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Penny now drops to third in the betting – politicalbetting.com

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  • Options
    numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 5,463
    edited July 2022

    Which of the following individuals do you think would be the better Prime Minister?

    Sunak (CON): 33% (-1)
    Starmer (LAB): 43% (+2)

    Starmer (LAB): 37%
    Mordaunt (CON): 31%

    Starmer (LAB): 41%
    Truss (CON): 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton, 17 Jul

    (Changes with 10 Jul)

    Yep, none of them have been able to demonstrate that they’ll be a gamechanger. Interesting that Mordaunt does the best, who they’ve comprehensively trashed and destroyed in order to get Rishi or Liz in Number 10…

    Advantage Labour…
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,687
    edited July 2022

    @MarqueeMark was an early and enthusiastic backer of Penny. Would be good to hear his view.

    I still can’t quite make the numbers work for Truss, so I maintain it will be Rishi v Mordaunt.

    My prediction tonight (first posted this morning):

    Sunak 113
    Mordaunt 89
    Truss 84
    Badenoch 56

    I can't see how Truss doesn't make the final two from that.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,679
    Farooq said:

    Farooq said:

    Farooq said:

    As things stand I think Liz Truss is going to win.

    I bloody hope so!
    I'm hoping for a Rishi/Truss run-off to the membership as its then literally win/win.

    Either win - my bet comes in, or win - the best candidate wins and we get the best candidate to be PM. Either way I'd be happy. 👍
    Truss is the Fuck the Union candidate par excellence. She’s head and shoulders above the rest.

    I think the SNP would have big problems if they joined with the Conservatives under Truss to undermine the operation of a Lab/LD coalition or Lab minority government with C&S and perhaps even bring it down. PM Truss would make that outcome more likely I think. So be careful what you wish for.
    “Joined with the Conservatives”?!? Ho ho. That’s a tremendous Labour attack line… when you lot quite literally just “joined with the Conservatives” in councils throughout the country. And don’t forget:



    Your memory is short. The SNP went from 11 to 2 seats in 1979 when it last brought down a Labour government.
    The SNP didn't just bring down a Labour government. The SNP joined with the Conservatives to bring down a Labour Government put Margaret Thatcher in power for 11 years.
    I always thought it was the voters who put Thatcher in power, but I'm happy to be corrected if wrong.
    It was the SNP that forced the General Election that gave the voters that opportunity. Thatcher may never have been PM if it wasn't for the SNP voting with the Conservatives to bring down the Labour government when they did.
    The election had to be held by October, 5 months later. What do you think Labour would have done in those 5 months that would have bettered their standing with the voters?
    If Labour had been allowed to hold the GE at a time of their own choosing they may have held on to power. As it was they were forced to have the GE in May 1979 which was a time that the SNP and the Conservative's chose. The Conservative won in 1979 with the help of the SNP. It's not convenient for the SNP to remember this now but it happened and you can't change history although the SNP would certainly try.
    Respectfully, you've just waffled and ignored my question.
    There HAD to be an election by October 1979. Labour were in trouble with the electorate, as the actual result showed. What would they have done in the last five months to turn it around?

    You claim it might have been better and it might have. It might have been worse, too. Voters don't like it when a government is holed below the waterline but limps on and on. Labour weren't governing well by this point and it's wishful thinking that they could have pulled a miracle out of the hat.
    I think the poor performance of the SNP in 1979 was more to do with the flop of the 1978 referendum.

    Callaghan would probably have won in 1978 with an autumn election. It was only after the collapse of his wage control policy that it all went wrong. Something that current politicians should ponder on.
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,687

    Foxy said:

    SandraMc said:

    I've just been watching the quiz show "Pointless". There was a round on politics where contestants were asked to name a member of the Cabinet following the 2021 reshuffle (The quiz was obviously filmed a few months back). One man said: "Isn't there someone called Rene Sunak?" From now on I shall think of Rishi with an apron and a tray of drinks serving in a French cafe.

    BTW there was a appalling lack of knowledge. One contestant could only name Boris Johnson and another had to make up a name because she couldn't think of anyone.

    Rene Sunak and the fallen Madonna with the big boobies?
    Yes I noticed Boris has big boobies and also makes some
    You were planning on voting for him at the next GE not so long ago!
  • Options
    bigglesbiggles Posts: 4,341

    Not to alarm anyone but..

    “Extreme heat is taking its toll on Britain's electricity system. Demand is unusually high due to air con & fans, while solar & gas plants are less efficient...

    National Grid has issued an alert calling for more power plants tonight and analysts say the situation looks serious 😬”

    Solar plants are “less efficient”. Eh?
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,316
    moonshine said:

    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    (FPT)

    ping said:

    Phil said:



    IIRC Sri Lanka didn’t run out of currency - they chose to ban fertiliser for their own reasons (albeit mad ones) failing to realise that the existing cash export crops were dependent on fertiliser imports & there wasn’t enough domestically produced fertiliser (regardless of source) to make up the difference. So exports fell more than imports & triggered a currency / balance of payments crisis.

    There was an excellent bbc world service programme on this last night;

    “The Climate Question: Can we feed the world without using chemical fertilisers?”

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/w3ct3kj5

    TBH, I usually skip over these climate programmes because they tend to be rather boring. But the title of this one piqued my interest.

    Anyway;

    Short answer is: No. The world can probably feed about 4bn people. But long term, chemical fertilisers are a big climate problem because methane is such a destructive greenhouse gas.

    Innovative solutions required.
    Farm kangaroos instead of cows. Produce much less methane.
    Milking them is a bit of a faff, though.
    No animal is created/evolved not to digest its food properly. The cows are fed shite, that's why they fart/burp. Do the same to Kangaroos; you'd get the same outcome.
    No, it is because cows ferment cellulose to break it down into digestible form, methane is a byproduct.
    Oh, right you are - I retract the above. It seems that claims of lower carbon footprint rest on 'soil carbon sequestration', rather thsn healthier no
    belchy cows.
    Grass fed beef is much healthier though of course.

    Not for the cows, it's not :lol:
  • Options
    kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 3,955

    Not to alarm anyone but..

    “Extreme heat is taking its toll on Britain's electricity system. Demand is unusually high due to air con & fans, while solar & gas plants are less efficient...

    National Grid has issued an alert calling for more power plants tonight and analysts say the situation looks serious 😬”

    And they said I was mad for having backup batteries... best investment ever imho.

    Wait til winter and there's not enough gas...
  • Options

    It wouldn't shock me if Penny Mordaunt collapses like a flan tonight.

    She's been exposed as being an empty vessel over the last few days and I think a fair few of her votes will move to Rishi.

    Agreed.

    Rishi v Truss final two looking increasingly nailed on, which is the perfect outcome.
    Perfect in what sense?

    This sense.

    As things stand I think Liz Truss is going to win.

    I bloody hope so!
    I'm hoping for a Rishi/Truss run-off to the membership as its then literally win/win.

    Either win - my bet comes in, or win - the best candidate wins and we get the best candidate to be PM. Either way I'd be happy. 👍
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,371

    Which of the following individuals do you think would be the better Prime Minister?

    Sunak (CON): 33% (-1)
    Starmer (LAB): 43% (+2)

    Starmer (LAB): 37%
    Mordaunt (CON): 31%

    Starmer (LAB): 41%
    Truss (CON): 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton, 17 Jul

    (Changes with 10 Jul)

    Yep, none of them have been able to demonstrate that they’ll be a gamechanger. Interesting that Mordaunt does the best, who they’ve comprehensively trashed and destroyed in order to get Rishi or Liz in Number 10…

    Advantage Labour…
    Mordaunt would have been a total disaster.

    She looks nice and relatable, but there's nothing there. Nothing.
  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    biggles said:

    Not to alarm anyone but..

    “Extreme heat is taking its toll on Britain's electricity system. Demand is unusually high due to air con & fans, while solar & gas plants are less efficient...

    National Grid has issued an alert calling for more power plants tonight and analysts say the situation looks serious 😬”

    Solar plants are “less efficient”. Eh?
    Wrong sort of sunshine
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,031

    Not to alarm anyone but..

    “Extreme heat is taking its toll on Britain's electricity system. Demand is unusually high due to air con & fans, while solar & gas plants are less efficient...

    National Grid has issued an alert calling for more power plants tonight and analysts say the situation looks serious 😬”

    As I warned a few days ago... ;)
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,791
    edited July 2022

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    As things stand I think Liz Truss is going to win.

