If Biden did that, people would be shouting "senile", but Johnson gets away with it...
Well, that is because Biden is senile. Johnson is unlikely to be, at his age. Not sure in what sense Johnson "gets away with it" though. You are kinder to him than most of us.
"Biden is senile" today, is in same category as "Goldwater is nuts" back in HIS day.
Most Tugendhat votes tomorrow will go to Sunak and Mordaunt and Mordaunt has kept second, Truss would have been hoping for far more than just 7 extra votes from Braverman's 27 backers.
Christ Kemi really is dumb, the actuarial tables say she'll still be around here.
…I believe there is climate change and that’s something we do need to tackle, but we have to do it in a way that doesn't bankrupt our economy. We've got to take people with us. What would happen if we moved it to 2060 or 2070? We're not going to be here. Let's be realistic”.
She's not saying she'll be dead, just that she'll no longer be among those making decisions (this not being the US, which is basically a gerontocracy - this country is run entirely for the benefit of the elderly, but not yet by them).
Anyway, she is almost 50:50 to be dead by 20260, and more likely than not to be gone by 2070.
What on earth do you have against her?
She's so overrated, I asked her supporters if they could link to a decent speech or policy she had implemented and there nothing but tumbleweeds.
Truss picks up 7 of 27 Braverman despite endorsement.
I think Truss picked up more of Braverman's votes than that, but lost some of her existing votes, probably to Sunak on an "experienced and competent pair of hands basis."
Strong result for Sunak. Mordaunt holing out, but not dead yet as Truss not seized advantage as much as she could have. Tugendhat did well to hold onto what he had.
Badenoch is supposed to be very right wing - surely people are right her lot mostly go Truss? Though the possibility of her slipping past Truss as Tugendhat's 'clean start' people should really go for her would be funny. Can't see it though.
Most Tugendhat votes tomorrow will go to Sunak and Mordaunt and Mordaunt has kept second, Truss would have been hoping for far more than just 7 extra votes from Braverman's 27 backers.
So could have been worse for Penny
That’s a disaster for Truss today. 27 Bravermans and she hardly rise, Badenoch went up more.
Given that Tom’s votes will put Sunak further clear and some may go to Mordaunt, Sunak will be in a position to lend a few over to keep Truss firmly in third.
Despite the spin from the Badenoch camp, if Truss’s two dismal performances haven’t got MPs leaving her side, it is hard to see what else would?
The TERF-led campaign against Penny has worked well, hasn't it?
It's a shame they're too thick to realise that they've sided with some people who will soon be going after them...
Radical Feminists in the Tory Party?
Er ...
Some in the Tory Party are the TERF's useful idiots.
Which is exactly the problem. The same sort of dinosaurs within the Conservative Party who spit their tea out at the thought of anyone being any different to them, whether in gender, race, sexuality or anything else, are the same sort who will be spitting their tea out at other things in the future. like same-sex marriage et al. As we are seeing in the US.
They really are dinosaurs.
The 2nd time on this thread you've made this ignorant comment.
Womens' rights under the Equality Act have been under sustained attack now for a number of years by TRA extremists (generally on the left). They want to abolish the single sex exemptions under that Act & the offence of rape by deception. They've relentlessly attacked online any woman objecting to this, sometimes in the most lurid & violent of terms; they've created an atmosphere where women have been hounded out of their jobs & had to go to law to get their rights; they've defamed women, been forced to apologise & pay compensation by the courts; they've attacked women-only meetings (most recently in Bristol where a friend of mine, married to a transgender person, was present & saw the threats of violence from men).
Today they're attacking Rachel Reeves for saying - in her words - "Biology is important. A woman is somebody with a biology that is different from a man's biology." They've attacked Rosie Duffield & other Labour women MPs who have sought to stand up for women's rights.
These attacks are supported by a well-funded lobby group that has sought to misrepresent existing equality law, sought to redefine homosexuality as same-gender attraction & has attacked lesbians who say they're not attracted to male bodies. It spat out its dummy when the ECHR pointed out that there are 9 protected characteristics under the EA, it has a duty to consider them all & no one group's rights take priority over another. It even sought to attack the EHRC at the UN & get its UN designation revoked.
The dinosaurs are those who do this, who support this attack on women, their rights & who are dismissive of the reason why such rights exist: the need to be protected from assault, the need for privacy & dignity in intimate situations.
