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Reassuring CON voters 3 days before the Bexley by-election – politicalbetting.com

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  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,115
    Leon said:

    See also that item on tomorrow's Telegraph front page

    "Help! How to cure HOGO: the Hassle Of Going Out"

    We've all got used to Staying In. Cooking our own food (miso soup!). Seeing the odd friend. Doing nothing much. The plague has made us antisocial. It is not good

    I'm not sure I'm more antisocial, as such, but a lot of what I do is done habitually, and I'm out of the habit of going out.

    I've always thought of myself as being very introverted, but I've really missed being around other people. And yet, despite knowing I've missed other people I've had to make quite an effort to coax myself back out.
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,073
    edited November 2021

    I see that leftwingers keep bringing up Peppa Pig in mockery (and no I've not seen the clip or the news or the video speech, I've been busy).

    Peppa Pig isn't "just" a children's cartoon its an iconic cultural export well known in millions of households not just in the UK but around the globe.

    Watch the speech for yourself before beating up on "leftwingers". It was astonishing. I doubt you could spin it out.

    That said will it impact on him? Maybe not. Supporters will claim it humanises him. Detractors will find it confirms what we already knew
  • Options
    FairlieredFairliered Posts: 3,966

    Leon said:

    tlg86 said:

    Just back from my second post-pandemic knit night at the pub.

    I know it's a Monday, and it's just one observation, but it was eerily quiet. There were four of us knitting and no more than two or three others. They always had a decent crowd in even on Mondays before the pandemic, and there were twice as many people a fortnight ago.

    Wondering how tough it will be for many businesses if people are choosing to stay at home without being told to do so.

    I tend to find the pub I go to gets progressively quieter as the month goes on before a bumper crowd on and around pay day.
    Hmm. I was in Hereford, my old hometown, last week, and it was eerily quiet. I haven't been there in 30 years so quite possibly my anecdote is entirely worthless, as its context is so dated

    But it wasn't for a lack of open pubs. They were all open. On a Friday evening. A mild and clear evening, at that. The ideal night for a get together. Yet the boozers were 30% full at best and the restaurants no better
    It's impossible to get a table reservation on Friday/Saturday without a weeks notice at anywhere decent in Newcastle at the moment. Unheard of until recently.
    The cities are booming and the towns are not?
    We were in Inveraray at the weekend. The hotel where we were staying had to put a sign outside on Saturday night to tell people the restaurant and bars were all full and they couldn’t let anyone else in. The place was rammed.
    If it was the George I think it’d be rammed after the third month of a nuclear winter.
    It was the George.
    BTW, Alba until the SNP become a democratic party again.
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,129

    Scott_xP said:

    Boris Johnson gave a speech in the North East today and - well. It didn't go down brilliantly with local leaders. @Graemewhitfield, @sophie_brownson and @danhollandnews report for @ChronicleLive and @TheJournalNews #TomorrowsPapersToday https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/fury-boris-johnsons-embarrassing-defence-22241786 https://twitter.com/helendalby/status/1462900537091842049/photo/1

    And despite all this he leads Starmer as best PM in tonight's RedfieldWilton poll and conservatives drew level with Labour

    I have yet to be convinced all this is cutting through though Paterson did and as long as he is not behind in the polls, your 24/7 negative Boris posts will I expect continue and you will have many more months to work on your output, and even then he may win in GE24 for another 5 years of pain for you

    And the main site is not working
    There is a much broader issue - embarrassment. As in national.

    Frankly I don't care that much about lagging index polls somehow saying all this is alright. That the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom going to the UN General Assembly, throwing a speech together on the train up there and talking about Kermit the Frog's mistreatment of Miss Piggy is alright. That the same Prime Minister going to the CBI to make vroom vroom noises and hands up who's been to Peppa Pig World.

    Whether it cuts through or not isn't front of mind. Its appalling. Embarrassing. Wrong. Those of us who are paying attention and care about politics - increasingly of all parties - know how profoundly damaging He is.

    So frankly I don't care for the argument that "you're all biased against him" and "the polls still give him a narrow lead". There can be no defence. No justification. No succour. For Kermit the Frog at the UN and vroom vroom Peppa Pig World at the CBI. For all our sakes it has to stop.
    Yep. He's taking the piss. If you can't see that you're either thick or not paying attention. And if you can but don't care you're a knob. These are the only 3 possible categories for those who still like and rate this guy. Thick. Asleep. Knob.
  • Options
    Leon said:

    Jonathan said:

    Notable about the "hands up if you've been to Peppa Pig World" segment of the PM's speech to the CBI (fuxsake...). He was lost again. Pages being sifted through. Winging it. Again.

    This isn't Labour vs Tory. This is what image you are supposed to have as Prime Minister.

    Disraeli
    Gladstone
    Lloyd George
    Churchill
    Macmillan
    Wilson
    Thatcher
    Blair

    Now some bumbling fool blathering on about Peppa Pig.

    We used to matter as a country. It used to matter who was PM, what they did and how they did it.
    Forget the greats. Let's consider the disappointments we have recently had as PM.

    May. She couldn't take her party with her, but she was prepared to stand there and take the abuse to try to promote her vision of the future. And if we're honest, her vision was more coherent and better than that of the incumbent.

    Cameron. Made one epoch-defining mistake, but open to working with others, able to speak without notes, willing to work through the essay crisis.

    Brown. At some level mad, and deliberately chose to ignore some red flashing elephants in the room. But clearly clever and on top of stuff.

    Major. Had the misfortune to hold the exploding parcel when the music stopped. But got more done than you might think, and the epitome of decently keeping buggering on.

    None of them great PMs. But I'd have any of them back in a heartbeat, because the incumbent is just painful to watch.
    Boris is better than all of those. He wins. He would never make such a major fuck up as:

    1. May. Social care, nearly losing to Corbyn, NI backstop, eating chips
    Nearly losing? She ended up with 55 seats MORE than Corbyn.
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,251
    edited November 2021

    Scott_xP said:

    Boris Johnson gave a speech in the North East today and - well. It didn't go down brilliantly with local leaders. @Graemewhitfield, @sophie_brownson and @danhollandnews report for @ChronicleLive and @TheJournalNews #TomorrowsPapersToday https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/fury-boris-johnsons-embarrassing-defence-22241786 https://twitter.com/helendalby/status/1462900537091842049/photo/1

    And despite all this he leads Starmer as best PM in tonight's RedfieldWilton poll and conservatives drew level with Labour

    I have yet to be convinced all this is cutting through though Paterson did and as long as he is not behind in the polls, your 24/7 negative Boris posts will I expect continue and you will have many more months to work on your output, and even then he may win in GE24 for another 5 years of pain for you

    And the main site is not working
    There is a much broader issue - embarrassment. As in national.

    Frankly I don't care that much about lagging index polls somehow saying all this is alright. That the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom going to the UN General Assembly, throwing a speech together on the train up there and talking about Kermit the Frog's mistreatment of Miss Piggy is alright. That the same Prime Minister going to the CBI to make vroom vroom noises and hands up who's been to Peppa Pig World.

    Whether it cuts through or not isn't front of mind. Its appalling. Embarrassing. Wrong. Those of us who are paying attention and care about politics - increasingly of all parties - know how profoundly damaging He is.