    I bloody hope so!
    I'm hoping for a Rishi/Truss run-off to the membership as its then literally win/win.

    Either win - my bet comes in, or win - the best candidate wins and we get the best candidate to be PM. Either way I'd be happy. 👍
    Truss is the Fuck the Union candidate par excellence. She’s head and shoulders above the rest.

    I think the SNP would have big problems if they joined with the Conservatives under Truss to undermine the operation of a Lab/LD coalition or Lab minority government with C&S and perhaps even bring it down. PM Truss would make that outcome more likely I think. So be careful what you wish for.
    “Joined with the Conservatives”?!? Ho ho. That’s a tremendous Labour attack line… when you lot quite literally just “joined with the Conservatives” in councils throughout the country. And don’t forget:



    Your memory is short. The SNP went from 11 to 2 seats in 1979 when it last brought down a Labour government.
    Jim Callaghan himself said that that was a lot of nonsense.
    "At an election rally in Glasgow at the start of the campaign, Callaghan attacked the SNP's role in joining with the Conservatives to bring his Government down. He described them as "turkeys voting for Christmas" and urged his Scottish supporters to "carve them up in the polling booths.""
    That was when he was electioneering. He had a different and more considered view as do political historians - that it only speeded things up by a few months at most.

    Labour had breached an agreement to allow a referendum without nobbling it. Simple as that.

    In any case, why aren't you complaining about the LDs as well?

    Or for that matter the Labour and SDLP MPs who abstained (one with an excellent excuse)?
    Considering the collapse of the SNP vote at the following election, it does rather seem as if they were turkeys voting for Christmas and they did indeed get carved up in the pooling booths.
    Whoever and whatever was ultimately responsible for Callaghan's government really does not matter to be honest. What matters is that the last time the SNP 'helped' bring a Labour government down, their vote collapsed. Which is why Starmer - if we get a hung parliament next election - is not going to struggle to get a Queen's Speech through the Commons and will likely be able to govern for long enough to call another election on his terms.
    "It was the SNP's fault we were so crap in 1979!"

    In any case - it seems to have escaped attention that the situation is now radically different thanks to devolution. So many discussions on PB are fixated on the SNP in a Labour minority government situation - but, as I have pointed out several times, there is a prior problem: the likelihood (but not, it should be said, certainty) of a Tory majority in England.

    Now, it has also largely escaped attention that Tories have carefully eliminated their flagship policy of literally the morning after indyref1 of EVEL. There are two possible explanations*. One is to make sure that Mr Gove could become Prime Minister even if he stood for, as he once memorably put it, the Scottish seat of Fraserhead and Peterborough. Does that seem likely? The other - well, you work it out.

    *apart, of course, from the goodness of their collective heart.
  • Options
    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 12,416

    Did that PBer end up going golfing?
    Is BartyBobbins still insisting the weather is “glorious”?

    Absolutely glorious weather here. 😎🌞

    Spent the last couple of hours with the kids in our blow up pool in the garden. 🏊‍♀️

    Great weather you'd normally have to pay to fly to, but at home instead. Even the Moaning Myrtles seem to have briefly stopped moaning and started enjoying themselves.
    Great new game, you should say. Daddy sits in the pool and you pour cold buckets of water over his head. 😎
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,267
    Well, that was a very long, warm day.

    Highest temperature I have clocked is 37.5 at Rugeley Trent Valley. But it still feels pretty warm here.
  • Options
    jonny83jonny83 Posts: 1,261

    Which of the following individuals do you think would be the better Prime Minister?

    Sunak (CON): 33% (-1)
    Starmer (LAB): 43% (+2)

    Starmer (LAB): 37%
    Mordaunt (CON): 31%

    Starmer (LAB): 41%
    Truss (CON): 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton, 17 Jul

    (Changes with 10 Jul)

    Yep, none of them have been able to demonstrate that they’ll be a gamechanger. Interesting that Mordaunt does the best, who they’ve comprehensively trashed and destroyed in order to get Rishi or Liz in Number 10…

    Advantage Labour…
    but there's nothing there. Nothing.
    Bit like Sunak and his plans to deal with the Cost of Living Crisis he contributed to.
  • Options
    MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,288

    Which of the following individuals do you think would be the better Prime Minister?

    Sunak (CON): 33% (-1)
    Starmer (LAB): 43% (+2)

    Starmer (LAB): 37%
    Mordaunt (CON): 31%

    Starmer (LAB): 41%
    Truss (CON): 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton, 17 Jul

    (Changes with 10 Jul)

    Further confirmation that Truss will not make it to the GE if she wins.

    We know MPs don't want her - if MPs decided between the Final 2 then it's obvious Sunak would win by miles against either Truss or Mordaunt.

    So if the members impose Truss on the MPs, after the Con poll rating inevitably goes down even further MPs will boot her out next summer, just in time for a new leader to have 9 months pre GE.
  • Options
    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,786

    @MarqueeMark was an early and enthusiastic backer of Penny. Would be good to hear his view.

    I still can’t quite make the numbers work for Truss, so I maintain it will be Rishi v Mordaunt.

    My prediction tonight (first posted this morning):

    Sunak 113
    Mordaunt 89
    Truss 84
    Badenoch 56

    I can't see how Truss doesn't make the final two from that.
    Truss is the only one of those four that I believe is certain to lose a GE.
  • Options
    RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 2,977
    biggles said:

    Not to alarm anyone but..

    “Extreme heat is taking its toll on Britain's electricity system. Demand is unusually high due to air con & fans, while solar & gas plants are less efficient...

    National Grid has issued an alert calling for more power plants tonight and analysts say the situation looks serious 😬”

    Solar plants are “less efficient”. Eh?
    I reckon that means no storage capacity
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,581

    Foxy said:

    SandraMc said:

    I've just been watching the quiz show "Pointless". There was a round on politics where contestants were asked to name a member of the Cabinet following the 2021 reshuffle (The quiz was obviously filmed a few months back). One man said: "Isn't there someone called Rene Sunak?" From now on I shall think of Rishi with an apron and a tray of drinks serving in a French cafe.

    BTW there was a appalling lack of knowledge. One contestant could only name Boris Johnson and another had to make up a name because she couldn't think of anyone.

    Rene Sunak and the fallen Madonna with the big boobies?
    Yes I noticed Boris has big boobies and also makes some
    You were planning on voting for him at the next GE not so long ago!
    Look, in my book, everyone is entitled to their own turn-on, OK? As long as we're talking consenting adults!

    Admittedly BJ-boobyphilia is topic on which Freud, Jung AND Sacher-Madsoch would all have LOTS to talk about.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,031
    MattW said:

    The TERF-led campaign against Penny has worked well, hasn't it?

    It's a shame they're too thick to realise that they've sided with some people who will soon be going after them...

    Radical Feminists in the Tory Party?

    Er ...
    Some in the Tory Party are the TERF's useful idiots.

    Which is exactly the problem. The same sort of dinosaurs within the Conservative Party who spit their tea out at the thought of anyone being any different to them, whether in gender, race, sexuality or anything else, are the same sort who will be spitting their tea out at other things in the future. like same-sex marriage et al. As we are seeing in the US.

    They really are dinosaurs.
  • Options
    WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 8,503
    edited July 2022

    Which of the following individuals do you think would be the better Prime Minister?

    Sunak (CON): 33% (-1)
    Starmer (LAB): 43% (+2)

    Starmer (LAB): 37%
    Mordaunt (CON): 31%

    Starmer (LAB): 41%
    Truss (CON): 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton, 17 Jul

    (Changes with 10 Jul)

    Yep, none of them have been able to demonstrate that they’ll be a gamechanger. Interesting that Mordaunt does the best, who they’ve comprehensively trashed and destroyed in order to get Rishi or Liz in Number 10…

    Advantage Labour…
    Yup ; as she mentioned in the debate, she was the only one amongst them who had been able to win a Labour seat. It's the communicative and relational abilities again. As I mentioned earlier, for this reason she's likely to be back again in 2024 or after, if Sunak wins and then fails.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,371
    jonny83 said:

    Which of the following individuals do you think would be the better Prime Minister?