Let me spell this out to you: - it is to ensure that teenage girls or women with heavy periods do not have to go into a loo with stains on her clothes or wash out her knickers in the presence of men or boys; - it is to ensure that women suffering miscarriages do not have to have men present while cleaning up the blood pouring down their legs; - it is to ensure that women who are breast feeding do not have to express milk in front of male strangers; - it is to ensure that Muslim women can wash for their prayers without men present; - it is to ensure that when women are in a state of deshabille in changing rooms they are not being watched by male strangers; - it is to ensure that the disabled or elderly needing intimate care can insist on a same sex carer not a man to wipe their bottom or change their tampon.
It is not because people don't like difference. It is because they object to being told that they can't have boundaries & have them respected.
No political party is campaigning to remove transpeople's existing rights under the GRA or the EA. But there are those seeking to do this to women. So we don't need to wait for the future or for the US.
Post of the day! Do trans extremists realise, or care, that they are making the lives of ordinary trans people more difficult?
They don't care. I have 2 friends who have gender dysphoria, 1 a lesbian woman and 1 a transwoman and neither support - in fact, are in despair at - the activities of and nonsense being spouted by the activists. Trans people are simply being used by those who are seeking to use gender ideology for their own purposes.
Worth looking at the money to be made by the drug companies peddling puberty blocking hormones and cross-sex hormones, the lifelong and pretty unpleasant medical consequences of those drugs and who they are funding. This is a medical scandal in the making.
There are extremists on both sides. and many trans people are trapped in the middle. Sadly, extremists rarely recognise themselves as such, and it is therefore necessary to try to judge one's own position accordingly. Am I being extreme? Have I taken one small issue and enlarged it to such a degree that it hurts more than it saves? Are there other ways of preventing the harms I want to prevent?
I hope everybody took Raab advice to keep cool by heading to lie on the beach....
Off to the seaside tomorrow*
It was 37 degrees a few minutes ago.
I actually had to unpeel myself from my office chair.
Will somebody please sacrifice a virgin to the Gods so they can change the weather.
*I wish
I've persuaded Mrs J not to drive into work tomorrow, 50 mins there, 50 mins back. Although it's scorchio in our study, it's better than being in a car for 100-120 minutes in this heat.
Some of us don't have much choice, of course...
Indeed. And that's important to note. Many of us can talk about the joys of WfH; the poor sods I saw on the West Cambroune building site this morning cannot exactly be working from home. Someone else's future home, maybe...
I find I work much more effectively at home. And it's much cheaper. Plus the internet connection is about a thousand times better.
But bizarrely schools are actually going the other way. My school is now insisting we* stay an extra three hours a week on site next year to do work.
*I say 'we.' I am of course unaffected.
What?
Is your school trying to save money by having all their staff leave?
I suspect Kemi’s goes 1/3 equally to Rishi, Truss and Penny.
No way, Kemi's MPs will transfer 2/3rds to Liz, look at how Braverman's MPs just transferred to those two by 2/3rds and 1/3rd to Rishi. I doubt more than a handful transfer to Penny, I'd guess at ~2/3rds to Liz and ~1/3rd to Rishi.
Given that Tom’s votes will put Sunak further clear and some may go to Mordaunt, Sunak will be in a position to lend a few over to keep Truss firmly in third.
Despite the spin from the Badenoch camp, if Truss’s two dismal performances haven’t got MPs leaving her side, it is hard to see what else would?
We overlook it, but from an MPs perspective Truss has some firm credentials. Experience counts.
A lot of Kemi supporters might be doing so because she is a change candidate, fresh face. Liz isn’t, so I’m not sure. I think Kemi’s votes will go in 3 ways.
You think? The Braverman votes were meant to migrate to Truss, and look at what actually happened.
Looks like Kemi and Liz picked up a lot of Braverman's votes. What we don't know is if Sunak took back some votes he had leant in earlier rounds. Perhaps that's why Sunak was targeted by the others. They probably knew that they were getting more votes than they could account for.
Where Kemi's votes goes depends on why people are currently backing her.
Is it because she is very right wing? Or is it because she is seen as a fresh new face and a bit of a break from Johnson and this government.
If it's the former then the majority will go to Truss if it's the latter I see Gardenwalker being right, those votes could split including to Mordaunt.
