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Punters think there will be a Johnson VONC but he’ll win it – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 8,489
edited June 13 in General
imagePunters think there will be a Johnson VONC but he’ll win it – politicalbetting.com

Inevitably the main betting interest at the moment continues to be whether Boris Johnson is going to survive. Currently on Smarkets punters make it an 80% chance that he will face a VONC amongst Tory MPs in 2022.

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 5,877
    Leon said:

    Trooping the Colour is a truly bizarre mix of the Utterly Absurd and Unexpectedly Impressive, with a dash of peculiar melodrama

    British history as dressage

    Who the fuck are the guys banging drums on top of shire horses?? Why??

    And yet, Wow men can bang big drums on top of shire horses. Who knew

    You are so right On the mix Leon. What you are commenting on here, the difference between the pomp and circumstance is exactly what inspired Elgar. He based it on a poem!

    I found this on the web

    “Between 1901 and 1934 Edward Elgar composed five marches and sketched a sixth, the title he took from Act III, Scene 3 of Shakespeare's Othello:

    Farewell the neighing steed and the shrill trump,
    The spirit-stirring drum, th'ear-piercing fife,
    The royal banner, and all quality,
    Pride, pomp, and circumstance of glorious war!

    For the first is set a motto for the whole set of marches, set to a verse from Lord de Tabley's poem "The March of Glory" on assumption the splendid show of military pageantry—"Pomp"—has no connection with the drabness and terror to come —"Circumstance"

    Like a proud music that draws men on to die
    Madly upon the spears in martial ecstasy,
    A measure that sets heaven in all their veins
    And iron in their hands.
    I hear the Nation march
    Beneath her ensign as an eagle's wing;
    O'er shield and sheeted targe
    The banners of my faith most gaily swing;
    Moving to victory with solemn noise,
    With worship and with conquest, and the voice of myriads.

    As a tune, March number one quickly became very popular, on its Proms debut the audience demanded two encores. There was no singing involved at this stage, just pure appreciation of the music Elgar composed.

    Elgar was asked by the King to rework this popular piece into a Coronation Ode, of which the chorus only (and not supplied by Elgar) is now used for Last Night pageantry. It is well known later in life Elgar was uncomfortable with this work morphing into something else, not because of his working class roots or Catholic upbringing during an era it was easier to have influence if you were hindered by neither, Ed was more than capable of looking after himself in that regard, it was more a case of losing control of his artistic soul, seeing his work man handled by those without understanding or good taste.

    But what of appreciation and understanding of an artists work, if it is only the pomp cut from the relating circumstance?

    Elgar in his own words, in a lecture at Birmingham University

    “The commonplace mind can never be anything but commonplace, and no amount of education, no polish of a university, can eradicate the stain from the low type of mind which is the English commonplace,” he declared to a shocked room. “An Englishman will take you into a large room, beautifully proportioned, and will point out to you that it is white – all over white – and somebody will say, ‘What exquisite taste.’ You know in your own mind, in your own soul, that is not taste at all – that it is the want of taste, that it is mere evasion. English music is white, and evades everything.”
  • LeonLeon Posts: 20,922
    Are we expecting a glimpse of Meghan and Harry?
  • FarooqFarooq Posts: 6,969
    First like the Queen
  • LeonLeon Posts: 20,922

    Leon said:

    Trooping the Colour is a truly bizarre mix of the Utterly Absurd and Unexpectedly Impressive, with a dash of peculiar melodrama

    British history as dressage

    Who the fuck are the guys banging drums on top of shire horses?? Why??

    And yet, Wow men can bang big drums on top of shire horses. Who knew

    You are so right On the mix Leon. What you are commenting on here, the difference between the pomp and circumstance is exactly what inspired Elgar. He based it on a poem!

    I found this on the web

    “Between 1901 and 1934 Edward Elgar composed five marches and sketched a sixth, the title he took from Act III, Scene 3 of Shakespeare's Othello:

    Farewell the neighing steed and the shrill trump,
    The spirit-stirring drum, th'ear-piercing fife,
    The royal banner, and all quality,
    Pride, pomp, and circumstance of glorious war!

    For the first is set a motto for the whole set of marches, set to a verse from Lord de Tabley's poem "The March of Glory" on assumption the splendid show of military pageantry—"Pomp"—has no connection with the drabness and terror to come —"Circumstance"

    Like a proud music that draws men on to die
    Madly upon the spears in martial ecstasy,
    A measure that sets heaven in all their veins
    And iron in their hands.
    I hear the Nation march
    Beneath her ensign as an eagle's wing;
    O'er shield and sheeted targe
    The banners of my faith most gaily swing;
    Moving to victory with solemn noise,
    With worship and with conquest, and the voice of myriads.

    As a tune, March number one quickly became very popular, on its Proms debut the audience demanded two encores. There was no singing involved at this stage, just pure appreciation of the music Elgar composed.

    Elgar was asked by the King to rework this popular piece into a Coronation Ode, of which the chorus only (and not supplied by Elgar) is now used for Last Night pageantry. It is well known later in life Elgar was uncomfortable with this work morphing into something else, not because of his working class roots or Catholic upbringing during an era it was easier to have influence if you were hindered by neither, Ed was more than capable of looking after himself in that regard, it was more a case of losing control of his artistic soul, seeing his work man handled by those without understanding or good taste.