    So frankly I don't care for the argument that "you're all biased against him" and "the polls still give him a narrow lead". There can be no defence. No justification. No succour. For Kermit the Frog at the UN and vroom vroom Peppa Pig World at the CBI. For all our sakes it has to stop.
    Then you need to win the argument
    You don't need to "win" any argument to hold an opinion Big G.
    When increasing numbers of Tory grandees and Red Wall Tories are gobbing off in horror I rather think that we are winning the argument!

    As I said earlier Big_G and others seem to willing to defend pretty much anything (despite claiming they want him gone). Imagine had PM Milliband done it...
    I want Boris replaced but remember he will not always be there and right now neither labour of the lib dems are in a better place

    Labour provide a Tony Blair style platform then who knows, I voted for him twice
  • Options
    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 19,911
    We have truly entered the twilight zone with Bozza now. Just a bizarre episode, he presents as decidedly unwell.
  • Options
    RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 27,182
    edited November 2021

    Scott_xP said:

    Boris Johnson gave a speech in the North East today and - well. It didn't go down brilliantly with local leaders. @Graemewhitfield, @sophie_brownson and @danhollandnews report for @ChronicleLive and @TheJournalNews #TomorrowsPapersToday https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/fury-boris-johnsons-embarrassing-defence-22241786 https://twitter.com/helendalby/status/1462900537091842049/photo/1

    And despite all this he leads Starmer as best PM in tonight's RedfieldWilton poll and conservatives drew level with Labour

    I have yet to be convinced all this is cutting through though Paterson did and as long as he is not behind in the polls, your 24/7 negative Boris posts will I expect continue and you will have many more months to work on your output, and even then he may win in GE24 for another 5 years of pain for you

    And the main site is not working
    There is a much broader issue - embarrassment. As in national.

    Frankly I don't care that much about lagging index polls somehow saying all this is alright. That the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom going to the UN General Assembly, throwing a speech together on the train up there and talking about Kermit the Frog's mistreatment of Miss Piggy is alright. That the same Prime Minister going to the CBI to make vroom vroom noises and hands up who's been to Peppa Pig World.

    Whether it cuts through or not isn't front of mind. Its appalling. Embarrassing. Wrong. Those of us who are paying attention and care about politics - increasingly of all parties - know how profoundly damaging He is.

    So frankly I don't care for the argument that "you're all biased against him" and "the polls still give him a narrow lead". There can be no defence. No justification. No succour. For Kermit the Frog at the UN and vroom vroom Peppa Pig World at the CBI. For all our sakes it has to stop.
    Then you need to win the argument
    You don't need to "win" any argument to hold an opinion Big G.
    When increasing numbers of Tory grandees and Red Wall Tories are gobbing off in horror I rather think that we are winning the argument!

    As I said earlier Big_G and others seem to willing to defend pretty much anything (despite claiming they want him gone). Imagine had PM Milliband done it...
    I want Boris replaced but remember he will not always be there and right now neither labour of the lib dems are in a better place

    Labour provide a Tony Blair style platform then who knows, I voted for him twice
    I agree with you there - and do I have to restate that I expect the Tories to replace Peppa and then win the next election? I am not ramping for Labour nor do I expect them to win.

    But there are standards. When bad happens call it out. This. Is. Bad. Saying so - and that we have to have better - is not saying vote Labour. The Tories should be better than this. They used to be. They could be again.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,943
    edited November 2021

    More good news for the government - its motion to have poor northerners sell their homes to pay for the care of rich southerners has gone through.

    Genuinely poor people don't own a property at all, they live in social housing or rent via housing benefit. They will still get all their care costs covered by the local authority.

    Those with assets under £100,000 will also get assistance with care costs on a means tested basis, now only those with assets under £23,250 do.

    Those with assets over £100,000 will no longer have to pay more than £86,000 for care costs, now they can lose all their assets down to their last £23,250 if they need residential care.

    So good news the new social care bill has gone through the Commons, despite even most SNP MPs voting with Labour and opposition parties even though the social care bill will only affect England
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,827

    Leon said:

    Jonathan said:

    Notable about the "hands up if you've been to Peppa Pig World" segment of the PM's speech to the CBI (fuxsake...). He was lost again. Pages being sifted through. Winging it. Again.

    This isn't Labour vs Tory. This is what image you are supposed to have as Prime Minister.

    Disraeli
    Gladstone
    Lloyd George
    Churchill
    Macmillan
    Wilson
    Thatcher
    Blair

    Now some bumbling fool blathering on about Peppa Pig.

    We used to matter as a country. It used to matter who was PM, what they did and how they did it.
    Forget the greats. Let's consider the disappointments we have recently had as PM.

    May. She couldn't take her party with her, but she was prepared to stand there and take the abuse to try to promote her vision of the future. And if we're honest, her vision was more coherent and better than that of the incumbent.

    Cameron. Made one epoch-defining mistake, but open to working with others, able to speak without notes, willing to work through the essay crisis.

    Brown. At some level mad, and deliberately chose to ignore some red flashing elephants in the room. But clearly clever and on top of stuff.

    Major. Had the misfortune to hold the exploding parcel when the music stopped. But got more done than you might think, and the epitome of decently keeping buggering on.

    None of them great PMs. But I'd have any of them back in a heartbeat, because the incumbent is just painful to watch.
    Boris is better than all of those. He wins. He would never make such a major fuck up as:

    1. May. Social care, nearly losing to Corbyn, NI backstop, eating chips
    Nearly losing? She ended up with 55 seats MORE than Corbyn.
    She lost her outright Majority to him despite you voting for her
  • Options

    Scott_xP said:

    Boris Johnson gave a speech in the North East today and - well. It didn't go down brilliantly with local leaders. @Graemewhitfield, @sophie_brownson and @danhollandnews report for @ChronicleLive and @TheJournalNews #TomorrowsPapersToday https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/fury-boris-johnsons-embarrassing-defence-22241786 https://twitter.com/helendalby/status/1462900537091842049/photo/1

    And despite all this he leads Starmer as best PM in tonight's RedfieldWilton poll and conservatives drew level with Labour

    I have yet to be convinced all this is cutting through though Paterson did and as long as he is not behind in the polls, your 24/7 negative Boris posts will I expect continue and you will have many more months to work on your output, and even then he may win in GE24 for another 5 years of pain for you

    And the main site is not working
    There is a much broader issue - embarrassment. As in national.

    Frankly I don't care that much about lagging index polls somehow saying all this is alright. That the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom going to the UN General Assembly, throwing a speech together on the train up there and talking about Kermit the Frog's mistreatment of Miss Piggy is alright. That the same Prime Minister going to the CBI to make vroom vroom noises and hands up who's been to Peppa Pig World.

    Whether it cuts through or not isn't front of mind. Its appalling. Embarrassing. Wrong. Those of us who are paying attention and care about politics - increasingly of all parties - know how profoundly damaging He is.

    So frankly I don't care for the argument that "you're all biased against him" and "the polls still give him a narrow lead". There can be no defence. No justification. No succour. For Kermit the Frog at the UN and vroom vroom Peppa Pig World at the CBI. For all our sakes it has to stop.
    Then you need to win the argument
    You don't need to "win" any argument to hold an opinion Big G.
    When increasing numbers of Tory grandees and Red Wall Tories are gobbing off in horror I rather think that we are winning the argument!

    As I said earlier Big_G and others seem to willing to defend pretty much anything (despite claiming they want him gone). Imagine had PM Milliband done it...
    I want Boris replaced but remember he will not always be there and right now neither labour of the lib dems are in a better place

    Labour provide a Tony Blair style platform then who knows, I voted for him twice
    I agree with you there - and do I have to restate that I expect the Tories to replace Peppa and then win the next election? I am not ramping for Labour nor do I expect them to win.