    Sunak (CON): 33% (-1)
    Starmer (LAB): 43% (+2)

    Starmer (LAB): 37%
    Mordaunt (CON): 31%

    Starmer (LAB): 41%
    Truss (CON): 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton, 17 Jul

    (Changes with 10 Jul)

    Yep, none of them have been able to demonstrate that they’ll be a gamechanger. Interesting that Mordaunt does the best, who they’ve comprehensively trashed and destroyed in order to get Rishi or Liz in Number 10…

    Advantage Labour…
    but there's nothing there. Nothing.
    Bit like Sunak and his plans to deal with the Cost of Living Crisis he contributed to.
    I've got no doubt that Sunak simply offers more of the same. But, at least he'll deliver competent rational government,

    The rest are worse.

    And Starmer is no better. He'd be the same as Sunak, perhaps with a tad more tax & spend, but without the charisma.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,679

    Which of the following individuals do you think would be the better Prime Minister?

    Sunak (CON): 33% (-1)
    Starmer (LAB): 43% (+2)

    Starmer (LAB): 37%
    Mordaunt (CON): 31%

    Starmer (LAB): 41%
    Truss (CON): 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton, 17 Jul

    (Changes with 10 Jul)

    Yep, none of them have been able to demonstrate that they’ll be a gamechanger. Interesting that Mordaunt does the best, who they’ve comprehensively trashed and destroyed in order to get Rishi or Liz in Number 10…

    Advantage Labour…
    Mordaunt would have been a total disaster.

    She looks nice and relatable, but there's nothing there. Nothing.
    Those Truss figures are grim, or great depending on political perspective.

    LICIPM
  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Sir Bill Cash ffs

    Can people like this not be made illegal?
  • Options
    moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,244

    jonny83 said:

    Which of the following individuals do you think would be the better Prime Minister?

    Sunak (CON): 33% (-1)
    Starmer (LAB): 43% (+2)

    Starmer (LAB): 37%
    Mordaunt (CON): 31%

    Starmer (LAB): 41%
    Truss (CON): 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton, 17 Jul

    (Changes with 10 Jul)

    Yep, none of them have been able to demonstrate that they’ll be a gamechanger. Interesting that Mordaunt does the best, who they’ve comprehensively trashed and destroyed in order to get Rishi or Liz in Number 10…

    Advantage Labour…
    but there's nothing there. Nothing.
    Bit like Sunak and his plans to deal with the Cost of Living Crisis he contributed to.
    I've got no doubt that Sunak simply offers more of the same. But, at least he'll deliver competent rational government,

    The rest are worse.

    And Starmer is no better. He'd be the same as Sunak, perhaps with a tad more tax & spend, but without the charisma.
    What is competent or rationale about his tax and spend record as Chancellor? Or his planned counter cyclical austerity he kept bragging about on tv last night? Roll the dice I say. I don’t care who, anyone but him please Tory Party.
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,074
    Foxy said:

    Which of the following individuals do you think would be the better Prime Minister?

    Sunak (CON): 33% (-1)
    Starmer (LAB): 43% (+2)

    Starmer (LAB): 37%
    Mordaunt (CON): 31%

    Starmer (LAB): 41%
    Truss (CON): 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton, 17 Jul

    (Changes with 10 Jul)

    Yep, none of them have been able to demonstrate that they’ll be a gamechanger. Interesting that Mordaunt does the best, who they’ve comprehensively trashed and destroyed in order to get Rishi or Liz in Number 10…

    Advantage Labour…
    Mordaunt would have been a total disaster.

    She looks nice and relatable, but there's nothing there. Nothing.
    Those Truss figures are grim, or great depending on political perspective.

    LICIPM
    All three are in the same ballpark so I don't think you can infer anything about their chances in a GE from those numbers.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,031
    ydoethur said:

    Well, that was a very long, warm day.

    Highest temperature I have clocked is 37.5 at Rugeley Trent Valley. But it still feels pretty warm here.

    I have a mid-sized inflatable pool out in the garden. Yesterday the little 'uns best friends came round for a splash for three hours. Today, we invited a random kid from the school over. By the time school had ended the pool was shaded, meaning it was ideal. Ice lollies, splashing, and a liberal soaking at random intervals from the hose.

    So much fun. Happy days.

    Although looking at the turbidity of the water, I'm unsure it'll last until tomorrow afternoon...
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,267
    IshmaelZ said:

    Sir Bill Cash ffs

    Can people like this not be made illegal?

    We're getting rid of Cash. He'll soon be Sir Bill Contactless and we won't have to worry about him.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,031
    ydoethur said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Sir Bill Cash ffs

    Can people like this not be made illegal?

    We're getting rid of Cash. He'll soon be Sir Bill Contactless and we won't have to worry about him.
    Sir Bill Bitcoin.
  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    ydoethur said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Sir Bill Cash ffs

    Can people like this not be made illegal?

    We're getting rid of Cash. He'll soon be Sir Bill Contactless and we won't have to worry about him.
    Sunak will have no idea how to deal with him, then
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,898
    MattW said:

    moonshine said:

    It’s tedious waiting until 8pm for the result today. Get on with it!

    As for fertiliser and CO2, can Robert enlighten us on what Californian startup is going to become the Apple/Tesla/Google of food? Surely there’s mahoosive scope for highly energy and resource efficient vertical farming, closed loop even. Plenty experimenting with it, who’s going to be the trillion dollar company because of it? Because someone will.

    The last time I looked vertical farming was one to two orders of magnitude less efficient in produce per investment.

    Eventually, but nowhere near yet.
    It’s great in my part of the world, where there’s not a lot of farmland relative to the population - but anywhere with thousands of square miles of existing farmland, not so much. Yet.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,267

    ydoethur said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Sir Bill Cash ffs

    Can people like this not be made illegal?

    We're getting rid of Cash. He'll soon be Sir Bill Contactless and we won't have to worry about him.
    Sir Bill Bitcoin.
    He could be honest and say Sir Bill iPay.
  • Options
    StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 14,468

    I feel like whoever wins is going to have large chunks of the parliamentary party looking for an opportunity to stab them in the back from day 1.

    It does have shades of 2001 about it... three candidates in the final round, all with obvious flaws, all getting roughly a third of the electorate. Someone and their backers are going to be really narked at not making the membership vote.
  • Options
    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,786
    IshmaelZ said:

    Sir Bill Cash ffs

    Can people like this not be made illegal?

    Knighthood has moved on. More a comedy turn now it seems. (Some very few exceptions will I hope forgive as I hope will HMQ!)
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    Don't panic Captain Mainwaring

    The announcement comes after two unrelated patients from the southern Ashanti region of Ghana, both of whom later died, tested positive for the virus.

    The patients had shown symptoms including diarrhea, fever, nausea, and vomiting, WHO said, adding that more than 90 contacts are being monitored.

    Marburg is a highly infectious viral hemorrhagic fever in the same family as the better known Ebola virus disease and has a fatality ratio of up to 88%, according to WHO.
  • Options
    StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 14,468
    ydoethur said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Sir Bill Cash ffs

    Can people like this not be made illegal?

    We're getting rid of Cash. He'll soon be Sir Bill Contactless and we won't have to worry about him.
    If Chris Pincher had been contactless, none of this would be happening.
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    I hope everybody took Raab advice to keep cool by heading to lie on the beach....
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,679

    Foxy said:

    Which of the following individuals do you think would be the better Prime Minister?

    Sunak (CON): 33% (-1)
    Starmer (LAB): 43% (+2)

    Starmer (LAB): 37%
    Mordaunt (CON): 31%

    Starmer (LAB): 41%
    Truss (CON): 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton, 17 Jul

    (Changes with 10 Jul)

    Yep, none of them have been able to demonstrate that they’ll be a gamechanger. Interesting that Mordaunt does the best, who they’ve comprehensively trashed and destroyed in order to get Rishi or Liz in Number 10…

    Advantage Labour…
    Mordaunt would have been a total disaster.

    She looks nice and relatable, but there's nothing there. Nothing.
    Those Truss figures are grim, or great depending on political perspective.

    LICIPM
    All three are in the same ballpark so I don't think you can infer anything about their chances in a GE from those numbers.
    Certainly none provides evidence of a strong revival, but only Truss makes the Tory chances worse than at present.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,371
    moonshine said:

    jonny83 said:

    Which of the following individuals do you think would be the better Prime Minister?