    But what of appreciation and understanding of an artists work, if it is only the pomp cut from the relating circumstance?

    Elgar in his own words, in a lecture at Birmingham University

    “The commonplace mind can never be anything but commonplace, and no amount of education, no polish of a university, can eradicate the stain from the low type of mind which is the English commonplace,” he declared to a shocked room. “An Englishman will take you into a large room, beautifully proportioned, and will point out to you that it is white – all over white – and somebody will say, ‘What exquisite taste.’ You know in your own mind, in your own soul, that is not taste at all – that it is the want of taste, that it is mere evasion. English music is white, and evades everything.”
    Bit harsh from Sir Edward

    Also, I wonder what he'd have said in about 1995, after 30 years of the Golden Age of British Pop Music, when we gave the world many of the popular songs they will be singing for the rest of time
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 5,877
    Farooq said:

    First like the Queen

    Third behind MoonRabbit.

    Loser.

    Tri service fly past coming to us out here. I can’t wait! Amazing day.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 20,922
    Look, squirrel

    LITERALLY
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 48,722
    @Sandpit

    Do you mean your computer only has two screens?

    How do you cope?

    Parkinson brought in for Leach as Potts gets another. To quote what they said about another county bowler who took four for not many on debut, 'He must think this international cricket is a very easy game.'
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 2,916
    Leon said:

    Are we expecting a glimpse of Meghan and Harry?

    Not until the wicker man is unveiled
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 101,701
    This Geordie can play cricket.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 101,701
    I’m thinking of doing a piece asking is Boris Johnson the new Edward VIII ?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 38,998
    ydoethur said:

    @Sandpit

    Do you mean your computer only has two screens?

    How do you cope?

    Parkinson brought in for Leach as Potts gets another. To quote what they said about another county bowler who took four for not many on debut, 'He must think this international cricket is a very easy game.'

    This is the office computer. Two screens - and the ipad for PB, of course. Three screens at home though, so I can have PB, Jubilee, cricket and work, all at the same time!
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 17,019
    Was hoping to go to Lords on the final day when tickets are £20. It doesn't look too hopeful atm.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 48,722
    Andy_JS said:

    Was hoping to go to Lords on the final day when tickets are £20. It doesn't look too hopeful atm.

    at this rate New Zealand will have won it by lunchtime tomorrow.
  • StockyStocky Posts: 8,148

    Leon said:

    Are we expecting a glimpse of Meghan and Harry?

    Not until the wicker man is unveiled
    lol

    no ...

    LOL
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 1,488
    We really need some imagination from the band. Flight of the Valkyries?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 38,998
    The Kiwis could still get less than their antipodean neighbours’ famous 60 all out, at Trent Bridge in 2015.

    https://www.news24.com/Sport/Australias-60-all-out-by-the-numbers-20150806
  • LeonLeon Posts: 20,922
    They should refurb Concorde for the fly pasts
  • RobDRobD Posts: 57,312
    Leon said:

    They should refurb Concorde for the fly pasts

    I was thinking that. It would have been an amazing surprise.
  • CorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorseBattery Posts: 19,419
    https://twitter.com/jamesrbuk/status/1532331677929857025

    Interesting signs of the fundamental shallowness of the Johnson government:
    (1) That they’ve now identified this as their key target voter
    (2) That targeting them means knocking off virtually all of the culture war nonsense they’ve majored on for the last 18 months

    They've given up on the Red Wall then and are now targeting the liberal Southern Lib Dem inclined voter. They are in big, big trouble.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 13,821
    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    They should refurb Concorde for the fly pasts

    I was thinking that. It would have been an amazing surprise.
    A Concorde-shaped drone should be within our grasp.
  • FarooqFarooq Posts: 6,969
    edited June 2

    OllyT said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farooq said:

    Republic. Now.

    Obviously. Tomorrow is too late.


    I’m afraid the endearing ineptitude of that makes me more of a monarchist
    Republicans always get their timing, tone and arguments wrong. Always wrong.

    They will try again at the next coronation, and lose then too.

    They will always lose.
    Yep

    The genius of a monarchy is its predictably human unpredictability. So it has inherent drama, like a soap opera, and we are all addicted, even when it takes a dark turn

    So you get periods when it’s awful, ugh, Prince Andrew is a fiddler, yuk, and the Queen is nearly dead, oh no, and then suddenly you get a birth or a birthday or a wedding and then Yay, look, the Mall is lovely in the sun! - it reminds me of having a baby which is exactly like Brexit, no, it’s like bringing up a baby - you have periods when it is all nappies and what the F and then you get the first smile or the first word and happiness is unconfined

    Except for the churlish, joyless republicans, but then I suspect they get a secret surly joy out of being churlish and joyless, so it’s all good

    Yes, they are rude, humourless, joyless, self-obsessed and rather pompous people.

    Nobody can watch Trooping the Colour today and tell us that a republic would better; still less an elected head of state that would command neither the history, prestige or magic of a monarchial family stretching back 1,000 years nor provide its continuity or unity. It wouldn't help in providing a unifying role for the State above the dirty squabbles and pettiness of day to day politics and political behaviour. And nor would it aid Britain in enhancing its profile and admiration around the world.

    Republics are either political and divisive, or entirely forgettable and boring.

    I have no desire to replace something so magical and wonderful that works so well for us to satisfy the neurosis and insecurities of a small minority.
    Blimey, all that rage against people who simply have the temerity to believe our head of state should not be an hereditary position. Hardly a bizarre notion across most of the world.