    But there are standards. When bad happens call it out. This. Is. Bad. Saying so - and that we have to have better - is not saying vote Labour. The Tories should be better than this. They used to be. They could be again.
    We are much on the same page and to be honest, I do not think Boris is well

    He may still be suffering long covid, he certainly had a heavy cold last week, and he has looked exhausted for a while

    I did say at the time of his speech it was cringeworthy and I expect he is coming under increasing pressure to get his act together or else !!!!
  • Options
    HYUFD said:

    More good news for the government - its motion to have poor northerners sell their homes to pay for the care of rich southerners has gone through.

    Genuinely poor people don't own any property at all, they live in social housing or rent via housing benefit. They will still get all their care costs covered by the local authority.

    Those with assets under £100,000 will also get assistance with care costs on a means tested basis, now only those with assets under £23,250 do.

    Those with assets over £100,000 will no longer have to pay more than £86,000 for care costs, now they can lose all their assets down to their last £23,250 if they need residential care.

    So good news the new social care bill has gone through, despite even most SNP MPs voting with Labour and opposition parties even though the social care bill will only affect England
    As I said. Make the North pay for the south. Bye Bye red wall, bye bye Tory government.
  • Options
    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,077

    HYUFD said:

    More good news for the government - its motion to have poor northerners sell their homes to pay for the care of rich southerners has gone through.

    Genuinely poor people don't own any property at all, they live in social housing or rent via housing benefit. They will still get all their care costs covered by the local authority.

    Those with assets under £100,000 will also get assistance with care costs on a means tested basis, now only those with assets under £23,250 do.

    Those with assets over £100,000 will no longer have to pay more than £86,000 for care costs, now they can lose all their assets down to their last £23,250 if they need residential care.

    So good news the new social care bill has gone through, despite even most SNP MPs voting with Labour and opposition parties even though the social care bill will only affect England
    As I said. Make the North pay for the south. Bye Bye red wall, bye bye Tory government.
    Nah. Remember the North only voted Tory to get Brexit done. They're not arsed about things like levelling up.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,115

    We have truly entered the twilight zone with Bozza now. Just a bizarre episode, he presents as decidedly unwell.

    The Long Twilight Of The Johnson?
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,943
    edited November 2021

    HYUFD said:

    More good news for the government - its motion to have poor northerners sell their homes to pay for the care of rich southerners has gone through.

    Genuinely poor people don't own any property at all, they live in social housing or rent via housing benefit. They will still get all their care costs covered by the local authority.

    Those with assets under £100,000 will also get assistance with care costs on a means tested basis, now only those with assets under £23,250 do.

    Those with assets over £100,000 will no longer have to pay more than £86,000 for care costs, now they can lose all their assets down to their last £23,250 if they need residential care.

    So good news the new social care bill has gone through, despite even most SNP MPs voting with Labour and opposition parties even though the social care bill will only affect England
    As I said. Make the North pay for the south. Bye Bye red wall, bye bye Tory government.
    The North voted mostly for Labour MPs even in 2019, it was the Midlands and South which had a majority of Tory seats and gave Boris his majority.

    Most voters in seats the Tories won in the RedWall will still get to keep more of their assets exempt from care costs than they do now as I said, so these reforms benefit even them

  • Options
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    More good news for the government - its motion to have poor northerners sell their homes to pay for the care of rich southerners has gone through.

    Genuinely poor people don't own any property at all, they live in social housing or rent via housing benefit. They will still get all their care costs covered by the local authority.

    Those with assets under £100,000 will also get assistance with care costs on a means tested basis, now only those with assets under £23,250 do.

    Those with assets over £100,000 will no longer have to pay more than £86,000 for care costs, now they can lose all their assets down to their last £23,250 if they need residential care.

    So good news the new social care bill has gone through, despite even most SNP MPs voting with Labour and opposition parties even though the social care bill will only affect England
    As I said. Make the North pay for the south. Bye Bye red wall, bye bye Tory government.
    The North voted mostly for Labour MPs even in 2019, it was the Midlands and South which had a majority of Tory seats and gave Boris his majority.

    Most voters in seats the Tories won in the RedWall will still get to keep more of their assets exempt from care costs than they do now as I said, so these reforms benefit even them

    It is fascinating just how short your political antennae are.
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,226
    Leon said:

    Jonathan said:

    Notable about the "hands up if you've been to Peppa Pig World" segment of the PM's speech to the CBI (fuxsake...). He was lost again. Pages being sifted through. Winging it. Again.

    This isn't Labour vs Tory. This is what image you are supposed to have as Prime Minister.

    Disraeli
    Gladstone
    Lloyd George
    Churchill
    Macmillan
    Wilson
    Thatcher
    Blair

    Now some bumbling fool blathering on about Peppa Pig.

    We used to matter as a country. It used to matter who was PM, what they did and how they did it.
    Forget the greats. Let's consider the disappointments we have recently had as PM.

    May. She couldn't take her party with her, but she was prepared to stand there and take the abuse to try to promote her vision of the future. And if we're honest, her vision was more coherent and better than that of the incumbent.

    Cameron. Made one epoch-defining mistake, but open to working with others, able to speak without notes, willing to work through the essay crisis.

    Brown. At some level mad, and deliberately chose to ignore some red flashing elephants in the room. But clearly clever and on top of stuff.

    Major. Had the misfortune to hold the exploding parcel when the music stopped. But got more done than you might think, and the epitome of decently keeping buggering on.

    None of them great PMs. But I'd have any of them back in a heartbeat, because the incumbent is just painful to watch.
    Boris is better than all of those. He wins. He would never make such a major fuck up as:

    1. May. Social care, nearly losing to Corbyn, NI backstop, eating chips

    2. Cameron's EU referendum, OMFG

    3. Brown. Botched election call, the endless stupid Blair feud

    4. Major. Being a europhile twat again and again and, still, again


    I'm quite serious. Boris has already proven himself a better PM than any of them by winning as mayor twice, winning the referendum, winning the election (with a huge majority), winning the vaccine race, and, it looks like - God willing - winning the Freedom Day Handicap and taking the risk on a summer opening

    Boris is a risk taker. A selfish, shambolic wanker of a risk taker, but a risk taker. And he wins. That. in politics and life, counts for a LOT, as Napoleon noted
    You seem to have confused being a risk taker with being a twat.

    He is the worst kind of decision maker, whose instinct is to prevaricate and flip flop and procrastinate until a decision becomes unavoidable, and even then it may get unmade again the following day. If he ends up taking a risk it is through ineptitude rather than calculated judgement.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,544

    We have truly entered the twilight zone with Bozza now. Just a bizarre episode, he presents as decidedly unwell.

    He presents as someone drunk trying to pretend to be sober.
  • Options
    If a Labour leader had made the speech BoJo made today people here would be calling for their resignation now and saying the next GE was already lost.

    These same people say we never call out Labour when they do bad things, yet they’re just the same. They have double standards.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,943
    edited November 2021

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    More good news for the government - its motion to have poor northerners sell their homes to pay for the care of rich southerners has gone through.

    Genuinely poor people don't own any property at all, they live in social housing or rent via housing benefit. They will still get all their care costs covered by the local authority.