I suspect Kemi’s goes 1/3 equally to Rishi, Truss and Penny.
No way, Kemi's MPs will transfer 2/3rds to Liz, look at how Braverman's MPs just transferred to those two by 2/3rds and 1/3rd to Rishi. I doubt more than a handful transfer to Penny, I'd guess at ~2/3rds to Liz and ~1/3rd to Rishi.
The Kemi/Penny crossover is absolutely tiny IMO.
Not so sure. A lot of them look to be Red Wallers. LT would probably be a disaster, PM might offer at least some chance of redemption.
It's not ideology that counts, it's whether you will keep your job.
The TERF-led campaign against Penny has worked well, hasn't it?
It's a shame they're too thick to realise that they've sided with some people who will soon be going after them...
Radical Feminists in the Tory Party?
Er ...
Some in the Tory Party are the TERF's useful idiots.
Which is exactly the problem. The same sort of dinosaurs within the Conservative Party who spit their tea out at the thought of anyone being any different to them, whether in gender, race, sexuality or anything else, are the same sort who will be spitting their tea out at other things in the future. like same-sex marriage et al. As we are seeing in the US.
They really are dinosaurs.
The 2nd time on this thread you've made this ignorant comment.
Womens' rights under the Equality Act have been under sustained attack now for a number of years by TRA extremists (generally on the left). They want to abolish the single sex exemptions under that Act & the offence of rape by deception. They've relentlessly attacked online any woman objecting to this, sometimes in the most lurid & violent of terms; they've created an atmosphere where women have been hounded out of their jobs & had to go to law to get their rights; they've defamed women, been forced to apologise & pay compensation by the courts; they've attacked women-only meetings (most recently in Bristol where a friend of mine, married to a transgender person, was present & saw the threats of violence from men).
Today they're attacking Rachel Reeves for saying - in her words - "Biology is important. A woman is somebody with a biology that is different from a man's biology." They've attacked Rosie Duffield & other Labour women MPs who have sought to stand up for women's rights.
These attacks are supported by a well-funded lobby group that has sought to misrepresent existing equality law, sought to redefine homosexuality as same-gender attraction & has attacked lesbians who say they're not attracted to male bodies. It spat out its dummy when the ECHR pointed out that there are 9 protected characteristics under the EA, it has a duty to consider them all & no one group's rights take priority over another. It even sought to attack the EHRC at the UN & get its UN designation revoked.
The dinosaurs are those who do this, who support this attack on women, their rights & who are dismissive of the reason why such rights exist: the need to be protected from assault, the need for privacy & dignity in intimate situations.
Let me spell this out to you: - it is to ensure that teenage girls or women with heavy periods do not have to go into a loo with stains on her clothes or wash out her knickers in the presence of men or boys; - it is to ensure that women suffering miscarriages do not have to have men present while cleaning up the blood pouring down their legs; - it is to ensure that women who are breast feeding do not have to express milk in front of male strangers; - it is to ensure that Muslim women can wash for their prayers without men present; - it is to ensure that when women are in a state of deshabille in changing rooms they are not being watched by male strangers; - it is to ensure that the disabled or elderly needing intimate care can insist on a same sex carer not a man to wipe their bottom or change their tampon.
It is not because people don't like difference. It is because they object to being told that they can't have boundaries & have them respected.
No political party is campaigning to remove transpeople's existing rights under the GRA or the EA. But there are those seeking to do this to women. So we don't need to wait for the future or for the US.
Post of the day! Do trans extremists realise, or care, that they are making the lives of ordinary trans people more difficult?
They don't care. I have 2 friends who have gender dysphoria, 1 a lesbian woman and 1 a transwoman and neither support - in fact, are in despair at - the activities of and nonsense being spouted by the activists. Trans people are simply being used by those who are seeking to use gender ideology for their own purposes.
Worth looking at the money to be made by the drug companies peddling puberty blocking hormones and cross-sex hormones, the lifelong and pretty unpleasant medical consequences of those drugs and who they are funding. This is a medical scandal in the making.
There are extremists on both sides. and many trans people are trapped in the middle. Sadly, extremists rarely recognise themselves as such, and it is therefore necessary to try to judge one's own position accordingly. Am I being extreme? Have I taken one small issue and enlarged it to such a degree that it hurts more than it saves? Are there other ways of preventing the harms I want to prevent?
