PM than Truss.
    But do also remember we are in a leadership battle. Rishi backers are predispo andsed programmed to vote not Truss and Truss backers the same re Rishi. The key issue for them right now is the leadership not the next GE
    Yes indeedy - one to study over the next few months.

    If Truss starts behind though, it's not going to go well if the economy goes in the toilet.
    She will likely surge to start as the Tories recoalesce and 'new thing' voters. She'll get a limited honeymoon to either use or bed down for the run in to late 2024
    So we will see if she's Gordo or Johnson.

    The economy is not making me confident about her chances of success
    Attlee faced a much more difficult economic situation.
    Attlee had essentially run the domestic agenda during WW2.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 101,102
    Note that 50% of Tory members thought Truss won the debate. So that means if all the undecideds voted for Sunak it could still be very close
  • I hate strikes, they piss me off.

    But I am afraid trying to legislate against them puts us down a very dark road indeed.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 101,102
    Note that 50% of Tory members thought Truss won the debate. So that means if all the undecideds voted for Sunak it could still be very close
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 15,680

    eek said:


    Guido Fawkes
    @GuidoFawkes

    Hearing Team Rishi is wobbling and considering announcing some immediate multi-billion tax cuts... fancy that! Seems like they will be affordable after all now he's trailing badly.

    That would surely destroy his credibility after last night's performance.
    Are they the ones he'd already pencilled in for 2023/4?
  • Sunak has no political ability at all.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 23,402
    eek said:


    Guido Fawkes
    @GuidoFawkes
    ·
    9m
    Hearing Team Rishi is wobbling and considering announcing some immediate multi-billion tax cuts... fancy that! Seems like they will be affordable after all now he's trailing badly.

    Dirty tricks!
  • Labour leads Conservatives in ALL issues but Ukraine.

    Which party do Red Wall voters trust the most on...? (Conservative | Labour)

    Pandemic (27% | 31%)
    The NHS (20% | 40%)
    Immigration (21% | 30%)
    The Economy (26% | 33%)
    Levelling Up (18% | 38%)
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 22,694
    Off topic but may be of interests to geologists on here.

    I have acquired some 600 square metres of land which I am very very slowly turning into a garden and potager etc. it is currently wild and this week NW Electricity have started the process of removing an electricity pole on the land and laying the connection in an underground cable. It is hard work because the rock under the land (and we are on a hill) is dolerite, which is a sort of volcanic-like - and incredibly hard - rock, as you can see below.

    Raised beds in the potager anyway. Even digging up a small bed in the front garden brought up quantities of the stuff. Imagine doing 600 sq mtrs!!


  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 71,279
    tlg86 said:

    eek said:


    Guido Fawkes
    @GuidoFawkes
    ·
    9m
    Hearing Team Rishi is wobbling and considering announcing some immediate multi-billion tax cuts... fancy that! Seems like they will be affordable after all now he's trailing badly.

    Dirty tricks!
    Lol Flip flop Rishi.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 22,808

    Labour leads Conservatives in ALL issues but Ukraine.

    Which party do Red Wall voters trust the most on...? (Conservative | Labour)

    Pandemic (27% | 31%)
    The NHS (20% | 40%)
    Immigration (21% | 30%)
    The Economy (26% | 33%)
    Levelling Up (18% | 38%)

    That's a huge lead on levelling up.
    Especially since it's a Conservative flagship policy taken in the area it's supposed to benefit.
  • dixiedean said:

    Labour leads Conservatives in ALL issues but Ukraine.

    Which party do Red Wall voters trust the most on...? (Conservative | Labour)

    Pandemic (27% | 31%)
    The NHS (20% | 40%)
    Immigration (21% | 30%)
    The Economy (26% | 33%)
    Levelling Up (18% | 38%)

    That's a huge lead on levelling up.
    Especially since it's a Conservative flagship policy taken in the area it's supposed to benefit.
    After GE19 most of the money has been spent on London.

    Vote Labour, the only party to have actually levelled up this country in the last thirty years.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 46,146
    FPT @Sean_F

    Merkel made a number of serious policy mistakes during her time in office that, had it not been for her centrism, would have been put down to populism.
  • sarissasarissa Posts: 1,401
    Cyclefree said:

    Off topic but may be of interests to geologists on here.

    I have acquired some 600 square metres of land which I am very very slowly turning into a garden and potager etc. it is currently wild and this week NW Electricity have started the process of removing an electricity pole on the land and laying the connection in an underground cable. It is hard work because the rock under the land (and we are on a hill) is dolerite, which is a sort of volcanic-like - and incredibly hard - rock, as you can see below.