    Sunak (CON): 33% (-1)
    Starmer (LAB): 43% (+2)

    Starmer (LAB): 37%
    Mordaunt (CON): 31%

    Starmer (LAB): 41%
    Truss (CON): 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton, 17 Jul

    (Changes with 10 Jul)

    Yep, none of them have been able to demonstrate that they’ll be a gamechanger. Interesting that Mordaunt does the best, who they’ve comprehensively trashed and destroyed in order to get Rishi or Liz in Number 10…

    Advantage Labour…
    but there's nothing there. Nothing.
    Bit like Sunak and his plans to deal with the Cost of Living Crisis he contributed to.
    I've got no doubt that Sunak simply offers more of the same. But, at least he'll deliver competent rational government,

    The rest are worse.

    And Starmer is no better. He'd be the same as Sunak, perhaps with a tad more tax & spend, but without the charisma.
    What is competent or rationale about his tax and spend record as Chancellor? Or his planned counter cyclical austerity he kept bragging about on tv last night? Roll the dice I say. I don’t care who, anyone but him please Tory Party.
    He will balance the books and prevent a run on the pound, which Liz Truss wouldn't it.

    He'll clearly throw any spare cash he gets at the NHS and Pensions, just like any Tory PM, and has little political imagination, but aside from Kemi there is no alternative.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,898

    Am I the only person on this site who, book-value aside, thinks that Truss is the best candidate?

    Almost everyone else on this site seems to be anti-Truss for one reason or another it seems.

    My personal order of preference:
    Badenoch
    Truss
    Tugendhat
    Sunak
    Mourdaunt
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,031
    biggles said:

    Not to alarm anyone but..

    “Extreme heat is taking its toll on Britain's electricity system. Demand is unusually high due to air con & fans, while solar & gas plants are less efficient...

    National Grid has issued an alert calling for more power plants tonight and analysts say the situation looks serious 😬”

    Solar plants are “less efficient”. Eh?
    Basically: the higher the temperature goes from the optimal temperature for the solar panel, the less its efficiency. It may be getting more sunlight, but it will be less efficiently be converting the photons into electricity than if it was nearer that optimum temperature.

    https://captaingreen.com.au/optimal-temperature-for-solar-panels/
  • Options
    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 12,416
    edited July 2022

    ydoethur said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Sir Bill Cash ffs

    Can people like this not be made illegal?

    We're getting rid of Cash. He'll soon be Sir Bill Contactless and we won't have to worry about him.
    Sir Bill Bitcoin.
    Labour plenty to attack on Rishi, the Tory’s plenty to attack if he Sunak struggles to close the poll gap after assaination of their favourite.
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,284
    The Government big hitters must be keeping their powder dry for later, since those defending the government now are a ragbag off mostly obscure backbenchers.
  • Options
    logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,721

    Which of the following individuals do you think would be the better Prime Minister?

    Sunak (CON): 33% (-1)
    Starmer (LAB): 43% (+2)

    Starmer (LAB): 37%
    Mordaunt (CON): 31%

    Starmer (LAB): 41%
    Truss (CON): 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton, 17 Jul

    (Changes with 10 Jul)

    Yep, none of them have been able to demonstrate that they’ll be a gamechanger. Interesting that Mordaunt does the best, who they’ve comprehensively trashed and destroyed in order to get Rishi or Liz in Number 10…

    Advantage Labour…
    Mordaunt would have been a total disaster.

    She looks nice and relatable, but there's nothing there. Nothing.
    Mordaunt to take a dive or
    Mordaunt to make a splash?
  • Options
    StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 7,056

    Fucking woke governments! How dare they assist deviant, foreign rodents display their trans(national) genitals in pure English habitats?

    Beavers to be legally protected from harm in England from October

    Under new legislation, it will be an offence to deliberately capture, kill, disturb or injure beavers in England or damage where the animals breed and rest

    A five-year government trial on the river Otter in south-west England concluded that beavers had brought “a wealth of benefits to the local area and ecology”.

    https://www.newscientist.com/article/2329105-beavers-to-be-legally-protected-from-harm-in-england-from-october/

    "Vote Penny, Get Beaver!"
    So there was a River Otter Beaver Trial. Is there a River Beaver Otter Trial?
    You can trial if you like but you’d far better n’otter?
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,031
    Sandpit said:

    Am I the only person on this site who, book-value aside, thinks that Truss is the best candidate?

    Almost everyone else on this site seems to be anti-Truss for one reason or another it seems.

    My personal order of preference:
    Badenoch
    Truss
    Tugendhat
    Sunak
    Mourdaunt
    My personal preference:
    Mordaunt
    Tugendhat
    Badenoch
    Sunak
    Truss

    Truss is out of the running for the way she abandoned her job at the G20 to come back to the UK for her own benefit. We've had enough of that sort of rubbish from Johnson, thankyou very much.
    Sunak is too tied to the Johnson regime to be able to create his own identity, I think.
    Tugendhat would be a Major-style figure.
    Badenoch would, at least, be interesting.

    Any of them might grow into the role. Or be a disaster.
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,581

    Did that PBer end up going golfing?
    Is BartyBobbins still insisting the weather is “glorious”?

    Absolutely glorious weather here. 😎🌞

    Spent the last couple of hours with the kids in our blow up pool in the garden. 🏊‍♀️

    Great weather you'd normally have to pay to fly to, but at home instead. Even the Moaning Myrtles seem to have briefly stopped moaning and started enjoying themselves.
    Out of curiosity, just how hot is it at your coordinates, outdoors & inside?

    Certain sounds like a good day for a splash. BTW, here in the States, lawn sprinklers are VERY popular with the younger generation during dog days of summer.

    Last hot spell we had in Seattle last month I when out & about I observed with great pleasure local kiddies enjoying the large kiddie pool at Green Lake city park.

    Years ago a newly-elected (and one-term) mayor dealt with short-term budget crunch one summer by CLOSING the city's kiddie pools. Swore I'd never vote for the SOB, and kept my promise. And will in future, unless he's running against 45 or suchlike trash.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,267

    Which of the following individuals do you think would be the better Prime Minister?

    Sunak (CON): 33% (-1)
    Starmer (LAB): 43% (+2)

    Starmer (LAB): 37%
    Mordaunt (CON): 31%

    Starmer (LAB): 41%
    Truss (CON): 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton, 17 Jul

    (Changes with 10 Jul)

    Yep, none of them have been able to demonstrate that they’ll be a gamechanger. Interesting that Mordaunt does the best, who they’ve comprehensively trashed and destroyed in order to get Rishi or Liz in Number 10…

    Advantage Labour…
    Mordaunt would have been a total disaster.

    She looks nice and relatable, but there's nothing there. Nothing.
    Mordaunt to take a dive or
    Mordaunt to make a splash?
    Mordaunt of the navy, feeling blue.
  • Options
    WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 8,503
    edited July 2022

    moonshine said:

    jonny83 said:

    Which of the following individuals do you think would be the better Prime Minister?

    Sunak (CON): 33% (-1)
    Starmer (LAB): 43% (+2)

    Starmer (LAB): 37%
    Mordaunt (CON): 31%

    Starmer (LAB): 41%
    Truss (CON): 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton, 17 Jul

    (Changes with 10 Jul)

    Yep, none of them have been able to demonstrate that they’ll be a gamechanger. Interesting that Mordaunt does the best, who they’ve comprehensively trashed and destroyed in order to get Rishi or Liz in Number 10…

    Advantage Labour…
    but there's nothing there. Nothing.
    Bit like Sunak and his plans to deal with the Cost of Living Crisis he contributed to.
    I've got no doubt that Sunak simply offers more of the same. But, at least he'll deliver competent rational government,

    The rest are worse.

    And Starmer is no better. He'd be the same as Sunak, perhaps with a tad more tax & spend, but without the charisma.
    What is competent or rationale about his tax and spend record as Chancellor? Or his planned counter cyclical austerity he kept bragging about on tv last night? Roll the dice I say. I don’t care who, anyone but him please Tory Party.
    He will balance the books and prevent a run on the pound, which Liz Truss wouldn't it.

    He'll clearly throw any spare cash he gets at the NHS and Pensions, just like any Tory PM, and has little political imagination, but aside from Kemi there is no alternative.
    Osborne very nearly had a disaster in 2012-13 espousing the same counter-cyclical policy that moonshine mentions, until he changed course, so I'm not too confident of his economic policy if he actually goes through with it to the caricatured "don't the max out the credit card", rhetorical and over-simplified extent. He seems a reasonably competent manager in other areas, though, and quite strategic.