False equivalence there. There really are not extremists on both sides. There are people who think that women should non-negotiably be kept safe from rape and should be free to compete in sport against other women, and that otherwise trans women should be entirely free to behave and be identified exactly as they please, and there are posturing twats who want to make an issue of it.
If MPs decide that Mordaunt's campaign is done, might some of her voters switch to Badenoch to knock out Liz Truss?
Maybe a small chance? Think it needs more of an implosion, and there's not much time for that, but if there's a stop Truss campaign out there, Mordaunt is clearly tapped out.
I wonder if Sunak had leant some votes in the first two rounds so that he could take them back to give a sense of momentum.
If he lent a few to each of the others that would make sense - hard to imagine Braverman supporters giving him a +14. Tomorrow's ballot should see him over the top, and Truss probably just holding off Badenoch. It'll then come down to whether Badenoich's backers are as solidly right-wing as we think. But yhes, I still think it'll be Sunak-Truss in the end.
You think? The Braverman votes were meant to migrate to Truss, and look at what actually happened.
A lot of Braverman's votes were always going to go to Badenoch because they had similar political views.
The biggest beneficiary in this round of voting was Sunak. If the Braverman vote really did rush to either Badenoch or Truss then some very unusual and convenient churn has been happening to disguise the fact.
Where Kemi's votes goes depends on why people are currently backing her.
Is it because she is very right wing? Or is it because she is seen as a fresh new face and a bit of a break from Johnson and this government.
If it's the former then the majority will go to Truss if it's the latter I see Gardenwalker being right, those votes could split including to Mordaunt.
The logic for Mordaunt getting a decent slice of the Tugenhat and then some Badenoch votes would be from those who subscribe to the view that the current Cabinet are all too tainted with lipstick from the clown.
Genuinely good result for Sunak. He's not the runaway winner, but there's some distance now at least, and the stop Rishi campaign has not yet resolved itself.
Truss + Badenoch up 16 Mordaunt + Tugendhat down 2
Great result.
You have to be careful not to talk seesaw but roundabouts. Sunak extra 14 may hardly have come from Braverman. He could have got them from Liz and Liz most Bravermans 27.
Which candidate would Rishi Sunak prefer to face with the membership? I'm not sure now. It used to be Truss rather than Mordaunt but Mordaunt has become less popular in recent days.
Truss + Badenoch up 16 Mordaunt + Tugendhat down 2
Great result.
You have to be careful not to talk seesaw but roundabouts. Sunak extra 14 may hardly have come from Braverman. He could have got them from Liz and Liz most Bravermans 27.
Oh yeah there'll be some churn. He probably got a couple from Mordaunt/Tug too.
You think? The Braverman votes were meant to migrate to Truss, and look at what actually happened.
A lot of Braverman's votes were always going to go to Badenoch because they had similar political views.
The biggest beneficiary in this round of voting was Sunak. If the Braverman vote really did rush to either Badenoch or Truss then some very unusual and convenient churn has been happening to disguise the fact.
Sunak and Truss are the two candidates with experience of the big Cabinet jobs, but Truss has not looked that competent in the debate. I think she lost votes to Sunak.
The TERF-led campaign against Penny has worked well, hasn't it?
It's a shame they're too thick to realise that they've sided with some people who will soon be going after them...
Radical Feminists in the Tory Party?
Er ...
Some in the Tory Party are the TERF's useful idiots.
Which is exactly the problem. The same sort of dinosaurs within the Conservative Party who spit their tea out at the thought of anyone being any different to them, whether in gender, race, sexuality or anything else, are the same sort who will be spitting their tea out at other things in the future. like same-sex marriage et al. As we are seeing in the US.
They really are dinosaurs.
The 2nd time on this thread you've made this ignorant comment.
Womens' rights under the Equality Act have been under sustained attack now for a number of years by TRA extremists (generally on the left). They want to abolish the single sex exemptions under that Act & the offence of rape by deception. They've relentlessly attacked online any woman objecting to this, sometimes in the most lurid & violent of terms; they've created an atmosphere where women have been hounded out of their jobs & had to go to law to get their rights; they've defamed women, been forced to apologise & pay compensation by the courts; they've attacked women-only meetings (most recently in Bristol where a friend of mine, married to a transgender person, was present & saw the threats of violence from men).