    Those with assets under £100,000 will also get assistance with care costs on a means tested basis, now only those with assets under £23,250 do.

    Those with assets over £100,000 will no longer have to pay more than £86,000 for care costs, now they can lose all their assets down to their last £23,250 if they need residential care.

    So good news the new social care bill has gone through, despite even most SNP MPs voting with Labour and opposition parties even though the social care bill will only affect England
    As I said. Make the North pay for the south. Bye Bye red wall, bye bye Tory government.
    The North voted mostly for Labour MPs even in 2019, it was the Midlands and South which had a majority of Tory seats and gave Boris his majority.

    Most voters in seats the Tories won in the RedWall will still get to keep more of their assets exempt from care costs than they do now as I said, so these reforms benefit even them

    It is fascinating just how short your political antennae are.
    The alternative eg having £100,000 of assets exempt from care costs but all assets above that liable for residential and at home care costs as May originally proposed in 2017 might benefit a handful of RedWall seats with the lowest house prices a bit more. However it would devastate the Tories in the South and London and lead to mass defections to ReformUK in protest, letting Labour and the LDs through the backdoor in those areas.

    Remember how badly May's dementia tax hit her poll rating, forcing her to U-turn mid campaign. Boris' £86,000 care costs cap is far better
  • Options
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    More good news for the government - its motion to have poor northerners sell their homes to pay for the care of rich southerners has gone through.

    Genuinely poor people don't own any property at all, they live in social housing or rent via housing benefit. They will still get all their care costs covered by the local authority.

    Those with assets under £100,000 will also get assistance with care costs on a means tested basis, now only those with assets under £23,250 do.

    Those with assets over £100,000 will no longer have to pay more than £86,000 for care costs, now they can lose all their assets down to their last £23,250 if they need residential care.

    So good news the new social care bill has gone through, despite even most SNP MPs voting with Labour and opposition parties even though the social care bill will only affect England
    As I said. Make the North pay for the south. Bye Bye red wall, bye bye Tory government.
    The North voted mostly for Labour MPs even in 2019, it was the Midlands and South which had a majority of Tory seats and gave Boris his majority.

    Most voters in seats the Tories won in the RedWall will still get to keep more of their assets exempt from care costs than they do now as I said, so these reforms benefit even them

    It is fascinating just how short your political antennae are.
    The alternative eg having £100,000 of assets exempt from care costs but all assets above that liable for residential and at home care costs as May originally proposed in 2017 might benefit a handful of RedWall seats with the lowest house prices a bit more. However it would devastate the Tories in the South and London and lead to mass defections to ReformUK in protest, letting Labour and the LDs through the backdoor in those areas.

    Remember how badly May's dementia tax hit her poll rating, forcing her to U-turn mid campaign. Boris' £86,000 care costs cap is far better
    Your "handful of red wall seats" is the difference between a May minority and a Peppa majority.

    As I said, amazingly clueless. You can't even do self-centred pig-ignorance "as long as we're alright, we're alright" properly as you actually need to win a majority. Which means the red wall.
  • Options
    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    edited November 2021

    If a Labour leader had made the speech BoJo made today people here would be calling for their resignation now and saying the next GE was already lost.

    These same people say we never call out Labour when they do bad things, yet they’re just the same. They have double standards.

    I seem to recall that Corbyn was attacked for being a vile antisemite who hates this country and supports terrorists and our enemies.

    I don't recall Corbyn being attacked for name checking one of the most popular cultural exports globally that this country has generated this century.

    Peppa Pig generates over a billion dollars per annum. https://www.statista.com/statistics/623382/retail-revenue-peppa-pig/

    Chancellor Hammond also named Peppa Pig in a speech in the past. I don't recall any uproar over that. https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/uk/chancellor-hails-peppa-pig-as-screen-industry-boosts-uk-economy-by-79bn-37398860.html
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,073
    .**** me!

    Diane Abbott on Newsnight embarrassing herself and the Labour Party with "wave machines". Why is she even on, making Johnson's performance today look like Olivier's Hamlet?
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 46,855
    IanB2 said:

    Leon said:

    Jonathan said:

    Notable about the "hands up if you've been to Peppa Pig World" segment of the PM's speech to the CBI (fuxsake...). He was lost again. Pages being sifted through. Winging it. Again.

    This isn't Labour vs Tory. This is what image you are supposed to have as Prime Minister.

    Disraeli
    Gladstone
    Lloyd George
    Churchill
    Macmillan
    Wilson
    Thatcher
    Blair

    Now some bumbling fool blathering on about Peppa Pig.

    We used to matter as a country. It used to matter who was PM, what they did and how they did it.
    Forget the greats. Let's consider the disappointments we have recently had as PM.

    May. She couldn't take her party with her, but she was prepared to stand there and take the abuse to try to promote her vision of the future. And if we're honest, her vision was more coherent and better than that of the incumbent.

    Cameron. Made one epoch-defining mistake, but open to working with others, able to speak without notes, willing to work through the essay crisis.

    Brown. At some level mad, and deliberately chose to ignore some red flashing elephants in the room. But clearly clever and on top of stuff.

    Major. Had the misfortune to hold the exploding parcel when the music stopped. But got more done than you might think, and the epitome of decently keeping buggering on.

    None of them great PMs. But I'd have any of them back in a heartbeat, because the incumbent is just painful to watch.
    Boris is better than all of those. He wins. He would never make such a major fuck up as:

    1. May. Social care, nearly losing to Corbyn, NI backstop, eating chips

    2. Cameron's EU referendum, OMFG

    3. Brown. Botched election call, the endless stupid Blair feud

    4. Major. Being a europhile twat again and again and, still, again


    I'm quite serious. Boris has already proven himself a better PM than any of them by winning as mayor twice, winning the referendum, winning the election (with a huge majority), winning the vaccine race, and, it looks like - God willing - winning the Freedom Day Handicap and taking the risk on a summer opening

    Boris is a risk taker. A selfish, shambolic wanker of a risk taker, but a risk taker. And he wins. That. in politics and life, counts for a LOT, as Napoleon noted
    You seem to have confused being a risk taker with being a twat.

    He is the worst kind of decision maker, whose instinct is to prevaricate and flip flop and procrastinate until a decision becomes unavoidable, and even then it may get unmade again the following day. If he ends up taking a risk it is through ineptitude rather than calculated judgement.
    Beat the fuck out of you whining Remainer c*nts tho, and for that I will always revere him
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,943
    edited November 2021

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    More good news for the government - its motion to have poor northerners sell their homes to pay for the care of rich southerners has gone through.

    Genuinely poor people don't own any property at all, they live in social housing or rent via housing benefit. They will still get all their care costs covered by the local authority.

    Those with assets under £100,000 will also get assistance with care costs on a means tested basis, now only those with assets under £23,250 do.

    Those with assets over £100,000 will no longer have to pay more than £86,000 for care costs, now they can lose all their assets down to their last £23,250 if they need residential care.

    So good news the new social care bill has gone through, despite even most SNP MPs voting with Labour and opposition parties even though the social care bill will only affect England
    As I said. Make the North pay for the south. Bye Bye red wall, bye bye Tory government.
    The North voted mostly for Labour MPs even in 2019, it was the Midlands and South which had a majority of Tory seats and gave Boris his majority.