    You need to reign it in or in a few years you are going to find yourself sat on the Mall in the pouring rain at midnight with your union Jack underpants on your head.
    Just to be clear - and @Farooq tried to make a similar point earlier - I am perfectly calm and thoroughly enjoying today.

    My sentiments on republicans and the arguments they advance for a republic are entirely sincere.

    What irritation I expressed earlier was for the crassness and rudeness of some republicans trying to piss on her day.

    It doesn't mean I share their empty frustration and anger.
    I don't want to play the victim here, because I'm wholly immune to rudeness from you or anyone else on here, but I just said "Republic. Now", and you responded with "Dick". Which, as I say, is fine with me. But I don't think you're quite in the position to talk about other people being rude as you think you are.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 17,019
    Leon said:

    They should refurb Concorde for the fly pasts

    Why not bring it back completely?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 20,922
    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    They should refurb Concorde for the fly pasts

    I was thinking that. It would have been an amazing surprise.
    Because it's a bit boring, what next, the Royal Ryanair Airbus to Gran Canaria?

    Tho the

    OK just saw the REd Arrows. Impressed
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 48,722
    Sandpit said:

    The Kiwis could still get less than their antipodean neighbours’ famous 60 all out, at Trent Bridge in 2015.

    https://www.news24.com/Sport/Australias-60-all-out-by-the-numbers-20150806

    They've already gone past their own nadir though:

    https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/england-tour-of-new-zealand-1954-55-61780/new-zealand-vs-england-2nd-test-62788/full-scorecard
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 6,534
    edited June 2
    Very impressive fly-past over my wife's old place in West London just now, here - looked like about 50 aircraft, and a huge racket.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 57,312
    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    They should refurb Concorde for the fly pasts

    Why not bring it back completely?
    Too inefficient and expensive.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 6,609
    edited June 2
    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    They should refurb Concorde for the fly pasts

    I was thinking that. It would have been an amazing surprise.
    It could have been even more amazing considering the reason they grounded it but I agree.
  • MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 7,216
    Leon said:

    They should refurb Concorde for the fly pasts

    Using whose money?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 20,922
    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 17,893
    Concorde, a symbol of bright futures past.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 38,998
    RobD said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    They should refurb Concorde for the fly pasts

    Why not bring it back completely?
    Too inefficient and expensive.
    That, and the French making damn sure that they were disabled properly after retirement, and would never be allowed to come close to flying again.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 27,302
    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    They should refurb Concorde for the fly pasts

    Why not bring it back completely?
    Insanely expensive and rather dangerous. After the crash they did a re-assessment of the issues - and found it was worse than they thought. Rolls Royce washed their hands of maintaining the engines, for that reason.

    The list of things wrong with the flight that crashed, before it hit that metal strip on the runway is instructive.
  • FarooqFarooq Posts: 6,969
    edited June 2
    kjh said:

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    They should refurb Concorde for the fly pasts

    I was thinking that. It would have been an amazing surprise.
    It could have been even more amazing considering the reason they grounded it but I agree.
    And the designated survivor is...

    Zadok the priest
    And Nathan the prophet
    Anointed Andrew, king

    And all the people
    Rejoiced.

    And all the people (Alleluia)
    Rejoiced.

    God save the King! Long live the King!
    May the King live for ever,
    Amen, Alleluia.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 6,534
    edited June 2
    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then

    I think partly thanks to the Queen herself not being particularly bothered by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - hence Meghan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 20,922
    London looks fucking glorious from an iPad screen in Tbilisi

    The monarchy probably earns its keep simply by making foreign people want to visit London
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 38,998

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    They should refurb Concorde for the fly pasts

    I was thinking that. It would have been an amazing surprise.
    A Concorde-shaped drone should be within our grasp.
    Re-paint this one: https://youtube.com/watch?v=FwY_dPjkz7c

    It’s small and close, but looks a bit like one that’s big and far away.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 20,922

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
  • RobDRobD Posts: 57,312
    Sandpit said:

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    They should refurb Concorde for the fly pasts

    I was thinking that. It would have been an amazing surprise.
    A Concorde-shaped drone should be within our grasp.
    Re-paint this one: https://youtube.com/watch?v=FwY_dPjkz7c

    It’s small and close, but looks a bit like one that’s big and far away.
    Now we just need 1/6th scale red arrow jets.
  • El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 2,922

    Elgar in his own words, in a lecture at Birmingham University

    “The commonplace mind can never be anything but commonplace, and no amount of education, no polish of a university, can eradicate the stain from the low type of mind which is the English commonplace,” he declared to a shocked room. “An Englishman will take you into a large room, beautifully proportioned, and will point out to you that it is white – all over white – and somebody will say, ‘What exquisite taste.’ You know in your own mind, in your own soul, that is not taste at all – that it is the want of taste, that it is mere evasion. English music is white, and evades everything.”

    Plenty of Elgar's own works undoubtedly qualify for that - I'm thinking the Vesper Voluntaries and the Severn Suite, for example.

    And he did set O'Shaughnessy's execrable Ode to music, which is as bad as McGonagall's Tay Bridge Disaster (even if it gave us the phrase "movers and shakers").