Today they're attacking Rachel Reeves for saying - in her words - "Biology is important. A woman is somebody with a biology that is different from a man's biology." They've attacked Rosie Duffield & other Labour women MPs who have sought to stand up for women's rights.
These attacks are supported by a well-funded lobby group that has sought to misrepresent existing equality law, sought to redefine homosexuality as same-gender attraction & has attacked lesbians who say they're not attracted to male bodies. It spat out its dummy when the ECHR pointed out that there are 9 protected characteristics under the EA, it has a duty to consider them all & no one group's rights take priority over another. It even sought to attack the EHRC at the UN & get its UN designation revoked.
The dinosaurs are those who do this, who support this attack on women, their rights & who are dismissive of the reason why such rights exist: the need to be protected from assault, the need for privacy & dignity in intimate situations.
Let me spell this out to you: - it is to ensure that teenage girls or women with heavy periods do not have to go into a loo with stains on her clothes or wash out her knickers in the presence of men or boys; - it is to ensure that women suffering miscarriages do not have to have men present while cleaning up the blood pouring down their legs; - it is to ensure that women who are breast feeding do not have to express milk in front of male strangers; - it is to ensure that Muslim women can wash for their prayers without men present; - it is to ensure that when women are in a state of deshabille in changing rooms they are not being watched by male strangers; - it is to ensure that the disabled or elderly needing intimate care can insist on a same sex carer not a man to wipe their bottom or change their tampon.
It is not because people don't like difference. It is because they object to being told that they can't have boundaries & have them respected.
No political party is campaigning to remove transpeople's existing rights under the GRA or the EA. But there are those seeking to do this to women. So we don't need to wait for the future or for the US.
Ms Free, before you accuse other people out for 'ignorant comments', I might suggest you remove the plank from your own eye.
*You* want to remove the rights for transgender people from being able to change gender. Because you won't let them use women's toilets. Which they need to do by law for a year or two, and which is a reasonable requirement IMO.
Let me quote back something you said the other day. There is a great deal to say about it: "Women can always tell when a man pretends to be a woman. And I'd tell them to use the men's." (*)
1) You do not speak for all women. I have asked a couple of women, and they disagree with your comments above, one quite fiercely. This is not the first time you have deigned to speak for all women.
2) Women come in all types, shapes and sizes. Some look a little androgynous. Others, including some gay women, choose to look a little androgynous. Others may not fit your idea of 'woman'. Particularly ones that may be of other ethnicities. Or ones who have had cancer. Or ones who are disabled. Or black. Or just *different*.
3) Trans people come in all types, shapes and sizes. They are not always cartoonish and obvious. Rarely, IME, because many of them just want to get on with their lives without getting hassled by bigots.
4) Just think for a moment: if you are wrong, and tell a woman who is a woman to go and use the male facilities, what harm are you causing them? How would you feel is someone said to you that you had to use the gents because you are not a lady?
5) What gives you the right to police this? If not you, who?
6) How closely do you 'examine' the people who come into the ladies?
7) Why not let people be what they want to be, as long as they do not hurt other people?
8) How common do you really thing this is?
You are the extremist. Your position will cause no end of harm to trans people and women who do not match your ideal of what a 'woman' is.
The requirements are for medical evidence. It is a paper exercise. There is no requirement for friends or family or other evidence that a person uses loos or dresses as a woman. So you are wrong on this.
You are also wrong in stating that I am an extremist because I would ask a person with a male body who is of the male sex to use a loo or changing room which is not a woman's one. Why? Because this is the current law. It is lawful to exclude a transwoman from such places in the grounds of sex under the Equality Act.
The rest of your post is irrelevant. I have never pretended to speak for anyone other than myself nor have I sought to define femininity. But what constitutes the female sex is clear. And the male sex is not - and cannot - turn into the female sex.
As for harm - what harm is caused by asking a TW to use a loo which is unisex rather than a female one? The risks of harm are very much greater for women. 98% of all sexual assaults are carried out by men and such evidence as there is shows that transgender people - TW, even after full transition - have the same offending rates and the same types of offences as men. In short their gender change does not make them less of a risk to women. This does not of course deal with the very much greater risk of men claiming to be women even though they do have any sort of dysphoria.