    Most voters in seats the Tories won in the RedWall will still get to keep more of their assets exempt from care costs than they do now as I said, so these reforms benefit even them

    It is fascinating just how short your political antennae are.
    The alternative eg having £100,000 of assets exempt from care costs but all assets above that liable for residential and at home care costs as May originally proposed in 2017 might benefit a handful of RedWall seats with the lowest house prices a bit more. However it would devastate the Tories in the South and London and lead to mass defections to ReformUK in protest, letting Labour and the LDs through the backdoor in those areas.

    Remember how badly May's dementia tax hit her poll rating, forcing her to U-turn mid campaign. Boris' £86,000 care costs cap is far better
    Your "handful of red wall seats" is the difference between a May minority and a Peppa majority.

    As I said, amazingly clueless. You can't even do self-centred pig-ignorance "as long as we're alright, we're alright" properly as you actually need to win a majority. Which means the red wall.
    May still stayed in power of course. We only needed a majority and most of the Redwall in 2019 rather than a May minority to get Brexit done. Brexit has now been done so a majority at the next general election is not as important as still winning most seats, ideally with enough to stay in power with the DUP as May did.

    Lose lots of seats in the South however and we would lose power completely
  • Options
    Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 7,524
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    More good news for the government - its motion to have poor northerners sell their homes to pay for the care of rich southerners has gone through.

    Genuinely poor people don't own any property at all, they live in social housing or rent via housing benefit. They will still get all their care costs covered by the local authority.

    Those with assets under £100,000 will also get assistance with care costs on a means tested basis, now only those with assets under £23,250 do.

    Those with assets over £100,000 will no longer have to pay more than £86,000 for care costs, now they can lose all their assets down to their last £23,250 if they need residential care.

    So good news the new social care bill has gone through, despite even most SNP MPs voting with Labour and opposition parties even though the social care bill will only affect England
    As I said. Make the North pay for the south. Bye Bye red wall, bye bye Tory government.
    The North voted mostly for Labour MPs even in 2019, it was the Midlands and South which had a majority of Tory seats and gave Boris his majority.

    Most voters in seats the Tories won in the RedWall will still get to keep more of their assets exempt from care costs than they do now as I said, so these reforms benefit even them

    You make a good point about the north: most MPs in the north are still Labour. Labour has a bigger problem in the midlands.

    I think we should refer to the north as a red hedge, rather than a red wall.
  • Options
    FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    More good news for the government - its motion to have poor northerners sell their homes to pay for the care of rich southerners has gone through.

    Genuinely poor people don't own any property at all, they live in social housing or rent via housing benefit. They will still get all their care costs covered by the local authority.

    Those with assets under £100,000 will also get assistance with care costs on a means tested basis, now only those with assets under £23,250 do.

    Those with assets over £100,000 will no longer have to pay more than £86,000 for care costs, now they can lose all their assets down to their last £23,250 if they need residential care.

    So good news the new social care bill has gone through, despite even most SNP MPs voting with Labour and opposition parties even though the social care bill will only affect England
    As I said. Make the North pay for the south. Bye Bye red wall, bye bye Tory government.
    The North voted mostly for Labour MPs even in 2019, it was the Midlands and South which had a majority of Tory seats and gave Boris his majority.

    Most voters in seats the Tories won in the RedWall will still get to keep more of their assets exempt from care costs than they do now as I said, so these reforms benefit even them

    It is fascinating just how short your political antennae are.
    The alternative eg having £100,000 of assets exempt from care costs but all assets above that liable for residential and at home care costs as May originally proposed in 2017 might benefit a handful of RedWall seats with the lowest house prices a bit more. However it would devastate the Tories in the South and London and lead to mass defections to ReformUK in protest, letting Labour and the LDs through the backdoor in those areas.

    Remember how badly May's dementia tax hit her poll rating, forcing her to U-turn mid campaign. Boris' £86,000 care costs cap is far better
    Your "handful of red wall seats" is the difference between a May minority and a Peppa majority.

    As I said, amazingly clueless. You can't even do self-centred pig-ignorance "as long as we're alright, we're alright" properly as you actually need to win a majority. Which means the red wall.
    Yesterday I went, as we all must, to Peppa Pig World. Hands up if you’ve been to Peppa Pig World! I have to say, I'm surprised more of you haven't been. This must be a case of casting pearls before swine... you really haven't been? I loved it. They all had their snouts in a trough, and this was clearly the place for me. The twist in the tail is that the red wall is now the pink wall. They said we couldn't win in the midlands, but pigs can fly! But the real story is of this government supporting creative industries. Accounting, mostly. Or us selling you a pig in a poke. Forgive me. Forgive me.
  • Options
    Leon said:

    IanB2 said:

    Leon said:

    Jonathan said:

    Notable about the "hands up if you've been to Peppa Pig World" segment of the PM's speech to the CBI (fuxsake...). He was lost again. Pages being sifted through. Winging it. Again.

    This isn't Labour vs Tory. This is what image you are supposed to have as Prime Minister.

    Disraeli
    Gladstone
    Lloyd George
    Churchill
    Macmillan
    Wilson
    Thatcher
    Blair

    Now some bumbling fool blathering on about Peppa Pig.

    We used to matter as a country. It used to matter who was PM, what they did and how they did it.
    Forget the greats. Let's consider the disappointments we have recently had as PM.

    May. She couldn't take her party with her, but she was prepared to stand there and take the abuse to try to promote her vision of the future. And if we're honest, her vision was more coherent and better than that of the incumbent.

    Cameron. Made one epoch-defining mistake, but open to working with others, able to speak without notes, willing to work through the essay crisis.

    Brown. At some level mad, and deliberately chose to ignore some red flashing elephants in the room. But clearly clever and on top of stuff.

    Major. Had the misfortune to hold the exploding parcel when the music stopped. But got more done than you might think, and the epitome of decently keeping buggering on.

    None of them great PMs. But I'd have any of them back in a heartbeat, because the incumbent is just painful to watch.
    Boris is better than all of those. He wins. He would never make such a major fuck up as:

    1. May. Social care, nearly losing to Corbyn, NI backstop, eating chips

    2. Cameron's EU referendum, OMFG

    3. Brown. Botched election call, the endless stupid Blair feud

    4. Major. Being a europhile twat again and again and, still, again


    I'm quite serious. Boris has already proven himself a better PM than any of them by winning as mayor twice, winning the referendum, winning the election (with a huge majority), winning the vaccine race, and, it looks like - God willing - winning the Freedom Day Handicap and taking the risk on a summer opening

    Boris is a risk taker. A selfish, shambolic wanker of a risk taker, but a risk taker. And he wins. That. in politics and life, counts for a LOT, as Napoleon noted
    You seem to have confused being a risk taker with being a twat.

    He is the worst kind of decision maker, whose instinct is to prevaricate and flip flop and procrastinate until a decision becomes unavoidable, and even then it may get unmade again the following day. If he ends up taking a risk it is through ineptitude rather than calculated judgement.
    Beat the fuck out of you whining Remainer c*nts tho, and for that I will always revere him
    Been a good night has it Seanie?
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,073

    If a Labour leader had made the speech BoJo made today people here would be calling for their resignation now and saying the next GE was already lost.

    These same people say we never call out Labour when they do bad things, yet they’re just the same. They have double standards.

    I seem to recall that Corbyn was attacked for being a vile antisemite who hates this country and supports terrorists and our enemies.

    I don't recall Corbyn being attacked for name checking one of the most popular cultural exports globally that this country has generated this century.