    Raised beds in the potager anyway. Even digging up a small bed in the front garden brought up quantities of the stuff. Imagine doing 600 sq mtrs!!


    Great! I’m working on a pier restoration project for which we need 500+ m3 of dolerite type rock. Mind if we establish a quarry in your garden?😁
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 22,808
    edited July 26
    Cyclefree said:

    Off topic but may be of interests to geologists on here.

    I have acquired some 600 square metres of land which I am very very slowly turning into a garden and potager etc. it is currently wild and this week NW Electricity have started the process of removing an electricity pole on the land and laying the connection in an underground cable. It is hard work because the rock under the land (and we are on a hill) is dolerite, which is a sort of volcanic-like - and incredibly hard - rock, as you can see below.

    Raised beds in the potager anyway. Even digging up a small bed in the front garden brought up quantities of the stuff. Imagine doing 600 sq mtrs!!


    Don't they mine that stuff round there?
    You could see if anyone might want to buy it if you get enough collected.
  • Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 3,863

    Which of the following individuals do Conservative Red Wall voters think would be the better PM for the United Kingdom? (25-26 July)

    Liz Truss 47%
    Rishi Sunak 34%
    Don't Know 20%

    Rishi Sunak 48%
    Keir Starmer 33%
    Don't Know 27%

    Liz Truss 54%
    Keir Starmer 27%
    Don't Know 20%

    A interesting comparison is with the latest (24th July) R&W poll amongst all 2019 Conservative voters across the whole country. Sunak led Starmer as best PM by 32% (55% to 23%) and Truss by +45% (60% to 15%).

    So the margins amongst Red Wall 2019 Conservatives are much narrower than for 2019 Consevatives as a whole, at a pretty paltry +15% and +27% for Sunak and Truss respectively. That is good news for Starmer in the seats he needs to win back.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 24,250
    HERE WE GO
  • LeonLeon Posts: 24,250
    Liz 'Mum's the word in Helsinki' Truss

    versus


    Rishi 'vanillaboy' Sunak

    Let's RUMBLE
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 22,808
    dixiedean said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Off topic but may be of interests to geologists on here.

    I have acquired some 600 square metres of land which I am very very slowly turning into a garden and potager etc. it is currently wild and this week NW Electricity have started the process of removing an electricity pole on the land and laying the connection in an underground cable. It is hard work because the rock under the land (and we are on a hill) is dolerite, which is a sort of volcanic-like - and incredibly hard - rock, as you can see below.

    Raised beds in the potager anyway. Even digging up a small bed in the front garden brought up quantities of the stuff. Imagine doing 600 sq mtrs!!


    Don't they mine that stuff round there?
    You could see if anyone might want to buy it if you get enough collected.
    I see someone does already!
  • sarissasarissa Posts: 1,401
    FPT - if we are heading to a new Elizabethan era, and given that a generation is much shorter, will we see Indyref 2 next month?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 33,520
    dixiedean said:

    Labour leads Conservatives in ALL issues but Ukraine.

    Which party do Red Wall voters trust the most on...? (Conservative | Labour)

    Pandemic (27% | 31%)
    The NHS (20% | 40%)
    Immigration (21% | 30%)
    The Economy (26% | 33%)
    Levelling Up (18% | 38%)

    That's a huge lead on levelling up.
    Especially since it's a Conservative flagship policy taken in the area it's supposed to benefit.
    New research out from @IPPRNorth today shows public spending since ‘levelling up’ was unveiled - three years ago this week - has risen more in London than anywhere else; lowest rises in the north. It says levelling up has been ‘business as usual’ https://t.co/zGFz82WVLl

  • londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 1,726
    Slightly worried that Liz thinks 'the next election will be about the cost of living '.

    Shouldn't we be doing something about it before an election in two years time?!?!
  • LeonLeon Posts: 24,250
    Nigelb said:

    (FPT)Interesting thread discussing evidence on the early cases of the pandemic in Wuhan.

    https://twitter.com/MichaelWorobey/status/1551949557205938176
    Our preprints on the origin of SARS-CoV-2 have now been peer reviewed and published as a pair of Research Articles by @ScienceMagazine

    Well worth a read for those still interested.

    That's the same already-debunked article that was loudly publicised then embarrassingly demolished several months back

    And look at the co-authors: Angela Rasmussen, Kristian Andersen, on and on, and all part of the conspiracy to silence lab leak at the beginning

    I can't see the point in this drivel
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 22,808
    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    Labour leads Conservatives in ALL issues but Ukraine.