"I am who I say I am" is the MO of every fraudster who has ever lived, financial or sexual, and it is only the naive or wilfully ignorant who think otherwise.
TW should be allowed to live their lives. But what they cannot be allowed to do is make it difficult or impossible for women to live their lives freely without fear or a lack of dignity. Nor are they entitled to demand that women give up the rights they have.
The longer it goes on with Sunak as the clear frontrunner, but with any worries about the damage the process might be doing to the party continuing, the more the temptation for Tories will be to accelerate the process in some way, to minimise the damage and streamline the process.
Boris Johnson will do almost anything to stop this happening, as his parting contribution. He's very good at vengeance, and keeping and bearing grudges.
If MPs decide that Mordaunt's campaign is done, might some of her voters switch to Badenoch to knock out Liz Truss?
That approach is risky. The gaps between the camps aren't huge, and they could easily end up knocking Mordaunt out by accident and leaving Truss in place.
Which candidate would Rishi Sunak prefer to face with the membership? I'm not sure now. It used to be Truss rather than Mordaunt but Mordaunt has become less popular in recent days.
Badenoch, without a doubt. Truss destroys him, and even Mordaunt probably still wins, since lots of voting members won't be at any of the hustings and that's where she's weakest. Sunak is not that well liked anymore as a result of his recent policies as Chancellor, and the mess resulting from his wife's tax affairs. Badenoch is his best bet, since her name recognition is poor and a lot of members will just end up playing it safe.
The question is, can he engineer Truss's demise by lending votes to Badenoch, and get away with it?
Mordaunt - Relief that despite relentless attacks she's held firm and Tug's votes en-route
Truss - Just can't get lift-off. Still behind M. Few from Tug to come
Badenoch - Creeping closer to Truss but still too far away. Trap door await
Tugendhat - Remained firm but votes will split Mordaunt & Sunak - Not Just Votes But M&S Votes ....
Sunak could lend some votes to Badenoch to knock out Liz, in theory, but it just seems too uncertain. He cannot known all of Badenoch's vote holds up (though it seems a decent shout given her showing). He cannot be confident of how many he will need to lend to ensure Truss goes out, and if he tries it and misses it doesn't look savvy, it looks incompetent.
(((Dan Hodges))) @DPJHodges · 15m Confirmed. The Tories are now going to either elect their third female leader and Prime Minister or Britain’s first black Prime Minister. Labour, meanwhile, cling desperately to their white men from north London.
Comments
Sunak, 118
Mordaunt 84
Truss, 83
Badenoch, 56
Tugendhat 12
I overestimated Truss and underestimated Tugs, but pretty damn close.
Truss picks up 7 of 27 Braverman despite endorsement.
So could have been worse for Penny
Tugendhat votes will now go to Rishi and Mordaunt; Badenoch’s will go to all three.
I suspect Kemi’s goes 1/3 equally to Rishi, Truss and Penny.
EDIT: Though that was in the final round, so it wasn't a question of losing momentum.
Betfair next prime minister
2 Rishi Sunak 50%
3.25 Liz Truss 31%
5.3 Penny Mordaunt 19%
18 Kemi Badenoch 6%
260 Dominic Raab
Next Conservative leader
1.99 Rishi Sunak 50%
2.92 Liz Truss 34%
7.4 Penny Mordaunt 14%
20 Kemi Badenoch 5%
To be in final two
1.02 Rishi Sunak 98%
1.6 Liz Truss 63%
2.26 Penny Mordaunt 44%
9 Kemi Badenoch 11%
Plus Sunak likely gives tactical votes to Mordaunt too
Only 7 votes more after the Braverman endorsement.
Sunak - 116 (+15)
Mordaunt - 88 (+5)
Truss - 84 (+20)
Badenoch - 45 (-4)
Tugendhat - 25 (-7)
I guess I really did call Truss's performance wrong. Congrats on the bottom two for holding onto their supporters.
Sunak 115 (+14)
Mordaunt 82 (-1)
Truss 71 (+7)
Badenoch 58 (+9)
Tugendhat 31 (-1)
Strong result for Sunak. Mordaunt holing out, but not dead yet as Truss not seized advantage as much as she could have. Tugendhat did well to hold onto what he had.