    I do love Sospiri though.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 6,609
    Just got all the helicopters overhead. Dog not impressed.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 2,916
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    Working royals plus the Kate and William brood only
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 6,534
    edited June 2
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    It looks that way from the Daily Mail's headline and pictures. Either way, the Queen's clearly happy for her to be involved in the celebrations.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 33,453
    Leon said:

    London looks fucking glorious from an iPad screen in Tbilisi

    The monarchy probably earns its keep simply by making foreign people want to visit London

    Not so good at keeping the dildo whittlers in residence..
  • RobDRobD Posts: 57,312

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    From the Daily Mail's headline and pictures, it looks like that.
    She's not in the main picture of those standing on the balcony. That's a shot from a window during the trooping of the colour.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 98,943
    I think Johnson would win a VONC about 55% to 45% if one is held now amongst MPs.

    However if both Wakefield and Tiverton and Honiton were lost in the by elections then he could be ousted
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 38,998
    RobD said:

    Sandpit said:

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    They should refurb Concorde for the fly pasts

    I was thinking that. It would have been an amazing surprise.
    A Concorde-shaped drone should be within our grasp.
    Re-paint this one: https://youtube.com/watch?v=FwY_dPjkz7c

    It’s small and close, but looks a bit like one that’s big and far away.
    Now we just need 1/6th scale red arrow jets.
    That’s a lot easier to do!
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 98,943
    Leon said:

    London looks fucking glorious from an iPad screen in Tbilisi

    The monarchy probably earns its keep simply by making foreign people want to visit London

    Yes and the Mall packed too with people and union jacks as the royal family came on the balcony, wonderful to see!
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 6,534
    edited June 2
    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    From the Daily Mail's headline and pictures, it looks like that.
    She's not in the main picture of those standing on the balcony. That's a shot from a window during the trooping of the colour.
    Yes, I see that's correct. The essential point still stands, though - the Queen herself is much less bothered by the quarrel than many others, got on well with her from the start, and has been happy enough for her and Harry to be associated with the whole event.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 32,311
    edited June 2
    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    From the Daily Mail's headline and pictures, it looks like that.
    She's not in the main picture of those standing on the balcony. That's a shot from a window during the trooping of the colour.
    She is looking after the young cousins on the non-working Royals balcony it seems. The Royals seem to be able to rub along in away that the Royalists struggle to do so.

    https://twitter.com/Daily_Express/status/1532336247007592449?t=97JQsIOLN01TIpmBh8Ny8Q&s=19




  • RobDRobD Posts: 57,312

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    From the Daily Mail's headline and pictures, it looks like that.
    She's not in the main picture of those standing on the balcony. That's a shot from a window during the trooping of the colour.
    Yes, I see that's correct. The essential point still stands, though - the Queen herself is much less bothered by the quarrel than many others, got on well with her from the start, and has been happy enough for her and Harry to be associated with the whole event.
    Well we don't actually know any of that for sure, do we? It's all speculation.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 6,534
    edited June 2
    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    From the Daily Mail's headline and pictures, it looks like that.
    She's not in the main picture of those standing on the balcony. That's a shot from a window during the trooping of the colour.
    Yes, I see that's correct. The essential point still stands, though - the Queen herself is much less bothered by the quarrel than many others, got on well with her from the start, and has been happy enough for her and Harry to be associated with the whole event.
    Well we don't actually know any of that for sure, do we? It's all speculation.
    Well, the Queen is at the head of the institution, and is by all accounts still compos mentis. Meghan may not have been present on the balcony, but apparently was at the event, so clearly the Queen wanted her to be there. On her relationship with Meghan, from the latter's retelling at least, she always got on better with HMQ than many of the others to begin with.
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 3,897
    Wtf! Just seen the cricket score. Wasn’t expecting that!
  • RobDRobD Posts: 57,312

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    From the Daily Mail's headline and pictures, it looks like that.
    She's not in the main picture of those standing on the balcony. That's a shot from a window during the trooping of the colour.
    Yes, I see that's correct. The essential point still stands, though - the Queen herself is much less bothered by the quarrel than many others, got on well with her from the start, and has been happy enough for her and Harry to be associated with the whole event.
    Well we don't actually know any of that for sure, do we? It's all speculation.
    Well, the Queen is at the head of the institution, and is by all accounts still compos mentis. Meghan may not have been present on the balcony, but apparently was at the event, so clearly the Queen wanted her to be there.
    I think you can only prove that she didn't not want her there. ;)
  • MattWMattW Posts: 13,836

    Wtf! Just seen the cricket score. Wasn’t expecting that!

    NZ about to become a republic...
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 6,534
    edited June 2
    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    From the Daily Mail's headline and pictures, it looks like that.
    She's not in the main picture of those standing on the balcony. That's a shot from a window during the trooping of the colour.
    Yes, I see that's correct. The essential point still stands, though - the Queen herself is much less bothered by the quarrel than many others, got on well with her from the start, and has been happy enough for her and Harry to be associated with the whole event.
    Well we don't actually know any of that for sure, do we? It's all speculation.
    Well, the Queen is at the head of the institution, and is by all accounts still compos mentis. Meghan may not have been present on the balcony, but apparently was at the event, so clearly the Queen wanted her to be there.
    I think you can only prove that she didn't not want her there. ;)
    That depends if we still think the Queen is still making a lot of the key decisions - I think she probably is.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 13,836
    edited June 2
    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    From the Daily Mail's headline and pictures, it looks like that.
    She's not in the main picture of those standing on the balcony. That's a shot from a window during the trooping of the colour.
    Yes, I see that's correct. The essential point still stands, though - the Queen herself is much less bothered by the quarrel than many others, got on well with her from the start, and has been happy enough for her and Harry to be associated with the whole event.
    Well we don't actually know any of that for sure, do we? It's all speculation.
    Well, the Queen is at the head of the institution, and is by all accounts still compos mentis. Meghan may not have been present on the balcony, but apparently was at the event, so clearly the Queen wanted her to be there.
    I think you can only prove that she didn't not want her there. ;)
    That's interesting insight.