    Which party do Red Wall voters trust the most on...? (Conservative | Labour)

    Pandemic (27% | 31%)
    The NHS (20% | 40%)
    Immigration (21% | 30%)
    The Economy (26% | 33%)
    Levelling Up (18% | 38%)

    That's a huge lead on levelling up.
    Especially since it's a Conservative flagship policy taken in the area it's supposed to benefit.
    New research out from @IPPRNorth today shows public spending since ‘levelling up’ was unveiled - three years ago this week - has risen more in London than anywhere else; lowest rises in the north. It says levelling up has been ‘business as usual’ https://t.co/zGFz82WVLl

    And yet. It has been noted more than once that folk down South think they are struggling because all the money is being spent up North.
    That's some good politics, there.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 15,680
    Does Liz Truss sound more nasal than last night?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 24,250
    SHE'S WEARING THE NECKLACE
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 22,808
    Are they doing this again?
    Off to the beach, then.
    Laters.
  • TazTaz Posts: 5,426

    Labour leads Conservatives in ALL issues but Ukraine.

    Which party do Red Wall voters trust the most on...? (Conservative | Labour)

    Pandemic (27% | 31%)
    The NHS (20% | 40%)
    Immigration (21% | 30%)
    The Economy (26% | 33%)
    Levelling Up (18% | 38%)

    Interesting to see labour, the party of open door migration, so ahead on that subject.

    I’d guess that post brexit people are far more relaxed about migration. Over a million people came in the last 12 months, including 400,000 students, and barely a murmur.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 46,146
    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    Labour leads Conservatives in ALL issues but Ukraine.

    Which party do Red Wall voters trust the most on...? (Conservative | Labour)

    Pandemic (27% | 31%)
    The NHS (20% | 40%)
    Immigration (21% | 30%)
    The Economy (26% | 33%)
    Levelling Up (18% | 38%)

    That's a huge lead on levelling up.
    Especially since it's a Conservative flagship policy taken in the area it's supposed to benefit.
    New research out from @IPPRNorth today shows public spending since ‘levelling up’ was unveiled - three years ago this week - has risen more in London than anywhere else; lowest rises in the north. It says levelling up has been ‘business as usual’ https://t.co/zGFz82WVLl

    I think for that to be serious you'd need the massive fiscal transfers the FDR made to the former GDR post reunification.

    In reality it's meant a few million here and there for some town centre facelifts and a bit of HS2/transpennine.

  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 46,146
    dixiedean said:

    Labour leads Conservatives in ALL issues but Ukraine.

    Which party do Red Wall voters trust the most on...? (Conservative | Labour)

    Pandemic (27% | 31%)
    The NHS (20% | 40%)
    Immigration (21% | 30%)
    The Economy (26% | 33%)
    Levelling Up (18% | 38%)

    That's a huge lead on levelling up.
    Especially since it's a Conservative flagship policy taken in the area it's supposed to benefit.
    dixiedean said:

    Labour leads Conservatives in ALL issues but Ukraine.

    Which party do Red Wall voters trust the most on...? (Conservative | Labour)

    Pandemic (27% | 31%)
    The NHS (20% | 40%)
    Immigration (21% | 30%)
    The Economy (26% | 33%)
    Levelling Up (18% | 38%)

    That's a huge lead on levelling up.
    Especially since it's a Conservative flagship policy taken in the area it's supposed to benefit.
    I think someone earlier (Richard Nabavi?) nailed it when he said success for Boris is just the rhetoric and the speech.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 101,102
    sarissa said:

    FPT - if we are heading to a new Elizabethan era, and given that a generation is much shorter, will we see Indyref 2 next month?

    No both Truss and Sunak oppose the UK government recognising an indyref2 before a generation has elapsed
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 24,284
    Bit late but perhaps one for @RochdalePioneers as well as those who claim Brexit is a doddle for impex folk.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/26/british-wine-wholesaler-leave-uk-over-post-brexit-paperwork

    He's having to move to France:

    'There he will set up a French company to export back to his own company in Wales.

    He said the only way he could get around the “incredibly complicated” paperwork for importing alcohol was to establish a French company to export into the UK, and do the administration in the EU himself.

    “I am doing what the government was suggesting, which is to have a company here and in Europe to mitigate the impact of Brexit,” he said. “What I’m doing will enable me to import and export into and out of the EU within the company itself, so that we mitigate all of the cost of importing into the UK.”'