Badenoch is supposed to be very right wing - surely people are right her lot mostly go Truss? Though the possibility of her slipping past Truss as Tugendhat's 'clean start' people should really go for her would be funny. Can't see it though.
Despite the spin from the Badenoch camp, if Truss’s two dismal performances haven’t got MPs leaving her side, it is hard to see what else would?
Is your school trying to save money by having all their staff leave?
How very 2012.
For Truss to get just 7 from Braverman is hopeless.
But Penny has gone backwards which is also very poor.
I think big picture is Rishi has spare votes which he should be able to use to manipulate situation if he wants to.
Penny has two more rounds to go so it'll be interesting to see if she makes it from here. I think probably not.
The Kemi/Penny crossover is absolutely tiny IMO.
But if they want to get rid of Truss, then the obvious route is for TT's MPs to switch to KB.
Doesn't look good for Truss only getting 7 from Braverman.
https://twitter.com/TomTugendhat/status/1549107460752957441?s=20&t=6jPUjDBvhrhB4jcMK00-1w
Is it because she is very right wing? Or is it because she is seen as a fresh new face and a bit of a break from Johnson and this government.
If it's the former then the majority will go to Truss if it's the latter I see Gardenwalker being right, those votes could split including to Mordaunt.
Sunak 130
Mordaunt 97
Truss 74
Badenoch 54
The TT camp want to stop Truss.
It's not ideology that counts, it's whether you will keep your job.
I'm not sure she's out the race yet.
Truss + Badenoch up 16
Mordaunt + Tugendhat down 2
Great result.
Have we seen this before?
The party doesn’t really want anyone, do they?
So, if he tells his voters to vote a particular way, they may well do so than what happened with Braverman's vote.
PS I actually think the value bet now might actually be PM.
Kidding. We need your insight.
Sunak - Frustrating close to the threshold
Mordaunt - Relief that despite relentless attacks she's held firm and Tug's votes en-route
Truss - Just can't get lift-off. Still behind M. Few from Tug to come
Badenoch - Creeping closer to Truss but still too far away. Trap door await
Tugendhat - Remained firm but votes will split Mordaunt & Sunak - Not Just Votes But M&S Votes ....
Surely the right are smart enough to game this before it’s too late 🤭
The right have messed this up with Penny and Rishi in last two.
There's no way Sunak would come last with 95.
If he did that, he eliminates Truss on the spot.
She said that they will vote as a block in the next round. Not that they can be sure of what each other will do!
Interesting to see no white males left.
The requirements are for medical evidence. It is a paper exercise. There is no requirement for friends or family or other evidence that a person uses loos or dresses as a woman. So you are wrong on this.
You are also wrong in stating that I am an extremist because I would ask a person with a male body who is of the male sex to use a loo or changing room which is not a woman's one. Why? Because this is the current law. It is lawful to exclude a transwoman from such places in the grounds of sex under the Equality Act.
The rest of your post is irrelevant. I have never pretended to speak for anyone other than myself nor have I sought to define femininity. But what constitutes the female sex is clear. And the male sex is not - and cannot - turn into the female sex.
As for harm - what harm is caused by asking a TW to use a loo which is unisex rather than a female one? The risks of harm are very much greater for women. 98% of all sexual assaults are carried out by men and such evidence as there is shows that transgender people - TW, even after full transition - have the same offending rates and the same types of offences as men. In short their gender change does not make them less of a risk to women. This does not of course deal with the very much greater risk of men claiming to be women even though they do have any sort of dysphoria.
"I am who I say I am" is the MO of every fraudster who has ever lived, financial or sexual, and it is only the naive or wilfully ignorant who think otherwise.
TW should be allowed to live their lives. But what they cannot be allowed to do is make it difficult or impossible for women to live their lives freely without fear or a lack of dignity. Nor are they entitled to demand that women give up the rights they have.
On that analysis it is Anybody But Rishi.
Are there enough @TSEs to offset the bonkers faction.
Boris Johnson will do almost anything to stop this happening, as his parting contribution. He's very good at vengeance, and keeping and bearing grudges.
The question is, can he engineer Truss's demise by lending votes to Badenoch, and get away with it?
@DPJHodges
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15m
Confirmed. The Tories are now going to either elect their third female leader and Prime Minister or Britain’s first black Prime Minister. Labour, meanwhile, cling desperately to their white men from north London.