    Between us can you tell us about the Putin's motivations, inner thoughts and what will persuade him to withdraw?

    Stuff on the inner mind of Kim Jong Littlun would be great too.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 57,312

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    From the Daily Mail's headline and pictures, it looks like that.
    She's not in the main picture of those standing on the balcony. That's a shot from a window during the trooping of the colour.
    Yes, I see that's correct. The essential point still stands, though - the Queen herself is much less bothered by the quarrel than many others, got on well with her from the start, and has been happy enough for her and Harry to be associated with the whole event.
    Well we don't actually know any of that for sure, do we? It's all speculation.
    Well, the Queen is at the head of the institution, and is by all accounts still compos mentis. Meghan may not have been present on the balcony, but apparently was at the event, so clearly the Queen wanted her to be there.
    I think you can only prove that she didn't not want her there. ;)
    That depends if we still think the Queen is still making a lot of the key decisions - I think she probably is.
    My last comment was a bit facetious, but my point remains. I don't think you can claim that she was "unfussed" and "happy with it all" from the scant evidence provided.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 57,312
    MattW said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    From the Daily Mail's headline and pictures, it looks like that.
    She's not in the main picture of those standing on the balcony. That's a shot from a window during the trooping of the colour.
    Yes, I see that's correct. The essential point still stands, though - the Queen herself is much less bothered by the quarrel than many others, got on well with her from the start, and has been happy enough for her and Harry to be associated with the whole event.
    Well we don't actually know any of that for sure, do we? It's all speculation.
    Well, the Queen is at the head of the institution, and is by all accounts still compos mentis. Meghan may not have been present on the balcony, but apparently was at the event, so clearly the Queen wanted her to be there.
    I think you can only prove that she didn't not want her there. ;)
    That's interesting insight.

    Between us can you tell us about the Putin's motivations, inner thoughts and what will persuade him to withdraw?

    Stuff on the inner mind of Kim Jong Littlun would be great too.
    Well my point was exactly that, that you can't make these sort of insights remotely...
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 6,534
    edited June 2
    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    From the Daily Mail's headline and pictures, it looks like that.
    She's not in the main picture of those standing on the balcony. That's a shot from a window during the trooping of the colour.
    Yes, I see that's correct. The essential point still stands, though - the Queen herself is much less bothered by the quarrel than many others, got on well with her from the start, and has been happy enough for her and Harry to be associated with the whole event.
    Well we don't actually know any of that for sure, do we? It's all speculation.
    Well, the Queen is at the head of the institution, and is by all accounts still compos mentis. Meghan may not have been present on the balcony, but apparently was at the event, so clearly the Queen wanted her to be there.
    I think you can only prove that she didn't not want her there. ;)
    That depends if we still think the Queen is still making a lot of the key decisions - I think she probably is.
    My last comment was a bit facetious, but my point remains. I don't think you can claim that she was "unfussed" and "happy with it all" from the scant evidence provided.
    This could become a bit circular, but I think the main evidence is that she is still at the top of the institution, has the final say, and is compos mentis ; hence if Meghan is there it must be a positive decision, unless her leadership position is significantly weakened, which I don't think.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 14,139

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    From the Daily Mail's headline and pictures, it looks like that.
    She's not in the main picture of those standing on the balcony. That's a shot from a window during the trooping of the colour.
    Yes, I see that's correct. The essential point still stands, though - the Queen herself is much less bothered by the quarrel than many others, got on well with her from the start, and has been happy enough for her and Harry to be associated with the whole event.
    And that is a big part of what makes her more popular than the institution itself. An inclusive, tolerant approach to divisions rather than seeking to take sides and win. Our politicians should take note.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 32,311
    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    From the Daily Mail's headline and pictures, it looks like that.
    She's not in the main picture of those standing on the balcony. That's a shot from a window during the trooping of the colour.
    Yes, I see that's correct. The essential point still stands, though - the Queen herself is much less bothered by the quarrel than many others, got on well with her from the start, and has been happy enough for her and Harry to be associated with the whole event.
    Well we don't actually know any of that for sure, do we? It's all speculation.
    Well, the Queen is at the head of the institution, and is by all accounts still compos mentis. Meghan may not have been present on the balcony, but apparently was at the event, so clearly the Queen wanted her to be there.
    I think you can only prove that she didn't not want her there. ;)
    That depends if we still think the Queen is still making a lot of the key decisions - I think she probably is.
    My last comment was a bit facetious, but my point remains. I don't think you can claim that she was "unfussed" and "happy with it all" from the scant evidence provided.
    The Kremlinology of Court politics is quite something, but the Queen did send a car and security detail to take them from airport to Frogmore Cottage.

    https://metro.co.uk/2022/06/02/queen-sends-car-and-security-to-pick-up-harry-and-meghan-after-they-land-in-uk-16754036/