    Nevertheless, he seems quite heavily ideological beneath the fluid and sunny charm, to me, which is why I don't necessarily think the country would be safer with him than Mordaunt overall.

    When either of them is compared to Liz Truss, however .... well.
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,581

    ydoethur said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Sir Bill Cash ffs

    Can people like this not be made illegal?

    We're getting rid of Cash. He'll soon be Sir Bill Contactless and we won't have to worry about him.
    If Chris Pincher had been contactless, none of this would be happening.
    A rum affair, for sure. Also wine, whisky, whiskey, lager, porter,stout,gin, vodka, slivovitz, sake, etc., etc.

    And 20-year-old aged-in-the-boiler Everclear 90-proof American crazy water?
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    Has anybody worked out why the government called this stupid VONC in itself?
  • Options
    eekeek Posts: 24,983

    Has anybody worked out why the government called this stupid VONC in itself?

    Because Bozo is a clown?
  • Options
    DriverDriver Posts: 4,522

    Fucking woke governments! How dare they assist deviant, foreign rodents display their trans(national) genitals in pure English habitats?

    Beavers to be legally protected from harm in England from October

    Under new legislation, it will be an offence to deliberately capture, kill, disturb or injure beavers in England or damage where the animals breed and rest

    A five-year government trial on the river Otter in south-west England concluded that beavers had brought “a wealth of benefits to the local area and ecology”.

    https://www.newscientist.com/article/2329105-beavers-to-be-legally-protected-from-harm-in-england-from-october/

    "Vote Penny, Get Beaver!"
    So there was a River Otter Beaver Trial. Is there a River Beaver Otter Trial?
    You can trial if you like but you’d far better n’otter?
    Not sure how appropriate that quote is for today, when heat meant no work...

  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,267
    eek said:

    Has anybody worked out why the government called this stupid VONC in itself?

    Because Bozo is a clown?
    Harsh. On clowns.
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,284

    Has anybody worked out why the government called this stupid VONC in itself?

    Bizarrely as frightened of Labour saying they hadn’t been allowed a vote at all as they were about having one that forced them to vote on a motion that actually named the PM.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,371

    Sandpit said:

    Am I the only person on this site who, book-value aside, thinks that Truss is the best candidate?

    Almost everyone else on this site seems to be anti-Truss for one reason or another it seems.

    My personal order of preference:
    Badenoch
    Truss
    Tugendhat
    Sunak
    Mourdaunt
    My personal preference:
    Mordaunt
    Tugendhat
    Badenoch
    Sunak
    Truss

    Truss is out of the running for the way she abandoned her job at the G20 to come back to the UK for her own benefit. We've had enough of that sort of rubbish from Johnson, thankyou very much.
    Sunak is too tied to the Johnson regime to be able to create his own identity, I think.
    Tugendhat would be a Major-style figure.
    Badenoch would, at least, be interesting.

    Any of them might grow into the role. Or be a disaster.
    I don't think we can blame her for that.

    Had she not done so she'd have been totally out of the running.
  • Options
    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 32,002

    moonshine said:

    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    (FPT)

    ping said:

    Phil said:



    IIRC Sri Lanka didn’t run out of currency - they chose to ban fertiliser for their own reasons (albeit mad ones) failing to realise that the existing cash export crops were dependent on fertiliser imports & there wasn’t enough domestically produced fertiliser (regardless of source) to make up the difference. So exports fell more than imports & triggered a currency / balance of payments crisis.

    There was an excellent bbc world service programme on this last night;

    “The Climate Question: Can we feed the world without using chemical fertilisers?”

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/w3ct3kj5

    TBH, I usually skip over these climate programmes because they tend to be rather boring. But the title of this one piqued my interest.

    Anyway;

    Short answer is: No. The world can probably feed about 4bn people. But long term, chemical fertilisers are a big climate problem because methane is such a destructive greenhouse gas.

    Innovative solutions required.
    Farm kangaroos instead of cows. Produce much less methane.
    Milking them is a bit of a faff, though.
    No animal is created/evolved not to digest its food properly. The cows are fed shite, that's why they fart/burp. Do the same to Kangaroos; you'd get the same outcome.
    No, it is because cows ferment cellulose to break it down into digestible form, methane is a byproduct.
    Oh, right you are - I retract the above. It seems that claims of lower carbon footprint rest on 'soil carbon sequestration', rather thsn healthier no
    belchy cows.
    P
    Bullocks

    Grass fed beef is much healthier though of course.

    Not for the cows, it's not :lol:
    Bullocks
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,581
    ydoethur said:

    Which of the following individuals do you think would be the better Prime Minister?

    Sunak (CON): 33% (-1)
    Starmer (LAB): 43% (+2)

    Starmer (LAB): 37%
    Mordaunt (CON): 31%

    Starmer (LAB): 41%
    Truss (CON): 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton, 17 Jul

    (Changes with 10 Jul)

    Yep, none of them have been able to demonstrate that they’ll be a gamechanger. Interesting that Mordaunt does the best, who they’ve comprehensively trashed and destroyed in order to get Rishi or Liz in Number 10…

    Advantage Labour…
    Mordaunt would have been a total disaster.

    She looks nice and relatable, but there's nothing there. Nothing.
    Mordaunt to take a dive or
    Mordaunt to make a splash?
    Mordaunt of the navy, feeling blue.
    In the Navy - Village People
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hqAOj6pLoA4

    Did PM4PM star in this classic vid? (At a very tender age!)

    And IF she makes it to the top, what are odds that Trump will volunteer to campaign for her? Hopefully for her sake in Hot Coffee, Mississippi NOT in Crackpot, North Yorkshire.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,791

    ydoethur said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Sir Bill Cash ffs

    Can people like this not be made illegal?

    We're getting rid of Cash. He'll soon be Sir Bill Contactless and we won't have to worry about him.
    If Chris Pincher had been contactless, none of this would be happening.
    A rum affair, for sure. Also wine, whisky, whiskey, lager, porter,stout,gin, vodka, slivovitz, sake, etc., etc.

    And 20-year-old aged-in-the-boiler Everclear 90-proof American crazy water?
    Mm, weather like this reminds me of visiting Seattle for a conference and discovering that those particular Americans actually did have decent beer from the microbreweries (this was c. 1994).
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,371
    Voters are cast. A long hour now whilst the 1922 count & verify them.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,267

    Voters are cast. A long hour now whilst the 1922 count & verify them.

    Well, it's not surprising it's such a slow process. It's going to take 38 of them, unless one of them is a freak with more than ten digits a la Anne Boleyn (allegedly).
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,631
    biggles said:

    Not to alarm anyone but..

    “Extreme heat is taking its toll on Britain's electricity system. Demand is unusually high due to air con & fans, while solar & gas plants are less efficient...

    National Grid has issued an alert calling for more power plants tonight and analysts say the situation looks serious 😬”

    Solar plants are “less efficient”. Eh?
    As it gets hotter, yes.
    Not a huge effect overall, though, since solar is only a small proportion of total UK generating capacity.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,267

    moonshine said:

    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    (FPT)

    ping said:

    Phil said:



    IIRC Sri Lanka didn’t run out of currency - they chose to ban fertiliser for their own reasons (albeit mad ones) failing to realise that the existing cash export crops were dependent on fertiliser imports & there wasn’t enough domestically produced fertiliser (regardless of source) to make up the difference. So exports fell more than imports & triggered a currency / balance of payments crisis.

    There was an excellent bbc world service programme on this last night;

    “The Climate Question: Can we feed the world without using chemical fertilisers?”

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/w3ct3kj5

    TBH, I usually skip over these climate programmes because they tend to be rather boring. But the title of this one piqued my interest.

    Anyway;

    Short answer is: No. The world can probably feed about 4bn people. But long term, chemical fertilisers are a big climate problem because methane is such a destructive greenhouse gas.

    Innovative solutions required.
    Farm kangaroos instead of cows. Produce much less methane.
    Milking them is a bit of a faff, though.
    No animal is created/evolved not to digest its food properly. The cows are fed shite, that's why they fart/burp. Do the same to Kangaroos; you'd get the same outcome.
    No, it is because cows ferment cellulose to break it down into digestible form, methane is a byproduct.
    Oh, right you are - I retract the above. It seems that claims of lower carbon footprint rest on 'soil carbon sequestration', rather thsn healthier no
    belchy cows.
    P
    Bullocks

    Grass fed beef is much healthier though of course.