    And that's a lot of employment, profit and tax lost to the UK. As HMG should have knonw when they said "**** business, go away and set up elsewhere".
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 46,146
    tlg86 said:

    eek said:


    Guido Fawkes
    @GuidoFawkes
    ·
    9m
    Hearing Team Rishi is wobbling and considering announcing some immediate multi-billion tax cuts... fancy that! Seems like they will be affordable after all now he's trailing badly.

    Dirty tricks!
    Rishi's best hope is to stick to his guns and hope to be vindicated in time, probably in opposition.

    He's not going to win this one.
  • Alphabet_SoupAlphabet_Soup Posts: 1,579
    edited July 26
    Cyclefree said:

    Off topic but may be of interests to geologists on here.

    I have acquired some 600 square metres of land which I am very very slowly turning into a garden and potager etc. it is currently wild and this week NW Electricity have started the process of removing an electricity pole on the land and laying the connection in an underground cable. It is hard work because the rock under the land (and we are on a hill) is dolerite, which is a sort of volcanic-like - and incredibly hard - rock, as you can see below.

    Raised beds in the potager anyway. Even digging up a small bed in the front garden brought up quantities of the stuff. Imagine doing 600 sq mtrs!!


    Get a megaton of topsoil and dump it on top.

    ETA it's what Osgood Mackenzie did at Inverewe.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 24,284
    Taz said:

    Labour leads Conservatives in ALL issues but Ukraine.

    Which party do Red Wall voters trust the most on...? (Conservative | Labour)

    Pandemic (27% | 31%)
    The NHS (20% | 40%)
    Immigration (21% | 30%)
    The Economy (26% | 33%)
    Levelling Up (18% | 38%)

    Interesting to see labour, the party of open door migration, so ahead on that subject.

    I’d guess that post brexit people are far more relaxed about migration. Over a million people came in the last 12 months, including 400,000 students, and barely a murmur.
    OTOH some polling showed it was No 2 concern amongst Tory voters/party members (can't recall which, members I think) recently. Some disconnect somewhere.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 24,284
    HYUFD said:

    sarissa said:

    FPT - if we are heading to a new Elizabethan era, and given that a generation is much shorter, will we see Indyref 2 next month?

    No both Truss and Sunak oppose the UK government recognising an indyref2 before a generation has elapsed
    Still coming up with that generation nonsense? It was old crap when Henry VIII was around, for heaven's sake.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 19,448
    Hospitals falling apart on whose watch, lizzie?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 24,250
    Jeez this is dull

    The format yesterday was miles better
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 36,902

    I hate strikes, they piss me off.

    But I am afraid trying to legislate against them puts us down a very dark road indeed.

    Tory freedom is a very strange freedom. It seems to involve taking a lot of freedoms away from people.

  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 41,257
    Sunak's tendency to use policy wonk vocabulary is really unfortunate: "Grip inflation", "surgical hubs to crack through the backlog". If I were waiting for an operation, I wouldn't want to hear that.
  • TazTaz Posts: 5,426
    Leon said:

    Jeez this is dull

    The format yesterday was miles better

    It’s not good. I thought yesterday was mediocre but this is worse.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 19,448
    Bit bats asking them whether one should personally go vegetarian?
  • londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 1,726
    Leon said:

    Jeez this is dull

    The format yesterday was miles better

    Hopefully the football will be better later.

    This is shyte. Both utterly unconvincing.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 29,938
    Oh are they at it again?

    Right. Telly on.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 332

    Sunak's tendency to use policy wonk vocabulary is really unfortunate: "Grip inflation", "surgical hubs to crack through the backlog". If I were waiting for an operation, I wouldn't want to hear that.

    Has a 'new boy at McKinsey who's over-prepped his presentation' feel.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 23,402
    IshmaelZ said:

    Bit bats asking them whether one should personally go vegetarian?

    Classic example of trying to get one or both to say something that sounds utterly horrific in isolation.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 16,848
    edited July 26
    Has anyone else noticed how team PB Johnson/ Truss is painting Sunak to be as useless a loser as they have painted Starmer over the last two years?

    I certainly think they have decided who is the next Conservative Party Leader.
  • They're tying Starmer for boring whilst having to defend 12 years of failure...
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 15,680
    Rishi has forgotten about the NIC threshold rise that will add more to pay packets this week.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 332
    kinabalu said:

    Oh are they at it again?

    Right. Telly on.

    Stream is at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngb9770xx10 if it's easier.
  • Liz Truss argues that increase in NHS rise should be funded from general taxation - "we did have that money available in our budget". For better or worse, a major repudiation of Tory orthodoxy on the public finances.

    Wut
This discussion has been closed.