    If she really prefers Lilibet's first birthday party to a day at the races, that will be an interesting choice. I suspect both can be done.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 13,836
    RobD said:

    MattW said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    From the Daily Mail's headline and pictures, it looks like that.
    She's not in the main picture of those standing on the balcony. That's a shot from a window during the trooping of the colour.
    Yes, I see that's correct. The essential point still stands, though - the Queen herself is much less bothered by the quarrel than many others, got on well with her from the start, and has been happy enough for her and Harry to be associated with the whole event.
    Well we don't actually know any of that for sure, do we? It's all speculation.
    Well, the Queen is at the head of the institution, and is by all accounts still compos mentis. Meghan may not have been present on the balcony, but apparently was at the event, so clearly the Queen wanted her to be there.
    I think you can only prove that she didn't not want her there. ;)
    That's interesting insight.

    Between us can you tell us about the Putin's motivations, inner thoughts and what will persuade him to withdraw?

    Stuff on the inner mind of Kim Jong Littlun would be great too.
    Well my point was exactly that, that you can't make these sort of insights remotely...
    TBF I was paging the Oracle, rather than yourself.
  • FarooqFarooq Posts: 6,969
    Leon said:

    The most moving point of the entire day was when the Spitfires flew over Buck House, and the Queen pointed up at them, and clearly said to Prince Charles - “that sound!”

    Her Maj can remember the Blitz, and the Battle of Britain, and the sound of Spitfires defending our island

    That’s quite something. Republicanism, pfff

    The Queen has ears and is old 🤷
  • RobDRobD Posts: 57,312

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    From the Daily Mail's headline and pictures, it looks like that.
    She's not in the main picture of those standing on the balcony. That's a shot from a window during the trooping of the colour.
    Yes, I see that's correct. The essential point still stands, though - the Queen herself is much less bothered by the quarrel than many others, got on well with her from the start, and has been happy enough for her and Harry to be associated with the whole event.
    Well we don't actually know any of that for sure, do we? It's all speculation.
    Well, the Queen is at the head of the institution, and is by all accounts still compos mentis. Meghan may not have been present on the balcony, but apparently was at the event, so clearly the Queen wanted her to be there.
    I think you can only prove that she didn't not want her there. ;)
    That depends if we still think the Queen is still making a lot of the key decisions - I think she probably is.
    My last comment was a bit facetious, but my point remains. I don't think you can claim that she was "unfussed" and "happy with it all" from the scant evidence provided.
    This could become a bit circular, but I think the main evidence is that she is still at the top of the institution, has the final say, and is compos mentis ; hence if she is there it would be a positive decision unless her leadership position is sigiificantly weakened, about which I don't think so.
    At 'best' a positive decision, at 'worst' a neutral one. But I don't think the evidence is there to support your original claim.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 98,943
    MattW said:

    Wtf! Just seen the cricket score. Wasn’t expecting that!

    NZ about to become a republic...
    https://www.1news.co.nz/2021/11/20/third-of-kiwis-want-nz-republic-47-favour-keeping-monarchy/
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 2,916
    Leon said:

    The most moving point of the entire day was when the Spitfires flew over Buck House, and the Queen pointed up at them, and clearly said to Prince Charles - “that sound!”

    Her Maj can remember the Blitz, and the Battle of Britain, and the sound of Spitfires defending our island

    That’s quite something. Republicanism, pfff

    I honestly don't think a large part of the country is prepared for the upheaval of the bridge falling. I think it will be an unexpectedly profound period for many.
    Not everyone of course.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 6,534
    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    From the Daily Mail's headline and pictures, it looks like that.
    She's not in the main picture of those standing on the balcony. That's a shot from a window during the trooping of the colour.
    Yes, I see that's correct. The essential point still stands, though - the Queen herself is much less bothered by the quarrel than many others, got on well with her from the start, and has been happy enough for her and Harry to be associated with the whole event.
    Well we don't actually know any of that for sure, do we? It's all speculation.
    Well, the Queen is at the head of the institution, and is by all accounts still compos mentis. Meghan may not have been present on the balcony, but apparently was at the event, so clearly the Queen wanted her to be there.
    I think you can only prove that she didn't not want her there. ;)
    That depends if we still think the Queen is still making a lot of the key decisions - I think she probably is.
    My last comment was a bit facetious, but my point remains. I don't think you can claim that she was "unfussed" and "happy with it all" from the scant evidence provided.
    This could become a bit circular, but I think the main evidence is that she is still at the top of the institution, has the final say, and is compos mentis ; hence if she is there it would be a positive decision unless her leadership position is sigiificantly weakened, about which I don't think so.
    At 'best' a positive decision, at 'worst' a neutral one. But I don't think the evidence is there to support your original claim.
    The only evidence required is a functioning Queen ;.)
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 6,534
    edited June 2

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    From the Daily Mail's headline and pictures, it looks like that.
    She's not in the main picture of those standing on the balcony. That's a shot from a window during the trooping of the colour.
    Yes, I see that's correct. The essential point still stands, though - the Queen herself is much less bothered by the quarrel than many others, got on well with her from the start, and has been happy enough for her and Harry to be associated with the whole event.
    And that is a big part of what makes her more popular than the institution itself. An inclusive, tolerant approach to divisions rather than seeking to take sides and win. Our politicians should take note.
    Agreed, although if Charles is wise he may be able to transfer that appeal and approach to the next generation, contrasting it with our polarised times again.