    Not for the cows, it's not :lol:
    Bullocks
    Nice try, have you heifer considered a career in standup?
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,581

    Did that PBer end up going golfing?
    Is BartyBobbins still insisting the weather is “glorious”?

    Absolutely glorious weather here. 😎🌞

    Spent the last couple of hours with the kids in our blow up pool in the garden. 🏊‍♀️

    Great weather you'd normally have to pay to fly to, but at home instead. Even the Moaning Myrtles seem to have briefly stopped moaning and started enjoying themselves.
    Great new game, you should say. Daddy sits in the pool and you pour cold buckets of water over his head. 😎
    Too much risk of the tykes getting a weeeeeeee bit carried away.

    Perhaps by fetching a fire hose to REALLY cool daddy down. Not a bad idea, actually!

    As they say Down South - go soak yer head!
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,477

    I hope everybody took Raab advice to keep cool by heading to lie on the beach....

    Off to the seaside tomorrow*

    It was 37 degrees a few minutes ago.

    I actually had to unpeel myself from my office chair.

    Will somebody please sacrifice a virgin to the Gods so they can change the weather.

    *I wish
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,284

    Voters are cast. A long hour now whilst the 1922 count & verify them.

    Hopefully they will look at the bits of paper rather than counting each other.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,791
    ydoethur said:

    moonshine said:

    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    (FPT)

    ping said:

    Phil said:



    IIRC Sri Lanka didn’t run out of currency - they chose to ban fertiliser for their own reasons (albeit mad ones) failing to realise that the existing cash export crops were dependent on fertiliser imports & there wasn’t enough domestically produced fertiliser (regardless of source) to make up the difference. So exports fell more than imports & triggered a currency / balance of payments crisis.

    There was an excellent bbc world service programme on this last night;

    “The Climate Question: Can we feed the world without using chemical fertilisers?”

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/w3ct3kj5

    TBH, I usually skip over these climate programmes because they tend to be rather boring. But the title of this one piqued my interest.

    Anyway;

    Short answer is: No. The world can probably feed about 4bn people. But long term, chemical fertilisers are a big climate problem because methane is such a destructive greenhouse gas.

    Innovative solutions required.
    Farm kangaroos instead of cows. Produce much less methane.
    Milking them is a bit of a faff, though.
    No animal is created/evolved not to digest its food properly. The cows are fed shite, that's why they fart/burp. Do the same to Kangaroos; you'd get the same outcome.
    No, it is because cows ferment cellulose to break it down into digestible form, methane is a byproduct.
    Oh, right you are - I retract the above. It seems that claims of lower carbon footprint rest on 'soil carbon sequestration', rather thsn healthier no
    belchy cows.
    P
    Bullocks

    Grass fed beef is much healthier though of course.

    Not for the cows, it's not :lol:
    Bullocks
    Nice try, have you heifer considered a career in standup?
    A stirk and exposed position, though, up on the stage.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,255
    ydoethur said:

    eek said:

    Has anybody worked out why the government called this stupid VONC in itself?

    Because Bozo is a clown?
    Harsh. On clowns.
    I think he wants to be able to say that he was never voted down in the actual Commons. It was back stabbing plotters like Sunak who brought him down and so the myth of the 'stab in the back' can begin and the cultists like Mogg can sit late into the night nursing their whiskey and muttering about the lost king over the water.
  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    ydoethur said:

    moonshine said:

    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    (FPT)

    ping said:

    Phil said:



    IIRC Sri Lanka didn’t run out of currency - they chose to ban fertiliser for their own reasons (albeit mad ones) failing to realise that the existing cash export crops were dependent on fertiliser imports & there wasn’t enough domestically produced fertiliser (regardless of source) to make up the difference. So exports fell more than imports & triggered a currency / balance of payments crisis.

    There was an excellent bbc world service programme on this last night;

    “The Climate Question: Can we feed the world without using chemical fertilisers?”

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/w3ct3kj5

    TBH, I usually skip over these climate programmes because they tend to be rather boring. But the title of this one piqued my interest.

    Anyway;

    Short answer is: No. The world can probably feed about 4bn people. But long term, chemical fertilisers are a big climate problem because methane is such a destructive greenhouse gas.

    Innovative solutions required.
    Farm kangaroos instead of cows. Produce much less methane.
    Milking them is a bit of a faff, though.
    No animal is created/evolved not to digest its food properly. The cows are fed shite, that's why they fart/burp. Do the same to Kangaroos; you'd get the same outcome.
    No, it is because cows ferment cellulose to break it down into digestible form, methane is a byproduct.
    Oh, right you are - I retract the above. It seems that claims of lower carbon footprint rest on 'soil carbon sequestration', rather thsn healthier no
    belchy cows.
    P
    Bullocks

    Grass fed beef is much healthier though of course.

    Not for the cows, it's not :lol:
    Bullocks
    Nice try, have you heifer considered a career in standup?
    You have given him a steer in the right direction
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,031

    Sandpit said:

    Am I the only person on this site who, book-value aside, thinks that Truss is the best candidate?

    Almost everyone else on this site seems to be anti-Truss for one reason or another it seems.

    My personal order of preference:
    Badenoch
    Truss
    Tugendhat
    Sunak
    Mourdaunt
    My personal preference:
    Mordaunt
    Tugendhat
    Badenoch
    Sunak
    Truss

    Truss is out of the running for the way she abandoned her job at the G20 to come back to the UK for her own benefit. We've had enough of that sort of rubbish from Johnson, thankyou very much.
    Sunak is too tied to the Johnson regime to be able to create his own identity, I think.
    Tugendhat would be a Major-style figure.
    Badenoch would, at least, be interesting.

    Any of them might grow into the role. Or be a disaster.
    I don't think we can blame her for that.

    Had she not done so she'd have been totally out of the running.
    Yes we can. It was her job. She was the boss, going over to meet people and arrange things. It's bad luck for her that the job became available at that time, but she abandoned what she should have been doing just for her own ambitions. What else will she abandon for her ambition? After Johnson, that is not the sort of person we want.

    If she wins, how can she send any of her ministers out on these jollies?
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,791

    ydoethur said:

    eek said:

    Has anybody worked out why the government called this stupid VONC in itself?

    Because Bozo is a clown?
    Harsh. On clowns.
    I think he wants to be able to say that he was never voted down in the actual Commons. It was back stabbing plotters like Sunak who brought him down and so the myth of the 'stab in the back' can begin and the cultists like Mogg can sit late into the night nursing their whiskey and muttering about the lost king over the water.
    Not to mention the lost lands of Ireland, I see.

    But thanks - I was just trying to make sense of it too!
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,477
    How on earth did the British Empire conquer all those hot countries?
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,371
    IanB2 said:

    Voters are cast. A long hour now whilst the 1922 count & verify them.

    Hopefully they will look at the bits of paper rather than counting each other.
    No mistake goes unpunished. Bravo.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,780
    I am surprised the drop for Penny has not been matched by an equal rise for Truss. Rishi's strengths and weakness remain as they were, more or less.
  • Options
    StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 7,056
    Driver said:

    Fucking woke governments! How dare they assist deviant, foreign rodents display their trans(national) genitals in pure English habitats?

    Beavers to be legally protected from harm in England from October

    Under new legislation, it will be an offence to deliberately capture, kill, disturb or injure beavers in England or damage where the animals breed and rest

    A five-year government trial on the river Otter in south-west England concluded that beavers had brought “a wealth of benefits to the local area and ecology”.

    https://www.newscientist.com/article/2329105-beavers-to-be-legally-protected-from-harm-in-england-from-october/

    "Vote Penny, Get Beaver!"
    So there was a River Otter Beaver Trial. Is there a River Beaver Otter Trial?
    You can trial if you like but you’d far better n’otter?
    Not sure how appropriate that quote is for today, when heat meant no work...

    At least one person got the reference!

  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,791

    Sandpit said:

    Am I the only person on this site who, book-value aside, thinks that Truss is the best candidate?

    Almost everyone else on this site seems to be anti-Truss for one reason or another it seems.

    My personal order of preference:
    Badenoch
    Truss
    Tugendhat
    Sunak
    Mourdaunt
    My personal preference:
    Mordaunt
    Tugendhat
    Badenoch
    Sunak
    Truss

    Truss is out of the running for the way she abandoned her job at the G20 to come back to the UK for her own benefit. We've had enough of that sort of rubbish from Johnson, thankyou very much.
    Sunak is too tied to the Johnson regime to be able to create his own identity, I think.
    Tugendhat would be a Major-style figure.
    Badenoch would, at least, be interesting.