    Peppa Pig generates over a billion dollars per annum. https://www.statista.com/statistics/623382/retail-revenue-peppa-pig/

    Chancellor Hammond also named Peppa Pig in a speech in the past. I don't recall any uproar over that. https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/uk/chancellor-hails-peppa-pig-as-screen-industry-boosts-uk-economy-by-79bn-37398860.html
    If you haven't seen the clip, don't defend the indefensible. In the right context Peppa Pig would be fine. I am not sure at the CBI it was.
  • Options
    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 19,911
    Leon said:

    IanB2 said:

    Leon said:

    Jonathan said:

    Notable about the "hands up if you've been to Peppa Pig World" segment of the PM's speech to the CBI (fuxsake...). He was lost again. Pages being sifted through. Winging it. Again.

    This isn't Labour vs Tory. This is what image you are supposed to have as Prime Minister.

    Disraeli
    Gladstone
    Lloyd George
    Churchill
    Macmillan
    Wilson
    Thatcher
    Blair

    Now some bumbling fool blathering on about Peppa Pig.

    We used to matter as a country. It used to matter who was PM, what they did and how they did it.
    Forget the greats. Let's consider the disappointments we have recently had as PM.

    May. She couldn't take her party with her, but she was prepared to stand there and take the abuse to try to promote her vision of the future. And if we're honest, her vision was more coherent and better than that of the incumbent.

    Cameron. Made one epoch-defining mistake, but open to working with others, able to speak without notes, willing to work through the essay crisis.

    Brown. At some level mad, and deliberately chose to ignore some red flashing elephants in the room. But clearly clever and on top of stuff.

    Major. Had the misfortune to hold the exploding parcel when the music stopped. But got more done than you might think, and the epitome of decently keeping buggering on.

    None of them great PMs. But I'd have any of them back in a heartbeat, because the incumbent is just painful to watch.
    Boris is better than all of those. He wins. He would never make such a major fuck up as:

    1. May. Social care, nearly losing to Corbyn, NI backstop, eating chips

    2. Cameron's EU referendum, OMFG

    3. Brown. Botched election call, the endless stupid Blair feud

    4. Major. Being a europhile twat again and again and, still, again


    I'm quite serious. Boris has already proven himself a better PM than any of them by winning as mayor twice, winning the referendum, winning the election (with a huge majority), winning the vaccine race, and, it looks like - God willing - winning the Freedom Day Handicap and taking the risk on a summer opening

    Boris is a risk taker. A selfish, shambolic wanker of a risk taker, but a risk taker. And he wins. That. in politics and life, counts for a LOT, as Napoleon noted
    You seem to have confused being a risk taker with being a twat.

    He is the worst kind of decision maker, whose instinct is to prevaricate and flip flop and procrastinate until a decision becomes unavoidable, and even then it may get unmade again the following day. If he ends up taking a risk it is through ineptitude rather than calculated judgement.
    Beat the fuck out of you whining Remainer c*nts tho, and for that I will always revere him
    Oh dear. Reminiscent of SeanT in his darkest hours. Hmm.
  • Options
    FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775

    Leon said:

    IanB2 said:

    Leon said:

    Jonathan said:

    Notable about the "hands up if you've been to Peppa Pig World" segment of the PM's speech to the CBI (fuxsake...). He was lost again. Pages being sifted through. Winging it. Again.

    This isn't Labour vs Tory. This is what image you are supposed to have as Prime Minister.

    Disraeli
    Gladstone
    Lloyd George
    Churchill
    Macmillan
    Wilson
    Thatcher
    Blair

    Now some bumbling fool blathering on about Peppa Pig.

    We used to matter as a country. It used to matter who was PM, what they did and how they did it.
    Forget the greats. Let's consider the disappointments we have recently had as PM.

    May. She couldn't take her party with her, but she was prepared to stand there and take the abuse to try to promote her vision of the future. And if we're honest, her vision was more coherent and better than that of the incumbent.

    Cameron. Made one epoch-defining mistake, but open to working with others, able to speak without notes, willing to work through the essay crisis.

    Brown. At some level mad, and deliberately chose to ignore some red flashing elephants in the room. But clearly clever and on top of stuff.

    Major. Had the misfortune to hold the exploding parcel when the music stopped. But got more done than you might think, and the epitome of decently keeping buggering on.

    None of them great PMs. But I'd have any of them back in a heartbeat, because the incumbent is just painful to watch.
    Boris is better than all of those. He wins. He would never make such a major fuck up as:

    1. May. Social care, nearly losing to Corbyn, NI backstop, eating chips

    2. Cameron's EU referendum, OMFG

    3. Brown. Botched election call, the endless stupid Blair feud

    4. Major. Being a europhile twat again and again and, still, again


    I'm quite serious. Boris has already proven himself a better PM than any of them by winning as mayor twice, winning the referendum, winning the election (with a huge majority), winning the vaccine race, and, it looks like - God willing - winning the Freedom Day Handicap and taking the risk on a summer opening

    Boris is a risk taker. A selfish, shambolic wanker of a risk taker, but a risk taker. And he wins. That. in politics and life, counts for a LOT, as Napoleon noted
    You seem to have confused being a risk taker with being a twat.

    He is the worst kind of decision maker, whose instinct is to prevaricate and flip flop and procrastinate until a decision becomes unavoidable, and even then it may get unmade again the following day. If he ends up taking a risk it is through ineptitude rather than calculated judgement.
    Beat the fuck out of you whining Remainer c*nts tho, and for that I will always revere him
    Been a good night has it Seanie?
    you can't spell "vodka and lemon" without "leon".
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,226
    edited November 2021

    If a Labour leader had made the speech BoJo made today people here would be calling for their resignation now and saying the next GE was already lost.

    These same people say we never call out Labour when they do bad things, yet they’re just the same. They have double standards.

    I seem to recall that Corbyn was attacked for being a vile antisemite who hates this country and supports terrorists and our enemies.

    I don't recall Corbyn being attacked for name checking one of the most popular cultural exports globally that this country has generated this century.

    Peppa Pig generates over a billion dollars per annum. https://www.statista.com/statistics/623382/retail-revenue-peppa-pig/

    Chancellor Hammond also named Peppa Pig in a speech in the past. I don't recall any uproar over that. https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/uk/chancellor-hails-peppa-pig-as-screen-industry-boosts-uk-economy-by-79bn-37398860.html
    If you haven't seen the clip, don't defend the indefensible. In the right context Peppa Pig would be fine. I am not sure at the CBI it was.
    It made me reflect that most of his speeches have been given to supportive audiences, most notably at Tory conference. When people are neutral or sceptical, wanting to hear about the substance rather than his shtick, his jokes don’t fly. God knows how he will cope when people turn hostile.
  • Options
    Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 7,524
    edited November 2021

    If a Labour leader had made the speech BoJo made today people here would be calling for their resignation now and saying the next GE was already lost.

    These same people say we never call out Labour when they do bad things, yet they’re just the same. They have double standards.

    I seem to recall that Corbyn was attacked for being a vile antisemite who hates this country and supports terrorists and our enemies.

    I don't recall Corbyn being attacked for name checking one of the most popular cultural exports globally that this country has generated this century.