    There's a couple of promising signs there - an interesting mix of fascination for global religions, a certain cultural open-mindedness, and a slightly more traditional, tweedy ruralism, which taken altogther defies too easy a categorisation.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 2,916
    edited June 2
    7 down and Jimmy on fire
  • RobDRobD Posts: 57,312

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Looks like the monarchy has survived "Meghan's Racist Bombshell", then


    I think partly thanks to the Queen being unfussed by all the quarrels, weaponised on social media for various culture war quarrels on both sides - there's Megan back on the balcony, and Liz happy with it all.
    Was she on the balcony? I couldn't see her or Harry
    From the Daily Mail's headline and pictures, it looks like that.
    She's not in the main picture of those standing on the balcony. That's a shot from a window during the trooping of the colour.
    Yes, I see that's correct. The essential point still stands, though - the Queen herself is much less bothered by the quarrel than many others, got on well with her from the start, and has been happy enough for her and Harry to be associated with the whole event.
    Well we don't actually know any of that for sure, do we? It's all speculation.
    Well, the Queen is at the head of the institution, and is by all accounts still compos mentis. Meghan may not have been present on the balcony, but apparently was at the event, so clearly the Queen wanted her to be there.
    I think you can only prove that she didn't not want her there. ;)
    That depends if we still think the Queen is still making a lot of the key decisions - I think she probably is.
    My last comment was a bit facetious, but my point remains. I don't think you can claim that she was "unfussed" and "happy with it all" from the scant evidence provided.
    This could become a bit circular, but I think the main evidence is that she is still at the top of the institution, has the final say, and is compos mentis ; hence if she is there it would be a positive decision unless her leadership position is sigiificantly weakened, about which I don't think so.
    At 'best' a positive decision, at 'worst' a neutral one. But I don't think the evidence is there to support your original claim.
    The only evidence required is a functioning Queen ;.)
    She could have said "F it, let them come.. I don't care" for all we know!
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 32,311
    HYUFD said:

    MattW said:

    Wtf! Just seen the cricket score. Wasn’t expecting that!

    NZ about to become a republic...
    https://www.1news.co.nz/2021/11/20/third-of-kiwis-want-nz-republic-47-favour-keeping-monarchy/
    The real test will be after London Bridge is done and dusted. A new page will then turn.

    Of course there are a large number of republics in the Commonwealth, so no big deal really.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 44,307
    Leon said:

    They should refurb Concorde for the fly pasts

    1950's technology. Only kept flying by a massive army of weekend engineers, fabricating unavailable bits of kit in their garden sheds at the weekend.

    Literally.

    I knew somebody who had to prepare a report on its future viability. Easy. It had none, even back in the late 80's.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 13,836
    Quite enjoying the research being puffed that people who grew up in places like Milton Keynes or New York are bad at navigation, and get lost a lot.

    https://www.discovermagazine.com/mind/your-navigation-skills-depend-on-where-you-grew-up
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 22,070
    Leon said:

    The most moving point of the entire day was when the Spitfires flew over Buck House, and the Queen pointed up at them, and clearly said to Prince Charles - “that sound!”

    Her Maj can remember the Blitz, and the Battle of Britain, and the sound of Spitfires defending our island

    That’s quite something. Republicanism, pfff

    I am not old enough to remember the Blitz, but the sound of Merlin engines at full chat is stirring for anyone
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 48,722

    7 down and Jimmy on fire

    Do we get a substitute for that?
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 4,487
    Looks like England have got themselves in a strong position to avoid having to follow-on after their first innings.
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 3,897

    7 down and Jimmy on fire

    ‘Potts pans NZ’ is one of Gary Lineker’s better tweets.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 32,311
    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    The most moving point of the entire day was when the Spitfires flew over Buck House, and the Queen pointed up at them, and clearly said to Prince Charles - “that sound!”

    Her Maj can remember the Blitz, and the Battle of Britain, and the sound of Spitfires defending our island

    That’s quite something. Republicanism, pfff

    The Queen has ears and is old 🤷
    It's a bit more than that. She was in London for the Blitz and the Battle of Britain

    She was on that same Buck Palace balcony with her mum, dad, sister and Winston Churchill when we officially defeated the Nazis on VE Day

    The genius of monarchy is that it links a nation to its own past, with a chain of real humanity. No presidency can ever do this, tho some - like the French presidency - aspire to be monarchies. Which shows that constitutional monarchy - if you can manage it, and you don't get too many wrong uns - is a desirable thing
    Nothing says forward looking country like a nostalgic Royalist in his cups.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 2,916
    ydoethur said:

    7 down and Jimmy on fire

    Do we get a substitute for that?
    Nah, a charred Jimmy will still blow these kiwi colonials away
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 5,877

    Farooq said:

    First like the Queen

    Third behind MoonRabbit.

    Loser.

    Tri service fly past coming to us out here. I can’t wait! Amazing day.
    It was AMAZING. First it looked like apocalypse now right over our heads, and then the Battle of Britain and everyone was roaring and cheering, and then the 70. I got great pictures of the 70!

    Going to get food and drink now. 🙋‍♀️
  • LeonLeon Posts: 20,922
    Scott_xP said:

    Leon said:

    The most moving point of the entire day was when the Spitfires flew over Buck House, and the Queen pointed up at them, and clearly said to Prince Charles - “that sound!”