    Any of them might grow into the role. Or be a disaster.
    I don't think we can blame her for that.

    Had she not done so she'd have been totally out of the running.
    Yes we can. It was her job. She was the boss, going over to meet people and arrange things. It's bad luck for her that the job became available at that time, but she abandoned what she should have been doing just for her own ambitions. What else will she abandon for her ambition? After Johnson, that is not the sort of person we want.

    If she wins, how can she send any of her ministers out on these jollies?
    Look at Mr Wallace - getting on with the job. And he was in London all along.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,631
    Those who argued that much time and effort are required for the effective use of heavy weapons in Ukraine are evidently correct.
    https://twitter.com/Frknwar/status/1549084445164158977
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,267
    Carnyx said:

    ydoethur said:

    moonshine said:

    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    (FPT)

    ping said:

    Phil said:



    IIRC Sri Lanka didn’t run out of currency - they chose to ban fertiliser for their own reasons (albeit mad ones) failing to realise that the existing cash export crops were dependent on fertiliser imports & there wasn’t enough domestically produced fertiliser (regardless of source) to make up the difference. So exports fell more than imports & triggered a currency / balance of payments crisis.

    There was an excellent bbc world service programme on this last night;

    “The Climate Question: Can we feed the world without using chemical fertilisers?”

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/w3ct3kj5

    TBH, I usually skip over these climate programmes because they tend to be rather boring. But the title of this one piqued my interest.

    Anyway;

    Short answer is: No. The world can probably feed about 4bn people. But long term, chemical fertilisers are a big climate problem because methane is such a destructive greenhouse gas.

    Innovative solutions required.
    Farm kangaroos instead of cows. Produce much less methane.
    Milking them is a bit of a faff, though.
    No animal is created/evolved not to digest its food properly. The cows are fed shite, that's why they fart/burp. Do the same to Kangaroos; you'd get the same outcome.
    No, it is because cows ferment cellulose to break it down into digestible form, methane is a byproduct.
    Oh, right you are - I retract the above. It seems that claims of lower carbon footprint rest on 'soil carbon sequestration', rather thsn healthier no
    belchy cows.
    P
    Bullocks

    Grass fed beef is much healthier though of course.

    Not for the cows, it's not :lol:
    Bullocks
    Nice try, have you heifer considered a career in standup?
    A stirk and exposed position, though, up on the stage.
    I was just exploring udder options.
  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    How on earth did the British Empire conquer all those hot countries?

    Solar topees and linen spine-pads. Don't know how I'd have got on today without mine
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,581
    ydoethur said:

    moonshine said:

    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    (FPT)

    ping said:

    Phil said:



    IIRC Sri Lanka didn’t run out of currency - they chose to ban fertiliser for their own reasons (albeit mad ones) failing to realise that the existing cash export crops were dependent on fertiliser imports & there wasn’t enough domestically produced fertiliser (regardless of source) to make up the difference. So exports fell more than imports & triggered a currency / balance of payments crisis.

    There was an excellent bbc world service programme on this last night;

    “The Climate Question: Can we feed the world without using chemical fertilisers?”

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/w3ct3kj5

    TBH, I usually skip over these climate programmes because they tend to be rather boring. But the title of this one piqued my interest.

    Anyway;

    Short answer is: No. The world can probably feed about 4bn people. But long term, chemical fertilisers are a big climate problem because methane is such a destructive greenhouse gas.

    Innovative solutions required.
    Farm kangaroos instead of cows. Produce much less methane.
    Milking them is a bit of a faff, though.
    No animal is created/evolved not to digest its food properly. The cows are fed shite, that's why they fart/burp. Do the same to Kangaroos; you'd get the same outcome.
    No, it is because cows ferment cellulose to break it down into digestible form, methane is a byproduct.
    Oh, right you are - I retract the above. It seems that claims of lower carbon footprint rest on 'soil carbon sequestration', rather thsn healthier no
    belchy cows.
    P
    Bullocks

    Grass fed beef is much healthier though of course.

    Not for the cows, it's not :lol:
    Bullocks
    Nice try, have you heifer considered a career in standup?
    You've had your fun, now move along, little doggie!

    My favorite Gary Larson cartoon: Cows and Great Chicago Fire

    https://i.pinimg.com/564x/47/8e/d8/478ed8149f39419110a379386558ee18.jpg
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,791

    How on earth did the British Empire conquer all those hot countries?

    With a lot of dead Tommies, mainly from disease and heat stroke. As well as even more dead locals, of course.
  • Options
    pingping Posts: 3,731
    edited July 2022
    Interesting and very accessible podcast on inflation (via Adam Tooze’s twitter). Mostly US, but still relevant to the UK.

    “Inflation: a guide for the perplexed”

    https://pca.st/tvortocc

    Worth an hour of anyones time, imo.

    Takeaways

    - be sceptical of economists/pundits who explain inflation as a consequence of wages/prices. Data doesn’t really support this explanation.
    - Inflation (US) is probably spiking right now/soon and should come down.
    -Main cause is supply shocks which are easing.
  • Options
    RandallFlaggRandallFlagg Posts: 1,157

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    As things stand I think Liz Truss is going to win.

    I bloody hope so!
    I'm hoping for a Rishi/Truss run-off to the membership as its then literally win/win.

    Either win - my bet comes in, or win - the best candidate wins and we get the best candidate to be PM. Either way I'd be happy. 👍
    Truss is the Fuck the Union candidate par excellence. She’s head and shoulders above the rest.

    I think the SNP would have big problems if they joined with the Conservatives under Truss to undermine the operation of a Lab/LD coalition or Lab minority government with C&S and perhaps even bring it down. PM Truss would make that outcome more likely I think. So be careful what you wish for.
    “Joined with the Conservatives”?!? Ho ho. That’s a tremendous Labour attack line… when you lot quite literally just “joined with the Conservatives” in councils throughout the country. And don’t forget:



    Your memory is short. The SNP went from 11 to 2 seats in 1979 when it last brought down a Labour government.
    Jim Callaghan himself said that that was a lot of nonsense.
    "At an election rally in Glasgow at the start of the campaign, Callaghan attacked the SNP's role in joining with the Conservatives to bring his Government down. He described them as "turkeys voting for Christmas" and urged his Scottish supporters to "carve them up in the polling booths.""
    That was when he was electioneering. He had a different and more considered view as do political historians - that it only speeded things up by a few months at most.

    Labour had breached an agreement to allow a referendum without nobbling it. Simple as that.

    In any case, why aren't you complaining about the LDs as well?

    Or for that matter the Labour and SDLP MPs who abstained (one with an excellent excuse)?
    Considering the collapse of the SNP vote at the following election, it does rather seem as if they were turkeys voting for Christmas and they did indeed get carved up in the pooling booths.
    Whoever and whatever was ultimately responsible for Callaghan's government really does not matter to be honest. What matters is that the last time the SNP 'helped' bring a Labour government down, their vote collapsed. Which is why Starmer - if we get a hung parliament next election - is not going to struggle to get a Queen's Speech through the Commons and will likely be able to govern for long enough to call another election on his terms.
    EDIT: Forgot to add the word 'collapsing' after government. Wish you could actually edit your post after six minutes.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,898
    Nigelb said:

    Those who argued that much time and effort are required for the effective use of heavy weapons in Ukraine are evidently correct.
    https://twitter.com/Frknwar/status/1549084445164158977

    Best comment underneath - “Don’t drink and tank!”
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,477
    The British Empire built the Cairo to Khartoum railway, how on did they manage that but rail tracks in this country cannot cope with the heat?
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,791
    IshmaelZ said:

    How on earth did the British Empire conquer all those hot countries?

    Solar topees and linen spine-pads. Don't know how I'd have got on today without mine
    I came across this some time back -

    https://militaryhealth.bmj.com/content/jramc/102/4/217.full.pdf
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,581
    IshmaelZ said:

    How on earth did the British Empire conquer all those hot countries?

    Solar topees and linen spine-pads. Don't know how I'd have got on today without mine
    Demand genuine pith helmet, with genuine (or good imitation) pith.