    Peppa Pig generates over a billion dollars per annum. https://www.statista.com/statistics/623382/retail-revenue-peppa-pig/

    Chancellor Hammond also named Peppa Pig in a speech in the past. I don't recall any uproar over that. https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/uk/chancellor-hails-peppa-pig-as-screen-industry-boosts-uk-economy-by-79bn-37398860.html
    If you haven't seen the clip, don't defend the indefensible. In the right context Peppa Pig would be fine. I am not sure at the CBI it was.
    Yes, I think that's right. It's one thing doing all that knockabout shtick at a Conference speech, say, but maybe not at the CBI.

    By contrast, I gather Starmer was serious and thoughtful in front of the CBI (yes, I'm sure he was dull as well). The CBI notices these things. I suspect Starmer is trying to woo the business community as Blair did so successfully. He may succeed if the contrast is with Johnson.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 46,855

    Leon said:

    IanB2 said:

    Leon said:

    Jonathan said:

    Notable about the "hands up if you've been to Peppa Pig World" segment of the PM's speech to the CBI (fuxsake...). He was lost again. Pages being sifted through. Winging it. Again.

    This isn't Labour vs Tory. This is what image you are supposed to have as Prime Minister.

    Disraeli
    Gladstone
    Lloyd George
    Churchill
    Macmillan
    Wilson
    Thatcher
    Blair

    Now some bumbling fool blathering on about Peppa Pig.

    We used to matter as a country. It used to matter who was PM, what they did and how they did it.
    Forget the greats. Let's consider the disappointments we have recently had as PM.

    May. She couldn't take her party with her, but she was prepared to stand there and take the abuse to try to promote her vision of the future. And if we're honest, her vision was more coherent and better than that of the incumbent.

    Cameron. Made one epoch-defining mistake, but open to working with others, able to speak without notes, willing to work through the essay crisis.

    Brown. At some level mad, and deliberately chose to ignore some red flashing elephants in the room. But clearly clever and on top of stuff.

    Major. Had the misfortune to hold the exploding parcel when the music stopped. But got more done than you might think, and the epitome of decently keeping buggering on.

    None of them great PMs. But I'd have any of them back in a heartbeat, because the incumbent is just painful to watch.
    Boris is better than all of those. He wins. He would never make such a major fuck up as:

    1. May. Social care, nearly losing to Corbyn, NI backstop, eating chips

    2. Cameron's EU referendum, OMFG

    3. Brown. Botched election call, the endless stupid Blair feud

    4. Major. Being a europhile twat again and again and, still, again


    I'm quite serious. Boris has already proven himself a better PM than any of them by winning as mayor twice, winning the referendum, winning the election (with a huge majority), winning the vaccine race, and, it looks like - God willing - winning the Freedom Day Handicap and taking the risk on a summer opening

    Boris is a risk taker. A selfish, shambolic wanker of a risk taker, but a risk taker. And he wins. That. in politics and life, counts for a LOT, as Napoleon noted
    You seem to have confused being a risk taker with being a twat.

    He is the worst kind of decision maker, whose instinct is to prevaricate and flip flop and procrastinate until a decision becomes unavoidable, and even then it may get unmade again the following day. If he ends up taking a risk it is through ineptitude rather than calculated judgement.
    Beat the fuck out of you whining Remainer c*nts tho, and for that I will always revere him
    Oh dear. Reminiscent of SeanT in his darkest hours. Hmm.
    Er. If you can get drunk on too much home-made Miso soup, I plead guilty

    You people are far too kind to me. Sometimes I am not drunk and thereby excusable, I am just nasty for the sake of it, especially with a tedious, whingeing, effeminate, repetitive waste-of-old-spunk like IanB2
  • Options
    IanB2 said:

    Leon said:

    Jonathan said:

    Notable about the "hands up if you've been to Peppa Pig World" segment of the PM's speech to the CBI (fuxsake...). He was lost again. Pages being sifted through. Winging it. Again.

    This isn't Labour vs Tory. This is what image you are supposed to have as Prime Minister.

    Disraeli
    Gladstone
    Lloyd George
    Churchill
    Macmillan
    Wilson
    Thatcher
    Blair

    Now some bumbling fool blathering on about Peppa Pig.

    We used to matter as a country. It used to matter who was PM, what they did and how they did it.
    Forget the greats. Let's consider the disappointments we have recently had as PM.

    May. She couldn't take her party with her, but she was prepared to stand there and take the abuse to try to promote her vision of the future. And if we're honest, her vision was more coherent and better than that of the incumbent.

    Cameron. Made one epoch-defining mistake, but open to working with others, able to speak without notes, willing to work through the essay crisis.

    Brown. At some level mad, and deliberately chose to ignore some red flashing elephants in the room. But clearly clever and on top of stuff.

    Major. Had the misfortune to hold the exploding parcel when the music stopped. But got more done than you might think, and the epitome of decently keeping buggering on.

    None of them great PMs. But I'd have any of them back in a heartbeat, because the incumbent is just painful to watch.
    Boris is better than all of those. He wins. He would never make such a major fuck up as:

    1. May. Social care, nearly losing to Corbyn, NI backstop, eating chips

    2. Cameron's EU referendum, OMFG

    3. Brown. Botched election call, the endless stupid Blair feud

    4. Major. Being a europhile twat again and again and, still, again


    I'm quite serious. Boris has already proven himself a better PM than any of them by winning as mayor twice, winning the referendum, winning the election (with a huge majority), winning the vaccine race, and, it looks like - God willing - winning the Freedom Day Handicap and taking the risk on a summer opening

    Boris is a risk taker. A selfish, shambolic wanker of a risk taker, but a risk taker. And he wins. That. in politics and life, counts for a LOT, as Napoleon noted
    You seem to have confused being a risk taker with being a twat.

    He is the worst kind of decision maker, whose instinct is to prevaricate and flip flop and procrastinate until a decision becomes unavoidable, and even then it may get unmade again the following day. If he ends up taking a risk it is through ineptitude rather than calculated judgement.
    If he prevaricates and never takes a risk then how come he took the risk of lifting all legal restrictions in the summer, a step not replicated anywhere across the continent?

    The "not make decisions" meme seems to come from those annoyed he didn't put the country into lockdown sooner last year, rather than make the decision to not have lockdowns.

    Not making the decision you want isn't the same as not making a decision.
  • Options
    FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    IanB2 said:

    Leon said:

    Jonathan said:

    Notable about the "hands up if you've been to Peppa Pig World" segment of the PM's speech to the CBI (fuxsake...). He was lost again. Pages being sifted through. Winging it. Again.

    This isn't Labour vs Tory. This is what image you are supposed to have as Prime Minister.

    Disraeli
    Gladstone
    Lloyd George
    Churchill
    Macmillan
    Wilson
    Thatcher
    Blair

    Now some bumbling fool blathering on about Peppa Pig.

    We used to matter as a country. It used to matter who was PM, what they did and how they did it.
    Forget the greats. Let's consider the disappointments we have recently had as PM.

    May. She couldn't take her party with her, but she was prepared to stand there and take the abuse to try to promote her vision of the future. And if we're honest, her vision was more coherent and better than that of the incumbent.

    Cameron. Made one epoch-defining mistake, but open to working with others, able to speak without notes, willing to work through the essay crisis.

    Brown. At some level mad, and deliberately chose to ignore some red flashing elephants in the room. But clearly clever and on top of stuff.

    Major. Had the misfortune to hold the exploding parcel when the music stopped. But got more done than you might think, and the epitome of decently keeping buggering on.