    Her Maj can remember the Blitz, and the Battle of Britain, and the sound of Spitfires defending our island

    That’s quite something. Republicanism, pfff

    I am not old enough to remember the Blitz, but the sound of Merlin engines at full chat is stirring for anyone
    I've heard Spitfires, a couple of times. IIRC one was the last big jubilee

    I didn't understand what people meant by their amazing sound - until I heard it for myself. There must be some acoustic reason why it is so distinct and even emotive

    So yes I get the idea. And I can only imagine what sensations these engines must stir if they personally evoke the Blitz and the Battle of Britain, because you actually heard them then
  • MattWMattW Posts: 13,836
    edited June 2
    HYUFD said:

    MattW said:

    Wtf! Just seen the cricket score. Wasn’t expecting that!

    NZ about to become a republic...
    https://www.1news.co.nz/2021/11/20/third-of-kiwis-want-nz-republic-47-favour-keeping-monarchy/
    This morning's 6 for 36 to 47 for 7 at the hands of the English is after that poll.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/live/cricket/58516467
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 3,897
    On topic, I don’t really understand how Johnson wins a VONC. Mogg and Nadine apart, he has no real supporters.
  • CorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorseBattery Posts: 19,419
    If Theresa May couldn’t lose a VONC there’s no way Johnson will
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 14,139
    MattW said:

    Quite enjoying the research being puffed that people who grew up in places like Milton Keynes or New York are bad at navigation, and get lost a lot.

    https://www.discovermagazine.com/mind/your-navigation-skills-depend-on-where-you-grew-up

    Hardly surprising but non locals get lost in Milton Keynes "because all the roads look the same and the road names sound the same" whereas locals understand it is simply a grid. All moot with sat navs anyway.
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 3,897
    edited June 2

    If Theresa May couldn’t lose a VONC there’s no way Johnson will

    A significant number of her MPs were genuinely attached to her.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 14,139

    On topic, I don’t really understand how Johnson wins a VONC. Mogg and Nadine apart, he has no real supporters.

    If he loses are you ready for PM Nadine?
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 2,916

    If Theresa May couldn’t lose a VONC there’s no way Johnson will

    I can see dozens promising support and saying fuck him when the vote comes
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 38,998
    edited June 2

    On topic, I don’t really understand how Johnson wins a VONC. Mogg and Nadine apart, he has no real supporters.

    180 MPs have to vote him out. Right now, it looks like the rebels don’t even have the 54 required to call that vote in the first place.

    Mrs May won her confidence vote, even though she couldn’t get her flagship policy through Parliament.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 23,034
    Chuffed to have noticed this whilst everyone else was looking at DRS:


  • kjhkjh Posts: 6,609
    What is wrong with people?

    We have a small group Brexiteers who moan on and on about Brexit far more than any Remainers do and now we have a small group on Monarchists moaning on and on about Republicans far more than any Republican does and today of all days.

    Why don't you just enjoy it. I know I am.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 13,836
    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    The most moving point of the entire day was when the Spitfires flew over Buck House, and the Queen pointed up at them, and clearly said to Prince Charles - “that sound!”

    Her Maj can remember the Blitz, and the Battle of Britain, and the sound of Spitfires defending our island

    That’s quite something. Republicanism, pfff

    The Queen has ears and is old 🤷
    It's a bit more than that. She was in London for the Blitz and the Battle of Britain

    She was on that same Buck Palace balcony with her mum, dad, sister and Winston Churchill when we officially defeated the Nazis on VE Day

    The genius of monarchy is that it links a nation to its own past, with a chain of real humanity. No presidency can ever do this, tho some - like the French presidency - aspire to be monarchies. Which shows that constitutional monarchy - if you can manage it, and you don't get too many wrong uns - is a desirable thing
    Nothing says forward looking country like a nostalgic Royalist in his cups.
    I'd argue that it reduces the likelihood of history repeating itself.
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 3,897
    Sandpit said:

    On topic, I don’t really understand how Johnson wins a VONC. Mogg and Nadine apart, he has no real supporters.

    180 MPs have to vote him out. Right now, it looks like the rebels don’t even have the 54 required to call that vote in the first place.
    Yes, but all the calculations change once the VONC is called. Plenty of MPs don’t think it’s the right time for one, but if it happens, that doesn’t mean they’ll support Johnson.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 20,922
    kjh said:

    What is wrong with people?

    We have a small group Brexiteers who moan on and on about Brexit far more than any Remainers do and now we have a small group on Monarchists moaning on and on about Republicans far more than any Republican does and today of all days.

    Why don't you just enjoy it. I know I am.

    lol. This is PB. Are you new here?
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 3,897

    On topic, I don’t really understand how Johnson wins a VONC. Mogg and Nadine apart, he has no real supporters.

    If he loses are you ready for PM Nadine?
    Tbf, her being in the Cabinet has been mind-boggling enough.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 6,609

    On topic, I don’t really understand how Johnson wins a VONC. Mogg and Nadine apart, he has no real supporters.

    If he loses are you ready for PM Nadine?
    It would be a hoot.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 20,922
    tlg86 said:

    Chuffed to have noticed this whilst everyone else was looking at DRS:


    STOP. You're making me REALLY homesick

    Lords is about 1 mile from my flat.

    *existential yearning*
This discussion has been closed.