    Works great in hot, esp dry weather PROVIDE you keep it wet, preferably with coldest water available. PROVIDED you have the personal confidence & chutzpah to wear it in public!
  • Options
    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,342
    Keystone said:

    algarkirk said:

    Keystone said:

    Am I the only person on this site who, book-value aside, thinks that Truss is the best candidate?

    Almost everyone else on this site seems to be anti-Truss for one reason or another it seems.

    She seems serious, passionate and capable. I think you should back her to the hilt.
    From a Labour perspective she looks suitable. The public persona and charisma of T May + a harsh set of principles and without the solidity and correctness. I think Labourites are looking at a further period in opposition if Kemi gets it, otherwise they should be reasonably confident. Truss would be the Labour favourite though, as there is something to be said for all then others.

    Truss is probably better than Rishi for a host of reasons. Chief among them not having to take ownership for the economic situation.

    His stature will also be an issue on TV.

    The real question is whether Kemi would really broaden or sustain the party's reach.

    I'm not sure she will appeal to UKIP leaning former Labour voters in the Red Wall - or to Remain leaning Wets down south.

    She is articulate, attractive and sharp. I'm just not sure she is the answer to the fragmenting electoral coalition that the next leader will need to address.

    I don't think there is a large Black middle class vote that will flip if she runs - unlike the sizeable Hindu vote which is already moving into the Tory column.

    And she has personal weaknesses - I think she will look too ideological. She doesn't have personal gravitas - although she might develop that in time.

    My gut feeling is that she doesn't come across well on "women's issues" - health, transport, education etc - which is where the current Tory party is getting crucified among female swing voters. (Hillary Clinton had the same problem - she really loved the big picture economic and geopolitical strategy - and that was ultimately reflected in voter perceptions).

    It is remarkable how little attention the Tories have paid to these issues. Housing has only belatedly got onto the agenda because it is biting young activists.

    So the idea that a black female leader would close off the race and gender angle evaporates under closer scrutiny.

    And if she did win pretty soon she would get dragged down into the sorry horse trading that running the country involves.

    Selling personal sacrifices to the electorate while cutting corporate taxation is going to be a tough message.

    I think she is really cementing her position as a strong challenger for leader in 2025 if the election is lost.
    I don't think the fact that she's black would affect things much - people who vote purely on race are really rare now. She's interesting and lucid and although she's right-wing she does'nt have the air of a head-banger who never listens - witness her firm commitment to net zero. I'm not going to vote Tory if she's leader, but I know people who might, and really wouldn't for the others. Essentially she fits the "time for a change " narrative - Sunak and Truss are not a change, and Mordaunt hasn't succeeded in establishing a USP.

    Tonight's ballot won't change much, But I suspect tomorrow's ballot is going to be all about Truss vs Badenoch, with Mordaunt trailing.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,477
    Did Boris Johnson really say 'We saw off Brenda Hale?'

    If he really did, then he get in the fucking sea.
  • Options
    StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 7,056
    ydoethur said:

    Voters are cast. A long hour now whilst the 1922 count & verify them.

    Well, it's not surprising it's such a slow process. It's going to take 38 of them, unless one of them is a freak with more than ten digits a la Anne Boleyn (allegedly).
    She was a Norfolk though
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,631
    ydoethur said:

    Carnyx said:

    ydoethur said:

    moonshine said:

    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    (FPT)

    ping said:

    Phil said:



    IIRC Sri Lanka didn’t run out of currency - they chose to ban fertiliser for their own reasons (albeit mad ones) failing to realise that the existing cash export crops were dependent on fertiliser imports & there wasn’t enough domestically produced fertiliser (regardless of source) to make up the difference. So exports fell more than imports & triggered a currency / balance of payments crisis.

    There was an excellent bbc world service programme on this last night;

    “The Climate Question: Can we feed the world without using chemical fertilisers?”

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/w3ct3kj5

    TBH, I usually skip over these climate programmes because they tend to be rather boring. But the title of this one piqued my interest.

    Anyway;

    Short answer is: No. The world can probably feed about 4bn people. But long term, chemical fertilisers are a big climate problem because methane is such a destructive greenhouse gas.

    Innovative solutions required.
    Farm kangaroos instead of cows. Produce much less methane.
    Milking them is a bit of a faff, though.
    No animal is created/evolved not to digest its food properly. The cows are fed shite, that's why they fart/burp. Do the same to Kangaroos; you'd get the same outcome.
    No, it is because cows ferment cellulose to break it down into digestible form, methane is a byproduct.
    Oh, right you are - I retract the above. It seems that claims of lower carbon footprint rest on 'soil carbon sequestration', rather thsn healthier no
    belchy cows.
    P
    Bullocks

    Grass fed beef is much healthier though of course.

    Not for the cows, it's not :lol:
    Bullocks
    Nice try, have you heifer considered a career in standup?
    A stirk and exposed position, though, up on the stage.
    I was just exploring udder options.
    I’ve herd better from you.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,791

    The British Empire built the Cairo to Khartoum railway, how on did they manage that but rail tracks in this country cannot cope with the heat?

    The Khartoum line didn't have to cope with snow and ice in the winter. It's hot all the time in Egypt/Sudan? So no need to worry about the line shrinking in winter if it is given too much room for expansion.

    Also - not continuous welded rail, so more play - just send a few dozen chaps with spanners to redo the fishplates every few weeks?
  • Options
    sarissasarissa Posts: 1,783
    eek said:

    Today's London to Inverness train has just reached Newcastle, 2 and a half hours late!

    (It's actually cancelled tomorrow).

    https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:L77648/2022-07-18/detailed

    It does seem to have spent over an hour sat at Darlington Station.
    Problem with the overhead power lines, I believe.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,477
    I see Kemi Badenoch puts in the anus in Janus, what a lying two faced git.

    After using the CEN hustings to publicly back the Net Zero by 2050 target, Kemi Badenoch now says she COULD delay it, telling @TalkTV

    "Yes there are circumstances where I would delay it... setting a target is not delivering."


    https://twitter.com/NatashaC/status/1549096711271768069

    Only the gullible fall for her words.
  • Options
    bigglesbiggles Posts: 4,341

    The British Empire built the Cairo to Khartoum railway, how on did they manage that but rail tracks in this country cannot cope with the heat?

    The Cairo to Khartoum line is rarely covered in snow.
  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Carnyx said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    How on earth did the British Empire conquer all those hot countries?

    Solar topees and linen spine-pads. Don't know how I'd have got on today without mine
    I came across this some time back -

    https://militaryhealth.bmj.com/content/jramc/102/4/217.full.pdf
    That is riveting. Also a great relief, because after posting that I decided that there was a 30% chance that spine pads were something I had just dreamt.
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,581

    Fucking woke governments! How dare they assist deviant, foreign rodents display their trans(national) genitals in pure English habitats?

    Beavers to be legally protected from harm in England from October

    Under new legislation, it will be an offence to deliberately capture, kill, disturb or injure beavers in England or damage where the animals breed and rest

    A five-year government trial on the river Otter in south-west England concluded that beavers had brought “a wealth of benefits to the local area and ecology”.

    https://www.newscientist.com/article/2329105-beavers-to-be-legally-protected-from-harm-in-england-from-october/

    "Vote Penny, Get Beaver!"
    So there was a River Otter Beaver Trial. Is there a River Beaver Otter Trial?
    You can trial if you like but you’d far better n’otter?
    You better not oughter be messin' with that otter - American folk wisdom
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,031

    I hope everybody took Raab advice to keep cool by heading to lie on the beach....

    Off to the seaside tomorrow*

    It was 37 degrees a few minutes ago.

    I actually had to unpeel myself from my office chair.

    Will somebody please sacrifice a virgin to the Gods so they can change the weather.

    *I wish
    I've persuaded Mrs J not to drive into work tomorrow, 50 mins there, 50 mins back. Although it's scorchio in our study, it's better than being in a car for 100-120 minutes in this heat.
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,408
    edited July 2022

    I hope everybody took Raab advice to keep cool by heading to lie on the beach....

    Off to the seaside tomorrow*

    It was 37 degrees a few minutes ago.

    I actually had to unpeel myself from my office chair.

    Will somebody please sacrifice a virgin to the Gods so they can change the weather.

    *I wish
    Get a proper office chair with a mesh seat and back. £1,500 will get you a Herman Miller Aeron.
    https://www.johnlewis.com/herman-miller-aeron-office-chair-onyx/p6201703
This discussion has been closed.