    None of them great PMs. But I'd have any of them back in a heartbeat, because the incumbent is just painful to watch.
    Boris is better than all of those. He wins. He would never make such a major fuck up as:

    1. May. Social care, nearly losing to Corbyn, NI backstop, eating chips

    2. Cameron's EU referendum, OMFG

    3. Brown. Botched election call, the endless stupid Blair feud

    4. Major. Being a europhile twat again and again and, still, again


    I'm quite serious. Boris has already proven himself a better PM than any of them by winning as mayor twice, winning the referendum, winning the election (with a huge majority), winning the vaccine race, and, it looks like - God willing - winning the Freedom Day Handicap and taking the risk on a summer opening

    Boris is a risk taker. A selfish, shambolic wanker of a risk taker, but a risk taker. And he wins. That. in politics and life, counts for a LOT, as Napoleon noted
    You seem to have confused being a risk taker with being a twat.

    He is the worst kind of decision maker, whose instinct is to prevaricate and flip flop and procrastinate until a decision becomes unavoidable, and even then it may get unmade again the following day. If he ends up taking a risk it is through ineptitude rather than calculated judgement.
    Beat the fuck out of you whining Remainer c*nts tho, and for that I will always revere him
    Oh dear. Reminiscent of SeanT in his darkest hours. Hmm.
    Er. If you can get drunk on too much home-made Miso soup, I plead guilty

    You people are far too kind to me. Sometimes I am not drunk and thereby excusable, I am just nasty for the sake of it, especially with a tedious, whingeing, effeminate, repetitive waste-of-old-spunk like IanB2
    Drunk on miso soup? Or just salty?
    Lord knows why, and the devil cares. Go to bed.
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    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,073
    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    IanB2 said:

    Leon said:

    Jonathan said:

    Notable about the "hands up if you've been to Peppa Pig World" segment of the PM's speech to the CBI (fuxsake...). He was lost again. Pages being sifted through. Winging it. Again.

    This isn't Labour vs Tory. This is what image you are supposed to have as Prime Minister.

    Disraeli
    Gladstone
    Lloyd George
    Churchill
    Macmillan
    Wilson
    Thatcher
    Blair

    Now some bumbling fool blathering on about Peppa Pig.

    We used to matter as a country. It used to matter who was PM, what they did and how they did it.
    Forget the greats. Let's consider the disappointments we have recently had as PM.

    May. She couldn't take her party with her, but she was prepared to stand there and take the abuse to try to promote her vision of the future. And if we're honest, her vision was more coherent and better than that of the incumbent.

    Cameron. Made one epoch-defining mistake, but open to working with others, able to speak without notes, willing to work through the essay crisis.

    Brown. At some level mad, and deliberately chose to ignore some red flashing elephants in the room. But clearly clever and on top of stuff.

    Major. Had the misfortune to hold the exploding parcel when the music stopped. But got more done than you might think, and the epitome of decently keeping buggering on.

    None of them great PMs. But I'd have any of them back in a heartbeat, because the incumbent is just painful to watch.
    Boris is better than all of those. He wins. He would never make such a major fuck up as:

    1. May. Social care, nearly losing to Corbyn, NI backstop, eating chips

    2. Cameron's EU referendum, OMFG

    3. Brown. Botched election call, the endless stupid Blair feud

    4. Major. Being a europhile twat again and again and, still, again


    I'm quite serious. Boris has already proven himself a better PM than any of them by winning as mayor twice, winning the referendum, winning the election (with a huge majority), winning the vaccine race, and, it looks like - God willing - winning the Freedom Day Handicap and taking the risk on a summer opening

    Boris is a risk taker. A selfish, shambolic wanker of a risk taker, but a risk taker. And he wins. That. in politics and life, counts for a LOT, as Napoleon noted
    You seem to have confused being a risk taker with being a twat.

    He is the worst kind of decision maker, whose instinct is to prevaricate and flip flop and procrastinate until a decision becomes unavoidable, and even then it may get unmade again the following day. If he ends up taking a risk it is through ineptitude rather than calculated judgement.
    Beat the fuck out of you whining Remainer c*nts tho, and for that I will always revere him
    Been a good night has it Seanie?
    you can't spell "vodka and lemon" without "leon".
    ...or absinthe without "seant".
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    LeonLeon Posts: 46,855
    edited November 2021
    This latest J K Rowling argument is extraordinary


    "I’ve now received so many death threats I could paper the house with them, and I haven’t stopped speaking out. Perhaps – and I’m just throwing this out there – the best way to prove your movement isn’t a threat to women, is to stop stalking, harassing and threatening us. 8/X"


    https://twitter.com/jk_rowling/status/1462759297465692162?s=20

    Trans activists are the worst. It is like they are a plant by Trans-phobes, sown 30 years ago to discredit all trans people in the far future
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    LeonLeon Posts: 46,855
    Foxy said:

    We have truly entered the twilight zone with Bozza now. Just a bizarre episode, he presents as decidedly unwell.

    He presents as someone drunk trying to pretend to be sober.
    He really, really doesn't

    God knows I drink enough, and am drunk enough, and have pretended to be sober enough. I doubt you've been really drunk a dozen times in your life? You know nothing of this

    If Boris was just a desperate secret boozer, like Charles Kennedy, it would be bloody obvious. He isn't. His problems actually go deeper than that, and they are more interesting. He has some deep neediness, related to his mum and dad, allied with a schoolboy shtick of "I'm just a bumbling amateur, hahaha" which got him into Eton, Oxford and the Buller, but this has now fossilised into a persona, all of which is sunk in a genuinely gifted and powerful intelligence, which means he lives at total cross purposes
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    FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775
    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    We have truly entered the twilight zone with Bozza now. Just a bizarre episode, he presents as decidedly unwell.

    He presents as someone drunk trying to pretend to be sober.
    He really, really doesn't

    God knows I drink enough, and am drunk enough, and have pretended to be sober enough. I doubt you've been really drunk a dozen times in your life? You know nothing of this

    If Boris was just a desperate secret boozer, like Charles Kennedy, it would be bloody obvious. He isn't. His problems actually go deeper than that, and they are more interesting. He has some deep neediness, related to his mum and dad, allied with a schoolboy shtick of "I'm just a bumbling amateur, hahaha" which got him into Eton, Oxford and the Buller, but this has now fossilised into a persona, all of which is sunk in a genuinely gifted and powerful intelligence, which means he lives at total cross purposes
    Great post. Half psychiatrist's couch, half casting couch. [shudder]
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    If a Labour leader had made the speech BoJo made today people here would be calling for their resignation now and saying the next GE was already lost.

    These same people say we never call out Labour when they do bad things, yet they’re just the same. They have double standards.

    I seem to recall that Corbyn was attacked for being a vile antisemite who hates this country and supports terrorists and our enemies.

    I don't recall Corbyn being attacked for name checking one of the most popular cultural exports globally that this country has generated this century.

    Peppa Pig generates over a billion dollars per annum. https://www.statista.com/statistics/623382/retail-revenue-peppa-pig/

    Chancellor Hammond also named Peppa Pig in a speech in the past. I don't recall any uproar over that. https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/uk/chancellor-hails-peppa-pig-as-screen-industry-boosts-uk-economy-by-79bn-37398860.html
    If you haven't seen the clip, don't defend the indefensible. In the right context Peppa Pig would be fine. I am not sure at the CBI it was.
    You don't think a billion dollar business is worthy of the CBI?
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    Is there a division list available yet re: social care vote?
  • Options
    New thread.
This discussion has been closed.